Latest / The Elevator Careers Podcast / Learn All You Can and Get Involved in the Elevator Trade | Joe McAnulty

Transcript

Learn All You Can and Get Involved in the Elevator Trade | Joe McAnulty · The Elevator Careers Podcast

• 0:00
  SPEAKER_00: You know, if you're not involved in what's going on, then you can't help change it.
• 0:04
  SPEAKER_00: So and if you want to change it to a certain way, then get involved.
• 1:12
  SPEAKER_01: And um I'm I'm excited to dig into that a little bit deeper.
• 1:16
  SPEAKER_01: So I am curious, you know, where did you start in the elevator industry to uh begin your career?
• 1:23
  SPEAKER_00: Sure.
• 1:24
  SPEAKER_00: So I uh graduated high school and uh when I was 18 and um I had a was a volunteer firefighter at a local firehouse, and uh one of the gentlemen that was there, he had said, you know, you needed an apprentice, and I've always been working on cars, and my family had some, you know, small little um basically I guess like rental properties that I always took care of.
• 1:48
  SPEAKER_00: So I had the basics of like electricity and kind of construction.
• 1:51
  SPEAKER_00: And so he started me off as a as an as his apprentice, and um I really took to it because it was kind of everything, you know, three days into the job and I got to start welding, uh, which I thought was awesome, you know, being 18 and just kind of I was always interested in um, you know, welding and electrical, and I was really into racing cars and uh so you know, everything that kind of had the mechanics around it.
• 2:14
  SPEAKER_00: Um, you know, when I was on the first day of the job, he took me up.
• 2:18
  SPEAKER_00: We were, I think we were 18 stories up, and he took me up and he set the ladder out and put a harness on me and said, All right, go set that top bracket.
• 2:27
  SPEAKER_00: And I looked down and I shook my head.
• 2:29
  SPEAKER_00: I was like, I don't want to do that.
• 2:30
  SPEAKER_00: He said, Look, you got to go out there and do it.
• 2:32
  SPEAKER_00: So uh went out there, set, set my first bracket on the 18 stop, and uh, you know, kind of broke the ice for you know being afraid of heights and things along those lines.
• 2:41
  SPEAKER_00: So it was really cool because you know, the this industry kind of gets you involved in everything.
• 2:46
  SPEAKER_00: And so when I got there, um I started with uh with Deller Elevator and it was uh a great, they had a great apprenticeship program.
• 2:54
  SPEAKER_00: So I was able to kind of get get my feet rolling and they um kind of brought me to the next level with you know just being on different types of projects.
• 3:03
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, we saw everything.
• 3:05
  SPEAKER_00: Um I got to do everything from being on the drilling rig to drill the hole uh for the jack, for an in-ground jack, which I know most people don't get to ever do, but it was uh it was one heck of an experience, uh something I never want to do ever again.
• 3:20
  SPEAKER_00: But it was uh it was a messy, messy day.
• 3:22
  SPEAKER_00: I remember it was like 35 degrees outside and we were drilling this hole, and you know, there's the waters coming up out of the hole.
• 3:28
  SPEAKER_00: And uh the gentleman I worked with was French Canadian, so he was cursing in French at me and another apprentice that was down there throwing the muck up out of the into the dumpster, and we had no idea what he was saying, and we didn't know if we were doing things wrong or if he was just angry at something else.
• 3:44
  SPEAKER_00: But it was uh it was a pretty, I tell people that a lot, it was a pretty unique experience because um I got to do it once and never had to do it again, luckily, but it was it was fun.
• 3:54
  SPEAKER_00: Um, it was kind of brought me around to see like there's other parts of it, so don't take for granted what what I had when I was in new construction and we were on you know, pretty cake cake jobs that everything was clean and meant because it was new.
• 4:07
  SPEAKER_00: So I started working in my on the mod side of it.
• 4:10
  SPEAKER_00: And luckily, one of my mechanics was one of the adjusters.
• 4:14
  SPEAKER_00: And um after I was there for a while and being on that side of it, I really enjoyed like the electrical side and troubleshooting and wiring and you know, finishing out and figuring out how to do the tests at the end of the end of the um, you know, the new whether it was new construction or modernization, and it really gave me a different perspective of it from being on the drilling rig and slinging rails to you know being up, you know, at the end of it and cleaning things up and tidying it up and making it look and run good.
• 4:40
  SPEAKER_00: And I got to get into the code side of it and you know, knowing the code.
• 4:44
  SPEAKER_00: And a lot of them were government jobs, so it was always the newest code that was out there.
• 4:49
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so I then uh had switched to a couple of different companies um in like the mid-Atlantic area, and it was great because I got to work with a lot of people and a lot of different um mechanics and and adjusters and even owners that were um you know had a different take on things and some of them more innovative than others, but um, you know, some some too get, you know, kind of gave you, you know, you didn't really have a leash, you just kind of went as far as you could take yourself.
• 5:17
  SPEAKER_00: And that was um one of the, you know, I think for myself, I'm very self-motivated.
• 5:22
  SPEAKER_00: So I got to, you know, dig myself into anything and they would call me and say, Do you know how to do this?
• 5:27
  SPEAKER_00: And I said, No, but I'll I'll go to the job and I'll figure it out.
• 5:30
  SPEAKER_00: You know, luckily, you know, there was always time built in for me to, you know, the learning curve, which is all which was awesome.
• 5:36
  SPEAKER_00: And um, I ended up on the service side of things, which is where I really um felt more comfortable in and really enjoyed it.
• 5:45
  SPEAKER_00: And, you know, although slinging mud outside of that hole while I was digging in 30 degree day, you know, service calls were um, you know, have their own problems, you know, waking up at two o'clock in the morning.
• 5:56
  SPEAKER_00: But, you know, the the troubleshooting aspect of it is where I really enjoy and you know, really passionate about.
• 6:02
  SPEAKER_00: And that's what, you know, kind of learning things and taking notes.
• 6:05
  SPEAKER_00: I have a ton of um basically like black notebooks that I keep and they're not very organized.
• 6:12
  SPEAKER_00: Uh so if somebody else went in there, they would think it was uh, you know, somebody from like Ray Man drawing inside of this.
• 6:17
  SPEAKER_00: But it was it was my myself, my writing notes down for you know, whether it was a problem with a tax 50 that I found that was very unique or something along those lines.
• 6:26
  SPEAKER_00: I kept everything so that I, you know, can go back and remember exactly how we corrected those problems.
• 6:32
  SPEAKER_00: And that's what I, you know, kind of like was figuring out the problems and figuring out unique issues.
• 6:37
  SPEAKER_00: And that's kind of how ended up, you know, at liberty with the consulting side is we have clients all over the country and their elevator companies having problems.
• 6:45
  SPEAKER_00: You know, we kind of give them advice as to how to, you know, maybe approach a certain problem or something we may see, or you know, obsolete parts.
• 6:53
  SPEAKER_00: What do we do for solutions for that?
• 6:55
  SPEAKER_00: Things along those lines that kind of got me on the service side.
• 6:59
  SPEAKER_00: I really enjoyed.
• 7:00
  SPEAKER_00: So, how can I help the client out a little bit better with having like an unbiased opinion of, you know, is something really obsolete?
• 7:07
  SPEAKER_01: And if it is, you know, do we need to modernize the whole elevator or can we put something else in there to sound sounds like you you kind of hit things fast and hard and just kind of dove in headfirst is is what I'm hearing.
• 7:19
  SPEAKER_01: I'm I'm curious what what were some of the things that really contributed your to your success early on that really clicked for you?
• 7:26
  SPEAKER_00: Sure.
• 7:27
  SPEAKER_00: I think I think definitely education, um, you know, going to classes, um, I really enjoyed like going to like a GAL class.
• 7:36
  SPEAKER_00: And when I got to be more involved in in learn in the learning experience, I really got to um kind of take some pride in what I was doing.
• 7:45
  SPEAKER_00: And then that just kind of motivated me more.
• 7:47
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so kind of seeing the difference in, you know, I can go install a GAL controller without ever learning uh about it.
• 7:56
  SPEAKER_00: But after you learn about it, the you know, it makes your job easier and then it makes all of a sudden, you know, your your product that you're personally putting out, whether it be within your company or just in the industry, is is always better.
• 8:08
  SPEAKER_00: And that was the education side of it was really what helped me kind of move along and be like more inspired to um just kind of take on a different role.
• 8:19
  SPEAKER_00: And whether I was an actual supervisor or at some point in time didn't even have title.
• 8:25
  SPEAKER_00: It was just Joe kind of just did whatever I needed to do.
• 8:29
  SPEAKER_01: Some self-confidence to to dive in, right?
• 8:32
  SPEAKER_01: Just know what you know.
• 8:33
  SPEAKER_00: I went to a company uh one time and I didn't really know I didn't know anybody at the company.
• 8:38
  SPEAKER_00: And uh the one company I was at had just closed, they just locked up their doors one day.
• 8:41
  SPEAKER_00: So I went to another company and nobody nobody knew me.
• 8:44
  SPEAKER_00: And they I just applied and and walked in the door, and they put me with a guy who probably had about five or six five or six years experience, and he was did all maintenance.
• 8:53
  SPEAKER_00: Um he probably does the best maintenance I've ever seen out of anybody, but he didn't know how to troubleshoot elevators or even go on service calls.
• 9:00
  SPEAKER_00: So we started going on service calls and I was just telling him how to do it.
• 9:05
  SPEAKER_00: And so then they started giving him service calls, and and then he and I wasn't with him after I did my you know onboarding kind of orientation, and he kept calling me and he's like, You have to tell them that it was you.
• 9:17
  SPEAKER_00: And I was like, No, you're the you know, you were the lead mechanic.
• 9:20
  SPEAKER_00: You you know, you tell them.
• 9:21
  SPEAKER_00: I was like, If you have problems, just call me and I'll help you.
• 9:23
  SPEAKER_00: And he's like, No, I don't want to do trouble calls, I don't want, but now they think that I can.
• 9:27
  SPEAKER_00: He's like, So we so we need to do it.
• 9:29
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I'm like, no, I'm like, just just you'd be fine.
• 9:33
  SPEAKER_00: And um, we currently still work together, and he he's a great guy, but we um I always pushed him further and further.
• 9:39
  SPEAKER_00: I was like, no, you need to, you know, go on the service call, take it, call me when you're there.
• 9:43
  SPEAKER_00: And you know, he was well educated, he he had a certification, and um, you know, he had he was one of those guys that um he always had a brush in his back pocket and he would clean every single hill and every um, you know, just he would sweep the controller out every single time he was there, even if it was a little bit of dust, you know, he was that type of guy.
• 10:03
  SPEAKER_00: And and people like that really inspired me too, because I want to help them because you know that no matter what they do, they're gonna um, you know, just kind of give it their all.
• 10:13
  SPEAKER_00: And he really, and he really did.
• 10:14
  SPEAKER_00: So it really like inspired me to help push him along.
• 10:18
  SPEAKER_00: And it made me kind of take a step back when I was doing something as minimal as maintenance and say, well, you know, people really say, you know, this guy does a really good job.
• 10:29
  SPEAKER_00: So add maintenance.
• 10:30
  SPEAKER_00: And I want them to say that about me too.
• 10:33
  SPEAKER_00: So I would just kind of take notes from him.
• 10:35
  SPEAKER_00: And like I said, we you know, that was we probably started working about 12 or 13 years ago, and we still currently work together.
• 10:41
  SPEAKER_00: And it's great because we'll be on jobs and and his paperwork is phenomenal and it's always clear.
• 10:47
  SPEAKER_00: And you know, I'm sure you know elevator guide paperwork is always uh as fast as they can scribble at it together, is usually what it is.
• 10:53
  SPEAKER_00: But his is very thought out and it's uh always has the most accurate stuff, and he's very honest with what he's doing.
• 11:00
  SPEAKER_00: So if if you tell him you have eight hours to go do this and he finishes in five, he calls you in five at five and says, Where can where can we go next?
• 11:08
  SPEAKER_00: So it's really like working with those types of people that kind of inspired me.
• 11:12
  SPEAKER_00: And I, you know, I guess we probably started maybe it was probably about 15 years ago, we started together when I started at and at that company, we I had a lot of education and it you know kind of took me to the next level.
• 11:24
  SPEAKER_00: I worked with a gentleman who um he he repaired like circuit boards and um and elevator circuit boards and uh different types of problems.
• 11:33
  SPEAKER_00: He would get uh flown out to jobs all across the country to um troubleshoot.
• 11:38
  SPEAKER_00: And luckily for me, he was uh in a spot at a company where he was kind of a supervisor.
• 11:42
  SPEAKER_00: I don't really know if he had a title, but um he I worked with him uh for probably about um on and off for about a year, and he would uh eventually became like a manager and he was a field guy.
• 11:55
  SPEAKER_00: He always wanted to be on the field, he hated being in the office.
• 11:57
  SPEAKER_00: So he would come out with me a lot and uh just teach me these real nuances of certain types of elevators and certain types of just things that you would just never realize and you were never really taught.
• 12:09
  SPEAKER_00: It's not taught in any book.
• 12:11
  SPEAKER_00: And, you know, he kind of drove me to the next level, I feel like, in troubleshooting, with you know, kind of stepping back, taking a look at things that, you know, going back maybe like a two years in service calls and starting to see some trends and things along those lines.
• 12:26
  SPEAKER_00: He was very analytical about it.
• 12:28
  SPEAKER_00: He had no emotion when it came to troubleshooting.
• 12:32
  SPEAKER_00: It was just um, you know, let's let's look at all the facts and let's think about this like outside the box.
• 12:38
  SPEAKER_00: And when he did that, you know, it I still use it to this day.
• 12:42
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, I've been I have clients that we go all over the country for and we troubleshoot things that you know, maybe two or three elevator companies didn't necessarily have the time to do it, or they were just kind of rushed through.
• 12:55
  SPEAKER_00: And I mean it really like it makes Liberty look better because you know, we have that time and we and we are able to kind of be well-rounded and and take that um approach to it from outside the box and and you know, from an unbiased opinion.
• 13:10
  SPEAKER_00: And uh, my team now that I have on the consulting side at Liberty is a lot of people that I worked with in the past and guys that I like, you know, like that.
• 13:18
  SPEAKER_00: And all the time we get compliments from our clients and they're like, you know, that we had so many elevator companies out here they couldn't fix it.
• 13:25
  SPEAKER_00: And you know, Nick, he just look all he did was look at the service tickets and he was like, I know exactly what that is.
• 13:30
  SPEAKER_00: And and it's because of you know looking at that outside the box, and I think that's really, you know, having the book education and having education where you're working with people that have, you know, kind of done it all where they're you know fixing circuit boards instead of just replacing a circuit board so you really know what uh you know what you're looking at.
• 13:52
  SPEAKER_00: And sure most of my team in in consulting is guys that have been in construction.
• 13:57
  SPEAKER_00: So they you know they slung the rails, you know, they dug the hole and all the way up to the modernization side and and you know they've adjusted it all the way out.
• 14:05
  SPEAKER_00: So that's you know, really like the my passion is to have everybody is so well rounded that we can take care of everything.
• 14:14
  SPEAKER_00: Solve any problem.
• 14:14
  SPEAKER_00: Me personally can, yeah, we can solve your problem.
• 14:17
  SPEAKER_00: We're we're consultants, consultants.
• 14:19
  SPEAKER_00: I hate the word consultant because it's such a broad term, but really we're there as your elevator advocate, you know, and and that's what I want to be is somebody's elevator advocate so they don't have any problems.
• 14:29
  SPEAKER_00: And I just they just tell me to talk to whoever the elevator company is and we'll resolve it with them.
• 14:33
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah.
• 14:33
  SPEAKER_01: So let's let's back up for just a second.
• 14:35
  SPEAKER_01: Just curious, how how long were you in the field?
• 14:37
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, it sounds like you were certainly rubbing shoulders with all kinds of you know different people, learning from them and them from you and and um at what at what point uh well I guess first question, how long were you in the field as a mechanic?
• 14:51
  SPEAKER_00: Uh so next year will be my 20th year in elevators, I think.
• 14:56
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 14:57
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so I was uh I was in the field.
• 15:01
  SPEAKER_00: Um probably, I mean, in reality, I was in the field until I started at Liberty.
• 15:06
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but I was in the field as a construction mechanic from 2003 uh to about maybe like 2008 or nine.
• 15:16
  SPEAKER_00: Um and then I kind of I was still doing construction, I was doing construction and monetization, and then I moved into the service side um along that side.
• 15:24
  SPEAKER_00: Now, when I was on the construction and monetization side, I was an on-call mechanic.
• 15:29
  SPEAKER_00: And in between jobs, I would go on service calls and do maintenance.
• 15:33
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so it kind of started there, and that's kind of where I wanted to know.
• 15:36
  SPEAKER_00: I knew I wanted to be on the service side once I got a little taste of being on service calls, and you know, it's definitely a lot easier than carrying 18-pound rails, you know, across the, you know, curl across a building or down a block, down a city block.
• 15:49
  SPEAKER_00: But um, so I was there, I was from there until about 2008, 2009.
• 15:54
  SPEAKER_00: Then I kind of switched over to the service side.
• 15:56
  SPEAKER_00: When I was on the service side, I was still adjusting for the modernization crews um and um and the new construction.
• 16:04
  SPEAKER_00: Um, just because I I knew a lot of the inspectors and um just it being, you know, the code, I I knew took it upon myself to kind of start learning the code in the different jurisdictions and knowing that while you're right before you're going to take a test or do a test or final acceptance, it makes things a little bit easier, you know.
• 16:24
  SPEAKER_00: So um, so that until about 2000 and um I guess I was I was probably a service uh mechanic for till about 2012 or 13 and and I was in a supervisor, but it mostly field role then.
• 16:42
  SPEAKER_00: Um so you know, I was still working on elevators and being out in the field with the teams and and then 20 um maybe 13, 14, 15, it kind of started to slow down field work, but I was still mostly just like troubleshooting with the guys, even though I was still a supervisor.
• 16:58
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and then continue that that role until about 2018 when I switched over to Liberty and came on the consulting and inspection side of it.
• 17:08
  SPEAKER_01: So at what point did you did you have that that thought that, hey, I really want to get in on in on the consulting and inspection side, or or was it more of a an invitation from from a friend that said, hey, you want to look into this?
• 17:22
  SPEAKER_00: Sure.
• 17:22
  SPEAKER_00: So it's kind of a dual dual answer to that.
• 17:25
  SPEAKER_00: Um in about like around 2010, um, I had met a few consultants and uh met a few of inspectors, and it was kind of intrigued me.
• 17:36
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so they were third-party inspectors, I should say.
• 17:39
  SPEAKER_00: Most of the time I'd always worked with like AHJ um people that worked for the state.
• 17:43
  SPEAKER_00: And I knew I didn't really didn't want to go on that side of things, but um I met a couple of consultants at um some functions, some NAC functions, and uh really kind of intrigued me of what they're doing and you know the design side of it.
• 17:57
  SPEAKER_00: Um I always had an interest in CAD drawings and um writing and the specifications because being that adjuster, you know, you have not only adjusting punch out for the code, but you got to punch out for the, you know, as this consultant writes a 60-page specification, you have to read through it.
• 18:13
  SPEAKER_00: And I always was curious is like how it started, does you know, do you just start a blank page and somebody just start pecking away the keyboard, or is it, you know, is it set up in a certain way?
• 18:23
  SPEAKER_00: And um, I never really got an answer because the answer really was no, most of the time it's cut and pasted from different documents and things along those lines.
• 18:33
  SPEAKER_00: So um fast forward to about 20 uh 17.
• 18:38
  SPEAKER_00: Um I had uh talked with Chris, who's the president of Liberty, and we had worked together at our previous jobs and uh the job that I was currently still in at the time, and he was on the construction side and I was on the service side, and uh we had a great relationship because uh he was he was he was always thinking outside the box and he was always um you know taking on projects that were just you know, nobody had ever done it before, or you know, the company had definitely not done it before.
• 19:04
  SPEAKER_00: So um, you know, trying to finish that stuff, and I was always like, let me help because I really want like if it was something new, I wanted to learn about it.
• 19:12
  SPEAKER_00: So and I knew the service side was gonna take it on.
• 19:15
  SPEAKER_00: And Chris was awesome about kind of bringing everybody in and you know, looping everyone together um so that we were all on the same page because we knew that you know the service side eventually was gonna have to take this over, right?
• 19:25
  SPEAKER_00: And if it was a new product that nobody's ever done, where are we gonna get some training on it?
• 19:30
  SPEAKER_00: Who do we call?
• 19:31
  SPEAKER_00: You know, things along those lines.
• 19:32
  SPEAKER_00: And obviously Chris and I had some back and forth a lot, and uh, but the great part about him is is even though we may, you know, have disagreeing uh opinions on you know if we should put something in or if we shouldn't, um, you know, at the end of the day, we kind of reel it back in and and you know, we'll kind of get back on the same page because we were always on the same team.
• 19:53
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but you know, obviously different departments and construction consult our construction and uh service always kind of go back and forth.
• 19:59
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so I had that conversation with him in 17.
• 20:02
  SPEAKER_00: Um, he had had liberty for about um three years or so.
• 20:07
  SPEAKER_00: And um it was late, late in 17.
• 20:09
  SPEAKER_00: We had a conversation and uh we did sit on a couple of boards together for um, like I said, I sit on the board certification for NASA and I I can't remember what board it was, but we were at a conference together and we kind of had a little brief conversation and then um kind of helped we helped each other out on a project and um that kind of got the ball rolling and then um Chris is uh he's very driven and he started to acquire a bunch of a bunch of inspection companies and consulting companies, so he needed some uh management to to help out.
• 20:43
  SPEAKER_00: And um, we had a conversation and I was like, look, I really want to do this, but you know, I wanna there's consulting to me was kind of a older thing, and so was inspections.
• 20:56
  SPEAKER_00: There was a lot of you know retirement phase.
• 20:58
  SPEAKER_00: I said, uh Chris and I are actually two days apart.
• 21:01
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so we're saying about the same age.
• 21:03
  SPEAKER_00: So I was like, I want this to be, you know, kind of a different type of uh you know role.
• 21:08
  SPEAKER_00: And and that's what when he gave me his vision of it, um, of what he wants to do with not just liberty, but with these two types of services, you know, consulting and um inspections, it really kind of inspired me to jump on board and and figure out where we want to go.
• 21:24
  SPEAKER_00: And um, you know, everything we do kind of maybe upsets uh the flow of the norm in each of the industries, but it it's always for the better.
• 21:34
  SPEAKER_00: Um, you know, we talked about talked previously about the consulting side, and it was like, are guys just you know, how are they making these specifications?
• 21:41
  SPEAKER_00: Because some of them don't even make sense and things along those lines.
• 21:45
  SPEAKER_00: Well, we we were able to kind of make it our own, standardize it so our team can just, you know, go in there and enter the information that they need and things start to generate themselves, and you know, using the technology that we have to make.
• 22:00
  SPEAKER_00: things more accurate and at the same time save time.
• 22:04
  SPEAKER_00: So people that um it's hard to find people that are very good at uh you know Excel and um Word and things along the that have a lot of elevator experience because most of those guys are in the field.
• 22:16
  SPEAKER_00: So you don't have that experience.
• 22:19
  SPEAKER_00: And um we were able to kind of take that and move it into something that is is a little bit easier for someone that doesn't necessarily have the Microsoft platform down to a science, but they have elevators down to a science.
• 22:31
  SPEAKER_00: So that's really what we need.
• 22:33
  SPEAKER_00: And that's what we were able to do on the consulting side and the inspection side, you know, really just um getting in there and figuring out the ways to make it easier for the inspectors to you know get their reports in, find code, um, and then you know workflows, processes using admin teams instead of having the inspector do all that stuff because that's where they're more reliable at.
• 22:55
  SPEAKER_01: Right, right.
• 22:55
  SPEAKER_01: Let's let's um let's say what what you mentioned is kind of coming out of the different angle and and obviously we're talking a little bit about automation.
• 23:03
  SPEAKER_01: Is that one of the things that you did differently or you know what what well I guess the question is what are the things that that Liberty does differently from some of the others in the industry?
• 23:14
  SPEAKER_00: Sure.
• 23:14
  SPEAKER_00: So um and this is what I believe you know um so when we're talking about let's talk about modernization specifications and um and the design side of modern modernizations we were able to basically um take a document and have it so you only have to put in most of the information once.
• 23:33
  SPEAKER_00: So if it you know you're talking about uh building ABC we put this information in once and it generates it throughout the whole document.
• 23:41
  SPEAKER_00: So when you see a lot of specification documents I know this sounds odd but you see a lot of specification documents and they'll say the top of it will say building ABC and then as you get down somewhere in the middle of it it'll say at building QRF and the wrong dot because nobody went through the whole document because they were copying past and things.
• 24:02
  SPEAKER_00: So you know and that and that's where the the difference is and and having the the resources um there at basically on your screen to show you um if you're talking about um what type of door operator to put in there.
• 24:19
  SPEAKER_00: There's obviously linear and um mechanical and there's different uh you know the waterproof ones and we have that language set up um so it's already in the document and you just need to bring it to the front.
• 24:32
  SPEAKER_00: So you choose which one you want to use for each specific thing but you have to choose it so it doesn't you don't see like three different options which own specifications you see because something left over from from some other document.
• 24:46
  SPEAKER_00: Yep exactly and and that's like the you know it was always my biggest pet peeve was well it says you know on page three it says this but on page you know 15 it contradicts itself.
• 24:56
  SPEAKER_00: So you know what which one is it?
• 24:58
  SPEAKER_00: What are we talking about and you know narrowing that down and and having that set up and um we luckily Liberty has had a ton of um acquisitions so we've kept almost all the personnel from all those people unless they retired.
• 25:12
  SPEAKER_00: Usually it was uh somebody was retiring but um people like um Bill Snyder he he's a um well known consultant uh liberty acquired his company in 2019 and and he spent the time to put all those actual information in there and actual code um you know just for uh Florida alone they use different keys for fire service in different areas and I mean there's I think there's nine different regions that they use different keys for so you have to have the right key for the right county that you're in and things along those lines.
• 25:43
  SPEAKER_00: So instead of it just saying use the right key for this county it says the specific things and that's where it holds people accountable because in the when the specification is too generic it kind of brings people like to change orders and our goal is to never have a change order on a wow that's that's a big uh that's a big goal because yeah I hear about change orders all the time.
• 26:08
  SPEAKER_00: It is and that's you know that's like our biggest pitch is is we'll make sure you don't have any change orders if you're using if you agree to use our specification um and allow our terms to all be in there most likely you will not have a a change order and and like I said using somebody like Bill that be in there and you know just say for Florida because it's a you know regional in there like if he has all the different nuances in there and he has all the different Florida has their own uh elevator statute so using that um and having somebody like that that knows all the information for each of those states is is really good because it it will it's already in there it's already available to you so you don't have to you know copy and paste it from somewhere else it's you just bring it to the front or leave it in there um but it it allows for the document to be very accurate and very specific.
• 27:02
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah yeah exactly and the and the the generic part of it is is what everybody else does and Liberty is trying to be very specific about it.
• 27:11
  SPEAKER_00: I don't like being generic right so but being specific about it and being um as accurate as we can in in each of those states and even you know when it comes to time how how long is this project going to take you know adding liquidated damages in there so that if it takes over you know we say it's gonna take 180 days then you better be in there 180 days and your team can't pull off you know things along those lines.
• 27:33
  SPEAKER_00: Now granted you know we go the same side we want to help the elevator companies out.
• 27:38
  SPEAKER_00: So you know we allow for some type of notification process if there's things that that are going to slow it down you know especially right now with all the supply chain issues.
• 27:48
  SPEAKER_00: But you know it's it's really making sure that the client's going to pay the customer and that at the same time the the client or the I'm sorry the client's going to pay the elevator company and at the same time the elevator company is going to do what they say they're gonna do.
• 28:04
  SPEAKER_00: And um you know it it becomes a problem too with you know without with payments.
• 28:10
  SPEAKER_00: I'm sure you you know elevator companies I wouldn't want want to see their DSO but elevator companies probably have all sorts of outstanding invoices from you know punch lists and and stuff like that.
• 28:20
  SPEAKER_00: And we push the client to pay because we want to be able to use these great elevator companies, you know, because some elevator companies won't work with clients and they're usually clients we won't work with either but sometimes we're in a position where the client hasn't paid the elevator company and and we're the advocate for the elevator company even though technically the client is our client.
• 28:41
  SPEAKER_00: So we're trying to help both sides of it.
• 28:43
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah talk talk a little bit more about and you and I have you know in our other conversation talk about the balancing act that you walk between between the client the and the I guess the elevator company when you're when you're a consultant you you it seems to me from looking outside of the very fine line that you're walking and you talk a little bit about kind of holding both sides accountable what does it what does that look like from your perspective?
• 29:12
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah it's I mean it's it's my everyday right and then my consulting side can definitely vouch for that is you know we we want to use all all the best elevator companies but you know sometimes a client's already in um a long-term contract with somebody and and we need to build that relationship with them and we're not there to just come in and start bullying because in reality most elevator company contracts are pretty solid and there's they're very generic so they don't really necessarily have to do all the things that the client wants or if you know liberty comes in and says we would like you to do these these 10 things most of the times they don't actually have to do it.
• 29:51
  SPEAKER_00: However if you come in there with the you know approach of look we're trying to build this relationship and the client's unhappy but most of the time these clients if they have one elevator they have 50.
• 30:02
  SPEAKER_00: So if we're coming in there we want to build this relationship up because the elevator company and the uh client they probably all just want to pay one invoice right we just want to throw everything on one invoice they only have to pay one elevator contractor makes things easier you know you always have one point of contact so how can we get you back on the same page both the elevator company and the client how can we get everybody back on the same page to a lot of times it's a miscommunication there you know the client is emailing the salesperson because that's who they had their initial conversation with.
• 30:37
  SPEAKER_00: So they're and the salesperson you know he's just forwarding it and he's probably not even forwarding it to the right person because some of these people are multi-states and it's just not going.
• 30:46
  SPEAKER_00: So setting up a line of communication between the three of us and looping our team in so that we can see that things are getting done and holding both sides accountable.
• 30:56
  SPEAKER_00: So we've seen a ton of times where the elevator company is like we don't have any service calls and they're like well I called the mechanic and you're like well yes you called the mechanic however the mechanic is not the person that you know takes the service call.
• 31:09
  SPEAKER_00: So he probably already is he's probably waiting for you to call them the elevator company so that we can basically like have a service call on record but it doesn't happen and we see that a lot and that's really you know trying to mesh everybody together you know and that's with the companies that we don't um or that it isn't on the whole Liberty elevator program.
• 31:34
  SPEAKER_00: That's you know the best approach that we take is kind of opening up the lines of communication and seeing where where we can kind of take it.
• 31:41
  SPEAKER_00: And uh 80% of the time it works and they we kind of get um a good response from both sides and everybody buys into it.
• 31:52
  SPEAKER_00: And that's really what we want is everybody to buy into what's going on and what's going to happen because even if you're locked in a long-term contract with a client you don't want to have a bad relationship with you because you're never going to get any other work.
• 32:06
  SPEAKER_00: And most of these building owners recommend I mean that's how we get a lot of stuff is we don't do a lot of advertising.
• 32:12
  SPEAKER_00: So you know all of our stuff is word of mouth and so are elevator companies you know that it's not like they you know have an ad on TV because you would never get to the right people.
• 32:22
  SPEAKER_02: Sure.
• 32:22
  SPEAKER_00: So you know word of mouth and saying a lot of times what we hear is somebody has an elevator company already they call us and we get in a mix and they're like well my friend at such and such you know building ownership they use this company can we start using this company and you know we obviously will work with them in whatever way but you hear it a lot because somebody's always recommending somebody else and um you know we're doing a project in the Carolinas and somebody recommended a company that we've never worked with before.
• 32:51
  SPEAKER_00: So but they have so many buildings with them that clearly they must be doing something right.
• 32:57
  SPEAKER_00: So you know we started talking to them and we and we met with them personally to figure out you know what kind of service they provide and and kind of got some projects behind them.
• 33:05
  SPEAKER_00: And here you know some of our clients on our third party inspection side use them.
• 33:10
  SPEAKER_00: So you know they have a good reputation so you know we can all kind of work together.
• 33:15
  SPEAKER_00: And that's really the the thing about it is just trying to work you know trying to find that balance like you said and and really get everybody to buy in but if we on our side of it when we have a blank slate and we get to use the Liberty program which has a pretty in-depth uh maintenance specification right um I feel that a lot of elevator companies like to use it because it is not for the low bidder um it's for somebody that wants to have a lot of hours in and luckily for them is our contract says how many hours you need to be on site and that's what we want you to you know bid it at and we want you to you know we don't want you to bid it to try and be lower than the next person.
• 34:00
  SPEAKER_00: Most likely if we're asking you to bid something it's because we feel that you know you're very capable of doing this and and you put out a really good product.
• 34:08
  SPEAKER_00: So uh for us, you know if it's a just a two-stop hydro it's got an hour of maintenance but that's for one elevator.
• 34:15
  SPEAKER_00: So if there's two it's you know two two hours and we want you to bid it like that because you're held accountable.
• 34:21
  SPEAKER_00: And if you don't go there for those one hours then you lose money that month and it gets kicked back to the client and they get credited you know a certain percent.
• 34:28
  SPEAKER_00: But at the same time it's you know that's the hour that we wanted you to bid it.
• 34:33
  SPEAKER_00: So sometimes we see we see that elevators are um you know maybe$50 to a hundred dollars higher than what they previously were per month.
• 34:43
  SPEAKER_00: And you know we have that conversation with our clients is this is why and sometimes it's less uh money because you know they know that it's gonna be a bulk buy and if you're you know do a really good job with this at this location you're gonna get more but even when it's a little bit higher the client almost appreciates it because they know that they're gonna have somebody there every month you're not gonna hear I never see the elevator company because that's a you know a not new trend but a a trend that's been happening for a while in the elevator industry is you know 250 plus units on an elevator mechanic that doesn't fly with you know a lot of these people that they get a bad reputation they get bad Google reviews from you know their hotel or apartment building people don't want to move in or rent rooms because the elevator is making noise or the elevator is you know shut down all the time and to me maintenance solves almost every issue you know if you're actually doing the maintenance on the checklist you're gonna find 99% of the problems is going on now things happen you know crazy little board issues happen and things along those lines but you can start to see you know if the elevator is starting to lean a little bit or if they're you know starting to clip some door locks you see that at maintenance.
• 35:58
  SPEAKER_00: If you're not there you're not going to see it.
• 36:00
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 36:00
  SPEAKER_00: And as you're rushed around for a service call you're not going to see it either so you know that's being there on site with a you know a no rush kind of you know just kind of have that ability to sit there and can say you know ride the elevator, get on top, see what's going on and know that you have a whole hour to do this you know on an elevator and you might only have 20 minutes worth of stuff to do but then you can start to look around and you know figure some stuff out.
• 36:25
  SPEAKER_00: And you know we go back to the gentleman I worked with uh that does the best maintenance ever.
• 36:29
  SPEAKER_00: I kid you not he had the least amount of service calls for and had the most amount of elevators on his route and he had the least amount of service calls on his route because he always did maintenance you know he never had something in his door track.
• 36:42
  SPEAKER_00: He always took care of the money bump on the by the door lock and you know he was always taking care of that door track and kind of making sure he would always hit it with a piece of sandpaper and it was something that we would see all the time in the city because maintenance just never got done in the city and in Philadelphia and it was just his they took his work ethic or I took his work ethic and pushed it on to the next uh the mechanic or mechanic that kind of took over the route in Philadelphia and all of a sudden the call started dropping because they they got to spend that amount of time in there and that's really what it is is obviously elevator owners want hours right they want that's the only way they can bill so if you're if you say to them assume that you have to do these this one hour you get to bill for it put it in your maintenance monthly maintenance number and then put on you know on top for material and things along those lines but put those hours in there so because I want you to bill for it each month.
• 37:40
  SPEAKER_00: I mean it's recurring revenue that's every business owner's dream is to you know I'm we're not I'm not asking you to to chase somebody to the bottom on this number I want you to you know really be accurate and and really be uh you know put the hours in for what's going to be a good job and get get paid for for doing a good job right exactly yep yep so with this program we've uh we've seen about a 30% reduction in service calls in that I think it's 33 point nine or something as of a couple weeks ago but um for the small pieces that we're able to look at um you know we obviously different clients but we take a snapshot of each of them and that's what it is and you know it's a on they're just numbers so it's nothing that you know we can't can't adjust them or or we're not taking a wag at it.
• 38:28
  SPEAKER_00: It's an actual number and it the great part about it is it's it's from different types of um buildings.
• 38:35
  SPEAKER_00: So it's hotels, it's condos, apartments um and commercial style buildings that you know we're seeing this reduction in.
• 38:43
  SPEAKER_00: So maintenance is really the the thing and I uh years ago when I started at one of the elevator companies the owner told me like if you can basically get in there and actually do maintenance you'll save money long term.
• 39:01
  SPEAKER_00: So having 250 routes and this was kind of during that uh beginning of that whole thing where some people were you know pushing those 150 to 250 unit routes I mean you will you will save money because running guys service call guys costs a lot more money than maintenance guys right especially on the you know on the uh open shop style companies those guys cost a lot more money so if you could just run those guys run those maintenance guys around and actually get you know get a program in place where you're you know holding your guys accountable for doing their work you're gonna see a great reduction in um in service calls and nighttime callbacks and that's when people really start to get aggravated sure when the nighttime callbacks and their labor gets really expensive too right yep exactly and you know some contracts some it's included or you're only getting the difference in the pay so you know uh if it's uh you know the company's hourly rate is$200 then you know it's$300 for a service call for you know time and a half but they're only getting$100 because they only get the difference in the pay.
• 40:11
  SPEAKER_00: So if you don't have shutdown, you know it's more beneficial you know now obviously some contracts it's not included and the elevator company just gets the bill but you're starting to see the trend where it's you know you're usually just covering the difference.
• 40:24
  SPEAKER_00: So you're just covering that um 50% of the of the time and a half.
• 40:29
  SPEAKER_01: Right, right.
• 40:30
  SPEAKER_01: So that's and and you're we're kind of with with a question for you what would you what would I do a lot of people do after you retire.
• 40:55
  SPEAKER_00: That's not the case what would you what would you offer to something that's coming after that sure um definitely education um get your certifications you know a lot of the certifications have um an an S a supervisor to add on to that to it so you get it um so if you get your QEI um big component against QEI you get a QEI then you get the QEI supervisor after that um because it's more education hours each year so you get to learn more things um you know dealing with the code is one thing and then dealing with personnel is another thing.
• 41:31
  SPEAKER_00: So you know if you have that ability to to train in in each of those aspects I think it'll make you a great elevator person and a great person in general to work with.
• 41:40
  SPEAKER_00: So the education portion of it is and having an open mind.
• 41:46
  SPEAKER_00: We I talk about a lot with my team and some of the guys that I've worked with for years joke around about sometimes when they were um on the server side we would tell them to go do something that just sounded really odd when they were troubleshooting and they're like that there's no way it's not related you know it's not even in the area of what we're you know looking at like what are you talking about?
• 42:05
  SPEAKER_00: And then they go and do it and they see that it there's an instant change to the elevator and whatever problem was going.
• 42:10
  SPEAKER_00: And it's not for me.
• 42:12
  SPEAKER_00: It wasn't for me.
• 42:13
  SPEAKER_00: I learned that from somebody you know I learned those weird odd troubleshooting skills and and so it doesn't matter whether you're looking at the code or you're looking at troubleshooting or you know you're looking at design you know keep an open mind about everything and really allow for change.
• 42:29
  SPEAKER_00: Obviously control the change and help you know be involved instead of complaining about something just be involved in whatever's going on.
• 42:36
  SPEAKER_00: Okay if you want you know if you don't think it's a good idea explain yourself instead of just saying it's not a good idea.
• 42:43
  SPEAKER_00: Get involved in the conversation and figure out what everybody's opinion is and then try and work it out so that it's going to work for everybody so that everybody is involved and you know if you're not involved in what's going on then you can't help change it.
• 42:57
  SPEAKER_00: So and if you want to change it to a certain way I mean get involved get get involved in any type of committees out there there's elevator committees um there's code committees the code committees are there well they're always looking for help um I'm part of the um national uh the ESF EESF which is the elevator and escalator safety foundation uh get involved in that I mean I know that's that's just for dealing with riding public the safety of riding public but get involved in that because those people are you get to have conversations with people from all over the country and that's what getting involved really does is it opens you up to speaking with people that you probably would never speak with if you just wanted to stay, you know if you're just your route mechanic and you know you're not really getting involved in anything else and all those things I'm sure most employees or I'm sorry employers would love for to say we have an employee that's part of this board.
• 43:51
  SPEAKER_00: So get involved and and uh with the education side with certification side and all of the you know elevator little things that are going on like any has tons of committees.
• 44:02
  SPEAKER_00: People have all sorts of groups.
• 44:04
  SPEAKER_00: You know, there's always obviously always golf foundings that are involved in those things.
• 44:07
  SPEAKER_00: But, you know, there's a it's a there's a fun aspect to it and it kind of makes life a little more enjoyable when you get to be involved in the change and you get to see it.
• 44:17
  SPEAKER_00: It makes the job more fun and it makes it, you know, you have that passion and that's what it, you know, kind of how, you know, I realized that this was it for me.
• 44:25
  SPEAKER_00: I want to be in elevators for a long time and be being involved in all these little boards.
• 44:30
  SPEAKER_00: I first one of the first boards I got involved in was um in NAC, it was their safety committee and and it was fun.
• 44:37
  SPEAKER_00: You know, we got to share videos, we got to um give presentations, we were doing um round tables and it was, you know, the things I got to hear from these guys I was in Philadelphia, but I was at a round table with somebody from California.
• 44:52
  SPEAKER_00: You know, it was, you know, we got to hear the differences, but at the same time, a couple weeks later, we were having a problem with some elevator that is manufactured in California and I never worked on before and there wasn't any other ones on the East Coast.
• 45:05
  SPEAKER_00: And so I called that gentleman and he walked me through how to you know reset a fault code or something along those lines.
• 45:11
  SPEAKER_00: So you know being involved expands everything.
• 45:14
  SPEAKER_00: You know one, you get to you know meet new people, but two, you really get to um get more way more information about elevators and definitely take it takes you to another level.
• 45:25
  SPEAKER_00: And you'll see a lot of the people that are involved in all these things are have a really good name, they have a really good reputation.
• 45:32
  SPEAKER_00: And the the best part about it is they're having fun in the industry and that's really what it's all about.
• 45:38
  SPEAKER_00: Everybody wants to go to work and have fun and I want to go to work and have fun.
• 45:41
  SPEAKER_00: So you know meeting all these new people we were just at the elevator um the consultants convention um in uh Minnesota a couple weeks ago and I got to meet a ton of people that I've never met before and I you know I thought I'd met everybody that's involved in all these things and I had never been to that convention before.
• 45:57
  SPEAKER_00: So I got to meet a ton of new people um got to see people that I you know don't normally don't get to see but I mean there's so many friendships that I got to develop from people that are all across the country um you know in Texas and Alabama and you know everywhere it's it's incredible that we get to do that.
• 46:15
  SPEAKER_00: And so if you want to be on the consulting side I say get involved in things because consultants are the ones that drive you know how elevators are going to be installed and what the specification is going to look like.
• 46:25
  SPEAKER_00: So if you're involved on every aspect and whether it's code or construction um you know or even safety um I love um safety like actual worker safety.
• 46:35
  SPEAKER_00: So for for me I was involved in a lot of the safety things for construction industry not necessarily elevators.
• 46:40
  SPEAKER_00: You'd be very surprised how many spots they leave open for elevator contractors because none of the elevator contractors are involved in a lot of these big construction safety forums or even big large conventions for construction.
• 46:56
  SPEAKER_00: They you know that's just there's not a lot of elevator people so there's not always a um somebody looking to be in those spots so there's tons of opportunity to you know get involved and you know you really expand your career when you're involved in things that nobody else was involved in before.
• 47:11
  SPEAKER_01: That's great.
• 47:11
  SPEAKER_01: That's great.
• 47:12
  SPEAKER_01: Good advice and Joe, thank you so much for your time.
• 47:14
  SPEAKER_01: It's been a pleasure wish you the very best all right thanks for having me look forward talking soon.
• 47:20
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you for listening to the Elevator Careers Podcast sponsored by the All Red Group in Elevator Industries you can check us out online at elevatorcareers.net