Latest / BREAK/FIX the Motorsports & Vehicle Enthusiast Variety Show / Evening With A Legend: David Murry

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Evening With A Legend: David Murry · BREAK/FIX the Motorsports & Vehicle Enthusiast Variety Show

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Evening with a Legend is a series of presentations exclusive to
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Legends of the Famous 24 Hours of Le Mans, giving us an opportunity
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to bring a piece of Le Mans to you.
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By sharing stories and highlights of the big event, you get a chance
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to become part of the legend of Le Mans, with guests from different
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eras of over 100 years of racing.
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Tonight, we have an opportunity to bring a piece of Le Mans to
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you, sharing in the legend of Le Mans with guests from different
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eras of over 100 years of racing.
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And as your host, I'm delighted to introduce David Murray, whose career
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began in Formula Fords, leading to the Sports Renault series, and
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then driving everything he could get his hands on from 1981 to 1991.
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He won numerous races in the 85 Sports Renault Championship.
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And in 1991, he saw the beginning of his long term relationship with manufacturers
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like Lotus, Porsche, and BMW, contracting him to drive the infamous BMW M3 GTR.
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And in 1998, he began his journey to win at Le Mans with four
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attempts from 1998 through 2011.
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And with that, I'm your host.
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Crew chief, Eric from the motoring podcast network, welcoming everyone
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to this evening with the legend and David, welcome to the show.
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Thanks very much.
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I heard a lot about it.
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I'm looking forward to being on.
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I appreciate you having me.
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You've been racing for quite a number of years, building
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up your skills and reputation.
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Talk us through the early days and how you got to Le Mans in 1998 with Porsche.
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How was that deal put together?
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What led to it?
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To you going to lama.
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Was that always a goal?
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Absolutely not.
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This was the real odd part, but my whole world started.
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I was doing autocross.
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I had a Fiat X one nine.
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I bought brand new in 1975.
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Wasn't very smart.
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I thought, I can't afford to do this.
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So when I started racing on the track, I had to sell it because I didn't have time
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to work on that and the race car as well.
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But I did that autocross.
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Got my feet wet, but it was frustrating to be at the autocross all day
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long and do three one minute runs.
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So I said, gotta be better, work your job, save my money, bought a Formula Ford.
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And I did that.
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And the first session was 20 minutes long.
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It was more than I'd driven in a whole year.
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I'm hooked.
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All the guys I raced against from Mike Andretti to Chip Robinson, Drake Olson,
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all those guys went on to do great things.
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And I just knew that was where I wanted to be because that to me
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was the ladder to F1, which was my desire at the time, my goals.
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I thought, well, being a poor American, how would I get to F1?
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I traced it backwards.
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So the step before that would be IndyCar.
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And then the step before that would either be Formula Super V, which some of the
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guys like Chip Robinson, those guys did, or would it be through Imsa's GTP series?
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When I was racing in the spec race for Sport Renault, I started even back in
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Formula Ford days, as soon as I got my car, I started looking for sponsorship.
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And I was calling everybody on the planet and go, will you sponsor me?
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No, no, no, no.
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And one of the last calls after.
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four years of Formula Ford was to Joyce Julius, who was a VP at Domino's Pizza.
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And she said, yeah, I think we can.
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I'm like, did you just say what I thought you did?
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And so she said, yes, we're going to do Indy B Series.
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Had me go talk to Doug Shearson about doing that.
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Well, Doug came to the race at Detroit.
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We did the support race for F1 and Got to know a little bit
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talking about some of the stuff.
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The budget went away when Danny Sullivan went to Penske and had a half
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a million dollar budget for his salary.
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So they got John Paul Jr.
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So they had that much money to do Indy B Series.
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But then John had to go serve time in jail for his dad, poor guy.
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And so then they got Al Junior to drive, salary went back up.
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So now we did spec race for Fort Renault back in the day called that.
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So did that.
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But when asked Doug, I said, how do I get to IndyCar?
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Would you rather have a driver that did Super V?
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Or would you rather have a driver that did GTP?
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And he said GTP because of the horsepower.
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So that guided me towards the IMSA route.
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And so I went to all the IMSA races after those four years of Formula Ford and
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one year of Spec Racer, slept in my car.
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I couldn't afford a hotel and talked to every team owner I could.
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Can I drive your car?
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And they said, do you have any money?
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I said, no.
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They said, we'll beat it.
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After two years, I think I drove a Mini Metro, but it was a Metro, MG Metro Turbo.
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And we put a sticker on it, GTUU, because it was so slow.
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It was under the GTU category.
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My first IMSA race ever, Ken Madren, Mark's Buick GTP car in
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1986 at the finale at Daytona.
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He let me drive it.
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Funny enough, I was testing my Ford one day and his son was there and
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somebody else said, gee, why don't you let his son drive your car?
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I can't afford to have anything happen to it.
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I don't have any money.
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I'm working two jobs to make it five races a year.
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So I did anyway, and Ken remembered it.
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He wasn't even there, but some must have told great people
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and he wanted to help me.
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So he actually let me drive his GTP car with him at Daytona.
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So that was the beginning of EMSA.
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And of course, then you'd go around asking for rides, nothing happened.
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And finally, after teaching for Skip Barber, one of my students said, if
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I buy a race car, will you race it?
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That was a Camaro that we ended up racing in Firehawk.
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Then the slow process of moving through EMSA, but the goal was still, how do I
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get to F1 or IndyCar or whatever else?
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As I got further into IMSA and did more and more racing, Doc Bundy was racing for
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Hendrick Motorsports and the GTP Corvette.
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When that program ended, the active suspension was made by Lotus.
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So he convinced Lotus to come back in where they're a spree
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in Supercar and World Challenge.
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And he got me a drive with that, which was great.
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So that was how I got introduced to Porsche.
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And then Porsche hired me to run the world challenge series, which we won
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the championship in 1995 for that.
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Then as we went on, they decided they were going to run Le Mans.
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Well, I didn't know they were going to run 1997 at the Porsche banquet
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in Germany, Alvin Springer, head of Motorsport North America for Porsche.
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Porsche was there and he said, do you want to test at Daytona?
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Yeah, of course I did.
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Okay.
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So that was in November.
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Then in January for the pre Daytona race back then, the roar, they
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were testing it at a dozen dollars.
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Alan McNish was their factory driver.
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And then they had all these other drivers from Europe and Danny
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Sullivan was there and Mule was there.
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All these guys were there testing.
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So I went to Alvin.
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I was there actually running with Jim Matthews.
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That was 1998, the beginning of the year.
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And I was driving his LMP one car, the Raleigh Scott.
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Yeah.
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And I saw Alvin there and I said, so Alvin, when do I drive?
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Oh, you still want to do that?
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Well, of course I do.
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So he said, see that motor home?
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Go talk to him.
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That was Herbert Ampfer, who was the head of Porsche Motorsport worldwide.
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He said, just trust me.
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And Alvin was really on our side and pushed for me and tried to help me.
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So I went there and talked to Ampfer.
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I said, you know, I really like to drive for you.
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He said, well, North America is behind me, Fred Schwab, because
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they want us to have Americans in the car so they can sell more cars.
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So I came back out and a little bit later, he didn't give me an answer.
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And Alvin came back up on the last day.
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I said, okay.
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You're going to get in the car with a brand new set of tires and
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you're going to get five laps.
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And then you're going to get out of the car a little bit later.
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You get another set of new tires and get in the car, do another five laps.
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That's it.
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And I had no idea what the test was for.
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So I said, okay, well, of course the plan was from them.
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Give him 10 laps.
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He won't go fast because he won't have time.
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We'll say, I told you so, and it'll all be over.
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Well, I was pretty motivated and the Roar team that I ran for in the World
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Challenge Series 95 was running the car.
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Brad Kettler was the crew chief, Jochen was there, the whole team.
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John Wright was on the team, and Alvin looked at me and said, You don't hold
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back, you drive as hard as you can.
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And of course, I had still been in the LMP1 car all week, so I had time.
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I hadn't driven carbon brakes, hadn't driven the GT, it was a 96 GT1 car.
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And I went and I did my first five laps.
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And it got out of the car and these guys were driving the car for three days.
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To be fair, they probably didn't have a lot of time each one, because they
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were splitting the car with 12 people.
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So I got my five laps and came in and it looked at times I was
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already midfield in the 12 guys.
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I'm like, that's plenty more to go.
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And Alan McNish was great.
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He, I said, you know, what's different about carbon brakes.
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He helped me out a little bit here.
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I just told me a few things.
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So I got back out in the car and I went out and drove my next
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five laps, but the checker flag fell after four for the weekend.
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So I think I only got four laps, still went quicker than everybody,
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including Alan by like a half second.
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And of course they didn't want it.
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So then Alvin calls me in a week and says, you're not hired, but
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we'll give you another test in South France, Val de Vienne.
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So I went there and went quicker than everybody, except for
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Alan, who was getting out of the car, puffing pretty hard.
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So you're trying pretty hard this time.
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He goes F and A.
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So he was trying really hard to go fast.
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That went well.
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Then they hired me for Le Mans and that was the first time I
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even knew what the test was for.
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I didn't know what I was testing for.
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We went back home for Le Mans, and that time, it was actually pre qualifying.
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You had to qualify for the race.
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It wasn't invitational.
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It was pre invitational.
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And so, when you went there in May, which was a month before
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the race, you had to qualify.
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Well, we had gone to Paul Ricard to test.
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And the funny thing there, too, is I'm just lowering the car.
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I've never been the driver.
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Paul car before we had one GT one, the nine six GT one, where they were running
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four cars in Lamar, right two of each.
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Two of open LMP ones, two GT one cars.
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So they had the 12 drivers, three from each car out there to do
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a 24 hour test in the GT one.
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This is the first time the LMP one car had rolled out.
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McKay TTA was driving that car and Stephan New Hansen was there 'cause
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they were gonna drive together.
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I was the first one to drive.
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Both cars and Europeans are a different approach than Americans.
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They wanna go faster than the co-driver of the car.
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They don't care about anything else.
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They were trying to be fast to each other.
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I was just getting used to the car on the track.
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Somebody had set a lap baseline and one driver, I won't say who it
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was, was German and went like two seconds faster than everybody else.
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And of course, Porsche's going, yeah, yeah, yeah.
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It's the German, yeah, yeah.
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One of the other guys, Michael Bartles overlays the data.
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And Michael's fast from this guy all the way until they get down the back
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straightaway, where they had a makeshift chicane to simulate Le Mans with cones.
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Well, funny, his steering didn't change.
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And he went like 20 miles an hour faster than anybody through there.
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Pretty clear.
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He was blowing the skein off, said, don't do that anymore.
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And anyway, test didn't work because the gearbox had some problems.
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They couldn't run it, but I drove the LP one car got along really well
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with the Yost guys and Ralph Yutner.
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And McKaylee was the nicest racer I've ever met in my life.
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And so he actually treated me with respect, which I didn't expect.
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I made the gum in his shoe.
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You know, here's an F1 Ferrari driver.
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And same thing for Stephan Johansson.
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You know, at the end of the day, after we did that, they slotted me to drive with
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McKinley Alvareta and Stephan Johansson at Le Mans, the biggest event in the planet.
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And so we went for the test at Le Mans.
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It was raining and drying up, so you couldn't afford to have anybody in
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the car except one person because the track was changing so rapidly.
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So McKinley was the only one that drove.
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and they were having me d but then I'd have to driv So they didn't have
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me dr I didn't drive them all a So there's a lot of testi two years, 97
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to 98 leadi did a lot of racing in th done any actual racing in that point?
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That was my f For pre qualifying May and street clothes, people go, Oh,
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David Murray, David Murray had no idea how big the event was because
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being American, honestly, and I appreciate it now, and that's what
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was great about going back in 2011.
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Talk about that.
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But I had no idea how big Lamar was because I said I was testing for portions.
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Didn't know what for.
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And then when it went there in May, I'm just kind of slowly getting a grasp
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of how big of an event it really is.
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You know, you go to a restaurant and they go, Pilat, Pilat.
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I'm like, what?
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Yes, I'm a, oh, pilot.
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Yes, I'm a driver.
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Because we call drivers, right?
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So all the culture and all those things over there, but slowly you start to get
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encompassed in just how big this event is.
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But you're still under the pressure of representing the factor of
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the biggest race in the world.
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You don't have time to really enjoy it and absorb it.
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You're just doing your job.
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Testing in May, and then you kind of jump forward to June to the actual race.
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It's a whole different circus, let's call it that, when the fans are there,
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and you have all, you know, the booths.
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and all the things that happened and the music and the festivals and all that.
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So your impressions of Le Mans when it came down to practice and
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qualifying and the race itself, what were your impressions of it?
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Was it as intimidating as everybody says it is?
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I've been racing for about 20 something years before that.
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And you think, okay, I've been to every track in the world.
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planet.
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This track, the atmosphere, the track itself is different because the corners
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himself, except for the force occurs in Indianapolis, are nothing spectacular.
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I would say not their diminishing at all.
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They're great corners, but they're not anything like super.
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But the straightaways, your approach speed is so high that now you're
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breaking from 200 miles an hour.
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And even though Daytona has one like that, you're sitting there riding
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it forever at 200 miles an hour.
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And you're waiting, did I go by the restaurant yet?
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Or the little bar?
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Because you're worried you're going to miss that, and then you're on top
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of the corner before you know it.
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You can't stop.
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But when I first went in pre qualifying, before I went over,
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I knew I was going to do Le Mans.
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So I wanted to learn the track.
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Well there was no videos or sims or any that kind of stuff.
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So I actually went and they have a VHS video called NCAR 956.
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And it has all the tracks from the NCAR 956.
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So I got that tape and now I'm looking at this tape which has a lot
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of tracks on it from NCAR from 956.
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And I'm looking, nope can't be it because the straightaway is not long enough.
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Nope.
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Nope.
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Nope.
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Watch finally get to Lamar, which I don't know what Lamar even looks like.
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And here we go on the straightaway and they get the fifth gear,
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which is top gear back then.
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And they're going 200 something miles an hour.
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And it just keeps going and going.
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I remember today watching that video for the very first time and laughing out loud.
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I say, I know there's a kink in the middle.
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We haven't gotten that yet.
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And so it was huge how long this straightaway was and that video
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had lapsed before the chicanes.
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So that's why it was like super long.
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And so anyway, so I got this video and I took and copied it from the VHS tape
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to an eight millimeter tape so I could bring my little camera, little eight
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millimeter camera with me everywhere.
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I have one lap and I'd sit there and watch it to where my eye would
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get red from looking at the video and watching on airplanes and
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non stop so I'd get to the track.
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My very first time, and this is before the track goes green in May pre qualifying,
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and the streets are still open.
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So I'm going to take my rental car, and I'm going to drive around
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the track to get a feel of what it really looks like in person.
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Down the mall sign, I'm going, okay, I'm getting ready for the right hander,
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and all of a sudden, it's a left hander.
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Well, next one's supposed to be a right hander.
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It's a left hander.
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I'm opposite.
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What?
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I have no idea where I'm at now.
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All that studying is nothing.
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Oh, I'm going the wrong way.
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So I turned around, went the other way, And it all made sense.
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So that helped me a tremendous amount.
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So pre qualifying was learning to track and I had no idea what to expect.
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Even watching the videos and you think, okay, I know Indianapolis is gonna be
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really fast and I was planning for that.
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I had no idea how fast the Porsche curves would be.
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I guess John Dous, he was having issues and so he ended up, he
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wanted to drive the GT one.
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There wasn't a seat for him, so then he wanted to drive the LMP one car.
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He wanted to drive with Michaela Alberta and Stef Hansen.
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And so Porsche asked me would I move over to the other car, which
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was James Weaver and Pier Raffael.
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And I said, I'll do it because I'm a team player, because they said car's the same.
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And I said, you know what?
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Cars are the same.
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I'm sure they are.
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Everything's the same, and the drivers are probably good, but for me personally,
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to drive with Michaela Al Baretta.
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And Stephan Johansson, what a personal bucket list that would be.
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I have a model that they make it every year for prequalifying, and they make
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another model of the car at the rates.
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And so this was at prequalifying.
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It was number seven car.
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And on the car is the driver name.
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And it says McKaylee Alvareta, Stephan Johansson, D Murray.
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And so that's incredibly special to me because I was on the car then they
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asked me to move over and I did for the race, but I got Stephan to sign it.
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But before I got McKaylee to sign it.
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He had the accent and was skilled.
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Honestly, he was the most gentleman person I've ever met.
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I'm jumping forward, but when we went Petit Le Mans that year, I ran Jim
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Matthews car, the LMP1 from Riley Scott.
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Stefan Johansson drove this car at Petit Le Mans.
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We both started the race and we had an incredible battle for probably 45 minutes.
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Where the Porsche was faster in the straight, I had more downforce.
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And I remember trying to, well, the only place I can do it is the corner.
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So I tried to get underneath him at turn three at Atlanta
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and he chopped the door on me.
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And I'm in my helmet in the race, laughing my head off and smiling, thinking, I
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just got chopped by McKinley Alberta.
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How cool is that?
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So big, big impression for that.
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Go back to the race, the prequalifying, not a lot of fans.
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There's still some there, but when you come back for the race,
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that's when the impact hits you of how big a deal this really is.
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There's 300, 000 fans there.
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Yeah.
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You go to the actual tech downtown at Lamar on Monday.
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That's how the whole thing starts.
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And they have a stage and they're interviewing people.
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You go and it's incredible the number of people and how big an
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event it is for the entire week, plus the pre qualified before.
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But that week, And then every day, more and more fans come from the Bentley
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ran there at the year, they had all the people from England coming over at
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another a hundred thousand, you know, we have a big fan base here and stuff, but
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the track there is spread out so big.
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And to have that many people everywhere and you're going in the infield, it's
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like you're going to another city.
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It's crazy.
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And there's people everywhere.
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It was definitely an eyeopener for me in a great way.
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I think Indianapolis says they're the biggest single day
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spectator event in the planet.
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Well, that's because Lamar's over two days.
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When you have that many people, right?
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It's mind boggling.
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And I'm flattered every year I get an email from ACO for a
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credential to go to Le Mans.
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So I'm waiting until I go back for my son races.
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You were there during the new era of Le Mans.
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That transition happened in 1990 into 1991, where they added the chicanes
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and all the new pits and the new buildings and all those kinds of things.
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And as you said, 1998, your first attempt at Le Mans, and they
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say you never forget your first.
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So run us through the 1998 race.
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What happened?
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How did it end?
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It could have ended better for me.
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It was great because when we first went there, like I said, we did the pre qualify
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and then we went back for the race.
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Similar now, but at that time, there were Monday, Tuesday were tech, Wednesday and
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Thursday were on track, Friday's a break.
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So Wednesday and Thursday were the same, seven to nine and 10 to midnight.
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And the 10 to midnight was clarified as night running.
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So you had to run three laps at night and then the seven and nine
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and the same thing for the second.
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And every lap was a qualifying lap.
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So they just took the best lap of four hours.
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And I remember we went there, Pierre Raffanel went out first because
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he was French and from that place.
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So he went out and we had two transmissions.
17:17
We're going to run.
17:17
And again, I'm running the LMP one car.
17:19
They asked me which one I want to drive.
17:21
And because I drove LMP over here and the GT one, I drove it at
17:24
Paul Ricard and the tight corners.
17:26
You couldn't see the apex because the big giant mirror there
17:29
and the APO stuff like that.
17:30
So you know what?
17:31
I like the open car better.
17:32
So I picked that.
17:33
And so James Weaver, Pierre Efrenel and myself.
17:35
So Pierre started the session at seven o'clock on Wednesday and on the outlap,
17:39
I think it was, or the second lap on the track, the car had a transmission failure.
17:43
We were trying to run the dog box up to qualifying until the race,
17:47
because it was a little bit quicker and then run the synchro box.
17:49
For the race.
17:50
And so we went out there and the dog box failed on track.
17:53
So we stuck on track until 9 PM when they then could tow the car back and
17:58
now start changing the transmission.
17:59
So they changed the gearbox.
18:00
And by the time they get finished with our gearbox, it was after 11 o'clock,
18:04
11, 15, 1130, something like that.
18:06
And each driver has to do three night laps.
18:08
So you have to go by twice.
18:10
And so, okay, we got to get a night run.
18:11
So Pierre goes out first, checks the gearbox out, does his three
18:14
laps, comes in, gets out of the car.
18:16
James Weaver's been in before.
18:18
He gets the car, goes out, does three laps, checker flag.
18:20
So Dave still hasn't qualified for the race.
18:22
So now I'm like, okay, not nervous.
18:24
And now the car, when James drove it, it was like, okay, we need to make some
18:28
adjustments for the suspension too.
18:29
We haven't had a chance to sort it out.
18:30
So they took the car that night.
18:32
Wednesday night to the airport, do some cornering and they made some changes,
18:36
came back and then on Thursday, I started the session so that I get my time in.
18:40
And so I did a full tank of gas, which is 45 minutes and probably
18:43
what, seven times around the track.
18:45
So I've seen this corner seven times now, but it helped to know where
18:49
the track was and where it went.
18:50
And then I got back in at night and did my three laps at night
18:53
and then time for the race.
18:55
Well, as the race went on, I got more comfortable in the car.
18:58
And we did test the car some other places at VISOC and of
19:01
course driving Jim's LMP1 car.
19:03
So I was comfortable in the car, just needed to learn the track.
19:05
And while I did my first 45 minutes, I actually contributed,
19:08
made some shock changes in the car, which were the right direction.
19:11
And James was happy with that.
19:12
So we did that.
19:13
When we did the race, I got better and better in the race.
19:15
And at night, I had a battle with.
19:18
We were leading went back and forth.
19:20
It was raining.
19:21
One of the GT one cars had already been out.
19:23
I think McKinley actually had to go off the gravel trap and hit the wires.
19:26
And so they were done.
19:27
Like I said, done a stint in the daytime and now at night it was dry.
19:31
And then after my stint in the dry and we had issues with the electrical too.
19:35
When I got the car the first time, I was supposed to leave it in
19:37
gear, so I got in after Michele.
19:39
So he's left it in first gear and shut the motor off.
19:42
I get in, I'll just start the motor up, because you have to
19:44
have the motor off to do the fuel.
19:45
The gear readout on the dash was jumping around, so I didn't know
19:48
what gear it was in, so it was a problem with the electrical.
19:50
And Michele had to go back and forth with gear, because he
19:52
couldn't see what gear it was in.
19:53
And so anyway, then, then Yost Reinhold was like, did you leave it?
19:56
I said, yep.
19:57
I left it in gear, shut it off like I'm supposed to, but the
19:59
electrical glitches are happening.
20:00
And it finally got to the point where the radio didn't work.
20:02
And then at night you're breaking for the chicanes, the headlights
20:06
would go out and they wouldn't come on until you started to release the
20:09
brakes, turned in for the chicanes.
20:10
But it wasn't bad because at Lamar and when you went to the
20:14
straightaway, the moon so bright, it's lightened up pretty good.
20:17
You're only dark for what, five or six hours.
20:19
Anyway, the guardrails are closed down the straightaways.
20:22
So when your lights are on, they're bouncing off the guardrails
20:24
in addition to the ground.
20:25
So it's pretty lit up better than it is in other tracks that are maybe.
20:29
More of a permanent road course where there's no guardrails close to the track.
20:32
It's further out.
20:33
So all the electricals were out, the lights were going off, no radio.
20:36
So I remember at night, I'd already been in the car a few stints.
20:38
I ran one drive stint and we were leading in the LMP1 category.
20:42
At Vysoc, we tested the LMP1 car.
20:44
It was faster than the GT1s were the day before.
20:46
So, okay, good choice.
20:48
Well, with the law, because they had a bigger restrictor and ABS and more
20:52
downforce, they were faster at Lamar.
20:54
So we were running for class with not overall one full step in the drive.
20:57
Then it starts rain.
20:59
And I came in and changed for rain tires.
21:00
We were four seconds faster than GT ones at night in the rain.
21:04
And my second step, Josh, that the West, that was over.
21:07
As I was coming to the fuel load, the tread squirm, when you're going through
21:10
the kinks before Indianapolis, the car would wander out because the tread
21:13
squirm was getting really, really bad.
21:15
Came in, they didn't know what tires, because they couldn't
21:17
tell them on the radio.
21:18
And I came in and I said, intermediates.
21:20
And they put intermediates on.
21:22
What they failed to tell me was they were not in the tire warmer.
21:25
And so the first lap out, first chicane, slippery, and it just went around,
21:29
just grazed the guardrail backwards.
21:31
And I said, you know what, I better go and check it out, Let's be sure.
21:33
So I went in, they didn't see any damage, but then they looked at it
21:36
and said, well, it changed the wing.
21:38
They saw something that changed the wing.
21:39
And I got out and Weber got in and he went out, ran 20 minutes
21:43
and the deck lid blew off.
21:44
And the other, they took the deck lid off when they changed the wing
21:46
and the catches must've come undone.
21:48
So the deck lid blew off and they went, okay, they retired the car.
21:51
That was a big letdown for there.
21:52
But I think there was so many issues going on.
21:55
Yost had won that race a bunch before because he had triple stinted.
21:58
We thought we were going to be able to go four stints on a set of tires.
22:00
We couldn't go any further than the GT1, they would change tires every stint.
22:03
So the advantage that we thought we had wasn't there and their
22:06
car was just so much faster.
22:07
We couldn't run with them and the Toyota was fast and the
22:09
Mercedes and the Rails was fast.
22:11
We just couldn't compete with those guys.
22:12
1998, a little bit of a letdown, but so much experience gained
22:16
from that first run at Le Mans.
22:19
Two years goes by, here we are at the year 2000, and you return to Le Mans in
22:23
a Porsche again, but this time a 911 GT3.
22:26
And you're not with the Porsche factory team.
22:28
You're with a privateer, you're with skier racing.
22:30
So what was it like to go back to Lamar in a GT production based
22:35
car compared to running an LMP?
22:37
It was different.
22:38
Both of our four experiences there, two were prototype and two were GT.
22:41
The GT car, it's funny cause you're going straight away.
22:43
You're pretty fast in straights.
22:45
The cornering ability is nowhere near there where that is.
22:47
You remember the track the same as it was.
22:49
The Porsche curves, I will say, the one place that's really tricky, after you make
22:53
the very first really fast one coming off the straightaway, in the transition going
22:57
from the right one to the left one, you're slowing down, but you're going so fast.
23:00
I mean, a prototype, you're probably doing 170 or something like that.
23:04
And that transition, the only thing I can attest it to is
23:07
the flat bottoms of the cars.
23:09
When you're making one transition to another, you're changing
23:13
the downforce, the platform, and the bottom to the ground.
23:15
It gives more grip and then gives less grip.
23:17
So it makes it want to walk out.
23:19
It feels like the car is going to get away from you on that transition.
23:21
But the GT car, and even though we still had some factory, a little bit,
23:26
not a lot, because Sascha Massen drove with us, and Johnny Molen and myself.
23:30
So we were still a private team, but with Sascha there too, it
23:33
helped with a little bit of stuff.
23:34
But we still, we were running against the factory cars, which was Dick Barber.
23:38
And they had a huge budget and Tony Dow, and he knew how to make things fast.
23:43
And they had another wing that was on the car within the rules and homologation,
23:47
that was a very thin wing for the law.
23:49
And so he could make it go faster in the straight, pick up time there.
23:52
And then it went in the race, but then it got disqualified for
23:55
too big a fuel load on the car.
23:56
And so we ended up finishing second because you're in the middle of
23:59
your career, trying to still have a good result and performance.
24:02
So it was still a big effort.
24:04
And so that was, uh, I'll say a different experience.
24:06
But the pressure is still there because now you're trying to drive with other
24:09
guys that are fast and it matters where you're at and where's your result.
24:12
And so we're not lucky, but we were glad that we had a good
24:15
result to go back with too bad.
24:17
We didn't have a chance to win, but it was close.
24:19
I've been the bridesmaid there and Daytona and Sebring more than you can count.
24:23
One of our other guests talked about being there in production cars versus LMP cars.
24:29
It was kind of funny when they described being on the other side of the table,
24:32
they're used to going so fast that you kind of chew up and spit out the
24:35
little cars, but when you're the little guy, it's a lot more intimidating.
24:39
You have to be a lot more situationally aware you're driving
24:41
in your mirrors a lot more.
24:43
Did you find yourself suddenly a little bit more on edge because
24:45
of the speed differential?
24:47
No.
24:47
And it's funny when you say that all these memories come back because I
24:50
had driven so much in the States.
24:52
On both sides.
24:53
And that's what I think really helps.
24:54
If a driver's only done one, he's only done prototypes or only done GT cars,
24:58
you don't understand the mindset and the challenges of the other driver.
25:02
And because I've driven the LP1 cars, and now I've driven GT
25:05
cars, you know what to look for.
25:07
And of course, back then, The cars were open cockpit for the most
25:10
part, the GT ones were closed.
25:12
But when you have an open cockpit car, it was great because in a GT
25:15
car, you can look back and see the helmet, even the closed car, you can
25:18
some degree and see who's in the car.
25:20
And you go, Oh, that's Alan McNish.
25:22
When I see Alan McNish, Butch Lightsinger, any of those guys,
25:25
I'll look back and go, I already know exactly what they're thinking.
25:28
Their mindset is as mine is let's get to the corner and don't slow each other down.
25:33
and try to make it as painless as it can for both of us.
25:36
And the telegraph is huge.
25:38
Let's say McNish came up behind me or Butch.
25:40
And I can see I'm getting ready to go to the brake zone for the chicane.
25:42
If he pulls his car directly behind me, that's telling me
25:46
I'm not going to go past you.
25:47
So I can then focus on the corner, get to the corner, and as I'm
25:50
exiting the corner, I can look back.
25:52
And I remember one pass in particular, I'm in a GT.
25:54
Here comes Allen.
25:55
And he comes out and he goes back.
25:57
Then you can go outside.
25:58
You didn't need to use the exit.
26:00
to the guardrail.
26:00
So he would go to the outside and I come out, I'd move the left
26:03
a little bit and give him room.
26:04
And there's nothing better than that ballet between a
26:08
GT driver and an LP driver.
26:09
On the flip side, if you see somebody like Max Angeli behind you, you're
26:13
sweating and pouring down because you know it's going to be not a good experience
26:16
because he's going to try and pass you when he shouldn't and things like that.
26:19
So those are the things that you actually watch and see who's in the car to know.
26:24
What they're going to do.
26:24
Well, I'm glad you brought that up because 2000 was also the year that
26:27
Andretti was there in the Panos.
26:29
Was he putting a little pressure on you to being in a GT car?
26:32
Yeah.
26:32
And you know, Lamar is such a big track.
26:34
It's funny how you end up running with people, but not as close as you.
26:39
There's so many of the factors that's not just racing against the other car.
26:42
You're aware of all that stuff, but at the end of the day, you're saying,
26:45
I want to keep that thing going because it's a race for 24 hours.
26:48
Who gets there first, not who's going to battle out right then and there.
26:51
Went back in 2011, tuned it to the fuel over here and one's E85, one's E10.
26:56
So we went over there, car wasn't very fast in the straightaway.
26:59
And I remember in the race, faster car come by, they were good in the corners.
27:03
And I started drafting and I picked up like three or four seconds a lap.
27:07
And my engineer's on the radio going, you better don't, don't take any chances.
27:11
Don't take any chances.
27:11
He thinks I'm taking all his chances and I'm on the radio going, Lee,
27:14
it's like so easy right now, got a hook to the car in front of me.
27:17
I'm just riding.
27:17
I'm not doing anything.
27:18
I'm not driving hard at all.
27:19
It's a place where so many things matter that don't matter in other
27:23
places and vice versa to some degree.
27:25
You think you've done and seen it all until you go there.
27:27
It's like, no, it's a different place.
27:28
So you just wave as Mario goes by down the straightaway.
27:31
It's all good.
27:31
So that jumps us to 2001.
27:33
You're back at Lamar again, back to back.
27:35
As you mentioned, you leapfrogged between LMP cars and production cars.
27:39
This time you're there in a Judd powered Renard.
27:41
And so I want to talk about the Renard and what that was like driving compared
27:45
to the Porsche and everything else, but you're also in the middle of everything.
27:49
Audi's rise to dominance at Le Mans, their first win in 2000, they had unfortunately
27:54
been some setbacks with the original R8 Roadster back in the late nineties.
27:59
Now they're rising to power.
28:00
They're going to do their 13 years of dominance.
28:03
What was that like being there with them in an LMP car as well?
28:07
That was a whole different era.
28:09
In 98, Porsche ran, and I remember they built a new LMP1 car for 99.
28:16
And I remember Alan McNair talking about testing it at Vysok and stuff.
28:20
He was so excited.
28:21
The car was so much better and faster than the 1998 car.
28:24
But Porsche decided not to run it.
28:26
Because Audi came out with their R8 and we're going to run that.
28:29
And I guess kids and cousins don't race against each other.
28:31
So they ended up pulling the Porsche and ran the Audi R8 starting in 99, I believe.
28:36
And then they ran 2000 on.
28:37
And what I remember is Porsche was designed the car, 98 car, because they
28:42
didn't really win much FIA that year.
28:44
They built it for the beginning of the season.
28:45
Audi waited until Le Mans to have their final car.
28:48
So they had six months more of development.
28:51
And I remember when they ran it, Moskvort, they had off an incident, hit
28:55
the wall, got it back in the pit lane and with four bolts, changed the entire
28:59
rear assembly, engine, transmission, and suspension, put a new one on
29:03
like five minutes and went back out.
29:04
And that's when Porsche went, okay, we're never going to design and build
29:07
a car for the beginning of the year.
29:08
They want to wait for Le Mans to make sure it's right, but in a
29:11
series, you're going to have to.
29:12
So anyway, when Audi came out, it was the beginning of the Audi era, really, right?
29:16
They won so many races nonstop because the cars were not only fast, but they
29:20
were also reliable and they were built in a fashion of easy maintenance.
29:23
A lot of work to go into, let's change this piece quick, make it happen.
29:27
So they thought about the Reliability, speed and quick repairs, and they were
29:32
quieter to, of course, the Peugeot was the beginning of the really quiet
29:35
era, but these cars would come by you and you couldn't even really hear him.
29:39
If you're a GT car until they were by here to win the turbo goodbye.
29:43
Whereas the old days.
29:44
You had the loud engine noise, the engine sounds.
29:47
That was when that era all started.
29:49
And then they grew up to what?
29:50
Thousand pounds of torque and just stupid fast of how much that stuff was.
29:54
I think we ran in 98.
29:56
We were running Ford motor.
29:57
We ran the Raleigh Scott had like 650 horsepower.
30:00
And it's funny because my son ran the LMP2 cars past several years.
30:03
Those cars are faster than the LMP1 cars when we ran back then.
30:07
And a lot of it is due to the technology in Somewhat tires, but
30:12
suspension, I mean, the aero for sure.
30:14
That's where our GT cars improved most recently was aero, but to see the
30:18
LMP cars in the slow corners compared to like a Porsche 962 would turn so
30:23
much quicker and crisper and be gone.
30:25
As opposed to the old cars, you know, I've driven those back in Rennsport.
30:29
962s or the BMW had to come out at the Monterey Historics
30:32
and drive their old 86 GTP car.
30:34
And it's like, come on, baby, come on.
30:35
You can do this.
30:36
You know, it's like, cause it just feels like a heavier car.
30:38
So the technology of suspension stuff just continued to make those things so much
30:41
faster and easier and better to drive.
30:43
So in 2001, you're in the Renard, you're in the mix with Audi.
30:46
What was that like, just trying to stay at pace?
30:49
That race, if you remember, it rained on the start of the race.
30:52
And I was driving with Milka Duno and John Graham.
30:55
And so she started the race and it was dry.
30:58
So we went out halfway around the track, on the pace lap, it poured.
31:02
They had a ton of cars go off and ours was one of them.
31:04
So she went off, had the crash, came back in.
31:06
And I remember getting ready to get up at midnight to get in the car.
31:09
They finally got the car fixed.
31:10
When the tech inspectors were there watching you do that, watching the
31:13
crew fix the car and have to get it all fixed, put that together, ready
31:16
to drop it out, they went, nope, you can't do that because on the front
31:19
crash box, it had ripped it off.
31:22
It pulled, I guess, the mounts or the threads out of the car.
31:25
And so they just drilled them in a different spot, but it wasn't homologated
31:29
that way, so they wouldn't let us run.
31:30
And so that was super disappointing.
31:32
So we didn't get any laps really in the race at all.
31:34
So we didn't get a chance to do that stuff.
31:36
It's funny you bring up the big downpour because one of our other
31:38
Evening with the Legend guests talked about that particular race.
31:41
And we're kind of hyper focused on 2001 because it's a
31:44
special year in a lot of ways.
31:45
The weather conditions, the beginning of Audi's back to back, all these things
31:49
are happening, the crashes and whatnot.
31:50
It's funny.
31:50
But if I look at your driver resume with a little bit more careful microscope,
31:54
I noticed that you either leapfrog with this other guest or you ran in the same
31:58
series together and that's Andy Pilgrim.
32:01
And so he came on and talked about 2001 and being there with the C5R
32:05
and the team Corvette program.
32:06
So I was wondering, you know, you guys traded paint over the years.
32:09
What was it like running with Andy at Le Mans?
32:11
Andy is one of the best people on the planet.
32:14
Best drivers.
32:15
Everything about Andy is awesome.
32:17
We actually raced Firehawk together back in the early nineties.
32:20
And so, yeah, we traded paint and rubbed each other a little bit here and there.
32:23
Had some great runs.
32:24
He was in the Firebird and I was in a Porsche 944 for a while,
32:28
968, and then went back to some Firebirds and stuff like that.
32:31
So we raced against each other a lot there.
32:33
Then we ran Lotus for the factory, the Lotus Esprit that
32:37
Doc started all the stuff.
32:38
Running for a little bit, then Andy came and we all had our own
32:40
car because it was short races.
32:42
And it was great because I remember we'd all go out for the first session.
32:45
This is where Doc Bundy was great too.
32:46
He had help for a setup and just organizing me.
32:49
We'd all go out, run a session, come back, and Andy and Doc and I would sit and
32:53
debrief, and we would talk about it with the engineers what we needed for the car.
32:57
So then we all agreed, okay, Doc's going to stay on the springs we're on, and
33:01
I'll go softer and Andy will go stiffer.
33:03
And we come back and debrief after the next session.
33:05
So we knew where it was with Doc's baseline of the springs that we ran
33:08
before, and I'm softer than Andy Stiffer.
33:10
So you knew which way to go.
33:11
You can't do that with a lot of drivers, because I was saying before the European
33:15
drivers, there's so much competition.
33:17
They're not going to tell you anything.
33:18
Oh, it was terrible, but keep me on the stiff springs.
33:20
You should go to the soft spring, stuff like that.
33:22
Andy and Doc.
33:22
You could trust them implicitly to be honest and forth.
33:26
Cause we just want to do what was right for the team.
33:28
At the end of the day, we'd all be doing better.
33:30
And so Miami, one time we ran the Lotus Esprit and that race early in
33:34
the year, we finished one, two, three.
33:35
So it was a great team effort.
33:37
And yeah, Andy, Andy is awesome.
33:39
And like I said, he ended up going to Corvettes and run the GT1 category, which
33:42
we were running the GT2 category or GT.
33:45
So we weren't competing together, but be on the track same time.
33:48
But we all, like I said, we did Firehawk race against each other,
33:50
Firehawk and a bunch of other stuff.
33:52
And I bring it up because that's at the peak of Corvette versus
33:55
Viper and Corvette's multi year dominance as well in GT1.
33:58
So as an American in France at Le Mans, seeing this all unfold,
34:02
how did you feel about that?
34:04
Seeing Corvette just kicking butt and taking names?
34:06
Most of my career has been with Porsche and I got a special place in my heart
34:09
for them because of all that stuff.
34:10
I got some really good friends in Porsche Motorsport, Porsche cars, everything else.
34:14
And so that'll always be geared to me because of the opportunities I had.
34:18
But there's also that side of me that says, why don't we have more Americans
34:22
and more American entries everywhere?
34:25
It's like, Porsche won't run a lot of Americans over there, but why
34:29
don't we run more Americans here?
34:30
You know, it's a great, I think it's been since me, Patrick Long is
34:33
about the only one that's done that.
34:33
That's been the Porsche driver.
34:35
And I'm glad to see that was for a long term, but to see Corvette,
34:39
Andy and Kelly Collins, and those guys, Americans running was awesome.
34:44
And you want to just cheer him on for that stuff because of that stuff.
34:47
And Doug Feehan run the program.
34:49
It was great to see him being loyal to those guys.
34:51
But you know, when you see, I remember it was disappointing to me
34:53
LMP one cars years and years ago.
34:56
I think the only American on the team was Wayne Taylor.
34:59
Which is kind of a dual citizenship, but that was disappointing to me.
35:02
And really disappointed when you see the commercial for Cadillac and they drive
35:05
the LP one car down the street, pulling the all American driveway and the all
35:09
American dad gets out and they have our mom and the three point two kids.
35:12
And you're like, wait a minute.
35:13
That's not what I, so it'd be great if they did actually another
35:16
marketing guys would like that.
35:17
But it's great to see that robbery.
35:19
And of course we did the four GT and we raced against Corvette.
35:23
And so that was pretty emotional.
35:24
That whole thing was great.
35:25
Well, we're going to get to that, but we got to explain what
35:28
happened between 2001 and 2011.
35:30
You got a 10 year gap before returning to Lamont.
35:33
Racing over the States.
35:35
With a lot of EMSA GT stuff, we ran with Synergy.
35:38
We ran Osco, ran helped Craig Stanton win the championship 2005.
35:42
And so we had a lot of stuff going on that.
35:44
We ran Peterson White Lightning, which was a quasi factory effort, but
35:49
they had the true factory effort that they would get the, okay, this motor
35:51
goes here and you get this motor.
35:53
And so it wasn't quite the same, but we had a lot of factory support.
35:57
And that was great because they had myself and Johnny Mollem.
36:00
You love the gentleman drivers because that's what keeps this whole thing going.
36:04
But when you have a chance to drive with another professional driver with a
36:07
team that's funding it all and running it, all they care about is winning.
36:11
That was a really special year.
36:13
So we had Craig Stanton and I drove that year together.
36:15
We finished in the podium, six out of nine races.
36:18
Fantastic.
36:19
And the only reason we didn't win is because the factory cars, which had their
36:22
special mojo, would be hard to beat.
36:25
When we finished ahead of one of them sometimes, or right behind
36:27
them most of the other time.
36:28
We had a really good season there.
36:29
And then the other times you're racing different cars, whether it's
36:33
with Porsche or other cars, trying to get back to Le Mans, but the
36:36
opportunity is not always there.
36:38
And so for me, you're obviously trying to do what you can do, and the way to
36:41
do that is to do it over here in Epsom.
36:42
Do well.
36:43
And then when somebody needs somebody to drive at Le Mans, hopefully
36:46
you'll fill that bill, because that is the biggest prize out there.
36:49
That opportunity presented itself in 2011, and we got to see the car that you drove
36:53
earlier this year at M1 Concourse when we did the Le Mans viewing party there,
36:57
and Andrea Robertson was there with the GT40 that you drove with her and Dave.
37:01
She shared some stories while on set.
37:03
Stage about that year, and you know how you guys did and everything, but 10 years
37:07
had passed since you had been to Lamont.
37:08
So let's talk about being there with a whole different car, you know,
37:11
running a Ford on a private tier team.
37:13
How did the track change?
37:14
How did you change, you know, like a decade had gone by?
37:17
Did it all come back to you?
37:18
Was it like riding a bicycle?
37:19
You know, tracks were like that.
37:20
When you went back to Lamont, it was like saying it.
37:23
'cause like you said.
37:24
The track configuration is the same and it's funny how when you
37:26
drive a track and we drove three 24 hour races, you have enough laps.
37:30
It's instilled in you.
37:31
You don't take any time to get back that muscle memory of how to drive the track.
37:34
So that was all the same.
37:35
What was great for me personally was in 98 the pressure was enormous because
37:42
you're trying to perform at your peak.
37:44
Part of your career and everything matters.
37:46
The pressure is there.
37:47
And so you're performing, but you don't have a chance to enjoy it
37:50
until now reliving it years later.
37:53
But when I went back in 2011 with Dave and Andrea, who are the best people on
37:57
the planet, knowing you feel you're solid in that spot, The pressure after doing
38:02
that, like I said, 10 years off and now going back at a different part of your
38:06
career, you still want to win, but maybe the more confidence or I don't know how
38:09
you look at it, but I was able to actually enjoy it this time and it was fantastic.
38:13
And then to take Dave and Andrea, who had never done, I think they did Sebring
38:17
before that, and we only finished nine hours, something like that.
38:20
But anyway.
38:21
They've never done a 24 hour race in their life.
38:23
So to go over there and to kind of help them bring them along and cut a
38:27
lot of shortcuts to the process and the experience down so they enjoy it.
38:32
Dave was at Sebring when we first did Sebring.
38:35
He would drive his 45 minute stint or ever get out and walk around,
38:38
drink coffee and talk to everybody.
38:39
He's like, no, Dave, you got to rest because you need your energy.
38:42
At Le Mans that year, I think Dave drove like four hours.
38:45
Andrew and I drove like almost 10 hours each.
38:47
She was a machine.
38:48
And when we first met them, they were okay.
38:50
And then, so Andrew and I, we worked out every day we were at the track.
38:53
We get done, we go running, we go to the gym.
38:56
And she was really motivated.
38:58
And so we got great shape.
38:59
So she could run, but she wanted to.
39:00
But her issue was, she was so nervous that she didn't want to eat.
39:04
And then Andrew, you have to eat because you need that energy.
39:06
Every time I do a 24 hours, every stint I'll get out, I'll eat 2000
39:10
calories because you burn that much.
39:11
And so you did the first stint and she was like, I didn't want to eat.
39:14
They went, she got out and that took the butterflies off.
39:17
And then she started eating like she should like 2000 calories.
39:20
So she did the entire race.
39:21
Like I said, 10 hours, her eyes went back and forth most of the night.
39:24
And it was really good to see that and have them come along and experience
39:28
this incredible event as a participant.
39:31
And then to come away with the podium finish.
39:33
For me, I was happier for her and Dave to have that result than myself.
39:38
And I mean, and I was thrilled myself.
39:40
But to have her there and experience that stuff.
39:43
And I know she told you that, did she tell you it was her anniversary?
39:45
Yep.
39:45
Did she, she showed you a picture of that.
39:47
She's got, I was sleeping.
39:48
So obviously getting rest.
39:49
And I saw it later on where Dave stand there with a rose.
39:52
She gets out of the car.
39:53
I get it to her.
39:53
It gets in, drives away.
39:54
I mean, what a unique couple and still performed, did the job they had to do.
39:58
You know, and the nicest people.
40:00
And they let the team do the job.
40:01
Okay.
40:02
You do that.
40:02
That's what you do best.
40:03
And if you have questions, you might ask her.
40:05
But he relied on people and sometimes you'll get folks that
40:07
come in from the outside and well, I've been successful here.
40:10
So let me tell you how to do this.
40:11
It's not their forte.
40:12
And once they start making decisions and the effort suffers a little bit.
40:16
And so these guys didn't do that at all.
40:17
And then they could focus on the driving and that's what they both did.
40:20
And I think Andrew has worked at that harder than anybody I've ever seen.
40:23
We did a new track.
40:24
Sure.
40:24
She did it for Lamar as well.
40:26
I sent a video of the entire race from a GT perspective from in car,
40:30
cut that one good lap out so she could watch that lap over as much.
40:33
She watched that one lap probably a hundred times, it
40:36
was a three or four hour race.
40:37
She watched the entire race four or five times before she went, so
40:40
she was prepared before she went.
40:42
To put that effort and energy into it, but then you look at the results.
40:45
My advice was when we went to Le Mans, everything matters, I said go as fast
40:49
as you can go, knowing not thinking, you're not going to make a mistake,
40:53
because once you make that mistake.
40:54
It's over and so they did that and the only issue we had I think I had a tire
40:58
that came apart and I just went slow to bring it back in to get that fixed.
41:02
The paddle shifters had an issue and the team was prepared so we just
41:06
kept driving it until we came in and they just connected the shifter.
41:09
Went back out, didn't miss it.
41:11
That's the only issues we had the entire time.
41:12
And neither one of those took any time at all.
41:14
And so that's what said back in Lamar, you think all these other tracks, like Daytona
41:18
or Sebring, cause they're hard on the car.
41:19
And you think that would be an issue for liability.
41:22
Lamar is a huge reliability factor involved in that.
41:27
And it's amazing, I guess because you wouldn't think hard of a
41:30
car being fairl but it's tough.
41:34
There's a mechanical sympathy and t that Lamont chooses its w to think about it
41:40
from a I think a lot of legends that have been on the show have expressed the
41:46
idea of Lamar changed them as a driver.
41:49
So I wonder, Dave, how did Lamar change you, all of its challenges, the changing
41:54
weather conditions, all the things you went through, your four attempts at
41:57
getting on the podium of Lamar and finally clinching it there in 2011, what's the
42:01
biggest and most important takeaway from Lamar and again, how did it change you?
42:05
How could it not change you?
42:06
Right?
42:06
You go there realizing it's a once a year event.
42:10
That's the biggest event in the planet.
42:12
And you realize that, okay, how many chances will you have?
42:15
So I have four shots at it.
42:17
It's difficult for all the factors that go into it.
42:20
And like I said, the weather changes, you don't have the three mile track.
42:22
That's okay.
42:23
It might rain a little bit here, but the odds are it's going to rain in one
42:26
part of the track and the other part of the track are not going to be for long.
42:28
And Le Mans, it's such a big track.
42:30
There's no telling what will happen in one part of the track versus another.
42:34
The change in the nighttime, there's very little night running.
42:37
The guardrails.
42:38
I mean, there's so many different things about that event that are
42:41
so different than anywhere else.
42:43
It helps you to understand that each time you go to an event, whether
42:46
it's here, Daytona, wherever it is, it allows you to look at these new
42:50
factors that weren't a factor before.
42:52
And be better at those because you have more experience in different
42:56
circumstances, either whether it's the weather difference, whether
42:58
it's the difference in night, the guardrail lights, all these things
43:02
bring more tools in your toolbox.
43:04
And it might not even be the instance that actually happened.
43:06
We went there and I thought it was pretty neat.
43:08
The team, they put a toolbox in the car, because you can work
43:10
in the car if it stops on track.
43:12
They put a cell phone in the car, so you can call and talk to the crew.
43:16
In German, I don't know, so you just push one and hold it
43:19
and speed dials to the crew.
43:20
We didn't have to use that, but I thought, what a clever idea.
43:23
And that's the difference between a factory and then, you a huge track,
43:27
you're so far away or radio might not work or maybe a car radio doesn't work.
43:31
And then if you're back in the engine compartment, you want to have a light and
43:34
a phone to say, well, this belt goes here.
43:36
Oh, take that.
43:36
Okay.
43:37
This bolt towards that.
43:38
Okay.
43:38
I got it.
43:38
And there help talk you through.
43:40
I can't wait.
43:40
So the future is going to be.
43:42
They're going to put headband with a camera in there and you're going
43:44
to have that on with the light shining on the engine and they go,
43:46
yeah, see that bolt to your right?
43:48
No, no, a little bit higher over that and take that and turn it.
43:50
It's technology that continues to get better and better, better on that line.
43:54
When I went, BMW had me come out to the Monterey historics a few
43:57
years back when BMW was the mark and had me drive their 86 GTP car.
44:01
And I remember sliding down the seat to see if the fit was like.
44:04
And I'm like, wow, there was one analog tachometer, push button reset, and
44:09
two idiot lights in orange and red.
44:11
I went, how primitive?
44:12
And I went, that's how we drove them.
44:14
That's how it was.
44:15
But the evolution is so continuous, you don't see it happening.
44:19
And now I'll go back and tell my son, I said, wish I had good in car video.
44:23
From back in 98, because that'd be great to have that.
44:26
Oh, look here.
44:27
I am at Lamont and the video was terrible back then.
44:30
And we even in 2011, it was not really much data.
44:33
I mean, I remember 98, they had the flagship, which is like, wow.
44:36
But in 2011, we had the smarty cam and put that in the Ford GT.
44:41
It was standard definition.
44:42
The antenna was inside, didn't work.
44:43
We kept telling them, no, it doesn't work.
44:45
No, no, it's all good.
44:46
And then they finally went, okay, so they got an external antenna.
44:48
And then finally the HD came out and was like, GoPro would have been great to have
44:51
back then, just to have video, right?
44:53
I mean, who'd have thought?
44:54
Well, I went scuba diving back 100 years ago in Hawaii and we're going to video.
44:58
So we got a VHS camera, big giant thing.
45:01
It was in a big cylinder that weighed 120 pounds.
45:04
You put the water and video now a GoPro and 10 times better quality.
45:09
Well, since we're talking about the evolution and a little bit about the
45:11
future, we'll wrap up with a couple of questions here for you, Dave.
45:14
In the rise of popularity, especially in Formula 1, of people that never
45:19
were really interested in racing, and some of this has to do with
45:21
COVID and programs like Drive to Survive and things like that.
45:24
I often get these questions like, why would I want to watch endurance racing?
45:28
Why would I want to watch 24 hours of Lamar?
45:30
So if somebody came up to you that is into racing and says, Dave, you drove it Lamar,
45:35
why would I want to watch this race?
45:36
What would you say to them?
45:37
What a fantastic question.
45:38
Because over my years, almost one of that myself, like, and F1, the car is great.
45:43
You know why there's always, always passing in sports car
45:49
racing, because you're running multiple classes at the same time.
45:52
Not only is it exciting to watch passing, but it sets up picks
45:56
and opportunities for cars within their own class to pass each other.
46:00
If I become a prototype in this GT car there, I might use that GT car as a pick.
46:04
And that's incredible racing.
46:06
If you watch Le Mans, it works both ways because the excitement is,
46:10
Oh, the prototype is going to catch these GT cars in about a half a lap.
46:14
Well, what's going to happen when that happens?
46:15
And is that going to set up an opportunity for the second place
46:18
prototype to pass for the lead?
46:20
Or is that going to set up for the number one prototype to keep the
46:24
lead because it uses the pick, or is that going to affect the GT race?
46:27
I mean, there's so many things going on that in a single make race is
46:31
nowhere near to me as exciting because how many times you watch single make
46:35
race, it's a boring lead follow race.
46:37
Not their fault, and Formula One's tried by going, oh, let's do DRS.
46:41
Then they got so far, and the length of the straightaway
46:43
depends on how easy it is.
46:44
Then all of a sudden, they're driving by them, there's no
46:46
defense, there's no fight.
46:48
Where's the battle?
46:49
And so that's why I didn't see it until a number of years ago, Rene Arnoux
46:52
and Jill Villeneuve having a battle.
46:54
F1 race that went back and forth.
46:56
That's when I think the best racing was when they had these cars, you had
46:58
shift with H patterns and they actually draft each other and all this stuff.
47:01
And they went back and forth several times.
47:03
Of course, there's only two cars, but how often do you get those cars that
47:07
close to each other and have a good race?
47:09
And I said, the DRS, well, it does help passing.
47:12
It loses some of the, well, where's the battle.
47:15
I hopefully I can get that a little bit better, but, but back to sports
47:17
car, there's passing all the time.
47:19
There's always that challenge.
47:20
So Dave, it's been 10 plus years since you've been at Le Mans.
47:23
Let's say you could get back in the driver's seat this coming season.
47:26
Drive any of the 2023 or 2024 cars at Le Mans.
47:31
What would you drive?
47:32
Because of my history and opportunities, the Penske Porsche would be pretty nice.
47:37
But because of the American, a Wheelan Cadillac.
47:39
You are an LMP guy through and through.
47:41
It's funny.
47:42
I'll tell you one of the story prototypes.
47:44
It's like, if you ever been in a track street car and then you have a
47:47
GT car with It's a massive difference between a GT car with slicks and
47:52
a prototype is more than that.
47:54
It's crazy how much faster it is.
47:56
And until you've been in that situation, that car, you can't appreciate it.
48:00
And my son, I told him that story.
48:01
And of course, we tried to get him to go a little bit of NASCAR
48:03
to expose me to everything.
48:05
And I said, first time you drive a prototype.
48:07
And of course, team asked me to do an LP three car.
48:10
We brought my son along.
48:11
He did some laps and okay.
48:12
Now let's do a test day at Rhode Island.
48:14
High speed track with downforce.
48:16
He drove that car for the first time for a good 20, 30 minutes.
48:19
And he got out of the car and we're all watching him talk.
48:22
And he's trying to be cool.
48:23
Yeah, well, this, that, and you can see a little inside and I said, pretty great.
48:27
And he goes, So same thing for him.
48:30
Once you get that experience of a prototype that seems to defy the laws
48:34
of physics because the aerodynamics and the speed, it's nothing like it.
48:38
Well, that said, what's next for Dave Murray?
48:40
When I was driving back in the mid 2000s and 2009 10, you know, driving is
48:45
going to come to an end at some point.
48:46
60, my wife said, you better get a job.
48:48
And I said, who's going to hire a 60 year old pro racer.
48:51
So I would always look for an opportunity.
48:54
Finally, 2009 at one of the events, I was coaching a gentleman driver
48:58
at one of the group 52 events and said, you know, what's a good format.
49:01
And somebody that was running another program asked me what about it.
49:04
So we joined together and started David Murray track days.
49:07
And so we started off just doing events where we had open track,
49:10
which is something nobody else does.
49:12
Whereas no sessions, no groups, just open track, go out when you want, you're
49:15
not gonna drive seven hours a day, but if you have more drivers, you can, but
49:18
at least it gives you the opportunity to go out when you want, as long as
49:20
you want for as often as you want.
49:22
So we started that and then we started realizing that it would be
49:25
beneficial to some of the series if.
49:27
They could test their cars, so we do that four times a year
49:31
before the PCA club races.
49:33
We do it at Sebring, VIR Atlanta, and Road America, and then we do
49:36
it 15 other times in front of the IMSA races or SRO or Porsche Sprint.
49:41
It's usually a couple weeks out.
49:43
And they have a chance to bring their cars, saves them money.
49:45
They don't have to pay for the track rental by themselves.
49:47
And then we limit the car account.
49:49
So we get good quality testing and try to group the cars together.
49:52
So we've been doing that for 16 years and we've got 19 events next year.
49:55
We had 15 this year with 19 next year.
49:57
So it's been a great continuation for me.
49:59
Because this is my family and my world.
50:02
How can I do that to continue to go along?
50:05
And with my son racing, it keeps me engaged and keeps those relationships
50:10
going that I see people, you know, you'll see people that you
50:12
haven't seen that live in Atlanta.
50:14
I've never seen them in Atlanta, but I've seen them.
50:15
I've seen the racetrack thousands of times around the world.
50:18
So it's a great family and I'm glad I don't have to part ways with that.
50:21
I can continue on that and be involved and be engaged with it and
50:24
help out, give folks something back.
50:26
Well, as we close out here, I want to pass the microphone to
50:29
our ACO USA ambassadors tonight.
50:31
May Lee and William Withers.
50:34
Well, since David Lowe couldn't be here, I want to thank you, David, for joining
50:37
us and thank Eric again for hosting another great evening with a legend.
50:40
We really appreciate all of your time and sharing your stories with us.
50:43
I'd like to thank you for coming by the booth at Road
50:46
Atlanta last year and this year.
50:48
I know I missed you this year, and I'm sorry about that.
50:51
I was running around doing a couple other things, but we'd like to thank
50:54
you for everything you do for the club, and it's just much appreciated.
50:57
I don't know.
50:58
I appreciate you guys, what you're doing for ACO for the U.
51:01
S.
51:01
We've needed this for so long and it's great to see David and have
51:05
you guys all take this and create opportunities for people in the U.
51:08
S.
51:09
That like me may not even know anything about ACO or Lamar or anything
51:13
else until they're exposed to it.
51:14
So it's really great to see this in the U.
51:16
S.
51:17
And I think there's so many people are going to benefit from it.
51:19
and enjoy it.
51:19
I know you have a lot of functions, the boat function.
51:21
That's like, there's so many things that can do in the watch parties for Le Mans.
51:25
I'm looking forward to seeing a lot of new fans for Le Mans.
51:28
And we're looking forward to working with you in the future for sure.
51:31
Thank you.
51:31
Thank you again.
51:32
And on behalf of everyone here and those listening at home, thank you
51:35
Dave for sharing your story with us.
51:37
Since 1981, when he first stepped into a Formula Ford, David Murray
51:41
built a reputation as a fast and consistent driver and has become
51:45
known as one of the good guys in the often wacky world of motorsports.
51:49
And he has continued racing for various brands all around the world.
51:52
In 2009, late in his successful driving career, David started
51:56
David Murray Track Days.
51:57
This continues to be his primary focus today.
51:59
And you can learn from one of our legends of Le Mans with personalized
52:03
instruction, interactive class time, evaluation of in car footage and or
52:07
data, along with car setups and other ways to maximize your driving potential.
52:11
So if you want to learn more, be sure to check out David Murray Track Days at www.
52:15
davidmurraytrackdays.
52:15
com.
52:16
DavidMurray.
52:17
com.
52:17
That's David M U R R Y.
52:20
com for more information.
52:21
So we hope you enjoyed this presentation and look forward to more Evening with
52:24
the Legends throughout the season.
52:26
And with that, David, I can't thank you enough for coming on and sharing your
52:28
story with us, sharing your evening with us and telling us all these war
52:31
stories of your multiple attempts at Le Mans and again, clinching that
52:34
podium there at your last attempt.
52:36
So congratulations and keep up the good work.
52:38
Thank you, Eric.
52:39
Appreciate you doing this.
52:40
And I know your library is going to be.
52:41
Growing and a pretty neat to have this forever.
52:44
Thank you for doing it.
52:56
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