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Duels: A guide to throwing down the gauntlet · Stuff You Should Know

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  Speaker 1: Brought to you by the reinvented two thousand twelve camera.
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  Speaker 1: It's ready. Are you welcome to you Stuff you should
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  Speaker 1: Know from house Stuff Works dot Com. Hey, and welcome
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  Speaker 1: to the podcast. I'm Josh Clark. With me is Charles W.
• 0:19
  Speaker 1: Chuff Bryant and uh, you've got stuff you should know
• 0:23
  Speaker 1: on guard. Yeah, it's too shame it means a touch
• 0:27
  Speaker 1: and friends. I thought this was one of the funniest
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  Speaker 1: openings of an article ever. By the way, did you
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  Speaker 1: like it? I thought that very first part was hysterical
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  Speaker 1: when I read it. Well, you know what, it just
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  Speaker 1: so happens. I don't have an intro for this one,
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  Speaker 1: so I think you might want to read it. Should
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  Speaker 1: we just read it? Yeah? Ed Grabanowski never lets us down.
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  Speaker 1: He's good the Grabster h This is how duels work.
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  Speaker 1: Ladies and gentlemen. Pistols at dawn. The challenge is issued.
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  Speaker 1: To turn it down would leave you marked as a
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  Speaker 1: coward for life. You meet at the chosen spot, facing
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  Speaker 1: your opponent at a distance of twenty paces. You're dueling.
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  Speaker 1: Pistols are loaded. One or both of you could be
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  Speaker 1: severely wounded or killed. Today doctors are standing by them
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  Speaker 1: in the damage if possible, while your friends eye each
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  Speaker 1: other warily. Why is this all happening because you made
• 1:11
  Speaker 1: fun of his hat? So good? That is about right too,
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  Speaker 1: if we find out and the rest of the article, Yeah,
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  Speaker 1: well done, Grabster. It's not much of an exaggeration. Apparently,
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  Speaker 1: throughout the history of people or ever since, we've had
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  Speaker 1: swords at least um men have challenged other men to
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  Speaker 1: duels and other people have died as the result. You know,
• 1:33
  Speaker 1: I thought this is a great article. Um, I thought
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  Speaker 1: so too. This is definitely something I knew like virtually
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  Speaker 1: nothing about. Yeah, officially, me too. But I did find
• 1:41
  Speaker 1: out that things like uh while West duels shootouts very
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  Speaker 1: very close to reality. Sure, they apparently happened to coincide
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  Speaker 1: at a time when dueling was very popular in America,
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  Speaker 1: and this kind of all it was. It was the
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  Speaker 1: Old West version of Pistols at Dawn and um. As
• 1:59
  Speaker 1: an aside, probably the best dueling movie of all time,
• 2:02
  Speaker 1: The Quicken the Dead, The Quicken the Dead. It's exactly right.
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  Speaker 1: If you have not seen that, pause, pause this podcast,
• 2:10
  Speaker 1: get off your treadmill, put your ice cream down, whatever
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  Speaker 1: you're doing, go watch The Quicken the Dead. And then
• 2:15
  Speaker 1: come back and resume this podcast. Yeah. You know, what
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  Speaker 1: I always appreciate about that movie was that there were
• 2:21
  Speaker 1: how many how many quick draw shootouts? Like, let's say
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  Speaker 1: they were ten in the movie. Each one of them
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  Speaker 1: was different. He filmed him different and had a different
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  Speaker 1: feel Like. I just thought that was so creative, like
• 2:34
  Speaker 1: each one had its own little flavor. That's our Sam Raymie.
• 2:36
  Speaker 1: He's so good man. I love that movie. Um, he's
• 2:39
  Speaker 1: got something new coming out, doesn't he? Mr Hollywood guy?
• 2:42
  Speaker 1: Come on, he's got something coming He's not doing the
• 2:45
  Speaker 1: New Spider Man. What's uh? I don't know. I think
• 2:49
  Speaker 1: he might be working on another Evil Dead, like a
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  Speaker 1: modern remake the uptake, or he might just be producing that.
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  Speaker 1: If he does that, then'll be the second time he's
• 2:58
  Speaker 1: remade The Evil Dead, and Well Dead two is a
• 3:00
  Speaker 1: remake of the Evil Dad. Yeah pretty much? Okay, Um,
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  Speaker 1: so Chuck. A duel for anybody who doesn't know, is
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  Speaker 1: basically a one on one battle, as is evidenced by
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  Speaker 1: the etomology and apparently we said entomology before. I don't
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  Speaker 1: know that. I don't like some eleven year old kid
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  Speaker 1: called us out on that. I think he might have
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  Speaker 1: misertus because I definitely know the difference between etomology and entomology.
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  Speaker 1: Etomology etomology of the word duel is um. I think
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  Speaker 1: Latin right, duello, I'm sorry, dwell um, which is a
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  Speaker 1: contraction of a duo too and bellum war obviously antebellum
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  Speaker 1: pre war. Okay, I never realized that, huh, okay, But
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  Speaker 1: duo too. It's basically a war between two individuals is
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  Speaker 1: a duel um and it's been around for quite a
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  Speaker 1: long time. Um, I guess we should probably just get
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  Speaker 1: to the get to the meat of it first. Let's
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  Speaker 1: let's talk about duels and then we'll talk a little
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  Speaker 1: bit about the history. Let's just throw down the gauntlet.
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  Speaker 1: So somebody does throw down the gauntlet, and a gauntlet
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  Speaker 1: is a glove. And when you throw down a gauntlet
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  Speaker 1: at the feet of somebody that was at the height
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  Speaker 1: of dueling, um enough to issue a challenge you and
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  Speaker 1: I are going to try to kill one another for
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  Speaker 1: a little bit. Were not necessarily we'll get to that. Um.
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  Speaker 1: When you went to a duel, you had a second
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  Speaker 1: which basically was the guy who came along a friend,
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  Speaker 1: a trusted individual. Uh. It was it was like the
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  Speaker 1: best man at your death. He was there to like
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  Speaker 1: help you prepare your firearms or your sword. Um. He
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  Speaker 1: was there to basically make sure you weren't ambushed. Um.
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  Speaker 1: He was supposedly a neutral third party, a second um.
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  Speaker 1: Supposedly uh and uh. Supposedly we would try to talk
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  Speaker 1: talk it down and diffuse it. That was the first
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  Speaker 1: role of the second But I don't know how much
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  Speaker 1: I buy that. And Ed even points out, like more
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  Speaker 1: times than not, the second way to actually fight the
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  Speaker 1: other second and sometimes there was third and force that
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  Speaker 1: would fight the other third en force. And that's I
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  Speaker 1: looked at this as it's the same as like a
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  Speaker 1: bar fight today. There's always usually like a friend nearby
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  Speaker 1: that's you know, he's got your back, but it's really
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  Speaker 1: between you and that jerk. But if things get out
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  Speaker 1: of hand, he like gets a beer bottle all of
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  Speaker 1: a sudden, then you get involved and his friend gets involved.
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  Speaker 1: So it's sort of like that. I think, Yeah, if
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  Speaker 1: he tries to get in the middle of the two things,
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  Speaker 1: he ends up like River Phoenix at the end of
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  Speaker 1: stand by Me and takes a knife to the neck
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  Speaker 1: and dies in a bar that was so sad satis
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  Speaker 1: ending a River Phoenix character. Let's say, since he really died,
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  Speaker 1: then that's we should point that out. He had a
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  Speaker 1: sad ending in real life as well. Um, So Chuck.
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  Speaker 1: When you declared duel, you could use any weapon, but
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  Speaker 1: for a very long time, basically all you had available
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  Speaker 1: to you was a heavy sword. Yes, and you had
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  Speaker 1: used the same weapon, and depending on what code of
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  Speaker 1: dueling you were following, the challenger or challenge E would
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  Speaker 1: pick that weapon, right. Um, and you mentioned dueling codes.
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  Speaker 1: There were several dueling codes and the one that became
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  Speaker 1: the most widespread was the Dueling Code of seventeen seventy seven,
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  Speaker 1: the Irish code UM, which is cited extensively in this article.
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  Speaker 1: And I believe you're prepared to give everyone a treat
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  Speaker 1: and read some of the rules from the code. Yeah,
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  Speaker 1: the code Duello uh. It replaced um, the floss uh Duellatorium,
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  Speaker 1: which was in the fourteen hundreds, the ill Duello in
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  Speaker 1: fifteen fifty. Apparently the Germans had their own dueling code
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  Speaker 1: which um it was set by the fect Schulen dueling schools.
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  Speaker 1: Imagine there's was just because they were German. It was
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  Speaker 1: probably a little more hardcore, although everything was pretty hardcore
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  Speaker 1: back then. It was. But if you look at the
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  Speaker 1: dueling codes um, a lot of the rules appear to
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  Speaker 1: be set up so that you don't kill the other person.
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  Speaker 1: The whole point of a duel is not to kill
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  Speaker 1: the other person's to regain honor. Dueling is the result
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  Speaker 1: of an insult. When somebody insults you and you challenge
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  Speaker 1: them to a duel, you are seeking to say, I'm
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  Speaker 1: going to get my satisfaction from you. Basically, you punked
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  Speaker 1: me out in public, and that can't happen, that's another
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  Speaker 1: way to put it, because I would be looked at
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  Speaker 1: as a coward, and that would be a knock on
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  Speaker 1: my family's and my ancestors honor. Even Yeah, you had
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  Speaker 1: to protect the honor of your ancestors backwards and forwards
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  Speaker 1: in in space or time on either side of you.
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  Speaker 1: That's right, as I was saying, some of the uh,
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  Speaker 1: some of the rules are intended to prevent harm or injury,
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  Speaker 1: Like you see people like facing away from each other
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  Speaker 1: and turning and firing. That was a designed so that
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  Speaker 1: when you're using a clumsy seven teenth century firearm, Yeah,
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  Speaker 1: the chances of you hitting anybody, but a bystander way
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  Speaker 1: off in the distance is pretty low. Yeah. From what
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  Speaker 1: I gathered after reading a handful of these rules is
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  Speaker 1: that the Code Duello encouraged injury but not death. Yeah.
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  Speaker 1: What they didn't encourage was purposefully uh firing in the air,
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  Speaker 1: as sometimes happened when neither one of them really wanted
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  Speaker 1: to get hurt. They didn't really like that because that
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  Speaker 1: sort of takes all the the jotspah out of the
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  Speaker 1: duel to begin with. You're very excited to read these rules,
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  Speaker 1: aren't you jumping ahead a little bit? No? No No, no,
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  Speaker 1: we're not there yet. Um. But one of the rules,
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  Speaker 1: uh was that the winner could pretty much do whatever
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  Speaker 1: they wanted it once you've won the duel. If let's
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  Speaker 1: say there's an injury, you could kill him if you wanted.
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  Speaker 1: You could just humiliate him if you wanted. You could
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  Speaker 1: be a good guy and say, you know what, my
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  Speaker 1: honor has been squashed. It's great, so, uh, let me
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  Speaker 1: give you a hand up, a little buddy, and you're
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  Speaker 1: a good person for doing that. I would say, so
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  Speaker 1: I could see you totally doing that, Chuck. That wouldn't
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  Speaker 1: I would have been that. There's no way I would
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  Speaker 1: have been dueling to begin with. You you could also
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  Speaker 1: cut the other person's head off after finishing them off,
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  Speaker 1: or maybe finish them off by cutting his head off
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  Speaker 1: and then posting it in a public place, right um.
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  Speaker 1: I said also that the Irish code is very widespread,
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  Speaker 1: so much so that this to me is one of
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  Speaker 1: the facts of the podcast. It was reprinted in full
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  Speaker 1: as part of the Midshipman's Handbook of the U. S.
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  Speaker 1: Navy up until eighteen sixty two, when the Navy outlawed
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  Speaker 1: or band dueling among officers. But up until that time,
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  Speaker 1: it was like, hey, you're probably gonna get a duel
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  Speaker 1: at some point in time, and here's what the Navy
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  Speaker 1: says about that. And what the Navy says is what
• 9:48
  Speaker 1: the Irish saying. Women typically did not duel and when
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  Speaker 1: they did, uh, it says in the article here it
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  Speaker 1: was viewed on as an oddity and a strange, amusing spectacle,
• 9:59
  Speaker 1: which like Foxy boxing is today, well or the it's
• 10:02
  Speaker 1: kind of like the first catfights. Yeah, is that sexist totally?
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  Speaker 1: But I mean that's what they that's apparently what they
• 10:09
  Speaker 1: they viewed duels among women as it was an amusement
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  Speaker 1: for men because women are just so stupid. But that
• 10:15
  Speaker 1: that right, except except if you were dumb enough to
• 10:19
  Speaker 1: make uh that kind of judgment about Llamo pen Yeah,
• 10:23
  Speaker 1: you probably would have had your head cut clean off
• 10:25
  Speaker 1: your body. She was a genuine dueler swordswoman, and depending
• 10:31
  Speaker 1: on who you talked to, it's either her father who
• 10:33
  Speaker 1: trained her, or a lover who was a great fencer.
• 10:37
  Speaker 1: And uh, however, I think she liked the ladies as well,
• 10:41
  Speaker 1: because later in her life, after performing in bars and
• 10:45
  Speaker 1: a dressed as a man, but not to like say
• 10:48
  Speaker 1: hey I am a man. I think it was just like, hey,
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  Speaker 1: I'm more comfortable in these clothes. It's easier to move
• 10:51
  Speaker 1: in these clothes exactly. Um, she uh dug up the
• 10:56
  Speaker 1: corpse of a dead nun right put in the dorm room,
• 11:00
  Speaker 1: set that room on fire to take her own death
• 11:02
  Speaker 1: so she could escape the convent with her female lover.
• 11:08
  Speaker 1: She was a pretty uh progressive rock and chick back then. Yeah,
• 11:10
  Speaker 1: she was pretty cool. Um, and that was after she
• 11:14
  Speaker 1: retired from the opera Early Sea. Yeah, so she she
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  Speaker 1: was pretty cool. No foxy boxing there, No, I don't
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  Speaker 1: even know what that is. I haven't seen that. It's
• 11:24
  Speaker 1: exactly what it sounds like, yeah, it was kind of
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  Speaker 1: big in the I think the eighties, maybe the seventies
• 11:31
  Speaker 1: of like just women like boxing one another, but not
• 11:36
  Speaker 1: really and then like it's it's incredibly sexist. There were
• 11:40
  Speaker 1: a lot of fights at my school, my high school.
• 11:43
  Speaker 1: I mean not like a lot, like it was a
• 11:44
  Speaker 1: rough of school, but it always struck me even as
• 11:47
  Speaker 1: a youngster that like, when guys would get in a fight,
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  Speaker 1: it was always horrific, and then when girls would get
• 11:53
  Speaker 1: in a fight, the dudes would be sitting around laughing
• 11:55
  Speaker 1: at it. I saw a girl fight in high school
• 11:57
  Speaker 1: once that was really disturbing. It was more disturbing then
• 12:00
  Speaker 1: any guy fight I've ever seen because girls fight dirty. Yeah,
• 12:03
  Speaker 1: both of these girls were fighting very dirty. It was
• 12:05
  Speaker 1: really horrible. M One of the I think like the
• 12:08
  Speaker 1: assistant principal jumped in and got like smacked around and
• 12:11
  Speaker 1: ended up backing off. Yeah, that was a bad fight.
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  Speaker 1: So there was nothing funny about that one. No, not
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  Speaker 1: at all. And I mean, really, is there anything funny
• 12:18
  Speaker 1: about anybody fighting? No? I don't think so, unless it's like,
• 12:24
  Speaker 1: I don't know, clowns, Yeah, clowns fighting, Yeah, that'd be funny.
• 12:27
  Speaker 1: Clown fight. That's hilarious unless one of them dies, that's right,
• 12:31
  Speaker 1: Uh chuck. So we mentioned that seconds are in charge
• 12:35
  Speaker 1: of issuing apologies, and you can't just go over and say, um,
• 12:39
  Speaker 1: hey man, guys, sorry, he'll never do it again. Can
• 12:43
  Speaker 1: he have his gauntlet back? That just doesn't work. There's standards,
• 12:47
  Speaker 1: there's rules to issuing an apology, and as I understand,
• 12:51
  Speaker 1: you're prepared to explain the rule from the Code Duello
• 12:56
  Speaker 1: for issuing apology. I think even it's rule number one,
• 12:59
  Speaker 1: very first rule, as it should be. Let's hear, the
• 13:02
  Speaker 1: first offense requires the first apology, though the retort may
• 13:06
  Speaker 1: have been more offensive than the insult. Example, A tells
• 13:11
  Speaker 1: B he is impertinent, ETCETERA B retorts that he lies.
• 13:17
  Speaker 1: Yet A must make the first apology because he gave
• 13:20
  Speaker 1: the first offense, and then, after one fire, B may
• 13:24
  Speaker 1: explain away the retort by a subsequent apology. Very nice,
• 13:29
  Speaker 1: thank you, thank you very much. Um. So, basically, no
• 13:32
  Speaker 1: matter how bad the retort is from the first insult, Yes,
• 13:36
  Speaker 1: whoever insults the other person first has to apologize first,
• 13:40
  Speaker 1: then they shooting one another, and then the second person
• 13:42
  Speaker 1: can apologize. Um. You also have rules to whether or
• 13:48
  Speaker 1: not or how a um an apology can be accepted,
• 13:51
  Speaker 1: or if an apology a verbal one is even worth
• 13:55
  Speaker 1: anything at all? What situation that is it? Won't you?
• 13:58
  Speaker 1: I point you to rule number five Josh as a
• 14:01
  Speaker 1: blow is strictly prohibited under any circumstances among gentlemen. So
• 14:07
  Speaker 1: no hitting, evidently, yeah no, Or if you do, that's it. Yeah,
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  Speaker 1: there's no going back, No vertebal apology can be received
• 14:14
  Speaker 1: for such an insult. The alternatives therefore, the offender handing
• 14:19
  Speaker 1: a cane to the injured party to be used on
• 14:22
  Speaker 1: his own back at the shame time, begging pardon and
• 14:25
  Speaker 1: fightering on until one or both are disabled, or exchanging
• 14:28
  Speaker 1: three shots and then asking pardon without profit of the cane.
• 14:33
  Speaker 1: So if you wanted apology after smacking someone in the face, um,
• 14:38
  Speaker 1: but you didn't want the cane, you guys have just
• 14:40
  Speaker 1: shooted each other three times, or I imagine maybe deal
• 14:43
  Speaker 1: three blows with a sword. Right. But by this time
• 14:48
  Speaker 1: seventy seven firearms were all the rage for dueling, which
• 14:51
  Speaker 1: we'll get to. Um, so you've got to duel. All
• 14:54
  Speaker 1: the apologies have been either not offered or rejected, and
• 14:58
  Speaker 1: it's time for the due it's uh, there's certain etiquette, right.
• 15:04
  Speaker 1: You mentioned um that there's rules against not really doing
• 15:10
  Speaker 1: this wholeheartedly, Like if you're going to get into a duel,
• 15:12
  Speaker 1: you have to do it wholeheartedly as as far as
• 15:15
  Speaker 1: the code duelloh um is concerned. But this is also
• 15:20
  Speaker 1: one of the more frequently broken rules because most people
• 15:23
  Speaker 1: who were in duels didn't really want to die, and
• 15:25
  Speaker 1: they probably didn't want to kill the other person either,
• 15:27
  Speaker 1: because I imagine when you're in a duel with somebody
• 15:30
  Speaker 1: and that's your reality at that moment, and it's not
• 15:33
  Speaker 1: just some guys and powdered wigs out, you know, in
• 15:36
  Speaker 1: an apple tree, and it's avoid engraving or wood carving,
• 15:39
  Speaker 1: but it's really what's going on in your world. Right then,
• 15:42
  Speaker 1: I'm sure you are acutely interested in not killing and
• 15:47
  Speaker 1: not dying at that moment. Yeah. I would applied them
• 15:50
  Speaker 1: with alcohol. I would have been the guy being like,
• 15:52
  Speaker 1: come on, man, you would have made a great second,
• 15:54
  Speaker 1: like can we just have this ale here and talk
• 15:57
  Speaker 1: it over and laugh about it? Right, it's an right,
• 16:01
  Speaker 1: but they took it way more seriously than So. There's
• 16:05
  Speaker 1: this rule that says, man, if you're going to get
• 16:07
  Speaker 1: in a duel, you have to do it all the way.
• 16:10
  Speaker 1: It's called Rule thirteen. No dumb shooting or fighting in
• 16:14
  Speaker 1: the air is admissiable. In any case, the challenger ought
• 16:20
  Speaker 1: not to have challenge without receiving offense, and the challenged ought,
• 16:23
  Speaker 1: if he gave a finch, to have made an apology
• 16:27
  Speaker 1: before he came on the ground. Therefore, children's play must
• 16:30
  Speaker 1: be dishonorable on one side of the other end is
• 16:33
  Speaker 1: accordingly prohibited. Very nice. Um, so you've got all these
• 16:37
  Speaker 1: we need strickling Huh No, No, I think that's great. Okay. Um,
• 16:41
  Speaker 1: so so you you've got this rule that says you
• 16:45
  Speaker 1: you do this all the way. But that's not necessarily
• 16:48
  Speaker 1: how a lot of duels worked. Um, guys would agree
• 16:51
  Speaker 1: ahead of time, like, hey, we're actually gonna do the duel,
• 16:53
  Speaker 1: but we'll both shoot into the air. Um, you don't
• 16:56
  Speaker 1: want an idea, which, which, by the way, is what happened,
• 17:00
  Speaker 1: is how Alexander Hamilton died at the hands of the
• 17:02
  Speaker 1: treacherous Aaron Burr. Let's go ahead and talk about it. Well,
• 17:06
  Speaker 1: they were political rivals, they were both um, they were
• 17:10
  Speaker 1: in a law firm together, and that's where they first
• 17:12
  Speaker 1: learned to hate one another, and then they were in
• 17:14
  Speaker 1: a very small country at the time. They were very
• 17:17
  Speaker 1: big fish in the same small pond um and things
• 17:21
  Speaker 1: got out of hand. And I can't remember who challenged
• 17:24
  Speaker 1: you to a duel, do you? Uh? Yes, it was
• 17:27
  Speaker 1: a series of insults. And this was at a time
• 17:31
  Speaker 1: where the losing presidential candidate would become vice president, which
• 17:36
  Speaker 1: could you imagine that these days? Yeah, they'd be pretty
• 17:39
  Speaker 1: awesome kind of. I think it'd be nice. It would.
• 17:41
  Speaker 1: It would temper things, it would. I guess it was
• 17:44
  Speaker 1: for balance of power. It was a consolation price, that's true. Uh,
• 17:49
  Speaker 1: So they disliked each other. There were a bunch of insults,
• 17:52
  Speaker 1: and Burr challenged Hamilton's in Weehawken, New Jersey, and uh
• 17:58
  Speaker 1: they're varying accounts um on what happened. But what we
• 18:02
  Speaker 1: do know that happened Hamilton's got shot, Bird didn't Whether
• 18:05
  Speaker 1: or not Hamilton's fired in the air is a good guy,
• 18:07
  Speaker 1: that's what I heard, or got hit and was like
• 18:10
  Speaker 1: and fired up in the air. Never, it's debatable. Alexander
• 18:14
  Speaker 1: Hamilton was a crack shot. You great timing. He had
• 18:17
  Speaker 1: catlike reflexes. Aaron Burr shot Hamilton's Hamilton's fired into the air.
• 18:22
  Speaker 1: Aaron Burr was actually, uh, I think arrested for murder,
• 18:25
  Speaker 1: wasn't he? He was charged with murder and basically acquitted
• 18:29
  Speaker 1: in the end. But um, this is a time when
• 18:32
  Speaker 1: it was like kind of on the OLPs they were
• 18:34
  Speaker 1: beginning to outlaw dueling anyway, and it ruined his career,
• 18:37
  Speaker 1: basically ruined his political career. From that point, people are like,
• 18:40
  Speaker 1: who's on the twenty and by twenty, of course, I
• 18:44
  Speaker 1: mean who's on the tin? Yeah, Jackson's on the twenty,
• 18:47
  Speaker 1: but Alexander Hamilton's un stopped emailing. You've got nothing but
• 18:50
  Speaker 1: twenties though in your role, so that I can't even
• 18:52
  Speaker 1: tell him he's on the time. And did they even
• 18:54
  Speaker 1: make dollar bills? Um? So, chuck, let's get two seconds,
• 18:58
  Speaker 1: which again I wanted to say that, um oh before
• 19:01
  Speaker 1: I got ahead of ourselves. I'm sorry. Um. Also, you
• 19:05
  Speaker 1: should never duel at night. The only time when you
• 19:07
  Speaker 1: can legitimately hold a duel at night, meaning that the
• 19:10
  Speaker 1: same night of the offense. Um, it was when the
• 19:13
  Speaker 1: person was going to be leaving town before daybreak. No
• 19:17
  Speaker 1: need to even read that one that speaks for itself,
• 19:19
  Speaker 1: and that makes good sense. Basically they're cooler. Heads prevailed
• 19:21
  Speaker 1: generally the next day, h which is a great rule
• 19:26
  Speaker 1: in marriage in life. I'm always a big fan of
• 19:29
  Speaker 1: sleep on it. Why don't we sleep on it? Yep,
• 19:31
  Speaker 1: you're absolutely right. But and but sometimes the wife will
• 19:35
  Speaker 1: still wake up just as angry the next day. It happens,
• 19:38
  Speaker 1: But most times the worst is waking up in the
• 19:40
  Speaker 1: middle of the night angry. Yeah. That's pretty bad when
• 19:45
  Speaker 1: the rage is seething. Um, So, Chuck, do you want
• 19:50
  Speaker 1: to talk about seconds? Yes? Uh? Seconds Uh. They had
• 19:54
  Speaker 1: very specific rules for the role of the second Um.
• 19:57
  Speaker 1: They had to take care of the guns in the
• 19:59
  Speaker 1: same a and load in the presence of one another.
• 20:02
  Speaker 1: I can't shake the feeling that we're both in trouble. Um.
• 20:07
  Speaker 1: They would have to, like I said, load the guns
• 20:09
  Speaker 1: together and in front of each other, and the gun
• 20:12
  Speaker 1: was already agreed upon. Um. They have a smooth a
• 20:15
  Speaker 1: smooth boar. Yeah, and I think the rifle boar would
• 20:18
  Speaker 1: would be a more accurate, longer distance shot. So they said,
• 20:21
  Speaker 1: we can't use up. Yeah. It's like shot putting a
• 20:23
  Speaker 1: football or throwing it in a tight spiral, which one
• 20:26
  Speaker 1: is going to get further with more accuracy. Exactly. That
• 20:29
  Speaker 1: makes sense. But yeah, so you want to load in
• 20:32
  Speaker 1: the presence of one another, yeah, saying look, see the
• 20:35
  Speaker 1: boar smooth, and we're doing it right here so everyone
• 20:38
  Speaker 1: can see it. There are sports, everyone pay attention. And
• 20:41
  Speaker 1: we also mentioned how they are bound to offer or
• 20:45
  Speaker 1: to try to get an apology generated to avoid a duel.
• 20:50
  Speaker 1: They're supposed to according to the code UH and then
• 20:53
  Speaker 1: rule twenty five if if they can't come to any
• 20:56
  Speaker 1: kind of resolution and the seconds clearly or eyeball on
• 21:00
  Speaker 1: one another, like oh dude, you're going down to it's
• 21:03
  Speaker 1: on between us. They had rules for that as well,
• 21:06
  Speaker 1: like rule where seconds disagree and resolved to exchange shots themselves.
• 21:13
  Speaker 1: It must be at the shame time and at right angles.
• 21:16
  Speaker 1: With their principles, I don't get the right angles thing.
• 21:18
  Speaker 1: How is that physically possible? I don't know. I took
• 21:24
  Speaker 1: that to mean they shoot from the same angle that
• 21:28
  Speaker 1: would be parallel, not right angle. Well, I don't think
• 21:31
  Speaker 1: it meant right angle in the geometric sense. I think
• 21:33
  Speaker 1: it meant the correct angle, as in the same angle.
• 21:37
  Speaker 1: Maybe I'm wrong. Do you think it meant like geometry
• 21:41
  Speaker 1: I think the authors had put in a full day
• 21:43
  Speaker 1: by the time they got to this rule, or maybe
• 21:45
  Speaker 1: at right angles. That meant, if these two are shooting here,
• 21:48
  Speaker 1: then they have to shoot there. So they don't there's
• 21:50
  Speaker 1: no crossfire coming at them. Okay, so they make a square.
• 21:57
  Speaker 1: I don't know, we'll have to look into that um.
• 21:59
  Speaker 1: And then how do you know when a duels over,
• 22:01
  Speaker 1: especially when it doesn't necessarily result in the decapitation of one.
• 22:05
  Speaker 1: When you cut somebody's head off and posted on a
• 22:07
  Speaker 1: pike in the town square, the duels over. But there's
• 22:11
  Speaker 1: also more nuanced endings possible. Right rule number five if
• 22:16
  Speaker 1: Schauds are used, Mr Turbec, the parties engage until one
• 22:21
  Speaker 1: is well bloodied, disabled or disarmed, or until after receiving
• 22:25
  Speaker 1: a wound and blood being drawn, unless the unless the
• 22:30
  Speaker 1: person who's disabled insists that it's only a flesh point. Right,
• 22:34
  Speaker 1: he does have a Did you notice his his money
• 22:37
  Speaker 1: Python reference in here? No, that's definitely not the only
• 22:40
  Speaker 1: article with the money Python reference from him. What is it? Well,
• 22:44
  Speaker 1: later on he's talking about how nobles weren't allowed to
• 22:46
  Speaker 1: work and they made money off of rent from their
• 22:49
  Speaker 1: huge tracts of land. That's for money. By then, I
• 22:52
  Speaker 1: don't remember that part. Do you remember that she's got
• 22:55
  Speaker 1: huge tracts of land? I don't remember. That's a good part.
• 23:00
  Speaker 1: Good for you for noticing that he's always sneaking them
• 23:03
  Speaker 1: in um. And also, any wounds sufficient to agitate the
• 23:08
  Speaker 1: nerves or make the handshake must end the business of
• 23:12
  Speaker 1: the day. I mean that would be that's kind of
• 23:15
  Speaker 1: a loose if you ask me. Yeah, but that does
• 23:18
  Speaker 1: mean that the duel is over. So that's uh. If
• 23:21
  Speaker 1: you if you want to know more, if you want
• 23:23
  Speaker 1: to know all the rules, you can get your hands
• 23:26
  Speaker 1: on a pre eighteen sixty two US Navy Midshipman's Handbook.
• 23:31
  Speaker 1: Apparently PBS has all of them as well on frontline site.
• 23:36
  Speaker 1: We don't. I'm sorry, um, but chuck. Dueling was for
• 23:42
  Speaker 1: a very long time the pursuit of nobles right. As
• 23:46
  Speaker 1: a matter of fact, it was used to differentiate nobles
• 23:48
  Speaker 1: from common people. Like in a lot of medieval Europe
• 23:52
  Speaker 1: European countries, Um, commoners weren't allowed to duel. It was out,
• 23:57
  Speaker 1: it was illegal. Yeah, and before gun that a lot
• 24:00
  Speaker 1: of commoners couldn't even afford swords because swords are expensive
• 24:03
  Speaker 1: to make and even more expensive than firearms once they
• 24:06
  Speaker 1: came around, so a lot of them couldn't duel in
• 24:09
  Speaker 1: the traditional sense, although the Grabster points out that there
• 24:14
  Speaker 1: were plenty of dual like circumstances among commoners too. It
• 24:18
  Speaker 1: was probably just the bar fight. You just can't let
• 24:21
  Speaker 1: the local fuzz find out what you're doing. Yes, and
• 24:24
  Speaker 1: noblemen were expected to duel, right, and the whole point
• 24:27
  Speaker 1: of dueling was the protection of honor. And honor as
• 24:30
  Speaker 1: a concept, as the Grabster points out, is is not
• 24:33
  Speaker 1: what we think of it today. Um. Honor is basically
• 24:36
  Speaker 1: like if you were rich, if you have a title,
• 24:39
  Speaker 1: if you are a member of an important family, you
• 24:42
  Speaker 1: have honor automatically it's attached to you. Yeah, it doesn't
• 24:45
  Speaker 1: mean that you were a good upstanding guy. It just
• 24:47
  Speaker 1: means like, this is your station in life. You were
• 24:50
  Speaker 1: you're blessed basically by being born rich and white. Exactly.
• 24:53
  Speaker 1: It's like the one percent um and you have honor.
• 24:58
  Speaker 1: And it's fragile, extremely at all times. Uh, it's prone
• 25:03
  Speaker 1: to be insulted at the drop of the drop of
• 25:06
  Speaker 1: a glove, especially, but even the drop of the hat. Um.
• 25:09
  Speaker 1: And not only is your honor at stake, but the
• 25:11
  Speaker 1: honor of your family for generations forward, generations backward, and
• 25:16
  Speaker 1: any schmow of noble rank um. I imagine if a
• 25:20
  Speaker 1: commoner came up and insulted your family, you just cut
• 25:23
  Speaker 1: their head off right there, and there's no duel. It's
• 25:25
  Speaker 1: just death for the commoner, right. But if another person
• 25:28
  Speaker 1: of nobility comes up and insult your family honor, then
• 25:32
  Speaker 1: you say it's on. I challenge you to a duel.
• 25:36
  Speaker 1: At this point, and you've mentioned cowardice already, but at
• 25:39
  Speaker 1: this point, the other person has a choice. Very socially speaking,
• 25:44
  Speaker 1: they don't really have a choice that they do have
• 25:46
  Speaker 1: a choice. They can either accept the duel or they
• 25:49
  Speaker 1: can be a coward. And in the same vein, the
• 25:52
  Speaker 1: person whose honor is insulted has a choice. They can
• 25:55
  Speaker 1: either issue a challenge to a duel or they can
• 25:58
  Speaker 1: let it slide. Either if you let it slide, or
• 26:01
  Speaker 1: you sure could duel, you're a coward. And that was
• 26:04
  Speaker 1: a big deal back then. Yeah, it wasn't just like,
• 26:07
  Speaker 1: you know, Jimmy's a sissy because he wouldn't fight me
• 26:09
  Speaker 1: at school. It was which haunts you for the rest
• 26:11
  Speaker 1: of your life. That's true, But your family was was insulted,
• 26:16
  Speaker 1: you could lose your honor, like they would take it
• 26:19
  Speaker 1: away legally sometimes, Um, they could publish an account of
• 26:23
  Speaker 1: it to the church who and you know in the
• 26:25
  Speaker 1: church they're gonna tell everybody you're a coward. Uh. It
• 26:30
  Speaker 1: was not an abstract thing. Kings who would not uphold
• 26:34
  Speaker 1: their honor could lose their noble ranking. They would just
• 26:37
  Speaker 1: take it away. And you could actually be punished and
• 26:39
  Speaker 1: excommunicated and your voting rights revoked for cowardice, serious stuff.
• 26:44
  Speaker 1: Back then. You could also be imprisoned and killed and
• 26:48
  Speaker 1: just it just generally bad things fed to dragons. Probably.
• 26:51
  Speaker 1: I don't know if you could be killed. I just
• 26:53
  Speaker 1: I just said that, well, if a dragon's evening you,
• 26:56
  Speaker 1: you wish someone would kill you. A good point. Um,
• 26:59
  Speaker 1: So I think probably the whole this whole code, this
• 27:03
  Speaker 1: whole dueling code is and how refined it became was
• 27:07
  Speaker 1: out of the frequency of dueling. Right. Yeah. Apparently, like
• 27:11
  Speaker 1: you said, these people um sat around with their huge
• 27:14
  Speaker 1: tracts of land. Well they couldn't work. No, they like
• 27:17
  Speaker 1: you couldn't work if you wanted to work, you couldn't
• 27:21
  Speaker 1: if you were of noble noble blood. Yeah, I mean,
• 27:24
  Speaker 1: you literally could not hold a job even if if
• 27:27
  Speaker 1: you're like if you found you were really good at something.
• 27:30
  Speaker 1: But I really like Blacksmith in making these these shoes,
• 27:33
  Speaker 1: these sports shoes. You're a nobleman, you have to make
• 27:36
  Speaker 1: your money off of rent. So the end result of
• 27:39
  Speaker 1: that is after a lot of sitting around and uh
• 27:42
  Speaker 1: fox hunting and mead drinking, you get a little bored,
• 27:46
  Speaker 1: and so dueling kind of became a sport for board nobleman. Yeah,
• 27:51
  Speaker 1: these young guys are like, well, I got nothing better
• 27:53
  Speaker 1: to do, so let me go down to the pub
• 27:55
  Speaker 1: and uh throw down the gauntlet on someone, or just
• 27:59
  Speaker 1: be really easy, really irritable to where anything that happens
• 28:02
  Speaker 1: to me. You bought me in the bar and like
• 28:03
  Speaker 1: all right, it's on, or you looked at my lady.
• 28:06
  Speaker 1: That was a big one. Yeah. Um, the other aspect
• 28:09
  Speaker 1: of it wasn't just boredom. It was also that you
• 28:12
  Speaker 1: were the better person in a field where you know,
• 28:16
  Speaker 1: there is a definite set hierarchy. Earls are equal to earls,
• 28:20
  Speaker 1: and dukes equal to dukes, and viscounts equal to viscants,
• 28:25
  Speaker 1: um viceroys equal device rays. That whole kind of thing
• 28:28
  Speaker 1: I could continue, I don't. I can't continue. You called
• 28:32
  Speaker 1: my bluff, um. But this is a way to differentiate
• 28:35
  Speaker 1: yourself among your rank by saying I challenge you to duel,
• 28:40
  Speaker 1: and I won. And the reason that differentiates me is
• 28:44
  Speaker 1: not only am I the winner, but it means that
• 28:46
  Speaker 1: God favors me. And apparently that that was used that
• 28:51
  Speaker 1: was the predecessor to the legal systems we had today. Well, yeah,
• 28:55
  Speaker 1: let's let's get to this. This is the commoners, uh
• 28:58
  Speaker 1: would duel early on in the eleventh in twelve centuries um,
• 29:02
  Speaker 1: you would have trial by combat. Sometimes it was like
• 29:05
  Speaker 1: dunking a witch. Like if the witch floated, she was
• 29:08
  Speaker 1: a witch, and then she got burned out of the steak.
• 29:10
  Speaker 1: If she drowned, then she wasn't really a witch and
• 29:13
  Speaker 1: she was pure of heart. So if you win the duel,
• 29:15
  Speaker 1: then you're at in fact innocent of your crime. Yes,
• 29:17
  Speaker 1: because God favored the winner of the duel, and more importantly,
• 29:21
  Speaker 1: the guy who accused you was now dead, so you
• 29:23
  Speaker 1: must be innocent. Although you may also fight a court
• 29:27
  Speaker 1: appointed really professional duelists. That's awesome and I can't imagine
• 29:32
  Speaker 1: beating that guy. Yeah, who would that? What was the
• 29:36
  Speaker 1: most Sky in the Max Mad Max three. Master Blaster. Yeah,
• 29:41
  Speaker 1: Master Blaster, you fight Master Blaster. Yeah you kill them. Boy,
• 29:45
  Speaker 1: what a reveal that was when they took off his mask. Yeah.
• 29:48
  Speaker 1: Powerful stuff. A lot of times, if you were good
• 29:51
  Speaker 1: at dueling, you would just use it to get out
• 29:54
  Speaker 1: of stuff like, Hey, I don't want to pay this bill,
• 29:58
  Speaker 1: so let's duel about it, and that settle it. And
• 30:00
  Speaker 1: I know I'm really good with the swords, so you
• 30:03
  Speaker 1: don't stand a chance. Yeah, it's all over. Not just
• 30:06
  Speaker 1: um debts, but also like if you had a political rival,
• 30:10
  Speaker 1: um that later became really big in Missouri. Yes, Um,
• 30:14
  Speaker 1: if you wanted somebody's land, anything, anybody who who had
• 30:20
  Speaker 1: something you wanted or who you owed something to, you
• 30:22
  Speaker 1: could just challenge them to a duel, kill them in
• 30:24
  Speaker 1: their problem solved. This is one of the reasons why
• 30:27
  Speaker 1: I think that noble classes were eventually removed from the
• 30:30
  Speaker 1: face of the earth. Well, you mentioned Missouri. Between eighteen
• 30:35
  Speaker 1: sixteen and eighteen twenty four, the the elect territorial elections
• 30:39
  Speaker 1: became so fraught with dueling to get rid of your
• 30:42
  Speaker 1: rival that, um. The first governor of California, Peter Burnett, said,
• 30:46
  Speaker 1: Peter Burgh. Now Peter Burnett said it became desirable to
• 30:49
  Speaker 1: kill off certain aspirants to get them out of the way.
• 30:52
  Speaker 1: So in Missouri even just you know, killed the dude
• 30:56
  Speaker 1: before election day and you're all set. Yeah. Can you
• 30:58
  Speaker 1: imagine like new Ingrich and Mitt Romney dueling one another? No,
• 31:03
  Speaker 1: because no. Um, So you've got dueling evolving from early
• 31:11
  Speaker 1: legal uh an early legal system, to the board noble
• 31:16
  Speaker 1: classes to the elimination of political rivals. Um. And it
• 31:24
  Speaker 1: comes from even further back than that though, like the duel,
• 31:28
  Speaker 1: the idea of one person battling another person in some
• 31:32
  Speaker 1: sort of combat and a formal rule driven way grabs
• 31:37
  Speaker 1: her goes back to jostin competitions in the Middle Ages,
• 31:40
  Speaker 1: I think, go back to glatutorial combat further back than that.
• 31:45
  Speaker 1: But um, in Europe, in western Europe, northwestern Europe, it
• 31:50
  Speaker 1: came from jousting, right, Yeah, And it makes sense to me, uh,
• 31:54
  Speaker 1: Like you said, the joust is pretty much a duel
• 31:56
  Speaker 1: on horseback. Then you had the chivalric code, which sort
• 31:59
  Speaker 1: of lines up with the code of the duel. And
• 32:01
  Speaker 1: also you skipped right past what to me is one
• 32:04
  Speaker 1: of the facts of the podcast. Oh no, I didn't
• 32:06
  Speaker 1: know was coming. Go ahead, you go ahead. Well when nights, uh,
• 32:10
  Speaker 1: only uh, noble noblemen were allowed to be knights and
• 32:13
  Speaker 1: to joust against one another. So they would raise their
• 32:16
  Speaker 1: visor at the beginning to say, hey, look at me,
• 32:19
  Speaker 1: I'm not just sending along my assistant, who's a lot
• 32:21
  Speaker 1: better at this than I am, as Heath Ledger did,
• 32:24
  Speaker 1: As Heath Ledger did. What what was that first night? Yeah,
• 32:27
  Speaker 1: that's a good movie, that's all right. Uh. So they
• 32:29
  Speaker 1: would reveal their identities, and that josh, as you know,
• 32:35
  Speaker 1: was evolved into the military salute. Years later, the lift
• 32:38
  Speaker 1: of the visor evolved into that the hand. I guess
• 32:41
  Speaker 1: pretty cool, very cool. Um. Eventually, though, firearms came around
• 32:47
  Speaker 1: and they found that yeah, these incredibly heavy suits of
• 32:50
  Speaker 1: armor that can protect you even from a joust. Generally, um,
• 32:55
  Speaker 1: are no match for this. Must get the smooth board,
• 32:58
  Speaker 1: must get with terrible aim and accuracy, which if it'll
• 33:01
  Speaker 1: kill you. Yeah. In our night's podcast, that was kind
• 33:03
  Speaker 1: of the end of the night exactly. It was also
• 33:05
  Speaker 1: what the end of Samurai. Yeah, guns ruined everything. Yeah,
• 33:13
  Speaker 1: well they changed everything for the worst. Um, and then
• 33:18
  Speaker 1: you have uh as a result, the no no More
• 33:22
  Speaker 1: need for a heavy sword because there's no need for armor.
• 33:26
  Speaker 1: Armor doesn't work, no heavy swords, which they do. An
• 33:29
  Speaker 1: evolution and sword making, and you have, at least in Europe.
• 33:32
  Speaker 1: I think Japan already had far lighter, more better swords.
• 33:36
  Speaker 1: But um in the West. The evolution of swords led
• 33:40
  Speaker 1: to the sport of fencing as a direct result of
• 33:43
  Speaker 1: dueling and the loss of armor, and it became more contest,
• 33:47
  Speaker 1: especially after the Italian said, I don't want to die.
• 33:51
  Speaker 1: Let's put a little put a little rubber tip on
• 33:53
  Speaker 1: the internet. My sister was in defencing. Call interesting, old sister.
• 33:59
  Speaker 1: I've always uh, I've always wanted to try that. Well,
• 34:03
  Speaker 1: I think you should go to town. You could take classes, right, totally.
• 34:07
  Speaker 1: I think it's a kind of expensive startup. Sure, like
• 34:10
  Speaker 1: the whole get up in in a decent sword and
• 34:12
  Speaker 1: all that, but a foil if in the vernacular. But
• 34:17
  Speaker 1: I'm I'm sure once you got all that stuff, you're fine. Yeah.
• 34:19
  Speaker 1: That would end up being like my venture into ice hockey,
• 34:21
  Speaker 1: though I could just end up having a closet full
• 34:23
  Speaker 1: of gear really ever gets used. I didn't know you're
• 34:26
  Speaker 1: in the hockey. I was at one point, uh, mid twenties. Yeah,
• 34:32
  Speaker 1: I learned how to ice skate pretty well, and then
• 34:34
  Speaker 1: me and all my friends got hockey gear and we're like, hey,
• 34:36
  Speaker 1: let's play, and uh, that was pretty much where it ended. Yeah, pistols,
• 34:43
  Speaker 1: so Josh, and when did you get into pistols? Well no, no, no,
• 34:46
  Speaker 1: I didn't get into pistols ever. But um, when pistols
• 34:49
  Speaker 1: came along, basically leveled the playing field because pistols are
• 34:53
  Speaker 1: actually cheaper than swords and cheaper than getting trained and fencing.
• 34:58
  Speaker 1: You can just practice shooting, you know, coke cans in
• 35:01
  Speaker 1: the backyard. So all of a sudden, it democratize it.
• 35:06
  Speaker 1: It was no longer the sport of noblemen because anyone
• 35:09
  Speaker 1: could do it right. And this is a time when um,
• 35:12
  Speaker 1: the word cocktail was invented to describe the strong drink
• 35:17
  Speaker 1: you had in the morning, like an old fashioned um.
• 35:20
  Speaker 1: So America was super drunk. So dueling seemed like a
• 35:23
  Speaker 1: really good idea, and it took off as a sport, well,
• 35:26
  Speaker 1: not as a sport, but basically as a as a
• 35:29
  Speaker 1: socially accepted pastime because America doesn't have kings or dukes
• 35:33
  Speaker 1: or anything, and there are a lot of guns at
• 35:34
  Speaker 1: the time, and everybody started shooting one another in duels well,
• 35:38
  Speaker 1: which is one of the big reasons dueling began to die. Uh,
• 35:43
  Speaker 1: I thought, and it pointed out that I was wrong.
• 35:45
  Speaker 1: I thought it maybe because people called forward the end
• 35:48
  Speaker 1: of it and said, you know, this is wrong, we
• 35:49
  Speaker 1: shouldn't be doing this. But since dueling began, the church
• 35:53
  Speaker 1: and other legal bodies said said, we don't like this
• 35:56
  Speaker 1: because it takes the Uh it kind of cripples I
• 35:59
  Speaker 1: leegal stim because you're taking into your own hands. And
• 36:02
  Speaker 1: the church didn't like it. They were like, we want
• 36:03
  Speaker 1: to judge these people on their crimes. And it also
• 36:06
  Speaker 1: kind of violates one of the big bigger commandments. Absolutely
• 36:11
  Speaker 1: forget about the crusades for that one. But sure. Uh.
• 36:16
  Speaker 1: Military leaders didn't like it because it was killing off
• 36:18
  Speaker 1: able young bodied men. Yeah, and then later on war itself,
• 36:23
  Speaker 1: like the Civil War and the First World War really
• 36:28
  Speaker 1: were like, hey, there's more serious things going on. People
• 36:31
  Speaker 1: really die in battle, like it sort of became a
• 36:34
  Speaker 1: bit of fools undertaking. Well what I understand. I think
• 36:38
  Speaker 1: it also hit home to the horrors of combat, made
• 36:42
  Speaker 1: people not want to kill one another as much like
• 36:44
  Speaker 1: real deal combat. Yeah, and the Civil War and the
• 36:48
  Speaker 1: First World War. Like you said, we're linked to declines
• 36:50
  Speaker 1: in the US and Europe respectively of dueling. Um and
• 36:56
  Speaker 1: there's I guess also one of the other reasons dueling
• 37:00
  Speaker 1: declined was because when it was exposed to the male classes,
• 37:03
  Speaker 1: it wasn't just super rich people killing each other anymore,
• 37:06
  Speaker 1: which was the original purpose, which is why the lower
• 37:08
  Speaker 1: classes were like, who cares? Dueling is fine, Go, that's fine,
• 37:12
  Speaker 1: We're doing our own thing. And then once it's, like
• 37:14
  Speaker 1: you said, democratized and spread to the middle and lower classes,
• 37:18
  Speaker 1: it became a problem. And then eventually it was we
• 37:22
  Speaker 1: were left with dueling banjo's and that was about as
• 37:24
  Speaker 1: serious as it got. I think that that is an
• 37:27
  Speaker 1: excellent way to end this podcast. Dude, you got you can't.
• 37:31
  Speaker 1: I'm not even gonna ask if you have an anything more.
• 37:33
  Speaker 1: If you want to learn more about dueling and you
• 37:35
  Speaker 1: want to see some of these cool rules, you can
• 37:38
  Speaker 1: type duel into the search bar at how stuff works
• 37:41
  Speaker 1: dot com. Yeah, and I said search bar, which means
• 37:44
  Speaker 1: it's time for a listener mail. WHOA. I'm gonna say
• 37:50
  Speaker 1: whoa from now on, apparently, Chuck, Before we do listener mail,
• 37:53
  Speaker 1: we should announce our big south By Southwest extrap agans
• 37:57
  Speaker 1: two days two days in March, we'll call it Okay
• 38:00
  Speaker 1: March eleven, we will be live podcasting and this is
• 38:03
  Speaker 1: for south By Southwest attendees and badge holders only. Unfortunately,
• 38:08
  Speaker 1: uh Driscoll Hotel, Maximilian Room, three pm, Live podcast done.
• 38:16
  Speaker 1: What's happened in the next day. The next day from
• 38:18
  Speaker 1: five to nine at Fidough Irish Pub at to fourteen
• 38:20
  Speaker 1: West fourth Street in Austin, we are going to be
• 38:23
  Speaker 1: having a stuff you Should Know variety show. It's open
• 38:26
  Speaker 1: to the public. You don't have to be a badge holder,
• 38:29
  Speaker 1: free note cover and as a matter of fact, if
• 38:31
  Speaker 1: you were on the first hundred people through the door,
• 38:33
  Speaker 1: you get a free ticket for a free drink. That's right, yeah. Um.
• 38:37
  Speaker 1: And this is going to feature the likes of Hodgement,
• 38:40
  Speaker 1: Eugene Merman's gonna do some stand up for us, the
• 38:43
  Speaker 1: musical stylings of Lucy Waywright Roach who plays Jerry in
• 38:47
  Speaker 1: our TV pilot which you're gonna premiere. Um and let's
• 38:51
  Speaker 1: see Crooks local Austin Man. And then the Henry Clay
• 38:54
  Speaker 1: people are going to play some music as well. And
• 38:56
  Speaker 1: again we're gonna be showing clips from our TV pilot
• 38:59
  Speaker 1: that's going to air a science channel, and this is
• 39:01
  Speaker 1: the public debut. That's right. So if you are in
• 39:05
  Speaker 1: the just let's just say the west from Texas to California,
• 39:10
  Speaker 1: or actually you could go from the east. Just make
• 39:12
  Speaker 1: a point to be there. That's all I'm saying. You
• 39:15
  Speaker 1: can crash on my floor. Actually you can't, but you
• 39:18
  Speaker 1: can crash in your van. All right, back to it, Okay, yeah, Josh,
• 39:22
  Speaker 1: this is a shout out. Remember Joanne uh stand alonis
• 39:25
  Speaker 1: who nominated us to get nominated for a Grammy Award.
• 39:30
  Speaker 1: Grammy nominated, nominated, Right, we didn't make it because we're
• 39:33
  Speaker 1: not a celebrity reading our autopography, which is the only
• 39:36
  Speaker 1: people who get nominated for spoken word. I'm we're not um.
• 39:40
  Speaker 1: But Joanne is the founder and CEO of the Amazon Institute,
• 39:43
  Speaker 1: which we've talked about before, and she's doing a lot
• 39:46
  Speaker 1: of great work to help preserve the Amazon uh it
• 39:50
  Speaker 1: is Amazon Institute dot com. And they're having a little
• 39:53
  Speaker 1: contest where you can win two round trip tickets to Bogata, Columbia,
• 40:00
  Speaker 1: And this is how you do it. You go to
• 40:01
  Speaker 1: Amazon Institute dot com. Any listener who wants to can
• 40:05
  Speaker 1: participate by clicking our projects in the navigation bar. And
• 40:09
  Speaker 1: basically what you do is create a page on razoo
• 40:12
  Speaker 1: dot com to fundraise for them, and between now and
• 40:15
  Speaker 1: the end of June, June at midnight Eastern, the page
• 40:18
  Speaker 1: with the most funds gets to choose between two round
• 40:21
  Speaker 1: trip flights to Bogata or one ticket to travel with
• 40:26
  Speaker 1: her as your guide. Um, and it just covers air fare,
• 40:30
  Speaker 1: but she says, they'll hook you up with all the
• 40:32
  Speaker 1: information and cheap places to stay and um, flights depart
• 40:37
  Speaker 1: you've got to be over eighteen flights depart from New
• 40:39
  Speaker 1: York A see Port Lauderdale, Miami. I guess only okay
• 40:45
  Speaker 1: because they are limitations and you can always get a
• 40:47
  Speaker 1: connection to one of those cities. And travel dates are
• 40:50
  Speaker 1: August through December of this year. Tickets provided by Avianca
• 40:54
  Speaker 1: Airlines and uh they use Razoo because it's very transparent.
• 40:59
  Speaker 1: You can see where all the money is going. Very cool.
• 41:01
  Speaker 1: So Joanne, thank you for your participation with our show. Yeah,
• 41:06
  Speaker 1: we appreciate and with the Amazon Institute and uh go
• 41:10
  Speaker 1: out and win tickets to Columbia. People give them the
• 41:13
  Speaker 1: give them the website again it is Amazon Institute dot
• 41:16
  Speaker 1: com and you create a page to help them raise
• 41:19
  Speaker 1: money on Razu. What's the tab that you click our
• 41:23
  Speaker 1: projects and you could win a trip well. As always Chuck,
• 41:27
  Speaker 1: remember we put out the word for um NGOs and
• 41:31
  Speaker 1: nonprofits who need a good plug. We're always looking for those.
• 41:36
  Speaker 1: Um Yeah, we want to hear about them. Send them
• 41:40
  Speaker 1: to us. You can tweet to us at s y
• 41:42
  Speaker 1: s K podcast. That's our Twitter handle. Um You can
• 41:45
  Speaker 1: also reach us on Facebook at Facebook dot com slash snow,
• 41:48
  Speaker 1: and you can send us a nice link the email
• 41:52
  Speaker 1: at Stuff Podcast at Discovery dot com. Be sure to
• 42:01
  Speaker 1: check out our new video podcast, Stuff from the Future.
• 42:04
  Speaker 1: Join Halstework staff as we explore the most promising and
• 42:07
  Speaker 1: perplexing possibilities of tomorrow, brought to you by the reinvented
• 42:13
  Speaker 1: two thousand twelve camera. It's ready, are you