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Modern Pharmacy Media and the Rise of Functional Medicine | TWIRx · Pharmacy Podcast Network

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  Speaker 1: You are listening to the global network of podcasters dedicated
• 0:09
  Speaker 1: to the pharmacy profession. Welcome to the Pharmacy podcast.
• 0:12
  Speaker 2: Network, Hey, listeners of Twerks of This Week in Pharmacy
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  Speaker 2: special episode today, I had a dream.
• 0:46
  Speaker 3: I had a.
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  Speaker 2: Dream, my goodness, probably ten years ago, and it involves
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  Speaker 2: a friend of mine who's been in my life for
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  Speaker 2: more than fifteen years in the pharmacy business, mister Josh Paristani.
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  Speaker 2: He's one of pharmacy fifties most influential, and obviously the
• 1:02
  Speaker 2: reason is because he's so dedicated to the realm of
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  Speaker 2: survival and thriving of our independent community pharmacy so much
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  Speaker 2: that he put out a magazine called Dispense Times. And
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  Speaker 2: I was thrilled to hear about that because my version
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  Speaker 2: of This Week in Pharmacy, if you think of the
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  Speaker 2: original kind of thought of this, was to use a
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  Speaker 2: magazine as a way of pulling over content and then
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  Speaker 2: expanding that content through discussions through podcasting. So I'd like
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  Speaker 2: to welcome Chris Ray, who's on the board of advisors. Chris,
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  Speaker 2: Welcome to Twerks.
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  Speaker 3: And I can't remember what title, what role do you
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  Speaker 3: have over it at.
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  Speaker 4: Dispense Times yeah, I think I am actually the prison
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  Speaker 4: of the advisory board.
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  Speaker 5: So we'll go with that.
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  Speaker 3: We'll go with that.
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  Speaker 2: But thank you so much. I'm so proud to be
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  Speaker 2: on the advisory board at all. We had a really
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  Speaker 2: good meeting a little while ago. But Dispense Times has
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  Speaker 2: come a long way. And I tell you what the
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  Speaker 2: website is out of this world. The accessibility of the
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  Speaker 2: information it's available. Shout out to Josh once again for
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  Speaker 2: doing such a good job. If you're driving, if you're walking,
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  Speaker 2: and you don't you don't have time to look, you
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  Speaker 2: can go to your YouTube channel and actually find this
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  Speaker 2: this interview. But this this website looks amazing, Chris. It's
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  Speaker 2: broken up into several different categories, news and clinical operations, technology, marketplace,
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  Speaker 2: and then of course my favorite part is the magazine.
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  Speaker 2: And a shout out to doctor Nicole at Matthew. She's
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  Speaker 2: on the cover of our latest magazine edition of Dispensed Times.
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  Speaker 2: But Chris, talk to us about your involvement and how
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  Speaker 2: you got involved in Dispense Times.
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  Speaker 4: Yeah, Todd, So you know there are other periodicals out there,
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  Speaker 4: they're dedicated to pharmacy. But when talking to Josh and
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  Speaker 4: other vendors in this industry. A lot of those folks said, hey,
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  Speaker 4: there's nothing dedicated to just the community pharmacies. Right, there's
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  Speaker 4: a lot of good clinical magazine and magazines with clinical
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  Speaker 4: type of information. But what we wanted to come up
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  Speaker 4: with is something that hit four strong pillars of pharmacy
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  Speaker 4: ownership and community pharmacy, and those pillars consist of clinical expansion,
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  Speaker 4: so operating at the top of your license, legislative efforts,
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  Speaker 4: so what's going on from a legislative standpoint in both
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  Speaker 4: the state and federal level. And then also pharmacy economics,
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  Speaker 4: so what are pharmacies doing to keep their doors open
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  Speaker 4: and keep a sustainable business? And then the other one
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  Speaker 4: being workflow optimization. So when it comes down to it,
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  Speaker 4: we're looking for content and we're looking for vendors that
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  Speaker 4: solely are focused on those things. And I think that
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  Speaker 4: that has resonated with community farm paracy owners where we
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  Speaker 4: have about eight to nine thousand readers on every issue.
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  Speaker 3: It's freaking amazing. I love this.
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  Speaker 2: I love the fact that, like you said, it's very purposeful.
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  Speaker 2: It's not just a magazine for magazine's sake. There's really
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  Speaker 2: some structure and the type of issues and the themes
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  Speaker 2: that you're dialing into. And then the powerhouses that we
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  Speaker 2: have on our team, Bruce Nalan and Darshan Kolcarney and
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  Speaker 2: you and Josh and Leanne, and it's just there's people
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  Speaker 2: to start off. Just start off this way for listeners.
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  Speaker 2: Everyone that's involved in this magazine, from the board of
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  Speaker 2: Advisor to the editor, we are personally vested in the
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  Speaker 2: success of pharmacy and more importantly, I think the independent
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  Speaker 2: community of pharmacy.
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  Speaker 3: And here's what's happening. It's evolving.
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  Speaker 2: So you back up ten years ago, Chris, and you
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  Speaker 2: remember very well pharmacy was different. And now we're finally
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  Speaker 2: seeing PBM reform really getting some bigger teeth, stronger teeth,
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  Speaker 2: stronger grips. Tennessee, you can't own an insurance company and
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  Speaker 2: a pharmacy saying with Arkansas, that's going to continue.
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  Speaker 3: So as we're evolving and as.
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  Speaker 2: Things are changing, we need publications that are up to
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  Speaker 2: date with those same things that are happening. And then
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  Speaker 2: better than that, we have to have publications that are
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  Speaker 2: giving us blueprints in guidance to what's going to what's
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  Speaker 2: going to be the next evolution of independent community pharmacy,
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  Speaker 2: because I guarantee you, as I'm saying this in this
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  Speaker 2: podcast on this wonderful Friday, that things are going to
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  Speaker 2: be vastly different in two to five years from now
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  Speaker 2: for independent community pharmacy than they are right now. And
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  Speaker 2: I want you, Chris, to kind of give some testimony
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  Speaker 2: that because the reason why you and I are on
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  Speaker 2: that same page as you were around you know, ten
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  Speaker 2: twenty years ago within independence and that was that was
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  Speaker 2: a different world.
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  Speaker 4: Yeah, Todd, I you know when I came into this industry,
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  Speaker 4: I remember just wanting to learn from the drug stores.
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  Speaker 4: So I took in a flyer from the DA about
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  Speaker 4: the rescheduling of hydro codone to a schedule too, So
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  Speaker 4: that kind of shows, you know how old I am
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  Speaker 4: in this industry. And ultimately it is you know, where
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  Speaker 4: is the puck going? How can the folks that are
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  Speaker 4: operating community pharmacy have information and partners that instill hope
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  Speaker 4: and ideas that are going to shift their paradigm thinking
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  Speaker 4: from well that's how I've always done it to well,
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  Speaker 4: this is how I'm going to do it because I
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  Speaker 4: care about my community. My business has to remain viable
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  Speaker 4: and I'm not ready to throw in the towel, right, So,
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  Speaker 4: like you know, obviously there's a lot of non controllables
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  Speaker 4: in this industry, and I empathize with everybody that works
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  Speaker 4: in a community pharmacy. We know that all you want
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  Speaker 4: to do is have a profitable, prosperous business and take
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  Speaker 4: care of your customers in the community. And that shouldn't
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  Speaker 4: be you know that that shouldn't be a trigonometry, that
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  Speaker 4: should be just an easy you know, easy. Hey, I
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  Speaker 4: care about people, and I'm a pharmacist, and you know
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  Speaker 4: I'm going to be successful. But ultimately, like unfortunately, there's
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  Speaker 4: a lot of money in drug supply and that creates
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  Speaker 4: a lot of tentacles and big corporations and companies, and
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  Speaker 4: what we're trying to do is just make sure we
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  Speaker 4: can help small business owners navigate those waters.
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  Speaker 2: So something that you know, I've been in, like I said,
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  Speaker 2: pharmacy quite some time, same as you, and I would
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  Speaker 2: see organizations, publications use the word omni channel, and an
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  Speaker 2: omni channel pissed me off to I was like, where's
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  Speaker 2: the omni channel? I see it a written piece and
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  Speaker 2: maybe a link to a website, and that's it. What
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  Speaker 2: I am so excited about to spends time is going
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  Speaker 2: to be bringing us the written piece, the magazine, the blogs,
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  Speaker 2: the podcast, the videos. So it's really for really, really
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  Speaker 2: really omni channel. And one of that's one of those
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  Speaker 2: sections is the marketplace. And I want to give a
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  Speaker 2: shout out to those vendors and those companies that are
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  Speaker 2: way ahead of the curve who have already invested in
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  Speaker 2: this publication and in doing some really interesting things. A
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  Speaker 2: shout out to a Freza. We're going to be doing
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  Speaker 2: a lot more with that organization. But talk to us
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  Speaker 2: about these organizations, Chris, and giving some reference to how
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  Speaker 2: they're using a true omni channel environment to come at
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  Speaker 2: the reader from multiple points of view and rather than
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  Speaker 2: just a traditional magazine.
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  Speaker 4: I think it starts with the networking aspect. Like you said, Todd,
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  Speaker 4: everybody that's on the advisory board has invested interest in pharmacies.
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  Speaker 4: Staying afloat right, we are our businesses rely on community
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  Speaker 4: pharmacy prospering and we made sure to pick entities that
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  Speaker 4: to work with that aren't exploitative of pharmacy. So everybody
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  Speaker 4: here that is listed in, everybody that is represented on
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  Speaker 4: our advisory board, like we've vetted and we said like, look,
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  Speaker 4: the value that you're adding is exponential, and we just
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  Speaker 4: want to get the information out there to the drug stores.
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  Speaker 4: So it is a strategic approach that is Okay, you're
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  Speaker 4: we're going to run ads into in the magazine, but
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  Speaker 4: we're also going to create content that is educational, and
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  Speaker 4: we're going to involve the podcast that Todd's doing, We're
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  Speaker 4: going to involve you know, just a multi layered approach
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  Speaker 4: that it is going to create an easy way to
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  Speaker 4: adopt good innovative practice.
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  Speaker 2: If you're a marketer, if you're a director of marketing
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  Speaker 2: for a pharmacy technology system or a program or something
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  Speaker 2: that you're like, wow, I want to tap into an
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  Speaker 2: organization that understands my market. They understand the world of
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  Speaker 2: independent community pharmacy and not only where you are, but
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  Speaker 2: like Chris said, where the puck's going and the specissivity
• 10:30
  Speaker 2: of that independent community pharmacy. Maybe they're dialing into wanting
• 10:34
  Speaker 2: to expand compounding, or maybe they're dialing into a program
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  Speaker 2: for contraception in their community because they've lost a big
• 10:44
  Speaker 2: center that used to do contraception and you really want
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  Speaker 2: to grow that as a business. Not only is this
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  Speaker 2: a magazine, and not only is it a publication, but
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  Speaker 2: it's a network.
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  Speaker 3: So if you.
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  Speaker 2: Come to Dispense Times, dispense marketing, dispense organizations, Dispense Times
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  Speaker 2: dot com is the easiest one to remember for those driving.
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  Speaker 2: If you don't have it, there will be a link
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  Speaker 2: in the show notes. But if you reach out to
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  Speaker 2: the Dispense Times organization, even if it's not if you're
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  Speaker 2: not advertising right away, there is a network here for
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  Speaker 2: you to help you be more successful. So it's going
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  Speaker 2: to eventually help community pharmacy, independent community pharmacy be more
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  Speaker 2: successful mankind, the pharmacy marketplace, Data Scan, Pharmacy Outcomes, RMS, infoworks,
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  Speaker 2: these people believe.
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  Speaker 3: In the success of independent pharmacy.
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  Speaker 2: By the way, as a play center and kind of
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  Speaker 2: as a short little break talk to us about the
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  Speaker 2: evolution of the pharmacy marketplace, because you know that that
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  Speaker 2: piece of it pretty well.
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  Speaker 4: Yeah, tod So you know farm's market it's a perfect
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  Speaker 4: example of adapting to the market needs.
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  Speaker 5: Right.
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  Speaker 4: You mentioned PBM reform a little bit ago. You know,
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  Speaker 4: when we came out, our predominant focus was on helping pharmacies,
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  Speaker 4: you know, buy drugs optimally, right, However, with PBUM reform,
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  Speaker 4: we've designed some new modules around helping pharmacies file underwater macapels. Right,
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  Speaker 4: So it is asking our pharmacies to adapt to the
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  Speaker 4: market and also putting our money where our mouth is
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  Speaker 4: and adapting our technology solutions to the market as well.
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  Speaker 4: And you know, this is just one example of a
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  Speaker 4: commitment of hey, we're doing our best to.
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  Speaker 5: Make sure we are skating to where the puck is.
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  Speaker 6: I love that.
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  Speaker 3: I love that.
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  Speaker 2: So you've seen the evolution of this, just as I
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  Speaker 2: have what I said earlier about a publication that is
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  Speaker 2: following the evolution. What are some other things that to
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  Speaker 2: spense Times is doing and positioning to bring more value
• 12:57
  Speaker 2: value to the pharmacy owner. And this isn't just the
• 13:00
  Speaker 2: angle pharmacy owner, pharmacy publications in general, like I say,
• 13:05
  Speaker 2: Pharmacy Times and Drug Topics and all these you know
• 13:07
  Speaker 2: the grandfathers, the ones that kind of set the roots
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  Speaker 2: and were still are great publications, but they never really
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  Speaker 2: dialed just into the survival of how the community pharmacy
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  Speaker 2: is impacting their individual community, how pharmacy deserts are ravaging
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  Speaker 2: the accessibility of.
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  Speaker 3: Healthcare in general.
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  Speaker 2: So talk to us about other things that this spends
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  Speaker 2: times is doing to position our independent community pharmacies.
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  Speaker 5: Yeah, tod So.
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  Speaker 4: A great example would be a few years ago, I
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  Speaker 4: had a pharmacy owner that had owned a store for
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  Speaker 4: about twenty five years and he find his wife wanted
• 13:51
  Speaker 4: to go to San Diego and our a trade show
• 13:54
  Speaker 4: just so happened to be in San Diego, and we
• 13:57
  Speaker 4: were able to get him and his wife out there
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  Speaker 4: and they had a wonderful time and he was able
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  Speaker 4: to network in a way that he'd never been.
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  Speaker 5: Able to do.
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  Speaker 4: And he took me to a He took me on
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  Speaker 4: the side after the show and he said, Hey, I
• 14:11
  Speaker 4: really appreciate you pushing me to do this. He said,
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  Speaker 4: I've been operating in a vacuum within my four walls
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  Speaker 4: for twenty five years, thinking that that's the best thing
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  Speaker 4: to do, Just split my head down and do what
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  Speaker 4: I know to do and take care of patients. And
• 14:29
  Speaker 4: I agreed with him, that is the best thing to do.
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  Speaker 4: Focus on your patients. But there's so much out there
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  Speaker 4: from our peers, from quality vendors that care about pharmacy
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  Speaker 4: and don't want to exploit pharmacy, and that's what we're
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  Speaker 4: trying to do is create an ecosystem through this magazine
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  Speaker 4: that really is like.
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  Speaker 5: Okay, if you get your head out.
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  Speaker 4: Of the the business and just look at it from
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  Speaker 4: a Bob perspective, what are some of the strategic things
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  Speaker 4: and some of the ideas that you really need to
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  Speaker 4: focus on?
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  Speaker 5: And here are things.
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  Speaker 4: Find the things that you're passionate about from a business
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  Speaker 4: perspective and the things that your market needs and hopefully
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  Speaker 4: those will you know, intertwine a little bit and that's
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  Speaker 4: where your pharmacy business will be going. Right. So to
• 15:18
  Speaker 4: bring up full circle, it spends times is trying to
• 15:22
  Speaker 4: help pharmacies concentrate on ideas and concepts and vendors and
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  Speaker 4: it's really just an educational opportunity for drugstore owners and
• 15:34
  Speaker 4: folks to help you know the viability of their business.
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  Speaker 2: Yep, I want to go back to something you were
• 15:41
  Speaker 2: talking about. You kind of gave some reference. If you're
• 15:44
  Speaker 2: looking watching us on LinkedIn streaming through YouTube, you'll see
• 15:50
  Speaker 2: on your screen the philosophies of the magazine that Chris
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  Speaker 2: mentioned earlier. This is covering built around how independent pharmacy
• 16:03
  Speaker 2: actually operates and not just today, but what's going to
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  Speaker 2: help them excel and be profitable in the future. And
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  Speaker 2: we're talking about pharmacy operations, reimbursement and economics, technology and workflow.
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  Speaker 3: That's a huge one.
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  Speaker 2: That's actually where my career started from was the technology side,
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  Speaker 2: our clinical expansion absolute must, industry policy, marketplace and solutions.
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  Speaker 2: And then one of my favorites is marketing and growth. Chris,
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  Speaker 2: take us through a couple of these and just kind
• 16:38
  Speaker 2: of cherry pick maybe a couple that is near to
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  Speaker 2: near and dear to your heart, and how this how
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  Speaker 2: these blueprints fit into the ecosystem of our independent community
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  Speaker 2: pharmacy owners well.
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  Speaker 4: To definitely all these are passions of mine, you know,
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  Speaker 4: and as the kind of the president of the Advisory Board,
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  Speaker 4: I'm trying to find tent puritributors and vendors that are
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  Speaker 4: specific to these areas, right and we welcome any pharmacy
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  Speaker 4: owners to make recommendations or to get on this website
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  Speaker 4: and give us content. You know, if you want to
• 17:14
  Speaker 4: submit an article for Josh to review and me a review,
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  Speaker 4: we'd welcome the opportunity. You know, what we have is
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  Speaker 4: we have the best and brightest that are in these areas,
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  Speaker 4: like you mentioned, you know, Nicolette Matthew being on the
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  Speaker 4: cover of our latest issue. Nicolette is a marketing guru,
• 17:35
  Speaker 4: and she's a clinical expansion guru, and now she has
• 17:39
  Speaker 4: become a technology and guru through her dotty platform. Right,
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  Speaker 4: So what she's doing is she's trying to teach pharmacies
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  Speaker 4: how to take advantage of the compounding opportunities, how to
• 17:53
  Speaker 4: collaborate with physician partners and utilize data analytics to to
• 17:58
  Speaker 4: you know, nowhere to prioritize their ffforts. Right. So, you know,
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  Speaker 4: that is an example of how marketing and technology and
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  Speaker 4: clinical expansion all come into one through Nicolette's best practices.
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  Speaker 4: And you know, one that I'm really really passionate about
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  Speaker 4: is reimbursement in economics and tie that into industry policy.
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  Speaker 4: So we mentioned that, you know, PBM reform.
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  Speaker 5: Every day I.
• 18:23
  Speaker 4: See another article about a state that is trying to
• 18:26
  Speaker 4: push for some type of lower limit benchmark that pharmacies
• 18:32
  Speaker 4: can't get paid under. And you know, as those laws
• 18:35
  Speaker 4: come into place, they're only as good as the participation
• 18:38
  Speaker 4: of said drug stores. If you have legislative efforts happen,
• 18:43
  Speaker 4: and you spend all this time and energy and it passes,
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  Speaker 4: then pharmacies don't actually take advantage. Well, what happens is
• 18:50
  Speaker 4: the momentum shifts back to the PBM blobbyist. Right. So
• 18:53
  Speaker 4: what we're doing is we're this latest issue. We highlighted
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  Speaker 4: the Tennessee law and how that came to place, and
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  Speaker 4: how CBS was trying to be a bad actor in
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  Speaker 4: fight it. So that would be a very engaging article
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  Speaker 4: if you're passionate about PBM reform to read.
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  Speaker 3: I love it.
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  Speaker 2: It's a publication that is following what's happening in the
• 19:19
  Speaker 2: healthcare system, what is happening to the ecosystem of pharmacy.
• 19:24
  Speaker 2: That's why I'm so excited to be a small part
• 19:26
  Speaker 2: of it. This is exciting. We're going to have more
• 19:29
  Speaker 2: this week in Pharmacy that's going to be dedicated specifically
• 19:33
  Speaker 2: to Dispense Time stories, Dispense Times partners, advertisers, roundtable discussions.
• 19:40
  Speaker 2: I want to give a shout out to all of
• 19:41
  Speaker 2: our listeners. If you want to be a part of this,
• 19:44
  Speaker 2: this is not ours, this is yours. This is the listener,
• 19:48
  Speaker 2: a listener that's in pharmacy and wants to make a difference.
• 19:51
  Speaker 3: I want you to reach out.
• 19:52
  Speaker 2: Go to Dispense Times dot com or reach out to me,
• 19:56
  Speaker 2: or if you know Chris your.
• 19:58
  Speaker 3: LinkedIn to him and LinkedIn, shout to Chris.
• 20:00
  Speaker 2: Let them know that you have an idea for either
• 20:02
  Speaker 2: a story or something inside business operations or technology or
• 20:07
  Speaker 2: marketing or whatever it is. This is the way that
• 20:09
  Speaker 2: we change things, Chris, is by doing and working together,
• 20:12
  Speaker 2: and I think to spend times is the is like
• 20:15
  Speaker 2: the foundation of what we're going to really be able
• 20:18
  Speaker 2: to build different things off of. And then let's meet
• 20:21
  Speaker 2: up at conferences. I'm headed to McKesson Idea Share, I'm
• 20:25
  Speaker 2: going to be headed to RBC Cardinal Health. I'm going
• 20:28
  Speaker 2: to be going to the Sincora Thoughts Spot. So if
• 20:32
  Speaker 2: you're going to any of those, Chris, promise that we're
• 20:35
  Speaker 2: going to get a chance to say out to each other,
• 20:37
  Speaker 2: maybe even have you on one of the shows.
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  Speaker 5: Yeah, that definitely will be it.
• 20:41
  Speaker 4: I think a majority of those Todds, I'm sure we'll
• 20:45
  Speaker 4: see you around. And I just put in to reenterate
• 20:48
  Speaker 4: the inclusive philosophy that you that you were positioning there.
• 20:53
  Speaker 5: This is not a good old boys club.
• 20:55
  Speaker 4: This is not some VC firm that's come out with
• 20:57
  Speaker 4: some periodical. This is a group of people that are
• 21:01
  Speaker 4: passionate about community pharmacy, and we want you all to
• 21:05
  Speaker 4: participate through writing articles or requesting specific content or vendors participate.
• 21:11
  Speaker 4: Like you know, this is something that's here to empower
• 21:14
  Speaker 4: community pharmacy owners to continue to operate and do what
• 21:18
  Speaker 4: they do best, which is take care of their customers.
• 21:21
  Speaker 6: I love it.
• 21:22
  Speaker 3: I love being a part of it.
• 21:23
  Speaker 2: Thank you so much Chris for being on twerq's today.
• 21:26
  Speaker 2: We have more collaborations upcoming. I hope you have a
• 21:30
  Speaker 2: great weekend, all.
• 21:31
  Speaker 5: Right, Thanks Todd.
• 21:35
  Speaker 7: Feeling lost with the complexities of pharmacy accounting.
• 21:38
  Speaker 8: In pharmacy today, There's so many different variables and issues
• 21:44
  Speaker 8: that impact the pharmacy, books, records, accounting, the profitabilities for
• 21:48
  Speaker 8: so forth. There's different components of pharmacy that have its
• 21:51
  Speaker 8: own nuances from an accounting standpoint, and so it's tricky,
• 21:55
  Speaker 8: there's no doubt about it.
• 21:56
  Speaker 7: Ready to take your pharmacy to the next level, but
• 21:59
  Speaker 7: don't know where to start. Psychs and Companies here to help,
• 22:02
  Speaker 7: introducing the RX Assessment. With the RX Assessment, the pharmacy
• 22:07
  Speaker 7: CPAs and advisors at psykes will do a deep dive
• 22:10
  Speaker 7: into your accounting and tax situation and give you the
• 22:13
  Speaker 7: action steps you need to take to take your pharmacy
• 22:16
  Speaker 7: to the next level.
• 22:17
  Speaker 8: If you're interested in, you know, working with a team
• 22:20
  Speaker 8: who understands the industry and how the accounting and tax
• 22:24
  Speaker 8: should really be in a pharmacy, this is this is
• 22:27
  Speaker 8: your chance to get under the hood check of what's
• 22:29
  Speaker 8: going on and getting the feedback of any issues or
• 22:33
  Speaker 8: concerns or again things we think you're doing really well with.
• 22:35
  Speaker 7: Get the financial check up your pharmacy needs and head
• 22:38
  Speaker 7: over to Pykes HYPHENCPA dot com or call two five
• 22:42
  Speaker 7: to two, four eight two seven six four to four.
• 22:52
  Speaker 2: Hey, welcome back to this week in Pharmacy. Quite excited
• 22:55
  Speaker 2: to have run into James Maskal, who's the founder of
• 23:01
  Speaker 2: the evolution of medicine. This plays into much of what's
• 23:05
  Speaker 2: happening to the pharmacy profession. We know that there are
• 23:08
  Speaker 2: pharmacists out there who are known as deprescribing pharmacists, consultant pharmacists.
• 23:13
  Speaker 2: They're dying into senior care, dialing into pediatrics, even helping
• 23:18
  Speaker 2: with hyperactivity with children, and where pharmacists come in to
• 23:23
  Speaker 2: balance the pharmacological the development of medications and the realm
• 23:29
  Speaker 2: of functional medicine and natural medicine. James Maskell, I want
• 23:33
  Speaker 2: to welcome you to twerkus.
• 23:35
  Speaker 6: Great to be here, Thanks for having me all.
• 23:38
  Speaker 3: Right out of the gate.
• 23:39
  Speaker 2: You are not a pharmacist, so give us some of
• 23:41
  Speaker 2: your background and tell us about the evolution of the
• 23:45
  Speaker 2: evolution of medicine.
• 23:47
  Speaker 6: Yeah.
• 23:47
  Speaker 9: So grew up in a community where there was a
• 23:53
  Speaker 9: lot of healthy things happening. No one in my circle
• 23:58
  Speaker 9: knew what a chiropractic was or a homeopath, but I
• 24:00
  Speaker 9: had a little bit of that in my world. I
• 24:04
  Speaker 9: did a degree in health economics.
• 24:05
  Speaker 6: I realized we were going to fall off.
• 24:07
  Speaker 9: A massive cliff with the cost of chronic illness, and
• 24:10
  Speaker 9: I moved to America in two thousand and five to
• 24:12
  Speaker 9: try and understand where does chronic illness come from?
• 24:15
  Speaker 6: Is it reversible?
• 24:16
  Speaker 9: And ultimately it been on a journey to understand that,
• 24:20
  Speaker 9: and in twenty fourteen I started a business called the
• 24:23
  Speaker 9: Functional Forum. It started with a meetup group in New
• 24:26
  Speaker 9: York for practitioners interested in functional medicine. It became a
• 24:31
  Speaker 9: worldwide phenomenon. We had four hundred and fifty meetup groups
• 24:34
  Speaker 9: on six continents with practitioners of all varieties getting excited
• 24:38
  Speaker 9: about the potential of functional medicine and the operationalization of
• 24:42
  Speaker 9: functional medicine. And then I showed up at a functional
• 24:45
  Speaker 9: medicine pharmacy conference, I think maybe the first one that
• 24:48
  Speaker 9: was in twenty nineteen. And part of my job with
• 24:51
  Speaker 9: the Functional Forum is to go around and interview people
• 24:53
  Speaker 9: doing cool stuff. And I found a lot of pharmacists
• 24:56
  Speaker 9: doing cool stuff, reorganizing pharmacy around health creation, and some
• 25:00
  Speaker 9: of it was some of the things you mentioned deeprescribing
• 25:03
  Speaker 9: consulting physically, reorganizing an independent pharmacy to put health at
• 25:08
  Speaker 9: the front and drugs at the back, the whole shabank,
• 25:11
  Speaker 9: and I got really excited because I felt like his
• 25:13
  Speaker 9: trusted profession and in general, you know, these pharmacists want
• 25:17
  Speaker 9: to do the right.
• 25:18
  Speaker 6: Thing and want to help people get healthy.
• 25:20
  Speaker 9: And so I've been on a journey the last seven
• 25:22
  Speaker 9: years really understanding the pharmacy world and seeing how we
• 25:25
  Speaker 9: could use that as a lever for this evolution of medicine.
• 25:30
  Speaker 2: Don't you think we back up to the to the
• 25:34
  Speaker 2: advent of compounding in America America and an industrialization age
• 25:40
  Speaker 2: the mid eighteen hundreds where the local physician was also
• 25:45
  Speaker 2: the local pharmacist and when they show up on the
• 25:48
  Speaker 2: farm and they were compounding a very specific medication for
• 25:52
  Speaker 2: a very specific situation, and they were following up and
• 25:56
  Speaker 2: it was very natural driven. Then, of course, at the
• 25:59
  Speaker 2: beginning of the nineteen hundreds and and we started seeing more, uh,
• 26:04
  Speaker 2: the development and manufacturing of specific medications. And and now
• 26:09
  Speaker 2: we're on the other end of the spectrum where it's
• 26:11
  Speaker 2: we see a lot of the pharma manufacturers really wanting
• 26:15
  Speaker 2: to hold I'll say hold hostage because that's the way
• 26:19
  Speaker 2: I think of it, old hostage, the compounding pharmacist that
• 26:22
  Speaker 2: does a lot of more customization. I feel like the
• 26:26
  Speaker 2: balance a lot was lopsided too much on the pharmacological side,
• 26:30
  Speaker 2: and we almost have to bring it back to the personalization.
• 26:33
  Speaker 2: Personalization is that keyword. Talk to us and share with
• 26:37
  Speaker 2: us in with with allergies, with gluten issues, with things
• 26:45
  Speaker 2: that have happened, hyperactivity and children with Talk to me
• 26:48
  Speaker 2: about that balance and talk to me about that what personalization,
• 26:52
  Speaker 2: How how important personalization is for modern medicine.
• 26:57
  Speaker 9: Well, I'll give you an example of the apex of
• 27:00
  Speaker 9: functional medicine. The hardest kind of condition to work with,
• 27:03
  Speaker 9: and I want to talk about cognitive decline in Alzheimer's,
• 27:06
  Speaker 9: because on one hand, you have zero drugs that have
• 27:10
  Speaker 9: ever worked to reverse cognitive decline, to actually bring function back,
• 27:15
  Speaker 9: for someone to actually get back their driver's license that
• 27:18
  Speaker 9: they had lost because they had lost function. The only
• 27:22
  Speaker 9: examples of that happening are in functional medicine, which is
• 27:25
  Speaker 9: essentially delivering a personalized approach. What does that look like, Well,
• 27:28
  Speaker 9: these drugs are looking across all of these different mechanisms
• 27:32
  Speaker 9: for the one mechanism that will affect Alzheimer's, and I
• 27:35
  Speaker 9: think if that had been true, we already would have
• 27:38
  Speaker 9: discovered that. But if you understand that maybe Alzheimer's is
• 27:43
  Speaker 9: there's a unique set of subsets that drives the pathology,
• 27:46
  Speaker 9: subsets of root cause, and the work is to identify
• 27:49
  Speaker 9: what's going on.
• 27:50
  Speaker 6: In each individual and treat accordingly.
• 27:52
  Speaker 9: And there was the first randomized controlled trial that came
• 27:55
  Speaker 9: out in pre print in the end of last year,
• 27:57
  Speaker 9: is coming out this year in a prestigious and all
• 28:01
  Speaker 9: ninety two percent of people get better from a disease
• 28:03
  Speaker 9: that no one ever got better with any drug.
• 28:05
  Speaker 6: For now.
• 28:05
  Speaker 9: There's all kinds of examples under that of all the
• 28:08
  Speaker 9: other chronic illnesses. But my view is that Alzheimer's will
• 28:10
  Speaker 9: teach us what some pharmacists have already seen and started
• 28:15
  Speaker 9: to evolve their practice towards, and some people have not
• 28:17
  Speaker 9: seen yet, which is that a personalized approach, understanding the
• 28:21
  Speaker 9: unique physiology of the patient and treating accordingly is a
• 28:25
  Speaker 9: lot more of an effective way of dealing with chronic illness,
• 28:27
  Speaker 9: but it takes a different.
• 28:28
  Speaker 6: Set of skills.
• 28:30
  Speaker 2: It does so when I look at the pharmacy schools
• 28:34
  Speaker 2: and the intensity of that four to six year run
• 28:38
  Speaker 2: of becoming a pharmacist and an expert in medication and
• 28:42
  Speaker 2: the expert in chemistry, and how it impacts you, how
• 28:45
  Speaker 2: it impacts your metabolism or how your metabolism actually plays
• 28:49
  Speaker 2: into it, or the advent of pharmacogenomics where they're testing
• 28:54
  Speaker 2: people's genes to see how they're going to react to medications.
• 28:58
  Speaker 3: The more of these.
• 28:59
  Speaker 2: New technologies that are now being studied and coming out,
• 29:03
  Speaker 2: the more I see functional medicine rising as a solution
• 29:08
  Speaker 2: to many of the of the mysteries of what people
• 29:11
  Speaker 2: are going through. And in my opinion, I'm not a pharmacist,
• 29:15
  Speaker 2: I'm not a physician, but I've hung out with pharmacists
• 29:18
  Speaker 2: now for over twenty years. I listen more podcast than
• 29:22
  Speaker 2: anyone about pharmacy over the.
• 29:24
  Speaker 3: Last seventeen years.
• 29:26
  Speaker 2: And what I've learned is is there is no silver bullet.
• 29:32
  Speaker 3: It's you don't just go.
• 29:33
  Speaker 2: With here's this medication that you're going to be on
• 29:36
  Speaker 2: now for the rest of your life, and that's it.
• 29:38
  Speaker 2: That's all you have to do now instead of I've
• 29:42
  Speaker 2: seen so many pharmacists. Marina Buskov is going to be
• 29:45
  Speaker 2: on this Week in Pharmacy coming up after this interview,
• 29:50
  Speaker 2: and she spent her whole career. How does she take
• 29:55
  Speaker 2: what nature has built and what nature has been designed,
• 30:00
  Speaker 2: and what substances are out there, and how do we
• 30:02
  Speaker 2: apply this to the realm of living hundreds of years
• 30:08
  Speaker 2: ago or or how you know humans were able to
• 30:11
  Speaker 2: survive certain things. So what's the My issue my frustration
• 30:19
  Speaker 2: really for pharmacists that want to pursue this some sometimes
• 30:24
  Speaker 2: they feel shunned by the pharmacological world, by the pharmaceutical
• 30:29
  Speaker 2: world of saying, oh, this is an evans based but
• 30:32
  Speaker 2: in and it may not be documented the same way.
• 30:36
  Speaker 2: But there are people like Marina, for example, in you
• 30:39
  Speaker 2: for example in Delon, Canterbury and so many other pharmacists
• 30:44
  Speaker 2: who are doing things where they have studied and they
• 30:47
  Speaker 2: have practiced and they have documented, just hasn't been published,
• 30:51
  Speaker 2: you know, in a in a in a journal.
• 30:53
  Speaker 3: In certain in certain ways.
• 30:56
  Speaker 2: But where do you see a way for us to
• 30:58
  Speaker 2: infiltrate what is the world of medicine in order to
• 31:02
  Speaker 2: get more physicians and more pharmacists, you know, collaborating together
• 31:08
  Speaker 2: in the realm of functional medicine.
• 31:10
  Speaker 9: I mean, it's already happening, it's just not evenly distributed.
• 31:13
  Speaker 9: So you know there, if you go to the conferences,
• 31:16
  Speaker 9: you can meet other practitioners who are taking this medicine
• 31:19
  Speaker 9: into health systems and community pharmacies and organizations.
• 31:24
  Speaker 6: And you know where twelve years.
• 31:25
  Speaker 9: Ago when we started this, there were very few technologies
• 31:28
  Speaker 9: that have been built around this group of practitioners.
• 31:31
  Speaker 6: Now there are.
• 31:32
  Speaker 9: Tools that can allow you to do this at scale
• 31:35
  Speaker 9: with very little like set up and organization costs. I
• 31:38
  Speaker 9: interviewed someone the other day who's a community pharmacist who
• 31:42
  Speaker 9: you know, has basically built, has built the health system
• 31:46
  Speaker 9: that she needed and that all of her patients wants,
• 31:48
  Speaker 9: and she just decided to do it and is now
• 31:50
  Speaker 9: supported by all of these different companies and organizations. You know,
• 31:55
  Speaker 9: the next phase of what I see happening in functional
• 31:57
  Speaker 9: medicine with what we started on, you know, with the
• 32:00
  Speaker 9: Functional Forum. The first effort was to introduce people locally
• 32:04
  Speaker 9: to each other who wanted to make a change, and
• 32:06
  Speaker 9: we did that for a long time.
• 32:07
  Speaker 6: You know.
• 32:08
  Speaker 9: The next season, I think is really creating structures that
• 32:12
  Speaker 9: allow all the people that have seen the light to
• 32:14
  Speaker 9: work together to be able to take this from something
• 32:18
  Speaker 9: that is still a little bit clunky, hard to learn,
• 32:22
  Speaker 9: not nearly as efficient as just giving everyone drugs for
• 32:24
  Speaker 9: the symptoms that they have, into something that could actually
• 32:28
  Speaker 9: be an operating system for each of the different you know,
• 32:31
  Speaker 9: chronic illnesses.
• 32:33
  Speaker 6: But it has to get more efficient.
• 32:35
  Speaker 9: But ultimately there are plenty of examples now of pharmacists
• 32:39
  Speaker 9: who have just decided they want to do this, and
• 32:42
  Speaker 9: ultimately they don't necessarily care about the pushback.
• 32:45
  Speaker 6: They really care about the person standing across from that.
• 32:48
  Speaker 9: And how many times you have to see you know,
• 32:52
  Speaker 9: you know, unorganized, you know, out of control metabolic disease
• 32:56
  Speaker 9: before you realize like, I have to step in here
• 32:59
  Speaker 9: and be a solution.
• 33:01
  Speaker 2: The exciting part is I'm seeing independent community pharmacies that
• 33:06
  Speaker 2: have had issues with staying in business because of the
• 33:11
  Speaker 2: very wrecked and misguided world of the PBM, And now
• 33:16
  Speaker 2: they're starting to move towards cash based systems that include
• 33:22
  Speaker 2: health coaching, medication review, and customization. They're doing a lot
• 33:29
  Speaker 2: more consulting and they're able to make money. They're able
• 33:33
  Speaker 2: to stay in business based on some of these new
• 33:36
  Speaker 2: programs your coaching systems. What aspect of the sectors of
• 33:43
  Speaker 2: pharmacy have you worked in. I mentioned senior care, I
• 33:46
  Speaker 2: mentioned pediatrics, obviously independent community pharmacy. Have you worked with
• 33:50
  Speaker 2: independent community pharmacy to really help bring these programs to
• 33:54
  Speaker 2: a point where they can actually make a living on it.
• 33:57
  Speaker 9: Yeah, We've worked with a number of different groups like this.
• 34:00
  Speaker 9: I'll give you a couple of examples. The pharmacists that
• 34:03
  Speaker 9: I was just thinking about, Doctor m La Tubuo, who's
• 34:05
  Speaker 9: in Ohio, you know, started off by doing some functional
• 34:09
  Speaker 9: medicines some consults, then has some nutrition available in her
• 34:12
  Speaker 9: pharmacist and has recently now launched what we call a
• 34:17
  Speaker 9: full script journey, which is essentially competing with these big
• 34:21
  Speaker 9: direct to consumer lab offerings like Function Health and Superpower
• 34:24
  Speaker 9: and Aura Ring and all these groups that are selling labs.
• 34:27
  Speaker 9: So you sell labs into the community. People want to
• 34:29
  Speaker 9: know about themselves. There's this you know, urgency to understand themselves.
• 34:34
  Speaker 9: But then if they have questions, they end up coming
• 34:36
  Speaker 9: to you. So it's a way of bringing new business
• 34:38
  Speaker 9: to your pharmacy by selling the thing that patients want,
• 34:41
  Speaker 9: which is the labs. Another example Eastern Bryant. We've worked
• 34:44
  Speaker 9: with a lot who has you know, transformed his little
• 34:47
  Speaker 9: pharmacy in Kentucky to a nationwide powerhouse you know, with
• 34:50
  Speaker 9: membership programs and pharmacy but also like particular clinical programs
• 34:56
  Speaker 9: around all different areas. So there's a range of the
• 34:59
  Speaker 9: kind of people that we've with and there's a range
• 35:01
  Speaker 9: of the innovation, and that's really the sort of the
• 35:03
  Speaker 9: early that's always a sign of an early movement is
• 35:07
  Speaker 9: that people are working yourself out. What we're doing is
• 35:09
  Speaker 9: just you know, sharing best practices, and I'm happy to
• 35:12
  Speaker 9: take a call with any pharmacist who you know, feels
• 35:15
  Speaker 9: the pull for that and is looking for a community
• 35:18
  Speaker 9: of other like minded people who could be supportive resources
• 35:21
  Speaker 9: on how to make the journey easier. I'm very, very
• 35:24
  Speaker 9: interested right now in polypharmacy, getting people off medication, deprescribing
• 35:29
  Speaker 9: in the elder population, and how that could happen in
• 35:32
  Speaker 9: senior living centers because you know, as I sort of
• 35:35
  Speaker 9: hinted at earlier, I'm I'm really interested right now in
• 35:38
  Speaker 9: reversing cognitive decline because it's just an area where functional
• 35:41
  Speaker 9: medicine has an unlimited opportunity because of the lack of medication.
• 35:45
  Speaker 6: So in any of those situations, I'm happy to take
• 35:48
  Speaker 6: a call.
• 35:48
  Speaker 9: You could book a concierge call on the website, or
• 35:52
  Speaker 9: you go to go evomed dot com slash concierge and
• 35:56
  Speaker 9: you can set up a team with you know, set
• 35:58
  Speaker 9: up a meeting with me or someone on the tea.
• 36:01
  Speaker 2: You also have a very popular podcast where you dive
• 36:05
  Speaker 2: into specific issues talking with other providers and other you know,
• 36:08
  Speaker 2: other issues that you come about, share with that with
• 36:11
  Speaker 2: our with our listeners as well, the Evolution of Medicine podcast.
• 36:15
  Speaker 6: Evolution of Medicine. That's the place to go. Go evomed
• 36:18
  Speaker 6: dot com.
• 36:19
  Speaker 9: You can find the podcast, you can kind you can
• 36:21
  Speaker 9: find the concierge.
• 36:22
  Speaker 6: Calls on there.
• 36:24
  Speaker 9: You know, we're we're tracking you know, different organizations that
• 36:28
  Speaker 9: are and different people that are innovating on the front end.
• 36:32
  Speaker 9: Some of that is clinical, some of its technology, some
• 36:35
  Speaker 9: of its business models. And we've always had those three
• 36:38
  Speaker 9: topics because ultimately it takes those three things to enact
• 36:41
  Speaker 9: the sort of change that we're seeing, because you know,
• 36:43
  Speaker 9: for pharmacists to have a community pharmacy, what is the
• 36:46
  Speaker 9: business model by which we create health? That is not
• 36:50
  Speaker 9: that that's not an obvious answer to that question, and
• 36:52
  Speaker 9: lots of people are trying different things, and you know,
• 36:55
  Speaker 9: I think we can find something that that works for you,
• 36:58
  Speaker 9: no matter what your focused, no matter what your SYS,
• 37:00
  Speaker 9: no matter what your current job status is.
• 37:04
  Speaker 3: James, this has been great.
• 37:05
  Speaker 2: I really appreciate you spending time with us and talking
• 37:08
  Speaker 2: with me and shout out to our listeners out there,
• 37:11
  Speaker 2: pharmacists out there, technicians out there who are really trying
• 37:14
  Speaker 2: to change the game. It's coming that we're seeing less
• 37:20
  Speaker 2: pharmacies focused on the prescription and more focused on the
• 37:25
  Speaker 2: total health of the individual, driving down diabetes, helping to
• 37:30
  Speaker 2: reverse issues and make diseases less impactful to people's lives.
• 37:37
  Speaker 2: So this is great. Once again, give the website. I'm
• 37:40
  Speaker 2: going to have it listed on the screen as well
• 37:42
  Speaker 2: as the show notes.
• 37:43
  Speaker 3: But give the listeners a way to get a hold
• 37:46
  Speaker 3: of you.
• 37:47
  Speaker 9: Yeah, you can google the Evolution of Medicine, but it's
• 37:49
  Speaker 9: goevomed dot com.
• 37:51
  Speaker 6: G O E V O M A D dot com.
• 37:54
  Speaker 9: Come and hang out, set up a call, and you know,
• 37:57
  Speaker 9: listen to the podcast and we'd love to be in touch.
• 38:01
  Speaker 2: Thank you James for being on twerks. We appreciate it.
• 38:04
  Speaker 2: Promise me you're going to come back.
• 38:05
  Speaker 6: I would love to. Yeah.
• 38:06
  Speaker 9: I love the pharmacy community and I think you can
• 38:09
  Speaker 9: be a big part of this evolution of medicine that
• 38:12
  Speaker 9: we're all co creating.
• 38:13
  Speaker 2: All right, we'll be right back with more twerks.
• 38:25
  Speaker 7: This episode is sponsored by Independent Pharmacy Cooperative, widely known
• 38:29
  Speaker 7: as IPC. Established in nineteen eighty three, IPC is the
• 38:32
  Speaker 7: nation's largest group purchasing organization owned by independent pharmacy with
• 38:37
  Speaker 7: a mission of maximizing the success of community pharmacists. IPC
• 38:41
  Speaker 7: works to provide members with access to effective programs and
• 38:44
  Speaker 7: services designed to enhance profitability for independent pharmacy.
• 38:49
  Speaker 5: Read more about our mission.
• 38:50
  Speaker 7: By checking out our website at ipcrx dot com. That's
• 38:54
  Speaker 7: ipcrx dot com.
• 39:06
  Speaker 2: Hey, welcome back to this Week in Pharmacy on twerks.
• 39:10
  Speaker 2: I don't know if this is Marina's first time on twerks,
• 39:13
  Speaker 2: but Marina Bokso, who's been a member of the Pharmacy
• 39:16
  Speaker 2: Podcast Network for quite some time, Welcome to Torks. Marina.
• 39:21
  Speaker 1: Thank you so much. Todd. Yes, I believe this is
• 39:24
  Speaker 1: my first time here. I'm excited.
• 39:26
  Speaker 2: Yeah, shame on me for not getting you on sooner.
• 39:29
  Speaker 2: You have been the leading voice on the network around
• 39:34
  Speaker 2: herbal medication, holistic pharmacy. You're consistent constantly, You're always bringing
• 39:41
  Speaker 2: us amazing discussions on the network. Talk to us about
• 39:45
  Speaker 2: using podcasting, by the way to get your messaging out there,
• 39:49
  Speaker 2: and how that's evolved over the years for you.
• 39:53
  Speaker 10: Yeah, I believe my first podcast was close to nine
• 39:56
  Speaker 10: years ago. That's when I decided to just start airing
• 40:00
  Speaker 10: some of my thoughts. And it started out with just
• 40:03
  Speaker 10: me reading some of my earlier blogs about my work
• 40:06
  Speaker 10: and my research and the foundations of health and how
• 40:10
  Speaker 10: that's coming up in my own life and in my
• 40:12
  Speaker 10: clients' lives and what I'm noticing from both a pharmacy
• 40:16
  Speaker 10: and a much more holistic perspective with herbal medicine and
• 40:20
  Speaker 10: other approaches. So that's how it started and since then,
• 40:24
  Speaker 10: I've been going consistently year after year, and now I'm
• 40:28
  Speaker 10: in season nine and each year I have about twenty
• 40:32
  Speaker 10: two episodes.
• 40:33
  Speaker 1: So I publish every other week.
• 40:35
  Speaker 10: And I believe like five or so years ago, we
• 40:38
  Speaker 10: teamed up and we started co promoting and I joined
• 40:41
  Speaker 10: the PPN, which has been really amazing.
• 40:45
  Speaker 2: That's awesome. We so much appreciate you the content that
• 40:48
  Speaker 2: you developed. A recent episode regarding menopause and there's so
• 40:53
  Speaker 2: much mystery around that, and you just put up incredible
• 40:58
  Speaker 2: content for our list. If you're not watching us on
• 41:01
  Speaker 2: YouTube or on LinkedIn and you're just listening, there's going
• 41:05
  Speaker 2: to be a link to the in the show notes
• 41:07
  Speaker 2: to the Holistic Pharmacy podcast, which is the podcast that
• 41:12
  Speaker 2: Marina has done for nine seasons.
• 41:15
  Speaker 9: Now.
• 41:15
  Speaker 3: Boy, that went fast, I know, right, all right, So.
• 41:20
  Speaker 2: Today's episode is really all about the rise of functional medicine,
• 41:26
  Speaker 2: integrative medicine, the world that more and more people are
• 41:31
  Speaker 2: wanting to understand. They want to live better lives, they
• 41:34
  Speaker 2: don't want to take as many medications. They want to understand,
• 41:37
  Speaker 2: and they know, based on history that there are more
• 41:41
  Speaker 2: natural ways to deal with preventing and combating disease and
• 41:48
  Speaker 2: talk to our listeners just to set the stage if
• 41:51
  Speaker 2: they don't, if they haven't heard of you, how'd you
• 41:53
  Speaker 2: get into this? And how long have you been researching
• 41:55
  Speaker 2: and studying herbal medicine and holistic pharmacy.
• 42:02
  Speaker 1: Yeah, great question, Todd.
• 42:04
  Speaker 10: It's honestly been quite a long journey, and I would
• 42:08
  Speaker 10: say both on a personal health journey level, where I
• 42:14
  Speaker 10: was seeking solutions for my own health, specifically shortly after
• 42:20
  Speaker 10: graduating pharmacy school, I found myself at this professional crossroads
• 42:25
  Speaker 10: as well, so that it kind of all played a role, right,
• 42:30
  Speaker 10: both my professional life and being trained as a pharmacist
• 42:33
  Speaker 10: and my personal health challenges kind of shaped what I'm
• 42:38
  Speaker 10: doing today. So basically, I just found myself conflicted, you know,
• 42:43
  Speaker 10: seeing that in retail pharmacy, which is where I went into,
• 42:47
  Speaker 10: there's just so much medications and our patients are just
• 42:50
  Speaker 10: not getting better. And then my own stress and my
• 42:54
  Speaker 10: own health struggles kind of made me ask different questions
• 43:00
  Speaker 10: like what else can we do? And I have tried
• 43:03
  Speaker 10: conventional medicine, I'll start off with that. So that's the
• 43:05
  Speaker 10: first thing I did as a pharmacist is go to
• 43:07
  Speaker 10: all the things you're supposed to do and see all
• 43:10
  Speaker 10: the professionals and even take drugs and beyond long term
• 43:16
  Speaker 10: polypharmacy treating symptoms of a medication with another medication. So
• 43:22
  Speaker 10: kind of just rubbed me the wrong way, like why
• 43:24
  Speaker 10: am I doing this when I know as a pharmacist
• 43:27
  Speaker 10: this is not the best way anyway. And there's a
• 43:30
  Speaker 10: lot of non pharmacological steps too that I wasn't being
• 43:33
  Speaker 10: told about. I even ended up choosing to have elective surgery,
• 43:38
  Speaker 10: which unfortunately did not solve the issue that I was having.
• 43:42
  Speaker 10: So I just felt like there was a lot of
• 43:44
  Speaker 10: aggressive therapy recommendation that I did agree to, I did
• 43:47
  Speaker 10: consent to, but I wasn't really given other alternatives or
• 43:52
  Speaker 10: other information or even a promise of success or like
• 43:55
  Speaker 10: the statistics around it. So it just got me really questioning,
• 43:59
  Speaker 10: like what's this I'm at part of what system am
• 44:01
  Speaker 10: I actually working in?
• 44:03
  Speaker 1: And you got me questioning why are we dispensing so
• 44:07
  Speaker 1: many medications and why are people.
• 44:09
  Speaker 10: So sick and just not getting better even with the medications.
• 44:14
  Speaker 10: So I started researching, I started seeing other providers. I
• 44:18
  Speaker 10: started seeking out acupuncture and anything and everything from like
• 44:25
  Speaker 10: chiropractor and cranio sacral to energy work and reiki like
• 44:29
  Speaker 10: you name.
• 44:29
  Speaker 1: It, I've probably tried it.
• 44:32
  Speaker 10: And that gave me a lot of perspective as a patient.
• 44:36
  Speaker 10: And then I also wanted to change what I'm doing
• 44:39
  Speaker 10: in my practice, so I started.
• 44:40
  Speaker 1: Taking all these courses.
• 44:43
  Speaker 10: And health coaching and nutrition and functional medicine, and eventually
• 44:47
  Speaker 10: I found herbalism and to me, it gave me the
• 44:53
  Speaker 10: other side of the coin to pharmacy, like they go
• 44:56
  Speaker 10: hand in hand actually, because they originated from the same feshion. Right,
• 45:00
  Speaker 10: there's the doctor who diagnoses, and then there's the herbalist
• 45:04
  Speaker 10: or pharmacistist who is the medicine expert. And our medicines
• 45:09
  Speaker 10: back in the day, we're all from herbs. They were
• 45:11
  Speaker 10: all from whole foods and herbs and botany, and all
• 45:15
  Speaker 10: of that was very, very intertwined. And then we hit
• 45:19
  Speaker 10: a point where we could now synthesize and we had
• 45:23
  Speaker 10: a whole industrialization happening, and then we had a demonization
• 45:27
  Speaker 10: as well of anything that wasn't synthetic and industrial. So
• 45:31
  Speaker 10: that's how we ended up with a completely different conventional
• 45:34
  Speaker 10: system and then a completely separate alternative model.
• 45:38
  Speaker 1: And so I am.
• 45:40
  Speaker 10: Of the point of view that we actually should be
• 45:43
  Speaker 10: considering all the options. We shouldn't just say like one
• 45:46
  Speaker 10: is the standard of care and one is substandard. I
• 45:49
  Speaker 10: think it's all valid, and we need to look for
• 45:52
  Speaker 10: the valid parts of all of them.
• 45:55
  Speaker 2: The Marina, let's put on our conspiracy hats for a
• 45:58
  Speaker 2: second and look at the evolution of medication, look at
• 46:04
  Speaker 2: the evolution of medical education, look at the evolution of
• 46:10
  Speaker 2: pharmaceutical manufacturers. And I can't help but to think that healthcare, medicine,
• 46:19
  Speaker 2: treatment and therapy got hijacked by too much of the
• 46:25
  Speaker 2: capitalistic side of things, instead of remembering that nature has
• 46:34
  Speaker 2: brought us so much in place in order to prevent
• 46:39
  Speaker 2: and treat different things that a human is going to
• 46:43
  Speaker 2: go through. And the quick fix mentality of America more
• 46:48
  Speaker 2: American than Eastern realms of our world.
• 46:53
  Speaker 3: They want to take a pill, they want to be done.
• 46:55
  Speaker 2: They don't want to exercise, they don't want to eat right,
• 46:57
  Speaker 2: they don't want to practice, you know, healthy living, they don't.
• 47:01
  Speaker 2: They just want to pop this pill. And the world
• 47:04
  Speaker 2: that you and I are from. I've podcasted for seventeen
• 47:07
  Speaker 2: years about the pharmaceutical life cycle, about the ecosystem, about
• 47:12
  Speaker 2: pharmacy care, I'm in it. So when I discussed this
• 47:16
  Speaker 2: with family with friends who also don the conspiracy theory hats,
• 47:21
  Speaker 2: we all say the same thing. We all we all
• 47:24
  Speaker 2: agree that something doesn't seem right and it's been gobbled
• 47:29
  Speaker 2: up by, like I said, the big corporations shunning people
• 47:34
  Speaker 2: like you, saying, Oh, Marina's a quack. You know, she's quick,
• 47:39
  Speaker 2: she's quacky, she's doing crazy.
• 47:41
  Speaker 6: But that.
• 47:42
  Speaker 2: But in I've been I'm fifty four years old. I've
• 47:45
  Speaker 2: been around in business now for thirty goodness, I'm getting old,
• 47:49
  Speaker 2: thirty three, thirty five years And never in my life
• 47:53
  Speaker 2: has there been more pharmacists that are actually coming out
• 47:58
  Speaker 2: leaning much more into integrative and holistic and functional and
• 48:03
  Speaker 2: proving with their own patients that in fact it's working
• 48:07
  Speaker 2: and and lives are changing. So give us your input
• 48:12
  Speaker 2: on kind of that and and is this is this
• 48:15
  Speaker 2: the best time? And is this the best time in
• 48:18
  Speaker 2: history right now to be a pharmacist.
• 48:22
  Speaker 10: I have so much to share that.
• 48:29
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I think you know.
• 48:31
  Speaker 10: From like a bigger worldview perspective, we really need to
• 48:35
  Speaker 10: look at the evolution of human history and understand that
• 48:40
  Speaker 10: we are not separate from nature, and nature is not
• 48:44
  Speaker 10: there for us. It has evolved to include us, and
• 48:49
  Speaker 10: so we are part of it and we are nature.
• 48:52
  Speaker 1: But it doesn't just exist there for our pleasure.
• 48:54
  Speaker 10: And our use for medicine, right, So like we have
• 48:57
  Speaker 10: co evolved with the other four kingdom and also other
• 49:01
  Speaker 10: species in our kingdom, the animal kingdom, right. And so
• 49:06
  Speaker 10: I think when we try to take ourselves out of
• 49:09
  Speaker 10: that ecosystem or like put us above the ecosystem, that
• 49:13
  Speaker 10: like everything here is for us and we need to
• 49:16
  Speaker 10: just be serviced, right, and like everything else is subservient
• 49:20
  Speaker 10: to us.
• 49:21
  Speaker 1: That gives us a really.
• 49:23
  Speaker 10: Complex foundational and philosophical problem because then we end up
• 49:27
  Speaker 10: doing like the extractive models and the constraints of our
• 49:31
  Speaker 10: current capitalistic society like actually create the problem that they're
• 49:36
  Speaker 10: then trying to fix. So it's sort of like the FDA, Right,
• 49:39
  Speaker 10: it's supposed to have a balance of like providing healthy foods,
• 49:42
  Speaker 10: and then when that fails, then okay, there's some medications
• 49:46
  Speaker 10: you can take, but there does need to be a
• 49:48
  Speaker 10: balance because if you're not looking at one, then there's
• 49:51
  Speaker 10: going to be more stress on the other. So under
• 49:55
  Speaker 10: the current industrial and capitalistic model where just now told
• 50:00
  Speaker 10: to work work.
• 50:01
  Speaker 1: Work, work, work and.
• 50:02
  Speaker 10: Go, go, go, go go, and so nobody has time
• 50:05
  Speaker 10: to not take a pill and miss a day of
• 50:08
  Speaker 10: work and what have you? Right, And we kind of
• 50:10
  Speaker 10: saw that during COVID gave us an opportunity to slow
• 50:14
  Speaker 10: down and actually think, like what are we doing with
• 50:16
  Speaker 10: our lives and what's going on here? And so it
• 50:20
  Speaker 10: was a big reframe and I think looking at other
• 50:24
  Speaker 10: countries and like, historically what's been done. It's always been
• 50:29
  Speaker 10: foundations first, and it's always been like lifestyle and food
• 50:36
  Speaker 10: and rest and create creative pursuits, Like all of these
• 50:41
  Speaker 10: things are the foundations of our health. And like the
• 50:45
  Speaker 10: pill for every ill model is like somewhere very very
• 50:48
  Speaker 10: like at the tip of the iceberg, right where it's
• 50:51
  Speaker 10: like we have a really annoying symptom, you know, so
• 50:55
  Speaker 10: we can take a pill, but we're not actually addressing
• 50:58
  Speaker 10: all the causes that are downstream of that. And so
• 51:02
  Speaker 10: that is what functional medicine and other types of medicine
• 51:05
  Speaker 10: are trying to ask different questions like why do we
• 51:09
  Speaker 10: have this symptom, what's going on in the physiology, and
• 51:13
  Speaker 10: how can we start to correct the causes the inputs, right,
• 51:18
  Speaker 10: which is really caused by our life. Right, It's like
• 51:20
  Speaker 10: the things that we do in daily life. It could
• 51:23
  Speaker 10: be medicinal for us and it could be not so
• 51:26
  Speaker 10: great for us. And it's like the one percent gains
• 51:29
  Speaker 10: or losses over time that are going to be compounding
• 51:33
  Speaker 10: into either a healthier body or into a more disease
• 51:36
  Speaker 10: prone body. And so like, these are all the complexities
• 51:40
  Speaker 10: that we're faced with. But the current conventional system it's
• 51:45
  Speaker 10: kind of like the assembly line.
• 51:47
  Speaker 1: Right.
• 51:47
  Speaker 10: It's like there's a process and we all go to
• 51:50
  Speaker 10: these different specialists and they're all looking at one tiny
• 51:53
  Speaker 10: piece of the puzzle and prescribing a new prescription for it,
• 51:57
  Speaker 10: and us as pharmacists, we're the ones that that get
• 52:00
  Speaker 10: to see all of that in their profile, hopefully if
• 52:03
  Speaker 10: they're going to the same pharmacy and not pharmacy shopping around, right,
• 52:07
  Speaker 10: and so we get to see, wow, this is the
• 52:09
  Speaker 10: big picture, and this person is suffering and they're going
• 52:13
  Speaker 10: to all of these places and they're getting all these prescriptions,
• 52:16
  Speaker 10: but they're not actually getting better, and they're sort of
• 52:19
  Speaker 10: becoming a legal addict.
• 52:21
  Speaker 4: Right.
• 52:21
  Speaker 10: They're just coming back to get their refills month after month,
• 52:25
  Speaker 10: but nothing is really changing because they're not addressing the
• 52:29
  Speaker 10: root causes and what's actually making them sick. And so
• 52:34
  Speaker 10: that is why it is, like you said, the best time,
• 52:38
  Speaker 10: I think right now to be a pharmacist, because when
• 52:40
  Speaker 10: we get this bird's eye view, we can't help but
• 52:44
  Speaker 10: have our alarm bells.
• 52:45
  Speaker 1: Right, It's like, I don't want to be that person,
• 52:48
  Speaker 1: you know.
• 52:48
  Speaker 10: And I have again been sick, and I've been through
• 52:51
  Speaker 10: the healthcare system, and I've had emergency situations where I
• 52:56
  Speaker 10: was in the hospital, and I'm glad we have that,
• 52:59
  Speaker 10: and it's time for the pendulum to kind of swing
• 53:02
  Speaker 10: the other way a little bit, where we're not so
• 53:04
  Speaker 10: focused on emergency medicine and like always having the big
• 53:09
  Speaker 10: guns and having enough time to actually invite slowing down
• 53:14
  Speaker 10: and understanding why are we all so sick in the
• 53:17
  Speaker 10: first place, and understanding that will help us to design
• 53:21
  Speaker 10: a better system.
• 53:23
  Speaker 2: So we have three hundred and thirty million, roughly three
• 53:28
  Speaker 2: hundred and thirty million people in the United States right
• 53:31
  Speaker 2: now as a population, we have roughly three hundred and
• 53:34
  Speaker 2: sixty six thousand pharmacists. And think of how many of
• 53:40
  Speaker 2: those pharmacists that are looking at a patient's med list
• 53:45
  Speaker 2: who gasp or say, you know, I don't I have
• 53:50
  Speaker 2: six hundred prescriptions to check. I'm in the fast food
• 53:53
  Speaker 2: pharmacy realm. I'm pumping out prescriptions. I'm looking at this
• 53:58
  Speaker 2: patient's profile, and if I could just take time with
• 54:01
  Speaker 2: that individual patient and really dial into what's really happening,
• 54:07
  Speaker 2: that's the hijack I'm talking about pharmacy, pharmacists, pharmacological usage
• 54:14
  Speaker 2: hijacked by fast food process. Let's keep the money flowing
• 54:20
  Speaker 2: and never giving a pharmacist a chance to slow down.
• 54:25
  Speaker 2: Take the patient, you know, set them aside. Hey, let's
• 54:28
  Speaker 2: talk about your diabetes, or let's talk about hypertension, or
• 54:31
  Speaker 2: let's talk about what's happening, or you're having issues getting pregnant,
• 54:35
  Speaker 2: or you're having you know, night sweats and you can't
• 54:39
  Speaker 2: sleep well, and let's dial in to what's really happening
• 54:42
  Speaker 2: instead of take this next prescription, take this next pill,
• 54:46
  Speaker 2: take this next pill, and it's just like, that's why
• 54:49
  Speaker 2: I think what has been you and I are going
• 54:52
  Speaker 2: to remember this for the rest of our lives. I
• 54:54
  Speaker 2: don't know if the young pharmacy students that are p
• 54:57
  Speaker 2: ones right now in the pharmacy school, they might not
• 55:00
  Speaker 2: realize this, but there's a play tectonics thing happening in
• 55:03
  Speaker 2: pharmacy right now because of the breakup of PBMs, and
• 55:06
  Speaker 2: it's going to give us a chance to start building
• 55:10
  Speaker 2: more value based care, true value based care, and really
• 55:13
  Speaker 2: allowing the pharmacists to dial in to what they're doing,
• 55:16
  Speaker 2: and start compensating pharmacists for their knowledge and their experience
• 55:22
  Speaker 2: rather than the dispensing fee. If we can get away
• 55:25
  Speaker 2: from that dispensing fee and leave the dispensing fee for
• 55:28
  Speaker 2: the administrative stuff, leave it for the packaging, leave it
• 55:32
  Speaker 2: for the electricity, leave it for the just kind of
• 55:35
  Speaker 2: like the base stuff, but now start paying for the
• 55:39
  Speaker 2: pharmacists to dial into the individual so we can really
• 55:43
  Speaker 2: understand what's happening. And now, of course that's my dream,
• 55:46
  Speaker 2: that's probably your dream too, But what do you think
• 55:49
  Speaker 2: of that? How do we accelerate this change that I
• 55:52
  Speaker 2: see happening. I finally see things taking hold in PBM reform,
• 55:57
  Speaker 2: where we finally got the attention of Congress and Tennessee
• 56:00
  Speaker 2: and Arkansas. You're not allowed to own an insurance company
• 56:03
  Speaker 2: and a pharmacy now, which is freaking amazing. But talk
• 56:07
  Speaker 2: to us about this day and age of what you
• 56:09
  Speaker 2: see happening.
• 56:12
  Speaker 10: Well, I think you hit the nail on the head
• 56:14
  Speaker 10: because we do have to talk about the monetization, the
• 56:18
  Speaker 10: payment models, the compensation. All of that is what the
• 56:23
  Speaker 10: incentive is, right like who are who is paying, who
• 56:28
  Speaker 10: is receiving the money, and what are they paying for?
• 56:31
  Speaker 10: And the current system, it's like the amount of care
• 56:36
  Speaker 10: and treatment that somebody receives gets paid more.
• 56:41
  Speaker 1: And then that's why there's a lot of fraud and
• 56:43
  Speaker 1: waste things.
• 56:43
  Speaker 10: No matter how many times they're trying to inspect and
• 56:47
  Speaker 10: you know, prevent that and educate around that, it just
• 56:51
  Speaker 10: doesn't work because of the payment system. It's just prone
• 56:54
  Speaker 10: to corruption, just because of human nature and politics. And
• 56:57
  Speaker 10: this is the way things are, and so we do,
• 57:01
  Speaker 10: I believe, need to change it for like you said,
• 57:04
  Speaker 10: a value based system, which we've been talking about for decades.
• 57:06
  Speaker 1: I feel like at this point, and you know, like.
• 57:11
  Speaker 10: I think there needs to be a level of public
• 57:13
  Speaker 10: education and awareness too that is accessible and free. But
• 57:18
  Speaker 10: for example, individual pharmacists shouldn't be expected to give all
• 57:23
  Speaker 10: their knowledge away for free, which we have been all along.
• 57:26
  Speaker 10: We never charge for our advice or are counseling. It's
• 57:29
  Speaker 10: part of what we do, and yet we don't get
• 57:32
  Speaker 10: to charge for appointments like a doctor would, and the
• 57:36
  Speaker 10: patients are just kind of again running around from all
• 57:40
  Speaker 10: these different offices and practitioners and revolving door of healthcare
• 57:45
  Speaker 10: with hospitals and emergency care and then med reconciliation that
• 57:49
  Speaker 10: happens or doesn't happen, and social work and so there's
• 57:52
  Speaker 10: like a lot of pieces and a lot of advocacy
• 57:56
  Speaker 10: needs to be had so that the roles are clear.
• 57:59
  Speaker 10: There's also creep off scope of practice that we have
• 58:02
  Speaker 10: to be very concerned about, right, like making sure that
• 58:06
  Speaker 10: we do have that separation that allows us to be
• 58:09
  Speaker 10: in integrity and to do our part without maybe overstepping
• 58:13
  Speaker 10: on somebody else. Like I would never be expected to
• 58:16
  Speaker 10: diagnose something because that's.
• 58:17
  Speaker 1: Not what I learned in school.
• 58:19
  Speaker 10: But I certainly can create a care plan, but you
• 58:24
  Speaker 10: know as well as a doctor, I would think, if
• 58:26
  Speaker 10: not better. So you know, I think there's a lot here, right,
• 58:31
  Speaker 10: And so the whole like vertical and horizontal monopoly thing,
• 58:36
  Speaker 10: I just think has got to go.
• 58:38
  Speaker 1: Like you said, like why was.
• 58:39
  Speaker 10: That even legal before that they get to own all
• 58:42
  Speaker 10: these different pieces of the puzzle. Like I don't know,
• 58:45
  Speaker 10: but I'm very happy that there is now more light
• 58:47
  Speaker 10: on that and more clarity on that, because again, what
• 58:51
  Speaker 10: we don't know, it's like we can't fix.
• 58:53
  Speaker 1: So that is all very very good.
• 58:57
  Speaker 10: As far as creating better system of payment, I feel
• 59:03
  Speaker 10: we should be showing results like how much money can
• 59:05
  Speaker 10: we actually save and which negative outcomes can we prevent
• 59:10
  Speaker 10: by doing these proactive things and these counseling and you know, deprescribing.
• 59:17
  Speaker 10: Why can't I get paid for that? Why must I
• 59:19
  Speaker 10: get paid for dispensing.
• 59:21
  Speaker 1: More and more and more? You know?
• 59:23
  Speaker 10: And also during COVID, we saw how, you know, how
• 59:28
  Speaker 10: much we depend on this fragile system to be honest
• 59:32
  Speaker 10: of supplying demand, and like all of a sudden, there
• 59:35
  Speaker 10: were all these shortages of things that people needed, and
• 59:38
  Speaker 10: it's like, we don't have a plan be we don't
• 59:40
  Speaker 10: know what else we can use other than that one
• 59:44
  Speaker 10: thing that we were so dependent on. And I think
• 59:47
  Speaker 10: anytime we'd become dependent on something and we're not flexible
• 59:51
  Speaker 10: enough to switch gears is a problem. And I think
• 59:54
  Speaker 10: that's what's happened with the pharmaceutical model. We're so dependent
• 59:58
  Speaker 10: that something's wrong, We're going to get us a plier
• 1:00:00
  Speaker 10: to fix it. We're going to have insurance cover it
• 1:00:03
  Speaker 10: and we'll be able to mask it for a period
• 1:00:05
  Speaker 10: of time until the next thing comes along. Like that
• 1:00:07
  Speaker 10: is just not sustainable and we need to open our
• 1:00:11
  Speaker 10: eyes to that. And like me, for one, I don't
• 1:00:15
  Speaker 10: want to be dependent on a system. I want to
• 1:00:17
  Speaker 10: be able to walk outside and know what I can do,
• 1:00:20
  Speaker 10: like you said, from nature, know what I need, and
• 1:00:25
  Speaker 10: I wouldn't have all of these restrictions and policies governing.
• 1:00:29
  Speaker 1: The type of care that I can receive.
• 1:00:31
  Speaker 10: So you know, it's a big topic, and again there's
• 1:00:35
  Speaker 10: lots of complexity, but I think it starts with awareness.
• 1:00:39
  Speaker 10: And again I wish for more public education, and I
• 1:00:44
  Speaker 10: want this to go a step deeper, a step even
• 1:00:47
  Speaker 10: beyond functional approaches and root cause medicine by looking at
• 1:00:51
  Speaker 10: the root causes globally of what's making us sick from
• 1:00:56
  Speaker 10: our environment and from the lack of regulation and polyyes
• 1:01:00
  Speaker 10: from the government, and from the businesses that are providing
• 1:01:04
  Speaker 10: food for us and creating.
• 1:01:07
  Speaker 1: The type of lifestyle that we're all used to.
• 1:01:10
  Speaker 10: And you know, and it's everything everything in our life,
• 1:01:13
  Speaker 10: right like from the moment you wake up to where
• 1:01:16
  Speaker 10: you live and what you do for works like all
• 1:01:19
  Speaker 10: of it plays a role, all the chemicals and the
• 1:01:22
  Speaker 10: pharmaceuticals that are being sprayed into our food, into our environment,
• 1:01:27
  Speaker 10: into our air, into our waters, and then we can't
• 1:01:31
  Speaker 10: expect to get healthy food from that, healthy soil from that,
• 1:01:35
  Speaker 10: et cetera. And when we don't have a healthy foundation,
• 1:01:38
  Speaker 10: how can we expect to have a sustainable model of care?
• 1:01:42
  Speaker 3: Yeah? Absolutely, amen?
• 1:01:44
  Speaker 2: Yeah, how do we expand the concept of blue zones?
• 1:01:48
  Speaker 3: Why are the blue zones.
• 1:01:49
  Speaker 2: Throughout the world where people are living the most full
• 1:01:54
  Speaker 2: lives and they're living the longest And what does that mean?
• 1:01:57
  Speaker 2: And what do those areas have it? New York City
• 1:02:01
  Speaker 2: doesn't have, or Chicago or Miami. And it's just it's
• 1:02:07
  Speaker 2: it's a return to nature and in my opinion, I'm sure.
• 1:02:12
  Speaker 3: Yours as well and more for stop.
• 1:02:15
  Speaker 2: Forgetting where we came from and what was and what is?
• 1:02:19
  Speaker 2: And like you said, I love how you put it, Marina,
• 1:02:21
  Speaker 2: that you said that we've separated ourselves from the ecosystem
• 1:02:25
  Speaker 2: and we try to be the dominant being or entity
• 1:02:29
  Speaker 2: within the system rather than being you know, one with
• 1:02:32
  Speaker 2: it and working with it. This is exciting. We have
• 1:02:35
  Speaker 2: to have more conversations with you. I want to encourage
• 1:02:40
  Speaker 2: listeners to look you up. You are on LinkedIn. You
• 1:02:43
  Speaker 2: also can go to marinabuksove dot com. There's going to
• 1:02:48
  Speaker 2: be a link in our show notes. That's the wonderful website.
• 1:02:52
  Speaker 2: Websites amazing, it looks great, it reads well, it gives
• 1:02:55
  Speaker 2: lots of information to people that are are very curious. Also, Marina,
• 1:03:01
  Speaker 2: let's I want you back. So we have to talk
• 1:03:04
  Speaker 2: more about the cash based systems of building functional medicine
• 1:03:10
  Speaker 2: programs inside communities. And a shout out to pharmacy owners
• 1:03:13
  Speaker 2: out there that are listening right now. There is a
• 1:03:16
  Speaker 2: lot of money that people want to spend if they thought, hey,
• 1:03:22
  Speaker 2: is there an opportunity for me to tap into a
• 1:03:24
  Speaker 2: pharmacist who really understands the science of this and become
• 1:03:29
  Speaker 2: more holistic and more tied into herbal medicine and more.
• 1:03:34
  Speaker 3: And the answer is yes, yes, yes, yes. It's just
• 1:03:37
  Speaker 3: it's a.
• 1:03:37
  Speaker 2: Setup and there's a process, and I want to get
• 1:03:39
  Speaker 2: more pharmacists and more pharmacy owners connected into you, Marina.
• 1:03:44
  Speaker 2: And I'm really excited to say that you have a
• 1:03:47
  Speaker 2: special event share with our listeners what's coming up on Thursday,
• 1:03:52
  Speaker 2: June twenty fifth.
• 1:03:54
  Speaker 1: Yes, this is really exciting.
• 1:03:56
  Speaker 10: I've been invited to an intimate gathering called Galilea and
• 1:04:02
  Speaker 10: we're going to be recording a podcast live about how
• 1:04:07
  Speaker 10: psychedelic plans and medicine can be used in clinical settings
• 1:04:11
  Speaker 10: for women's health. And this is part of the initiative
• 1:04:16
  Speaker 10: by Galilea to train clinicians and have real and honest
• 1:04:20
  Speaker 10: conversations because our patients are looking for other solutions, and
• 1:04:27
  Speaker 10: this is one of the things that's been coming up
• 1:04:29
  Speaker 10: in recent years, and as the politics around it are changing,
• 1:04:33
  Speaker 10: as the legal status is changing, as there is more
• 1:04:35
  Speaker 10: education and awareness, more people are curious and they're asking
• 1:04:38
  Speaker 10: clinicians questions, and unless we're informed, we're not going to
• 1:04:42
  Speaker 10: be able to support these patients and they might go
• 1:04:44
  Speaker 10: off and explore their own in not such safe environments.
• 1:04:48
  Speaker 10: And so we need to know what to be able
• 1:04:50
  Speaker 10: to counsel on and how to have these conversations.
• 1:04:53
  Speaker 3: That's awesome.
• 1:04:54
  Speaker 2: So if you're in the area of Brooklyn, it's the
• 1:04:57
  Speaker 2: Galilea the Brooklyn Gathering Thursday, June twenty fifth. If you're driving,
• 1:05:03
  Speaker 2: you're walking, don't worry about it. I'm going to put
• 1:05:05
  Speaker 2: this link in the show notes Marina, this has been
• 1:05:09
  Speaker 2: very special. Thank you so much for not only your
• 1:05:12
  Speaker 2: work and membership of the Pharmacy Podcast Network, but thanks
• 1:05:15
  Speaker 2: for being on Torksday.
• 1:05:16
  Speaker 3: We got to get you more on torks once in
• 1:05:18
  Speaker 3: a while.
• 1:05:19
  Speaker 1: Yeah, this was so fun. I'd love to be back.
• 1:05:21
  Speaker 1: Thank you for having me