Latest / The Daily Writer / An Honest Conversation About Depression & Mental Health

Transcript

An Honest Conversation About Depression & Mental Health · The Daily Writer

• 0:09
  SPEAKER_00: Welcome to this episode of the Daily Writer Podcast.
• 0:12
  SPEAKER_00: I'm going to go ahead and skip my usual intro for the weekend edition because this is going to be a different sort of episode.
• 0:19
  SPEAKER_00: As you probably saw from the title of this episode, this is going to be about depression and mental health.
• 0:27
  SPEAKER_00: And you're probably wondering, what is this all about?
• 0:30
  SPEAKER_00: Isn't this a podcast about writing?
• 0:32
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, of course it is, but as writers, we are human beings with emotions.
• 0:37
  SPEAKER_00: We have problems, we have issues, we have ups and downs.
• 0:40
  SPEAKER_00: And if something is affecting us and our ability to create or to write, then that topic is fair game on this podcast.
• 0:48
  SPEAKER_00: So I want to take this episode and I want to share some of my journey with this issue of depression and mental health.
• 0:55
  SPEAKER_00: And here's why.
• 0:56
  SPEAKER_00: This seems like a good time to talk about this issue.
• 0:59
  SPEAKER_00: A lot of people are struggling right now, and here in the United States, people have been through a lot.
• 1:05
  SPEAKER_00: Now I realize we're in the midst of a global pandemic.
• 1:08
  SPEAKER_00: This is not just something, obviously, that people in the US are dealing with.
• 1:12
  SPEAKER_00: This is all around the world, but things in the U.S.
• 1:15
  SPEAKER_00: have been pretty crazy the last few months.
• 1:19
  SPEAKER_00: Some would argue the last number of years, which I would agree with, but that's neither here nor there.
• 1:25
  SPEAKER_00: So we've just been through a crazy election cycle.
• 1:28
  SPEAKER_00: We have this pandemic going on.
• 1:30
  SPEAKER_00: It's also January.
• 1:32
  SPEAKER_00: You know, this is it's cold outside in much of the U.S., which means that people are indoors most of the time and not getting a lot of sunlight.
• 1:39
  SPEAKER_00: And that affects your mental health, of course.
• 1:41
  SPEAKER_00: And then when you throw in a global pandemic and, you know, uh joblessness and unemployment and all kinds of things, pretty much you have the recipe for some serious mental health challenges.
• 1:55
  SPEAKER_00: So I thought I would just address this here in my episode, more than anything, not necessarily to give, you know, like the expert solution because I'm I'm I'm not an expert in this area, I promise.
• 2:05
  SPEAKER_00: But I have lived through it and I have dealt with it as you'll hear in a little bit.
• 2:09
  SPEAKER_00: And I want to share my story and hopefully some things that that may help you or someone that you know or someone that you love.
• 2:17
  SPEAKER_00: I'm calling this an honest conversation about depression and mental health.
• 2:21
  SPEAKER_00: And it's not because there are two people talking on this episode, but the deal is I'm calling this a conversation because I want to help nudge the door open on more conversations about these kinds of topics.
• 2:33
  SPEAKER_00: And I have been pretty open about my journey with depression over the years.
• 2:37
  SPEAKER_00: I've written about it on my blog several times.
• 2:39
  SPEAKER_00: I've talked about it on this podcast, I think before.
• 2:42
  SPEAKER_00: I've given talks about it.
• 2:43
  SPEAKER_00: I've been very open with my college students about it and with other people.
• 2:46
  SPEAKER_00: So I literally have nothing to hide.
• 2:48
  SPEAKER_00: There's nothing you can ask me about, about my experience with depression that I probably would not share and that I would not willingly share publicly.
• 2:58
  SPEAKER_00: And I do that.
• 3:00
  SPEAKER_00: Uh it's not because I'm trying to appear, it's not because this is a cry for sympathy, it's not that at all.
• 3:06
  SPEAKER_00: Um, God's been very good to me.
• 3:08
  SPEAKER_00: My wife has been very gracious to me.
• 3:10
  SPEAKER_00: I've had so many people in my life who've been so incredibly supportive.
• 3:15
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, I can't even begin to to name all the people who have helped me along the way.
• 3:20
  SPEAKER_00: I really can't, because it's such a huge list.
• 3:24
  SPEAKER_00: So I feel very blessed.
• 3:26
  SPEAKER_00: This is this is uh definitely not like a thing where I'm saying feel sorry for me, boo hoo, and all that stuff.
• 3:33
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I'm doing this because I know that for some of you who are listening, depression and mental mental health, mental illness is a very real issue that's affecting your daily life.
• 3:44
  SPEAKER_00: And if you're not the person who's struggling with it, I guarantee that you do know someone who does.
• 3:50
  SPEAKER_00: You may just not know it.
• 3:52
  SPEAKER_00: There are all kinds of people in your everyday life who are struggling and you may not even be aware of it.
• 3:57
  SPEAKER_00: Now, likewise, if you're the person who's struggling, there are all kinds of people in your life who don't know that you're struggling.
• 4:06
  SPEAKER_00: You know, how many times have we heard stories about somebody who took their own life and everybody around them said, oh, they seem so happy, nobody knew anything was wrong.
• 4:16
  SPEAKER_00: And they were shocked that that that that person was having that depth and that level of struggle and uh that horrible, you know, level of depression in their life, so much so that that the only solution they felt was right for them was to take their own life.
• 4:33
  SPEAKER_00: That kind of stuff happens all the time.
• 4:35
  SPEAKER_00: I saw it on Facebook just a couple days ago.
• 4:37
  SPEAKER_00: A friend of mine had a f he had a friend who took his own life just recently, and it was a tragic situation.
• 4:45
  SPEAKER_00: I didn't know the gentleman who took his own life, but my friend was was good friends with him.
• 4:49
  SPEAKER_00: And my understanding was that this gentleman who took his life had you know had kids at home, and it was just a really, really tragic thing.
• 4:58
  SPEAKER_00: So if you are the person who's struggling and you feel like you can't tell anybody, if you're going through a hard time with this, um this up this episode is for you.
• 5:10
  SPEAKER_00: It really is.
• 5:12
  SPEAKER_00: I want you to know that there's somebody in your corner, and that person is me.
• 5:17
  SPEAKER_00: And we may not know each other personally, but but I have I've had a journey of depression uh for decades.
• 5:25
  SPEAKER_00: And it's not something maybe you you knew that about me.
• 5:29
  SPEAKER_00: But this this episode, I do want to share some about that and some ways that I have found to live with it and to uh to function in spite of that reality of depression in my life and that tendency to to sometimes go to that place, even in the present.
• 5:48
  SPEAKER_00: I don't mean right this moment, but you know, it's it's something that I have learned to live with, and I realize it's always gonna be with me.
• 5:53
  SPEAKER_00: I'm always gonna have that tendency in my life, wherever that comes from.
• 5:58
  SPEAKER_00: But I have learned to manage it and I've learned to live with it, I think, very successfully.
• 6:02
  SPEAKER_00: But it wasn't always that way, and I want to share uh my story with you um in just a moment.
• 6:08
  SPEAKER_00: So now with the pandemic and with so much turmoil and anxiety and people losing jobs over the past year and all this kind of stuff, I just want to do my small part to help open up the to help open up this conversation about mental health.
• 6:23
  SPEAKER_00: So I want to share a little bit and then I want to get into the main thing that I want to share with you, which is talking about five lies that I believed about depression and what I did about those.
• 6:36
  SPEAKER_00: But first, let me share a bit about my story.
• 6:38
  SPEAKER_00: And like many stories, my story begins with a dream.
• 6:45
  SPEAKER_00: Throughout my whole adult life, I have had a recurring dream.
• 6:48
  SPEAKER_00: And I've had it at least a couple of dozen times.
• 6:52
  SPEAKER_00: In this dream, I'm running somewhere, but there's a shadowy, unseen force that is holding me back.
• 6:59
  SPEAKER_00: It's almost like I'm running in place.
• 7:02
  SPEAKER_00: And by the way, this is all absolutely true.
• 7:05
  SPEAKER_00: This is, uh, I'm not exaggerating or making this up.
• 7:08
  SPEAKER_00: This is a dream that I've actually had a couple dozen times over the years.
• 7:12
  SPEAKER_00: And I don't know enough about human psychology to understand what this dream means or why I keep having it.
• 7:19
  SPEAKER_00: I don't know what or who the force is that's holding me back, but it does seem like a good metaphor for my experience with depression.
• 7:27
  SPEAKER_00: I started to experience symptoms of depression in my late 20s.
• 7:32
  SPEAKER_00: And I at that time I really had no reason to be depressed.
• 7:35
  SPEAKER_00: I was a successful worship pastor at a church of about 600 people in northern Illinois, and I had been married for several years.
• 7:44
  SPEAKER_00: We had good jobs, we had a great marriage, I was healthy and I was going to grad school, I had a good church, a good ministry, and everything seemed to be going perfectly well.
• 7:54
  SPEAKER_00: But over time, I began to experience what I can only describe as a fog.
• 8:00
  SPEAKER_00: You know, many people think that depression just means feeling sad, but that's never been my experience.
• 8:06
  SPEAKER_00: I don't want to tell you what your experience is, but my experience is that it feels like when I feel depression, it feels like my head is in a fog.
• 8:16
  SPEAKER_00: And that's the best metaphor that I can think of.
• 8:18
  SPEAKER_00: I can't think straight.
• 8:20
  SPEAKER_00: Time seems to slow down, and I just feel like I'm walking through a fog.
• 8:26
  SPEAKER_00: And when depressed people talk about not being able to get out of bed in the morning, I understand how that feels and why they would say that.
• 8:33
  SPEAKER_00: Because depression to me feels like a gradual descent into this gray fog of apathy.
• 8:41
  SPEAKER_00: Depression to me is not about the presence of sadness.
• 8:45
  SPEAKER_00: It actually is much more about the absence of emotion.
• 8:49
  SPEAKER_00: It's about the absence of feeling.
• 8:52
  SPEAKER_00: And most of the time in my life, my depression has been manageable, but there have been times when it's gotten what I would call out of control and it's actually really, really frightened me.
• 9:01
  SPEAKER_00: Now, thankfully, that hasn't that hasn't happened very many times, but and thankfully it hasn't happened really anytime recently.
• 9:08
  SPEAKER_00: But I can recall specific episodes from from years back.
• 9:12
  SPEAKER_00: There was one time when I was driving back home from grad school at night and I was feeling really, really down.
• 9:19
  SPEAKER_00: I just felt very, very depressed for whatever reason.
• 9:22
  SPEAKER_00: And I was on this um two or four-lane highway in Illinois, driving back from grad school late at night.
• 9:29
  SPEAKER_00: And this must have been this must have been around 2002 or 2003.
• 9:33
  SPEAKER_00: And I was in my late 20s at the time.
• 9:36
  SPEAKER_00: I was feeling really tired and really stressed, which for me only makes depression worse.
• 9:41
  SPEAKER_00: And as I drove on this road, I began to wonder what would it feel like to just end the pain and to be free from this pain.
• 9:53
  SPEAKER_00: And I started to wonder, maybe you might even say fantasize.
• 9:56
  SPEAKER_00: I started to wonder what it would feel like to just jerk the steering wheel to the left and drive right into the oncoming traffic.
• 10:05
  SPEAKER_00: And I wondered, would I hear anything?
• 10:10
  SPEAKER_00: Would I experience anything?
• 10:13
  SPEAKER_00: Would it be quick?
• 10:14
  SPEAKER_00: Would it be instantaneous?
• 10:15
  SPEAKER_00: What would actually happen if I did that?
• 10:18
  SPEAKER_00: And I remember in that moment, you know, it's like it's like that thing from uh the old TV show, you know, the that the flashing light, danger Will Robinson, danger Will Robinson.
• 10:29
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm so thankful because there was that little part of my mind that was just going off.
• 10:34
  SPEAKER_00: It was like a red light or red blinker saying, This is really, really bad that you're having these thoughts.
• 10:39
  SPEAKER_00: So I'm thankful that although one most of my mind was thinking those horrible thoughts, there was another part of my mind that was still coherent, it was still cogent.
• 10:48
  SPEAKER_00: And it was saying, I was I was still self-aware enough to realize, okay, this isn't really you, this is like your depression talking.
• 10:56
  SPEAKER_00: And that's that's another way that I think about this, is when I'm in those those places, and I and they still come up occasionally, not to the extent where you know I think about taking my own life or anything like that, but when I can feel myself slipping a little bit, um there is that part of me that is self-aware enough to know what's happening.
• 11:19
  SPEAKER_00: And I think and I'm very thankful that I've that I've always retained that.
• 11:23
  SPEAKER_00: Some people don't.
• 11:24
  SPEAKER_00: Some people just slip totally into that and and uh you know go to very, very dark places, of course.
• 11:34
  SPEAKER_00: I remember another time a few years later after my son was born, and this would have been uh year 2004, maybe early 2005.
• 11:43
  SPEAKER_00: He was born in 2004.
• 11:45
  SPEAKER_00: Now my son, whenever he was born, he had colic for about eight or ten months.
• 11:51
  SPEAKER_00: Uh excuse me, he had colic for about eight or ten months after he was born, which means that he he screamed and he cried almost all the time.
• 12:00
  SPEAKER_00: Now, I'm not a doctor and I don't play one on TV, but uh our understanding was that it had something to do with probably acid reflux.
• 12:08
  SPEAKER_00: Uh that's my understanding of of what colic is, and I could be off on that.
• 12:12
  SPEAKER_00: If you're a medical professional, you know far more about this than I do.
• 12:15
  SPEAKER_00: But that was our understanding is that you know, whenever he would eat, he would just have this acid reflux and it would obviously really, really bother him.
• 12:22
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, it bothers adults, so of course it's going to bother a baby.
• 12:26
  SPEAKER_00: But but we can never really figure out a good solution for him.
• 12:29
  SPEAKER_00: And literally we tried everything.
• 12:31
  SPEAKER_00: I re I remember even my dad ordered something from England called gripe water.
• 12:38
  SPEAKER_00: I will forever remember that.
• 12:40
  SPEAKER_00: He was so good to buy this for us because it was said to help with colic in in you know babies.
• 12:46
  SPEAKER_00: Well, uh, you know, if somebody on the internet recommended a solution, chances are pretty high that we bought it and that we tried it, and like literally nothing ever worked except for one thing.
• 12:57
  SPEAKER_00: There was only one thing that ever worked in helping our son to calm down whenever he had colic, really, really bad during most of that first year.
• 13:07
  SPEAKER_00: And that is that a hairdryer would help him to calm down.
• 13:10
  SPEAKER_00: And that whole first year after he was born, uh, he could not sleep laying down in his crib.
• 13:16
  SPEAKER_00: We he had to sleep in his car seat.
• 13:18
  SPEAKER_00: So, you know, we had two car seats, one in the car, and literally a car seat that he slept in on the couch downstairs, and one of us would sleep with him on the couch every night.
• 13:28
  SPEAKER_00: And, you know, it was literally this went on for months and months and months.
• 13:33
  SPEAKER_00: We would take turns sleeping on the couch with him with a hairdryer going all night because the only thing that would help him to calm down was the sound of that hairdryer.
• 13:41
  SPEAKER_00: And in fact, we I think we burned through two or three hairdryers that way.
• 13:46
  SPEAKER_00: And it actually was the extent where, and I still remember this, we bought a C D.
• 13:53
  SPEAKER_00: Remember, this was back before MP3s and stuff.
• 13:55
  SPEAKER_00: We bought a CD of like a solid hour of hairdryer sound.
• 13:59
  SPEAKER_00: I don't remember where we got that, but we used the heck out of that thing.
• 14:04
  SPEAKER_00: So, anyway, uh back to the main story here.
• 14:08
  SPEAKER_00: I remember uh one day my wife was gone and I was home alone with my son, and he was having one of his really, really bad spells.
• 14:16
  SPEAKER_00: He was screaming and crying, and nothing that I could do seemed nothing that I did seemed to help him, and I just felt completely helpless.
• 14:23
  SPEAKER_00: And I was so heartbroken for my son because nothing uh, you know, holding him, singing to him, hairdryer at that on that particular day, nothing seemed to help him.
• 14:34
  SPEAKER_00: And I felt so down and discouraged and sad and probably very, very sleep deprived.
• 14:40
  SPEAKER_00: And um I was feeling very, very depressed that day.
• 14:44
  SPEAKER_00: And I remember he was in the other room and I went into my office uh here in our house, and I remember sitting down at the computer and I I Googled ways to commit suicide because I could not take it anymore.
• 14:59
  SPEAKER_00: Now, again, I was coherent enough to realize you're not being yourself, you're sleep deprived.
• 15:05
  SPEAKER_00: You know, I I was kind of telling myself this can't you're sleep deprived, you're you're very anxious, you're going through a difficult time.
• 15:11
  SPEAKER_00: This is not gonna last forever, you're gonna get through this.
• 15:14
  SPEAKER_00: I remember thinking that, but I was also upset enough to where I was just like, I'm not gonna make it.
• 15:21
  SPEAKER_00: I am literally literally not gonna make it through this.
• 15:24
  SPEAKER_00: So it for all of you who have been through a colicky baby or you're going through that now, just please hear me on this.
• 15:34
  SPEAKER_00: You will you will make it, you will get through it.
• 15:37
  SPEAKER_00: People who've never had colicky babies don't understand.
• 15:40
  SPEAKER_00: They really don't.
• 15:42
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but if you've been through that, you understand how that can be such a difficult mental health challenge.
• 15:49
  SPEAKER_00: You know, people always joke about, you know, newborn parents of newborns, you know, you're sleep deprived.
• 15:55
  SPEAKER_00: And, you know, once you've been through it, you kind of joke about it.
• 15:58
  SPEAKER_00: But when you're going through that with a newborn, especially one who has colic, it's it's no joke.
• 16:03
  SPEAKER_00: It's no laughing matter.
• 16:04
  SPEAKER_00: That's it's really, really serious business.
• 16:07
  SPEAKER_00: And um, it can have a major toll on your relationships and your mental health.
• 16:13
  SPEAKER_00: And uh you can easily go into some dark places when you're really sleep deprived.
• 16:18
  SPEAKER_00: So if that's you, please know you have my sympathy.
• 16:21
  SPEAKER_00: I've been there and you will get through this, I promise.
• 16:26
  SPEAKER_00: Well, in those moments and other moments like them, I I knew things were bad, and I knew things were really, really bad.
• 16:33
  SPEAKER_00: But again, I'm so thankful that I was coherent enough to realize what I was thinking, but it was kind of like standing outside myself and knowing, okay, Kent, you're having a bad time now, you're having a bad time right now, but don't do anything stupid.
• 16:46
  SPEAKER_00: That was kind of like my mantra, don't do anything stupid.
• 16:50
  SPEAKER_00: Well, I was stuck in that cycle for a long time because of several lies that I believed about depression.
• 16:57
  SPEAKER_00: And these are things that that I want to share with you uh here in just a second.
• 17:06
  SPEAKER_00: But first, I do want to just acknowledge something that probably a good percentage of people listening to this episode are struggling with depression at this moment.
• 17:16
  SPEAKER_00: So again, I want to emphasize if you're not somebody who struggles, I guarantee that you know somebody who does.
• 17:22
  SPEAKER_00: And you may not even know it.
• 17:26
  SPEAKER_00: Now, before I share these uh five lies that I believed about depression, I do want to share four quick observations.
• 17:32
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, this kind of sets the stage for what I want to share in the rest of this episode.
• 17:38
  SPEAKER_00: Observation number one is I'm not a doctor or a professional counselor, so I'm not really qualified to give counseling or medical advice.
• 17:47
  SPEAKER_00: I'm not trying to dispense medical advice or anything like that.
• 17:50
  SPEAKER_00: So that's kind of my disclaimer on this.
• 17:52
  SPEAKER_00: So I'm just sharing my story with you and my journey, okay.
• 17:57
  SPEAKER_00: Observation number two is I'm only speaking from my own experience.
• 18:01
  SPEAKER_00: I'm not representing anybody else's experiences.
• 18:04
  SPEAKER_00: I'm not suggesting that my experiences should be your experiences.
• 18:08
  SPEAKER_00: I'm just sharing my own journey in hopes that if you're struggling, that you would get help as well.
• 18:14
  SPEAKER_00: Observation number three, I believe depression is primarily a medical issue.
• 18:19
  SPEAKER_00: Now you can be a very spiritual person or a dedicated Christian leader and you can still be depressed.
• 18:25
  SPEAKER_00: I'm not saying that there is not a spiritual element to depression, but just so you know where I'm coming from, I look at depression as a medical condition, just like diabetes, cancer, uh, or any other medical condition is.
• 18:40
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, so that's where I'm coming from.
• 18:43
  SPEAKER_00: And then finally, observation number four is I like to be solution-oriented.
• 18:48
  SPEAKER_00: I don't believe that your depression should define you.
• 18:52
  SPEAKER_00: You know, some people like to essentially wallow in the depression.
• 18:56
  SPEAKER_00: And, you know, if you're struggling, I'm not saying you shouldn't be struggling.
• 18:59
  SPEAKER_00: That's not what I'm saying.
• 19:00
  SPEAKER_00: But what I am saying is that you should not let your pressure your depression define you.
• 19:06
  SPEAKER_00: Some people like to define themselves by their illnesses or by their what they perceive as flaws or mistakes or deficiencies.
• 19:16
  SPEAKER_00: You know, none of us should be defined by the things that are wrong with this or mistakes that we've made or things that we're struggling with.
• 19:24
  SPEAKER_00: We should be defined by our best days.
• 19:27
  SPEAKER_00: And I want you to think about depression in terms of solutions, in terms of how do we get better, how do we improve?
• 19:36
  SPEAKER_00: Not staying in it.
• 19:39
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm not saying it's easy to not stay in it, but I am saying I think that should be our orientation is how do I move away from this?
• 19:45
  SPEAKER_00: How do I get better?
• 19:47
  SPEAKER_00: Um now, I also understand that a dynamic of depression is that it makes you stop caring.
• 19:54
  SPEAKER_00: So, in essence, you don't want to get better.
• 19:56
  SPEAKER_00: You know, I I think a result of depression in our lives is that it makes us not care about getting better.
• 20:04
  SPEAKER_00: You know, that's kind of one of the things that depression does in my experience.
• 20:07
  SPEAKER_00: So if you're in that place right now, I want I want to suggest to you that you can get better, that there are things that can help, and and if there's nobody else telling you this, please know that I want you to be better.
• 20:20
  SPEAKER_00: If you're listening to this podcast episode, that means you're interested in writing, probably.
• 20:25
  SPEAKER_00: And I think that you have a gift to give to the world.
• 20:28
  SPEAKER_00: I really do.
• 20:29
  SPEAKER_00: I really truly honor honestly believe that.
• 20:31
  SPEAKER_00: There's something unique that you have to offer to the world.
• 20:34
  SPEAKER_00: You are here for a purpose, you're here for a reason.
• 20:36
  SPEAKER_00: God did not put you here for no reason.
• 20:40
  SPEAKER_00: So know that at the very least, there is one person, and that's me, who wants you to be better.
• 20:49
  SPEAKER_00: There's somebody that's on your side and who's on your team, and that is me, your your friend on the podcast, Kent Sanders.
• 20:58
  SPEAKER_00: Even if we've never met, I am on your team, I'm on your side, I'm here cheering for you and rooting for you.
• 21:05
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 21:06
  SPEAKER_00: So, with that, let's dive in here.
• 21:08
  SPEAKER_00: I want to share five lies that I believed about depression, and at the end of each one of these, I just have a simple question that I want to ask you.
• 21:15
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, here's the first lie that I used to believe, and that is I can manage my depression on my own.
• 21:24
  SPEAKER_00: One of my favorite movies of all time is The Searchers from 1956, and that stars John Wayne.
• 21:31
  SPEAKER_00: It is John Ford's most well-known movie, and at the very end of the movie, there's this cool shot.
• 21:38
  SPEAKER_00: And by the way, John Ford was a very well known director.
• 21:41
  SPEAKER_00: I'm kind of a movie geek, you probably already know that.
• 21:43
  SPEAKER_00: If you've listened to this podcast for any length of time, anyway, the very last shot of the searchers is very, very famous.
• 21:50
  SPEAKER_00: In fact, if you Google the searchers' final shot, here's what you'll see you'll see John Wayne silhouetted in a doorway.
• 22:00
  SPEAKER_00: Walking off into the distance.
• 22:02
  SPEAKER_00: Either that or he's standing in the doorway facing the camera, one of those two shots.
• 22:06
  SPEAKER_00: And it's very famous for probably many reasons, but it represents how many of us American males perceive ourselves, which is having to go it alone.
• 22:17
  SPEAKER_00: We perceive that we should be self-sufficient enough to go on our journey by ourselves.
• 22:22
  SPEAKER_00: And as an adult, it's natural to think that you should handle life on your own.
• 22:27
  SPEAKER_00: It's natural to think, I've got this, I don't need help, I'm a big boy, I'm a big girl, and so forth.
• 22:33
  SPEAKER_00: And I think that men are especially prone to this line of thinking.
• 22:37
  SPEAKER_00: You know, we don't want to show our weaknesses, and we feel like we have to maintain this kind of a tough guy image.
• 22:43
  SPEAKER_00: But on the inside, you may be falling apart totally.
• 22:46
  SPEAKER_00: And you may be thinking, I'm like barely keeping my life together.
• 22:51
  SPEAKER_00: Well, the problem with a tough guy mentality is that it really works against you when it comes to dealing with depression.
• 22:57
  SPEAKER_00: You're sinking further and further inside yourself, and it's impossible to pull yourself out of it.
• 23:04
  SPEAKER_00: Depression to me is like quicksand.
• 23:07
  SPEAKER_00: You can't get out by yourself.
• 23:09
  SPEAKER_00: You've got to have help.
• 23:11
  SPEAKER_00: You've got to have somebody throw you that rope and pull you out.
• 23:14
  SPEAKER_00: You're not going to get out by yourself.
• 23:17
  SPEAKER_00: Now, that may seem like it's bad news, but actually it's really, really good news because there's a metaphor here, and the metaphor is you're not going to get out by yourself.
• 23:27
  SPEAKER_00: I guess that's not really a metaphor.
• 23:29
  SPEAKER_00: That's just like a simple truth.
• 23:31
  SPEAKER_00: Um, that metaphor of being in the quicksand is kind of like how life is.
• 23:34
  SPEAKER_00: We're not going to go very far on our own.
• 23:37
  SPEAKER_00: You need help.
• 23:38
  SPEAKER_00: We all need help.
• 23:40
  SPEAKER_00: With my depression, I tried to manage things by myself for way too long.
• 23:44
  SPEAKER_00: And to be honest, it's still a tendency that I struggle with.
• 23:48
  SPEAKER_00: I've always been an independent person.
• 23:49
  SPEAKER_00: I've always been reluctant to ask for help.
• 23:52
  SPEAKER_00: In grade school, whenever our teacher would put us in groups, I was always the kid who would just be like, everybody, just let me do the project.
• 23:59
  SPEAKER_00: We would always make an A on it because I'm a perfectionist.
• 24:01
  SPEAKER_00: And I would leave everybody else out because I didn't, I didn't want this perfect project to be sullied by their ideas and mistakes.
• 24:07
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, that's kind of how I on my worst days, that's kind of how I approach life, you know, for better or for worse.
• 24:14
  SPEAKER_00: And for a long time, the only person who knew about my depression was my wife, Melanie.
• 24:19
  SPEAKER_00: But as I've gotten older and hopefully a little bit wiser, I've opened up to a lot of trusted fan, uh friends and family members who I knew would be supportive.
• 24:28
  SPEAKER_00: So if you're struggling with depression, the first person who I think should help you is your husband or your wife if you're married.
• 24:35
  SPEAKER_00: They need to know about your struggle.
• 24:37
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, let's be honest, you can't you can't really hide it anyway.
• 24:41
  SPEAKER_00: If you're battling depression, your spouse has probably noticed something different about you.
• 24:46
  SPEAKER_00: And they're also the person who hopefully loves you the most and they are likely the most well-equipped person to help you and to give you support.
• 24:54
  SPEAKER_00: So, you know, I would say if you have a healthy marriage, your spouse should be your first line of defense.
• 25:02
  SPEAKER_00: But you should also have some friends who can help you.
• 25:04
  SPEAKER_00: You need friends who you can lean on when times are bad.
• 25:08
  SPEAKER_00: And as a man, I confess that it's not always easy to maintain close relationships with guys.
• 25:14
  SPEAKER_00: That was really, really difficult when I was younger.
• 25:16
  SPEAKER_00: Thankfully, now I have a number of really, really wonderful friends who who I could call at a moment's notice.
• 25:25
  SPEAKER_00: I call them your 3 a.m.
• 25:26
  SPEAKER_00: friends.
• 25:26
  SPEAKER_00: These are guys that I could call at 3 a.m.
• 25:30
  SPEAKER_00: with any problem, and they would do everything in their power.
• 25:35
  SPEAKER_00: They would move heaven and earth to help me if they could.
• 25:37
  SPEAKER_00: And I I have probably, you know, three or four, five, six friends like that.
• 25:43
  SPEAKER_00: I have to go back and like really think about it, but but I've got several friends who are those 3 a.m.
• 25:48
  SPEAKER_00: kinds of friends.
• 25:49
  SPEAKER_00: It takes work to build those relationships, but it's worth the effort.
• 25:53
  SPEAKER_00: I've been a lot more intentional the last few years about building friendships.
• 25:56
  SPEAKER_00: And now I'm part of a few different really close-knit groups, including a couple masterminds.
• 26:02
  SPEAKER_00: I've been doing that for several years, and I spend a lot of time building relationships each week.
• 26:06
  SPEAKER_00: As men, we're not naturally wired to always do that because we do tend to be loners sometimes.
• 26:12
  SPEAKER_00: But it is worth the effort to build those relationships and to build into those friendships.
• 26:18
  SPEAKER_00: So you have your spouse, your network of close friends, but also you need a larger support network.
• 26:24
  SPEAKER_00: And this can include pastors, coaches, counselors, therapists, people in your mastermind group or small group or other kinds of people.
• 26:32
  SPEAKER_00: So my question for you is as we talk about you know these five lies that I believed about depression, the first lie is I can manage my own, I can manage depression on my own.
• 26:42
  SPEAKER_00: So my question for you is are you trying to manage life on your own, or do you have a solid support network in place to help you through depression and some other struggles of life?
• 26:52
  SPEAKER_00: And I really hope that you do.
• 26:55
  SPEAKER_00: Here's the second lie that I believed about depression, which is self-medicating my pain is an effective coping strategy.
• 27:04
  SPEAKER_00: You know, we all have our drug of choice.
• 27:07
  SPEAKER_00: It might be alcohol, gambling, too much TV, uh, illicit relationships, or any number of other vices that are both big or small.
• 27:19
  SPEAKER_00: And when we're suffering, it's easy to medicate the pain with things that make us feel good in the moment, even if they destroy us in the long run.
• 27:27
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, that's basically the definition of an addiction.
• 27:30
  SPEAKER_00: It's something that makes you feel good in the moment, but it will destroy you in the end.
• 27:35
  SPEAKER_00: And for me, one of the biggest things for me is food.
• 27:39
  SPEAKER_00: Whenever I'm angry, upset, or I'm just plain bored, I'm pretty quick to drown my sorrows in like a McDonald's meal or I live in St.
• 27:51
  SPEAKER_00: Louis, so we have White Castle around here.
• 27:53
  SPEAKER_00: Um, it's easy to zip through White Castle and get, you know, four or half a dozen burgers.
• 28:01
  SPEAKER_00: And it feels good.
• 28:02
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, that greasy food, let's just be honest, it does taste good.
• 28:05
  SPEAKER_00: And it makes you forget your problems for a while.
• 28:07
  SPEAKER_00: But this kind of behavior creates its own set of problems and it actually makes your depression worse because you end up feeling worse about yourself, and you end up physically feeling worse too if you're eating you know junk all the time.
• 28:19
  SPEAKER_00: It's a vicious cycle where you feel this unbearable pain of depression and and and sadness and emptiness, and you try to medicate it with your drug of choice, but the medication that you're taking only causes more pain.
• 28:33
  SPEAKER_00: So you continue in this downward spiral and you wonder when you're ever going to hit the bottom.
• 28:39
  SPEAKER_00: And for some people, they hope that they hit the bottom.
• 28:42
  SPEAKER_00: They they want to experience the the bottoming out of their life because they just want to end it all.
• 28:49
  SPEAKER_00: And if that's you, man, I I would just I'm just hoping and I'm praying for you that that you don't do that, that you reconsider, that that you realize life is worth living.
• 29:02
  SPEAKER_00: Because maybe there's somebody listening to this right now who you know you're just wondering, should I even go on with my life?
• 29:08
  SPEAKER_00: And the answer is yes.
• 29:10
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, you absolutely should.
• 29:13
  SPEAKER_00: Medicating ourselves is not a good coping strategy because it's only coping, it's not healing.
• 29:21
  SPEAKER_00: And whenever you're going through a painful time, it's hard to see beyond the next day or even the next five minutes sometimes.
• 29:27
  SPEAKER_00: You just want to feel better now and in the moment.
• 29:30
  SPEAKER_00: But here's the truth.
• 29:32
  SPEAKER_00: And the truth is that you can't run from yourself.
• 29:36
  SPEAKER_00: You have to face your pain and you have to ask the hard questions about the behavior in your life that's making things worse.
• 29:44
  SPEAKER_00: And despite whatever the culture around us says, there's no easy solutions.
• 29:49
  SPEAKER_00: Managing your depression effectively is not a neat and tidy process.
• 29:53
  SPEAKER_00: It's messy, it's real.
• 29:55
  SPEAKER_00: And my experience is that it involves a lot of zigzags and curves in the road.
• 30:01
  SPEAKER_00: Sometimes it feels like, you know, two steps forward, three steps back, kind of a deal.
• 30:05
  SPEAKER_00: Sometimes you have setbacks, but that's a normal part of the process.
• 30:10
  SPEAKER_00: So here's my question for you to think about Are you trying to medicate your pain with a vice or a bad habit?
• 30:17
  SPEAKER_00: And if so, what is the pain that you're running away from in your life?
• 30:23
  SPEAKER_00: And you know, sometimes it just helps to name that pain and even write it down.
• 30:27
  SPEAKER_00: In fact, I would encourage you to write it down because when you write it down and identify it, it it begins to take the power away from it when you see it written there on a piece of paper.
• 30:40
  SPEAKER_00: Here's line number three that I believed.
• 30:44
  SPEAKER_00: I have no control over the forces that make my depression worse.
• 30:48
  SPEAKER_00: Now, let me explain what I mean by this.
• 30:51
  SPEAKER_00: You might struggle with depression, but there are things that make it worse.
• 30:54
  SPEAKER_00: It's like being a diabetic but eating a lot of candy all the time.
• 30:59
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, you have the condition, but your behavior is actually making your symptoms a lot worse.
• 31:04
  SPEAKER_00: Now, with depression, and again, I'm only speaking for my own experience here.
• 31:08
  SPEAKER_00: With depression, there are three specific things that for me make it worse.
• 31:13
  SPEAKER_00: And those are stress, fatigue, and conflict.
• 31:18
  SPEAKER_00: So when I when I when I talk about this lie that I believed that that I had no control over the forces that make my depression worse, I believed that I could not do anything to improve these factors.
• 31:31
  SPEAKER_00: Stress, fatigue, and conflict.
• 31:34
  SPEAKER_00: So here's how I have have learned to deal with these in a healthier way.
• 31:38
  SPEAKER_00: The first one is stressed.
• 31:40
  SPEAKER_00: So I get stressed whenever I have too much going on.
• 31:43
  SPEAKER_00: If I'm too busy or if there are too many expectations placed upon me.
• 31:49
  SPEAKER_00: So what I've started doing the last couple of years is just saying no to more things.
• 31:53
  SPEAKER_00: And that's hard because I'm a people pleaser at heart.
• 31:56
  SPEAKER_00: I like to make people happy.
• 31:59
  SPEAKER_00: But I'm only trying to do things now that are the most important to me.
• 32:04
  SPEAKER_00: You know, I find it interesting that several times in the Gospels, it talks about Jesus withdrawing from the crowds and getting away from the immediate demands of people.
• 32:13
  SPEAKER_00: So even Jesus needed margin in his ministry and leadership.
• 32:17
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, this is the Son of God we're talking about.
• 32:20
  SPEAKER_00: So if Jesus needed to pull away from the crowds, I think, and and by the way, every good leader does this.
• 32:28
  SPEAKER_00: Every good leader has to pull back sometimes.
• 32:30
  SPEAKER_00: You can't be on stage all the time.
• 32:32
  SPEAKER_00: We've got to find a way to get away and to be quiet and to deal with our stress in a healthy way.
• 32:39
  SPEAKER_00: The second thing that makes my depression worse is fatigue.
• 32:42
  SPEAKER_00: And there are several things that have helped me in this regard.
• 32:45
  SPEAKER_00: One is going to bed earlier, which is hard because I'm naturally wired to be a night owl.
• 32:51
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so that definitely helps.
• 32:53
  SPEAKER_00: You know, a good night's sleep solves a lot of problems.
• 32:57
  SPEAKER_00: But something else that I do is I take a nap almost every single day.
• 33:02
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, it is rare that a day goes by where I don't take a short nap somewhere in the early afternoon or around lunchtime.
• 33:12
  SPEAKER_00: Uh that really helps me, but also exercise really helps me as well.
• 33:16
  SPEAKER_00: So, you know, there are very few problems that can't be solved by a good night's sleep and some exercise.
• 33:22
  SPEAKER_00: Now, I have not hit my weight loss goal.
• 33:24
  SPEAKER_00: If you heard my my episode on my 2021 goals at the beginning of January, uh, one of my goals is to lose some weight and to get healthier, but I'm making steady progress.
• 33:36
  SPEAKER_00: I do know that when I am well rested and I have more energy, that helps a lot with keeping my depression at bay.
• 33:44
  SPEAKER_00: Now, the third thing that makes my depression worse, and this is again something that I believed I had no control over, was conflict.
• 33:52
  SPEAKER_00: Now, this is probably in reality the thing that you do have the least control over because you can't control other people.
• 33:58
  SPEAKER_00: However, you can control your response to other people.
• 34:01
  SPEAKER_00: So I try to resolve conflicts as soon as I can.
• 34:04
  SPEAKER_00: I used to run away from conflict, and now I'm doing way, way better with it.
• 34:09
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, I don't feel as intimidated by conflict anymore, and I'm I'm much more quick to deal with it in a healthy way.
• 34:16
  SPEAKER_00: Now, something else that does help with all three of these things is I uh I regularly journal and I am meditating more these days, and those have been very helpful in helping to reduce stress.
• 34:28
  SPEAKER_00: So the main idea here is taking control of your life and taking the initiative to become healthier in your relationships and with with your with your health, with your sleep, managing stress and things like that.
• 34:42
  SPEAKER_00: And when when I stopped being a passive observer in my own life and I started to be more of an active doer in my own life, things started becoming a lot better.
• 34:53
  SPEAKER_00: So, my question for you is what are some proactive ways that you're dealing with stress, fatigue, and conflict in your life?
• 35:04
  SPEAKER_00: Here's line number four that I used to believe, and this is a big one.
• 35:09
  SPEAKER_00: Lie number four was I don't need professional help.
• 35:14
  SPEAKER_00: Now, there are many reasons that people avoid counselors.
• 35:18
  SPEAKER_00: You know, counselors, it takes time to go to a counselor or a therapist.
• 35:21
  SPEAKER_00: It costs money, usually, and sometimes there's judgment associated with going to counseling.
• 35:28
  SPEAKER_00: But there's one major reason to do it, and that is a counselor can help give you insights and strategies that can radically help you in your recovery.
• 35:36
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm not ashamed to tell you that I've seen a counselor at various points in my life.
• 35:41
  SPEAKER_00: There was a time in my mid-30s when I felt completely lost with no direction, and I felt like I was wandering in this vast emotional wilderness.
• 35:50
  SPEAKER_00: Now, the counselor did not give me a magic pill, but he he did help me process what was going on in my life, which was very helpful.
• 35:58
  SPEAKER_00: Now, I will tell you that um it was kind of a weird situation with this this counselor.
• 36:03
  SPEAKER_00: This this guy had his counseling practice in his house, which um, you know, which was totally fine.
• 36:08
  SPEAKER_00: Him and his wife were actually both therapists, and they had like a this space set aside in their home, like this whole room for the therapy sessions and so forth.
• 36:17
  SPEAKER_00: But I had a coworker who actually lived just down the street from this guy.
• 36:22
  SPEAKER_00: They were in the the kind of the same neighborhood.
• 36:24
  SPEAKER_00: So it always felt very awkward, like I didn't want this coworker to see my vehicle parked in this therapist driveway.
• 36:32
  SPEAKER_00: Because if I happened to see them, they would be like, Well, what are you doing in my neighborhood?
• 36:37
  SPEAKER_00: So that was kind of a strange, uh, a strange dynamic, I guess.
• 36:41
  SPEAKER_00: But at that time, I was I kind of felt shame because I was seeing this therapist, but I no longer feel that way.
• 36:48
  SPEAKER_00: You know, it's like, hey, you if you need help, go get help.
• 36:51
  SPEAKER_00: So I don't really care what anybody else thinks, honestly.
• 36:54
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I think if you, you know, if you need to go to the doctor, go to the doctor.
• 36:59
  SPEAKER_00: If you need to go to a counselor, go to a counselor.
• 37:01
  SPEAKER_00: What's to be ashamed about?
• 37:02
  SPEAKER_00: We all need help sometimes.
• 37:04
  SPEAKER_00: So there's there's counselors and therapists, but there's also doctors who can be an indispensable resource.
• 37:10
  SPEAKER_00: And doctors are a great resource, not just because they can prescribe appropriate medication, but also because they are trained to assess your level of depression and whether medication is needed in the first place.
• 37:24
  SPEAKER_00: You know, the internet is great, but one of the bad things about the internet is that there's lots of misinformation out there.
• 37:31
  SPEAKER_00: Nothing is a good replacement for actually going to your doctor and getting like an actual medical professional's feedback on what you're struggling with and different things that may be causing depression and how to make it better and so forth.
• 37:47
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm I'm just gonna be honest with you, it's probably no exaggeration to say that medication for depression probably saved my life.
• 37:56
  SPEAKER_00: And I don't think that's an exaggeration.
• 37:59
  SPEAKER_00: It took time and it took patience for me to find a medication that really has worked for me, but it was really worth the effort.
• 38:07
  SPEAKER_00: So if you're struggling with figuring out, you know, if you take medication and you're struggling with it, um again, I'm not a medical professional, I'm not trying to dispense advice on any level, but for me, it took a while to find the right one that worked.
• 38:22
  SPEAKER_00: So um, so I encourage you if you're going through that right now in your life, um, to continue trying to find what works for you.
• 38:33
  SPEAKER_00: So I believe that seeing a doctor or a counselor is a great investment of your time and money.
• 38:40
  SPEAKER_00: And I will be the first to say that those professionals have been really, really important factors in helping me to manage my symptoms of depression.
• 38:49
  SPEAKER_00: So, my question for you is if you struggle with depression or your mental health, have you considered seeing a doctor or getting counseling?
• 38:58
  SPEAKER_00: And if not, maybe that's something that you should consider for your own health and wellness.
• 39:04
  SPEAKER_00: Let me go on to lie number five here as we begin to wind up this episode.
• 39:07
  SPEAKER_00: By the way, thanks for hanging in here with me.
• 39:09
  SPEAKER_00: I know this is a different episode.
• 39:11
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, this isn't the most positive, you know, joyful topic.
• 39:14
  SPEAKER_00: This isn't like a writing episode where I'm giving you productivity tips.
• 39:19
  SPEAKER_00: But in a sense, maybe it is.
• 39:21
  SPEAKER_00: Um, this might be the best thing to help you be more productive and to be more joyful and to help you get back on the right path if you're struggling in this area.
• 39:31
  SPEAKER_00: So perhaps this is the most important episode um I've ever done on my podcast.
• 39:37
  SPEAKER_00: Who knows?
• 39:39
  SPEAKER_00: Line number five is my struggle with depression means that I am deficient in some way.
• 39:47
  SPEAKER_00: For some reason, a lot of people view depression differently than they view other medical conditions.
• 39:53
  SPEAKER_00: And I talked about this earlier, but I want to hit this again here, just to reiterate this point.
• 39:58
  SPEAKER_00: Some people tend to see depression as a character weakness.
• 40:02
  SPEAKER_00: And especially with men, we rarely admit that we're depressed.
• 40:06
  SPEAKER_00: We'll say things like, just buck up, just be a man, or just you know, pull yourself up by your own bootstraps, which is kind of funny because I don't even know what bootstraps are.
• 40:16
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I assume some of you know what bootstraps are.
• 40:18
  SPEAKER_00: I've heard the phrase my whole life.
• 40:20
  SPEAKER_00: I should probably Google it and figure out what the heck are bootstraps and why do people need to pull themselves up by their bootstraps.
• 40:26
  SPEAKER_00: But anyway, that's the English language.
• 40:28
  SPEAKER_00: We say things sometimes we don't even know what we're talking about, but it's like an old-timey phrase.
• 40:33
  SPEAKER_00: But anyway, back to the point.
• 40:34
  SPEAKER_00: Sometimes as men, we we talk like that.
• 40:36
  SPEAKER_00: Like you just got to be strong and just keep on pressing through.
• 40:40
  SPEAKER_00: And to be fair, there are some ladies who feel that way as well.
• 40:44
  SPEAKER_00: Now, I don't think it means you necessarily need to go around talking about your weaknesses or your personal problems all the time.
• 40:51
  SPEAKER_00: We all have these friends on Facebook who they're constantly, you know, kind of talking about, you know, I'm just struggling and I'm having a hard time and having a bad time.
• 41:02
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm not trying to make light of people who are struggling, but uh but you know what I'm talking about.
• 41:06
  SPEAKER_00: We all know those people who it's like they're just always talking about how they're struggling and they never seem to have a good day, and they kind of make a public show out of out of their ailments, okay?
• 41:18
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm not making light of their struggles, I'm just saying there's some people who kind of enjoy the attention that comes from constantly talking about how bad their life is.
• 41:27
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 41:28
  SPEAKER_00: Hopefully you understand where I'm coming from with that.
• 41:32
  SPEAKER_00: I'm not saying that we should be that way.
• 41:34
  SPEAKER_00: I'm not saying that we should use our our struggles or our problems or our our depression to try and get attention for ourselves.
• 41:42
  SPEAKER_00: That's not what I'm saying at all.
• 41:44
  SPEAKER_00: Um, however, I do think it's healthy and I think it's needed.
• 41:48
  SPEAKER_00: I think it's necessary to process through our problems and struggles with a trusted group of friends.
• 41:53
  SPEAKER_00: There is a huge difference between confiding in trusted people who can help us, and and then the flo, you know, the opposite of that is just like plastering our problems all over social media because I don't think that actually solves anything.
• 42:09
  SPEAKER_00: I'm not sure that people who are constantly doing that on social media really want to be helped.
• 42:13
  SPEAKER_00: I'm not sure that they're really looking for a solution.
• 42:15
  SPEAKER_00: I think they're mostly looking for just sympathy.
• 42:18
  SPEAKER_00: What I'm interested in for you is not just sympathy.
• 42:22
  SPEAKER_00: I'm interested in solutions.
• 42:24
  SPEAKER_00: And I think the solution is found in confiding in a trusted group of people who can actually help you with your problems and help you to to deal with them in a in a good way that's going to put you on a better footing for the future.
• 42:38
  SPEAKER_00: I do want to say this you're not deficient, you're not incomplete.
• 42:44
  SPEAKER_00: You're not any less of a person because you deal with depression.
• 42:49
  SPEAKER_00: You are a whole person.
• 42:52
  SPEAKER_00: You may be broken, you may be struggling, but you are a whole person.
• 42:58
  SPEAKER_00: So my question for you is as we begin to wrap up this episode, is if you're struggling, do you see yourself as deficient or weak?
• 43:07
  SPEAKER_00: And if so, why?
• 43:10
  SPEAKER_00: And if so, I also want to challenge you to begin seeing yourself as a whole person, as an amazing person, as a person who has a gift to share.
• 43:19
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, maybe you you are struggling, maybe you're feeling very weak, and you need help.
• 43:24
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, my goodness, we all need help.
• 43:26
  SPEAKER_00: But at the end of the day, you are a whole person who has value, you have a lot to offer, you have a gift that the world needs.
• 43:35
  SPEAKER_00: So I challenge you and I encourage you to begin taking initiative and finding those ways to get healthier.
• 43:44
  SPEAKER_00: You know, over the last few years, I have learned to manage my depression fairly effectively, I would say.
• 43:50
  SPEAKER_00: I still have occasional days when it gets the best of me, but it doesn't have nearly the grip on my life as it once did.
• 43:58
  SPEAKER_00: So I say that because I want you to be in the same place.
• 44:01
  SPEAKER_00: I want you to have to feel hope and be able to get healthy and be able to manage this in a way where it doesn't totally consume your whole life.
• 44:09
  SPEAKER_00: Life is hard enough as it is.
• 44:11
  SPEAKER_00: And when you add battling depression into the mix, it gets infinitely tougher.
• 44:17
  SPEAKER_00: And if you believe one or more of these lies that I have shared, it will pull you down.
• 44:22
  SPEAKER_00: It can really knock you down to the ground and make it tough to get up.
• 44:26
  SPEAKER_00: And if that's you, if that describes you or someone that you know, I again I want to encourage you to seek professional help.
• 44:33
  SPEAKER_00: Make the choice today to get healthier, not just for yourself, but for the people you love.
• 44:37
  SPEAKER_00: And I would be remiss if if I did not mention this here on this episode, is that if you are thinking about hurting yourself, or if you're thinking about hurting someone else for that matter, but particularly yourself, um I want to give the number for the National Suicide Prevention Lifeline, and that is 1-800-273-8255.
• 45:02
  SPEAKER_00: That's 1-800-273-8255.
• 45:07
  SPEAKER_00: And I share that just in case.
• 45:10
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, there may be someone who's listening to this at some point in the future, maybe years into the future, I don't know, who's just at that point where you're wondering if you should go on.
• 45:19
  SPEAKER_00: And I I want to encourage you to call that number uh or to seek professional help as soon as possible.
• 45:27
  SPEAKER_00: Well, my friend, that brings this episode to a conclusion.
• 45:31
  SPEAKER_00: I know this has been a very different kind of episode, but I am prayerful and I and I am hopeful that this helps you and that this encourages you uh to become healthier.
• 45:41
  SPEAKER_00: And if if you're dealing with depression or a mental health issue, that this maybe gives you a little nudge toward uh at the very least, just talking with somebody about this and more than anything, just getting healthy.
• 45:53
  SPEAKER_00: The most important thing I want you to know is that there is hope.
• 45:57
  SPEAKER_00: You don't need to travel this road alone.
• 45:59
  SPEAKER_00: There are people who love you, who care about you, and who can help you.
• 46:03
  SPEAKER_00: And again, I would start with a doctor, start with the suicide prevention lifeline, or a therapist.
• 46:10
  SPEAKER_00: You have a gift, not just to give to the world, you are a gift to the world.
• 46:16
  SPEAKER_00: Hey, thanks so much for listening to today's episode.
• 46:18
  SPEAKER_00: I appreciate your time.
• 46:19
  SPEAKER_00: I know this has been a little bit longer.
• 46:21
  SPEAKER_00: Thanks for sticking with me uh and listening to my journey, and hopefully this has been helpful to you.
• 46:26
  SPEAKER_00: Thanks, and I'll see you tomorrow.