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SAVANNAH GUTHRIE MOM MISSING: DAY 26 · Crime Stories with Nancy Grace

0:00
Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Grace.
0:07
Speaker 2: Breaking news Savannah Guthrie's mother, Nancy Guthrie missing, day twenty six.
0:13
Speaker 2: This after a flurry of activity at Nancy Guthrie's home,
0:18
Speaker 2: including federal prosecutors one in a blacked out suv that
0:23
Speaker 2: drives into the garage and has never seen what's going
0:26
Speaker 2: on inside of Nancy Guthrie's home just a few hours ago. This,
0:33
Speaker 2: as we learn, DNA found in the home does not
0:39
Speaker 2: match Nancy Guthrie or her friends and family. So whose
0:46
Speaker 2: isn't and what does a digital blackout have to do
0:51
Speaker 2: with catching the kidnapper?
0:53
Speaker 1: I'm Nancy Grace. This is Crime Stories. I want to
0:56
Speaker 1: thank you for being with us.
0:57
Speaker 3: Intruder or intruders came into the snuck into her room,
1:02
Speaker 3: awakened her out of a dead sleep, and took this
1:07
Speaker 3: eighty four year old grandmother out of her own bed, A.
1:11
Speaker 2: Little old lady dragged out of her own bed.
1:17
Speaker 4: Hi there, coming on to say, it is day twenty
1:23
Speaker 4: four since our mom was taken in the dark of
1:28
Speaker 4: night from her bed, and every hour and minute and
1:35
Speaker 4: second and every long night has been agony since then
1:41
Speaker 4: of worrying about her and fearing for her. And aching
1:48
Speaker 4: for her, and most of all just missing her, just
1:52
Speaker 4: missing her.
1:55
Speaker 2: Savannah Guthrie, you can see her deteriorating with missive with
2:01
Speaker 2: every video plea that she issues. That reward is full
2:08
Speaker 2: of implications.
2:10
Speaker 1: For instance, earlier, up.
2:12
Speaker 2: Until that time, the reward had been predicated upon the
2:18
Speaker 2: arrest and or conviction of the kidnapper.
2:22
Speaker 1: Not so anymore.
2:23
Speaker 2: The family begging for information to bring Nancy Guthrie home.
2:28
Speaker 2: This as we learn a DNA sample found in the
2:32
Speaker 2: home is absolutely definitively stranger DNA. Where was it found?
2:40
Speaker 2: When was it found? Can it be isolated and identified?
2:45
Speaker 2: A lot happening straight out to special guests joining us
2:49
Speaker 2: Mary Coleman, she is the thirteen Evening anchor at KOLD.
2:55
Speaker 2: If you will recall that was one of the stations
2:59
Speaker 2: that we got a ransom note. Mary Coleman, thank you
3:03
Speaker 2: for being with us.
3:05
Speaker 1: Mary.
3:05
Speaker 5: What is the latest, well, Nancy talking about the ransom note.
3:11
Speaker 5: A lot of people have questioned why there's been silence.
3:14
Speaker 5: We personally haven't received any notes for a while now,
3:19
Speaker 5: and a lot of people are still questioning the legitimacy
3:22
Speaker 5: of those notes. Law enforcement still hasn't said one way
3:25
Speaker 5: or another, but It was clear when the family started
3:27
Speaker 5: coming out with those videos that they were taking these
3:30
Speaker 5: notes very seriously because of some of the contents of them.
3:34
Speaker 2: There was a flurry of activity at the home yesterday,
3:39
Speaker 2: including federal prosecutors on the scene. You're seeing that video
3:43
Speaker 2: now from our friends at Fox News, Mary Colman, can
3:46
Speaker 2: you confirm those were, in fact federal prosecutors as we
3:51
Speaker 2: assumed last night?
3:53
Speaker 5: Yes, we can, and we have confirmed that biagent's along
3:56
Speaker 5: with the US.
3:57
Speaker 6: Attorney's office, we're out there.
4:00
Speaker 5: People had some questions about that, you know, if there's
4:03
Speaker 5: no one to prosecute yet, why are they out there?
4:05
Speaker 6: And I feel like you might be able to shed
4:06
Speaker 6: some light on that.
4:08
Speaker 2: Guys, take a look at what we saw yesterday. This
4:11
Speaker 2: is from our friends at Fox News to you, Dave
4:14
Speaker 2: Matt Crime Stories investigative reporter. You and I closely combed
4:20
Speaker 2: through the video to determine what we were seeing yesterday. Again,
4:24
Speaker 2: a florry of activity.
4:26
Speaker 1: They were there throughout the day, on and off, on
4:28
Speaker 1: and off. One of them.
4:30
Speaker 2: Shielded from view by taking the black the blackened windowed
4:35
Speaker 2: suv into the garage, closing the door, going in and
4:38
Speaker 2: then coming back out without ever being seen.
4:41
Speaker 1: What did you observe, Dave Matc.
4:43
Speaker 3: You know, Nancy, it was very secretive with that one vehicle. Now,
4:47
Speaker 3: as all the vehicles pulled in, we could see the
4:50
Speaker 3: different investigators getting out. They were dressed differently than what
4:54
Speaker 3: we had seen with deputies and other investigators. We're talking
4:58
Speaker 3: about suit and tie here. Those are your federal prosecutors
5:01
Speaker 3: that were looking over this entire scene. But Nancy, they
5:05
Speaker 3: spent a lot of time they being the investigators on
5:09
Speaker 3: scene yesterday, the federal prosecutors spent a long time at
5:13
Speaker 3: the front door where the blood was found, right there
5:17
Speaker 3: in front of that nest camera location. They spent almost
5:21
Speaker 3: an hour in that one area. Investigators also looked just
5:26
Speaker 3: inside in the foyer. Spent an enormous a large amount
5:29
Speaker 3: of time there. But as you mentioned, we did have
5:32
Speaker 3: multiple vehicles pulling in. They all stayed in order except
5:36
Speaker 3: for one, and that was a blackened out suv you
5:39
Speaker 3: could not see through the windows. It pulls in. They
5:43
Speaker 3: waited in front of the garage door. Garage door opens,
5:46
Speaker 3: the vehicle pulls in, garage door shuts before anybody gets out.
5:51
Speaker 3: We don't know who was in the vehicle. We don't
5:53
Speaker 3: know who got out. It was there for about an
5:56
Speaker 3: hour and then it left the same way it came in.
6:00
Speaker 3: No sign of who was in that vehicle, but it
6:03
Speaker 3: was a very active day on site yesterday.
6:07
Speaker 1: Tammy Ballard joining us on DNA.
6:10
Speaker 2: Tammy, I want you to hear what Mary Coleman has
6:12
Speaker 2: to say about the discovery of DNA in the home.
6:15
Speaker 2: Mary Coleman joining us ko ld Also, Mary, were you
6:20
Speaker 2: there at your station when the first note came in.
6:28
Speaker 5: The mood was still the same when I got in
6:30
Speaker 5: when we saw the first notes, just because of how.
6:34
Speaker 6: Put together the note was.
6:37
Speaker 5: It was pretty alarming once we started to read it
6:41
Speaker 5: a little further and we immediately handed that over to
6:43
Speaker 5: law enforcement.
6:45
Speaker 1: What was so alarming about it.
6:49
Speaker 5: I think how eloquent this person was, Frankly, Nancy. I mean,
6:54
Speaker 5: you would think, you know, some note like this would
6:57
Speaker 5: would be all over the place. It's a and some
7:00
Speaker 5: notes someone's demanding something, so you would think that they'd
7:03
Speaker 5: be in a state of shock or you know, a
7:06
Speaker 5: different state. But this person was clearly in a place
7:10
Speaker 5: where they were able to get their thoughts across. It
7:13
Speaker 5: was clear, concise, and I think that was what was
7:17
Speaker 5: most alarming to us.
7:18
Speaker 1: Is that.
7:18
Speaker 5: That's when we said, Okay, this this might be real,
7:21
Speaker 5: This might not be a hoax.
7:22
Speaker 1: What about it made you think it was real? Mary?
7:27
Speaker 5: There were some details in there that only a person
7:32
Speaker 5: who perhaps was with Nancy would know, and I think
7:37
Speaker 5: you know, law enforcement finally alluded to some of those
7:39
Speaker 5: details a little bit later on a watch and some
7:42
Speaker 5: of the things that may have been in her room.
7:44
Speaker 5: And so seeing those and hearing about that was just
7:50
Speaker 5: it was a lot for us to see and again
7:52
Speaker 5: immediately sent it over to law enforcement, who also immediately
7:54
Speaker 5: got back to us and asked for some more details
7:56
Speaker 5: so that they could try and track down who it was.
7:59
Speaker 5: And as we also mentioned again earlier, it's gone pretty
8:04
Speaker 5: silent from whoever this person or people is as far
8:07
Speaker 5: as notes coming into our newsroom.
8:11
Speaker 2: Mary, did that note that you observed with Kold did
8:16
Speaker 2: it offer proof of life other than the details about
8:20
Speaker 2: the inside of her room?
8:23
Speaker 6: It did not. Nancy.
8:25
Speaker 5: We actually received two notes. The first one I would
8:28
Speaker 5: call a ransom note, the second I wouldn't. There were
8:31
Speaker 5: no demands there, but there was no proof of life
8:34
Speaker 5: in either of those notes that we received.
8:37
Speaker 2: The first one was a ransom the second one they
8:40
Speaker 2: did not ask for a ransom, what do they want?
8:44
Speaker 5: It was more of a declaration, And unfortunately, I still
8:47
Speaker 5: can't talk too much about the contents of these notes
8:49
Speaker 5: because once again we still don't know the legitimacy of them.
8:53
Speaker 5: In law enforcement is still looking into that. But there
8:56
Speaker 5: were no requests in this note. It was more of
8:59
Speaker 5: a declar and I think the tone of the videos
9:02
Speaker 5: that the family released after kind of indicated what may
9:07
Speaker 5: have been in that note and how they were feeling
9:09
Speaker 5: about if these were.
9:11
Speaker 2: Legitimate exactly, Mary, I understand because the desperation exhibited in
9:18
Speaker 2: each progressive video from Savannah and her siblings tells me
9:24
Speaker 2: that they got more and more concerned, likely because of
9:27
Speaker 2: these notes.
9:27
Speaker 1: So you're not telling.
9:29
Speaker 2: Me this, but I am interpreting that the second note,
9:33
Speaker 2: while it did not demand a ransom or an increase
9:36
Speaker 2: in ransom, it emphasized the seriousness of the first note,
9:42
Speaker 2: and of course.
9:43
Speaker 1: You guys immediately handed that over.
9:45
Speaker 2: Guys Again, Mary Coleman joining us from KOLD, we've heard
9:50
Speaker 2: a lot about the missive sent to TMZ.
9:53
Speaker 1: There was also a missive sent.
9:54
Speaker 2: To kg U N two sent to KOLD, and the
10:01
Speaker 2: nature of the notes and the recipients indicated to me
10:05
Speaker 2: on day one that this was someone in the Tucson
10:08
Speaker 2: area that maybe grew up hearing or watching Kold.
10:14
Speaker 1: Was very familiar with it.
10:16
Speaker 2: That said, when you read the notes, Mary Coleman, and
10:21
Speaker 2: I'm not asking you to divulge their contents, I know
10:24
Speaker 2: you won't do that.
10:26
Speaker 1: Did you believe they were real? And were you afraid
10:29
Speaker 1: for missus Guthrie?
10:33
Speaker 5: Sure, yeah, I mean the first one, it took us
10:35
Speaker 5: a second once we started reading a little bit further,
10:38
Speaker 5: and that's when we felt like these were legitimate claims
10:42
Speaker 5: being made. And so by the time the second one
10:44
Speaker 5: came in, we were all very alarmed by it. And
10:48
Speaker 5: I will say that, yes, absolutely, our stomach dropped and
10:54
Speaker 5: our guts were not feeling great. We were scared and
10:58
Speaker 5: still are scared for or what happened to Nancy. And
11:02
Speaker 5: at the end of the day, of the goal is
11:03
Speaker 5: getting her back, and that's you know what everyone wants
11:06
Speaker 5: right now.
11:08
Speaker 2: I know you will not divulge details. But in the notes,
11:12
Speaker 2: did the perp well the person writing the notes threatened
11:17
Speaker 2: specific harm to Nancy.
11:23
Speaker 5: See in the first note there was an allusion to
11:26
Speaker 5: something that may happen if a price wasn't paid. In
11:29
Speaker 5: the second note, there was none of that.
11:32
Speaker 2: So the first note was more threatening than the second note.
11:35
Speaker 2: The second note was more.
11:37
Speaker 1: Hey, I really meant it when I said that first note.
11:40
Speaker 6: Sure that be accurate, supporting the first correct.
11:44
Speaker 2: Got it and then interestingly a lot of the missives
11:48
Speaker 2: went dead. And this is unlike any other ransom scenario
11:54
Speaker 2: I've ever seen. I've still got to get back to
11:56
Speaker 2: the DNA. That's what I want to talk about tonight.
12:00
Speaker 2: And they found at the scene. But Brayfzgibbons is joining
12:03
Speaker 2: US Director Operations usp A nationwide security.
12:07
Speaker 1: He actually leads a team.
12:09
Speaker 2: Of missing persons investigators that traveled the world extracting them
12:13
Speaker 2: and finding them at uspasecurity dot Com. Also from a
12:18
Speaker 2: marine also Iraqi war Vet. Needless to say, he's seen
12:22
Speaker 2: it all. Typically in a ransom, which is why a
12:25
Speaker 2: lot of people were curious about the timing of these notes.
12:31
Speaker 2: The person is kidnapped and you immediately get a ransom.
12:34
Speaker 2: They don't just hold on to an eighty four year
12:36
Speaker 2: old woman from multiple days and then go oh, yeah, hey,
12:39
Speaker 2: I meant to send this the other day, but now
12:40
Speaker 2: here it is. That was very unusual because the point
12:45
Speaker 2: of the kidnap is to get the money, and they
12:49
Speaker 2: waited for was it seventy two hours or more before
12:53
Speaker 2: the first ransom note.
12:55
Speaker 1: I find it hard to believe, Brian. You have to
12:58
Speaker 1: analyze this like.
12:58
Speaker 2: It's Rubik's cub until you put it all together, constantly
13:02
Speaker 2: changing your theory. I wonder if they hadn't decided yet
13:09
Speaker 2: to whom they would send the ransom because they originally
13:13
Speaker 2: sent it right to three places TMZ Kold and believe.
13:20
Speaker 1: kgU n.
13:22
Speaker 2: Did they not have it together because they had certainly
13:25
Speaker 2: been at her home before, they had taken time to
13:27
Speaker 2: stake it out. But what they didn't have their ransom
13:29
Speaker 2: idea together? What do you make of the delay?
13:32
Speaker 1: And they never, to our knowledge, have sent.
13:36
Speaker 2: Visual proof of life like a video or a picture
13:39
Speaker 2: of Nancy Guthrie. They did, however, according to Mary Coleman,
13:43
Speaker 2: Kold give details from the inside of her room. Now,
13:49
Speaker 2: some of the details were already out there, like her
13:52
Speaker 2: smart watch, like the floodlight. But I'm inferring that there
13:57
Speaker 2: were more details in that ransom note that other people
14:01
Speaker 2: couldn't glean by just hopping on the internet.
14:05
Speaker 7: Absolutely, in these ransom notes that were sent to the
14:08
Speaker 7: media outlets don't meet any of the traditional hallmarks of
14:13
Speaker 7: a kidnap and ransom case. That's something that's been highlighted
14:17
Speaker 7: very early on, right reaching out to the media versus
14:21
Speaker 7: directly to the family, not having a clear and distinct
14:26
Speaker 7: path for payment, and terms, not providing proof of life.
14:33
Speaker 7: You know, these are things that a typical kidnap and
14:37
Speaker 7: ransom case, the ransomer will want to be in direct
14:40
Speaker 7: contact with the family to make this deal as quickly
14:43
Speaker 7: as possible, and that didn't happen here. So it really
14:47
Speaker 7: lends credence to the idea that these were opportunists and
14:53
Speaker 7: not authentic.
14:54
Speaker 1: To doctor Bethany Marshall joining a psychoalyst out of the
14:58
Speaker 1: LA jurisdiction. She's the author of deal Breakers.
15:01
Speaker 2: You can see her now on peacock and find her
15:04
Speaker 2: a doctor Bethanymarshall dot com. We pointed out that we
15:09
Speaker 2: now know Nancy Guthrie did not go to the door
15:13
Speaker 2: and allow the purp in, and there's been a lot
15:16
Speaker 2: of speculation around does that mean she knew the purp?
15:19
Speaker 1: Did she recognize his face or his voice? That said
15:23
Speaker 1: that didn't happen. She was dragged from her bed.
15:26
Speaker 2: So an elderly grandma woken up at that time of night,
15:33
Speaker 2: what reaction would she have had?
15:37
Speaker 8: Well, Nancy, we have to take several factors into account.
15:40
Speaker 8: Does she wear hearing aids? Were they out? How does
15:43
Speaker 8: that affect how she experienced the attack. Was she clothed
15:47
Speaker 8: or unclothed? Did she wear a seatpot machine? Does she
15:51
Speaker 8: have oxygen? So we have to think about all of that, Nancy.
15:54
Speaker 8: When somebody is attacked in the middle of the night,
15:56
Speaker 8: when they're asleep, especially an elderly person, the first response
16:01
Speaker 8: is shock, a shock to the system like fight or flight.
16:05
Speaker 8: The next step is disorientation.
16:08
Speaker 6: Who am I?
16:09
Speaker 8: Where am I? What is happening? There's no ability to
16:13
Speaker 8: orient oneself to the environment. The third step is denial.
16:20
Speaker 8: This is not really happening to me. This couldn't be
16:23
Speaker 8: happening to me. The person dissociates from the reality and
16:28
Speaker 8: then confusion sets in and the final stage, Nancy, is
16:32
Speaker 8: extreme pain. You know, as seniors, your mother lives with you.
16:36
Speaker 8: You just touch their skin and it peels back. The
16:41
Speaker 8: skin of seniors is very, very fragile, So if they
16:46
Speaker 8: are dragging her through the house, there's going to be
16:49
Speaker 8: extreme pain and extreme harm to the body. And the
16:53
Speaker 8: final thing, Nancy, is the first forty five minutes of
16:57
Speaker 8: a kidnap or abduction is the most dangerous time. So
17:02
Speaker 8: we have to think about what were these purps or
17:05
Speaker 8: the purp actually doing to her out of their own panic,
17:10
Speaker 8: their own ruthlessness to subdue her, And how did that
17:14
Speaker 8: lead to blood on the doorstep and then the blood
17:18
Speaker 8: the blood trails stopping as they potentially carried her to
17:22
Speaker 8: a vehicle. Was she dead or alive at that point?
17:25
Speaker 8: Was she conscious or unconscious? What was she thinking? But
17:28
Speaker 8: certainly at that point confusion, shock and disbelief.
17:34
Speaker 2: Straight back to Mary Colman joining us kold Crime Files.
17:40
Speaker 2: Is it Crime Files Investigator files? F I L E
17:46
Speaker 2: s Okay, I'm sorry. I thought that must have been
17:48
Speaker 2: a type I'm sorry, Crime Files Investigator, Mary Coleman. We
17:53
Speaker 2: now know that DNA in Nancy Guthrie's home is stranger DNA,
18:00
Speaker 2: but yet we are also hearing that there are problems
18:04
Speaker 2: because it's mixed DNA.
18:07
Speaker 6: What do you know, Yeah, we're hearing the same thing, Nancy.
18:11
Speaker 5: We've been told that it's going to take a longer
18:14
Speaker 5: amount of time, even up to a year, to get
18:17
Speaker 5: some of this back to let us know whether this
18:20
Speaker 5: person is in a system, or whether they have a
18:22
Speaker 5: relative who we can trace this to, or anything of
18:24
Speaker 5: that nature, which is obviously concerning time is of the
18:27
Speaker 5: essence right now. We've seen this technology used in so
18:29
Speaker 5: many other cases, and so to hear that it's mixed
18:33
Speaker 5: and that it might not be as reliable as some
18:35
Speaker 5: of the other DNA that we've seen in previous cases
18:38
Speaker 5: is alarming for the community and especially for the family.
18:41
Speaker 6: As you can imagine, they just want answers here.
18:45
Speaker 2: Who is it that is saying that it's a problem
18:48
Speaker 2: because the DNA is mixed.
18:50
Speaker 1: Did Nanos say.
18:51
Speaker 6: That this is coming from the Sheriff's Department.
18:54
Speaker 5: I don't know if he specifically said that, but we
18:56
Speaker 5: received that in a press release that they had released.
19:00
Speaker 2: I don't understand why they had to blurt that out,
19:05
Speaker 2: that said straight out to Timmy Balarie joining us. Tammy's
19:10
Speaker 2: a crime scene investigation investigator reconstruction as former DNA criminalists
19:14
Speaker 2: for the San Diego Police Department Crime Lab, Tammy Ballard.
19:18
Speaker 2: In this day and age, mixed DNA is to be
19:24
Speaker 2: expected and is actually routine.
19:29
Speaker 1: Explain exactly how.
19:31
Speaker 2: Well First of all, what is mixed DNA deoxur rivat
19:35
Speaker 2: and claic acid and how exactly mechanically is it evaluated
19:41
Speaker 2: and analyzed?
19:42
Speaker 1: How do you do it? How do you handle mixed DNA?
19:47
Speaker 9: Mixtures of DNA are going to make law enforcement and
19:51
Speaker 9: attorneys very nervous. So in the DNA world, mixtures are everywhere.
19:58
Speaker 9: As technology advanced, the sensitivity increases, you're going to find
20:03
Speaker 9: mixtures in almost everything. Even bloodstains that used to be
20:08
Speaker 9: single source, you might get that one percent contributor that's
20:12
Speaker 9: going to make it a mixture. So that being said,
20:16
Speaker 9: in this case, we know Nancy's profile, we know her
20:20
Speaker 9: family's profiles, so there's a lot to work with and
20:24
Speaker 9: basically remove from those mixtures. Do I think it's going
20:29
Speaker 9: to take a year?
20:31
Speaker 1: Not at all.
20:32
Speaker 9: I think that's the law enforcement translation because it's probably
20:38
Speaker 9: lack of understanding. So what they've got is probably good
20:42
Speaker 9: mixtures that they have to deal with, and they're going
20:44
Speaker 9: to put those out, But it is not going to
20:47
Speaker 9: take a year in my opinion.
20:55
Speaker 2: Crime stores with Nancy Gray.
21:01
Speaker 1: You know Timmy Ballard.
21:03
Speaker 2: Little known fact DNA has been used for decades. It's
21:08
Speaker 2: been used on the battlefield to identify victims our military,
21:18
Speaker 2: and it has advanced, advanced advance. I tried a lot
21:22
Speaker 2: of cases before it was accepted in court, and a
21:25
Speaker 2: lot of cases after it was accepted in court, and
21:28
Speaker 2: it makes all the difference. When I heard Nano's blurt
21:33
Speaker 2: out again, it could take a year, that's not true.
21:39
Speaker 2: Anyone that has worked with DNA knows that is not true. Now,
21:44
Speaker 2: what can take some time, and please Tammy jump in.
21:48
Speaker 2: What can take some time is when you're trying to
21:50
Speaker 2: build out a family tree with genetic genealogy.
21:53
Speaker 1: That can take some time. It can take weeks, it
21:56
Speaker 1: can take a month. It does not take a year.
22:00
Speaker 2: And I'll point to one of the first times it
22:02
Speaker 2: was you successful in our country, and.
22:04
Speaker 1: That is the Golden State Killer.
22:05
Speaker 2: I always use him as the poster boy for genetic
22:07
Speaker 2: genealogy because it was one of the first right that
22:11
Speaker 2: didn't take a year, and it had never been admitted
22:14
Speaker 2: in court before.
22:15
Speaker 1: So you said a couple of things. I want to
22:17
Speaker 1: follow up on.
22:18
Speaker 2: Number one, you said there could be a mixture of
22:21
Speaker 2: one percent.
22:22
Speaker 1: What did you mean by one percent? One percent?
22:25
Speaker 9: What when I testify in court as I just did
22:29
Speaker 9: last week, I inform a jury that the sensitivity is
22:35
Speaker 9: so advanced at this point, and the technology is so
22:39
Speaker 9: advanced that when historically, if you would swab a blood
22:43
Speaker 9: stain off of a surface, you're going to get a
22:46
Speaker 9: single source profiled one person your bleeder. Now, because that
22:51
Speaker 9: sensitivity has increased, I take a swab, I swab that
22:55
Speaker 9: blood stain, and I'm very likely collecting cells from underneath
22:59
Speaker 9: that blood stain, and those cells are showing up in
23:03
Speaker 9: my and creating a mixture of DNA. So what everyone
23:08
Speaker 9: needs to realize is that there are mixtures, but the
23:12
Speaker 9: technology is advancing so much that we're able to deal
23:16
Speaker 9: with those mixtures so much better. Now there are limitations.
23:20
Speaker 9: So genealogy is coming along very rapidly, but that type
23:26
Speaker 9: of testing, that SNIP testing, not the traditional STR testing,
23:31
Speaker 9: has the limitations that you may not be able to
23:36
Speaker 9: work with something that is a three person mixture. Now, again,
23:40
Speaker 9: we have Nancy's profile, So if we take Nancy out
23:45
Speaker 9: of any mixture, now maybe we're dealing with a two
23:48
Speaker 9: person mixture and that might be something that we can
23:51
Speaker 9: use for genealogy. But with traditional str testing, we're up
23:55
Speaker 9: to evaluating five person mixtures, so that it is definitely
24:01
Speaker 9: something that we can work with and it does not
24:04
Speaker 9: take a year.
24:06
Speaker 2: Tammy, you said one percent, and when you were originally
24:12
Speaker 2: explaining dn R mix DNA mixed DNA, and I took
24:17
Speaker 2: that to mean the mixture could be one percent Nancy
24:21
Speaker 2: and ninety nine percent the stranger. Can you actually tell
24:28
Speaker 2: a jury we had a mixture of DNA. Let's just
24:31
Speaker 2: pretend we're talking about a rate case. We had a
24:33
Speaker 2: mixture of DNA, and fifty percent of the DNA that
24:36
Speaker 2: we obtained off the victim's body was the victims DNA.
24:40
Speaker 2: Fifty percent was the defendants DNA. You can actually I
24:44
Speaker 2: sew it down to a percentage.
24:47
Speaker 9: Yes, with the current computer technology, the software that is developed,
24:52
Speaker 9: you can actually estimate. Now it's an estimate, so you
24:56
Speaker 9: can estimate the percent of CONSTRA from each person in
25:01
Speaker 9: that mixture. So when I report the data and I say, okay,
25:07
Speaker 9: I have a three person mixture, ninety two percent of
25:11
Speaker 9: that is estimated to come from one contributor and eight
25:14
Speaker 9: percent of that is estimated to come from another contributor.
25:18
Speaker 9: I say those values because I was able to get
25:21
Speaker 9: an eight percent contributor up to a code of search.
25:24
Speaker 9: So we are moving so far forward with the technology
25:29
Speaker 9: that it's just better and better. So as long as
25:33
Speaker 9: the laboratories that they're sending them to are utilizing this technology,
25:38
Speaker 9: which they are, this is not going to take a year.
25:41
Speaker 3: The videos from the front porch are not timestamped. We
25:46
Speaker 3: don't know the daytime or anything. We only know what
25:49
Speaker 3: we're watching in front of us. There. They're having to
25:52
Speaker 3: pull back the video layer by layer.
25:55
Speaker 2: Multiple law enforcement sources have confirmed those videos or absolutely
26:02
Speaker 2: two different days. I don't know why, Nanos He'll say
26:06
Speaker 2: everything else, but he won't confirm that. That said, in
26:10
Speaker 2: addition to DNA in the home absolutely belonging to a
26:15
Speaker 2: stranger now being analyzed. Tammy ballard with us with any
26:21
Speaker 2: question you have regarding DNA.
26:23
Speaker 1: She can answer it that.
26:25
Speaker 2: As we learn, an elite FBI video team a video
26:29
Speaker 2: unit is forensic Audio, video and Image analysis unit is
26:38
Speaker 2: back on the scene, has been back on the scene
26:41
Speaker 2: as we.
26:41
Speaker 1: Go to air tonight.
26:42
Speaker 2: Scott Iiker is joining us guys, founding member at the
26:47
Speaker 2: FBI of the Cellular Analysis Survey Team, Homicide Detective Norfolk, Virginia,
26:52
Speaker 2: twelve years now a precision cellular analysis Scott Aker, thank
26:58
Speaker 2: you for being with us.
26:59
Speaker 1: What does it mean when the FBI is.
27:02
Speaker 2: Sending in an elite videography team and audio team. We
27:06
Speaker 2: saw this happen in coburger.
27:11
Speaker 10: It's very helpful to have people that are experts in
27:14
Speaker 10: those each individual fields. As you know, I'm an expert
27:17
Speaker 10: in this cellular stuff and networks, but we have people
27:21
Speaker 10: that are experts in the video. I'm sure that they've
27:25
Speaker 10: already been involved in this case and been looking at
27:28
Speaker 10: the film clips that we got from the doorbell camera,
27:32
Speaker 10: but there might be other things that they're now at
27:34
Speaker 10: the house or examining other doorbell camera from the neighborhood.
27:41
Speaker 10: So it's great that they could be further involved and
27:46
Speaker 10: use their expertise in pulling data.
27:48
Speaker 2: I'm very curious about what it is that they're video
27:52
Speaker 2: and guys. Here you see an aerial view video of
27:58
Speaker 2: what went down within the last two four hours at
28:00
Speaker 2: Nancy Guthrie's home.
28:02
Speaker 1: They walked every inch of.
28:05
Speaker 2: The outside, so that gives you an idea of what
28:09
Speaker 2: they did on the inside. A federal prosecutor, at least one,
28:15
Speaker 2: was with them. This is around friend at friends at
28:18
Speaker 2: Fox News. Look at them. They are stopping and looking
28:21
Speaker 2: at everything of interest everything. Now, as you recall, in
28:28
Speaker 2: the last days, a tent was erected around the front
28:33
Speaker 2: of Nancy Guthrie's home. Many believe that was there in
28:39
Speaker 2: order to get partial darkness. To perform certain tests that
28:46
Speaker 2: require partial darkness, such as aluminol, you really need full
28:53
Speaker 2: darkness for that. But there are next generations that grew
29:00
Speaker 2: on that technology that don't need full darkness.
29:06
Speaker 1: We believe the FBI had ordered that as well.
29:10
Speaker 2: To you, Scott Iiker, when you see a federal prosecutor
29:14
Speaker 2: with the FBI at the scene, coming over it with
29:19
Speaker 2: a fine tooth comb.
29:21
Speaker 1: What does that tell you?
29:22
Speaker 2: There they have brought a videographer an audio person.
29:27
Speaker 10: Why, well, there's nothing better than your personal view of
29:33
Speaker 10: a scene, right. I mean, you can look at pictures.
29:35
Speaker 10: We've all looked at pictures of homicide scenes, but you
29:38
Speaker 10: don't get the full aspect of what the sizes, where
29:42
Speaker 10: everything is placed, how the house looks, how is it accessible.
29:46
Speaker 10: And you can see that these prosecutors need to go
29:49
Speaker 10: to the residence and just like sometimes we try to
29:52
Speaker 10: take juries to the place of a crime scene so
29:56
Speaker 10: they can visually in person see what's going on and
29:59
Speaker 10: how things are laid out pictures don't always do a justice.
30:02
Speaker 10: So getting them out there, having them first hand, see
30:05
Speaker 10: the whole property, the four year, the inside of the house,
30:09
Speaker 10: the pool, the fencing, all that would really help the
30:13
Speaker 10: prosecutors in understanding the case and be able to prosecute
30:16
Speaker 10: it correctly.
30:18
Speaker 2: And not only that, looking for clues, looking for evidence. Guys,
30:23
Speaker 2: this is from our friends at Fox News back to you,
30:27
Speaker 2: Dave Matt. Recall when the Coburger House was torn down,
30:34
Speaker 2: the home there on King Road where four beautiful University
30:39
Speaker 2: Idahos students were slaughtered.
30:42
Speaker 1: Medi legal eagles like myself thought that.
30:45
Speaker 2: Was a major, major fauxpauh, a major error in tactics.
30:53
Speaker 1: What if a jury had wanted.
30:55
Speaker 2: To visit it or needed to visit it. We also
31:00
Speaker 2: see three dimensional crime scene reconstructions built. They could have
31:09
Speaker 2: been there doing that because once this home is released
31:13
Speaker 2: back to the family, it is of no evidentiary value
31:18
Speaker 2: at all. Even if something were found a week from now,
31:24
Speaker 2: the chain of custody is ruined and it likely will
31:28
Speaker 2: not come into evidence. Remember when the Coburger crime scene
31:32
Speaker 2: was destroyed.
31:33
Speaker 3: It still amazes me that they did that to the
31:37
Speaker 3: crime scene with Coburger. There have been other cases where
31:41
Speaker 3: crime scenes were kept intact for ten years. I think
31:45
Speaker 3: of the Jeffrey McDonald case where that crime scene was
31:50
Speaker 3: exactly as it was for nine years till they had
31:53
Speaker 3: the trial and they took the jury to go and
31:54
Speaker 3: look over the crime scene. In this case, we're talking
31:57
Speaker 3: about this elite FBI in it that comes out using
32:01
Speaker 3: top of the line professional audio and video equipment so
32:06
Speaker 3: that they can go over every part of this inside
32:09
Speaker 3: and out, and they can make measurements. They got digital
32:13
Speaker 3: measurements of everything so they can try to get the
32:16
Speaker 3: height of the suspect, which is what they did. But
32:18
Speaker 3: also investigators are going to be taking photos and building
32:23
Speaker 3: videos that can be viewed probably three D so that
32:28
Speaker 3: the trial or jurors in the future will have a
32:31
Speaker 3: look at it. But right now, Nancy, they've still got
32:33
Speaker 3: to find who did this. So it boggles my mind
32:38
Speaker 3: that they would return the home back to the family
32:40
Speaker 3: right now. There's no need to. Nobody else lives there,
32:44
Speaker 3: nobody in the family lives there, there's no reason to
32:48
Speaker 3: turn the house back over.
32:49
Speaker 2: Yet, you know, those measurements that you mentioned can be
32:52
Speaker 2: so important to Brianitz Gibbons, USPA Nationwide Security. I recall
32:58
Speaker 2: a murder case I prosecute that had been set up
33:02
Speaker 2: to look like a suicide, and when I got to
33:05
Speaker 2: the scene, I nearly did a backflip because there were
33:10
Speaker 2: three guys walking around in the bedroom where the murder occurred,
33:16
Speaker 2: believed to.
33:16
Speaker 1: Have been a suicide.
33:18
Speaker 2: I'm like, who are you and why are you tramping
33:20
Speaker 2: around in here? Well, lucky for me, they're from the
33:24
Speaker 2: medical Examiner's office and they were taking measurements.
33:28
Speaker 1: One was down on all fours.
33:29
Speaker 2: I remember it was carpeted in the bedroom where she
33:33
Speaker 2: was killed, and they were taking measurements from the casing
33:41
Speaker 2: that blows out when you take a shot, and they
33:46
Speaker 2: were analyzing the distance from the bed. Now, the theory
33:50
Speaker 2: was the woman committed suicide.
33:53
Speaker 1: But there were no cases. There was no evidence on
33:56
Speaker 1: the bed where she was lying practically in the middle
33:59
Speaker 1: of the bed.
34:00
Speaker 2: They're found on the floor and they were measuring it,
34:04
Speaker 2: and that helped me prove, along with blood spatter found
34:07
Speaker 2: under her pillow, that she did not commit suicide based
34:12
Speaker 2: on where they were found. So the victim can't speak
34:18
Speaker 2: for themselves. You have to speak for them, and that
34:22
Speaker 2: can include very sophisticated DNA evidence like Tammy Ballard is
34:25
Speaker 2: telling us about, very intricate facts like Mary Coleman is
34:31
Speaker 2: telling us about, and measurements, measurements that I guarantee you
34:35
Speaker 2: they were taking inside that home, and they better take
34:39
Speaker 2: it before.
34:39
Speaker 1: They release that home. I agree with Dave mac I
34:41
Speaker 1: don't think they should release that home. Why release it?
34:46
Speaker 7: Yeah, the length of the hold on this scene. You know,
34:49
Speaker 7: certainly at the beginning of the case, when it was
34:51
Speaker 7: originally released, was perplexing, right, and then when you saw
34:55
Speaker 7: the FBI get involved, it's made a lot more. Since
34:58
Speaker 7: they've had the scene locked down, You've had investigators in
35:02
Speaker 7: and out, and now when we see prosecutors there, that
35:05
Speaker 7: tells me a couple of things. First off, that these
35:09
Speaker 7: prosecutors our new sets of eyes, and it could indicate
35:14
Speaker 7: that they are preparing an affidavit for a rest. So
35:18
Speaker 7: on the good side is hey, this could be part
35:21
Speaker 7: of a good process that we don't know about. There's
35:24
Speaker 7: more information there that we don't know about, or it
35:27
Speaker 7: is that they are indeed preparing to release the scene
35:30
Speaker 7: and that the FBI has done what they've needed to
35:32
Speaker 7: do with it and they want to make sure that
35:34
Speaker 7: those prosecutors get eyes on in person view of that
35:39
Speaker 7: crime scene.
35:40
Speaker 2: You're so right, Fitz Gibbons. Remember the Parkland school massacre.
35:46
Speaker 2: That school stay closed for seven years after.
35:51
Speaker 6: Prime scene investigation is both an art and a science.
35:55
Speaker 3: I have been critical of the sheriff in this case
35:58
Speaker 3: from day one. This sheriff is not a trained.
36:00
Speaker 6: Public information officer. She's not familiar with my media.
36:04
Speaker 7: Relations, and he just shouldn't be spouting out and blaming
36:08
Speaker 7: the media for overreacting and so forth.
36:13
Speaker 4: Hope against hope, as my sister says, we are blowing
36:16
Speaker 4: on the embers of hope.
36:22
Speaker 1: We also know that.
36:26
Speaker 6: She may be lost.
36:27
Speaker 4: She may already be gone. She may have already gone
36:32
Speaker 4: home to the Lord that she loves and is dancing
36:35
Speaker 4: in heaven with her mom and her dad and with
36:40
Speaker 4: her beloved brother appears and with our daddy. And if
36:47
Speaker 4: this is what is to be, then we will accept it.
36:55
Speaker 4: But we need to know where she is. We need
36:58
Speaker 4: her to come home.
37:01
Speaker 2: One point two plus million dollars reward, Doctor Bethony Marshall,
37:07
Speaker 2: How can we break the bond of loyalty amongst the
37:14
Speaker 2: kidnappers or amongst that small orbit of the kidnapper, the girlfriend,
37:19
Speaker 2: the wife, the neighbor, the co conspirator, the friend.
37:23
Speaker 1: How can we break that bond? Will one point two
37:27
Speaker 1: million dollars do it? It should?
37:29
Speaker 8: It could, Nancy, there's a very specific strategy to the
37:33
Speaker 8: offering of a larger reward as the case progresses. You know, Nancy,
37:37
Speaker 8: if you offer a million dollar reward at the beginning,
37:40
Speaker 8: the purp could panic and kill the victim. So you
37:45
Speaker 8: do not want to do that. And also you get
37:47
Speaker 8: all these false leads, you know, flooding in. But offering
37:51
Speaker 8: a one or one point two million dollar reward right now,
37:55
Speaker 8: they the Guthrie family is not appealing to morality. Remember
38:00
Speaker 8: Savannah said, you know, we believe in the goodness of
38:03
Speaker 8: human nature. They're appealing to the intrinsic motivation of turning
38:08
Speaker 8: in the perpetrator. Now they are appealing to the extrinsic motivation,
38:14
Speaker 8: meaning money, Nancy, money, big money that could change the
38:19
Speaker 8: rest of a person's life. That reduces loyalty. And you
38:22
Speaker 8: know what, Nancy, that much money causes people to think.
38:27
Speaker 8: It's like when powerball or the lottery starts to go
38:32
Speaker 8: way up.
38:32
Speaker 6: Somebody who might not have.
38:34
Speaker 8: Bought a lottery ticket before is going to think about
38:37
Speaker 8: stopping into the local seven eleven and buying a lottery ticket.
38:40
Speaker 8: Somebody who sees a one point two million dollar reward
38:43
Speaker 8: is going to start to think, Hmm, who do I
38:46
Speaker 8: know that was out in the middle of the night
38:48
Speaker 8: at that night, or that boyfriend I dated, but I
38:51
Speaker 8: don't really like him so much now, you know what,
38:53
Speaker 8: I like the thought of a one point two million
38:55
Speaker 8: reward a lot more. So, They're not playing on you know,
38:59
Speaker 8: people's anymore. They're playing on greed.
39:04
Speaker 2: Much has been made on the cell phone data the
39:08
Speaker 2: dump that was created by the FBI Cellular Analysis Survey Team. Recall,
39:14
Speaker 2: there has already been one detainment, a catch and release
39:18
Speaker 2: of a guy that performed deliveries worked in the area
39:23
Speaker 2: neighbors were rated their phones very well may have been
39:27
Speaker 2: active around the time that Nancy Guthrie was kidnapped.
39:31
Speaker 1: But it's not just what we.
39:34
Speaker 2: Are seeing on her street or around her home the
39:37
Speaker 2: night Nancy was kidnapped.
39:39
Speaker 1: It's what we are not seeing. Go with me. It's
39:44
Speaker 1: called a digital blackout.
39:47
Speaker 2: And as I would try to tell the jury things
39:51
Speaker 2: I found it was easier to explain the law or
39:53
Speaker 2: facts with examples. Remember Coburger, that cold blooded kill. He
40:01
Speaker 2: thought this one night of all knights, to turn off
40:06
Speaker 2: his cell phone when he approached the murder scene on
40:10
Speaker 2: King Rhad where he robbed four beautiful young Ida host
40:14
Speaker 2: students of their lives and destroyed the lives of their
40:20
Speaker 2: families forever.
40:23
Speaker 1: He turned off his cell phone. Then he thought to
40:25
Speaker 1: turn it.
40:25
Speaker 2: Back on after the murders when he immediately called his mommy.
40:33
Speaker 2: We also see it in the Suzanne Morphew case. According
40:37
Speaker 2: to prosecutors, not proven yet, Barry Morphew murdered his wife
40:42
Speaker 2: Suzanne and had turned off his cell phone at very
40:48
Speaker 2: critical moments around the time of her disappearance.
40:53
Speaker 1: A digital blackout? What is it? How do you find it?
40:58
Speaker 2: Straight out to Scott Iiker, a founding member of the
41:01
Speaker 2: FBI Cellular Analysis Survey Team Nor Virginia Homicide twelve years
41:06
Speaker 2: now at Precision Cellularanalysis dot com. Scott, here's my question
41:11
Speaker 2: about digital blackouts. Number one, what is a digital blackout?
41:15
Speaker 2: And number two, I'm very curious could cast Cellular Analysis
41:20
Speaker 2: Survey team pick up on their data up from multiple
41:25
Speaker 2: towers a cell phone approaching and then cutting their cell
41:32
Speaker 2: phone off and then cutting it back on.
41:36
Speaker 1: I mean, how does this whole thing work? Okay, start
41:38
Speaker 1: with the definition.
41:40
Speaker 10: So a digital blackout is when the suspects basically try
41:45
Speaker 10: to turn off all their electronic devices so their phones
41:50
Speaker 10: cannot be tracked to the crime scene. Well, that might
41:53
Speaker 10: be a good idea for the day and time of
41:56
Speaker 10: the crime if they're that savvy. Most criminals are not.
42:00
Speaker 10: But I've worked numerous cases along with the Coburger and
42:03
Speaker 10: Brian Murphy cases where they've used, you know, tried to
42:07
Speaker 10: turn off their phones or digital devices at the time
42:11
Speaker 10: of the crime, but they're not smart enough to turn
42:14
Speaker 10: it off when they go case the crime a day,
42:17
Speaker 10: a week, whatever before the crime. So that's one of
42:21
Speaker 10: the things that the cash unit will be doing is
42:24
Speaker 10: looking at which phones are you know, in that area
42:29
Speaker 10: a week before, a month before, maybe some of the
42:32
Speaker 10: dates we've already talked about with the videos, and which
42:36
Speaker 10: ones are not there at the time of the crime
42:39
Speaker 10: because they might have turned off their phones. So in
42:43
Speaker 10: those type cases, what the kind of bookends Like Coburger,
42:48
Speaker 10: it's something you can show the jury he's there ten
42:51
Speaker 10: times in the area of King Road in the middle
42:54
Speaker 10: of the night, but on the night of the crime.
42:57
Speaker 10: He turns off his phone, turns off his wife, turns
43:01
Speaker 10: off his bluetooth when he leaves his house, and then
43:05
Speaker 10: turns it back on on the way back home after
43:08
Speaker 10: killing the four individuals. Sometimes that's just as telling to
43:13
Speaker 10: the jury as the phone being in the area.
43:24
Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Grace.
43:30
Speaker 2: Scott Ker, I need to understand the mechanics of how
43:34
Speaker 2: CAST identifies a cell phone or you connect in a
43:40
Speaker 2: car or a smart watch, or in anything connecting to cellular,
43:45
Speaker 2: connecting to Wi Fi.
43:47
Speaker 1: How do you.
43:47
Speaker 2: ISO a vehicle or a cell approaching let's just say,
43:52
Speaker 2: on the main thoroughfare, maybe around the circle K coming
43:55
Speaker 2: that way. How do you id and ISO isolate a
43:59
Speaker 2: vehicle coming that way and then note that it turns
44:03
Speaker 2: off as it approaches the turn in to Nancy Gathrie Subdivision,
44:09
Speaker 2: and then how do you pick it back up when
44:11
Speaker 2: it's leaving.
44:12
Speaker 1: How did they do that with Coburger?
44:16
Speaker 10: Well, you got to remember they identified Coldburger through other
44:20
Speaker 10: ways first, and then they got his phone records and
44:23
Speaker 10: be able to kind of look at all that pattern analysis.
44:27
Speaker 10: It wasn't the cellular stuff that brought them to Koldberger.
44:32
Speaker 10: Initially they found him through the DNA on the knife sheath.
44:37
Speaker 10: But once you get that data, you can get all
44:39
Speaker 10: that pattern of life based on that phone records and
44:45
Speaker 10: the person. Now, if you don't have a person identified,
44:48
Speaker 10: it's a lot harder to look at the thousands of
44:51
Speaker 10: phones in there and try to figure out which ones
44:53
Speaker 10: are relevant to the case. In the tower dome, Wait,
44:55
Speaker 10: put him up, which ones are relevant?
44:57
Speaker 1: Whoa, whoa, whoa whoa?
44:59
Speaker 2: Hold on, It's two o'clock in the morning in an
45:03
Speaker 2: isolated area. There's nobody around except the guys we keep
45:08
Speaker 2: picking up on door cam. Same guy with the backpack.
45:12
Speaker 1: Why are all these guys walking around the neighborhood at
45:14
Speaker 1: two am with a backpack and looking sneaky? That said,
45:21
Speaker 1: how many cars are traveling in that area? Not many.
45:26
Speaker 2: Remember this is an isolated and remote area.
45:31
Speaker 1: It's not in the heart of Tucson.
45:34
Speaker 2: So when you're saying pick out a cell phone with
45:39
Speaker 2: all of this activity, there's not a lot of activity.
45:42
Speaker 1: Come on, how hard can it be?
45:43
Speaker 10: Iker, Well, I understand that you might not understand that
45:49
Speaker 10: the cell phone towers they might be five, four, ten
45:55
Speaker 10: miles away from Nancy Guthrie's house and cover a huge
45:59
Speaker 10: amount of area, right, So that neighborhood might not have
46:04
Speaker 10: a lot of activity, but you expand out to the
46:08
Speaker 10: coverage area of all the towers that might give some
46:11
Speaker 10: signal to the area of Nancy Guthrie's house. You might
46:14
Speaker 10: look at ten different towers, all covering two or three
46:18
Speaker 10: miles of area itself. When you put all that together,
46:22
Speaker 10: you have hundreds of phones and devices, cell phones, cars,
46:29
Speaker 10: anything that has a cellular connection. That's a lot of
46:33
Speaker 10: beata still to go through. Even though the it's a
46:36
Speaker 10: sparser area than maybe a downtown area like Denver, but
46:41
Speaker 10: you still have a lot of phones in that area
46:45
Speaker 10: and devices.
46:46
Speaker 2: And also iiker you can isolate it by time, not
46:51
Speaker 2: necessarily the time the per entered the subdivision. And that's
46:55
Speaker 2: using that word subdivision a very loose sense of the word,
46:59
Speaker 2: because it's more like a rural area because the homes
47:03
Speaker 2: are far apart, there's so much foliage. But the leaving,
47:08
Speaker 2: the leaving can be identified not necessarily when the person
47:12
Speaker 2: gets there, because they could have staked out our house.
47:14
Speaker 1: For three hours for all I know. But the leaving,
47:17
Speaker 1: you know, they wanted to get out of there.
47:18
Speaker 2: Like a bad out of hell. This video from our
47:21
Speaker 2: friend's at twelve News. So that is something I think
47:24
Speaker 2: you can eye so much easily, much more easily. It
47:27
Speaker 2: is when they were leaving, So you've got it narrowed
47:31
Speaker 2: down to like an hour of the time.
47:33
Speaker 1: They were leaving. And if there is a blackout, digital
47:37
Speaker 1: blackout bookended, you've got one of those bookends down to
47:41
Speaker 1: an hour. Again, you're right, I don't know anything about this.
47:48
Speaker 2: To be a good trial lawyer, you have to admit
47:50
Speaker 2: you're not an expert in everything. One thing you're an
47:54
Speaker 2: expert in that's trying a case. But as a layperson,
47:58
Speaker 2: how hard can it be? You've got it narrow down
48:00
Speaker 2: for an one hour in a remote area.
48:05
Speaker 10: Well, there's many reasons a phone could move in and
48:07
Speaker 10: out of that area, or be turned off or turned on.
48:11
Speaker 10: So it's a lot of analytical work to try to
48:14
Speaker 10: figure out which phones are relevant to the case and
48:18
Speaker 10: which ones are not. Sometimes we can get more specific
48:21
Speaker 10: data on the towers and distance from the towers the
48:24
Speaker 10: phones are, and that does help us kind of indicate,
48:28
Speaker 10: all right, this phone is traveling down this road. But
48:32
Speaker 10: ninety percent of the time, which you can get from
48:34
Speaker 10: the phone records themselves are towers that were used, the
48:38
Speaker 10: sector or side of the tower that was used, and
48:41
Speaker 10: maybe a possible distance from the tower that phone is.
48:46
Speaker 10: So it's not as precise as we want to think
48:50
Speaker 10: it like it is in you know, the movies are
48:53
Speaker 10: on CSI on TV. It takes a lot of work.
48:58
Speaker 1: Put him up, I ker, you're preaching to the choir.
49:04
Speaker 2: I know that real kidnapping and real felony cases are
49:08
Speaker 2: not like in the movies.
49:10
Speaker 1: But you're absolutely right, and.
49:14
Speaker 2: Believe me, I am not trying to get three inches
49:17
Speaker 2: up the tailpipe of Sale Analysis Survey team. Without them,
49:23
Speaker 2: we wouldn't have what we've got right now, See what
49:26
Speaker 2: I mean, I get it. I just don't understand everything
49:30
Speaker 2: the complexities of the technology that CAST is using, and
49:34
Speaker 2: I'm trying to understand it.
49:36
Speaker 1: Back out to Mary.
49:37
Speaker 2: Coleman joining US News Evening anchor Channel thirteen. Kold everyone
49:45
Speaker 2: knows Kold and that region, but now across the nation
49:49
Speaker 2: everyone knows Kold because they came forward with ransom notes.
49:54
Speaker 2: So Mary Coleman, in this last plea from Savannah our
49:59
Speaker 2: friend Savannah go three. Already nearly two thousand tips have
50:03
Speaker 2: come in additional tips, right.
50:06
Speaker 6: That's correct?
50:07
Speaker 5: Yeah, they haven't stopped, and that was the goal with
50:11
Speaker 5: putting out the one million dollar reward is to have
50:15
Speaker 5: more people coming in and hopefully giving something of substance. Unfortunately,
50:19
Speaker 5: a lot of those tips have not been substantial, as
50:22
Speaker 5: we've talked about. But the hope is that even just
50:25
Speaker 5: something small can can turn this into bringing Nancy home.
50:29
Speaker 2: Mary Coleman, you are so right, Mary, it only takes
50:35
Speaker 2: one one tip. And believe you me, there is an accomplice.
50:42
Speaker 2: Someone does know what's going on other than the suspect,
50:47
Speaker 2: and I believe that her last plate and this million
50:51
Speaker 2: dollar now one point two million dollar reward is targeted
50:58
Speaker 2: at not just this suspect, not the suspect actually, but
51:02
Speaker 2: his small orbit around him. If there is an accomplice,
51:08
Speaker 2: they may be having second thoughts as we go to
51:11
Speaker 2: air tonight. Mary Coleman, you're absolutely correct. If you know
51:17
Speaker 2: or think you know anything about the disappearance of Nancy Guthrie,
51:22
Speaker 2: please die all toll free one eight hundred, call FBI
51:27
Speaker 2: one eight hundred, two two five five three two four,
51:31
Speaker 2: or if you wish to remain anonymous five two zero
51:34
Speaker 2: eight eight two seven four six three repeat five two
51:38
Speaker 2: zero eight eight two seven, four, six three.
51:42
Speaker 1: A one point two plus million dollar reward hangs in
51:50
Speaker 1: the balance.
51:52
Speaker 2: Nancy Grace signing off goodbye friend,