Latest / Bulletproof Screenwriting™ Podcast / BPS 399: FBI Witness Relocation Interview with Boris The Cinematographer from Shooting for the Mob

Transcript

BPS 399: FBI Witness Relocation Interview with Boris The Cinematographer from Shooting for the Mob · Bulletproof Screenwriting™ Podcast

• 0:03
  Speaker 1: You are listening to the IFAH podcast Network. For more
• 0:07
  Speaker 1: amazing filmmaking and screenwriting podcasts, just go to ifahpodcastnetwork dot com.
• 0:12
  Speaker 2: Welcome to the Bulletproof Screenwriting Podcast, Episode number three ninety nine.
• 0:16
  Speaker 2: What are we Animals? We will have Cappuccino ors the cinematographer.
• 0:22
  Speaker 1: Broadcasting from a dark, windowless room in Hollywood when we
• 0:25
  Speaker 1: really should be working on that next draft. It's the
• 0:28
  Speaker 1: Bulletproof Screenwriting Podcast, showing you the craft and business of
• 0:32
  Speaker 1: screenwriting while teaching you how to make your screenplay bulletproof.
• 0:36
  Speaker 2: And here's your host, Alex Ferrari. Welcome, Welcome to another
• 0:41
  Speaker 2: episode of the Bulletproof Screenwriting Podcast. I am your humble
• 0:43
  Speaker 2: host Alex Ferrari. Now, today's show is sponsored by Bulletproof
• 0:48
  Speaker 2: Script Coverage. Now, unlike other script coverage services, Bulletproof Script
• 0:53
  Speaker 2: Coverage actually focuses on the kind of project you are
• 0:57
  Speaker 2: and the goals of the project you are. We actually
• 1:00
  Speaker 2: break it down by three categories, micro budget, indie film,
• 1:03
  Speaker 2: market and studio film. There's no reason to get coverage
• 1:06
  Speaker 2: from a reader that you used to reading tempole movies
• 1:09
  Speaker 2: when your movie is going to be done for one
• 1:11
  Speaker 2: hundred thousand dollars and we wanted to focus on that.
• 1:13
  Speaker 2: At Bulletproof script Coverage, our readers have worked with Marvel Studios, CIA,
• 1:18
  Speaker 2: w MEE, NBC, HBO, Disney, Scott Free, Warner Brothers, The Blacklist,
• 1:23
  Speaker 2: and many many more. So if you need your screenplay
• 1:26
  Speaker 2: or TV script covered by professional readers, head on over
• 1:31
  Speaker 2: to covermiscreenplay dot com. So, guys, today we have a
• 1:36
  Speaker 2: very very very special guest today we have Boris the Cinematographer. Now,
• 1:44
  Speaker 2: this is a cinematographer that worked with me on Shooting
• 1:48
  Speaker 2: for the Mob in the movie inside the book Shooting
• 1:51
  Speaker 2: for the Mob, And we've been friends for about almost
• 1:54
  Speaker 2: twenty years now, and he is the main reason I
• 1:57
  Speaker 2: actually got off my butt and wrote the story and
• 2:00
  Speaker 2: told wrote this book and decided to tell my story
• 2:03
  Speaker 2: because of him constantly beating me up over the years
• 2:07
  Speaker 2: to do so. And I wanted to bring Boris on
• 2:10
  Speaker 2: the show to talk about the story from his perspective.
• 2:14
  Speaker 2: And it is done in a very deep throat FBI
• 2:18
  Speaker 2: Witness Relocation program kind of style, so his voice will
• 2:22
  Speaker 2: be altered so his identity is not revealed. He does
• 2:27
  Speaker 2: sense a little bit of worry about putting himself out
• 2:30
  Speaker 2: there publicly right now. I told him he shouldn't unless
• 2:33
  Speaker 2: he really really wants to for obvious reasons. I mean,
• 2:36
  Speaker 2: we are talking about a gangster, a mobster, you know,
• 2:38
  Speaker 2: all that kind of good stuff. I on the other hand, decided, Hey,
• 2:42
  Speaker 2: what the heck, I'm just going to do it anyway
• 2:43
  Speaker 2: because I need to get this story out of me
• 2:45
  Speaker 2: and out into the world. So that was my decision.
• 2:48
  Speaker 2: But again, I want to have Boris on because his
• 2:50
  Speaker 2: perspective and his storytelling is awesome and this is going
• 2:54
  Speaker 2: to be a very very interesting episode. So if you
• 2:57
  Speaker 2: guys have not heard, I have written that book called
• 3:00
  Speaker 2: Shooting for the Mob. It is now officially available on Amazon,
• 3:04
  Speaker 2: so please go buy it, tell people about it, share it.
• 3:09
  Speaker 2: Just go to Shooting Forthemob dot com and it'll take
• 3:11
  Speaker 2: you straight to Amazon. Or you could just go to
• 3:13
  Speaker 2: indie film Hustle dot comport slash Mob and it'll take
• 3:16
  Speaker 2: you there as well. And if you have read the book,
• 3:19
  Speaker 2: I really really need you to stop what you're doing
• 3:21
  Speaker 2: and go leave a review on Amazon. It really really
• 3:24
  Speaker 2: helps us out a lot. We have, believe it or not,
• 3:27
  Speaker 2: become bestsellers already on Amazon in the in certain categories.
• 3:31
  Speaker 2: So we are an Amazon best selling book, which is
• 3:35
  Speaker 2: insane to me and I'm humbled by it. So thank
• 3:38
  Speaker 2: you guys so much for buying the book and continuing
• 3:40
  Speaker 2: to buy the book, and please spread the word and
• 3:43
  Speaker 2: tell anybody and everybody about the book. I really really
• 3:46
  Speaker 2: appreciate it. And if you guys are in the LA
• 3:49
  Speaker 2: area April twenty fifth, we will be having a screening
• 3:53
  Speaker 2: of on the Corner of Ego and Desire at the
• 3:55
  Speaker 2: Chinese Theater, the world famous Chinese Theater in Hollywood, followed
• 3:59
  Speaker 2: by Qan for the movie, and then I'm going to
• 4:01
  Speaker 2: be doing a talk about fear and breaking through your
• 4:05
  Speaker 2: fears to make your first feature film and talking about
• 4:08
  Speaker 2: my story and what I went through with shooting for
• 4:11
  Speaker 2: the Mob. And then afterwards we're gonna have Q and
• 4:13
  Speaker 2: A and then a book signing and we're going to
• 4:15
  Speaker 2: be selling books there as well. So if you want
• 4:17
  Speaker 2: to get tickets to come out and see the Tribe,
• 4:20
  Speaker 2: visit with the Tribe and myself, just head over to
• 4:22
  Speaker 2: indieilm huscle dot com forward Slash Screening to check it out,
• 4:25
  Speaker 2: and I promise you it's going to be a pretty
• 4:28
  Speaker 2: epic evening. But this episode. This interview is fairly epic.
• 4:33
  Speaker 2: It's nothing like I've ever done before on the show.
• 4:36
  Speaker 2: But I want you to remember that we altered the
• 4:39
  Speaker 2: voice for Boris to protect him, and I just didn't
• 4:42
  Speaker 2: feel comfortable putting him out there, exposing who he is
• 4:47
  Speaker 2: and putting his name out there at this point in
• 4:50
  Speaker 2: time because I really care about Boris and don't want
• 4:53
  Speaker 2: anything to happen to him. So that is the reason
• 4:55
  Speaker 2: why we have altered his voice bear with it. So
• 4:59
  Speaker 2: it is just amazing. Really, I'm so happy to bring
• 5:03
  Speaker 2: this to you, guys. I'm like you can tell in
• 5:04
  Speaker 2: my voice, I'm so like giddy because I can't wait
• 5:07
  Speaker 2: for you guys to hear this story. So I've told
• 5:09
  Speaker 2: you a little bit of the story, but now you're
• 5:11
  Speaker 2: going to hear a whole bunch more about the story
• 5:13
  Speaker 2: from behind the scenes, episodes of what's going on, things
• 5:17
  Speaker 2: that were happening at the time, and I just I'm
• 5:21
  Speaker 2: just excited to get it to you. So without any
• 5:23
  Speaker 2: further ado, please enjoy my Deep Throat Witness Relocation Program
• 5:30
  Speaker 2: interview with Boris the Cinematographer. Okay, Boris, so you've read
• 5:39
  Speaker 2: the book and you were well let's take it back
• 5:42
  Speaker 2: to the beginning. You were the reason why I wrote
• 5:45
  Speaker 2: this book. You were the one that kept hounding me
• 5:47
  Speaker 2: for years to tell this story. And finally it came
• 5:51
  Speaker 2: to the point where I could not argue with you
• 5:55
  Speaker 2: anymore because you wanted me to write a screenplay originally,
• 5:58
  Speaker 2: and I said, no, I can't write a scream I
• 6:00
  Speaker 2: don't want to write a screenplay. This it's just not
• 6:02
  Speaker 2: I'm not gonna go chase money. And then you said
• 6:05
  Speaker 2: to me, well, why don't you write a book, And
• 6:08
  Speaker 2: it's like, damn it, I can write a book, and
• 6:10
  Speaker 2: it's your fault that this has happened in the first place.
• 6:15
  Speaker 3: Yes, as we do this in Eastern Europe. You know
• 6:19
  Speaker 3: where I come from. We read books. Books are very
• 6:22
  Speaker 3: important part of your education, and books are also something
• 6:26
  Speaker 3: that stays and as a document for the history for posterity.
• 6:32
  Speaker 3: So having the book, having the book done, it's more
• 6:36
  Speaker 3: than just like doing your own personal soul searching or
• 6:39
  Speaker 3: making the journey or re experiencing everything that you went through.
• 6:46
  Speaker 3: I think about it, this is like something generations and
• 6:49
  Speaker 3: generations of aspiring filmmakers, or if there is any films
• 6:55
  Speaker 3: or something in the future they might be doing something else,
• 6:58
  Speaker 3: but they will be finding this is very very interesting
• 7:01
  Speaker 3: and inspiring and amusing, educational, informative, and whatever else people
• 7:07
  Speaker 3: will find in this book.
• 7:09
  Speaker 2: Yes, it is. It was all of that. And then
• 7:13
  Speaker 2: and then with a question, so you've read the book,
• 7:18
  Speaker 2: I want to ask you straight. Is this book true
• 7:21
  Speaker 2: to your experience? Because you were with me on this
• 7:23
  Speaker 2: journey for about three months out of the year that
• 7:26
  Speaker 2: I was involved with this project. What is your feelings
• 7:29
  Speaker 2: on the book's truth, authenticity and did I exaggerate anything?
• 7:33
  Speaker 3: I don't think when when it comes down to exaggeration,
• 7:38
  Speaker 3: I don't think there is any level of exaggeration in
• 7:42
  Speaker 3: the book. I think that's what the biggest I think
• 7:45
  Speaker 3: the real value of the book in that there is
• 7:47
  Speaker 3: really no exaggeration. It's real, It's all real, and it's
• 7:50
  Speaker 3: really one hundred percent of the truth what really happened.
• 7:55
  Speaker 3: And that's what I think is going to be the
• 7:57
  Speaker 3: most increasing aspect of the book to me. I think
• 8:02
  Speaker 3: it was really interesting to read a book because not
• 8:05
  Speaker 3: only that I was part of this for all these
• 8:08
  Speaker 3: several months we spent together on it, but learning all
• 8:12
  Speaker 3: the background stories, learning about you, learning how you get
• 8:15
  Speaker 3: into this and learning about some other people that I
• 8:18
  Speaker 3: had a chance to interact during our pre production. So
• 8:21
  Speaker 3: this is all combined together gave me a whole new
• 8:24
  Speaker 3: perspective on our experience.
• 8:27
  Speaker 2: In back then, right, because you didn't know the whole story.
• 8:30
  Speaker 2: You only knew parts of the story, and it was patchy,
• 8:33
  Speaker 2: And then you only knew the stories from your perspective.
• 8:35
  Speaker 2: You never saw all the stuff that I went through
• 8:37
  Speaker 2: behind the scenes, a lot of it before and after
• 8:39
  Speaker 2: you left.
• 8:40
  Speaker 3: Well, that's right. I mean, when you are in pre production,
• 8:43
  Speaker 3: you don't have time much for chip chat, although we
• 8:45
  Speaker 3: did have a lot of time later on downtime, but
• 8:48
  Speaker 3: at least, you know, we ended up. We ended up
• 8:51
  Speaker 3: doing anything, very very interesting work with interesting group of people,
• 8:56
  Speaker 3: really talented people. And going back and thinking about this,
• 9:00
  Speaker 3: I really wish we maade this movie because aside from
• 9:04
  Speaker 3: all the experience that we went through, I still wish
• 9:10
  Speaker 3: that story is told somehow about Jimmy's life and everything
• 9:17
  Speaker 3: that's it's about.
• 9:19
  Speaker 2: The story is obviously about redemption.
• 9:20
  Speaker 3: It's all about redemption.
• 9:22
  Speaker 2: There's no question that the story is not about Jimmy.
• 9:24
  Speaker 2: It's all about redemption.
• 9:26
  Speaker 3: No, it was always from the beginning all about redemption.
• 9:29
  Speaker 2: Now, and you actually coined that phrase. You're the one
• 9:32
  Speaker 2: that said redemption to him. And then from that moment on,
• 9:36
  Speaker 2: apparently he looked up the word and he started spouting
• 9:41
  Speaker 2: that and you turned to me like I just told
• 9:43
  Speaker 2: him that yesterday.
• 9:45
  Speaker 3: Well, as we all know, Jimmy had this tendency because
• 9:49
  Speaker 3: he's a total newcomer to the world of film.
• 9:55
  Speaker 2: We'll be right back after a word from our sponsor
• 10:01
  Speaker 2: and now back to the show.
• 10:05
  Speaker 3: So he does not understand really the language, the lingua
• 10:08
  Speaker 3: that we use in the business and industry. So I
• 10:10
  Speaker 3: remember one of his favorite phrases was favorite nation in
• 10:15
  Speaker 3: the contract, because many times he would get any kind
• 10:20
  Speaker 3: of draft of the contract. Well, favorite nation is a
• 10:22
  Speaker 3: term used normally in the contract in a legal language,
• 10:29
  Speaker 3: basically explaining that everybody is equal of favorite nation. But
• 10:37
  Speaker 3: so for me any any when we had this production meeting,
• 10:43
  Speaker 3: I still remember vividly even more like pep talk, pep rally,
• 10:49
  Speaker 3: and what they wanted to hear how everybody is so
• 10:52
  Speaker 3: excited about the project and everybody I remember the I
• 10:58
  Speaker 3: remember production meeting we had, and Jimmy was so eager
• 11:02
  Speaker 3: to hear from everybody like one of the first meetings,
• 11:05
  Speaker 3: like how great this whole film is going to be
• 11:09
  Speaker 3: and what we think about it? And for me, well,
• 11:15
  Speaker 3: it was kind of just like war that came out. Oh,
• 11:19
  Speaker 3: it's about redemption, because as much it was all Eagle
• 11:23
  Speaker 3: driven project, he was very sensitive not to make it obvious.
• 11:28
  Speaker 3: So I think redemption was a perfect excuse for him
• 11:31
  Speaker 3: to find the real catchphrase that explained really the meaning
• 11:36
  Speaker 3: of the film. So it's about redemption. It's not about
• 11:38
  Speaker 3: him a love and of course about him.
• 11:40
  Speaker 2: As we know very much, So it was all about
• 11:43
  Speaker 2: him without question. Now a quick question before we continue.
• 11:47
  Speaker 2: We obviously have blacked out your face here and changed
• 11:51
  Speaker 2: your voice to protect your identity. I obviously cannot protect
• 11:57
  Speaker 2: my identity because I am the author and the subject
• 12:00
  Speaker 2: of the book. Do you fear for yourself? Is that
• 12:03
  Speaker 2: the reason why you, you know, agreed to do this,
• 12:06
  Speaker 2: I mean, is it the reason why you wanted us
• 12:09
  Speaker 2: to block out your face and change your voice? Do
• 12:11
  Speaker 2: you fear for your life in any way?
• 12:13
  Speaker 3: Well, I don't feel for my life. Just to say
• 12:16
  Speaker 3: I might be able to be too much self fear
• 12:19
  Speaker 3: for my life, but I think it's better to not
• 12:24
  Speaker 3: to to be too public about is, at least for me.
• 12:27
  Speaker 3: You know, maybe one day I might say really who
• 12:31
  Speaker 3: boris frees and everything, but that remains to be seen.
• 12:35
  Speaker 3: I think what is more important than you tell the story,
• 12:38
  Speaker 3: because this is your story and we are all just
• 12:41
  Speaker 3: part of that world that happened during the during the production.
• 12:45
  Speaker 3: So I think at this point it's still better for
• 12:48
  Speaker 3: me to stay kind of in the shadow and not
• 12:50
  Speaker 3: to drive too much attention.
• 12:52
  Speaker 2: Literally in the shadows.
• 12:53
  Speaker 3: Literally in the shadows fair enough.
• 12:56
  Speaker 2: So when one of the one of the moments that
• 13:02
  Speaker 2: I loved in the in the book and us when
• 13:04
  Speaker 2: we when we met, was the expresso the cappuccino events,
• 13:10
  Speaker 2: can you refresh for the audio for people listening, because
• 13:14
  Speaker 2: people a lot of people who are watching this have
• 13:16
  Speaker 2: already read the book. Can you talk from your perspective
• 13:19
  Speaker 2: about the cappuccino machine.
• 13:21
  Speaker 3: Well, back in Old Country, it's very important. Coffee is
• 13:26
  Speaker 3: not just the drink that you kept in the morning
• 13:31
  Speaker 3: and get you there going has more social meaning. You know,
• 13:36
  Speaker 3: we would sit and enjoy coffee while having meaningful conversation
• 13:41
  Speaker 3: or just you know, kind of having a little chot
• 13:43
  Speaker 3: and just to warm up before we really get serious.
• 13:46
  Speaker 3: About whatever we want to do that day. So for me,
• 13:48
  Speaker 3: having this ritual is really essential. And I still give
• 13:52
  Speaker 3: this ritual first thing in the morning even at my home.
• 13:55
  Speaker 3: Here I can run like appuccino machine and then gradually
• 14:00
  Speaker 3: embark upon of the day and see what's going to happen.
• 14:04
  Speaker 3: But I never drink coffee by myself is kind of boring.
• 14:08
  Speaker 3: So coffee is social event. Coffee is a part of
• 14:11
  Speaker 3: the cultural ritual. And I wanted to bring this culture
• 14:15
  Speaker 3: into the culture of our production and I think I
• 14:18
  Speaker 3: did it successful. Yeah.
• 14:20
  Speaker 2: You actually, if I may quote, you said, what are
• 14:23
  Speaker 2: we savages? We will have cappuccino.
• 14:25
  Speaker 3: That's exactly my point, you know, to be in production
• 14:27
  Speaker 3: office without coffee maker or at least a little bit
• 14:30
  Speaker 3: more sophisticated. So coffee maker. Come on, after all, we
• 14:33
  Speaker 3: are twenty million dollar budget production. It has to be best.
• 14:37
  Speaker 3: We cannot just go for some whatever, you know, forgers.
• 14:41
  Speaker 2: And let's talk about that twenty million dollar budget which
• 14:44
  Speaker 2: we never saw and the budget kept getting dropped daily,
• 14:47
  Speaker 2: weekly and rescheduled and all this kind of stuff. When
• 14:51
  Speaker 2: you showed up to the production offices the first day,
• 14:56
  Speaker 2: what was your thought when you were dropped off at
• 14:59
  Speaker 2: a racetrack.
• 15:01
  Speaker 3: Well from even before I showed up on the racetrack
• 15:07
  Speaker 3: in our production office, I knew this is not going
• 15:09
  Speaker 3: to be your typical normal production as we all used to.
• 15:13
  Speaker 3: We knew there's already so many things. Just the way
• 15:16
  Speaker 3: I was brought in it was so out of the ordinary,
• 15:19
  Speaker 3: being hired without reading the script and just being brought
• 15:22
  Speaker 3: because I said I like the script to read and
• 15:27
  Speaker 3: that was enough for me to be hired. That was,
• 15:29
  Speaker 3: let's spoke the volume. That is going to be very interesting,
• 15:33
  Speaker 3: unusual journey so for me. And you know the fact
• 15:36
  Speaker 3: that I was picked up by the producer and his
• 15:39
  Speaker 3: wife and a couple other assistants and brought to some
• 15:42
  Speaker 3: Italian hangout restaurant in south side of the city and
• 15:49
  Speaker 3: immediately presented with my key Grip and the guffer as
• 15:54
  Speaker 3: people who are already hired. There's a lot of things
• 15:57
  Speaker 3: and given big Lexus you need to drive around. To me,
• 16:03
  Speaker 3: these are all signs out of something very much out of
• 16:07
  Speaker 3: the charts. And then of course coming to horse truck
• 16:09
  Speaker 3: race truck, which I have never been in my life.
• 16:13
  Speaker 3: It was yet another world that I had to learn experience,
• 16:17
  Speaker 3: and I had no idea and it was quite interesting experience.
• 16:21
  Speaker 3: But then seeing the vastness of production office, Yeah, it
• 16:25
  Speaker 3: was something that I mean, I'm auple bigger and smaller
• 16:29
  Speaker 3: production productions, but I've never seen anybody having production office
• 16:33
  Speaker 3: of this scope.
• 16:35
  Speaker 2: For such a you know, an unknown right right now.
• 16:41
  Speaker 2: I want to I've always wanted to ask you this question.
• 16:43
  Speaker 2: What did you think when they told you, oh, it's
• 16:46
  Speaker 2: a first time director and he's a young guy and
• 16:49
  Speaker 2: all that kind of stuff, because this was I mean,
• 16:51
  Speaker 2: you had already been being a cinematographer for a few years.
• 16:54
  Speaker 2: I mean, were not a few years, probably about ten
• 16:56
  Speaker 2: years by that point, so you weren't established in amatographer,
• 16:59
  Speaker 2: you know, working your way up the ladder. What did
• 17:02
  Speaker 2: you think when you saw the trailer that I shot
• 17:06
  Speaker 2: and everything like that in general, before you even met me.
• 17:10
  Speaker 3: Yeah, the truth is, yes, I was by then. I
• 17:13
  Speaker 3: would say my career was nicely on steady rising direction.
• 17:18
  Speaker 3: And you know, as a cinematographer, we always have to
• 17:23
  Speaker 3: be open minded about the projects that we are working on,
• 17:26
  Speaker 3: and and I always find it exciting meeting new people,
• 17:30
  Speaker 3: working with new people, working with the first time director.
• 17:34
  Speaker 3: That was the first time that I worked with the
• 17:36
  Speaker 3: first time director, so for me it was not something
• 17:40
  Speaker 3: out of the ordinary. When it comes out to my
• 17:42
  Speaker 3: approach to film. Usually working with first time director as
• 17:46
  Speaker 3: a cinematographer requires a little bit more, I would say,
• 17:50
  Speaker 3: patients and time because the gap as much as creatively
• 17:56
  Speaker 3: you might have some great ideas and the way is
• 18:01
  Speaker 3: how you see this film, it's really cinematographer who has
• 18:04
  Speaker 3: to kind of bring it down to reality and facilitate
• 18:07
  Speaker 3: and figure it out how to basically deliver the division.
• 18:11
  Speaker 3: And sometimes if directors have no experience, they might be
• 18:16
  Speaker 3: dreaming big and way beyond what is really feasible and possible.
• 18:22
  Speaker 3: But after seeing the trailer the problem and that you
• 18:25
  Speaker 3: guys shot before I even came on the board, I
• 18:28
  Speaker 3: definitely recognized the talent and to me it was like, Okay,
• 18:30
  Speaker 3: well that's somebody who I think that can work with
• 18:32
  Speaker 3: and we will be able to communicate and you know,
• 18:36
  Speaker 3: obviously have when we started working, when we started our
• 18:39
  Speaker 3: pre production and everything else, we quickly established our way
• 18:43
  Speaker 3: of communication as we all know, and it's really well
• 18:47
  Speaker 3: described in the book. But I would say the gap
• 18:52
  Speaker 3: that we had was just normal natural gap. We mean
• 18:55
  Speaker 3: already by them had like maybe six seven feature films
• 18:58
  Speaker 3: and much of other projects. So I felt it's my
• 19:00
  Speaker 3: duty to bring you up to kind of speed and
• 19:04
  Speaker 3: and and and take you out any possible. Like pittfors it,
• 19:07
  Speaker 3: normally first directors tends to get on so and you know,
• 19:12
  Speaker 3: of course, I enjoy the fact that we could because
• 19:17
  Speaker 3: we had a time, we could actually watch a movie.
• 19:20
  Speaker 2: We watched many, many, many movies.
• 19:23
  Speaker 3: So for me, it was kind of like having a
• 19:26
  Speaker 3: giving a basically personal film history almost film history, cinematography,
• 19:34
  Speaker 3: personal class just for you to be able to if
• 19:38
  Speaker 3: I'm referencing something so it can develop shorthand so it's easy,
• 19:42
  Speaker 3: or if I say whatever Berner Coursana or whatever else,
• 19:46
  Speaker 3: being abeble to throw around makes us also good, makes
• 19:49
  Speaker 3: us look.
• 19:49
  Speaker 2: AT's know what you're talking about, because it's all about redemption.
• 19:52
  Speaker 3: Because it's all about redemption.
• 19:55
  Speaker 2: We'll be right back after a word from our sponsor,
• 20:01
  Speaker 2: and now back to the show. Now, have you ever
• 20:05
  Speaker 2: been on before or since a project that had well
• 20:10
  Speaker 2: been in pre production for nine months?
• 20:14
  Speaker 3: Uh No, that is such a rarity. Honestly, when I
• 20:18
  Speaker 3: think about it, I was personally think about three months.
• 20:22
  Speaker 3: It's such a rarity. Unless you're really on a big movie.
• 20:26
  Speaker 3: I'm sure on some big project, it's normally the cinematography
• 20:29
  Speaker 3: will be part of the pre production for several months.
• 20:34
  Speaker 3: Traditionally in typical Hollywood production, cinematographers always brought well, it
• 20:38
  Speaker 3: depends on the budget, for sake, maybe eight weeks. That's
• 20:41
  Speaker 3: already like getting into medium medium budget productions. And and
• 20:47
  Speaker 3: if you're in any larger size, well there is a
• 20:50
  Speaker 3: reason if you have like three months pre production, that's
• 20:52
  Speaker 3: like the scope of the film, and the scope of
• 20:55
  Speaker 3: the pre production is far bigger than having enough time
• 20:59
  Speaker 3: to We did to watch movies for two three hours
• 21:02
  Speaker 3: every day during appucrinos and scout endlessly, endlessly all over
• 21:08
  Speaker 3: the state. And that's kind of luxury which I never had.
• 21:12
  Speaker 2: When we were traveling around Louisiana looking at all those locations,
• 21:15
  Speaker 2: I mean we must have had how many locations did
• 21:19
  Speaker 2: we look at? Hundreds?
• 21:21
  Speaker 3: I don't know. I stopped I stopped counting because I
• 21:25
  Speaker 3: know after initial scout and initial visit of locations, we
• 21:29
  Speaker 3: would go again and revisit them, and then again revisit
• 21:32
  Speaker 3: them just to make sure that maybe something might change.
• 21:36
  Speaker 3: Oh maybe let's check another prison. Al let's check another
• 21:39
  Speaker 3: streetcar and or another house or whatever. I don't even
• 21:45
  Speaker 3: know how many places we scouted. It was kind of
• 21:47
  Speaker 3: just like almost a day routine. Get in the morning,
• 21:52
  Speaker 3: get the coffee, get the breakfast, watch a movie, and
• 21:54
  Speaker 3: then get in our Lexus I think four hundred and
• 21:58
  Speaker 3: eightysuvs ambidition and the lady in the trunk who we'd
• 22:03
  Speaker 3: guide us to our design.
• 22:06
  Speaker 2: That was space age technology back then.
• 22:08
  Speaker 3: Back then it was unbelievable. It was like, what was
• 22:12
  Speaker 3: more unbelievable? We had to return these astuias.
• 22:14
  Speaker 2: Every week because of the mileagege, so can we talk
• 22:18
  Speaker 2: about that really quickly. We actually got a product placement
• 22:22
  Speaker 2: for a move for for these Lexuses from a local dealership,
• 22:26
  Speaker 2: not from Lexus, but from a local dealership, so then
• 22:29
  Speaker 2: we could actually, you know, we turn it after one
• 22:34
  Speaker 2: hundred miles.
• 22:35
  Speaker 3: I don't know, but there was a something cut off
• 22:36
  Speaker 3: number which we're not allowed to write more than whatever, and.
• 22:40
  Speaker 2: We would just replace the news right.
• 22:41
  Speaker 3: Because they are still something as new cars otherwise.
• 22:44
  Speaker 2: Needless to say, this was a period piece film, so
• 22:46
  Speaker 2: there was no place for a two thousand and one Lexus.
• 22:50
  Speaker 3: No, but I remember actually when I when I asked what.
• 22:57
  Speaker 3: I asked Jimmy about it. He said, no worry, no worries,
• 23:00
  Speaker 3: gonna be all good. We're gonna put the deep kind
• 23:02
  Speaker 3: of deep in the background. Nobody's gonna that's going to recognize.
• 23:05
  Speaker 3: But I don't remember even in a movie which ends
• 23:07
  Speaker 3: up in ninetek nineteen ninety was the title scene of
• 23:10
  Speaker 3: the film, of the script at least they had this
• 23:14
  Speaker 3: kind of cars as ubs. So I just didn't want
• 23:18
  Speaker 3: to argue, Hey, who would argue? Somebody gives you. I
• 23:20
  Speaker 3: have to say, this was the first and only time
• 23:22
  Speaker 3: that I had such a car as my vehicle to
• 23:25
  Speaker 3: drive around in production. That's like, that's really like normally, Yeah,
• 23:29
  Speaker 3: you could see director, producer, so they drive this, not
• 23:33
  Speaker 3: the VP and some other people we had on the.
• 23:35
  Speaker 2: Production, yes, exactly, our production designer, our location scouts, and
• 23:40
  Speaker 2: our first a D who was generally on on the
• 23:44
  Speaker 2: journey with us every time. Indeed, indeed, now you you
• 23:48
  Speaker 2: heard of a lot of these stories of what Jimmy
• 23:50
  Speaker 2: was doing as far as yelling and threatening people and screaming.
• 23:54
  Speaker 2: What was the one time that you heard or saw
• 23:58
  Speaker 2: something that you that fixed with you still to this day.
• 24:03
  Speaker 3: Well, I have to admit having Jimmy around was always
• 24:07
  Speaker 3: fun because he is definitely one of these kind of
• 24:11
  Speaker 3: characters you see like in this movies about gangsters and mafia.
• 24:18
  Speaker 3: He is I think I think he was definitely trying
• 24:20
  Speaker 3: very hard to impersonate either Joe Becci or one of
• 24:23
  Speaker 3: these guys. And I mean, you have to admit, these
• 24:26
  Speaker 3: guys are always very charismatic, very talkative, full of stories,
• 24:32
  Speaker 3: unpredictable on every moment. You never know what's going to
• 24:34
  Speaker 3: happen with them, and that's what kind of adds a
• 24:36
  Speaker 3: little mystery to each of these guys. So with the Jimmy, well,
• 24:42
  Speaker 3: I think he'll like me right away from the beginning.
• 24:45
  Speaker 3: I think he trusted me, and that was a big deal.
• 24:48
  Speaker 3: I think on on on instinct, the level he he
• 24:52
  Speaker 3: felt it. You know, he can he can rely on me,
• 24:55
  Speaker 3: which is which is fine. It's actually a good place
• 24:57
  Speaker 3: to be when you're dealing with dies like this. But
• 25:01
  Speaker 3: his impulsiveness is something that was interesting to me to observe.
• 25:09
  Speaker 3: And I've seen him a couple of times in production
• 25:11
  Speaker 3: office and I remember one occasion that he was talking
• 25:14
  Speaker 3: to agent to the agent of one of the prospective
• 25:20
  Speaker 3: actors and it was actually early on, I think we
• 25:25
  Speaker 3: had somebody who was attached, attached, well not really attached,
• 25:29
  Speaker 3: but somebody who said that he's interested in reading the script. Well,
• 25:34
  Speaker 3: if you're in a film business, you understand somebody says, well,
• 25:37
  Speaker 3: I'm interested in reading the script means nothing. It has
• 25:40
  Speaker 3: no commitment, has no obligation. You know, I'm just okay,
• 25:43
  Speaker 3: I'm just going to read it when I have time. Well,
• 25:47
  Speaker 3: in his mind, that meant we get this guy. He's
• 25:51
  Speaker 3: reading the script, he's interested. That means he's going to
• 25:53
  Speaker 3: do the movie. And I think there was a basic, basic,
• 25:58
  Speaker 3: like a starting point for him to eat and pull
• 26:00
  Speaker 3: the trigger and not palttended and get production. So that's
• 26:04
  Speaker 3: why he brought all of us and started production, because
• 26:07
  Speaker 3: he has a guy who is interested and it was
• 26:10
  Speaker 3: quite non actor and I think I happened to be
• 26:13
  Speaker 3: in the office when the agent of that particular talent,
• 26:20
  Speaker 3: particular movie star basically passed on the split past the movie,
• 26:25
  Speaker 3: passed on project because he couldn't do it because of
• 26:28
  Speaker 3: I think a schedule conflict or something was not really
• 26:33
  Speaker 3: quite as we say in Europe kosure. So so I
• 26:40
  Speaker 3: think that's what created this rage in Jimmy, and he
• 26:45
  Speaker 3: was yelling and screaming and cursing and threatening that he's
• 26:49
  Speaker 3: gonna break this guy's kneecup next time he sees him,
• 26:53
  Speaker 3: and he slammed the phone. Not great, just like as
• 26:57
  Speaker 3: a whole, Like there's something if you are ahead of
• 27:00
  Speaker 3: for a big studio and you're doing some big movie
• 27:03
  Speaker 3: in forties. I think that's how they used to act, probably,
• 27:09
  Speaker 3: but not if you're some unknown whoever who's never done anything.
• 27:13
  Speaker 3: And to me, there was like, Okay, this is going
• 27:17
  Speaker 3: to be very very interesting. Of course I called my
• 27:19
  Speaker 3: agent right away, and that's also what happened, and she said, well,
• 27:25
  Speaker 3: the world is out already that he is. She said,
• 27:32
  Speaker 3: lose Kennon and nobody wants to really commit to this project.
• 27:38
  Speaker 3: Comment of what, so she told me he just hanging
• 27:41
  Speaker 3: there as long as you can. But I don't think
• 27:45
  Speaker 3: this movie is going best movie ever gonna get made.
• 27:48
  Speaker 2: Do you think that Jimmy was the best thing and
• 27:52
  Speaker 2: the worst thing to try to get the movie because
• 27:54
  Speaker 2: the door you would have never been able to crack
• 27:56
  Speaker 2: the door into Hollywood without Jimmy and his story. But
• 27:59
  Speaker 2: because Jimmy, it would never get made.
• 28:02
  Speaker 3: Here's the thing. One thing that I think maybe when
• 28:06
  Speaker 3: I told you that at some point, what I realized
• 28:10
  Speaker 3: from all this experience is that maybe it subconsciously Jimy
• 28:14
  Speaker 3: never wanted to make a movie, really and why he
• 28:17
  Speaker 3: would not do that, Well, it's not about money. I
• 28:22
  Speaker 3: don't think he needed money. Well, it's about a redemption,
• 28:28
  Speaker 3: not really, it's about him. So the process of making
• 28:33
  Speaker 3: being acting as a producer, having people around him, making
• 28:39
  Speaker 3: him so important on a daily basis, was what he needed.
• 28:46
  Speaker 3: And in his mind, as long as he can he
• 28:50
  Speaker 3: can live this life of importance he is running on.
• 28:58
  Speaker 3: That's what gives him really really, like like like thick,
• 29:03
  Speaker 3: the moment film is made, but leg it, he doesn't
• 29:08
  Speaker 3: have any other movie to make. This is his one
• 29:11
  Speaker 3: only shot. This is his story. It's a great story.
• 29:15
  Speaker 3: But he cannot going now started opening another whatever. I
• 29:18
  Speaker 3: doubt that he would be able to even if he
• 29:21
  Speaker 3: made the movie. So for him, it was more important
• 29:23
  Speaker 3: just to live the dream of making it, never making it.
• 29:26
  Speaker 3: And as we con see, this movie was never made.
• 29:29
  Speaker 3: And I'm sure there's a reason for it.
• 29:32
  Speaker 2: It was while it was his dream, it was our nightmare.
• 29:36
  Speaker 3: Well, it was a roller coaster, it was your nightmare
• 29:38
  Speaker 3: for sure, because you were invested in the film far
• 29:43
  Speaker 3: more than us. We are just kept as you know,
• 29:47
  Speaker 3: kind of like as I call it, props, one of
• 29:52
  Speaker 3: the props. We are just kind of like supporting, supporting.
• 29:55
  Speaker 3: We are extras.
• 29:58
  Speaker 2: We'll be right back after a word for my sponsor
• 30:04
  Speaker 2: and now back to the show.
• 30:07
  Speaker 3: We're extras. Really like in all this, you know, all
• 30:10
  Speaker 3: this drama, and as much as much it was all
• 30:16
  Speaker 3: roller coaster, for me, I enjoyed every moment. I enjoy
• 30:20
  Speaker 3: being with you. I enjoy being with Jimmy and all
• 30:22
  Speaker 3: other people that I actually became friend for life, which
• 30:25
  Speaker 3: is great. This kind of experience really bonds you. But
• 30:29
  Speaker 3: one thing that I knew right away from the beginning,
• 30:32
  Speaker 3: especially after that episode in his office and slamming the
• 30:37
  Speaker 3: phone and yelling and threatening, I knew this film desire ground.
• 30:40
  Speaker 3: I knew this is what I get made. So for me,
• 30:43
  Speaker 3: it's like, okay, might well just enjoyed the ride, and
• 30:47
  Speaker 3: it was a roller coaster for sure. But if I
• 30:50
  Speaker 3: think about anything bad that happened to me, not really,
• 30:54
  Speaker 3: nothing really happened. Actually, I had a great time. What
• 30:57
  Speaker 3: I think about it, I had a fantastic time. We
• 30:59
  Speaker 3: would hate out do the things that we like to do,
• 31:02
  Speaker 3: except you know, we will never make a movie. But
• 31:06
  Speaker 3: in my mind, you remember I told you that in
• 31:08
  Speaker 3: my mind I have to be finished, all the scouts
• 31:10
  Speaker 3: I have to be finished, endless talks, discussions about the
• 31:15
  Speaker 3: scenes and short listing it and storyboarding it and everything.
• 31:21
  Speaker 3: Basically like I felt like, here'sh cockay for me. This
• 31:24
  Speaker 3: movie is not this movie. I already made it, just
• 31:27
  Speaker 3: a matter of executive putting it in front of the lens.
• 31:29
  Speaker 3: But I had every possible detail worked out. What kind
• 31:34
  Speaker 3: of light, where, what lens, what movement, everything was. Everything
• 31:38
  Speaker 3: was figured out that when so as far as I'm
• 31:41
  Speaker 3: concerning anybody, put show it.
• 31:44
  Speaker 2: Now. You being there for the three months that you were,
• 31:46
  Speaker 2: you caught me at towards the tail end of my
• 31:48
  Speaker 2: journey from your perspective, I wanted to ask you what
• 31:52
  Speaker 2: you thought of me and what you witnessed in my day,
• 31:58
  Speaker 2: my day to day life then, because you were pretty
• 32:01
  Speaker 2: much the closest you and the first A D were
• 32:05
  Speaker 2: the closest to people to me on the production who
• 32:09
  Speaker 2: I leaned on the most. What did what was your
• 32:12
  Speaker 2: take on what was I like your impression of what
• 32:16
  Speaker 2: I was going through and kind of tell the audience
• 32:18
  Speaker 2: that well.
• 32:20
  Speaker 3: Right away from the moment when we met, I realized
• 32:23
  Speaker 3: that you are the tremendous pressure. That's like obvious, that
• 32:27
  Speaker 3: was very obvious. So so and I can completely understand
• 32:33
  Speaker 3: and relate where the pressure was coming from. It was
• 32:36
  Speaker 3: obvious too, I mean after two minutes in the production office,
• 32:40
  Speaker 3: it's clear was I was tightening the group and pressuring everything.
• 32:46
  Speaker 3: But you have different responsibilities than anybody else in the production,
• 32:51
  Speaker 3: so obviously for you, the pressure was far greater. And
• 32:54
  Speaker 3: then later on learning about all this background story that
• 32:58
  Speaker 3: you had prior to the stepping in was well obviously
• 33:03
  Speaker 3: explains everything even more so my take was, Okay, I
• 33:08
  Speaker 3: can see he's under pressure. How can I help? So
• 33:12
  Speaker 3: I was really focusing mostly in creating, helping you to
• 33:18
  Speaker 3: to to kind of keeping you away from Jimmy, ensuring
• 33:22
  Speaker 3: Jimmy and I did it. In a couple of times,
• 33:24
  Speaker 3: I would say, Jimmy, don't worry. He would ask me,
• 33:26
  Speaker 3: can he do that? I don't worry him. It's fine,
• 33:28
  Speaker 3: it's okay. He would ask anybody, he would question anybody.
• 33:32
  Speaker 3: I'm sure him in a question me. Occasually, my cap
• 33:35
  Speaker 3: can you do this? And I can understand. Also for Jimmy,
• 33:38
  Speaker 3: he was also he was probably he was probably reporting
• 33:43
  Speaker 3: to some high higher authority. I don't know, mag not sure.
• 33:47
  Speaker 3: So he had somebody to report to. Somebody was giving money.
• 33:51
  Speaker 3: Obviously we are getting our bags and being paid and
• 33:55
  Speaker 3: it was all nice and.
• 33:56
  Speaker 2: Good cash mostly cash.
• 33:58
  Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, it's good case. But for me really going
• 34:03
  Speaker 3: back to our connection, really, I think my main main
• 34:07
  Speaker 3: goal was to he's the pressure and get you really
• 34:11
  Speaker 3: into the world of what is important to me. Even
• 34:14
  Speaker 3: if this movie never gets made, I felt it would
• 34:16
  Speaker 3: be great value for you to go through the process
• 34:20
  Speaker 3: to prepare you at least what's the proper way and
• 34:24
  Speaker 3: the next time you get into many kind of productions
• 34:26
  Speaker 3: of that's how we do it this way, that way,
• 34:29
  Speaker 3: that way, and not really the other way. And I
• 34:32
  Speaker 3: think we managed to do it.
• 34:34
  Speaker 2: You basically were my film school, a second film school
• 34:39
  Speaker 2: with this whole project, and I was it's a film
• 34:42
  Speaker 2: history class and also a production class on how to
• 34:45
  Speaker 2: actually Between you and and the first a d Frank,
• 34:49
  Speaker 2: they you two taught me how to make a movie,
• 34:52
  Speaker 2: like how to actually make a feature film. And I
• 34:55
  Speaker 2: could have done that if Jimmy wasn't around.
• 34:58
  Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, well frank was fantastic guy to have around.
• 35:01
  Speaker 3: I mean you have to say, you have to really
• 35:03
  Speaker 3: consider that you're so lucky to have frank somebody of that,
• 35:06
  Speaker 3: that knowledge and experience, and also the calmness, I mean,
• 35:12
  Speaker 3: the way he was handling any situation like a really
• 35:14
  Speaker 3: good seasoned ad would. There is nothing that can take
• 35:19
  Speaker 3: him out of his bands and that was the greatest
• 35:21
  Speaker 3: thing to have. Anybody else, I would say, would freak
• 35:23
  Speaker 3: out and run for his life. Not Frankie. Frankly is
• 35:27
  Speaker 3: a good guy. He knew how to do it right away,
• 35:31
  Speaker 3: and well, for me, it was really I kind of
• 35:33
  Speaker 3: took row of a mentor, which I do nowadays regularly
• 35:39
  Speaker 3: with the younger cinematographers, and I enjoy doing that. I
• 35:44
  Speaker 3: enjoy sharing knowledge because I always find out it's the
• 35:50
  Speaker 3: two way street. And working with somebody who does not
• 35:53
  Speaker 3: have maybe that much experience, well, the value of somebody
• 35:58
  Speaker 3: who doesn't have much experience is the freedom, you know,
• 36:02
  Speaker 3: as much as getting a knowledge, getting unication and learning
• 36:05
  Speaker 3: the craft. Learning what you do is great and gives
• 36:08
  Speaker 3: you confidence and knowledge and skill, But other hand, a
• 36:11
  Speaker 3: little bit of maybe kay gives you far more freedom
• 36:15
  Speaker 3: to be unconventional, and I think for somebody who gets
• 36:19
  Speaker 3: a little bit seasoned, it's always good to be reminded
• 36:23
  Speaker 3: that there is another powerless, a structured approach to do
• 36:29
  Speaker 3: the same thing. So for me it was like, okay, well,
• 36:32
  Speaker 3: I think between your freedom in doing things and between
• 36:37
  Speaker 3: my pragmatic, logical way of planning it, because at the
• 36:42
  Speaker 3: end that's how SIMI whatever fy is, I think we
• 36:45
  Speaker 3: can find nice balance, and I think we did except
• 36:48
  Speaker 3: in our shop.
• 36:49
  Speaker 2: So basically you were the spot to myke kirk, so.
• 36:52
  Speaker 3: To speak, as we say back in Eastern Europe.
• 36:56
  Speaker 2: Yes, what was the worst day you saw? First of
• 37:01
  Speaker 2: all your worst day and my worst day that you
• 37:04
  Speaker 2: saw from your perspective. I'd love to if you remember
• 37:06
  Speaker 2: anything specifically.
• 37:10
  Speaker 3: I think my worst day it was not really necessarily
• 37:12
  Speaker 3: my worst day, but it was worse day for everybody.
• 37:16
  Speaker 2: Nine eleven, Yes, yes, that was.
• 37:21
  Speaker 3: Day when we knew things will be different, and that
• 37:28
  Speaker 3: definitely set it down for quite a lot of things.
• 37:31
  Speaker 2: But you weren't on the production during nine to eleven,
• 37:33
  Speaker 2: yet you came after. I came after, right, So on
• 37:36
  Speaker 2: actual production, on the actual production, on actual production and
• 37:39
  Speaker 2: I know it was just a week away before I came. Yeah,
• 37:43
  Speaker 2: it happened a week before again, so it was still
• 37:44
  Speaker 2: in the air.
• 37:46
  Speaker 3: Yes, but he was very much present. I would say
• 37:48
  Speaker 3: the worst. The worst, or let's say more like bringing
• 37:56
  Speaker 3: down to reality day was the fact that when our
• 37:59
  Speaker 3: production designed them went first to Jimmy's office to ask
• 38:03
  Speaker 3: to be released to lose some other project, and when
• 38:10
  Speaker 3: Jimmy turned and almost touched him for daring to ask
• 38:16
  Speaker 3: such a thing, because obviously Jimmy saw this is a
• 38:19
  Speaker 3: personal betrayal, and I guess in his mind, when you commitment,
• 38:24
  Speaker 3: he owes you. That's just how it is. So basically
• 38:27
  Speaker 3: I realized that he oweses we are really props. We're
• 38:31
  Speaker 3: really like like extras in the drama in the world
• 38:35
  Speaker 3: that he created for himself to tell the story about
• 38:40
  Speaker 3: himself well at Redemption. Really, so that was a thing like, Okay,
• 38:45
  Speaker 3: that's going to be interesting. How do I get out
• 38:48
  Speaker 3: of this?
• 38:49
  Speaker 2: Yeah, because I think that was the moment that it
• 38:52
  Speaker 2: dawned on you like, oh, wait a minute, I can't leave.
• 38:56
  Speaker 2: Like I was having fun, but like all of a sudden,
• 38:58
  Speaker 2: like wait a minute, I I have to figure out
• 39:01
  Speaker 2: how to get out of here because you're in a
• 39:02
  Speaker 2: different state. I mean it, you know, you just can't
• 39:06
  Speaker 2: walk away, you know, all that kind of stuff. So
• 39:09
  Speaker 2: it must have been it must have been interesting for
• 39:12
  Speaker 2: you because you and Frank were the only two La
• 39:14
  Speaker 2: guys at the time. Everybody else was local, so you
• 39:19
  Speaker 2: guys were in a unique situation. You were living out
• 39:21
  Speaker 2: of a hotel, you know, you you were making your
• 39:25
  Speaker 2: sandwiches and bringing them in for lunch because there was
• 39:27
  Speaker 2: no catering.
• 39:28
  Speaker 3: No, no, yeah, that was that was very interesting routine
• 39:32
  Speaker 3: how we had it. But to me, it was very Yeah.
• 39:37
  Speaker 3: It was me and Frank is the only two guys,
• 39:39
  Speaker 3: and we've been talking about okay after that, like Frank,
• 39:42
  Speaker 3: what do we do? And Frank was like, I really
• 39:45
  Speaker 3: don't know, you know, I'm sure, Uh, there must be
• 39:49
  Speaker 3: some kind of scenario and if we're just saible to
• 39:53
  Speaker 3: find the moment that has to be perfect storms sold
• 39:56
  Speaker 3: to speak of elements.
• 39:58
  Speaker 2: We'll be right back after a wh from our sponsor,
• 40:04
  Speaker 2: and now back to the show.
• 40:07
  Speaker 3: For Jimmy to be open for the idea, but seeing
• 40:13
  Speaker 3: how he reacted on our production designer's request to let
• 40:17
  Speaker 3: him go and barely managed to get the live off
• 40:21
  Speaker 3: the office. To me, there was a sign I was
• 40:23
  Speaker 3: that gotta be easy, and I was thinking about it
• 40:26
  Speaker 3: because obviously realized not as fun as we had, and
• 40:29
  Speaker 3: we had fun. It was fun. We're doing things. But okay,
• 40:32
  Speaker 3: that's enough, let's close this hructer. Let's move on. I
• 40:34
  Speaker 3: have other projects lined up and career to take care of,
• 40:38
  Speaker 3: and I cannot just hang out in beautiful, sweet sweet
• 40:43
  Speaker 3: on top of the hotel in Penthouse. I mean, it's
• 40:47
  Speaker 3: all nice. I'm not complaining. It was all great. I
• 40:49
  Speaker 3: switted really well, even the sandwiches I was making because
• 40:53
  Speaker 3: I got tired of local pool, Like, can I just
• 40:54
  Speaker 3: make my own sandwich? Nice knife?
• 40:58
  Speaker 2: And as we do it in European, yes, you cut
• 41:01
  Speaker 2: your cut your sandwiches with the life and for.
• 41:04
  Speaker 3: You to be civilized, and and so that was a
• 41:08
  Speaker 3: kind of all these elements until the finally I get
• 41:12
  Speaker 3: an idea that Christmas was coming, and that's like, that's
• 41:16
  Speaker 3: the opportunity that's like signed for me. If any day
• 41:20
  Speaker 3: in a whole year, if any opportunity can be perfect
• 41:24
  Speaker 3: excuse to champ the ship, it's a Christmas And that's
• 41:27
  Speaker 3: what I did. I'm i to the office trying to
• 41:30
  Speaker 3: be as calm as I could imagine and get you
• 41:34
  Speaker 3: in a good mood and chat, chat and chat and
• 41:37
  Speaker 3: kind of a passing mention that you know, the Christmas
• 41:39
  Speaker 3: is coming, would be so nice if I could spend
• 41:42
  Speaker 3: it with my family, and he looked at me like
• 41:44
  Speaker 3: what are you telling me? Like no loger, thinking what
• 41:49
  Speaker 3: would happen? I could be it would it be so
• 41:50
  Speaker 3: nice if I could maybe spend But but of course
• 41:55
  Speaker 3: I'm committed to you. I mean, I'm part of this,
• 41:57
  Speaker 3: unmarried to this project. And then you know you can
• 42:01
  Speaker 3: count on me. And he looked at me kind of
• 42:03
  Speaker 3: like are you being on me? Like I've never ever
• 42:08
  Speaker 3: my word, I'm committed to this, but you can count
• 42:12
  Speaker 3: on this that the moment you need me, I'm there
• 42:14
  Speaker 3: for you. And then he said, well, if you really
• 42:18
  Speaker 3: want to go see your family, I can understand it.
• 42:22
  Speaker 3: You know, go but be back, of course. And there
• 42:25
  Speaker 3: was a moment when of course I had everything backed
• 42:28
  Speaker 3: and ready just in case it works, and get in
• 42:32
  Speaker 3: a car, drove pick up my stuff and I was
• 42:35
  Speaker 3: on the flight like.
• 42:36
  Speaker 2: Two hours later, ready and Frank was right behind you.
• 42:41
  Speaker 3: Frank was right behind me, So I guess Frank realized, oh,
• 42:43
  Speaker 3: that's maybe the moment when Jimmy is softened up, and
• 42:48
  Speaker 3: he kind of used that as a same kind of
• 42:51
  Speaker 3: like opening for him, and it worked.
• 42:54
  Speaker 2: I tell you, though, that was I'll never forget you
• 42:57
  Speaker 2: guys getting in the cab and driving away. I will
• 43:00
  Speaker 2: never I remember we were right off front of the
• 43:03
  Speaker 2: racetrack and you guys got in the car and you said,
• 43:07
  Speaker 2: you said to me, I'll be back, don't worry, I'll
• 43:09
  Speaker 2: be back, and I knew you were never coming back.
• 43:14
  Speaker 2: I knew, And that was honestly the saddest day out
• 43:17
  Speaker 2: of all the craziness that happened. That to me was
• 43:20
  Speaker 2: the saddest day because then I knew I was alone
• 43:23
  Speaker 2: again and I had no one to really protect me
• 43:28
  Speaker 2: or guide me or anything to be a barrier between
• 43:31
  Speaker 2: me and Jimmy. It was the saddest day of my
• 43:35
  Speaker 2: existence on that project.
• 43:36
  Speaker 3: I knew that, and I knew that, and I knew
• 43:40
  Speaker 3: this was going to probably happen, but we really didn't
• 43:45
  Speaker 3: feel like believing you're hanging out there, and we really
• 43:51
  Speaker 3: hope that our leaving the project will help with the
• 43:55
  Speaker 3: other had opened the door really wide saw that the
• 43:58
  Speaker 3: flood of people jumping the ship will really just happen,
• 44:03
  Speaker 3: and then eventually Jimmy might decide to put everything on
• 44:08
  Speaker 3: hold and let you kind of of the hook. We
• 44:11
  Speaker 3: hope for that, because it was clear Albius, especially when
• 44:14
  Speaker 3: we realized that twenty million dollar became fifteen, they became ten,
• 44:18
  Speaker 3: and the incredible shrinking budget and started getting smaller and smaller,
• 44:22
  Speaker 3: and then we realized, well, there must be some issue there,
• 44:25
  Speaker 3: but obviously the biggest issue was Jimmy, which it would
• 44:28
  Speaker 3: never realize.
• 44:30
  Speaker 2: And what was the worst day that you saw in
• 44:33
  Speaker 2: me from your perspective, I'm really curious to hear that
• 44:36
  Speaker 2: if you remember any worse specific day.
• 44:40
  Speaker 3: I don't know if there was really specific day, but
• 44:43
  Speaker 3: I think there are moments you had the days coming,
• 44:45
  Speaker 3: and there are usually these days of hyped up expectations
• 44:48
  Speaker 3: for you. I know that you did. You did take
• 44:52
  Speaker 3: a trip to meet some big actor and that looked
• 44:57
  Speaker 3: multiple multiple yes. So so I could see that every
• 45:02
  Speaker 3: time you would come back from any of these trips
• 45:05
  Speaker 3: meeting actors, that your spirit was broken more and more.
• 45:12
  Speaker 3: And I can see that you're realizing that the dream
• 45:14
  Speaker 3: that you'll be dreaming for months and months and months
• 45:18
  Speaker 3: is further further away of ever being realized. And I'm
• 45:22
  Speaker 3: also realizing I've been realizing that you know, you are
• 45:26
  Speaker 3: basically trapped without any any way out. So to me,
• 45:32
  Speaker 3: it's not one event, but there's been several of them,
• 45:34
  Speaker 3: especially if you had to do with you coming back
• 45:38
  Speaker 3: from these meetings with the actors and realizing that they
• 45:42
  Speaker 3: do not do it.
• 45:45
  Speaker 2: Those are they? Those were tough times. And what was
• 45:50
  Speaker 2: the one thing that you told me about moving to la.
• 45:55
  Speaker 3: And I think I told you, well, if you really
• 45:57
  Speaker 3: want to, if you're really serious about making movies, you
• 45:59
  Speaker 3: have to come to Hollywood.
• 46:02
  Speaker 2: And what was And the one thing you always told
• 46:03
  Speaker 2: me was the biggest regret you will ever have is
• 46:06
  Speaker 2: that you didn't do it earlier.
• 46:07
  Speaker 3: Yes, and there was another thing that you told you. Yes,
• 46:09
  Speaker 3: I remember it, you know, and you better do it
• 46:11
  Speaker 3: right away. Better do it right away, because yes, you
• 46:14
  Speaker 3: will have the biggest regret if you don't do this,
• 46:17
  Speaker 3: You will have the biggest regret not doing it. If
• 46:20
  Speaker 3: you do it later, well you regret not doing it,
• 46:23
  Speaker 3: not doing it earlier. But at the end, in the end,
• 46:26
  Speaker 3: I believe that things always happen, may be supposed to happen.
• 46:29
  Speaker 3: You know, there's a there's a there's a moment when
• 46:32
  Speaker 3: you have to act on your instinct or if something
• 46:36
  Speaker 3: tells you this instinct to do, then you do it.
• 46:38
  Speaker 3: Doing it maybe too early can be also damaging as
• 46:43
  Speaker 3: maybe more than not doing it at all. So I
• 46:47
  Speaker 3: think you.
• 46:49
  Speaker 2: You did the right thing.
• 46:50
  Speaker 3: You did, You evaluated everything, and you you you came
• 46:54
  Speaker 3: here when it was the right time in your life
• 46:56
  Speaker 3: for you to be here and do what you like
• 46:59
  Speaker 3: to do.
• 47:00
  Speaker 2: So, reviewing everything that we've gone through, you're one of
• 47:04
  Speaker 2: my oldest and dearest friends. We went through war together.
• 47:10
  Speaker 2: As these kind of relationships are built up on locations,
• 47:14
  Speaker 2: on productions, they're pretty intense. Ours was probably one of
• 47:19
  Speaker 2: the more intense ones you've ever dealt with with another
• 47:22
  Speaker 2: director in this sense, looking back at it at everything is,
• 47:31
  Speaker 2: what is the feeling that you have about the whole
• 47:34
  Speaker 2: experience that really kind of just rings to you at
• 47:37
  Speaker 2: this point looking back with the perspective of almost twenty
• 47:40
  Speaker 2: years back now, I mean, I can't believe we're saying
• 47:43
  Speaker 2: twenty years, but it's almost twenty years that we did this.
• 47:48
  Speaker 2: What's the thing that comes to your mind when you
• 47:52
  Speaker 2: kind of look at Jimmy and the experience and now
• 47:56
  Speaker 2: the book and how the story is finally going to
• 47:58
  Speaker 2: get out there to people, What's what's your feeling on
• 48:01
  Speaker 2: It never.
• 48:03
  Speaker 3: Fails to really amaze me when it comes down to
• 48:08
  Speaker 3: film industry, the range of people that business attracts, that's
• 48:13
  Speaker 3: really to me, it's it's most fascinating. And and that experience,
• 48:21
  Speaker 3: particularly experience on our film was so much different than
• 48:28
  Speaker 3: than anything I've ever experienced before or after, but proves
• 48:32
  Speaker 3: my point absolutely to to to to the core and
• 48:37
  Speaker 3: and really it's it's a case study of the madness,
• 48:42
  Speaker 3: the mayhem, but also determination. And I don't think that
• 48:49
  Speaker 3: any business that I know of brings people with so
• 48:55
  Speaker 3: much determination. And also I think it's a following the
• 48:59
  Speaker 3: dream people follow dream about being anything, being chef, being
• 49:03
  Speaker 3: I don't know, pilot, being doctor is a dreams. But
• 49:08
  Speaker 3: the intensity of the dream that people in the film
• 49:12
  Speaker 3: business are dreaming, I would say it's exponentially higher. So
• 49:18
  Speaker 3: no business I think other than really the closer experience
• 49:21
  Speaker 3: when it comes down to bonding, just being in pre
• 49:27
  Speaker 3: film production, pre production, the level you see what bonds people,
• 49:33
  Speaker 3: I think it's being it's really seemed best and worst
• 49:38
  Speaker 3: on everybody because the pressure creates environment that you cannot fall,
• 49:44
  Speaker 3: you cannot cheat, you cannot why you are who you are.
• 49:48
  Speaker 3: And the pressure really enables people to get to know
• 49:52
  Speaker 3: each other on much different level than you will normally do.
• 49:55
  Speaker 3: And that's why everybody says, but that's kind of closes
• 49:57
  Speaker 3: to you when you are in a war, when you're
• 49:59
  Speaker 3: in the trenches.
• 50:01
  Speaker 2: We'll be right back after a word from our sponsor,
• 50:07
  Speaker 2: and now back to the show.
• 50:10
  Speaker 3: You really get to know it because you rely you're
• 50:13
  Speaker 3: part of the team. It's not only you, it's about everybody.
• 50:16
  Speaker 3: So you know that if a person next to you
• 50:20
  Speaker 3: does not trust you, well, it's an effect on everybody
• 50:24
  Speaker 3: else and everything. So I think it's about the ultimate
• 50:28
  Speaker 3: team building experience when you're in your production that creates
• 50:33
  Speaker 3: this unity, that creates a coection, especially when you come
• 50:36
  Speaker 3: across the people that are on the same wave length,
• 50:39
  Speaker 3: so to speak, and they're on some different level connected.
• 50:43
  Speaker 3: That's the biggest value that you get out of experience.
• 50:47
  Speaker 2: And this the one thing I mentioned this in the book,
• 50:52
  Speaker 2: but I want to hear from your point of view.
• 50:53
  Speaker 2: You when you came back to LA you would tell
• 50:57
  Speaker 2: anybody who would listen about this story and have been
• 51:01
  Speaker 2: for the last twenty years. Is this true?
• 51:03
  Speaker 3: Yes, Yes, this was the best dinner conversation, that's party
• 51:06
  Speaker 3: conversation I had for the last many years.
• 51:10
  Speaker 2: It's still going. It's still going.
• 51:12
  Speaker 3: And every time you know, we hang out, you know,
• 51:14
  Speaker 3: the film people and everybody shares the horror stories from
• 51:17
  Speaker 3: the set and like, ah, let me tell you my story.
• 51:20
  Speaker 3: I'm on top of this. Absolutely nothing comes close to
• 51:25
  Speaker 3: this one. And so far, I mean, I never heard
• 51:28
  Speaker 3: anybody that talked to this story and any dinner or
• 51:31
  Speaker 3: party conversation because every time I mentioned Jimmy and what
• 51:35
  Speaker 3: we went through and what all happens everywhere, that's not possible, Like, well,
• 51:40
  Speaker 3: trust me, because if I tell them, yeah, it's really,
• 51:43
  Speaker 3: it's true.
• 51:44
  Speaker 2: And now you actually are going to be handing out
• 51:46
  Speaker 2: books to everybody.
• 51:48
  Speaker 3: I cannot wait to get the books and prove that
• 51:52
  Speaker 3: what I told them that the party was actually there
• 51:54
  Speaker 3: and it's and here it is now.
• 51:57
  Speaker 2: And it's also true that anytime I would show up
• 51:59
  Speaker 2: to one of these parties, your friends would would find
• 52:02
  Speaker 2: me and it would come to me and go, you're
• 52:05
  Speaker 2: is it true? We thought Boris was just joking is
• 52:08
  Speaker 2: it true? And I would have to sit there and
• 52:09
  Speaker 2: like validate your story.
• 52:11
  Speaker 3: That's right, that's right, and that brings even more like
• 52:15
  Speaker 3: expression of confusion and disbelief on anybody level. Also that
• 52:19
  Speaker 3: really was be true? Then how is this possible? So yeah,
• 52:23
  Speaker 3: I mean for sure, that's very very We ended up
• 52:26
  Speaker 3: playing such a We have quite a few good things
• 52:29
  Speaker 3: off of this.
• 52:29
  Speaker 2: Oh no, there was many, many good things that came
• 52:32
  Speaker 2: out of this experience. Obviously a great friendship over the years,
• 52:35
  Speaker 2: and it made me who I am today. And it's
• 52:39
  Speaker 2: also made me the grizzled independent filmmaker that I am
• 52:43
  Speaker 2: now because of it. So uh, and it was probably
• 52:46
  Speaker 2: one of the reasons why I wanted to launch indie
• 52:48
  Speaker 2: film Hustle, because I wanted to help others not to
• 52:51
  Speaker 2: do the same mistakes that I did.
• 52:53
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I think this will be perfect handbook for anybody
• 52:56
  Speaker 3: who is in the in the film hustle world, as
• 52:59
  Speaker 3: well as anybody who is just like for amusement quality
• 53:03
  Speaker 3: of the book itself, I think that's that's going to
• 53:06
  Speaker 3: be just amazing.
• 53:07
  Speaker 2: And without question, please explain to people who are listening,
• 53:14
  Speaker 2: because a lot of people were like, oh, this must
• 53:16
  Speaker 2: happen all the time, or this situation can't be this unique.
• 53:20
  Speaker 2: You've been now close to thirty years in the film business.
• 53:25
  Speaker 2: Let's say, let's twenty odd years, close to thirty. Lest
• 53:28
  Speaker 2: let's round it up, round it up. You're you're a
• 53:29
  Speaker 2: younger manser. But yes, let's just throw it out there.
• 53:32
  Speaker 3: Kindergarten.
• 53:33
  Speaker 2: In kindergarten, you started taking more obvious films.
• 53:38
  Speaker 3: They can understand you. If we do that, we make
• 53:39
  Speaker 3: movies in kindergarten, your more and then elementary school. And
• 53:43
  Speaker 3: that's why we have suchingle cinematographers. That's the key.
• 53:46
  Speaker 2: That's right, that's right. But please explain to the audience
• 53:50
  Speaker 2: how unique and ridiculous this and that this does not happen.
• 53:59
  Speaker 3: Well, it's really hard to explain the ridiculousness of all
• 54:04
  Speaker 3: this experience. I mean, every datail you bring telling the story.
• 54:10
  Speaker 3: In my case, just if I say how I get
• 54:12
  Speaker 3: the film, it's already like a com on so no, no, no,
• 54:16
  Speaker 3: but there is more, and I bring up ida, Oh no,
• 54:19
  Speaker 3: there's no way. And then when I say, oh yeah,
• 54:21
  Speaker 3: and by the way, and I or no, that can't
• 54:23
  Speaker 3: be possible. So the level of ridiculousness in this whole
• 54:29
  Speaker 3: experience It's something that is really hard to match. And
• 54:34
  Speaker 3: that's why only us who really lived and experienced through
• 54:39
  Speaker 3: this can really truly understand how this was possible, that
• 54:44
  Speaker 3: we went through this and then added whatever happens to us.
• 54:50
  Speaker 3: But I think for everybody who reads the book, I'm
• 54:54
  Speaker 3: sure there would be people who say, no, that was
• 54:56
  Speaker 3: all no way, that was all like blown out off portion.
• 55:00
  Speaker 3: And it's okay to think that way. It's fine. It's
• 55:03
  Speaker 3: fine because for a lot of people there will be
• 55:05
  Speaker 3: no point of reference in their own personal experience to say, oh, yeah,
• 55:10
  Speaker 3: I've seen that. Yeah. Maybe they say they will recognize
• 55:12
  Speaker 3: the episodes and say, oh yeah, yeah, I remember also
• 55:14
  Speaker 3: that when we ended up scouting for strip club with
• 55:19
  Speaker 3: an up scouting entire state to find out the best
• 55:21
  Speaker 3: strip club for half page scene. Yeah, I'm sure there
• 55:25
  Speaker 3: will be people like that, Oh yeah, we're also the
• 55:27
  Speaker 3: producer who will hang up on the phone. Yeah. But
• 55:30
  Speaker 3: all these puzzles, all these audience together, it's something that's
• 55:33
  Speaker 3: I think, very hard to match. But it's also what
• 55:37
  Speaker 3: I get out of this experience is nothing ever surprises
• 55:44
  Speaker 3: me anymore. And I've been to some tough productions since then,
• 55:49
  Speaker 3: quite few, but that's okay. That's kind of like okay,
• 55:53
  Speaker 3: once you have this experience, when you have points that
• 55:57
  Speaker 3: it's hard to matches like a been there, it's worse.
• 56:00
  Speaker 3: It's nothing like you the dog. Oh that's nothing. Always
• 56:05
  Speaker 3: shot four of course that's nothing but character, that's nothing.
• 56:11
  Speaker 3: So for me on kind of that's nothing. And that's
• 56:14
  Speaker 3: a great place to be, like whenever you get in
• 56:16
  Speaker 3: production and things are really tough and Babel it would
• 56:21
  Speaker 3: be so because I know I've seen better, I live
• 56:23
  Speaker 3: to I've seen worse. I live to worse.
• 56:28
  Speaker 2: Now there has been already there's going to be this
• 56:31
  Speaker 2: question after the book comes out, and it's already you know,
• 56:34
  Speaker 2: from the few industry people that I've read it before
• 56:37
  Speaker 2: it comes out, about the movie, the movie version. It
• 56:41
  Speaker 2: is a question that's asked constantly in any of my interviews.
• 56:44
  Speaker 2: It's constantly asked by anybody, is it this would make
• 56:48
  Speaker 2: a great movie. Originally your idea for me was to
• 56:52
  Speaker 2: write a screenplay. I said I didn't want to write
• 56:55
  Speaker 2: the screenplay, and the book came out. I think it's
• 56:57
  Speaker 2: much better that the book came out first because I
• 56:59
  Speaker 2: got the whole story out. The screenplay can't encompass the
• 57:03
  Speaker 2: entire story. So what is your feeling of the movie idea,
• 57:08
  Speaker 2: first of all getting made one day, and secondly, if
• 57:12
  Speaker 2: the movie does go through. Obviously I'm the only director
• 57:16
  Speaker 2: that I will allow on the project, and you are
• 57:18
  Speaker 2: the only cinematographer that I will allow on this project.
• 57:22
  Speaker 2: What's your feeling on first of the movie and then
• 57:25
  Speaker 2: us being part of the movie.
• 57:27
  Speaker 3: Well, here's the thing. The movie itself, and I always say,
• 57:32
  Speaker 3: this is still one of the best scripts I read.
• 57:35
  Speaker 2: The movie of the of the of Jimmy's Moviems movie, right.
• 57:39
  Speaker 3: Movie Dreams movie. The script itself, it was great. It
• 57:43
  Speaker 3: was if we made.
• 57:47
  Speaker 2: It, it could have done something, you have done something.
• 57:49
  Speaker 3: I think it had the protectial.
• 57:51
  Speaker 2: I agree.
• 57:52
  Speaker 3: The story is interesting and all, and it's very colorful,
• 57:56
  Speaker 3: and the characters are colorful, and something is color for and.
• 57:59
  Speaker 2: It was a unique, it was a unique take on it.
• 58:01
  Speaker 3: It's maybe very you know, yes, it is kind of
• 58:04
  Speaker 3: like Get another Mafia movie, but with a little bit
• 58:08
  Speaker 3: more personal family. Yeah, you know, so I would see
• 58:13
  Speaker 3: I could see that. I could see that what would say,
• 58:14
  Speaker 3: this film, apart from anything else our film making off
• 58:19
  Speaker 3: that film would be something that well, you remember I
• 58:22
  Speaker 3: kept telling you during the pre production and the worst
• 58:25
  Speaker 3: thing that we're missing here that we don't have surveillance
• 58:29
  Speaker 3: cameras broadcasting twenty four hours what's happening in production, And
• 58:33
  Speaker 3: that could have been the best film ever made. About
• 58:38
  Speaker 3: making off of the movie that was never made, but
• 58:41
  Speaker 3: we didn't think about it. We just joked about it.
• 58:44
  Speaker 3: But now in hindsight, when we think about it, like, wow,
• 58:46
  Speaker 3: I wish we had the cameras. It would have been
• 58:48
  Speaker 3: so great to have cameras and get all these precious
• 58:51
  Speaker 3: moments recorded. So if this movie ever gets made, making
• 58:56
  Speaker 3: off the movie, I think that could be so interesting
• 59:01
  Speaker 3: because I remember back maybe around the same time, there
• 59:07
  Speaker 3: was a movie called Room about crazy filmmaker who coincidentually
• 59:15
  Speaker 3: a couple friends of mine worked on. And when they
• 59:18
  Speaker 3: told me, when they told me, what was experienced working
• 59:22
  Speaker 3: on this film the Room, which is probably as crazy
• 59:24
  Speaker 3: as it can get, I no one away. I ended
• 59:29
  Speaker 3: up seeing the Room actually couple of times I've seen.
• 59:32
  Speaker 3: I went through the screaming and it was the craziest,
• 59:36
  Speaker 3: the most ridiculous thing I've ever seen, and became a cult.
• 59:39
  Speaker 3: It had a following and still has a following. Midnight
• 59:42
  Speaker 3: screaming there was a whole and then somebody heard about
• 59:45
  Speaker 3: it and they made movie disaster Artists about making a
• 59:50
  Speaker 3: movie about how they made the movie The Room with
• 59:52
  Speaker 3: the crazy guy who was a director of producer everything,
• 59:57
  Speaker 3: and it was successful.
• 1:00:00
  Speaker 2: Will be right back after a word from our sponsor,
• 1:00:06
  Speaker 2: and now back to the show.
• 1:00:09
  Speaker 3: It was really successful. So for a lot of people
• 1:00:11
  Speaker 3: who have not even seen the movie rule it was
• 1:00:15
  Speaker 3: just enough to see the movie about making it to
• 1:00:18
  Speaker 3: make it really great film. So I feel the same
• 1:00:21
  Speaker 3: way about this film. If we would make it one day, well,
• 1:00:27
  Speaker 3: that would be fantastic to read it this time forever.
• 1:00:33
  Speaker 2: But the question I had, because I always tell people
• 1:00:36
  Speaker 2: this that you know, I always use the critique Jimmy,
• 1:00:40
  Speaker 2: and you did too, that this movie he was an
• 1:00:43
  Speaker 2: ego maniagomaniac because he was making a movie about He's
• 1:00:47
  Speaker 2: producing a movie about his own life. And I had
• 1:00:52
  Speaker 2: never really seen a producer produce a film about their
• 1:00:55
  Speaker 2: own life. Generally speaking, it's not something that's done. But
• 1:00:59
  Speaker 2: then of course I would take it to the next
• 1:01:01
  Speaker 2: level where that I only would not only produce, I
• 1:01:03
  Speaker 2: would direct and write a movie about my life and
• 1:01:07
  Speaker 2: have me in the scene and then you would be
• 1:01:09
  Speaker 2: there next to me. So then, now, how surreal and
• 1:01:13
  Speaker 2: meta would it be that I would be directing a
• 1:01:16
  Speaker 2: scene with you and me as the characters, and then
• 1:01:20
  Speaker 2: you would be there where the actor playing you, which
• 1:01:22
  Speaker 2: would obviously Sasha born Coin.
• 1:01:25
  Speaker 3: There is the yes, absolutely, I think this would be
• 1:01:27
  Speaker 3: so unique and I don't think it's ever done in
• 1:01:29
  Speaker 3: the history of cinema. So there is a point that
• 1:01:32
  Speaker 3: we have to break the new ground here, right, That's
• 1:01:34
  Speaker 3: really what it is. And as part of such a
• 1:01:36
  Speaker 3: bottom Coin, well, you know, I have to think about
• 1:01:39
  Speaker 3: I have to look at the RESUMESM really do the
• 1:01:42
  Speaker 3: screen test. I mean, cinematographer in this particular story is
• 1:01:48
  Speaker 3: such a crucial part. It's almost as equally as important
• 1:01:51
  Speaker 3: as the directory, maybe even more important than director.
• 1:01:53
  Speaker 2: I would disagree, but go ahead.
• 1:01:55
  Speaker 3: So we have to really think about complexity of the
• 1:01:57
  Speaker 3: character and how is simple to bring all these nuances.
• 1:02:02
  Speaker 3: God Boris is very complex, God, oh Jesus, and it
• 1:02:06
  Speaker 3: has the Communicut, his his historic background, his education, his
• 1:02:10
  Speaker 3: cultural heritage, aside from his artistic skill, and a whole
• 1:02:16
  Speaker 3: philosophy when it comes down to telling the story visually.
• 1:02:21
  Speaker 3: So yeah, I agree, maybe such a bottle coin would
• 1:02:24
  Speaker 3: be as close as we can get to get the
• 1:02:28
  Speaker 3: character of Borish me as very true to the life.
• 1:02:33
  Speaker 2: I'm rethinking the whole Boris character in general. We might
• 1:02:36
  Speaker 2: have to tone it down a little bit. You might
• 1:02:38
  Speaker 2: just have one or two scenes there. You should make
• 1:02:42
  Speaker 2: it on the poster. You should be the front most.
• 1:02:44
  Speaker 3: You should be on the poster because because he's such
• 1:02:47
  Speaker 3: a crucial part of the story.
• 1:02:49
  Speaker 2: Without without question, I think it would be. It would
• 1:02:52
  Speaker 2: obviously be a very unique experience. I can't even I
• 1:02:57
  Speaker 2: can't even think about making a movie like this without you.
• 1:03:01
  Speaker 2: So it just has to happen. If it has I mean,
• 1:03:04
  Speaker 2: I can't have another cinematography do this, it have to
• 1:03:06
  Speaker 2: be you. Frank is no longer with us. He has
• 1:03:10
  Speaker 2: since passed, but I would have loved to have Frank
• 1:03:14
  Speaker 2: on this on this project as well. But between I mean,
• 1:03:20
  Speaker 2: having you would be there would be so surreal. I
• 1:03:23
  Speaker 2: think we might break the space time continuum.
• 1:03:27
  Speaker 3: I have a feeling the right way to do this
• 1:03:29
  Speaker 3: would be to go back to the original location, to
• 1:03:31
  Speaker 3: the crime scene and go to the same race truck,
• 1:03:35
  Speaker 3: get back to the same production office as we have
• 1:03:37
  Speaker 3: their album, make up Pacrino and start production there, which
• 1:03:40
  Speaker 3: can also serve as location for the movie. And I
• 1:03:45
  Speaker 3: think also, really, I think everybody who participated in the
• 1:03:48
  Speaker 3: original movie would be great, So bring them all.
• 1:03:52
  Speaker 2: Back, wouldn't that be amazing?
• 1:03:53
  Speaker 3: That would be really campastic. By now, I'm sure many
• 1:03:56
  Speaker 3: of them have very good, successful careers, so might be
• 1:03:59
  Speaker 3: the major stepping down, but doesn't matter. They can still
• 1:04:02
  Speaker 3: be pa better than you know. I hope he get it,
• 1:04:04
  Speaker 3: and so I think that would be a really the
• 1:04:07
  Speaker 3: right way to do this. The question is how Jimmy.
• 1:04:11
  Speaker 2: That was the question. What do you think? What do
• 1:04:13
  Speaker 2: you think Jimmy is going to do when he sees
• 1:04:16
  Speaker 2: because this will eventually get to him.
• 1:04:19
  Speaker 3: Well, it's hard to predict. As we know, Jimmy is
• 1:04:23
  Speaker 3: very hard to predict type of guy. He might have
• 1:04:26
  Speaker 3: his own idea and I think the biggest problem, the
• 1:04:30
  Speaker 3: biggest issue he would have is that he would be
• 1:04:33
  Speaker 3: taken out of equation the whole process, so he would
• 1:04:36
  Speaker 3: not like that. On other hand, including him in whatever capacity,
• 1:04:42
  Speaker 3: even just to play himself, who knows, that might open
• 1:04:47
  Speaker 3: whole possibility. But I don't think it's ever going to happen.
• 1:04:51
  Speaker 2: No, it will not happen. Not on my set, sir.
• 1:04:53
  Speaker 2: I'm sorry, that will not happen. We are not casting
• 1:04:57
  Speaker 2: Jimmy to play Jimmy, but we can bring him.
• 1:04:59
  Speaker 3: We can bring him as a consultant.
• 1:05:01
  Speaker 2: I think absolutely not. I don't want there's no consulting.
• 1:05:05
  Speaker 2: There's nothing I want Jimmy to do on this film,
• 1:05:08
  Speaker 2: nothing whatsoever. So if anything, we might be able to
• 1:05:11
  Speaker 2: give him a ticket to the premiere.
• 1:05:13
  Speaker 3: I think we will need to have a beef up
• 1:05:15
  Speaker 3: security if anything else on the production.
• 1:05:17
  Speaker 2: Oh that I give that. I guarantee you are going
• 1:05:19
  Speaker 2: to have beef up and you and I will have
• 1:05:21
  Speaker 2: personal bodyguards walking around with us at all times.
• 1:05:23
  Speaker 3: Of course I will not do it in any other way.
• 1:05:26
  Speaker 2: But in all honesty, though, what do you think Jimmy
• 1:05:28
  Speaker 2: will do when he when he sees this?
• 1:05:32
  Speaker 3: I think here's here's the thing. He would of course
• 1:05:37
  Speaker 3: be very happy because he is important part of the story.
• 1:05:41
  Speaker 3: So for him it will stroke his able really nicely.
• 1:05:45
  Speaker 3: And you motorize, immortalize him as a Jimmy forever, and
• 1:05:51
  Speaker 3: that's something I'm sure he would love. I think that
• 1:05:53
  Speaker 3: he would not love. Well, it will not be filmed.
• 1:05:56
  Speaker 3: If you wanted to make about himself. It's about us,
• 1:05:59
  Speaker 3: it's about the just where he's just important part but
• 1:06:03
  Speaker 3: not the key player in all the story. So marginalizing
• 1:06:07
  Speaker 3: Jimmy as a character in all this story structure would
• 1:06:11
  Speaker 3: be something he would don't be happy about.
• 1:06:13
  Speaker 2: I mean, he won't be the star, but he is
• 1:06:14
  Speaker 2: the main protagonist. Excuse me, the antagonist.
• 1:06:18
  Speaker 3: He is called also starring character starring the Boris.
• 1:06:24
  Speaker 2: Okay, Boris is not top villing. Can I have to please?
• 1:06:36
  Speaker 2: You know, like Jimmy and Jimmy and the driver, And
• 1:06:42
  Speaker 2: you think that he would that would be the problem
• 1:06:45
  Speaker 2: he has, I think don't want to find out.
• 1:06:46
  Speaker 3: Who is to make it as soon as possible and
• 1:06:48
  Speaker 3: see what really reaction would be.
• 1:06:50
  Speaker 2: Well, he's gonna hear the book before the movie is made.
• 1:06:53
  Speaker 2: That's no question. The book will get out before the movies.
• 1:06:55
  Speaker 2: I mean no question. Yes, because we are recording this
• 1:06:59
  Speaker 2: prior to the release of the book. You know we
• 1:07:02
  Speaker 2: haven't spoken. Well, maybe we'll do another one when we
• 1:07:04
  Speaker 2: speak after the book has been released, maybe after it
• 1:07:07
  Speaker 2: gets a little pressed. We'll see what happens. But right
• 1:07:10
  Speaker 2: now this is being this is being recorded before the
• 1:07:13
  Speaker 2: book is released, so we have no idea, what will
• 1:07:16
  Speaker 2: happen to the book? What what? What will go on?
• 1:07:19
  Speaker 2: We have no idea. So this is a very interesting
• 1:07:21
  Speaker 2: place to be.
• 1:07:23
  Speaker 3: Yes, definitely interesting place to be, and I'm very happy
• 1:07:25
  Speaker 3: to be in this place, even though people read real boris.
• 1:07:32
  Speaker 2: But I think that one day will I think the
• 1:07:35
  Speaker 2: real boys will step out of the shadows.
• 1:07:36
  Speaker 3: One day, I hope I will be proud one day
• 1:07:38
  Speaker 3: to bring the key lect on me and find the opinions, relieve,
• 1:07:42
  Speaker 3: release the idea of the cool boys.
• 1:07:46
  Speaker 2: And one last question or two last questions. They kind
• 1:07:50
  Speaker 2: of are similar. What did you feel when you first
• 1:07:55
  Speaker 2: read the book? But the whole thing from cover to
• 1:07:58
  Speaker 2: cover when you first read it, what was the first
• 1:08:02
  Speaker 2: thing that came to you?
• 1:08:04
  Speaker 3: It all? It was allike to me. Reading the book
• 1:08:07
  Speaker 3: was like a big closer, big closer as much for
• 1:08:11
  Speaker 3: you was also closer away for me because I remember
• 1:08:17
  Speaker 3: a year or more before that when I made a
• 1:08:21
  Speaker 3: phone call and called you and told you, hey, I
• 1:08:23
  Speaker 3: just heard Jimmy on the radio. I don't believe this
• 1:08:27
  Speaker 3: guy's still around and still doing the same thing. Something
• 1:08:30
  Speaker 3: needs to be done about it. And I told you, hey,
• 1:08:32
  Speaker 3: I read the book and you did it. Because I
• 1:08:35
  Speaker 3: knew that you need to get it out of your system.
• 1:08:37
  Speaker 3: That's important. There was something that was always like we
• 1:08:40
  Speaker 3: would always over the years reference it, make joke, always
• 1:08:44
  Speaker 3: crack the jokes, kind of revisit the moments, and but
• 1:08:48
  Speaker 3: I knew that there is far more to the story
• 1:08:51
  Speaker 3: than what you and I went through and you and
• 1:08:53
  Speaker 3: I joked about. So for me, finally when I read
• 1:08:56
  Speaker 3: the book, I got the whole picture. I got the
• 1:08:59
  Speaker 3: whole picture like, oh, that's what's about. And I knew
• 1:09:03
  Speaker 3: that was a chapter that you needed to close for
• 1:09:05
  Speaker 3: your own sanity, for your own sake of mind. And
• 1:09:10
  Speaker 3: and it's also I think it was a good place
• 1:09:13
  Speaker 3: to go to revisit where you started and where you
• 1:09:18
  Speaker 3: are right now. Can you kind of give you some
• 1:09:20
  Speaker 3: kind of validation of your own personal existence in your
• 1:09:24
  Speaker 3: personal life. So to me, that was the thing I loved.
• 1:09:27
  Speaker 3: I loved the book very much from the beginning when
• 1:09:29
  Speaker 3: I started reading, especially chapter about bodies that was really
• 1:09:33
  Speaker 3: very very inspirational. And but for me it was really
• 1:09:38
  Speaker 3: like I read it him one you know what, you know,
• 1:09:39
  Speaker 3: like in one continuous chuck of time. That's how I
• 1:09:45
  Speaker 3: think compelling read it is regardous. I was part of it,
• 1:09:49
  Speaker 3: and I could relate to many characters, to many events.
• 1:09:52
  Speaker 3: But as a journey the book takes people, it takes
• 1:09:56
  Speaker 3: really their on.
• 1:09:58
  Speaker 2: We'll be right back after a word from our sponsor,
• 1:10:04
  Speaker 2: and now back to the show.
• 1:10:07
  Speaker 3: Even if it's home completely fictional, I think it's just
• 1:10:11
  Speaker 3: one and it's great world to be immersed in, even
• 1:10:16
  Speaker 3: for a great point in time.
• 1:10:20
  Speaker 2: And when you held the book in your hand, I
• 1:10:23
  Speaker 2: just did that recently. I gave you a full book
• 1:10:26
  Speaker 2: because you read the digital version. When you saw it
• 1:10:28
  Speaker 2: with the cover and everything, where did you feel, well, you.
• 1:10:33
  Speaker 3: Know, book is a document and it's surreal, and I
• 1:10:39
  Speaker 3: hope this book is going to stay in somewhere in
• 1:10:42
  Speaker 3: some archives and library of comers. So whatever is going
• 1:10:44
  Speaker 3: to whoever is going to give this book for generations
• 1:10:47
  Speaker 3: and generations. So for me it was it was real
• 1:10:51
  Speaker 3: final closure for you, for us, for anybody who was
• 1:10:55
  Speaker 3: part of this. It was like, Okay, this thing is
• 1:10:58
  Speaker 3: not real, and now this thing is going to go
• 1:11:01
  Speaker 3: out there and we have part of life, so many
• 1:11:05
  Speaker 3: many people out there, so now you have the real
• 1:11:08
  Speaker 3: thing in your hand, and that, to me, it was
• 1:11:10
  Speaker 3: a great moment of comb.
• 1:11:13
  Speaker 2: Of course, thank you so much for the inspiration to
• 1:11:17
  Speaker 2: write the book, for the nudging that you've been giving
• 1:11:21
  Speaker 2: me for the last twenty years. Every time do you
• 1:11:24
  Speaker 2: tell me to do something, it takes me a little
• 1:11:26
  Speaker 2: bit to get around. You told me to move to
• 1:11:28
  Speaker 2: La took me about sixty seven years to do that,
• 1:11:31
  Speaker 2: and you pushed me for seventeen years or so to
• 1:11:35
  Speaker 2: put to write this book or to write to tell
• 1:11:37
  Speaker 2: the story. But I finally got it done. So I
• 1:11:40
  Speaker 2: want to thank you so much from the bottom of
• 1:11:42
  Speaker 2: my heart that you did that and for everything you
• 1:11:45
  Speaker 2: did while I was going through the most difficult time
• 1:11:49
  Speaker 2: of my entire life.
• 1:11:50
  Speaker 3: Well, thank you for taking me along with the journey,
• 1:11:53
  Speaker 3: and I'm very happy that I can. I can push
• 1:11:56
  Speaker 3: in the right direction. Man. Then when you listen to
• 1:11:58
  Speaker 3: me at the Airballs, result is something that you appreciate
• 1:12:02
  Speaker 3: and it makes me feel good too, so that means
• 1:12:04
  Speaker 3: I'm not as crazy as I might be. But as
• 1:12:08
  Speaker 3: we said, be can all come to this SPACEBA and
• 1:12:10
  Speaker 3: thank you and hope to see who again is something exciting.
• 1:12:17
  Speaker 2: I truly want to thank Boris for putting himself out
• 1:12:21
  Speaker 2: there and doing this interview for not only me, but
• 1:12:25
  Speaker 2: for the tribe and to kind of, you know, set
• 1:12:28
  Speaker 2: the record straight that this this is not this is
• 1:12:31
  Speaker 2: not just me, guys. I mean I have proof. I
• 1:12:34
  Speaker 2: have people who say that this is a true story.
• 1:12:37
  Speaker 2: So I really really want you guys to read this book.
• 1:12:40
  Speaker 2: I really want you guys to get into it. And again, Boris,
• 1:12:43
  Speaker 2: thank you. Thank you so much, my friend. You are
• 1:12:46
  Speaker 2: one of my best friends in the entire world, and
• 1:12:48
  Speaker 2: I truly, truly, truly appreciate everything you did for me
• 1:12:51
  Speaker 2: then and everything you've done since. So thank you again, Boris. Now,
• 1:12:55
  Speaker 2: if you enjoyed this episode of Boris and his interview,
• 1:12:59
  Speaker 2: if you want to actually watch this interview, just go
• 1:13:03
  Speaker 2: to the show notes at any film ausole dot com
• 1:13:04
  Speaker 2: for Slash three one two and I have posted that
• 1:13:08
  Speaker 2: interview on YouTube and there's a video in the show notes,
• 1:13:12
  Speaker 2: So if you actually want to see Boris in live
• 1:13:15
  Speaker 2: and action, definitely check it out as well. There'll be
• 1:13:18
  Speaker 2: links there as well for the screening, the book signing,
• 1:13:21
  Speaker 2: and the talk that I'll be doing on April twenty
• 1:13:23
  Speaker 2: fifth at the Chinese Theater. I'm so so excited to
• 1:13:25
  Speaker 2: get this out there for you guys, and the reviews
• 1:13:28
  Speaker 2: that have been coming in on Amazon and privately are
• 1:13:31
  Speaker 2: amazing and I really, really really am humbled and thank
• 1:13:34
  Speaker 2: you so so much for this. If you guys have
• 1:13:37
  Speaker 2: purchased the book, guys, take some pictures, send them to me.
• 1:13:41
  Speaker 2: I want to post them. I want to put them
• 1:13:42
  Speaker 2: out there. If you want to do a video review,
• 1:13:45
  Speaker 2: send me a video. I will post it on YouTube,
• 1:13:48
  Speaker 2: I will post it on Facebook, I will post it
• 1:13:49
  Speaker 2: throughout all of my social media. I really want to
• 1:13:53
  Speaker 2: get what you guys think out there. I want this
• 1:13:55
  Speaker 2: to be I want this book to be not only
• 1:13:59
  Speaker 2: about me and about the story, but about the tribe
• 1:14:01
  Speaker 2: and how it's affecting you guys, and how it's hopefully
• 1:14:03
  Speaker 2: bringing us together and helping you guys on your own journey.
• 1:14:07
  Speaker 2: So please send me anything and everything you guys got, pictures, videos, audio, whatever.
• 1:14:13
  Speaker 2: I will post it. I will get it out there
• 1:14:15
  Speaker 2: as much as I can. So thank you, guys, again,
• 1:14:18
  Speaker 2: so so so much for the support. I truly appreciate it.
• 1:14:21
  Speaker 2: If you want to get links to anything we spoke
• 1:14:23
  Speaker 2: about in this episode, head over to the show notes
• 1:14:25
  Speaker 2: at Bulletproof Screenwriting dot TV. Forward Slash three ninety nine.
• 1:14:28
  Speaker 2: Thank you so much for listening to guys as always,
• 1:14:31
  Speaker 2: keep on writing no matter what. I'll talk to you soon.
• 1:14:34
  Speaker 1: Thanks for listening to the Bulletproof Screenwriting podcast at Bulletproof
• 1:14:38
  Speaker 1: Screenwriting dot tv.