Latest / Daily Influence / 807. Connection Is the Advantage: Building Teams, Trust, and Ethical Influence with Barry Moline

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807. Connection Is the Advantage: Building Teams, Trust, and Ethical Influence with Barry Moline · Daily Influence

0:10
[SPEAKER_01]: Welcome to Daily Influence, your daily dose of positive influence.
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[SPEAKER_01]: I'm Brian Smith founder of IA Business Advisors and co-author of the Iain team series.
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[SPEAKER_01]: Each day we share stories and insights to help you find be and build your influence in a positive and responsible way.
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[SPEAKER_00]: And I'm Greg Clino, partner at IA Business Advisors, and co-host of Daily Influence.
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[SPEAKER_01]: Hey everybody, Brian Smith here with the I&T series and your daily influence.
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[SPEAKER_01]: And today I am joined by very moving, Barry has spent decades working with leaders, organizations, associations, and teams, including nearly three decades as a CEO.
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[SPEAKER_01]: He's the author of Connect how to quickly collaborate for success in business and life.
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[SPEAKER_01]: And as work focuses on something that has become increasingly important in business, our ability to connect, collaborate, influence, and leave people through change.
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[SPEAKER_01]: Various also a CLD-neal licensed trainer bringing the principles of ethical influence and persuasion into his work with leaders and organizations.
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[SPEAKER_01]: Those of you familiar with our work at the I&T series know that we believe everyone of us is influenced the people and environments around us all the time.
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[SPEAKER_01]: So I'm particularly interested in today's discussion
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[SPEAKER_01]: and ethical influence.
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[SPEAKER_01]: And what happens to all three as our workplaces continue to change, very welcome to daily influence.
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[SPEAKER_01]: Brian is great to be with you and I'm looking forward to the conversation.
2:09
[SPEAKER_01]: Thank you.
2:10
[SPEAKER_01]: I am really excited about our conversation and you know, you wrote in connect about collaboration and building successful relationships.
2:23
[SPEAKER_01]: We hear at the Iron Team series, use the word team constantly in business.
2:29
[SPEAKER_01]: And it's used all over in business, but putting a group of people together doesn't necessarily create a team.
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[SPEAKER_01]: What actually has to happen between people before they can become a strong collaborative team?
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[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, that's a great question because I used to think that having a great leader,
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[SPEAKER_02]: that brought everybody together and then sort of played the piano, brought people in at the right moment, got people to speak up, got people who were quiet to engage.
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[SPEAKER_02]: All those things that leader was was the principal reason why a team function well and and then I did research for my book
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[SPEAKER_02]: I'm not sure if I caught the opposite, but something different.
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[SPEAKER_02]: And I was shocked because I had been the kind of person who would bring people together.
3:32
[SPEAKER_02]: And I felt like I was not only a pretty good leader, but a good facilitator.
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[SPEAKER_02]: I could come into a room of strangers and make them work together.
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[SPEAKER_02]: And the key there in that way I phrased it was making them, right?
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[SPEAKER_02]: And when I learned in the book and the book is 15 case studies of individuals and
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[SPEAKER_02]: organizations in some cases communities that got through difficult situations by bringing people together.
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[SPEAKER_02]: And the consistent thread throughout, again, which I was not expecting because I was looking in the book to sort of like mirror my experience and mirror my knowledge.
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[SPEAKER_02]: But the all of the case studies pointed to a different action, which
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[SPEAKER_02]: And if the leader does a good job, pretty much stepping away from the facilitator role, from that piano player role, to helping the keys understand each other basically.
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[SPEAKER_02]: And people don't have to love each other in the world of work.
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[SPEAKER_02]: They just have to like each other.
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[SPEAKER_02]: And by the way, we say work, but it could be in any environment.
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[SPEAKER_02]: It could be a religious environment.
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[SPEAKER_02]: It could be a sports team.
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[SPEAKER_02]: still getting people to know a little bit about each other does one thing.
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[SPEAKER_02]: It gets them to understand each other, like them just enough to want to work together and we realize that we think we work for a company.
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[SPEAKER_02]: But in reality, when we like where we work, as we spend
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[SPEAKER_02]: You know, most of our waking hours during the week, like 50% of our waking hours at work.
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[SPEAKER_02]: When we like being at work, and when we're okay with the people that we work with,
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[SPEAKER_02]: We do a good job for them.
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[SPEAKER_02]: We know we get our paycheck from the company.
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[SPEAKER_02]: There's a logo on there somewhere on the check or we see it in our bank account.
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[SPEAKER_02]: But we do a good job for the people around us.
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[SPEAKER_02]: So the leader's job isn't to facilitate the meeting.
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[SPEAKER_02]: Well, I mean, we need meeting facilities.
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[SPEAKER_02]: No question.
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[SPEAKER_02]: But the real job of the leader is to say, one of my doing to help people get to know each other.
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[SPEAKER_02]: And there are specific actions leaders can take to do that.
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[SPEAKER_02]: But that is the thread that I learned in writing the book.
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[SPEAKER_02]: and it changed the way that I lead.
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[SPEAKER_02]: It just literally turned it on set.
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[SPEAKER_01]: I think one thing that might help our listeners and watchers is, where do you think leaders comment, what do you think they get wrong when trying to create these teams and make these connections?
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[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, you did say, you know, getting it all each other, but what are leaders getting wrong when they're trying to lay that foundation?
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[SPEAKER_02]: I think that what they get wrong is the forced connection.
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[SPEAKER_02]: What really has to happen is the casual connection.
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[SPEAKER_02]: So, a neighbor of mine is the coach of the Sacramento State Women's Basketball Team.
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[SPEAKER_02]: And they have
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[SPEAKER_02]: strategy sessions where they talk to each other about their positions and their and what plays are going to run.
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[SPEAKER_02]: And there's no question that you need great teamwork to run those plays.
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[SPEAKER_02]: You have to, you know, the point guard has the ball and the point guard is going to throw to the forward and then the forward is going to look at somebody cutting into the middle to make a pass for a layup or something like that.
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[SPEAKER_02]: That's a play.
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[SPEAKER_02]: You can think about it in a football.
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[SPEAKER_02]: The quarterback is going to drop back and why receiver is going to run five yards out, turn right, and then the quarterback is going to throw the ball.
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[SPEAKER_02]: There's a timing issue.
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[SPEAKER_02]: You have to practice that timing.
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[SPEAKER_02]: to people really need to know each other to do that.
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[SPEAKER_02]: So the answer is yes, because when you know, you're passing the ball to a colleague, a, you know, you might say a friend or somebody you like, you're gonna be motivated to really do that well.
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[SPEAKER_02]: If it's somebody you don't care about and they screw it up or maybe you didn't get it quite right and it's like, oh well, whatever.
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[SPEAKER_02]: You know, well, I guess the team didn't do well this time.
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[SPEAKER_02]: Maybe next game will get them.
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[SPEAKER_02]: But when it's, when you are engaged with that person, and you, you know, you want them to do well, then the thing that that leaders don't get right is that you need those, those other moments.
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[SPEAKER_02]: You need the pizza party.
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[SPEAKER_02]: When people are just, you know, just having a good time
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[SPEAKER_02]: Um, and icebreaker before meeting where everybody takes out their phone and and pulls up a dad joke and tells a quick dad joke.
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[SPEAKER_02]: Icebreakers are the kind of thing where people can divulge a little bit about themselves.
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[SPEAKER_02]: Maybe then an icebreaker is, tell us about a family food that you ate, uh, you know, when you are growing up, maybe at special holidays.
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[SPEAKER_02]: And
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[SPEAKER_02]: not only are you sharing something personal, but it evokes a memory in you, which is a tight connection within yourself that you're sharing.
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[SPEAKER_02]: When we're sharing those kinds of things and that's it, that's all you share.
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[SPEAKER_02]: You don't go into the long story of it all.
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[SPEAKER_02]: Then later on, people can say, hey, tell me about that fruit cake that you or what was the recipe for that
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[SPEAKER_02]: Those are the kinds of connections that develop later where, as you said, leaders don't think that those are important.
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[SPEAKER_02]: And it turns out those are the parts that are the most vital.
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[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, you know, giving our teams, well, the individuals on our teams, the opportunity to build trust and to learn about each other's really important.
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[SPEAKER_01]: I find in the channel and sometimes with our clients, they want to do that too quickly.
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[SPEAKER_01]: Or they want to establish meaningful connections too quickly, so they forced things.
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[SPEAKER_01]: How quickly do you think a meaningful connection can actually be established?
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[SPEAKER_02]: Well, there's no better time to start making that connection than today.
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[SPEAKER_02]: if you haven't been going down that road, just start.
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[SPEAKER_02]: There's little things, just doing those ice breakers, just starting that, maybe planning a social net.
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[SPEAKER_02]: Whatever it might be, you don't have to go overboard.
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[SPEAKER_02]: You just want to do it steadily over time and in very small increments.
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[SPEAKER_02]: In fact, the bigger the increment you do, hey, let's go and have a two-day retreat.
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[SPEAKER_02]: Like that's overwhelming for people, right?
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[SPEAKER_02]: It's better to do it in very small pieces and then everybody likes hanging out with each other.
10:50
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I mean, there's no question that we like to make connections with people or some, I should say, some like to make those connections with people.
11:01
[SPEAKER_02]: But when you're in that kind of a situation, people want to make that connection quickly.
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[SPEAKER_02]: You know, you, you try to find that emotional and intelligent place.
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[SPEAKER_02]: where there's comfort, right?
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[SPEAKER_02]: Some people are fine sharing and others are like, yeah, I'll share a little bit.
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[SPEAKER_02]: And then let's get down to business.
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[SPEAKER_02]: So you have to be reflective of that sweet spot with your counterparty.
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[SPEAKER_02]: If they're a big sharing kind of person or client, well, and you may not be,
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[SPEAKER_02]: you have to balance that relationship and if you've got a client that doesn't want to share a lot initially, well that's okay too.
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[SPEAKER_02]: You do it slowly and just work your way up.
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[SPEAKER_02]: It will happen over time.
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[SPEAKER_02]: What's important is to stay
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[SPEAKER_02]: Um, you know, keep your finger on the pulse of where you're, your, your client or your counterparty is at in terms of their level of interest and engaging.
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[SPEAKER_02]: But they, but you need to engage at least a little bit.
12:15
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I thank you for that.
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[SPEAKER_01]: That's good for our audience.
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[SPEAKER_01]: I think they struggle more with it than we might hear in why I say that is as people are always trying to go too fast and trying to do things, you know, too quickly and get onto the next.
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[SPEAKER_01]: thing, whatever that thing is in their area of influence.
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[SPEAKER_01]: And it needs to meet to my next set of questions, which is all around ethical influence versus persuasion.
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[SPEAKER_01]: And I got to tell you I had some interesting conversations with Scott Holdle.
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[SPEAKER_01]: I don't know.
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[SPEAKER_01]: Our audience knows who Scott Vogel is.
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[SPEAKER_01]: Scott Vogel is the president of IHeart Radio in Hawaii and he's written a book on persuasion.
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[SPEAKER_01]: We always have this persuasion versus influence and persuasion being ethical or not ethical in how it's applied.
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[SPEAKER_01]: So, Barry, this is where our respective bodies of what really intersect in an interesting way because of our work with responsible influence.
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[SPEAKER_01]: and how we look at that, and as a trained Robert C. Aldini principle, as somebody trained in his principles of influence in persuasion, and when we spoke previously, emphasize that your approach begins with ethical influence when we are talking the other day.
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[SPEAKER_01]: Our perspective is that human beings are influencing all the time, whether we recognize it or not, so responsibility becomes
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[SPEAKER_01]: incredibly important.
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[SPEAKER_01]: Where is the line between ethically influencing someone and simply trying to get someone to do what we want them to do?
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[SPEAKER_02]: I think it's difficult to put into words.
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[SPEAKER_02]: It's easier to say, you know, when you see it, or when you feel it.
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[SPEAKER_02]: And what we don't want to do, I do have a definition.
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[SPEAKER_02]: So we'll get to that in a second.
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[SPEAKER_02]: But when we are in the presence of someone who is just trying to sell us something for the commission,
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[SPEAKER_02]: or for the bonus.
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[SPEAKER_02]: If I sell this TV to anybody, then I'll get an extra, you know, $500 this month, whatever that might be because of all the other TVs by just hit this goal.
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[SPEAKER_02]: If, you know, we see that in car dealerships as well.
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[SPEAKER_02]: If I just move the metal, so they say, then
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[SPEAKER_02]: you just feel like you're a cog in their sales wheel, you know, you're, you really don't mean anything to them.
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[SPEAKER_02]: They're just going through the motions.
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[SPEAKER_02]: And, and that is, to me, is unethical influence.
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[SPEAKER_02]: And I'll tell you why in just a second, but the bottom line is is that when you can definitely feel it when you're in that environment, when that salesperson doesn't really care about the value proposition, meeting your needs for the right price.
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[SPEAKER_02]: And if here's the price, I don't care if it meets your needs, I just need you to pay the money.
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[SPEAKER_02]: then that's not ethical.
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[SPEAKER_02]: So the way that we define ethical influence and the child union institute is in three ways.
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[SPEAKER_02]: One is, it has to be true.
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[SPEAKER_02]: So there has to be some facts here.
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[SPEAKER_02]: And if we watch a car accident,
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[SPEAKER_02]: you and I can certainly agree that we saw a car accident, but we might disagree on the speed of the two vehicles.
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[SPEAKER_02]: We might disagree that we think one vehicle might have been turning and but you know, the one of us might have said, oh, they're about going straight.
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[SPEAKER_02]: Whatever that might be.
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[SPEAKER_02]: we can both agree on certain things.
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[SPEAKER_02]: And that's where we need to focus on the truth.
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[SPEAKER_02]: There's some element of the truth here that we're seeing.
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[SPEAKER_02]: The second one is that when we're trying to move people toward our side, does it have to make sense to them?
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[SPEAKER_02]: It has to be something where they say, yeah, I can see that.
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[SPEAKER_02]: And that's partly based on their own history.
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[SPEAKER_02]: But there has to be a
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[SPEAKER_02]: a level of common sense that they would say, yeah, I can see it.
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[SPEAKER_02]: If you walk into a doctor's office and the doctor's wearing a white lab coat, hey, that's great.
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[SPEAKER_02]: That's what a doctor wears, right?
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[SPEAKER_02]: But are the doctors smoking and the office itself looks like a garage?
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[SPEAKER_02]: You can say, well, wait a minute.
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[SPEAKER_02]: That doesn't look like a typical doctor's office.
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[SPEAKER_02]: But if you walk into another doctor's office and they're wearing the white lat code and it looks like, you know, a clean, you know, hospital type environment, that the person may be an actor, but you would still feel like this is the right context.
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[SPEAKER_02]: That's the common sense.
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[SPEAKER_02]: And then the last part is that.
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[SPEAKER_02]: when you're making a recommendation for something that it has to be wise.
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[SPEAKER_02]: And by wise, I mean it's something that you would do yourself, or you would recommend to your family, your children, your parents, your friends, your colleagues.
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[SPEAKER_02]: This is something that I would do myself and that's why, or maybe I am using it myself.
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[SPEAKER_02]: I've got a TV just like this, this one, and here's how I use it.
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[SPEAKER_02]: So when you have those three elements together that it's true, that it makes sense, and that it's wise, you'd recommend it to someone else, then you're in the sphere of ethics and people and trust grows from there.
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[SPEAKER_02]: So that's ethical influence.
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[SPEAKER_01]: Actually, that's a good explanation.
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[SPEAKER_01]: And I think it answered some of the follow-up points I had about, you know, when can we recognize in Florence's starting to become a dipulated or, you know, the difference between ethics and not ethics?
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[SPEAKER_01]: I think you did a good job of explaining that does.
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[SPEAKER_01]: And I think I might have said the name around G.L.D.E.E's principles to,
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[SPEAKER_01]: as well as to say, is it negotiations?
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[SPEAKER_02]: Oh yeah, absolutely, it's everywhere.
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[SPEAKER_02]: And the way I think about influence is not just ways to influence others.
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[SPEAKER_02]: The way I think about it is I like to know how I'm being influenced when I walk out the door and who's trying to, my first thought is like, pull one on me, right?
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[SPEAKER_02]: But that's not necessarily the best way to think about it.
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[SPEAKER_02]: people are going through their day and and they're just using the techniques the way I think about influences I mean the elements of influence is like an alien lands on earth and says how do I influence these people and then
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[SPEAKER_02]: these techniques let's talk about what they are.
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[SPEAKER_02]: So basically there's three.
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[SPEAKER_02]: And one of them, the first one is enhancing relationships.
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[SPEAKER_02]: It's good to have better relationships because we buy from people that we like.
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[SPEAKER_02]: We trust people that we like and we're on the same team.
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[SPEAKER_02]: So it's good to
19:39
[SPEAKER_02]: The first one we talked about there, I just mentioned, is liking, how do we get somebody to like us?
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[SPEAKER_02]: And the way to do that is to not tell them all about ourselves, it's to ask them questions about them.
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[SPEAKER_02]: And when they are answering questions about themselves and sharing, they enjoy the conversation.
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[SPEAKER_02]: We all love talking about ourselves.
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[SPEAKER_02]: I mean, our favorite word is our name.
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[SPEAKER_02]: Well, so ask lots of questions.
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[SPEAKER_02]: Ask follow-up questions.
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[SPEAKER_02]: It's the greatest way to make a connection to somebody.
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[SPEAKER_02]: You went on a big, you know, hey, you're talking about your vacation to, you know, to New York.
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[SPEAKER_02]: Oh, wow, what did you do there?
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[SPEAKER_02]: You know, blah, blah, blah.
20:23
[SPEAKER_02]: What was that museum?
20:24
[SPEAKER_02]: Like I've heard about that and you talk about the museum?
20:27
[SPEAKER_02]: Oh, that's really cool.
20:29
[SPEAKER_02]: What else did you do?
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[SPEAKER_02]: So where I'm just interested in your vacation now what what you want to avoid is something that's frequently done overtopping you know you tell me you went to New York oh that's great I went to New York too let me tell you about my trip to New York comes like a wait a minute we're talking about my trip here not your trip it's things you
20:56
[SPEAKER_02]: You can talk about your experience after you've asked a few follow-up questions and say, well, I've been in New York and I had a similar experience so that too, anyway, you can then introduce your part.
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[SPEAKER_02]: So liking is asking questions about someone else and they will enjoy the conversation and they will like you.
21:16
[SPEAKER_02]: The, another really good,
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[SPEAKER_02]: principle, you know, I call it a technique.
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[SPEAKER_02]: But it happens all around us is unity is being on the same team.
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[SPEAKER_02]: And
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[SPEAKER_02]: When we're working together at our office, we need to call ourselves team, name of our business, or team, name of our division.
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[SPEAKER_02]: Because even though a science kind of hokey, people still like being on a team.
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[SPEAKER_02]: And then people do things for that team.
21:53
[SPEAKER_02]: So I have a question for you.
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[SPEAKER_02]: Have you ever traveled somewhere?
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[SPEAKER_02]: I mean, you're on vacation, literally on vacation.
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[SPEAKER_02]: And you meet somebody from the same town.
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[SPEAKER_02]: It's a stranger, a stranger.
22:08
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
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[SPEAKER_02]: And then you say, whoa, you're like, wait, where do you live?
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[SPEAKER_02]: What neighborhood, right?
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[SPEAKER_02]: You go there and then you just say, wait, I do.
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[SPEAKER_02]: We know people in common.
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[SPEAKER_02]: You might go there and have you done that?
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[SPEAKER_02]: What do you found people?
22:22
[SPEAKER_02]: Oh my goodness.
22:23
[SPEAKER_02]: OK.
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[SPEAKER_02]: So now you've developed this relationship in what seemingly is seconds with somebody when you find out that they're from the same town.
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[SPEAKER_02]: And now you're like fast friends.
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[SPEAKER_02]: And that's what unity is.
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[SPEAKER_02]: When you're on the same team, no matter what, the circumstances, you kind of like that person and you will help that person.
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[SPEAKER_02]: So maybe you might say, what have you done here in town or have you done this?
22:50
[SPEAKER_02]: So because we're about to go do that, you know, what's the inside baseball on that?
22:54
[SPEAKER_02]: And they'll share with you because they've got a new friend from this name, Neighborhood.
22:59
[SPEAKER_02]: And so that's unity, that's a power of unity and you can create that in many ways, but but the best way is through that team element.
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[SPEAKER_02]: You know, if we're both, you know, Chicago bare fans, then we, I don't know what it is.
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[SPEAKER_02]: We just like the bareism.
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[SPEAKER_02]: We got things to talk about.
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[SPEAKER_02]: who knows what we could go on forever or talking about the bears and then maybe we've talked about some other teams.
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[SPEAKER_02]: But if I'm a Packers fan and you're a bears fan, there's some friction there.
23:35
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, the second way to influence people is to reduce their uncertainty.
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[SPEAKER_02]: And by reduce it, I say that in that way,
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[SPEAKER_02]: It's like a negative way, like a double negative there.
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[SPEAKER_02]: It's not to increase someone's certainty, because that's hard to do, because you can't control that, but you can reduce, you can't answer their questions and help them understand what you're talking about.
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[SPEAKER_02]: And we do that in two ways.
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[SPEAKER_02]: One is by showing your authority.
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[SPEAKER_02]: And it's okay to show your authority.
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[SPEAKER_02]: We talked about the doctor example.
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[SPEAKER_02]: We go into the doctor's office.
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[SPEAKER_02]: We know we're in the presence of somebody who knows something probably more than we do.
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[SPEAKER_02]: When we go to Best Buy, they're wearing a logo shirt.
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[SPEAKER_02]: And that's how we know those people work there.
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[SPEAKER_02]: And they probably know something about the equipment in their department.
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[SPEAKER_02]: So we ask them those questions.
24:36
[SPEAKER_02]: And that is a great way wearing a logo shirt.
24:38
[SPEAKER_02]: you know, soothing up, looking in the part of your job makes you an authority before you open your mouth.
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[SPEAKER_02]: You gave me an introduction today.
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[SPEAKER_02]: That gave me authority to talk about this topic.
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[SPEAKER_02]: So there's a variety of ways to do that and what's and the key to doing it is recognize that
25:08
[SPEAKER_02]: an experiment in at a university where they had two groups of students and they gave what each student, $10,000 of monopoly money, you know, fake money.
25:19
[SPEAKER_02]: And with the first group, they said, here's a book on how to invest your money.
25:25
[SPEAKER_02]: Look through the book and and then we'll talk about
25:29
[SPEAKER_02]: And the second group, they brought in and some of them they introduced as the top investor in the state.
25:39
[SPEAKER_02]: And their returns were 12% a year for the last 10 years and they will help you with your investing.
25:46
[SPEAKER_02]: So then they measured the brain waves of the people in each group.
25:50
[SPEAKER_02]: And the people that had looked through the book, their brains were just lit up.
25:55
[SPEAKER_02]: They were looking at what to do and all the options and so on.
25:59
[SPEAKER_02]: And the people in the other group who were in the presence of the expert of investing.
26:05
[SPEAKER_02]: their brains were practically dead.
26:07
[SPEAKER_02]: They all they were doing was just saying to the expert, whatever you say, that's what we're going to do, because I like that kind of return that you're talking about.
26:16
[SPEAKER_02]: So when we're in the presence of an authority, we believe that authority.
26:19
[SPEAKER_02]: And then when we don't have an authority, we go to
26:23
[SPEAKER_02]: society.
26:24
[SPEAKER_02]: We go to the crowd.
26:26
[SPEAKER_02]: And that is social proof.
26:28
[SPEAKER_02]: That's, you know, when we shop on Amazon or Etsy or wherever we look at the number of stars, you know, we're buying, looking to buy an Airbnb, we look at the testimonials, what did other people say about this place?
26:40
[SPEAKER_02]: And I'll tell you that, like when I see five stars, I like to also look at the one star reviews to see
26:48
[SPEAKER_02]: one if they're just whiny people because sometimes they have some people are just hard to please or if they have just a poor experience or if it's a pattern.
26:56
[SPEAKER_02]: So that tells me a lot.
26:58
[SPEAKER_02]: But even still we use those two and I think a lot of businesses ignore or don't properly use authority and social proof that they think social proof is like bragging.
27:10
[SPEAKER_02]: When it's a it's a major key that we use everywhere else, why not for your business testimonials, they're great people want to know the before and after they want to know the experience of others a bad and and of course your authority, you know stuff share what you know and people will leave it put up.
27:30
[SPEAKER_02]: put up diplomas.
27:33
[SPEAKER_02]: Hey, I've got some diplomas right back here, right behind me.
27:35
[SPEAKER_02]: And you know, you don't have to look real close at him, but you know, like, huh, looks like Barry's got a little diploma back there.
27:41
[SPEAKER_02]: I guess I'll believe what he says.
27:45
[SPEAKER_02]: And then the last one is motivating people to act.
27:48
[SPEAKER_02]: And this one, it has included, included in it is scarcity, which is the most misused type of persuasion.
27:57
[SPEAKER_02]: Because we think about, I don't know, the president's day sale, and then there's the Fourth of July sale, and then there's the Labor Day sale.
28:07
[SPEAKER_02]: There's gonna be sales all year long.
28:09
[SPEAKER_02]: And if you miss this sale, you'll catch the next one, and they try to get you to buy during that sale period.
28:15
[SPEAKER_02]: when it's really just, you know, bogus.
28:18
[SPEAKER_02]: So, what is much more effective is scarcity in the number of products or services that you have.
28:27
[SPEAKER_02]: We only have, you know, an artist makes 25 coffee creamer,
28:36
[SPEAKER_02]: cups, you know, ceramic cups.
28:38
[SPEAKER_02]: And they're going to sell those 25 and they're in the same pattern and when those are used up, they're going to move on to a different pattern.
28:45
[SPEAKER_02]: Well, that's it.
28:46
[SPEAKER_02]: That's it for those 25.
28:48
[SPEAKER_02]: And it's got to be real.
28:49
[SPEAKER_02]: They can't just then turn around and make the same pattern like you're watching, you know, the commercial for selling a garden hose.
28:56
[SPEAKER_02]: you know, tonight and and the first hundred colors get two for one and then tomorrow night, the first hundred colors get two for one, you know, it's the same commercial leads time.
29:08
[SPEAKER_02]: So that's that's fake scarcity, but you can use it properly by limiting the number if you're going to a conference.
29:16
[SPEAKER_02]: The conference has a date.
29:18
[SPEAKER_02]: It's going to happen.
29:19
[SPEAKER_02]: You know, at a certain time, you're going to a concert, it's going to happen.
29:23
[SPEAKER_02]: There's only so many tickets when it's sold out, it's sold out.
29:26
[SPEAKER_02]: So, you know that if you want to go, you have to get your ticket, you have to, you get the early bird rate so that they know how many people are going to come to the conference.
29:37
[SPEAKER_02]: So, it's important to use scarcity.
29:39
[SPEAKER_02]: Well.
29:40
[SPEAKER_01]: Awesome, thank you for that.
29:41
[SPEAKER_01]: I really enjoyed the talk about familiarity and I do travel a lot.
29:48
[SPEAKER_01]: And one of the unique experiences, well, it's not unique because it happens all the time, but an experience that happens all the time that seems unique to some is,
29:59
[SPEAKER_01]: We always run into people that are wearing Cubs, hats, ducks, hats.
30:03
[SPEAKER_01]: Whatever teams that we like, and it is an instant bridge to a conversation.
30:11
[SPEAKER_01]: Sometimes the conversations go nowhere, but that conversation is so much more comfortable.
30:16
[SPEAKER_01]: than just walking up to somebody out of the blue and not having, you know, an icebreaker, a word from our earlier discussion, you know, having that icebreaker.
30:25
[SPEAKER_01]: I think that was a really good contextual way for our listeners to apply that.
30:36
[SPEAKER_01]: have that comfort to ice break, you know, they're in here, an introvert, especially in situations where there is no familiar.
30:47
[SPEAKER_01]: So I think that's going to be really helpful.
30:50
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm going to make a pivot for us because we are all faced with this new
30:56
[SPEAKER_01]: changing workplace that is challenging human connection it's turning off the brain if you well as you said earlier about when we're given not having to think too much and what I'm talking about Barry is AI you know this
31:13
[SPEAKER_01]: extra ordinary amount of change in the workplace right now is the last time I felt this was what the internet came on in the late 90s early 2000s and the acceleration is way beyond that and while I don't necessarily want to make this an AI conversation because technology actually is always going to change.
31:36
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean
31:37
[SPEAKER_01]: As soon as we think that it can't get any faster or any better, it's going to get faster and better, but what I am interested in talking about is the human response to that change.
31:49
[SPEAKER_01]: So as technology becomes increasingly capable of doing things that previously required people to do,
31:58
[SPEAKER_01]: What becomes more important about the way human beings connect, collaborate, and influence one another?
32:07
[SPEAKER_02]: There's no question that in this new AI era, which is never going away, that the human element, and this is a debate that's going on around warfare, for example, about should, um,
32:24
[SPEAKER_02]: You know, drones have the ability to identify a target and then make the choice to shoot on it, right?
32:32
[SPEAKER_02]: That humans need to remain in control.
32:35
[SPEAKER_02]: And there there needs to be some level of oversight.
32:40
[SPEAKER_02]: There's there's no question about it.
32:42
[SPEAKER_02]: We're we're already seeing people writing using a chatter or
32:51
[SPEAKER_02]: and it produces a report and some people don't even read it, you know, they, and then they just turn it in.
33:00
[SPEAKER_02]: This is, and they're missing the context that they're missing the customization, and a lot of things are wrong because I like to think about AI as a really good analyst,
33:21
[SPEAKER_02]: halfway decent answer, even a pretty good answer, but you know the details of your clients, you know the details of your products and services, and it doesn't.
33:33
[SPEAKER_02]: It just does not know those things.
33:35
[SPEAKER_02]: So you have to review the output and make it yours.
33:40
[SPEAKER_02]: And a lot of people are are missing that.
33:43
[SPEAKER_02]: They're saying, oh, this is pretty good work.
33:45
[SPEAKER_02]: I don't need to change anything.
33:48
[SPEAKER_02]: And it doesn't even need to sound like me, so I'm just going to sound like a really good flower rewriter from here on up.
33:56
[SPEAKER_02]: So I think number one is adopting that attitude.
34:02
[SPEAKER_02]: You know, in the old days, you did research on the internet, you learned something and then you incorporated that into something you might be writing.
34:10
[SPEAKER_02]: You could reference that nowadays it pulls it all together into the report and that has to sound like you.
34:18
[SPEAKER_02]: It has to be you and you have and and most important is take responsibility for it and the outcome and then the subsequent use by other people.
34:29
[SPEAKER_02]: The, um,
34:31
[SPEAKER_02]: What one of the things that I like to use AI for, there's really two things that I love to do.
34:37
[SPEAKER_02]: One is to, I did this in my organization, and I've done it for several others, is I've taken the job descriptions that we have, and job descriptions are, they're okay.
34:49
[SPEAKER_02]: I mean, they're constantly shifting a little bit, and sometimes they get a little outdated if they haven't been updated in a year or two.
34:55
[SPEAKER_02]: But nevertheless, they're in the ballpark of reflecting what a job is.
35:01
[SPEAKER_02]: Take the job description, the whole thing.
35:03
[SPEAKER_02]: You know, it might be two to four pages, drop it into AI.
35:08
[SPEAKER_02]: And then say, what can you do to help this position
35:23
[SPEAKER_02]: And AI will tell you, I can help do this.
35:26
[SPEAKER_02]: I can help make this report go faster.
35:28
[SPEAKER_02]: And if this is a repetitive report, you have a variety of things.
35:32
[SPEAKER_02]: And then it would say, and here are things, in terms of client interaction that I can't do.
35:38
[SPEAKER_02]: I mean, here's mine.
35:40
[SPEAKER_02]: There's my to-do list, okay?
35:42
[SPEAKER_02]: You know, on video, it's a full page.
35:46
[SPEAKER_02]: And on the yellow sticky notes, those are the higher priorities.
35:51
[SPEAKER_02]: And then on the back, here's my back burner thing.
35:54
[SPEAKER_02]: So I've got two pages.
35:56
[SPEAKER_02]: I don't know how many lines around this page.
35:58
[SPEAKER_02]: There's 20, 30 things on each page.
36:02
[SPEAKER_02]: So I've got 60 things that I've written down as, I don't know, I want to get to soon and in some day.
36:10
[SPEAKER_02]: If AI could move me down that list, you know, by 25%.
36:17
[SPEAKER_02]: Hallelujah.
36:18
[SPEAKER_02]: I would love that to happen because right now I'm barely scratching the surface on that list.
36:23
[SPEAKER_02]: I might get the top two to three four things done and then they're replaced by other things.
36:29
[SPEAKER_02]: So we're not going to run out of things to do.
36:32
[SPEAKER_02]: Hopefully we'll get farther down the list of things to do.
36:35
[SPEAKER_02]: Ultimately, we need to take responsibility for those and not let AI run the table for us.
36:44
[SPEAKER_01]: human interactive instead of AI driven is one of our emissions, not just for ourselves as a consultancy but also for our clients and in whatever area of influence they haven't, we have clients from every walk of life so we are dealing with AI in amazingly different circumstances
37:06
[SPEAKER_01]: on a daily basis, how AI integrates in the medical field is different than the legal field than the accounting field that in the trades and in manufacturing and we're lucky enough to be able to pivot through that.
37:19
[SPEAKER_01]: We struggle, however, in defining some times.
37:23
[SPEAKER_01]: Not every time, it's how do we prevent efficiency from replacing relationships?
37:29
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, these are some of the questions that were posed with how do leaders communicate during periods of uncertainty in their areas of influence as they have so many people bringing to them AI solutions that look great because of the efficiency on paper, but ultimately break down what's really valuable, which is the human connection.
37:54
[SPEAKER_01]: So, do you have any advice for those situations from a very high level?
38:00
[SPEAKER_01]: Because we're still, I mean even though we're in the weeds, we're still really just on the initial, you know, 10% or less of what this is going to mean to us.
38:12
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, it's a good question because ultimately I think the answer is we have to be intentional about it and like the like the idea of getting our teams together and and sharing those.
38:28
[SPEAKER_02]: those icebreakers.
38:30
[SPEAKER_02]: We have to not icebreakers, but we have to do something similar with our clients.
38:36
[SPEAKER_02]: We have to make sure we make time with them to talk to them and not just communicate digitally, not just through texting an email or sending them a report to review.
38:49
[SPEAKER_02]: getting on the phone with them, talking them, talking with them, or Zoom, even if we can, just getting some, some FaceTime.
38:58
[SPEAKER_02]: It doesn't have to be long, but when you, when you maintain that connection, then it leads to so many other positive benefits.
39:07
[SPEAKER_02]: But when we lose that connection, we're like, wait, who are those people again?
39:11
[SPEAKER_02]: And we're human, this is what makes us go is human interaction.
39:18
[SPEAKER_02]: So we need to make sure that somebody is being assertive about maintaining that connection.
39:26
[SPEAKER_02]: You want to come to the icebreakers.
39:32
[SPEAKER_02]: I put together a list of 30 workplace appropriate icebreakers.
39:38
[SPEAKER_02]: Some icebreakers can be
39:41
[SPEAKER_02]: You know, in a social group might maybe, you know, when was the last time you cried?
39:46
[SPEAKER_02]: We don't want to do that at work.
39:47
[SPEAKER_02]: We don't want to be talking about that.
39:49
[SPEAKER_02]: That's what therapy session.
39:51
[SPEAKER_02]: What we want is, what was your most unusual job?
39:56
[SPEAKER_02]: That's all we want.
39:57
[SPEAKER_02]: We want something that's going to, we'll learn a little bit about someone, make them human, and then talk to them later.
40:05
[SPEAKER_02]: So on my website, variablein.com slash resources, you can get that.
40:10
[SPEAKER_02]: It's just a PDF download.
40:13
[SPEAKER_02]: And it's a very quick way to get a bunch of ideas
40:18
[SPEAKER_02]: I used to hate icebreakers.
40:19
[SPEAKER_02]: I hate them because I thought they were just really inefficient.
40:24
[SPEAKER_02]: There's like, why are we wasting our time here?
40:26
[SPEAKER_02]: We got into gender.
40:26
[SPEAKER_02]: Let's get into it.
40:27
[SPEAKER_02]: You know, the fact that I don't know everybody here, whatever.
40:30
[SPEAKER_02]: You know, I'll get to know them eventually.
40:33
[SPEAKER_02]: Well, you know what the most
40:39
[SPEAKER_02]: Well, they say that our greatest fear is not dying, but making a presentation, right?
40:49
[SPEAKER_02]: If you heard that, standing up in front of people, making a presentation, when you dig deeper on that, making a presentation, it's actually
40:57
[SPEAKER_02]: Just not knowing people and being afraid that you're going to like put your foot in your mouth.
41:04
[SPEAKER_02]: You know, say something dumb.
41:07
[SPEAKER_02]: And when we're in a meeting with people, some we know, some we don't know, we have that experience.
41:13
[SPEAKER_02]: It's not making a presentation.
41:15
[SPEAKER_02]: We might just be sharing or talking or something.
41:19
[SPEAKER_02]: But if we don't know people, then we have that same trepidation.
41:24
[SPEAKER_02]: So doing an icebreaker, or at least at a minimum, doing introductions, well, at least I know people.
41:30
[SPEAKER_02]: I know that that's Joe from accounting.
41:34
[SPEAKER_02]: I've never met Joe before, but now I know Joe or from another company.
41:40
[SPEAKER_02]: Whatever it might be, doing the introductions at a minimum is really great.
41:45
[SPEAKER_02]: Doing an icebreaker is even better.
41:48
[SPEAKER_02]: And it gets us over that hump of anxiety that we all feel when we're in a room with just one person we don't know because there's a level of anxiety we have they're like, who's that?
42:03
[SPEAKER_02]: You know, what are they gonna think of me?
42:04
[SPEAKER_02]: I don't know whatever whatever it might be, but it's that same feeling of standing up in front of a room and being afraid you're gonna say something done.
42:15
[SPEAKER_01]: Barry, I always like to allow our guests to have the final word.
42:22
[SPEAKER_01]: So we have people listening to our leading companies, managing teams, working alongside co-workers, working along, for just simply trying to become more intentional about the influence they have.
42:37
[SPEAKER_01]: in their specific areas of influence.
42:40
[SPEAKER_01]: So if there is one thing that you would like them to take from our conversation and put into practice as quickly as possible, what might that be?
42:51
[SPEAKER_02]: There's kind of like one-and-a-half things.
42:53
[SPEAKER_02]: So here's the half thing.
42:55
[SPEAKER_02]: Because this is related to influence.
42:57
[SPEAKER_02]: And that is, look around.
42:59
[SPEAKER_02]: When you're walking out the door, when you're in a restaurant, coffee shop,
43:04
[SPEAKER_02]: buying something at a store, wherever.
43:08
[SPEAKER_02]: Notice the influence that is going on.
43:11
[SPEAKER_02]: People are conveying that to you.
43:14
[SPEAKER_02]: When you're at a restaurant, and the server says, how's everything tasting?
43:21
[SPEAKER_02]: That is a, or a no, they won't say that.
43:24
[SPEAKER_02]: They'll say, is everything tasting good?
43:27
[SPEAKER_02]: They're already planting the seed.
43:29
[SPEAKER_02]: inside you to say yeah it tastes good yeah they're giving you the word already yeah just notice notice the stuff that's going on around you because you can learn from those those statements those actions that others are are using.
43:45
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, you can you can learn them and and and get educated on them, but you can also see them.
43:52
[SPEAKER_02]: And it's not manipulation.
43:54
[SPEAKER_02]: It's just paying attention so that you can say, oh, Starbucks writes my name on the cup and then they use my name, which is my favorite word, right?
44:04
[SPEAKER_02]: So.
44:06
[SPEAKER_02]: There must be something there if they spent millions of dollars in customer service trying to figure out that people like their names.
44:14
[SPEAKER_02]: So pay attention to what's going on.
44:17
[SPEAKER_02]: But the other one, I think that is, so that's the half, but the other full one.
44:24
[SPEAKER_02]: is, yeah, we're going through a lot of change.
44:27
[SPEAKER_02]: And some people are more bullish on AI, and things like teamwork, and others are more, like, I don't know if I really need that right now, or they are, you know, I don't know if I want to to pull people together as a team.
44:46
[SPEAKER_02]: I'm not really sure that's going to be effective.
44:49
[SPEAKER_02]: It's whatever decision you make, take charge of that, because doing nothing is effectively not an option.
44:58
[SPEAKER_02]: So take charge of something and do something, do one thing.
45:03
[SPEAKER_02]: And then when you do that one thing, it's like doing one sit-up.
45:08
[SPEAKER_02]: Well, okay, I do one sit-up, I guess I could do two sit-ups.
45:12
[SPEAKER_02]: And it just gets you started.
45:18
[SPEAKER_02]: and then look and see what the benefits are, then you can say, oh, that wasn't too difficult.
45:27
[SPEAKER_02]: And look, we got some benefit out of it.
45:28
[SPEAKER_02]: Maybe we should try it again.
45:30
[SPEAKER_02]: So take charge, do something, take action.
45:34
[SPEAKER_01]: That's really good advice.
45:35
[SPEAKER_01]: Thank you, yeah, just do something.
45:39
[SPEAKER_01]: So you heard him, everybody.
45:40
[SPEAKER_01]: And Barry, tell us how can our listeners and watchers get ahold of you find out more about you?
45:48
[SPEAKER_02]: Our website is BarryMolene.com and my email is Barry at BarryMolene.com so there's all the branding right in there and on the website there's information about I speak on teamwork and leadership
46:10
[SPEAKER_02]: There's information on that, but as I mentioned before, very moly.com slash resources.
46:16
[SPEAKER_02]: There are some summary papers, there from some of my talks.
46:22
[SPEAKER_02]: And if you want to see something from it, I've mentioned the icebergers, but there's also summary talk on influence and persuasion.
46:30
[SPEAKER_02]: There's one on teamwork.
46:32
[SPEAKER_02]: So,
46:33
[SPEAKER_02]: look at that resources page and you can get some really good fast summaries on ways to tackle those issues as well.
46:44
[SPEAKER_01]: Awesome, and as everybody who's listening, they're watching those, the least who has been watching it.
46:49
[SPEAKER_01]: If you haven't, down below in the description, there are links to Barry and Wakes for you to reach out to him and start having icebreaker and start a conversation of your own.
47:03
[SPEAKER_01]: So Barry, I thank you.
47:05
[SPEAKER_01]: I really appreciate sharing your perspective today, your influence with us today.
47:14
[SPEAKER_01]: I think there's an important reminder in this conversation.
47:17
[SPEAKER_01]: Technology changes, workplaces, change, our environment is going to change, but the environment in which we lead will continue to always be that way, but business is going to remain human.
47:31
[SPEAKER_01]: And how we connect with people, how we collaborate,
47:36
[SPEAKER_01]: and how responsibly we use our influence does matter.
47:40
[SPEAKER_01]: Your influence in the people around you every day, the opportunity is to become more aware and more intentional about the influence you choose to have.
47:50
[SPEAKER_01]: So Barry, thank you again for joining me and us today on daily influence.
47:55
[SPEAKER_01]: And to everybody listening, remember, find your influence, be your influence, and build your influence.
48:02
[SPEAKER_01]: Until next time, have a great day.