Latest / Rich Fulcher's TalkBox / Gary Gulman: Grandiloquent, Ya Gotta Go to Ruffles, Shandling vs. Seinfeld, Big Break…down I Talk Box Ep. 21

Transcript

Gary Gulman: Grandiloquent, Ya Gotta Go to Ruffles, Shandling vs. Seinfeld, Big Break…down I Talk Box Ep. 21 · Rich Fulcher's TalkBox

• 0:00
  What the hell is Narnia? Hi talk boxers.
• 0:05
  It's Rich Fulcher with Rich Fulcher's talk box.
• 0:10
  How did the frog get in here? Anyway, I just wanted to say
• 0:16
  it's great to be with you guys again.
• 0:19
  I really look forward to these podcasts.
• 0:22
  It gets me out of the house. So this one is going to be
• 0:27
  particularly good because we have an American coming to
• 0:31
  London. His name is Gary Goleman.
• 0:34
  I don't know if you've seen him, but he's really big.
• 0:38
  He's really big and he's done loads of TV specials on Netflix
• 0:43
  and HBO. His name is Gary Goleman, as I
• 0:47
  said before. So please welcome Gary Goleman.
• 0:50
  We have a great Gary Goleman. I keep saying is Gary go?
• 0:54
  Oh, shit. So listen, let's watch.
• 0:59
  We go through a lot of fun stuff about Gary Goleman.
• 1:21
  I'd like the big bed please. Oh, hey, Carrie, what are you
• 1:29
  doing here? Good to see you.
• 1:33
  Thank you so much for having me. Richard Oh, thanks for being
• 1:35
  here. This is great.
• 1:37
  Yes, you're at the Soho Theatre. Yes, through October 11th.
• 1:42
  Which is down the road, Yeah. Yeah.
• 1:45
  People don't know that. Right.
• 1:46
  It's a few minutes away, yes. And you've already had one show.
• 1:50
  I had one show last night and it went well enough that I want to
• 1:53
  go back and do it again. So.
• 1:55
  Yeah. And do you?
• 1:58
  Are you always surprised when you go to another country and
• 2:00
  it's like, oh wow, these jokes land?
• 2:03
  That that's a good question. I've only performed in in Canada
• 2:07
  really. So this was.
• 2:09
  It's weird. Yeah, Canada is is just so
• 2:13
  similar to in a lot of ways to and and it's so I wasn't
• 2:20
  surprised that jokes work, but I did consult all my Jewish
• 2:24
  friend, my English Jewish friend and my English English friend to
• 2:31
  see which expressions would would work over here, right.
• 2:36
  Yeah, see, you did your research.
• 2:37
  Yeah, I did research. Don't say elevator.
• 2:40
  Right. Yeah.
• 2:41
  And just certain things that that don't they don't have over
• 2:45
  over here and so. So I was driving a truck,
• 2:49
  Laurie. But yeah, but in in America,
• 2:53
  often I want to, I want to pass out a glossary of terms anyhow,
• 2:56
  because of people aren't aren't onto a lot of my references and
• 3:02
  and sometimes that's that's lonely.
• 3:04
  But I find if you're true to your material, I think people
• 3:07
  respect that. Yeah, they get it.
• 3:10
  Yeah, and a lot of the things you can figure out with context
• 3:12
  and, and, and also American and British culture is, is so
• 3:19
  intertwined at this point that, that it's not that uncommon that
• 3:23
  people are familiar with. Inextricably intertwined.
• 3:26
  Yes, yes, I got this great. I used to do a lot of comedy
• 3:29
  festivals, you know, like in Australia.
• 3:32
  Oh wow, yeah. Yeah, but I got the best advice
• 3:35
  from Rich Hall. Oh, he's wonderful.
• 3:38
  Yeah, he does a lot of those things and he goes, whenever you
• 3:41
  go out there as an American, always start out by being self
• 3:45
  deprecating because they don't like the, you know what I mean?
• 3:49
  Right, yeah, no, I get that 100%.
• 3:53
  But the self deprecating is is is something that I'm I'm very
• 3:56
  comfortable with so. Though your show is called.
• 4:00
  Grandiloquent. Which I just real when I was
• 4:03
  thinking about it, I don't think I've said that word like right
• 4:07
  more than twice in my whole life, the SA, TS and this.
• 4:13
  Yeah, it it it becomes clear why I use the word in the in the
• 4:18
  show. It means flowery language used
• 4:23
  to impress. Right.
• 4:25
  Yeah. So it's kind of got a little
• 4:27
  negative connotation or. A little bit, yeah.
• 4:29
  Yeah, a synonym is bombastic and verbose, so yeah.
• 4:36
  But but it the the explanation is is a good payoff in the in
• 4:40
  the show and and in context it works.
• 4:43
  So when you were doing the material, did you have the title
• 4:47
  already in your mind or did you go grand eloquent?
• 4:50
  No, it just happened to be part of a part of a joke that that
• 4:55
  kind of summed up the the nature of the language in the show, if
• 4:59
  not the the content. And and so it another idea for
• 5:06
  the one man show was mommy look, because my, my theory was that
• 5:10
  that you could call just about every one man show mommy look
• 5:16
  because because it's, it's, it's really people starve like myself
• 5:20
  for attention and, and it stems from childhood and that.
• 5:24
  We want to impress our mom. Yeah, that's one of the themes
• 5:27
  of the of the show is trying to we didn't want to impress our.
• 5:30
  Dad, did we? In my case, my my dad was so
• 5:34
  easily impressed and and such a big fan from the get go that
• 5:38
  that it wasn't his attention wasn't hard to garner, but my
• 5:41
  mother was just distracted and tired and it was and so it was
• 5:46
  hard to get her attention. You really, you really had to
• 5:48
  be. Funny, so it was harder work so.
• 5:51
  It was harder work. And of course, we're we're more
• 5:54
  drawn to the people who are, who are rejecting.
• 5:56
  Yeah, Yeah. And less excited about us.
• 5:59
  It's like when you're in a crowd and you see that one person.
• 6:01
  Oh my. Word Yes, yes, that that happens
• 6:05
  every single night and I have to I have to fight.
• 6:08
  With my mom. I have to fight with myself to
• 6:10
  find the person who is enjoying themselves to, to give me some
• 6:14
  comfort. And also you can, you can work
• 6:16
  your timing off the person who is, is laughing and, and that's
• 6:21
  really helpful, but it's counter to all my my neurosis, which is
• 6:25
  to find the person who is not enjoying you and try to win them
• 6:29
  over, which is just a fool's errand.
• 6:30
  But have you ever done that where you worked that person and
• 6:34
  then eventually there? Yeah.
• 6:35
  Eventually, but it's it's, yeah, it's a, it's.
• 6:38
  A fool's errand. Yeah, it's a Pyrrhic victory
• 6:41
  And, and it, it really just throws, it throws me off
• 6:49
  frequently. And, and the key is, is that
• 6:52
  I've gotten better at not addressing it.
• 6:57
  And, and I'll make up a little story in my head about the
• 7:00
  person's day in order to, in order to rationalise why they're
• 7:05
  having such a lousy time with my show.
• 7:08
  And, and, or there's a, there's always, there's always somebody
• 7:13
  you can find who is not, who's not outwardly expressing.
• 7:18
  Yeah. Yeah.
• 7:19
  Have you ever had this, though? This is like this only happened
• 7:22
  to me once but somebody who was laughing but ruined the whole Oh
• 7:28
  yeah timing of that. Yeah, of course that happens.
• 7:31
  That happens to all. The the inappropriate laugh.
• 7:33
  And and they're impossible to wrangle because you can't say,
• 7:36
  hey, knock it off, stop. Stop having fun.
• 7:40
  Yes. I mean that there was an
• 7:43
  interesting story. I I I was in the movie Joker
• 7:47
  with Joaquin Phoenix and heard I played, I played myself doing a
• 7:52
  show and one of the extras was laughing so off timing and in
• 8:01
  such a bizarre manner. And after you pulled a Christian
• 8:05
  Bale. After five, almost after 5
• 8:09
  takes, it hit me, Oh, he's Joker is in the scene.
• 8:14
  He is he is there. I had had not thought he would
• 8:18
  sit in on my side of the of the filming but he was he was
• 8:24
  watching me and he was laughing in such a Joker manner and I and
• 8:29
  but it took me 5 takes to realise that that's who the the
• 8:32
  off timed insane laugh. But then you probably gave an
• 8:36
  honest reaction to of. Course I was.
• 8:39
  I was infuriated, but also, but also trying not to ruin the take
• 8:48
  by by saying, hey, what the fuck is wrong with you?
• 8:53
  Yeah. So that was that was sort of the
• 8:55
  the the most dramatic case of what you're saying that happens.
• 8:59
  That happens pretty frequently because I think some some people
• 9:02
  do have odd laughs and some people do try to join the show
• 9:05
  by by being a a distinctive laugh.
• 9:08
  It's kind of a sign of nerves too, right?
• 9:11
  Yeah. I'm funny, I'm laughing.
• 9:13
  I get it. Yes, yeah, it's really
• 9:17
  interesting. We have something in common, OK?
• 9:21
  We were both born in Massachusetts.
• 9:23
  Oh, I didn't. I didn't know that.
• 9:24
  Yes, you were born I. Should have known that I was
• 9:26
  born in Danvers, MA. I grew up in Peabody, MA.
• 9:29
  I was born in Northampton, Mass. Oh wow, what?
• 9:32
  A great town in Amherst. Oh, another great town.
• 9:36
  So I was born a lesbian. OK, no.
• 9:40
  Yeah, that is my word. That is the lesbian capital of
• 9:43
  America. But it was very young in my
• 9:45
  life. But my mom always, she considers
• 9:48
  herself a New Englander. Oh, that's cool.
• 9:51
  Only grew up there. Oh.
• 9:52
  Interesting. And when did you, when did you
• 9:54
  come over here? Well, I came over here when I
• 9:57
  started doing the Edinburgh festivals.
• 9:59
  Wow, yeah, in in like the 90s. Amazing.
• 10:03
  Yeah. And then I just sort of got
• 10:05
  work. So and then this was the time
• 10:08
  when I was moving to LA. So I would go back and forth.
• 10:11
  And then finally, I, I just moved over here during COVID.
• 10:15
  Oh, during COVID is yeah. Are you a citizen here?
• 10:19
  Or yes, I just got, oh, congratulations.
• 10:21
  Yes, I had to do some sort of thing to the king.
• 10:27
  I had to kiss the picture. Yeah, so funny.
• 10:30
  Yeah, my wife is British, so. OK.
• 10:33
  Oh, that helps. Yeah, that helps.
• 10:35
  So when you were growing up in Danvers?
• 10:39
  I grew up in Peabody. My I was born in a hospital in,
• 10:42
  in Danvers. I I was too literal in where
• 10:45
  were you born? So.
• 10:46
  Is is anybody else from Peabody gone into showbiz or?
• 10:52
  This is a great question. See, I'm asking good questions,
• 10:55
  Kenny. No.
• 10:57
  No, we. We.
• 11:01
  I'm trying to think our biggest celebrity is a was a baseball
• 11:05
  star from the 19. But that's great you're in. 80s
• 11:08
  Yeah, yeah. Oh, I do have a friend who is
• 11:13
  playing as as Harry Potter's son in the Cursed Child on Broadway.
• 11:19
  So he is in show business and and his name is Alex Serino.
• 11:25
  And he was cast as as. I don't know what Harry Potter's
• 11:30
  son's name is. Oh, oh, I.
• 11:33
  Saw it too in that show. West End show.
• 11:36
  Yeah. But this one is on Broadway.
• 11:37
  Yeah, yeah. And yeah.
• 11:39
  So he's the other show business? That is really tough.
• 11:42
  I talked to somebody that played the Harry Potter.
• 11:45
  You cannot miss the show. Oh, I can imagine.
• 11:47
  Yeah. And they're they're 2A day for
• 11:49
  Yeah, it's crazy. Yeah, it is crazy.
• 11:52
  But it's an impressive production.
• 11:53
  We really enjoyed it. We, we went when it was you had
• 11:58
  a break in between where you would leave for a couple of
• 12:00
  hours and then come back for the second part.
• 12:02
  It was like a, it was like a 5 hour or 4 1/2.
• 12:05
  I don't know that's. Production, it was too much.
• 12:08
  They've shortened it now, but my my wife is a is a big fan.
• 12:11
  So she was, she was very happy. That's a whole food cycle.
• 12:15
  Yes, you could get hypoglycemia just going totally.
• 12:19
  Yeah, we, we left it starving. The first one when we came back
• 12:22
  after after lunch, it was it was very interesting.
• 12:25
  So when you got the bug to do this?
• 12:28
  When I was six or seven years old.
• 12:30
  Really. Yeah.
• 12:31
  Was the goal to go, OK, I'm going to hit Boston?
• 12:35
  Yeah. Or was it like it became?
• 12:37
  Clear early on that you needed to do an open mic and they had
• 12:40
  open mics in in Boston. And then as you know, you go to
• 12:44
  1 and then and then you start to become friendly with other
• 12:47
  comedians and they say, hey, there's this open mic or there's
• 12:50
  this show that you can just hop on and and it was.
• 12:55
  Got to go to Ruffles. Yeah, yeah, it.
• 12:58
  Was like A and and your goals becoming increasingly more
• 13:04
  ambitious. So you just want to play at the
• 13:06
  place where they where they pay you a little bit of money.
• 13:09
  Like you could get $25 at this place and then Oh my gosh.
• 13:13
  Professional. Aid comedian But the thing that
• 13:16
  I that I know is that at every level it's a very enjoyable
• 13:22
  experience in terms of if you just want to be around witty,
• 13:27
  honest people. For the most part there aren't.
• 13:30
  There are creeps, but for the most part there are a lot of of
• 13:34
  witty, honest, interesting people doing comedy.
• 13:38
  And then you get to do comedy for a little while, 5 minutes
• 13:41
  usually, sometimes less than you can.
• 13:44
  You can do that. The barriers to entry are are,
• 13:48
  are not. Very rigid.
• 13:49
  Not very rigid. And I think a lot, a lot of
• 13:53
  people, myself included, thought that that at that time that
• 13:58
  that, well, you had to be like at the time, in order to get an
• 14:03
  audience, you kind of had to have a, a situation comedy on
• 14:06
  television or being movies or something like that.
• 14:08
  So it was that became the goal. And that was a bummer because
• 14:12
  you just, you just want to be a stand up.
• 14:14
  And then they're telling you know, you, you the, the only
• 14:17
  route really before the Internet was to become famous as
• 14:21
  something else. And then you might be able to be
• 14:24
  a, a touring stand up. But but now in some ways it's
• 14:28
  better because you can like I'm known primarily as a, as a stand
• 14:33
  up and and my acting roles and things like that have just been.
• 14:36
  Just come from that come. From doing stand up rather than
• 14:38
  the other way or. Yeah, I think.
• 14:41
  Who's that one liner comic? He's dead now.
• 14:44
  He had a great bit about. Oh, Mitch Hedberg.
• 14:46
  Mitch Hedberg about. How?
• 14:48
  Everybody was asking him, thinking.
• 14:49
  About that, he says if he it's like if you were a great chef
• 14:52
  and you worked your whole life and they said, OK, you're a
• 14:55
  great chef, can you farm? Like two different things.
• 15:00
  Totally. Yeah, totally.
• 15:02
  So did you have a mentor when you were kind of going through?
• 15:06
  Had many mentors There was one man who who was particularly.
• 15:12
  In a van started. His his name was Paul D'Angelo.
• 15:16
  It still is Paul D'Angelo and he was a a great comedian from
• 15:19
  Wakefield, MA and he he really took a liking to me and, and
• 15:26
  gave me stage time and advice and friendships and then
• 15:29
  mentorship. And then there was another man
• 15:32
  named Don Gavin, who is who is very generous with his time and
• 15:37
  and. That really helps.
• 15:38
  It's I mean, it's everything. And so, I mean, if, if you're a
• 15:43
  halfway decent person, you try to do that for other, other
• 15:47
  young comics growing up. And, and so that's what I've
• 15:49
  I've done and it, and it's also very, very helpful to yourself
• 15:53
  because it reminds you of what it takes.
• 15:55
  And, and also also, I feel like it's insurance for my my 70s.
• 16:01
  Someone will let me open for them.
• 16:02
  Yeah, yeah, yeah. No, that's it's very important.
• 16:06
  Be nice to those kids coming up. I hate to be so transactional,
• 16:11
  but but there there's also just in, in general, if you're, if
• 16:16
  you're kind, there'll be a space for you at some point.
• 16:19
  Where like somebody finishes their act.
• 16:21
  It's like, can I talk to you about it?
• 16:22
  Get out of here. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, No, I, I
• 16:26
  mean, yeah. It's, it's extraordinary the
• 16:28
  range of personalities in this business from the warmest,
• 16:31
  kindest people to the most cruel and dismissive.
• 16:35
  So I I generally am. I'm attracted to the the kinder,
• 16:40
  softer people, of course. So when did you go to Boston?
• 16:44
  How old were you? Like, well, in years.
• 16:48
  I was 23 when I first started doing comedy in Boston.
• 16:50
  I graduated college with a with an accounting degree and I was
• 16:54
  working for an account. As one does as one does Bob
• 16:57
  Newhart. Was like, the whole thing is
• 16:59
  that I, I modelled myself after Bob Newhart, except that I, I, I
• 17:04
  started a little bit younger than him.
• 17:07
  And the thing was, is that I, I, the, the goal in, in accounting,
• 17:12
  you want to become a certified public accountant.
• 17:14
  And I remember on the first day I opened up the book that tells
• 17:19
  you, oh, here's like a practise to do the CPA exam.
• 17:22
  Oh, right, and it's hard. It's really hard and I had just
• 17:25
  graduated, I had just taken all these classes and I didn't.
• 17:28
  LIFO. FIFO.
• 17:29
  Yes, and I didn't remember. I knew LIFO and FIFO, but I
• 17:33
  didn't remember. It's an inventory system.
• 17:36
  Very exciting stuff. Yeah, look it up.
• 17:40
  And, and so I opened it up and I said, all right, let's just
• 17:45
  write jokes. It would be easier.
• 17:47
  That's what's interesting. Of course, it would have been
• 17:49
  easier to be ACPA than a comedian looking back on it,
• 17:53
  because it takes like 10 years for me.
• 17:57
  It took 10 years till I was till I was getting any kind of meagre
• 18:01
  living as a Rode comic and the conditions were were horrific.
• 18:06
  So did you work at all as an accountant?
• 18:09
  Yes, for three years in total I was an accountant and then I
• 18:12
  just started getting odd jobs to support my my addiction to
• 18:17
  comedy. So it's funny, there was a
• 18:20
  accountant that I had on early on that's a British stand up and
• 18:25
  he he had a moment. Did you have a moment when it's
• 18:28
  like now I'm going to quit accounting like officer and a
• 18:33
  gentleman. You sort of.
• 18:34
  Right. I mean, there were there were
• 18:37
  there were moments, but I had to keep doing day jobs.
• 18:41
  So my last day job was as a substitute teacher at the high
• 18:43
  school that I went to, which was really cool.
• 18:46
  It sounds like a nightmare that you would that you would come
• 18:49
  back at 28 years old and and be paying, being paid so little
• 18:54
  money and the kids knew how little money and they would mock
• 18:57
  me. But it was really nice to be
• 19:00
  with some of the teachers that I had had and also get to know the
• 19:04
  kids. And it it was it really the my
• 19:07
  favourite job other than than comedian.
• 19:09
  I think there's a universe where I am a where am I substitute or
• 19:13
  a full time. You got to go to the teachers
• 19:15
  lounge I. Got to go to the teachers lounge
• 19:17
  and it was, it was interesting because I don't know if you had
• 19:22
  this, I'd be surprised if that's wasn't the case.
• 19:25
  The more eccentric the teacher, the more I, I love them.
• 19:29
  And really when I was growing up, if they were, if they were
• 19:31
  funny and weird and, and off I love them.
• 19:36
  And then you come back and you realise, oh, they're probably in
• 19:40
  some sort of either bipolar or, or some sort of some sort of
• 19:44
  condition. That caused them to be.
• 19:46
  So interesting. And it was either did the job
• 19:50
  made them that way or they were attracted to the job because
• 19:53
  they could be themselves in a in a way.
• 19:55
  And and so it was very interesting to but I.
• 19:58
  Was going to say, did that make you because you kind of looked
• 20:01
  up to these teachers and now when you're older.
• 20:04
  I think it made me admire them, made me admire them more because
• 20:08
  they, they had, they had fought back against this, this because
• 20:14
  they could have just been in a, in a, a rubber rum dribbling
• 20:18
  their, their lips and and they chose to do something that that
• 20:22
  is challenging. I mean, the kids can be
• 20:23
  overwhelming. So a lot of mentally challenged
• 20:26
  people go into teaching. I don't think that's.
• 20:28
  That's what I'm getting. From No, what I said, Rich, I
• 20:32
  don't want to be misconstrued here is that I was attracted to
• 20:36
  the crazy crazier teacher. Yeah, that that I felt a kinship
• 20:42
  with them and they were. It's interesting because I think
• 20:48
  mental illness can lead to a funnier personality because you
• 20:54
  are trying to cope through laughter and laughter is, is
• 20:58
  such a great antidepressant. So here it's and it's and it
• 21:01
  gives you a charge even when you're just being funny.
• 21:04
  Laughing, of course, is great. But if you're being funny and
• 21:06
  you're making people laugh, that really is it gives you some,
• 21:10
  some serotonin. And I think that's what they
• 21:13
  were working off of. They were making, they were
• 21:15
  making kids laugh and they were always kids.
• 21:17
  They were always tough audiences.
• 21:19
  But I found that my, the classes that I was in, I mean, we quote
• 21:24
  some of these these teachers on a day-to-day basis.
• 21:26
  There was this man and I, I don't think he was bipolar or
• 21:29
  anything, but he was, he was, he was off in that he.
• 21:34
  He was a sanitarian. He.
• 21:36
  Was just so himself and he so whenever he sneezed and he would
• 21:41
  do that loud middle-aged sneeze and he would turn to someone, he
• 21:45
  would just and he would say that would have killed a mortal man.
• 21:50
  He did the same thing every time.
• 21:53
  Every single time and every single time I laugh.
• 21:56
  It was probably 6 * a year, but it was just, it was spread out
• 22:00
  and he had great timing and he was just, there was no there.
• 22:04
  There was sometimes when somebody is doing a character
• 22:08
  like this is a character, but no, this was just him and he
• 22:11
  just, he made us laugh so much and he was a great storyteller
• 22:15
  and, and I just adored him. We had a.
• 22:18
  Teacher with, he literally had kind of a greenish tinge to his
• 22:23
  hair. And so we would always do this.
• 22:25
  We would go like that. It's just so weird, mature and I
• 22:31
  was 30. It is pretty.
• 22:32
  Clear it is clever for a child, but at 30 you should be.
• 22:36
  Passing. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 22:38
  Oh Lord, so you did that and then you you were doing the
• 22:43
  clubs in Boston. Yeah, I imagine with people that
• 22:47
  are now quite. Yeah, I mean the, the, the
• 22:50
  international superstars that are all Bostonians, Yeah, that I
• 22:55
  came up with Bill Burr and Patrice O'Neal and Dame Cook and
• 23:02
  Robert Kelly and yeah. Were they the versions that we
• 23:06
  see now or they were they very raw and it's.
• 23:10
  Interesting because you can look back at yourself and you can
• 23:13
  look back at any comedian and you think, Oh my gosh, they were
• 23:17
  not nearly as strong as they are now.
• 23:21
  But at the time I watched them and I was like, these guys are
• 23:25
  fully formed and they are incredible.
• 23:26
  They were probably 2 years ahead of me and they were just
• 23:31
  extraordinary. Really, really blew us away.
• 23:34
  There was another guy that was sort of my, my class named
• 23:38
  Dwayne Perkins and, and we were like 2 years behind and we were
• 23:41
  just, they were really good role models because they were very,
• 23:45
  they were very driven and very ambitious.
• 23:47
  There were a lot of, in this, probably in every comedy scene,
• 23:50
  there were a lot of Boston guys who had been there for 20 years
• 23:53
  and we're not, we're not leaving.
• 23:55
  And then there were these guys who it was clear that Boston was
• 23:58
  not going to be big enough for them because they were, they
• 24:01
  were. So they were so powerful and,
• 24:03
  and really impressive acts. Yeah.
• 24:07
  So you you hung out in Boston for how long?
• 24:11
  You were 6. Six years.
• 24:14
  Nice. Yeah.
• 24:15
  From from 23 to 29. And then I did the The Just for
• 24:19
  Last Montreal Comedy Festival, Juiced.
• 24:21
  Barrier in the French. Yes, yeah.
• 24:24
  And that changed. That changed everything back at
• 24:27
  a time when it could change everything, yeah.
• 24:30
  I remember people would go up and they go such and such, got a
• 24:34
  deal. Yes, that's what I was.
• 24:36
  Such and such you. Were you killed?
• 24:38
  Yeah, yeah, I don't even know that I killed.
• 24:41
  I was just cute and I had a pretty good act.
• 24:43
  And so and, and so I had these meetings and I would go into the
• 24:47
  meetings and I would tell the story of my, my life and, and
• 24:51
  the people in my life and, and being a teacher and, and my mom
• 24:56
  is a very funny character and just insane.
• 25:01
  And so and then, and then you get a call and they're like
• 25:04
  they're going to offer you more than you made and, and.
• 25:07
  That must have been. 10 years of teaching, it was really, it was
• 25:11
  really trippy. Did you go to?
• 25:13
  I went to LA, yeah. I went to LA and then I moved
• 25:16
  out there and I stayed there for for six years.
• 25:18
  But this the scene was was really challenging in terms of
• 25:23
  getting on stage. It was I found myself performing
• 25:25
  in in laundromats and above restaurants and bars.
• 25:29
  It was really hard to get into the three main the three main
• 25:32
  clubs there so. Comedy Store.
• 25:34
  Laugh Factory. And improv, yeah.
• 25:37
  And I, and I wasn't really, I, I didn't have it.
• 25:40
  I had a pretty mainstream act so I couldn't play any of the any
• 25:43
  of the alternative rooms, which were really the best, the best
• 25:46
  rooms, yeah. Now I play Largo regularly.
• 25:49
  Yeah, yeah. But back then I, I think I was I
• 25:52
  was also very intimidated by the the level of mastery that the
• 25:57
  comedians had out there. So it was very intimidating and.
• 26:00
  When I was out there, Pat Paul left Tomkins.
• 26:04
  And Janine Garofalo and, and I mean the Laugh Factory was very
• 26:08
  interesting. They would they would bring on
• 26:11
  Tim Allen and Ray Romano and Gary Shandling and and the the
• 26:15
  one club I was able to work, which was really special is
• 26:17
  called the Comedy and Magic Club in, in Hermosa Beach.
• 26:22
  Yes, right on the beach. And they have a variety show in
• 26:26
  that they have comedians and. That's what Leno does.
• 26:29
  Yeah, Leno. Does every Sunday night, but so
• 26:31
  I was able to work with Garry Shandling and when Garry
• 26:34
  Shandling works a place, you get to meet all the people that
• 26:37
  Garry Shandling knows. So, so David Duchovny would come
• 26:41
  by there and and I met George Carlin and Harry Shearer and and
• 26:46
  just some really some. That's amazing.
• 26:48
  Just. Immortals would, would, would
• 26:50
  work out there and it was, it was a really cool place.
• 26:53
  And in July they would have a show where at that time, however
• 26:57
  many years they had been in business, that's how many
• 26:59
  comedians they would put on. So I could do 5 minutes every
• 27:03
  night in July and, and all I had to do was drive about 30
• 27:06
  minutes. And it was, it was really,
• 27:08
  really helpful. And I and I got to, to meet
• 27:11
  Garry Shandling, who is one of my, one of my heroes growing up,
• 27:14
  I just, I, I was. All right, love Gary.
• 27:17
  Yeah, RIP Gary. He was such a such an impressive
• 27:21
  mind and and comedian. I never met him, but I I
• 27:25
  remember sitting at a like a coffee place in Beverly Hills
• 27:31
  and he was right where and I was already done with my coffee, but
• 27:35
  I just sort of sat there to listen in on.
• 27:38
  I, I first saw him when I was 13 from my bar mitzvah.
• 27:42
  My mother took me to Los Angeles to see the Johnny Carson show.
• 27:47
  And yeah, you had to be 16 years old.
• 27:52
  And the thing was, is that my brother had been bumped from a,
• 27:55
  from an airline flight and he wasn't able to use the, the
• 27:58
  flight. So my mother and I, he had, it
• 28:01
  had happened to him twice. So my mother and I used the
• 28:03
  flights to go to Los Angeles. We stayed with my cousin Della
• 28:06
  and she took us to see The Tonight Show with Johnny Carson.
• 28:11
  And did they card you? No, they just asked how old I am
• 28:15
  and I said 16 and then and then one of the pages said excuse me,
• 28:19
  how old are you? And my mother said how dare you?
• 28:23
  How dare you? Do you think I would bring an
• 28:25
  underage child to see Johnny? Mr Johnny Carson and and and the
• 28:31
  1 was so apologetic when it was. Yeah.
• 28:35
  No, totally. I you were probably, I was very
• 28:38
  tall. Yeah, but I looked like a I
• 28:40
  probably look 10 years old. I didn't have any kind of facial
• 28:43
  or anything like that. Princess Leia.
• 28:47
  Nice. Carrie Fisher, who's who's
• 28:49
  another person I admire because she's been very open about her
• 28:52
  was very open about her mental health and and and alcoholism.
• 28:56
  And so and so it's a very famous episode because at one point
• 29:00
  Garry Shandling is on the couch with Princess Leia.
• 29:04
  And he says now your your parents are are Eddie Fisher and
• 29:10
  Debbie Reynolds. And do you know my parents, Irv
• 29:14
  and Muriel Shandling and she and Carson went crazy and we all
• 29:19
  went. It was, I mean, I get goosebumps
• 29:22
  thinking about it. It was one of the greatest
• 29:24
  experiences of my. Carson tapped his pencil and
• 29:28
  looked around. Wow.
• 29:31
  You grew up a fan of Johnny? Yeah, right.
• 29:33
  Yeah. It was.
• 29:34
  It was he was it. He really was it.
• 29:37
  And it was really, it was. It was something else.
• 29:39
  That was So after that, eventually you went into this,
• 29:43
  this comedy competition, right? Oh.
• 29:47
  Last comic standing. Last comic standing, yes.
• 29:50
  This is it's a reality show, yeah.
• 29:53
  Which I've seen before. I never saw you in it.
• 29:56
  Yeah, it was on the second season and that was that was
• 29:58
  pretty neat. Yeah, so were you.
• 30:02
  Was that something that a lot of your peers did?
• 30:04
  Or a lot of, a lot of people auditioned for it and it was, it
• 30:10
  was, it was very competitive and, and I made it and I was the
• 30:15
  second runner up, which means 3rd place.
• 30:18
  And and that was a game changer in terms of being able to tour
• 30:22
  as a stand up because even though I had been, I had been
• 30:25
  paid handsomely to make to develop sitcoms that never
• 30:29
  aired. Right, right.
• 30:30
  You got a development deal. Nobody knew who I was and then
• 30:33
  all of a sudden I was able to to sell some tickets at some comedy
• 30:37
  clubs and that was really, that was really special and, and, and
• 30:41
  fleeting, but it was very fun. No, no, yeah.
• 30:44
  And what is funny, I don't know if you like this or not, but the
• 30:49
  first time I actually came to know you publicly, Yeah.
• 30:54
  Was that show tour orgasm? Oh, interesting.
• 30:57
  Yes, yeah, it was, it was difficult.
• 30:59
  It was, it was, it was gruelling.
• 31:02
  I was especially interested because I was over here and I
• 31:05
  was with a group called the Mighty Boosh, yes.
• 31:08
  We had just gone. On tour, right?
• 31:11
  So I thought, oh, this show is like behind the scenes of a tour
• 31:15
  bus and everything. And I was watching you guys and
• 31:18
  you had sometimes you had a, a pained expression.
• 31:22
  Oh, I was, I was very unhappy. I, I, I mean my manager's
• 31:27
  assistant, which and then, and you know, in show business, the
• 31:30
  manager's assistant does all the work.
• 31:31
  Of course, nightly I would call her and, and she would talk me
• 31:35
  off a, off a ledge, sometimes literally, sometimes sometimes
• 31:40
  literally I was on a ledge and then other times I was just on a
• 31:43
  figurative ledge. But but she would be.
• 31:46
  Down. All right, set up a flight.
• 31:49
  I got to get out of here. Did you know Dane?
• 31:52
  Yeah. I started off and he was already
• 31:56
  a star of of Boston and and very successful in terms he had been
• 32:00
  on Letterman. So it was really he.
• 32:02
  He was. His trajectory was very.
• 32:04
  He just went very steep. Yeah.
• 32:06
  And so we we were, we were friends and and he invited me on
• 32:11
  that. And it was, it was, it was just
• 32:14
  tough to be in the orbit of a of a shooting star and so.
• 32:19
  There were four of you, right? Yeah.
• 32:21
  And you had to go on before the person that everybody was there
• 32:24
  to see. And some some shows were were
• 32:28
  better than others, but some shows the audience was was
• 32:33
  hostile to the opening accident it was.
• 32:36
  Really. Because they wanted to see.
• 32:37
  Because they wanted to see day and that was so that was
• 32:39
  difficult. And my and my, my ego is is
• 32:43
  pretty fragile. I mean I I had.
• 32:46
  It just. Yeah, it gives you.
• 32:48
  It gives you more low self lowers, lowers your self esteem
• 32:53
  and and. Because here you are.
• 32:55
  You've got this. You're on this show.
• 32:57
  Yeah, a chance to show your stuff.
• 33:00
  Yeah, yeah. And it was difficult.
• 33:02
  I mean that there were some fun moments, but if I had to, if I
• 33:07
  was asked to do it again, I would say no, not a million.
• 33:10
  Well, now it would be you with a bunch of your yeah people
• 33:15
  opening for you. Right, but I don't think you
• 33:18
  understand what a he was a phenomenon.
• 33:20
  He was a phenomenon in America at that time.
• 33:22
  So that was it. That was really, it was an
• 33:24
  interesting thing to witness. But as we, as we do in, in life,
• 33:30
  we compare and then we despair. And so that that was, that was
• 33:35
  what was going on there. I wasn't I, I and and who knows
• 33:38
  if I'm even mature enough and and strong enough of mind to be
• 33:42
  able to handle that type of. But what doesn't kill you makes
• 33:45
  you stronger. Ohh I did that show right I'm
• 33:48
  I've never been the same. Let's see, I don't remember the
• 33:52
  performances from that thing so much as like stuff like when you
• 33:57
  were arguing over who gets the bed and the.
• 34:00
  Back Yeah, yeah, yeah stuff like that Oh yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 34:03
  I had to sleep in a coffin every night and it was just, yeah,
• 34:06
  it's not good for your. Little curtain.
• 34:09
  Right, we all know what sleep deprivation will will do to you
• 34:12
  and it just made me surly and and.
• 34:14
  You what probably wanted the big bed 'cause you were.
• 34:17
  Yeah, of course, of course. But Dane got the big bed and and
• 34:21
  we slept in these little births or but they were coffins.
• 34:26
  Yeah, it was humbling. It was.
• 34:27
  Did stuff come out of that? No, not a single, not a single
• 34:31
  thing. In fact, we weren't even really
• 34:33
  paid because it was, it was a documentary.
• 34:36
  We were paid to do the shows originally, but when it was sold
• 34:38
  to HBO. Nothing.
• 34:40
  We didn't. Get a.
• 34:44
  Yeah, yeah. So after that you you were still
• 34:48
  in LA. Yeah, I was in Lai stayed there
• 34:51
  until 2006 and then I went to New York for six months.
• 34:55
  Ostensibly I was going to go for six months and I never I never
• 34:59
  left. That was almost 20 years ago
• 35:00
  because the, the stage time in in New York City really, really
• 35:05
  incredible. I was, I, I and, and I, I, I
• 35:08
  really feel, I always tell young comedians, and this was, this
• 35:12
  was obvious from when I first started that, that your, your
• 35:17
  improvement is a function of how often you're getting on stage.
• 35:21
  No matter how bad the, the, the audience is or the, or the
• 35:25
  venue, getting on stage is, is everything.
• 35:28
  Yeah. And, and so I, I, I used to, I
• 35:32
  used to just fantasise, I would say once I can get on stage,
• 35:36
  like some of these people who just drop in, like then, then
• 35:40
  I'll be be able to be as good as I, as, as my work ethic can, can
• 35:45
  allow. Because I, I always had a pretty
• 35:47
  good work ethic for a comedian. Like we know how, how comedians
• 35:52
  will will stick with their same act for years and years.
• 35:55
  But I, I, I knew early on that you, you really had to be
• 35:59
  creative and disciplined. And, and I, I just would see,
• 36:04
  for instance, Garry Shandling come to the, and this was, this
• 36:07
  was as good as comedy. God, he would come with this, a
• 36:10
  yellow legal pad. But here's the thing with the
• 36:12
  yellow legal pad, the papers fly off all the time.
• 36:15
  So he's got this, this big ball of, of pages and, and, and he's
• 36:19
  going through them and I, and I, I noticed that everybody whose
• 36:23
  act I liked did some preparation before they went on stage and
• 36:27
  had someone more organised than others.
• 36:29
  Some guys would print it out and things like that.
• 36:31
  And I, I, I, I, I don't care for, for my printer, so I don't
• 36:35
  really print it out very much. But yeah, I've noticed that I
• 36:39
  didn't want to fawn, but I I'm such a fan of the Mighty Boosh
• 36:42
  and, and you guys do so yeah, no, I mean, it's, it's an
• 36:46
  institution and and. It's it's the highest the.
• 36:51
  Highest level of of comedy. No.
• 36:53
  Oh, thank you. But it's one of those things now
• 36:56
  where the the people that saw it initially now are grown up and
• 37:00
  they keep coming. Oh, I'm showing my kids now.
• 37:04
  Yeah. So I don't know what to say to
• 37:06
  that. It's you should say thank you.
• 37:09
  Yeah. Thanks.
• 37:10
  Yeah, well, I do say thank you. It's.
• 37:11
  Incredibly cool. Shut up.
• 37:17
  But I was about that discipline because I I've quickly learned
• 37:22
  that too. You got to be disciplined.
• 37:24
  Yeah. Tape the show, maybe go, go over
• 37:28
  it, which I hate. And then it's.
• 37:29
  So hard to listen to yourself and also listen because it never
• 37:33
  sounds as good as you remembered it on stage.
• 37:35
  So it's, yeah, it's it's humbling.
• 37:37
  In some comics, I find because of that, the ones that are
• 37:40
  really disciplined, not you like, some of them are actually
• 37:43
  kind of conservative. Oh, sure.
• 37:45
  In a way, yeah, because they have set ways of doing things.
• 37:49
  Yeah, that was the other thing with with Shandling.
• 37:53
  I keep remembering things that he would say, like I would read
• 37:56
  an interview and he would, he would say, I try to do it from
• 38:00
  different angles every every night with different timing and
• 38:04
  and swap orders. And then you have Seinfeld, it
• 38:07
  seems like an automaton and he does it the same way every
• 38:10
  single night. And he tries to replicate the
• 38:12
  exact delivery of when it worked best.
• 38:15
  And I, I, I'm not a very big fan of him on or off stage.
• 38:21
  And but Garry Shandling, I really like that that approach.
• 38:25
  It's more of an improv. Seinfeld will change like a
• 38:28
  little word, maybe to get the right yeah.
• 38:30
  Yeah, the the man is a really odd character, but Garry
• 38:37
  Shandling was the was the guy and disciplined and also but
• 38:42
  very loose, which which I don't, I don't think you should be
• 38:45
  conservative in. Terms of.
• 38:48
  Either politically nor in terms of how you approach your.
• 38:52
  Yeah, yeah, totally. And and sort of courting failure
• 38:57
  and taking bigger and bigger risks.
• 38:59
  And there's a time when you can't take any risks because you
• 39:02
  may not work in that club again if they if if you don't do well.
• 39:05
  It's a tough call. Yeah.
• 39:08
  But I think, I think the the I think the people who take the
• 39:12
  most risks push at the furthest and and well, you know that from
• 39:15
  the. Yeah, yes.
• 39:18
  We didn't know anything. When did you get to the point
• 39:22
  where you were doing, you know, sets and headlining and stuff to
• 39:26
  when you started doing these hour long shows?
• 39:29
  Because you've done about 5 TV specials.
• 39:33
  Yeah, I think so. Yeah, and they're all, they're
• 39:36
  amazing. Oh, thank you.
• 39:38
  Yeah, that's really nice. So.
• 39:39
  Funny. Thank you.
• 39:40
  And I think in 2000, 2005, I started headlining and doing
• 39:50
  hours. But the the big difference comes
• 39:53
  when people are there to see you and you can really be yourself.
• 39:57
  You don't have to appeal to just people who came to a comedy.
• 39:59
  Club. That's when you've reached a
• 40:00
  plateau, I think. And so I don't think that
• 40:03
  happened until like 2014 or, or. And then there was there was a
• 40:09
  dramatic change in 2016 when I did, I had done, I think in
• 40:13
  2015, a spot on Conan's show where I where I told the story
• 40:19
  and it was completely made-up about how all the states got
• 40:22
  their abbreviations. Oh, thank you.
• 40:24
  And nobody saw it when it first came out.
• 40:27
  And then Patton Oswalt saw it and he says, I can't believe I
• 40:31
  missed this. And he put it on Facebook.
• 40:33
  And then all of a sudden I would I would be filling 300 seat.
• 40:38
  Just for that repo, yes. Oh my God, it was.
• 40:42
  Incredible. It changed.
• 40:43
  I haven't seen it. Watch the bit about the two
• 40:46
  it's. Called how the states got their
• 40:47
  abbreviations. Yes, because they all have two
• 40:49
  letter abbreviations and and that changed everything.
• 40:53
  And then I was going to comedy clubs where people were familiar
• 40:58
  with what I did and how I did it, and then I could do similar
• 41:02
  jokes that were that were longer and weirder.
• 41:05
  But did they go do the bit about the post office?
• 41:08
  No, no, it was, it was interesting.
• 41:11
  Occasionally they would and they knew all the words to it, which
• 41:14
  is which is uncomfortable and and not great for comedy.
• 41:18
  But for the most part, I had, I, I've been doing it so long that
• 41:22
  I had other stories that were in a similar type of style and so
• 41:28
  that they were, they were satisfied with what I was doing.
• 41:31
  And then, and then you just become more and more yourself
• 41:34
  and become more and more comfortable in that.
• 41:36
  So that, so I, I feel like 2015, 2016 at 4546 was when I hit my
• 41:45
  stride, but also when I had a 2 1/2 year layoff in terms of
• 41:51
  productivity because I was, I, I went crazy.
• 41:55
  I went nuts and and wound up in in the psych ward for for a
• 41:59
  month and and. Which is the subject of one of
• 42:02
  your shows. Yeah, that was the subject of a
• 42:04
  show called The Great Depression that I that I did.
• 42:07
  And that was the first time I was really open about my
• 42:10
  personal life. It was, it wasn't.
• 42:12
  Did you ever know this? It became hey, I ever, ever,
• 42:16
  ever get recognised in the psych ward.
• 42:19
  That had to be a big step. That was a big step because
• 42:23
  nobody knew that I was mentally ill.
• 42:26
  And then everybody with an HBO subscription knew I was mentally
• 42:30
  ill. And the thing I learned from
• 42:32
  that was it's it's much more comfortable to be open rather
• 42:36
  than keeping secret. So it was it, it was, it was
• 42:39
  really a we're. Friends a dramatic.
• 42:41
  Lesson. They were surprised at how at
• 42:44
  how bad it was because I never told anybody.
• 42:46
  I went to the psych ward. I said, I said I'm taking a
• 42:49
  break and only, only my manager and my wife and my immediate
• 42:54
  family knew that I was, that I was getting electroshock
• 42:58
  therapy. Right.
• 43:00
  Yeah. And that was like 2 1/2 years. 2
• 43:04
  1/2 years, of which I was, I was for, for half of it, I was
• 43:09
  probably like catatonic on the on the couch.
• 43:12
  Yeah. And I was able to for a period.
• 43:15
  I was able to pull myself together at the end of the day
• 43:17
  and go down to the Comedy Cellar and do 15 minutes and and that
• 43:21
  was good. That was healthy because you
• 43:23
  were still. Doing little for.
• 43:25
  Part of it for part of it. And then occasionally I would go
• 43:28
  on the road and it became a fight not to find a, a really
• 43:34
  high bridge in every city, right?
• 43:37
  It was brutal. When during that time and you
• 43:40
  were doing a stage time, was it about your condition and stuff?
• 43:44
  No, no, not until I got out of the hospital and I and I looked
• 43:49
  so I was a wreck. I was a wreck.
• 43:55
  I was not able to pull myself together for the shows that I
• 43:57
  had to do. So I looked off and I was biting
• 44:01
  my lips and my lips were often either to scabby or bleeding and
• 44:05
  from anxiety. I would bite my lip and then I
• 44:09
  had to address it because I I had to make some sort of joke
• 44:13
  about I look like a lunatic. Yeah, yeah, I was.
• 44:16
  I was not showering and, and, and so I would talk about it and
• 44:21
  then and then people would come off after the show and tell me
• 44:25
  that they had similar experience.
• 44:27
  So this came organically. Yes, and and then you're
• 44:32
  rewarded for something in a different way.
• 44:35
  Yeah. I had just gotten laughs and now
• 44:37
  I was connecting with people and they were and they were feeling.
• 44:40
  Which people hadn't done before well.
• 44:43
  Well, I mean, a lot of people had done it.
• 44:45
  Maria Bamford was very open and Chris Gethard.
• 44:48
  So I was standing on the shoulders of these giants.
• 44:50
  So I wasn't, I didn't have to be the first person to open about
• 44:53
  the open up about this, but I opened up about it in a in a
• 44:56
  different way and and it was very helpful that I had this
• 45:00
  audience from Patton Oswalt's repo.
• 45:02
  That's amazing. And, and that they were
• 45:04
  sensitive enough to, to be like, oh, we don't want to listen to
• 45:07
  this guy tell scary. They're not really scary
• 45:11
  stories. But to somebody who's
• 45:13
  uninitiated in terms of the mental health condition and
• 45:17
  hospitalisation, it could be a little bit scary.
• 45:20
  I, I didn't, I wouldn't have wanted to hear stories of, of
• 45:24
  hospitalizations before that, but but if you can make it
• 45:26
  funny, yes. They will go with you, but the
• 45:28
  cynic in me, sometimes the managers and stuff bring it up
• 45:32
  like, so let's turn this into something good.
• 45:35
  It's really funny. I, I wrote jokes about it and my
• 45:38
  manager figured out a way to monetize it, which is, which is
• 45:42
  their job. But he was very, he was very
• 45:45
  patient with me in terms of he didn't say, right, let's get you
• 45:47
  out on the road. Let's get you out on the road
• 45:49
  now. We can't cook again whenever
• 45:52
  you're. Ready was the mantra, but I it
• 45:55
  was a it was a slow recovery because and the and the other
• 45:58
  person who is who is just so incredibly patient was my wife
• 46:02
  because she had to, she had to sit with me 23 hours a day when
• 46:08
  I wasn't on stage and and talk me through my, my.
• 46:12
  But then you came out on the other end.
• 46:14
  Yeah, thank God. Thank God.
• 46:16
  Yeah. And I and I do have seven.
• 46:18
  I do have seven years. I almost feel like a person
• 46:22
  who's in the in the programme, but seven years of uninterrupted
• 46:26
  mental health. So I'm very grateful for that.
• 46:29
  Yeah. Thank you.
• 46:30
  Yes. Thanks, Rich.
• 46:34
  You don't need my validation, but yes, you've got it.
• 46:37
  I like validations. Yeah, yeah.
• 46:39
  After that you did Great Depression and then Grand
• 46:43
  Deliquent. I did one special in between, it
• 46:45
  was just sort of a sorbet. Third base.
• 46:48
  Born on third base, which was, it was just a lot of jokes about
• 46:52
  and stories about growing up poor and my, my, I, I, I don't
• 46:57
  know if every poor kid is like this, but just my resentment for
• 47:00
  wealthy people and, and their excesses.
• 47:02
  So, so that was really fun to do because I didn't have to, to
• 47:07
  talk about being crazy or, or in the hospital.
• 47:10
  And, and now grand eloquent is, is, is back to a more personal
• 47:14
  thing. And I and it's, it was, it's
• 47:17
  sort of a more memoirish and it, and it, I talk about how it how
• 47:22
  it became the person and comedian that I am.
• 47:27
  But it's funny. But there is a there is a part,
• 47:29
  it's very, it's a one man show. So there is a part where it's
• 47:33
  it's very it's heavy than the rest of the show.
• 47:37
  And that's very uncomfortable for a comedian to not be funny
• 47:39
  for 5 minutes and and you're dying to get a laugh.
• 47:43
  And it's just so that that. That was a nice.
• 47:45
  Challenge. Yeah, that's.
• 47:47
  Good. I agree.
• 47:49
  You're always challenging yourself.
• 47:51
  I like to do something that's a 20% out of my I don't, I don't
• 47:55
  go too far because I, I don't really believe in myself.
• 47:58
  But the, the, the idea is that you, you should feel at some
• 48:04
  point during a project, I'm over my head.
• 48:07
  I, I, I bet off more than I can chew.
• 48:09
  I think that's a sign. That's a healthy.
• 48:11
  Thing, yeah, I think that's a sign of a good project.
• 48:13
  Do you ever get like this when you're doing a one person show?
• 48:16
  I used to always. I don't know why at the 40
• 48:20
  minute mark I knew exactly when it was 40 minutes.
• 48:26
  It's so true. Yeah.
• 48:28
  Yeah, 40 minutes is that's so interesting.
• 48:30
  I never heard anybody say that, but that's so true at about 40
• 48:33
  minutes. And then there's this feeling.
• 48:36
  And I wonder if I wonder if people in a in a play get the
• 48:39
  same feeling where you're like, all right, The the I, I just
• 48:43
  have to push, yeah, let's just stick this landing.
• 48:46
  And then and then we can take a a sigh of relief because I, I
• 48:50
  think that's another good sign is then is that it, it's a
• 48:53
  little bit hard Every, every single night are certain moments
• 48:57
  that I that I have to, that I have to get to that aren't I
• 49:00
  don't know how I'm going to get there each night.
• 49:02
  And that's, that's, I think that's a good sign.
• 49:04
  That's great. Yeah.
• 49:05
  Yeah. I remember.
• 49:06
  I don't know if you're a fan of the band Rush, but but I
• 49:09
  remember in an interview, Neil Parrot, the drummer, said every
• 49:13
  single night it's hard to do these drum parts.
• 49:16
  And I'm really proud of myself at the end.
• 49:18
  Wanna. If I've done it if I've done it
• 49:21
  well. And that feels really good.
• 49:22
  And I. And I thought wow, he's amazing.
• 49:24
  He's not. Yeah.
• 49:25
  He wasn't phoning it in. And.
• 49:26
  And. And just so that that that I
• 49:29
  really, always really admire. Yeah.
• 49:31
  For. Them now same, yeah.
• 49:34
  Same, I enjoyed them growing up, but then when I've learned more
• 49:38
  and more about them and seen how musicians react to them who
• 49:41
  understand how difficult the they're, they're that.
• 49:44
  That's the thing with comedy too.
• 49:45
  Don't you find that you we are ranking and rating on a
• 49:49
  different system than most of the audience because we've
• 49:52
  recognised the degree of difficulties in in.
• 49:55
  Look at that like a dive. Yes, yeah, yes.
• 49:59
  There. Oh my God, did you see what
• 50:01
  Louis CK just did? My, my word.
• 50:07
  But but yeah, but like what you guys were were doing and and
• 50:11
  then I, I, I always think of what Maria Bamford does on on
• 50:15
  stage. It's just, Oh my gosh, without a
• 50:18
  net and and so brave and, and, and just my word, I'm in awe
• 50:25
  because the, the thing with comedians is, is we're like
• 50:28
  magicians in a way. And now, Oh, I don't understand
• 50:31
  where that came from. And, and I, I wish I had thought
• 50:34
  of that, but I think I could have thought of that.
• 50:36
  And then you see a comedian, you're like, I don't know where
• 50:37
  this. Is I know.
• 50:39
  It's just inspiration, right? I just had a magician on and not
• 50:44
  that I always have magicians and puppet people.
• 50:47
  No, I I love but. I asked him like, how do you
• 50:51
  think of a trick? And he goes think of the ending
• 50:55
  first, like how do I want to impress?
• 50:58
  Which is a lot of times with jokes, you find something funny
• 51:02
  and then you reverse engineer it.
• 51:04
  How do I get to that ending? Point Have you ever seen the
• 51:07
  movie The Prestige? No.
• 51:10
  Oh, I think you wouldn't really see that.
• 51:12
  I think you would really love it.
• 51:14
  It's, it's really well written and the acting is tremendous,
• 51:18
  but you'll watch it because I tell you this and think of these
• 51:22
  guys not as magicians, but as comedians.
• 51:24
  And what you have to understand is these men are so dedicated to
• 51:28
  the craft, but also, and, and I've outgrown this thing.
• 51:33
  Heavens, but they were young when they were getting into this
• 51:38
  business and, and murderously competitive, right?
• 51:42
  They're willing to kill each other or themselves for their
• 51:45
  for their own. It's yes, it's like that.
• 51:50
  And it's just, and I see so much of it's, it's just, it's some
• 51:56
  like the king of comedy is uncomfortable to watch because
• 51:58
  we see the desperation and the delusion.
• 52:02
  But this you get to see the the dedication to the craft and, and
• 52:07
  what they're willing to sacrifice to to do a better
• 52:12
  trick and and be better magicians and Michael Caine and
• 52:16
  Christian. Bale, see this.
• 52:18
  And I think you'll love it. Oh it's on my list now.
• 52:21
  OK, good of like 50,000? Now I know, I know, it's never.
• 52:25
  Ending much now, Gary, I have a segment in the show I usually
• 52:28
  love segments with. Yeah.
• 52:30
  I love a segment. I like to have segments at lunch
• 52:33
  with my, with my friends. I'll, I'll say that OK, this is
• 52:37
  health corner in which they're all named after corners.
• 52:41
  And this is health corner And we're going to talk about our
• 52:43
  ailments, yes, for a few minutes.
• 52:46
  And then and then we'll go into a celebrity sightings corner
• 52:49
  and, and someone will say of a of a celebrity that they worked
• 52:52
  with so. Well, this corner is called fill
• 52:55
  in the blank. It's very Dave Hill on the show.
• 52:58
  Yes, Dave Hill is one of the people.
• 53:00
  Oh, OK. Oh, I love it.
• 53:02
  Yes. He's great, always terrific
• 53:04
  people. Say we look alike oh so
• 53:07
  sometimes I. Mean you have a similar
• 53:09
  complexion and and his hair. Is a little.
• 53:12
  Bit longer and you're both you're both you're both honkies.
• 53:16
  But he's a What a beautiful person.
• 53:19
  And so impossibly funny. He's and.
• 53:22
  Working at the. Nice degree of difficult.
• 53:24
  Oh, he's so nice. Yeah, you can't get.
• 53:27
  Mad at Dave. No, I can't.
• 53:30
  I can't think of a reason to get Madam.
• 53:32
  He's also a I'm a great writer of he writes great books and her
• 53:35
  guitar playing is incredible. Yeah, he can really thrash, as
• 53:40
  they say. I'm jealous of Dave.
• 53:42
  Same. My second favourite soft drink
• 53:46
  is Blank. Doctor Pepper?
• 53:49
  Really. Not your first.
• 53:50
  No, my, my first is probably Sprite, but my second is nice.
• 53:54
  Yeah, but but Sprite was, I was a closeted Sprite drinker in
• 53:58
  the, in the growing up. I, I talked about this in the
• 54:01
  Great Depressed. Sprite was considered a woman's
• 54:03
  beverage in my community. And so you had to, you had to
• 54:07
  sneak it. Your mother could buy it, but
• 54:08
  yeah. Do you know the difference
• 54:10
  between 7UP and? No do.
• 54:12
  You, I think more lime. OK.
• 54:14
  Yeah. I don't know.
• 54:18
  That's good. I love Doctor Pepper.
• 54:20
  Yeah, Doctor Pepper is excellent.
• 54:22
  Blank is the hardest state capital to memorise.
• 54:28
  Pierre. Pierre SD Yeah, yes, it is.
• 54:35
  I really think so. Do you know North Dakota?
• 54:39
  Bismarck, ND Yeah. I mine I think is the one.
• 54:44
  It's either Washington or Oregon is Olympia.
• 54:47
  Yeah, Like I always get that run.
• 54:49
  Yeah. Yeah, in Salem OR Yeah, yeah.
• 54:52
  But the same place that I, that I memorised the abbreviations
• 54:55
  for the states, this book that they gave out, they didn't give
• 54:58
  out. They gave out books once a year
• 55:00
  in school. You could pick two books and one
• 55:02
  of the books I got was this book of States and it gave you all.
• 55:05
  I love the. State bird and so when you don't
• 55:07
  have many books in the house, you you, you memorise every
• 55:10
  book. Yes.
• 55:11
  And I so I knew everything. I knew all the capitals and and
• 55:14
  you didn't want to challenge me to a capital fight.
• 55:16
  I always got those books too, like the greatest sporting.
• 55:21
  Yes. Oh yeah.
• 55:22
  The Scholastic. Yeah, I've always been a fan of
• 55:25
  Best Of's people. Yeah, people dump on Best Of's,
• 55:27
  but you get a nice Yeah, you get a nice general, general idea.
• 55:33
  You're a lovely interviewer. Oh, thank you.
• 55:35
  And I and I, I love that we get to play a little game at the
• 55:38
  end. My fear of blank.
• 55:41
  And there's only three more. Let's think about our our origin
• 55:44
  story. We met over Instagram.
• 55:46
  You reached out over Instagram. Yes, yeah, a small reach out
• 55:50
  because I asked Dave Hill I go, Do you know Gary Goma?
• 55:53
  Yeah. And he goes, Yes, he's a buddy
• 55:55
  of mine. Yeah, You got to get into.
• 55:57
  That we have. We have a breakfast with my
• 56:00
  friend Mike Bonfiglio, who's a documentary director.
• 56:03
  He directed the George Garland and the Garry Shandling
• 56:05
  documentary with Judd Apatow. But anyhow, and then Adam
• 56:08
  Resnick, who created Get a Life and wrote the greatest memoir
• 56:13
  I've ever read, which is called will not attend the funniest
• 56:16
  thing I've ever read in my life. But we have a yeah, we have a
• 56:18
  breakfast twice a month usually. And I create all these segments
• 56:24
  for the to just to keep the. I'm jealous of that.
• 56:27
  Thing going, if you're ever in, if you're ever in New York
• 56:30
  during a meeting, we will. We will invite you.
• 56:32
  We'd love to have you. No, no.
• 56:34
  OK. All right.
• 56:36
  We don't have one next week, but.
• 56:37
  But I think we have one on the 27th.
• 56:40
  OK, write that down. My fear of blank comma often
• 56:47
  stops me from doing blank that thing.
• 56:51
  Failure. Everything right?
• 56:55
  Yeah, but as we said earlier today, you kind of have to court
• 57:00
  failure and and make it a make it a friend make.
• 57:04
  So just trying and then failing. I've learned to look at that as,
• 57:09
  oh, you did your job, which is to which is to take a risk.
• 57:12
  It's not really a failure to step on the way to doing
• 57:15
  something different. So so that's a healthier because
• 57:19
  when you are afraid of failing, I found the audience has you by
• 57:22
  the balls. Yeah, because their reaction can
• 57:25
  just ruin your night. So you can't, you can't really
• 57:27
  tyre your self esteem to how the audience.
• 57:30
  Reacts. They smell fear too.
• 57:32
  Oh my God, they. Sniff it out.
• 57:34
  Yeah, Yeah, totally. Yeah.
• 57:36
  Yeah, of OK, if I had to leave New York City comma, I would
• 57:42
  move to blank. This will sound like I'm
• 57:45
  pandering, but if you if you were on my shoulder this entire
• 57:49
  week with my wife, we just keep being in awe of the differences,
• 57:55
  positive differences between London and New York like you,
• 58:00
  you know, this is a much cleaner and.
• 58:05
  Cleaner. Yes, like like our subways are a
• 58:09
  nightmare Yes. And our trains are a nightmare
• 58:12
  and you do not you're not even really allowed to go to the
• 58:16
  bathroom in in public spots in New York City.
• 58:20
  And if you do, the places are are.
• 58:23
  Really a problem. Yeah, it's, it's, it's.
• 58:25
  And I went in Paddington Station and I came out and it was almost
• 58:30
  as if we had just stayed in a in a great hotel.
• 58:33
  I was like I said, you couldn't you can't believe the urinals in
• 58:36
  this, in this place. And it didn't smell And.
• 58:39
  And I said go enjoy the ladies from.
• 58:42
  And we go yes. This was a padding and station a
• 58:45
  very busy it was at the end of the day.
• 58:49
  Where the bear is. Yeah, where the bear is.
• 58:51
  And, and so I I'm not pandering if I could, if I could figure
• 58:57
  out a way. And, and I can't wait to to come
• 59:00
  back because the only thing that made this trip a little bit
• 59:03
  difficult was I was so anxious about about the audience just
• 59:06
  staring at me for an hour last night.
• 59:08
  And they were really nice. They were really a great crowd,
• 59:10
  so. Of all the comics who are dead,
• 59:15
  Blank is the one I'd like to have dinner with.
• 59:17
  Oh. Interesting.
• 59:22
  I tried. The dead comedians.
• 59:25
  Just dinner. So maybe there's an aspect they
• 59:29
  don't have to be. It could be Richard.
• 59:33
  Lewis. Nice.
• 59:35
  Yeah. Yeah, he just.
• 59:38
  Yeah. He just passed away and I, I
• 59:40
  feel like he was even even more than some of your other neurotic
• 59:44
  comedians. That man really was himself when
• 59:48
  nobody else was talking like that, nobody was talking about.
• 59:51
  He always talked about therapy. Yes, yes, we he had the same
• 59:55
  therapist as as me and in an interview he said that they had.
• 1:00:00
  That my therapist, whose name is Alan Lefkowitz, had retired his
• 1:00:04
  appointment time, and I thought that was a really funny joke.
• 1:00:08
  That's great, yeah. Well, Gary, Rick, pleasure.
• 1:00:12
  I will. I will.
• 1:00:13
  Solo theatre. Yeah, this week until Saturday.
• 1:00:18
  Yes, the October 11th is Saturday.
• 1:00:20
  The Soho Theatre person is here. The Soho.
• 1:00:23
  Theatre is, is a lovely space. And the other thing that I, I
• 1:00:28
  had been in London for three days in 2002 and the thing that
• 1:00:31
  I remembered from that 'cause I didn't really see many of the
• 1:00:34
  sites, but I remembered how, how witty and, and easy to talk to
• 1:00:40
  Londoners were. And I found that because some
• 1:00:43
  comedians came to the show last night and I, we were strangers,
• 1:00:46
  but we talked for a while after the show and I felt very, very
• 1:00:50
  at home and very comfortable with them.
• 1:00:52
  That's. That's the great brethren.
• 1:00:54
  Yeah, the brethren, it was. It was really, it was.
• 1:00:58
  It was such a great feeling. London mothers show, if you
• 1:01:02
  will. But not as toxic, no, No.
• 1:01:04
  Yeah. Yeah.
• 1:01:06
  Mothership, it's perfect. 9:30 PM Soho Theatre and the website
• 1:01:11
  issohotheatre.com. Yes, buy tickets please.
• 1:01:18
  All right, Gary. All right, such a.
• 1:01:19
  Pleasure. Thank you.
• 1:01:20
  Thank. You so much.
• 1:01:21
  Wow, that was good. So if you want to see him and
• 1:01:28
  you're in town, Soho Theatre, it's 9:30 PM, so you can have
• 1:01:34
  dinner before, but make sure you digest the dinner.
• 1:01:38
  Let's not be farting in the theatre, right?
• 1:01:42
  I don't know why I said that you guys don't do that.
• 1:01:46
  I do. So listen, check it out if you
• 1:01:50
  want and look forward to seeing you again.
• 1:01:55
  Please Rich vultures talk box.