Transcript

Sharri | 22 June · Sharri

0:01
Speaker 1: Live on Sky News. This is Shari.
0:07
Speaker 2: Good Evening.
0:08
Speaker 3: I'm Caroli Marcus filling in Pushari so keios Dama announces
0:12
Speaker 3: his resignation after less than two years as UK Prime Minister.
0:19
Speaker 4: I will resign as leader of the Labor Party. I
0:23
Speaker 4: have spoken to His Majesty the King this morning to
0:26
Speaker 4: inform him of my decision.
0:29
Speaker 3: Tom Slater joins us from London to unpack what this
0:32
Speaker 3: means for the future of the British Labor Party and
0:36
Speaker 3: the Australian government. More on those explosive claims against a
0:41
Speaker 3: Sydney University professor in a top un counter terror role.
0:46
Speaker 3: Un Watch boss HELLL. Neuer joins us in an exclusive interview.
0:50
Speaker 5: He's called in independent expert. I want to know how
0:54
Speaker 5: can you be an independent expert while you're receiving one
0:58
Speaker 5: hundred and fifty thousand dollars from the Chinese communist regime.
1:04
Speaker 3: And the Iran peace deal is already on shaky ground.
1:08
Speaker 3: Trump threatens to hammer Tehran and negotiators storm out. Strategic
1:14
Speaker 3: analyst Michael Schubridge joins us with the latest but first
1:19
Speaker 3: to that big breaking news from the last hour or so,
1:22
Speaker 3: and there are extraordinary scenes out of the UK, where
1:25
Speaker 3: Prime Minister Kia Stamer has been forced to resign. It's
1:30
Speaker 3: a decision that will no doubt be sending chills down
1:33
Speaker 3: the spines of our own Australian labor leaders that even
1:37
Speaker 3: prime ministers on the left with massive majorities can fall
1:41
Speaker 3: on their own swords. Here is Sir Kia announcing his
1:45
Speaker 3: resignation outside Number ten a short time ago.
1:50
Speaker 4: The question my party is asking now is whether I
1:55
Speaker 4: am best placed to lead us into the next general election.
2:01
Speaker 4: I have heard the answer of my parliamentary party to
2:06
Speaker 4: that question, and I accept that answer with good grace.
2:13
Speaker 3: Now he's not usually an emotional kind of guy, but
2:16
Speaker 3: Sakia's voice was noticeably shaky as he paid tribute to
2:20
Speaker 3: his wife and family.
2:23
Speaker 4: And when I leave the biggest job in the country,
2:27
Speaker 4: I shall spend more time on the most important job,
2:31
Speaker 4: being the best husband I can to my fantastic wife, Vick,
2:36
Speaker 4: who has been a rock by my side through good
2:39
Speaker 4: times and bad, and being the best dad I can
2:44
Speaker 4: to my beautiful children who are my pride and my joy.
2:49
Speaker 3: Andy Burnham is the man widely tipped to be his
2:54
Speaker 3: successor after the Mayor of great at Manchester one A
2:57
Speaker 3: key by election last week. But honestly, there are important
3:02
Speaker 3: messages here for our own labor government to heed with
3:06
Speaker 3: the risks that come with alienating voters, especially when Prime
3:11
Speaker 3: Minister Anthony Albanesi's popularity is at an all time low
3:15
Speaker 3: and Pauline Hanson's One Nation is the preferred party to
3:19
Speaker 3: lead Australia. High immigration, cost of living pressures, hefty tax
3:24
Speaker 3: changes that forced top owners to flee the country while
3:28
Speaker 3: punishing business owners with higher wages for workers and for
3:32
Speaker 3: their capital gains all are the legacies.
3:35
Speaker 2: Of Serquia Starmer.
3:37
Speaker 3: Meanwhile, Nigel Faraja's Reform UK remains a real threat to
3:42
Speaker 3: the UK left.
3:43
Speaker 2: Does all of this sound a bit familiar?
3:46
Speaker 3: I'll speak to my panel about this developing story shortly,
3:49
Speaker 3: and we'll also cross to the UK for reaction later
3:52
Speaker 3: in the program. But now let's turn to the Middle East,
3:58
Speaker 3: where there is yet more evidence the Iran peace deal
4:02
Speaker 3: is looking flimsier by the hour. And I hate to
4:05
Speaker 3: say I told you so, but as I pointed out
4:08
Speaker 3: from day one, trying to negotiate with the biggest terrorists
4:11
Speaker 3: in the world is a surefire recipe for disaster. We
4:16
Speaker 3: woke this morning to news Iranian negotiators stormed out of
4:20
Speaker 3: peace talks with the US in Switzerland after Donald Trump
4:24
Speaker 3: threatened to blow the s.
4:26
Speaker 2: Out of Iran.
4:28
Speaker 3: Talks were paused after just eighty minutes when the US
4:32
Speaker 3: President grew frustrated and unleashed on Tehran, also threatening to
4:37
Speaker 3: seize the Strait of Hormus. Those threats came after the
4:41
Speaker 3: Iranian said they would close the Vital Waterway in response
4:46
Speaker 3: to Israeli strikes in Lebanon.
4:49
Speaker 6: President Trump tells Fox News he spoke with Iranian officials
4:52
Speaker 6: overnight and said, you close it, and you won't have
4:56
Speaker 6: a country.
4:57
Speaker 7: He went on to tell.
4:58
Speaker 6: These officials, you won't even make it back to your
5:01
Speaker 6: effing country.
5:04
Speaker 3: Iran's chief negotiated then tweeted angrily, don't they realize that
5:08
Speaker 3: if their threats worked, they wouldn't be this desperate now?
5:13
Speaker 3: They'd better watch their words. Our armed forces are ready
5:16
Speaker 3: to respond differently. And these are just the first round
5:21
Speaker 3: of talk since the memorandum of understanding was agreed to
5:24
Speaker 3: last week. Not going so well? Is it then quick
5:28
Speaker 3: enough to give you whiplash? CNN reported the talks were
5:31
Speaker 3: back on, a US official telling the network the Iranians
5:35
Speaker 3: are still here and discussions are ongoing. We anticipate, anticipate
5:40
Speaker 3: continuing to work through the night.
5:43
Speaker 2: It's hard to keep up.
5:45
Speaker 3: Meanwhile, Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Nana, who has again responded
5:49
Speaker 3: to the escalating personal criticism from the Trump administration. Trump
5:54
Speaker 3: has called Bibbi efing crazy, has said he has no
5:58
Speaker 3: effing judgment and told him everybody hates you now sounds
6:03
Speaker 3: like something kids would say in the schoolyard. US Vice
6:06
Speaker 3: President JD. Vance has also joined the pylon.
6:13
Speaker 1: Donald J.
6:14
Speaker 8: Trump is the only head of state in the entire
6:18
Speaker 8: world who is sympathetic to the Nation of Israel at
6:21
Speaker 8: this moment in time.
6:24
Speaker 3: While there have been some vocal critics of the Trump
6:27
Speaker 3: administration from within the Israeli cabinet, Nan Yahoo wasn't taking
6:31
Speaker 3: the bait.
6:33
Speaker 9: And often we see eye do I sometimes we don't,
6:37
Speaker 9: But we respect each other's sovereignty and leadership and commitment
6:42
Speaker 9: to our people.
6:44
Speaker 3: And if Trump and fans are hoping that public humiliation
6:47
Speaker 3: would weaken met Yahoo's commitment to continue strikes on Israel's enemies,
6:53
Speaker 3: like Iran's proxy has Blah in Lebanon, he has another
6:57
Speaker 3: thing coming and.
6:59
Speaker 9: We attack those enemies that seek our destruction, that seek
7:03
Speaker 9: to kill us, We attack them before they have a
7:05
Speaker 9: chance to do so. If you know Hebrew a camlo
7:08
Speaker 9: geha ashkeemlongo kill them first.
7:13
Speaker 3: And just to reinforce the message about the type of
7:16
Speaker 3: threat Israel is facing, its Defense force released this video
7:20
Speaker 3: of a massive two hundred meter Hesbla tunnel ten kilometers
7:25
Speaker 3: from Israel's border with Lebanon. Soldiers found hundreds of weapons,
7:29
Speaker 3: including drones, anti tank missiles, and eight tons of explosives.
7:35
Speaker 3: Michael Goodwin rites in the New York Post, Trump and
7:38
Speaker 3: Vance are rattled on Iran, and their attacks on Israel
7:42
Speaker 3: prove it quote an essential and great ally one day,
7:46
Speaker 3: road kill the next. The wild swings offer the clearest
7:49
Speaker 3: example yet of how widespread criticism of the generous deal
7:54
Speaker 3: with Iran is rattling the administration.
7:57
Speaker 2: JD.
7:58
Speaker 3: Vance had earlier used a press briefing to draw equivalents
8:01
Speaker 3: between the democratic state of Israel and the world's greatest
8:06
Speaker 3: sponsor of terror in Iran, a move that is pure madness.
8:10
Speaker 8: Countries don't give up the right of self defense. Israel
8:13
Speaker 8: doesn't give up the right of self defense of hesbelafires, rockets,
8:17
Speaker 8: or drones at Israel. The Iranians don't give up the
8:19
Speaker 8: right of self defense in their country.
8:23
Speaker 3: But it was on a podcast with Christian conservative ali
8:27
Speaker 3: Beth Stuckey that Vance reached a new low attacking valid
8:32
Speaker 3: criticism of this piece deal as somehow using the anti
8:36
Speaker 3: Semitism card.
8:38
Speaker 8: Always conflating criticism of a particular government with jew hatred,
8:44
Speaker 8: because if everything is jew hatred, then nothing is jew hatred.
8:47
Speaker 8: It's kind of like how progressives for twenty years called
8:50
Speaker 8: everything racist.
8:52
Speaker 3: The bloke is honestly starting to sound like Tucker Carlson.
8:55
Speaker 3: The ABC's America's editor, John Lyons meanwhile, suggested today the
9:00
Speaker 3: criticism of this deal from within the Republican Party is
9:04
Speaker 3: because many are financially backed by the pro Israel lobby.
9:09
Speaker 3: This is an extraordinary claim.
9:11
Speaker 2: Just listen to this.
9:13
Speaker 10: Firstly, Donald Trump has been getting backlash from his own
9:17
Speaker 10: Republican or GOP party on this. Many of them who
9:22
Speaker 10: are supported by the pro Israel lobby. Many get funding
9:25
Speaker 10: from APEX, the pro Israel lobby group here.
9:30
Speaker 3: So yet again you have these old tropes about this
9:33
Speaker 3: all powerful Israel lobby buying American opinion. The reality is
9:39
Speaker 3: you don't need to be on Israel's payroll to see
9:42
Speaker 3: this is an objectively bad deal, one that could well
9:46
Speaker 3: allow the Iranian regime to rebuild and continue its torment
9:51
Speaker 3: of its neighbors and its own people, not to mention
9:55
Speaker 3: sponsor attacks right here in Australia. So Kiyo Starmer is
10:04
Speaker 3: out as Labor leader in the UK less than two
10:07
Speaker 3: years after winning a landslide and promising to end Britain's
10:12
Speaker 3: political chaos. It's a brutal warning for governments that win
10:16
Speaker 3: big then lose control of the economy, immigration, and their
10:20
Speaker 3: own party room. Remind you of anyone joining me no
10:24
Speaker 3: our former Labor MP Michael Danby and Menzies Research Centers
10:28
Speaker 3: senior fellow Nick Cata. Gentlemen, Welcome to both of you.
10:31
Speaker 3: I'm very glad to have you both on the panel
10:33
Speaker 3: to Light because I think getting your reaction to this story.
10:37
Speaker 2: Will be very worthwhile for our viewers. Michael, I'll start
10:41
Speaker 2: with you.
10:41
Speaker 3: Starmer won big like Albaneze did, so how nervous should
10:46
Speaker 3: labor here in Australia be watching this collapse?
10:51
Speaker 7: Well?
10:52
Speaker 11: Starmer one extraordinarily because of the proportional representation system there, Caroline,
10:59
Speaker 11: he did one thing you have to admit it. He
11:01
Speaker 11: got rid of Jeremy Corbyn, who was a far left
11:05
Speaker 11: sort of nutcase who took over the Labor Party. Albow
11:09
Speaker 11: will be saved by Rudd's rules. Rudd as when he left,
11:16
Speaker 11: so the same thing wouldn't happen to him about being sacked.
11:19
Speaker 11: Instituted rules that meant the entire Labor Party membership, not
11:23
Speaker 11: just the parliamentarians, have to be.
11:25
Speaker 12: Pulled before he can be replaced.
11:29
Speaker 11: So I think he's fairly safe until the next election
11:33
Speaker 11: unless they do to him. What's going to happen in
11:35
Speaker 11: the UK that they have a not an election but
11:40
Speaker 11: a coronation where Andy Burnham is put in with no opposition.
11:44
Speaker 3: Nick, what do you think can Albanizi rest easy? I mean,
11:48
Speaker 3: you're a Britch, You're watching this news from back home
11:50
Speaker 3: from Afar.
11:52
Speaker 2: What's your reaction to it?
11:53
Speaker 3: And do you think that Albinizi is as safe as
11:56
Speaker 3: maybe more?
11:57
Speaker 13: Suggesting I'm an next Bert in some way people are
11:59
Speaker 13: ex Look, I think Michael was underplaying this a bit.
12:06
Speaker 13: I think there are two things that are paralleled with
12:08
Speaker 13: his country. First, yes, he won a huge parliamentary majority
12:13
Speaker 13: on the scale of Margaret Thatcher in eighty three or
12:17
Speaker 13: you know, I mean, so it's that kind of majority,
12:19
Speaker 13: but honor only a third of the popular vote. That's
12:22
Speaker 13: exactly where Albanizi finds himself a huge parliamentary majority but
12:27
Speaker 13: only a third of the popular vote. So people voted
12:30
Speaker 13: for his candidates, they voted for the party, but with
12:32
Speaker 13: not any great enthusiasm for him, as they did with Starmer.
12:35
Speaker 13: So there's your problem, and your problem is that the
12:38
Speaker 13: closer it gets to an election, if one nation continues
12:41
Speaker 13: to make inroads and coalition I think will make inroads
12:45
Speaker 13: in some seats, then you'll get Labor back benchers in
12:49
Speaker 13: Canberra very very nervous, and that's when the trouble really
12:51
Speaker 13: starts for the prime minister. And the other thing I think,
12:54
Speaker 13: which is a directly parallel is the populist movement, you know,
12:58
Speaker 13: that reform in their case One Nation here, because what
13:01
Speaker 13: they do is really highlight basic national values and show
13:06
Speaker 13: how far the prime ministers departed from those.
13:08
Speaker 3: Well, Albanizi has responded on Twitter saying I consider KOs
13:13
Speaker 3: Arma a friend and I'm thinking of him on what
13:15
Speaker 3: must be a very tough day. Serving in public life
13:19
Speaker 3: is a tremendous privilege but politics can also be a
13:22
Speaker 3: harsh business. Michael, just one more question on this. But
13:27
Speaker 3: I mean, obviously there's going to be a nice self
13:30
Speaker 3: response from leaders around the world. Maybe not Trump, who
13:33
Speaker 3: announced Keios Darma's retirement before he emitted that was a
13:37
Speaker 3: must have been a bit of a sting. But Albanize
13:41
Speaker 3: is going to put on a brave face.
13:42
Speaker 11: Obviously, well he is, and he's protected by the preferential system.
13:49
Speaker 11: I think Nix unders underestimating that he's got his majority
13:54
Speaker 11: unless he loses his nerve. There's no sign that the
13:57
Speaker 11: labor backbench here have any conscience. That's the problem, Caroline.
14:02
Speaker 11: They don't have any opposition within the party to some
14:04
Speaker 11: of these ridiculous moves on industrial relations, on the environment,
14:09
Speaker 11: no one opposes blackout Bowen. If there was some opposition there,
14:13
Speaker 11: there'd be hoped that there could be a change, But unfortunately,
14:16
Speaker 11: I think it can only be changed.
14:17
Speaker 12: In an election.
14:19
Speaker 3: Yeah, maybe it's just ad Hues on Orcas. You don't
14:21
Speaker 3: hear too much else, do you.
14:23
Speaker 1: Look.
14:24
Speaker 2: Let's talk about the Teals.
14:25
Speaker 3: They've always denied they were a political party, but a
14:28
Speaker 3: group of Teal independents are now poised to launch as
14:32
Speaker 3: a new party as early as this week.
14:35
Speaker 14: I have taken to the election that I will work
14:37
Speaker 14: with anybody from any color team to get things done,
14:41
Speaker 14: particularly on climate action, and so those convent whether I
14:46
Speaker 14: can do that the best as an independent or as
14:48
Speaker 14: part of a formal alliance is a genuinely open conversation
14:52
Speaker 14: that I'm having with the people of Bradfield.
14:54
Speaker 15: There's things up for discussion, and I'll be going back
14:56
Speaker 15: to my community having a chat to them about it.
15:00
Speaker 15: We ran as community independence, so they've got to be
15:02
Speaker 15: a big part of any decisions that are made.
15:04
Speaker 2: I don't have an intention of joining a party.
15:07
Speaker 7: I'm very very happy, isn't it as an independent?
15:10
Speaker 2: Now?
15:10
Speaker 3: The push to formalize the group's loose alliance is being
15:14
Speaker 3: pushed most enthusiastically by Warringer and Pszli Staggel and a
15:18
Speaker 3: bid to push back against the rise of One Nation. Nick,
15:22
Speaker 3: do you think this will work if they do manage
15:25
Speaker 3: to come together as a party to stampaull In Hanson's popularity.
15:29
Speaker 13: I don't think it's a forward step for them at all.
15:32
Speaker 13: I mean, they've campaigned on this idea we're independent. We
15:35
Speaker 13: know we're not. I mean, the one thing that has
15:37
Speaker 13: defined these people as a party is that all of
15:40
Speaker 13: them take funding from Climate two hundred, the slush fund
15:43
Speaker 13: of the renewable energy industry. That's so, you know, they're
15:46
Speaker 13: not really independent in that sense. But I think as
15:49
Speaker 13: soon as they start forming a party, it gets MESSI
15:51
Speaker 13: who's going to be the leader. I see they're saying, well,
15:53
Speaker 13: we don't need a leader of the leader, and that's
15:56
Speaker 13: where it gets ugly, Michael. And though that a party
16:00
Speaker 13: to have a.
16:00
Speaker 3: Leader, I mean even the Socialists have a leader. Ultimately
16:04
Speaker 3: that's not going to work, Michael. I mean Nick does
16:07
Speaker 3: mention Climate two hundred there, and this move is also
16:11
Speaker 3: light space about countering the new donation laws that they get.
16:14
Speaker 3: Albanese government is set to introduce capping individual donations at
16:18
Speaker 3: fifty thousand dollars per candidate, and obviously that would have
16:21
Speaker 3: an impact on how teals would accept money from groups
16:25
Speaker 3: like Climate two hundred.
16:27
Speaker 11: Well, that's precisely the problem. They are, as Nick said,
16:31
Speaker 11: the party of the renewable industry. And it's a fiction
16:36
Speaker 11: to say that they're all independent. There will be individuals
16:40
Speaker 11: like Monique Ryan who, for our own political reasons, decide
16:43
Speaker 11: not to join the Stegel Party. But Stegel and co,
16:49
Speaker 11: especially the Sydney Teals, want a way around the shifty
16:54
Speaker 11: electoral donations law changes that Don Ferrell made to try
16:59
Speaker 11: and force to why they do this and show their
17:01
Speaker 11: hand to the Australian public or to run as defunded independence.
17:05
Speaker 3: Well, you've already annointed at the Staggle Party, so I
17:08
Speaker 3: guess she is the leader, at least according to Michael
17:11
Speaker 3: Dabby if it does come into effect. Nick, you've written
17:14
Speaker 3: a piece in The Australian calling Treasurer Jim Chalmers budget
17:18
Speaker 3: retreat just another ALP whiteboard disaster.
17:21
Speaker 2: You compare these tax reforms.
17:24
Speaker 3: To John Howard's to GST, which, as you point out,
17:27
Speaker 3: was stress tested in two elections, informed by copious Treasury analysis,
17:32
Speaker 3: and patiently negotiated through the Senate before finally being incorporated
17:37
Speaker 3: in the budget.
17:38
Speaker 2: Charmers. By contrast, you right.
17:40
Speaker 3: Arrived with a policy devised on a whiteboard.
17:44
Speaker 2: Explain to us what you mean by that.
17:45
Speaker 13: I think it's become a habit for labor that they've
17:48
Speaker 13: dumbed down the policy making process. I mean, the key
17:51
Speaker 13: example that I started with was the NDIS where Julia
17:54
Speaker 13: Gillar comes into Parliament full of passion. She's very emotional
17:57
Speaker 13: about this, but no detail. It doesn't say you know
18:00
Speaker 13: who qualifies as a disabled person, for instance, or what
18:03
Speaker 13: benefits they'd be entitled to. And of course it's become
18:06
Speaker 13: a very very bad policy because it was drawn up
18:09
Speaker 13: on a whiteboard without being stress tested against reality. You
18:12
Speaker 13: could say exactly the same again about renewable energy and
18:15
Speaker 13: even going to that, we know there were no engineers
18:17
Speaker 13: in the room when they did that policy, and I
18:19
Speaker 13: think that's what's gone wrong with the budget. Charmers sat
18:21
Speaker 13: there with a whiteboard with some very scant and scrappy
18:25
Speaker 13: advice from Treasury and he says, we're going to do this.
18:27
Speaker 13: But you can't do that, especially when it's something as
18:30
Speaker 13: complicated as so many moving parts as a tax system.
18:33
Speaker 13: You have to get out there and work hard on
18:35
Speaker 13: it for a number of years, and I'm afraid the
18:38
Speaker 13: Treasurer hasn't had the patience to do that.
18:39
Speaker 3: And you ideally have to take it to the voters
18:41
Speaker 3: and be honest with them that you're thinking about introducing
18:44
Speaker 3: these changes instead of lying fifty times about it.
18:47
Speaker 2: The ABC has refused to.
18:48
Speaker 3: Publish an opinion piece why by women's sex based rights
18:52
Speaker 3: campaigners sal Grover about her federal court loss to a
18:57
Speaker 3: transgender activist and what's being called common information of ideological
19:01
Speaker 3: capture at the public broadcaster. The rejection comes despite a
19:05
Speaker 3: senior editor at the ABC describing the piece as very,
19:08
Speaker 3: very good and Grover extensively redrafting the article twice to
19:13
Speaker 3: meet the broadcaster's requirements. Now Shadow Communications mister Sarah Henderson
19:19
Speaker 3: condemned the ABC earlier on Sky News. She contrasted the
19:22
Speaker 3: decision not to publish the piece with an article the
19:26
Speaker 3: network did publish by human rights law professor arguing that
19:31
Speaker 3: Grover's court loss was a victory for women's rights. Michael,
19:35
Speaker 3: yet another reason to support Pauline Hansen's policy to turn
19:39
Speaker 3: the ABC into a subscription model.
19:42
Speaker 11: I would have thought, Caroline, there's a golden thread running
19:45
Speaker 11: through so many of the ABC decisions. John Lyons, who
19:50
Speaker 11: just identified in an earlier program a conspiracy theorist shoved
19:55
Speaker 11: over there in Washington. This decision to exclude people have
19:59
Speaker 11: a different point of view on very.
20:01
Speaker 12: Difficult trans issues. It does lead.
20:06
Speaker 11: Exactly what you say, to a more widespread support for
20:11
Speaker 11: the handsome idea of turning the ABC into a subscription
20:15
Speaker 11: service in the cities but funded in the regions. I
20:20
Speaker 11: am surprised that the Liberal Party don't take up these
20:24
Speaker 11: kinds of issues that make a real difference rather than
20:27
Speaker 11: being like in that hilarious ad that Andrew Boltcher showed before,
20:32
Speaker 11: a man sitting on a horse.
20:34
Speaker 3: I don't know where they come up with this stuff,
20:36
Speaker 3: but clearly Paulin Hanson is all over it. Nikata and
20:40
Speaker 3: Michael Damby, thank you so much for your time tonight. Now,
20:43
Speaker 3: New Southwells teachers have reportedly been shying away from teaching
20:47
Speaker 3: students about the Holocaust after the October seven terror attacks
20:52
Speaker 3: in Israel. One Western Sydney history teacher reportedly said, many
20:57
Speaker 3: of our students are of Middle Eastern background, and I
21:01
Speaker 3: have decided not to teach the Diary of Ann Frank
21:04
Speaker 3: this term to my year nine elective history class because
21:08
Speaker 3: of their views on Jewish people in the Israeli Palestine conflict.
21:14
Speaker 3: So students aren't learning about the most catastrophic genocide in
21:18
Speaker 3: human history because some students may be anti Semitic.
21:23
Speaker 2: Make it make sense?
21:24
Speaker 3: Shadow Education Minister Julian Lisa joins me. Now, Julian, first off,
21:28
Speaker 3: your response to that disturbing story.
21:32
Speaker 16: Well, it is a very disturbing story, Carolyn, particularly after
21:36
Speaker 16: what we've seen with the rise of anti Semitism in
21:38
Speaker 16: the last few years, culminating in the murder of fifteen
21:40
Speaker 16: Australians at Bondi. This is a time where people need
21:43
Speaker 16: to learn more about anti Semitism and the Holocaust. But
21:46
Speaker 16: I think more broadly, Holocaust education needs a rethink. It
21:50
Speaker 16: needs a rethink because the anti Semitism that led to
21:53
Speaker 16: the Holocaust is ultimately based on a range of conspiracy theories,
21:58
Speaker 16: lies about manipulation and people controlling power. It's the reason
22:02
Speaker 16: why so many social justice activists of the left engage
22:06
Speaker 16: in anti Semitic things, because it's almost seen as a
22:09
Speaker 16: virtuous idea to be anti Semitic. What I think we
22:12
Speaker 16: need to do with our education system is to ensure
22:14
Speaker 16: that Australians learn about who are the Jews and.
22:17
Speaker 7: What do they stand for, what do they believe. Jewish
22:19
Speaker 7: people have.
22:20
Speaker 16: Introduced wonderful ideas into Western civilization, like equality, like the
22:24
Speaker 16: rule of law, like human dignity. It's in the interest
22:27
Speaker 16: of all Australians that more people know about that contribution
22:30
Speaker 16: to our civilization.
22:31
Speaker 2: Yeah.
22:31
Speaker 3: Absolutely, I think that I agree with you, that needs
22:35
Speaker 3: to be everythink although teaching a classic book like The
22:38
Speaker 3: Diary of Ant Frank about a little girl having to
22:40
Speaker 3: hide from Nazi the fact that teachers don't want to
22:43
Speaker 3: teach that because they think that some kids might be
22:47
Speaker 3: so anti Jewish that they can't stomach that book.
22:50
Speaker 16: I mean, well, it says that there's a sickness in
22:53
Speaker 16: our education system and a sickness in our society. And
22:55
Speaker 16: what is worse is when teachers won't take the leadership
22:58
Speaker 16: that is necessary educate their own students. If people are
23:02
Speaker 16: not getting an education about anti Semitism and about the
23:05
Speaker 16: contribution of Jews to the wonderful country that we have
23:08
Speaker 16: and the wonderful civilization we have at a school, when are.
23:11
Speaker 7: They ever going to change their mind about these things?
23:13
Speaker 16: When are we ever going to become a stronger and
23:15
Speaker 16: more cohesive country. So I'm very disappointed to hear these reports.
23:18
Speaker 16: The teachers in my state in New South Wales are
23:21
Speaker 16: failing to deal with classic texts which have such an
23:24
Speaker 16: important moral lesson for our world.
23:26
Speaker 2: Yeah, me too.
23:27
Speaker 3: Well, hopefully the Royal Commission can make some recommendations, or
23:31
Speaker 3: maybe they'll come from elsewhere like yourself. Let's talk about
23:34
Speaker 3: former Prime Minister turned federal president of the Liberal Party
23:38
Speaker 3: Tony Abbot. He's now personally calling Liberal members to try
23:42
Speaker 3: and stop defections, to want Nation, the personal please come
23:46
Speaker 3: after members in Gilmour and curl Coll quit, saying the
23:50
Speaker 3: party has lost its way and no longer represents conservative values. Julian,
23:56
Speaker 3: what do you think of these defections and do you
23:58
Speaker 3: think that Tony Abbott will be able to stam some
24:01
Speaker 3: of this hemorrhage and we're seeing to one Nation.
24:05
Speaker 16: Well, Tony Abot's my friend and his doing great job
24:08
Speaker 16: as the party president, and his job is to build
24:11
Speaker 16: a big political organization so we can fight the next election.
24:15
Speaker 16: What I think all of this says is that people
24:16
Speaker 16: are angry and I share that anger, and they're angry
24:19
Speaker 16: at to how bad this government has handled Australia. I mean,
24:24
Speaker 16: they've lost control of the economy and they've lost control.
24:26
Speaker 7: Of our borders. And I'll tell you what the Liberal
24:28
Speaker 7: Party is about.
24:29
Speaker 16: We believe Australia deserves strong borders and we believe Australians
24:33
Speaker 16: should make money. Now some of them are going to
24:36
Speaker 16: One Nation. One Nation's talked a bit about radical Islam.
24:39
Speaker 16: Let me say that we will take on anyone in
24:42
Speaker 16: the Parliament on radical Islam because we were the party
24:45
Speaker 16: that called for the listing of the IGC, we were
24:47
Speaker 16: the party that called for diplomatic relations with the Iranian
24:51
Speaker 16: regime to be severed. We were the party that went
24:53
Speaker 16: to Bondai day after day. That's the difference between us
24:56
Speaker 16: and one nation.
24:57
Speaker 3: Well, I don't think anyone can accu use you, Julian Lisa,
25:01
Speaker 3: of not being strong on radical Islam and put standing
25:04
Speaker 3: up against due hatred and some of the other hatreds
25:08
Speaker 3: that come from that that.
25:11
Speaker 2: Strain of Islam.
25:12
Speaker 3: But do you think the defactions do show that the
25:15
Speaker 3: Liberal Party has drifted too far from its conservative base.
25:20
Speaker 16: Well, people come in and out of political parties all
25:22
Speaker 16: the time. Let me tell you what's happening in my
25:25
Speaker 16: part of Sydney. I'm actually seeing new people join our
25:27
Speaker 16: party because they hate what Labor is doing to the country.
25:31
Speaker 7: They are against Labour's terrible budget and therefore what.
25:34
Speaker 16: We're trying to do by putting an endo bracket creep
25:36
Speaker 16: because as I say, we want strong borders and we
25:38
Speaker 16: want Australians to make money.
25:39
Speaker 7: That's what we're about.
25:40
Speaker 16: And that's an attractive message for all Australians.
25:44
Speaker 3: Meanwhile, Labor is defending its planned head to negative geary
25:47
Speaker 3: and capital gains tax even as auction clearance rates across
25:52
Speaker 3: the Capital's crash A Sydney is at it's lowest since
25:56
Speaker 3: April twenty twenty.
25:58
Speaker 2: Is Labor seriously.
25:59
Speaker 3: Trying to sell a housing slump as an affordability when, Jillian,
26:04
Speaker 3: I mean.
26:05
Speaker 7: This is a joke.
26:06
Speaker 16: Labor has taken a baseball bat to confidence.
26:09
Speaker 7: That's what low clearance rates indicate.
26:12
Speaker 16: And what they indicate is that no one likes Labour's taxes.
26:15
Speaker 16: They're creating great uncertainty because they're radical taxes, they're bad taxes,
26:21
Speaker 16: and they're the taxes Labor promised they would not bring in.
26:24
Speaker 16: By contrast, our plan is to reduce red tape, to
26:28
Speaker 16: reduce migration and to reduce governments beIN in to put
26:31
Speaker 16: downward pressure on inflation. That's how you get young people
26:34
Speaker 16: into homes.
26:35
Speaker 2: Jillian, Lisa, thank you very much for your time tonight.
26:38
Speaker 2: We do appreciate it.
26:39
Speaker 3: Coming up, the UN's Australian Counter Terrorism Rapperto is under
26:43
Speaker 3: fire overclaims he's compromised by Chinese government funding HELLEL. Newer
26:49
Speaker 3: joins me later and Trump puts it Run on notice.
26:53
Speaker 3: As tay Run threatens to walk away from talks. Michael
26:56
Speaker 3: Schubridge is after the break, let's return to the peace
27:03
Speaker 3: talks in the Middle East, and the US and Iran
27:06
Speaker 3: have agreed to create a deconfliction cell to end military
27:11
Speaker 3: operations in Lebanon. Deconfliction What does that even mean? Is
27:15
Speaker 3: that like Gwyneth Paltrow and Chris Martin's conscious uncoupling?
27:20
Speaker 2: I don't know. The move comes.
27:22
Speaker 3: After peace talks were paused when Donald Trump put the
27:25
Speaker 3: Iranian regime on notice over its terror proxy Hezbollah, posting
27:30
Speaker 3: on truth Social Iran must immediately stop their highly paid
27:35
Speaker 3: proxies in Lebanon from causing trouble. If they don't, we'll
27:39
Speaker 3: hit around very hard again, just like we did last week,
27:43
Speaker 3: only harder.
27:44
Speaker 2: President Donald J. Trump.
27:47
Speaker 3: Iran then hit back, with parliament speaker and Teitruan's chief
27:51
Speaker 3: negotiator Mohammed baghe Gulli BAF posting on Twitter they better
27:56
Speaker 3: be careful with their statements. Our armed forces are ready
27:59
Speaker 3: to respond in a different way whatever they say. We're
28:03
Speaker 3: the ones who will act. Strategic Analysis Australia director Michael
28:07
Speaker 3: Schubridge joins me. Now, Michael, first, there's deconfliction cell. I'm
28:12
Speaker 3: not sure if you've heard this term before, but can
28:14
Speaker 3: you explain what it means and do you think it
28:17
Speaker 3: will work to stop the fighting in Lebanon?
28:21
Speaker 17: Well, Caroline, the deconfliction cell is a bit like a
28:24
Speaker 17: reverse fight club, isn't it. The first rule of the
28:27
Speaker 17: deconfliction cell is there's no fighting in fight club. So
28:32
Speaker 17: I think it's America and Iran seeing that they both
28:37
Speaker 17: need to control one other party. America needs to control
28:41
Speaker 17: Israel and it's war in southern Lebanon. Iran needs to
28:45
Speaker 17: control Hazbola and stop it firing missiles and drones into
28:49
Speaker 17: northern Israel. And what President Trump was doing is stopping
28:55
Speaker 17: Iran having all the leverage putting pressure on him to
28:58
Speaker 17: control the Israelis. He's now put pressure on Tehran to
29:02
Speaker 17: control has Bola.
29:04
Speaker 3: But as the Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Nanyahu has said
29:08
Speaker 3: he's the leader of a sovereign country, he doesn't seem
29:13
Speaker 3: like he's going to back down on fighting the threat
29:16
Speaker 3: from Hesbalah.
29:18
Speaker 2: So will this.
29:20
Speaker 3: Deconfliction deconflicted cell on kind of it's o the term
29:25
Speaker 3: will will it even work?
29:26
Speaker 2: Or is it just a gesture?
29:30
Speaker 17: Well, the Israelis are not in the deconfliction cell and
29:34
Speaker 17: I don't think Hezbola are in it either, And they're
29:37
Speaker 17: the two parties that are fighting that war in southern
29:40
Speaker 17: Lebanon right now. So whatever this cell is, both the
29:47
Speaker 17: Israelis and Hezbola can make their own decisions. The trick
29:52
Speaker 17: is how much pressure come their big supporters America when
29:57
Speaker 17: it comes to mister Netanyahu and Iran when it comes
30:00
Speaker 17: to Hasbolla put on them to get them both to stop.
30:04
Speaker 17: But you're right, I don't think a Prime Minister Netan
30:07
Speaker 17: Yahoo has any plan to get the IDF the Israeli
30:11
Speaker 17: military out of southern Lebanon.
30:13
Speaker 3: Well we'll talk a little bit more about Israel in
30:16
Speaker 3: a moment. But Michael, these talks they were off, now
30:20
Speaker 3: they're back on. Does it fill you with confidence that
30:23
Speaker 3: they already seem so fickle?
30:26
Speaker 17: No, because all of the difficult issues keep getting kicked
30:30
Speaker 17: down the road. So first we had this one and
30:33
Speaker 17: a half page, fourteen point memorandum of understanding, and that
30:38
Speaker 17: now after eighteen hours of high level talks, the most
30:42
Speaker 17: senior delegation from America and Iran have left, leaving it
30:47
Speaker 17: to technical experts. And we've now apparently got a roadmap,
30:51
Speaker 17: so an MoU followed by a roadmap, and at the
30:54
Speaker 17: end of this magical mystery journey, the hard issues have
30:57
Speaker 17: to be dealt with.
31:00
Speaker 3: I mentioned this in my editorial at the top of
31:02
Speaker 3: the show, But the New York Posts Michael Goodwin says
31:05
Speaker 3: Trump and JD. Vance's verbal attacks against Israel show they
31:09
Speaker 3: are rattled by the criticism of the Iran deal that
31:12
Speaker 3: they're getting, especially back in the Republican Party. Within their
31:16
Speaker 3: own party, Vance has said both Israel and Aroon have
31:19
Speaker 3: the right to self defense and even told a podcast
31:23
Speaker 3: critics on the US right were using the dew hatred card.
31:27
Speaker 3: Do you think that's a fair assessment of the criticism
31:30
Speaker 3: that's coming, especially within the Republican Party, of this deal.
31:36
Speaker 17: No, I don't. I think it's pretty clear that the
31:39
Speaker 17: Trump administration and mister Nettnia, who's government in Israel, have
31:44
Speaker 17: now got different interests and aims. The Trump administration wants
31:49
Speaker 17: this MoU and the road map and the deconfliction cell
31:54
Speaker 17: to make the war go away. And get on with
31:58
Speaker 17: other things. YEA, who thinks this is still an existential
32:02
Speaker 17: conflict and Israel hasn't finished using forms. That's the big
32:07
Speaker 17: problem here. And the Vice President can wrap it up
32:09
Speaker 17: however he likes.
32:11
Speaker 3: Yep, It's it's going to be very difficult to reconcile
32:14
Speaker 3: those two different aims. Michael Schubridge, thank you so much
32:18
Speaker 3: for your analysis tonight. Coming up, the UK's political earthquake,
32:22
Speaker 3: Keir Starmer steps down as Prime Minister. Spiked onlines. Tom
32:27
Speaker 3: Slater joins me later tonight with the detail and the
32:30
Speaker 3: UN's Australian counter terrorism Rappertoire under fire over Chinese government
32:36
Speaker 3: funding and claims of anti Western bias. My exclusive interview
32:41
Speaker 3: with un Watch Executive director HELLL Niuer is.
32:44
Speaker 2: Next on our last show.
32:49
Speaker 3: I told you about how Australian Professor Ben Saul, who
32:53
Speaker 3: serves as the United Nations Special Rappertoire on counter terrorism,
32:58
Speaker 3: has been accused of ideological called bias and conflicts of
33:01
Speaker 3: interest in a new report from the Geneva based group
33:05
Speaker 3: un Watch, which pointed out that the Chinese government is
33:08
Speaker 3: one of his biggest funders. The report goes on to
33:13
Speaker 3: accuse Professor Saul of repeatedly demonstrating a deep seated anti
33:18
Speaker 3: Western and anti Israel bias. Professor Saul has condemned the
33:23
Speaker 3: killing of the then most senior leader of terror group
33:27
Speaker 3: Archayeta in Afghanistan, I'man al Zawahiri, who was one of
33:33
Speaker 3: the FBI's most wanted terrorists, calling his assassination in a
33:38
Speaker 3: US drone missile strike unlawful.
33:41
Speaker 2: He's also called.
33:42
Speaker 3: The killing of Iranian General Kassem Solimani illegal and criticized
33:48
Speaker 3: Trump's designation of the Houties as a terrorist organization as
33:53
Speaker 3: one that could disrupt peace efforts. Again, He's meant to
33:59
Speaker 3: be this special rappertoire on counter terrorism. I spoke to
34:04
Speaker 3: you and watch executive director helel Niua a little earlier,
34:08
Speaker 3: and I began by asking him why he thinks that
34:11
Speaker 3: funding from the Chinese government may compromise Professor Saul.
34:16
Speaker 5: Well, he claims to be an independent expert. So this
34:20
Speaker 5: is a law professor at the University of Sydney, has
34:23
Speaker 5: a position on human rights and counter terrorism, and he's
34:26
Speaker 5: called an independent expert. I want to know, how can
34:30
Speaker 5: you be an independent expert while you're receiving one hundred
34:34
Speaker 5: and fifty thousand dollars from the Chinese communist regime. Now,
34:38
Speaker 5: let me be clear, No one's claiming that it's going
34:40
Speaker 5: into his own pocket to buy a ferrari or what
34:43
Speaker 5: have you. But it's going to his office. But this
34:46
Speaker 5: is the same office that has never condemned to China
34:49
Speaker 5: for putting a million wiggers into camps under the pretext
34:53
Speaker 5: of counter terrorism, which is the very issue he's supposed
34:57
Speaker 5: to be addressing. When countries bus use human rights in
35:00
Speaker 5: the name of counter terrorism, Professor Ben Saul is supposed
35:04
Speaker 5: to speak out, and yet when it comes to China,
35:06
Speaker 5: the one giving him a hundred and fifty thousand dollars
35:08
Speaker 5: a year, he is silent.
35:12
Speaker 3: What about his past statements about the US and Israel
35:15
Speaker 3: in particular, what does this show about his fitness to
35:18
Speaker 3: hold this role as Special Rappertoire on counter terrorism.
35:23
Speaker 5: Well, Professor Ben Saul has made extremist statements that manifest
35:29
Speaker 5: a distinct anti American, anti Western, and anti Israel ideology.
35:34
Speaker 5: They often go together with many radical left activists. He's
35:41
Speaker 5: not supposed to be an activist, you know, He's supposed
35:43
Speaker 5: to be an academic. We're supposed to see scholarship as
35:46
Speaker 5: a UN rapporteur. He's supposed to engage in rigorous corroboration
35:51
Speaker 5: of facts. Instead you get these adolescent style tweets. We're
35:57
Speaker 5: going to arrest the US president for murder. We're going
35:59
Speaker 5: to arrest the US Secretary of Defense for murder making
36:04
Speaker 5: echoing the pro Hamas narrative when it comes to Israel.
36:08
Speaker 5: That is not what the United Nations Charter was about.
36:10
Speaker 5: The UN Charter was about defeating Hitler. It's the anti
36:13
Speaker 5: Hitler alliance about international peace and security.
36:16
Speaker 12: The UN experts.
36:17
Speaker 5: Should be the first to oppose Hamas terrorists, the first
36:20
Speaker 5: to oppose the Islamic regime in Iran, and yet Ben
36:23
Speaker 5: Sol seems to echo the narrative of the Islamic regime
36:26
Speaker 5: in Iran and its terrorist proxies.
36:29
Speaker 3: In those comments about the President and Secretary for War.
36:33
Speaker 3: Those were about the US's war on drug trafficking in Venezuela.
36:37
Speaker 2: But you're right, Hellal.
36:39
Speaker 3: It seems totally aligned though with what we hear from
36:41
Speaker 3: a lot of academics, which he is as well at
36:44
Speaker 3: the University of Sydney.
36:45
Speaker 2: But what can be done about this?
36:47
Speaker 3: The UN seems to have stuck by its rapertoires the
36:51
Speaker 3: UN Human Rights chief, saying it, I presume this is about.
36:54
Speaker 2: The UN Watch report.
36:55
Speaker 3: Efforts to intimidate, discredit, or even sanction UN human rights
37:00
Speaker 3: experts are unacceptable.
37:02
Speaker 2: How do you respond to that?
37:04
Speaker 3: Do you accept your report is an effort to intimidate
37:07
Speaker 3: these rappertoires?
37:09
Speaker 12: No, and unless people believe that.
37:11
Speaker 5: Scrutiny and issuing a report of one hundred pages with
37:14
Speaker 5: hundreds of footnotes is quote intimidation, which is absurd and
37:20
Speaker 5: is not appropriate for a UN Human Rights High Commissioner.
37:25
Speaker 5: I'm disappointed in mister Vulkar Turk, who gave a speech
37:29
Speaker 5: last week where he called our report disinformation. You know,
37:35
Speaker 5: it's notable he had not made a single response, a
37:39
Speaker 5: single rebuttal to any of the points. The points include
37:42
Speaker 5: Bensaal getting one hundred and fifty thousand dollars from China,
37:45
Speaker 5: Alena Duhan, the UN expert on coercive measures which means sanctions,
37:50
Speaker 5: getting one point three million dollars for her office from China,
37:54
Speaker 5: Russia and Qatar. Another gentleman, George Katchrugalos, who is the
37:59
Speaker 5: chair of the UN and Human Rights Expert He's the
38:01
Speaker 5: special he's the independent expert on a democratic and equitable
38:05
Speaker 5: international Order, which means the West is unfair to the
38:08
Speaker 5: rest created by Cuba and other countries. He received one
38:11
Speaker 5: hundred thousand dollars his office from China in the same
38:15
Speaker 5: year that he went to an event in Athens promoting
38:18
Speaker 5: the Book of Shijinping. So you couldn't make this up
38:21
Speaker 5: if you wanted to. There's not a single word of
38:24
Speaker 5: rebuttal from the UN other than to say which is
38:27
Speaker 5: their modus operandi when they have no answer to say, disinformation?
38:31
Speaker 3: But what can people do to voice their concerns with
38:34
Speaker 3: how the rappertoires are conducting themselves?
38:38
Speaker 12: Well, sadly, we have been calling for the UN to
38:41
Speaker 12: hold these rogue rappert tours responsible. They failed to do so.
38:46
Speaker 5: You know, there's the famous case, of course, of Francesca Albinizi,
38:50
Speaker 5: who routinely spouts the latest Hamas lies about saying the
38:57
Speaker 5: hundreds of thousands of children have been killed more than
39:00
Speaker 5: the numbers she cites are larger than the number of
39:04
Speaker 5: children in Gaza. She makes many wild accusations. She's been
39:08
Speaker 5: condemned for anti Semitism by France, Germany, Canada, the United
39:12
Speaker 5: States many other countries.
39:14
Speaker 12: The first UN Rabbert forever and the UN wouldn't do
39:16
Speaker 12: a thing. Hu Terra has.
39:17
Speaker 5: Refused to do a thing. America sent letters and they
39:20
Speaker 5: didn't do anything. So it's incumbent first, it's incumbent upon
39:23
Speaker 5: our democracies. And if our own governments fail to act,
39:25
Speaker 5: then we as citizens need to speak out.
39:27
Speaker 12: It means we need to.
39:28
Speaker 5: Demand that our universities stop legitimizing these people. You know,
39:32
Speaker 5: ALBINIZI is someone who got again. This is Francesca Albanesi
39:35
Speaker 5: of the UN. She received a doctorate from three different universities,
39:39
Speaker 5: an honorary doctorate that's shameful from Belgium. So I think
39:42
Speaker 5: civil society should speak out and hold them to account.
39:46
Speaker 3: Speaking of Francesca Albanesi, the US Federal Court of Appeals
39:50
Speaker 3: has temporarily reinstated sanctions against her following allegations she was
39:55
Speaker 3: running an illegitimate campaign of economic and political called warfare
40:01
Speaker 3: against the.
40:01
Speaker 2: US and Israel.
40:03
Speaker 3: Tell us more about this case and why you think
40:05
Speaker 3: the sanctions should remain on her.
40:08
Speaker 5: Well, Look, she is the first UN rappertoeur in history.
40:12
Speaker 5: We're talking about more than eighty years of UN history,
40:15
Speaker 5: the first to have been condemned by countries such as France,
40:19
Speaker 5: Germany and Canada for the Netherlands for violating the UN
40:23
Speaker 5: Code of Conduct, for spreading anti Semitism, for engaging in
40:26
Speaker 5: a Holocaust inversion. She says America is controlled by the
40:30
Speaker 5: Jewish lobby. She compares Israeli leaders to Nazi Germany. This
40:35
Speaker 5: is routinely and this is someone who brings the United
40:41
Speaker 5: Nations into disrepute.
40:43
Speaker 12: She must be held accountable. The UN is failed to
40:45
Speaker 12: do so.
40:46
Speaker 5: The only government that's done anything concrete is the US government.
40:51
Speaker 5: Secretary of State Marco Rubio on July ninth, twenty twenty five,
40:54
Speaker 5: announced sanctions against Albanizi.
40:57
Speaker 12: These she calls devastating.
40:59
Speaker 5: She says she can't use a bank card anymore, She's
41:02
Speaker 5: not able to make a payment, receive a payment, can't
41:05
Speaker 5: enter America. The sanctions are very significant and they send
41:08
Speaker 5: a message to the UN that if you support terrorists,
41:12
Speaker 5: if you spread racism and hate and anti Semitism, you
41:16
Speaker 5: will pay a price. And she tried to fight them.
41:18
Speaker 5: She got her husband and her minor daughter to file
41:22
Speaker 5: lawsuit in America, and as you indicated, the US Appeals
41:25
Speaker 5: Court for now said the sanctions.
41:26
Speaker 3: Are on and finally staying on the topic of Palestinians.
41:31
Speaker 3: The United Nations Relief and Works Agency NRA has fired
41:35
Speaker 3: seventy GAZA staff members after long standing claims from Israel
41:40
Speaker 3: of ties with hamas ANRA insists the decision isn't an
41:45
Speaker 3: admission of guilt, but one taken quote to mitigate safety
41:49
Speaker 3: and security risks for the refugees the agency serves helll
41:54
Speaker 3: HONRA has had to let go of staff before after
41:57
Speaker 3: evidence was presented some of them had actually anticipated in
42:01
Speaker 3: the October seven attacks. What do you make of how
42:04
Speaker 3: the agency has spawned this lightest round of sackings.
42:09
Speaker 5: Well, look, we welcome the firings of seventy UNRA staff
42:13
Speaker 5: over terroritized though they wouldn't exactly acknowledge it as you indicated,
42:18
Speaker 5: but obviously that's what's going on here. But it's a
42:20
Speaker 5: drop in the bucket. It's too little and too late.
42:23
Speaker 5: This is an agency that began with altruistic motives to
42:26
Speaker 5: help Arabs who were displaced in the conflict decades ago,
42:30
Speaker 5: in nineteen forty eight nineteen forty nine, and yet very
42:34
Speaker 5: quickly it became a pathological agency. Hasn't resettled a single
42:38
Speaker 5: Palestinian in more than seventy five years. You know, they've
42:42
Speaker 5: received billions of dollars from taxpayers in Australia, Canada, America,
42:46
Speaker 5: Europe billions of dollars. Haven't resettled one of them, which
42:51
Speaker 5: is absurd. The opposite, they perpetuate Palestinians as dependents, as refugees,
42:56
Speaker 5: even though they've been living in Arab countries, even with citizenship.
42:59
Speaker 5: In Jordan, they have to lean of them have citizenship,
43:01
Speaker 5: and yet they're called citizen refugees. It's absurd.
43:05
Speaker 3: Well, thank goodness, somebody is holding the United Nations to account.
43:09
Speaker 2: Hellal Newer, thank you so much for your time, Thank
43:14
Speaker 2: you for having me.
43:16
Speaker 3: And again, we did reach out to Professor Ben Saul
43:19
Speaker 3: to see if he would like to respond to these claims,
43:22
Speaker 3: but as we go to air, we haven't heard back.
43:25
Speaker 3: After the break, we'll cross to London for the latest
43:27
Speaker 3: on the developing story out of the UK. So Keith
43:31
Speaker 3: Starmers steps down as Prime ministers spiked onlines edited Tom
43:35
Speaker 3: Slater will join us next. Okay, let's go back to
43:45
Speaker 3: that breaking news now. After months of speculation, UK Prime
43:49
Speaker 3: Minister Keir Starmer has tonight announced his resignation after a
43:53
Speaker 3: number of cabinet ministers including his closest to allies, made
43:58
Speaker 3: it clear his leadership was not tenable. Andy Burnham has
44:02
Speaker 3: now confirmed that he will run for the top job,
44:05
Speaker 3: posting on Twitter, Kia has given huge service to our
44:09
Speaker 3: country and I want to thank him for his leadership
44:12
Speaker 3: and dedication during such a challenging period. His decision marks
44:16
Speaker 3: the beginning of a transition, and it is important that
44:20
Speaker 3: this process is conducted in an orderly and responsible way.
44:24
Speaker 3: I will put myself forward as part of this process.
44:28
Speaker 3: Spiked online editor Tom Slater joins me. Now, Tom, first
44:33
Speaker 3: of all, I want to get your reaction to this
44:35
Speaker 3: extraordinary resignation announcement. I mean, it wasn't unexpected, but Starman
44:40
Speaker 3: didn't really have much choice here, did he.
44:45
Speaker 1: No, he didn't.
44:45
Speaker 18: I mean, he's been a dead PM walking for many
44:49
Speaker 18: months now. It was just the question of who was
44:51
Speaker 18: going to replace him as soon as Andy Burnham won
44:53
Speaker 18: that by election in Greater Manchester and so had a
44:57
Speaker 18: path back to the House of Commons and to the
44:59
Speaker 18: leadership basically over. I mean, he was trying to cling on.
45:02
Speaker 18: He was suggesting even as of a few days ago,
45:05
Speaker 18: that he would fight any future leadership election. But he's
45:08
Speaker 18: got no support in the country. He's the most unpopular
45:10
Speaker 18: prime minister since records began. Labor and peas and backbenches
45:13
Speaker 18: have turned against him. Then his own cabinet turned against him.
45:16
Speaker 18: It was curtains after that.
45:18
Speaker 3: And what were the main reasons that voters really turned
45:22
Speaker 3: against him and his own allies and the party?
45:24
Speaker 2: Was it?
45:24
Speaker 3: Like I mentioned some at the beginning of the show, immigration,
45:28
Speaker 3: cost of living pressures. You know, he was accepting gifts
45:32
Speaker 3: at the time when the country was struggling. What do
45:35
Speaker 3: you see as the key reasons that he lost his
45:40
Speaker 3: leadership his hold on it.
45:43
Speaker 1: I think it's a combination of factors.
45:44
Speaker 18: I mean, Kirstearmer is uniquely ill equipped to deal with
45:47
Speaker 18: some of the big issues that are roiling society. Immigration
45:50
Speaker 18: is one of the biggest concerns of the public at
45:52
Speaker 18: the moment, and yet he's a human rights lawyer who
45:54
Speaker 18: really doesn't want to go anywhere.
45:55
Speaker 1: Near this particular question.
45:57
Speaker 18: He's also so many kind of just straight forward errors
46:01
Speaker 18: in terms of dealing with the public taking away winter
46:03
Speaker 18: fuel payments for pensions, even though that was obviously going
46:06
Speaker 18: to go down at the proverbial cup of cold stick.
46:09
Speaker 18: Is that combination I think of people realizing that he
46:11
Speaker 18: wasn't up to it, didn't want to do what was
46:14
Speaker 18: necessary to put the country back on track. And also
46:17
Speaker 18: just how rudtherless it felt since then that it's been
46:20
Speaker 18: a kind of mix of people didn't just hate him.
46:23
Speaker 18: I think they started to think you slightly pathetic and
46:25
Speaker 18: that's a terrible position for a prime minister to be.
46:27
Speaker 3: Yeah, when people feel sorry for you, it's almost worse,
46:30
Speaker 3: isn't it. What will this mean but Nigel for Archer's
46:33
Speaker 3: reform UK? Is it a gift for them? Or does
46:36
Speaker 3: Andy Burnham possibly or likely taking over? Will that renew
46:41
Speaker 3: the popularity of UK labor?
46:45
Speaker 18: I think there will be a Burnham bounce almost certainly.
46:48
Speaker 18: He nexte kissed arm. It looks a hell of a
46:51
Speaker 18: lot more human, a lot more capable. But my sense
46:54
Speaker 18: is that that won't last very long. Andy Burnham is
46:58
Speaker 18: someone who is a bit of a political chameleon. He's
47:01
Speaker 18: new turn on absolutely every issue he's ever talked about,
47:05
Speaker 18: and I think in time the public will start to
47:07
Speaker 18: see that really he is not that far away from Starmer,
47:09
Speaker 18: who was also famous for his new terms and changing
47:12
Speaker 18: depending on what the political weather was dictating.
47:15
Speaker 1: So the question is how close does the election comes.
47:18
Speaker 18: If Andy Burnham calls a snap election to get his
47:20
Speaker 18: own mandate, there could be a.
47:21
Speaker 1: Chance that that really puts reform on the defensive.
47:23
Speaker 18: But if it is a case that we've got a
47:25
Speaker 18: few more years of an unelected Prime minister, then there
47:28
Speaker 18: might be more time for the public to realize that
47:30
Speaker 18: Burnham is a lot more like the rest of them
47:32
Speaker 18: than he might have wise like them to believe.
47:34
Speaker 2: Doing u turns on policies, we call that well.
47:37
Speaker 3: Our Australian government calls it changing their position on things.
47:40
Speaker 3: So do you think there's any messages in what happened
47:43
Speaker 3: to s Key is damma for our own labor government
47:46
Speaker 3: in Australia.
47:48
Speaker 18: I know they're very similar figures Albernese and Keir Starmer,
47:53
Speaker 18: not least because they are that strange mix of empty
47:56
Speaker 18: suited technocratic politicians in one sense, but also quite authoritarian,
48:01
Speaker 18: quite naturally given to dismiss and dodge any form of criticism.
48:08
Speaker 1: So I think what's clear is that you have to listen.
48:10
Speaker 18: To the public and if you can't deliver for them,
48:12
Speaker 18: then you've got to get the hell out. That's been
48:13
Speaker 18: the story of Keir Starmer. Will it be the story
48:15
Speaker 18: in Australia, Time will tell.
48:17
Speaker 3: Meanwhile, in a final humiliation for Sakia, Trump announced his
48:21
Speaker 3: resignation hours before he did, posting on truth Social the
48:25
Speaker 3: British Prime Minister will resign as Prime Minister of the
48:28
Speaker 3: United Kingdom. He fell badly on two very important subjects,
48:31
Speaker 3: immigration on and energy.
48:33
Speaker 2: He did say he wished him well.
48:35
Speaker 3: Do you think just quickly, Tom, that this would have
48:37
Speaker 3: been a final big sting for Starmer or could he
48:41
Speaker 3: have seen this coming.
48:43
Speaker 1: I'm sure he could have seen it coming.
48:44
Speaker 18: I mean, the relationship between Starin and Trump has broken
48:47
Speaker 18: down pretty significantly over recent months, and clearly the US
48:51
Speaker 18: President couldn't help but get a dig in. I mean
48:53
Speaker 18: in a sense, I mean getting bashed around by the
48:56
Speaker 18: President of the United States, something that might actually endear
48:58
Speaker 18: you to certain left wing since the least in this country.
49:01
Speaker 18: But yeah, it was the sort of final humiliation here
49:03
Speaker 18: I suppose.
49:05
Speaker 3: Well, yes, I mean Trump does have a way of
49:07
Speaker 3: sticking the boot in, I guess. But you almost had
49:10
Speaker 3: to feel a little bit sorry for the keyst time
49:12
Speaker 3: we're giving his resignation speech. He was in tears, but
49:15
Speaker 3: not too sorry, Tom Slater, Thank you so much for
49:18
Speaker 3: your time, and that is all the time we have
49:20
Speaker 3: for on the show tonight. I'll be back here tomorrow
49:23
Speaker 3: at eight o'clock. But coming up next is Paul Murray
49:26
Speaker 3: with Paul Murray Live