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High Achievement as a Trauma Response with Seema Sharma, SEP, LMFT, PhD · The Trauma Therapist

0:00
Speaker 1: Welcome to the Trauma Therapist Podcast. My name is Guy McPherson.
0:04
Speaker 1: I interview incredible people who've dedicated their lives to helping
0:07
Speaker 1: those who've been impacted by trauma. A big thank you
0:11
Speaker 1: to our sponsors and our guests who are supporting this show.
0:15
Speaker 1: So five, four, three, two, one. Our folks, welcome back
0:19
Speaker 1: to the podcast. Very excited to have as my guest today, Dr.
0:23
Speaker 1: Seema Sharma. Seema, welcome.
0:26
Speaker 2: Hi, nice to be here.
0:27
Speaker 1: Awesome. So Seema is a trauma therapist, researcher, and founder
0:31
Speaker 1: of Holistic Trauma Therapy, who spent more than 25 years
0:35
Speaker 1: in senior leadership roles across Fortune 500 companies, global organizations,
0:40
Speaker 1: and startups before entering clinical practice. She's a licensed marriage
0:44
Speaker 1: and family therapist, somatic experiencing practitioner, ASECT certified sex therapist,
0:50
Speaker 1: and Gottman Level 3 trained couples therapist with a doctorate
0:53
Speaker 1: in psychology. Seema specializes in complex PTSD, developmental and childhood trauma,
0:59
Speaker 1: attachment wounds, sexual trauma, corporate burnout, and the mental health
1:03
Speaker 1: of high-achieving professionals, integrating somatic and trauma-focused approaches into her work.
1:09
Speaker 1: She also brings a particular focus to Asian American mental health,
1:12
Speaker 1: including intergenerational trauma and cultural shame. All right, Seema, just
1:17
Speaker 1: a little bit about you. But before we get going,
1:21
Speaker 1: share with the listeners where you're from originally and where
1:23
Speaker 1: you are currently.
1:26
Speaker 2: So I was born and raised in SoCal, Southern California.
1:30
Speaker 2: I'm still here in this in this region and just
1:36
Speaker 2: have a practice out in two locations and one in
1:39
Speaker 2: Newport Beach and one in Pasadena. Pasadena is our home
1:42
Speaker 2: office here.
1:43
Speaker 1: All right. So how does all this start for you?
1:47
Speaker 2: Yeah, I was in the corporate arena and I thought
1:52
Speaker 2: that's where I had to be. And for me, it
1:56
Speaker 2: was conveyed very early on that achievement was so associated
2:00
Speaker 2: with my sense of value. And when I started, really,
2:04
Speaker 2: I got lucky. And I think that's how I moved
2:07
Speaker 2: into leadership. I was in leadership by the time I
2:09
Speaker 2: was 24 years old and at General Motors at the time.
2:13
Speaker 1: And so what do you mean you got lucky?
2:17
Speaker 2: I think I just got the right interview at the
2:20
Speaker 2: right time and then was regional director all of a
2:24
Speaker 2: sudden of General Motors. Okay, wow. Yeah, at 24. Yeah,
2:33
Speaker 2: I worked with acquisitions and at that time I was
2:36
Speaker 2: out in the New York, New Jersey area. And yeah,
2:42
Speaker 2: so I worked out there. So I just got lucky
2:45
Speaker 2: to be you know, in management really early on. But
2:49
Speaker 2: what I learned very quickly was everyone around me was
2:53
Speaker 2: traumatized and I didn't know the word then. And everyone
2:57
Speaker 2: was operating from their wounded self and just like witnessing,
3:00
Speaker 2: for example, you know, a boss screaming and yelling at you, right?
3:05
Speaker 2: And then apologizing the next day. And it's like almost
3:07
Speaker 2: like cycle of violence that happens in the corporate arena.
3:11
Speaker 2: I didn't know what was happening for a very long
3:13
Speaker 2: time until I started doing my own work And started
3:17
Speaker 2: figuring out, like, those that happen to be on the
3:20
Speaker 2: higher echelons of these corporations happen to be wounded people.
3:26
Speaker 2: And what they're doing is enacting their trauma. And as
3:29
Speaker 2: you start healing, you kind of don't fit in that mold.
3:33
Speaker 2: And so I chose to step out of that arena
3:37
Speaker 2: and get trained as a clinician specifically for this group
3:42
Speaker 2: of people.
3:43
Speaker 1: Okay. So you just said... A lot of interesting things there. One,
3:49
Speaker 1: that many of the people in the higher echelons of
3:53
Speaker 1: the corporate world are traumatized. And it kind of begs
3:58
Speaker 1: the question, to what degree does that go hand in hand,
4:03
Speaker 1: that need for that level of achievement, et cetera. But also,
4:09
Speaker 1: how did you manage that as a young person?
4:14
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think that I was operating as a people
4:17
Speaker 2: pleaser and it helped me then climb the ranks. And
4:21
Speaker 2: that's one of the big super skills that I see
4:24
Speaker 2: in myself, but also my clients is like kind of
4:27
Speaker 2: doing whatever they wanted, kind of pandering to those that
4:31
Speaker 2: happen to be in power to then move up and
4:34
Speaker 2: be recognized as someone that's kind of, you know, compliant
4:38
Speaker 2: with whatever agendas the company has. And so I was
4:43
Speaker 2: able to move up. And I actually, you know, when
4:47
Speaker 2: I retired, I was the head of global real estate
4:49
Speaker 2: for Pinterest. And so I was really able to move
4:53
Speaker 2: up quickly in my career. But it was because, you know,
4:59
Speaker 2: I was able to handle those that were traumatized. And
5:03
Speaker 2: it mimicked very similarly, like the childhood I grew up with,
5:07
Speaker 2: you know, like, and so those parallels. helped me survive.
5:11
Speaker 2: It was the same exact coping mechanism I had in
5:15
Speaker 2: my family structure, was the same exact skill set that
5:18
Speaker 2: I needed to operate at that level in corporate America.
5:22
Speaker 1: So, and to what degree you're able to effectively manage
5:28
Speaker 1: and navigate these relationships, but is there a cost that
5:33
Speaker 1: goes along with that?
5:35
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think the cost is your authenticity. Absolutely. Absolutely.
5:39
Speaker 2: And so you're not authentic. And then you get to
5:42
Speaker 2: a point and you wonder, who are you? You know,
5:47
Speaker 2: as someone who traveled internationally 75% of the time at
5:52
Speaker 2: one point in my career, career is no longer nine
5:56
Speaker 2: to five. Career is 24-7, almost seven days a week.
6:00
Speaker 2: And it's because you get home on Saturday, right? You're
6:03
Speaker 2: leaving again on Sunday night. There isn't that time to
6:07
Speaker 2: reset or even connect with your support system that the
6:12
Speaker 2: corporate arena becomes your world. Yeah, I hope I answered that.
6:17
Speaker 1: You did that in the bio. How long did you
6:21
Speaker 1: do that for?
6:21
Speaker 2: 25 years.
6:23
Speaker 1: A crazy amount of time to live like that. How
6:28
Speaker 1: are you managing? What is the self-talk that you're going
6:35
Speaker 1: through to do I mean you've got the cachet you're
6:40
Speaker 1: making money you're traveling all over the place things from
6:44
Speaker 1: the outside I'm sure look great but what's going on
6:47
Speaker 1: for you internally are you married at some point you
6:51
Speaker 1: have kids.
6:51
Speaker 2: Or what yeah I'm married I I was married early
6:55
Speaker 2: on in my career when I was 24 managing a
6:59
Speaker 2: marriage very poorly and I had three kids so I
7:03
Speaker 2: had kids by the time I was I had all
7:07
Speaker 2: my children. So I had three daughters. And I wasn't
7:11
Speaker 2: truly there all the time. My husband was a stay-at-home parent.
7:15
Speaker 2: He was the one who had to then step up
7:17
Speaker 2: and take care of the kids. And that was the
7:20
Speaker 2: compromise we made in our household. But there was a
7:24
Speaker 2: lot of, like, feeling like you're not a great mom.
7:27
Speaker 2: You know, you are missing out. You are also, at times.
7:34
Speaker 2: You know, envious of your partner because they're able to
7:37
Speaker 2: be there and you actually want to be there. And
7:40
Speaker 2: then at the same time, there's a part of you
7:41
Speaker 2: that can't stop that drive of like that corporate drive
7:45
Speaker 2: of getting more. And it soon becomes where we disconnect
7:50
Speaker 2: our value system from the family and then have to
7:54
Speaker 2: reconnect it to honestly stupid things like, you know, your
7:59
Speaker 2: hotel status or your airline status. And that's what conversation is.
8:03
Speaker 2: And that group becomes is more like, hey, what status
8:07
Speaker 2: are you on American Airlines? You know, like and oh,
8:11
Speaker 2: you're platinum pro. Well, I'm executive platinum. You know, it's
8:14
Speaker 2: like really that becomes the conversations because that's all we have.
8:20
Speaker 1: So how does it unfold such that you begin to
8:25
Speaker 1: question things? What is when does this happen? What does
8:29
Speaker 1: it look like?
8:30
Speaker 2: Yeah, for me, like I know that I was always
8:33
Speaker 2: the only woman in the room and I was usually
8:36
Speaker 2: the only person of color. So being the only was
8:40
Speaker 2: my entire career. And that came with a cost of,
8:45
Speaker 2: you know, like managing real estate facilities globally is usually
8:50
Speaker 2: a man's game. And usually they don't see people like me.
8:54
Speaker 2: And so there was a lot of hurdles. And then
8:58
Speaker 2: recognizing that that longevity for me didn't include, their vision
9:05
Speaker 2: of longevity didn't really include a person like me. There's ageism.
9:09
Speaker 2: Ageism is a real fact that I think people start
9:13
Speaker 2: confronting around 40s, 50ish, because companies start letting go of
9:19
Speaker 2: people that happen to be older. And I know it's illegal,
9:22
Speaker 2: but that's what we witness as those in leadership. And
9:26
Speaker 2: you know there is an expiration date on your career.
9:29
Speaker 2: But at the same time, there's a piece of you
9:32
Speaker 2: that is almost starving to be seen, that authentic piece.
9:37
Speaker 2: And towards the end of my career, I started doing
9:40
Speaker 2: things and I recognized if I did this earlier, I
9:42
Speaker 2: may have survived the career longer than the 25 years was.
9:46
Speaker 2: I never stayed in the same hotel as my employees
9:48
Speaker 2: or my boss. You know, I never fly on the
9:50
Speaker 2: same airlines just to give myself moments for myself. Like
9:55
Speaker 2: you have to constructively build them into your life in
9:58
Speaker 2: a very different way. And so like really recognizing there
10:03
Speaker 2: was this emptiness. I lost touch of who I was.
10:08
Speaker 2: I started diving into a lot of like, you know,
10:11
Speaker 2: like trying to do some spiritual awakening, trying to do
10:14
Speaker 2: like these Tony Robbins retreats, kind of that's what we
10:17
Speaker 2: start doing. Because we've lost who we are. We're trying
10:20
Speaker 2: to figure out who that person was. And doing then,
10:24
Speaker 2: going into therapy was a big part of my journey.
10:28
Speaker 2: And recognizing that I probably didn't know who I was
10:31
Speaker 2: probably my entire life.
10:33
Speaker 1: If I may, Seema.
10:34
Speaker 2: Yeah.
10:36
Speaker 1: What were some of the things that happened or maybe
10:41
Speaker 1: thoughts you had that brought out the fact that or
10:46
Speaker 1: made you start to question? like, I don't know who
10:49
Speaker 1: I am. I want to, can you tease that out
10:53
Speaker 1: a little more for us?
10:54
Speaker 2: Yeah. Um, you know, so for several companies, I was
10:58
Speaker 2: part of a large reduction in force, right? And so
11:01
Speaker 2: you're going to get, you have to lay off a
11:04
Speaker 2: large chunk of the people that report to you. And
11:08
Speaker 2: it's done in a very, in the tech industry, it's
11:11
Speaker 2: done in a very, um, cold way. You just get
11:16
Speaker 2: an email in the morning. It's like Hunger Games. If
11:18
Speaker 2: you get the email, you're gone. If you get another email,
11:22
Speaker 2: you're saved. And that's what happens on a larger scale.
11:26
Speaker 2: And it happened in numerous companies. But recognizing the way
11:31
Speaker 2: that was working was so misaligned to who I was
11:34
Speaker 2: as a human being and who I was as a
11:36
Speaker 2: leader was the aha moment that got me thinking of like,
11:41
Speaker 2: this is not for me. Like there is something wrong
11:44
Speaker 2: here that I need to leave before it takes all
11:48
Speaker 2: of me.
11:49
Speaker 1: And this was at year, what, 23, 4, 5 or what?
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Speaker 2: Yeah, this was not at that age. This was towards
11:57
Speaker 2: probably in my late 30s that I started witnessing the
12:00
Speaker 2: way that layoffs were done, the way that, you know,
12:04
Speaker 2: terminations were done. And really struggling with that because I...
12:09
Speaker 2: at one point managed really large international teams and you
12:13
Speaker 2: couldn't get that FaceTime me and you couldn't tell them.
12:16
Speaker 2: So there was this part of you that had to
12:18
Speaker 2: constantly be masked. And that just really led to a
12:22
Speaker 2: more of a disconnection from yourself as opposed to, in
12:27
Speaker 2: addition to the company and then just, you are just untethered.
12:31
Speaker 2: And so that is when I knew that this is
12:34
Speaker 2: not working. And not only is the ageism thing true,
12:37
Speaker 2: But this is not working for me as a human
12:40
Speaker 2: and what I want to do with my life journey
12:43
Speaker 2: on this planet.
12:44
Speaker 1: And you said you started therapy at some point.
12:47
Speaker 2: Yeah, I started therapy in my later days.
12:49
Speaker 1: How was that for you to begin doing that?
12:54
Speaker 2: It was really scary because it was something you don't
12:58
Speaker 2: want to tell anyone at work, especially when you're in leadership,
13:03
Speaker 2: because there's a lot of questions that are then asked.
13:06
Speaker 2: And so it was something that you had to do secretively.
13:11
Speaker 2: And so this was prior to telehealth. And so it
13:15
Speaker 2: was really done in ways where you would have to
13:19
Speaker 2: do it during your lunch break where someone doesn't know
13:21
Speaker 2: and then come back in time. And so it was
13:24
Speaker 2: always like racing there, racing back. But the work itself
13:29
Speaker 2: was really all about held in trauma. And like, that's
13:34
Speaker 2: really one of the reasons why I was so good
13:37
Speaker 2: in that corporate arena. And I'm making that connection for myself.
13:41
Speaker 1: Repeat that. You kind of glitched out a little bit.
13:43
Speaker 1: What about trauma?
13:46
Speaker 2: Making the connection between trauma and my success was kind
13:50
Speaker 2: of like the biggest aha moment. But I think the
13:53
Speaker 2: biggest leap happened when I made the connection to somatics.
13:59
Speaker 2: And so what I started doing at that moment it
14:03
Speaker 2: kind of opened my eyes to healing. And it was
14:08
Speaker 2: actually something that I was interested in in high school
14:11
Speaker 2: was actually alternative forms of healing. Um, and so when
14:16
Speaker 2: I would travel, no matter where I went, um, let's
14:19
Speaker 2: say I was in the United Kingdom or, you know,
14:22
Speaker 2: I would look for different ways of healing. And that's
14:26
Speaker 2: really what I started investigating prior to actually going to school. Um,
14:31
Speaker 2: So I went and I traveled all over the world.
14:33
Speaker 2: And so I looked at the way other communities and
14:38
Speaker 2: other cultures were treating mental health, childhood trauma, just because
14:44
Speaker 2: I was struggling with the symptom-based care that I was
14:47
Speaker 2: receiving from the clinicians that I was personally seeing in
14:52
Speaker 2: my own life. And it was really more about the
14:55
Speaker 2: symptoms than it was anything else. And so that's where
14:59
Speaker 2: I discovered consciousness. That's where I discovered somatics. And that's
15:04
Speaker 2: a big part of the practice now, which is why
15:07
Speaker 2: I consider myself a holistic practice is we integrate and
15:10
Speaker 2: weave in consciousness and somatics. And that is where I
15:15
Speaker 2: felt like was the healing for me was I was
15:19
Speaker 2: able to incorporate those pieces in addition to the talk
15:22
Speaker 2: therapy that I was receiving at the time.
15:24
Speaker 1: It seems to me, and correct me if I'm wrong here,
15:28
Speaker 1: but you're at some point yearning thirst for becoming your
15:37
Speaker 1: authentic self, reclaiming your authentic self must have been so
15:45
Speaker 1: satisfying for you. Like you, at some point you must
15:48
Speaker 1: have like, you know, realize, wait a minute, I'm not
15:52
Speaker 1: being true to who I am. But then you, you,
15:55
Speaker 1: you get a, you get a glimpse of it through
15:57
Speaker 1: some of the, teachings or studyings you were doing and
16:01
Speaker 1: you're like, Oh my God, this, this can be really
16:03
Speaker 1: amazing that I could just imagine being driven to, uh,
16:11
Speaker 1: own that to declare that. Yeah. Important that is, but
16:16
Speaker 1: it also at the same time, it feels from what
16:19
Speaker 1: you're describing almost diametrically opposed to the corporate life you
16:24
Speaker 1: were leading.
16:25
Speaker 2: Absolutely.
16:26
Speaker 1: Absolutely.
16:26
Speaker 2: Absolutely. And that's why it was done in secrecy for
16:30
Speaker 2: a lot of the time. But it was almost like
16:31
Speaker 2: an OCD where I was so obsessed with that material.
16:35
Speaker 2: It was like water in a desert, you know, and
16:40
Speaker 2: so consumed by that. And when I started doing that,
16:44
Speaker 2: I started finding other women and other people in the
16:49
Speaker 2: corporate world who were also doing the same work and
16:53
Speaker 2: also trying to explore similar things. And Creating community with
16:59
Speaker 2: the people I knew in the corporate arena at that
17:02
Speaker 2: time really helped me continue that work as well.
17:07
Speaker 1: So let's talk about the work you're doing now. How
17:12
Speaker 1: did that come about? Well, first of all, when did
17:17
Speaker 1: you leave and start to say, all right, this is
17:19
Speaker 1: what I want to do?
17:21
Speaker 2: Yeah. I think I left in, I fully left in 2021.
17:28
Speaker 2: or 23, somewhere around there. I went back and forth.
17:32
Speaker 2: I dipped in and dipped out because the life of
17:34
Speaker 2: an associate is really hard. And so once I got
17:38
Speaker 2: all my hours and I was fully licensed, I was
17:41
Speaker 2: dipping in and dipping out because it was hard to
17:44
Speaker 2: make a transition from that sort of role into full-time clinician.
17:50
Speaker 2: And I finally made the leap and just did it.
17:54
Speaker 2: And I think that was when I was at Pinterest
17:56
Speaker 2: and it was You know, I just had this aha moment. Like,
18:00
Speaker 2: I just can't do this anymore. I think I had
18:03
Speaker 2: just reached my limit at that time and I was done.
18:07
Speaker 2: And so at that moment, I leaped over and I
18:13
Speaker 2: was lucky to have found the school I went to
18:16
Speaker 2: as well. And the doctorate I had as well, like
18:19
Speaker 2: my doctorate is in integral and transpersonal psychology. And specifically
18:24
Speaker 2: in consciousness. And so it is a PhD in psychology,
18:27
Speaker 2: but that's the emphasis area.
18:29
Speaker 1: Where did you do that?
18:30
Speaker 2: At California Institute of Interval Studies up in San Francisco.
18:35
Speaker 2: And so I feel like it was so attuned to
18:38
Speaker 2: what I was doing for almost like these decades of
18:41
Speaker 2: like this research and learning and all of these explorations
18:45
Speaker 2: I did globally all came together in this one place.
18:49
Speaker 2: And it was just like synchronousness. there's so much synchronicity
18:53
Speaker 2: around that. And that's really what my practice is now
18:57
Speaker 2: is like, we incorporate eco-psychology, we incorporate movement, map music,
19:02
Speaker 2: we incorporate intention. And so all in consciousness, in addition
19:08
Speaker 2: to the trauma therapy work that we do. And we
19:12
Speaker 2: are definitely trained in trauma therapy. I feel like I
19:16
Speaker 2: have a lots and lots and lots of training in
19:18
Speaker 2: trauma therapy, but I still, travel globally to get training
19:23
Speaker 2: in trauma. And so it's still a part of me
19:27
Speaker 2: where I'm still like, I'm going to Canada next month
19:30
Speaker 2: to go to a trauma training. And so it's still
19:33
Speaker 2: a part of me where I'm still trying to learn
19:36
Speaker 2: more and more and bring it back because I feel
19:39
Speaker 2: like that wholeness is what I feel was missing for me.
19:42
Speaker 2: And I'm hoping to provide that to my clients.
19:46
Speaker 1: And who do you work with? Who are your clients? Yeah.
19:50
Speaker 2: I work with clients of all ages, but mostly overachievers, perfectionists.
19:55
Speaker 2: That's what I specialize in. A large chunk of my
19:59
Speaker 2: population is definitely your executives, your professionals, your entrepreneurs. That's
20:05
Speaker 2: a large chunk of my practice because we talk about
20:08
Speaker 2: boardroom survival. We talk about how do you navigate work,
20:12
Speaker 2: travel while working and how do you navigate these pieces
20:16
Speaker 2: while still doing your healing work?
20:18
Speaker 1: And is there, or to what degree is there correlation between, um,
20:24
Speaker 1: people in the corporate field, high achievers up the upper
20:27
Speaker 1: echelon and trauma?
20:30
Speaker 2: There's quite a bit correlation. And that is what I
20:33
Speaker 2: found out afterwards through the research I did. And, um,
20:37
Speaker 2: Everything else is there's a certain reason why these people
20:42
Speaker 2: in the upper echelons made it to the upper echelons.
20:45
Speaker 2: They had a high resiliency for a certain number of things.
20:50
Speaker 2: But very often their trauma plays out. It's almost like
20:56
Speaker 2: systems work, right? And so it's almost like a new
20:58
Speaker 2: family system for them, but it happens to be more
21:00
Speaker 2: of a corporate system. And they all find roles within that.
21:05
Speaker 2: the corporate arena to play and to their trauma does
21:08
Speaker 2: show up and they operate in their survival skills do
21:12
Speaker 2: show up. And so that's what we look at. That's
21:15
Speaker 2: what we recognize. I always have to emphasize your expertise
21:19
Speaker 2: and your leadership skills are not going to diminish by
21:22
Speaker 2: getting the healing that you need. You're just going to
21:25
Speaker 2: be a better leader, a more conscious leader and more
21:27
Speaker 2: grounded leader. And that's really what my work.
21:31
Speaker 1: Is all about. When people, come to you uh from
21:37
Speaker 1: that position and with the understanding that everyone's different what
21:44
Speaker 1: what are they thinking what are they are they at
21:46
Speaker 1: their ropes end their wits end.
21:50
Speaker 2: What do you see yeah yeah they come to me
21:53
Speaker 2: for all different reasons um i definitely specialize in workplace
21:57
Speaker 2: trauma which is definitely if there is a crisis happening
22:01
Speaker 2: at work um For many, many, many reasons, whether they're
22:05
Speaker 2: being bullied or they're sexual harassment or just simply a
22:08
Speaker 2: toxic environment they're trying to navigate. Definitely have that. I
22:13
Speaker 2: have a lot of leaders that come in that just
22:15
Speaker 2: want to work on themselves to be a better human
22:17
Speaker 2: and live their best life. And that's where a lot
22:20
Speaker 2: of the consciousness themes come in because they're the ones
22:23
Speaker 2: that were doing exactly what I was doing. Going to
22:25
Speaker 2: these workshops, trying to like find better ways to be
22:29
Speaker 2: their best self. And so those are also another group
22:32
Speaker 2: of people that come in and then others that have
22:34
Speaker 2: had childhood trauma and now want to take a look
22:37
Speaker 2: at that and don't want to explain maybe the nuances
22:42
Speaker 2: of like their corporate life and just want someone to
22:44
Speaker 2: get it. And so that's the third bucket that all
22:47
Speaker 2: of those people are those that come to me in
22:50
Speaker 2: addition to young folks that are happen to be there
22:52
Speaker 2: 20 and 30s that want to get into leadership and
22:55
Speaker 2: want to work on their stuff earlier than later.
22:58
Speaker 1: Is it? possible to live both lives to be in
23:05
Speaker 1: the corporate world and to and to live your best
23:08
Speaker 1: life to be your your best version.
23:10
Speaker 2: Of yourself it is very possible to live your best
23:15
Speaker 2: life as long as you're constantly doing your work and
23:19
Speaker 2: able to recognize how you're showing up and if it's
23:22
Speaker 2: in a mode of survival or if it's in a
23:26
Speaker 2: world in any mode of like groundedness And I think
23:30
Speaker 2: that's the key. Survival is a coping strategy that you
23:34
Speaker 2: have around the workplace. And that is a very common
23:38
Speaker 2: strategy I see most people in. And moving from that
23:43
Speaker 2: space to a grounded space is the goal.
23:46
Speaker 1: But doesn't it also have to do with the culture
23:49
Speaker 1: at an organization or company? I mean, if you were to...
23:54
Speaker 1: as you described it, you know, as you described your situation,
23:58
Speaker 1: start living your authentic self within that context. I would
24:02
Speaker 1: imagine that would be maybe rubbing people the wrong way,
24:05
Speaker 1: presenting people with some pushback or what?
24:08
Speaker 2: Um, so absolutely. But we meet every client where they're at.
24:13
Speaker 2: We don't come in and say, live your best life.
24:16
Speaker 2: They're the ones saying that to me, you know, very
24:18
Speaker 2: often they're the ones coming in. They want to, uh,
24:22
Speaker 2: They're the ones that want to pull off my consciousness
24:25
Speaker 2: pages and reference that back to me. But every corporation
24:29
Speaker 2: is different. I do want to highlight that. Not every
24:32
Speaker 2: corporation is toxic per se. There are those that I
24:35
Speaker 2: have met in my research or met through other ways
24:39
Speaker 2: that have had collaborative, you know, like positive experiences in
24:46
Speaker 2: their corporation. So I don't want to rule that out
24:49
Speaker 2: as not existing. Definitely want to have space for that.
24:52
Speaker 2: But those that I work with don't usually come from
24:56
Speaker 2: those environments. They're coming in from the other environments most often.
25:01
Speaker 1: And you mentioned consciousness. How specifically are you incorporating that
25:05
Speaker 1: into the work you're doing?
25:07
Speaker 2: Oh, consciousness is a large part of the work I do.
25:09
Speaker 2: And it's really about not only awareness, but just, you know,
25:14
Speaker 2: using consciousness-based tools or transpersonal tactics. There's a whole slew
25:18
Speaker 2: of them. In the work of trauma, which includes like,
25:23
Speaker 2: for example, like nature, for example, is the nature's natural antidepressant.
25:30
Speaker 2: So it's like how much nature is around you? How
25:32
Speaker 2: much nature have you incorporated? And just being in nature
25:35
Speaker 2: is really great. If someone doesn't know what nervous system
25:39
Speaker 2: regulation feels like, just being in nature and noticing that
25:43
Speaker 2: gives them an access to what safety may feel like
25:46
Speaker 2: for a second or for a moment. And just really
25:49
Speaker 2: using that to really help themselves ground in different ways.
25:53
Speaker 2: So that's how we incorporate various transpersonal tools or consciousness-based
25:57
Speaker 2: tools into trauma therapy to help people find safety, nervous
26:02
Speaker 2: system regulation, or just kind of like the life they want.
26:08
Speaker 1: What's been, Seema, I'm curious, what's been challenging for you
26:13
Speaker 1: having made this shift? Having what? why would you just
26:19
Speaker 1: call it, call it really rediscovering yourself, rebirthing yourself almost.
26:26
Speaker 1: What's been challenging for you in, in moving into this role? Yeah.
26:32
Speaker 2: I think the most challenging thing is very often like
26:36
Speaker 2: I loved the corporate world. I don't want to say
26:39
Speaker 2: that I didn't like it. I love the job I
26:42
Speaker 2: did too. And sometimes missing it and missing the travel,
26:46
Speaker 2: missing the, you know, the, the adventures I had. And
26:50
Speaker 2: so I still try to travel, but not as much.
26:53
Speaker 2: And I feel like that's the piece where I go
26:55
Speaker 2: back and forth where I'm like, I understand that world
26:58
Speaker 2: so well. And it's so, it's so home to me.
27:02
Speaker 2: And that's probably why I work with this population. But that,
27:06
Speaker 2: I feel like that's been the hardest for me. And
27:07
Speaker 2: the transition is like, you know, reminiscing about the life
27:10
Speaker 2: I had.
27:11
Speaker 1: To get there too. I, you talked about survivability and,
27:17
Speaker 1: But my guess is that it calls upon a lot
27:21
Speaker 1: of skills you have, a lot of strengths you have
27:24
Speaker 1: to get there and to sustain that type of life. Right.
27:28
Speaker 1: Are you able to tap into those skills and strengths still? Yeah.
27:34
Speaker 2: I mean, one of the biggest skills I had in
27:37
Speaker 2: that world was negotiation and conflict management. And that's kind
27:40
Speaker 2: of the skill I still use, you know, and I
27:43
Speaker 2: do do business coaching and work with businesses as well,
27:48
Speaker 2: not only just individuals and consulting with businesses and teams.
27:52
Speaker 2: Lots of corporations have teams in their organization and sometimes
27:57
Speaker 2: there's unrest or dysregulation within the team. So I will
28:00
Speaker 2: come in and do some team management, team coaching. That's
28:05
Speaker 2: what I do in that arena as well. So that's
28:07
Speaker 2: kind of the way I still kind of dip in
28:09
Speaker 2: and dip out that those skills negotiate, like that's what
28:13
Speaker 2: I help with my clients with as well as like, negotiation,
28:17
Speaker 2: how do you talk to an employee around performance if
28:20
Speaker 2: they're struggling, some tactics around like nonviolent communication, just kind
28:26
Speaker 2: of ways that they want to be versus the way
28:27
Speaker 2: they're showing up and how do they kind of get there.
28:31
Speaker 2: Love it.
28:31
Speaker 1: All right, Seema, how do people learn more about you?
28:34
Speaker 1: What's the best way?
28:36
Speaker 2: Yeah, they can go to my website, which is holistictraumatherapy.com.
28:40
Speaker 2: And there's a contact page there. They can reach out
28:43
Speaker 2: and that's the best way to reach me.
28:46
Speaker 1: We'll have all that linked up here at the show
28:47
Speaker 1: notes page at the traumatherapistpodcast.com. Seema, awesome. I mean, so inspiring.
28:55
Speaker 1: And I think what you're doing sheds, what you've shared
29:01
Speaker 1: with us here sheds light on an issue. I don't
29:04
Speaker 1: know if I was so much aware of this correlation,
29:08
Speaker 1: association between what the upper echelons of the corporate world
29:14
Speaker 1: and trauma are. and how they're so kind of enmeshed
29:20
Speaker 1: in a sense, necessarily so, but fascinating. Really appreciate you
29:25
Speaker 1: being here.
29:26
Speaker 2: Thank you for having me.
29:27
Speaker 1: All right. We'll be in touch. All right.