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Trump's Bizarre Town Hall DJ Set · Pod Save America

0:20
Speaker 1: Welcome to Pod Save America. I'm Tommy Vitor.
0:22
Speaker 2: And I'm Rebecca Katz.
0:23
Speaker 1: Rebecca, it's great to see you. My old friend and
0:27
Speaker 1: the brilliant democratic strategist behind many Huge Democratic wins over
0:31
Speaker 1: the last few years. It's great to see you.
0:33
Speaker 2: Great to be here.
0:35
Speaker 1: So for the listeners, Rebecca and I go way back.
0:39
Speaker 1: We worked together on John Edwards for President 2004. The
0:42
Speaker 1: good campaign, right?
0:44
Speaker 2: That's how I got it.
0:46
Speaker 3: We were very hopeful.
0:46
Speaker 1: It was the good campaign.
0:47
Speaker 2: We were very hopeful. It was a fun time. It
0:50
Speaker 2: really was.
0:50
Speaker 1: It was a very fun time. It was a great team.
0:52
Speaker 1: We were like the little engine that could campaign that
0:54
Speaker 1: took this totally unknown and arguably unqualified senator... From, you know,
1:01
Speaker 1: Senator to the VP nominee. And I don't know, the
1:05
Speaker 1: To America's message from that campaign, people should be studying
1:08
Speaker 1: and stealing that because it was very good. You even
1:11
Speaker 1: saw John Edwards at the DNC, right?
1:13
Speaker 2: Yes, John Edwards was at the DNC. You know, they
1:15
Speaker 2: invite all the former nominees and he had been a
1:18
Speaker 2: VP nominee in 2004. So he came back as a
1:22
Speaker 2: guest and he just had a happy hour for former
1:25
Speaker 2: staffers just to say hi.
1:27
Speaker 1: That's very nice.
1:28
Speaker 3: Yeah.
1:28
Speaker 1: I like that. Look, obviously, the history is complicated. We
1:32
Speaker 1: don't need to relitigate it here. It is just interesting
1:35
Speaker 1: in like political life who is given sort of absolution
1:38
Speaker 1: for mistakes and failings and who isn't. And I'm surprised
1:42
Speaker 1: he's sort of still on the isn't list.
1:45
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think I.
1:45
Speaker 2: Think he's due for a rehabilitation tour. I mean, he did.
1:49
Speaker 2: It was he's a he's a flawed man. But I
1:51
Speaker 2: think he was was vilified and kind of served his
1:54
Speaker 2: time in public opinion there.
1:57
Speaker 1: Yeah, he definitely he definitely. was widely criticized. But thank
2:01
Speaker 1: you for doing the show, Rebecca. We have a lot
2:02
Speaker 1: to talk about today. I just want to do like,
2:04
Speaker 1: let's do a little vibe check. How are you feeling?
2:06
Speaker 1: It's a couple weeks out. I'm getting a million texts
2:08
Speaker 1: from people telling me how nervous they are. How are you?
2:11
Speaker 2: I am cautiously optimistic. I will say October always feels
2:15
Speaker 2: terrible for Democrats. And we just have to remember that, right? August,
2:18
Speaker 2: we feel great. We feel like we're going to win everything.
2:21
Speaker 2: It's going to be amazing. And then October hits and like,
2:24
Speaker 2: We all just kind of feel nauseous and this like
2:27
Speaker 2: heavy weight we're carrying the whole month of just this dread.
2:31
Speaker 2: And I will say just like, you know, obviously we
2:34
Speaker 2: have every reason to be worried, but we shouldn't let
2:38
Speaker 2: it be paralyzing fear.
2:41
Speaker 1: That's right. Yeah, it's the stakes couldn't be higher. Let's
2:44
Speaker 1: just be honest about that. It's super close. I know
2:47
Speaker 1: some people kind of in the political world that are
2:50
Speaker 1: looking at polling and that are increasingly nervous. You're hearing
2:54
Speaker 1: people talk about concern that Trump is outspending Kamala Harris
2:58
Speaker 1: in some TV markets. She was slightly out of the news,
3:02
Speaker 1: I think, for a couple of weeks because of the hurricanes.
3:04
Speaker 1: And obviously, like the messaging and response about FEMA is
3:09
Speaker 1: going to come from the White House. But I think
3:11
Speaker 1: like since then, she's been hitting the gas. She's doing
3:13
Speaker 1: all these interviews and town halls and events that we'll
3:15
Speaker 1: talk about. But it's tied and it will be tied
3:18
Speaker 1: until Election Day. And I just think For all the
3:21
Speaker 1: nervous texters, just remember, you have agency. It's October 16th.
3:27
Speaker 1: If you want to donate, if you want to knock doors,
3:29
Speaker 1: if you want to go to votesaveamerica.com to find opportunities,
3:33
Speaker 1: you have time. But do not refresh the 538 polling
3:38
Speaker 1: average every day from now until election day.
3:40
Speaker 2: That's no good for any of it. And there's a
3:42
Speaker 2: burden here. For the third time, In the last eight years,
3:45
Speaker 2: this is the most important election of our lifetime, right?
3:49
Speaker 2: That is exhausting. Like we have real fatigue. It's tiring,
3:53
Speaker 2: but there's still a lot we can do. And we
3:56
Speaker 2: shouldn't feel like we're just sitting there just biting our fingernails.
4:00
Speaker 2: Like go do something.
4:01
Speaker 1: Yeah. Go do something. Do not tweet that you think
4:04
Speaker 1: she's going to lose. You can quote tweet yourself in
4:06
Speaker 1: November because if you do that, I will hate you forever.
4:09
Speaker 4: Okay.
4:10
Speaker 1: On today's show, we have- What do we got? Kamala
4:12
Speaker 1: Harris- Trying to reach black voters in a tough town
4:15
Speaker 1: hall style interview with Charlamagne the God in Detroit. Donald
4:18
Speaker 1: Trump goes after women voters in a Fox News town
4:22
Speaker 1: hall with this all-female audience. This was not a tough interview.
4:26
Speaker 1: This was a bunch of softballs. I suspect he'd get
4:28
Speaker 1: harder questions from his family and own staff. We'll also
4:31
Speaker 1: talk about the state of the race in key states
4:33
Speaker 1: like Pennsylvania and Arizona. We'll talk about how some things
4:38
Speaker 1: are going in these red and purple house races. and
4:42
Speaker 1: why they are defying the trend lines that we're seeing nationally.
4:46
Speaker 1: But first, and Rebecca, this is not breaking news, but
4:49
Speaker 1: we on this show have not yet had the chance
4:51
Speaker 1: to talk about Trump's bizarre Monday night event in Oaks, Pennsylvania,
4:56
Speaker 1: this Philly suburb.
4:57
Speaker 5: Yes.
4:57
Speaker 1: Where we were treated to, I don't know, maybe the
5:00
Speaker 1: most bizarre Trump event of an already weird cycle. It
5:04
Speaker 1: was intended to.
5:05
Speaker 2: Be- And think about that bar for a second.
5:07
Speaker 1: Yeah, that bar is here.
5:09
Speaker 2: How do we get here?
5:10
Speaker 1: That bar is over our head.
5:11
Speaker 5: Yes.
5:11
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's like, so I think it was supposed to
5:14
Speaker 1: just be a town hall, Q & A format, taking
5:16
Speaker 1: questions to the audience. But then someone in the crowd
5:18
Speaker 1: needed medical attention. The crowd starts chanting or singing God
5:21
Speaker 1: Bless America. And Trump basically called in his DJ to
5:25
Speaker 1: play Ave Maria. Then someone else needed medical attention. Things
5:28
Speaker 1: took a turn. Here's a clip.
5:30
Speaker 5: Let's not do any more questions. Let's just listen to music.
5:33
Speaker 1: Let's make it into a music. Who the hell wants
5:37
Speaker 1: to hear questions, right?
5:39
Speaker 5: I want this to be a really important evening. And
5:42
Speaker 5: those two people that went down are patriots, and we
5:45
Speaker 5: love them. And because of them, we ended up with
5:47
Speaker 5: some good.
5:48
Speaker 3: Music, right?
5:49
Speaker 5: Right?
5:50
Speaker 1: So play YMCA.
5:52
Speaker 3: Go ahead. Let's go. Nice and loud.
5:54
Speaker 6: Here we go, everybody.
5:56
Speaker 3: Nobody's leaving. What's going on? There's nobody leaving. Keep going.
6:02
Speaker 1: Keep going. Should we keep going? All right, turn that
6:08
Speaker 1: music up. Turn it up. So this goes on for
6:11
Speaker 1: like 40 minutes, literally. 40 minutes is a long time.
6:15
Speaker 2: It's a very long time.
6:17
Speaker 1: To be standing. Yes. Standing there, doing nothing, swaying on
6:21
Speaker 1: the stage awkwardly. Let me read you the set list
6:24
Speaker 1: real quick. Ave Maria, Time to Say Goodbye, It's a
6:26
Speaker 1: Man's Man's Man's World, YMCA, Hallelujah, Nothing Compares to You,
6:30
Speaker 1: An American Trilogy, Richmond, North of Richmond, November Rain, in
6:34
Speaker 1: memory from cats. People started walking out. South Dakota governor
6:38
Speaker 1: and puppy killer, Kristi Noem, kind of didn't seem to
6:42
Speaker 1: know what to do. I don't know, Rebecca, what track
6:44
Speaker 1: got you going? What got you amped?
6:46
Speaker 3: What I will just say.
6:46
Speaker 2: Is like Ava Maria to YMCA, like that's kind of
6:50
Speaker 2: the wild swings that are going on in his brain
6:53
Speaker 2: right now. Like what kind of psychopath has this set list?
6:57
Speaker 2: Like it doesn't even make sense. And I just, I
7:01
Speaker 2: don't know. I felt like it was.
7:05
Speaker 2: For reporters to comment that a Trump rally is strange,
7:08
Speaker 2: you have to take it so far, right? And for
7:11
Speaker 2: him to, you know, a town hall, when you do
7:13
Speaker 2: a town hall event, you want to take questions like,
7:16
Speaker 2: what are people thinking? You know, here he is in
7:18
Speaker 2: suburban Philadelphia, the most, probably the most important media market
7:23
Speaker 2: he can be in all of the swing states. And
7:26
Speaker 2: he is losing his mind a little bit, right? And
7:30
Speaker 2: he is smiling and he doesn't usually smile so like
7:34
Speaker 2: that that caused me some like is what what is
7:38
Speaker 2: his new like regimen like I'll have what he's having
7:41
Speaker 2: you know what I mean because he was just like
7:43
Speaker 2: happy and then he was doing his like little dance
7:46
Speaker 2: and there's Kristi Noem just kind of standing there not
7:50
Speaker 2: really knowing what to do and she has to be
7:53
Speaker 2: the sane person right it was.
7:56
Speaker 1: Kind of wild Yeah, I mean, you and I have
7:58
Speaker 1: been staffers for a long time. We've both been at
8:01
Speaker 1: events where you are kind of like on your phone,
8:04
Speaker 1: half paying attention. Then you hear your boss give a
8:06
Speaker 1: bad answer and you're like, oh God, oh God, what
8:08
Speaker 1: are we going to do? Or like something kind of
8:10
Speaker 1: goes south in an event. Someone protests, something bad happens.
8:14
Speaker 1: Imagine being the staffer in the back and it's like
8:16
Speaker 1: minute 23 and you're like, how do we get the
8:18
Speaker 1: boss to stop DJing this event?
8:21
Speaker 2: Well, I heard that they were like trying to tell
8:23
Speaker 2: him on the teleprompter, like you can now answer questions.
8:25
Speaker 2: You can now, and he just wasn't, taking those cues.
8:29
Speaker 2: He was just like wanting to dance. And there's nobody
8:33
Speaker 2: who can save him when he's going out that far. And,
8:37
Speaker 2: you know, we say a lot that Trump doesn't get
8:39
Speaker 2: real scrutiny. Like he says crazy stuff and he doesn't
8:42
Speaker 2: do it. This was the first time that I think
8:44
Speaker 2: reporters really took the beat to say like something seems wrong.
8:50
Speaker 2: And I just, I'm just going to say it, you know,
8:53
Speaker 2: when you get old, you get old fast, right? And
8:56
Speaker 2: I do think he is much worse in this month
9:00
Speaker 2: of October than he was even a few months ago.
9:02
Speaker 2: And we've seen this, you know, like I remember we
9:05
Speaker 2: all saw the State of the Union with Biden in January.
9:07
Speaker 2: We're like, we're going to be great. And then the
9:08
Speaker 2: debate happened. We're like, OK, maybe we're not so great.
9:11
Speaker 2: Like there is something that is going on with Trump
9:15
Speaker 2: that seems pretty bad.
9:17
Speaker 1: Yeah. Let's let's dig in on this a bit, because
9:20
Speaker 1: even before the musical interlude, Trump did some Q & A,
9:23
Speaker 1: and even those were weird. So Philip Bump at The
9:26
Speaker 1: Washington Post printed in full one of Trump's answers to
9:29
Speaker 1: a very straightforward audience question about bringing down grocery prices.
9:32
Speaker 1: I'm going to read the beginning of it. So, you know,
9:34
Speaker 1: it's such a great question in the sense that people
9:36
Speaker 1: don't think of grocery. You know, it sounds like not
9:38
Speaker 1: much an important word when you talk about homes and
9:40
Speaker 1: everything else, right? But more people tell me about grocery
9:43
Speaker 1: bills where the price of bacon, the price of lettuce,
9:44
Speaker 1: the price of tomatoes, they tell me. And we're going
9:47
Speaker 1: to do with a lot of things. You know, our
9:48
Speaker 1: farmers aren't being treated properly. And we had a deal
9:50
Speaker 1: with China and it was a great deal. I never
9:52
Speaker 1: mentioned it because once COVID came, I said that was
9:55
Speaker 1: a bridge too far because I had a great relationship
9:57
Speaker 1: with President Xi. And here's a fierce man and he's
9:59
Speaker 1: a man. that likes China and I understand that, but
10:01
Speaker 1: we had a deal and he was perfect on that deal.
10:03
Speaker 1: 50 billion he was going to buy. We were doing
10:05
Speaker 1: numbers like you wouldn't believe for the farmer. That goes
10:08
Speaker 1: on for another 800 words, Rebecca. They mentioned the border control.
10:12
Speaker 7: Okay, grandpa.
10:16
Speaker 1: This reminds me of when I was a kid when
10:19
Speaker 1: one of my grandparents would tell me to go to
10:22
Speaker 1: the bar to get him another drink and my dad
10:24
Speaker 1: would intercept me on the way back and fill it
10:26
Speaker 1: up with water. That's what that reminds me of.
10:29
Speaker 2: Something is very wrong there. There's not one fully cognizant answer.
10:34
Speaker 2: He doesn't He is not speaking in regular English anymore.
10:40
Speaker 2: It is just like it is a whirlwind of like
10:43
Speaker 2: what's going on in his head. This man should not
10:45
Speaker 2: be in charge of anything.
10:46
Speaker 5: Yeah.
10:47
Speaker 1: And clearly this is why Kamala Harris is telling voters
10:49
Speaker 1: to watch Trump's rallies. I think she sincerely means it.
10:51
Speaker 1: It's not just a line. It's also why Kamala Harris
10:53
Speaker 1: is playing videos of Trump at her rallies. Now, I
10:57
Speaker 1: think they played a clip of some of his recent
10:59
Speaker 1: answers to Maria Bartiromo.
11:00
Speaker 2: In Erie.
11:01
Speaker 4: Yeah.
11:01
Speaker 1: I think like the challenge is, you know, Democrats will
11:04
Speaker 1: watch this and be like, this guy's losing his mind.
11:06
Speaker 1: Republicans will just see it through a partisan lens and
11:08
Speaker 1: decide that, you know, it's funny or charming. I guess
11:11
Speaker 1: the question is whether undecideds will ever see this. It's
11:14
Speaker 1: hard to sum it up in like a concise way. Like,
11:16
Speaker 1: how do you make this? We struggle to make a
11:18
Speaker 1: super cut of a 38 minute event. But but I mean, Rebecca,
11:22
Speaker 1: do you think this is a message that the Harris
11:24
Speaker 1: folks can or should try to introduce kind of in
11:27
Speaker 1: these closing weeks? Is this part of a closing argument?
11:30
Speaker 3: I mean, I do.
11:31
Speaker 2: At the end of the day, people need to know
11:33
Speaker 2: that the person in charge of this country is fighting
11:37
Speaker 2: for them and has their best interests and at the
11:39
Speaker 2: very least understands what is going on in the world.
11:43
Speaker 2: And he seems very far away from reality at the moment.
11:47
Speaker 2: And I think it's important for them to remind people
11:50
Speaker 2: that she has a plan. She can articulate the plan.
11:53
Speaker 2: She understands the plan. She's knowledgeable. He can't articulate an
11:58
Speaker 2: answer to anything. When's the last time he just had
12:00
Speaker 2: like a regular answer to a question?
12:02
Speaker 1: Yeah, and he's actually branded his incoherence to the weave
12:06
Speaker 1: and he thinks it's an asset. He's like, oh, I
12:07
Speaker 1: say all this random shit and I string it together
12:09
Speaker 1: at the end. It's like, no, you don't, pal. You just,
12:11
Speaker 1: that's called rambling. He also did a Q & A
12:13
Speaker 1: on Tuesday, though, at the Economic Club of Chicago where
12:16
Speaker 1: he got, you know, an hour's worth of economic questions.
12:19
Speaker 1: Here was one about Google and antitrust. Here's the answer.
12:23
Speaker 6: Should Google be breaking up?
12:26
Speaker 5: I just haven't gotten over Something the Justice Department did
12:30
Speaker 5: yesterday where Virginia cleaned up its voter rolls and got
12:37
Speaker 5: rid of thousands and thousands of bad votes. And the
12:41
Speaker 5: Justice Department sued them that they should be allowed to
12:44
Speaker 5: put those bad votes and illegal votes back in and
12:47
Speaker 5: let the people vote. So I haven't gotten over that.
12:52
Speaker 5: A lot of people have seen that. They can't even
12:54
Speaker 5: believe it.
12:54
Speaker 1: The question is about Google, President Trump.
12:56
Speaker 5: Yeah.
12:57
Speaker 1: I love that. The question was about Google.
12:59
Speaker 2: The question was about Google. I mean, he can't answer
13:03
Speaker 2: a question to the extent that you're wondering, like, is
13:05
Speaker 2: he processing what is being asked of him? Like, is
13:09
Speaker 2: his brain processing it?
13:11
Speaker 5: Yeah.
13:11
Speaker 2: Or, like, does he not know what Google is? Like,
13:13
Speaker 2: which one is it? You know, I have no idea.
13:17
Speaker 2: He knows what Twitter is, you know.
13:19
Speaker 1: Yeah, he loves Twitter. He loves Elon. The other sort
13:22
Speaker 1: of piece of evidence here, Rebecca, is like Trump had
13:24
Speaker 1: an interview scheduled, I guess, on CNBC with this guy,
13:26
Speaker 1: Joe Kernan, who might as well be a Trump surrogate
13:29
Speaker 1: or family member. He's like that kind of in the
13:30
Speaker 1: tank and insufferable. And that was a weird flag. But
13:33
Speaker 1: then I watched this whole event and it was with
13:36
Speaker 1: this guy, John Micklethwaite, the editor-in-chief of Bloomberg, who was
13:39
Speaker 1: formerly the editor of The Economist. And it was a tough,
13:43
Speaker 1: contentious interview. And I actually thought that format kind of
13:47
Speaker 1: served Trump well. Because that answer we just heard was incoherent,
13:51
Speaker 1: but they had stacked the audience with supporters and Micklethwaite
13:54
Speaker 1: kind of interrupted enough to prevent the weave from happening
13:57
Speaker 1: and preventing him from getting too incoherent. And also, look,
14:00
Speaker 1: if we're being honest, John Micklethwaite was kind of the
14:03
Speaker 1: perfect foil for Trump because I bet a lot of
14:06
Speaker 1: the clips that Trump people will put out are of
14:08
Speaker 1: him berating this kind of pompous seeming British guy about
14:13
Speaker 1: why he was wrong about tariffs. And boy, you know,
14:17
Speaker 1: I bet that plays well in like, Pittsburgh. I don't know.
14:20
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, I just think he's picking a lot
14:24
Speaker 2: of fights. His reliance on the word tariffs in that
14:27
Speaker 2: interview seemed a little bit troubling as well. It's like
14:32
Speaker 2: he just learned the word or something. It was just
14:34
Speaker 2: a weird way that he was talking. I think he
14:37
Speaker 2: likes to fight with everyone who's interviewing him now. And
14:40
Speaker 2: I think he likes to have the crowd cheering him on.
14:43
Speaker 2: It's like wherever he goes, he just has a crowd
14:45
Speaker 2: that is cheering for him because that is what he likes.
14:49
Speaker 1: Yeah, he loves it.
14:49
Speaker 5: I don't know.
14:50
Speaker 2: I mean, I think it's interesting that he's not doing
14:53
Speaker 2: more interviews. He doesn't seem to be talking beyond just
14:57
Speaker 2: a very specific base.
14:59
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's a Fox News safe space. That said, I
15:01
Speaker 1: do think the headline that came out of the Economic
15:03
Speaker 1: Club interview was him once again ducking questions about the
15:06
Speaker 1: peaceful transition of power, which ain't good. And he refused
15:10
Speaker 1: to comment on whether he talked to Putin since he
15:11
Speaker 1: left office. So I don't think that's helpful either. That said,
15:14
Speaker 1: you know, this morning, Trump just taped a Fox News
15:17
Speaker 1: town hall. I think they taped it yesterday, but it
15:19
Speaker 1: aired this morning on women's issues moderated by Harris Faulkner,
15:24
Speaker 1: a Fox anchor. Let's play a couple of clips. The
15:27
Speaker 1: first is Trump and Harris Faulkner talking about a Georgia
15:31
Speaker 1: woman named Amber Thurman.
15:33
Speaker 6: Amber Thurman's family have come out on a press call
15:37
Speaker 6: and they're doing what's called a prebuttal to our town
15:40
Speaker 6: hall right now.
15:40
Speaker 5: Oh, that's nice.
15:41
Speaker 4: Yeah.
15:42
Speaker 5: And I want to get better ratings, I promise.
15:46
Speaker 1: So just some context for the listeners here. Amber Thurman
15:48
Speaker 1: is a Georgia woman who died after being denied an
15:51
Speaker 1: emergency abortion for 20 hours. Some members of her family
15:56
Speaker 1: did a call with the Harris campaign to talk about
15:58
Speaker 1: her story and the stakes for women in terms of
16:01
Speaker 1: abortion access in this election. Rebecca, that answer we heard
16:05
Speaker 1: is them laughing. I mean, it's so callous.
16:07
Speaker 2: I mean, this is a woman who died. It's who,
16:11
Speaker 2: who literally like bled out and they're laughing about it
16:14
Speaker 2: and talking about ratings. Like he, first of all, let
16:17
Speaker 2: me just take a step back. He said he's had
16:19
Speaker 2: this women's forum, right? He spent, how long was it?
16:23
Speaker 2: 50 minutes of this, of the 60 to get to
16:26
Speaker 2: the question of abortion, right? Like that is not a
16:29
Speaker 2: woman's forum. This is, he was, had women in the
16:32
Speaker 2: audience and he was talking to the same people he
16:33
Speaker 2: always talks to on Fox News. Let's just get that
16:35
Speaker 2: out of the way. But the way that he sees
16:37
Speaker 2: everything is about ratings and laughing about women dying. Like
16:41
Speaker 2: this is, this is why he's losing women voters at
16:44
Speaker 2: such record numbers. And like another thing, like he's, for
16:49
Speaker 2: him to say he's going to do this women's forum,
16:51
Speaker 2: it's like he would do anything rather than debate Kamala Harris, right? Like,
16:56
Speaker 2: He is so afraid of her about the way that
16:58
Speaker 2: she destroyed him at the last debate, that he is
17:00
Speaker 2: avoiding that. He's trying to show that he's talking to
17:02
Speaker 2: all these people. But he's talking to the same people.
17:06
Speaker 2: You go to Trump rallies, they look very similar from.
17:09
Speaker 7: State to state.
17:09
Speaker 2: You go to a Harris rally, whether she's in Bucks County,
17:13
Speaker 2: Pennsylvania or Erie, Pennsylvania, very different audiences. She's in Georgia.
17:19
Speaker 2: Everywhere she goes, her audience is different. Trump is speaking
17:23
Speaker 2: to a lot of the same people and he has
17:25
Speaker 2: not expanded his base.
17:26
Speaker 1: Yeah, this is just kind of like branding that it
17:28
Speaker 1: was a women's rally. It didn't seem like it actually
17:30
Speaker 1: focused on the issues, as you noted.
17:32
Speaker 2: They just had women there.
17:33
Speaker 1: Yeah, just the sort of who that asked very friendly questions.
17:37
Speaker 1: One of the more bizarre claims of this event was
17:40
Speaker 1: about IVF. Let's listen to that.
17:42
Speaker 6: Let's get this question because I believe that's what this
17:44
Speaker 6: is about.
17:45
Speaker 5: Oh, I want to talk about IVF.
17:46
Speaker 7: Yeah.
17:48
Speaker 6: I'm the father.
17:51
Speaker 5: Of IVF, so I want to hear this question.
17:53
Speaker 1: Again, for context, IVF became available in 1978. It's been
17:59
Speaker 1: widely available for decades. The biggest impediment to getting IVF
18:02
Speaker 1: has been the cost of IVF. It's very expensive. But
18:05
Speaker 1: the next biggest threat to IVF has been the overturning
18:09
Speaker 1: of Roe v. Wade by Trump judges in It was
18:12
Speaker 1: highlighted when Alabama moved to ban IVF. Republicans freaked out
18:17
Speaker 1: in that moment. They've tried to cover their political flank
18:19
Speaker 1: on this issue. Trump has proposed giving out free IVF
18:23
Speaker 1: treatments to everybody in America. But when Democrats try to
18:26
Speaker 1: pass bills guaranteeing access to IVF nationwide, Republicans block it
18:31
Speaker 1: over and over and over again in Congress. Rebecca, the
18:34
Speaker 1: Democrats were very focused on IVF for a while. That
18:37
Speaker 1: focus seems to have faded a bit. How much do
18:40
Speaker 1: you think that should be a part of the abortion
18:42
Speaker 1: messaging in this closing stretch?
18:45
Speaker 2: OK, let me just take a step back. I am
18:47
Speaker 2: not convinced that Trump knows what IVF is. I just
18:50
Speaker 2: want to be really clear. Like you listen to him
18:52
Speaker 2: talk about IVF and I do not think he knows
18:55
Speaker 2: what it is.
18:56
Speaker 1: OK, so there's that.
18:59
Speaker 2: And, you know, in Arizona, we had Kerry Lake, who
19:02
Speaker 2: spent a good part of the debate talking about UVF.
19:05
Speaker 2: You know, so it's very hard to say what Republicans
19:07
Speaker 2: are understanding with Republican political leaders and IVF. I will
19:13
Speaker 2: say that Democrats, like, they have talked about it and
19:15
Speaker 2: they will fight for it and, like, they will protect
19:18
Speaker 2: women's ability to have families or anybody to have families.
19:22
Speaker 2: You know what I mean? It's just, it is so
19:25
Speaker 2: strange to me that the Trump Supreme Court, like, where he,
19:31
Speaker 2: one third of that court is, those are his judges.
19:35
Speaker 2: that they are going farther and farther, and he's trying
19:37
Speaker 2: to distance himself from the same judges he put on there.
19:40
Speaker 2: You know, whether it's talking about abortion going to the states,
19:42
Speaker 2: we don't want abortion to go to the states. We
19:43
Speaker 2: wanted Roe. His judges overturned it, right? And that's something
19:47
Speaker 2: like the intensity of women voters right now, I think
19:50
Speaker 2: it's because they understand what's at stake.
19:54
Speaker 5: Yeah.
19:55
Speaker 1: And to your point, I think in that interview, he
19:56
Speaker 1: says he basically learned about IVF or the crisis in
20:00
Speaker 1: IVF because he got a call from Katie Britt, Senator
20:03
Speaker 1: in Alabama, who gave that bizarre State of the Union
20:06
Speaker 1: response that we all remember. In his comments about Katie Bird,
20:09
Speaker 1: I think he called her attractive. It was like very,
20:11
Speaker 1: the whole thing was just very weird and gross and
20:13
Speaker 1: very Trump.
20:14
Speaker 2: It's like he knew the initials, but he didn't actually
20:16
Speaker 2: know what happened.
20:17
Speaker 1: Right, right. He knows he's mad about it.
20:20
Speaker 2: And he knows he's losing voters on that issue.
20:23
Speaker 1: Yeah, so like, oh, it's free for everybody now.
20:25
Speaker 5: Okay.
20:26
Speaker 1: Of course, though, you know, no.
20:28
Speaker 2: You get IVF and you get IVF.
20:29
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's like Oprah in the car. All right. We're
20:31
Speaker 1: going to take a quick break. When we come back,
20:33
Speaker 1: we are going to talk about how things are shaping
20:35
Speaker 1: up in some of the key states that Rebecca knows
20:37
Speaker 1: incredibly well. But a couple of things before we do that. First,
20:40
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21:59
Speaker 1: No women's town hall will be complete without a little
22:01
Speaker 1: light fascism. Here is Trump once again talking about his enemies.
22:06
Speaker 6: President, Kamala Harris has said you sounded unhinged and unchecked
22:10
Speaker 6: power is in our future. What do you say about that?
22:13
Speaker 5: I thought it was a nice presentation. I wasn't unhinged.
22:18
Speaker 3: You know what they are?
22:19
Speaker 5: They're a party of soundbites. Somebody asked me, Can they
22:24
Speaker 5: be brought together? You know, I never thought, really, I
22:27
Speaker 5: wasn't thinking like they could. Because they are very different.
22:33
Speaker 5: And it is the enemy from within. And they're very dangerous.
22:36
Speaker 5: They're Marxists and communists and fascists. And they're sick. I
22:40
Speaker 5: use a guy like Adam Schiff because they made up
22:42
Speaker 5: the Russia, Russia, Russia hoax. It took two years to
22:45
Speaker 5: solve the problem. Absolutely nothing was done wrong, et cetera,
22:49
Speaker 5: et cetera. They're dangerous for our country.
22:52
Speaker 1: So, Rebecca, we talked about Trump's kind of heightened accelerationist
22:56
Speaker 1: rhetoric on the show on Tuesday. I do think it's
22:58
Speaker 1: worth being even more clear today that talking about the
23:02
Speaker 1: enemy within is textbook fascist rhetoric. This is stuff you
23:07
Speaker 1: heard from Hitler talking about Jews and communists, et cetera.
23:10
Speaker 1: Heard it from Mussolini, heard it from Franco. But the
23:13
Speaker 1: question I always have is when you make that point
23:17
Speaker 1: or tell that to people, does it sound so extreme?
23:21
Speaker 1: that people think you're hyperbolic and tune you out? What
23:24
Speaker 1: do you think you do with a clip like that?
23:27
Speaker 2: I mean, obviously it's chilling to hear him talk like that.
23:31
Speaker 2: But I do think that the messaging argument against him
23:36
Speaker 2: on this has been challenging, right? People think he's a clown.
23:40
Speaker 2: They think he's funny. They don't see how scary he is.
23:43
Speaker 2: And the more that other people start saying, know your history,
23:47
Speaker 2: like learn these dog whistles, it's it's not resonating. It's like,
23:51
Speaker 2: we're all talking to ourselves and, and a whole other
23:55
Speaker 2: segment of the population just does not believe it, even
23:58
Speaker 2: if it's right there and true. And it's, it's sad,
24:01
Speaker 2: but I, I don't, I don't, I don't think it's
24:04
Speaker 2: registering with a lot of folks.
24:06
Speaker 5: Yeah.
24:06
Speaker 1: I really, I don't either. And it's not just this clip.
24:09
Speaker 1: It's not just this commentary about the enemy within. It's
24:12
Speaker 1: not just like the obvious rage at the various court
24:16
Speaker 1: cases against him or his, suggestions that Democrats were behind
24:20
Speaker 1: the assassination attempts. Like if you watch his truth social feed,
24:23
Speaker 1: I mean, the other day he posted something in the
24:25
Speaker 1: middle of the night where he said that Kamala Harris's
24:29
Speaker 1: medical report about seasonal allergies were a dangerous situation. You know,
24:33
Speaker 1: he's talking about revoking CBS's broadcast rights because he's mad
24:36
Speaker 1: at 60 Minutes for editing a clip. And his supporters
24:40
Speaker 1: are now like this. This is the other thing that
24:42
Speaker 1: happens in October is It's the nastiest part of every campaign.
24:46
Speaker 1: I mean, there's a nonprofit now called Building America's Future,
24:49
Speaker 1: funded in part by Elon Musk, that is funding a
24:51
Speaker 1: bunch of super PACs doing dirty shit. One of them
24:54
Speaker 1: is sending mailers highlighting Kamala Harris's marriage to Doug Emhoff,
24:58
Speaker 1: who is Jewish, his work combating anti-Semitism, his support for Israel.
25:02
Speaker 1: And they're sending that to Muslim and Arab American voters,
25:05
Speaker 1: trying to drive them away from her. The same super back,
25:08
Speaker 1: I believe, is sending pro-Israel and Jewish voters mailers saying
25:11
Speaker 1: she's too pro-Palestinian. So this is just like the most cynical,
25:16
Speaker 1: dishonest and nasty part of the whole thing.
25:19
Speaker 2: They're trying to win by making everyone hate each other.
25:22
Speaker 2: That is their recipe, right? Like Harris is out there
25:26
Speaker 2: talking about what brings us together and, you know, bringing
25:28
Speaker 2: back hope and joy. And there is no hope and
25:34
Speaker 2: joy on the Trump campaign. Like they want you to
25:36
Speaker 2: hate everyone. They want you to be so pissed off
25:39
Speaker 2: at the whole world. And they want you to hate
25:41
Speaker 2: everyone who doesn't look like you.
25:43
Speaker 5: Yeah.
25:44
Speaker 1: And it's all being funded by some of the richest
25:45
Speaker 1: people in the world. I think Politico had some data
25:48
Speaker 1: from the most recent FEC filing. So I just thought
25:51
Speaker 1: it was worth noting in terms of like the biggest
25:53
Speaker 1: donors out there. So you got Elon Musk giving $ 75
25:56
Speaker 1: million to a pro-Trump super PAC. Miriam Adelson, Sheldon Adelson's widow,
26:01
Speaker 1: gave $ 95 million to another super PAC. Dick Uline, another
26:06
Speaker 1: billionaire you've probably never heard of, gave $ 49 million. Ken Griffin,
26:09
Speaker 1: Paul Singer, doing eight figures. Timothy Mellon gave $ 165 million
26:14
Speaker 1: to various GOP-aligned groups earlier in the cycle. And so
26:19
Speaker 1: what you're seeing now is the fruits of this billionaire courtship,
26:23
Speaker 1: them dumping money into super PACs and doing Trump's dirty
26:26
Speaker 1: work for him across the country.
26:28
Speaker 2: And trying to tell regular people that they get their problems.
26:31
Speaker 5: Right.
26:31
Speaker 6: Right.
26:31
Speaker 5: Like that.
26:32
Speaker 2: Like we understand you. Like, I mean, it's it's really
26:36
Speaker 2: it's a really messed up system. Like Post Citizens United.
26:39
Speaker 2: All of this is a disaster.
26:41
Speaker 5: Yes.
26:41
Speaker 2: This should never this should not be.
26:43
Speaker 3: Allowed to be happening.
26:44
Speaker 5: No.
26:44
Speaker 1: Thank you, Supreme Court. Finally, on this Trump rally. I mean,
26:47
Speaker 1: there was a lot of talk about immigration. I would
26:49
Speaker 1: say it was the primary thing discussed. Here's one example.
26:52
Speaker 5: We are going to end all sanctuary cities immediately. We're
26:56
Speaker 5: going to end them.
26:57
Speaker 3: Because they're really.
26:58
Speaker 6: Is that an executive order you do that with? They're really.
27:03
Speaker 5: I can do it with an executive order. I have
27:05
Speaker 5: to do it with an executive order. You can do
27:07
Speaker 5: it with the Aliens Act of 1798. We can do
27:11
Speaker 5: things in terms of moving people out. We can move
27:14
Speaker 5: them out of the sanctuary cities.
27:16
Speaker 1: So again, just to explain what he's talking about there,
27:18
Speaker 1: because it's never clear. Trump is saying he can use
27:21
Speaker 1: a law passed in the 1700s when John Adams was president,
27:24
Speaker 1: a law that was later used to authorize Japanese internment
27:28
Speaker 1: to authorize sending U.S. troops into cities that he doesn't
27:31
Speaker 1: think are sufficiently cooperating with ICE or other federal immigration authorities.
27:36
Speaker 1: So I guess like to paint a picture of what
27:37
Speaker 1: that looks like, I guess we're sending troops into San
27:41
Speaker 1: Francisco or New York and Chicago to like ferret out
27:46
Speaker 1: people he thinks are undocumented. I mean, like, again, this
27:49
Speaker 1: is like crazy fascist behavior, but helping people understand what
27:53
Speaker 1: that really looks like in practice seems very difficult.
27:55
Speaker 3: Yeah.
27:56
Speaker 2: I mean, it's like when they tell you who they are,
27:58
Speaker 2: believe them. And he's been, he's been telling voters who
28:01
Speaker 2: he is for a very long time. And it's pretty,
28:03
Speaker 2: it's pretty fucking scary.
28:04
Speaker 4: Yeah.
28:05
Speaker 1: So Rebecca, you're a political professional. You're always trying to
28:08
Speaker 1: figure out how we reach these voters. How do you
28:10
Speaker 1: think like this Fox event compares to the Caller Daddy
28:13
Speaker 1: interview or other, you know, kind of more niche opportunities
28:17
Speaker 1: we've seen the Harris campaign take?
28:19
Speaker 3: So I think that.
28:20
Speaker 2: Harris campaign has done a lot of like, I would say,
28:23
Speaker 2: high risk interviews. And I think for the most part,
28:26
Speaker 2: they've gone extremely well. And they've they've right now that
28:30
Speaker 2: the the election is so tight, you have to go
28:32
Speaker 2: find more voters.
28:34
Speaker 4: Right.
28:34
Speaker 2: Like, where can we reach more voters? So they're going
28:36
Speaker 2: out to all these different outlets and they're, you know,
28:38
Speaker 2: trying to figure out, like, find voters where they are.
28:41
Speaker 2: I found the call her daddy interview to be one
28:44
Speaker 2: of the better conversations I've ever heard from any public
28:47
Speaker 2: official ever. especially the part where they are talking about
28:51
Speaker 2: what it means when you say life of the mother, like,
28:54
Speaker 2: and Harris going into detail about like, you have to
28:57
Speaker 2: bleed out this much and be near dead for anyone
29:01
Speaker 2: to help you. That is called life of the mother.
29:03
Speaker 2: And I just found that so different from any other,
29:07
Speaker 2: like the way you hear politicians speak. And I think
29:09
Speaker 2: to the young women who were listening, I think it resonated.
29:12
Speaker 2: I think, and then she goes on Howard Stern and
29:14
Speaker 2: she talks about, you know, formula one race. Like she's,
29:18
Speaker 2: Let her do these longer form interviews where she's letting
29:22
Speaker 2: her personality come out. She's authentic. She's smart. She can, like,
29:27
Speaker 2: tell you a little bit about herself. I think that's important.
29:30
Speaker 2: It still goes down to, like, who would you rather
29:32
Speaker 2: have a beer with, right? And she seems like she'd
29:35
Speaker 2: be really fun. Just putting that out there.
29:37
Speaker 1: Yeah, I like that. I have a drink with her.
29:39
Speaker 1: I bet she's more of a. wine cocktail person.
29:41
Speaker 2: A little glass of wine?
29:42
Speaker 1: I don't know.
29:42
Speaker 5: We'll find out.
29:43
Speaker 1: We'll find out. So, yeah, let's talk about the Kamala
29:45
Speaker 1: Harris media tour. She's in these swing states. Apparently, she's
29:48
Speaker 1: going to do a Fox News interview with Bret Baier
29:51
Speaker 1: that's going to air after this pod comes out. On Tuesday,
29:55
Speaker 1: she sat for an audio town hall meeting moderated by
29:58
Speaker 1: Charlamagne Tha God. It was anything but a softball interview.
30:02
Speaker 1: Let's listen.
30:03
Speaker 7: Doesn't the Biden administration have to take some blame for
30:05
Speaker 7: the border, though?
30:06
Speaker 3: A lot of the blame?
30:07
Speaker 7: Because, I mean, the first three years, y'all did get
30:08
Speaker 7: a lot of things wrong with the border.
30:10
Speaker 4: Charlemagne, within hours of being inaugurated, first thing we dropped
30:17
Speaker 4: was a bill to fix the broken immigration system.
30:21
Speaker 1: Which, by the way, Trump did not fix when he
30:22
Speaker 1: was president.
30:23
Speaker 4: Why are we sending money to other countries when we
30:27
Speaker 4: desperately need it in our own country for homeless, housing, resources,
30:33
Speaker 4: for whatever? That is my determining factor if I vote
30:38
Speaker 4: for Kamala or not.
30:39
Speaker 1: We can do it all, and we do.
30:41
Speaker 7: Black Americans are heavily asked to vote Democrat in every
30:45
Speaker 7: election for over half a century, with very little in return.
30:49
Speaker 7: What are your plans? to address these very important issues
30:53
Speaker 7: and change that narrative.
30:55
Speaker 1: Thank you, Zeke.
30:56
Speaker 6: I appreciate that. Thank you. And thank you for your work.
30:59
Speaker 1: So Rebecca, I know you listened. I mean, what did you,
31:01
Speaker 1: how'd you think she did?
31:02
Speaker 2: I thought she did really well. I thought there were
31:04
Speaker 2: some hard questions. Like this was not a softball interview.
31:08
Speaker 2: And she answered each question with like thoughtful answers.
31:13
Speaker 1: Sometimes it helps actually to get tough questions sometimes. Because
31:17
Speaker 1: I think it kind of jolts politicians out of complacency.
31:20
Speaker 1: Like the first question is, Why are you always on
31:22
Speaker 1: your talkie points? And her response was kind of like,
31:25
Speaker 1: I don't know, I'm disciplined. I just kind of like
31:26
Speaker 1: thought I was disarmingly honest and effective. And it's true.
31:30
Speaker 2: I mean, she said you have to say a message
31:32
Speaker 2: at least three times for people to like for it
31:34
Speaker 2: to resonate. Like that is true. Being on message is
31:37
Speaker 2: a good thing. Trump is like all over the place.
31:41
Speaker 2: You know, Harris like goes to every audience and she
31:43
Speaker 2: tells them what she wants to do as president. That's
31:45
Speaker 2: what you're supposed to do when you're running for office.
31:48
Speaker 1: Do you think she's getting better at these or are
31:51
Speaker 1: we just hearing more of them and making less of
31:54
Speaker 1: kind of like individual slip ups in one or the other?
31:57
Speaker 2: I mean, I think it is. I think a lot
32:01
Speaker 2: of these interviews are hard. I feel like I feel
32:03
Speaker 2: for the staffers, you know, in prep, like trying to
32:06
Speaker 2: figure out any possible question that could get asked and
32:08
Speaker 2: talking about it. It's a lot. I do think she's
32:12
Speaker 2: like I found her to be generally pretty warm in
32:14
Speaker 2: a lot of these interviews. And I think I think that.
32:17
Speaker 2: resonates with people. She sounded, she was talking about stories
32:21
Speaker 2: of her life. She was giving examples. She was talking
32:24
Speaker 2: about her career. I think it's good to do that.
32:29
Speaker 2: I wouldn't mind her separating herself a little bit more
32:31
Speaker 2: from Joe Biden. But other than that, I think she's
32:34
Speaker 2: been handling herself pretty well.
32:35
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think that was the one kind of Error
32:38
Speaker 1: we've heard recently was not the best answer on how
32:42
Speaker 1: are you different than Joe Biden. And I understand the
32:44
Speaker 1: sensitivity there. It's not easy. I mean, if I got
32:47
Speaker 1: the question, I would I think I would say something like, obviously,
32:52
Speaker 1: me and Joe, there are things we would do different
32:54
Speaker 1: with the benefit of hindsight. But you don't have that
32:56
Speaker 1: as president. I'm not going to, you know, Monday morning quarterback. my,
33:00
Speaker 1: you know, running mate, but here are the things I believe, blah, blah, blah. Like,
33:03
Speaker 1: make a perspective going forward.
33:04
Speaker 5: Right.
33:05
Speaker 2: I would say some of us would like her to
33:06
Speaker 2: separate even more, but she's also, she, you know, she
33:09
Speaker 2: is trying to be respectful, too, of him. And, you know,
33:14
Speaker 2: he appointed her vice president. I don't, it's like, you
33:17
Speaker 2: don't talk out loud about your friends. Like, I think
33:20
Speaker 2: she probably knows a lot of things that he could
33:22
Speaker 2: have done better. And she just, you know, did not
33:26
Speaker 2: go into that.
33:26
Speaker 1: Too much. Yeah. It's a complicated dance that it does
33:29
Speaker 1: for sure. But you know, the other thing about the
33:31
Speaker 1: Charlemagne interview, they did it in Detroit, um, which led
33:34
Speaker 1: them to get a bunch of additional local pickup, which
33:37
Speaker 1: was smart. Uh, the Detroit free press headline was Harris,
33:40
Speaker 1: a kindred spirit with Detroit. She says after interview with Charlemagne,
33:43
Speaker 1: the God, I think she did like another event with, um, yeah,
33:47
Speaker 1: I know. Seriously. Like that's gold, right. In politics, like
33:50
Speaker 1: who cares what the New York times says you want
33:52
Speaker 1: the Detroit free press. Um, I think she did Some
33:55
Speaker 1: more local stops afterwards, she met with black entrepreneurs. So
33:58
Speaker 1: it was just smart. It was all around smart. It
34:01
Speaker 1: was smart to do Charlemagne. It was smart to do
34:03
Speaker 1: it in a swing state. It was smart to bring
34:06
Speaker 1: in a bunch of questioners who asked Michigan-specific questions that
34:10
Speaker 1: sort of made it feel even more authentic to the state.
34:13
Speaker 1: What do you think, though, about Fox News? I have
34:16
Speaker 1: to say, when I heard that she was doing Bret Baier,
34:18
Speaker 1: I guess I get the meta messaging, which is, Trump's
34:22
Speaker 1: in his safe space. I'll go anywhere, talk to anyone.
34:25
Speaker 1: I'm like fearless. But I also think when you, you
34:27
Speaker 1: might as well do an interview with Jason Miller or
34:31
Speaker 1: someone from the RNC, right? Like when the chips are down,
34:33
Speaker 1: Fox News, we can all pretend Brett Baer is like
34:35
Speaker 1: the reasonable one. He takes orders, right? And Fox News
34:39
Speaker 1: wants Trump to win.
34:41
Speaker 2: I would say it's high risk, high reward, right? Like,
34:43
Speaker 2: I don't know if I would have picked that one,
34:46
Speaker 2: but she's, I'm sure that she will be working for that,
34:51
Speaker 2: like thinking about it. And she's taken hard questions from
34:54
Speaker 2: lots of people. I think she can take some hard questions.
34:58
Speaker 2: And I think she's proven that she can do that.
35:02
Speaker 2: And once you go on there and you answer some
35:04
Speaker 2: of those questions, I think that matters to some of
35:06
Speaker 2: those viewers.
35:07
Speaker 5: She shows up.
35:08
Speaker 2: I don't think all of Fox viewers are that like
35:10
Speaker 2: excited about Trump. A lot of them are, obviously. But
35:13
Speaker 2: there are some reasonable voters out there. And I think
35:16
Speaker 2: she's going to go after them.
35:17
Speaker 1: I also think- Yeah, and there's some research that shows
35:22
Speaker 1: that when you're showing ads to voters, if you're just
35:27
Speaker 1: showing kind of like a clip from a network, if
35:30
Speaker 1: it's on a conservative network that they trust, maybe you
35:33
Speaker 1: get even more benefit from it, right? Like if it's
35:35
Speaker 1: like a Wall Street Journal article, maybe conservatives are more
35:37
Speaker 1: likely to think it's credible than something in the New
35:39
Speaker 1: York Times. So maybe they're thinking about what things they
35:42
Speaker 1: can lift from the Bret Baier interview if it goes
35:44
Speaker 1: well for ads.
35:45
Speaker 2: Yeah, I just think like, The whole team is probably
35:48
Speaker 2: looking at the numbers, looking at how close every single
35:51
Speaker 2: state is and thinking, what can we do to shake
35:53
Speaker 2: this up?
35:54
Speaker 5: Yeah.
35:54
Speaker 1: And the downside risk of a bad interview is like, whatever.
35:57
Speaker 1: If you're doing enough of them, you'll be okay.
35:59
Speaker 3: Hopefully.
36:00
Speaker 5: Hopefully.
36:00
Speaker 2: That's the only downside.
36:02
Speaker 1: Hopefully. Yeah. We've all been there.
36:03
Speaker 2: Yeah.
36:04
Speaker 1: It goes real bad. The last one that keeps getting
36:07
Speaker 1: reported on is Joe Rogan. There was a report, I
36:10
Speaker 1: think it was Reuters, that was like Kamala Harris considering
36:13
Speaker 1: doing Joe Rogan's like, what kind of news report is that?
36:16
Speaker 1: How do you have a headline?
36:17
Speaker 2: It was like a weird float. Like they floated that
36:19
Speaker 2: out there. I don't know where it exactly came from.
36:23
Speaker 3: It could be interesting.
36:24
Speaker 2: I mean, I think they both said they might do it.
36:26
Speaker 2: So I don't know. Let's give it a listen.
36:30
Speaker 1: I'm fully on board for doing Rogan. I mean, I
36:32
Speaker 1: don't know if this translates to his audience, but he
36:34
Speaker 1: has 14.5 million followers on Spotify, which would make him
36:38
Speaker 1: like the biggest podcast out there by far and much
36:42
Speaker 1: bigger than most networks. Or cable shows. I don't think
36:45
Speaker 1: he's like super partisan Republican. I think he's more of
36:50
Speaker 1: an RFK guy. He has lots of weird hobby horses
36:53
Speaker 1: like he's obsessed with.
36:54
Speaker 2: But we need those voters. I mean, you know, like
36:56
Speaker 2: she has to get some of those too. So I
36:59
Speaker 2: think it could be smart. And I think there's a
37:01
Speaker 2: lot of caricatures out there of her. But when you
37:03
Speaker 2: see her like talking, like she sounds pretty normal.
37:07
Speaker 5: Yeah.
37:07
Speaker 2: You know what I mean? So I think that's good.
37:09
Speaker 2: Why isn't she on Hot Ones? That's my question. How
37:11
Speaker 2: come she hasn't gone.
37:12
Speaker 3: On Hot Ones?
37:13
Speaker 1: I think they would if they could. I'm not sure
37:15
Speaker 1: if Hot Ones wants them. I know. She would be
37:19
Speaker 1: so good.
37:19
Speaker 2: She would be so good.
37:20
Speaker 1: I would love to see that, too.
37:22
Speaker 3: All right.
37:34
Speaker 1: We talked a lot about the national stuff. I do
37:36
Speaker 1: want to take your pulse on some of these state-level
37:39
Speaker 1: races because you have a ton of experiences there. especially
37:42
Speaker 1: in Pennsylvania and Arizona. So Politico had a story out
37:45
Speaker 1: this morning about alleged disarray in the Democratic effort in Pennsylvania.
37:52
Speaker 1: It read to me as like both kind of typical
37:56
Speaker 1: finger pointing you see when Democrats are nervous, stuff that
38:00
Speaker 1: gets over torqued by reporters. There was a similar story
38:03
Speaker 1: the other day about super PAC spending and people sort
38:06
Speaker 1: of carping about the main Democratic super PAC and where
38:10
Speaker 1: they're spending their money. But also, it was worrisome, and
38:13
Speaker 1: it kind of dovetailed with some things I have heard
38:16
Speaker 1: about the organization in Pennsylvania from people in the political world. So,
38:20
Speaker 1: I don't know. What did you make of that, and
38:21
Speaker 1: what do you think is happening in PA?
38:24
Speaker 2: Okay. So, I'm from Philadelphia, right? And I will say
38:28
Speaker 2: that there's a long history of hackery in Philadelphia politics,
38:33
Speaker 2: where a lot of people want a lot of attention.
38:37
Speaker 2: Do I think that there's some challenges to some of
38:41
Speaker 2: the campaign? Yes, we all worry about Pennsylvania because Pennsylvania
38:46
Speaker 2: is kind of ballgame. But I do think there's a
38:49
Speaker 2: lot of finger pointing that just happens so that people
38:51
Speaker 2: can say, if the worst happens, they've already blamed somebody else.
38:55
Speaker 2: When really, this is about all of us trying to
38:58
Speaker 2: come together and win this race. And I think there's
39:03
Speaker 2: a lot of really good people on the ground in Pennsylvania.
39:05
Speaker 2: I've One of the people mentioned in the article, Brendan McPhillips,
39:09
Speaker 2: he has run plenty of Pennsylvania statewides and he knows
39:12
Speaker 2: how to win. And he's a senior advisor to the campaign.
39:15
Speaker 2: There's good people working. I just think they haven't been
39:20
Speaker 2: holding hands with as many politicians and spreading the money
39:24
Speaker 2: around to as many politicos as who wants it. And
39:27
Speaker 2: I think that's part of the problem.
39:28
Speaker 5: Yeah.
39:28
Speaker 1: I mean, it's going to be, it's just, a tough
39:30
Speaker 1: state too, because there's massive spending on the presidential, but
39:34
Speaker 1: you also have this hotly contested Senate race where.
39:37
Speaker 2: And house races.
39:38
Speaker 1: And house races. But like Bob Casey is running against McCormick,
39:43
Speaker 1: who has not only the money he's raised personally, but
39:45
Speaker 1: he has two of his hedge fund billionaire buddies who
39:48
Speaker 1: who dumped money into their own super PAC. So the
39:50
Speaker 1: spending in the state is just out of control.
39:52
Speaker 2: So part of you is like- Dave McCormick of Connecticut
39:54
Speaker 2: residency fame.
39:55
Speaker 1: Connecticut hedge fund leader, Dave McCormick.
39:58
Speaker 4: Right.
39:58
Speaker 1: But with that much money being spent on ads, it's like,
40:00
Speaker 1: I don't know what's actually breaking through.
40:03
Speaker 2: I mean, it's really hard because you have a bunch
40:05
Speaker 2: of very competitive House seats in Pennsylvania. You have the
40:08
Speaker 2: Senate race. You have like you can't go anywhere in
40:11
Speaker 2: Pennsylvania without being communicated to. Like one of the things
40:14
Speaker 2: one of my friends who when the Phillies lost, he
40:17
Speaker 2: said the best things. The only good thing about the
40:19
Speaker 2: Phillies losing was that they don't have to watch political
40:22
Speaker 2: ads every five minutes anymore. They won't be in the
40:25
Speaker 2: Phillies games. You know, it's pretty intense.
40:27
Speaker 5: Yeah.
40:29
Speaker 1: The one thing I did hear, when we were there
40:30
Speaker 1: a couple weeks ago, a very well-connected person said to me,
40:33
Speaker 1: I'm worried about Harris in the Philly suburbs. Have you
40:36
Speaker 1: heard anything about that?
40:38
Speaker 2: I don't buy that. I mean, maybe they're more connected
40:40
Speaker 2: than I am, but I think Harris is going to
40:43
Speaker 2: really turn out in the suburbs. I think her voters
40:46
Speaker 2: are really going to come out for her.
40:47
Speaker 1: Do you see that Trump's going to go to a
40:49
Speaker 1: McDonald's on Sunday to work the fry cooker? I hope
40:51
Speaker 1: he's wearing a full suit and tie. Is this an
40:54
Speaker 1: actual thing that's happening in Pennsylvania?
40:56
Speaker 2: I did not hear that. That's terrible. Or I guess regular, like,
41:00
Speaker 2: I mean, he has to do these things to show
41:01
Speaker 2: that he's a regular guy because there's nothing about him
41:03
Speaker 2: that is regular.
41:05
Speaker 4: Yeah.
41:05
Speaker 1: Nothing says regular guy, like full suit and tie, pretending
41:08
Speaker 1: to work the fry cooker before you like slip somebody
41:10
Speaker 1: a hundred and leave the Mickey D's. Last thing, you
41:12
Speaker 1: mentioned something about an ice cream truck for ballots, giving
41:15
Speaker 1: you some hope.
41:15
Speaker 5: Yes. Okay.
41:16
Speaker 2: So let's have some good news. We never, you know, like,
41:18
Speaker 2: so there is a Montgomery County commissioner. His name is
41:21
Speaker 2: Neil McKeisha. And Montgomery County is one of the few counties,
41:25
Speaker 2: like one of the best turnout counties in Pennsylvania. It's
41:27
Speaker 2: a suburb of Philadelphia. And when your ballot isn't quite right,
41:32
Speaker 2: like if you mail in your ballot and there's an error,
41:33
Speaker 2: they throw it out, right? But what he's doing is
41:36
Speaker 2: when they come in with ballots that there's problems, they
41:40
Speaker 2: go in like an old ice cream truck and go
41:43
Speaker 2: find voters and help them make their ballots correct so
41:47
Speaker 2: their vote counts. So here are all these people out
41:51
Speaker 2: there who are trying to make their Like trying to
41:54
Speaker 2: say like there's conspiracies or they don't want your vote
41:56
Speaker 2: to count. Like, and here's a good story in Pennsylvania
41:59
Speaker 2: of someone trying to get every vote in so that
42:01
Speaker 2: every voice counts.
42:02
Speaker 3: I love that.
42:03
Speaker 1: We need more people like that. See, if you're anxious
42:06
Speaker 1: and texting your friends about Doomer shit, go do that.
42:09
Speaker 1: The other state that we talk about a lot is Arizona.
42:11
Speaker 1: We were there a couple months ago. It was 110 degrees.
42:14
Speaker 1: I couldn't believe it. People were canvassing. The polling has
42:17
Speaker 1: been noisy. The Journal had Harris up to on Sunday.
42:20
Speaker 1: The Times-Siena poll had Trump up five on Saturday. The average,
42:24
Speaker 1: the Times average has Harris up two. The 538 average
42:28
Speaker 1: has Trump up 1.5. God only knows what's right, right?
42:31
Speaker 1: It's all in the margin.
42:31
Speaker 2: This is why you should stop paying attention to polls. Like,
42:33
Speaker 2: it's only going to make you crazy.
42:34
Speaker 1: Make you crazy. I can't even follow them, let alone
42:38
Speaker 1: keep track of them. So you're working on Ruben Gallego's
42:42
Speaker 1: Senate race there, which means I'm not going to ask
42:45
Speaker 1: you for any, you know, privilege information unless you want
42:47
Speaker 1: to cough them up. But I do not.
42:49
Speaker 3: Okay.
42:50
Speaker 1: Democrats generally seem to be optimistic about Gallego, less optimistic
42:56
Speaker 1: about Harris. What do you think about that?
42:58
Speaker 2: So what I would say is Arizona is still Arizona.
43:01
Speaker 2: Like there's still more Republicans and independents than there are Democrats.
43:04
Speaker 2: Like we should be concerned with Arizona. And that means
43:07
Speaker 2: it's not like it's going to be a walk for
43:08
Speaker 2: Ruben Gallego either. Like we should all be, you know,
43:13
Speaker 2: taking this very seriously on all levels. I do think
43:16
Speaker 2: that Harris is out there, you know, really trying to,
43:20
Speaker 2: to spread her message to voters. She's got, she's talking
43:23
Speaker 2: a lot to the Republic, like reasonable Republicans in Arizona.
43:27
Speaker 2: And I think at the end of the day, I
43:29
Speaker 2: think she's going to bring a lot of them over
43:30
Speaker 2: to her. I really do.
43:32
Speaker 1: It carry like, it's so wild to watch her go
43:34
Speaker 1: from being the craziest person in all of politics to
43:37
Speaker 1: try to just sand off the edges and go like
43:39
Speaker 1: full gauzy lens, Barbara Walters, like, this new person out
43:44
Speaker 1: there on the campaign trail. Is that people buying that?
43:47
Speaker 2: No, no, I don't think people are buying that. I mean,
43:50
Speaker 2: I think she is, she is someone who is really
43:53
Speaker 2: out for herself. And at the end of the day,
43:55
Speaker 2: everything comes back to what she wants. And she is
43:59
Speaker 2: not someone who is fully truthful. I do think voters
44:02
Speaker 2: see through her, but I also think like she's not
44:05
Speaker 2: really trying to convince anyone. She told McCain Republicans to
44:08
Speaker 2: get the hell out of the party. You know, Rubin
44:10
Speaker 2: has spent two years going to every community in Arizona,
44:15
Speaker 2: across the whole state, and meeting voters where they are
44:17
Speaker 2: and talking to them. And he understands them. He's a
44:20
Speaker 2: working class kid. He's a veteran. And he has really
44:24
Speaker 2: connected with a lot of people. And they're like, you know,
44:26
Speaker 2: I'm a Republican, but I'm voting for Rubin.
44:28
Speaker 1: We did a live show in Arizona back in September,
44:31
Speaker 1: and Rubin Gallego was our guest. I feel like he
44:33
Speaker 1: had been marching in a parade at like 7 a.m.
44:37
Speaker 1: that morning, someplace five hours away, and then drove to
44:40
Speaker 1: the show. And I was like, all right, this guy's grinding.
44:42
Speaker 1: So you're working on this race. I mean, what is
44:44
Speaker 1: it telling you, what you're seeing in the numbers in
44:46
Speaker 1: Arizona about Latino support for Democrats generally? Because that's a
44:50
Speaker 1: huge concern.
44:53
Speaker 2: So a lot of Latinos in Arizona are independents, right?
44:57
Speaker 2: And I think that Democrats traditionally have used them as
45:01
Speaker 2: a turnout audience and not as a persuasion audience. which
45:05
Speaker 2: means that it's been about turning out the vote, not
45:08
Speaker 2: actually communicating with Latino voters. And I think what Rubin
45:11
Speaker 2: has been doing over the last two years is actually
45:14
Speaker 2: communicating to voters about what he wants to do as
45:17
Speaker 2: a senator. And I think Democrats need to talk to
45:22
Speaker 2: voters more about their plans and not just say like,
45:25
Speaker 2: you're with us, let's turn out the vote. And I
45:27
Speaker 2: think we're doing that, but it took a minute. Like
45:30
Speaker 2: we've been a little slow, like Democrats in general with
45:34
Speaker 2: voters of color of understanding, like you should actually persuade
45:38
Speaker 2: them to, to vote for you. And you don't just
45:39
Speaker 2: have a, you can't take any votes for granted.
45:41
Speaker 5: Yeah.
45:42
Speaker 2: I would have liked that to happen a little quicker.
45:43
Speaker 5: Yeah.
45:44
Speaker 1: A couple of years ago. Finally, so let's talk about
45:46
Speaker 1: a couple of critical house raises. We have not, we've
45:49
Speaker 1: barely talked about, you know, the house on this show.
45:52
Speaker 2: Nobody talks about the house. Nobody gives the house any love.
45:55
Speaker 2: I've made this pitch before. I'm going to say it again.
45:57
Speaker 2: If you are sitting at home and you are terrified
46:00
Speaker 2: that Trump is going to win, The best thing you
46:02
Speaker 2: can do beyond helping Harris is like making sure Trump
46:06
Speaker 2: would have a check on his power. And that is
46:08
Speaker 2: delivering a Democratic House. The House is very winnable, right?
46:12
Speaker 2: There are races all across the country, probably near a
46:15
Speaker 2: lot of your listeners. There's races in California, in New York,
46:19
Speaker 2: and then all in the purple and red states that
46:23
Speaker 2: Democrats can win. We saw in northern New Jersey, Sue
46:28
Speaker 2: Altman is now like neck and neck. With Tom Keene,
46:31
Speaker 2: that's a good Democrat to give to. Janelle Steltsen out
46:34
Speaker 2: in Pennsylvania, York, Pennsylvania. It's like traditionally Trump area, Republican area.
46:40
Speaker 2: But Scott Perry's like a little too, went a little
46:43
Speaker 2: too far, a little too MAGA for that district. And
46:46
Speaker 2: I think she has a great chance. There's Jonathan Nez,
46:49
Speaker 2: the former Navajo Nation president who's running against Eli Crane
46:53
Speaker 2: in Arizona. I mean, we have so many good candidates.
46:57
Speaker 2: And I just, I think like, number one, the Democrats
46:59
Speaker 2: are doing the work They're out-raising all of these Republicans.
47:03
Speaker 2: They're trying to communicate their message. And they are normal
47:08
Speaker 2: people and that we should try and be behind them
47:11
Speaker 2: and elect them.
47:12
Speaker 1: So is there like a dynamic you're seeing broadly? Are
47:15
Speaker 1: these House races, are the Democrats running ahead of Kamala Harris?
47:19
Speaker 1: Are there candidate quality issues? I know there's so many races,
47:22
Speaker 1: it's hard to draw with a broad brush. Anything we
47:23
Speaker 1: should learn from it?
47:25
Speaker 2: I think a lot of these Republicans are running as
47:29
Speaker 2: MAGA candidates. in districts where people don't want that. And
47:34
Speaker 2: I think Democrats are doing a good job of raising
47:37
Speaker 2: money from small donors to just communicate their message and
47:43
Speaker 2: talk about what we stand for. I think Democrats have
47:46
Speaker 2: been more inviting to people who disagree than MAGA Republicans
47:50
Speaker 2: are at this moment.
47:52
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's 100% true. I mean, as you mentioned earlier,
47:55
Speaker 1: Carrie Lake told them to To get out of the
47:57
Speaker 1: party if you're not a Trump fan. Well, that is
48:00
Speaker 1: good advice. And also another thing you can do if
48:01
Speaker 1: you're anxious. I know we're going to all knock on
48:04
Speaker 1: doors here in some of these California races. Because California
48:07
Speaker 1: and New York, man, I mean, that could tip this
48:09
Speaker 1: whole thing. Yeah.
48:11
Speaker 2: I mean, can you imagine? I would say New York
48:15
Speaker 2: is where we lost the House last time, and it
48:17
Speaker 2: could be where we win the House this time, right?
48:19
Speaker 2: Battleground New York, Battleground California, go check out those websites
48:24
Speaker 2: because you can go out right now and help them out.
48:28
Speaker 1: Have you guys got your shit together? Is everyone still
48:30
Speaker 1: getting arrested? What's happening in New York?
48:32
Speaker 2: New York's a disaster.
48:35
Speaker 1: How's the state party?
48:36
Speaker 2: I'm not defending New York. I mean, let me just
48:39
Speaker 2: vent about the state party for just one second. The
48:42
Speaker 2: New York Democratic Party was not built to win general elections.
48:46
Speaker 5: Why?
48:46
Speaker 2: It is a disaster because they never thought they had to.
48:50
Speaker 2: They are a mess. They've been a mess for years.
48:53
Speaker 2: They care more about beating progressives than they care about
48:55
Speaker 2: beating Republicans.
48:57
Speaker 1: It is, I.
48:59
Speaker 2: Think it needs some, you know, some cleaning out.
49:02
Speaker 1: A little refresh. Well, it's so frustrating because like you
49:06
Speaker 1: see these states where there is a really smart, well-functioning
49:11
Speaker 1: state Democratic Party, like Wisconsin, right? Where they've had people
49:15
Speaker 1: in place doing the work for years and years and years.
49:18
Speaker 1: And you can see the impact on the ground. You
49:20
Speaker 1: see how professional they are. You see them doing events
49:23
Speaker 1: in off years and winning state Supreme Court races and
49:27
Speaker 1: knocking on doors 18 months before an election and doing
49:30
Speaker 1: deep canvassing and persuasion and not just GOTV events and
49:34
Speaker 1: dumb ads at the end. And you're like, yeah, I
49:36
Speaker 1: will give all the money I have to Wisconsin Democrats.
49:39
Speaker 1: the Wisconsin Democratic Party, because they are so competent. But
49:42
Speaker 1: it's like, how do we take Ben Wickler, the chair there,
49:44
Speaker 1: and clone him and send him to 50 states?
49:48
Speaker 2: I mean, I think the problem is that there's a
49:51
Speaker 2: lot of red pockets in blue states, and the people
49:55
Speaker 2: in charge have no idea how to deal with it, right?
49:58
Speaker 2: Whereas the folks who have been in the purple states
49:59
Speaker 2: have been working on it for some time. And some
50:04
Speaker 2: of the reddest parts of this country are in the
50:06
Speaker 2: bluest states. Um, and, and you gotta worry about, like,
50:09
Speaker 2: I talked to you about all the challengers that might, um,
50:12
Speaker 2: that might win, but there's also people like Johanna Hayes
50:14
Speaker 2: in Northwest Connecticut, who's now got a very tough race.
50:17
Speaker 2: Like that's another Democrat we need to go support. So
50:20
Speaker 2: it's just, it's a, it's a, it's a weird moment
50:22
Speaker 2: for sure, but we gotta, we gotta get our parties,
50:25
Speaker 2: they gotta get their shit together.
50:26
Speaker 1: Gotta get our shit together, get our state party shit together. Uh, well, Listen, again,
50:31
Speaker 1: so listeners know, Rebecca has been my friend for a
50:33
Speaker 1: long time. She's someone I text about my anxiety, usually
50:37
Speaker 1: before like 6 a.m. So it's good to actually just
50:39
Speaker 1: do this on the podcast. It's a lot more constructive.
50:43
Speaker 1: But that's our show for today. Thank you so much
50:45
Speaker 1: for being here. Dan and John will be back with
50:48
Speaker 1: a new episode on Friday. It won't be as good
50:50
Speaker 1: as this, but you should still listen to it anyway.
50:53
Speaker 1: Thank you, Rebecca.
50:54
Speaker 2: Thanks, Tommy.
50:56
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50:59
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Speaker 1: Cherlin is our executive editor and Adrian Hill is our
51:31
Speaker 1: executive producer. The show is mixed and edited by Andrew Chadwick.
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Speaker 1: Jordan Cantor is our sound engineer with audio support from
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Speaker 1: Kyle Seglin and Charlotte Landis. Writing support by Hallie Kiefer.
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Speaker 1: Madeline Herringer is our head of news and programming. Matt
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Speaker 1: DeGroat is our head of production. Andy Taft is our
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Speaker 1: executive assistant. Thanks to our digital team, Elijah Cohn, Haley Jones,
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Speaker 1: Phoebe Bradford, Joseph Dutra, Ben Hefcoat, Mia Kelman, Molly Lobel,
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Speaker 1: Kirill Pelleviv, and David Toles.