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Transcript

“Abraham Lincoln over here.” (Debate recap special) · Pod Save America

• 0:20
  Speaker 1: Welcome to Pod Save America. I'm Tony Bablinski. I'm John.
• 0:23
  Speaker 2: I was going to say, I'm John Favreau because I've
• 0:25
  Speaker 2: all thrown off. Well, I'm not ready for you to
• 0:28
  Speaker 2: go off script.
• 0:29
  Speaker 3: I'm John Lovett.
• 0:30
  Speaker 4: I'm just the guy who's happy these debates are over
• 0:32
  Speaker 4: named Tommy. So good to see you guys.
• 0:34
  Speaker 3: I'm just Dan Pfeiffer.
• 0:35
  Speaker 5: I have no jokes.
• 0:36
  Speaker 1: On today's pod, the gang's all here to talk about
• 0:38
  Speaker 1: the last presidential debate we will ever see that includes
• 0:40
  Speaker 1: Donald Trump. Probably.
• 0:43
  Speaker 3: Probably. Has to be, right? He can run in 2024.
• 0:47
  Speaker 6: He'll get a third term.
• 0:48
  Speaker 1: That's why I said probably.
• 0:49
  Speaker 7: Third term.
• 0:49
  Speaker 1: There is the there's the third term thing, but there's
• 0:52
  Speaker 1: the run in 2024, which is who knows. Anyway, before that,
• 0:56
  Speaker 1: we got some big news. Dan, love it. You want
• 0:58
  Speaker 1: to tell everyone who you're interviewing today?
• 1:02
  Speaker 2: We look, it took it was a tough scheduling thing,
• 1:05
  Speaker 2: took about a year.
• 1:06
  Speaker 3: But we're talking to Joe Biden. Maybe, you know, I'm.
• 1:12
  Speaker 1: The winner of last night's debate. There's a picture going
• 1:14
  Speaker 1: around on Twitter. I don't know if this is Russian disinformation,
• 1:19
  Speaker 1: but it is Joe Biden shaking hands with a very
• 1:23
  Speaker 1: young Dan Pfeiffer with a suit that's a couple sizes
• 1:28
  Speaker 1: too big.
• 1:28
  Speaker 3: Do you know what size that suit is, John?
• 1:29
  Speaker 8: 1995.
• 1:30
  Speaker 5: That's what size that suit is.
• 1:34
  Speaker 1: Is the picture from 1995?
• 1:35
  Speaker 5: So the backstory of that picture is I was an
• 1:38
  Speaker 5: intern in college in Joe Biden's office because– I'm a
• 1:41
  Speaker 5: proud Delawarean. And I never received my intern photo because
• 1:45
  Speaker 5: I think I moved in college and I was a knucklehead.
• 1:47
  Speaker 3: So I didn't get it.
• 1:47
  Speaker 5: So on my last day in the White House, Joe
• 1:50
  Speaker 5: Biden's staff found that photo in his archives and he
• 1:53
  Speaker 5: gave it to me as a going away gift, which.
• 1:57
  Speaker 3: Was very nice.
• 1:58
  Speaker 5: The last nice thing was then he also tweeted it
• 2:01
  Speaker 5: out to his like 12 million followers, which was less cool.
• 2:04
  Speaker 5: But I decided to own this and get ahead of it.
• 2:07
  Speaker 3: So I.
• 2:08
  Speaker 5: I shared the photo with the very social media savvy
• 2:11
  Speaker 5: folks at Crooked Media.
• 2:12
  Speaker 4: Dan went directly from that to a Coolio concert because, again,
• 2:16
  Speaker 4: it was 1995.
• 2:17
  Speaker 6: Wow.
• 2:19
  Speaker 5: I look like the childhood of a defense attorney on
• 2:21
  Speaker 5: NYPD Blue.
• 2:22
  Speaker 2: That's what I look like. You look like you sold
• 2:25
  Speaker 2: the most copies of Dianetics.
• 2:29
  Speaker 1: Anyway, if you're listening to this podcast, go online, go
• 2:32
  Speaker 1: to our Twitter feed at Pod Save America, check out
• 2:33
  Speaker 1: the picture. And that interview with Joe Biden will be
• 2:36
  Speaker 1: out Saturday morning, first thing. So check it out. One
• 2:40
  Speaker 1: more note before we start. We have 11 days left
• 2:42
  Speaker 1: to vote. And the single most important thing we can
• 2:44
  Speaker 1: do right now is to make sure the people in
• 2:46
  Speaker 1: our lives get out there and vote, especially the people
• 2:49
  Speaker 1: in our lives who live in swing states. Go to votesaveamerica.com
• 2:53
  Speaker 1: slash volunteer anytime between now and election day, and you
• 2:56
  Speaker 1: can find opportunities to help get out the vote whenever
• 2:58
  Speaker 1: you're available. You have no excuses. We have a volunteer hub.
• 3:01
  Speaker 1: It's easy to just go. We will plug you into
• 3:03
  Speaker 1: a shift somewhere in some state.
• 3:05
  Speaker 3: You just click.
• 3:06
  Speaker 1: Just click. Just click votesaveamerica.com slash volunteer. If we volunteer,
• 3:11
  Speaker 1: if we vote, we will win.
• 3:13
  Speaker 3: All right.
• 3:15
  Speaker 1: Let's get to the news. The final debate between Donald
• 3:17
  Speaker 1: Trump and Joe Biden took place in Nashville last night.
• 3:20
  Speaker 1: And it was much less awful than the first debate,
• 3:22
  Speaker 1: thanks to skilled moderating by NBC's Kristen Welker, muted microphones,
• 3:25
  Speaker 1: and what I'm guessing was a shock collar that the
• 3:27
  Speaker 1: Trump campaign forced their candidate to wear. And yet, Trump
• 3:31
  Speaker 1: on his best behavior included the president telling more lies
• 3:33
  Speaker 1: than he did in the first debate, interrupting Joe Biden
• 3:36
  Speaker 1: 34 times, floating baseless conspiracy theories about the vice president's family,
• 3:40
  Speaker 1: declaring himself the least racist person in the debate hall,
• 3:42
  Speaker 1: and telling America that the pandemic is almost over, despite
• 3:45
  Speaker 1: a surge in cases across the country.
• 3:48
  Speaker 7: Love it.
• 3:48
  Speaker 1: What was your overall impression of the debate? How did
• 3:51
  Speaker 1: Chris and Welker do? What did you think of the
• 3:53
  Speaker 1: muted mics at the beginning of each of the two-minute segments?
• 3:56
  Speaker 1: First impressions.
• 3:57
  Speaker 3: Yeah, it was normal. It was normal adjacent.
• 4:02
  Speaker 2: And it was nice to not be confronted by the
• 4:07
  Speaker 2: most monstrous person at his absolute worst. It was the
• 4:10
  Speaker 2: most monstrous person at his medium worst. I think Welker
• 4:13
  Speaker 2: did an incredible job. I think it's remarkable that she's
• 4:15
  Speaker 2: receiving bipartisan support. She even received praise on the stage
• 4:20
  Speaker 2: by Donald Trump while he was losing the debate, which
• 4:23
  Speaker 2: I think he instantly regretted after because Sean Hannity was
• 4:25
  Speaker 2: desperate to blame Kristen Welker. But Trump took away that
• 4:29
  Speaker 2: talking point.
• 4:30
  Speaker 3: I will say, though, like we shouldn't be lulled. First
• 4:33
  Speaker 3: of all, only in politics, if.
• 4:35
  Speaker 2: You catastrophically fuck up your first job interview and then
• 4:38
  Speaker 2: only do merely terribly in your second job interview, does
• 4:41
  Speaker 2: anyone suggest that you've recovered? Um, and also just that
• 4:46
  Speaker 2: he delivered a lot of the same hits. He was
• 4:48
  Speaker 2: trying to do a lot of the same thing he
• 4:49
  Speaker 2: did in the first debate. He just had a better tone.
• 4:52
  Speaker 2: It's like, it's like the director, like whispered in his ear, like,
• 4:55
  Speaker 2: we love what you're doing out there, but this time just,
• 4:57
  Speaker 2: just make it smaller, just throw it away. Um, so,
• 5:01
  Speaker 2: you know, I thought first debate Trump lost this debate
• 5:03
  Speaker 2: Biden won.
• 5:05
  Speaker 1: Tommy, was this the night that Donald Trump became president?
• 5:08
  Speaker 1: What did you think of the performance? And we got
• 5:11
  Speaker 1: another new tone cycle.
• 5:12
  Speaker 4: I agree that he was more restrained last night compared
• 5:15
  Speaker 4: to the first debate. Part of that was muted mic.
• 5:17
  Speaker 4: Part of it was new rules. Part of it was
• 5:18
  Speaker 4: Kristen Welker doing a great job. But the suggestion that
• 5:21
  Speaker 4: he has the discipline to maintain a new tone or
• 5:24
  Speaker 4: that a new tone for 11 days can undo four
• 5:27
  Speaker 4: or five years of assholery is just beyond stupid. I
• 5:32
  Speaker 4: also just thought like, like Biden's strength last night to
• 5:35
  Speaker 4: me was this sort of core contrast on character that
• 5:38
  Speaker 4: he made a couple of times. And I thought that
• 5:40
  Speaker 4: broke overwhelmingly in his favor. Biden also brought up like
• 5:44
  Speaker 4: issues that are very popular and Donald Trump took the
• 5:46
  Speaker 4: wrong position, like increasing the minimum wage to $ 15 an hour.
• 5:50
  Speaker 4: Donald Trump loudly came out against that last night.
• 5:53
  Speaker 6: He attacked Dr. Fauci.
• 5:55
  Speaker 4: Trump also spoke a language that is best described as
• 5:59
  Speaker 4: OAN or Fox News, right? Like 18 angry Democrats, Russia, Russia, Russia,
• 6:05
  Speaker 4: the laptop from hell. No one knows what the fuck
• 6:07
  Speaker 4: you're talking about, man.
• 6:08
  Speaker 6: I'm sorry. They just don't.
• 6:10
  Speaker 4: And then like, again, they spent weeks and weeks, if
• 6:12
  Speaker 4: not months, suggesting that Joe Biden has dementia. You could
• 6:16
  Speaker 4: not watch Joe Biden's performance last night and come away
• 6:19
  Speaker 4: thinking he is anything but pretty sharp and knowledgeable on
• 6:22
  Speaker 4: the issue.
• 6:23
  Speaker 6: So I thought it was a great night for Joe Biden.
• 6:27
  Speaker 1: Dan, what do you think Joe Biden's plan was heading
• 6:29
  Speaker 1: into the debate and how well did he execute on it?
• 6:32
  Speaker 5: I think his plan was, he didn't, I would say
• 6:35
  Speaker 5: he didn't really know what he was going to face
• 6:36
  Speaker 5: with Trump. So he probably had two plans. There was
• 6:38
  Speaker 5: this version of Trump and then the insane first debate
• 6:42
  Speaker 5: version of Trump. You know, step one, don't lose your cool, right?
• 6:45
  Speaker 5: He has maintained this stature gap throughout this whole campaign.
• 6:47
  Speaker 5: He doesn't want to lose that. And he came close
• 6:49
  Speaker 5: to doing it a couple of times that first debate.
• 6:51
  Speaker 5: Second is to have a series of moments. And he
• 6:54
  Speaker 5: worked really hard to get those in. The first question
• 6:57
  Speaker 5: on COVID was a moment where Biden could lay out
• 6:59
  Speaker 5: his case. He clearly wanted that moment comparing their characters.
• 7:02
  Speaker 5: You know me, you know him. That worked very well
• 7:04
  Speaker 5: for him. And to find a couple of places to
• 7:08
  Speaker 5: needle Trump a little bit to see if he could
• 7:09
  Speaker 5: get him out of that new tone back into the
• 7:11
  Speaker 5: other version of Trump.
• 7:12
  Speaker 3: And he had some decent success with that.
• 7:13
  Speaker 5: He didn't get Trump to completely melt down and flip out,
• 7:16
  Speaker 5: but he got Trump to be angry and off his game.
• 7:18
  Speaker 5: And the angrier Trump gets, the less coherent he gets.
• 7:21
  Speaker 5: And that sort of was ramping up throughout that debate.
• 7:24
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I think that Biden had like a few moments
• 7:28
  Speaker 1: where he might have went on too long or rambled
• 7:30
  Speaker 1: or didn't make the point like as crisp as he
• 7:32
  Speaker 1: needed to. But I thought he was much stronger than
• 7:35
  Speaker 1: the first debate. He was much sharper. He had clearly
• 7:37
  Speaker 1: practiced a series of moments, like you said, delivered on
• 7:40
  Speaker 1: almost all of those moments. And I think for Trump,
• 7:43
  Speaker 1: it's like, yeah, I guess Trump was a little more
• 7:46
  Speaker 1: restrained because like, But, yeah, he didn't, like, you know,
• 7:49
  Speaker 1: throw shit at the wall. But, like, he's... That might
• 7:53
  Speaker 1: have been the best that Trump could have done. And
• 7:55
  Speaker 1: his best was still awful.
• 7:57
  Speaker 9: Right.
• 7:57
  Speaker 1: He was still, like, lying. He was still angry at times.
• 8:00
  Speaker 1: He was still, like, talking. He was still, like, doing
• 8:01
  Speaker 1: all the Fox News language. Like, he was not... I
• 8:05
  Speaker 1: just don't buy this bullshit that, like, he was somehow
• 8:07
  Speaker 1: that much better. It's like we all have fucking Stockholm Syndrome. Like,
• 8:11
  Speaker 1: we've been living with Donald Trump for so long that
• 8:13
  Speaker 1: we can't, you know, like, we don't understand that he's still...
• 8:17
  Speaker 1: spends most of his time lying.
• 8:19
  Speaker 7: Yeah, it's Trump.
• 8:19
  Speaker 3: It's Trump goggles, right? He's graded on a curve. That's
• 8:21
  Speaker 3: always been true. I do also think, too, like, you know,
• 8:25
  Speaker 3: the two biggest issues.
• 8:27
  Speaker 2: Facing the country right now, right, are the pandemic and
• 8:30
  Speaker 2: the economy. Both of those came up in pretty direct comparisons.
• 8:33
  Speaker 2: You know, Donald Trump is asked directly, what is your
• 8:36
  Speaker 2: plan to cover pre-existing conditions? He issues gobbledygook. Biden responds
• 8:40
  Speaker 2: by delivering a very clean description of his plan in bullets.
• 8:44
  Speaker 2: Trump is asked, what is your plan for COVID? He says,
• 8:47
  Speaker 2: it's not my fault and I feel better. Immediately, Joe
• 8:50
  Speaker 2: Biden responds with a key, like his plan in bullets.
• 8:53
  Speaker 2: And like that is, you know, regardless of scoring the
• 8:58
  Speaker 2: debate on points, like those are the two biggest questions,
• 9:01
  Speaker 2: you know, over and over again, we've heard this.
• 9:02
  Speaker 3: These are the two biggest questions people have.
• 9:04
  Speaker 2: And on the key issues facing the country, like Joe
• 9:07
  Speaker 2: Biden was as excellent in this debate as he has
• 9:09
  Speaker 2: been in any debate in all of 2020.
• 9:12
  Speaker 1: Let's talk about some of the more notable moments. Chris
• 9:14
  Speaker 1: and Welk are open by asking both candidates about the pandemic,
• 9:17
  Speaker 1: which is once again surging in almost every state. Yesterday
• 9:19
  Speaker 1: was the highest number of cases since the early summer.
• 9:22
  Speaker 1: Here's how both candidates responded.
• 9:23
  Speaker 8: I say we're learning to live with it. We have
• 9:25
  Speaker 8: no choice. We can't lock ourselves up in a basement
• 9:28
  Speaker 8: like Joe does. He has the he has the ability
• 9:31
  Speaker 8: to lock himself up.
• 9:33
  Speaker 10: I don't know.
• 9:33
  Speaker 8: He's obviously made a lot of money someplace. but he
• 9:35
  Speaker 8: has this thing about living in a basement. People can't
• 9:38
  Speaker 8: do that. By the way, I, as the president, couldn't
• 9:41
  Speaker 8: do that. I'd love to put myself in the basement
• 9:43
  Speaker 8: or in a beautiful room in the White House and
• 9:45
  Speaker 8: go away for a year and a half until it disappears.
• 9:48
  Speaker 9: He says that we're, you know, we're learning to live
• 9:51
  Speaker 9: with it. People are learning to die with it. You
• 9:54
  Speaker 9: folks home will have an empty chair at the kitchen
• 9:56
  Speaker 9: table this morning. That man or wife going to bed
• 9:58
  Speaker 9: tonight and reaching over to try.
• 10:00
  Speaker 7: To touch their... out of habit where their wife or
• 10:02
  Speaker 7: husband was is gone. Learning to live with it. Come on.
• 10:06
  Speaker 7: We're dying with it. And you say, I take no responsibility.
• 10:11
  Speaker 3: Let me talk about your two.
• 10:12
  Speaker 8: Excuse me, I take full responsibility. It's not my fault
• 10:16
  Speaker 8: that he came here. It's China's fault.
• 10:19
  Speaker 9: What I would say is I'm going to shut down
• 10:20
  Speaker 9: the virus, not the country. It's his ineptitude that caused
• 10:25
  Speaker 9: the country to have to shut down in large part.
• 10:27
  Speaker 9: Why businesses have gone under, why schools are closed, why
• 10:30
  Speaker 9: so many people have lost their living and why they're concerned.
• 10:33
  Speaker 1: Tommy, I feel like on another planet, the president saying
• 10:36
  Speaker 1: we're learning to live with it about a virus that's
• 10:38
  Speaker 1: killed over 200,000 Americans and put him in the hospital
• 10:41
  Speaker 1: would be you know, game over. But new tone, I guess.
• 10:45
  Speaker 1: What did you what did you think of the COVID?
• 10:47
  Speaker 8: New tone?
• 10:47
  Speaker 4: Yeah, look, Trump's strongest moments in the debate and the
• 10:50
  Speaker 4: places where I thought he actually scored some points were
• 10:53
  Speaker 4: when he was when he could say, you've been around
• 10:56
  Speaker 4: for 47 years, you didn't accomplish anything, you're a typical politician.
• 10:59
  Speaker 4: That's just not an avenue that's open to Donald Trump here.
• 11:02
  Speaker 4: He still wants credit seemingly for not having 2 million
• 11:06
  Speaker 4: people die when 200,000 died. And I thought, you know,
• 11:11
  Speaker 4: Biden coming right out of the box and saying anyone
• 11:13
  Speaker 4: who has this record of 200,000 people dead does not
• 11:16
  Speaker 4: deserve to be reelected. I thought that was quite clear.
• 11:19
  Speaker 4: And then Trump just can't help himself but to pivot
• 11:22
  Speaker 4: to attacking various other enemies who are not currently his
• 11:25
  Speaker 4: opponent in the 2020 presidential campaign. He's attacking China. He's
• 11:29
  Speaker 4: attacking Governor Cuomo. He was attacking Dr. Fauci for a while.
• 11:33
  Speaker 4: It was just like he was attacking Pelosi. It was
• 11:34
  Speaker 4: just sort of like misplaced rage while, you know, this was,
• 11:38
  Speaker 4: I thought Biden's, like he was struggling to.
• 11:40
  Speaker 6: Warm up during this part of the debate, right? Not
• 11:42
  Speaker 6: everything came.
• 11:42
  Speaker 4: Out crisply, but I still thought that you at least
• 11:45
  Speaker 4: heard something that sounded like a plan. You heard about
• 11:48
  Speaker 4: support for states. You heard about getting money for schools
• 11:51
  Speaker 4: and states to reopen. Like, I didn't think Trump did
• 11:53
  Speaker 4: not score any points here.
• 11:54
  Speaker 6: I didn't think.
• 11:55
  Speaker 1: No, I think Biden was warming up in this section too,
• 11:57
  Speaker 1: but I think Trump was awful in this section. I mean,
• 11:59
  Speaker 1: he complained about the cost of plexiglass at one point.
• 12:02
  Speaker 4: And he pivoted to an attack on Gold Star families again. Again,
• 12:05
  Speaker 4: that's not something you want to do in a debate.
• 12:07
  Speaker 3: He made it about himself. He made it about his
• 12:10
  Speaker 3: own COVID experience. He complained that Dr.
• 12:10
  Speaker 1: Fauci's a Democrat. He called Dr. Fauci a Democrat, which
• 12:13
  Speaker 1: I know, love it.
• 12:14
  Speaker 3: That was for me. That was for me. That was
• 12:16
  Speaker 3: for me.
• 12:18
  Speaker 1: At some point, he started bragging about how he could
• 12:20
  Speaker 1: raise more money than Biden, that he'd be better off.
• 12:23
  Speaker 1: I could raise more money than you if I wanted
• 12:24
  Speaker 1: to on the campaign. You're talking about a fucking virus
• 12:27
  Speaker 1: that is like ravaging the country right now. And you're
• 12:30
  Speaker 1: bragging about how you could raise more money if you wanted.
• 12:33
  Speaker 2: And even just throwing in that little hit inside of
• 12:35
  Speaker 2: it about Joe Biden making money because like, how else
• 12:37
  Speaker 2: could he afford to stay in his basement? It's just like,
• 12:40
  Speaker 2: you have to know a lot. You have to be
• 12:43
  Speaker 2: very well versed in the Trump lingo to understand anything
• 12:46
  Speaker 2: that he was.
• 12:46
  Speaker 6: Talking about there.
• 12:47
  Speaker 1: Dan, did you ever want something on COVID?
• 12:49
  Speaker 5: No, I think the problem for Trump is that he
• 12:52
  Speaker 5: is 100% wrong on this issue. Like, I agree with
• 12:54
  Speaker 5: your take that Biden, it wasn't his Christmas moment, but
• 12:57
  Speaker 5: just standing on stage with Trump while Trump says those things,
• 13:01
  Speaker 5: even if Biden said nothing.
• 13:03
  Speaker 3: He would win that exchange, right?
• 13:05
  Speaker 5: It's just like not being the guy complaining about the
• 13:07
  Speaker 5: skyrocketing cost of plexiglass in a pandemic.
• 13:11
  Speaker 3: You're a winner, you've won.
• 13:12
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I think even in real time, like I liked
• 13:14
  Speaker 2: that answer a lot and I didn't feel as though,
• 13:16
  Speaker 2: I think he maybe like kind of petered out a
• 13:17
  Speaker 2: bit towards the end, but just going through, here are
• 13:20
  Speaker 2: the things that I would do on COVID. Here is
• 13:23
  Speaker 2: a plan. I don't care if there was some sloppiness
• 13:25
  Speaker 2: in it. I don't care if he struggled to land it.
• 13:27
  Speaker 2: Like that is what I think people wanna hear from him.
• 13:30
  Speaker 2: I'm glad he did that.
• 13:31
  Speaker 3: The contrast is staggering.
• 13:33
  Speaker 1: Biden had two crisp lines in that section. One was like,
• 13:36
  Speaker 1: I don't want to shut down the country. I want
• 13:37
  Speaker 1: to shut down the virus. And then he said Americans
• 13:39
  Speaker 1: don't panic. He panicked about Trump, which I thought were
• 13:42
  Speaker 1: two really good lines.
• 13:42
  Speaker 5: I think one of the lessons we always have to
• 13:44
  Speaker 5: remind ourselves that many people have pointed out over the
• 13:47
  Speaker 5: course of the entire Biden candidacy is people like us,
• 13:51
  Speaker 5: particularly political professionals, including speechwriters, care a lot more about
• 13:54
  Speaker 5: the crispness of lines than voters. Like Biden is not–
• 13:58
  Speaker 5: he never has been the clearest speaker. Sometimes he– it's
• 14:04
  Speaker 5: a little elliptical sometimes he mangles his words. And for–
• 14:06
  Speaker 5: like he overcame a stutter. That's obvious. But voters care
• 14:09
  Speaker 5: less about that than we do. And so the– The
• 14:12
  Speaker 5: impression of that answer and the substance is that he
• 14:14
  Speaker 5: is someone who will take it seriously and he cares,
• 14:16
  Speaker 5: which is the exact opposite of Trump.
• 14:17
  Speaker 2: The day we hit them, we did a new record.
• 14:20
  Speaker 2: You're a senior watching this. You're already wanting to flee
• 14:22
  Speaker 2: to Joe Biden. One person said, don't worry, we'll live
• 14:25
  Speaker 2: with it. You're terrified because you're in the age group
• 14:27
  Speaker 2: that is most likely to die. Who did he bring home?
• 14:30
  Speaker 3: Nobody.
• 14:31
  Speaker 10: Nobody.
• 14:32
  Speaker 1: So the Trump campaign and the right wing media all
• 14:35
  Speaker 1: hope that the big moment of the night would be
• 14:37
  Speaker 1: about Hunter Biden's laptop. which may have emails on it
• 14:39
  Speaker 1: that may reveal that Joe Biden once met a business
• 14:41
  Speaker 1: associate of his son's in 2017 after he was vice president.
• 14:44
  Speaker 1: That's the big scandal. Trump campaign believed this was so
• 14:48
  Speaker 1: scandalous that they invited a debate guest named Tony Bobulinski,
• 14:52
  Speaker 1: a disgruntled former associate of Hunter's. It's sort of just
• 14:55
  Speaker 1: funny when you say it. If you're having trouble following
• 14:58
  Speaker 1: the details of the story, so is Donald Trump. Here's
• 15:02
  Speaker 1: how the exchange went.
• 15:03
  Speaker 8: They were paying you a lot of money and they
• 15:05
  Speaker 8: probably still are. But now with what came out today,
• 15:09
  Speaker 8: it's even worse. All of the emails, the emails, the
• 15:12
  Speaker 8: horrible emails of the kind of money that you were
• 15:14
  Speaker 8: raking in, you and your family. And Joe, you were
• 15:17
  Speaker 8: vice president when some of this was happening and it
• 15:20
  Speaker 8: should have never happened. And I think you owe an
• 15:23
  Speaker 8: explanation to the American people. Why is it somebody just
• 15:27
  Speaker 8: had a news conference a little while ago who was
• 15:29
  Speaker 8: essentially supposed to work with you and your family But
• 15:33
  Speaker 8: what he said was damning.
• 15:34
  Speaker 9: I have not taken a single penny from any country whatsoever, ever.
• 15:39
  Speaker 7: Number one.
• 15:40
  Speaker 9: Number two, this is a president. I have released all
• 15:43
  Speaker 9: of my tax returns.
• 15:45
  Speaker 7: 22 years. Go look at them.
• 15:47
  Speaker 9: 22 years of my tax return. You have not released
• 15:50
  Speaker 9: a single solitary year of your tax return. What are
• 15:53
  Speaker 9: you hiding? Why are you unwilling? The foreign countries are
• 15:57
  Speaker 9: paying you a lot. Russia's paying you a lot. China's
• 16:00
  Speaker 9: paying you a lot. And your hotels and all your
• 16:02
  Speaker 9: businesses all around the country, all around the world.
• 16:05
  Speaker 7: And China's building a new road to a new golf
• 16:09
  Speaker 7: course you have overseas. So what's going on here?
• 16:12
  Speaker 9: Why don't you release your tax return or stop talking
• 16:14
  Speaker 9: about corruption?
• 16:15
  Speaker 1: So that was it. That was a big moment. Tommy,
• 16:17
  Speaker 1: what becomes of Tony Bobulinski and the big email scandal?
• 16:19
  Speaker 4: I don't know that Tony B is making it to
• 16:22
  Speaker 4: the next round here. I mean, they tried to spoon
• 16:24
  Speaker 4: feed whatever these allegations are. I barely understand them. to
• 16:28
  Speaker 4: Kim Strassel, who might as well be, you know, a
• 16:31
  Speaker 4: member of the Trump family. She's just a hack on
• 16:33
  Speaker 4: the editorial side at the Wall Street Journal. And then
• 16:36
  Speaker 4: the Wall Street Journal's actual news reporters, their political reporters,
• 16:40
  Speaker 4: wrote a hard news article about the same allegations that
• 16:43
  Speaker 4: completely undercut any argument that Joe Biden did anything wrong.
• 16:47
  Speaker 4: There's no evidence at all in these emails that Trump
• 16:49
  Speaker 4: is referencing there that Joe Biden did anything wrong.
• 16:51
  Speaker 6: So this thing fell completely flat. And then I thought
• 16:54
  Speaker 6: the rejoinder.
• 16:55
  Speaker 4: Of just release your tax returns It was so simple.
• 16:58
  Speaker 4: And it sounds crazy four years into being president to
• 17:01
  Speaker 4: still be claiming about an audit. And again, he's speaking
• 17:03
  Speaker 4: MAGA saying I get treated worse than the Tea Party
• 17:05
  Speaker 4: was treated.
• 17:06
  Speaker 6: No one knows what you're talking about.
• 17:08
  Speaker 7: This is a.
• 17:08
  Speaker 4: Reference to some made up scandal from like 2010, 2009. Yeah,
• 17:13
  Speaker 4: I don't. Trump did not win this exchange.
• 17:15
  Speaker 6: Not even close.
• 17:18
  Speaker 1: It's a.
• 17:19
  Speaker 3: It's very funny too.
• 17:20
  Speaker 2: Like they've been chopping this story around so hard and
• 17:22
  Speaker 2: they just sort of like, well, we've hit a dead
• 17:25
  Speaker 2: end in the nonfiction sections of the newspapers. We'll have
• 17:28
  Speaker 2: to move to the fiction section.
• 17:32
  Speaker 1: Dan, I found it amazing that Trump trots this out
• 17:35
  Speaker 1: and then he ends up on the defensive complaining about,
• 17:38
  Speaker 1: I called my accountant and I did all this. It
• 17:41
  Speaker 1: ended up being worse for Trump than it was supposed
• 17:43
  Speaker 1: to be for Biden. I also thought, by the way,
• 17:45
  Speaker 1: you could tell that Biden's most practiced moments were defensive
• 17:49
  Speaker 1: moments trying to anticipate what Trump was going to come
• 17:52
  Speaker 1: at him with. Because I thought some of the best
• 17:54
  Speaker 1: moments Biden had were in response to Trump.
• 17:56
  Speaker 5: Well, it was probably pretty easy for the Biden team
• 17:59
  Speaker 5: to do that because the Trump advisors just.
• 18:01
  Speaker 3: Have a direct... redline phone.
• 18:03
  Speaker 5: To Axios to tell them the entire debate strategy on
• 18:05
  Speaker 5: a minute-by-minute basis. It wasn't hard to anticipate this was coming.
• 18:11
  Speaker 5: I think my takeaway from that whole exchange is that
• 18:14
  Speaker 5: Trump is the laziest man in America. He was too
• 18:17
  Speaker 5: lazy to even come up with a coherent lie about
• 18:21
  Speaker 5: his favorite conspiracy theory. Let's say you were someone who
• 18:25
  Speaker 5: was prepping Trump for a debate. That would mean that
• 18:27
  Speaker 5: you were a pretty stupid racist person without self-worth or shame.
• 18:31
  Speaker 5: But let's say you were doing that for a second.
• 18:34
  Speaker 5: There were two moments you would prepare for, right? They're
• 18:36
  Speaker 5: the two key moments. Your number one offensive moment is
• 18:38
  Speaker 5: you were going to nail Joe Biden on this laptop.
• 18:42
  Speaker 5: Trump didn't learn how to pronounce the guy's name, so
• 18:44
  Speaker 5: he couldn't say it. There was no story to tell.
• 18:48
  Speaker 5: He didn't bother to learn the Cliff Notes version of
• 18:51
  Speaker 5: the fake conspiracy theory to attack him. And then the
• 18:53
  Speaker 5: other moment, which I think we're gonna talk about is healthcare,
• 18:55
  Speaker 5: where Trump has gotten his ass handed to him on
• 18:58
  Speaker 5: healthcare twice in the last five days, right? Savannah Guthrie
• 19:02
  Speaker 5: did it. And then Leslie Stahl did it. And you
• 19:04
  Speaker 5: know it's coming. And he didn't even bother to learn
• 19:06
  Speaker 5: three bullet points for that answer. It's like he mailed
• 19:09
  Speaker 5: it in, like new tone aside, not throwing temper tantrum,
• 19:12
  Speaker 5: but he had put no effort into trying to do
• 19:15
  Speaker 5: anything on that debate stage to win this election.
• 19:26
  Speaker 1: Well, I think this is an example of where not
• 19:27
  Speaker 1: only does his staff not help him, but the MAGA
• 19:30
  Speaker 1: media doesn't help him either because they don't have a
• 19:33
  Speaker 1: good story for this, right? Like all of these opinion
• 19:35
  Speaker 1: columns and all the other stuff, like they tell like
• 19:38
  Speaker 1: an indecipherable story about this. There's no real corruption there.
• 19:41
  Speaker 1: The hard straight news reporters at Wall Street Journal, Fox
• 19:45
  Speaker 1: and New York Post have all debunked this story. So
• 19:47
  Speaker 1: there really isn't a good story for Trump to even
• 19:50
  Speaker 1: grab onto. So all he's left to is just be like,
• 19:52
  Speaker 1: the emails are bad, the laptop from hell. You made
• 19:54
  Speaker 1: a lot of money like he can't understand the scandal.
• 19:57
  Speaker 1: But as you pointed out, like at some point, Joe
• 19:59
  Speaker 1: Biden tried to move the debate away from major issues
• 20:02
  Speaker 1: like Hunter's laptop to more trivial things like health care
• 20:04
  Speaker 1: and the economy. Trump was not a fan of that approach.
• 20:08
  Speaker 1: Here's the exchange.
• 20:09
  Speaker 7: There's a reason why he's bringing up all this malarkey.
• 20:13
  Speaker 7: There's a reason for it.
• 20:14
  Speaker 9: He doesn't want to talk about the substantive issues. It's
• 20:18
  Speaker 9: not about his family and my family. It's about your family.
• 20:21
  Speaker 9: And your family's hurting badly. If you're making less than...
• 20:24
  Speaker 9: If you're a middle-class family, you're getting hurt badly right now.
• 20:29
  Speaker 9: You're sitting at the kitchen table this morning deciding, well,
• 20:31
  Speaker 9: we can't get new tires. They're bald because we have
• 20:34
  Speaker 9: to wait another month or so. Or are we going
• 20:35
  Speaker 9: to be able to pay the mortgage? Or who's going
• 20:37
  Speaker 9: to tell her she can't go back to... to community college.
• 20:40
  Speaker 9: They're the decisions you're making, and the middle-class families like
• 20:43
  Speaker 9: I grew up in Scranton and Claymont.
• 20:45
  Speaker 7: They're in trouble.
• 20:47
  Speaker 9: We should be talking about your families, but that's the
• 20:49
  Speaker 9: last thing he wants to talk about.
• 20:51
  Speaker 10: I want to talk about North Korea.
• 20:54
  Speaker 3: I do want to turn to 10 seconds, Mr.
• 20:56
  Speaker 5: President.
• 20:56
  Speaker 10: That's a typical political statement.
• 20:58
  Speaker 8: Let's get off this China thing. And then he looks,
• 21:00
  Speaker 8: the family, around the table, everything. Just a typical politician
• 21:04
  Speaker 8: when I see that.
• 21:04
  Speaker 3: Let's talk about North Korea now. I'm not a typical politician.
• 21:06
  Speaker 8: That's why I got elected. Let's get off the subject
• 21:10
  Speaker 8: of China. Let's talk around sitting around the table.
• 21:12
  Speaker 1: That was the new tone that everyone is celebrating today.
• 21:15
  Speaker 3: The new tone.
• 21:16
  Speaker 6: Love it.
• 21:17
  Speaker 1: Matt Iglesias at Vox pointed out that One big difference
• 21:20
  Speaker 1: between 2016 Trump and 2020 Trump is that Trump used
• 21:23
  Speaker 1: to pretend to be populist back then. But right there,
• 21:26
  Speaker 1: he was mocking Biden for talking about struggling families. He
• 21:29
  Speaker 1: also later complained that raising the minimum wage would hurt businesses.
• 21:32
  Speaker 1: I don't know, it seemed like an underrated, damaging moment
• 21:36
  Speaker 1: for him.
• 21:37
  Speaker 2: Look, he was trying to do his roast comic thing,
• 21:39
  Speaker 2: trying to say that it's phony. Like, it is him
• 21:42
  Speaker 2: mocking Joe Biden for talking about people's kind of core
• 21:45
  Speaker 2: economic concerns. But at the same time, I really think
• 21:48
  Speaker 2: the problem there is Joe Biden turns to the camera
• 21:50
  Speaker 2: and says, I want to talk about.
• 21:52
  Speaker 3: What we're going to do for your families. I want
• 21:53
  Speaker 3: to talk to you directly. I want to talk about
• 21:54
  Speaker 3: the problems you're facing.
• 21:56
  Speaker 2: And throughout this debate, I mean, like to what Dan
• 21:59
  Speaker 2: said earlier, like Trump is refusing to do the basics
• 22:01
  Speaker 2: of normal politics, right? Like that's where he's really losing.
• 22:04
  Speaker 2: Like he won't, he's been asked about preexisting conditions over
• 22:07
  Speaker 2: and over and over again. Joe Biden, he's asked about
• 22:10
  Speaker 2: court packing again and again and again. And finally, they
• 22:13
  Speaker 2: come up with an answer. an answer that they can
• 22:15
  Speaker 2: dispense with that issue and move forward. They do some
• 22:17
  Speaker 2: normal politics. Trump now doesn't have an answer on his
• 22:20
  Speaker 2: tax returns. He doesn't have an answer on pre-existing conditions.
• 22:22
  Speaker 2: He doesn't have an answer for what he wants to
• 22:23
  Speaker 2: do in his second term. So what he's really left
• 22:25
  Speaker 2: with is this kind of Dennis Leary shtick. And I
• 22:28
  Speaker 2: feel like the tickets are not selling like they once were.
• 22:32
  Speaker 3: It just doesn't work. It's just so small and so
• 22:35
  Speaker 3: petty on that stage.
• 22:36
  Speaker 1: Yeah, Tommy, I feel like he didn't really, like at
• 22:38
  Speaker 1: no point did Trump try to turn this on well,
• 22:42
  Speaker 1: here's what I'm going to do for you or here's
• 22:43
  Speaker 1: what I've done for you. Like at one point, Biden's
• 22:45
  Speaker 1: talking about how well billionaires have done under Trump. And
• 22:48
  Speaker 1: Trump responds by saying, you're not really from Scranton.
• 22:51
  Speaker 7: Yeah.
• 22:51
  Speaker 3: I mean, he's like, excuse me, excuse me.
• 22:54
  Speaker 4: Let me interrupt and say something incredibly damaging about myself
• 22:57
  Speaker 4: and my campaign. I mean, like you don't have to
• 23:00
  Speaker 4: like Joe Biden, but I think you come away thinking
• 23:02
  Speaker 4: that he actually is in politics to do things for
• 23:05
  Speaker 4: real people. And Trump is not. He views politics as
• 23:09
  Speaker 4: a competition thing. You know, his rejoinders are about how
• 23:11
  Speaker 4: he could fundraise more if he played by a different
• 23:14
  Speaker 4: set of rules. He could raise more from Wall Street
• 23:17
  Speaker 4: if you would give them kickbacks.
• 23:19
  Speaker 5: Right.
• 23:19
  Speaker 4: Like it's all about the game and the sport of
• 23:21
  Speaker 4: it for him. And so, yes, it's a prepared line
• 23:24
  Speaker 4: to like speak to the people at home directly about
• 23:26
  Speaker 4: their concerns. But you come away thinking Joe Biden means it.
• 23:30
  Speaker 4: And I think those sorts of unity moments and bringing
• 23:32
  Speaker 4: it back to first principles about why we're all here
• 23:35
  Speaker 4: to give people more health care, to give them better
• 23:36
  Speaker 4: wages is to, you know, deal with climate change are
• 23:39
  Speaker 4: what people want to hear. And Trump just like doesn't
• 23:41
  Speaker 4: get that.
• 23:42
  Speaker 6: It's all a sport.
• 23:43
  Speaker 2: Trump giving Joe Biden a rotten tomato on a performance
• 23:46
  Speaker 2: moment is not an argument for Donald Trump to continue
• 23:49
  Speaker 2: being president.
• 23:50
  Speaker 3: It's just nothing. It doesn't have anything to do with
• 23:52
  Speaker 3: what we're talking about.
• 23:53
  Speaker 1: Dan, that's what really struck me. And this is also
• 23:55
  Speaker 1: going to come up in the 60 Minutes interview on
• 23:58
  Speaker 1: Sunday that Trump released early because he had a tantrum.
• 24:00
  Speaker 1: Like I didn't, watching that debate last night for 90 minutes,
• 24:04
  Speaker 1: like if you were looking for Any hint of a
• 24:08
  Speaker 1: second term agenda from Donald Trump? Like, what did you hear?
• 24:11
  Speaker 3: Nothing.
• 24:11
  Speaker 5: If you were looking for a hint of a plan
• 24:13
  Speaker 5: to win reelection, you would find nothing. Right. I mean,
• 24:16
  Speaker 5: just like it is just Trump standing on stage being Trump.
• 24:20
  Speaker 5: Sometimes he's giant asshole Trump. Sometimes he's subtle asshole Trump.
• 24:23
  Speaker 5: But it's just the same thing. He like he really
• 24:27
  Speaker 5: has no. I mean, I guess it's I guess it
• 24:30
  Speaker 5: is the entitlement of an insecure person. rich kid, which
• 24:34
  Speaker 5: is essentially what Trump is, is that he thinks he
• 24:36
  Speaker 5: deserves re-election just because he's him. He's not doing anything
• 24:39
  Speaker 5: to try to get it. If you had any sort
• 24:43
  Speaker 5: of self-awareness, you would say, boy, people keep asking me
• 24:46
  Speaker 5: this question about what I'm going to do with the
• 24:47
  Speaker 5: second term that I'm asking people to give me. I'm
• 24:50
  Speaker 5: not currently leading in the effort to get that. So
• 24:53
  Speaker 5: is there something I should do differently? Maybe I should
• 24:54
  Speaker 5: come up with an answer to it. And he's offended
• 24:57
  Speaker 5: at the idea that he has to answer that question.
• 24:59
  Speaker 5: And that permeated itself throughout the debate. Like everyone is,
• 25:04
  Speaker 5: and I think we can debate how terrible the press
• 25:07
  Speaker 5: coverage or punditry about the debate is, and it's probably
• 25:09
  Speaker 5: a mixed bag, but the substance was actually just as
• 25:12
  Speaker 5: bad or worse this time too.
• 25:15
  Speaker 1: Sahil Kapur with NBC pointed this out. The most Google
• 25:18
  Speaker 1: searched issue last night was wages, right? So there's like
• 25:22
  Speaker 1: people sitting home hearing a conversation about minimum wage where
• 25:25
  Speaker 1: Donald Trump complains about it and Joe Biden saying, I'm
• 25:27
  Speaker 1: going to raise minimum wage to $ 15. And they're not
• 25:30
  Speaker 1: caring about fucking Hunter's laptop or any of the bullshit
• 25:32
  Speaker 1: Trump's saying, like they're Googling wages. Because that matters to them.
• 25:35
  Speaker 5: I mean, like politics is not that complicated. You want
• 25:38
  Speaker 5: to be a likable person who supports popular policies that
• 25:41
  Speaker 5: people trust, right?
• 25:43
  Speaker 1: Right.
• 25:43
  Speaker 3: It's like that's the goal, right? It's not that– like
• 25:45
  Speaker 3: sometimes it's hard to achieve, but it's not hard to
• 25:47
  Speaker 3: put on the whiteboard. And Trump was unlikable lied and he.
• 25:51
  Speaker 5: Specifically jumped on the unpopular side of popular issues. There
• 25:55
  Speaker 5: was a minimum wage initiative, $ 15 minimum wage initiative on
• 25:58
  Speaker 5: the Florida ballot this year. The last poll I saw
• 26:01
  Speaker 5: for it saw two thirds of Floridians supporting a $ 15
• 26:03
  Speaker 5: minimum wage. These absolute must win state of which Trump
• 26:08
  Speaker 5: is a voter and a resident. He picked the one
• 26:11
  Speaker 5: third side of a two third side issue.
• 26:13
  Speaker 1: Which he had previously been for.
• 26:14
  Speaker 4: Yeah, and 43% of Republicans want to increase the minimum
• 26:17
  Speaker 4: wage to $ 15 an hour.
• 26:18
  Speaker 6: It's a wildly popular position.
• 26:20
  Speaker 3: Yes, John, you're right. That's why it's so stupid. He
• 26:22
  Speaker 3: already had the popular position and he abandoned it. Because
• 26:25
  Speaker 3: he doesn't know.
• 26:26
  Speaker 1: He can't remember which positions he's taken. He's fucking.
• 26:30
  Speaker 2: I would also just point out that the reason he
• 26:33
  Speaker 2: walked out on Leslie Stahl is because she asked a
• 26:35
  Speaker 2: hard question about healthcare and that question was how.
• 26:39
  Speaker 3: How are you going to do it?
• 26:43
  Speaker 1: Ow.
• 26:44
  Speaker 3: This is unfair.
• 26:45
  Speaker 10: This is unfair.
• 26:46
  Speaker 1: You're so angry. So there was a section on race
• 26:49
  Speaker 1: in America last night. Welker also asked Trump about the
• 26:51
  Speaker 1: over 500 immigrant children who still have not been reunited
• 26:54
  Speaker 1: with their parents because of the administration's family separation policy.
• 26:58
  Speaker 1: Trump responded to that by blaming Biden. And here's how
• 27:00
  Speaker 1: he responded to Welker's questions about race relations.
• 27:03
  Speaker 8: Nobody has done more for the black community than Donald Trump.
• 27:07
  Speaker 8: And if you look With the exception of Abraham Lincoln,
• 27:12
  Speaker 8: possible exception, but the exception of.
• 27:14
  Speaker 10: Abraham Lincoln, nobody has done what I've done. I am
• 27:18
  Speaker 10: the least racist person.
• 27:20
  Speaker 8: I can't even see the audience because it's so dark,
• 27:24
  Speaker 8: but I don't care who's in the audience.
• 27:25
  Speaker 10: I'm the least racist person in this room.
• 27:28
  Speaker 9: Abraham Lincoln here is one of the most racist presidents
• 27:30
  Speaker 9: we've had in modern history. He pours fuel on every
• 27:34
  Speaker 9: single racist fire.
• 27:37
  Speaker 10: You made a reference to Abraham Lincoln. Where did that
• 27:39
  Speaker 10: come in?
• 27:40
  Speaker 7: You said you're Abraham Lincoln. No, no.
• 27:44
  Speaker 8: I said not since Abraham Lincoln has anybody done what
• 27:48
  Speaker 8: I've done for the black community.
• 27:50
  Speaker 10: I didn't say I'm Abraham Lincoln.
• 27:52
  Speaker 1: Lovett, I wanted to ask you about this because we've
• 27:54
  Speaker 1: talked before about how Trump can be genuinely funny at times, right?
• 27:59
  Speaker 1: I thought in that moment that was one of Biden's
• 28:02
  Speaker 1: most genuinely funny moments of the debate or the campaign
• 28:05
  Speaker 1: and Trump didn't really get the humor of making the
• 28:09
  Speaker 1: Abraham Lincoln joke.
• 28:10
  Speaker 2: Well, whether he gets it or not, One thing he
• 28:13
  Speaker 2: cannot understand is a joke at his own expense, right?
• 28:17
  Speaker 3: That doesn't compute. What do you mean?
• 28:19
  Speaker 2: My rhetoric was quite clear. I didn't say I was
• 28:20
  Speaker 2: Abraham Lincoln. I said I was as good as, if
• 28:23
  Speaker 2: not better than Abraham Lincoln. Your joke doesn't make sense.
• 28:26
  Speaker 2: I award you no points for your joke as a
• 28:28
  Speaker 2: comedy person. That's what he was doing. But yeah, like,
• 28:32
  Speaker 2: you know, look, Trump is occasionally funny, more often than
• 28:36
  Speaker 2: not funny by accident. And we've never seen him laugh, right?
• 28:39
  Speaker 2: So that tells you just how receptive he is to
• 28:41
  Speaker 2: a joke about himself.
• 28:44
  Speaker 1: Tommy, Trump campaign strategy has been to reduce Biden's margins
• 28:48
  Speaker 1: among black and Latino voters, particularly younger black and Latino men.
• 28:52
  Speaker 1: Do you think he did anything to further that goal
• 28:54
  Speaker 1: with any of his answers last night in those sections?
• 28:57
  Speaker 4: I think it's hard for me to judge. I think
• 28:59
  Speaker 4: there's a fair critique of Joe Biden's record when it
• 29:02
  Speaker 4: comes to the crime bill. But instead, Trump keeps accusing
• 29:06
  Speaker 4: him of using the term super predators, which isn't accurate.
• 29:10
  Speaker 4: And I don't know why you wouldn't stick to a
• 29:12
  Speaker 4: much more relevant criticism when it comes to that 1994 bill.
• 29:18
  Speaker 4: And when Trump talks about his accomplishment when it comes
• 29:20
  Speaker 4: to helping the African-American community, he focuses on such narrow things.
• 29:24
  Speaker 4: It's like a slight increase in HBCU funding over the years,
• 29:28
  Speaker 4: a tiny incremental bit of progress when it comes to
• 29:31
  Speaker 4: criminal justice reform. So I don't know that he made
• 29:34
  Speaker 4: the case particularly well. It ended in a bunch of
• 29:38
  Speaker 4: complaining that people he had worked with when it came
• 29:40
  Speaker 4: to criminal justice reform no longer are nice to him publicly, right?
• 29:44
  Speaker 4: That was the thrust of where he ended up with
• 29:46
  Speaker 4: his answer.
• 29:48
  Speaker 1: Dan, this was the section on both immigration and criminal
• 29:52
  Speaker 1: justice reform where Trump really dug into the Joe Biden
• 29:55
  Speaker 1: had eight years as vice president and did nothing. He's
• 29:58
  Speaker 1: all talk, no action. What did you think about that
• 30:01
  Speaker 1: line of attack from Trump, which he really hammered home
• 30:04
  Speaker 1: in that section?
• 30:05
  Speaker 5: It would be a better message than whatever his message
• 30:08
  Speaker 5: has been about Biden. One of Trump's problems is he
• 30:11
  Speaker 5: has been unable to pick a message about Biden and
• 30:15
  Speaker 5: stick to it for a long period of time. Has dementia,
• 30:18
  Speaker 5: sleepy Joe, doesn't leave the basement, oh, maybe he's too
• 30:22
  Speaker 5: coherent to have to mention, oh, he's a criminal mastermind
• 30:24
  Speaker 5: with Hunter, or he's an Antifa super soldier. He's never
• 30:27
  Speaker 5: figured it out. I've always thought that typical politician, 47
• 30:31
  Speaker 5: years in Washington, was potentially a more effective message. I
• 30:35
  Speaker 5: don't know that it overrides Trump's own conduct or his
• 30:38
  Speaker 5: failure to deal with this pandemic, but it would be
• 30:40
  Speaker 5: one that probably had a little more chance of success.
• 30:42
  Speaker 5: I think the mistake Trump made is A better attack
• 30:45
  Speaker 5: on Biden is he's been in Washington for 47 years
• 30:48
  Speaker 5: and hasn't solved these problems. Then remember this presidency that
• 30:51
  Speaker 5: was just four years ago that you're really nostalgic for
• 30:54
  Speaker 5: and the president in that presidency has an approval rating
• 30:58
  Speaker 5: in the 60s? That's bad. I think that is a
• 31:03
  Speaker 5: too recent touchstone and that administration's policies and president are
• 31:07
  Speaker 5: too popular to make that be the specific part. But
• 31:09
  Speaker 5: at least it was a– you could kind of– if
• 31:12
  Speaker 5: you squint, you can see strategy in it.
• 31:15
  Speaker 6: I'm sorry, I forgot one thing.
• 31:15
  Speaker 4: I forgot that Trump just kept ranting over and over
• 31:18
  Speaker 4: again that he's the least racist person in the room,
• 31:20
  Speaker 4: including the moderator, who is an African-American woman, which was
• 31:25
  Speaker 4: normally if someone is shouting at you that they're the
• 31:28
  Speaker 4: least racist person you've ever met, they're probably pretty racist.
• 31:31
  Speaker 4: So I'm not sure that played particularly well in that answer.
• 31:34
  Speaker 3: They're probably not wearing a mask at a Trader Joe's.
• 31:40
  Speaker 1: Tommy, there were a lot of like little moments like
• 31:42
  Speaker 1: that in that section that just sort of went unremarked.
• 31:44
  Speaker 1: Like they're talking about immigrants showing up for their court
• 31:48
  Speaker 1: hearings to find out whether they're going to be deported
• 31:51
  Speaker 1: or allowed to stay. And Joe Biden's pointing out that
• 31:55
  Speaker 1: most immigrants come back for their court hearings. They don't
• 31:58
  Speaker 1: just like go out into the country. And then Trump's like,
• 32:00
  Speaker 1: only the ones with the lowest IQ come back for
• 32:03
  Speaker 1: their court hearings.
• 32:03
  Speaker 6: That was very weird.
• 32:04
  Speaker 1: Just incredibly offensive. So there are moments like that. But
• 32:07
  Speaker 1: I do think like, To the point, Dan, about the,
• 32:10
  Speaker 1: you know, you've been there for 47 years. Like, Biden,
• 32:13
  Speaker 1: I think, missed an opportunity in that section. And it's
• 32:15
  Speaker 1: one I think he can seize in the final couple
• 32:18
  Speaker 1: days if Trump continues this line of attack. Like, it
• 32:21
  Speaker 1: would work better for Trump if Trump was the challenger
• 32:23
  Speaker 1: and Biden was the incumbent. But like, all you have
• 32:26
  Speaker 1: to do is turn to Donald Trump and say like, yeah,
• 32:28
  Speaker 1: I was vice president for eight years. You're president now.
• 32:31
  Speaker 1: And we have 200,000 Americans dead of COVID. We have
• 32:35
  Speaker 1: an economy in recession. You haven't done anything to come
• 32:38
  Speaker 1: up with a deal for a stimulus package. What have
• 32:41
  Speaker 1: you done these last four years? What are you talking about?
• 32:44
  Speaker 1: You haven't done anything. You haven't passed shit. Like, I
• 32:47
  Speaker 1: just think there's an easy rejoinder to that, even though
• 32:50
  Speaker 1: I do agree it can be an effective line of attack.
• 32:53
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I was also a bit frustrated just because I
• 32:55
  Speaker 2: thought that that was maybe when Biden said we had
• 32:58
  Speaker 2: a Republican Congress and kind of looked at Trump like
• 32:59
  Speaker 2: that was sort of a kind of a checkmate. I
• 33:02
  Speaker 2: felt like it was a little bit of an excuse.
• 33:04
  Speaker 2: And I I understand why he went there. But, you know,
• 33:08
  Speaker 2: the fundamental attack, you didn't do anything in all of
• 33:10
  Speaker 2: your time. Like there's a I think a substantive argument
• 33:13
  Speaker 2: about like about how progress works in America, that progress
• 33:16
  Speaker 2: takes time and you solve a lot of problems as
• 33:18
  Speaker 2: much as you can over eight years. But there's work
• 33:20
  Speaker 2: to finish. Like you use the time as best as
• 33:22
  Speaker 2: you can. Look how you failed. Over the last four
• 33:24
  Speaker 2: years to use your time to do anything to help people.
• 33:26
  Speaker 2: I want to keep doing building on.
• 33:27
  Speaker 3: The progress we made. Is the job done? Of course not.
• 33:29
  Speaker 2: Like, I think that there is a more a less
• 33:31
  Speaker 2: defensive response to that kind of criticism.
• 33:34
  Speaker 1: That's it's true, though. I will say Trump opened the
• 33:37
  Speaker 1: section about the stimulus negotiations with the reason I haven't
• 33:40
  Speaker 1: got it done yet is because of Nancy Pelosi. He
• 33:43
  Speaker 1: did the exact same.
• 33:44
  Speaker 3: That's true. That's true.
• 33:54
  Speaker 1: One reason the debate was pretty great is that we
• 33:56
  Speaker 1: got our first ever section on climate change. The result
• 33:58
  Speaker 1: was Donald Trump ranting about the dangers of wind and
• 34:01
  Speaker 1: tiny windows and Joe Biden expressing support for a transition
• 34:04
  Speaker 1: away from fossil fuels like oil, which is a position
• 34:06
  Speaker 1: that's apparently controversial with not only Republicans, but many of
• 34:09
  Speaker 1: the pundits and reporters covering the debate. Here's a clip.
• 34:13
  Speaker 8: They want to knock down buildings and build new buildings
• 34:16
  Speaker 8: with little, tiny, small windows.
• 34:18
  Speaker 10: I mean, and many other things.
• 34:20
  Speaker 3: And many other things. Let me have the vice president respond.
• 34:22
  Speaker 7: And we're running out of time.
• 34:23
  Speaker 3: And we have a lot more questions.
• 34:26
  Speaker 10: We are energy independent. I know more about wind than
• 34:29
  Speaker 10: you do.
• 34:29
  Speaker 8: It's extremely expensive, kills all the birds. It's very intermittent.
• 34:35
  Speaker 8: It's got a lot of problems. And they happen to
• 34:36
  Speaker 8: make the windmills in both Germany and China.
• 34:39
  Speaker 7: I have one final question.
• 34:41
  Speaker 10: Would he close down the oil industry?
• 34:42
  Speaker 1: It falls.
• 34:42
  Speaker 10: Would you close down the oil industry?
• 34:44
  Speaker 7: By the way, I would transition from the oil industry, yes.
• 34:47
  Speaker 10: Oh, that's a big statement.
• 34:48
  Speaker 7: I would transition. It is a big statement.
• 34:49
  Speaker 10: That's a big statement.
• 34:50
  Speaker 7: Because I would stop.
• 34:51
  Speaker 3: Why would you do that?
• 34:52
  Speaker 9: Because the oil industry pollutes significantly.
• 34:56
  Speaker 10: I see.
• 34:56
  Speaker 7: Here's the deal.
• 34:57
  Speaker 10: But you can't do that.
• 34:57
  Speaker 7: That's a big statement.
• 34:58
  Speaker 9: Well, if you let me finish the statement, because it
• 35:01
  Speaker 9: has to be replaced by renewable energy over time, over time.
• 35:06
  Speaker 9: And I'd stop giving... to the oil industry, I'd stop
• 35:09
  Speaker 9: giving them federal subsidies. He won't give federal subsidies to
• 35:12
  Speaker 9: the gas, excuse me, to solar and wind. Why are
• 35:18
  Speaker 9: we giving it to oil industry?
• 35:19
  Speaker 10: We actually do give it to solar and wind.
• 35:21
  Speaker 3: And that's maybe the biggest statement in terms of business.
• 35:24
  Speaker 10: That's the biggest statement. Because basically what he's saying is
• 35:27
  Speaker 10: he is going to destroy the oil industry.
• 35:31
  Speaker 1: I do not know how you can listen to Donald
• 35:32
  Speaker 1: Trump talk about tiny windows and wind killing birds and
• 35:36
  Speaker 1: be like, yeah, that was a good performance right there.
• 35:39
  Speaker 1: That guy nailed it. So, Dan, Biden did clarify after
• 35:43
  Speaker 1: the debate that he was talking about ending federal subsidies
• 35:45
  Speaker 1: to the oil industry. I'm really not sure why that
• 35:47
  Speaker 1: was a clarification because we just heard him say that
• 35:50
  Speaker 1: specifically in the answer. Why do you think so many
• 35:52
  Speaker 1: pundits and reporters treated this as like a potential gaffe?
• 35:55
  Speaker 5: Because they need a gaffe and they hadn't had one yet, right?
• 35:59
  Speaker 3: Look, I mean, I think it's two separate.
• 36:02
  Speaker 5: But equally stupid things. One is this desperate desire for
• 36:07
  Speaker 5: some sort of change in the narrative. Joe Biden has
• 36:10
  Speaker 5: been winning by the same amount. within a point or
• 36:13
  Speaker 5: two for like six months now, right? And we keep
• 36:15
  Speaker 5: waiting for the, us included, keep waiting for the other
• 36:17
  Speaker 5: shoe to drop.
• 36:18
  Speaker 3: Will it be the debate?
• 36:19
  Speaker 5: Will it be because of COVID or will COVID recede
• 36:21
  Speaker 5: or a stimulus or all those things? And it has
• 36:23
  Speaker 5: not happened. The race has been locked in and incredibly
• 36:25
  Speaker 5: steady despite all the tumultuous news environment we're in. And
• 36:28
  Speaker 5: the other one is just this old school view of
• 36:31
  Speaker 5: politics that thinks climate change is bad. It is a
• 36:33
  Speaker 5: bad political issue. Democrats should be scared of climate change.
• 36:35
  Speaker 5: And that's just the wrong way of thinking about it.
• 36:37
  Speaker 5: It's an outdated view of the world. I mean, the
• 36:39
  Speaker 5: fact that it is like the germ of that notion
• 36:43
  Speaker 5: is embedded in your question, which is this is the
• 36:45
  Speaker 5: first ever section on climate change in a presidential debate.
• 36:49
  Speaker 5: We just had debates four years ago. The planet was
• 36:51
  Speaker 5: also melting four years ago. We didn't talk about it.
• 36:54
  Speaker 5: And the whole section was incredibly stupid because Trump, like
• 36:58
  Speaker 5: he doesn't understand the issue. He gets these little weird
• 37:01
  Speaker 5: things in his head like tiny windows or shower heads
• 37:05
  Speaker 5: or having to wash your dishes twice or his deep,
• 37:08
  Speaker 5: deceited concerns about toilet flushing that just they miss the point.
• 37:13
  Speaker 5: They're so disconnected from what people who care about the
• 37:15
  Speaker 5: planet think.
• 37:18
  Speaker 2: Well, the windmill thing is just a residue from not
• 37:21
  Speaker 2: wanting windmills to be an eyesore near his golf course.
• 37:23
  Speaker 2: It's like that's just an old bit of information that
• 37:26
  Speaker 2: kind of crawled its way in there before the memory.
• 37:28
  Speaker 6: Card got full.
• 37:30
  Speaker 1: But Tommy, I also think it's like, you know, Biden's
• 37:32
  Speaker 1: position on oil and climate in general, like, is the
• 37:35
  Speaker 1: popular position, right?
• 37:37
  Speaker 4: If you ask Americans whether they want to expand fossil
• 37:40
  Speaker 4: fuels or develop alternative energy, 79% of Americans say they
• 37:45
  Speaker 4: want to develop alternative energy. It's the more popular position.
• 37:49
  Speaker 4: He's not running for president of Texas and Oklahoma, right? Like,
• 37:52
  Speaker 4: people don't love big oil. They don't love fossil fuel subsidies. So, like,
• 37:56
  Speaker 4: I thought this was actually a strong... section for Biden.
• 38:00
  Speaker 4: And I'm not sure why the press corps, I guess
• 38:02
  Speaker 4: they were right. Like they're reading polling from like the
• 38:04
  Speaker 4: year 2000, if they thought that was a bad response. Also,
• 38:08
  Speaker 4: it's another example of Trump speaking his weird language, right?
• 38:11
  Speaker 4: He kept talking about AOC plus three. No one knows
• 38:14
  Speaker 4: what you're talking about. The small windows hit. That's not
• 38:17
  Speaker 4: what Democrats want. Democrats are saying, let's invest and create
• 38:20
  Speaker 4: a ton of jobs by replacing shitty old single pane
• 38:23
  Speaker 4: windows with like triple pane windows that are better insulated.
• 38:26
  Speaker 4: That takes investment and money and creates jobs. Like it's,
• 38:29
  Speaker 4: it's just none of the hits made any sense.
• 38:31
  Speaker 1: Even Texas, like the number of clean energy jobs in
• 38:35
  Speaker 1: Texas is through the roof. Like oil companies are investing
• 38:38
  Speaker 1: in clean energy, too. You know, like it's just like
• 38:39
  Speaker 1: the whole country is moving away from fossil fuels towards
• 38:43
  Speaker 1: clean energy. It's like it's not only popular, it's already happening.
• 38:47
  Speaker 1: And like, yes, there are going to be Democrats in,
• 38:51
  Speaker 1: you know, fossil fuel producing states that say we still
• 38:54
  Speaker 1: want to have some fossil fuels even as we move
• 38:57
  Speaker 1: towards a clean energy future.
• 38:58
  Speaker 9: Right.
• 38:58
  Speaker 1: Like there's obviously going to be Democrats that say that.
• 39:00
  Speaker 1: But the vastly popular position for someone running for president
• 39:04
  Speaker 1: is to invest in clean energy and to move away
• 39:07
  Speaker 1: from fossil fuels. That is an extremely popular position. So
• 39:10
  Speaker 1: the final question to Trump and Biden was about what
• 39:13
  Speaker 1: they'd say at their inauguration to the people who didn't
• 39:15
  Speaker 1: vote for them in this election. Here's the clip.
• 39:17
  Speaker 8: We have to make a country totally successful as it
• 39:20
  Speaker 8: was prior to.
• 39:21
  Speaker 10: The plague coming in from China.
• 39:23
  Speaker 8: Now we're rebuilding it and we're doing record numbers, 11.4
• 39:26
  Speaker 8: million jobs in a short period of time, et cetera.
• 39:29
  Speaker 10: But I will tell you, go back. Before the plague
• 39:31
  Speaker 10: came in, just before, I was getting.
• 39:33
  Speaker 8: Calls from people that were not normally people that would
• 39:37
  Speaker 8: call me.
• 39:37
  Speaker 10: They wanted to get together. We had the best black
• 39:41
  Speaker 10: unemployment numbers in the history of our country. Hispanic, women, Asian.
• 39:47
  Speaker 8: People with diplomas with no diplomas, MIT graduates number one
• 39:51
  Speaker 8: in the class, everybody had the best numbers.
• 39:54
  Speaker 10: And you know what? The other side wanted to get together.
• 39:56
  Speaker 8: They wanted to unify. Success is going to bring us together.
• 40:01
  Speaker 8: We are on the road to success. But I'm cutting taxes,
• 40:04
  Speaker 8: and he wants to raise everybody's taxes, and he wants
• 40:06
  Speaker 8: to put new regulations on everything.
• 40:08
  Speaker 10: He will kill it.
• 40:10
  Speaker 8: If he gets in, you will have a depression the
• 40:12
  Speaker 8: likes of which you've never seen. Your 401 s will
• 40:15
  Speaker 8: go to hell. And it'll be a very, very sad
• 40:18
  Speaker 8: day for this country.
• 40:19
  Speaker 1: Inspiring. Do we have the Biden clip?
• 40:21
  Speaker 6: Morning in America there.
• 40:22
  Speaker 9: I will say I'm an American president. I represent all
• 40:26
  Speaker 9: of you, whether you voted for me or against me.
• 40:29
  Speaker 9: And I'm going to make sure that you're represented. I'm
• 40:32
  Speaker 9: going to give you hope. We're going to move. We're
• 40:33
  Speaker 9: going to choose science over fiction. We're going to choose
• 40:36
  Speaker 9: hope over fear. We're going to choose to move forward
• 40:39
  Speaker 9: because we have enormous opportunities, enormous opportunities to make things better.
• 40:44
  Speaker 9: We can grow this economy. We can deal with the
• 40:47
  Speaker 9: systemic racism. And at the same time, we can make
• 40:50
  Speaker 9: sure that our economy is being run and moved and
• 40:54
  Speaker 9: motivated by clean energy, creating millions of new jobs.
• 40:59
  Speaker 7: And that's the fact. That's what we're going to do.
• 41:01
  Speaker 9: And I'm going to say, as I said at the beginning,
• 41:04
  Speaker 9: what is on the ballot here is the character of
• 41:07
  Speaker 9: this country. Decency, honor, respect, treating people with dignity, making
• 41:13
  Speaker 9: sure that everyone has an even chance. And I'm going
• 41:15
  Speaker 9: to make sure you get that. You haven't been getting
• 41:18
  Speaker 9: it the last four years.
• 41:19
  Speaker 1: So every scientific poll conducted after the debate showed Biden
• 41:23
  Speaker 1: was the winner. CNN was 53-39. Data for Progress was 52-41.
• 41:28
  Speaker 1: YouGov was 54-35. And the CNN focus group of undecided
• 41:32
  Speaker 1: voters in North Carolina had nine going for Biden, two
• 41:34
  Speaker 1: saying it was a tie, and zero for Trump. Frank
• 41:37
  Speaker 1: Luntz's focus group was a little more favorable to Trump.
• 41:40
  Speaker 1: And of course, Trump crushed it in the Twitter polls
• 41:42
  Speaker 1: on right-wing media websites.
• 41:45
  Speaker 6: Love it.
• 41:46
  Speaker 1: How does how does this debate set up the final
• 41:48
  Speaker 1: week of the campaign? And what do you think about
• 41:50
  Speaker 1: all these Republican operatives crowing about Donald Trump's performance today?
• 41:55
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, look, this is what they've been given.
• 41:56
  Speaker 2: This is the clay they'll have to mold into some
• 42:00
  Speaker 2: kind of a pleasant shape. I've seen all of Trump's
• 42:02
  Speaker 2: intellectual zambonis saying that the oil answer was a historic
• 42:05
  Speaker 2: gaffe that will carry Trump through the rest of the campaign.
• 42:08
  Speaker 2: Rick Santorum was incredibly laudatory on CNN about just how
• 42:13
  Speaker 2: well Donald Trump had done. Like you could see it
• 42:15
  Speaker 2: in their eyes by the end, even Trump in that
• 42:17
  Speaker 2: final answer, kind of going back to do a hit
• 42:20
  Speaker 2: on Biden, the sense that like he hadn't landed anything. Oh,
• 42:23
  Speaker 2: I didn't do the tax hit I was supposed to
• 42:24
  Speaker 2: do during the tax section.
• 42:25
  Speaker 3: I fucked that up. I got to land this.
• 42:27
  Speaker 2: He came back to China. He kept coming back to
• 42:29
  Speaker 2: the hits that he just couldn't get to land. And
• 42:31
  Speaker 2: I thought it was an interesting twist on what happened
• 42:33
  Speaker 2: in the first debate. In the first debate, Trump came
• 42:35
  Speaker 2: there to throw Joe Biden off. In this debate, I
• 42:37
  Speaker 2: think Joe Biden kind of tried to push Donald Trump's buttons.
• 42:39
  Speaker 2: And by the end of the debate, I think it
• 42:41
  Speaker 2: really had worked. You saw like Joe Biden felt really confident.
• 42:44
  Speaker 2: He was interrupting just a little bit. He was pointing
• 42:46
  Speaker 2: things out. He delivers that big sweeping close kind of
• 42:49
  Speaker 2: disregarding what Donald Trump had done.
• 42:50
  Speaker 3: So, you know. They didn't need a draw. They didn't
• 42:53
  Speaker 3: need a close loss.
• 42:54
  Speaker 2: They needed Donald Trump to do something Donald Trump couldn't do,
• 42:56
  Speaker 2: which is deliver an incredible transformative debate performance. Does that
• 43:00
  Speaker 2: mean Trump can't still win? No, but it does mean
• 43:03
  Speaker 2: that the dynamic shift that they needed to make in
• 43:05
  Speaker 2: this debate did not happen.
• 43:08
  Speaker 1: Tommy, what did you think?
• 43:09
  Speaker 4: Yeah, look, Joe Biden was very good and he talked
• 43:12
  Speaker 4: about things people care about and he did it in
• 43:14
  Speaker 4: a way that seemed honest and earnest and like he
• 43:16
  Speaker 4: would unite the country. And I think that ultimately is
• 43:19
  Speaker 4: what a lot of people want to hear. The Trump
• 43:21
  Speaker 4: strategy has been to tell us for months that Joe
• 43:24
  Speaker 4: Biden has dementia and will never make it to the
• 43:28
  Speaker 4: inauguration day, right? And instead, he got out debated. You know,
• 43:32
  Speaker 4: Biden looks sharp. And all the hits that he brought
• 43:35
  Speaker 4: to the debate about the Biden family, about traditional politician,
• 43:40
  Speaker 4: about taxes, none of them really landed well, and they
• 43:43
  Speaker 4: ended up kind of jumbled. So it's hard for me.
• 43:46
  Speaker 4: I'm trying to like, not be a partisan Democrat here,
• 43:50
  Speaker 4: but I don't feel good about how good I feel
• 43:53
  Speaker 4: right now. I feel like I should be more anxious
• 43:58
  Speaker 4: about the state of the race 11 days out, but
• 44:00
  Speaker 4: it was hard to watch that performance last night and
• 44:03
  Speaker 4: not come away thinking like Joe Biden did a hell
• 44:05
  Speaker 4: of a good job and Donald Trump is kind of flailing.
• 44:07
  Speaker 1: Dan, let me ask it this way. Do you think
• 44:09
  Speaker 1: any of the Republican crowing today about how great Donald
• 44:14
  Speaker 1: Trump did is not just posturing. Like, do you think
• 44:18
  Speaker 1: there are some operatives out there who run campaigns and
• 44:23
  Speaker 1: look at data and watch last night and thought, this
• 44:26
  Speaker 1: might get us some more voters. This might stop the bleeding.
• 44:29
  Speaker 1: This might be the beginning of a comeback. I feel
• 44:32
  Speaker 1: good about this.
• 44:32
  Speaker 3: Sort of.
• 44:33
  Speaker 5: I don't think they necessarily think that about Trump. I
• 44:37
  Speaker 5: think that the people who are running races in red
• 44:40
  Speaker 5: states for Republican senatorial and congressional and gubernatorial candidates were
• 44:44
  Speaker 5: running panicking that Trump is going to deliver a performance
• 44:47
  Speaker 5: similar to the first one, which would further shift politics
• 44:51
  Speaker 5: more broadly in the Democratic discussion. So I think Trump
• 44:55
  Speaker 5: didn't do anything here that changes the dynamic of the race.
• 44:58
  Speaker 5: And that is a gigantic, huge win for Biden. But
• 45:01
  Speaker 5: he did make his situation worse. And we're looking at
• 45:04
  Speaker 5: all these races in these red states in the polls
• 45:06
  Speaker 5: we're seeing, like Montana and Alaska and South Carolina. These
• 45:09
  Speaker 5: races are on the cusp. In order for the Democrats
• 45:13
  Speaker 5: to win those races, they need some number of Republicans
• 45:16
  Speaker 5: to vote for them. And the crazier Trump seems, the
• 45:19
  Speaker 5: more repellent his conduct is, the more he pours gasoline
• 45:24
  Speaker 5: on fires, the easier it is to get some of
• 45:26
  Speaker 5: those voters to come out. So I do think that
• 45:27
  Speaker 5: there is some, I don't think it's celebration, but I
• 45:29
  Speaker 5: do think there is some relief from some Republicans running
• 45:32
  Speaker 5: races that Trump was not as bad as he was
• 45:34
  Speaker 5: the first time.
• 45:37
  Speaker 1: I would be incredibly surprised if there was a single
• 45:39
  Speaker 1: voter who was backing Joe Biden or leaning towards Joe
• 45:43
  Speaker 1: Biden heading into that debate that said, I'm going to
• 45:47
  Speaker 1: change my mind. I'm going to be with Trump now.
• 45:49
  Speaker 1: And that is a problem for Donald Trump because if
• 45:50
  Speaker 1: you believe the polls, Joe Biden is ahead, right? I
• 45:53
  Speaker 1: do think there is a small cohort of undecided voters
• 45:57
  Speaker 1: we've heard from who either are truly undecided or leaning Trump.
• 46:01
  Speaker 1: And these people actually really like Donald Trump's policies. They
• 46:05
  Speaker 1: think he's done a pretty okay job as president. And
• 46:07
  Speaker 1: what they hate is that he's an asshole. What bothers
• 46:10
  Speaker 1: them is the Donald Trump we saw in the first debate.
• 46:13
  Speaker 1: So for that group of voters who are Republican-leaning, who
• 46:18
  Speaker 1: love Trump's policies, who think he hasn't done that bad
• 46:21
  Speaker 1: of a job, who just think he can be an asshole, yeah,
• 46:24
  Speaker 1: maybe they think he was normal enough last night that
• 46:27
  Speaker 1: maybe I'll pull the lever. Were they going to pull
• 46:29
  Speaker 1: the lever for him anyway?
• 46:31
  Speaker 10: Probably.
• 46:32
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 46:32
  Speaker 1: Probably. And again, like we've seen in some of these polls,
• 46:35
  Speaker 1: there is this gap between The vote share Trump's getting,
• 46:38
  Speaker 1: which is around 40, 41, 42, and his approval rating,
• 46:41
  Speaker 1: which is like 43, 44, 45 in some of these.
• 46:45
  Speaker 1: And you wonder if that gap closes a little bit
• 46:48
  Speaker 1: and the vote share starts looking more like the approval rating.
• 46:51
  Speaker 1: And those are sort of like soft Republicans coming home.
• 46:54
  Speaker 1: That's the only thing.
• 46:55
  Speaker 5: In every election, there are some set of voters who
• 46:57
  Speaker 5: are eventually going to come home. But Trump has done
• 47:00
  Speaker 5: so many crazy, stupid things on a weekly basis that
• 47:03
  Speaker 5: he keeps delaying that process and delaying that process. And
• 47:06
  Speaker 5: if he had had another terrible debate, he could have
• 47:09
  Speaker 5: pushed some of those people into the non-voting category. But
• 47:12
  Speaker 5: maybe if they were going to get to Trump anyway
• 47:13
  Speaker 5: by Election Day, they might do it a few days
• 47:15
  Speaker 5: sooner because of this.
• 47:18
  Speaker 1: And of course, there's still time. There's still time for
• 47:21
  Speaker 1: him to do some crazy shit.
• 47:22
  Speaker 3: What is today? What is it? What is it the
• 47:24
  Speaker 3: anniversary of?
• 47:25
  Speaker 1: Oh, today is that happy anniversary of the Jim Comey letter, guys.
• 47:28
  Speaker 8: Wow.
• 47:29
  Speaker 1: Not four years ago today. It's four years ago with
• 47:31
  Speaker 1: 11 days left in the campaign, which is.
• 47:33
  Speaker 6: What we have.
• 47:34
  Speaker 4: Jim Comey posts some little ha ha funny fucking Instagram.
• 47:39
  Speaker 6: I'm going to lose my mind. Well, how dare you?
• 47:43
  Speaker 1: How about like talk about Trump's new tone? He already today,
• 47:47
  Speaker 1: as he's announcing some other foreign policy win, I honestly
• 47:50
  Speaker 1: didn't even pay attention to what it was. He's on
• 47:52
  Speaker 1: the phone with Bibi Netanyahu and he's like, you think
• 47:54
  Speaker 1: Sleepy Joe could have gotten this deal done, Bibi?
• 47:56
  Speaker 3: Huh?
• 47:56
  Speaker 1: You think Sleepy Joe?
• 47:57
  Speaker 6: You can hear Bibi Netanyahu hedging his bets in real time.
• 48:00
  Speaker 6: He's like, oh, Mr. President, we support anything from the
• 48:03
  Speaker 6: United States that is helpful to Israel.
• 48:05
  Speaker 4: It's like, he's not on the MAGA train right now.
• 48:08
  Speaker 6: He's looking at his polls.
• 48:10
  Speaker 2: No, he's like, he's definitely like... Yeah, I'm pretty sure
• 48:14
  Speaker 2: I'm going to have to be nice to Joe Biden
• 48:15
  Speaker 2: pretty soon. So I'm going to go ahead and say that, yeah,
• 48:17
  Speaker 2: Sleepy Joe could get it done. Huge fan of Sleepy Joe. Also,
• 48:21
  Speaker 2: Trump is going to a rally this weekend. He's going
• 48:24
  Speaker 2: to go right back to the hits. And then we're
• 48:26
  Speaker 2: going to have the 60 Minutes interview on Sunday night
• 48:28
  Speaker 2: where he walks out of the interview like this is
• 48:32
  Speaker 2: just like the convention period.
• 48:33
  Speaker 1: This ain't lasting long. The discipline Trump ain't lasting long.
• 48:36
  Speaker 5: I mean, he has definitely gotten worse over the last
• 48:38
  Speaker 5: four years. But I would note that at the last
• 48:41
  Speaker 5: this last period at the end of 2016 he kept
• 48:45
  Speaker 5: his shit together for the last 11 days he did so.
• 48:48
  Speaker 1: Like that could happen again he could now it'll be
• 48:51
  Speaker 1: tough if he's if he's really down I don't know
• 48:53
  Speaker 1: it's gonna be tough because you can tell last night
• 48:55
  Speaker 1: at certain moments in the debate he started gritting his
• 48:58
  Speaker 1: teeth on in the split screen like he was ready
• 49:01
  Speaker 1: to blow but he sort of held himself.
• 49:03
  Speaker 3: Yeah it was like he was holding in an evil burp.
• 49:09
  Speaker 1: On that note that's all we have guys tune in Tomorrow, Saturday,
• 49:14
  Speaker 1: where we will have Dan and John's interview with hopefully
• 49:18
  Speaker 1: the next president of the United States. Joe Biden. Finally.
• 49:22
  Speaker 1: It's the final piece in the puzzle coming on Pod
• 49:24
  Speaker 1: Save America.
• 49:24
  Speaker 3: Smart of him to leave it to the very end.
• 49:26
  Speaker 5: Like, you don't play your best card early in the game.
• 49:29
  Speaker 5: You save it.
• 49:29
  Speaker 1: The biggest audience, you know?
• 49:32
  Speaker 10: All right, everyone.
• 49:32
  Speaker 3: And the easiest questions.
• 49:36
  Speaker 1: You're not asking about the laptop?
• 49:37
  Speaker 3: What the fuck?
• 49:39
  Speaker 1: Bye, everyone.
• 49:39
  Speaker 2: Bye.
• 49:43
  Speaker 1: Pod Save America is a Cricket Media production. The executive
• 49:46
  Speaker 1: producer is Michael Martinez. Our associate producer is Jordan Waller.
• 49:51
  Speaker 1: It's mixed and edited by Andrew Chadwick. Kyle Seglin is
• 49:54
  Speaker 1: our sound engineer. Thanks to Tanya Sominator, Katie Long, Roman Papadimitriou,
• 49:59
  Speaker 1: Quinn Lewis, Brian Semel, Caroline Rustin, and Elisa Gutierrez for
• 50:02
  Speaker 1: production support. And to our digital team, Elijah Cohn, Nar Melkonian,
• 50:07
  Speaker 1: Yale Freed, and Milo Kim, who film and upload these
• 50:10
  Speaker 1: episodes as videos every week.