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Street Farbrengen Episode #144: Chassidic Intimacy and Collecting Maamarim · ChabadLife.TV Street Farbrengen

• 0:00
  SPEAKER_03: So Shabbat's morning I learned with a couple of people, Chasidis, and there's a gentleman on the side, a Chasid, and he always has his ear cocked to the discussion.
• 0:11
  SPEAKER_03: And he says to me the following, because we were learning about the subject.
• 0:16
  SPEAKER_03: He says, There was a Chasid walking through B'Nabrak, and he heard through the open windows of a base madrash of Chabad them having a Fabran and talking about or and ma'or and atmos and mahus.
• 0:32
  SPEAKER_03: And the more they spoke about it, the more he was intrigued and he was enchanted.
• 0:37
  SPEAKER_03: And he said, This is amazing stuff.
• 0:38
  SPEAKER_03: He'd never learned any of this stuff before.
• 0:41
  SPEAKER_03: This is amazing.
• 0:42
  SPEAKER_03: And he's listening, he's listening, and then he thinks to himself, if talking about God is so geschmack, can you imagine what it would be like if I go speak to him?
• 0:52
  SPEAKER_03: So I'm gonna go to the breast love.
• 1:20
  SPEAKER_04: So I don't know if it's appropriate to slap somebody on Chavez, but it was that your reaction, or did you uh just respond in kind?
• 1:29
  SPEAKER_03: Well, I first of all I didn't slap him.
• 1:30
  SPEAKER_03: Um No, it it actually at first it's it I mean I knew what he was doing, and at first it stung a little bit.
• 1:39
  SPEAKER_03: Because there's a grain of truth to it.
• 1:42
  SPEAKER_03: A grain.
• 1:43
  SPEAKER_03: Okay.
• 1:44
  SPEAKER_03: Because obviously his point is experience over academic.
• 1:55
  SPEAKER_01: Okay.
• 1:57
  SPEAKER_04: And and valid.
• 1:59
  SPEAKER_04: Valid.
• 1:59
  SPEAKER_04: I I hear that.
• 2:01
  SPEAKER_04: And you you do like to make fun of the uh the the Columbia professor learning Kabbalah and Hasidis and being only an app academic and not having any translation.
• 2:14
  SPEAKER_03: Is that what is that what I am sitting there on Shabbos morning learning Hasidis?
• 2:18
  SPEAKER_04: Well, it depends on if you then go talk to God, which is what I think is the insulting um, you know, ins uh assumption that he's making is that it doesn't translate to your Davening, your experience, your Herges Elocus.
• 2:35
  SPEAKER_04: And again, for most people, most of the time it's not, but you know, who who is he to say that?
• 2:40
  SPEAKER_04: And like again, so you're saying you could just go in your your your uh your your ignorance of not learning and be able to just like automatically disconnect on such a deep level?
• 2:54
  SPEAKER_04: Give me a break.
• 2:55
  SPEAKER_04: It's called a voida for a reason.
• 2:57
  SPEAKER_03: Okay, so but but we're not talking about him.
• 3:01
  SPEAKER_03: Okay.
• 3:02
  SPEAKER_03: So what's the message I was being telegraphed to him?
• 3:09
  SPEAKER_04: Well, the fact that you sense the the kernel of truth to what he was saying, is that you still feel like we or yourself or Chabad are being too academic and not enough hergish or not enough um talking to the one that we're learning about.
• 3:29
  SPEAKER_03: Um I don't think based on my experience in this jewel, that it's not the really the idea of talking to God.
• 3:40
  SPEAKER_03: He wants to say that learning Hasidis doesn't make God real and pouring out your heart to him does.
• 3:55
  SPEAKER_03: So let's keep those two separate for a second.
• 3:58
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, hold on, say it again.
• 4:00
  SPEAKER_04: Talking about God doesn't make him real.
• 4:03
  SPEAKER_04: No, I did not say that.
• 4:04
  SPEAKER_04: Okay, no, it's a little bit.
• 4:13
  SPEAKER_03: Because then God is real.
• 4:15
  SPEAKER_04: Because then God is real.
• 4:17
  SPEAKER_04: Okay, I gotta think about that for a moment.
• 4:20
  SPEAKER_03: Go ahead.
• 4:22
  SPEAKER_04: Okay, so so therefore what?
• 4:26
  SPEAKER_03: I mean saying that's his point.
• 4:28
  SPEAKER_04: No, I'm saying therefore what for you as a you know experiencer of this in the shul that you go to about.
• 4:36
  SPEAKER_03: So in his you know, not that this guy is like, you know, a Rebbe, even though he actually comes from Rebbe Sh of Mishbucha, but is not um to the l level of a Rebbe, but let's break apart from his point of view what he's saying, is do you do I think that learning about God is being with God?
• 5:02
  SPEAKER_01: Okay.
• 5:04
  SPEAKER_03: Well okay, do you and then the question is do I feel it?
• 5:12
  SPEAKER_03: Again, he's contrasting pouring your heart out to God because you rely on him and he's your rock and your savior and so forth, um, which of course David Miloch says, um, versus you're learning about him.
• 5:25
  SPEAKER_03: I think well, I'm not even going to the idea of learning Tarah, obviously, is being one with God, but not but I mean in the subject matter, in the grappling with as as the Rebbex and the Reb, you know, the Rebbe Shab's laid out about Tongetamim and Chabad is that we should be learning about God in the same way you would learn a piece of Gomorrah Okay.
• 5:52
  SPEAKER_03: So you have to learn it in Sekel and you have to understand it and so forth.
• 5:57
  SPEAKER_03: So um does that make it is that enough to have the experience of being with God by learning about God?
• 6:14
  SPEAKER_04: You're saying if it stops at the learning?
• 6:19
  SPEAKER_03: Not so much as i uh we we know it's not supposed to stop at the learning.
• 6:23
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, well, but the first of all, there's there is an extreme pleasure that you get in the learning itself if that's your Thynog, if that's like your Okay, but I could be learning about uh Lahavdil um quarks and string theories and also have Ghmack if you're talking about Altsechel.
• 6:40
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
• 6:40
  SPEAKER_03: Right.
• 6:40
  SPEAKER_03: Rebirashab says in Mesurs and Efesh of a Tamr Chachum, a real true Chachum is that he doesn't learn physics because it's Ghmaq, but he won't learn it anyways because it's not terror, because his nature is to to learn anything.
• 6:56
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 6:56
  SPEAKER_03: Okay.
• 6:57
  SPEAKER_03: But let's but but but no, I'm looking at more as let's put the question the other way around.
• 7:04
  SPEAKER_03: Let's not make it uh confrontative.
• 7:08
  SPEAKER_03: When I learn a mimer, does it make it easier for me to pour out my heart to God?
• 7:20
  SPEAKER_03: We all have things to pour our hearts out.
• 7:23
  SPEAKER_03: Okay.
• 7:23
  SPEAKER_03: I'm not talking about does it make it easier toinen and the abush to to feel that he's real in the sense of like with Khav Kheshvan that Rabbi Rashab said, why doesn't God appear to me?
• 7:36
  SPEAKER_03: So that's a pretty real that's a strong state of God is real.
• 7:40
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 7:41
  SPEAKER_03: Right?
• 7:41
  SPEAKER_03: So when you and I don't have that angst, why does God not appeal appear to us?
• 7:50
  SPEAKER_03: Is that because we think um we're not ra'oi for it?
• 7:57
  SPEAKER_03: We're not fitting to have him appear, it's not gonna happen.
• 8:01
  SPEAKER_04: Um well let's I mean the Rebbe addresses this in a lot of seconds, but but let's I'm asking you, I'm not asking you what the Rebbe addresses.
• 8:10
  SPEAKER_04: I got it, I got it.
• 8:10
  SPEAKER_04: But but let's go let's go back to what you had said before, though, because you were avoiding, yeah.
• 8:16
  SPEAKER_04: I don't think so.
• 8:17
  SPEAKER_04: You actually just made a couple of bigger statements that you just decided to just uh skimp over.
• 8:23
  SPEAKER_04: Let's I'm gonna bring it up.
• 8:24
  SPEAKER_03: Let's let's bring it up about the stuff that you said.
• 8:26
  SPEAKER_03: I'm curious, that's why I'm saying what?
• 8:28
  SPEAKER_03: I'm not challenging you.
• 8:30
  SPEAKER_04: You you made a statement that pouring out yourself pouring your heart out to God, is it gonna be easier when you learn a mimer?
• 8:41
  SPEAKER_04: Let's stick with that question for a minute for a minute.
• 8:43
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, but the way you're saying it makes it sound like is that the function of the mimer?
• 8:47
  SPEAKER_03: I'm asking you when I close the safer to go to Devin, am I going to pour out what's on my heart, which came, which was there before I learned the mimer?
• 8:59
  SPEAKER_03: Okay.
• 9:00
  SPEAKER_03: Am I gonna pour out my heart to God in a different way because I learned the mimer?
• 9:04
  SPEAKER_04: Okay.
• 9:05
  SPEAKER_04: And what g give me your my my senses you're saying no, or like that's what I'm sensing.
• 9:14
  SPEAKER_03: I asked the question.
• 9:14
  SPEAKER_03: I where'd you get in the sense I said no?
• 9:16
  SPEAKER_03: I'm just uh that's the sense.
• 9:18
  SPEAKER_03: Don't project on me.
• 9:19
  SPEAKER_04: I could project all I want.
• 9:20
  SPEAKER_03: Oh, I'm gonna call you on the carpet.
• 9:22
  SPEAKER_04: That's totally fine.
• 9:23
  SPEAKER_03: Okay.
• 9:24
  SPEAKER_04: So do I change like do I change the pouring out?
• 9:30
  SPEAKER_03: Do I change not what you're pouring out.
• 9:32
  SPEAKER_03: Does pouring out your heart change?
• 9:35
  SPEAKER_03: Or let's ask the question the other way.
• 9:38
  SPEAKER_03: If I have something bothering me, like, you know, that I need to pour my heart out.
• 9:44
  SPEAKER_03: God, why you're doing this, right?
• 9:46
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 9:46
  SPEAKER_03: Do I need a mimer to do that?
• 9:48
  SPEAKER_04: No.
• 9:49
  SPEAKER_03: Okay.
• 9:50
  SPEAKER_03: So then there's seemingly the answer would be that the mu that the mimer really doesn't affect my pouring out.
• 9:59
  SPEAKER_04: I mean, it's an interesting, I mean, that is not the only function.
• 10:03
  SPEAKER_03: All this is in context of what the guy told us.
• 10:05
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, because that's that is not the only function of Davening is to pour out.
• 10:10
  SPEAKER_03: The Davenamel says.
• 10:12
  SPEAKER_04: It's part I'm not saying it's not one of the things.
• 10:15
  SPEAKER_03: Okay, what's the other thing?
• 10:16
  SPEAKER_04: I'm saying Ms.
• 10:17
  SPEAKER_04: Boynen on Hashem and Elokuus and Ms.
• 10:20
  SPEAKER_03: Boyin is not Davening.
• 10:21
  SPEAKER_04: No, but no, I'm saying that the the experience and the the feeling of being connected to Hashem, what you're describing is your lacking about you and what you want and what you need, yeah, versus the fact that a lot of Davening is focusing on Hashem and Hashem's greatness and your love of Hashem, your year Hashem, uh seems to be a bit different.
• 10:45
  SPEAKER_04: It's not only just about your pouring yourself out.
• 10:48
  SPEAKER_03: But I'm talking about this guy brought up the idea of pouring out your hard.
• 10:51
  SPEAKER_04: You're right that that so the things that I'm mentioning, I think, very much get affected by the learning of that mimer.
• 10:58
  SPEAKER_04: Oh the the depth of understanding and appreciation of Avas Hashem and Yuras Hashem and that experience.
• 11:09
  SPEAKER_03: Appreciation?
• 11:10
  SPEAKER_03: See, this is exactly what this guy is addressing.
• 11:13
  SPEAKER_03: He would never say appreciation of Avas Hashem and Yeras Hashem.
• 11:20
  SPEAKER_04: I'm trying not to use Hebrew words, but hoda is the entire thing.
• 11:26
  SPEAKER_03: He would say no.
• 11:27
  SPEAKER_03: He said he would say that is academic.
• 11:30
  SPEAKER_04: Then it's ignoring all of Modaani through Modani is before your Davin.
• 11:36
  SPEAKER_04: Through I said Mod'ani through Yishtabach, through Suka de Zimra is all about Hoda.
• 11:42
  SPEAKER_04: And and that that is the But that's not what he's referring to.
• 11:46
  SPEAKER_03: So you're you're saying the front end, you know exactly what he's referring to.
• 11:49
  SPEAKER_04: I know exactly what he's referring to.
• 11:51
  SPEAKER_03: What I'm saying is Davening is and by the way, Hodda's not appreciating love and fear of God.
• 11:56
  SPEAKER_04: No, appreciating God, appreciating his his existence and what he creates and how he creates and things like that.
• 12:04
  SPEAKER_04: But my point is, is Davening, as we know from Chasidis, because we learned the Maimarum and the Cuntuses and the things that the Rebeyim gave us, yeah, that Daven is a ladder.
• 12:14
  SPEAKER_04: And so therefore, you do need that buildup for the appropriate pouring out that you're going to have in Shmonas.
• 12:23
  SPEAKER_03: Okay, so let me ask you this.
• 12:25
  SPEAKER_03: From this guy's point of view about the joke that it was really a joke that he was telling me I got it.
• 12:29
  SPEAKER_03: He said it's a joke.
• 12:31
  SPEAKER_04: It was a good joke, by the way.
• 12:33
  SPEAKER_03: He would ask you, Why do you need a ladder to pour out your heart?
• 12:40
  SPEAKER_03: The ladder concept is about your awareness of God.
• 12:48
  unknown: Okay.
• 12:49
  SPEAKER_03: I don't think you have do you have to be aware of God to tell him what's on your heart?
• 12:54
  SPEAKER_04: There are different degrees of it.
• 12:56
  SPEAKER_03: I'm asking you a question.
• 12:57
  SPEAKER_03: And so yes or no.
• 12:58
  SPEAKER_03: Yes.
• 12:58
  SPEAKER_03: Why?
• 12:59
  SPEAKER_03: Explain.
• 13:04
  SPEAKER_04: Um I don't know how to describe it.
• 13:10
  SPEAKER_03: We can't be academic about this, big boy.
• 13:12
  SPEAKER_04: So that's why I'm saying I don't know how to describe it.
• 13:14
  SPEAKER_04: Because you can't be academic, it defeats the purpose.
• 13:16
  SPEAKER_04: I get that.
• 13:16
  SPEAKER_03: No, it's not defeats the purpose.
• 13:18
  SPEAKER_03: We're not talking about academic.
• 13:19
  SPEAKER_03: We're talking about pointing out your heart.
• 13:20
  SPEAKER_03: And we're talking about feeling with your is what it says, what is the avoid the void of the heart?
• 13:30
  SPEAKER_03: So the Gomorrah answers, the void of the heart is dovening.
• 13:36
  SPEAKER_03: Serve him with all your heart.
• 13:38
  SPEAKER_03: It's dovinging.
• 13:39
  SPEAKER_03: Heart.
• 13:42
  SPEAKER_03: And this guy's saying, pouring out your heart is exactly like when don't you want your kids if they're in a state of of um anxiety and question and whatever's bothering them to come to you?
• 13:57
  SPEAKER_03: Of course.
• 13:57
  SPEAKER_03: Right?
• 13:58
  SPEAKER_03: And don't you feel like a big Tati when they do?
• 14:00
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 14:01
  SPEAKER_03: Okay.
• 14:01
  SPEAKER_03: So you know, using that as a mushroom, etc.
• 14:04
  SPEAKER_03: etc.
• 14:04
  SPEAKER_03: So um I it it gave me that Shabbos gave me a pause for thought.
• 14:14
  SPEAKER_03: And um you know, we've spoken about this.
• 14:21
  SPEAKER_03: This is this is something which we've spoken a lot, but it deserves all the time of a bringing.
• 14:28
  SPEAKER_03: Because it's very easy to get disassociated from God by your intellect.
• 14:35
  SPEAKER_03: Yes.
• 14:36
  SPEAKER_03: And feel satisfied by your accomplishment in that intellect.
• 14:43
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, and have so much pleasure from just the Mimer's intellect itself that you don't even remember to bring it into your Davening and What Remember, it has nothing to do with me.
• 14:52
  SPEAKER_04: I'm not even remembering you don't connect it to the pouring out aspect of Davening.
• 14:58
  SPEAKER_03: So we come for I think the the question, or not the question, but the recalibration.
• 15:05
  SPEAKER_03: I like that term, by the way.
• 15:06
  SPEAKER_03: The recalibration of everything is is today's connection to Chaf Kheshvan.
• 15:13
  SPEAKER_03: Do you when the the the the essential message that the Rebbe takes out of the story of the Rebbe Rashab is why doesn't God appear to me?
• 15:23
  SPEAKER_03: And we should feel the same way.
• 15:26
  SPEAKER_03: Now, do you really feel that way?
• 15:30
  SPEAKER_03: I know I don't.
• 15:32
  SPEAKER_03: I know that if God appeared to me, it would be quite an astounding, you know, uh experience.
• 15:38
  SPEAKER_03: And I would say, Why me or who me?
• 15:42
  SPEAKER_03: Or would get down on my knees and faint, whatever.
• 15:45
  SPEAKER_03: But am I asking why doesn't God appear to me?
• 15:50
  SPEAKER_03: No.
• 15:52
  SPEAKER_03: But you want to know something?
• 15:53
  SPEAKER_03: We've spoken about this before.
• 15:55
  SPEAKER_03: Before I turned from, I did ask that question.
• 16:00
  SPEAKER_03: Not Al Sino Yapirta from Avino because I didn't put it in that context.
• 16:04
  SPEAKER_04: Okay.
• 16:05
  SPEAKER_03: Where's this God that I believe exists?
• 16:08
  SPEAKER_03: Where am I gonna find him?
• 16:10
  SPEAKER_03: Where am I gonna feel him?
• 16:13
  SPEAKER_03: I was looking for that.
• 16:15
  SPEAKER_03: Right?
• 16:16
  SPEAKER_03: So I went to all the different areas to look.
• 16:18
  SPEAKER_03: I went into drugs, I went into wine women and song, I went into uh gurus and gurus and etc.
• 16:30
  SPEAKER_03: etc.
• 16:32
  SPEAKER_03: And I could have got caught in any of those, by the way.
• 16:36
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, a lot of them are pretty fun.
• 16:38
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, and and I don't know if it would have been me re f reaching God through wine, but it would have been a at least a pleasurable experience.
• 16:49
  SPEAKER_03: So so that would distract me.
• 16:52
  SPEAKER_03: And it's so the question is not for me coming up, is not, oh, so you became from and now I'm not looking.
• 17:06
  SPEAKER_03: Right, so it became like they used to tell jokes about you know the different ways of the Baltshuva newcomer who eventually became an FFB.
• 17:14
  SPEAKER_03: You know, uh from a lipskar Allah Shalom just passed away, the Rosh Shiva from Morristown, and uh very special man.
• 17:22
  SPEAKER_03: And he would you would have to ask permission from him to put on a black hat.
• 17:29
  SPEAKER_03: You have to earn it, because putting on a black hat was a real red flag.
• 17:35
  SPEAKER_03: Okay, so but so you can say, Oh, you know, you became one of the regular guys and so on and so forth.
• 17:41
  SPEAKER_03: That's one way of understanding what takes place.
• 17:44
  SPEAKER_03: Um but where goes and and and is it the pshat I'm not looking anymore because I found it?
• 17:53
  SPEAKER_04: Well, so you you said that you had it.
• 17:56
  SPEAKER_04: Did that thirst ever get quenched?
• 18:00
  SPEAKER_04: I mean, you talk about your experience of seeing the Rebbe and being by the Rebbe, which obviously we don't have anymore to the same degree.
• 18:07
  SPEAKER_03: Right.
• 18:08
  SPEAKER_04: So I th I I think was enough to see that the Rebbe saw it?
• 18:12
  SPEAKER_03: I think that there's a paradox when learning Chasid's Chabad.
• 18:17
  SPEAKER_03: On the one hand, if you really do learn properly a Mimer, you really do feel godliness.
• 18:26
  SPEAKER_03: But simultaneously, you feel you have nothing to do with it, even though you're feeling it.
• 18:33
  SPEAKER_03: Because you're sculpting, you're sculpting what is the holy in your chasidis?
• 18:40
  SPEAKER_03: Lamylamina sechel into sechel.
• 18:43
  SPEAKER_03: People think it means I could philosophize about that which you cannot grasp in thought.
• 18:49
  SPEAKER_03: That's not the Pshat.
• 18:51
  SPEAKER_03: The Pshat is you're gonna feel the La Mylamina Sechel in the world of your Sechel.
• 18:57
  SPEAKER_03: Not that the Sechel is gonna turn the La Mylamina Sechel into Sechel.
• 19:02
  SPEAKER_03: That doesn't work that way.
• 19:04
  SPEAKER_03: And because of that, you have you're sitting in a paradox.
• 19:07
  SPEAKER_03: On one hand, I'm feeling La Mylamina Sechel.
• 19:13
  SPEAKER_03: Now, if you're feeling Mailamina Sechel, Lukhuri should be motivated to find that mystery, right?
• 19:22
  SPEAKER_03: That that's Lamila Mina Sechl.
• 19:25
  SPEAKER_03: I can't consider it.
• 19:26
  SPEAKER_03: And at the same time, you're bringing it into Sechel.
• 19:30
  SPEAKER_03: So that means you found it.
• 19:33
  SPEAKER_03: Or the my the the Sechel tells me exactly what Lamila Sechel really is, and therefore, maybe I should drop the whole pursuit.
• 19:47
  SPEAKER_04: Okay.
• 19:48
  SPEAKER_04: So then what do you do with that?
• 19:50
  SPEAKER_04: I I'm still thinking about what you're doing.
• 19:52
  SPEAKER_03: What do you do with it?
• 19:53
  SPEAKER_03: You have this guy tell me, because he knows me.
• 19:56
  SPEAKER_03: He he you have this guy tell me, okay.
• 19:58
  SPEAKER_03: It's easy to talk about God.
• 20:00
  SPEAKER_03: Let me see you pour your heart out to him.
• 20:04
  SPEAKER_03: I mean, isn't this what the message is from the Rebbe and Keshvan?
• 20:10
  SPEAKER_03: I mean, that's the primary thrust of every sikha from the Rebbe.
• 20:15
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, the Rebbe Rashab poured himself out, poured it, poured his heart out to Tsamaxetic, and we have to do or we should want to.
• 20:23
  SPEAKER_04: And what was it?
• 20:24
  SPEAKER_03: Why doesn't God appear?
• 20:27
  SPEAKER_03: Now, does that bother us?
• 20:29
  SPEAKER_03: Obviously not.
• 20:31
  SPEAKER_03: We think it's status quo, and we wouldn't even you know what?
• 20:34
  SPEAKER_03: And it's kind of like in the same room as why hasn't Mashiach come?
• 20:41
  SPEAKER_03: You know, Admasai and Kayhnisan.
• 20:44
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
• 20:44
  SPEAKER_04: I mean, I get I guess it does get to the point where it's like, you know, mimer after mimer, year after year, and it hasn't happened, and so therefore you almost have a fear of burning out if you focus on the lacking too much.
• 20:59
  SPEAKER_03: You know, I saw something from the I don't know if I've told you this, I saw something from the Mitler ebba that blew me away.
• 21:07
  SPEAKER_03: I never sa I've learned it before and I'm learning it again, and I I didn't understand it the first ten times I learned it.
• 21:15
  SPEAKER_03: Or maybe I didn't I forgot, but whatever.
• 21:20
  SPEAKER_03: He he gives four categories of people who get lost in the shuffle of life.
• 21:27
  SPEAKER_03: When it comes to Elakos.
• 21:30
  SPEAKER_03: And he says the rub or the most majority of people is because of the distraction of living.
• 21:39
  SPEAKER_03: You've got to make a living, you gotta bring up your kids, you gotta go to to uh carpool, whatever your pressure in life is, right?
• 21:48
  SPEAKER_03: And gotta and you gotta pay for the mortgage, etcetera, etcetera, etcetera.
• 21:53
  SPEAKER_04: You said the Mittler Rebbe's talking about that?
• 21:55
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 21:56
  SPEAKER_03: Why are you laughing?
• 21:58
  SPEAKER_04: Saying all the things you just mentioned are Modern day things.
• 22:00
  SPEAKER_04: It's interesting.
• 22:01
  SPEAKER_03: No, he's the language that he uses Lachats Mina Parnasa.
• 22:08
  SPEAKER_03: The pressure of making a living.
• 22:11
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
• 22:11
  SPEAKER_03: Okay.
• 22:12
  SPEAKER_03: I'm contemporizing it.
• 22:14
  SPEAKER_03: So good.
• 22:15
  SPEAKER_03: To meet you and me.
• 22:18
  SPEAKER_03: Even though I don't have to worry about Scarlement.
• 22:21
  SPEAKER_03: So maybe they'll come knocking on my door.
• 22:23
  SPEAKER_03: My kids know not to knock on my door for their kids because I don't have the money, so they don't come and ask.
• 22:27
  SPEAKER_03: But if I had the money, they'd come and ask.
• 22:29
  SPEAKER_03: Anyways, that's a different discussion.
• 22:32
  SPEAKER_03: So the Mitlarebbe says, anumai is a beautiful thing.
• 22:36
  SPEAKER_03: It's like you can cry from reading it.
• 22:39
  SPEAKER_03: Mitlarebbe says, okay, most people lose their contact with God and they don't dava in and learn Tara well enough or enough because of the pressure of we'll call it modern day life.
• 22:56
  SPEAKER_03: So what do you do?
• 22:58
  SPEAKER_01: He says, in your Parnasa, connected to God.
• 23:10
  SPEAKER_03: In other words, the davaning bih slavut, you're all excited and you've m meditated.
• 23:17
  SPEAKER_03: You're not doing that.
• 23:19
  SPEAKER_03: Right?
• 23:20
  SPEAKER_03: Go find God in the nitty-gritty of you making a living.
• 23:29
  SPEAKER_03: And that's the same.
• 23:31
  SPEAKER_03: He doesn't say those words, but it seems to be he's saying, that's the same as the guy who doesn't have the lachats of making a parnasa.
• 23:40
  SPEAKER_03: So your parn, God, in other putting it in a different way, God has pushed you into the arena of making all of the money you're going to make and all of the pressures to make it in order for you to find him.
• 23:55
  SPEAKER_03: Now that's a different way of looking at parnasa.
• 23:58
  SPEAKER_03: Now, it kind of parallels this guy, by the way, on Shabbas who spoke to me when I think about it.
• 24:04
  SPEAKER_03: How so?
• 24:05
  SPEAKER_03: How do most people say and relate to God is related to your parnasa?
• 24:13
  SPEAKER_03: What's the average guy say in the Frim world?
• 24:17
  SPEAKER_04: You do your Hishadlass and Batachin.
• 24:21
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, God will pour his brachas into your.
• 24:26
  SPEAKER_03: So what are you using God for?
• 24:29
  SPEAKER_03: You're using God for Him to be your provider.
• 24:32
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 24:32
  SPEAKER_03: Okay.
• 24:33
  SPEAKER_03: Pouring out your heart.
• 24:35
  SPEAKER_03: I need, I need, I need.
• 24:37
  SPEAKER_03: That's not what the Mittla Reb is saying.
• 24:39
  SPEAKER_03: You're gonna find God.
• 24:42
  SPEAKER_03: Not going to use God in your Parnasa, you're gonna find God in the making of your Parnasa.
• 24:49
  SPEAKER_03: That's a different flavor.
• 24:55
  SPEAKER_03: Okay.
• 24:55
  SPEAKER_03: Now, if you assuming you and I came to this table of Orthodox Judaism, oi fa.
• 25:08
  SPEAKER_03: Um in order to look for triggered both of us for God, right?
• 25:12
  SPEAKER_03: I'm not triggered by it anymore, I'm just angry.
• 25:15
  SPEAKER_03: So um so if you come to the table to look for God, and the Mittlereb is saying, okay, good.
• 25:25
  SPEAKER_03: Look for God in your pathways and byways of making a living.
• 25:31
  SPEAKER_03: Not rely on God, which is obvious, but find him in the highways and byways of making a living.
• 25:43
  SPEAKER_03: If you don't have time because of the pressure of making a living, to Davan.
• 25:46
  SPEAKER_03: To just find him there.
• 25:47
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 25:48
  SPEAKER_03: Now it doesn't mavata you not having to learn, you know, in the Echabishakh's.
• 25:55
  SPEAKER_03: I got it.
• 25:56
  SPEAKER_03: I got it.
• 25:56
  SPEAKER_04: It's isn't that an amazing very powerful, very powerful.
• 26:01
  SPEAKER_03: So we don't have an excuse because you left Yeshiva and you were learning and whatever, that now and that's isn't that what the Alt-Reba says?
• 26:11
  SPEAKER_03: People who go to work shouldn't be at the front of the room leading the davening.
• 26:17
  SPEAKER_03: Except on Shabbos, those people go to work should lead the Davening.
• 26:21
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
• 26:22
  SPEAKER_03: So you should Davin a little bit longer if you can on Shabbos.
• 26:27
  SPEAKER_03: But in general, find God and wherever you're taken to.
• 26:33
  SPEAKER_04: So let's go back to the guy who made the statement.
• 26:38
  SPEAKER_04: Do you have a uh a different response now, Louvre?
• 26:43
  SPEAKER_03: You mean now after we spoke about it?
• 26:45
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 26:46
  SPEAKER_03: Um Well, uh everything we just spoke was my response, really, when you think about it.
• 26:53
  SPEAKER_03: Um it got it was just a clarity for me.
• 26:56
  SPEAKER_03: The the when this let's let's get down to the real bottom of the pit.
• 27:10
  SPEAKER_01: I have uh needs and he has needs.
• 27:15
  SPEAKER_03: And the way he's sculpting, pouring out your heart, right, is I uh have a Muna that Hashem is listening and will fulfill my needs.
• 27:32
  SPEAKER_03: Right?
• 27:34
  SPEAKER_03: What is the Vort from the Mittlerebba?
• 27:37
  SPEAKER_03: Is it that same thing?
• 27:43
  SPEAKER_04: Yes, with the addition of not only will he fulfill your needs, but you will be able to find him.
• 27:51
  SPEAKER_03: He doesn't discuss fulfilling your needs, by the way, at all.
• 27:54
  SPEAKER_04: I'm sure he doesn't disagree with it, though.
• 27:58
  SPEAKER_03: So let's just talk about the voort.
• 27:59
  SPEAKER_04: But I'm saying, but more than that is that in your um attempt to fulfill your needs, you will be able to find God there.
• 28:12
  SPEAKER_03: No.
• 28:13
  SPEAKER_03: What do you mean attempt to fulfill your needs?
• 28:16
  SPEAKER_03: We're talking about dubbing.
• 28:18
  SPEAKER_03: That's what he's saying.
• 28:19
  SPEAKER_03: I understand that.
• 28:20
  SPEAKER_03: In the work, you're gonna find, in the process, you're gonna find God.
• 28:24
  SPEAKER_03: But this other gentleman is telling me, where's your heart connection with God is when is when you pour your heart out.
• 28:32
  SPEAKER_03: Right?
• 28:33
  SPEAKER_03: That's what he's saying.
• 28:34
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, no, I got I got it.
• 28:35
  SPEAKER_04: Okay, so we're yeah, so what does he say?
• 28:36
  SPEAKER_04: So what would the Mittler Rebbe saying?
• 28:39
  SPEAKER_03: And the Metal Rebbe is saying, I'm just telling you what the Red Metal Rebbe said about finding God in your work.
• 28:48
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 28:48
  SPEAKER_03: Okay.
• 28:49
  SPEAKER_03: That's not the same thing as pouring out your heart and having a Muna that you're and having a Muna that is gonna help you.
• 28:56
  SPEAKER_03: True.
• 28:56
  SPEAKER_03: Okay.
• 28:57
  SPEAKER_03: So now let's ask this question, it comes up for me, because you know, um let's say you find God in your di in your work.
• 29:11
  SPEAKER_01: Right?
• 29:12
  SPEAKER_01: Okay.
• 29:14
  SPEAKER_01: How does that affect your dominant?
• 29:19
  SPEAKER_01: How does it affect your learning of Mimer?
• 29:26
  SPEAKER_01: Like a new Um How does it change your needs?
• 29:36
  SPEAKER_00: I don't want to think about that.
• 29:38
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, so it's a different approach because again, we've said it so many times.
• 29:43
  SPEAKER_03: Is God your ATM machine and your crutch?
• 29:46
  SPEAKER_03: Of course the gashem is tevativ.
• 29:50
  SPEAKER_03: And he gives and he wants to give.
• 29:52
  SPEAKER_03: We have so many different ways of explaining where that takes place and so forth, including in your making a living, of course.
• 30:00
  SPEAKER_03: Um, but where do you sit in all of that?
• 30:03
  SPEAKER_03: With this little 18-year-old boy, and I really was a boy, hitchhiking across Canada.
• 30:12
  SPEAKER_03: And I I don't know if I ever told you this.
• 30:15
  SPEAKER_03: I actually took a tulus with me.
• 30:17
  SPEAKER_03: And I didn't sleep, I hitchhiked across the country.
• 30:20
  SPEAKER_03: I didn't sleep in a sleeping bag, I slept in the tulus.
• 30:24
  SPEAKER_03: I don't know why I did that.
• 30:26
  SPEAKER_03: Just be like a big like a tulus, not a tus cotton.
• 30:30
  SPEAKER_04: As like a as like a blanket?
• 30:33
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 30:34
  SPEAKER_03: I found out later that you don't do that because you're buried in them.
• 30:37
  SPEAKER_03: But that's besides the point.
• 30:38
  SPEAKER_03: So why did I do that?
• 30:40
  SPEAKER_03: Because just before I left hitchhiking, I went to the guy who took me to a shool for schwuis, and I knew I was Jewish, you know, I wasn't like, you know, totally checked out, but I wasn't whatever.
• 30:52
  SPEAKER_03: And yeah, and I felt, you know, it was like later on you have the picture of me with a blanket.
• 30:59
  SPEAKER_03: I used to wear a poncho.
• 31:01
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
• 31:01
  SPEAKER_03: Because it was my Indian, American Indian stage, you know.
• 31:05
  SPEAKER_03: So I went through my Jewish stage first, and I carried and I slept in this.
• 31:10
  SPEAKER_03: So this little boy chick who's traveling across country with his telus and wanting to find God.
• 31:20
  SPEAKER_03: Right?
• 31:21
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 31:21
  SPEAKER_03: I wasn't looking for Parnassa.
• 31:23
  SPEAKER_03: I got that.
• 31:24
  SPEAKER_03: Right?
• 31:25
  SPEAKER_03: I wasn't looking for how is he gonna make my life take away my problems, which is one of my um pet peeves, is that everybody assumed when I got to Morristown that I must have had a problem in life that brought me into Yiddishkite.
• 31:46
  SPEAKER_03: And I say, screw you.
• 31:48
  SPEAKER_03: I was happy in the sense of like I told you what I was looking for: wine, women, and song and gurus.
• 31:57
  SPEAKER_03: I didn't need Kugel eaters.
• 32:01
  SPEAKER_03: To me, Kugel, I told you the story.
• 32:04
  SPEAKER_03: I used to go to Sufi dancing in Vancouver with all these wonderful looking, you know, hippy-dippy flowing um pedal wearing, you know, rose petal in your hair wearing people.
• 32:19
  SPEAKER_03: And then the next day I'm sitting in a Tanya share with a rabbi who's sipping coke and drinking and eating Kogle.
• 32:30
  SPEAKER_03: And I'm thinking to myself, brown rice, man, that's where it's at.
• 32:35
  SPEAKER_03: Like, what is this Kuggle business, right?
• 32:37
  SPEAKER_03: And anyways, that's a different story.
• 32:41
  SPEAKER_03: So I wasn't looking to fix problems, except I was looking for God.
• 32:47
  SPEAKER_03: That was my problem.
• 32:51
  SPEAKER_03: So why isn't it now?
• 32:54
  SPEAKER_03: So so you become so the rep the Mittlereb is saying, yeah, you know why it's not now?
• 32:59
  SPEAKER_03: Because you're deflected by your pressures.
• 33:02
  SPEAKER_04: Well, you said there's four levels.
• 33:04
  SPEAKER_04: I don't know what the other thing is.
• 33:05
  SPEAKER_03: No, there's four groups of people.
• 33:07
  SPEAKER_03: It's not important.
• 33:07
  SPEAKER_03: He says the rave of people are as a matter of fact that the first category kind of fits us, also.
• 33:16
  SPEAKER_03: He says, the guy.
• 33:18
  SPEAKER_03: It's kind of funny.
• 33:19
  SPEAKER_03: This is in the Derekheim.
• 33:21
  SPEAKER_03: Um he says the guy who tasted, I'm putting it in our way of talking, who tasted sin has a hard time not always going back to it.
• 33:35
  SPEAKER_03: Because he tasted it.
• 33:38
  SPEAKER_03: Right?
• 33:39
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 33:40
  SPEAKER_03: Anyways, so that was one of the categories.
• 33:43
  SPEAKER_03: And the other category is one of the guys who's just totally straight, doing everything perfect fine.
• 33:49
  SPEAKER_03: And the third category, it's not in this order, the third category is an interesting guy.
• 33:54
  SPEAKER_03: He's from, does everything.
• 33:56
  SPEAKER_03: This is maybe kind of like us now, maybe, and we're from, and we're doing everything.
• 34:02
  SPEAKER_03: And we don't do big averas.
• 34:04
  SPEAKER_03: I'm putting the word big, you know, we're not doing the big ones, you know, like when was the last time you were at a Yankee game?
• 34:10
  SPEAKER_03: So we're not doing the big Averas, but we'll do Late Sunnis, and we'll do Bittl T Bittles Mun and just you know, shooting the breeze, talking about, I don't know, whatever, politics.
• 34:24
  SPEAKER_03: So he says that's like that's not a big Avera to the you know to to that group.
• 34:29
  SPEAKER_03: Anyways.
• 34:31
  SPEAKER_03: So let's come back full circle.
• 34:35
  SPEAKER_03: So um, like, where am I now with Chaf Keshvan and this whole idea?
• 34:44
  SPEAKER_03: And you know, it's it's when I was on that path of looking for God and and whatever that meant to me at the time was I sure I would have an answer.
• 35:04
  SPEAKER_01: Dummy?
• 35:06
  SPEAKER_03: Um I don't know if I thought of it consciously like that.
• 35:10
  SPEAKER_03: I would I think it was could be a yes or a no.
• 35:15
  SPEAKER_03: Because I wasn't sure.
• 35:16
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 35:18
  SPEAKER_03: Right?
• 35:18
  SPEAKER_03: I mean, I believe there was a God of some sort, but am I gonna find him?
• 35:22
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 35:23
  SPEAKER_03: Right?
• 35:24
  SPEAKER_03: So, I mean, it's so funny how I lived, just you know, to get I hope I'm not boring you with my personal story here, but I lived that straddle between two worlds.
• 35:38
  SPEAKER_03: Like I'm hitchhiking across the country, having a grand old time, but I'm going to sleep in a talis.
• 35:45
  SPEAKER_03: You know, it's like there's no congruency there.
• 35:48
  SPEAKER_03: But I was going, I was, I did a guru weekend, and the next weekend I was at a Shabbaton with Chabad.
• 35:59
  SPEAKER_03: And I had to go into the cabin at the where the Shabbaton was in a campground of some sort of camp.
• 36:05
  SPEAKER_03: Um, I had to go high to do my meditation from the guru.
• 36:11
  SPEAKER_03: Right?
• 36:11
  SPEAKER_03: So here I am at this Shabbaton with Chabad, and I'm doing this some kind of like guru meditation, you know, Indian meditation thing.
• 36:19
  SPEAKER_03: And yeah, so I live I straddled things on uh and um but Burk Hashem, I think I've told you this before, I'm just remembering this.
• 36:29
  SPEAKER_03: I could I remember being in the room with 150 people with this guru, and he asked everybody to come up and he sprinkled water on people.
• 36:41
  SPEAKER_03: And I didn't go up.
• 36:43
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 36:43
  SPEAKER_03: Thank God.
• 36:45
  SPEAKER_03: I don't know why.
• 36:46
  SPEAKER_03: I mean, I knew it was because something bothered me, but I don't, you know, I didn't put it in.
• 36:50
  SPEAKER_04: Well, you just said you were fine, you were looking for it, you saw, wasn't that?
• 36:54
  SPEAKER_03: Um, I think it it was a trigger for me that I knew that it was like a little bit like being baptized or something, and it wasn't for me.
• 37:06
  SPEAKER_03: So uh it's hard to say.
• 37:07
  SPEAKER_03: But anyways, we're we're waxing and waning here.
• 37:10
  SPEAKER_03: So, you know, the so let's go back to this guy's question.
• 37:21
  SPEAKER_03: Which one was I when I was hitchhiking across the country?
• 37:25
  SPEAKER_03: Was I the guy pouring his heart out to God, or was I the guy looking through the window of the base madrash hearing incredible ideas at the Chabad house?
• 37:40
  SPEAKER_03: Which one were you, you think?
• 37:44
  SPEAKER_04: I was definitely hearing good ideas.
• 37:47
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 37:48
  SPEAKER_03: Meanwhile you were looking for God.
• 37:50
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 37:50
  SPEAKER_03: Okay.
• 37:51
  SPEAKER_03: So very much.
• 37:53
  SPEAKER_03: Maybe that's the whole difference.
• 37:57
  SPEAKER_03: Is that do you look for God in the outcomes of your life?
• 38:04
  SPEAKER_01: Or do you look for God?
• 38:08
  SPEAKER_01: What do you need to know God for?
• 38:12
  SPEAKER_03: The ickor is I want to live a good life.
• 38:15
  SPEAKER_03: I want to live a proper life.
• 38:17
  SPEAKER_03: I want to live a what was uh Kusiel Lippler said?
• 38:21
  SPEAKER_03: I want to live a life that's not filled with false living.
• 38:27
  SPEAKER_03: So I'm doing Torah and mitzvahs and I'm praying and this and that, and I'm making money and I'm giving sadaka and I have kids and I have grandchildren.
• 38:37
  SPEAKER_03: You know, I just went to my granddaughter's butt mitzvah.
• 38:41
  SPEAKER_03: I was in tears the whole time because I look for God for it's an interesting especially if you're gonna say you can't find him.
• 38:59
  SPEAKER_03: Achekalakai Tamatza, right?
• 39:01
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 39:02
  SPEAKER_03: So what's what's that whole chabad trip?
• 39:04
  SPEAKER_03: What would you say to the guy?
• 39:10
  SPEAKER_04: I would say you just don't know what you're missing.
• 39:14
  SPEAKER_03: Lay smakshabat fise bakkla.
• 39:17
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
• 39:17
  SPEAKER_03: So what do you mean you're missing?
• 39:19
  SPEAKER_03: You can't have it.
• 39:20
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
• 39:21
  SPEAKER_04: Who know?
• 39:23
  SPEAKER_04: But to know what that means, to learn the my marum.
• 39:26
  SPEAKER_03: And then then you're into intellect again.
• 39:28
  SPEAKER_04: No, no, that's what I'm saying.
• 39:29
  SPEAKER_03: We mean to know what it means that you don't know.
• 39:32
  SPEAKER_04: Okay, I I so any answer I'm gonna give you is gonna be a Sechateka answer.
• 39:36
  SPEAKER_04: I can't say the answer then, but if in whatever words I can describe it, too.
• 39:44
  SPEAKER_04: To have Hasidis is incomparable to not having Hasidis when you're even when you're searching for God.
• 39:53
  SPEAKER_03: Um I'm gonna give you a mushle, and everybody who's listening, clear the kids out of the room.
• 40:04
  SPEAKER_03: Okay.
• 40:08
  SPEAKER_03: A couple gets married, they have an intimate relationship that they didn't have before.
• 40:16
  SPEAKER_03: And won't have with anybody else.
• 40:20
  SPEAKER_03: Okay.
• 40:20
  SPEAKER_03: So they know each other in a way that nobody else knows them that way.
• 40:26
  SPEAKER_03: Right?
• 40:27
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 40:29
  SPEAKER_03: The more they're intimate, do they get to know who that person is more or less?
• 40:39
  SPEAKER_04: More.
• 40:41
  SPEAKER_03: No.
• 40:45
  SPEAKER_03: No, not if you really have a pure intimate relationship.
• 40:52
  SPEAKER_03: Because on one hand, you're having this ecstatic relationship, and on the other hand, the other person still remains a mystery because you're not the other person.
• 41:07
  SPEAKER_04: So why would it be less over time?
• 41:10
  SPEAKER_03: Ah good question.
• 41:13
  SPEAKER_03: Because it takes the knowing part of the relationship to feel the not knowing part.
• 41:24
  SPEAKER_03: This is the whole Vart, the difference between Chabad Chasidis, learning chasidis about God.
• 41:33
  SPEAKER_03: What does it say?
• 41:33
  SPEAKER_03: It says the mitzvah manasalakus is the machalikis whether there's a mitzvah to believe in God.
• 41:40
  SPEAKER_03: And we say, and the the basic answer from the Semak, famous Mimer, is to know that there is a God, that's not a Muna.
• 41:51
  SPEAKER_03: That you don't need faith.
• 41:52
  SPEAKER_03: You gotta use your brains.
• 41:54
  SPEAKER_03: Okay.
• 41:55
  SPEAKER_03: What kind of God?
• 41:56
  SPEAKER_03: And there's different levels of how to say what does that mean, but what kind of God?
• 42:00
  SPEAKER_03: That's a Muna.
• 42:03
  SPEAKER_03: Okay.
• 42:04
  SPEAKER_03: So as much as you're gonna know that God exists, you're never gonna know God Himself directly.
• 42:13
  SPEAKER_03: What's his mahus?
• 42:14
  SPEAKER_03: What's his essence?
• 42:15
  SPEAKER_03: What is godliness?
• 42:17
  SPEAKER_03: Okay.
• 42:17
  SPEAKER_03: So the person who learns chasidis is never gonna know God.
• 42:22
  SPEAKER_03: Late Smok Shabbat's feet in Bakal, not that I can grasp in you.
• 42:24
  SPEAKER_03: I can't fathom what you are.
• 42:26
  SPEAKER_03: I can't look at you, I can't see you, I can't grasp you.
• 42:29
  SPEAKER_03: All my paradigm of what's what's the simple paradigm of this world?
• 42:33
  SPEAKER_03: Science says it's very simple.
• 42:35
  SPEAKER_03: If you can't measure it, it doesn't exist.
• 42:37
  SPEAKER_03: You can't measure God.
• 42:38
  SPEAKER_03: Okay.
• 42:39
  SPEAKER_03: So I don't know what it is.
• 42:41
  SPEAKER_03: Okay, and the guy who says learning chosid is a waste of time.
• 42:46
  SPEAKER_03: You should only be learning Gemara, etc., etc., never learns chasidis.
• 42:51
  SPEAKER_03: Does he believe in God?
• 42:54
  SPEAKER_03: I think he believes in God.
• 42:55
  SPEAKER_03: Does he believe that God's unattainable?
• 43:01
  SPEAKER_01: 100%.
• 43:02
  SPEAKER_03: So what's the difference between the two?
• 43:06
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
• 43:06
  SPEAKER_04: What is it?
• 43:07
  SPEAKER_03: Okay.
• 43:08
  SPEAKER_03: So for the Bachrum who are listening, this mysterious help meet that you mate that you're gonna eventually meet and get married to, you don't know who she is.
• 43:22
  SPEAKER_03: Right?
• 43:23
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
• 43:23
  SPEAKER_03: You haven't met her yet, as far as you know.
• 43:26
  SPEAKER_03: Haven't met her yet.
• 43:27
  SPEAKER_03: And you're eventually gonna go on a shiddach and you're gonna meet her.
• 43:30
  SPEAKER_03: Okay, great, goal there.
• 43:33
  SPEAKER_03: That's like the Litvach and God.
• 43:39
  SPEAKER_03: The once they're married, the more you're united as a couple, the more the other person becomes you get in touch with the fact that the essence of the other person is beyond your grasp.
• 43:57
  SPEAKER_01: So the the that that the literature.
• 44:00
  SPEAKER_01: Don't have.
• 44:04
  SPEAKER_01: Right?
• 44:05
  SPEAKER_01: Okay.
• 44:06
  SPEAKER_03: So where do you know the spouse?
• 44:09
  SPEAKER_03: You know that, let's say for the for the average guy, you know, she you know that she cooks for you and she takes care of your children and she respects you, all the things you get from her.
• 44:22
  SPEAKER_03: Right?
• 44:24
  SPEAKER_03: Okay.
• 44:26
  SPEAKER_03: That's like the guy who said, Pour out your heart to God.
• 44:31
  SPEAKER_03: That's really real.
• 44:34
  SPEAKER_03: And the Chabad chasid says, I want to know the essence.
• 44:38
  SPEAKER_03: But you can't know the essence.
• 44:41
  SPEAKER_03: I know.
• 44:41
  SPEAKER_03: That's a great sweet spot to be in.
• 44:45
  SPEAKER_03: Wanting to know the essence, because it's real, real to you.
• 44:49
  SPEAKER_03: And that's the pshat by the Reverishab.
• 44:53
  SPEAKER_03: He didn't know.
• 44:54
  SPEAKER_03: When you if God's going to appear to you, is that going to be the level that's unknowable?
• 45:00
  SPEAKER_03: Yes or I mean I don't know what he means.
• 45:04
  SPEAKER_03: Well eventually it says Nigla Kol Kavodashem Rao Kobasu Yachtov and still says in Chasidis Ain Doymalcha.
• 45:14
  unknown: Okay.
• 45:15
  SPEAKER_03: There's still gonna be unfortunate.
• 45:19
  SPEAKER_04: But yeah, I hear.
• 45:20
  SPEAKER_04: Wow.
• 45:22
  SPEAKER_03: Now you know, so I don't know.
• 45:29
  SPEAKER_04: I think uh I think that's the whole point.
• 45:32
  SPEAKER_03: I mean you said it's uh it doesn't Yeah, but it leaves me feeling like what kind of schmuck am I?
• 45:38
  SPEAKER_03: That is this what I'm running around looking for.
• 45:41
  SPEAKER_04: Well, go to the I think it is the the Mitlereba's other marshal, I don't think it's in Darakhaim.
• 45:48
  SPEAKER_04: I don't remember where it is, but where he discusses the idea that the the father purposely hides from the son in order that the son should look for him.
• 45:57
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
• 45:57
  SPEAKER_04: And that that's the that's the icker is the place is in Konsosis Bilas, he says.
• 46:03
  SPEAKER_04: Ah, okay, yeah.
• 46:04
  SPEAKER_04: So the the the Icker is the fact that the son is looking for him.
• 46:08
  SPEAKER_03: That's what's the episode.
• 46:10
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, so I'm saying that That's what you're describing.
• 46:14
  SPEAKER_04: You're describing that that search that like, okay, so then what am I doing for?
• 46:19
  SPEAKER_04: That's the point.
• 46:20
  SPEAKER_03: Right.
• 46:21
  SPEAKER_03: So what do you s so what is a person to do if he's not holding there?
• 46:29
  SPEAKER_03: What does he turn?
• 46:30
  SPEAKER_03: How does he turn himself on?
• 46:33
  SPEAKER_03: Because I'm feeling it now.
• 46:35
  SPEAKER_03: Like I'm looking back and saying, come on, Ruvain.
• 46:38
  SPEAKER_03: This 18-year-old naive little boy chick hitchhacking across the country, not keeping Shabbos, blah blah blah blah blah, is looking for God.
• 46:47
  SPEAKER_03: And I found him, in in a sense, because like we came from.
• 46:52
  SPEAKER_03: And now I have a guy telling me, Oh, you don't pour your heart out to God, you're just an academic, you know, fuddy daddy.
• 47:00
  SPEAKER_03: Okay.
• 47:01
  SPEAKER_03: Um, to a degree he's correct.
• 47:04
  SPEAKER_04: So again, to that degree that he's correct, that bothers you, you could take in in a lesson in a void as a sham that it's now time to fuse little, you know, Ruvain, 18-year-old Ruvain, and matured thousands of my marm and pages under his belt, and knowing and understanding, and fuse the two together and see what comes.
• 47:33
  SPEAKER_01: What's his trip when he wants to see?
• 47:43
  SPEAKER_01: Interesting difference.
• 47:48
  SPEAKER_01: That leaves you hanging, doesn't it?
• 47:52
  SPEAKER_04: I guess so.
• 47:54
  SPEAKER_03: Wow.
• 47:57
  SPEAKER_03: So you can hang yourself with your own noose every time you learn Hasidis?
• 48:02
  SPEAKER_03: It's kind of weird.
• 48:12
  SPEAKER_03: That's the whole linchpin of this story.
• 48:16
  SPEAKER_03: It's not that you're gonna learn Hasidas and you're gonna see God.
• 48:23
  SPEAKER_03: You're not going to.
• 48:24
  SPEAKER_03: Two Mashik comes as and you have to apply your Amuna is steadfast and starts even before you learn.
• 48:34
  SPEAKER_01: But is that true?
• 48:36
  SPEAKER_03: Do you feel your Amuna beforehand?
• 48:42
  SPEAKER_03: Or do you expect the Chabad Khasis is gonna create your Amuna?
• 48:50
  SPEAKER_03: That's a totally other issue, which is why the other chasadas drops it.
• 48:55
  SPEAKER_03: You're not creating my experience by me learning this.
• 49:02
  SPEAKER_03: Okay, so we're gonna stop this whole thing, we're gonna start all over.