Latest / The Driven Athlete / Affordable Regeneration For Active Lives with Dr. K | Ep 107

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Affordable Regeneration For Active Lives with Dr. K | Ep 107 · The Driven Athlete

• 0:00
  SPEAKER_01: If you're a driven, active person who wants to reach and pursue a higher quality life with some ambition, then guess what?
• 0:06
  SPEAKER_01: This podcast is for you.
• 0:08
  SPEAKER_01: This is the Driven Athlete Podcast.
• 0:12
  SPEAKER_01: What's up, y'all?
• 0:12
  SPEAKER_01: It's your main Dr.
• 0:13
  SPEAKER_01: Kyle.
• 0:14
  SPEAKER_01: Welcome back to the Driven Athlete Podcast.
• 0:15
  SPEAKER_01: We got a really cool guest with us.
• 0:18
  SPEAKER_01: Dr.
• 0:18
  SPEAKER_01: Ben with the Longevity Center in West Palm Beach.
• 0:22
  SPEAKER_01: I know you're a busy guy, so thank you for coming in and sharing more of your insights and what y'all do and your practice and stuff.
• 0:29
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 0:30
  SPEAKER_01: Tell us we're again where you're located.
• 0:31
  SPEAKER_00: So we're in West Palm Beach, right off kind of Palm Beach Lakes Boulevard, right in the middle of Palm Beach.
• 0:36
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah.
• 0:37
  SPEAKER_00: And y'all opened that spot like within a year, year ago?
• 0:41
  SPEAKER_00: Just over a year now.
• 0:43
  SPEAKER_00: Yep.
• 0:43
  SPEAKER_00: I was in Jupiter for a few years before that.
• 0:44
  SPEAKER_01: I was working for someone else and I left and started my own place.
• 0:47
  SPEAKER_01: Gotcha.
• 0:48
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah.
• 0:49
  SPEAKER_01: What was the catalyst to do that?
• 0:52
  SPEAKER_00: Um, basically to start your own place.
• 0:54
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, the long story short is I was looking in the market, I'm like, the prices on some of the stuff, it's not there's no rhyme or reason for pricing on any of this stuff.
• 1:01
  SPEAKER_00: Everyone kind of looks at what everyone else is charging.
• 1:04
  SPEAKER_00: They're like, yeah, everyone charges$2,000.
• 1:06
  SPEAKER_00: I'm gonna charge$2,000.
• 1:07
  SPEAKER_00: And you look at some of this stuff, it's like the cost on it's like$100.
• 1:10
  SPEAKER_00: Like, so their margins on stuff is crazy.
• 1:13
  SPEAKER_00: And so my whole thing was, I want, I just got sick of having to tell patients, yeah, it's gonna be like five, ten thousand dollars.
• 1:19
  SPEAKER_00: And like, I can't afford them.
• 1:20
  SPEAKER_00: Like, and I would sit there thinking, I can't afford to be a patient here.
• 1:24
  SPEAKER_00: As a doctor, I don't make enough money to be a patient in this clinic.
• 1:26
  SPEAKER_00: Of my of like of yourself, yep.
• 1:28
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, so that that was really the cows.
• 1:30
  SPEAKER_00: Like, I want the middle class person to be able to afford services.
• 1:34
  SPEAKER_01: Gotcha.
• 1:35
  SPEAKER_01: Well, it's very philanthropic, you know, they want to reach more people and influence to help more people.
• 1:39
  SPEAKER_01: Yep.
• 1:40
  SPEAKER_01: Um what do y'all do?
• 1:42
  SPEAKER_01: Like, so stem cells is your main thing.
• 1:44
  SPEAKER_01: Um, PRP as well.
• 1:46
  SPEAKER_01: Yep.
• 1:46
  SPEAKER_01: Like, what do y'all do?
• 1:47
  SPEAKER_00: So kind of services.
• 1:49
  SPEAKER_00: Almost everything that exists in the functional regenerative integrative space we offer.
• 1:53
  SPEAKER_00: So we have peptides, we have stem cells, PRP, prolotherapy, and then we do all the IVs, ozone, eBu, chelation, methylene blue, NAD, procaine, vitamins, vitamin C.
• 2:04
  SPEAKER_00: We have it all.
• 2:05
  SPEAKER_01: Interesting.
• 2:06
  SPEAKER_01: What do you feel like for somebody who has like, let's say, like a lingering low back problem, all right, or a lingering shoulder problem or something like that?
• 2:14
  SPEAKER_01: Yep.
• 2:14
  SPEAKER_01: And you're like, hey, um, I've heard peptides, right, are really a good um adjunct with some things if they're a candidate for stem cell.
• 2:22
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 2:22
  SPEAKER_01: But anyway, with that for recovery, all right, and healing, what's like the best stack for peptides that usually recommend to people?
• 2:29
  SPEAKER_00: So the problem with peptides, well, you for recovering healing, but let me start by saying peptides, I tell patients peptides are like medications.
• 2:36
  SPEAKER_00: Everyone you have to take has to have a purpose and a goal for taking it.
• 2:40
  SPEAKER_00: And so you tell me your goal and I'll tell you which peptides to take.
• 2:44
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but the best stack for healing, it depends.
• 2:48
  SPEAKER_00: Are you going to work out while healing or not?
• 2:50
  SPEAKER_00: Let's say yeah.
• 2:51
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 2:52
  SPEAKER_00: So if you're going to work out, the best combo is going to be a mix of a couple.
• 2:56
  SPEAKER_00: One.
• 2:56
  SPEAKER_00: So it used to be take BPC with TB500 with zinc GHK.
• 3:02
  SPEAKER_00: But then glow came out, which combines all three of those, right?
• 3:05
  SPEAKER_00: What came out?
• 3:06
  SPEAKER_00: It's called Glow.
• 3:07
  SPEAKER_00: They basically took all three of those, which were always separate and combined them to pull them together.
• 3:11
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 3:12
  SPEAKER_00: And then there's another bunch of GHC.
• 3:14
  SPEAKER_00: GHK copper.
• 3:15
  SPEAKER_00: GHK, sorry.
• 3:16
  SPEAKER_00: So they work on different pathways, but basically between the three of them, they cover smooth muscle recovery, skeletal muscle recovery, and then also collagen regrowth.
• 3:25
  SPEAKER_01: Interesting.
• 3:26
  SPEAKER_01: Awesome.
• 3:27
  SPEAKER_01: Um, yeah, so uh so um TB500, BPC157, GHK, yep, and that stack, and then zinc.
• 3:36
  SPEAKER_00: Uh so it used to be zinc thymolin with GHK was always kind of how it came.
• 3:40
  SPEAKER_00: That was a different aesthetics peptide.
• 3:42
  SPEAKER_00: So glow took out the zinc, put the other three together.
• 3:45
  SPEAKER_01: Gotcha.
• 3:45
  SPEAKER_01: What was the zinc for?
• 3:47
  SPEAKER_00: Um, zinc thymolin, it's aesthetics basically.
• 3:50
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, okay.
• 3:51
  SPEAKER_00: All right.
• 3:51
  SPEAKER_00: Makes your face shine.
• 3:52
  SPEAKER_01: Got it.
• 3:53
  SPEAKER_01: So it makes your skin glow a little bit more, a little clarity.
• 3:56
  SPEAKER_01: Interesting.
• 3:57
  SPEAKER_01: Um, what about for like um for sleep?
• 4:00
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, sleep, that's my favorite peptide.
• 4:02
  SPEAKER_00: It's called DCP, delta sleep-inducing peptide.
• 4:06
  SPEAKER_00: So well the actual so our brain goes through four different stages of sleep alpha, beta, theta, and delta.
• 4:13
  SPEAKER_00: And so uh Dsip, it just promotes the hormone that promotes deep sleep.
• 4:18
  SPEAKER_00: So when you take an hour or two before bed, it just helps catapult you into deep sleep easier.
• 4:22
  SPEAKER_01: Interesting.
• 4:23
  SPEAKER_01: And that the and that's the delta?
• 4:25
  SPEAKER_01: Yep, it's called DCP.
• 4:27
  SPEAKER_01: DC delta waves that you're trying to achieve.
• 4:29
  SPEAKER_01: Yep.
• 4:29
  SPEAKER_01: And is that the rem component of sleep?
• 4:31
  SPEAKER_00: Like REM isn't actually deep sleep.
• 4:34
  SPEAKER_00: Um, REM is actually considered to be light sleep, but it's your dream state.
• 4:39
  SPEAKER_00: So you have deep sleep, which is before REM.
• 4:41
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, okay.
• 4:42
  SPEAKER_00: You achieve REM by going into deep sleep.
• 4:44
  SPEAKER_01: Got it.
• 4:45
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, okay.
• 4:45
  SPEAKER_01: Interesting.
• 4:46
  SPEAKER_01: So that's the best one for sleep.
• 4:48
  SPEAKER_01: Yep.
• 4:48
  SPEAKER_01: So do you recommend people take boat like that with the recovery one?
• 4:52
  SPEAKER_01: Like Oh, yeah.
• 4:53
  SPEAKER_01: Um, we have patients.
• 4:54
  SPEAKER_00: Could you over could you overstack?
• 4:56
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, you can definitely overstack.
• 4:58
  SPEAKER_00: Because at the end of the day, you what peptides really are, they're reproducing humans' natural hormones.
• 5:04
  SPEAKER_00: And so when you start messing with too many hormones at once, I've seen weird things happen.
• 5:07
  SPEAKER_00: People start to react to peptides they shouldn't be reacting to, and I think it's just because there are too many at once.
• 5:12
  SPEAKER_01: Like what?
• 5:12
  SPEAKER_01: Like what kind of reactions?
• 5:14
  SPEAKER_00: Um, some people feel super weird, some people get skin stuff, some people get histamine reactions.
• 5:19
  SPEAKER_01: Interesting.
• 5:20
  SPEAKER_01: Um, okay, yeah.
• 5:22
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, what about like like insomnia?
• 5:24
  SPEAKER_01: Like if it's or anxiety, or then when you say histamine response, like like uh like they start injecting rashes, yeah.
• 5:31
  SPEAKER_01: They inject and they get a rash.
• 5:33
  SPEAKER_01: I'm like, that's weird.
• 5:34
  SPEAKER_01: Interesting.
• 5:34
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, okay, gotcha.
• 5:35
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah.
• 5:36
  SPEAKER_01: Is there what I've I've heard different ideas and um thoughts behind how long to take peptides.
• 5:41
  SPEAKER_01: I've heard six months and like then take a drug holiday, like take a break, so you don't get too uh your receptors don't get used to the to the stimulant.
• 5:50
  SPEAKER_00: So I typically say three months.
• 5:52
  SPEAKER_00: Three months.
• 5:52
  SPEAKER_00: But with the bigger rule is it's equal time off as on.
• 5:56
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, okay.
• 5:57
  SPEAKER_00: So if you run it for a month, take a month off.
• 5:58
  SPEAKER_00: You run the three months, you're taking three months off.
• 6:00
  SPEAKER_00: Because there's two parts to it.
• 6:02
  SPEAKER_00: One, it's kind of yes, your receptors can become desensitized to the hormone so they stop responding as appropriately.
• 6:10
  SPEAKER_00: But two, you can shut down your own production if you're on something long enough because your body just like taking testosterone for guys that eventually shuts down their production because the body says, I'm getting plenty of need it.
• 6:18
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 6:19
  SPEAKER_00: Same thing can happen with the peptides.
• 6:20
  SPEAKER_00: You can shut down your own production.
• 6:21
  SPEAKER_01: So three months is what seems to be the rule of thumb, yeah, understanding uh length of time.
• 6:26
  SPEAKER_01: What about um the growth hormone pulsing peptides?
• 6:30
  SPEAKER_01: The CJC, CJC, Ipamerolin, Tesamorolin, and Tesamoralin.
• 6:34
  SPEAKER_01: Yep.
• 6:34
  SPEAKER_01: And what's the other one?
• 6:35
  SPEAKER_01: Sumorlin.
• 6:36
  SPEAKER_00: Sumorlin.
• 6:36
  SPEAKER_00: It's SMORLin, IPA, TESA.
• 6:39
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 6:39
  SPEAKER_00: They're they're the same thing, they're just strengths of it.
• 6:43
  SPEAKER_00: What's what's stronger, what's weaker?
• 6:44
  SPEAKER_00: TESA's the strongest.
• 6:46
  SPEAKER_01: IPA's in the middle, and some moralin's at the bottom.
• 6:48
  SPEAKER_01: IPA's in the middle.
• 6:49
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, and tesamerol is the highest.
• 6:51
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 6:51
  SPEAKER_01: So what would make somebody choose one versus the other?
• 6:54
  SPEAKER_00: Typically, what I recommend is so we typically skip some orelin.
• 6:58
  SPEAKER_00: We typically go straight to ipamarelin.
• 7:00
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 7:00
  SPEAKER_00: But we do CJC with Ipamerelin for usually three months, and then you take that one off, and then you can do CJC and Tessimerelin separately.
• 7:09
  SPEAKER_00: Um, because I haven't seen a combo of those come out yet.
• 7:12
  SPEAKER_00: But basically, it's a building pattern.
• 7:14
  SPEAKER_00: You want to stepwise upwards because if you jump straight to the top, one, you're probably going to react.
• 7:18
  SPEAKER_00: So we need too much growth response.
• 7:20
  unknown: Yeah.
• 7:21
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and then two, you lose your like lower levels because you get a lot of muscle growth at a little lower levels as well.
• 7:28
  SPEAKER_00: But if you skip them, you lose all that building.
• 7:31
  SPEAKER_01: Interesting.
• 7:31
  SPEAKER_01: And that's all again, three-month time is what you would suggest.
• 7:34
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 7:36
  SPEAKER_01: When with taking the growth hormone pulse, same thought.
• 7:39
  SPEAKER_01: It's like it's naturally, it's a natural peptide on your body.
• 7:42
  SPEAKER_01: You're just promoting your own pituitary gland to stimulate growth hormone production.
• 7:48
  SPEAKER_01: Correct.
• 7:48
  SPEAKER_01: And then when you get off of it, it's not like there's a cycle, like a post-cycle therapy you have to go through.
• 7:53
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 7:54
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, do people with pulsing growth hormone facilitating that?
• 7:58
  SPEAKER_01: The thought is to get more recovery and fat loss.
• 8:02
  SPEAKER_01: Pretty much, yeah.
• 8:03
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and or and building muscle lean muscle mass?
• 8:08
  unknown: Yeah.
• 8:08
  SPEAKER_00: Like what what else for?
• 8:09
  SPEAKER_00: So that that's the dip, that's the CJC and then the epimerelin.
• 8:13
  SPEAKER_00: They're two different pathways.
• 8:15
  SPEAKER_00: Um epimerelin's more about burning fat.
• 8:18
  SPEAKER_00: CJC is more about building muscle.
• 8:20
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, okay.
• 8:21
  SPEAKER_01: Interesting.
• 8:22
  SPEAKER_01: Um have people, I mean, by no like pathological growth hormone, like acromegaly, right?
• 8:29
  SPEAKER_01: Do people progress into that if they were to take it too much?
• 8:32
  SPEAKER_01: Like people grown inches by like taller?
• 8:35
  SPEAKER_00: No.
• 8:35
  SPEAKER_00: So, well, acromegally is growth of non-fused growth plates.
• 8:40
  SPEAKER_00: So, like you can't grow taller, even if you have acromegally um after the age of like 25 on your growth plates are fully fused, you're not going to grow any taller.
• 8:48
  SPEAKER_00: Giganticism, which is what happens in kids, that those are the ones that grow super tall.
• 8:52
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, I see.
• 8:52
  SPEAKER_00: Um, acromegally, like ears, jaws, jaw, yeah, non-fused structures grow.
• 8:58
  SPEAKER_01: Interesting.
• 8:59
  SPEAKER_01: Wow.
• 9:00
  SPEAKER_01: Um, so but that wouldn't happen.
• 9:02
  SPEAKER_01: Somebody taking growth hormone, people getting taller.
• 9:06
  SPEAKER_01: Or like if people if people take CJC, ipimeralin, testamerolin happen.
• 9:10
  SPEAKER_01: Or what about like heart enlargement?
• 9:12
  SPEAKER_01: Like, is that a risk?
• 9:14
  SPEAKER_01: In theory, it's a risk.
• 9:16
  SPEAKER_00: Um, in reality, I've never seen it, but in theory it's a risk.
• 9:20
  SPEAKER_01: And that would be um like left ventricular hypertrophy.
• 9:25
  SPEAKER_01: And that would be the the the risk.
• 9:27
  SPEAKER_01: Yep.
• 9:27
  SPEAKER_01: The thought behind it.
• 9:28
  SPEAKER_00: But you haven't seen that.
• 9:29
  SPEAKER_00: I haven't seen that.
• 9:29
  SPEAKER_00: I think the diff when so that's really a risk when you take like HDH human growth hormone because it's unregulated cell growth.
• 9:36
  SPEAKER_00: When you do the uh CJC, it's your body's kind of basically almost aware of what's happening, so it's ramping up other things to keep up to make sense.
• 9:45
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, so it's not gonna just be all out of just totally haywire and out of ra out of whack.
• 9:49
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 9:50
  SPEAKER_01: Interesting.
• 9:51
  SPEAKER_01: Um, do you take any peptides and stuff?
• 9:53
  SPEAKER_00: Um, here and there.
• 9:54
  SPEAKER_00: I'm like the worst one to ask.
• 9:57
  SPEAKER_00: I the only thing I ever manage to do consistently is iB stem cells.
• 10:00
  SPEAKER_00: Everything else I'm kind of all over the place.
• 10:03
  SPEAKER_00: What for?
• 10:04
  SPEAKER_00: Ivy stem cells.
• 10:06
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 10:06
  SPEAKER_00: Um, the way I look at ivy stem cells, every time you do them, they're going to go somewhere and heal something.
• 10:11
  SPEAKER_00: And so it's the ultimate anti-aging treatment.
• 10:14
  SPEAKER_01: I was gonna say, well, yeah, talk about that next.
• 10:17
  SPEAKER_01: Um, so stem cells is a lot of common.
• 10:19
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, that's I say it sounds super exciting from a medical from a healthcare standpoint, right?
• 10:25
  SPEAKER_01: Where um I'm always wondering, it seems still like not well known that the United States it's legal for stem cells, yeah, application and not just harvesting your own stem cells, but like umbilical, umbilically donated stem cells and adipose donated stem cells.
• 10:46
  SPEAKER_01: Is that correct?
• 10:46
  SPEAKER_01: Yep.
• 10:47
  SPEAKER_01: Um, why is there a misconception then?
• 10:49
  SPEAKER_01: Like where people like, oh, I have to go to I had to go out of Panama out of out of the country to Europe.
• 10:53
  SPEAKER_01: I had to go out of these places to get stem cells.
• 10:55
  SPEAKER_00: So 15 years ago, that was true.
• 10:57
  SPEAKER_00: Um the stem cell market in America was very poor, very restricted, and like the it was like the Wild West.
• 11:04
  SPEAKER_00: Companies were doing whatever they wanted with no regulations, and there's a lot of dirty product in America.
• 11:08
  SPEAKER_00: Um, the FDA, regardless of how people feel about them, they have cleaned up the stem cell market quite a bit.
• 11:14
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and so it's not quote unquote legal at a federal level, but it is legal at multiple state levels.
• 11:20
  SPEAKER_00: Florida recently made it legal, North Carolina is very pro-stem cells, Utah.
• 11:24
  SPEAKER_00: Um, there's a couple other states that are, I think Nevada, they're all very pro-stem cell.
• 11:29
  SPEAKER_00: And so I think it's a couple states short, and then it'll go to federal level for once enough states do it, the federal government has to approve something.
• 11:36
  SPEAKER_01: And that's when the FDA would be a part of that?
• 11:40
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, there is a whole biologics wing to the FDA that monitors like stem cells and all that.
• 11:45
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but I can tell you stem cells in America are much, much cleaner and more what's the word, um, reproducibly guaranteed than overseas countries.
• 11:58
  SPEAKER_01: Like replicated, like the same product.
• 12:00
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 12:00
  SPEAKER_01: You're confident the same consistency of the products gonna be the same.
• 12:03
  SPEAKER_01: The quality assurance on it's much better.
• 12:05
  SPEAKER_01: Interesting.
• 12:06
  SPEAKER_01: So yeah, so when it was 15 years ago, it was not legal.
• 12:09
  SPEAKER_01: When did Florida approve?
• 12:12
  SPEAKER_01: Florida was July.
• 12:13
  SPEAKER_01: It's like three months ago.
• 12:14
  SPEAKER_01: So for stem cells to be legal.
• 12:16
  SPEAKER_01: So then how were people able to do it before that?
• 12:18
  SPEAKER_01: So in Florida?
• 12:19
  SPEAKER_00: They've always been legal.
• 12:21
  SPEAKER_00: What Florida did was define the word stem cell so that now we can talk about it and market with it.
• 12:26
  SPEAKER_00: Because before, they're not stem cells is a marketing word at the end of the day.
• 12:30
  SPEAKER_00: What they really are, they're uh MSCs or mesenchymal or medicinal signaling cells that they're basically growth factors.
• 12:36
  SPEAKER_00: Mesenchymal signaling cells.
• 12:38
  SPEAKER_00: Yep.
• 12:38
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 12:39
  SPEAKER_00: I think it's mesenchymal stromal cells or medicinal signaling cells.
• 12:43
  SPEAKER_00: They have two names.
• 12:44
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 12:44
  SPEAKER_00: Um, the guy we can go into the whole history, but basically the guy that discovered them in the 90s, he keeps changing the name of them because he keeps saying, no, their purpose isn't what I thought it is, it's something else.
• 12:53
  SPEAKER_00: But he's the first one that coined stem cells.
• 12:55
  SPEAKER_01: Interesting.
• 12:57
  SPEAKER_01: So um it was always legal.
• 12:59
  SPEAKER_01: Like, yeah, how?
• 13:00
  SPEAKER_01: How was it always legal?
• 13:01
  SPEAKER_00: So they're so legal, they're allowed to be produced and they're allowed to be used.
• 13:08
  SPEAKER_00: A lot of it is for wound care and surgical uses.
• 13:11
  SPEAKER_00: Um, what happens is this passed in the 70s.
• 13:13
  SPEAKER_00: Physicians are allowed to use medicines and drugs and products for off-label purposes.
• 13:18
  SPEAKER_00: So we're using them for off-label purposes.
• 13:21
  SPEAKER_00: And as long as the patient has informed consent and I have reasonable medical understanding that they will provide benefit to the patient, we can use them.
• 13:28
  SPEAKER_01: Interesting.
• 13:29
  SPEAKER_01: All right.
• 13:30
  SPEAKER_01: Um, oh, that's really cool.
• 13:31
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, what's so let's say somebody, you know, has degenerative uh like in their lumbar spine, their cervical spine in their neck, shoulder rotated cuff, hip impingement, labrum, whatever.
• 13:42
  SPEAKER_01: And like I want to pursue stem cells to help heal or arthritis, of course, that's gonna be the number one thing too.
• 13:46
  SPEAKER_01: Arthritic changes.
• 13:48
  SPEAKER_01: Um what would be the best type of stem cells to pursue?
• 13:51
  SPEAKER_00: So that's now you've opened up the can of worms because there's so many different types out there, right?
• 13:56
  SPEAKER_00: So if we break it down, there's three that come from you.
• 13:59
  SPEAKER_00: They're called V cells out of your blood.
• 14:01
  SPEAKER_00: There is adipose out of your fat, and there's bone marrow out of your bone marrow out of your hip.
• 14:05
  SPEAKER_00: And then there's donated, which come from placenta, umbilical cord, amniotic.
• 14:11
  SPEAKER_00: So most of them are fluid-based.
• 14:15
  SPEAKER_00: And so this we're gonna talk about what I specifically use.
• 14:17
  SPEAKER_00: That gets me better results than the average person.
• 14:20
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so most of them are fluid-based.
• 14:22
  SPEAKER_00: So that when you inject them, you're injecting a bunch of cells and signaling factors and growth factors that tell your body, hey, there's an injury here, come repair it.
• 14:30
  SPEAKER_00: They don't actually grow or become anything.
• 14:33
  SPEAKER_00: So, what I use is a placental tissue allograft.
• 14:37
  SPEAKER_00: What that's fancy for is they actually take the placenta and basically grind it up and give me pieces of it.
• 14:42
  SPEAKER_00: And you can actually see them floating syringe.
• 14:44
  SPEAKER_00: So when I inject it, it's closer to a non-surgical graft than it is to stem cells.
• 14:49
  SPEAKER_00: So all I'm doing is putting tissue in our body has to do is stitch it into place, doesn't have to grow anything.
• 14:54
  SPEAKER_01: Interesting.
• 14:55
  SPEAKER_01: Um, are there also adipose donated stem cells?
• 15:00
  SPEAKER_01: There are adipost donated stem cells.
• 15:02
  SPEAKER_01: So I use those for IV.
• 15:03
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, that's okay.
• 15:04
  SPEAKER_01: So those are the IV stem cells.
• 15:05
  SPEAKER_01: All right.
• 15:05
  SPEAKER_01: So then the administration of the stem cells, we can do it intra-eticular, like in a joint for the purpose of healing arthritis.
• 15:12
  SPEAKER_01: Yep.
• 15:13
  SPEAKER_01: Or like regenerating cartilage.
• 15:15
  SPEAKER_01: Is that correct?
• 15:16
  SPEAKER_01: Correct.
• 15:16
  SPEAKER_01: How long does it take for like somebody has advanced arthritis or moderately advanced arthritis, whatever, and you inject stem cells?
• 15:25
  SPEAKER_01: Um, how many stem cells do you inject there?
• 15:27
  SPEAKER_01: And then how long until people would see a difference?
• 15:31
  SPEAKER_01: Like how slow, how long would it take for the cells to regenerate?
• 15:34
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so I'll answer those in reverse order.
• 15:36
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 15:37
  SPEAKER_00: I've seen imaging changes like on ultrasound as quickly as three weeks.
• 15:41
  SPEAKER_00: But on average, what I tell people is you'll start to get glimpses of pain relief at about six to eight weeks.
• 15:47
  SPEAKER_00: And then you really start to feel that three months, and it could take all the way up to six months for a full lock-in.
• 15:53
  SPEAKER_00: But by three months, I'd say 90% of people have significant reduction in their symptoms.
• 15:57
  SPEAKER_00: Amazing.
• 15:58
  SPEAKER_00: That's awesome.
• 16:00
  SPEAKER_00: And then knowing how much to use, that's that's actually the hard part.
• 16:03
  SPEAKER_00: Because I have patients that come to me like, why are you$5,000 when the guy down the street said he's a thousand?
• 16:08
  SPEAKER_00: I'm like, well, think about what he's giving you.
• 16:10
  SPEAKER_00: Go ask him what he's giving you.
• 16:11
  SPEAKER_00: He's probably giving you like one ml of it of who knows what into like your joint space.
• 16:16
  SPEAKER_00: Whereas me, I'm going to inject, let's take your knee for example, we're going to inject in your joint, but we're also going to inject the stability structures of your joint so that you don't regain the arthritis in a year.
• 16:27
  SPEAKER_01: Gotcha.
• 16:28
  SPEAKER_01: So then you would need more.
• 16:29
  SPEAKER_01: You need more, more volume.
• 16:30
  SPEAKER_01: Yep.
• 16:31
  SPEAKER_00: So volume really matters.
• 16:32
  SPEAKER_01: It's very patient-specific how much volume I need.
• 16:34
  SPEAKER_01: And what does that sound like?
• 16:35
  SPEAKER_01: Like a hundred million cells, 50 million, or maybe milliliters.
• 16:40
  SPEAKER_01: Is that a better way to describe it?
• 16:41
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, the tissue.
• 16:42
  SPEAKER_00: There's a few different companies that sell tissue-based stem cells, and they're not sold by count.
• 16:48
  SPEAKER_00: They're sold by just volume.
• 16:49
  SPEAKER_00: And then if you really want to be good, you do your own research into what their tissue counts are.
• 16:54
  SPEAKER_00: Per milliliter.
• 16:55
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 16:55
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah.
• 16:56
  SPEAKER_00: So that's the average for that.
• 16:57
  SPEAKER_00: Four to 10 is the average.
• 16:59
  SPEAKER_01: It's four to ten million.
• 17:00
  SPEAKER_01: Four to ten milliliters.
• 17:02
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, sorry.
• 17:02
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, sorry, how many, how many cells like per milliliter?
• 17:05
  SPEAKER_00: Um, it's in the hundreds of millions of like growth factors and it's decellularized, so there's no live cells in there, but it's growth factors and tissue counts.
• 17:15
  SPEAKER_01: I see.
• 17:16
  SPEAKER_01: Interesting.
• 17:17
  SPEAKER_01: Um, so somebody that has advanced arthritis or like hip arthritis, bone on bone, right?
• 17:22
  SPEAKER_01: There's someone here all the time.
• 17:24
  SPEAKER_01: Um, I mean, I'm super excited about the applications of stem cells and how they can help regenerate cartilage.
• 17:31
  SPEAKER_01: Because the thought would be like cartilage is avascular and a neural.
• 17:35
  SPEAKER_01: So then it's degenerative.
• 17:36
  SPEAKER_01: It can't be reproduced by its yourself.
• 17:40
  SPEAKER_01: But inject stem cells in there and then they just turn into cartilage, right?
• 17:45
  SPEAKER_01: Yep.
• 17:46
  SPEAKER_01: Is that like the thought?
• 17:47
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, basically those just kind of start to when you put them into the knee, they'll start to kind of just coat the cartilage of the knee and they'll kind of just fill in the divots.
• 17:55
  SPEAKER_00: It's kind of like when they fill potholes in the road and just pour the stuff in.
• 17:58
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 17:58
  SPEAKER_01: Gotcha.
• 17:59
  SPEAKER_01: No, I guess I was just thinking about what's the um, you know, you were uh, you know, ice hockey rinks and like the got the what's that thing called?
• 18:06
  SPEAKER_01: Zamboni?
• 18:06
  SPEAKER_01: The Zamboni.
• 18:07
  SPEAKER_01: Is it like Zamboniing the uh well the Zamboni shaves off the top layer, right?
• 18:11
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, it does.
• 18:12
  SPEAKER_01: Or does it pour water on?
• 18:13
  SPEAKER_01: I've never understood how those work.
• 18:14
  SPEAKER_01: I thought it did both.
• 18:15
  SPEAKER_01: Well, anyway, it coat, it's it's make it coats in the divots and it makes it smooth again.
• 18:20
  SPEAKER_01: I thought it did both, where it freezes the water and then it fills in the divots and then smooths it out.
• 18:24
  SPEAKER_01: It might.
• 18:24
  SPEAKER_01: You might be right.
• 18:25
  SPEAKER_01: Anyway, well, bottom line, the end of the game is that it's smoother and the divots are filled in.
• 18:28
  SPEAKER_01: Yep.
• 18:29
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and it takes like you can notice changes on an image like x-ray pre and post within three weeks.
• 18:36
  SPEAKER_01: That's rare, but I've seen it.
• 18:38
  SPEAKER_01: I would tell most people imaging changes are usually we look at about six months.
• 18:41
  SPEAKER_01: Six months.
• 18:42
  SPEAKER_01: Okay, and then what you'll feel is significant improvements in symptoms by 12 weeks, three months.
• 18:46
  SPEAKER_01: Usually, yeah.
• 18:47
  SPEAKER_01: That's awesome.
• 18:48
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and then the difference between why like what people pursue IV stem cells, which is just intravenous systemic stem cell infusion for the purpose of longevity, or yeah, what else?
• 19:05
  SPEAKER_00: So we have two different kinds of IV we use.
• 19:08
  SPEAKER_00: Uh so we have general IV, you infuse them, and I tell patients all the time.
• 19:11
  SPEAKER_00: These are the least guaranteed things we do.
• 19:13
  SPEAKER_00: They're going to go somewhere and heal something, but we have no idea where, why, or how.
• 19:17
  SPEAKER_00: What it's gonna prioritize.
• 19:18
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 19:18
  SPEAKER_00: So, like, I could tell you about this lady I had a few years ago, and she had two main issues.
• 19:23
  SPEAKER_00: She had really bad brain fog and she had neuropathy in her feet.
• 19:27
  SPEAKER_00: And she's like, I really want to do IV stem cells.
• 19:30
  SPEAKER_00: I think they're gonna fix my brain fog.
• 19:31
  SPEAKER_00: And I was like, same thing.
• 19:33
  SPEAKER_00: I have no idea where they're gonna go or what they're gonna do.
• 19:35
  SPEAKER_00: So, but she's like, Oh, I want to do them.
• 19:37
  SPEAKER_00: So we do IV stem cells on there.
• 19:39
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm talking to her like a month later, and I'm like, So, did they work?
• 19:43
  SPEAKER_00: How do you feel?
• 19:44
  SPEAKER_00: And she goes, Oh, I don't think they worked.
• 19:45
  SPEAKER_00: I'm like, Well, what's changed?
• 19:47
  SPEAKER_00: And she goes, Well, all my brain fog is still here.
• 19:49
  SPEAKER_00: I'm like, Okay, anything else?
• 19:50
  SPEAKER_00: She goes, Well, I think my neuropathy is gone, but like, I think that one didn't bother me as much.
• 19:55
  SPEAKER_00: I'm like, just because it didn't mentally bother you as much doesn't mean your body wasn't like, this is way worse.
• 20:00
  SPEAKER_00: Let me fix that.
• 20:00
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it's priority.
• 20:01
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah.
• 20:02
  SPEAKER_00: Interesting.
• 20:03
  SPEAKER_01: Um for systemic IV stem cells um with like neurological issues, yep.
• 20:11
  SPEAKER_01: And neuropathy can be helped.
• 20:14
  SPEAKER_01: Um, would that also be something for Parkinson's, like stuff like Parkinson's, multiple sclerosis, Huntington's disease, yeah, traumatic brain injury, stroke?
• 20:23
  SPEAKER_01: Yep.
• 20:24
  SPEAKER_01: All those things can be improved.
• 20:25
  SPEAKER_01: That can be, you can see benefit from stem cell inject or IV.
• 20:28
  SPEAKER_00: Yep.
• 20:28
  SPEAKER_00: So I've seen all that.
• 20:30
  SPEAKER_00: Um Wow.
• 20:31
  SPEAKER_00: How many treatments would it take?
• 20:32
  SPEAKER_00: It varies.
• 20:33
  SPEAKER_00: Um, one, two, three, four.
• 20:35
  SPEAKER_00: Um, kind of just what we tell patients.
• 20:37
  SPEAKER_00: We're gonna do one, we're gonna see where you're at in about a month.
• 20:39
  SPEAKER_00: And if we if it works some degree, we'll do another one, work another degree.
• 20:43
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, like double down and can continue.
• 20:46
  SPEAKER_01: That's uh so they break the blood brain barrier to access the brain.
• 20:51
  SPEAKER_00: If you do IV stem cells, they would not go in your brain.
• 20:54
  SPEAKER_00: They can't cross the blood brain barrier.
• 20:56
  SPEAKER_00: But what we can do is take stem cells and inject them intranasally, and then they'll catch a rile on the olfactory nerve and go into your brain.
• 21:03
  SPEAKER_00: What?
• 21:04
  SPEAKER_00: So we do that a lot, actually.
• 21:06
  SPEAKER_00: Wow.
• 21:07
  SPEAKER_00: Are they uh how do you administer that?
• 21:09
  SPEAKER_00: Like patients asleep?
• 21:10
  SPEAKER_00: Like you put them we use some numbing, it's really not that bad.
• 21:13
  SPEAKER_00: It's like three minutes of face pressure and then goes away as quickly as it came on.
• 21:16
  SPEAKER_01: Really?
• 21:16
  SPEAKER_00: Yep.
• 21:17
  SPEAKER_00: So just use some lytokine cream, inject in the nose to the turbinate, and then they'll ride up into the brain.
• 21:22
  SPEAKER_01: Wow, through the olfactory nerves.
• 21:24
  SPEAKER_01: Interesting.
• 21:25
  SPEAKER_01: And that's so that for Parkinson's stuff like Parkinson's stroke.
• 21:31
  SPEAKER_01: Yep.
• 21:32
  SPEAKER_01: What else?
• 21:32
  SPEAKER_00: Um, cognitive decline.
• 21:34
  SPEAKER_00: Um like Alzheimer's.
• 21:36
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 21:36
  SPEAKER_00: Wow.
• 21:37
  SPEAKER_00: So I've seen patients have, you know, we can't guarantee every patient's going to have results with it, but I've seen some good improvement.
• 21:43
  SPEAKER_00: I've had Alzheimer's patients sit up from the table, suddenly able to remember their kids' birthdays.
• 21:48
  SPEAKER_00: Because the stems, when they go in the brain, they start decreasing inflammation within minutes.
• 21:52
  SPEAKER_00: They haven't had time to heal the brain yet, obviously, but they decrease inflammation really, really quickly.
• 21:56
  SPEAKER_01: Wow.
• 21:57
  SPEAKER_01: And the inflammation, we don't have to get into like the nitty-gritty of Alzheimer's.
• 22:01
  SPEAKER_01: Um, would that be like some of the like glial scarring?
• 22:04
  SPEAKER_00: Like in the there, there's thought process that, yeah, the uh intranetal synapses can cause myelin uh resheathing.
• 22:12
  SPEAKER_01: Oh wow, that's incredible.
• 22:14
  SPEAKER_01: So that would be uh, I mean, for multiple sclerosis, um the let me see the other guys right, the oligodendrocytes, yeah, right?
• 22:22
  SPEAKER_01: Those are the sh the myelin sheaths.
• 22:24
  SPEAKER_01: Um so it'd resheath those.
• 22:26
  SPEAKER_01: Yep.
• 22:27
  SPEAKER_01: And what about spinal cord?
• 22:29
  SPEAKER_01: Same thing with that, yeah.
• 22:30
  SPEAKER_00: Like MS.
• 22:31
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, or ALS or spinal cord injury.
• 22:34
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 22:35
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so I've seen it.
• 22:36
  SPEAKER_00: So I've um I've had patients with like foot drop where we do like I do cotilepiduros, I don't go anywhere above the sacrum for epidurals, but I've done cotylepiduros on patients with like foot drop, and foot drop improves.
• 22:48
  SPEAKER_01: Wow, that's amazing.
• 22:51
  SPEAKER_01: That's uh that's awesome.
• 22:53
  SPEAKER_01: So with let's say somebody has a stroke, right?
• 22:55
  SPEAKER_01: Like they have hemiparesis, like one side's weak, the cognitive dysfunction, uh, but they can't move their arm, their leg, they can't walk.
• 23:03
  SPEAKER_01: Yep.
• 23:03
  SPEAKER_01: Uh you would do it an intranasal, a nasal injection.
• 23:07
  SPEAKER_01: Intranasal, yep.
• 23:08
  SPEAKER_01: Intranasal injection.
• 23:09
  SPEAKER_01: Um, try out a round of stem cells.
• 23:12
  SPEAKER_01: Yep.
• 23:12
  SPEAKER_01: And the thought would be hopefully the the body would probably prioritize the well, if you put them intranasal, they have nowhere to go except the brain.
• 23:19
  SPEAKER_01: Okay, so they're gonna go in the brain and then they're gonna fill in the divots and uh regenerate neurons and resheath myelin.
• 23:28
  SPEAKER_01: So they'll turn into neurons.
• 23:30
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 23:31
  SPEAKER_01: Have you seen like people come back from that?
• 23:33
  SPEAKER_01: Like stroke where they're like they can't lift their arm, they can't walk, and then all of a sudden, like a couple months later, they're able to move their arm again.
• 23:39
  SPEAKER_01: Wow.
• 23:40
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it's amazing.
• 23:41
  SPEAKER_01: So then, like, so the question I would have, and I'm sure a lot of people too, would be like, then why aren't there like, why aren't we scientists hitting the gas pedal and double down the doubling down on this research and applications?
• 23:55
  SPEAKER_00: Now you're touching a point you may not want to touch on your podcast, but I think a lot of it comes down to money.
• 24:00
  SPEAKER_01: I don't disagree.
• 24:01
  SPEAKER_01: All right, we've talked about before.
• 24:02
  SPEAKER_01: I'm not afraid to talk about that.
• 24:03
  SPEAKER_01: Um it's just opinions.
• 24:05
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I don't disagree.
• 24:06
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, I've also thought with like peptides, like I know BPC was illegal for a little while, yeah, right?
• 24:12
  SPEAKER_01: Um, other peptides, for my understanding, were also illegal.
• 24:15
  SPEAKER_01: They're constantly going legal, illegal, illegal, illegal.
• 24:18
  SPEAKER_01: It's crazy.
• 24:19
  SPEAKER_01: But but I I mean, I don't disagree.
• 24:21
  SPEAKER_01: There's a th up a hypothesis that if it's money driven, as in like, well, what if what if researchers and scientists and healthcare providers were able to like reverse and heal these major issues, yeah, then what would happen?
• 24:36
  SPEAKER_00: Like well, the problem is it takes you out of the system, and the system is just money moving in circles, coming out of your pocket, just moving in circles.
• 24:44
  SPEAKER_00: You go to physical therapy, to surgery, to your internal medicine, to your specialist, back to physical therapy, back to surgery, and until you end up in a nursing home, and that's it.
• 24:53
  SPEAKER_01: So if we can remove you from that system, but you're not producing revenue for that system.
• 25:00
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, who benefits from the system?
• 25:03
  SPEAKER_00: Insurance, um, pharma companies, hospital networks.
• 25:08
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it's crazy.
• 25:09
  SPEAKER_01: I don't anyway, it's just a thought.
• 25:11
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I haven't I don't I could I could see that um being a valid argument, you know, an opinion.
• 25:17
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, uh we could go down that rabbit hole, but I don't think we should.
• 25:20
  SPEAKER_01: We don't have to, maybe another time.
• 25:22
  SPEAKER_01: We can articulate things, you know, we do some research and articulate stuff, but I don't, it's it's interesting thought, you know.
• 25:29
  SPEAKER_01: I don't disagree that that could be a valid argument to be brought up, you know.
• 25:35
  SPEAKER_01: Um, which is a bummer, you know, that that's just the way it is.
• 25:39
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 25:39
  SPEAKER_01: So another thing I've asked, well, one more type of stem cell.
• 25:42
  SPEAKER_01: So uh our application is laser guided.
• 25:44
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 25:45
  SPEAKER_01: And that's specifically for cardiac heart tissue.
• 25:48
  SPEAKER_00: No, so they're called V cells, uh, very small embryonic-like stem cells.
• 25:52
  SPEAKER_00: And so what they are, they're dormant cells that exist in our body.
• 25:55
  SPEAKER_00: They're created at birth and they kind of just float around your body.
• 25:58
  SPEAKER_00: And they're only activated by extreme stress.
• 26:00
  SPEAKER_00: Um, yeah, heart attack, get shot, you have a stroke, they'll turn on, they'll flood towards the air of injury, try to heal it.
• 26:05
  SPEAKER_00: So it's kind of like Deadpool.
• 26:07
  SPEAKER_00: Basically.
• 26:08
  SPEAKER_00: We don't have quite as many as him, but yeah, yeah.
• 26:12
  SPEAKER_00: So we take the, we take your blood, we spin it down, and we have a laser.
• 26:16
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, it's called the song laser, and it can activate the cells to turn on.
• 26:20
  SPEAKER_00: And when they turn on, they will follow that laser wherever you shine it.
• 26:23
  SPEAKER_00: So we reinfuse them by IV, and wherever we shine it is where they'll go.
• 26:27
  SPEAKER_00: So there's been studies on uh they took patients for cardiac uh CHF for congestive heart failure, and they're so um injection fractions are rated any if you're dip under 15, you're dead, and anything over 55 is considered normal.
• 26:42
  SPEAKER_00: That's the range.
• 26:43
  SPEAKER_00: So they took people with uh EFs between 20 and like 28, and they did um they did the V cells on them.
• 26:51
  SPEAKER_00: After one round of treatment, something like 80% of them improved at least 10 points.
• 26:55
  SPEAKER_00: Wow.
• 26:56
  SPEAKER_00: So mid third, mid to high 30s.
• 26:58
  SPEAKER_00: Yep, which is a significant difference in quality of life.
• 27:00
  SPEAKER_00: And when you're in the 20s, you have chronic shortness of breath, you have swelling all the time.
• 27:03
  SPEAKER_00: So we're in the 30s, you can actually live a semi-normal life.
• 27:06
  SPEAKER_01: Wow.
• 27:07
  SPEAKER_01: Um, it's crazy, interesting, because I just talked to uh your colleague about this too.
• 27:11
  SPEAKER_01: I actually have a patient that um they reached out and they have been battling heart issues like that.
• 27:16
  SPEAKER_01: Their EF, their ejection fraction was like nine.
• 27:19
  SPEAKER_01: Jeez.
• 27:20
  SPEAKER_01: And they were um, you know, they were trying to recover and move and groove, and they were, they weren't bedridden, but they definitely weren't solid spot.
• 27:29
  SPEAKER_01: Doctors were like, You're dead man walking.
• 27:31
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I've never seen an EF that low before.
• 27:34
  SPEAKER_01: Really?
• 27:34
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 27:35
  SPEAKER_01: Anyway, that's what it was.
• 27:36
  SPEAKER_01: And then he uh this patient um was progressively trying to make improvements and exercising and eating and just being very mindful, red light therapy.
• 27:46
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and then has brought it up himself to 24.
• 27:51
  SPEAKER_01: Wow, that's impressive.
• 27:53
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, that everyone was like very surprised.
• 27:54
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 27:56
  SPEAKER_01: Um, but anyway, they uh were pursuing um stem cells in Panama in a different country to get um IV stem cell.
• 28:06
  SPEAKER_01: Yep.
• 28:07
  SPEAKER_01: What would you recommend for someone like that in that boat?
• 28:10
  SPEAKER_01: Same thing, like like laser-guided V cell stimulation.
• 28:14
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I mean, if you're open doing both, you do both.
• 28:16
  SPEAKER_00: Um when you do IV stem cells by themselves, they do tend to concentrate in the heart and lungs.
• 28:21
  SPEAKER_00: Just that's where blood, a lot of blood just passes through.
• 28:23
  SPEAKER_00: So they do concentrate there really well anyway.
• 28:25
  SPEAKER_00: So you could do donated or you can do V cells.
• 28:28
  SPEAKER_00: Um probably V cells might be a little bit more just focused, but I would imagine both probably give you pretty good results.
• 28:34
  SPEAKER_00: Do you ever get donated V cells?
• 28:36
  SPEAKER_00: No, you can't do that.
• 28:37
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, they're not stripped of uh allergenic markers, which means your body can recognize V cells as foreign substance.
• 28:44
  SPEAKER_01: I see.
• 28:45
  SPEAKER_01: When somebody, let's say somebody's in their 70s or 80s, would their V cells be as viable as somebody who's like in their 20s?
• 28:52
  SPEAKER_00: In theory, yes, because they're dormant.
• 28:53
  SPEAKER_00: And so they've never the reason that cells age is they divide and replicate.
• 28:57
  SPEAKER_00: And every time they replicate, they become smaller or their DNA lengths become shorter, and um the chance of um what's called misfolding when they replicate increases.
• 29:06
  SPEAKER_00: But in theory, V cells have never replicated because they were never active to start with.
• 29:11
  SPEAKER_00: And so they should be as good at 80 as they are at two.
• 29:16
  SPEAKER_01: Interesting.
• 29:17
  SPEAKER_01: Because I know that's a concern for people where it's like, I don't want to take my own adipose stem cells.
• 29:22
  SPEAKER_01: If I'm like a sick, you know, elderly individual.
• 29:26
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I want some like vibrant younger.
• 29:28
  SPEAKER_00: Well, adipose and bone marrow, that's true.
• 29:31
  SPEAKER_00: Those counts and qualities do decline as we age.
• 29:33
  SPEAKER_00: Uh so those are the ones.
• 29:35
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I wouldn't do those over the age of like 65.
• 29:37
  SPEAKER_00: I don't like doing adipose or bone marrow anymore.
• 29:39
  SPEAKER_01: When you do get donated stem cells, well, who are they from?
• 29:43
  SPEAKER_00: So it depends what you're using, right?
• 29:45
  SPEAKER_00: If you're using umbilical, placento, amniotic, or adipose.
• 29:48
  SPEAKER_00: Adipose.
• 29:48
  SPEAKER_00: So I mean that the other ones would be from from babies, right?
• 29:51
  SPEAKER_00: Yep.
• 29:52
  SPEAKER_00: So adipose, they take 18 to 30 year olds and they do liposuction on them and then they get cells out of there.
• 29:58
  SPEAKER_00: The difference between using your own versus donating.
• 30:00
  SPEAKER_00: Donated, it's uh they can guarantee counts when they donate because they're putting into a vial and they can count them they're in there before they ship it to you.
• 30:06
  SPEAKER_00: Whereas when we harvest off you, we can't guarantee anything.
• 30:10
  SPEAKER_01: The density, the density count.
• 30:11
  SPEAKER_01: Yep.
• 30:12
  SPEAKER_01: Interesting.
• 30:12
  SPEAKER_01: I know that before there was also conversations of ethical just ethics of acquiring embryonic, amniotic, placental, and umbilical stem cells.
• 30:24
  SPEAKER_00: That's where we get into American verse.
• 30:25
  SPEAKER_00: We'll call the rest of the like Europe aside, we'll call the rest of it overseas.
• 30:29
  SPEAKER_00: Um in America, live birth C-section has to donate.
• 30:32
  SPEAKER_00: It can't be paid for it.
• 30:33
  SPEAKER_00: Baby has to be born with no complications, no abortions, no fees, and nothing like that.
• 30:38
  SPEAKER_00: Tested for everything under the sun.
• 30:40
  SPEAKER_00: Um, the companies I use test well beyond what's required for an organ transplant.
• 30:44
  SPEAKER_00: The not-so-good companies just test to the extent organ transplant.
• 30:48
  SPEAKER_00: Gotcha.
• 30:48
  SPEAKER_00: So they're donated at will, like voluntarily.
• 30:52
  SPEAKER_00: Because let's take placenta, for example, or umbilical cord.
• 30:55
  SPEAKER_00: If the mom's not going to harvest stem cells for herself or do like cord blood banking or something, it's trash.
• 31:00
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it's thrown out.
• 31:01
  SPEAKER_01: So totally.
• 31:02
  SPEAKER_01: I was always like, well, they're I don't understand the ethics, like the question of ethics where it's like they're they're just trashed anyway.
• 31:09
  SPEAKER_00: So America.
• 31:11
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah.
• 31:11
  SPEAKER_00: Now look at overseas, they don't hold so firm to must be donated, must be live birds easection.
• 31:18
  SPEAKER_01: Interesting.
• 31:19
  SPEAKER_01: And that would be South America, Central America, yeah, Asia?
• 31:25
  SPEAKER_00: Probably.
• 31:25
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know much about Asia.
• 31:26
  SPEAKER_01: I've never lived.
• 31:27
  SPEAKER_01: But Europe is different, similar to the US.
• 31:29
  SPEAKER_01: Europe should be similar to the US, yeah.
• 31:31
  SPEAKER_01: Wow.
• 31:32
  SPEAKER_01: So it makes more sense to stay American and not go overseas.
• 31:36
  SPEAKER_00: Well, there's that part, and then there's something called culture expansion.
• 31:39
  SPEAKER_00: So familiar with that term?
• 31:42
  SPEAKER_00: So if you take one stem cell and leave it on the table, in a day it'll become two.
• 31:46
  SPEAKER_00: Leave it for another day, it'll become four, and then eight, and then so on and so forth.
• 31:49
  SPEAKER_00: That each time you leave it alone, that's called one expansion.
• 31:52
  SPEAKER_00: And they don't actually leave it alone, they incubate it.
• 31:54
  SPEAKER_00: Got it.
• 31:55
  SPEAKER_00: But it's called one expansion.
• 31:57
  SPEAKER_00: Over four expansions, you run the risk of what's called mutagenic risk.
• 32:01
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 32:02
  unknown: Okay.
• 32:02
  SPEAKER_00: Risk of malformed cancer cells.
• 32:04
  SPEAKER_00: So I use a zero expansion product.
• 32:07
  SPEAKER_00: Every company operating above board in America uses a zero expansion product.
• 32:11
  SPEAKER_00: It's called minimally manipulated in America.
• 32:14
  SPEAKER_00: If you go overseas, six to ten expansions is the normal.
• 32:20
  SPEAKER_00: Six to ten.
• 32:21
  SPEAKER_00: One company in Israel told me that they do 30.
• 32:23
  SPEAKER_00: What?
• 32:25
  SPEAKER_01: So unknowingly, they could be injecting cancerous cells.
• 32:28
  SPEAKER_00: And that's the other problem.
• 32:29
  SPEAKER_00: When they talk about their counts and being the hundreds of billions, I'm like, yeah, because you're expanding.
• 32:34
  SPEAKER_00: And so every time you expand cells, sometimes they can delineate.
• 32:37
  SPEAKER_00: And once they delineate and go down the cell lineage, they're no longer stem cells and they're useless to you.
• 32:42
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah, that makes sense.
• 32:43
  SPEAKER_01: Wow.
• 32:44
  SPEAKER_01: But they include them in their count.
• 32:46
  SPEAKER_01: Interesting.
• 32:46
  SPEAKER_01: So it just sounds inflated.
• 32:48
  SPEAKER_01: It's like, oh, I'm getting like 500 million cells or whatever.
• 32:51
  SPEAKER_00: So I've tried one trillion exosomes.
• 32:54
  SPEAKER_00: I've tried um like 10 billion.
• 32:57
  SPEAKER_00: I've tried 100 million MSCs.
• 32:59
  SPEAKER_00: The best results uh that I see are with the 4 million count out of post-derived.
• 33:04
  SPEAKER_00: That's why I've switched to them.
• 33:06
  SPEAKER_01: 4 million count, 4 million out of post-derived from a donor from the donor.
• 33:11
  SPEAKER_01: And so when 18 to 30 year old tested in young individual.
• 33:14
  SPEAKER_00: Yep.
• 33:14
  SPEAKER_00: So when I first got them, I was like, they sent them to me for free.
• 33:17
  SPEAKER_00: My vendor was like, you should try these out.
• 33:19
  SPEAKER_00: They're a new company.
• 33:19
  SPEAKER_00: And I was like, yeah, right.
• 33:20
  SPEAKER_00: This thing's gonna be a piece of garbage.
• 33:22
  SPEAKER_00: But I tried myself, I'm like, wait a second.
• 33:24
  SPEAKER_00: I actually feel because I've done a bunch of them.
• 33:25
  SPEAKER_00: So some of them like, yeah, I really feel these.
• 33:27
  SPEAKER_00: Some of them like I don't feel anything.
• 33:28
  SPEAKER_00: These, I'm like, I really feel these.
• 33:30
  SPEAKER_00: So I got I bought a few of them, started using my patients.
• 33:33
  SPEAKER_00: I had never had patients before tell me that they feel better while sitting in a chair until I started using the fat.
• 33:39
  SPEAKER_01: Wow.
• 33:39
  SPEAKER_01: Interesting.
• 33:40
  SPEAKER_01: And you you would choose that over the umbilical.
• 33:45
  SPEAKER_01: It's pretty much the only thing we carry now.
• 33:47
  SPEAKER_01: Wow.
• 33:47
  SPEAKER_01: We go through for everything for articular cartilage.
• 33:50
  SPEAKER_00: No, this is for IV and intranasal.
• 33:53
  SPEAKER_01: Okay.
• 33:53
  SPEAKER_00: For a direct injection, we still use that tissue-based product, but you can't do the tissue IBU.
• 33:58
  SPEAKER_01: Got it.
• 33:59
  SPEAKER_01: I see.
• 34:00
  SPEAKER_01: Um, wow, that's really interesting.
• 34:02
  SPEAKER_01: So that's the only thing you carry now.
• 34:04
  SPEAKER_01: Wow.
• 34:05
  SPEAKER_01: That's real.
• 34:06
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, it's great that it seems to be that much more effective.
• 34:10
  SPEAKER_00: Yep.
• 34:10
  SPEAKER_00: I can get the umbilical, I have no problem, make a phone call, I'll be here tomorrow, but I just don't like using this much.
• 34:15
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it's not as effective.
• 34:16
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 34:17
  SPEAKER_01: Wow.
• 34:18
  SPEAKER_01: That's good to know.
• 34:19
  SPEAKER_01: You know?
• 34:20
  SPEAKER_01: So four million count.
• 34:21
  SPEAKER_01: Yep.
• 34:22
  SPEAKER_01: And that would be for either intranasal or IV.
• 34:25
  SPEAKER_01: Yep.
• 34:25
  SPEAKER_01: How many of those four million, is that like one milliliter?
• 34:28
  SPEAKER_01: How much, how many, what volume of solution is that?
• 34:31
  SPEAKER_01: It's two mls.
• 34:32
  SPEAKER_01: Two milliliters.
• 34:34
  SPEAKER_01: How many of those two milliliter vials would you need to get like an effective dose?
• 34:38
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, just one.
• 34:39
  SPEAKER_01: Just one.
• 34:40
  SPEAKER_01: And then a month later you would reassess where they're at.
• 34:43
  SPEAKER_01: Yep.
• 34:43
  SPEAKER_01: And then after, and it's all that's standard, like you would wait a month, like four weeks.
• 34:47
  SPEAKER_01: Yep.
• 34:47
  SPEAKER_01: And then be like, How are you feeling?
• 34:49
  SPEAKER_01: I don't I feel the exact same.
• 34:50
  SPEAKER_01: Okay, let's schedule next week and do it again.
• 34:52
  SPEAKER_01: Yep.
• 34:53
  SPEAKER_01: And then again, follow that pattern until they feel results or until they well.
• 34:56
  SPEAKER_00: So if a patient comes in monthly and tells me they felt absolutely nothing from them, I may not do them again.
• 35:02
  SPEAKER_00: Um, it might not be worth doing.
• 35:04
  SPEAKER_00: It depends what we're chasing, right?
• 35:06
  SPEAKER_00: If we do IV, it it always becomes a hard point of like if they were free, I'd be like, Yeah, we're gonna do these once a month for the next two years because I know they're healing something.
• 35:14
  SPEAKER_00: But if you tell someone to keep doing something that costs thousands of dollars and they feel nothing time and time again, they're just gonna get frustrated and burnt out.
• 35:21
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 35:22
  SPEAKER_00: So if they can also money's a thing, yeah.
• 35:25
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so if they come back in a month and they're like, Yeah, I felt nothing, like, let's redirect, let's focus on root cause stuff, detox you, clean you out, and then revisit stem cells.
• 35:34
  SPEAKER_00: Interesting.
• 35:36
  SPEAKER_01: Wow.
• 35:37
  SPEAKER_01: Um that's really that's I mean, it's really cool though.
• 35:40
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, that that seems to be the most effective thing and and what the protocol would be.
• 35:44
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 35:44
  SPEAKER_01: So if somebody has a uh heart attack, the course of action would be laser-guided V cells.
• 35:53
  SPEAKER_01: Depends what was a heart attack.
• 35:55
  SPEAKER_00: Recent or old?
• 35:56
  SPEAKER_00: Let's say recent.
• 35:57
  SPEAKER_00: Recent, then probably actually I'd be just donated.
• 36:00
  SPEAKER_00: Donated IV.
• 36:01
  SPEAKER_00: Yep.
• 36:01
  SPEAKER_00: The reason, so the reason I really started using V cells for heart issues, um, the guy that invented them, Dr.
• 36:07
  SPEAKER_00: Todd, he's like, listen, if you have someone that had a heart attack within the last few months, the heart's still putting out inflammatory signaling.
• 36:13
  SPEAKER_00: You do donated, they're gonna flood to the heart.
• 36:15
  SPEAKER_00: But if they had a heart attack 10 years ago and left scarring on the heart, and you do IV donated stem cells, they're not gonna go there.
• 36:22
  SPEAKER_00: There's no inflammatory signaling coming out.
• 36:24
  SPEAKER_00: But V cells you can force to go there.
• 36:26
  SPEAKER_01: Interesting.
• 36:27
  SPEAKER_01: So for somebody that has like a chronic back pain or chronic neck pain, if it's chronic like that, you would imagine that the inflammatory signaling is not as vibrant.
• 36:35
  SPEAKER_01: And then you would also do so guided, or would you still do, would you do intra-articular?
• 36:40
  SPEAKER_00: I would inject at that point because the same reason that tendons, ligaments, joints don't heal on their own is why uh IV has trouble getting there.
• 36:48
  SPEAKER_00: They have bad blood supply.
• 36:50
  SPEAKER_00: So if you do IV for your back, not you're not getting a lot of uh results there.
• 36:55
  SPEAKER_00: So both we directly inject, you get much better results.
• 36:58
  SPEAKER_01: Gotcha.
• 36:59
  SPEAKER_01: Let's say somebody has um like knee arthritis or hip arthritis.
• 37:04
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and they also are interested, just for longevity purposes, doing IV.
• 37:08
  SPEAKER_01: Would you do both at the same day?
• 37:09
  SPEAKER_00: Well, I actually highly recommend it.
• 37:11
  SPEAKER_00: Um so when you do IV directly after injection, one, because you've just injected, you do have a bunch of inflammatory signaling there with what's called neovascularization or new blood vessel growth.
• 37:22
  SPEAKER_00: So you'll get some of that IV going towards the area you just injected and spend a bunch of money on.
• 37:26
  SPEAKER_00: So good benefit that.
• 37:28
  SPEAKER_00: And then yeah, the rest of it will filter throughout your body.
• 37:30
  SPEAKER_00: So you wouldn't want to do the the IV the same day.
• 37:32
  SPEAKER_00: No, you do.
• 37:33
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, you would do the IV.
• 37:34
  SPEAKER_00: It'll boost your injections first off.
• 37:35
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, okay.
• 37:36
  SPEAKER_01: And then two, it'll go elsewhere as well.
• 37:38
  SPEAKER_01: I see.
• 37:38
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, okay.
• 37:39
  SPEAKER_01: So it'd be beneficial if you can afford it.
• 37:40
  SPEAKER_01: Yep.
• 37:41
  SPEAKER_01: I was gonna say, so what's what would be preventing people from well, number one, they like the the notion of like, well, I need to go out of state, out of the country to get these treatments.
• 37:50
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, that's just a misconception.
• 37:52
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 37:52
  SPEAKER_01: That's just misunderstanding.
• 37:53
  SPEAKER_00: I would personally never do stem cells overseas.
• 37:56
  SPEAKER_00: We just simply do the culture expansion.
• 37:58
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 37:59
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and then you know the legality misunderstanding that it's not legal.
• 38:05
  SPEAKER_01: No, um, the quality is better here.
• 38:08
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 38:08
  SPEAKER_01: And the other thought, just people just aren't aware of it.
• 38:11
  SPEAKER_00: I think that's a big part of it.
• 38:12
  SPEAKER_01: Uh we don't know.
• 38:13
  SPEAKER_00: Because I have patients, they're like, I was talking to my friends and they're going to Panama because they and I'm I tell them I'm doing stem cells in West Palm down the street, and they're like, they've never heard of that.
• 38:21
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 38:21
  SPEAKER_01: So I think a lot of it's just knowledge.
• 38:24
  SPEAKER_01: It's so interesting, though, because I've been in the same boat, you know, until recently.
• 38:27
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 38:28
  SPEAKER_01: Where I'm like, well, it must be just like just pretend, you know, like pretend stem cells or something, you know, marketing or whatever.
• 38:34
  SPEAKER_01: Um, yeah, but I mean, I didn't the legality component was just it was just murky, you know, didn't know.
• 38:41
  SPEAKER_01: But it really it's not murky, it's just perceived that way from the the the national um uh lack of exposure of information.
• 38:52
  SPEAKER_01: And all right, so then the last barrier of of entry would just be cost, cost it's just costly.
• 38:57
  SPEAKER_00: Yep, it is so like the place I used to work for, 50 spending$50,000 there or spending roughly$12,000 with me gets you an equivalent amount of stem cells.
• 39:09
  SPEAKER_00: Wow, exact same product, exact same volumes.
• 39:12
  SPEAKER_00: So, like coming to me, it's actually cheaper to come to me than it is to fly overseas.
• 39:16
  SPEAKER_00: Going him compared to overseas, not even close.
• 39:20
  SPEAKER_01: Wow, that's nuts.
• 39:23
  SPEAKER_01: That's crazy.
• 39:24
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, so um so that's the best, that's the best route to go.
• 39:29
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, if you have the if they have the out-of-pocket availability to do that.
• 39:32
  SPEAKER_01: Is there anything you would not do?
• 39:35
  SPEAKER_01: Like if somebody had like if somebody just had a total knee replacement or a total hip replacement or something like that.
• 39:42
  SPEAKER_01: There's nothing for me to do.
• 39:44
  SPEAKER_00: Like if they had a total knee replacement and knee just full of plastic, what am I gonna do?
• 39:48
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah.
• 39:49
  SPEAKER_01: Or what about like cervical or lumbar like anterior disc replacements or post-surgical decompression?
• 39:56
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 39:56
  SPEAKER_01: That'd be good for it because it helps to facilitate the right healing.
• 39:59
  SPEAKER_00: Right, because why do they have it in the first place?
• 40:01
  SPEAKER_00: Probably because their cervical or their lumbar ligaments are torn and unstable.
• 40:04
  SPEAKER_00: So I can still inject those ligaments that recreate stability.
• 40:07
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 40:08
  SPEAKER_01: I had one patient too, post-op uh rotator cuff, and they had stem cell injection on the table before he woke up, I think.
• 40:16
  SPEAKER_01: I'm like, why isn't that just an absolute protocol, like a concrete protocol for this point forward?
• 40:21
  SPEAKER_01: But anyway, he this person was like, I mean, you're not even supposed to lift your arm for the first six weeks post-surgical.
• 40:27
  SPEAKER_02: Yep.
• 40:27
  SPEAKER_01: And this guy was like swinging a golf club at like four weeks.
• 40:30
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 40:31
  SPEAKER_01: I'm like, stop, you're making me nervous, you know.
• 40:33
  SPEAKER_01: Um, but he he was limited in motion, of course, but he was able to move and was doing pretty good.
• 40:38
  SPEAKER_01: Um, is there a reason why that's not normalized in orthopedic?
• 40:43
  SPEAKER_01: He probably has to pay extra for the stem cells because insurance does not cover them.
• 40:47
  SPEAKER_01: So uh could you like let's say somebody was having surgery, could you ask orthopedic and be like, yeah, do my roticuff surgery and I want you to inject the uh adipose derived donated stem cells?
• 40:59
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, there's a few different companies out there that do or open.
• 41:02
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it's the placento-based that have surgical like the ones I use are designed for surgery.
• 41:07
  SPEAKER_00: Um but you it comes down to if you don't want your ortho, you don't want to be the first one, let's put it like that, that your ortho is doing.
• 41:16
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 41:16
  SPEAKER_00: You want to find someone that does them regularly.
• 41:18
  SPEAKER_00: And if they're not offering it to you, chances are they don't do it regularly.
• 41:22
  SPEAKER_00: So you want to find the one that offers it to you.
• 41:24
  SPEAKER_01: So then when would somebody when would you advocate for somebody to come see someone like yourself for stem cell injection after surgery?
• 41:30
  SPEAKER_00: Post surgery.
• 41:31
  SPEAKER_00: Um it depends.
• 41:33
  SPEAKER_00: Basically, if I I get a lot of cases that are I had surgery, it failed, I feel worse, or I feel no different.
• 41:39
  SPEAKER_00: So usually that.
• 41:41
  SPEAKER_01: Like if somebody's having like rotator cuff surgery, um, yeah, let's say rotator cuff.
• 41:46
  SPEAKER_01: Let's keep it simple.
• 41:47
  SPEAKER_01: Rotator cuff surgery.
• 41:48
  SPEAKER_01: And uh they're like, I might my surgery is on the 15th of the month.
• 41:52
  SPEAKER_01: Can I come see you on the 18th of the month the next Monday?
• 41:55
  SPEAKER_00: Absolutely not.
• 41:56
  SPEAKER_00: Um, two reasons.
• 41:57
  SPEAKER_00: One to say, why don't you try this first if you're gonna do it anyway?
• 42:00
  SPEAKER_00: Let's see if we can keep you out of surgery.
• 42:02
  SPEAKER_00: But two, I won't touch patients for usually by the month post surgery, just for risk of infection.
• 42:07
  SPEAKER_00: Risk of infection.
• 42:08
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, if honestly, if anything goes wrong, the surgeon gets to say, Well, it's because you did stem failed, not because of me.
• 42:13
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, of course.
• 42:14
  SPEAKER_00: No, one month is minimum.
• 42:15
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah.
• 42:15
  SPEAKER_01: We're very similar with that with dry needling, like post-op.
• 42:19
  SPEAKER_01: We're like, we're not gonna even needle you until at least at minimum six weeks post-op for the infection risk, and then also just same thought.
• 42:27
  SPEAKER_01: You know, we don't want to, it's just a lot of there's a lot of stress and insult in the joint already and the tissues, and we're like and then risk of infection, you know, we're not gonna touch it for six weeks at least.
• 42:37
  SPEAKER_01: Yep.
• 42:37
  SPEAKER_01: Um something you mentioned is interesting.
• 42:41
  SPEAKER_01: Um, with the the turnover of the stem cells, the cultural, what do you what you call it again?
• 42:48
  SPEAKER_01: Culture expansion.
• 42:48
  SPEAKER_01: Culture expansion, cultural expansion.
• 42:50
  SPEAKER_01: And after four turnovers, the DNA starts the risk of folding over itself.
• 42:58
  SPEAKER_01: Malforming.
• 42:59
  SPEAKER_01: Malforming.
• 43:00
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and then with uh age, similarly, with the DNA after as we age, the DNA shrinks, and then there's more risk of DNA fold over with cell reproduction.
• 43:13
  SPEAKER_00: So as we age, you get senescent cells, which are dead cells that your body hasn't cleared out, but um are kind of just falling around.
• 43:20
  SPEAKER_00: They're called zombie cells.
• 43:22
  SPEAKER_01: Is that where a lot of systemic and cancerous issues would drive from, do you think?
• 43:27
  SPEAKER_00: In theory, cancer is just a cell that misfolded and replicated as a misfolded cell, and your immune system never took care of or got too big.
• 43:34
  SPEAKER_01: So misfolded DNA, and then it just doesn't die.
• 43:38
  SPEAKER_01: A lack of apop apoptosis, right?
• 43:41
  SPEAKER_01: Apoptosis.
• 43:42
  SPEAKER_01: Is it apoptosis or apoptosis?
• 43:44
  SPEAKER_01: What did you learn?
• 43:46
  SPEAKER_01: Truthfully, I learned that a book, so all whatever you want.
• 43:48
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, exactly.
• 43:50
  SPEAKER_01: Um, it just doesn't lack of cell death on like purposeful cell death, it folds over.
• 43:55
  SPEAKER_01: So the DNA folds over itself and replicates that uh uh malfunctioning DNA and then it just goes that direction.
• 44:02
  SPEAKER_01: Yep.
• 44:03
  SPEAKER_01: Interesting.
• 44:03
  SPEAKER_01: And that's and it just accumulates and that's a tumor.
• 44:06
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it's like you ever do a math problem wrong and you have like 10 questions following it based off your answer to the first one, and you just off you go.
• 44:12
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, the trajectory is completely off at that point.
• 44:15
  SPEAKER_01: Um, wow, that's crazy though.
• 44:16
  SPEAKER_01: That's just interesting to think about.
• 44:18
  SPEAKER_01: Have they gone into like telomeres and like um for for longevity and aging?
• 44:24
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, so there are so the idea behind that is you do things that can clear out senescent cells, um, which is you just turn them on just enough.
• 44:33
  SPEAKER_00: You never regrow the telomeres, but you can turn them on just enough that your body says, wait, you're supposed to be dead and kills it.
• 44:39
  SPEAKER_00: Got it.
• 44:40
  SPEAKER_00: There's peptides for that.
• 44:41
  SPEAKER_00: Um, FOXO4 and epithalon are the two peptides for it.
• 44:45
  SPEAKER_00: And then also IV stem cells can clear out senescent cells.
• 44:48
  SPEAKER_01: So IV stem cells, and that'd be the I'm gonna give this uh adipost-derived, yep, adipose donated IV or those peptides.
• 44:58
  SPEAKER_01: Yep.
• 44:59
  SPEAKER_01: How do the peptides do that?
• 45:01
  SPEAKER_01: Um, I have no idea.
• 45:03
  SPEAKER_01: I don't actually know their um their mechanism, but they target those senescent cells, the zombie cells, to turn them on a little bit for the body to recognize you're not supposed to be here, supposed to be dead, and then your immune system kills them.
• 45:17
  SPEAKER_01: So wow.
• 45:19
  SPEAKER_01: Um, if somebody would you recommend that for people just regularly?
• 45:23
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, yeah.
• 45:23
  SPEAKER_00: No, we have a lot of our patients do uh epithalon's only 10 days a year.
• 45:28
  SPEAKER_00: So we have a lot of patients that do a 10-day course of it.
• 45:30
  SPEAKER_00: Wow.
• 45:31
  SPEAKER_00: How do they feel?
• 45:32
  SPEAKER_00: What is that?
• 45:32
  SPEAKER_00: Do they feel different after that?
• 45:34
  SPEAKER_00: Um, over time, people are usually like, yeah, I feel I don't know what I did, but I feel way better.
• 45:38
  SPEAKER_00: I'm like, remember when you did epithalin like two months ago, that 10-day peptide?
• 45:41
  SPEAKER_00: Like, yeah, like that.
• 45:43
  SPEAKER_01: That's the reason why.
• 45:44
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 45:44
  SPEAKER_01: So it's epithet, what is it?
• 45:45
  SPEAKER_01: Epithalone?
• 45:46
  SPEAKER_01: E-P-I-T-H-A-L-O-N.
• 45:49
  SPEAKER_01: And then the what was the other one?
• 45:50
  SPEAKER_00: Fox O4, F O X04.
• 45:53
  SPEAKER_01: And what's that one?
• 45:54
  SPEAKER_01: That's the same thing they're the same thing.
• 45:55
  SPEAKER_01: They're very similar.
• 45:56
  SPEAKER_01: Do you do them together like CJC Ipamarillin?
• 45:58
  SPEAKER_00: No, you do one and the other if you want.
• 46:00
  SPEAKER_01: What would make you choose one versus the other?
• 46:02
  SPEAKER_00: Um, there's not much different.
• 46:05
  SPEAKER_00: Um you don't really I don't really know.
• 46:08
  SPEAKER_00: Um, really, if you're gonna do both, you do both.
• 46:10
  SPEAKER_00: Uh we carry epithalon, it's much less expensive.
• 46:13
  SPEAKER_00: FoxO4 is well over a thousand dollars for that 10-day course.
• 46:16
  SPEAKER_00: Wow.
• 46:16
  SPEAKER_00: Um, epithalon's a couple hundred.
• 46:19
  SPEAKER_00: Wow.
• 46:19
  SPEAKER_00: Epithalon works through mitochondrial stimulation, whereas FOXO4, it's come back to me.
• 46:24
  SPEAKER_00: FoxO4 works through um signaling.
• 46:26
  SPEAKER_00: Um, even senescent cells, they do something called uh autocrine and paracrine signaling, which is they tell the cells near them that they exist.
• 46:33
  SPEAKER_00: So FOXO4 goes after that and says, hey, we see that signaling, kill it.
• 46:38
  SPEAKER_01: Wow.
• 46:40
  SPEAKER_01: Cool.
• 46:40
  SPEAKER_01: Well, that's really cool though.
• 46:42
  SPEAKER_01: So it seems like for longevity, a longevity protocol would include epithalon or FOXO4, stem cell IV to flush out all the senescent cells, zombie cells, um, IV stem cells for just targeting areas, areas in your body that are prior needing needing recovery and clearance.
• 47:09
  SPEAKER_01: And then um if you're working out and exercising uh and battling maybe some aches and pains, TB500, BPC 157, and then some kind of growth hormone pulse, peptide.
• 47:23
  SPEAKER_01: Am I missing anything?
• 47:24
  SPEAKER_00: No, it's pretty NAD?
• 47:26
  SPEAKER_00: You can do NAD.
• 47:27
  SPEAKER_00: NAD is a good, I like daily injections of a little bit of it.
• 47:30
  SPEAKER_00: It's like a driver.
• 47:32
  SPEAKER_00: Daily inject- oh how much would be a little bit like 50 milligrams a day.
• 47:37
  SPEAKER_00: 50.
• 47:37
  SPEAKER_00: So it's like five five I use.
• 47:41
  SPEAKER_00: Like how much MLs you're injecting?
• 47:43
  SPEAKER_00: It depends on your bottle and how it's uh dosed, but usually what I use, it's uh I think it's 25 units.
• 47:49
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, okay.
• 47:50
  SPEAKER_01: Daily.
• 47:51
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, okay, interesting.
• 47:52
  SPEAKER_01: And that helps with mitochondrial stimulation.
• 47:55
  SPEAKER_01: Yep, adrenal support, mitochondrial stimulation, detox.
• 47:59
  SPEAKER_01: Interesting, cool.
• 48:01
  SPEAKER_01: Um, because I haven't taken that, and I was uh recommended to do that two or three times a week.
• 48:07
  SPEAKER_00: Injection?
• 48:08
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, at like 50 milliliters.
• 48:11
  SPEAKER_00: 50 milliliters?
• 48:12
  SPEAKER_01: 50, sorry, 50 IUs, 50 units, 50 units.
• 48:15
  SPEAKER_01: I gotcha.
• 48:16
  SPEAKER_00: Um you can people there's no hard and fast rules to a lot of the stuff, including NAD.
• 48:21
  SPEAKER_00: I found because you're doing this a little bit.
• 48:23
  SPEAKER_01: I found that yeah, like micro-dosing or just micro amounts over a long period of time.
• 48:29
  SPEAKER_01: That's what yeah, that's interesting.
• 48:31
  SPEAKER_01: That's that's good to know.
• 48:32
  SPEAKER_01: Um and then what what are your guys' thoughts on other uh modalities like red light therapy?
• 48:39
  SPEAKER_01: Yep.
• 48:40
  SPEAKER_01: You mentioned ozone therapy, O2 chambers, uh hyperbaric chambers.
• 48:46
  SPEAKER_01: Yep.
• 48:46
  SPEAKER_01: What are your thoughts on all those?
• 48:47
  SPEAKER_00: I'm a big fan of all of it.
• 48:48
  SPEAKER_00: Um each of them has different benefits, right?
• 48:50
  SPEAKER_00: Hyperbaric, it's cramming in more oxygen to your cells to promote healing because we live on oxygen.
• 48:55
  SPEAKER_00: Red light, it's stimulating blood vessel growth to heal.
• 48:59
  SPEAKER_00: Um, you can get to PMF, which stimulates electromagnetic frequency to promote um better cell signaling.
• 49:06
  SPEAKER_01: Um, ozone's a whole different well read the therapy.
• 49:08
  SPEAKER_01: Does it also stimulate micro mitochondrial activation?
• 49:12
  SPEAKER_01: So then that with NAD would be like a big driver.
• 49:14
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 49:14
  SPEAKER_01: If somebody was lethargic or brain fog, maybe.
• 49:20
  SPEAKER_01: Okay, interesting.
• 49:21
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 49:22
  SPEAKER_01: And then ozone therapy.
• 49:24
  SPEAKER_00: Ozone's a whole different, like that's a whole can of worms.
• 49:27
  SPEAKER_00: Um, that gets into IV injection.
• 49:30
  SPEAKER_00: A lot of people do IV, but then there's like rectal insufflation.
• 49:32
  SPEAKER_00: You can um make water out of it, you could drink it.
• 49:36
  SPEAKER_00: But basically, the whole idea behind it is you're putting in more oxygen into each cell.
• 49:40
  SPEAKER_00: Um, ozone's O3, regular air is O2.
• 49:43
  SPEAKER_00: So when you do ozone, you're basically giving red blood cells a third oxygen to carry.
• 49:48
  SPEAKER_00: So basically they can travel further before they run empty.
• 49:51
  SPEAKER_00: It's also antipathogenic in its form, so it kills bad stuff.
• 49:55
  SPEAKER_01: And is that like a like a um transfusion, like a um like a dialysis kind of thing where you take your blood out, filter it through, and then pump it back in with more O3?
• 50:04
  SPEAKER_00: That's called Ibu, um, which we do a lot of.
• 50:07
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so that that's that's like the highest level of ozone therapy.
• 50:10
  SPEAKER_00: But like I said, it goes all the way down to you can drink ozonated water.
• 50:14
  SPEAKER_00: So the range for it's really, really big.
• 50:16
  SPEAKER_01: And that's for just saturating more oxygen for your cells to heal and recover.
• 50:23
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 50:24
  SPEAKER_01: Interesting.
• 50:25
  SPEAKER_01: That's basically the bulk of it.
• 50:26
  SPEAKER_01: That's cool, that's awesome.
• 50:28
  SPEAKER_01: Um, at what point would you recommend somebody?
• 50:32
  SPEAKER_01: So you you think that'd be beneficial for everybody, just for longevity and healing and recovery and just life.
• 50:38
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, yeah.
• 50:38
  SPEAKER_01: And then nipping it in the bud with senescence and zombie cells to clearing that out.
• 50:45
  SPEAKER_01: Yep.
• 50:45
  SPEAKER_01: Have they done longevity studies on this for like yeah, cognitive decline?
• 50:49
  SPEAKER_01: Like if somebody was doing these things for many years of time, um, or if they already have cognitive decline, like this is significant improvement.
• 50:57
  SPEAKER_00: There's been short-term cognitive decline studies, like they take like Alzheimer's patients and do mental status exams on them before and after with improvement.
• 51:04
  SPEAKER_00: I don't think anyone's done a long-term study on it.
• 51:07
  SPEAKER_00: Brian Johnson's probably working on that.
• 51:09
  SPEAKER_01: I was gonna say that that's he's he's what came to mind, you know.
• 51:12
  SPEAKER_01: Um, no pun intended.
• 51:13
  SPEAKER_01: And then um, another interesting thought about that would be like CTE, you know, with like football or just contact sports and the maybe the effects that could have.
• 51:22
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 51:23
  SPEAKER_01: With um brain degenerative changes.
• 51:28
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, no, there's definitely stuff about that.
• 51:29
  SPEAKER_01: Again, it's all short-term stuff, but wow, that's crazy.
• 51:33
  SPEAKER_01: Um, well, we can we can land the plane there.
• 51:36
  SPEAKER_01: Um, thanks for coming in and explaining more of this stuff and breaking stuff down.
• 51:39
  SPEAKER_01: Um, remind everybody where they can find you.
• 51:42
  SPEAKER_01: So we're the longevity center, we're at West Palm Beach, we're the LCFL.
• 51:46
  SPEAKER_01: What's the like website phone number?
• 51:48
  SPEAKER_01: Yep, Instagram would be the best way to contact y'all.
• 51:50
  SPEAKER_00: Website phone number, the LCFL.com, like longevitycenterfl.
• 51:55
  SPEAKER_00: Phone number is 561-210-4033.
• 51:58
  SPEAKER_01: Cool.
• 51:59
  SPEAKER_01: Awesome.
• 51:59
  SPEAKER_01: Well, thanks, thanks again for coming in, sharing more about your about what y'all do and your story stuff.
• 52:05
  SPEAKER_01: And uh, if you have any questions about pain you're battling or issues uh they have going on, we're always open to at least chatting on the phone to see how we can help you.
• 52:12
  SPEAKER_01: And if you have any comments, questions, concerns, conflicting opinions, podcast ideas, we're always open to ideas and always opening to stimulating conversations in the community.
• 52:20
  SPEAKER_01: And uh, we'll catch y'all next time.