Latest / The #Backlog Breakdown / 197: Left Behind...by the ever-increasing cost of gaming w/ Alex

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197: Left Behind...by the ever-increasing cost of gaming w/ Alex · The #Backlog Breakdown

• 0:00
  Sam. Hello and welcome back to another episode of the backlog breakdown of Video Game Podcast, where we seek to encourage and equip the church to engage the medium of video games wisely and responsibly. Or as I am prone to say, wisely and well. I'm one of your hosts, Nate, and with me today is my co host, friend, and brother in Christ, Joshua. Hi, Josh.
• 1:04
  Hello. Hey, Nate.
• 1:07
  Hi, guys.
• 1:09
  Hi there.
• 1:09
  Hi. How's it going? How's it going, John?
• 1:12
  You introduced me, but I think you left well behind, didn't you?
• 1:15
  Yeah, our. Our shenanigans got kind of like, you know, oh, I left someone behind. You're the worst. Yeah, I did. We are joined today by a very. By a very special guest. The, like, the man with the most chill. He is the big chill, Alex Castellanos. I hope I didn't like white. White your name up too much. Like, you know, it was excellent.
• 1:43
  I loved it. That was great.
• 1:45
  Okay. Okay.
• 1:46
  I feel more Puerto Rican after hearing you say my name. Wow.
• 1:50
  Listen, my. My wife is half Cuban, and I actually work with a guy named Jaime, and we. We call him Jaime at work, but it is Jaime.
• 2:02
  Sure.
• 2:03
  And we will talk about it. And, you know, sometimes I, I. And it's like, I. He doesn't care. Like, he answers to both. But I do try to say Jaime just because, like, my wife is like, his name is Jaime. And I was just like, he doesn't care. But anyways, so. So she. She keeps me. She keeps me colorful because otherwise, like, I'm just. I'm about as white bread as it gets, brother. So, yeah, I'm like, when. When we adopted my son. Funny story, the judge, you know, he asks you a bunch of questions, and he. They. They ask you questions about, like, your. Your. Your ethnicity. And apparently I was kind of, like, nervous, which is weird, but not that weird. Right? You know, it's like, I talk a lot. I talk on this podcast. I. I talk a lot in real life, you know, and they were like, so what's your ethnicity? I said, I'm a mutt. Like, I just was like, so, like, I was like. I was just like, I'm. I'm like a Euro mutt. I'm like, you know, lots of European. Like, you know, some British, some German, some Scotch and Irish in there. I said like, I'm a mutt. And the judge was like, I've never heard that one before. And I was like, I got. I got a little like, like, kind of like.
• 3:31
  Did not want that answer.
• 3:33
  He didn't mind the answer. He just.
• 3:36
  He was like.
• 3:37
  It wasn't like. He wasn't like mad about it or anything, but he was just like, oh, that's. That's a. That's a new one for me.
• 3:44
  So.
• 3:47
  We made his day unique, Nate. You know, it wasn't a run of the mill day for him anymore.
• 3:53
  Yeah, yeah. But. But anyways, you know, it's. Well, this is your first time on the show, Alex, but you are no stranger to this format and I guess you know, you know that I would like to know how it's been. Oh, yeah, Josh, it's been. Yeah, yeah, it's been with you lately, my friend. You. I mean, this is your first time on the show, so you can take a couple minutes to just let us know, however, whatever you want. Like, tell us a little bit about yourself and let us know how you've been lately.
• 4:35
  All right. It's been good. I'm Alex Vasilanos. Like you said. Castellanos. I guess I am in New Jersey. I. I've been all right. I mean, I. I guess a little bit about me. I go to a church that called Cornerstone Christian Church.
• 5:06
  We.
• 5:06
  I'm a member there and a shepherd there. They call their leaders shepherds. And I'm on the worship team. Play piano and sing. And for work, I work at an electrical engineering company. They do like, commercial and industrial design projects. And I'm not an engineer, but I. I'm on the design team. I do drafting and design using like AutoCAD. I don't know if you've heard of that before, but just to help. Help make the blueprints and, and the drawing packages and things like that. So that's what I do by day. And Married. Married for 19 years to a beautiful wife, Alina. Yeah, that's great. Got married at 21, so I'm 40 now, getting up there and yeah, we just living our life, you know, doing the best we can to serve God as best we can in our community, our family. So that's a little bit about me.
• 6:10
  Yeah. Well, dude, that's awesome. That. That's. That's a pile of stuff in there, man. Like one, you're an engineer, so, like. Well, yeah, whatever. Yeah.
• 6:26
  Yeah. Okay.
• 6:28
  Yeah, but it's just, you know, I was just thinking too, I was thinking like, you know, you're sort of also underselling it that you are absolutely cutthroat when it comes to fantasy critic. Like, you know, okay, you know, we have the only 80s rule, or as I like to call it, you know, the big chill rule, like, we only pick 80s, you know?
• 6:47
  Yes. The off maligned 80s rule. It's been incredibly, incredibly butchered over the years. But that's all right, dude.
• 6:56
  Well, none of it. I don't think any of us hold to it very well, you know. Yeah. But can I explain.
• 7:03
  Can I take one minute to explain what I meant by that rule?
• 7:07
  Just.
• 7:07
  Just to clear the air a little bit.
• 7:09
  Yeah, dude.
• 7:10
  And then we can move on. Okay.
• 7:11
  Okay. Okay.
• 7:14
  So when I said I only pick 80s, what I meant to say and what I aim for with Fantasy Critic is a lot of us are trying to find that next amazing, great game. You see the trailers, you see the gameplay presentations, and you're just like, this game has so much potential and has such a high ceiling and people go for it and they try to pick up on these games. But those games can also have a pretty low floor. And for me, I'm looking for games that have a higher floor. I want to see, like, if nothing great happens in this game, I'm still looking at an 80, and that's kind of where I want to put. Because I figure that's just safe. And I, I of course, fail all the time at that. But that is my mindset. I'm not necessarily looking for the next 95. I'm looking for a lot of 80s. And that's, that's. That was my mentality there.
• 8:19
  Yeah, I think it was just like when, when you originally said it, it was just like the way you said it was like I. I tried to only pick 80s or something like that. And it was like. And everybody was just like, okay, guy, you know, but, you know, you dominated the Deer Critics League for like, it was like three years running, something like that. It was like my first, like two, three years in the league. And you were just like. And it wasn't even really close. It's only within like the last couple years.
• 8:50
  First year that you joined was like, I. For whatever reason, I. The league was kind of all in one spot and I just, I hit everything that year. It's been hard to repeat, for sure.
• 9:04
  But this year, this year I'm making. I, you know, I don't want to get too much into the league talk, but especially since like, you know, most, most people are like, what is it, dear? Critics League. But. But this year I'm making a run at it and I think I'm. I'm feeling pretty froggy. Feeling pretty froggy. Yeah, like, yeah, for sure. So we, we actually, you know, we do have Something potentially planned with. With Micah and Adam. The four of us need to make that happen. It'll be fun. That's definitely something that. Go ahead.
• 9:43
  I'm just saying I haven't heard anything about that yet, but, yeah, I know that we wanted to talk, try to get a discussion going.
• 9:51
  Yeah, well, this will. This will be. I'll. Well, this will be a good reminder. I'll bug Micah about it and be like, let's make this happen. Because he and I were talking about it and I was like, dude, that'd be sick. And he was like, I'll reach out to them.
• 10:03
  That's it.
• 10:04
  So anyways. Yeah, we need to make that happen anyways, so. Well, that's how it's been with you. But how has it been with you, Josh?
• 10:16
  Man, oh, man, just relentless. Yeah, you know, we're doing good. This last week, I've been. I've been out of pocket a bit. We took a trip to Minneapolis, Minnesota for a worship leader gathering through our church denomination, the efca. They met in Minneapolis. And so I took the family, and we have a puppy, we have a dog. So we brought the dog along. Planned to do a bunch of stuff outside, and it was kind of rainy for the first couple days, so spent a lot of time at the hotel pool, which my kids loved. So, like, I guess it's still. That's still a plus there. But we were able to take a day and go out to this park in the middle of town that had a waterfall. It was like a 50 foot waterfall, which is pretty cool. And go hiking and just some. Some really cool parks that we were able to see. So we had a good time. We had a good time in the. In the. The conference, the gathering, whatnot, was, was good. It was encouraging too. So enjoyed our time out there. Been up and down with some sickness still lingering with the family. We actually sat down to eat because it's mostly been the tail end of. It has been. My wife had gotten hit with sickness and I think actually the last time we recorded, she was getting sick and she was feeling better. We were in Minneapolis, you know, the whole family sleeping in one room in a hotel. You know, not exactly the most fun in the world, but, you know, you do what you got to do. But we get back and, you know, it's just kind of lingering effects, but she's feeling better. But last night we sat down to eat dinner. She takes a few bites of soup. She's like, you know what? I can't taste this. And I couldn't Smell it while you were cooking. So there's no, like, there's no real other effect. Just you know, kind of lingering cough, but not that bad. She's very tired but now. But she wasn't able to go to this event that we went to this evening because. Yeah, seems like she's got Covid, which is super fun. Yeah, I think that was supposed to be coffee. I don't know. Anyways, Anyways, yeah, so kind of up and down, good stuff for the most part, but also just man, the sickness doesn't seem to, to want to leave the household. But hey, but it's also, you know, it's times like this that are opportunities to continue to trust God. Like in a real day to day way of. You know what? I struggle with being frustrated when I have to cancel plans when I have, you know, and do stuff like this. And like I know for me when I was sick a couple weeks ago, like I struggle with, you know, like, oh, I'm going to be better. I'm not better and I get frustrated and it's legitimately a struggle. And I know it's on a very small scale, but at least relatively. But it is an opportunity to say, you know what, no, this is not beyond God's control. And he is, if I do believe that he's good, he's trying to teach me something in the midst of this. Right. And maybe that's just to trust in him to take a step back. These things will work themselves out and I have to accept that I'm not in control. So there's that element as well, which is a good thing. It's just not always an easy thing. So anyways, I'll get off my soapbox. But that's how we've been. Cool, Cool, cool, cool. How have you been, sir?
• 13:46
  We're okay. We're okay. Byron did manage to recover from hand, foot, mouth.
• 13:52
  Nice.
• 13:52
  I hate that. Like you know, it's like one of those diseases that is just, it just feels like mean spirited. Like it's, it's a viral thing and it just like, it's just like, it's not super life threatening or anything. It's just painful and unpleasant and makes you miserable for like the better part of a week. And I'm just like, ugh, gross. Like it's like wasps. Like it's like. Or do wasps actually do anything except for like sting people and ruin nice days? I doubt it. Um, but so, but yeah, we're not really sick. We do have like, I think like some allergy stuff. Kind of like percolating. Um, so that's. That's, you know, it's that time of year. You just have to watch out for it because like that's the kind of stuff where it's like. Megan actually the other week went to like a med express eye care kind of thing because she thought she was getting an ear infection. And it turns out. Well, no, you just have to really intense like congestion and pressure.
• 15:00
  Oh man.
• 15:01
  So, yeah, you know, we're kind of like doing the. Like, you know, I'm doing the thing where I dope myself with cold medicine and I'm trying. I'm actually trying to cut back on energy drinks. So it's like really. It's tough for me. It's like, you know, thoughts and prayers, folks. I need them.
• 15:21
  Yeah.
• 15:21
  But I can't rely on cold medicine and caffeine. It's just. Just the cold medicine. Because I am. But you know, for the next couple of days that might go a little bit on the whatever. But yeah, we're doing pretty good. We did have a family reunion the other week when went and sort of with my dad's side. It was just like. It's one of those things where I took a half day at work. We drove out to neighboring town about 45 minutes away it might be. Parents came in, my one sister brought, you know, and her husband and their kids came in and it was like just hanging out with my dad's side. And what. What's kind of funny is like, you know, I make. I have no problem sort of admitting that I'm. I'm a little rough around the edges. But like. And my. My parents are, you know, pretty sweet people. Like, you know, they're just. And it's. It's kind of one of those things where it's like I am a lot rougher than them. Like a lot. And I've always kind of wondered where that that came from. I spent about 30 seconds talking to my one uncle and I was like, oh no, there it is. Like, that's. That's it. That's it. I was like, ah, that's. It's a McKeever thing. So. But no, it was. It was cool to see everybody, you know. And it's. But it's. You know, you haven't seen some of. Like some of those people came. I haven't seen most. A good bit of those people since like my wedding. And that was 12, 13 years ago. And it's like. So, yeah, it's just kind of. But it was. It was Whatever. And then. Yeah, but that was cool. It just was also, like. It's just weird because, you know, at the same time, it's like, I love these people. Like, I'm. I'm bound to these people and I'm glad I know them, but it's also. I haven't seen them in like, 15 years, and so that makes things, like.
• 17:23
  A little.
• 17:25
  Awkward, you know, But. But yeah, and then we got some birthdays coming up. Like, actually tonight we. We went out to dinner at. There's like a. A ramen place that does, like, ramen and stir fry and all sorts of stuff. And so we went there for Megan's stepdad, for Pappy D. We went. We got. We took him out to dinner. And then in a. In like a week, Megan will have a birthday, and then a little bit after that, Byron will have a birthday. So we've got birthdays coming up in the next couple of weeks. Just kind of gearing up for that. I'm going to be home next week pretty much to prep for that. So, like, just like, do birthday stuff. Yeah, yeah, that's. That's how we're doing. It's like, that's how it's been with, with us, but we are. We have other forms to observe. And I, I think, Josh, as much as I'm. I'm. I'm gonna hate what's gonna. Do you have any experiences you'd like to share? Best start what's on your mind.
• 18:44
  In.
• 18:44
  A brand new way.
• 18:48
  Let's go.
• 18:56
  Crank it up.
• 18:59
  Yeah. Experiences to share. Yeah, we got lots of experiences to share. This is a. Where we talk about, you know, different forms of media before we get to video games, other media we may be consuming and. Or not consume it. Just, you know, interesting anecdotes and experiences to share with each other. So do we want to go in the same order? How's that sound?
• 19:18
  Yeah, well, I thought, like, since Alex is our guest, we can let him go first. So what have you been into? Big Chill.
• 19:27
  I have not been into much. I've. It's. My wife and I, we are fans of just chilling out at the end of the day and watching some good old network TV where those people that keep those shows on the air for years and years. So, you know, the new fall shows are out. We're checking them out, seeing what's good, what's not good. So that's what I've been doing. Trying to not really. Oh, and cbs, there is a show that's been out for a couple years called Fire country. And they just did a spin off show now called Sheriff country, which is basically the same town, but now they're focusing on the cops instead of the fire department. And we hadn't watched either show. So we checked out the Sheriff country because it was new and we kind of liked it. So then we went back on Paramount plus and started watching some of the Fire country stuff and it was pretty good. So it's just, it's good to watch while we're having dinner and just, you know, watching it. Put an episode of that on and just see what's, see what's going on. Yeah, so it's, it's pretty, it's all tame tv. We don't have to worry about anything too crazy. So we're, we're fans of that. The other thing that I think I've been into right now is over the last few months I've been reading comics from this, this comic book company called the Ripperverse. There's a guy by the name of Eric July. I don't know if you've heard of him. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. So he, he is a Christian and he is not necessarily a Christian company, although he has a lot of people who are Catholic or Christian on staff. And so they started their own independent comic book company and like publishing company. And I've been getting into reading some of those comics and getting caught up on that, on that universe. So it's called the Ripperverse here. I brought a visual aid for anyone who's watching.
• 21:37
  Oh, nice.
• 21:37
  This was like a. The first thing that I bought, it was like, it's called the Trinity and it had. Was like the three other big comics. Issue number one, just back to back, they call them comics, but they're really very much graphic novel style. They'd be like, you know, okay, 60 to 90 pages depending on. On the issue.
• 21:56
  Oh, wow.
• 21:56
  And so this was the first book I bought and it was pretty big, but it was interesting. It was a lot, it was a lot of the number ones and it caught my attention and I wanted to support the company, so I started looking into other ones. It's been fun. So I'm in grabbing those. If anyone's interested in those. You know, I'll point you in that direction. Ripperverse is pretty cool.
• 22:22
  Nice.
• 22:23
  Yeah.
• 22:24
  Yeah. I don't read as many comics consistently as I used to. If I. It's like definitely one of those things where I, I remember seeing him sort of announce the launch, but actually look like that, that big collection that you had that's actually like. I like that kind of stuff where it's like, just let me sit down and, like, chew through a good bit. Like, turn through a good bit of content in one shot. And so, yeah, I might have to.
• 22:53
  Yeah, I do like the collections.
• 22:56
  Yeah, yeah.
• 22:59
  Yeah, yeah. I do remember when he was launching it a few years ago, I think in 2022, he launched the company with the first. He had like a big Kickstarter or something to try to get or like some sort of campaign to get the first issue going. And I do remember hearing about that. And then I remember Last Stand Media. I remember Colin Moriarty had a woman on. I'm forgetting her name right now, who had gotten fired from Limited Run Games.
• 23:31
  Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 23:33
  And when she was going through, like, her media circuit and people were having her on shows, Eric July has a podcast and he had her on as well, and he ended up hiring her to be like, you know, part of their social media team or something like that. So I, you know, it had come up a couple of times, but I hadn't really jumped on and dove into the comics until this past year, and I started really reading. So it's. I like them. I think they've been fun, and it's interesting to not be bogged down with, like, you don't know where to start and you don't know the history of these characters. All these characters are rarely fairly new, so it's easy to just say, well, they're only on issue three. I'll just read the first one and you're caught up immediately if you want to. So.
• 24:19
  Yeah, I like that. Yeah, I have to check that out. So.
• 24:24
  Yeah. Yeah.
• 24:25
  Okay. Okay, okay.
• 24:26
  Ever.
• 24:27
  Joshua. How about you, sir?
• 24:31
  Yeah. What do I have to share, really? So it's. I realized that there's a bunch of new music that is kind of nostalgic or by bands that have been around for a while. It seems like in the past, like, two or three weeks, like six or seven different bands that I like have released new albums. And so I'm gonna just run this down really quickly. There's music that I have not listened to that I need to thrice put out a new album. I tried to listen to it on the drive to Minneapolis, but it's kind of atmospheric, so I couldn't really listen to it with the car noise. Like, it just didn't. It didn't work. So I still need to listen to that Motion City soundtrack, put out a new album, and I still have not listened to that. I'VE just heard a few of their singles which I liked one of them. The other one was laden with expletives, which is still a fun song, but it is laden with expletives so I don't recommend it. And then Coheeding Cambria put out a deluxe version of their latest album so that it has like five new songs on it. And so I listened through those and those are good. Mayday Parade is a band that's been around for quite a while. They've put out. They're on their second of three of like a three part album series this year. They're only like 2030 minute albums and I enjoyed the last one. Although there were a few expletives on it. This one does not have any expletives on it. And it's nice, fun, breezy kind of emo pop music, which is fun. I enjoy that. Yellow Card put out an album which, if you remember those guys, and it's good. They have Travis Barker playing their drums. Blink 182 guy, and I think he produced that album also. It's a good album. It is short. It is highly produced. Like I haven't heard the. The singer in a while. Like I haven't kept up with them and it seems like he's. Even most singers kind of lose their range as they get older. It seems like he's. His range has increased or at least he sings a bit higher. But it's a good album so it's fun. There's. There's a track with. With Avril Lavigne on it, which I think is kind of funny, but she does a good job. So it's a. There's that and then the. Lastly, the Starting Line put out their first full length in like 18 years. Unfortunately, it's not my favorite. It's just okay. Like it's not bad, but it is much more kind of raw sounding. The guy's vocal tone is. Has changed quite a bit. It sounds like he smokes because it sounds like he's on the verge of losing his voice the whole song. And it just doesn't. It just sounds more raw and laid back. And the mix is kind of off a bit too. It's a little muddy. It's not very dynamic and I get that they. It's not. Maybe they don't want to sound like they used to with a big produced sound. Totally understand that. But to me it just went the opposite direction a bit too far. Where I still enjoyed some of the tracks, but I feel like anytime that I Put it on. I'll probably just go listen to their older stuff because I really like their older stuff. So. Anyways, that's just a handful of bands that I like that have been putting out new music, so that those are my experiences to share. Cool. Cool.
• 27:42
  Well, I did. I followed up with you, actually, and just checked out some of the story so far, and they were fine. Like, it. It was fun. It was like. It was, like, good. I can definitely see where you're just like, yeah, they kind of write like, the same, like, three songs and it's just like, ah, yeah, but they've got like a. A decent sound, so. But I really haven't been into too much lately. Like, I've kind of. Yeah, I just haven't been watching or reading a ton. I mean, I'm still grinding away at, like, the Malazan Books of the Fallen, sort of like, just, you know, like, getting. Doing, like, major nerd work, the. The Ten Very Big Books podcast. So. And it's been kind of interesting and all I'm gonna, like, it's. It's one of those things, like, you know how sometimes, like, you maybe. Maybe you guys don't do this. Maybe you're not, as. I'm just gonna say arrogant as I am, but I'm like, I'm listening to this 10 very big books podcast, and I know part of it is like, the 2p. Two of the people on that podcast have never read the books at all before, but it's like I'm listening to it and, like, they'll do, like, chapter recaps and stuff, and I'm like, no, that's like. And I'm listening to those same chapters, and then I'm listening to the episode, you know, and so it's like, I'm kind of, like, doing it that way. And it's. I'm just like, no, that.
• 29:17
  That's not.
• 29:17
  No, that's. That's not right. That's not right.
• 29:20
  That's.
• 29:21
  No, no. Like. And it's just like. And it's. It's fun, but I'm also like. It's kind of like one of those things. Like, oh, like, yeah, I'm kind of a turd, you know.
• 29:40
  So.
• 29:40
  But it.
• 29:40
  It just kind of like, that's been an experience. But, like, as far as, like, interesting stuff, I've kind of been into lately. A friend of mine, a guy actually, that lives in town, he's part of a band called Tiger Wine, and it's like alt rock kind of. He was like, you know, seeing kid Kind of when I was, you know. And he plays drums, really gifted drummer. But the band's called Tiger Wine. And he posted something where. And I just like, oh, yeah. Like, they. They released an album last year, and so it's not. It's not what I would call, like, my go to music, but it's like. It's like, I know him, so I'm gonna, like, check out his stuff. And it's like, it's kind of atmospheric alt rock. It's. It's a cool album. I'm enjoying it. I haven't, like, listened to it, like, super in depth, you know, but I didn't hear anything, like, super objectionable off the crack. But it's like, yeah, it might be worth, you know, encouraging people to check it out, because I think it's like. I think it's a cool sound. So Toil and Spin is the name of the album that I've been listening to by them, and that's their most recent one. They released that last year. The other thing I've kind of really been into, and it's. It's kind of slow going, even though it is essentially like a manga or graphic novel. But it's. The same guy who did the Legend of Zelda manga has a new book called Komuto. And it's pretty. Pretty and kind of cool. And so I got that a little while ago, and I've kind of been just reading a little bit at a time, and it's cool and I like it. And the artwork is just, like, gorgeous. I love that dude style. It's so. It's so good. It's so, so stinking good. It's not super. It's not like, a super clean style. It's like. It is very, like, kind of, like, ornate, but, like. Yeah, it's pretty. It's pretty dope. Like, if you like really cool art and kind of like a weird, like, fantasy story kind of stuff. Like, yeah, Camuto is kind of dope. So, yeah, that's what I've been into. That is not video games, but we are a video game podcast, and we should talk about what we've been playing. So, Alex, what have you been playing, my guy?
• 32:21
  What have I been playing? I have. Most recently, I've been jumping into Stardew Valley. I. I played it very briefly a few years ago and, you know, just to try it out, and I probably got it really cheap and then played for a little while and then walked away and did something else.
• 32:46
  Sure.
• 32:47
  And I was just on Quick Play Mark's podcast a little while ago and I know he loves Stardew Valley, talks about it all the time. So I saw it again and let me just download this again and start playing. So I'm digging back in. I'm not, I'm not terribly deep into it, but I've been playing that the last couple Saturdays, trying to figure out what's going on as things continue to unravel in that game. So that's what I've been playing the most recently. But before that I have been in this mode where I'm just kind of picking here or there an hour or two at a time for a lot of different games. So I, I played Pac Man World Repack for an hour or two and.
• 33:34
  That was that like, pretty reboot thing.
• 33:38
  No, no, no. This is a PS1 game that they remastered. Just the original Pac Man World game. Remastered and.
• 33:47
  Oh, okay, the 3D platformer thing.
• 33:50
  Yeah, 3D platformer game. It's, it's, it's just a cute kids game. And I just went in there just to, just to run around a 3D environment and play as Pac Man. So I played that for a couple hours and, and I was also playing before that Hollow Knight Silk song, and I was telling you guys in the pre show how I was very much running into walls while playing that game and then having to leave. And this is when I would play Pac man or other things, I would have to go play something else, you know, kind of clear my head. Play something that was absolutely not challenging. This way I can go back and resume the frustration that was Hollow Knight Silksong, but I haven't picked that up in a couple of weeks. I haven't played in a little while. I know I'm nearing the point where the frustration will rise and my sense of progression will wane. So I, I know I'm towards the end of my experience with Hollow Knight Silksong. I probably could push forward a little, a little more and, and get a little further, but I don't like to come get to the point. When I was a young wee lad, I would very much get to the point in my video games where I just wanted to rip the controller apart or throw it somewhere. And I don't like experiencing that anymore as an adult. So I tend to turn the page and do something else. But yeah, those are the things that I'm playing. I think the last game that I've beaten was squeak it in one. Remaster up. I bought that squeak it in one and 2 HD remastered in one again. And those are great games. I love both of those games. I didn't get to the second one just because it takes me so long to play, but I played the first one and got to the end and. And then moved on. But I intend on getting back to the second one too, because I love both of those games. They're great.
• 35:55
  I don't know if I've ever shared my. My Suikoden story. It actually, it involves my. My friend Bull that passed away a while ago at this point, but I was over at his house and he had. They had a PlayStation and their memory card was full. But he was like, hey. He was like, I think you'd really enjoy this game. Why don't you like, check it out. You can't save right now because we don't have any spare memory cards. And I got on a tear with that game. Like, I mean, I stayed up like all night, was just like ripping through it and I actually like fell asleep. And there's this picture that. It's like one of my favorite pictures of me asleep on. On their couch, you know, controller in one hand, and I'm all sort of like balled up and, you know, sort of, you know, just like, like pure, like got my hood up like, and pulled real tight and like just like, you know, just pure gamer, like hardcore gamer energy, right? And so I fell asleep. They came downstairs, they woke me up, him and his brother. They're like, yo, you want breakfast? And I was like, yeah. And I started playing the game again and it was like, you know those. Those fights where it's like, there's like the different. There's like. There's like the. The. The little squad fights. And then you can do like the big. There's big, like the big army fights. And then there's like, you can do the duels. I was in one of those duels. And the duels are very like, rock, paper, scissory. And now granted, I was like 20 hours into this thing at this point, like, oh, no. And I woke up, I was like, yeah, breakfast sounds good. And I just sort of jump right back into this game and proceed to die. And I was like, that's the game. And I just went over and hit power and was like, done. And I've never gone back to Suika Den since, like, because it was like. I was just like. I really liked what was there. I was having a really good time. But like, that's sort of like, you know, it's like just. It completely kibosh the energy. And I was just like, so someday. Someday I might go back. Because I. I like. I think, though, what I would say is, like, the. The cast in those games like that, like the 101 stars of Destiny or whatever.
• 38:24
  Like 108 now.
• 38:26
  108.
• 38:27
  Yeah.
• 38:28
  That's just, like, cool. That's a. That's a lot of characters to keep track of. And I know not all of them are combatants and everything else, but.
• 38:36
  Yeah, but it's a great series, and that's a great story. Thank you for sharing it. It was fun. I like.
• 38:44
  Yeah, dude, it's. It's just like. It's like one of those things where it's like, yeah. I was like, I really like this. And then. And then I was like, I'm. I'm really, like, on a tear. And then it's like, no, you're not.
• 38:58
  I never inspired you to pick up the game yourself. You just left it right there.
• 39:01
  I was just like, nope, we're done. We're never touching this again.
• 39:07
  Yeah. Your first mistake was playing an RPG on PlayStation without a memory card. Like, oh, man.
• 39:14
  It was one of those things, too, where it's like, I just meant to, like, fool around with it.
• 39:18
  Yeah.
• 39:19
  And it was like, you know how sometimes, like, you just get in it and the game just, like, goes, and you just. Right along, it's like, I'm like, I should have stopped way before that point, but I was like, nah, I'm just gonna be stupid and we're gonna try and, like, one shot this thing. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 39:38
  Biggest mistake is playing a PlayStation RPG with no memory card. Second biggest mistake would be playing a PlayStation RPG with a suspect memory card, because then you're just playing Russian roulette. I don't know if you guys had any of those knockoff ones. I had one that was a four in one with a little digital screen on it. You push the button to go to a different one, and that thing erased itself multiple times throughout my childhood. And, man, that's the reason I only.
• 40:07
  Yeah, I mean, that's the reason. I only bought branded memory cards for anything.
• 40:12
  Well, you were.
• 40:13
  I was like, yeah, yeah.
• 40:17
  Anyways.
• 40:18
  But.
• 40:18
  Yes, sir.
• 40:19
  Joshua, what have you been playing?
• 40:22
  I don't really have much to say except that my library is pretty stinking Cool. Because I. By talking with some people who are fans of the series, I kind of caught onto the hype train. So I hopped on my phone on my library app, and lo and behold, my library got in a copy of Pokemon Za. Pokemon Legends Za for Nintendo Switch 2. I didn't even know they carried Switch 2 games. Apparently there's also Donkey Kong Bonanza right up the street, like four blocks from us at our library. And I was not expecting. Yeah, yeah. So I took it with me to Minneapolis and was playing it there and. And lo and behold, the the due date. It's only one week that you get video games, but it just auto renewed because no one else put it on hold. So I'm like, okay, cool, I get it for another week, which is. Which is pretty sweet. So. And then I get the email from Nintendo. How you liking your new game? Like that's funny. It's not mine. But anyways, anyway, so that's really what I've been spending time with is Pokemon Legends. Za. I will just basic impressions is that I really like the style of the Legends Arceus. I really like how it goes back in time. I really like how it's the old school Japan feel to it and I like surprisingly how different this one is because Legends are side story, like Gaiden type games. I like how this one differentiates itself and it's not trying to be let another Legends game. Like it's not trying to do the exact same thing that Arceus was trying to do. I actually like how it differentiates itself. So it's in a modern setting, you know, you're in a town. It makes a really good first impression, I think. And so for the five or so hours that I've put into it, you know, maybe five, eight, something like that, I'm really enjoying my time. It does not have the best reviews and apparently it gets stale by the end of the game is what I've heard is kind of the biggest problems with it, which might end up happening, you know, because this one all takes place in within one single city as opposed to Arceus, you know, going through a bunch of different landscapes. So I can see where the those may become problems in the future. But for my time, I'm actually really enjoying it. I like some of the changes of the formula. I like how it feels distinct and unique and it's not trying to be just another one because I mean, I think the Pokemon Mainland series has that issue of like it's kind of more of the same with one added gimmick each, you know, each generation. And this one feels like they really intentionally were trying to change from Arceus. And as much as I really like Arceus and everything that it did, I like that this one just feels distinct and it's not trying to be the be all and End all of Pokemon games. And I appreciate that because it's not overwhelming. So anyways, I'm enjoying my time with it. It's going to have to go back in just a few days, but. And you know, I probably won't pick it up for a while after that. But I've enjoyed my time with it. So that's. That's really the only thing I've been playing. I've kind of set everything else aside because, hey, I have this game for two weeks. So cool. I'm gonna play it. So cool. No change to my score. Just a borrowed game.
• 43:52
  I would talk to me about the action combat in Pokemon Legends. Za.
• 44:00
  So all of your attacks are on cooldowns. One of the reviewers that I had watched who was not very hot on the game, said that it's like Xenoblade light. And I'm like, okay, I can see, I can see where you get that from. One of the things that it does, I mean, it's Pokemon, so it's easy.
• 44:19
  Okay.
• 44:20
  You know, you just basically get. You. You gather a team of Pokemon that have moves that can. That can. That are super effective against your enemies, you know, and then you switch them out accordingly. So I'm not that far into it, and so it's been easy, which is fine. The cooldown system thing actually causes me to use those attacks that I don't typically use, like lear. That lower your enemy's defense and. Or lower their attack or increase your special attack. Because I'm waiting on my kind of big attacks for their cooldowns. So I've enjoyed it. It is very fast paced. So.
• 45:01
  Yeah.
• 45:02
  Cool. I like, seemed like the most unique thing out of that. Out of that game where there's moving around and aiming of attacks and things like this. That's what it seemed. Anyway.
• 45:16
  Yes. I have not encountered. Again, I'm early in the game, but I have not encountered anything where I need to line anything up in particular or that I found that there's much within battles that that does. But it's fun to run around. Yes. And it's fun to, you know, see them attack each other and stuff like that. So, yeah, it feels good. It's. It's basic, but it feels good. Yeah, sure.
• 45:43
  Yeah. I was just going to point out too that according to Game Freak, the Legend series are not Gaidens. They are considered part of like the mainline Pokemon franchise. They are considered like canon mainline games.
• 46:01
  So I. I can see how they are canon. Yes. But it does feel much more like, wow.
• 46:09
  Oh, I agree with you that they feel more like side stories than anything else. I'm just saying that game freak says, oh, no, they are not side stories. These are mainline Pokemon titles.
• 46:21
  So here, mainline games, please purchase on them.
• 46:24
  Right, right. We want to see the sales of our mainline series. Yeah, that's the way that I understand that. Because it's not. It does not seem to have the ambition of a mainline. Like, I don't know how many Pokemon are in this game. Something tells me it's not a , you know, 200 or whatever they're at. It doesn't seem that expansive, which.
• 46:47
  That's entirely Pokemon.
• 46:49
  Well. Right. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 46:52
  Entirely too many.
• 46:55
  Cool, cool, cool, cool, cool, cool.
• 46:59
  Well, I mean, I don't know that I've been playing a ton. A ton. But I have been playing a good bit lately. And so I've. I'm. Like I said, I'm kind of. I'm playing Arceus kind of. I have thoughts there. But we will save those primarily for the episode that we'll be doing on Arceus here in the. The upcoming future. So I'm still kind of, like, working through that a little bit. I'm debating honestly whether or not I. I ought to beat it or if I can just sort of like, cut and run. But again, talk more about that when we get to the Arus episode. So I beat Sword of the Sea. I talked about it last episode. I beat it. It's short. There's like. I think my play time was like four hours, and it offers, like, a new game plus experience. And I sort of jumped into that for a little bit. And then I was kind of like, okay, like, this is cool, and I really do like this. But I actually. It kind of got me thinking, and Giant Squid actually made another game, the Pathless, that I had purchased fairly early on when I got my PS5 and I was like, oh, I forgot that I had that. Like, I want to go back and play that. So I've been playing the Pathless, and the. The. The first time I came to the Pathless, it kind of was like a game where I just wasn't. It's kind of weird, but like, Sword of the Sea kind of prime me for the Pathless in the sense that, like, it's a very flow state kind of game. And I think when I tried to play it the first time, I just wasn't in the right headspace. But now I've been playing it this time, and it's like I've. I've beaten the first couple of areas and it's really like I'm like, I'm kind of just enjoying that. That chill like kind of here for the vibes. But there's also like some interesting gameplay loops and like there's just kind of like. I don't know. I kind of like what giant squid does. It's that very like journey adjacent gameplay. I. I would say so at this point in time. I've played. I've played Abzu. Abzu in my opinion is pretty much the weakest. I don't hate it, but I think that, that. I think the fact that is like you're just kind of swimming around in these environments is really. I've just never experienced swimming in a game that feels really like great. Like there's something weird about like that 3D navigation that I'm not a big fan of. But Abzu is still cool. I'm just like. It's not my favorite, but sort of the sea I really liked. I'm really enjoying the Pathless. I think like the Pathless has like a really cool traversal thing where it kind of reminds me a little bit of like. Like the web swinging in Spider Man. It's not the same like instead of. But it's kind of got like this. This push and pull and there's like an ebb and flow and I actually really, really like that. It's kind of fun to just like rip around the. The landscape, sort of like shooting things with your arrows. So the path. This is cool. I like it. I'm probably going to beat it here in the coming weeks because it's not supposed to be super long either, but so I'm kind of fooling around with that also, you know, fired up. It's been. It's been a. Since I got together with the squad and so Deuce. Well, some new content had been released in Warhammer 40K Dark Tide and Deuce picked up like it was a new class. So it's not like. And they. Apparently they did introduce a story mode, but the story mode is pretty much like. It's just. It's not really a story mode. Like I don't. If you've played Warhammer 40K Dark Tide, you'll know what I'm talking about. And if you haven't, well then you'll. It's like it's. The game basically now gives you like certain missions to sort of unlock the different features. Whereas like you would just. It would just kind of do that as you played the game. So now it's like now you have Actually specific levels and missions that you need to be. And, and that's the, that's the story mode.
• 51:27
  So.
• 51:27
  Yeah, whatever. But it's Dark Tide. It's cool. Like they're. Yeah. I don't know. It's. It's kind of just. You get in there, you do some, you know, you kill mutants or with abominations or whatever. You know, it's. It's just, it's good old grim Dark Warhammer 40K Dark Tide nonsense. It's. I don't know, it's. Yeah, it's. It's very much like. There's a little bit of a learning curve, but it is very. It's kind of a different type of flow state game in the sense that like, it's not super duper technical and you kind of just get in there and you just run around with your squad and smash, smash.
• 52:16
  Bad.
• 52:16
  Bad dudes. Or even more bad dudes. Because, you know, honestly, in the. The Warhammer universe, I don't know if they're really are good, good people. They're all kind of like. It's kind of gross the whole way down.
• 52:28
  Sure.
• 52:30
  But yeah, so that's kind of just what we're doing. So, yeah, that's been kind of cool, like I said, so. Haven't picked up anything. I'm. I'm really am trying to like, hold fast to this. Like, I'm. I'm really trying to get to negative 10. And then I do have some stuff that I'm like, yeah, I. I'm sitting on some PlayStation Store credit that kind of. It's burning kind of a hole in my pocket. But I'm gonna, I'm gonna exercise a little bit of discipline, just a tiny bit. But yeah, I did use one of my flex points for Sword of the Sea, so that puts me at a negative 6. And so if anybody's curious as to what the, the numbers are, when we were talking about some of this stuff, it's like the backlog beatdown, which is a meta that we run all year long. It's basically a gamified. It's, it's. It's a bit of a metagame that's meant to help you think about acquisition and playing and encourage you to play what you're already on. If it sounds even a little bit. Well, I'll give you a little bit of an overview here. The more you play, the more you subtract. So you want to get as low a score as possible or you want to go into the negatives, the more you Buy, the more you add. So think about adding to your backlog. Backlog, beat down. It's not that hard. But the rules are a little more nuanced than that. And if you're interested in those, we have those over in the Discord. Or you can reach out to me or Josh and we'll send you a copy of them if you know or not. It's up to you. We like it. We've been doing it for a while. That being said, other things that we like and have been doing for a while and think that you might be interested in, it's. Well, it's this podcast. We like doing it. And if you like listening to it or like watching it or whatever, you can actually be cool like Alex and become a patron for as little as a buck a month. So you can get early noncut access to each and every episode. You get a special role in our Discord and a little more access to. To just Josh and I. As a general rule. You also get to help us shape the. The podcast a little bit more. There's a lot more sort of push and pull with the patrons. Like, you know, we take feedback from them and we ask questions, and sometimes, you know, sometimes they say things we don't like, but most of the time, they're really cool. Most of the time. Alex, you've never said anything that I don't like, so I'm thinking about you.
• 54:56
  Paul, you're just forgetting.
• 54:59
  No, no, no. I just. I was gonna throw shade at Paul and I. I did. So. But it's. Anyways. But they also. Patrons, you know, get to recommend a game or a topic for us to cover or play. Like, we like having them on, you know, these guys, you know, so. And that's kind of what we're doing tonight. Even though it was. It was kind of like one of those things where I pitched it to Alex and I was like, what do you think of this? You want to hop on? And he was like, yeah. So that's. But, yeah, that's neither here nor there. They also are patrons. We recently added this. They get access to our calendar and schedule. They can see sort of what we've got coming up. And so they can. They get a little bit of the inside baseball, kind of like behind the scenes kind of thing. In addition to that, they also get an exclusive podcast called the Bro Hang, which tends to be a lot more conversational. Sometimes our guests join us, sometimes they don't. But it's more of this with a lot less filtering, and sometimes we don't talk about video game stuff, but if any of that sounds appealing or you're just looking for a way to sort of come alongside and help us, you know, so partner with us in this, you know, Cool. We'd love to have you. That being said, you know, do the rating and the reviewing, do the sharing and the caring, you know, do all those things. And like I said, if you want to go a little bit above and beyond, that's a way for you to do it. That being said, you know, we also are a proud member of the Playwell Network alongside our friends, you know, Paul Idle, Techno Funk boy, Nick Porch, and Wesley Ray, the Hench and dad himself. They each do podcasts and make content sort of exploring playing. Well, we like them, we like their stuff and we think it's worth checking out. So here's a word from one of them. Do you think that this is like a really close up shot of two small crabs? Or were those really big crabs?
• 57:06
  How do you know they're even real?
• 57:09
  They're imaginary crabs, simpleton. Please tell me what we can go look for. Imaginary crabs.
• 57:15
  Can we?
• 57:16
  How would you look for something that's imaginary?
• 57:18
  Oh, that's the best thing to look for. War has come to Kryn. A war building for centuries as dragons and gods drift into myth and legend. This is the war that will bring an end to it all or restore what was lost for good. Dragonlance. The Thorns of War is an actual play. Dungeons and Dragons podcast available everywhere in May. Subscribe today. And we're back. So tonight we're gonna talk like one. I've been trying to get Alex on the podcast for a while, but he's just, he is an effusive man, a bit of an elusive man, but he's. He's also an absolute sweetie, ladies and gentlemen. And so, but we. What kind of led me to this, though, was that over the last weather.
• 58:14
  Is cooling down and so you want to invite him, the Big Chill.
• 58:19
  Well, I mean, we would want to bring the Big Chill on when things are getting hot.
• 58:25
  Okay. Yeah, that's true.
• 58:27
  And Alex, we have clarified why you have that nickname, right? That your initials are A.C. so, air conditioning. You are also, like, the chillest dude I've ever come across. Like, you are fairly unfazable. Like, I've never seen you, like, get entirely out of pocket. Now, granted, we've only interacted in online spaces, so I'm sure that there's probably, like, you were talking earlier, like, like, hey, as a kid, wanted to snap my controller in half or like, you know, throw it through a wall or something, which I'm like, the fact that.
• 59:07
  Yeah, I was definitely the kid that cried while playing video games because it was just too frustrating and you couldn't beat the level. You know, I was definitely that kid.
• 59:17
  But I. I was the kid.
• 59:19
  I'm known. I'm known to a lot of people as a pretty even keel guy.
• 59:25
  Yeah.
• 59:25
  Yep.
• 59:26
  And I appreciate that about you because I am not even killed. Like, where. You were the kid who was like, I don't want to snap my controller in half. I was the kid who was like, I snapped my controller in half. It was like, you do that like once or twice and then when you have to start replacing them, you're like, this is not fun.
• 59:51
  Especially when a Switch 2 Pro controller costs, what, $80 nowadays? Oh, the prices, these things, they just keep going up. It's crazy.
• 1:00:00
  I see what you're doing here and I don't like it, but you're not wrong. One of the reasons. So I'll read the little bit of a blurb that I wrote and I. I'm reading it because I actually think it's not terrible. But we all know that gaming is a luxury Again, we know this. But it has gotten more expensive by hops and skips over the last couple of years. Game prices are rising, accessories are rising. The prices of consoles have been sort of on. On a pretty steady climb. And, well, maybe it's getting to be too much. Big Chill is Big sad because it seems like he might be getting priced out of the hobby we all love. So we decided to talk about how that makes us feel. And you know, one of the things that, like, one, I. I have a lot of respect, like, Josh is very sort of akin to you. And then the fact that, like, he's not an early adopter. And for, I'd say for a while, neither was I. But, like, there's something about, like, the hype beast in me that just like, I. I kind of like, I'm like, I want to be some. Not all the time, but far more often than not. I want to be like, in on the conversation early on. I want to sort of be in the. In the ground floor. And like, I know that that is just more expensive, you know? You know what I'm saying? Like, you know, I didn't get my PS5 day one, but I did get it fairly early on. I mean, not many people got PS5s on day one. You know, it was just. That was a whole thing. Right. But it's like, you know, and so it is kind of like this. This thing where it's like, you know, you. You have in. In the discord, you've talked about just sort of like the, The. The constant sort of trickling up of prices and how you just do feel like you're kind of getting priced out of gaming. Now you've also sort of mentioned the fact that you're a guy who, like, you just. He's like, I'll wait. I'll wait for it to go on sale. I'll. I'll wait like three, four years, and when it's 20 bucks, then we'll. We'll pick it up. And so, again, like, I think that requires a lot of control and discipline that, frankly, I'm a little envious of. And again, since I am a bit of a hype beast and where Josh is. Josh is a lot more akin to you. But, like, I think you even sort of like, turn that dial up. That, that sort of like that patience and that thriftiness, maybe even a little bit more than Josh does. And so I thought that that would be an interesting perspective. And, you know, you. You are an enthusiast. Like, you love video games. Like, no joke. I mean, and. And I know we talked a little bit about league stuff, but one of the things that always caught me, like, off guard, especially those first couple years, and I've come to kind of expect it, is that you study games. Like, and maybe, Maybe you're not. But like, you. You have a fairly significant, like, knowledge base. Like, you are constantly pulling stuff out that I have no idea what's going. Like, I'm like, what. What is this thing that Alex is like? He's just like, I'm. I pulled this game and it's like, I've been kind of watching this for a while, and I'm like, what the heck is this? And I, I like to think of myself as somebody who's in the know. So it's like, you are an enthusiast, you love video games, but, like, you've also sort of just like, made decisions where it's just like, I, I'm not gonna. Like, this is kind of the line, and I'm not gonna. I'm not gonna cross it. And so I think that's kind of an interesting place and an interesting space to examine and just have some candid conversation about it. And so it's like, you know, I've. I've kind of often said that, and I guess. So where we'll start with this is that I've often said that like, frankly, you know, and I, I think Colin Moriarty is probably the loudest voice in this space. Is that like games development, like it's, it only makes sense that the price of games goes up. Like the, the price of games was really stagnant for like 15, 20 years where like it kind of hit $60 in like the 90s and it just stayed there for a long time. And even though, you know, the market kind of jumped up and everything else and you know, we've seen, you know, well, two price hikes in the last three years. You know, where it goes from like a AAA game, you know, you can kind of expect them to come out at $70 and now like Nintendo drops Mario Kart World and they're like, oh, and hey, it's $80. Which pretty much everybody else in the industry breathed a sigh of relief because they were like somebody else. You know, Nintendo can fall on the, that sword for us. But like, what, how would you respond to that? Like, I mean, again, and, and this is the thing is like, I know you love video games. Like you, you are a student of the industry in a lot of ways. But again, like, like, so when, when people like me or like Colin Moriarty say, like, hey, like, it's kind of inevitable and it kind of only makes sense. Where, where does that kind of leave you?
• 1:05:31
  Yeah, I mean, I, I think it's one thing to understand someone's viewpoints or, or the industry and where it's going. It's, it's absolutely getting. Game costs are, are going way up, but game prices weren't going up in the same measure. So I do understand why things are going up now and could continue going up and it wouldn't seem unreasonable for the price that, that these companies are putting in to make these games. But I'll go, I'll go back a little bit to what you were saying before when you were talking about just how much people like to play games and how much you either want to be part of the zeitgeist or you don't, you know, or, or you have that need to be part of it or, or it's not as strong for other people. And for me, I knew growing up my family was going to be the family that had all the consoles, all the goodies, all the gizmos. We had to pick and choose and I was okay with that. And I can go to my friend's house and play the latest and greatest. And you know what? It actually was nice because I knew that by the Time I got something, I know exactly what I wanted, you know, because my friends played it and I, I've gotten to play a couple hours of this in, in bits and pieces. But now I finally get to have it on my own. I get to sit down and play all day. I don't have to just share with my friends and hope my mom doesn't come to pick me up. You know what I mean? And yeah, so that was a little bit of an advantage. When I was a kid, I, I, I remember going to my friend's house and playing Final Fantasy VII for the first time. I had no idea what it was. And every time I went to his house, I was like, can we play Final Fantasy 7 again? We played it already. And I was like, but it was so cool. And then so when I got the PlayStation, I got it in 98 for my birthday. It was one of the first things I knew I wanted to go get was like, let me go get Final Fantasy. And actually a really funny story is when I went to the store, Final Fantasy 8 had come out at that point. By the time I went to go get it, I guess it was 99 by the time I went to go get that game. So I said eight. Eight's better than seven, right? Oh no. And to be fair, I loved Final Fantasy 8 growing up. I love, I loved it. And you know, and only when you get older you realize maybe it wasn't as timeless as Final Fantasy 7. But that's just a funny anecdote. But you get to shoot. I was used from you. Well, yeah, yeah, I was used to that cycle of I was always three years late to the party, you know, when PlayStation 2 came out, I think I got it when I had first got a job and started saving up money and I was a senior in high school, I think. And that's when I got it in like 2002, 2003. And then when PS3 came out, you know, I think I didn't get that till like 2010 or something like that. So I've always been late to the party. But the advantage of waiting around a little bit used to be that price, the cost came down, you know. Yeah, I didn't have to pay 599 or whatever PS3 was at launch because when I got was $300 and it came with a game and an extra controller and I'm like, oh great. You know. So that was kind of the advantage of waiting. And so as costs are rising, as prices are rising, I understand that. But the, the Notion that waiting to get a console. Like right now, if I wanted to buy a PlayStation 5, it costs more than it did in 2020. And where I was totally baffled by that. Even with the Switch, Nintendo Switch, I was waiting for years for this thing to drop even $50. And it never did. Never did. And now it's actually more. It actually costs more now that the Switch 2 is out, which doesn't make any sense. I mean, let's be honest, the Switch is not worth anything more now than it was in 2017. I don't care what inflation says. But so, yeah, that's just the big difference. It's like if the PlayStation 5 had come down in price, I'd be happy to jump on. I think it's easy to pay 30, 40, $50 for a game, you know, but it's a lot harder sometimes to save up that bundle of money and throw something down for a new console. And that's where that barrier is right now. And that barrier just seems to be climbing.
• 1:10:42
  Yeah. And I mean, to be fair too, you're right, they aren't going down. It was like, I mean, I remember the PS1, PS2 cycles. Like, I didn't own an original gray box. The first PlayStation I owned was that little slim PS1. Like. And that was like.
• 1:11:04
  Oh, any.
• 1:11:07
  I forget what, I don't think I paid a hundred dollars for that. Like.
• 1:11:11
  Yeah, it was like 99 or something. Yeah, yeah. Well, even when it first came out.
• 1:11:15
  Yeah, yeah. And it's like. And my, the, the first PS2 I owned was a slim. And again, it was like when, when the, the original PS2 debuted, it was like 150 bucks, 200 bucks or something like that. I was like, I paid like 90 bucks, 100 bucks, you know, and it's like. And so it's. Yeah, there, there was this sort of like, cycle where it's like, hey, if you waited long enough, prices would come down like, or you'd get like a new sort of streamlined version. And even when we got the, the PS5 slim, it was like, you know, everybody's kind of waiting for the, the, the like, like they did that for the PS4. Like the PS4 Slim when it came out exactly was like 50 bucks or 100 bucks less. And yeah, and then it's like. But no, you know, what you're gonna get is. And what I will say is like, you know, the, the justification. My, my PS5 was like, that was my 40th birthday present to myself, you know, or whatever. So it was like that was like the big. Like, I was like, okay, you only turn 40 once. Like, we're gonna. But then, you know, a couple years later, it's like, oh, well, switch twos out and there goes another 500. And it's like.
• 1:12:29
  But, yeah, you only turned 42 once.
• 1:12:32
  Yeah, yeah, yeah, you only turned 45 once. You know, it's like.
• 1:12:38
  The.
• 1:12:38
  And the way that I've sort of. I sort of have justified it is like, it's like those years when it comes time for, like, a bigger expenditure, that's like, okay, it's like my birthday slash Christmas present. It's like all the big stuff. Like, I'm just not like, I'm getting this one big thing, and that's gonna be. That's gonna be it. But yeah, it is. It is kind of tough because it's like, it's like you said, even like the switch, you know, it's like you're expecting the switch, like, to. To go down and they're like, oh, no, now they actually cost more than they used to. And that's, again, it's. It's sort of, you know, that the market is kind of like, wild, but at the same time, that's just like, this feels like, counterintuitive. And I, I do think part of it is like, companies just aren't willing to take losses on hardware at all anymore. You know, we. We all know that, like, growing up, like, a lot of these. A lot of the hardware was sold at a loss. You know, I think the biggest one was like, the PS3 was sold at a massive. Like, it was like, actually the. The PS3 was like, the more units they sold, the harder it hit them. And that was at the 599 mark, you know.
• 1:13:57
  Yeah. Oh, yeah.
• 1:13:59
  And so. And. And especially with sort of like. I guess, like, the thing that has always sort of struck me and I kind of. What. I guess where I'm going with this is what. What's weird to me is that there's actually ways for these companies, like, these companies are more profitable than they've ever been. You know, it's like you. You read the financial reports, like, all of them are making more money. Like, Nintendo makes more money money than they have year over year over year. Sony with PlayStation makes more money. Even Xbox. Wow. Xbox struggles. Yeah, but it's like Xbox, you know, had some pretty good years there too. And it. But it's like, especially with like, digital marketplaces and everything else, where you can kind of capture people in this sort of like you. You have these Walled garden economies, right? And it's like, so you can extract even more money. But it's like even there, like the tendency is just like, go bigger, extract more, go bigger, extract more. And it's, I think, like kind of what you, you've been noticing as somebody again, who sort of like just waits and does tend to be a little more judicious, judicial, a little wiser with how you want to sort of like, you know, you know, deploy your money. It's like, dude, like, it's just, it's, it, it almost doesn't make sense the way that it's kind of like it keeps creeping up like, you know, and it, it's on. And too, with, with like studios closing all the time, like it, you can't help but like sort of look at the state of the industry and at the same time say like, you're closing all these studios, you know, you're, you're putting out these games that you want 70 or $80 out the gate at. Right You. And at the same time it's like this doesn't feel sustainable. And so all of this is just sort of like skyrocketing ahead. Meanwhile, there are a lot of people who just are like, you know, who love the industry, who love video games, but are just kind of getting, well, left behind by just the, this rapid growth. And it's like, it's just been one of those things where I don't. I think it's, it's easy to hear from people like me. It's easy to hear from people like Colin Moriarty because, like, we're sort of, we're a vocal minority where it's like, it's just like. But frankly, I think yours is kind of the better path in a lot of ways where it's like, you're just like, you're making sort of like principal decisions or just like I'm. When you know what I'm saying, where it's like, I love this hobby, but it is not necessary. And I want to sort of keep abreast. But it's also a lot harder to justify that at times.
• 1:16:58
  And I also just think is this a large segment of the market that is getting overlooked or maybe forgotten in the conversation where, you know, like, you were mentioning Colin and he'll talk about how this, you know, how gaming has always been a relatively expensive hobby. Hobbies in general are expensive once you, they're luxuries. Really want to dig deep into them. Yeah, they become, they be, you know, they become pricey. But video games, you Know, being the thing that I know. Well, that can be an expensive hobby if you're trying to stay on the cutting edge. Like you're saying you can talk about spending a hundred dollars for Fantasy Final Fantasy 3 all he wants. But the thing is, a year or two later, Final Fantasy 3 was probably $20. She had Funko land somewhere, you know what I mean? And then everyone else had the chance to experience this game that everyone's been talking about for the last year. So. And it's funny how, you know, that same thing still happens with games. Games will be discounted, you know, and they'll go on sale. But consoles were just not, you know, are not having that. I mean, and it just, it could be very much an adjustment to where the, where the industry has going, has, has been going over the past few years and maybe it was stagnating like you said, and now it's just adjusting to where the new level will be and people will figure it out. But I think to say, hey, you know, games are expensive. You just gotta, you gotta get on board. That's just, that's just what it is. Well, it's fine. Except, you know, not everybody goes to the movies on opening night and watches a million movies. Plenty of people are happy waiting till you could rent them, you know, at Blockbuster or now on streaming services or how many people didn't even do that and just waited years until it was the movie of the week on, you know, ABC or something, and that's when they finally saw the movie. I mean, there's always been tears of, of, you know, in, in the demographic. There's always been different tiers of, of interest and tiers of affordability. And I would hate to see video games approach this, this area where only, only people who are, either have plenty of money or are willing to save and scrounge for a long time are able to get in the door or. Now we're looking at these handhelds that people are talking about and these things are upwards of a thousand dollars and they're talking about the next generation consoles and how they might be. I mean, some, some reports are saying, oh, they might, it might be a little scaled back. Other reports saying it could be more expensive than what we've experienced in, in the past. And I'm just like, I don't really know what it is I'm supposed to look forward to. If like at this point I'm still playing on mostly a PlayStation gamer, so I have a laptop, but it's very modest, so it plays like little Indie games or whatever. But yeah, I'm still on PS4 and there's, don't get me wrong, there's plenty to play. I will, I can probably go another 5 years, 10 years experiencing all I've wanted to experience in this game out there. But you know, a lot of the, A lot of the big first party stuff is, is, is kind of passing me by right now and I don't know when they're gonna afford me the opportunity to jump in without, you know, without handing over a paycheck to them. This is what it takes for me to get in, you know.
• 1:21:02
  Yeah, yeah. Well, it's interesting too to see that from the different, you know, kind of the big three and stuff like that, because I completely agree with you that it's ridiculous that the Switch, you know, costs more nowadays than it did when it first was released. I'd say, at least in Nintendo, like I think what they're doing makes business sense because they have this other skew of the light the Switch Lite that if you really want to play Switch games, you can get in that way. So it does have another tier. And, and frankly I think them increasing the price of the Switch, no matter what they've said, why, you know, tariffs, whatever, it's a little harder to get parts which. No, it's not like I don't believe that.
• 1:21:44
  I think they're trying to get these incredibly old outdated parts that we've sold.
• 1:21:49
  Millions and millions and millions of right now.
• 1:21:52
  Not to mention I think they probably have millions of units stateside currently waiting to be sold. Yeah.
• 1:21:59
  So I think business wise they're just trying to push you to Switch to is what that's really all about. And so it seems to me. So why do say Sony or Microsoft, why don't they discount their consoles? And that's an interesting question I hadn't thought about before because in the past I would think that it would be a reaction to market conditions that when the, when their, their sales numbers start cooling off, then you lower the price to get more out there. You know, supply, basic supply and demand of people are going to buy it more. You know, the Super Nintend version, you know, was 99 bucks and it came with a game and I want to say an extra controller, I don't know, but it was cheaper because it was kind of the tail end of the Super Nintendo life cycle because they wanted to, you know, get people in that way. And so it makes sense, that makes sense to me why you would gradually lower the price of these consoles. Is because you want it to keep selling. I'm not sure that right now that that's a necessity. I don't know as far as PS5 sales numbers, I don't keep up with that. I can't imagine that Xbox series is doing very well. So I don't know why those aren't discounted further with Nintendo, I don't think they really have an incentive to lower the price because they're still, I mean Switch was always a hot seller and Even now Switch 2 is selling really well overall. So I don't foresee any like lowering of prices. I don't see that being necessary. You know, maybe a switch to light, you know, a couple of years down the road, but I don't know. That seems to work, to have worked for them. I'm not sure. But, but it is interesting to think about why was it done in the past and why haven't they continued? Because it seems, it seems to me like you would sell more consoles if you gradually lowered the price. But maybe I'm also just more in that demographic that's more price sensitive now.
• 1:24:03
  I, I think though too sort of what you're, you're, you, you. I think you kind of hit it without saying it is that the market, used to be the market gaming was not like gaming now makes more, as a, as a market makes more money than film, television and music combined.
• 1:24:25
  Right.
• 1:24:26
  This is like we, we, we've seen the stats. It probably also spends a lot more in some of those markets. But I think also like, the fact is like, you know, the Switch and the Switch 2 are still selling like hotcakes. The PS5s are still rolling off the shelves at a decent clip. There's not enough of a downturn in the market to where they feel the need because like, yeah, there is sort of like this sort of incentive. It's like, hey, maybe we've kind of hit like everybody we can at this point in time and we're really starting to see like sales trickle. I do think like the economic, like inflation doesn't help. You know, it's like they don't want to sell these units at a loss, period. I do think they run tight margins on all that. But I do think it's, it's basically that there's still enough demand that they can justify the price. Like. And you know, that kind of sucks because it's like, you know, the reality is like, you know, it's like, will the PS, like, will the PS5 get a price reduction when the PS6 comes out probably not, you know, or if it does, it'll, you know. And again, because like that's, that's the other part of it. Like one of the justifications has always been like hey, like the, the technology has been fairly streamlined at this point. Like we can actually make these things cheaper and just as effectively. And so like again, we sort of drop the, the price point on that to make, you know, to, to make entry a little more affordable. But I would just sort of say, I think the biggest problem is that the supply is consistent enough that they don't feel like there's any upside to that. You know. I would also sort of say, I think one of the things in this kind of is that a lot of these consoles, especially the last generation or two have been iterative in the sense that like Xbox has, has backwards compatibility all the way back to the original Xbox to 360 to 1, to the series. Like now granted, it's not perfect. I don't think all Xbox game, you know, OG Xbox games work with the series. But like you have that and then the PS4 and PS5, like the PS5 is backwards compatible and can play PS4 games. Right? The Switch 2 and the Switch. I think that some of it is like the mitigate. Like that is like it is a bigger jump to get on board. But they're kind of justifying that and saying that well like all your old stuff comes forward too. And so it's like that, kind of like that. Again, that's, that's sort of like one more thing where like they, they don't necessarily feel like they have to incentivize it because they're like you're, you know, even sort of the way that in a lot of ways like PS5. Yes. I think we're, we're. See there is some stuff that isn't playable on PS4 but like a lot of the first party titles up until recently were available on PS4. Horizon 0, Forbidden west, you know, God of War, Ragnarok, those things again, they were playable and you know, some people like me were like, they're. These games are actually being held back because they are only, you know, they are cross generational, you know.
• 1:28:15
  Sure.
• 1:28:16
  But yeah, so it's just, it's kind of one of those things where it's like, it is kind of like this. There, there is kind of a. I think the biggest thing though is like the question is like why aren't they sort of doing it is like because they don't have to in the sense that like these, these things are still moving enough numbers that it's not, it's not a concern to where they, they need to feel like they, they need more people, you know. Sure.
• 1:28:45
  Yeah. I do think that's probably your, your strongest point, your strongest argument for why, why the prices could say would stay consistent is, is by you saying that everything that you had on PS4 you have. When you jump to PS5, you know, the way these digital libraries stay with you. I think that is true. I mean in the past you'd be starting fresh or now you're not. You very much have everything you had before plus all the new things you were able to purchase. So I, that's probably, I think a really good argument for why these things are worth more and don't necessarily lose as much value maybe as far as how much they're selling and the rate at which they're selling. I mean I know that PS5, like if you listen to like the circana data every month Whatever, the PS5s are selling at a slower rate than PS4s were and they're only trailing by a little bit. But PS4 went down in price and PS5 hasn't yet. So yeah, it can't only be that, it can't only just be. Well, PS5 is still selling plenty because PS4 was selling even better. And then, and then. But again the Pro and the Slim and everything and they, and, and they cut the price for that. But so there's probably multiple factors.
• 1:30:14
  The, the economy's looking at the PS4 Pro though, or the PS4, the economy was in a much better shape like period. But also the tech stream was a lot more refined. And so again it was, you sort of have that like the economy was pretty stable, but then you have, it's like, hey, we can just make these things cheaper. And so it's like. And we kind of got used to the mid life cycle console refresh. And I think that it was like that happened a couple times notably like PS2, PS3 and PS4 all did that like a PS1 did too technically. Especially in PlayStation camps where it's like, hey, here's the new shiny version. It's a little cheaper, it's just as good, maybe even a little bit better. Have fun. And I think this time, you know, the fact that the global economy is just borked, um, you know, it doesn't help anything. But I do think that it's, we're still sort of in a lot of ways at the front end of this tech where it's like yes, they are making like the silicon a lot thinner there are a lot cheaper. But like, yeah, I don't know. It's. Yeah, I don't want to get into the economics of it. I, what I would say is I just think it sucks. Like you know that like I, I.
• 1:31:36
  Love.
• 1:31:38
  My PS5 but like, you know, I was also pretty happy with my PS4. But it's like, it is just, it is kind of unfortunate that we haven't sort of hit that, that midlife refresh rate or that midlife mid cycle refresh where it's like, oh hey, like okay, it's time to like maybe start. Like for the people who were like the, the later adopters or the slower cells, like it's time to sort of bring them on board. Board. And then you know, maybe that's sort of a bit of a signal for people who are gearing up for the next iteration. I mean that's even a lot of the talk where like, you know, there are rumors that the PS5 is, is going to be coming out soon or the PS6 is going to be announced soon. And I'm, I mean I'm excited about it. Especially kind of hearing some of the, having heard some of the things I've heard is that they're actually looking at making this one a lot more, more affordable than the PS5 which would actually kind of follow suit. Like PS2 is fairly affordable, PS3 fairly expensive. So they sort of again they sort of flip the script. PS4's a lot more approachable, a lot more user friendly or dev friendly and a lot more affordable. PS5, it's more of a bigger jump in tech, it's a little pricier, it's a little more whatever, boutique. Oh dude, the PS5. Well, so the PS3 was the cell structure architecture, PS5, it was the hard drive format that, the ultra fast SSD stuff that they, and they basically rewrote that Mark Cerny and those guys like it's an engineer. It was at the time it was an engineering feat. It was, you know, it was kind of like the reason to. But so I'm hopeful. Was it the guy from. Is it broken silicon or.
• 1:33:38
  Yeah, Moore's Law or Moore's Law dead or whatever.
• 1:33:43
  Yeah, Moore's Law is dead. He, he, he really does think that the next PlayStation is going to be a lot more affordable than the PS5. Just economies of scale and everything else, but who knows. But yeah, so I mean even sort of looking at that though and sort of, I Did want to just does that in thinking about that though, it's like saying, okay, like, hey, I guess the thing is like, I know that like the price point is, is painful, but that the, the consideration does. The consideration that like, hey, like my library is going to move forward. Like, does that help mitigate some of like the sting like when you, when you're thinking about it and you're like, yeah, like you're like, I suppose I'm.
• 1:34:39
  I, I guess so. It's. It was already a known quantity. It wasn't like it was a surprise to learn that.
• 1:34:47
  So.
• 1:34:49
  I guess.
• 1:34:52
  Well, yeah, I think.
• 1:34:54
  Go ahead. I've got a question. But it kind of, it kind of takes it in a different direction. So if Nate, you had something else you wanted to know. So we've talked about the console space and the price of consoles. How it hasn't gone down, how it's only gone up and stayed up and in some cases even risen for the same console, which is crazy. But in terms of games, games have gotten more expensive, by and large. Maybe not all of them, but by and large. And I think also we're coming upon this, that we've been talking about for two decades now, this digital future where a lot more games have different forms of digital only, whether that's key cards or whatever, whatever you want to. All that stuff that's happening in games, does any of that. Cause you give you pause when you're thinking about even just future purchases. Because you, you are, you're in an interesting position that Nate had mentioned earlier that you're really knowledgeable about games, but not even just about games themselves. Like a bunch of retro nerds are like, I'm one of those retro nerds. But you keep your ear to the ground with new games. And Nate was talking about this too. Like you're really good at the league and stuff like that. Whereas I don't as much in the here and now in the future speculation, I'm much more looking back. So does looking at the future or even, or even. Let me throw this out. Donkey Kong Bonanza is out for 80 bucks and then within a month it has DLC. You know, does stuff like that give you pause for, I don't know when you might be looking at getting a Switch two in two to three years, you know.
• 1:36:48
  Yeah. Especially with the understanding that most Nintendo first party games are not really going to drop in price at all. And some of them, you know, if you wait too long, they just go up in price because they're hard to find. After a while. Yeah, yeah, yeah. No, absolutely. I mean, when. When games were $50 and you would wait for them to be, you know, as a thrifty shopper, someone who always has a modest budget for games, and if you're waiting for them to be half price or something like that before, before you jump on board, then you're basically waiting for them to be 25. Right, sure. And if the price is 60, then you're. Then the half price becomes 30, the price is 70, half price becomes 35, prices, 80. Basic math.
• 1:37:39
  Right.
• 1:37:39
  So it's like, I mean, we understand that obviously inflation is affecting what the dollar is worth.
• 1:37:48
  Sure, yeah.
• 1:37:49
  But still, when I think what happens is, I think that, I guess there's two ways to think about it. There's the completely logical way to look at dollars and cents and you can sit down and read your economics handbook and learn about why inflation happens and why price go up and why. But then there's also the reality of someone hands you $100 for your birthday and you're like, I know what I can do with this hundred dollars.
• 1:38:25
  Yeah.
• 1:38:25
  And then a few years pass and you can do half as much with that hundred dollars.
• 1:38:30
  Right, right.
• 1:38:31
  And it's just the emotional component for me, and my wife makes fun of me all the time because I've become the old man who's just like, I remember when this was half the price.
• 1:38:40
  You know, Taco Bell, Taco was a dollar. Dang it. Now the cheapest thing you can get is three. What the heck.
• 1:38:47
  Exactly, exactly. And so it's just I feel that emotional weight of like, man, I used to be able to reserve a certain amount of money and know what to expect with that money. And now I feel like I have to reserve so much more just to enjoy the equivalent thing. And so, yeah, games are a component of that. You were talking about digital stuff. Not being able to resell, go to GameStop, trade in games and help save money in that way. Sure. I'm not necessarily opposed to the digital future. I am a little skeptical and hoping that there are enough people out there trying to preserve these titles for many, many years to come that we're not just going to lose out on things. So I'm not super scared of digital games, especially because a lot of times Steam or the PS Store or whatever, it's just gonna. That's where you're gonna find the best deal. So I don't mind jumping on there and just grabbing a game when it's 8.99, it's like oh, I'm getting it now. Cool.
• 1:39:55
  Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 1:39:59
  But yeah, I don't know if there was anything else I wanted to say there, but yeah, those are my thoughts on that.
• 1:40:05
  Cool.
• 1:40:07
  So we've talked about that and you know, and again, I don't want this to just be like a state of the industry, like, you know, but it's what. So we've kind of bemoaned the fact that like, yeah, it just like prices are kind of going up across the board and it just kind of sucks. What do you think? Could be, could the answer be here? Like that is sort of workable for both of them. I mean like, like what, what do you think the fix is? You know what I'm saying? Where it's like, we like obviously like budgets are just out of control with some of these, especially with the AAA games. Like, you know, GTA 6 or whatever's coming out is rumored to have a billion dollar budget which like just even that, that number just is like. And they'll make all that money back and then some. But it's, it, it's just kind of like. Well, you know, but they've probably already made that money back, you know, with like all the, the microtransaction junk. But like what, what do you think the solution is, Alex? Like, you know, or I guess like, sort of like, yeah, something that's a little healthier.
• 1:41:28
  But also if you're, if, if you're, if you're looking for me to solve the problem, I don't, I don't know if I can do that. I mean, I do agree that a lot of these AAA gaming budgets are probably ballooning a little past what will ultimately be sustainable. I think there's a learning curve associated with that. I think. Yeah, you know, if you look at like movie budgets or you know, that they probably, you know, experience a similar thing where the, the movie budget grows because they know that the return is gonna, is gonna be so great. And then all they have to do is experience a few instances where the return isn't what they expected. And what do you know? Now the next, the sequel to that movie becomes the budget's half, you know, and so, you know, I would expect that game companies, because it takes so long to make a game, I mean, I think right there is probably the first thing that we're going to experience is like, I think there has to be a changing of the tide. As far as waiting six or seven years for the next game from a studio. I don't see that being sustainable for very long. I don't know if we'll ever go back to getting games one, two, three years later, but there must be some sort of middle ground there. And maybe it comes through middleware or large language model things or whatever, but I would assume that there's some sort of middle ground there. And if we can stabilize gaming budgets, let's say at 100 million, for whatever the equivalent of 100 million will be a, a decade from now, then we can expect games to come out more regularly. And, you know, who knows? I don't know. I, I would, I would imagine that that would help in, in some way because, yeah, there's not. I mean, you're gonna have the people who want to chase the GTAs of this world and try to make the next one, and then they will fail. But yeah, yeah, you know, there's not too many games where you can just pour endless amounts of money into it and then expect to get it back. And, you know, I don't know. I don't know what you, what you hope to get out of those kinds of games, you know?
• 1:44:00
  Well, I mean, I think what they're hoping to get is like, I, I mean, it's, it's pretty telling that, that the bulk of like, gaming's revenue is generated by like five games. You know, it's. And they're all like perpetually online. And I think everybody's sort of like. It's actually kind of funny because I think Microsoft and Xbox is sort of a microcosm of like, gaming in general. It's in the sense that, like, Xbox, when it was smaller and scrappier, could be like, kind of bold and mouthy and do like, kind of wild things and be really disruptive. Right. You know, like, Game Pass was initially like hyper disruptive, like, and people like old guards like me and, and Micah, we were freaking out and like, this is, this, this can't be good for the industry. You know, it's like this is, this is not good. What. You know, we're, we're kind of like losing our minds and like, this is going to ruin everything. Maybe, maybe that was a bit of an overreaction on our part, but it's like, you know, it's like, it's definitely not sustainable long term. Right? And we would just kind of like beat on that drum and all these other things. But then it is one of those things where Xbox could do that one because they had a massive war chest behind as being a Microsoft company, and so they could just kind of like throw Money at problems. But like when the ABK acquisition happened like all of a sudden like it's like the, the, I call it the eye of Satya was upon them. And like all of a sudden it's like well okay, so you have a quarter where Micro or Xbox Gaming makes more than Windows does. And all of a sudden it's like now, now it's like, I don't know if you guys have been keeping up with the news where it's like, dude, I think Microsoft's intended projections for Xbox Is to generate 30% or to have a 30% profit increase or something like that. And it's like this is, this is in a market where Microsoft is like, or Xbox has been struggling as far as like console presence. Now they are moving more to like this explains like the third party publisher kind of move and every, all that other stuff. But I think basically what happens is like they get a taste of like that big money, right? And so it's like the last of us hits and it moves like 20 million units or something like that, right? It's just like these big hits where all of a sudden it's like instead of a game where you were expecting to make maybe 150, 250 million, you make 5 or 6 or $700 million. You know, you make an obscene amount of money off these things and all of a sudden it's like well we, we need to repeat that and we need to repeat that and we need to repeat that. And I do think like, I do think to just like, like you said Alex, at some point in time like it's going to like we're going to have enough failures where people are going to get like a little more careful. But frankly I think that sort of like having the fact that these companies are publicly traded and they have investors that want immediate returns instead and not just like, like hey, we're making money. And maybe it's not like, maybe it's only like a 2% revenue hike. You know what I'm saying? It's like nobody wants the modest returns. Everybody just wants to like, like run this thing until basically we're going to run this thing until it just, it stops, stops moving. And I think what, what needs it? Like, you know, I think even what you were saying is like we do need more sustainable bottles. We need to have to temper like we need investors to temper their expectations and sort of understand that they're investing, but it's not immediate returns and things like that. I mean, yeah, I. Cause like here's the thing, dude, I want the market to be healthy. And I don't think, I think what you're saying without saying it is that it's not the fact that people like you who do tend to be on the more conservative side and who do sort of be the, the fact that you feel like you're priced out is actually a problem because you are like a, you are a core gamer. Like, you are a die hard. Like you're in it. Like, you know, but it's like, it's kind of okay. It's kind of like the conversation we had before we started recording where it's like, you know, we talk about like the, the pain points in like Silksong and Hollow Knight and like the friction there. It's like the friction has actually, like the friction is, exists between your, your financial obligations and your wallet and you're like, I can't, I can't make, I can't justify those sacrifices. I can't like whether, you know, whatever the reasons are, right. And I, I actually think it's a problem for the industry when people like you are saying like, I can't keep up, like, and not because, like, hey, I can. It's. It's not like, oh, I'm poor and I can't afford it. It's like, I just, I can't justify that. And I think that that boxes a really important demographic out.
• 1:49:38
  Like.
• 1:49:39
  Yeah, and I think you see that a lot of different ways too. I think there's probably a good portion of people who, instead of, you know, buying less often or whatever, they're just going to turn toward games that are like the free to play or towards those kinds of options where they don't have to worry as much about those things. They can pay for a new map or a new skin whenever, whenever they feel like it, but otherwise they're, you know, happy to stay where there is still new things happening. There's still, you know, new communities and new events and new stories happening all the time, but it's just happening at a game that's 10 years old or whatever. So I think that could be what you see other people doing as well, instead of, you know, the, the core gamer demographic who's, who's trying to play first party titles. You know, there are probably plenty of people who are happy to just stay in Fortnite or stay in wherever, you know, and, and say, well, I guess this is where I'm gonna spend my time when I want to explore my gaming fun. You know, that's where they'll be. And I think just to answer what you. What you're talking about with me seeming to be, you know, I still keep my ear on the industry and stuff like that. And I think that's part of how I've expressed answering the lack of opportunity where it's like, if I can't play everything, then at least I want to hear other people tell me about what they're experiencing. I will listen to gaming podcasts, I will follow blogs and sites and review sites and things like this and get my feel that way of the industry. This way I can kind of get a piece of, of the story at least if I can't experience it all myself because, I mean, there are way too many games coming out anyway. There's no way I can play everything. So, I mean, there is a little bit of an obsessive part of me of just wanting to know everything all the time and, you know, just never being satiated in that way. But I think a lot of it is that, well, I'm not playing the PS5 games, but I can listen to a PlayStation podcast and talk. They'll talk about what's going on and at least I can be part of the, you know, the gaming culture in that way.
• 1:52:19
  Yeah, yeah, that's cool. I think that's a great place to kind of wind down. Is instead of just the, you know, what's. What's your diagnosis for the gaming landscape in general for you personally, what does that look like? As you know, the consoles have gotten expensive and stayed there. Games have gotten more expensive, by and large. And it's kind of in this weird place of there's no standard price, which is fine. Which is fine. But by and large more expensive. Has it simply in terms of you like how you've reacted to this, obviously one is like you haven't bought.
• 1:53:01
  Bought.
• 1:53:02
  That's not a word. You haven't bought like current gen consoles because of the price. Okay. And in terms of the games that you are buying, because you mentioned you're playing Silksong, so does it just look like you're still continuing to look for those deals? They're just fewer and farther between or they're older games or you're going for more indie games. Like, what does it look like for you right now and today and for the, you know, I'd say next few months or even as you plan out 2026, you know, what does that look like for you?
• 1:53:34
  Yeah, for me it's exactly that. It's me. There are fortunately still some games that come out for PS4 or for the Switch one right now there's still some that will come out. I mean a lot of them right now are smaller titles, so that's fine. But like, like you mentioned Silksong, that's a nice opportunity to be part of something that's huge, but that I can still be a part of. So, yeah, I mean, that's pretty much where I'm at is if there's a game coming out that I can play that's new, great, still probably will wait for it to be on sale or something like that. And otherwise, yeah, I, I go back and I, I look at some games that I haven't had a chance to finish yet. I go back and, and look at people's, you know, favorite games of all time and say, well, I've never actually played that. Let me go find that somewhere, you know, because it's got to be cheap by now and then. And you could fill up that gaming backlog. You know, it's kind of the opposite of what you guys are hoping for. We just submit, you know, be down the backlog. I'm kind of building mine by experiencing at least other, other things, but I'm experiencing them at a much, much cheaper cost. I'm not buying them when they're new, so.
• 1:54:59
  Yeah, yeah, yeah. I mean, I, I think it's actually conducive to what we're doing here in terms of just like trying to play the games that you already own is. That's another factor which when it comes to, you know, determining if you're. Are you going to spend $80 on a game and then $30 on DLC a month later? I don't know if that's the actual price, but that's what it feels like sometimes is okay. Do I have something similar like that in my backlog? Am I. Only if I'm honest. Am I really just excited about this because it's new and it's shiny? You know what I mean? So I know for me that's helped hold off on some purchases as well, even as things get more popular or like I mentioned earlier, we have a cool library so I can check out games there, which is, which is helpful.
• 1:55:48
  Yeah, that's awesome.
• 1:55:49
  Taste of some of the newer stuff and I'm just surprised that they have newer stuff, but I know it helps me kind of temper that. And again, as I mentioned, like looking forward to 2026. Yeah, there are a couple games that I'm looking forward to that I might pick up early at. Not such A high discount, you know, or even I can't think of any that I'm like, oh, I have to buy this Day one off the top of my head. But budgeting for, you know, two new games in the year, and then most of the other ones are going to be, you know, when I see, when I see Live Alive on sale for 20 bucks. Okay, I'll pick that up, you know, kind of a thing. So I think it actually works in tandem really well. Just don't go too far. Where I was at for years of like, oh, everything's $10, so let me buy 80 of them, you know, and now that is, that is the trap.
• 1:56:46
  That is the trap. You always have $10 in your pocket. You know what I mean? So.
• 1:56:50
  Right. Yeah.
• 1:56:52
  Just keep slapping that down every. Every three days.
• 1:56:56
  Yeah.
• 1:56:56
  Then you spend the whole price of a new console.
• 1:57:00
  Yeah. I mean, for sure, there's, there's if, If I was patient enough and literally was just putting some money aside that I could use the buying that was on sale, I technically could afford to get a PS5 by now. It's not, it's not like I can't. It's just it, like I was mentioning before that, that emotional component of actually having to.
• 1:57:23
  Yes.
• 1:57:24
  You know, pay that much money one time. 500. Much easier to say, like, what's on.
• 1:57:29
  Sale for a car payment. Yeah, it's, it's, it's tough.
• 1:57:37
  Yeah.
• 1:57:38
  Yeah.
• 1:57:38
  Well, Nate, how about you? Do you have any, any thoughts on how this kind of change. How does the, the rising cost of games, how does that affect you?
• 1:57:46
  Well, I mean, it, it's sort of like I've kind of. I think next year it's just going to be. I'm actually kind of going to be doing a bit of a detox because it's, it's one of those things where, I mean, we, we say it all the time. It's like. But we've. I mean, Alex, you even said it's like there's so many games to play. Like, I have a backlog of hundreds of games and it's like I, and I just, like, I just came off. I've come off a. Like. And it's, it's hard because every, it is really one of those things where every year that we're playing, it to me, just feels like this is possibly one of the best years in gaming. Like, it's just like. It's kind of like the opposite of the Office Space Pro problem where he's like, every time you see me, it's the worst day of my life. It's like every year that we're playing games, man, it actually just does feel like it just kind of always gets better. Like there's more stuff coming out. There's like. And, and I, I do tend to sort of be like a bit of a varied gamer. Like, I kind of like to be all over the place, you know, I, I like to have a foot in a bunch of different genres and like, I like the big sizzle, I like the big flashy, crazy experiences. I love AAA stuff. But I also like small, really heartfelt indie stuff. I mean like, I was talking about like I just played Sword of the Sea and that's like a pretty low key game. And no, it was like bigger in this the sense that it did get a lot of like buzz and it was on PS plus Extra or whatever and it was on game. I think it's on game pass as well. But it's like. So I love that. But I also like freaking Spider man. And you know what I'm saying? Like, it's like I'm all over the place and I think for me there's just been a challenge and even one of the reasons I wanted to talk to you specifically, Alex, is that you've made a very conscientious choice. This conscientious. I get a little bit of mushmouth. But you've made like a decision and kind of a principle stand. And yes, you sort of say like the, just like the emotional sort of like feedback. You're like, I just can't. But I think like there's, I think there's wisdom in that and just being like, you know, like even just sort of like saying like, I don't need it. And so like, this is kind of like the thing is like I'm, I'm. I am a hype beast. Like, I'm. I'm kind of like, I want the new and the shiny, like, and I like to be a part of the conversation and. But I do think like it's, I've got like a bajillion things to play, like and it's, it's okay to like step back. And I think too, like, honestly, it's kind of like you have to be the change that you, you want to see. I think frankly, like, the industry needs a little bit of like a reality check and if I'm one less dude who's like throwing, you know, you know, a bunch of money and, and honestly, over the years, like my spending has gotten significantly better. Like I think like when I first got the PS4, man, I was constantly in that store or I was constantly buying games, like, constantly adding to the pile. Even like my PS3, like, when I got my PS3, you know, it's like that digital storefront. I was like, constantly just like, oh, it's, it's like the, oh, it's on sale. It's on sale. I'm gonna buy this for $10 and I'm gonna buy that for $10 and I'm gonna Buy that for $20. I'm gonna buy this for 30, you know, and it's like the next thing you know, it's like, wow, I could have just bought a brand new console. And so I, I have gotten better. But it's like, it is really just, it's kind of like, it's kind of like Marvel Snap. Okay, in the sense that one of the things that that game does, and I think one of the things that gaming does is it kind of like there's always something new, there's always something more. And you, you do kind of get in this like, treadmill where it's like, I've got to keep up, I've got to keep up. And the reality is you can't. And I'd much rather sort of just be like, sort of like a, sort of a peaceful, sort of contented abandonment of, of the rat, the, the, the hamster wheel where it's just like, no, I'm, I'm gonna, so like I said, I think next, next year I'm really gonna try to just do a pretty significant detox. I'm, I'm actually gonna try to not buy anything and just prioritize playing what I already have. And like, well, I mean, we'll see. And maybe I'll, I'll adjust it, but I, I do kind of like think that it's like it's okay to take a step back and breathe because it's just. Yeah. Yeah. So that's, that's kind of like, like I said, one of the reasons I want to have Alex on was because, like, I do admire that position. I just, I, I don't do it.
• 2:02:52
  I mean, I, I, I even credit you guys. You know, listening to you guys talking about, talking about stewardship, stewarding your time, your finances, you know, having priorities in place, you know, always family first and responsibilities. Taking these things out of, way out of the way before, you know, enjoying that recreation time, that's helped me. You know, you've, you've reminded me at times to be like, hey, am I prioritizing myself in the right way? Am I putting too much emphasis on this hobby or. And I should be. You know, I mean, there's plenty of things we can do with money.
• 2:03:29
  You know what I mean? Yeah.
• 2:03:30
  And is it more. Is it more valuable for me to take a little bit of money that I have and. And use it towards something in the home or something, you know, my family or maybe something my wife is looking to have? I can bless her with that instead of saying, well, what can I get for it? You know? So I do appreciate your. You guys and the podcast that you guys have and how you've talked about these things. That always reinforces those concepts for me too. So it goes both ways, you know?
• 2:04:00
  Yeah.
• 2:04:01
  All shucks.
• 2:04:02
  Oh, shocks. You're gonna make me blush, man. You already made Josh blush. But no, I just. I've been really grateful for this conversation and just sort of like. And like I said, it is. I think. I think the biggest thing for me is like. Like, I am a hypebeast. And so I do, like, I get excited about the new and shiny and yeah, you know, it's. It is pretty easy, I think, when we're talking about the industry to sort of like, fall into, like, oh, here's just the math of it. It, you know, and this is just the. The practical realities. But like I said, it's like, even sort of. Yeah. I mean, during this conversation, but even before this conversation, it was just like, kind of like, oh, yeah, like there are people who are just kind of getting left behind by the cycle and, you know, and again, just like, because it's just. It's. It's moving too quickly and it's. It's. It's not. It's not growing responsibly or reasonably. I. I don't know. But anyways, and I'm just like, it. That's a good check for me. Because there is that kind of like, when you're on this side of, like, that. That kind of cycle, it's like you kind of expect everybody and think everybody else should be doing that. You know what I'm saying? And you need that. The almost like that reality check. Well, like, hey, that's actually like you've kind of got the. The cart before the horse here, friend. You know, So I just. I appreciate again, that. That voice, that sort of like, that. That kind of like, hey, like, and you. And you do it very graciously, but, you know, just like when. When we've. We've talked about this in the different. Like in the league chat or in our discord or whatever, you know, when we're talking about, like, gaming and stuff. It. Like I said, it's very easy for me to just go, like, hype beast mode, you know, where I'm just like, yeah, more faster, better go. You know, and then it's like. And then I see my homie sort of saying, like, man, like, I can't keep up. It's like, oh, oh. Like, this is. This is too much, man. And I'm like, oh, yeah, yeah, it probably is, you know, and so. Yeah, yeah.
• 2:06:32
  So that's.
• 2:06:33
  Does that answer your question, Josh?
• 2:06:36
  It does, it does. Okay, I. I appreciate that perspective as well, but, yeah, I. I think that's a good place to. I'm trying to think of a different metaphor. I feel like we always say laying the.
• 2:06:48
  Say laying the plane, baby.
• 2:06:49
  Yeah, yeah, that's a good. That's a good tarmac we've rolled out here. But before we get going, we do have a few forms that we like to. That we like to observe. There you go. The first, which is just a shout out. So, I mean, as we've said before, but Alex, thank you so much for joining us for this conversation. I'm glad that we finally were able to have you on because I don't know. I don't know how much of it we've done recorded in front of a microphone, but we have said multiple times, just Nate and I, that we wanted to have you on for different things because as he said, you're always so. So gracious in the way that you interact with everyone in our. In our little community and the other ones that we're a part of. And so it's always been so much fun. So thank you for taking the time. Thank you for being here and thanks for. For. For sharing your perspective with us because it is a good, Good little gut check as well. But it's just been fun, dude.
• 2:07:52
  Absolutely.
• 2:07:53
  It was a great excuse to have you on, man.
• 2:07:55
  Yeah.
• 2:07:55
  Like.
• 2:07:56
  Yeah.
• 2:07:56
  So.
• 2:07:58
  I. I'm not exactly the kind of person who. Who thinks they have a lot to say. I don't. I don't know if I have a lot to say. So it's like this was a topic because it was so personal that I. Yeah, I mean, I can talk about it for sure. I'm not sure how much I have to say, but I'm. It was less intimidating, I would say, than maybe something else. So I was happy to be able to answer the call this time around, dude.
• 2:08:22
  And. And, yeah, It's. I think I even made sort of like. It was like, it's, you know, with you. I, you know, I, I just, I was anticipating quality over quantity. And I think, I think you provided both here. We've gotten both. Don't.
• 2:08:37
  Yes.
• 2:08:38
  Don't sell yourself short, friend.
• 2:08:41
  Okay.
• 2:08:43
  That's awesome. Well, speaking of participation and continuing with quantity, do you have any shout outs that you would like to give Alex before we give ours? Me.
• 2:08:56
  Oh, I'll shout you guys out again. This podcast is fun. It's a lot of fun to listen to you. It's a little weird, I'm sure, for other people to be caught up on what's going on in your lives when you're not really actually a part of my life. But, you know, I do get to listen to you guys chit chat and have a friendship and I'm. If I can be even a tiny piece of that, I'm happy to be a part of that. You know, growing up there wasn't. I don't know about you guys. When I was growing up, there wasn't a lot of people who played video games who were interested in the things I was interested in. It was pretty much a. Either like football and basketball or you can go home. I was like, okay, I guess I like that too, and I like sports, but it's cool. As we got older and the Internet became a thing and we can find communities of people who like these specific things that we like.
• 2:09:58
  It's.
• 2:09:59
  And it's awesome to be a part of that. And the way that you guys have starred and started and fostered a community here, it's really great. So shout out to you guys.
• 2:10:09
  Thanks, man.
• 2:10:10
  Well, thank you.
• 2:10:11
  And thank you for being a part of that, you know, like. Sure, yeah, man. Dude, yeah. Yeah.
• 2:10:21
  Love it. Love being bros. It's. It's good times. Let's see. I mean, I guess I'll. I'll share my shout out and then Nate, you can go. I wanted to shout out Techno funk boy. With my, with my, you know, recent travels and things like that, I have been even less present in our communities lately. But one thing that Techno Funkboi had shared was a video. And it might have been in more of like a private chat, but I know, Nate, you were there also, but he shared a video. This is music related of is an interview of this guy. What's his first name? Chris, right? Yeah, Chris. Chris Thiele. I think his name, Thiele, I think is pronounced Thiele, but he's the mandolin singer. In Nickel Creek and in Punch Brothers. And it is a crazy interview because he is very energetic and he's like bouncing off the walls, but he is also an insane, insanely talented musician. So it was fun to watch through that. I was watching actually just earlier today because I was like, oh, yeah, that's right, you shared that. And I hadn't gotten back to that.
• 2:11:29
  So anyway, I didn't watch the video because I can't say the dude's name.
• 2:11:33
  Well, I mean, yeah, it's not. It's not a common last name, but that one's a lot of fun. If you are a music nerd and enjoy like some deep musicianship from and. And are not put off by very eccentric people, then I would encourage you to check it out. Anyways, Techno funk boy, thank you for sharing that. It's a lot of fun.
• 2:11:59
  Yeah, I had some shout outs, but I actually, I was sort of thinking about it and I'm gonna just like, sort of do a little bit of a pivot and I'm gonna shout out our patrons. You know, Alex, you, of course, you're one of them. But I just, I did want to shout out, like, our community, we don't do patron appreciation that often, but I did just kind of want to go down the list and just sort of offer a hailing hearty thank you for. Yeah, hanging out and paying us and all that other stuff. Like. And I definitely like you more when you give me money. But let's just kick it off starting out here. We got Micah Gear Solid. We've got Wesley Ray, the Hench and dad himself. Paul Lytle, the techno funk boy, the Trash Turkey Dorian. All your basement are belong to us. Aaron Cal, the caveman lawyer. Mark Kozlowski. You know, not Quick Mark Mark, but the other Mark. We've got Alex Castellanos, the Big Chill himself. We've got Porcho the Wonder from Down Under. We've got Nate Foote, the Imposter Nate, also known as Spike. We've got Quick Mark from Mark Erickson. We've got Sojourner. We've got push broom 101. That's my buddy John. We've got the Boulder, the boldest of the Boulder Boulders, which, that name I. It made me laugh back in the. The first time I heard it back in the TRG days and I just. Yeah, I love it. We got Gracious Josh. We've got my buddy Reed Butterfield. And we. We actually have a. A new patron as well. Bergen, the Reasonable Canadian has joined our ranks. And I'M starting to rethink my position. I'm not sure that he's that reasonable.
• 2:14:02
  Arrogant fellow. Trails fan too, dude. Legend of Heroes fan. So shout out.
• 2:14:10
  Yeah, I'm. I'm a little scared that at some point in time he's gonna put forth like the Trails games and that. Like, like, maybe that'll be mine.
• 2:14:23
  That's true.
• 2:14:24
  You and a couple others would just be like, remake that came out. Yeah, it's time, you know, at which point in time, yeah, like, I need. I need more RPGs. Like, I need holes in my head, but I do, I do want to play them. It's like, you know, it's like. I know it's like the world building and everything else, but it's just like, like that time, that capital, that, that, that, that time investment just has me like shrieking. It's like I have to play 15 games in order to understand what's going on. I'm gonna die. But. But yeah, I just wanted to shout out our patrons, you know, and Alex, you know, thanks. Thanks for giving us money, guys. Thanks for believing, you know, but on a less cynical, unless smarmy way, thank you for supporting us in this endeavor. Thank you for partnering with us in this endeavor. Like, that's cool. That means a lot more than I think we say sometimes. Yeah, we'd still be doing this without you guys paying us, but we probably wouldn't be doing it as well or.
• 2:15:38
  Yeah, yeah, I agree. I agree. So that's cool. We've got three people here on the episode. We've got all the patrons there. And then whoever is listening and is there someone else? Oh, yeah. Except this challenger, like, awkward transitions. I feel like when you lose In Street Fighter 2, the character portrait that just lost, I feel. Exactly, yes. Alex knows what I'm talking about. I just feel like I've got two black eyes and swollen side of my face because my challenge from last month was to finish a co op game with my son. And that did not happen. In fact, I can't remember a time at all in the past month that I played co op with with him. And I want to say that that was mainly due to the fact that we've had sickness kind of bouncing around the house. So our schedules have been all over the place with all kinds of different things. So as much as I am loathe to carry on a challenge to the next month, I'm going to give myself a pass on this just because of how odd this past month is. But I really would like to within the next month, play some more co op with him. So that's my challenge for the next month is, is because I failed so horribly this past month, I'd like to set that up for next month to play some halo with him. That's what I got. Nate, what are you challenging yourself with?
• 2:17:18
  So, I mean, I've already talked about that, like hitting negative 10 before I buy anything else. But I have been getting back into. I've been swinging my kettlebell around a little bit.
• 2:17:29
  Nice.
• 2:17:31
  Been doing 50. Like, I, I have a. I posted it in our discord in the. The Gut Busters channel. But there's a, it's a pretty. It's like just basically kettlebell fundamentals kind of like routine. It basically is a high intensity interval training sort of session. I've been doing it at £15, and I'm going to sort of. As I really sort of gain proficiency, I'm gonna keep adding a little bit more weight. And eventually what I'd like to do is do those three rotations at £40. And at that point in time, what I'm probably gonna do is like, probably take a couple, like a week or two to deload and then move into more, like, more advanced sort of kettlebell routines. But, yeah, intense. I like it. And I'll tell you what, like, you'd be like, oh, it's, it's 15 pounds. Like, it's not that bad. And then you, you do one full rotation and then you do two full rotations, and by the time you get to the third one, I'm like, I'm dying. I'm dying. Like, my, my legs hurt, my shoulders hurt, my stomach hurts, everything hurts. And I'm dying. And it's, but it's, it's been, it's been good to sort of like get to move, like, just moving around again. So it's like I do want to keep up and like I said, it's just going to be like just, you know, sort of gaining mastery and adding, adding more weight. So that's. Like I said, it's the sort of moving forward, it's. Stick with the routine until I can do three full rotations consistently at £40.
• 2:19:22
  Nice.
• 2:19:23
  So nice.
• 2:19:25
  Awesome. Man.
• 2:19:26
  That point in time, I'll be super ripped. So it's gonna be a while.
• 2:19:30
  Yeah, well, no, you're gonna have it done by next month.
• 2:19:33
  So.
• 2:19:37
  Yeah, good luck with that.
• 2:19:41
  Oh, boy.
• 2:19:43
  But it's time, you know, we've, we've done the things, we've had the conversation. And again, thank you for your time. Alex, thanks for hopping on with us, for chilling and for being just an absolute gem of a human being.
• 2:19:59
  It was.
• 2:19:59
  It's a pleasure. But it's time. It's time to call, boys. It's time to call a night. It's very late. It's time. So that being said, Josh, we've done the things.
• 2:20:10
  Yep.
• 2:20:10
  Until next time. What should they do?
• 2:20:12
  Guys, hold on.
• 2:20:14
  If they want to find us, that's true.
• 2:20:17
  Yeah.
• 2:20:17
  Where can they find us?
• 2:20:18
  Sorry, we were about to leave you guys behind, but if you guys have stuff to say on, you know, state of the industry or the cost of gaming or. Or where you're at in your gaming. I don't know. I hate using the term, but I'm gonna say it anyway. Your gaming journey in your collection and all that stuff. If there's stuff that you were just showing, shouting out, like, why aren't you guys talking about this? Let us know. There's tons of places you can reach out to us on the Internet, but all those places you can find at our linktree, which is linktree.com thebacklogbreakdown reach out. We'd love to hear from you.
• 2:20:53
  You know, I just, you know, I. I was just thinking. And then, well, I'll actually land the plane. But I was thinking, like, how I like to, like, throw shade at Paul because it's funny and it makes me laugh. Paul, though, you have a. You have company now. Because I just mentioned, like, Bergen and how I'm not so sure he's a reasonable Canadian anymore. It's like, might have competition for saying things I don't like now. Paul. So anyway, I don't know why I felt the need to go back there.
• 2:21:23
  And after shouting out the patrons.
• 2:21:27
  Yeah. Backhanded compliments. It's like, thanks, thanks, but. But yes, we have done the things. I've insulted some of our patrons. I think it's time to call it a night. So until next time. Josh, what should they do?
• 2:21:43
  Guys, Keep beating down your backlogs and we'll keep breaking down the benefits. Sam.