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UnchainedTV: South Korea Bans Dog Meat! · UNCHAINEDTV'S Truth Files with Jane Velez-Mitchell

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are so excited.
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Breaking news Unchained TV is speaking live with
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the animal rights leaders who helped achieve an
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historic breakthrough for animals and animal rights.
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South Korea has now voted to ban the
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dog meat trade.
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There were tears of joy outside the South
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Korean parliament after this groundbreaking vote was taken.
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Last chance for animals and its sister organisation,
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Animal Liberation Wave, led the charge to end
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this brutal dog meat industry.
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And last chance for animals, President Chris DeRose
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and Animal Liberation Wave President Jian Li, who
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is joining us live from South Korea, are
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here to talk about what this means for
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dogs everywhere and animals everywhere.
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We're also joined by Sheena Gao, who rescued
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so-called meat dogs from China.
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So what does this mean for the dogs
0:56
in China?
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Will this ban on dog meat spread to
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the rest of the world?
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We hope so.
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But let's find out.
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So excited to have my heroes.
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Let's start with Chris DeRose, founder and president
1:10
of Last Chance for Animals.
1:13
What an historic breakthrough.
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Put it in perspective.
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How big is this, Chris?
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This is international.
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This is huge.
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It's the biggest thing that I know of
1:23
in my 45 years in the movement that
1:25
took place that is this big in magnitude
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with the government of one very productive country
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working in cooperation with NGOs.
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This is the first time I've seen this
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ever happen.
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And it's really, really exciting.
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As you can see, the video there and
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the picture says it all.
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It just says how excited the activists were.
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Some were in shock.
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Some were so ecstatic that they just couldn't
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hold themselves back.
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And you can see, I mean, you can
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see here the prime minister with the blue
2:02
scarf.
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And she's she was a minister of parliament.
2:10
And she's the one who introduced the bill
2:13
initially and has stuck with it all this
2:15
time.
2:16
And then this is Jian Li.
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Jian Li is head of the animal liberation
2:21
wave, which is a sister organisation to LCA.
2:25
And basically, she was the frontline soldier and
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doing all this, and also the frontline thinker
2:33
and creator of different events, different campaigns that
2:37
we could go after to bring attention to
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this issue.
2:40
It was one we had to keep it
2:41
in front of them nonstop to let them
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know that this is just not a bunch
2:45
of people out here demonstrating.
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And then they're going to go away.
2:48
We're okay for another year.
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You know, no, that's what's been happening.
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So what we did is we set up
2:54
a plan to have many demonstrations, many, yeah,
3:01
many demonstrations and just to keep it out
3:06
there, keep it in front of them, having
3:08
laser lights shining on the Blue House Dome,
3:12
which was unheard of at any time.
3:14
I mean, even for LCA, that was unheard
3:17
of.
3:19
So, you know, we, we act, we actually
3:22
acted as a liaisons between the animal liberation
3:29
wave, and what was going to happen out
3:31
there.
3:32
We gave advice, we helped in that sense.
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We helped in a lot of different areas,
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but the credit is all due to animal
3:40
liberation wave and Jieun Lee.
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Well, you could just see how emotional everybody
3:46
is.
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This literally is history in the making.
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And of course, it's great news for dogs,
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but I think it's also great news for
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animals everywhere.
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And I just want to applaud everybody who
3:59
worked so hard to make this happen.
4:02
What an historic day.
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And there you see Jieun Lee and Chris
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DeRose, who are joining us today speaking after
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this historic vote.
4:10
And Jieun Lee, I want to talk to
4:12
you about some of the incredible sort of
4:14
techniques that you use to get across to
4:17
the public that this is something that must,
4:21
must end and must end now.
4:25
We also have to talk about the fact
4:26
that there is a three year adjustment period
4:29
that is built into the law.
4:31
So the dog meat farmers of whom there
4:33
are what, more than a thousand still can
4:38
ply their trade for three years is my
4:42
understanding.
4:43
Bring us up to date.
4:44
Tell us exactly what this vote said and
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what it means.
4:47
And again, you are joining us live from
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South Korea.
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What a privilege to have you.
4:53
It's such an honour to be joining this
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show.
4:57
And yeah, well, as Chris explained, we've done
5:02
for the last six years, we've done multiple
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campaigns, actions and demonstrations, both hosted by LCA.
5:16
Also we've been in the forefront to collaborate
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with the coalition itself, which means we have
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a bunch of NGOs who have been working
5:30
in South Korea tirelessly to end dog meat
5:33
trade.
5:34
And well, basically the tactics that we used
5:38
is get the MPs, the members of parliament,
5:44
to be able to continue to speak about
5:48
the necessity to end this brutal dog meat
5:50
trade.
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And that was about really making creative scenes
5:58
that South Korean people have not seen before,
6:04
that this kind of thing can also happen
6:06
in animal rights movement in South Korea, which
6:08
is, as you see, this is like gigantic
6:11
banner that we dropped on top of a
6:14
building that is in a really strategic location
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in the heart of Seoul.
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So after we did this action, I've been
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hearing from my friends who are not really
6:27
looking into this issue's news every time, but
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they had seen this banner going down while
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they were commuting to work on like bus
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or cars.
6:39
So yeah, this is what we have been
6:41
doing continuously.
6:43
And yeah, thanks to this kind of effort
6:47
and all the efforts compiled from the local
6:52
organisations and international too, I'm glad that we
6:56
had this ban passed not too much later
7:02
than January 2024 this year, because it also
7:08
could have been the case that we would
7:10
have seen the passage in sort of a
7:15
delayed in time, so just like 2024 May
7:18
or something.
7:19
But it was like really to our surprise
7:22
that ruling party and the opposition party has
7:25
actually really met their promise.
7:28
They made it come true that the promise
7:32
that they made that they will make sure
7:35
to pass this law early.
7:37
I want to jump in because we've got
7:39
callers lined up, don't want to lose them.
7:41
Michael in Los Angeles, your question or thought
7:44
for our team of heroes?
7:47
Yeah, listen, I am so excited by this
7:50
news, best news all year so far.
7:52
I actually adopted a South Korean rescue dog
7:55
seven years ago.
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And it's been a real challenge, but I'm
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so grateful to have him in my life.
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And I'm just really thankful that this happened
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and to everyone that made it happen.
8:05
And my question is this, I know that
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dog meat is actually an older cultural thing.
8:13
I don't think many of the younger people
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that live in these countries where they still
8:18
consume dog meat.
8:20
So my question is, do you think as
8:22
the older generation dies off, that this will
8:25
be a natural progression to where what happened
8:28
in South Korea will happen in China, Vietnam
8:30
and these other countries?
8:32
Thank you.
8:33
Yeah, and I'd like to toss that out
8:36
to Sheena Gao.
8:37
Sheena Gao is somebody who rescues dogs from
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China.
8:41
I've actually attended a couple of your events.
8:44
We're going to play a little bit of
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that in a second.
8:46
But do you think, and there were articles
8:48
that said, well, what is China going to
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do now?
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Because there's a Yulin dog meat festival that
8:53
is horrific.
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And I've got footage of that.
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I only want to play like 30 seconds
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of it because it's very disturbing.
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I mean, it disturbed me to edit it.
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I'm getting tears in my eyes just editing
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it.
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I'm thinking about editing it this morning.
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Let's play that for 30 seconds.
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It's difficult, only 30 seconds, and then we'll
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talk about it on the other side.
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Oh, Sheena, what are your thoughts about it
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spreading to China?
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I'm really hoping this winning in South Korea
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will set a precedent for China to change
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its way and its way of looking at
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animals and looking at dogs as a consumption
10:07
meat.
10:09
And it's just not going to prolong.
10:12
I feel like it's going to change.
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Most of the Chinese do not want dog
10:17
meat to be on their plates.
10:19
And you cannot really even buy dog meat,
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just go to a grocery store.
10:23
I grew up in China.
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I didn't even know there was dog meat
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until I actually come to America just a
10:28
few years ago.
10:29
At the start of 2015, it came to
10:32
my radar that China is a huge consumption
10:35
of dog meat.
10:37
And I was telling people, no, no, it's
10:38
not happening because I grew up in China,
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never seen that before.
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And little do I know, China, certain regions,
10:46
there's five different regions that have huge consumption
10:49
of dog meat, including Guangxi, Guangdong province, which
10:53
is one of the biggest dog meat trays
10:56
there.
10:57
It's called Yulin Dog Meat Festival that happens
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every June during, I think it's the summer
11:04
solstice.
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They celebrate that, consume dog meat and lychee
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wine.
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So I do believe it's going to stop.
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Young generation do not want to see that
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happening.
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Okay, I'm just going to jump out because
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we've got callers lining up.
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This has touched a nerve.
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I want to get to them all.
11:24
Niloufar in Dallas, Texas, your question or thought
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for our panel of heroes.
11:30
Wow, this is huge.
11:32
It is such a pleasure to meet you
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all.
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We just saw that it literally took an
11:38
act of God to pass this dog meat
11:41
ban in South Korea.
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A two-part question, can it be reversed
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during the three years or if it does
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move forward, do you expect a weak or
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strong enforcement of the law?
11:57
Okay, Chris DeRose.
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I'm going to pass that on to Jian,
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she's more up on that than I am.
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And plus I didn't hear the question.
12:06
Okay, Jian.
12:10
I think the possibility of getting this ban
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reversed is almost zero, like close to zero,
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because this is not just a announcement that
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a regime made or a policy that government
12:32
seeks to implement.
12:36
This is really a law that is now
12:39
going to be promulgated, that was passed with
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unanimous voting, almost unanimous voting.
12:48
So we don't have a case where we
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will have favourable
13:00
amendments, I would say, to better it and
13:05
maybe solve some loopholes that we missed last
13:14
year or this year to make this law
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pass quickly.
13:19
Yeah, that's what I think.
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And also about your enforcement, I would believe
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this is going to be over 50%
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enforced.
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If we are talking about from zero to
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100% of the satisfactory level of the
13:42
enforcement, I would say this would stay between
13:45
50% to 100%.
13:48
Because this law was also backed by the
13:53
ruling People Power Party and for the most
13:55
thing, the First Lady, which means this government
13:59
will need to act really strong to implement
14:03
because they want to take the credit.
14:04
They don't want to be remembered to South
14:07
Korean people who, after the law's passage, did
14:11
a bad job in enforcing this whole thing.
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And for the most thing, we do have
14:18
not only Last Chance for Animals and ALW,
14:23
Animal Liberation Wave on the ground, we do
14:25
have many local groups who are scattered all
14:29
over the country.
14:30
So we've got activists, many activists who are
14:34
really ready to monitor and we're just all
14:39
over the country.
14:40
And we are really ready to deliver our
14:43
strong opinions to the Department of Ministry of
14:49
Agriculture, who is currently formulating the task force
14:58
already to really enforce this bill.
15:03
It's great news that there's going to be
15:05
enforcement because here in California, we passed Prop
15:08
2, we passed Prop 12, no enforcement.
15:11
No enforcement.
15:12
So what does it mean?
15:14
Okay, we're going to run through these callers
15:16
because we've got so many of them.
15:18
So quick answers, thank you.
15:21
Rudy in Dallas, Texas, your question or thought?
15:28
Okay, Rudy, turn down the feed that you're
15:30
listening to.
15:31
Thank you.
15:32
Yeah, I just did.
15:33
I turned it down.
15:34
Hello.
15:34
Yeah.
15:34
Hi.
15:35
Greetings from Dallas, Texas.
15:36
It's freezing over here.
15:38
But anyway, I've actually been to Korea four
15:41
times to campaign against dog meat.
15:45
And I actually met Yujin Lee and Kristen
15:47
Rose and Kim Basinger back in 2018.
15:49
They don't remember, but I was there in
15:51
front of the National Assembly.
15:52
And I've also done work with KBS, Jenny
15:55
Kim, and also with Hangang with Mr. Wonsoong
15:59
Park and Ms. Miyambang.
16:01
And I've been to dog meat farms.
16:03
And I'm very happy that this bill finally
16:04
passed.
16:06
My question is, should they have a three
16:08
-year transitional period?
16:10
What I'm afraid of is there's going to
16:12
be an increase in dog meat farms in
16:14
order to shut it down.
16:19
What's the probability of that happening?
16:22
An excellent question.
16:23
And, you know, again, thank you for your
16:25
patience.
16:26
We have somebody in South Korea, we got
16:27
somebody in Dallas, Texas.
16:28
It's the miracle of conversation, but it's not
16:31
going to be like we're sitting next to
16:32
each other talking on the couch.
16:33
So basically, what he's saying is, with the
16:36
three-year transition period, could they ramp up
16:40
production to try to make some money at
16:42
the last minute?
16:43
And what is going to happen to the
16:45
dogs that are currently behind bars now in
16:49
these dog farms?
16:50
Jian, do you want to handle that?
16:53
Yeah.
16:54
Yes.
16:55
This is a question that is raised in
16:57
South Korea, too.
16:59
And by the way, I remember you, Rudy.
17:02
And I would say, on the process of
17:08
this bill, this law, when it was first
17:11
introduced, and when it was being discussed in
17:14
the National Assembly, and in the process, the
17:17
Ministry of Agriculture has been also delivering their
17:21
opinion, how they think about this law, the
17:25
bill, to the National Assembly.
17:29
And hearing that, the content was, the government
17:34
was really cautious not to hint that they
17:38
are going to compensate by the number of
17:43
dogs dog farmers hold in their farms.
17:46
And not only they are not hinting that
17:50
this will happen, they are actually really active
17:53
in speaking to us that they have no
17:56
plan of really making this happen, like compensating
18:00
by the number of farms, which means they
18:02
are also aware of the problem.
18:05
And I think government is also in the
18:07
position that if they make this happen, it's
18:10
going to be a tremendous amount of expenditure.
18:12
It's going to mean a tremendous amount of
18:14
expenditure that the Ministry of Agriculture will have
18:17
to be admitted to spend by the Ministry
18:22
of Finance in South Korea, which is really
18:25
hard to happen, I would say.
18:28
So at this point in time, I can't
18:30
really say that this is going to happen.
18:32
This is not going to happen, but that's
18:35
what I got.
18:36
That's the overall sense that I'm feeling.
18:38
But then again, of course, the monitoring is
18:41
really the key, which is why I've been
18:43
emphasising before that local groups would have to
18:47
be really investigating.
18:51
Yeah, so I'm going to go to the
18:53
next column.
18:55
I hear what you're saying.
18:57
It's all about enforcement.
18:59
And you know, somebody just said at an
19:02
LCA anti-fur demo that she considered herself
19:06
the anti-fur police because California has passed
19:09
a ban on the sale of new fur,
19:11
and she went into some stores on her
19:13
own and found out that they were still
19:15
selling new fur, and she contacted LCA, and
19:18
you guys are taking action on that.
19:20
Way to go.
19:22
But when she said we have to be
19:24
our own fur police, I thought, bingo, that
19:27
is really true.
19:28
So when the government isn't doing its job
19:31
of enforcement, you guys on the ground in
19:33
South Korea have to go in there and
19:37
enforce this law, and boy, that's a big
19:40
job.
19:42
You have done so much already.
19:43
Paige in Los Angeles, we've got a couple
19:45
of callers here, so let's race through them.
19:47
Paige, what do you got to say?
19:49
Hello.
19:50
I just wanted to throw this question over
19:52
to Chris DeRose and say, first of all,
19:55
hi.
19:55
Hi, everyone.
19:56
Thank you so much.
19:57
It's a huge success.
19:58
And what had you start, Last Chance for
20:01
Animals, and how long have you been fighting
20:03
for this ban?
20:05
Thank you very much.
20:08
We've been fighting for the ban cohesively for
20:12
about six years, but we had been in
20:15
there doing preliminary research and stuff to see
20:19
what needed to be done, and that went
20:22
on for about eight years altogether.
20:25
And then we were in China before that,
20:27
so we got our licks in China as
20:29
well.
20:33
But cohesively, we've been working with ALW for
20:38
six years, and it's been a real cooperation,
20:44
and Jian has been great.
20:46
She's been able to create things to keep
20:51
it out there, like these banners, like the
20:54
laser lights, like the demonstrations, the demonstrations with
20:57
the dead puppies.
21:00
And we used that, and I modelled that
21:04
after some other group had done it, and
21:06
I just said, you know what?
21:07
This works.
21:08
Let's use it.
21:09
Let's make it happen.
21:12
So we kept it out there.
21:15
It's the thing that we did.
21:16
We kept this out there so that the
21:18
government of South Korea didn't think this was
21:20
just a passing phase.
21:21
This is something that was going to be
21:23
here until they changed the law.
21:25
And it's an embarrassment to the country.
21:28
Many South Koreans despise this whole dog meat
21:31
trade.
21:32
They don't dislike it.
21:33
They despise it because it makes them look
21:35
bad.
21:36
And it's not all Koreans that are bad
21:39
on this.
21:40
It's just the minority, but the minority speaks
21:43
up.
21:44
And this is what we did.
21:46
We came in there.
21:47
We spoke up.
21:49
We had demonstrations.
21:52
We had them internationally.
21:54
We had demonstrations at the same time in
21:56
Washington, D.C. and New York City, Los
21:59
Angeles, at the Korean consulate here.
22:04
We had demonstrations everywhere.
22:08
So wherever the problem was, LCA was there.
22:14
ALW was there.
22:15
And as far as enforcement, you could bet
22:19
your last dollar, I'm going to make sure
22:21
that the enforcement is taking place.
22:23
We've had a meeting on this before.
22:25
We left South Korea a few days ago.
22:29
And it's an understanding now that the GN
22:32
has and we have that the most important
22:34
thing now is enforcement and cooperation, cooperation with
22:40
the NGOs and cooperation with the new bill
22:44
being passed.
22:45
I'm going to jump in only because we've
22:48
got so many callers.
22:49
I also have a few questions.
22:51
Thank you, everybody.
22:52
Sam in Pasadena, your question or thought for
22:55
our panel of heroes.
22:58
Hi.
22:59
Hi.
22:59
Thank you.
23:00
Hi, Jane.
23:01
Thank you so much.
23:02
Congratulations on such a huge win for dogs
23:05
and all animals.
23:07
Thank you all for your dedication and saving
23:10
dogs.
23:10
It just goes to show that perseverance and
23:13
persistence can change hearts and minds, even for
23:16
such a longstanding practise.
23:18
My question is, what are some of the
23:20
biggest challenges you guys face when pushing for
23:24
this dog ban in South Korea?
23:26
Thank you.
23:27
Great question.
23:29
Jian, you want to handle that one?
23:33
Again, she's speaking for South Korea.
23:35
The challenges that we faced?
23:37
Yes.
23:38
In the past that we, the challenges that
23:45
we faced is, okay, here's the biggest challenge.
23:50
The MPs, we've got, we had MPs, members
23:54
in the Parliament, National Assembly, who was willing,
23:58
who are willing to propose a law about
24:01
banning the dog meat trade.
24:03
But then again, it was so hard to
24:05
make the bill actually get processed, passed in
24:11
relevant committee, in the first place, which is
24:14
Agriculture Committee, and proceed to the Judiciary Committee
24:18
and plenary session.
24:19
This was because, looking back, it was hard
24:23
to make the dog meat ban a formal
24:28
programme, priority policy of any of the two
24:34
biggest parties that we have.
24:36
But the good thing is, last year, all
24:40
of a sudden, the situation changed.
24:42
So there was a, um, instigated by the
24:47
First Lady's comment, I would say, there was
24:51
a competition between the ruling People Power Party
24:54
and the opposition Democratic Party to take this,
24:58
take their lead on this issue.
25:00
So that was the success factor that made
25:05
this passage of dog meat ban that was
25:09
so much wanted within a year, looking back.
25:12
Wow.
25:13
Okay, I'm going to jump in and let's
25:14
go to more callers.
25:16
I mean, this has just touched a nerve.
25:19
Sarah in Culver City, your question or thought
25:21
for our panel of heroes.
25:24
Yes, I have a question for you.
25:27
Now that they voted that they don't want
25:29
to have the dog meat in South Korea,
25:33
two questions.
25:35
One, do they breed dogs for this specific
25:37
thing?
25:38
Will they shut down all the breeding facilities
25:40
there?
25:40
Because that's a huge problem.
25:42
As we know, the more animals bred is
25:44
a big problem.
25:46
So they don't go into shelters and stuff.
25:48
And then if this is going away in
25:51
South Korea, what's the time?
25:54
You know, is it going to be a
25:55
year from now?
25:55
Is it immediate?
25:56
And then do you see that China is
25:59
going to continue doing this kind of stuff?
26:01
Or do you see like, is there an
26:04
agreement with shipping these dogs to other countries
26:07
for dog meat?
26:09
I just want to know what's going on
26:11
because it could stop somewhere, but just be
26:14
going on in another place.
26:16
You know what I'm saying?
26:17
Yeah, we do.
26:18
Excellent questions.
26:19
Now, we just want to bring you up
26:20
to date because we've been covering this.
26:22
It goes into effect in three years.
26:25
And so that answers that question.
26:27
But the folks here, the heroes and the
26:30
activists you see in this video who are
26:33
celebrating after the vote are not going to
26:35
just stand by for three years and do
26:37
nothing.
26:38
So please tell us what you're going to
26:41
do in that three year time period.
26:43
And also, yeah, people don't realise that there
26:47
are farms that breed these dogs, just like
26:49
in the United States, we have farms that
26:52
breed cows and pigs.
26:53
And in fact, there is a huge contingency
26:57
of people who say, well, isn't this hypocritical?
27:00
We're factory farming pigs who actually have a
27:03
higher IQ than dogs, which is not really
27:06
something that should count at all, but it
27:09
just happens to be the fact.
27:11
And look how we keep pigs, okay?
27:13
We keep pigs in gestation crates, the size
27:15
of their bodies, unable to turn around and
27:18
scratch themselves.
27:19
It is a literally torture device.
27:23
And Americans are eating an average of 66
27:26
.18 pounds of pork per year.
27:29
So there's a very good argument to be
27:31
made that it's hypocrisy for us to call
27:34
out another country while we are systematically torturing
27:40
animals here for food.
27:42
I'd like to get some round table on
27:45
that because I think that is a really
27:46
crucial fact.
27:47
Now, nobody here on this panel eats animals.
27:51
So we're not the problem, but it's the
27:53
people who love dogs and continue to eat
27:56
other animals that, in my opinion, are the
28:00
ones who have a disconnect between their views
28:04
about how animals should be treated and what
28:07
their actions are.
28:08
Chris, take it away.
28:10
You know, I wanted to just bring up
28:11
something that was real important.
28:12
I didn't want to interrupt you before.
28:14
The spokesperson for the Ag Committee, he came
28:20
out and when he announced that they voted
28:23
on it, first the subcommittee voted on it,
28:25
and then the Ag Committee voted on it.
28:27
And both have said, this is going to
28:30
be a bill that's going to be put
28:31
into effect.
28:32
It's going to be a law.
28:34
And there's no skirting around it because there'll
28:37
be severe penalties, fines of up to $32
28:40
,000, US dollars.
28:43
There'll be imprisonment of three years.
28:47
So they've said some powerful words, which is,
28:49
I've never heard before in any bill, even
28:52
the Proposition 2 in California and all these,
28:55
I've never heard jail sentences and major fines
28:58
like that.
28:59
And then the committee's coming out and saying
29:02
that they're going to enforce it.
29:05
This is not something to play with.
29:07
This is something that's going to be serious,
29:09
that they're putting a lot into it.
29:11
And that's the beauty of the government.
29:14
Yes, it moves a little bit slower than
29:16
we activists, but it moves in a cohesive
29:20
manner.
29:21
And that's what we need to see.
29:24
We've got to believe that they're going to
29:26
tell the truth because their names are on
29:28
the line.
29:29
Their reputations are on the line.
29:31
And it's a bill.
29:34
It's a law.
29:34
It's going to be, it's a law.
29:36
So whatever it is, it's going to be
29:38
something that needs to be enforced.
29:40
Let me just jump in and say, I
29:43
would hope that there's a way of approaching
29:45
these farmers who actually protested and there were
29:47
fights outside the parliament.
29:50
We chose not to bring you that, but
29:52
there were fistfights outside with the dog farmers
29:56
that farm dogs, just like other people farm
29:58
pigs here in the United States, saying, it's
30:03
jobs.
30:03
You're taking away our jobs, which is always
30:06
the argument.
30:07
Throughout time, whether it's civil rights, women's rights,
30:11
anytime somebody wants to keep power for whatever
30:15
it is that they're doing, that ends up
30:17
causing a lot of suffering for somebody else,
30:20
another being or another person, they always cite
30:23
jobs.
30:24
This is the first thing.
30:25
And you know what?
30:26
There will be new jobs created as people
30:29
try to have other sorts of food to
30:33
eat, like plant-based meats, which actually originated
30:38
in Asia.
30:39
Tofu has been eaten for centuries in Asia,
30:41
and it's not something that the United States
30:43
invented at all.
30:45
You might say the Asian world is the
30:46
leader in meat alternatives.
30:49
Jian?
30:51
Yes, I totally agree.
30:53
Yes.
30:56
Yeah.
30:56
Well, I mean, no, let me go to
30:58
Sheena on this.
30:59
Sheena, there is a sense that people are
31:02
saying, some people are saying, look, in the
31:05
United States, we're saying, oh, this is terrible,
31:10
this is horrible, because we look at dogs
31:13
as pets, which they also do in South
31:16
Korea and China as well.
31:17
The pet population is growing rapidly, companion animals,
31:20
it's a growing industry.
31:22
But they're also saying there's a certain hypocrisy
31:26
for people who are eating pigs, saying, how
31:29
dare you eat dogs?
31:30
I just want to address that.
31:32
Yeah, it's definitely, it's a speciesism.
31:36
Certain animals are to be eaten, others are
31:40
to be as a pet, like a panda
31:42
and a pig.
31:43
I saw a picture before, they said, what's
31:46
the difference between panda and pig?
31:48
Just the outer skin, they look the same,
31:50
actually.
31:51
So I do believe a lot of people,
31:54
I transitioned into veganism from fighting against dog
31:58
meat.
31:59
And in 2016, I've noticed that, I started
32:02
to fight and then started to connect the
32:04
thoughts, I realised that meat is meat, animal
32:07
is animal, they're all the same thing, and
32:09
just eat one and treat the other one.
32:12
There's no equality in human or humanity, we
32:16
should all treat all human beings equally.
32:20
So we're against dog meat, against pig, eating
32:23
pig, eating cows, this is just a harm
32:27
programme.
32:27
I believe that we should not be eating
32:29
any living beings.
32:31
All right, we've got one more caller.
32:35
Annie and Sherman Oaks, your question or thought
32:37
for our panel.
32:39
Oh, hi, thank you for this.
32:41
Oh, my God, I'm so stoked up.
32:43
Thank you so much, heroes.
32:45
Appreciate you all for all you do.
32:48
Chris Zero as well, heroic.
32:51
I want to ask maybe two part questions.
32:55
Is there any other bills to try and
32:58
stop reproduction?
33:00
Because this had come up earlier from questions
33:03
of dogs, because these farms are perpetuating.
33:08
And what was the most powerful, strategic thing
33:12
that you've done?
33:13
I know this has been years you've been
33:14
working on, bless you, heroes in all meanings.
33:19
But what was the most powerful, strategic thing
33:22
that you did you feel that was most
33:25
effective?
33:27
So that we can adapt that.
33:28
Take it away, Chris.
33:30
The investigations, the expose of what's going on
33:33
in the slaughterhouses, what's going on in the
33:35
dog farms, what's going on in the auction
33:38
houses.
33:39
This was constantly gotten out there.
33:42
And we had cameras inside these places, GoPro
33:45
cameras that had maybe five or six GoPro
33:48
cameras going nonstop, nonstop.
33:51
So we had hundreds of hours of video.
33:54
And that video really is what shook the
33:56
world when they saw what was going on
33:58
in there.
33:59
And it's unedited.
34:01
It's nothing that we could say we edited
34:03
this in there or this out of there,
34:06
nothing like that.
34:07
And so it was very powerful.
34:09
And then doing the campaigns on it, setting
34:12
up a faux dog meat slaughter place in
34:15
the centre of Seoul and making it look
34:19
like you're doing exactly what you would be
34:22
doing with a dog in a slaughterhouse, slamming
34:26
it down on the ground.
34:27
But of course, it's a dummy dog.
34:30
And that was very effective.
34:33
And then the laser beam on the dome
34:36
of the Blue House, sending a message in
34:39
Korean, sending a message that this is wrong
34:43
and that the government needs to get behind
34:45
it and ban it once and for all.
34:48
So that's it.
34:52
So what would you say, Jian, was the
34:54
most successful strategy?
34:58
I would pick media presence because government really
35:03
is very sensitive.
35:06
Well, both government officials and the members of
35:10
parliaments are very sensitive to media coverage.
35:13
So LCA and ALW have been doing two
35:22
or three campaigns every year, an investigation, getting
35:27
it out to the major media, that includes
35:30
TV.
35:31
So I would think that continuous media coverage
35:36
and public awareness campaigns really piled up to
35:41
make this change happen.
35:43
And on this point also, about what Jian
35:46
explained about race, about what are we going
35:50
to do with factory farms?
35:52
Isn't it hypocrisy to ban only dog meat?
35:56
I totally agree.
35:58
And what this case that we experienced in
36:02
South Korea could mean is how I really
36:06
think, because in South Korea, the anti-movement
36:12
about dog meat trade is something that happened
36:14
over the last 30 years by continuous participation
36:18
of different peoples.
36:20
It just piled up.
36:21
And what we saw in this country is
36:24
that public perception opposing the dog meat trade
36:30
has been slowly rising up.
36:33
And it's right before the bill's passage just
36:37
this month, we were seeing absolute amount, 81%,
36:44
78% or 9% of South Koreans
36:47
now for the legal change to ban this,
36:51
which wasn't the case in five years ago,
36:54
or 10 years ago, or even 20 years
36:56
ago.
36:57
So what this means is how, even if
37:00
we could think any action by itself doesn't
37:03
change the world, it just piles up.
37:06
And I think it's really important that we
37:08
keep on doing this because that changes slowly
37:12
the people's opinions and their behaviours, and the
37:16
members of parliament, politicians, governments, they're just always
37:22
going for these changes in public perception because
37:26
they want to rule.
37:28
Yeah, that's what I think.
37:29
And you see here, this is from South
37:32
Korea outside the parliament building, after the historic
37:35
vote was taken, see Chris speaking, you see
37:38
Jen Lee speaking, you see all of these
37:41
folks.
37:42
My thought is, does it change the attitudes
37:46
of South Koreans toward all animals?
37:49
Is there a growing vegan movement in South
37:53
Korea, along with a movement toward having dogs
37:57
as companion animals and showing compassion to dogs?
38:01
Jian?
38:02
Sure thing.
38:04
Animal Liberation Wave is actually on the forefront,
38:08
really in the forefront, to make this happen
38:11
in South Korea, because we are renowned in
38:13
South Korea as a first organisation in the
38:15
country to put animal liberation on the forefront,
38:21
to liberate all the species of beings, and
38:24
to put anti-speciesism on the forefront, and
38:29
really act, spread words about veganism, how South
38:34
Korean people should adopt more vegan lifestyle.
38:37
So, and this is also very interesting, is
38:41
how over the last three or four, no,
38:45
I would say four to five years, three
38:47
to four years, that veganism has been appearing
38:51
a lot in the media stream.
38:54
So I would say five years ago, when
38:56
five or six years ago, when we were
39:00
not existent, we did see in the mainstream
39:02
media, people talking about vegetarianism.
39:07
But really, veganism was not there, or even
39:11
anti-speciesism, or even a word about animal
39:15
liberation, or the necessity to free these farm
39:20
animals from exploitation.
39:24
So what's happening now is that if I
39:27
turn on TV, I could suddenly see vegan
39:30
cosmetic products being advertised, really.
39:34
And yes, we are just seeing a growing,
39:39
fast growing of vegan movement in South Korea.
39:41
And I've, I've experienced fast growing of young
39:44
vegans in South Korea, among South Korean young
39:49
generations.
39:50
And this is something huge.
39:52
And I would like to pinpoint that every
39:54
South Korean think about our country, that when
39:58
we adopt, when we are willing to adopt
40:01
any change, this is, we are a small
40:04
country.
40:07
Go ahead.
40:09
Sometimes living really fast produces some problems.
40:12
But a good thing is we're also fascinated
40:14
with adopting good changes.
40:15
So that's actually, that's what I got to
40:17
say to your question.
40:18
Well, I'd like to say that I have
40:21
another very special guest who is with me
40:23
now.
40:24
And this is one of my two rescue
40:26
dogs, Wednesday, who was, somebody tried to dump
40:30
her at a shelter in Los Angeles.
40:32
And the shelters are so overrun and frankly
40:35
mismanaged that they actually said, oh no, just
40:38
take her back where you found her.
40:40
And luckily a rescuer heard that and rescued
40:44
her.
40:44
And now she is my little, my little
40:47
companion animal.
40:49
But like so many Americans, I love my
40:52
dogs.
40:52
You'll meet my other dogs Sunday in a
40:54
second.
40:55
I consider dogs the gateway drug to compassion
41:00
to animals because people love their dogs, like
41:04
they're their children, because they essentially are their
41:07
children.
41:08
I know people who have five or six
41:10
children, but they always talk about their dogs
41:13
every time I see them.
41:15
So let me ask the big question.
41:19
And I'd like to get a round table
41:21
from everybody.
41:22
Chris, as this, in fact, let me play
41:26
what you said in South Korea about how
41:30
the world is watching all of this.
41:32
And then we're going to talk about the
41:34
implications for the world when it comes to
41:37
compassionate dogs and translating that into compassion for
41:41
all animals.
41:43
The world is watching.
41:45
I say to you again now, the world
41:47
is watching.
41:49
The people that have gathered here today have
41:52
been by no means alone in their fight
41:54
for the lives of millions of dogs slaughtered
41:57
every year.
41:59
So Chris, you said the world is watching.
42:02
Is the world getting the message that it's
42:05
not just about dogs in South Korea?
42:09
That's huge.
42:09
It's a huge victory, but it's really about
42:11
all animals everywhere.
42:14
Yes, it is.
42:15
And especially farm animals, because these dogs on
42:18
the dog meat slaughter line were raised on
42:23
farms, in factory farms.
42:25
And so anything to do with factory farm
42:28
animals, yes.
42:29
And I think anything to do with any
42:31
animals in general, yes.
42:33
It sends a message.
42:36
It sends a message, number one, it can
42:38
be done.
42:38
It can be done on this scale.
42:40
And it has been done.
42:42
Now we've proven it can get done on
42:44
a national level.
42:45
And let me tell you, the dog lobbyists,
42:48
they were very powerful.
42:49
They were very vocal.
42:50
They were very in your face on things.
42:53
But we got just as aggressive, but in
42:56
a very more of a political way.
42:58
And so, yes, we feel that it's made
43:05
a difference all around the world.
43:06
It's like throwing that little pet rock in
43:08
a lake and it just ripples across the
43:10
lake and it just has an effect all
43:12
over the place.
43:14
So, yes, it's having an effect everywhere.
43:18
And it's building that momentum up.
43:20
And it happened at the beginning of the
43:21
year, 24.
43:22
And it's very exciting to see that.
43:26
And then plus, don't forget, enforcement is on
43:29
everybody, back of everybody's mind.
43:31
Because like you said before, Jane, we passed
43:34
these bills and there was no enforcement on
43:36
them or anything.
43:37
When we, LCA enforcement, gets a bill passed,
43:40
we stay behind it.
43:42
We say like, we've been going into these
43:45
stores on the fur farms, getting fur coats
43:49
from slaughterhouses and stuff.
43:53
So, yes, we're going to stay on top
43:55
of this.
43:55
We're definitely not going to let go of
43:57
it.
43:58
You can rest assured, as sure as we're
44:01
having this conversation, this is going to continue.
44:04
The enforcement of this is going to be
44:06
taken very seriously.
44:08
Okay.
44:09
I'm going to jump in because we've got
44:11
yet another caller.
44:12
People are just really, wow.
44:15
Tiffany in Los Angeles, your question or thought
44:18
for our panel of heroes.
44:20
Yes, this is great news.
44:22
And thank you, Unchained TV for covering this
44:25
exciting news.
44:26
I wanted to ask the Animal Liberation Waves,
44:30
what is their next, where do they go
44:32
from here?
44:33
Do they continue this campaign or what are
44:36
their next plans?
44:38
Take it away.
44:42
For the foremost thing, we would, because after
44:46
the passage, this is not the end.
44:48
We do have to spend this three years
44:51
until the enforcement of the ban, spend it
44:58
well to really monitor whether or not the
45:01
transition of dog farms and slaughterhouses, which means
45:05
shrinking of the dog meat industry that we
45:07
used to have, is really happening at a
45:10
satisfactory level.
45:12
And afterwards, when the raising, slaughtering and selling
45:20
happens, we would need to monitor as you
45:23
do in LA to monitor fur sales.
45:26
So yeah, that's one of our missions.
45:29
That's going to be our continued mission.
45:32
And also this overlaps with what we are
45:36
talking about in this show is that we
45:39
definitely need to take this case to have
45:44
impact on other farm animals or fur animals,
45:48
I would say, and spread egonism in South
45:51
Korea, because every animals are all the same.
45:57
And it's not that only dogs were suffering
45:59
from farms and systematic exploitation when pigs, cows,
46:04
chickens are not.
46:05
Actually, more number of animals are being slaughtered
46:08
every day in this continued business, bigger industry.
46:12
So we are, I think we are gearing
46:14
up for a even bigger fight because it's
46:17
an industry, the livestock industry, animal agriculture, as
46:20
it is in the United States and South
46:22
Korea too.
46:23
It's another totally bigger scale industry.
46:27
And we would like to, well, just one
46:29
more thing.
46:30
What we're trying to do is make this
46:34
change in South Korea to have an impact
46:36
throughout the Southeast Asia and China and Japan
46:39
too.
46:40
And we are already seeing what we're seeing
46:43
after the passage of dog meat ban.
46:46
We are getting foreign coverage about how Indonesia
46:50
is responding, how people in China is responding,
46:53
which is, I think South Korea is a
46:56
country in Asia that is really has powerful
47:01
movement, civil rights movement.
47:03
So what we see, what we make in
47:05
this country, I definitely believe is going to
47:09
have, is good to have a ripple effect
47:11
throughout the whole Asia.
47:13
Yes.
47:14
And people were asking to meet my other
47:16
dog.
47:16
This is my other companion animal, Sunday.
47:20
And she was rescued on a Sunday and
47:22
she was found in Arlita running in the
47:24
rain, no chip, no collar and not spayed.
47:29
Now both my animals are spayed because pet
47:31
overpopulation is another big aspect of this problem.
47:35
Obviously.
47:36
I also want to talk about the dogs
47:40
that Sheena Gao rescued.
47:42
She rescues dogs from the dog meat trade
47:45
in China.
47:46
I attended one of those events.
47:49
Let's talk about it on the other side.
47:51
Come here, babies.
47:55
Oh, look at these babies all from China
47:59
rescued from the dog meat trade.
48:03
They're up for adoption.
48:05
This one just got adopted by this lovely
48:08
lady came in from Chicago.
48:11
Oh, baby.
48:14
Come on, baby.
48:17
Tell me how you feel about rescuing your
48:20
dog.
48:21
I feel, I feel really great.
48:23
It's, it's very honourable and I feel like
48:26
I'm on a mission, but I also, I
48:28
will love the dog and like give her
48:30
a safe and warm home, make her feel
48:32
happy.
48:34
So excellent work, Sheena Gao.
48:36
You do so much.
48:38
I have attended so many of your events.
48:41
I just want to know, how do you
48:43
get these dogs out of China?
48:46
Okay.
48:47
Thank you for the platform.
48:48
Actually, I want to correct it.
48:50
I personally do not strictly go to China
48:53
rescue dogs.
48:54
I work with a lot of rescue groups
48:56
in China and in Chinese organised rescues in
49:02
America.
49:03
So I'll give them a platform to adopt
49:05
the dogs.
49:05
I foster them in the airport, pick them
49:09
up and their organisations.
49:11
I work on the paperwork for them to
49:14
go through the whole process of a medical
49:16
check, plan through CDC to get the dogs
49:19
here to make sure these dogs are adopted.
49:22
The one that you saw the last event,
49:26
I was working with a couple of other
49:28
Chinese rescue dog groups and they were able
49:32
to get the dogs here and just looking,
49:35
loving to get them placed from the meat
49:39
trade.
49:40
Yeah.
49:41
And I think that's a really important point.
49:43
You're part of a much bigger team.
49:45
I know you do have your own organisation,
49:47
Mercy for Chinese Dogs, but obviously it takes
49:50
a village to make these things happen.
49:53
My last question is, Jian, is there a
49:57
plan to in any way, try to work
50:00
with these farms, these so-called farms that
50:02
are manufacturing these dogs, basically giant breeding facilities
50:06
to see if there's a way you can
50:09
get some of these dogs out, maybe help
50:11
them transition to another line of work.
50:13
Are you going to dialogue with them at
50:15
all or is there just too hostility there?
50:21
I think it's a possibility.
50:24
I do know some farmers who are still
50:28
working, who are still running their farms, but
50:31
are also okay to speak with.
50:34
And the thing is, when you see on
50:37
the media, you will see only angry farmers.
50:40
But then again, in South Korea, there are
50:43
actually quite a bit of farmers who are
50:46
okay to speak with and who say that
50:51
if only government compensation or government support is
50:58
there, it slows down this business early.
51:04
So I think it's going to be another
51:07
one of our campaign lines to actually speak
51:13
with these people, how they think now, and
51:16
hear their opinions.
51:17
And I think our role is to just
51:19
be in the middle between the government and
51:22
these farmers, not only to speak for dogs,
51:26
of course, we will need to gather stories
51:31
from underground and just deliver it to the
51:37
government.
51:38
Because what we want at the end of
51:44
the day is to fasten these closure and
51:47
transition of dog farms into another livelihood.
51:50
If the industry shrinks fast, then we're going
51:55
to see some effects that's even earlier than
51:59
the ban even takes place.
52:02
Yeah.
52:03
We have only a minute left.
52:05
Chris, what are your final thoughts on this?
52:07
And again, wow, well done.
52:10
Let me just say this.
52:11
One of the things I feel made this
52:13
very successful too, is that the people over
52:15
there and the people that we dealt with
52:18
as far as NGOs and even the MPs,
52:22
no one made it a personal thing.
52:24
No one's lashed back at these dog farmers
52:27
and made it a personal thing.
52:29
It's not them that we hate, it's what
52:31
they're doing that we don't like.
52:33
And that was the focus on all this.
52:36
And it stayed that way.
52:38
So it didn't become a personal battle between,
52:41
I say this about you, and then you
52:43
say this about me.
52:44
No, this is about the dog meat trade.
52:47
It's wrong.
52:48
It's really wrong.
52:50
And that's what we stayed focused on.
52:52
We never got sidetracked on personalities.
52:54
We never got sidetracked on egos or anything
52:56
like that.
52:57
This is what I've always been talking about
52:59
for the last 45 years.
53:00
Stay focused on the issue.
53:02
It's the issue that's going to win.
53:03
And that's what came about in the forefront
53:06
of this battle with the dog meat people.
53:12
We are out of time.
53:13
I want to thank all of you.
53:14
You truly are my heroes.
53:17
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53:20
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53:20
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53:35
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53:38
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53:43
So thank you for joining us.
53:44
And we will see you next time here
53:46
on Unchained TV Voice of America podcast.
53:49
Love you guys.