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208 - The Leadville 100 - Brayden’s Story · Getting After It

• 0:00
  Brett: Dude, Braden, welcome back, man.
• 0:01
  Brayden: Dude, thanks for having me back.
• 0:03
  Speaker: This has been a very anticipated episode.
• 0:05
  Speaker 1: So I know people have been beaten down the door.
• 0:07
  Speaker: For me and for Jace, and I'm sure, like, I don't know, lots of other people who who want to hear the story, but um it's insane.
• 0:15
  Speaker: Like I you did one of my dream races.
• 0:18
  Speaker: I gotta like right off the bat, gotta say that.
• 0:21
  Speaker: Leadville 100.
• 0:22
  Speaker: You just finished that.
• 0:23
  Speaker 1: Dude, it was a bucket list for sure.
• 0:25
  Speaker: Yeah, insane.
• 0:26
  Speaker: So um, I mean, I remember you said that you were gonna like put your name in the draw or something.
• 0:33
  Speaker: I think I'm in your running group, and like you said something about that, and then you're like, oh, I actually got picked.
• 0:38
  Speaker: So walk me through that for a second because like were were you expecting like, okay, I'm gonna get selected for this?
• 0:46
  Speaker 1: No, literally, like everything that I had seen online on like Reddit threads and stuff was that it takes people like three to five, some people like even seven, but like nobody gets it on like the first year.
• 0:57
  Speaker 1: That's that was my understanding.
• 0:59
  Speaker 1: And so, like, Dylan and yeah, we had a handful of people that all put in and we're all like texting on you know pick day.
• 1:05
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it's like, oh, I didn't get in, I didn't get in, I didn't get in.
• 1:08
  Speaker 1: And I was like, Man, I like I haven't got an email yet.
• 1:10
  Speaker 1: Yeah, so then like I think Dylan texted text me like outside of the group chat, and he was like, Have you have you heard anything?
• 1:17
  Speaker 1: And I was like, No, I haven't heard anything.
• 1:19
  Speaker 1: And then literally, like the like bar drops at the top of your screen, you know, and it says like Leadville race series.
• 1:24
  Speaker 1: And I was like, Oh, there it is.
• 1:26
  Speaker 1: So I click on it and it says congratulations.
• 1:28
  Speaker 1: Like, that's a big and I was just like, like my heart just stopped.
• 1:31
  Speaker 1: I like uh because yeah, I literally it was supposed to be like a three to five year, like if we start putting in now, you know, we'll get it when we're ready in a few years.
• 1:40
  Speaker 1: And yeah, to see that congratulations was just like you can ask my coworkers.
• 1:44
  Speaker 1: Like, I literally just like stopped in the office and kind of had like deer and headlights for a minute.
• 1:49
  Speaker 1: I was just like, guys, I'm so screwed.
• 1:51
  Speaker 1: Like, I don't know what to do right now.
• 1:53
  Speaker 1: I had a I had like kind of a panic attack.
• 1:55
  Speaker 1: I like left work to go on a run because I was like, I don't know what else to do.
• 1:59
  Speaker 1: I need to just I need to go on a run right now.
• 2:02
  Speaker: Dang, man.
• 2:03
  Speaker: Okay, so I mean, for those people who don't know, because like my mom's gonna be listening to this and a few other people who might not know what Leadville is.
• 2:09
  Speaker: What is it?
• 2:10
  Speaker: What's Leadville?
• 2:11
  Speaker 1: Leadville is like one of the oldest, um, you know, I arguably one of the more iconic like ultra marathons in the country/slash world.
• 2:20
  Speaker 1: Um, I think it was the second ultra marathon ever in the United States.
• 2:24
  Speaker 1: Oh, really?
• 2:24
  Speaker 1: After Western states.
• 2:26
  Speaker: Dang, okay.
• 2:26
  Speaker 1: And so I mean it's it's one of the oldest, and it's because of that, you know, it's got a lot of prestige.
• 2:31
  Speaker 1: It's also, you know, one of the more difficult because there's so much elevation gain.
• 2:38
  Speaker 1: You start really high is above, yeah.
• 2:41
  Speaker 1: You're like you start at like 10,000 something feet.
• 2:45
  Speaker 1: Like that's your starting line.
• 2:46
  Speaker 1: That's insane.
• 2:47
  Speaker 1: And it's like, you know, here in Utah, um, right around here, we're between like 4,500 and 5,000 feet.
• 2:52
  Speaker 1: So literally double that double is where you start and then you go climb, and it's just like, yeah, that's uh like a huge draw, is just how high it is.
• 3:02
  Speaker: Oh, yeah, it's insane.
• 3:04
  Speaker: Like what's nuts is I've always looked at it as like it's kind of like the Moab 240, you know, it's this big thing where everyone's like, that's a crazy race.
• 3:12
  Speaker: Yeah.
• 3:13
  Speaker: I've seen documentaries like Nick Bear, I watched one of his Sally McRae, if you know who she is.
• 3:18
  Speaker: Yeah, um, I think those were like the main two I saw, and I was like, I I want to do this race, but it's out in Colorado.
• 3:23
  Speaker: And like you said, like for me, I've only done two 50Ks.
• 3:27
  Speaker: Um, and I was like, I I would need to really train up to get to that point.
• 3:31
  Speaker: Like, that's just nuts.
• 3:32
  Speaker: Um, and so I can imagine like that panic attack because I for sure would have the same thing.
• 3:37
  Speaker: I'd be like, okay, I'm I'm cooked.
• 3:39
  Speaker 1: Because when I'm like you submit like kind of a resume type thing, yeah, and yeah, in my resume, it's like I've done two 50Ks.
• 3:47
  Speaker 1: And like at that point, I had only done one marathon.
• 3:50
  Speaker 1: So I'm submitting this resume that's like two 50Ks, one marathon, a couple like you know, smaller trail races to try and boost the trail site.
• 3:59
  Speaker 1: Like, yeah, and I was just like, as I'm submitting this, I'm like, this is a terrible resume.
• 4:04
  Speaker 1: Like, you know, this is not a good resume to get into a hundred mile race.
• 4:09
  Speaker 1: And so I thought, you know, outside of the lottery, I thought someone with brain would look at that and go, like, he's just not quite there yet, you know, he's not ready.
• 4:17
  Speaker 1: And so that was just another thing.
• 4:18
  Speaker 1: Like, when I got the congratulations, was just I'm not ready.
• 4:22
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I've done 250Ks, I don't know anything about this distance or what it takes.
• 4:27
  Speaker 1: And so it was all just it was like a fever dream.
• 4:31
  Speaker 1: Dude, I can't even imagine.
• 4:32
  Speaker: So, when did you get that?
• 4:34
  Speaker: Like, what was the day?
• 4:35
  Speaker 1: That was like the first or second week of January.
• 4:38
  Speaker: Okay.
• 4:39
  Speaker 1: So it gave me about um what is that, like seven-ish, seven and a half months.
• 4:44
  Speaker: Dang, okay.
• 4:45
  Speaker: Yeah, because it's August, right?
• 4:46
  Speaker: Yeah, okay, man.
• 4:47
  Speaker: So what was training like for that?
• 4:49
  Speaker: Because like I've like I said, I've done 250ks training for those.
• 4:52
  Speaker: Like you the most you do is 26 miles in the mountains.
• 4:55
  Speaker: Right.
• 4:55
  Speaker: Um, when you're training for a hundred-mile race, like what does that even look like?
• 4:59
  Speaker 1: I didn't even know.
• 5:01
  Speaker 1: You know, I'm consulting.
• 5:03
  Speaker 1: I try to stay away from consulting like chat.
• 5:06
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 5:06
  Speaker 1: I was like consulting the internet, you know, trying to figure out like what do people do.
• 5:10
  Speaker 1: And I immediately after I'd got that letter, I had started, I just uh started rereading Goggins and Haynes, and I reread Nick Bear's book.
• 5:20
  Speaker 1: I read Andy Glit.
• 5:21
  Speaker 1: I yeah, I read like everything, you know, all that style of book.
• 5:24
  Speaker 1: I just reread all of it, re-listened to it, I should say.
• 5:27
  Speaker 1: And you know, Goggins talks about it, and he just kept mentioning, you know, hundred mile weeks, hundred mile weeks.
• 5:33
  Speaker 1: So that was like kind of became my mindset is like I just need to build up to like a hundred mile weeks.
• 5:39
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 5:39
  Speaker 1: And honestly, I thought I was like, I was on a good path.
• 5:43
  Speaker 1: I um had worked through some injuries that winter that I had got during my last marathon, and I had felt strong.
• 5:50
  Speaker 1: I felt really good all throughout that block.
• 5:52
  Speaker 1: I had worked up to about 70 miles in a week, and then I was going to run the Ogden Marathon because I had signed up for that, you know, way before, way before I found out about Leadville, because Ogden was like the initial 2026.
• 6:04
  Speaker 1: Yeah, that's your goal.
• 6:06
  Speaker 1: All in on Ogden, want to get my time to a certain point.
• 6:09
  Speaker 1: And then, you know, the Leadville thing came and I was like, Okay, that's gone out the window.
• 6:13
  Speaker 1: Like, I'll run Ogden as a fun run.
• 6:15
  Speaker: And yeah, that's training right now.
• 6:17
  Speaker 1: Yeah, that's how you gotta look at it.
• 6:19
  Speaker 1: I'm not gonna worry about trying to be fast, I'm just gonna run it.
• 6:22
  Speaker 1: And and that was the plan.
• 6:24
  Speaker 1: I got to Ogden, I had had my big 70-mile week and then tapered kind of a week and a half-ish into Ogden.
• 6:31
  Speaker 1: And I run Ogden um with my good buddy Logan.
• 6:35
  Speaker 1: I was just kind of pacing him for the first like 21, 21 and a half miles, and then you know, he hit his wall.
• 6:42
  Speaker 1: And I intended to just stay with him even after that, but we were going from like I think we were running right about eight minute miles, and it's pretty good.
• 6:51
  Speaker: Like for a marathon, that's fast.
• 6:53
  Speaker 1: Yeah, no, he was crushing it.
• 6:54
  Speaker 1: He did crush the whole thing, but he we were really crushing it up to that point, and then you know, inevitably during a marathon, you know, the wheels typically fall off, and that kind of happened for him about 21 and a half, and you know, we went from eight to kind of like 10 to 11-ish.
• 7:09
  Speaker 1: And that actually like the change in like stride and stuff, like hurt.
• 7:15
  Speaker 1: And so I was like, hey man, like you know, I'll meet you at the end.
• 7:19
  Speaker 1: You figure you know, which is good, you gotta figure yourself out sometimes in the rest.
• 7:22
  Speaker 1: So I was like, Absolutely, you figure yourself out, I'm gonna keep going.
• 7:26
  Speaker 1: And I had I felt just so good.
• 7:30
  Speaker 1: Like, I I hope one day I can feel that good again at like mile 22 of a marathon, because usually like that's starting to get really cracked at that point.
• 7:38
  Speaker 1: But I felt fantastic, and so I took off.
• 7:41
  Speaker 1: And you know, those last four miles were my fastest of the entire race.
• 7:45
  Speaker 1: Dang, okay, which you know I had felt really good about until about 24 and a half.
• 7:51
  Speaker 1: I felt my Achilles twinge.
• 7:54
  Speaker 1: Oh no, yeah, that's what I had just spent like the whole winter right like fixing, and so I feel it, and like you know, I kind of like ghost out for a second, and I was just like, crap, like please, no.
• 8:05
  Speaker 1: So I back off, I back off the pace, and I still even backing off, my miles were fast-ish, you know, it's all subjective in speed, right?
• 8:13
  Speaker 1: But it was still faster than the other miles.
• 8:16
  Speaker 1: And I finished the race and I felt okay.
• 8:18
  Speaker 1: So I was like, okay, maybe maybe that was nothing, I'm probably fine.
• 8:22
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and then it was like four days later, it just like I felt it.
• 8:26
  Speaker 1: I don't know how to describe what my Achilles problem is, but it's got like this specific I don't know a better term for this, but you know, like the Chinese finger traps as a kid.
• 8:37
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 8:38
  Speaker 1: It like imagine like that feeling.
• 8:40
  Speaker: Weird.
• 8:40
  Speaker 1: Like that's like what my Achilles feels like when I like injure it.
• 8:44
  Speaker 1: And so I felt that like four days after the race, and it was like really nasty.
• 8:49
  Speaker 1: It had like a really bad feel to it.
• 8:51
  Speaker 1: I'm just like crap.
• 8:53
  Speaker: Yeah, Achilles are rough too.
• 8:54
  Speaker: Like and yet, yeah, that's uh before I knew anything about running.
• 8:59
  Speaker: My mom ran Chicago and she got Achilles tendinitis, I think, but it was so bad to where it like just swell up and she could barely walk.
• 9:07
  Speaker: And I think she heard it on like a calf raise machine, actually.
• 9:10
  Speaker: Oh, really?
• 9:10
  Speaker: Of all things.
• 9:11
  Speaker: Dang.
• 9:12
  Speaker: Um, but I just remember she had like Lee limping around the house, and I saw your Strava, and you were like, Okay, I'm going back into like rehab mode.
• 9:20
  Speaker: Yeah, and I was just like, He's got Leadville so soon.
• 9:24
  Speaker: Like at that time, it was what four months until yeah.
• 9:27
  Speaker: Um, at that point, it was three months, right?
• 9:30
  Speaker 1: 12 weeks, yeah.
• 9:31
  Speaker 1: Because Jace and I had been talking about it previously about how Ogden is like basically 12 weeks before Leadville.
• 9:36
  Speaker 1: So it's like okay, take a week to recover after Ogden because it shouldn't have been too hard of an effort, and then it's like the biggest, you know, next weeks of my life was what was supposed to happen.
• 9:46
  Speaker 1: And instead, no, I go into like limp mode where it's like I'm just trying to keep you know base mileage, you know, at the time, just like keeping the run streak alive, like just base mileage, base effort, staying out of the hills because that's you know bad on Achilles, yeah.
• 10:02
  Speaker 1: Right.
• 10:02
  Speaker 1: And so, and you know, I'm going for one of the most up and down races in the country, and I can't train mountains yet.
• 10:08
  Speaker 1: You know, I can't train any hills, any elevation gain.
• 10:11
  Speaker 1: And so it was really frustrating, and it took me way off course.
• 10:15
  Speaker 1: I think from there till Leadville, the highest week I had, I don't know if I got back above 50.
• 10:20
  Speaker: Really?
• 10:21
  Speaker 1: And that played a huge part in like my mental downfall.
• 10:27
  Speaker 1: I don't know.
• 10:28
  Speaker 1: No, I was gonna ask on the on the psyche.
• 10:30
  Speaker 1: Absolutely.
• 10:31
  Speaker: Like, that's that's one of the hardest things.
• 10:32
  Speaker: Jason, I were talking about this last time he was here.
• 10:35
  Speaker: It's just like there the mental game of running, I think, for me is sometimes way harder than the actual physical piece.
• 10:41
  Speaker: Yeah, like getting out there and running, like, yes, sometimes I'm very sore.
• 10:44
  Speaker: Like last week had a crazy leg day, and that affected me for like four days afterwards with my running.
• 10:50
  Speaker: I've had those.
• 10:50
  Speaker: Um, yeah, dude, it's brutal.
• 10:52
  Speaker: But like, as long as like you can say, okay, well, I can just keep going.
• 10:55
  Speaker: But to your point, like, I would feel super overwhelmed if I was in your shoes, and I'm like, okay, well, I'm injured.
• 11:02
  Speaker: Like, I know that that's like that's screaming at me.
• 11:04
  Speaker: I can't ignore that.
• 11:06
  Speaker: Yeah.
• 11:06
  Speaker: Um, and I've only gotten to this point.
• 11:09
  Speaker: But what I admire is you're just like, I'm just gonna go for it.
• 11:13
  Speaker: Like, and that's huge.
• 11:14
  Speaker: I think that's we talk ourselves out of things like that all the time.
• 11:18
  Speaker: Like you said, it's a bucket list item.
• 11:20
  Speaker: Um, there might be some people out there who would just be like, hey, I'm just gonna throw in the towel.
• 11:26
  Speaker: But I like to think there's people out there, and like this might have been your experience where you go there and you're just like, Hey, even if I get like 25 miles, at least I went and gave it a shot.
• 11:33
  Speaker: Like if I had a DNF, but I might be speaking for you, and I'm sorry.
• 11:37
  Speaker 1: That was actually one of the things that like scared me the most.
• 11:39
  Speaker 1: Really?
• 11:40
  Speaker 1: Um, was on and I I don't say only lightly, but like only getting like 25, 30, even 40 miles.
• 11:47
  Speaker 1: For me, I was like so freaked out about not even getting halfway.
• 11:51
  Speaker 1: Oh because it's just like it's an ego thing.
• 11:55
  Speaker 1: I don't know for sure.
• 11:56
  Speaker 1: Oh, yeah.
• 11:56
  Speaker 1: I I feel like that would really hurt like my personal pride in running and and self-worth, even unfortunately.
• 12:04
  Speaker 1: Like it would all that was one of my biggest fears over almost anything, was like not even making the halfway point.
• 12:11
  Speaker 1: And you know, that's a it's in my head non-stop from you know May through August because I haven't been able to train.
• 12:19
  Speaker 1: I want to be at 100 mile weeks, and I and I think I was on that course, you know.
• 12:22
  Speaker 1: I'd hit that 70 and still felt you know whole.
• 12:26
  Speaker 1: And so I felt like I could have kept accelerating, yeah, got the mileage further up, kept getting the elevation further up.
• 12:32
  Speaker 1: Um, but I you know, I couldn't to an extent.
• 12:36
  Speaker 1: I I thankfully was able to get like some big runs in, and I feel like that helped.
• 12:40
  Speaker 1: I did like King's Peak.
• 12:41
  Speaker 1: I ran King's Peak, which is tough and not like a really runnable.
• 12:46
  Speaker: Yeah, that what's the elevation on that one?
• 12:47
  Speaker: That one's crazy, actually.
• 12:49
  Speaker 1: I think uh I'd have to pull my straw back up, but I want to say it was like close, it was somewhere between seven and eight thousand.
• 12:54
  Speaker 1: Jeez, how many months?
• 12:55
  Speaker 1: It's supposed to be twenty-six.
• 12:58
  Speaker 1: I ended up at twenty-eight because I we'll have to get into that.
• 13:01
  Speaker 1: Yeah, get lost, dude.
• 13:03
  Speaker 1: I've had that many times.
• 13:04
  Speaker 1: I had asked some people, because I was I was not my typical Boy Scout.
• 13:08
  Speaker 1: I did not plan, I had done it as a Boy Scout back in the day, and so I was like, Oh yeah, I got this, no big deal.
• 13:13
  Speaker 1: Yeah, that was like 16 years ago.
• 13:17
  Speaker 1: I realized once I got there, and I was like, I don't remember the whole fuck.
• 13:22
  Speaker 1: I should remember this.
• 13:23
  Speaker 1: So I got up to this one point, and I didn't know I didn't recall the trail splitting.
• 13:28
  Speaker 1: Yeah, so I like asked these people, I was like, hey, like which way?
• 13:31
  Speaker 1: And they told me one way, and that was not the way.
• 13:34
  Speaker: Yeah, and you're like, Well, screw you guys.
• 13:36
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and honestly, I couldn't even be mad at them because I was the one ill-prepared.
• 13:39
  Speaker 1: But anyways, 28 miles should have been like 26.
• 13:42
  Speaker 1: Yeah, um, terrible run.
• 13:44
  Speaker 1: That's not like a maybe people, maybe other runners disagree, but like I don't think that's a great runnable trap.
• 13:51
  Speaker: Steep or what?
• 13:51
  Speaker: Like or shape the terrain.
• 13:53
  Speaker: Okay.
• 13:53
  Speaker 1: Um, it's really rocky, which like you know, for the first few miles, I was like, oh, okay, whatever.
• 13:59
  Speaker 1: But like after you've been out there for like five or six hours, you gotta be watching every single step you take.
• 14:04
  Speaker: I hate that.
• 14:05
  Speaker: That's right.
• 14:06
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I was over it.
• 14:06
  Speaker 1: I was way over it.
• 14:07
  Speaker 1: And then like to summit Kings is it's just boulder hopping, so it's not I don't know, maybe some psychos can run it, but it's not really runnable because it's just big, massive boulders, and you're kind of just climbing over it to get to the top.
• 14:21
  Speaker 1: So not a great runnable trail, but like I was able to do that.
• 14:24
  Speaker 1: I did it by myself, which is also kind of frowned upon, but did that by myself, had you know, kind of gone through some things and pushed through it, and that gave me confidence.
• 14:34
  Speaker 1: So I was like, okay, we're all right.
• 14:35
  Speaker 1: And then I was able to go do Hope Pass, which is kind of the the that's like the but everyone talks about Hope Pass in Leadville.
• 14:42
  Speaker: That the climax, whatever term that is, that's gonna ask you about Hope Pass because like the monster.
• 14:47
  Speaker: Yeah, you have to go through that twice, right?
• 14:49
  Speaker: Because Leadville, it's not a loop, it's an out and back.
• 14:52
  Speaker 1: Out and back.
• 14:53
  Speaker: So like Hope Pass, which we'll get into it, but like what was your training run like with that?
• 14:57
  Speaker 1: Disgust.
• 14:57
  Speaker 1: It was the worst, it was the worst thing ever.
• 15:00
  Speaker 1: So let me I need to set up the scenario here.
• 15:03
  Speaker 1: So um Dylan Hayes, we had we had talked, he wanted to go do Kings with me, but I think he was in he was on like a family trip or something.
• 15:11
  Speaker 1: So I had done Kings and I was like, dude, I'm gonna hit you up though, because I need to go do hope.
• 15:14
  Speaker 1: Like, I want to do hope before the race.
• 15:17
  Speaker 1: I don't want that to be the surprise because everybody says, you know, hope pass that's the crux of the race.
• 15:23
  Speaker 1: Nick Bear in his like video calls it evil.
• 15:26
  Speaker 1: Yeah, he's like the backside of hope pass is evil.
• 15:28
  Speaker 1: I remember when I had watched his YouTube video, I was just like, I'm so screwed.
• 15:31
  Speaker 1: If Nick Bear is calling that evil, like I'm in trouble, and so that was like I have to go try it.
• 15:36
  Speaker 1: Yeah, so I also needed I don't know, we can get into what things are needed in ultra training, but I was under the impression you need to do a night run, like you have to do that.
• 15:49
  Speaker 1: And I don't know, I kind of maybe disagree with that now, but it's neither here nor there.
• 15:54
  Speaker 1: We could talk about that later if we want to.
• 15:55
  Speaker 1: But so my idea was like kill two birds with one stone.
• 15:58
  Speaker 1: Let's do Hope Pass and also do it as a night run.
• 16:01
  Speaker 1: So Dylan and I leave work on a Friday.
• 16:05
  Speaker 1: Um, I pick him up at like three or four o'clock, and we just drive straight to Colorado.
• 16:11
  Speaker 1: Straight to it's actually um you go the other way when you're going to um Hope Pass because Leadville's actually kind of further up, and so you come the backside like through Aspen, you go into Twin Lakes, is this like the city or township or whatever over there?
• 16:27
  Speaker 1: So you go to Twin Lakes, so we drive into Twin Lakes, we get there at like 1154 PM.
• 16:34
  Speaker 1: And we had intended to get there at like 10:30.
• 16:37
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and so you know the drive just took longer.
• 16:39
  Speaker 1: We had stopped for dinner at XYZ.
• 16:41
  Speaker 1: Um, but we get to Twin Lakes, we start the run at like I don't know, just before midnight thirty, and just cook it in the dark, in the dark, going up.
• 16:55
  Speaker 1: And it was tough.
• 16:56
  Speaker 1: The front side is like it's a you know, I'd say it's a respectable climb.
• 17:00
  Speaker 1: Like it's from the parking lot to the summit is about six miles.
• 17:05
  Speaker 1: And the and four of those miles are brutal.
• 17:10
  Speaker 1: I think they average, you know, right around like 800-ish feet of gain per mile.
• 17:15
  Speaker 1: So you're just going four straight miles.
• 17:16
  Speaker 1: Oh effectively.
• 17:18
  Speaker: And it's oh man.
• 17:20
  Speaker 1: And so it's tough going up.
• 17:22
  Speaker 1: And we're like, you know, and the other thing is like weird, we're tired.
• 17:25
  Speaker 1: It's now, you know, we're getting up there, and I don't, I think it was probably like two-ish in the morning or something like that.
• 17:30
  Speaker 1: We're getting to the saddle, and um kind of get new life once you get to the top of something, you know, reinvigorate you.
• 17:38
  Speaker 1: So we're like, okay, sweet, we're going down anyway, so like let's do this.
• 17:41
  Speaker 1: So down the back side, immediately as we go down the back side.
• 17:46
  Speaker 1: I realize what everybody's talking about.
• 17:49
  Speaker 1: Like, oh no, it's so steep, it's hard to run.
• 17:52
  Speaker 1: Yeah, like, and I hate that.
• 17:54
  Speaker 1: I hate when downhills are like so steep that they hurt, like, it's hard to run.
• 17:58
  Speaker 1: Yeah, you know, I want I love downhill running, it's fun, it's fast, it's free.
• 18:02
  Speaker 1: This is pain and anguish.
• 18:05
  Speaker 1: Oh yeah, I love speed down a trail.
• 18:07
  Speaker: Oh, you're talking about the ones where it's like you're hopping basically down, like yeah.
• 18:11
  Speaker 1: This is like I have to be like fully back, which is putting like way too much pressure on like my quads and stuff, and I've just climbed.
• 18:18
  Speaker 1: And so going down this is a nightmare because one, it's just really steep, and then two, I'm realizing we've been going down for a long time.
• 18:29
  Speaker 1: Oh no, and it's like I know we're coming back up.
• 18:31
  Speaker 1: Yes, we gotta hit this.
• 18:32
  Speaker 1: Like I'm telling Dylan probably over and over, like, dude, we are screwed.
• 18:36
  Speaker 1: Like, what did we why did we do what are we doing?
• 18:38
  Speaker: And it's just the middle of the night, and it's the middle of the freaking night.
• 18:43
  Speaker 1: But we get out, um and you know, once you hit the bottom, you go out to a place called Winfield, is like the aid station, and it's pitch black still, and we have no idea where the actual aid station's going to be.
• 18:57
  Speaker 1: So we just kind of went out until we got to I think it was 12 miles, was like our turnaround point, somewhere about there.
• 19:04
  Speaker 1: And then we just turn around and come back.
• 19:06
  Speaker 1: And I could break down that run.
• 19:08
  Speaker 1: That run could probably have a whole pod by itself because there was so much that went on during that run.
• 19:14
  Speaker 1: But the short story, we come back and we hit that uphill, and it is I mean, in some aspects, it was harder than a lot of like the actual race on race day.
• 19:28
  Speaker 1: Really?
• 19:29
  Speaker 1: Getting Dylan and I back up that hill.
• 19:31
  Speaker 1: And one and one of the huge factors was we were so dead.
• 19:35
  Speaker: Yeah.
• 19:35
  Speaker 1: Like we didn't the biggest hang up was that we didn't do like caffeine appropriately.
• 19:41
  Speaker 1: Oh dead.
• 19:41
  Speaker 1: We should have been taking caffeine through the night.
• 19:43
  Speaker 1: Instead, I think we pounded a monster at like 10 p.m.
• 19:46
  Speaker 1: and just went for that.
• 19:47
  Speaker 1: That was our caffeine for the whole thing, which you know seemed like a good idea.
• 19:51
  Speaker 1: Yeah, but we should have had caffeine to gels and we should have been keeping up on that.
• 19:55
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and I think that would have made a big difference.
• 19:57
  Speaker 1: And I think that is what made a more significant difference on race day was that you know, I knew that.
• 20:03
  Speaker 1: I okay, caffeine, caffeine, caffeine.
• 20:06
  Speaker 1: And so yeah, we're we're going up, and I'm literally I'm falling asleep while we're like hiking up this trail.
• 20:13
  Speaker 1: No way.
• 20:13
  Speaker 1: That's how bad it was.
• 20:15
  Speaker 1: Is like Dylan's behind me, and I'm just doing like this like do you hallucinate at all?
• 20:20
  Speaker 1: Not on that one.
• 20:22
  Speaker 1: I we'll uh we'll have to talk about my hallucinations during the I want to hear all about them.
• 20:26
  Speaker 1: But so you're falling asleep falling asleep, like Dylan.
• 20:28
  Speaker 1: A couple of times like, hey, hey, hey, you know, like watching me like kind of like fall like towards the edge because it's just a drop, you know.
• 20:35
  Speaker 1: Jeez.
• 20:36
  Speaker 1: And I'd my biggest thing was like just make it to the next switchback, like make it to the corner of the switchback.
• 20:42
  Speaker 1: If I can make it there, I can I can stop.
• 20:44
  Speaker 1: Like that was my like deal with myself.
• 20:46
  Speaker 1: Just like make it back to the corner, you can stop.
• 20:48
  Speaker 1: So I get there, I put my head on my poles, and like I had to fall asleep, yeah.
• 20:51
  Speaker 1: And then don't be like, hey, like let's keep playing, man.
• 20:54
  Speaker 1: And yeah, he was fighting his own thing as well because it was tough, like it's a really nasty ascent.
• 21:00
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and then we get to the top as the sun is like coming up, and it's gorgeous, it's beautiful.
• 21:06
  Speaker 1: We find life again.
• 21:08
  Speaker 1: I literally hugged the there's like this thing and some rocks at the top of Hope Pass, and I just like literally just sat there and hugged it for a minute because I was like, I just needed like we just made it, yeah, had to get back here.
• 21:20
  Speaker: Nick Bear's right, it was evil, but we made it.
• 21:23
  Speaker 1: Yes, I was like, that is evil, like that is actually evil, especially in that setting that we did it in.
• 21:29
  Speaker 1: Like, if you ever want to challenge yourself, yeah, drive to Leadville or drive to Twin Lakes in the middle of the night and run Hope Pass in the pitch black.
• 21:36
  Speaker: I mean, dude, that's it's kind of good training because like I'm sure you were just exhausted by the time that you did that in the actual race.
• 21:43
  Speaker 1: But we had such a good like coming down though, with the sun up and like feeling reinvigorated.
• 21:49
  Speaker 1: Like we killed it coming down, and so that was like kind of you know, brought it full circle from this like just miserable experience to like heck yeah, like we just crushed that.
• 21:59
  Speaker 1: And so once we did that, I was like, okay, the deal I started making with myself, you know, because that's you know, an aspect of ultra running is just like making deals with yourself the whole way.
• 22:12
  Speaker 1: And so right then I was like, okay, if I can get back to the top of Hope Pass on race day, I can finish this thing.
• 22:21
  Speaker: Yeah.
• 22:21
  Speaker 1: Like there, there's there can't be anything like harder than that.
• 22:24
  Speaker: Because then after that, what's the terrain like?
• 22:26
  Speaker: It's I guess we'll still sucks, but still hard.
• 22:32
  Speaker 1: It's still very difficult.
• 22:33
  Speaker 1: It's it was actually more gain and difficulty than I had probably than I had just given it credit for.
• 22:40
  Speaker 1: Not that it was like cracked up to be, but more than I had like given it credit for.
• 22:44
  Speaker 1: In my head, it was like you just gotta deal with hope, and then everything else is kind of like a fire road, like chilling trail run.
• 22:50
  Speaker 1: And that's not all the way true.
• 22:52
  Speaker 1: It's like still pretty difficult on the way back.
• 22:55
  Speaker 1: I found out.
• 22:56
  Speaker 1: And then there's also an aspect of difficulty just being 80 miles into a race.
• 23:01
  Speaker 1: Like I can't imagine stuff that wouldn't have phased you at mile 20 is like very freaking hard.
• 23:06
  Speaker: Yeah, dude, I can't imagine.
• 23:08
  Speaker: Which we'll talk about.
• 23:10
  Speaker: I want to I want to hear all about that.
• 23:12
  Speaker: But like, yeah, so you're I mean, that that is a huge piece of ultra running.
• 23:16
  Speaker: I've learned like even just the training and stuff is yeah, you gotta make deals with yourself.
• 23:19
  Speaker: Yeah, like I've done the same thing um where I'm running like my last 50k, it was like around mile 22, and then that's like I'm pretty sure that's where all the elevation gain was for the next like four miles, and it was like 4,000.
• 23:33
  Speaker: Ouch.
• 23:34
  Speaker: Um, and so I just kept telling myself, like, okay, I'll run until I hit a mile and then walk for like a quarter mile and then keep running and like just do those kinds of things.
• 23:43
  Speaker: But um, I I think it helps you stay sane.
• 23:45
  Speaker: Oh, yeah, you have to make deals with yourself.
• 23:48
  Speaker 1: Like, yeah, they've got to be like non-negotiable too.
• 23:51
  Speaker 1: Like, you know, realistic deals like mine.
• 23:54
  Speaker 1: I don't know how far the switchbacks were.
• 23:56
  Speaker 1: They could have been a quarter mile, they could have been a tenth of a mile.
• 23:59
  Speaker 1: I don't know, I don't know.
• 24:00
  Speaker 1: I can go back and look it up, but it was all just a lot at the time, and so it's like the little deals of like, okay, make it to that corner, make it to that corner, make it to that.
• 24:08
  Speaker 1: That's ultra running in a nutshell is like make it you know X to X and keep going.
• 24:14
  Speaker 1: And so thankfully, like once we did Hope Pass and you know got back home.
• 24:19
  Speaker 1: I we drove back home right after that.
• 24:22
  Speaker 1: We didn't sleep, we just that was dumb, that was dangerous.
• 24:26
  Speaker 1: Don't do that.
• 24:26
  Speaker 1: Yeah, um that's we kind of had to switch drivers a few times because we were just you know you're fading a little bit, but don't do counting monsters the whole time.
• 24:34
  Speaker 1: But that like gave me hope.
• 24:36
  Speaker 1: I was like, okay, you know, I I feel significantly under trained, but I've got a chance.
• 24:43
  Speaker 1: There's a chance I can do this.
• 24:45
  Speaker 1: And um I had that was right before the last deferral point.
• 24:52
  Speaker: Oh dang, okay.
• 24:53
  Speaker 1: I didn't even I had X'd it out of my head.
• 24:55
  Speaker 1: I was like, because you know, I called my wife as soon as I had found out I'm getting in, yeah, and I was like, you know, tripping, because I'm like, I'm so like I'm not, but she's like, well, can you just like defer to the next year?
• 25:07
  Speaker 1: And I was like, yes, technically, but like not an option.
• 25:10
  Speaker 1: I'm not putting that on the table.
• 25:11
  Speaker 1: Like, yeah, this is it.
• 25:13
  Speaker 1: I got drawn for a reason, you know, whatever the bigger reason is here, it's my time to do it, whether I'm ready or not.
• 25:19
  Speaker 1: And so I tried to take deferral all the way off the table, and then I kind of re I allowed myself to re-look at it um with the Achilles thing.
• 25:28
  Speaker 1: And not even like initially, I waited until you know the middle of July, and then I was like, okay, my Achilles is still not perfect, like this is getting dangerously close.
• 25:39
  Speaker 1: Yeah, my deferral date's dangerously close, and so I was kind of I was really looking at it, and I'd you know, I'd been texting Dylan a lot about you know pros and cons of deferring and whatnot, and everything led to like defer, for sure defer.
• 25:54
  Speaker 1: Yeah, because then it was like, oh man, I can get fully healthy, go have you know, effectively close to a year of just like knockout, drag out training, and that was really tempting.
• 26:05
  Speaker 1: So I was like, then I can put my best foot forward because I really respect, respected, still respect, but like before I did it, I really respected the race.
• 26:13
  Speaker 1: Yeah, because it's like I know how hard like a 50k is, right?
• 26:18
  Speaker 1: And so I'm like, you know, 3x plus that plus 3x times the elevation that I'm used to.
• 26:25
  Speaker: And so it was your first like night race besides like Ragnar and things, yeah.
• 26:30
  Speaker 1: Okay, yeah, Ragnar, that yeah, that experience is probably my first time running overnight.
• 26:35
  Speaker 1: This is like a different animal, man.
• 26:38
  Speaker: Yeah, but yeah, I mean that's something that's like like I was talking to Jace about this, and he told a story on the podcast, which you probably remember, like where you were you guys did, or maybe he didn't tell this, he might have told it afterwards, but you guys did like um uh a Spartan race.
• 26:55
  Speaker: Yeah, but it was uh the what's the hardest one called?
• 26:58
  Speaker: The Beast.
• 26:59
  Speaker: The Beast.
• 27:00
  Speaker: The beat, yeah.
• 27:00
  Speaker: Yeah, and he's like you guys showed up kind of unprepared or underprepared, you didn't have like water and stuff like that.
• 27:06
  Speaker: And so um he was saying, like, you were getting like heat stroke or something, your body was shutting down.
• 27:12
  Speaker 1: That like took me out pretty hard.
• 27:14
  Speaker: That's what he was saying, brutal.
• 27:16
  Speaker: Um, and he was like, Do you want to stop?
• 27:17
  Speaker: Like, and you're like, No, let's just finish this thing.
• 27:20
  Speaker: Like, that is something I think is so rare, and like even now you're telling me you're like, you know, the deferral thing.
• 27:26
  Speaker: I think anyone would look at like your Achilles and be like, you know, maybe maybe I take that as a sign, like I'm gonna do this.
• 27:31
  Speaker: But um, where's that come from?
• 27:33
  Speaker: Where you're just like you literally have that dog where you just don't stop.
• 27:36
  Speaker: Like, where's that from?
• 27:38
  Speaker 1: I wish I wish I had like a real answer for that.
• 27:41
  Speaker 1: I I don't know.
• 27:43
  Speaker 1: Um underlying thing.
• 27:48
  Speaker 1: I don't know, childhood.
• 27:49
  Speaker 1: There's probably I should probably unwind that with a therapist, and I've you know just chosen to run instead.
• 27:54
  Speaker 1: Hey, I mean it works.
• 27:55
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I don't know.
• 27:56
  Speaker 1: There's there's something in there that I don't want to quit.
• 27:59
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I I hate that idea.
• 28:02
  Speaker 1: Um it's just I don't want to.
• 28:05
  Speaker 1: And yeah, I I bought that same shirt that Mason has that says like um therapy, medication, running, but then like therapy and medication are like, I'll cross that, yeah.
• 28:15
  Speaker: Yeah, dude.
• 28:16
  Speaker: I mean, it really is something.
• 28:18
  Speaker: Like um, I you I've probably I don't know.
• 28:22
  Speaker: You may have might have heard on the podcast, like I've shared mental health struggles sometimes, and yeah, like running does that for me.
• 28:28
  Speaker: And the reason I'm out there as much as I I can be, um, is because like one, I was sick a long time ago, like 2021, um thought I was dying, and then like I've struggled with mental health kind of since then.
• 28:42
  Speaker: Um, but it's kind of like what you're saying, like I just I know that I can do these things, and like if not, at least I give it a shot.
• 28:49
  Speaker: Um like but I don't know.
• 28:51
  Speaker: I mean, everyone has their own reasons, and like I don't you'll probably figure it out at some point, but like I think it's just really like I I admire that.
• 29:00
  Speaker: I think a lot of people admire that too.
• 29:01
  Speaker: It's just like you know what?
• 29:02
  Speaker: Like, I'm just gonna go for it and give it my best.
• 29:05
  Speaker: Um, and then that led you to like getting in to the Bloodville and showing up at the star line, like that's nuts.
• 29:12
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it the whole thing was nuts to be honest.
• 29:15
  Speaker: So, like from when you did Hope's Pass, how long until you actually ran the race.
• 29:22
  Speaker 1: Uh, we could fact check me, but I want to say that was three weeks before the race.
• 29:25
  Speaker 1: Okay, all right.
• 29:26
  Speaker 1: Um, because that was kind of like my big last uh what are they like peak week ish, last big, big thing I was gonna do.
• 29:32
  Speaker 1: I did some smaller um trail runs just locally in Pleasant Grove after that, but that was like kind of the you know, the big dog for the training block.
• 29:43
  Speaker: Dang, okay.
• 29:44
  Speaker 1: Um so yeah, that was three weeks, and then I didn't like taper a ton just because I hadn't respected my block enough.
• 29:51
  Speaker 1: I didn't get up to enough mileage for me to be like, oh, you're gonna take two full weeks to taper.
• 29:56
  Speaker: That would be the same.
• 29:57
  Speaker: I'd be doing the same thing.
• 29:58
  Speaker: Like, I didn't I didn't do it, so we're gonna stay consistent.
• 30:01
  Speaker 1: So I I I just stayed in it.
• 30:02
  Speaker 1: I did, you know, kind of taper off that last week uh heading into it.
• 30:06
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 30:07
  Speaker 1: And then we did a shakeout run with Andy Glaze the day before.
• 30:10
  Speaker 1: That's so cool.
• 30:11
  Speaker 1: And that was super cool.
• 30:12
  Speaker 1: Was able to run with him for a good, I don't know, mile, a good 10 minutes or so of that.
• 30:18
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and he's just such a stand-up guy.
• 30:20
  Speaker 1: Like he's such a stud.
• 30:21
  Speaker 1: And so it was cool to go on that run with him.
• 30:24
  Speaker 1: And then I did run with him on race day for probably close to two miles.
• 30:28
  Speaker: You guys were pretty close.
• 30:30
  Speaker 1: He he's a beast.
• 30:32
  Speaker 1: I could he had because what a I don't know, maybe they all do, but he had just a lot of people didn't know he had just come off of that last man standing or last Soul Ultra, whatever the name of it was in Germany.
• 30:42
  Speaker 1: Oh, right, yeah.
• 30:43
  Speaker 1: He had just come off of that where he did pretty close to 100 miles, 90 something, I can't remember.
• 30:48
  Speaker 1: Yeah, but either way, like that was you know four or five days before Leadville.
• 30:53
  Speaker: Yeah, that's nuts.
• 30:54
  Speaker 1: And he had just done basically a hundred miles, and then he leaves Leadville.
• 30:58
  Speaker 1: We were talking about it um while he and I were running together.
• 31:01
  Speaker 1: He was like flying home from Leadville the next night, and then he had like a day or something to pack in California, and then he's catching a flight to France where he did the UTMB championship.
• 31:12
  Speaker 1: No way, and so it's like dude did three of some of the hardest racing within like uh two weeks, less than two weeks, because of the way, and you know, and then going international and all the like nuances there, time changes and stuff.
• 31:28
  Speaker 1: Like he's insane, built so different, and a lot of it, um, and I think he would agree is is consistency.
• 31:34
  Speaker 1: He's put that he's put in enough effort over the years to be able to do something like that.
• 31:40
  Speaker 1: I have not, I'm like still really, really fresh on ultra running, running in general, let alone ultra, but like still very fresh.
• 31:48
  Speaker 1: And he's been like doing hundred mile weeks for years, yeah, five or six.
• 31:53
  Speaker 1: He has a crazy like crazy amount of years doing hundred mile weeks.
• 31:58
  Speaker 1: Because people would ask me, like, how is he doing that?
• 32:00
  Speaker 1: It's like one, yeah, he is built different for sure, but also just you know, compounding interests.
• 32:06
  Speaker 1: Like he just he just put that in, he's put in that work, and if you want to do those kinds of crazy things, you have to put in the work beforehand.
• 32:13
  Speaker 1: And he's he's earned earned the right to go and do those things because he has put in that much work, yeah.
• 32:20
  Speaker 1: And he's nuts, yeah.
• 32:21
  Speaker 1: But that's so cool.
• 32:22
  Speaker: Like, what a what a cool experience to be able to run with like one of the that's like kind of an ultrarunning equivalent of someone like LeBron James or like Tom Brady.
• 32:31
  Speaker 1: That's what one of my favorite things about ultrarunning is is like I'll never be able to like you know sign up for a basketball tournament and play against LeBron James.
• 32:39
  Speaker 1: Like that doesn't work, you know, or some kind of NFL thing and play against Tom.
• 32:43
  Speaker 1: Like that doesn't work, but an ultra running, I can tow the line with like Andy Glaze, with you know, this um one of my other favorite runners, Mikey Mitchell.
• 32:52
  Speaker 1: He was there the race.
• 32:53
  Speaker 1: I think he took fourth overall, but it was like you know, I gotta tow the line with these guys, gotta pass them on the course.
• 32:59
  Speaker 1: Um, gave nuts to Eli uh Webby, oh yeah, whatever you say his last name.
• 33:04
  Speaker 1: Yes.
• 33:04
  Speaker 1: Him and Andy are good buddies, I think.
• 33:05
  Speaker 1: He's pretty stacked too.
• 33:07
  Speaker 1: He's one of the bigger guys on the stage.
• 33:09
  Speaker 1: It's like there's no other sport where you can do that.
• 33:12
  Speaker 1: Yeah, you know, like thankfully, Ultra Running is still at this spot where you can go toe-to-toe with the best.
• 33:18
  Speaker: Yeah, the elites.
• 33:19
  Speaker 1: Are they gonna wipe the floor with me?
• 33:21
  Speaker 1: Yes.
• 33:21
  Speaker 1: For sure, they killed me on that course.
• 33:24
  Speaker 1: The dude who won it beat me by like a cush, like 14 or 13 hours and like 51 minutes or something.
• 33:31
  Speaker 1: What was the time?
• 33:32
  Speaker 1: That's insane.
• 33:33
  Speaker 1: Like a 1540.
• 33:34
  Speaker 1: Oh my gosh.
• 33:35
  Speaker 1: Yeah, he didn't quite set the course record, so David Roach still has that.
• 33:38
  Speaker 1: But like that's insane though.
• 33:40
  Speaker 1: That's so fast.
• 33:41
  Speaker 1: So fast, insane, like insane.
• 33:44
  Speaker: I can't even imagine the pace for that.
• 33:45
  Speaker 1: He was done before I even started the night running.
• 33:48
  Speaker 1: I was just like, bruh.
• 33:50
  Speaker: Yeah, that is brutal.
• 33:51
  Speaker 1: And that's one of my favorite aspects of ultra running is like we can run with the best of the best.
• 33:57
  Speaker: Yeah.
• 33:57
  Speaker 1: And you know, you can't do that in like literally, I think any other sport for the most part.
• 34:01
  Speaker 1: Yeah, you gotta work your way up.
• 34:03
  Speaker: But so what was it like when you race day comes and I can't imagine the nerves, but then you toe up to the line, like what's going through your head?
• 34:13
  Speaker 1: So I slept for crap the night before.
• 34:16
  Speaker: Oh, I think, yeah, I can imagine, dude.
• 34:18
  Speaker 1: Slept, and then the worst part was is I had also slept bad that previous night.
• 34:22
  Speaker: Oh man.
• 34:23
  Speaker 1: We had got to Colorado, you know, two days early.
• 34:26
  Speaker 1: Um, I was that uh Thursday into Friday was supposed to be like big good sleep, you know.
• 34:33
  Speaker 1: I don't know if that's what you prioritize, but I always try to prioritize that second sleep before the race because you know the race night is going to be kind of rough.
• 34:40
  Speaker 1: So I always prioritized that day before, and I just didn't sleep good.
• 34:45
  Speaker 1: It didn't seem like nerves.
• 34:47
  Speaker 1: I wasn't like up all night tossing about oh, the race.
• 34:49
  Speaker 1: It was just like I just didn't sleep good.
• 34:52
  Speaker 1: I don't know.
• 34:52
  Speaker 1: I was in like a new bed in the Airbnb.
• 34:54
  Speaker 1: I don't know.
• 34:55
  Speaker 1: I didn't sleep well, and so I was not stoked about that.
• 34:58
  Speaker 1: And then to not sleep well again the night before the race, that was also just like not great, didn't enjoy that.
• 35:05
  Speaker 1: But race day race day happens.
• 35:11
  Speaker 1: We wake up at 2 a.m.
• 35:12
  Speaker 1: Which is brutal.
• 35:14
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it is brutal.
• 35:14
  Speaker 1: What time did the race now?
• 35:15
  Speaker 1: That's brutal.
• 35:16
  Speaker 1: Race kicked off at four, so gun went off at four a.m.
• 35:19
  Speaker 1: Um, we stayed in copper, which is like 30 minutes-ish out of Leadville.
• 35:24
  Speaker 1: Dang, and so we're up at two, and I wake up and my stomach is just like churning.
• 35:29
  Speaker 1: Oh, it it may have just been nerves, but it like it just didn't feel right.
• 35:35
  Speaker 1: My gut just felt unsettled.
• 35:37
  Speaker 1: And so, you know, my plan to go eat all the specific amount of carbs and whatever before the race just kind of goes to crap because my gut hurts.
• 35:46
  Speaker 1: I don't want to like it's hard to put food on a like hurting stomach.
• 35:52
  Speaker: Yeah, and did you like carb load before?
• 35:54
  Speaker 1: I had tried like pretty good to carb load, you know, two days and then one day we'd had like a big pasta the night before, which was really good.
• 36:02
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and I felt like that stuff all set mostly well.
• 36:05
  Speaker 1: Um, I didn't feel like it was any of my like pre-race meals or anything that did it to me.
• 36:10
  Speaker 1: So it could have just been nerds.
• 36:12
  Speaker: When I when I carb load like the day of the race, I'm like, this is the last thing I want to do, is like eat another bagel or banana on my bagel, like, oh, can't do it.
• 36:20
  Speaker: But more of the things.
• 36:20
  Speaker: Yeah, so I don't know.
• 36:21
  Speaker: Yeah, exactly.
• 36:22
  Speaker: Give me another two cups of rice.
• 36:24
  Speaker 1: And so, you know, that's immediately like in my head a little bit, is like I'm not on my nutrition, and we've not even started.
• 36:31
  Speaker 1: Right, right.
• 36:32
  Speaker 1: But we're driving to uh Leadville.
• 36:36
  Speaker 1: It's you know, again, pitch black, it's three-ish in the morning at this point.
• 36:40
  Speaker 1: And um, it's Dylan, me, and then my buddy Brandon in the back seat, and then my family and my uh my other crew, Willie, they were meeting us in Leadville.
• 36:53
  Speaker 1: And so we're driving in, and I'm like high key, you know, not panicking, but I'm just like just like all right, it's coming.
• 37:02
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I just like I couldn't, I was like, it's real, like this is now, this is real, and so and we were in silence.
• 37:10
  Speaker 1: I don't know, Dylan didn't have his music on or something, so I was like, dude, can I play something?
• 37:14
  Speaker 1: So I like grab the you know, and I turn on some music, and that finally, like, okay, all right, just breathe, just breathe.
• 37:21
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and so we get there, we get to the starting line, or we get to like the corral before the starting line.
• 37:28
  Speaker 1: I'm like saying hi, like hi and bye to like my parents and some friends and stuff who were there, and it's just so much.
• 37:38
  Speaker 1: Like, I I just felt such a weight, yeah, just overwhelming.
• 37:42
  Speaker 1: Oh, yeah, yeah, man.
• 37:44
  Speaker 1: And Goggins had kind of said this in his book when he I think it might have even been about Leadville.
• 37:49
  Speaker 1: Um, I think it was in uh his second book, uh, Never Finished.
• 37:53
  Speaker 1: But he I think I'm pretty sure it is Leadville.
• 37:55
  Speaker 1: He talks about going back to Leadville after having not done it for X amount of years and how that was his first experience on how Ultra Running had changed since he had kind of done it from back in the day.
• 38:05
  Speaker 1: Yeah, but anyway, he says this part where it's like all these people around him are very excited, the energy is really high, they've all got smiles on their face, and he's just like stoic and kind of locked in because he knows what's coming.
• 38:19
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and it's hard for him to be like all super pumped, yeah.
• 38:22
  Speaker 1: Yeah, because he knows what's coming.
• 38:24
  Speaker 1: And I I kind of felt like that.
• 38:25
  Speaker 1: Like people around me, everybody's cheering, the vibes are great, great vibes, super awesome.
• 38:30
  Speaker 1: Love at that, but I was just like, it was really hard for me to like you know, do that, get amped up because I was just like, You did hope's past.
• 38:39
  Speaker 1: I understood what was coming.
• 38:41
  Speaker 1: I was like, I know what I'm about to like try and do, and it's heavy, it's heavy, and I could feel that from the jump, and even you know, as they count down the whistle, I don't think there was a part of me that ever got like amped up and excited because I just like I had this understanding about what I was about to put myself through, and it's terrifying, it's hard to tow a line when you kind of know and respect what you're about to go through, yeah, and that was brutal.
• 39:10
  Speaker 1: Uh but we made it and the gun went off.
• 39:13
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and the other race started, and yeah, it's wild from there.
• 39:18
  Speaker 1: It's people go out hard, yeah.
• 39:22
  Speaker 1: That's just and I I wanted to not do that, but I also knew I had to bank time.
• 39:27
  Speaker 1: Banking time was because I knew what Hope Pass was.
• 39:31
  Speaker 1: I talked to people the day before, and that was one of my biggest questions to a lot of them was like, Did you come and practice Hope Pass?
• 39:37
  Speaker 1: And a lot of them said no.
• 39:39
  Speaker 1: And I was just like, dude, like please like give yourself time for it.
• 39:44
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it's it's tough.
• 39:45
  Speaker 1: And I did it on like arguably fresh legs, right?
• 39:48
  Speaker 1: And now I'm gonna have to do it at yeah.
• 39:50
  Speaker 1: How long into the race is it?
• 39:52
  Speaker 1: How many miles?
• 39:53
  Speaker 1: Uh Twin Lakes is 40.
• 39:56
  Speaker: Okay.
• 39:56
  Speaker 1: Starting it at 40, yeah, 40 miles.
• 39:58
  Speaker 1: Starting it at 40 miles.
• 40:00
  Speaker: Yeah.
• 40:00
  Speaker 1: So I had started it fresh and it had destroyed me.
• 40:03
  Speaker 1: Now I've got to start it at 40 miles.
• 40:05
  Speaker 1: Yeah, that's right.
• 40:06
  Speaker 1: So I'm like, I'm really I I knew I had to bank time.
• 40:10
  Speaker 1: So I start this race, and again, my stomach hurts.
• 40:14
  Speaker 1: Like I'm running and I'm I'm like two miles in, and I'm having these thoughts of like, this is so dumb.
• 40:20
  Speaker 1: Like, I cannot believe I have you know 98 miles to go and like my stomach hurts.
• 40:26
  Speaker 1: Like, this is I I was not discouraged, not wanting to quit.
• 40:30
  Speaker 1: Like, I was just like, I was just kind of frustrated.
• 40:33
  Speaker 1: I was like kind of annoyed.
• 40:34
  Speaker 1: It's like this is so dumb.
• 40:35
  Speaker 1: Like, my stomach hurts right now.
• 40:37
  Speaker 1: And then that was actually when I ran into Andy.
• 40:41
  Speaker: Oh, really?
• 40:41
  Speaker 1: Okay, and and that was great timing because you know, like it's Mr.
• 40:45
  Speaker 1: Positive, get out of your head.
• 40:46
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and I was wearing I wore his hat for the race.
• 40:49
  Speaker 1: That was that's cool.
• 40:50
  Speaker 1: Uh the smile you're doing it wrong.
• 40:52
  Speaker 1: Yeah, smile or you're doing it wrong.
• 40:53
  Speaker 1: And it was the one that's like pretty colorful, and he was wearing it too.
• 40:56
  Speaker 1: So that's kind of how I like re-broke the ice from the day before as I like rolled up on him.
• 41:01
  Speaker 1: He kind of looked over and I was like, That's a pretty cool hat, man.
• 41:04
  Speaker 1: And then he's like, and he like, you know, he cracked a joke about how it was gonna help me finish or something.
• 41:10
  Speaker 1: And dang.
• 41:10
  Speaker 1: And then we, you know, we ran together for probably a good mile and a half, two miles.
• 41:14
  Speaker 1: And then he, I think he actually, I think we stopped running together because he had to go to the bathroom.
• 41:18
  Speaker 1: He's like, so he built up, yeah.
• 41:20
  Speaker 1: It was literally that quick, too.
• 41:21
  Speaker 1: He's just like, I think I'm gonna go pee, and just like bounced into this bush.
• 41:24
  Speaker 1: And I was like, All right, peace.
• 41:27
  Speaker: Wearing his little uh his little one.
• 41:29
  Speaker: His jorts dude, yeah.
• 41:30
  Speaker 1: Yes, which I have the same pair.
• 41:32
  Speaker 1: I just I didn't want to wear them for the race.
• 41:34
  Speaker 1: I thought about wearing them for the race, and I was like, no, yeah, mostly because I want pockets.
• 41:38
  Speaker 1: That's the only downfall to those shorts.
• 41:39
  Speaker 1: We all have them because like you know, we did our our camo commando crew when we like the jorts with the camo and yeah, whole thing, but they just don't have pockets, so I didn't want to wear them for that run.
• 41:51
  Speaker: That makes sense.
• 41:52
  Speaker 1: Um, and so I'm going after Andy, I'm like feeling a little bit better.
• 41:56
  Speaker 1: Yeah, other than like I think it was about mile six, we hit like some incline and I had gone from kind of passing people to like all of a sudden I'm just being like overtaken by what I thought was like a lot of people, yeah.
• 42:12
  Speaker 1: And I was like, what the heck?
• 42:14
  Speaker 1: Because I'm like trying not to push too hard too early, makes sense.
• 42:17
  Speaker 1: You know, I want to bank time, so I am like pushing a little bit, but I didn't want to like take myself out of the race that early.
• 42:24
  Speaker 1: And so I was kind of getting a little discouraged again because it's like, man, I'm just getting gapped by all these people.
• 42:29
  Speaker 1: And we get to the first aid station, it's about 10 miles deep.
• 42:33
  Speaker 1: And when I got there, it was fully stocked, had water, had gels and stuff.
• 42:39
  Speaker 1: Come to find out later, like, and and this kind of helped me like perspective where I was.
• 42:44
  Speaker 1: Um, I had to have been, I guess, in the first, you know, half of the race.
• 42:48
  Speaker 1: I was with, I guess, kind of not the leaders, but you know, the front group, top 50%, because I had no idea that later on that station ran out of water and stuff.
• 42:58
  Speaker: Oh, really?
• 42:59
  Speaker 1: And that like got all their really messed up a lot of people's race.
• 43:02
  Speaker 1: And I I feel bad for that, but I I also part of me is like, you gotta be better prepared than that.
• 43:08
  Speaker 1: Yeah, you know, that's fair.
• 43:09
  Speaker 1: Like, it's a hundred miles.
• 43:11
  Speaker: Yeah, it's a hundred mile race.
• 43:12
  Speaker 1: I had packed my bag for what I felt like could sustain 20 um because they had said in like their I I had felt like their communication was good about it.
• 43:21
  Speaker 1: Yeah, like this is just gonna be a very basic aid station.
• 43:24
  Speaker 1: Um, I think they may have even said, like, don't really count on it.
• 43:28
  Speaker 1: And so I didn't count on it at all.
• 43:29
  Speaker 1: I knew we had our big aid station at mile like 20-ish or something like that.
• 43:33
  Speaker 1: And so I had kind of packed my bag accordingly, which was heavy.
• 43:36
  Speaker 1: Yeah, like granted that'll be.
• 43:37
  Speaker 1: I think I was dumb for not weighing it.
• 43:43
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 43:44
  Speaker 1: But my best guess is somewhere between 12 and 18 pounds.
• 43:48
  Speaker: Oh wow.
• 43:49
  Speaker 1: Yeah, because it's not like crazy.
• 43:50
  Speaker 1: No, it's not a 50 pound ruck, but it's also not negligible.
• 43:53
  Speaker: I mean, after like you know, 50 miles, you're gonna feel definitely not negligible.
• 43:57
  Speaker 1: Um, especially just like on the shoulders or One of the weirdest parts after the race was how sore my traps were.
• 44:03
  Speaker 1: Really?
• 44:04
  Speaker 1: They were like literally sore to the touch.
• 44:06
  Speaker 1: So I think someone it might have been my dad had come up to like, you know, give you like the neck rub and he hadn't even like put pressure on yet.
• 44:13
  Speaker 1: He just like touched it, and I was like, Oh, you're like, Well no, do not do that.
• 44:18
  Speaker 1: And then I touched it and I was like, Oh man, okay, yeah, like don't touch the traps right now.
• 44:22
  Speaker 1: Like, they are not chilled, they're in a bad way.
• 44:26
  Speaker 1: Don't touch my traps.
• 44:27
  Speaker 1: So, anyway, that was a side tangent, but like that was just a weird thing.
• 44:30
  Speaker 1: And I assume a lot of it had to be from the bag, from the polls, from just you know, running stance for so long.
• 44:37
  Speaker 1: Like, for but yeah, I guess that 10 mile aid station kind of ruined a lot of people's race.
• 44:42
  Speaker 1: I saw like I was part of a Leadville Facebook group, and yeah, a lot of people were really upset by that.
• 44:48
  Speaker 1: That like that aid station ran out of stuff.
• 44:51
  Speaker 1: Um, but thankfully, you know, I got through it, and I actually like that aid station had kind of been at the top of like the first section of hills, and then right after it just like it nuked back down.
• 45:02
  Speaker 1: Um it goes into uh oh, I'm gonna suck with the names.
• 45:07
  Speaker 1: Uh beautiful lake.
• 45:09
  Speaker 1: Uh Dylan would know it because it's where we like ran with Andy.
• 45:13
  Speaker 1: Uh not important, but you drop back into this lake, which is really beautiful.
• 45:17
  Speaker 1: But it was like a nice downhill part of it was paved, and so that was smooth, felt really good, kind of let my legs go up.
• 45:24
  Speaker: I bet that's nice.
• 45:25
  Speaker 1: Yeah, because it was runnable downhill, you know.
• 45:27
  Speaker 1: We'll get to the downhill that sucks, but like this was like nice, runnable downhill, yeah.
• 45:32
  Speaker 1: And really enjoyed that, kind of reignited, like you know, and I mean it's so early.
• 45:38
  Speaker 1: I'm saying reignited, but it did.
• 45:39
  Speaker 1: It like you know, sparked me up a little bit.
• 45:41
  Speaker 1: I was like, this is fun, and I I'm I've done a lot of downhill road races, and so I had fun with it.
• 45:47
  Speaker 1: I'm passing people, I'm like enjoying myself.
• 45:50
  Speaker: Yeah, you feel good.
• 45:51
  Speaker 1: Felt great, and we hit the trail along the lake, and it's just beautiful, absolutely beautiful.
• 45:58
  Speaker: I mean, Colorado Mountains are insane, man.
• 45:59
  Speaker 1: Yes, and the lake is like very blue, and the trail, it's not like this crazy, it's just like you know, subtle rollers, which is awesome.
• 46:07
  Speaker 1: Kind of the best terrain to run on, in my opinion.
• 46:10
  Speaker 1: And so you know, I'm I'm chilling, I'm holding really good pace through the hills.
• 46:15
  Speaker 1: I feel really good.
• 46:16
  Speaker 1: We're obviously still really early in the race, but like I feel great, and then I start to feel like a hot spot coming on, and I was like, that's bad.
• 46:27
  Speaker 1: Like, no hot spots this early.
• 46:28
  Speaker 1: That's bad news.
• 46:29
  Speaker 1: Like, no, and so I like pull out my phone and I had expected my crew to be at mile 20.
• 46:37
  Speaker: Um, because yeah, were there certain points that they could be at?
• 46:40
  Speaker 1: Yes, okay, and they were supposed to be able to be from our understanding of the way that they had broken down like the layout, yeah, they had the opportunity to be at mile 20.
• 46:51
  Speaker 1: But then I guess that wasn't actually the case.
• 46:53
  Speaker 1: I don't know.
• 46:54
  Speaker 1: So I had text them, they were like, yo, don't count on it, like you know, something messed up.
• 46:59
  Speaker 1: We're probably not gonna be there.
• 47:01
  Speaker 1: Count on us at the next one, which is mile 26.
• 47:03
  Speaker 1: Okay.
• 47:04
  Speaker 1: And so I was like, that's really not ideal because I can feel this hot spot, right?
• 47:08
  Speaker 1: You know, and I think at the time, um, I was like eight miles out, I was probably around mile 18.
• 47:13
  Speaker 1: And I was like, that's a lot of miles to put on a hotspot.
• 47:15
  Speaker: Right.
• 47:16
  Speaker 1: Um, that's gonna turn into like a nasty blister and it's gonna affect my day.
• 47:19
  Speaker: Random question: what shoes were you wearing?
• 47:22
  Speaker 1: Great question.
• 47:23
  Speaker 1: So I started the race in a pair of on cloud ultra pros.
• 47:28
  Speaker 1: Okay.
• 47:28
  Speaker 1: There's a uh from my understanding, that's a very distinct difference.
• 47:32
  Speaker 1: The cloud ultras are supposedly like a very okay shoe.
• 47:36
  Speaker 1: Yeah, the cloud ultra pros, fantastic.
• 47:39
  Speaker: Really?
• 47:39
  Speaker: Okay.
• 47:40
  Speaker 1: I have not like field tested that myself, but that was just like all the reviews.
• 47:44
  Speaker 1: That's what everyone says.
• 47:44
  Speaker 1: Like, because the price difference is decent.
• 47:48
  Speaker 1: Yeah, so I wanted the cloud ultras.
• 47:50
  Speaker 1: My wallet wanted the cloud ultras, yeah.
• 47:52
  Speaker 1: But everyone has said, like, no, like get the pro.
• 47:55
  Speaker 1: And so, you know, sucked it up, got the pros.
• 47:58
  Speaker 1: They are awesome.
• 47:59
  Speaker 1: Really great shoe.
• 48:00
  Speaker 1: I have like, I don't know why something had jaded me towards like on for running shoes.
• 48:05
  Speaker 1: I've heard not the best things about them for running, so I feel like I don't know necessarily where I had heard that, but I was definitely jaded to not wear on running shoes.
• 48:14
  Speaker 1: And then when I was really researching, you know, a lot of people had said, like, you know, if I had to choose one, I think I'm going with the Cloud Ultra Pros.
• 48:23
  Speaker: Interesting.
• 48:24
  Speaker 1: So I I found thankfully, I found a pair on sale.
• 48:27
  Speaker 1: Um, I think they're still like 200 bucks, but they were on sale, and I remember taking them out for my first like trial run, and I was like, these are sick, this is the greatest shoe ever.
• 48:37
  Speaker 1: So I I just kind of like started watching the internet and I ended up getting a second pair.
• 48:40
  Speaker 1: Oh, really?
• 48:41
  Speaker 1: So I wore two pairs of on cloud ultra pros that day, and then I had also worn my uh Norda 001s.
• 48:49
  Speaker: Okay, man.
• 48:49
  Speaker: Um three pairs of shoes, three pairs of shoes, three pairs of shoes.
• 48:53
  Speaker 1: Makes sense though, and like yeah, I don't think I would have done it any other way.
• 48:57
  Speaker 1: Like, if if they had to force me to wear one pair of shoes, I do just because of the climbing, I think I would have gone with the Norda's.
• 49:08
  Speaker 1: Um just because I did not the on the ons were fantastic, even on like some climbing, yeah, but hope there's it's like a little more technical climbing, a lot more jagged rock type stuff that you're like coming off.
• 49:22
  Speaker 1: And so can you feel them more in the on clouds?
• 49:25
  Speaker: And or they're just like the stack heights higher, and so like ankle rollability is like escalated a lot.
• 49:32
  Speaker: Yeah, that makes sense.
• 49:34
  Speaker 1: And I think maybe had I sized down a little bit, it would have been a little better.
• 49:38
  Speaker 1: But I wanted them big because you know, I get pretty much all of my shoes in a size 13 for running anyway, just for like, you know, swelling and and whatnot, even though I'm more like a 12 to 12 and a half, but I get all my running shoes in a 13.
• 49:52
  Speaker 1: And the Norda in a 13, yeah, it's got a lower stack height, and it's just a lot, it's a little more of a secure feel, and so I wore the Norda's for Hope Pass.
• 50:02
  Speaker 1: So from mile 40 to mile 65, I was in the Norda's.
• 50:05
  Speaker 1: That makes sense, yeah.
• 50:05
  Speaker 1: But from open to 40, I was in the Cloud Ultra Pros that are purple, and then for 65 to close, I was in the uh the Cloud Ultra Pros that were yellow.
• 50:16
  Speaker 1: That's sweet.
• 50:17
  Speaker 1: I had three pairs of shoes, yeah, and I would recommend that to anybody.
• 50:21
  Speaker 1: If anyone who runs Leadville, I would recommend three shoes.
• 50:24
  Speaker: That makes sense, yeah.
• 50:25
  Speaker 1: Or at least the bare minimum a second shoe.
• 50:28
  Speaker 1: Do a separate shoe for Hope Pass because you get wet.
• 50:32
  Speaker 1: You have to go through a river.
• 50:34
  Speaker: Yeah, that's right.
• 50:35
  Speaker 1: And that sucks.
• 50:36
  Speaker 1: Don't like that.
• 50:37
  Speaker 1: Don't like running through water and then running for extended periods of time.
• 50:41
  Speaker: Yeah, because then your feet are just soaked.
• 50:42
  Speaker: Yeah, you get tons of blisters after you.
• 50:45
  Speaker 1: Man, yes, yeah, we'll we'll hear about that.
• 50:48
  Speaker 1: But oh it's so luckily though, I get to that mile 28 station and I just kind of refuel, you know, refill my bottles, grab some gels.
• 50:57
  Speaker 1: I had my own gels, but like they had uh never second.
• 51:00
  Speaker 1: You ever use those?
• 51:01
  Speaker: Huh?
• 51:01
  Speaker: Are they good?
• 51:02
  Speaker 1: Pretty bomb gel, really, like really good uh like nutrition facts.
• 51:07
  Speaker: Are they like 100 calories, like 20 carbs?
• 51:09
  Speaker 1: They're 30 grams of carbs.
• 51:10
  Speaker 1: Oh, nice, okay, and then 200 milligrams of sodium, which is plus because now you're getting a little bit of electrolyte with your gel.
• 51:17
  Speaker 1: And they tasted like mostly good.
• 51:20
  Speaker 1: My only beef with them was the way that they like rip.
• 51:22
  Speaker 1: I enjoy that.
• 51:24
  Speaker 1: I don't know.
• 51:24
  Speaker 1: Fix that if you see this.
• 51:26
  Speaker 1: Fix the way your gels rip.
• 51:28
  Speaker 1: Like, I don't know.
• 51:29
  Speaker 1: Come on.
• 51:30
  Speaker 1: So I was packaging, I was packing, you know, a handful of those each aid station, and then um, I take off from there from the mile 28 station, you go down like this really steep, and it's all of it's probably not even a quarter mile, just really steep drop onto this flat fire road.
• 51:46
  Speaker 1: So I'm on the fire road, and then I see like Dylan, Brandon, and Willie, my crew, standing at the edge of the road.
• 51:53
  Speaker 1: And I was like, what the heck are you guys doing?
• 51:56
  Speaker 1: And they're like, hey man, like how's it going?
• 51:57
  Speaker 1: And I just immediately go into like, oh, they're here like in crew mode.
• 52:01
  Speaker 1: So I'm like, I just immediately like whip my shoe off.
• 52:03
  Speaker 1: I was like, here's the hot spot, like fix this right now.
• 52:05
  Speaker 1: And they're like, We're not like really supposed to like crew here, we're not supposed to.
• 52:09
  Speaker: Oh, so they just like jumped down.
• 52:11
  Speaker 1: Like there was like other spectators along the side as well, so they weren't like, you know, I don't feel like they were breaking any rules.
• 52:17
  Speaker 1: Yeah, they were really worried that they were breaking rules and didn't want to like get me in trouble.
• 52:20
  Speaker 1: Yeah, that's fair.
• 52:21
  Speaker 1: And so mad.
• 52:23
  Speaker 1: But I'd already like taken my shoe and like pulled my sock off because I'm like, fix this hot spot right now.
• 52:28
  Speaker 1: So they're like hurrying as fast as they can to like fix it, which is you know, I'll have to I'll have to go off on a tangent about the crew in a bit because those dudes just crush it so awesome.
• 52:39
  Speaker 1: But we get through, they get my shoe back on, I'm in really high spirits, they're telling me to slow down, and I'm just like, nah, like we're going.
• 52:46
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I feel good.
• 52:47
  Speaker 1: And so I I go, I take off, I do the next six miles at a really good clip for someone of what I'm running it at.
• 52:55
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and so we get to that first marathon being over, and that's like kind of a hub aid station.
• 53:00
  Speaker 1: Um, like a big thing.
• 53:02
  Speaker 1: It's like that's where you can set up like tents and like all that kind of thing.
• 53:07
  Speaker 1: So yeah, uh, Willie had brought like this freaking sweet tent, and then they had like chairs, they were cooking like waffles and stuff.
• 53:14
  Speaker 1: It was awesome.
• 53:15
  Speaker 1: It was awesome.
• 53:16
  Speaker 1: So that's like a hub of the crew aid stations was that one, and then Twin Lakes.
• 53:22
  Speaker 1: Those are kind of like the big crewing stations.
• 53:25
  Speaker 1: So I get there, and I'm immediately like, I'm behind on hydration and nutrition.
• 53:31
  Speaker: Yeah, like man, it's just two scary things to be behind on.
• 53:35
  Speaker 1: I was like, I'm behind, it's not like you know, DEF CON yet.
• 53:39
  Speaker 1: Right.
• 53:40
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm not cramping crazy, but I'm behind.
• 53:42
  Speaker 1: I can feel it.
• 53:43
  Speaker 1: And so they're just like, you know, pound food, pound food, taking care of my feet.
• 53:47
  Speaker 1: We had to like retape some of my toes and stuff.
• 53:49
  Speaker 1: Man, and then it's like pat you on the back, get you get you right back out on the course.
• 53:54
  Speaker: And is that hard to restart that?
• 53:56
  Speaker: Because like you get early, no.
• 53:58
  Speaker: Really?
• 53:59
  Speaker 1: Okay, later, yeah.
• 54:01
  Speaker 1: Definitely, yeah, it's just hard to do anything.
• 54:05
  Speaker: I can imagine it's like you get like you said, first marathon, and by in uh like any means, that's a great distance to get.
• 54:12
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and that's what the crazy part is like oh first marathon's over.
• 54:15
  Speaker 1: Like four more marathons.
• 54:16
  Speaker 1: All right, I got four more.
• 54:18
  Speaker: So it's like I I feel like that would be tough to be like, okay, well, I'm just gonna sit, I'm gonna eat some food really quickly, I'm gonna drink some electrolytes or whatever it is.
• 54:25
  Speaker: Oh, yeah, and then I'm gonna keep going.
• 54:27
  Speaker: Like, that's I feel like that's a part of that mental game we were talking about earlier.
• 54:30
  Speaker: It's like you gotta get over that.
• 54:31
  Speaker: No kidding.
• 54:32
  Speaker 1: Anyway, so that's so we're going yeah, right back out on the trail.
• 54:37
  Speaker 1: They're telling me to slow down um because I've banked a lot of time at that point.
• 54:41
  Speaker 1: I think I was on pace to finish the race, uh, staying at that pace.
• 54:44
  Speaker 1: I would have finished in like 19 hours.
• 54:46
  Speaker 1: Dang, okay.
• 54:46
  Speaker 1: Which you know is like pretty much where the elites were kind of in that ballpark, which I knew that wasn't you know sustainable.
• 54:53
  Speaker 1: I was just trying to bank time.
• 54:55
  Speaker 1: Yeah, but they're like, you know, my team is seeing this, and they're like, You've banked a lot of time, like slow down, like don't blow up.
• 55:00
  Speaker 1: And I'm just like in my head, I'm like, no, like I'm so focused.
• 55:04
  Speaker 1: The whole first part of the race, I was just so focused on hope.
• 55:07
  Speaker 1: I was like, I know what's coming, have to get there, have to give myself time to do it.
• 55:11
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and so I leave that mile 26 aid station, and that was kind of the first time I got to run with people.
• 55:19
  Speaker 1: Okay, um, because it wasn't like you weren't on your own, it hadn't been necessarily single track for a few miles in between here and there, but like it opens up.
• 55:31
  Speaker 1: You you come out of the aid station onto this paved road until you hop over onto the next set of like the dirt that takes you off into the mountains.
• 55:38
  Speaker 1: But you know, a lot still a lot of people at this time, and so I got to run with people, and and and that was awesome because the thing about ultra, and I I feel like it's talked about enough, I don't need to be the one to like go off on it, but like there's this awesome just like camaraderie.
• 55:56
  Speaker 1: Oh, for sure.
• 55:58
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it's it's not it's competitive, like ultra running is competitive, especially if you're at the front, yeah.
• 56:03
  Speaker 1: Right, but like the rest of us, it's you know, we want to see the guy next to you succeed just as much as you want to succeed.
• 56:11
  Speaker: I know that that's what's cool about it.
• 56:12
  Speaker: It's like it's awesome.
• 56:13
  Speaker: Everyone is excited that you're doing well, or like if you're not, they're they're cheering you up and they're like, hey, you got this, like just keep going.
• 56:20
  Speaker: Yeah, so I'm sure that was like a refreshing.
• 56:22
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and and like I got to be this guy's like and I never even caught his name, um, but I got to be this guy's kind of like beating post for a couple miles.
• 56:35
  Speaker 1: He needed to let some stuff out, and I was there to listen.
• 56:38
  Speaker 1: And he, you know, he was having some struggles with his knee.
• 56:41
  Speaker 1: He's a stud.
• 56:42
  Speaker 1: He had just done the Leadville 100 mountain bike the week before.
• 56:46
  Speaker: Oh, really?
• 56:47
  Speaker 1: So they do the mountain bike the second week of August and then the run the third week of August.
• 56:52
  Speaker 1: Dang it.
• 56:52
  Speaker 1: And like you can do it as like um some kind of series with like another event earlier in the summer.
• 56:57
  Speaker 1: Kind of like a triple crowd.
• 56:58
  Speaker 1: He was doing, yeah, he was kind of doing like the series of Leadville, and yeah, he was an absolute stud.
• 57:04
  Speaker 1: But yeah, he was like at that point in the race, he was kind of going through it.
• 57:08
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and think I was in like great spirits still at that point in the race, and so I was just like, you know, yeah, man, like throw it on me.
• 57:14
  Speaker 1: Throw it.
• 57:15
  Speaker 1: I got that.
• 57:15
  Speaker 1: Like, let's, you know, I'm here, we're gonna keep going together, was kind of the attitude we had.
• 57:19
  Speaker 1: And so, you know, we ran along for for quite a while, and it was it was really cool to like you know, help somebody else, so to speak, you know, not that I was saving his race or any, not that I'm super special in any regard.
• 57:35
  Speaker 1: I don't he might not even remember me, but like at that point in the race, he needed someone to kind of dump on, and I was there for him, yeah.
• 57:43
  Speaker 1: It was cool.
• 57:44
  Speaker 1: That is really cool, and like that part of ultra running is just it's special, right?
• 57:50
  Speaker 1: You're not getting that too many places because a lot of us, and for me especially, like it's 1v1 with myself for sure.
• 57:57
  Speaker: Like, yeah, absolutely the whole race.
• 58:00
  Speaker 1: I'm competing against myself, and that's why um, you know, I've kind of I've changed my attitude, especially when I kind of talk to my kids, yeah.
• 58:07
  Speaker 1: Because my kids watch Jace kick my trash in a local race one time, yeah, which is fair.
• 58:13
  Speaker 1: Jace is a much better runner than I am, you know, especially on the speed side.
• 58:16
  Speaker 1: He needs to run a hundred, so we can figure Yeah, come on, Jace.
• 58:20
  Speaker 1: Let's go.
• 58:20
  Speaker 1: But he's he's just objectively a much faster runner than I am.
• 58:25
  Speaker 1: And my kids saw that.
• 58:27
  Speaker 1: Yeah, they had been waiting at the finish line, they see Jace come through, and then they have to wait, you know.
• 58:31
  Speaker 1: And to them, any time is a lot of time.
• 58:34
  Speaker 1: And so for Jace to beat me by five or six minutes, I think this is just a 5k, but for him to beat me by actually it was probably like three minutes, it not important, but that's forever in kid time, yeah.
• 58:45
  Speaker 1: Right?
• 58:45
  Speaker 1: You're you'll find that you're gonna find all this out.
• 58:47
  Speaker 1: Oh, I'm sure.
• 58:48
  Speaker: I'm sure I will, man.
• 58:49
  Speaker: It's crazy.
• 58:50
  Speaker 1: So my kids are like, Dad, like Jace like beat you.
• 58:54
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and then they like kind of never let me live it down.
• 58:57
  Speaker 1: Every time I sign up for a race, they're like, Well, is Jace gonna be there?
• 59:01
  Speaker: You're like, Come on, Kate.
• 59:02
  Speaker 1: Yeah, he's gonna be there.
• 59:03
  Speaker 1: Like, is he gonna win?
• 59:04
  Speaker 1: Is he gonna beat you?
• 59:06
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it's like, thanks, guys.
• 59:07
  Speaker 1: Like, I really appreciate it.
• 59:08
  Speaker: Come on, a tear falls down.
• 59:10
  Speaker 1: Like, now it's like I talk to them and I'm like, Oh, I'm actually not racing Jace.
• 59:14
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm just racing me.
• 59:15
  Speaker 1: And and I don't know if they're understanding that yet, but I'm trying to like this is 1v1 with myself.
• 59:22
  Speaker 1: Yeah, none of this is about anybody else.
• 59:24
  Speaker 1: And sometimes, and I'll kind of I'll talk to the I'll talk into this more as we get further into the race, but there's parts where it's like you kind of the term use people feels wrong, but it's like you use people to like help push you along.
• 59:40
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah.
• 59:41
  Speaker 1: Makes sense, and it's no detriment to them, it's not wanting to beat them.
• 59:44
  Speaker 1: It's just like you need, you know, crumbs, you need something to fuel on.
• 59:50
  Speaker 1: And it's like passing them or just like talking, but it's like I can see you in the distance.
• 59:54
  Speaker 1: I'm gonna like yeah, and and that happened to me in the night.
• 59:57
  Speaker 1: Um, I I Dylan can probably share it a little better, but like I was just I was finding headlights and it was like, let's go get it.
• 1:00:04
  Speaker 1: Like, I gotta get that headlight.
• 1:00:05
  Speaker 1: And that was like crumbs for me in the night when I was like, you know, it's 2 a.m.
• 1:00:08
  Speaker 1: I'm trying to push through the night.
• 1:00:10
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I needed something to grasp on right that headlight a quarter mile ahead.
• 1:00:14
  Speaker 1: That's the that's what you're going out.
• 1:00:15
  Speaker 1: I'm going for them, they're mine, you know, type thing.
• 1:00:18
  Speaker 1: For sure.
• 1:00:18
  Speaker 1: But it's not about them, you know.
• 1:00:20
  Speaker 1: It's I'm sure I'm chasing them down in that moment, but it's not about them, it's about me and all of my running and ultra now is like it's 1v1 with myself.
• 1:00:30
  Speaker 1: And I love that aspect because it's like I'm not here to be anybody else, I'm here to see what I can do against myself.
• 1:00:37
  Speaker 1: Like, yeah, dude.
• 1:00:39
  Speaker 1: Because I'm I'm my own biggest competitor, right?
• 1:00:41
  Speaker 1: I'll I'll probably never be fast enough to try to compete with Connor Mance or Clayton Young.
• 1:00:46
  Speaker: And I mean, those guys are different too.
• 1:00:48
  Speaker 1: I'm here to just compete with myself, I'm here to see how far I can push myself against myself, right?
• 1:00:55
  Speaker 1: And that like that carries me through a lot of a lot of the race, and it it helped me right after I left that guy.
• 1:01:04
  Speaker 1: Um, because yeah, he was you know, he was going through it and I was feeling all right, so I I kind of took off.
• 1:01:09
  Speaker 1: And I had not planned on the next section.
• 1:01:14
  Speaker 1: Um, this would these this would be like miles 30 to 40, basically.
• 1:01:19
  Speaker 1: Yeah, um, I had not given them enough respect when I was like reviewing my race map and race plan and all these things.
• 1:01:29
  Speaker 1: Um miles 30 to 40 were a lot more uphill than I had intended.
• 1:01:36
  Speaker 1: Yeah, um, to me the map had looked like you know pretty gradual, fairly flat.
• 1:01:41
  Speaker 1: But it was like it was it was a lot.
• 1:01:44
  Speaker 1: It was a lot of uphill and it was hot.
• 1:01:46
  Speaker 1: It was the middle of the day in August, too, yeah.
• 1:01:48
  Speaker 1: Yeah, middle of the day in August, and it was warmer than I had anticipated.
• 1:01:52
  Speaker 1: So I'm going through my water and my electrolytes faster.
• 1:01:56
  Speaker 1: And I I end up really struggling um getting into mile 40, which is Twin Lakes, yeah, which is that's a start, the biggest aid station.
• 1:02:06
  Speaker 1: Um, that's like where your crew is primarily stationed.
• 1:02:10
  Speaker 1: Like Twin Lakes is the bigger hub of the whole race.
• 1:02:13
  Speaker 1: That's like the big spot.
• 1:02:15
  Speaker 1: And so I'm you know 3738, and Brandon calls me and he's like, Hey, like, how's it going?
• 1:02:22
  Speaker 1: You know, we see you're a few miles out.
• 1:02:24
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and I was like, it's bad.
• 1:02:26
  Speaker 1: Like, I'm I'm in a bad spot.
• 1:02:28
  Speaker 1: Um, I had run out of water.
• 1:02:30
  Speaker 1: Oh, dude.
• 1:02:31
  Speaker 1: And you know, talking, I was talking earlier about be prepared, and I wasn't at that point.
• 1:02:35
  Speaker 1: I didn't realize I had you know packed as I would, but I just I don't think I gave enough credit to the uphill and then the heat to the heat.
• 1:02:43
  Speaker: Yeah, man, it's tough.
• 1:02:45
  Speaker 1: So it took it out of me.
• 1:02:46
  Speaker 1: I was I was pretty cooked, and I go into 40, and I am I'm in a bad, bad way.
• 1:02:51
  Speaker 1: I was like, it was a fight just to get you you like climb, climb, climb, and then you drop and you go into um like mile 40 or into the Twin Lakes aid station.
• 1:03:04
  Speaker 1: And so I'm just like dying coming down this um drop.
• 1:03:09
  Speaker 1: And Dylan had um, I can't remember if he had text or called or something, but he was like, We're gonna get you like right to the med tent um and get you taken care of that way.
• 1:03:18
  Speaker 1: And he meets me as I come into like they have like a shoot kind of thing where it's like roped off just for runners and crew, and so I come into there and like I can see like my mom and wife, like they're like cheering me on and stuff.
• 1:03:32
  Speaker 1: And I'm just like I'm in a bad spot, like a spot you don't want to be in 40 miles into a hundred-mile race.
• 1:03:39
  Speaker: Man, and was it mainly physical or mental?
• 1:03:42
  Speaker 1: It was it was both, it was really physical because I think I was like borderline like heat stroking.
• 1:03:48
  Speaker 1: Um I just I had gotten super dehydrated, and because of that, I had like that, like kind of spins up your kidneys, and you like you just overheat.
• 1:03:57
  Speaker 1: Yeah, so it's like the heat's already hot, I'm already hot because of that, but now it's like my body's like exuding a lot more heat because I'm like dehydrated and stuff, and so you know, I get in there and they're like, Hey, like let's get you to medical.
• 1:04:11
  Speaker 1: And I was just like, no, like you know, F that.
• 1:04:14
  Speaker 1: Like, I just need water, like that's all like I was so you know, when your mouth is just so dry, and it's like all you want is just like something to quench, cold water.
• 1:04:24
  Speaker 1: And so I was just like, No, like F that, get me water, like, and so they they go and they sit me down, and this is where it's like, man, I owe my crew like my life, yeah.
• 1:04:36
  Speaker 1: Like these dudes, um, it was it was Brandon, Willie, and Dylan, and these guys saved me.
• 1:04:43
  Speaker 1: I I I genuinely do not think I could have kept going and finished the race had they not been there to like take care of me in that regard.
• 1:04:51
  Speaker 1: Or if I could have it, I don't know if I could have made it as far as I did, but like they they were so clutch.
• 1:04:59
  Speaker 1: Um, I come in, they're putting ice on me, they're taking my shoes off, they're they're you know, cold water, they're trying to like bring my body temperature down, and then it's like you know, we're shoveling me as much food and like liquid as I can slowly get back in.
• 1:05:15
  Speaker 1: And I had time.
• 1:05:18
  Speaker 1: Yeah, they knew I had time, and so they're like, hey, we want you to stay here for like an hour.
• 1:05:23
  Speaker 1: Man, and I was just like at that point, I was like, I don't care, like I am so dead right now.
• 1:05:29
  Speaker 1: Like I can't go do Hope Pass feeling like this, right?
• 1:05:32
  Speaker 1: I'm not gonna make it.
• 1:05:34
  Speaker 1: And so I ended up being there for about 30 minutes because you know, the work that they had put in to get me right worked.
• 1:05:43
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and I just like it it felt instantaneous.
• 1:05:46
  Speaker 1: It was like all of a sudden my life just like came back.
• 1:05:49
  Speaker 1: And I think they kind of describe it the same way.
• 1:05:51
  Speaker 1: It was just like, yeah, light came back into your eyes, and you said, I'm ready to go.
• 1:05:55
  Speaker 1: And we were like, What?
• 1:05:57
  Speaker 1: And you're just like, Yeah, I'm ready.
• 1:05:58
  Speaker 1: Let's get out of here.
• 1:05:59
  Speaker 1: Dang.
• 1:05:59
  Speaker 1: Okay.
• 1:06:00
  Speaker 1: And that's kind of how it went.
• 1:06:01
  Speaker 1: It's like all of a sudden I just like I had life again.
• 1:06:04
  Speaker 1: And I was like, whoa, like it's time to go.
• 1:06:06
  Speaker 1: I don't want I can't be here anymore.
• 1:06:07
  Speaker 1: I didn't want to like spend extra time.
• 1:06:10
  Speaker 1: I didn't want to waste any time because I knew everybody was like, dude, you're doing so good.
• 1:06:15
  Speaker 1: You're so far ahead of pace.
• 1:06:16
  Speaker 1: And I was just like, it's never far enough ahead.
• 1:06:19
  Speaker 1: Like this is a hundred-mile race.
• 1:06:21
  Speaker 1: It is never far enough ahead.
• 1:06:22
  Speaker: Yeah.
• 1:06:22
  Speaker: Something can happen in any second.
• 1:06:24
  Speaker: Literally.
• 1:06:24
  Speaker: Yeah.
• 1:06:25
  Speaker 1: Like, and so I was like, I gotta get back out of here.
• 1:06:28
  Speaker 1: And so, you know, they patched me up, um, pat me on the back, and again, it's like off we go.
• 1:06:32
  Speaker 1: And now I had also switched into the Nordas at that point, and so off I go.
• 1:06:38
  Speaker 1: Um, and that like that aid station was was awesome, yeah, because you know, it took me from like I was dead.
• 1:06:49
  Speaker 1: Like I felt dead rolling into Twin Lakes, and I left Twin Lakes feeling like not just back, but like powerful.
• 1:06:59
  Speaker 1: And you know, I don't feel that way a ton during my running, but to feel that way leaving the age station was just uh incredible.
• 1:07:07
  Speaker 1: Can't ask for a better feeling.
• 1:07:09
  Speaker: I was gonna say, yeah, you got to throw it to the crew because like yeah, I'm sure their thought process, because I've heard this before, like, especially in ultras, I've never gotten to this point.
• 1:07:17
  Speaker: But when you have a crew, they're supposed to be making decisions for you.
• 1:07:20
  Speaker: And I'm sure, like, you know, after 40 miles, like you said, you just ran through the heat, you're out of water.
• 1:07:24
  Speaker: Like, I can't imagine you trying to make like, okay, I'm gonna sit down for 30 minutes, like someone go get me ice, I'm gonna put it on my body.
• 1:07:31
  Speaker: Like them just being there taking care of you, like that's that's what it's yeah, all about.
• 1:07:36
  Speaker: Like, you gotta have strong people.
• 1:07:38
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I I seriously like I I'll never be able to thank them enough because like it would that was so clutch.
• 1:07:44
  Speaker 1: And they like, you know, they also put up with I'm you know, I'm sure I was a crab ass for most of that because it's just like oh, but they were, you know, Willie, um, to his credit, you know, he's like special forces in the military, and it's like he had trained um or like learned how trained to be a doctor as well, like in the military, um, ended up like changing paths, but like very knowledgeable in the field of like medicine and then like you know, military, so adjusting on the fly and doing all these things.
• 1:08:13
  Speaker 1: So he was super clutch, um, knowing like you know, hey, we gotta hit all these spots to cool them down.
• 1:08:18
  Speaker 1: We gotta do this, this, this, and this.
• 1:08:20
  Speaker 1: He was very he was so clutch, and then Dylan and Brandon just always holding it down, like always hyping me up, very professional.
• 1:08:29
  Speaker 1: Like, it was awesome.
• 1:08:30
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it was awesome to see these three guys, and then like you know, my family was helping as well.
• 1:08:34
  Speaker 1: I owe them a lot of credit too.
• 1:08:36
  Speaker 1: Um, and Lindsay for sure.
• 1:08:38
  Speaker 1: But them working as a like a cohesive unit was just so cool.
• 1:08:42
  Speaker 1: That is really cool.
• 1:08:43
  Speaker 1: Getting me back out, and I was really grateful.
• 1:08:45
  Speaker 1: I left that aid station, just like feeling powerful, feeling grateful for those guys because I knew like they had just saved my race at that point.
• 1:08:53
  Speaker 1: Because to go into mile 40 with 60 left, and I hadn't even touched the hardest part yet.
• 1:08:58
  Speaker 1: Like, I was gonna be cooked if I didn't have those guys, which also like you know, in a different light.
• 1:09:04
  Speaker 1: Kudos to all those people who don't use a crew, like self-crewing.
• 1:09:09
  Speaker 1: This was actually Andy's first time.
• 1:09:11
  Speaker 1: Um, I can't remember, it was it wasn't his first time in general using a crew, but it was his first time.
• 1:09:17
  Speaker 1: There's an asterisk somewhere, first time of something using a crew.
• 1:09:21
  Speaker: Really?
• 1:09:21
  Speaker: Okay, and so he doesn't he had a crew.
• 1:09:24
  Speaker 1: He's like he's never he had never done Leadville.
• 1:09:25
  Speaker 1: Maybe it was Leadville, because he's done Leadville a bunch, yeah, but he had never used a crew before.
• 1:09:29
  Speaker 1: This was his first year ever with a crew.
• 1:09:32
  Speaker 1: And so I'm just like, you know, I'm also thinking about that.
• 1:09:34
  Speaker 1: Like, kudos to all these guys who don't have crews and self-support because that's crazy.
• 1:09:40
  Speaker: That's insane.
• 1:09:40
  Speaker 1: Like, if I had to do self-support, I probably would have had to spend an hour to two hours at that aid station down and figuring it out myself, how to cool down, how to get my life back.
• 1:09:49
  Speaker 1: And luckily, I had super awesome crew of just absolute studs who got me back on the trail.
• 1:09:55
  Speaker 1: And then we go into hope.
• 1:09:58
  Speaker: Oh man.
• 1:09:59
  Speaker 1: And it's about two miles, maybe not even two miles from the aid station.
• 1:10:04
  Speaker 1: You have to go through a river.
• 1:10:06
  Speaker: Oh, dude.
• 1:10:06
  Speaker 1: So it's like run through the river, knowing that I still have you know 23 miles I have to run without changing shoes again.
• 1:10:14
  Speaker 1: Some people were there, you know, different strategies, different race plans, but some people would like bag their legs so that their shoes didn't get wet.
• 1:10:22
  Speaker 1: I guess yeah, that makes sense.
• 1:10:23
  Speaker: But yeah, honestly, I don't know how well that works.
• 1:10:26
  Speaker 1: I would have kind of liked to have done that in hindsight.
• 1:10:28
  Speaker 1: Um, but we get through the river and I'm feeling really good.
• 1:10:33
  Speaker 1: And I actually uh I think when we checked it, I PR'd.
• 1:10:38
  Speaker 1: I I did it faster than when Dylan and I had done it.
• 1:10:41
  Speaker 1: Oh damn going up hope.
• 1:10:42
  Speaker 1: And I and I had a good, you know, to to other racers' credit, I got with a good group of people.
• 1:10:48
  Speaker 1: There's like four or five of us, and we were all just like, you know, hustling, yeah, you know, in embracing the suck like together.
• 1:10:55
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 1:10:56
  Speaker 1: And that was great.
• 1:10:57
  Speaker 1: It was awesome to have those guys.
• 1:10:58
  Speaker 1: Not that we were like, you know, buddy buddy.
• 1:11:01
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I didn't best friends afterwards talk to any of them in depth, but it was like we had our little crew and we moved up the mountain together, yeah, and we did it like pretty well.
• 1:11:11
  Speaker 1: Um, and that was really cool.
• 1:11:12
  Speaker 1: And that was again just another like cool facet of Ultra Running is like you know, just four random people.
• 1:11:18
  Speaker 1: I joined up as a fifth and we cooked up the mountain.
• 1:11:21
  Speaker 1: No one cares, it's like sure.
• 1:11:22
  Speaker 1: It was freaking awesome, and we like you know, kind of uh leapfrog a little bit, and just the five or six of us at a time would just go up the mountain, and it was great.
• 1:11:32
  Speaker 1: That's so cool.
• 1:11:33
  Speaker 1: It was tough, like the front side was tough, and they have the coolest aid station though.
• 1:11:39
  Speaker 1: At uh it's not it's actually not at the top of Hope Pass, which is where I thought it was.
• 1:11:44
  Speaker 1: It's actually about a mile below Hope Pass.
• 1:11:47
  Speaker 1: Oh, really?
• 1:11:48
  Speaker 1: No way, all the geared stuff, and it's super cool.
• 1:11:56
  Speaker 1: And those are like some of the most rad people of the of the race.
• 1:12:00
  Speaker 1: All the you know, all the support of the race was great, but like these people who had climbed Hope Pass and like brought the donkeys up and set everything up, like those are some freaking studs.
• 1:12:10
  Speaker 1: Like they were cool, the energy was really high, the donkeys were super cool because that's just like super random.
• 1:12:16
  Speaker 1: There we go.
• 1:12:17
  Speaker 1: It's so that aid station was awesome, and that was about the time where I was beginning to struggle with gels.
• 1:12:28
  Speaker 1: Oh, yeah, with your stomach, like yeah, just or just taste-wise, yeah, just like I was so burnt out, and you know, again, we're only like 46 miles into the race, and I'm like burnt out on my fueling strategy, not good.
• 1:12:43
  Speaker 1: But they had uh they had like broth and they had ramen and like mashed potatoes and stuff.
• 1:12:49
  Speaker: Oh dude, I bet that was like a breath of fresh air.
• 1:12:52
  Speaker 1: I was just like, go, go, go, go, like, get as much of that crap can as I can because I'm sick of gels, and it is way too early.
• 1:12:59
  Speaker 1: And I knew that in my brain, I was like, this is way too early to be tired of your fuel source.
• 1:13:03
  Speaker 1: Go to the ramen, keep going, get to the top of hope for the first time.
• 1:13:09
  Speaker 1: And I tried to just like minimize it.
• 1:13:12
  Speaker 1: I was like, okay, like you know, boop, past it, yeah, moving on.
• 1:13:16
  Speaker 1: So we go, and it's like it was hard going down.
• 1:13:20
  Speaker 1: My knee like got upset.
• 1:13:23
  Speaker 1: My left knee.
• 1:13:24
  Speaker: I can't imagine after 46 miles, then you have that super steep decline.
• 1:13:27
  Speaker 1: Yeah, like and it's a good, it's like three, I think it's 3.5 miles of just straight, like a thousand feet plus per mile of drop or incline when you come back the other way.
• 1:13:38
  Speaker 1: But it's yeah, it's nasty, it's tough.
• 1:13:40
  Speaker 1: And my knees started acting up, and I was like, dang it, like, do not do this this early, like leave me alone.
• 1:13:45
  Speaker 1: So I'm hurting coming down this thing, and then this was an aspect I can't remember, it was probably Dylan.
• 1:13:52
  Speaker 1: Um, but I talked to him after because we had thought that there's a section when you get to the bottom of hope before Winfield that's like this out and back, yeah.
• 1:14:04
  Speaker 1: And we thought like that would be a good place to make up time, you know, because you're getting cooked on these climbs, and so we thought that's gonna be a great place to make up time.
• 1:14:14
  Speaker 1: And one of the things I had not even begin to think about was like traffic, like cars, like human traffic people, I guess that's fair.
• 1:14:24
  Speaker 1: Um, because I'm thinking ultra, I'm in my head, I'm like, oh yeah, there's probably gonna be like 20 miles where I don't even see people type thing, you know.
• 1:14:31
  Speaker 1: Especially a hundred-mile race, like that makes sense.
• 1:14:33
  Speaker 1: No, like traffic was bad on this stretch, yeah.
• 1:14:38
  Speaker 1: And and it is due to like the out and back nature of the race.
• 1:14:42
  Speaker 1: Like we're running to the halfway point at this at this part of the race, and everybody else is coming back from the halfway point.
• 1:14:49
  Speaker 1: Everyone ahead of you is coming back, and then yeah, after you get there, like you're facing everybody.
• 1:14:53
  Speaker: Pretty narrow and yes, single track.
• 1:14:55
  Speaker 1: Okay, yeah, that's and so it's like I'm trying to run, but then it's like you know, someone's coming, and neither of us can run because we have to like kind of scoop past each other because you kind of have like rocks on one side and trees on the other.
• 1:15:07
  Speaker 1: It's not like you can like step out and around type thing, and so I actually I didn't make as good a time through there as I felt I could have, yeah, and as we had kind of planned on because traffic, dude, that's so weird.
• 1:15:21
  Speaker 1: I've never even considered that.
• 1:15:22
  Speaker 1: Like, and yeah, I hadn't either, and it was like kind of frustrating.
• 1:15:25
  Speaker 1: I was kind of getting annoyed, especially like on the back side of it.
• 1:15:29
  Speaker 1: I was just like getting really flustered.
• 1:15:32
  Speaker: Yeah, I would do you know, not an aspect of ultra running that you're like thinking about, and you're halfway done, so it's like, and then you have this yeah, this variable.
• 1:15:41
  Speaker: I mean, like I had the same kind of experience with like an out and back during the Moab race.
• 1:15:46
  Speaker: Oh, yeah, yeah.
• 1:15:47
  Speaker: But like um, it was only one section, so it was kind of weird.
• 1:15:49
  Speaker: The trail broke off, went out back, and then like finished.
• 1:15:53
  Speaker: It was a big loop, but like it was just that one section, and there were people, but it was huge, so like I never even considered it.
• 1:15:58
  Speaker: Like one way would suck.
• 1:15:59
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it was it was kind of frustrating because at that point in the race, like your body's not at least me, you know, my body's not functioning normally.
• 1:16:09
  Speaker 1: So it's like it takes a little bit more to like get me running, and then it's like you know, a different effort to sustain it.
• 1:16:16
  Speaker 1: And so that was really hard because it's like okay, I can't just stop for a second and then hop back into a run because like my body's not doing that, it's hard to keep the momentum, and so it's like, yeah, you can't keep momentum because it's like every time you finally get started again, here comes somebody else, and you both have to stop and go around each other.
• 1:16:32
  Speaker 1: And so that was actually that kind of sucked.
• 1:16:36
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I can imagine, dude.
• 1:16:37
  Speaker 1: I can imagine.
• 1:16:38
  Speaker 1: I'd be so pissed.
• 1:16:39
  Speaker 1: The way out was again, it was a little more uphill than it'd given it credit for, yeah.
• 1:16:44
  Speaker 1: And which is harder, and so but then we get to, or I get to it wasn't a true halfway because they did change the course this year with the fires that rolled through.
• 1:16:54
  Speaker 1: Oh so it was actually about mile 52, I believe, is when you hit Windfield, which is typically about mile 50.
• 1:17:00
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 1:17:01
  Speaker 1: Um, or the it's a turnaround.
• 1:17:03
  Speaker 1: Because the way back is was not the same, it was the same up until about mile um eighty-five.
• 1:17:12
  Speaker: Oh man.
• 1:17:13
  Speaker 1: I mean, quote me on that.
• 1:17:14
  Speaker 1: It was somewhere between 80 and 85, the course changes and you finish differently.
• 1:17:18
  Speaker: Interesting.
• 1:17:18
  Speaker: Okay.
• 1:17:19
  Speaker 1: Um so yeah, the out and the out point is mile 52.
• 1:17:23
  Speaker 1: Dang.
• 1:17:24
  Speaker 1: So I hit mile 52, and this is like uh a thing I hadn't kind of consciously thought about.
• 1:17:31
  Speaker 1: That was like one of the key moments of like watching other people throw in the towel.
• 1:17:38
  Speaker: Really?
• 1:17:39
  Speaker 1: Um, because it's a no, it's a no spectator aid station, it's a no crew support aid station, it's in the middle of freaking nowhere.
• 1:17:47
  Speaker 1: Yeah, but they have like um they have a really big aid station and they have the shuttle.
• 1:17:52
  Speaker 1: And the shuttle takes you back if you're done.
• 1:17:56
  Speaker: Dude, I would hate to see that thing.
• 1:17:57
  Speaker 1: And you know, the volunteers, they're you know, it's not facetious or like ill-intended, but they're just giving they're letting you know of the option.
• 1:18:06
  Speaker: Yeah.
• 1:18:07
  Speaker 1: And man, I watched a lot of uh I don't know, a lot subjective as well.
• 1:18:12
  Speaker 1: I watched a lot of people throw it in right there, call it a day right there, and that was wild.
• 1:18:19
  Speaker 1: Um I didn't have that thought.
• 1:18:22
  Speaker 1: Uh you know, obviously you look at it and you're like, man, it'd be so sick to be done right now.
• 1:18:26
  Speaker 1: That's tempting.
• 1:18:26
  Speaker 1: Because and the reason I think a lot of people throw it in right there, and if I was, if I was having problems or something and that was um and I had made it that far, that is where I would throw in the towel because there's no support for 12 miles after that.
• 1:18:42
  Speaker: And then you gotta go.
• 1:18:43
  Speaker 1: You have your one aid station, but it's a it's a an aid station in the middle of a mountain.
• 1:18:47
  Speaker 1: It's you can't like DNF there, right?
• 1:18:49
  Speaker 1: You have to get yourself off the mountain.
• 1:18:51
  Speaker 1: Yeah, so you effectively, if you leave that aid station, it's 12 miles back to Twin Lakes, and it's the most difficult 12 miles of the race because you gotta go back up that evil backside of Hope Pass.
• 1:19:05
  Speaker: And you're just dead.
• 1:19:06
  Speaker 1: And and so I'm watching the, and yeah, so logically, if I was going to DNF Leadville, that's you know, arguably I'd do it at Twin Lakes and just skip hope all together.
• 1:19:16
  Speaker 1: But if I had made it that far, yeah, that's that's exactly where I would throw on the towel.
• 1:19:21
  Speaker 1: And so it was like, I know I'm watching these people do it, and I can sympathize with them because it's like I don't want to go do this either.
• 1:19:27
  Speaker 1: Yeah, like I know what's coming, and I don't want to go back up this mountain.
• 1:19:32
  Speaker: Arguably it's worse going back, right?
• 1:19:33
  Speaker 1: Oh, it's way worse going up, yeah, uh up the backside than it is going up the front side.
• 1:19:38
  Speaker 1: And so I'm watching, you know, just person after person like throw it in, get on this nice warm shuttle that's gonna take you right back into town.
• 1:19:47
  Speaker 1: How many people do you think did it?
• 1:19:49
  Speaker 1: I was there.
• 1:19:50
  Speaker 1: I stayed at that aid station um a little longer than I had anticipated.
• 1:19:54
  Speaker 1: I was probably there 15 minutes, and I intended to be there for like five.
• 1:20:00
  Speaker 1: Um, but in my 15 minutes, I probably watched at least 10.
• 1:20:03
  Speaker 1: Oh, wow.
• 1:20:04
  Speaker 1: Which feels like a lot.
• 1:20:05
  Speaker 1: Yeah, especially with a race like that.
• 1:20:07
  Speaker: Like how many people run Leadville?
• 1:20:08
  Speaker 1: Um, 724 this year.
• 1:20:11
  Speaker 1: And then I think it was uh 391 finished.
• 1:20:17
  Speaker: Wow, okay.
• 1:20:18
  Speaker 1: So I I think that's a little over half finished.
• 1:20:21
  Speaker 1: Um but like you know, but we're all spread out throughout the course, right?
• 1:20:27
  Speaker 1: I had passed a ton or a ton of people had passed me, I guess would be the more appropriate term, had passed me coming on their way back and me going out, and so you know, it felt like a lot of people, yeah.
• 1:20:37
  Speaker 1: And it was sad.
• 1:20:38
  Speaker 1: I was sad for them.
• 1:20:39
  Speaker 1: That's so tough.
• 1:20:40
  Speaker 1: Mo some people, it's like you can just see the defeat, they don't have it in them, like their soul's been taken.
• 1:20:46
  Speaker 1: Yeah, other people, I was surprised at like how casual it was.
• 1:20:50
  Speaker 1: You know, there's kind of like talking to another person there, and they're like, Yeah, you know, I think I am gonna like get back on the shuttle.
• 1:20:56
  Speaker 1: And it's like, all right.
• 1:20:58
  Speaker 1: I don't know.
• 1:20:58
  Speaker 1: To me, like Leadville was so meaningful that like it could have just never been like that casual of a conversation of like I'm gonna get back on the shuttle.
• 1:21:07
  Speaker: I don't know, especially I feel like if you're getting drawn for that thing, it's like, okay, I gotta show up.
• 1:21:10
  Speaker: Like, I gotta give away.
• 1:21:14
  Speaker 1: She was part of my little group that went up.
• 1:21:16
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 1:21:17
  Speaker 1: Um, we had kind of split or just naturally got separated on the trail after that.
• 1:21:22
  Speaker 1: So I didn't really know where she was, but she had rolled into the that aid station a little bit later, and she was talking to this lady next to her.
• 1:21:30
  Speaker 1: She's like, Yeah, I don't know.
• 1:21:31
  Speaker 1: I'm kind of waiting for my husband.
• 1:21:32
  Speaker 1: I'm gonna see if he's gonna take the shuttle back or not.
• 1:21:34
  Speaker 1: And I was just like, that's the decision making.
• 1:21:37
  Speaker 1: Like, that's crazy.
• 1:21:38
  Speaker 1: Like to me, that was yeah, that was so crazy.
• 1:21:41
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it's just like how casual, you know, some people were taking it.
• 1:21:45
  Speaker 1: And you know, cool for them that they can do that.
• 1:21:47
  Speaker 1: For me, it was like, you know, it was the battle big.
• 1:21:50
  Speaker 1: It was too like it was way more in-depth conversation than like, yeah, I'm gonna I'm gonna see what so-and-so's doing, and we'll decide that way.
• 1:21:57
  Speaker 1: And to her credit, she did, I'm pretty confident she did finish the race because I saw her again at like 80 something in the 80s.
• 1:22:05
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and so you know, kudos to her for continuing to go.
• 1:22:08
  Speaker 1: But I was also just like so lost when she had said casually, like, I'm just gonna see if he's gonna keep going.
• 1:22:14
  Speaker: I feel like for me, it would be like the only way I would stop is if like I was about to like injure myself or like something medically was off.
• 1:22:21
  Speaker: Like, that's the only reasons I would really think I would throw in the towel.
• 1:22:25
  Speaker 1: I'd like to think at least like yeah, you know, one of the questions that um a friend had asked was like, How many times do you realistically or did you realistically think about quitting?
• 1:22:34
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and I don't know how this is gonna come across, it's not intended to be cocky or something.
• 1:22:42
  Speaker 1: None.
• 1:22:44
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it wasn't an option.
• 1:22:46
  Speaker 1: Um I wasn't going to quit that race.
• 1:22:49
  Speaker 1: I I had accepted if I couldn't make a cutoff.
• 1:22:53
  Speaker 1: Um I had accepted that.
• 1:22:55
  Speaker 1: I was like, you know what?
• 1:22:56
  Speaker 1: If I'm if I'm out there and I, you know, I don't make it to the aid station in time and that's it, then so be it.
• 1:23:04
  Speaker 1: I can live with that.
• 1:23:06
  Speaker: Right.
• 1:23:06
  Speaker 1: But you know, there was no option to just quit.
• 1:23:10
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 1:23:11
  Speaker 1: And I didn't think about it during the race because it wasn't it wasn't an option.
• 1:23:15
  Speaker 1: There, there was no quitting.
• 1:23:17
  Speaker 1: If I if I can't make a cutoff and I have to DNF because of it, so be it.
• 1:23:21
  Speaker: Yeah.
• 1:23:22
  Speaker 1: But like, you know, of course, throughout the whole race, I'm thinking like, oh, it'd be so nice to be done right now because it sucks.
• 1:23:29
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 1:23:29
  Speaker 1: But like I wasn't, I don't think I ever actually consciously thought to myself, like, I want to quit and drop out of this race.
• 1:23:37
  Speaker: And I don't think you can.
• 1:23:38
  Speaker: Like, if you're doing something that difficult, like you can't even let that be an option.
• 1:23:43
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 1:23:44
  Speaker: Like you have to just you you can't think about quitting unless like I said something like went wrong.
• 1:23:49
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 1:23:49
  Speaker: But if you want to finish, like you can't ever consider that.
• 1:23:52
  Speaker: Yeah.
• 1:23:52
  Speaker 1: And I told um at least Dylan, I think it was just Dylan, but I told him the day before.
• 1:23:58
  Speaker 1: Oh, actually, Brandon had to have been there too.
• 1:24:00
  Speaker 1: Because they were both talking to me and they're like, We just need to like seriously know like what's on the line for this.
• 1:24:07
  Speaker 1: Like, where is your where's your mindset?
• 1:24:10
  Speaker 1: Like, is this a a die trying?
• 1:24:12
  Speaker 1: Is that you know, and they kind of laid out some options and and I had expressed my feedback of like, you know, I I'm not willing to die for this.
• 1:24:20
  Speaker 1: Like I have young kids, and I'm, you know, I'm not willing to die for it, but I'm pretty willing to get damn close.
• 1:24:27
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 1:24:27
  Speaker 1: All across the finish line.
• 1:24:30
  Speaker 1: And I was like, you know, if I miss a cutoff, that was like obviously one.
• 1:24:34
  Speaker 1: And then, you know, if I break something, yeah.
• 1:24:36
  Speaker 1: Like, and that's a legitimate concern coming down either side of Hope Pass is like it's just steep enough that like if you fell, you could like really mess something up.
• 1:24:46
  Speaker 1: Yeah, one misstep, and like especially on some of the really rocky sections.
• 1:24:51
  Speaker 1: It's like, man, if you slip and you like even hit your head on one of these, you're in trouble.
• 1:24:55
  Speaker 1: Yeah, like you're in big trouble.
• 1:24:56
  Speaker: That's so scary.
• 1:24:57
  Speaker 1: So I was thinking, like, you know, if I break something, I I could see myself breaking an ankle or you know, a leg or something because some of these rocks are so you know.
• 1:25:05
  Speaker 1: And so I was like, that's kind of my like deciding factors.
• 1:25:08
  Speaker 1: Everything else, like you don't let me off that course.
• 1:25:12
  Speaker 1: Like, I'm staying on course, there is no surrender, like we're going.
• 1:25:16
  Speaker 1: And and I I think it it helped me knowing that I had already decided that.
• 1:25:22
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I think if I would, oh yeah, if I can just get to you know 40 or 50 or something, then it's okay.
• 1:25:27
  Speaker 1: Yeah, but it was like, no, there is no quit.
• 1:25:30
  Speaker 1: Like, you just can't exist.
• 1:25:32
  Speaker 1: Um you have to keep fighting.
• 1:25:34
  Speaker 1: You can't throw it in.
• 1:25:36
  Speaker 1: You gotta keep going.
• 1:25:37
  Speaker: Absolutely.
• 1:25:37
  Speaker 1: Gotta keep going.
• 1:25:38
  Speaker: I love that mindset, man.
• 1:25:39
  Speaker: That's huge.
• 1:25:40
  Speaker 1: It it made I I think it helped me a lot during the race.
• 1:25:44
  Speaker 1: It's like there is no there is no quit.
• 1:25:46
  Speaker 1: You can't stop.
• 1:25:47
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 1:25:48
  Speaker 1: And I had to lean on that a lot right after I left that aid station because it goes to the worst part of the race.
• 1:25:55
  Speaker: Yeah, the worst part, and then it starts getting dark, right?
• 1:25:57
  Speaker 1: Like, oh yeah.
• 1:25:58
  Speaker 1: Well, it was getting dark.
• 1:25:59
  Speaker 1: The sun was setting as I was at the aid station.
• 1:26:02
  Speaker: Oh man, okay.
• 1:26:03
  Speaker 1: And so I'm like, I don't think I had pulled out my light yet because it wasn't like it was setting, it was still bright enough to run.
• 1:26:09
  Speaker 1: And so I I took off and I I still I felt really good.
• 1:26:14
  Speaker 1: I'd felt good working my way back, and then it was like immediately hitting that steep, steep uphill.
• 1:26:23
  Speaker 1: Oh man.
• 1:26:24
  Speaker 1: It like I just went from like holding something good to just just you know the slowest, most painful, like crawling up this hill.
• 1:26:35
  Speaker 1: Yeah, at that point, like how are your legs feeling?
• 1:26:38
  Speaker 1: Like just brut just I mean, everything just feels, you know, relatively cooked.
• 1:26:45
  Speaker 1: Like just tired and everything is like fatigued.
• 1:26:48
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 1:26:49
  Speaker 1: Um, I I my knee was kind of the only thing that had started to bother me at that point, as far as like actual things, yeah, you know, aside from just general like soreness, tiredness, fatigue.
• 1:27:00
  Speaker 1: My knee was the only thing that was bothering me.
• 1:27:02
  Speaker 1: And I I did about a mile, probably a good mile, at that just slow, nothing, brutal pace.
• 1:27:12
  Speaker 1: And that was that was tough.
• 1:27:14
  Speaker 1: That mile was so brutal.
• 1:27:17
  Speaker 1: And then I got just gapped by this guy, and I was taken back.
• 1:27:22
  Speaker 1: I was just like, you whoa, like what?
• 1:27:25
  Speaker: Like, you still got it.
• 1:27:26
  Speaker 1: Like, this is someone, you know, behind me, and in my head, I'm like, I'm really slow.
• 1:27:30
  Speaker 1: And so it's like, you know, this is someone behind me, like killing me coming up this freaking mountain.
• 1:27:36
  Speaker 1: Man, and I needed that.
• 1:27:38
  Speaker 1: He passed me like that, and it I just kind of stopped for a second, and I was like, you know, screw this, let's go.
• 1:27:46
  Speaker 1: I gotta go.
• 1:27:48
  Speaker 1: Let's go.
• 1:27:48
  Speaker 1: And I don't know where, you know, I didn't have the energy.
• 1:27:51
  Speaker 1: I just found it and it became like, okay, you know, it went from to like bah a little bit faster.
• 1:27:58
  Speaker 1: I'm just like Climbing up this hill.
• 1:28:01
  Speaker 1: And yeah, I think um again when we had checked the Strava on the end, it was like, yeah, I PR'd the whole back side of the mountain.
• 1:28:08
  Speaker: That's so cool.
• 1:28:09
  Speaker 1: And you know, and for better or worse, but I got to the top, and um it it was so it was tough, you know.
• 1:28:18
  Speaker 1: Even though I had found like kind of that wind to like push me up, it's tough.
• 1:28:23
  Speaker 1: Like it's it's hard to express.
• 1:28:26
  Speaker 1: It was brutal.
• 1:28:27
  Speaker 1: And I get to the top and I like stop, and a lot of people just kept going, you know, they didn't even take a breath at the top, which you know, but I I had to stop.
• 1:28:36
  Speaker 1: I got back to the top, and again, it was just like this little flag in the rocks, and I'm like, thank you.
• 1:28:40
  Speaker: Give it a little hug.
• 1:28:41
  Speaker 1: And I ended up it it sounds like corny now, but like I grabbed my poles and kind of like put them down, and I just like screamed.
• 1:28:52
  Speaker 1: I just like full on, I was just like, I mean, man, yelled at the top of the mountain, and I think I just I needed that, yeah.
• 1:29:02
  Speaker 1: I I needed I finishing that section was just so much, I just had to like kind of let it out.
• 1:29:08
  Speaker: Dude, yeah, I can't even imagine.
• 1:29:10
  Speaker 1: It's so difficult.
• 1:29:11
  Speaker 1: But I had also met like my commitment to myself of like, if you can get back to the top of Hope Pass, you can finish the race.
• 1:29:20
  Speaker 1: And you know, I think that became kind of a two-edged sword because I kind of wrote off the last 35 miles because I was like, Yeah, I'm finishing.
• 1:29:35
  Speaker 1: I just got back to the top of Hope Pass.
• 1:29:37
  Speaker 1: I'm finishing the race.
• 1:29:37
  Speaker 1: I got this.
• 1:29:38
  Speaker 1: 35 miles was still prior to that day farther than I've ever run in my life.
• 1:29:43
  Speaker: I mean, that's just a little over 50k, dude.
• 1:29:45
  Speaker 1: Yeah, so that's I think it's like almost exactly, I think I almost exactly had 55k left to go, or 57k or something like that.
• 1:29:53
  Speaker 1: And yeah.
• 1:29:55
  Speaker 1: So, you know, for better or worse, but I had met like my base criteria for finishing this race.
• 1:30:00
  Speaker 1: And so that was a a moment where, you know, on top of the scream, I just like kind of took it in of like this is possible.
• 1:30:08
  Speaker 1: It hit me, yeah.
• 1:30:09
  Speaker 1: Of like, I'm going to finish Leadville.
• 1:30:12
  Speaker 1: Because before then it was just like this kind of panic of like unsurety, but like, you know, yeah, desire and like strength to push.
• 1:30:21
  Speaker 1: But then I hit the top and it was like the first time it really sat in that like I'm going to finish Leadville.
• 1:30:29
  Speaker: You got this.
• 1:30:30
  Speaker: And I can't imagine what that would feel like, man.
• 1:30:32
  Speaker 1: Like it felt really good until I started moving again.
• 1:30:35
  Speaker: Yeah, I'm sure.
• 1:30:36
  Speaker 1: Then you're like, oh crap.
• 1:30:37
  Speaker 1: And then my knee was in my left one specifically, was just in a world of hurt.
• 1:30:43
  Speaker 1: Dude.
• 1:30:43
  Speaker 1: It was ever and you know, what's good on the knees?
• 1:30:47
  Speaker 1: Downhill.
• 1:30:48
  Speaker: Oh, yeah, it's the best, right?
• 1:30:49
  Speaker 1: Oh, and so it's like, you know, we have to do that.
• 1:30:52
  Speaker 1: Did it help at all that it was it wasn't like as steep?
• 1:30:54
  Speaker 1: I mean, because I'm sure actually not as steep as the back is still pretty freaking steep.
• 1:30:59
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I guess that's fair.
• 1:31:01
  Speaker: Yeah, you're going up a mountain, dude.
• 1:31:03
  Speaker 1: So and and you know, a big part of my plan because Dylan and I had really crushed going down that front side.
• 1:31:09
  Speaker: Yeah.
• 1:31:10
  Speaker 1: And so I was like, I'm gonna crush it again.
• 1:31:12
  Speaker 1: Well, one, no, my knee was it was in a bad way, and then two, it was now pitch black.
• 1:31:18
  Speaker 1: We had done that on the opposite side of the clock where the sun was starting to get and the sun came up, and now it's like it's pitch black.
• 1:31:25
  Speaker 1: I am like pulling out my light, and my light was great, but man, you know, in the daylight, I just didn't give enough kind of respect to how rocky that downhill was.
• 1:31:38
  Speaker 1: Because in the daylight I could see all the dirt patches, so it's just like la di da di-da.
• 1:31:41
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and then in the night, it's like you know, you're triple checking your eyes because if you step wrong, your race can be over.
• 1:31:48
  Speaker 1: I can't even.
• 1:31:48
  Speaker 1: And so I'm going, I'm in just an absurd amount of left knee pain, and I can't run, and that's frustrating me.
• 1:31:57
  Speaker 1: Yeah, because I'm like, I'm losing time that I'm like planning on.
• 1:32:01
  Speaker 1: You know, in my head, I had planned out all these sections, all the time I needed for all the sections, and I'm losing time on this section.
• 1:32:08
  Speaker 1: And I'm wondering, I'm like, something has got to give.
• 1:32:12
  Speaker 1: Like, I've got to be able to do better.
• 1:32:14
  Speaker 1: And then I get passed again.
• 1:32:17
  Speaker 1: Um, this time by Lexi Watts.
• 1:32:20
  Speaker 1: I don't know if you know if you're familiar with that name or not.
• 1:32:22
  Speaker 1: But I think we were pretty infamous, like run fluencer.
• 1:32:26
  Speaker: I'm pretty sure my wife and I were looking like watching her too.
• 1:32:28
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, she brought a lot of you know, credit to her, she brought a lot of attention to the race.
• 1:32:34
  Speaker 1: Was she an elite at the front?
• 1:32:36
  Speaker 1: No, she was actually backpack with me.
• 1:32:38
  Speaker 1: We came in kind of right before the end, the cutoff at the end of the race.
• 1:32:42
  Speaker 1: Um, but she brought a lot of attention to the race, and good for her, she's a stud.
• 1:32:45
  Speaker 1: What a freaking animal to to finish that race.
• 1:32:48
  Speaker 1: Yeah, but she passed me, and I had been ahead of her all day.
• 1:32:52
  Speaker 1: And I I wasn't like, you know, I didn't have this complex of like I gotta beat Lexi Watson.
• 1:32:57
  Speaker: You gotta beat a woman.
• 1:32:58
  Speaker 1: No.
• 1:33:00
  Speaker: Sounds horrible actually when you say that.
• 1:33:02
  Speaker 1: So when you say it that way, yeah, when you know, I and again, because it's 1v1, it's me versus me, right?
• 1:33:09
  Speaker 1: Um, but she like she didn't just pass me.
• 1:33:12
  Speaker 1: It was again kind of like the cruiser took me to Gaplebee's, you know, like just ripped right by.
• 1:33:18
  Speaker 1: And I was like, Dagum, like, are you kidding me right now?
• 1:33:22
  Speaker 1: Again.
• 1:33:22
  Speaker 1: And and that, like, you know, and again, it wasn't necessarily because you know, she's a woman or is some other competitor.
• 1:33:31
  Speaker 1: It was literally just another like bread crumb.
• 1:33:34
  Speaker: It's kind of like snaps you out of a bit.
• 1:33:36
  Speaker 1: Yeah, like my knee didn't stop hurting.
• 1:33:38
  Speaker 1: Like, I don't, you know, I didn't she didn't magically like have some wand that took away knee pain.
• 1:33:43
  Speaker 1: It just like my brain, I don't know.
• 1:33:45
  Speaker 1: I I tuned it out, yeah.
• 1:33:47
  Speaker 1: Um, and it still hurt, I still felt it, but I was just like, let's go.
• 1:33:52
  Speaker 1: And so I picked up my pace a ton.
• 1:33:54
  Speaker 1: Um, she still crushed me on that section.
• 1:33:57
  Speaker 1: She's a baller.
• 1:33:57
  Speaker 1: Like, I'll give her all of her kudos.
• 1:33:59
  Speaker 1: A lot of people online like talk their crap on her and the run fluencers, but like they're legit, man.
• 1:34:06
  Speaker 1: Yeah, she crushed it.
• 1:34:07
  Speaker 1: Like, I have nothing but respect for her, and um, her pacers were some of the other like run fluencer girls that are local here in Utah, but she crushed it, and I was I was actually grateful for her at that time because it pulled me out of the super pain cave that I was in.
• 1:34:25
  Speaker 1: Like my brain, I wanted to get more, and I just I couldn't.
• 1:34:28
  Speaker 1: And then it was like that was enough for whatever psyche thing to happen of me to like just ignore it, which you know, a doctor's probably gonna say that was a bad move, but like ignore the knee pain and let's go.
• 1:34:41
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and that it was kind of a bad move because that also like sparked my right knee to start hurting.
• 1:34:47
  Speaker: Oh no, dude.
• 1:34:48
  Speaker 1: It's so my crew calls me again and they're like, because you know, to the crew, they've been able to like follow me on like the iPhone, like find your friends, and then like the race updates and stuff.
• 1:35:00
  Speaker 1: Um, however, Hope Pass is kind of like a cell dark dead spot.
• 1:35:04
  Speaker 1: Okay, and so it's like they're not really seeing me on the find my and you know, it's only at like mile 54 or mile whatever 52 and then uh 60 or something like that where the aid stations are updating.
• 1:35:17
  Speaker 1: Dude, so it's a long time.
• 1:35:19
  Speaker 1: They're like, What's happening?
• 1:35:20
  Speaker 1: They have not seen me.
• 1:35:21
  Speaker 1: I mean, this is a quarter of the race, this is 25 miles of the race, and they haven't seen me.
• 1:35:25
  Speaker 1: And so, you know, they're kind of getting anxious, and I don't know what they did to fill their time, hopefully got some sleep or something.
• 1:35:32
  Speaker 1: But they I finally, I think my phone had kicked back into service and they could see me on like the find mine, realized I was like two or three miles from the aid station.
• 1:35:40
  Speaker 1: So they call me and they're like, dude, like how's it going?
• 1:35:44
  Speaker 1: And I'm like, you know, I hate that this is a recurring theme, but I'm in a bad way.
• 1:35:48
  Speaker 1: Like, I'm I'm bad.
• 1:35:50
  Speaker 1: I know I'm behind on nutrition and hydration again, basically the theme of the whole race.
• 1:35:55
  Speaker 1: I had actually I had taken a caffeine um packet or gel um right at the start coming back up Hope Pass on the backside, and it like didn't sit.
• 1:36:06
  Speaker 1: And so it like kind of sat like in the back of my throat, like you know, kind of that like throw-up feeling for you know, 45 minutes.
• 1:36:14
  Speaker 1: That sounds like so I couldn't bring myself to like have another gel because I had just had like this feeling of gel vomit for the past like 45 minutes.
• 1:36:22
  Speaker 1: Oh, dude.
• 1:36:23
  Speaker 1: And so I didn't take like any gels going down, which you know is another hour or so.
• 1:36:28
  Speaker 1: And so I knew I was way behind on nutrition, my carbs per hour, whatever I was behind, and I knew that, and I told them that I was like, I'm behind, and like my knees are bad.
• 1:36:39
  Speaker 1: Like, dude, find the KT tape.
• 1:36:41
  Speaker 1: Like, I knew I'd brought some KT tape.
• 1:36:43
  Speaker 1: I was like, find that, find something.
• 1:36:45
  Speaker 1: Like, we gotta figure out how to make my knees not hurt because ice them when you got there, or so bad.
• 1:36:52
  Speaker 1: Yeah, what happened?
• 1:36:53
  Speaker 1: So we you know, I hang up that phone call and like I keep going across the river again, get freaking soaking wet.
• 1:37:02
  Speaker 1: Yeah, now you're just river, man.
• 1:37:05
  Speaker 1: And so get back to the aid station, and like I had actually kind of felt like an uptick after the river.
• 1:37:14
  Speaker 1: Um, because the river was like it was ice cold.
• 1:37:17
  Speaker 1: It was yeah, it kind of refreshed a little bit.
• 1:37:18
  Speaker 1: You're like, and I think that actually helped me a lot because it kind of cooled down, you know, things that were overheated and pitched.
• 1:37:25
  Speaker 1: How deep was it?
• 1:37:26
  Speaker 1: Um, it was only like I think at the highest point, like mid-calf.
• 1:37:29
  Speaker 1: Okay, maybe up to my.
• 1:37:30
  Speaker 1: I don't even know if it got up to my knee, actually.
• 1:37:33
  Speaker 1: Uh it's all kind of a blur now.
• 1:37:34
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm sure, dude.
• 1:37:36
  Speaker 1: Um, but it it felt so good.
• 1:37:39
  Speaker 1: It actually kind of like refreshed me from kind of the ground up.
• 1:37:42
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 1:37:43
  Speaker 1: So I actually felt really good going into the aid station, which I think shocked them because I had just got off the phone, like struggling again.
• 1:37:49
  Speaker 1: I'm dying.
• 1:37:50
  Speaker 1: And I'm sure my speech was super slurred because that's like one of my first things.
• 1:37:54
  Speaker 1: When I like get low on fuel and like new uh electrolytes and stuff, my like jaw is one of the first things to like get really yeah.
• 1:38:03
  Speaker 1: It's the it's like it's really embarrassing.
• 1:38:06
  Speaker 1: I actually like am super self-conscious about it because like my jaw just like stops.
• 1:38:11
  Speaker 1: Really?
• 1:38:11
  Speaker 1: Like it just doesn't like work right.
• 1:38:14
  Speaker 1: Interesting.
• 1:38:14
  Speaker 1: So I like I can't talk normal.
• 1:38:16
  Speaker 1: I don't like slur my words, like I just like slur my words when I'm talking, and I it's super embarrassing.
• 1:38:21
  Speaker: But dude, I'd probably be I'd probably be slurring my words anyways at that point too.
• 1:38:25
  Speaker 1: Like, come on, it's yeah, it is low-key like a little embarrassment for me.
• 1:38:30
  Speaker 1: Like it's I I like think about it, but I just got off a phone call like that where I was probably you know slurring a lot of my words just because my jaw is like clenched up.
• 1:38:40
  Speaker 1: And but I get back to the aid station, it's again pitch black.
• 1:38:44
  Speaker 1: I think I think it literally was like 2 a.m.
• 1:38:46
  Speaker 1: or 1 30, something like that.
• 1:38:47
  Speaker 1: Yeah, um, getting back to Twin Lakes, and they were I think I shocked all of them because I rolled in and I was actually like I just got refreshed by the river like a mile and a half ago, and so I was just like, Yeah, what's up, guys?
• 1:39:00
  Speaker 1: Let's go.
• 1:39:00
  Speaker 1: And I came in like that.
• 1:39:01
  Speaker 1: I was like, eh, like how we like what's up, everybody.
• 1:39:03
  Speaker 1: And I they're all like, ah, because you know, I think they anticipated me to come in like I had come into Twin Lakes before, which was zombie dead, like they're helping me get sit down.
• 1:39:15
  Speaker 1: And I come in pretty hot, like come in strong.
• 1:39:18
  Speaker 1: I'm grabbing, they like meet me with a Gatorade, and I'm like chugging Gatorade.
• 1:39:23
  Speaker 1: Sorry, and uh get all like you know, suited back up for the night, and it you know this is like that last farewell because I know I'm like I'm not gonna see these guys again for a while, but I do finally get a pacer.
• 1:39:45
  Speaker: Oh no.
• 1:39:46
  Speaker 1: So this whole thing, you know, I'm effectively solo for zero to sixty-five, which again is like double what I have ever run in my whole life.
• 1:39:54
  Speaker 1: That's insane.
• 1:39:55
  Speaker 1: That's nuts.
• 1:39:55
  Speaker 1: So I'm zero.
• 1:39:56
  Speaker 1: So we get the bag off my shoulders, and that was like that was the biggest relief ever.
• 1:40:01
  Speaker: Just feel like 18 pounds lighter.
• 1:40:04
  Speaker 1: Freedom, no bag on the shoulders.
• 1:40:06
  Speaker 1: Gave the bag to Dylan, he was gonna be my first pacer, and that was like such a feeling of relief.
• 1:40:12
  Speaker 1: Getting getting the bag off the shoulders.
• 1:40:14
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and so we're like pounding food, we're trying to like get the knees to come down.
• 1:40:21
  Speaker 1: Um, I think we're you know, like icy hotting.
• 1:40:24
  Speaker 1: I think we did we did have ice, they were putting ice pretty much everywhere, and my feet too.
• 1:40:29
  Speaker 1: Um icing everything because I was again, I was overheating.
• 1:40:33
  Speaker 1: It was the middle of the night, and it's still hot.
• 1:40:35
  Speaker 1: We're high elevation, remember?
• 1:40:36
  Speaker 1: Like we're we're really high.
• 1:40:38
  Speaker 1: So even though, yeah, it got up like I think the high on the day was only in like the low 80s, but you're at above 10,000 feet, and so the sun, it just that's why it felt so hot for sure.
• 1:40:48
  Speaker: Um, I totally know where you're coming from.
• 1:40:50
  Speaker 1: But then on the flip side of that coin, you're really high up at night, which is cold.
• 1:40:55
  Speaker 1: Like, yeah, you get the opposite end, and so it's cold, and I'm like a furnace, huh?
• 1:41:01
  Speaker 1: Like, I am just like steaming heat because I think one, my kidneys are just overworking, everything is overworking because I'm so you know, behind on hydration, behind on fuel, and so everything.
• 1:41:14
  Speaker 1: You're just beating your body.
• 1:41:15
  Speaker 1: I'm a toaster, I'm like a toaster oven in the middle of the night.
• 1:41:19
  Speaker 1: And yeah, like one of the things that happened next was like after we took off, I like took my shirt off because I was cooking.
• 1:41:27
  Speaker 1: I was like, I am so hot right now.
• 1:41:30
  Speaker 1: And so I took my shirt off, handed it to Dylan, and ran shirtless through the night.
• 1:41:34
  Speaker 1: Dang.
• 1:41:35
  Speaker 1: But this was one of my favorite, this was easily my favorite segment of the whole race was miles 65 to 75.
• 1:41:43
  Speaker 1: Um, not like a great section, like it's immediately a climb.
• 1:41:48
  Speaker 1: And I was like pretty dead, but like we took off on that first climb hot, and I was just like, go, go, go, go, go.
• 1:41:54
  Speaker 1: And I think I kind of shocked everybody.
• 1:41:56
  Speaker 1: I remember like Lindsay and my mom after the race, they're like, We just couldn't believe how you took off out of the aid station.
• 1:42:01
  Speaker 1: And I was like, Yeah, me neither.
• 1:42:03
  Speaker 1: Like, I don't know where that came from, what that was.
• 1:42:05
  Speaker: Like, I bet it was dude, the backpack and the shirt probably had something to do with it, man.
• 1:42:10
  Speaker 1: Yeah, take off, and it's it's straight up a hill, it's a little hill, but it's like it's a straight up climb.
• 1:42:14
  Speaker 1: Yeah, you drop down, it's like literally just this hill.
• 1:42:17
  Speaker 1: So you drop up and over it, and then you climb way the frick back up.
• 1:42:22
  Speaker: Oh man.
• 1:42:23
  Speaker 1: And it had it sucked coming down because like that had been kind of the beginning of my knee pain going into Twin Lakes, yeah.
• 1:42:30
  Speaker 1: And so that section I knew it sucked, and so I wasn't looking forward to it on the other end.
• 1:42:34
  Speaker 1: Um, and I especially didn't think I was going to be in shape to run it.
• 1:42:37
  Speaker 1: Like Dylan and I like we hammered that whole section, and it was awesome.
• 1:42:43
  Speaker 1: And we get up to where finally, like, you're done climbing, and it it just it turns back to more like rollers.
• 1:42:49
  Speaker: That's gotta feel so good, dude.
• 1:42:51
  Speaker: Like mile 65 in that, and you're just pounding another 10 miles.
• 1:42:56
  Speaker 1: I literally felt like some of the best I had felt the entire day was miles 65 to 75.
• 1:43:01
  Speaker 1: Yeah, that's we were just hammering, like we're passing people, and I uh I could see it in their eyes, they're just like, What the hell?
• 1:43:08
  Speaker 1: Yeah, where did this guy come from?
• 1:43:10
  Speaker 1: This guy, and I'm like, this is a side note.
• 1:43:13
  Speaker 1: I'm like considered a big, bigger guy in ultra running.
• 1:43:17
  Speaker 1: I got told that actually like four, I think four times during the race, and then like Andy had even mentioned it like on the Friday during the shakeout run, and then I'd had some other guy online.
• 1:43:28
  Speaker 1: I had posted a TikTok of me finishing the Bryce Canyon half marathon, yeah, and he had made some comment about how that was fast for like a big guy.
• 1:43:36
  Speaker 1: I mean you're built, but I was like, like, yeah, what the heck, man?
• 1:43:39
  Speaker 1: Because like I'm you know, objectively to me, I'm like, I'm not that big of a guy.
• 1:43:44
  Speaker 1: I'm pretty small guy.
• 1:43:45
  Speaker 1: I mean, I work with dudes who are like six two, three hundred pounds, yeah, some 400 pounds, actually.
• 1:43:51
  Speaker 1: Like, I work with some big dudes, and so I'm always like, yeah, I'm like victim weight, like I'm a small guy, but no, you get on on the ultra, and I'm like way bigger than a lot of these people because I'm like just about six two and like 210 pounds, yeah.
• 1:44:06
  Speaker 1: So it's like I was a bigger guy, and so I take my shirt off in the middle of the night, and I'm just this big guy running through the freaking dark.
• 1:44:15
  Speaker 1: You're like everyone I feel like people are super stoked.
• 1:44:18
  Speaker 1: Who the heck?
• 1:44:19
  Speaker 1: You know, they're like, what is going on?
• 1:44:21
  Speaker 1: Because I'm just like David Goggins.
• 1:44:22
  Speaker 1: We were cruising, we were cruising.
• 1:44:25
  Speaker 1: Like, yeah, I think I caught Dylan off guard a little bit because it's like we were just cooking and it felt so good.
• 1:44:31
  Speaker 1: It just felt good, and that was when I was in the night, like chasing headlights, you know.
• 1:44:35
  Speaker 1: I was like, I need that one.
• 1:44:37
  Speaker 1: I'd I'd like pointed out to Dylan, I was like, there's one up there, like I can see a headlight up there, we gotta go get it.
• 1:44:42
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and we'd go get it, we'd track him down, and it felt so good.
• 1:44:47
  Speaker 1: But I'm sure all of them were thinking, like, this idiot, like he's gonna blow up later.
• 1:44:51
  Speaker 1: And yeah, they would have all been absolutely correct because after I had had so much fun, some of my best racing, you know, so to speak, um, that late-ish, like still got a marathon.
• 1:45:04
  Speaker 1: Wheels fell off at 75.
• 1:45:07
  Speaker 1: Hard, like so hard, everything started hurting.
• 1:45:13
  Speaker 1: Knees, both knees basically just gave up.
• 1:45:16
  Speaker 1: Um, and it's how are your hips?
• 1:45:17
  Speaker 1: Hips, surprisingly, like they felt like steel cables.
• 1:45:21
  Speaker 1: Okay, so pretty tight, but super tight, but they weren't like I've had like really painful hip pain, and this wasn't that, it was just like they were just so tight.
• 1:45:29
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I think I said it to my crew a few times how it's just like steel cables, like yeah, my hips are steel cables right now.
• 1:45:37
  Speaker 1: Um, but my hips like were holding up, but my knees completely fell apart, and it just it felt like that like stabbing, like you know, like an ice pick or something.
• 1:45:48
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it just like just sharp shooting pain with every single step.
• 1:45:53
  Speaker 1: They're just super swollen at that point, like they weren't even really swollen, really.
• 1:45:56
  Speaker 1: Like I'm grateful that they've kind of healed up now, but that was so painful.
• 1:46:02
  Speaker 1: My knees just and it was right about 75.
• 1:46:05
  Speaker 1: Like and then the the wild card, because I I had kind of knew going into it, I was like knees and hips, like any long, long distance I've done, like my knees and my hips always kind of hurt.
• 1:46:18
  Speaker 1: That's what happens, and so I knew that was coming.
• 1:46:21
  Speaker 1: That doesn't necessarily make it easier all the time, but like I knew the knees and the hips were gonna be a thing.
• 1:46:25
  Speaker 1: Yeah, the one that caught me off guard was not the Achilles that I had injured and worked, you know, so hard to fix from the marathon, but the other one that's never given me a problem a day in my life.
• 1:46:39
  Speaker 1: Huh.
• 1:46:40
  Speaker 1: My right Achilles blows up.
• 1:46:42
  Speaker 1: Really?
• 1:46:42
  Speaker 1: And it's like oh, dude.
• 1:46:45
  Speaker 1: It's hard to express because I don't know, we all feel pain so differently.
• 1:46:49
  Speaker 1: Yeah, but it it hurt just so it's like a sharp pain in there, or yeah, and like it felt so bad to run on it, it felt bad to walk on it, and so that was like, we know we're kind of rolling the dice of like what's the lesser of evils?
• 1:47:04
  Speaker 1: Like, if it hurts this much anyway, like do I go?
• 1:47:06
  Speaker 1: I was just trying to run on it, and you know, Dylan catches the tail end of that in his pacing, but we had had like this super solid block, and then he catches like right as I start to blow up, and then I go into the aid station, I think that was mile 20.
• 1:47:21
  Speaker 1: Um, and I I it was rough going into that aid station because I was already just in so much pain, more pain than I'd ever been in during any race, and I've got 20 miles left.
• 1:47:33
  Speaker: Yeah, that's insane.
• 1:47:35
  Speaker 1: And and then we make arguably my only mistake, and I it wasn't like something we could have planned on or that I had even known at the time, yeah.
• 1:47:45
  Speaker 1: But we sat me down at mile 80 in that aid station so that we could like you know tape up my um Achilles and try to tape up my knees and like kind of massage my calves.
• 1:47:56
  Speaker 1: But when we did that, it like locked up my quads.
• 1:48:00
  Speaker: Really?
• 1:48:00
  Speaker: Your body just like.
• 1:48:02
  Speaker 1: They just like and I was like, oh no.
• 1:48:05
  Speaker 1: And it was like as soon as I sat down, just like like locked.
• 1:48:10
  Speaker 1: I don't know how to describe it better.
• 1:48:12
  Speaker 1: Yeah, like just absolutely they did not want to move, like they didn't want any part of the bending motion anymore.
• 1:48:18
  Speaker 1: Like my quads just checked out, they were done with bending for the day, is how it felt.
• 1:48:24
  Speaker 1: And like I literally couldn't stand back up.
• 1:48:27
  Speaker 1: I had to have the three dudes literally like pick me back up to my feet because I couldn't stand back up because my quads had just literally cinched up so tight.
• 1:48:37
  Speaker 1: And so trying to just like even get moving again was incredibly painful, man, and slow.
• 1:48:45
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and now now we're on the flip side of the coin, right?
• 1:48:48
  Speaker 1: Like now we're fighting the clock, right?
• 1:48:49
  Speaker: Like now it's me versus the clock 30 hours is 30 hours, okay.
• 1:48:54
  Speaker 1: And you know, and so now we're not on the like, oh slow down, you've got plenty of time.
• 1:48:58
  Speaker 1: Now it's like, hey, we gotta like we're fighting the clock now.
• 1:49:02
  Speaker 1: And I I kept saying that over and over again.
• 1:49:04
  Speaker 1: I was like, this is just a fight between me and a clock, like that's all there is left, is I gotta fight this clock.
• 1:49:09
  Speaker 1: Man, and I wasn't pacing to do it because I I was I was in so much pain, my quads locked up.
• 1:49:17
  Speaker 1: I I was really struggling to get anything down.
• 1:49:20
  Speaker 1: Um, I just couldn't eat, couldn't drink.
• 1:49:23
  Speaker 1: I was super done with like electrolyte mixes.
• 1:49:26
  Speaker: Oh, I'm sure.
• 1:49:27
  Speaker 1: Um, you know, that far into it, I was just done with them.
• 1:49:30
  Speaker 1: I didn't want anything.
• 1:49:31
  Speaker 1: I I barely wanted water, I wanted nothing.
• 1:49:33
  Speaker 1: Yeah, you're like, I you just get to this point where it's like screw everything, and that's bad because you still need carbs, you still need electrolytes, like you still need all of these things.
• 1:49:43
  Speaker 1: And like poor Brandon, like Brandon was my final pacer, and I just you know, that's some of the worst I've ever felt in my life.
• 1:49:52
  Speaker 1: Yeah, like easily my top moments of pain, and you know, he put up he had to put up with it for 20 miles.
• 1:49:59
  Speaker 1: Dang.
• 1:50:00
  Speaker 1: Of me just, you know, being a whiny honri baby the whole way.
• 1:50:06
  Speaker 1: I bet he understood though.
• 1:50:07
  Speaker 1: And yeah, he's a stud.
• 1:50:08
  Speaker 1: I'm actually going to go crew him.
• 1:50:10
  Speaker 1: He's doing the Javelina 100 at the end of October.
• 1:50:13
  Speaker 1: So that's an Arizona, right?
• 1:50:14
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 1:50:15
  Speaker: Man, there we go.
• 1:50:15
  Speaker 1: So I get to go crew him.
• 1:50:16
  Speaker 1: I'm excited about that.
• 1:50:18
  Speaker 1: And we'll see, you know, how he compares to where I was in those last 20 because I was in such a rough place.
• 1:50:23
  Speaker 1: And I've apologized to him over and over again.
• 1:50:26
  Speaker 1: But he gets it.
• 1:50:27
  Speaker 1: You know, he's he's an athlete.
• 1:50:28
  Speaker 1: He's, you know, gonna go do his first 100.
• 1:50:31
  Speaker 1: So he gets it.
• 1:50:32
  Speaker 1: But like just for some perspective, like there was literally a section where I knew I had to run because you know I'm starting, I'm fighting the clock.
• 1:50:41
  Speaker 1: I know I've got to do this.
• 1:50:43
  Speaker 1: And so I'm like, I'm forcing myself to run, but it it hurts so bad that I'm literally like, you know, I'm not ashamed to admit it.
• 1:50:52
  Speaker 1: I'm I'm crying while I'm running because I'm just in so much pain.
• 1:50:56
  Speaker 1: Like I can't even stop the tears because I'm in I'm in so much physical agony at this point that it's just like it's insufferable.
• 1:51:05
  Speaker 1: Like I couldn't, yeah, I don't know, it's hard to relate.
• 1:51:08
  Speaker: And that's the thing, it's like I have no idea what that feels like.
• 1:51:10
  Speaker: Where your body's just like, I'm done.
• 1:51:13
  Speaker: Yeah, like your knees have just ran 80 miles, they've they've held you for that long, like your body's just going, like you said, your kidneys, everything's working over time.
• 1:51:22
  Speaker: Yeah, like I cannot imagine what that's like.
• 1:51:24
  Speaker: I'll experience it one day, but like I'm excited for you to experience it.
• 1:51:28
  Speaker 1: I feel like everybody should, but man, it's yeah, it's and even then, you know, I wasn't thinking about quitting.
• 1:51:34
  Speaker 1: My my thoughts were solely focused on like I have to beat this clock, yeah.
• 1:51:39
  Speaker 1: And you know, it hurt so bad, and I wanted to be done.
• 1:51:42
  Speaker 1: I wanted to not do it anymore.
• 1:51:44
  Speaker 1: I wanted to just teleport to the finished light, you know.
• 1:51:47
  Speaker 1: That was and then I threw up.
• 1:51:49
  Speaker 1: Oh, dude, and that made things exponentially worse, yeah.
• 1:51:52
  Speaker 1: Because it the only thing it did help like my stomach feel better, right?
• 1:51:56
  Speaker 1: Um, which was good.
• 1:51:57
  Speaker 1: That part was good, but it drained like everything else out of my body, and that part was really bad.
• 1:52:04
  Speaker 1: Yeah, because then like my kidneys started like seizing up.
• 1:52:08
  Speaker: Really?
• 1:52:09
  Speaker: And you felt that?
• 1:52:10
  Speaker 1: Yeah, because I got to a point where it's like I could I could push through the pain, but then and run.
• 1:52:19
  Speaker 1: So it's like I, you know, I'd get it and I'd get going again, but then my kidneys would seize up, and that would do like you know, it would like literally like seize my whole back and it would like suck my shoulders in.
• 1:52:30
  Speaker 2: Oh, dude.
• 1:52:31
  Speaker 1: And I just like and that would bring me to a dead stop.
• 1:52:34
  Speaker 1: Like you couldn't, that wasn't like a push-through thing.
• 1:52:36
  Speaker 1: That would like you, yeah, it would seize up my back so hard.
• 1:52:41
  Speaker 1: And and that was weird, yeah, and that was scary because I've like I've never experienced that before.
• 1:52:47
  Speaker 1: So I'm like, dude, I'm gonna, I'm telling Brandon, I'm like, I'm really worried I'm gonna go into like kidney failure.
• 1:52:52
  Speaker: Yeah.
• 1:52:53
  Speaker 1: Um, because this keeps happening.
• 1:52:54
  Speaker 1: This is like a you know, we're just cycling this run, walk, seize thing.
• 1:52:59
  Speaker 1: Like weird, man.
• 1:52:59
  Speaker 1: We're doing that for a few miles where it's just like run as far as I can until I like completely seize up from kidney pain.
• 1:53:06
  Speaker 1: Weird, and then walk and then run, and then you know, until I'm seized up from kidney pain.
• 1:53:11
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and so he's like trying to give me all the water I can handle, and we're trying to get more gels down.
• 1:53:17
  Speaker 1: And thankfully, I think the last like three or four miles it finally like stopped seizing on me.
• 1:53:23
  Speaker 1: But that was that was brutal, and I was really like concerned.
• 1:53:27
  Speaker 1: I was highly concerned I was gonna end up in the hospital, and I'm you now we're so deep, you know.
• 1:53:32
  Speaker 1: I'm in the 90s now, right?
• 1:53:33
  Speaker 1: And it's just like if I like you know, kind of medically DNF between 90 and 100, like I'm just gonna be pissed, right?
• 1:53:42
  Speaker: Yeah, like forget everything else.
• 1:53:44
  Speaker 1: I'm just I'm now gonna be really upset.
• 1:53:46
  Speaker 1: And so I was like, dude, I cannot like go into kidney failure here, right?
• 1:53:52
  Speaker 1: And oh dude, so you know, he's like, he wants me to cross that line, I want to cross that line, and he's the one, you know, he's in charge of the clock, yeah.
• 1:54:02
  Speaker 1: And so, you know, he's he's running that, he's running that, he's like, You gotta you gotta keep going, we gotta keep pushing, we gotta keep pushing, dude.
• 1:54:08
  Speaker: And I'm like, That's probably like the last thing you want to hear, dude.
• 1:54:11
  Speaker: It's like I'm doing all I can't.
• 1:54:12
  Speaker 1: Screw you, leave me alone.
• 1:54:13
  Speaker 1: Like exactly it hurts so bad.
• 1:54:15
  Speaker 1: But then, like, you know, aside from the pain, the truly like you're in that headspace.
• 1:54:23
  Speaker 1: I don't know, some people have like these epiphanies, they learn something, they learn these lessons or something.
• 1:54:29
  Speaker 1: I feel like I just learned like you know, my perseverance where I'm at.
• 1:54:35
  Speaker 1: Like, I wanted nothing more than to just cross that line.
• 1:54:38
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and that's all I needed, you know.
• 1:54:40
  Speaker 1: And to actually cross that line was just it's hard to describe.
• 1:54:48
  Speaker 1: I'm sure like the feeling of it being done is weird because you've just gone so long.
• 1:54:54
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and you have no you didn't sleep, right?
• 1:54:57
  Speaker 1: I didn't sleep through any of it.
• 1:54:58
  Speaker 1: So I'm pushing now 30 hours.
• 1:55:00
  Speaker 1: I came in like 28 and a half minutes before the deck cut off.
• 1:55:04
  Speaker 1: Man, um, and it was just such a such a cool feeling, overwhelming feeling of just you know, gratitude, especially for my team.
• 1:55:14
  Speaker 1: I was so grateful for my team for all the support that I had.
• 1:55:17
  Speaker 1: That was like just such a huge like a wave of relief, too.
• 1:55:23
  Speaker: It's like okay, now I can just yeah stop.
• 1:55:26
  Speaker 1: And they hand you they hand you the medal, which I did I did bring, I stuffed that in here.
• 1:55:31
  Speaker: Oh, dude, there we go.
• 1:55:33
  Speaker 1: The Leadville finisher medal and then the belt buckle.
• 1:55:36
  Speaker: Oh, that's right.
• 1:55:37
  Speaker 1: Got the buckle.
• 1:55:38
  Speaker: Let's go, dude.
• 1:55:39
  Speaker: That is sweet, and that was like the race across the sky.
• 1:55:43
  Speaker: That's pretty sweet.
• 1:55:43
  Speaker: Yeah, show that up.
• 1:55:45
  Speaker 1: Awesome.
• 1:55:46
  Speaker: Man, that's gotta feel good to have that, though.
• 1:55:48
  Speaker 1: Oh, absolutely.
• 1:55:49
  Speaker: That's a medal that's like, yeah, I'd be proud to have that.
• 1:55:52
  Speaker 1: They put that on, and then you know, you give a hug to the the lady who literally started the race.
• 1:55:58
  Speaker 1: She's the one giving you the medal.
• 1:55:59
  Speaker 1: No way.
• 1:56:00
  Speaker 1: That was also just really cool.
• 1:56:02
  Speaker: That's insane.
• 1:56:02
  Speaker 1: Like, you know, the founder of the race.
• 1:56:04
  Speaker 1: It was her and um Ken, and he, you know, I think he was having some some health problems, so he wasn't at the finish line, but she was, and she put that medal on, said welcome to the Leadville family.
• 1:56:15
  Speaker 1: And I was just like, like, thank you so much.
• 1:56:18
  Speaker 1: Like just so cool, such an overwhelming feeling of just joy and accomplishment.
• 1:56:24
  Speaker: Oh, I'm sure, man.
• 1:56:26
  Speaker 1: It's it's really hard to describe, but you know, it just it's wild because before that you're unsure if you can do anything like it.
• 1:56:35
  Speaker: Yeah.
• 1:56:36
  Speaker 1: And then now you're done and it's over.
• 1:56:38
  Speaker 1: And it's just like huh.
• 1:56:40
  Speaker 1: It's over.
• 1:56:40
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 1:56:41
  Speaker 1: You know, like it's a weird feeling for it to just be over.
• 1:56:44
  Speaker: I'm sure.
• 1:56:44
  Speaker: But it's like you were saying, you know, it's some people have epiphanies, and you know, I I don't think I've had like a moment where I'm like, oh wow, like I don't know.
• 1:56:53
  Speaker: Or it just comes to you and you just realize something.
• 1:56:56
  Speaker: But I think what ultras, and again, I haven't done 100 miles or haven't done lead well, but what they've taught me is like, you know what, you can do more than you thought that you could, and kind of like you were just saying, is like no matter what, like you can always push just a little bit further.
• 1:57:10
  Speaker: And like when you want to quit, or like if you have that thought, like you can still keep going.
• 1:57:16
  Speaker: It's just mind over matter at that point, unless, of course, like your kidneys did fail.
• 1:57:20
  Speaker: But I mean, like, you know, of course, there's there's those things where it's like, okay, well, a lot of it is just how strong am I?
• 1:57:26
  Speaker: And like you said, perseverance, like how resilient can I be?
• 1:57:29
  Speaker: How how do I keep my head high when like I'm mile ninety-five into it and I'm so close, but it I'm struggling.
• 1:57:37
  Speaker: Like, those are all I think really valuable lessons and things that you you do take with you, like not just in the races, but you apply that to other aspects of of life.
• 1:57:47
  Speaker: And I think that's like that's the the whole point.
• 1:57:50
  Speaker: Like you said, it's it's me versus me.
• 1:57:52
  Speaker: And like how far can I push myself?
• 1:57:55
  Speaker: Like, I I think that's the right mindset to have.
• 1:57:57
  Speaker: And like something I'm I'm trying to do with ultra marathoning is like I want to see what that line is for me where it I get cut off.
• 1:58:04
  Speaker 2: And yeah, for real.
• 1:58:05
  Speaker: Um but dude, I I think that's so amazing.
• 1:58:08
  Speaker: And you like you've aimed me up.
• 1:58:10
  Speaker: I want to do it even more now, man.
• 1:58:12
  Speaker: Like, I it sounds incredibly hard, and like obviously I'm not discounting that at all, but it is like something I really want to do.
• 1:58:18
  Speaker 1: Like, I I highly recommend it.
• 1:58:20
  Speaker 1: Uh, you know, just find that out about yourself for sure.
• 1:58:24
  Speaker 1: Like it's a cool, cool lesson to learn for yourself.
• 1:58:28
  Speaker 1: Like, it's hard to, you know, where it's applicable, what it accomplishes is all kind of subjective, but like that personal feeling of like, man, I can do I I can do hard things.
• 1:58:40
  Speaker: Yeah, I love that man.
• 1:58:42
  Speaker: And now you can tell your kids like, hey, Jace wasn't on that race, I beat him.
• 1:58:45
  Speaker: Like, but yeah, man, I think that's that's insane.
• 1:58:49
  Speaker: So, like, when you finished, um, did you just go home and or write to like a hotel or something?
• 1:58:55
  Speaker: Like, what was that like?
• 1:58:56
  Speaker 1: Dude, so I had Did you walk?
• 1:58:58
  Speaker 1: No, because of this blister.
• 1:59:01
  Speaker 1: I didn't even uh talk about that, but I had this blister form on the bottom of my right foot.
• 1:59:05
  Speaker: Was that from the beginning of the race?
• 1:59:06
  Speaker 1: No, thankfully.
• 1:59:07
  Speaker 1: That one had been on my interior of my left, but I this one was like the last 10 miles it just formed, and it got like it was pretty big.
• 1:59:16
  Speaker 1: Dude, um, I think I posted a picture um or it was part of one of the videos I had posted, but yeah, it hurt so bad.
• 1:59:24
  Speaker 1: And so like they take my shoes off at the end, and we like put me in my canes, you know, because I'm like, Yeah, get me out of running shoes forever.
• 1:59:30
  Speaker 1: Like give me something comfortable.
• 1:59:32
  Speaker 1: I go to stand back up and I was just like, Nope.
• 1:59:35
  Speaker 1: And they're like, huh?
• 1:59:36
  Speaker 1: And I was like, I'm not walking, I can't walk.
• 1:59:37
  Speaker 1: Like, what?
• 1:59:38
  Speaker 1: And like the blister, like after we had taken my socks and stuff off, like it was too exposed and it just hurt way too bad.
• 1:59:47
  Speaker 1: And so there's like a small clip of Dylan and uh Willie like carrying me because I can't walk, like I could not put weight on the blister anymore.
• 1:59:56
  Speaker 1: Like I had tapped that out in those last 10 miles, pushing to finish the race, and yeah, I couldn't, I couldn't walk.
• 2:00:03
  Speaker 1: It was brutal.
• 2:00:04
  Speaker: That's brutal.
• 2:00:05
  Speaker: Yeah, that's insane.
• 2:00:07
  Speaker: But what a cool story, dude.
• 2:00:08
  Speaker: Like that is, I don't know.
• 2:00:10
  Speaker: I think just like you were saying, you run with the elites, like you were running with all those guys, but at the end of the day, like it is just like a battle against yourself.
• 2:00:19
  Speaker 1: Yeah, oh yeah, 1v1.
• 2:00:20
  Speaker 1: I think there's a lot, I think a lot of people would benefit from that.
• 2:00:24
  Speaker 1: Just yeah, I don't think it has to just be ultra running or running in general or any kind of endurance or athletics, it's just anything.
• 2:00:31
  Speaker 1: It's yeah, absolutely.
• 2:00:31
  Speaker 1: It's you versus you, like you're your biggest competitor.
• 2:00:35
  Speaker 1: Like show up to the line, have the respect to compete against yourself, right?
• 2:00:38
  Speaker 1: Like respect who you are enough that you want to compete against them, you know.
• 2:00:42
  Speaker 1: Yeah, absolutely.
• 2:00:43
  Speaker 1: Like so many of us just leave so many leaves and pages unturned against ourselves.
• 2:00:49
  Speaker 1: Yeah, you know, and it's not like you know, don't take that as like diminish yourself or like knock yourself down, but it's like you should respect yourself enough to challenge yourself, whatever aspect it is.
• 2:00:59
  Speaker 1: It doesn't have to be physical, it can be mental, it can be with work, it can be family, whatever it is.
• 2:01:05
  Speaker 1: Like I think we just leave so much on the table because we're either not interested or we don't have the self-respect to like push against ourselves.
• 2:01:14
  Speaker 1: Yeah, man.
• 2:01:15
  Speaker 1: And I can totally see that ultra running running in general has taught me a lot about that.
• 2:01:19
  Speaker 1: Just like, you know, I am worth enough to myself that I want to push myself.
• 2:01:26
  Speaker 1: It's like a you know, it's kind of like a full circle mental health thing for me where it's like I do actually respect myself enough that I want to push.
• 2:01:35
  Speaker 1: Yeah, that I want to see, you know, can I beat him?
• 2:01:38
  Speaker 1: Like, you know, him being me, can I beat him?
• 2:01:41
  Speaker 1: And I strive for that.
• 2:01:43
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and honestly, it's helped me a lot in life, just having that kind of self-respect and then being able to push on it.
• 2:01:51
  Speaker: Yeah, man.
• 2:01:51
  Speaker: I think that's that's the whole reason we do it.
• 2:01:54
  Speaker: Yeah, that's really it.
• 2:01:55
  Speaker: And like you said, it doesn't have to be running, like yeah, like show yeah.
• 2:01:59
  Speaker: I I hate how cheesy this is, but it really is true.
• 2:02:02
  Speaker: Like you're trying to be better than the old version of you.
• 2:02:04
  Speaker: Like that's really what it is.
• 2:02:06
  Speaker: Like you hear people say like one percent better every day, but I think really it's just like just try and be better than who you were yesterday.
• 2:02:12
  Speaker: Like, yeah, whatever that looks like, it could be running, it could be like you said, business or whatever, but um, yeah, dude, that's a goal, and I think that's like the perfect place to bring this thing whole.
• 2:02:22
  Speaker 1: Yeah, dude, I just saw your watch.
• 2:02:23
  Speaker 1: I'm so sorry.
• 2:02:24
  Speaker 1: I cannot believe I love it.
• 2:02:26
  Speaker 1: That's crazy.
• 2:02:28
  Speaker 1: I thought we were like 40 minutes in.
• 2:02:30
  Speaker 1: Oh my gosh.
• 2:02:31
  Speaker 1: That is the whole purpose.
• 2:02:31
  Speaker 1: If you're still watching this, thank you.
• 2:02:33
  Speaker 1: You're you're a real one.
• 2:02:35
  Speaker 1: That's we're probably setting records here.
• 2:02:37
  Speaker 1: I'm sorry.
• 2:02:38
  Speaker: I think no, this like I'm I think this is a perfect one to do that on.
• 2:02:41
  Speaker: I think um no, don't don't don't apologize at all.
• 2:02:45
  Speaker: Uh wow.
• 2:02:46
  Speaker: That's why we have podcasts.
• 2:02:47
  Speaker 1: We were like an hour back on that.
• 2:02:49
  Speaker: That's actually why long form.
• 2:02:50
  Speaker: It's all good.
• 2:02:51
  Speaker: But that's the thing is like I I think I like the length of this one because people don't understand like what goes into a race like this.
• 2:02:58
  Speaker: So I think it's super cool.
• 2:02:59
  Speaker: Like the fact that we talked about before and then like the entire race during it and like what happened to each section.
• 2:03:07
  Speaker: Because like when you're talking about the race and your experience and everything, I'm thinking back on like some of my experiences when I had the ultra marathon or the ultras I've done, and I can exactly how you were doing, like, tell you step for step kind of what happened and like where I was and all these things.
• 2:03:22
  Speaker: It just like kind of is engraved into your memory, and so I think it's just like a testament to the sport, too.
• 2:03:28
  Speaker: So I think it's great.
• 2:03:29
  Speaker 1: Like it's it's crazy how much like goes into it, and then it's like you know, in the scheme of things, it's like the build-up, yeah, and then the event is just this little tiny, yeah.
• 2:03:38
  Speaker 1: You know, but that's you that's honestly life.
• 2:03:40
  Speaker 1: It's it's yeah, the journey, like you know, what's the cliche?
• 2:03:42
  Speaker 1: It's the it's about the journey, not the destination or whatever.
• 2:03:45
  Speaker: No, man.
• 2:03:45
  Speaker: So many cliches are true.
• 2:03:46
  Speaker: That's it.
• 2:03:47
  Speaker 1: It really is.
• 2:03:48
  Speaker 1: Like, it really is.
• 2:03:49
  Speaker 1: It's not about, I mean, it's kind of about this.
• 2:03:53
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I'll be for real.
• 2:03:54
  Speaker 1: Like, I'll be so for real right now.
• 2:03:56
  Speaker 1: But it was also about you know what I learned along the way.
• 2:03:59
  Speaker: Absolutely, dude.
• 2:04:00
  Speaker: And I love that.
• 2:04:01
  Speaker: And hopefully, like, I don't know.
• 2:04:03
  Speaker: I like to think of my podcast as like something my kids will go listen to.
• 2:04:06
  Speaker: I hope your sons will put it on one day and be like, I want to hear dad's experience, man.
• 2:04:10
  Speaker 1: Like, and I appreciate you having this platform and then allowing me to hop on and run way past time.
• 2:04:16
  Speaker: There's there's no time.
• 2:04:18
  Speaker 1: I truly appreciate it.
• 2:04:18
  Speaker 1: I love what you've built here.
• 2:04:20
  Speaker 1: Thanks, you know.
• 2:04:21
  Speaker 1: Literally in the studio and just on the platform itself.
• 2:04:24
  Speaker 1: I love the pod.
• 2:04:25
  Speaker: I appreciate it, man.
• 2:04:26
  Speaker 1: Appreciate you having me, dude.
• 2:04:27
  Speaker: Well, thanks for coming on, dude.
• 2:04:29
  Speaker: And you're always welcome.
• 2:04:30
  Speaker: Always welcome to come back on.
• 2:04:31
  Speaker: I want to hear what happens after Havelina 100.
• 2:04:33
  Speaker 1: Yeah, for sure.
• 2:04:34
  Speaker 1: If there's if there's space down the road, um, could also get into kind of how the post-race has been, you know, we're coming up on six weeks of post-race.
• 2:04:41
  Speaker 1: And so there's probably a whole I could probably ramble way too long about that.
• 2:04:45
  Speaker: Dude, no, we could do uh we uh we gotta do our our podcast with Jace too, us three.
• 2:04:49
  Speaker: So we gotta do that.
• 2:04:50
  Speaker: We gotta set it up and that'd be awesome, man.
• 2:04:52
  Speaker: But um yeah, man, seriously, thanks for coming on.
• 2:04:54
  Speaker: And everyone, thanks for listening.
• 2:04:56
  Speaker: And uh as always, keep getting after it, my friends.
• 2:04:59
  Speaker: Yeah, dude.
• 2:05:01
  Speaker: Show that on.