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Brigitte Morten: Political Commentator unpacks the second major leaders debate · Early Edition with Ryan Bridge

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: So we did have that second debate last night. This
• 0:02
  Speaker 1: is the Herald's leaders debate. There was some handshake, shaking,
• 0:05
  Speaker 1: a little bipartisanship going on. You'll sit down and you'll
• 0:08
  Speaker 1: have a conversation about these longer term issues.
• 0:11
  Speaker 2: I've already been very clear.
• 0:12
  Speaker 3: We're going to stop the flip-flopping on infrastructure.
• 0:14
  Speaker 2: We lose too many jobs on infrastructure.
• 0:16
  Speaker 3: Can we shake on it?
• 0:17
  Speaker 1: Can we get a handshake from you two?
• 0:19
  Speaker 2: Happy to do that.
• 0:20
  Speaker 3: We've already agreed on that.
• 0:21
  Speaker 2: Go on then.
• 0:22
  Speaker 3: Happy to do it. There we go.
• 0:24
  Speaker 1: It was a little bit awkward, but they did it.
• 0:25
  Speaker 1: Scraps over tax.
• 0:27
  Speaker 3: Mark my words, you are going to pay New Zealand.
• 0:29
  Speaker 3: You are going to pay with more tax.
• 0:31
  Speaker 1: I want to move on to jobs.
• 0:32
  Speaker 3: This is just nonsense. You're spending hundreds of thousands of
• 0:35
  Speaker 3: dollars telling lies about the Labour Party's policy.
• 0:37
  Speaker 1: Luxon got a bit tripped up on the minimum wage.
• 0:39
  Speaker 1: Will you increase the minimum wage by the rate of inflation?
• 0:42
  Speaker 1: Chris Hipkins.
• 0:43
  Speaker 2: Yes.
• 0:43
  Speaker 1: Christopher Luxon.
• 0:44
  Speaker 3: Yes, and that's what we've more or less been doing.
• 0:46
  Speaker 1: No, it isn't. The minimum wage has gone backwards three
• 0:48
  Speaker 1: years in a row.
• 0:50
  Speaker 3: No, I was just saying, on average, we try and
• 0:52
  Speaker 3: look at inflation, cost of living, build that into minimum
• 0:55
  Speaker 3: wage increases. But three years in a row it's been
• 0:57
  Speaker 3: below inflation. We should try and be as close to
• 0:59
  Speaker 3: the cost of living as we possibly can.
• 1:00
  Speaker 1: And on the Greens and Te Pānti Māori getting that
• 1:02
  Speaker 1: photo up with the mob, Hipkins says, well, they're not
• 1:05
  Speaker 1: getting anywhere near the portfolios. Will you rule out Te
• 1:09
  Speaker 1: Pānti Māori or Greens holding the police.
• 1:12
  Speaker 3: Or corrections portfolios, Chris Hipkins?
• 1:14
  Speaker 2: Yes.
• 1:15
  Speaker 1: Do you think it's appropriate they went to the mob pad? No.
• 1:18
  Speaker 1: Bridget Morton, political commentator with me this morning. Bridget, good morning.
• 1:22
  Speaker 3: Good morning.
• 1:22
  Speaker 1: Thoughts on last night?
• 1:24
  Speaker 2: Well, I think the actual real competition yesterday was not
• 1:27
  Speaker 2: actually between the two leaders, but whether or not they
• 1:29
  Speaker 2: could sell something to the people watching about why they
• 1:32
  Speaker 2: should vote for them, the so-called major parties, as opposed
• 1:35
  Speaker 2: to giving their vote to some of the minor parties.
• 1:37
  Speaker 2: And I do think there was some elements, I think,
• 1:40
  Speaker 2: in last night's debate. You can see both of them
• 1:42
  Speaker 2: really pointing to stability and the need to actually have
• 1:46
  Speaker 2: a significant sort of leading party to make sure things
• 1:49
  Speaker 2: actually get done. I think that Hipkins, you know, the
• 1:53
  Speaker 2: key thing that was hurting him last night, and that was,
• 1:56
  Speaker 2: of course, those photos for the mongrel mob visit from
• 1:59
  Speaker 2: potential coalition partners to Party Māori and the Greens. Obviously,
• 2:02
  Speaker 2: that was really, can you imagine, you know, being Hipkins,
• 2:05
  Speaker 2: you're staying in your debate prep and no one's popping up.
• 2:07
  Speaker 2: That was a difficult, I think, thing for him to face.
• 2:10
  Speaker 1: Yeah, but he did seem to handle it not too
• 2:12
  Speaker 1: badly by ruling it out. So, you know, he knew
• 2:15
  Speaker 1: he was alive to how damaging that could be, obviously. Hey,
• 2:19
  Speaker 1: what about the, you know, the minors are getting bigger,
• 2:21
  Speaker 1: the majors are getting smaller. Do you reckon that's, you know,
• 2:25
  Speaker 1: could we just get another John Key or another, dare
• 2:29
  Speaker 1: I say, Jacinda Ardern for the left, and this whole
• 2:31
  Speaker 1: thing will go away? You know, the popularity shoots up again?
• 2:35
  Speaker 2: Well, I think it is, without a doubt, there is
• 2:38
  Speaker 2: a sort of a global phenomenon happening at the moment.
• 2:40
  Speaker 2: There is a distrust, I think, in institutions. that has
• 2:43
  Speaker 2: particularly come out post-COVID. And so you have actually seen
• 2:46
  Speaker 2: across the world, particularly in Western democracies, those sort of
• 2:50
  Speaker 2: major parties, those ones that are associated with being the government,
• 2:54
  Speaker 2: losing sort of support and losing trust. I do think
• 2:57
  Speaker 2: that will probably correct itself to a certain extent. Also,
• 3:00
  Speaker 2: if you do go into an ex-government and it is
• 3:02
  Speaker 2: a coalition that is chaotic and that things don't get
• 3:06
  Speaker 2: actually done, I think voters will see that and want
• 3:08
  Speaker 2: to actually vote back for that stability of perhaps those
• 3:11
  Speaker 2: major parties.
• 3:12
  Speaker 1: Bridget Morton, political commentator, great to have you on the
• 3:14
  Speaker 1: show this morning. For more from Early Edition with Ryan Bridge,
• 3:18
  Speaker 1: listen live to Newstalk ZB from 5am weekdays or follow
• 3:23
  Speaker 1: the podcast on iHeartRadio.