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The Surprising Power of Authentic Storytelling in Nonprofits and Community Impact · Hart & Hustle Podcast

• Efrain: Welcome back to another episode here on the Hard and Hustle Podcast. We got Mr. Gene Harden in the building. Mr. Gene, where you where are you located, man? Gene Hardin: We are in Stockton, California. Efrain: All right. Born and raised? Gene Hardin: No, no. Been in Stockton about thirty six years of my life, so longer than anywhere else in my life, but yeah. That's Efrain: You know, I'm thirty six years old, so when I was a little baby, you moved over there. What brought you over there? Gene Hardin: Yeah, yeah, nineteen eighty nine. Well, there was ⁓ kind of a poll because of my working through ⁓ college in ⁓ broadcast journalism and so I kinda wanted to be on the coast and ⁓ had some family that was ⁓ living out here at the time and ⁓ had a ⁓ my first wife and I decided that was the place to be. And so we we moved to Stockton and we kinda never looked back. So Efrain: Love it. So you started in broadcast and journalism, but that's not where you're at today, are you? Gene Hardin: No, no, no, not n not ⁓ a lot of production work behind my belt, like ⁓ T V production, radio production, stuff like that, ⁓ stage production, all kinds of gigs like that. But usually always behind the scenes more than in front of the camera, even though that's what I studied to do. and that segued me into kind of a marketing role into pretty much what I do today. But ⁓ yeah. Yeah, it Efrain: Love it. And you had children's home of Stockton. What is your current role? Gene Hardin: ⁓ so at Children's Home I am the community engagement director and ⁓ basically I facilitate, you know, what it says, ⁓ engaging the community and what we do. Efrain: Yeah. And Gene, what makes you go from T V productions to all this entertainment world to say, you what, I wanna do more passion, purposeful work? ⁓ because when you get into an organization, it's not about the paychecks. There's truly a passion and purpose to it. Why? Gene Hardin: Yeah. Yeah. You know, I think that you I think honestly you there's something in you, you know, you're in your thirties now and I think that ⁓ honestly I I use this term or this kind of time frame for a lot of people that I talk to. It's once you reach your thirties, you're kinda thinking about how there's maybe more to life than just you. I think there needs to be that ego and kind of s ⁓ self driven thing when we're in our twenties 'cause that's kinda how we Efrain: Mm-hmm. Gene Hardin: We propel ourselves, you know, but then we start looking around and going, Wait a minute, there's more over here, maybe we can give back. so I think that was kind of the first mindset was to say, Okay, maybe I don't make a bazillion dollars, but ⁓ but there's other things here that I'm passionate about. So Efrain: Love it. And and I th I'm always a big believer that everything in our lives teaches us something for the next chapter. You talk about the production part of it and all these different things you were doing. What is that teaching you that leads you to hear that you're utilizing ⁓ in talent wise? Gene Hardin: Yeah, it's a that's a great question because and I and I really genuinely love to talk about that because I think there's a lot of times that in the nonprofit world, ⁓ we approach things ⁓ and I'm talking about all all nonprofits. I don't I don't care how big or small you are, but we we tend to approach things in an apologetic way, ⁓ whether that's asking for money or our marketing approach or our production quality or our level of excellence. And I thought that based on my background and my skills and my knowledge. I could bring that to the table to help elevate excellence in what we did through marketing, video production, posting, social media, all the things. so yeah, that's that's why, you know, to to help raise a level of quality and excellence in everything that we do. Because the technical term is that we are not for profit businesses. We're not necessarily charities. So Efrain: Mm-hmm. Yeah. I I love that you said that because ⁓ they are Completely businesses and and I've taken over organizations where people sit on a board and just think it's a nonprofit. Yeah, it's a business as well. Like we we still have to make sure there's money coming in in you know, various ways, whether it is that is asking for money, whether that is events, storytelling aspects of it. I ⁓ I'm actually intrigued, man, because you have the background of storytelling. ⁓ so you're really telling stories. How different is it to tell stories at the level that you're doing to now doing more tugging at the heart and really kind of showcasing what process. Gene Hardin: Right. Yeah. Efrain: programs and what people where their money is going. Like wh where's the d is there a difference? Gene Hardin: Well, you know, I is there a difference? Wow, that's a really good question. I don't know if there's a difference, you know, because I I I work in a world where, you know, we we do our best to make connections. If if you're in that for profit sector and you're with a board or you're an organization or you're a shareholder, you're you're always thinking about the ROI, ROI. What's the return on my investment, right? Well, donors to a nonprofit are no different. And so if you can connect the dots. with hey, we're donating money to this local organization in hopes that we're doing something good. We have the ability to turn around and tell the story of that something good or those outcomes and show them in a way. so it's kind of twofold. Yes, we want to tug at heartstrings, but you don't want to do it over emotionally so that you're, you know, pandering in a way, I guess. I don't want to I don't want to be negative about that, but you don't want to be that way, right? Efrain: Mm-hmm. Gene Hardin: You wanna tell the truth and you wanna tell the story and you do wanna pull on the emotions, you wanna back it up with the data, but that's connecting the dots for me and impact storytelling is what we do. Efrain: Yeah. I d I think communication has become so different. The way that we also receive messaging. Are you I can imagine you thought about that. People are receiving messages now via social. The number one form of communication these days is SMS. ⁓ we talk about TikTok, we talk about Instagram, really meeting people where they're at. Are you tapping into that market or you know, I I I run an organization, it's just funny to even think about it, but I'm always yelling with these people because not gonna say yelling, but arguing because they're like, Hey, we gotta send ⁓ letters out to people's houses. I'm like Like I get it, there is a generation that may want that, but we're in a whole new time right now. Like we don't need to send letters out. Where's your mind at, Gene, with all this? Gene Hardin: Another great question. I think okay, so you know, back in the I say back in the day, but just a few years ago when we were focused on SEO, you know, search engine optimization and now AI plays such a role in that and how we, you know, collect our data and figure out paths and to it really is just kind of a it's kind of a it's been a an enigma and a a mystery. But ⁓ I believe what what stands true is that attention span wanes. And you have to be cognizant of that. At the same time, you still have the donors and the people, your audiences of old. So you still have a section out here who believe they've come into the technological world and I'll just call them Facebook users. And so they're they're you know, they have a Facebook page and so they they get their information and they think that's a very up-to-date way of doing it. And then you have, I'll call them the the Patreon crowd. I don't necessarily like to generationalize certain things. Efrain: Yeah. Yeah. Gene Hardin: But I'll I'll call them that. And that attention span, we know from studies just even from two thousand and twenty. ⁓ the attention span now has has reduced down to seven and a half seconds. national average little study that was put out by somebody. seven and a half seconds I have to get your attention and tell you what w what I want to tell you, and then I hope that I got your attention and that you care about what I'm talking about, right? So it yeah, it's Efrain: Yeah. Tough. Yeah. Y you mentioned two things that I would love for you to tap into and don't know if you're how how ⁓ deep you're into it. Data, it's important, right? An organization. But you also mentioned AI. So many people that are scared of AI, especially in the nonprofit world. Where you guys at with AI and data? How important is data? Gene Hardin: It's a different landscape now, you know, for sure. You know, I have to thank our ⁓ we have a wonderful IT company, s managed service IT company that really takes good care of us and they're great on the education side. I and I appreciate what they try to do in helping us. ⁓ I always call it seeing around the corner. what you pay good IT people to do. Because w in this world where we don't know what we don't know, I really hate that phrase, but it's true. And y Efrain: Yeah. It is, a hundred percent. Gene Hardin: you look at you look at AI and you go, I need guidance. I need somebody here to tell me some things. And so they've been really good in in telling us how we need to use it, but use it cautiously. whether that's a paid service, ⁓ with you know, Chat GPT or whatever one you use, and you know, Claude or whatever. But even within the walls of your your own business, particularly we you know, we use all Microsoft products. So it's Efrain: Mm-hmm. Gene Hardin: ⁓ we have a business license agreement with Microsoft and when you use their AI, you're protecting your data. And that's really my point. ⁓ so yes, d do you need to be afraid of that? Yes. Do you need to be cautious in and all the things? Absolutely. You know, you wanna I I I equate it to like tradecraft. You wanna make sure your data, your things are protected. ⁓ because when you do a search on the free chat GPT, you're you're doing that's going out there to everyone. So, ⁓ I i d do I say use it? Sure. Use it with caution. Efrain: And because we're talking about data, ⁓ let's talk about that data, man. How many people are you guys serving? How many programs does ⁓ children home have? Gene Hardin: So we have ⁓ we have a unique kind of ⁓ track system here. We have one program that is ⁓ a state mandated program, also regulated federally, and that is called a short term residential therapeutic program or strtp. STRTPs are found all over the country. This is the new guidance ⁓ since about twenty eighteen ⁓ to regulate what used to be called group homes. So at one point we were at a fifty-four bed situation. And that got ⁓ regulated and re-regulated over the years since 2018 to now you can't have more than 16 beds in a facility. Otherwise, you're designated as what's called an IMD or an institution for mental disease, like a hospital, lockdown facility, all the things that surround them. So we are in that track, that is 16 beds. We have another more outward-facing program called Catalyst, which is a ⁓ program for transitional age youth, 18 to 25 year olds, ⁓ who are at risk of homelessness. And that is a ⁓ non not not regulated, it's regulated, but it's more fundraising, ⁓ how we fund that. And so we're not regulated by the state in how the funds are spent. and so it gives us a little bit more freedom. And that's a more of a self referral program for that age group of young adults. And ⁓ it's been a very successful. That currently is eighteen beds. So altogether we're serving thirty four. foster youth the STRTP track is twelve to eighteen year old foster youth girls. The eighteen to twenty five year olds is a co ed population. Efrain: Love it man. And and what have you learned being in the space? Because this was also new for you, right? You weren't in the space of helping this type of audience, was it? Gene Hardin: Yeah, I mean somewhat. ⁓ it's there's a little bit of a segue there, because so here's how it works. ⁓ I was in the world of child abuse prevention and was definitely in that ⁓ zero to five arena of kids, but ⁓ but all ages minors, right? and so when you look at that and you realize that there's so many contributing factors to abuse and neglect and trafficking and all the things, that did segue pretty pretty readily because the population that we serve of the twelve to eighteen year old foster youth girls is a very high acuity. It's a meaning it's they are victims of severe abuse, sex trafficking, ⁓ sorry, it's called technically C sec, ⁓ commercial sexual exploitation of children. but it's so yeah, it it wasn't ⁓ that wasn't too hard of a transition still in child welf welfare, if you will. Efrain: And why is this work important? Like being in the space of I would say helping the next generation, right? Fertilize in the future. I think it is very ⁓ I see why it's important, but for those that are listening, what why is it so important to you? Gene Hardin: Yeah. Yeah, it's important to me because I you know, we always make the kind of reference that we wish that we could work ourselves out of a job. ⁓ this is always gonna be a need, unfortunately. abuse and neglect ⁓ just ⁓ you know, they it just exists. And I I wish that wasn't the case, but I feel like You know, you do your part with your talents and skills and abilities that you bring to the table and hopefully your teammates ⁓ come along to that same table with their talent, skills and abilities, and we can eradicate today what we can eradicate. Knowing somewhere out there it's always gonna be a problem. Wish it wasn't gonna be a problem. Wish we could really eradicate it. But yeah, so Efrain: Right. Yeah. No, I love it. I it's putting your money where your mouth is. I speak to board members all the time and it's like because of the leader you are, people would actually follow, right, what you're doing. Put put I have a a board member he says he friend I wanna donate this but I don't want my name to be a part of it. What do you think about it? And I said, no, I think your name should be a part of it because so many people show up be for events and things that you do because you show up. So just imagine when someone knows that you donated a thousand and five thousand dollars. People are going to donate because that's just what how we're kind of wired to do, right? So those those friends that are wanting up Gene Hardin: Mm. Mm. Efrain: one up you, guess what are they going to do? They're going to also donate. ⁓ it's like, ⁓ I didn't think about that. I'm like, yeah, man, like you you hold so much influence. And sometimes we don't know because we just do the work. ⁓ and that's just a good leader in us. But Gene, I say the good leader and I bring us to good leader because clearly that is you. But Gene Hardin: Yeah, yeah. Efrain: There there were people that were pouring into you before you got became this good leader. Do you remember any of those things that people were saying to you as you were going through all these different chapters of your life that you still resonate with? Leadership ⁓ I guess skills that someone told you? Gene Hardin: Yeah, yeah, I think a ⁓ one gentleman that was I would consider him a mentor, he's since passed, but you know, he he forced me to do things beyond my my comfort zone, right? And I remember him showing me a diagram a long time ago. A picture it wasn't a diagram, but it it said, you know, had a little bubble and it said, This is your comfort zone right here. And out here it said, This is where the magic happens. Efrain: Yeah. Gene Hardin: all the stuff out here. And ⁓ I remember that, you know, I remember but he would force me to read. I wasn't a voracious reader and he would force me to read leadership books and different different things. but, you know, ⁓ i it's people like that that want to build into the younger generation. I think we all and no matter your age, I think you can be a mentor. I I think you can be a mentee. You should be the older you get, believe me, 'cause th there's a lot more that I realize I don't know. But Efrain: Mm-hmm. Gene Hardin: ⁓ yeah, just being able to stand on the shoulders of people who came before. super, super important. Trust in that, you know, learn from that. And that's that's where I was. Efrain: So what is your what what are you telling other young leaders that are coming up ⁓ through this pipeline? What is your messages to them? Gene Hardin: My message is you ⁓ you have influence. You have more influence than you maybe think you do. ⁓ you know, you mentioned that age gap. you were talking about the twenty-six year old earlier, we were having that conversation that versus you being thirty-six. And it's almost a Venn diagram if you look at kind of our age groups. And I always look at this. Somebody shared this with me and I'm gonna share with you. ⁓ the theory is is that you have influence ten years ahead of you and ten years behind you. And ⁓ it's a good ⁓ and and somewhere in the middle is that sweet spot, right? Where you where you have your your peers and you truly have influence and you dialogue and you you build off of each other and you to use that term, you riff off each other and do the do the cool things, right? But that influence to reach back, but it's not just to teach, it's to learn from that younger younger generation as well. I have to say that's really where I am in my life. ⁓ there's a gentleman that I meet with who's a COO of another organization. Efrain: Yeah. Gene Hardin: And we used to work together a long time ago and he's younger than me, quite a bit. And ⁓ I said to him the other day at lunch, I said, Hey, man, I j I ch I genuinely want to learn who you're reaching and who you're touching because ⁓ I'm still in the game and I need to know how to do that, right? And he said back to me, and I need your experience. And I said, That's that's how we balance. Efrain: Yeah. Yeah. I met someone like that and it's always weird 'cause I was like, what can I give you? You know, but this is a sixty one year old that worked at a hospital, about to retire, wants to do the passion and purpose work. ⁓ he says, Ephraim, like as I'm winding down here, I really want to understand nonprofits more. Like I sit on a board but I'm not really understanding. one thing he wants to do is start to share stories, right? And and Gene Hardin: Mm. Yeah. Efrain: smart because that's what we're in the business of telling stories, I would say, in the nonprofit. So he's asking like E Fran, how do I do this? And he's asking me here and I'm like, Sir, I'm here trying to learn from you, you know. But ⁓ it is true. We learn from one another. There's strengths that I have and there's strengths that he has. And how we do we put those together because we're not the smartest in the room and we can't do it all. ⁓ and I think when you have a team of people that are Gene Hardin: Yeah. Efrain: Have that same passion and the same just beliefs and mission and and maybe you guys don't know everything. You guys are truly going to learn from one another while you guys are really just getting it done. ⁓ so it is I'm at that space right now, man. Sometimes I feel the imposter syndrome, like what the hell am I doing in these rooms? But ⁓ realizing man that you know Gene Hardin: Right. It's it is like that. I get it. I get it. Efrain: Someone said this to me earlier. He says, Efrain, you have to get comfortable because you are the next generation in those rooms and we need you. Right. And when people say that to me, I'm like What do you need from me that you don't have? But it is, we're all very different. Times are different. The way we communicate, technology. Actually, he was saying, Efraine, ⁓ I'm not really good with Google Calendar because I've used Microsoft my whole career. And I know you use Google and you use Google Drives and all this. I need that class. And the same thing for my board, is like I've created this portal with data and all that. And then I go tell them to do something in Google Drive, and they look at me like I'm crazy. And I'm like, ⁓ my God. Like, you know, s having to teach someone Google Drive to me is basic. But if you don't we don't know what we don't know. You know, so that that is ⁓ as you as much as you mentioned you mentioned earlier, as much as so cringe to say, it is truly real. Like you don't know what you don't know. ⁓ That's the term, man. That's the term. Gene Hardin: Yeah. Yeah, there it is. Yeah. Until we come up with another term, that's the term. Efrain: ⁓ no man, this is this is really cool just to to be able to riff off of this. So Gene, what what are some of the things that you and the level that you're at that you're wanting to see within the organization to continue to to scale? Gene Hardin: No, ⁓ wow, that's a really good one. I think that what would I like to see? Yeah, I'm very fortunate. I have a very forward thinking CEO. ⁓ she's very dynamic. For twenty four years prior to being here, she led another organization, ⁓ Women's Center of San Joaquin. It's now called Prevail. And ⁓ then she came over to children's home about ten years ago. And she's she's forward thinking, she's progressive. And so it's easy to get behind a leader like that. and you know, be able to so what I wanna see is that continued ⁓ that continued vein of leadership. you know, we're we're y you just touched on it. We're not gonna be around forever and we need that next generation and we need to we need to show them that there's space. ⁓ you know there's space and room for those ideas. How do we innovate not only in our marketing and our approaches, but how do we innovate in the care that we give? that's That's what I'd like to continue to see, I guess. That Efrain: Copy a and for if we could just drop a nugget, you're you're in the space of ⁓ communications, what is one thing that people underutilize ⁓ that actually works that you've noticed? Without giving all your secrets away? ⁓ Gene Hardin: No, I don't know. I'll I don't secret. So no, it's good, man. If it helps somebody else, let's let's get after it, you know. it's a that's a good flag for peer groups, by the way. what's underutilized? ⁓ ⁓ honestly, the handshake and the coffee and the lunch here and there, you know, just simply saying I've gotten more mileage out of speaking with some of our donors and board members and saying, Hey, why don't we grab some coffee or hey, why don't you come over for a tour? and that really gets a lot of mileage. And I know you probably thought I was gonna say something in technology. It it's there and it's available and it's effective. but Efrain: Mm-hmm. Gene Hardin: But the personal touch, and I will say this since the pandemic, I think it's super important. Efrain: Yeah, I was actually watching something earlier. It's like if you're not going to the office, you're you're not you're missing out. Like people want to see the work ethic. People want to see the person staying longer. Like if you want that opportunity, it's hard to see when you're at home and you're you know, we don't know what you're doing. ⁓ so no, I I do agree. I as much as I love the virtual, 'cause here we are, right? Virtually having a conversation, I can imagine the energy is very different in person because Gene Hardin: Yeah. Yeah. Efrain: We get to feel each other, we get to really feel the energy of one another. So I'm a big believer in that. I am yeah, let's have a cup of coffee. ⁓ not everyone is good virtual. People are are better in person. Gene Hardin: You know, it it's a part of that too, Ephraim, is that you you get to share more of that impact. ⁓ if it's a board member that I'm talking to, it's like, hey, did did you hear about what happened last week? No, no, tell me, you know, and it's ⁓ it's a good interaction time in that way. If that's a donor, even better, you're taking a tour of the campus. Maybe you've never been here before, maybe it's been five or ten years and we've changed some things that we do. ⁓ here because our programs have changed, whether that's mandated laws that have changed, but i it's that it's that real feel, you know. yeah. Efrain: Mm-hmm. I love it. No, I I think it's as easy meeting a person, but for those that are also listening, picking up a phone and calling someone. Saying thank you. Finding out what's going on. Like I tell you I I just ⁓ taken over this organization and spoke to two donors. Gene Hardin: That's huge. Efrain: I mean, of course, sometimes you want you're speaking to them longer than you want, but there's just one donor, a little older. I got to learn so much more about why he's giving and where our flaws were and what we can do better. And ⁓ you know, he's giving me ideas and I'm like, wow, that's actually a really good idea. I never even thought about it. But those ideas don't come if you're not communicating to the people that are actually giving to your organization. ⁓ I had another donor that at first he was I'm a young guy, right? So people already kind of almost Gene Hardin: Man. Yeah. Efrain: knock me out of the the race because of my age. But ⁓ as I'm talking to him and I see that he's on my LinkedIn page and he sees that I'm I'm actually who I am. Say I am. And ⁓ he ended up going to his company he works for and getting us another $3,000 ⁓ grant. Why? Because I was willing to conversate, take the time to figure out what was his needs were, let him know who I was, relationship building communication. It doesn't happen t overnight, but if someone sees a consistency, I always say people do business with people. If they see the work that you're doing, they're more likely to give. Gene, I know you wanna jump in. Go ahead, go ahead. Gene Hardin: No, no, no. I am I'm just, you know, honestly really agreeing with you. And you made me think of that when you said the phone. ⁓ I'll give away one secret that we do. and it's very effective. So, you know, there's that cultivation part, right? And you're preparing the soil and you're weeding and doing all the things, but then there's the nurturing. I still gotta nurture the plant, right? And ⁓ one of the things that we do when a donor gives at a certain level, and it and it's not a huge dollar amount for us, but when they give over a certain level. Efrain: Mm-hmm. Yeah. Gene Hardin: Every month we collect that data and we pass that information back to our board members. And we have what's called TAPS and that stands for telephone appreciation program. And our board members then they can sort through those themselves and they are responsible for as a board member calling that donor and saying the donors already received a letter of thanks. ⁓ they've seen ⁓ received a letter of appreciation for their donation. It's a an official tax document as well. But but that one more touch point is to say, hey, ⁓ you know, this is Joe Schmo. I'm on the board of Children's Home of Stockton. And I just wanted to say thank you so much for your donation. I can see, you know, we give them a bio so they can see the history, you know. I can see you've been giving the children's home for a number of years. Thank you very much. We sure appreciate your consistency. All the things. And it also allows that us to retrieve some things back from that donor to say, ⁓ by the way, they got a new phone number, or they'd rather be contacted this way. Or You know, so it's a really good touch point. Efrain: Yeah. Yeah, man. I I'm learning. You know, Gene, for people like you. Another thing that I thought about ⁓ that I like to give Secret Sauce is join those chamber of commons ⁓ people around you, right? Like those are the business owners that also want to be in the community, clearly, that's why they're there. ⁓ and f spreading the word, what you guys are doing and build relationship building, man. I I was just talking to ⁓ another board member, he's a president of a foundation, realizing that he's getting ten thousand dollars from an organization that we used to actually also receive funds from. Gene Hardin: Mm-hmm. Efrain: But somewhere that relationship broke. So we we're not asking for those funds. No one's asking anymore. So if no one's asking, no one's giving. And I've I've realized that as well is that if you want it, you have to also go ask. Don't just wait for it to show up at your table. It's like go out and get it. ⁓ and I've learned that v in my twenties someone told me that Efrain, you are in the asking business and people have millions of dollars that they want to give away, but you haven't even asked them that yet. So I'm like, ⁓ okay. Gene Hardin: Mm. of the I think one of the humps I had to get over in that world, because I'm it's not natural for me in in development or those, you know, I'm more of the marketing approach. I will help you sell the program, no problem. But going and then asking for the dollars is different. And somebody said to me one time, you know, when you're approaching someone who is of means, we'll just put it that way, you you get ⁓ maybe worried or s scared about what you might say or how much you would think you're gonna ask for and again don't be apologetic. Sometimes that person would be offended if you didn't ask. And I really that really changed my mindset. Like, okay, they're sitting out there and they're wondering why one of the oldest organizations in the county ⁓ has never approached them for money. Well what why how how come? You know? and I think we get that backwards a lot. Efrain: Wow. Gene Hardin: You know, we think, ⁓ there's so many non profits and they all ask the rich guy for the money or the organization that donates all the grants, you know, all the grant money in. ⁓ but you're right. You just gotta ask. And ⁓ you know, the w the worst thing you get is, ⁓ no. No, I'm good, we're good. We give to you know, we give to we give to the animals or we give to the, you know, whatever. Whatever their philanthropic ideal is, right? So Efrain: Yeah. Yeah. No, I happened to I actually that conversation happened to me recently after I took over this organization where a gentleman was already kinda given to another organization and he says, Ephraim, honestly I didn't know that you guys were still in existence. I haven't heard from you guys in a very long time. He says I and he's giving like five, ten thousand dollars to this other organization. He's like I I was always willing to give to you guys, but no one's ever asked. Now this is the gentleman that's on the Hall of Fame that we've given credit to, but we're not tapping into that. Like you know And it goes back to sometimes in organizations structure is important. Like I always say make sure your house is in order before you ever try to bring somebody else in as well. Right, because it you also don't want to ⁓ bring in donors or bring in new people and it's just the back end looks like a mess. It's chaos. We're not getting those calls out, right? We're not ⁓ saying thank yous. We're not getting out tax donation receipts. All that makes a difference. I've also heard some of those things. It's like I was giving, but I don't even get tax receipts. So you know what? I'm not gonna give. Or I don't know the ROI. No one's sharing a story with me. So I mean, you dropped ⁓ a lot of good stuff, Gene, without even knowing you were dropping gems here today, Gene. I appreciate you, my brother. Gene Hardin: Well, I'm glad you appreciate it. Efrain: ⁓ Yeah, yeah, yeah. Well Gene, listen, I know we're up here on time, man, but ⁓ and I appreciate your time. If we could really speak to those leaders right now that do want to continue to spread the message ⁓ to their communities, but probably are finding it tough for whatever reason. Maybe it's ⁓ where we're at government-wise, maybe they just don't have the the knowledge and experiences that you have from the communication and and and production standpoint. If someone was to ask you, Hey Gene, I I need to get better at this, what do you tell them? Gene Hardin: Thing would say is don't overdo it. My ⁓ wife and I have a little phrase we say, ⁓ do what's put in front of you. And for me and my work here that translates into ⁓ Do the relevant thing. When you're marketing, you don't have to post every five seconds. You don't need 73 posts a day to put your presence out there and remind people what you do. But when you have something relevant and impactful to share, that could be a staff event. That could be a victory with a kid that we work with. That could be an upcoming event. But be relevant. don't overdo it. That would be my do it's put in front of you. Efrain: Alright, and I know I said that that was it, but I actually had another question 'cause I remember you said it, so I need to know if this is true. ⁓ you mentioned plant, you mentioned soil. Are you a plant guy? You just use the analogy. ⁓ man. It was good one. No, it's good. It's I love plants, so I always like that people use that analogy of the soil and and all this stuff. Because I look at it very different. Is that ⁓ and 'cause I've seen this in life, is that I had a plant that I thought was dead. ⁓ Gene Hardin: Not really, no. Matter of fact, I do not have a green thumb. It's just an analogy. Sorry. I love it. Efrain: And I still kind of kept around in this pot. As soon as I moved into a new house, I put into a bigger pot. And it it came back alive. And I was like, wow, that is like us. Sometimes we're in the wrong environments. And when you put us in environments where we can actually grow and spread out wings, that you'll actually see something that you didn't know was possible, right? ⁓ come out of it. So that's how I started to look at plants, man. I love to see it. Then I had another plant that as I I had my daughter, I about this plant, and just seeing it kind of grow alongside my daughter, right? And putting a new pot and all these different things. So when Gene Hardin: Yeah, yeah. Hundred percent. ⁓ yeah, yeah, cool. Efrain: You said that I'm like, ⁓ he's a plant guy. But then you tricked me, man. You're not a plank guy. You're not a plant guy. No jokes. ⁓ Gene, where can people find more information about the organization? About you? Are you on LinkedIn? What's the socials? Gene Hardin: Sorry, frame, sorry. ⁓ Yeah, we're on we're on LinkedIn. You can find us at ch Stockton dot org. honestly the best way is our Link Tree ⁓ address because we have all of our links on there. But so that's also CH Stockton. If you do the Link Tree address and then CH Stockton, you'll find all of our links. So Efrain: My brother what Gene, thank you so much, man, for your time. If you guys are still watching, make sure that you guys do go ahead and tap into what Gene is doing at the children's home of Stockton. phenomenal things. ⁓ and I know this is just not, this is just the beginning, right? You you got still so much more to work. You're trying to put yourself out of business. And if you guys want to also help Gene put themselves out of business, make sure you guys check out the website. And ⁓ I'm E-frained with all your wrestling. Actually, I'm not know your wrestling, I'm Efrain with Hard and House of Podcast. I'll catch you on the next one. Later.