Latest / Cookbook Love Podcast / Episode 406: What Award-Winning Cookbooks Can Teach Us

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Episode 406: What Award-Winning Cookbooks Can Teach Us · Cookbook Love Podcast

• 0:02
  Speaker: You're listening to the cookbook
• 0:03
  Speaker: Love Podcast with Maggie Greene,
• 0:06
  Speaker: episode number four hundred and
• 0:08
  Speaker: six.
• 0:10
  Speaker: Welcome to the Cookbook Love
• 0:12
  Speaker: Podcast, a podcast that
• 0:14
  Speaker: celebrates cookbook readers,
• 0:16
  Speaker: buyers, collectors, writers, and
• 0:18
  Speaker: clubs.
• 0:19
  Speaker: And now your host, cookbook
• 0:21
  Speaker: author, culinary dietitian, and
• 0:23
  Speaker: cookbook writing coach, Maggie
• 0:24
  Speaker: Greene.
• 0:31
  Speaker: Hi, everybody.
• 0:32
  Speaker: Welcome back to another episode of the Cookbook Love Podcast.
• 0:35
  Speaker: How's everybody doing today?
• 0:37
  Speaker: Hope you are all doing well.
• 0:39
  Speaker: I'm having a lovely Tuesday
• 0:42
  Speaker: morning here in my cookbook
• 0:43
  Speaker: bunker.
• 0:45
  Speaker: I've been out to the dentist,
• 0:47
  Speaker: came home, made a little bit of
• 0:48
  Speaker: breakfast, and now I'm settling
• 0:51
  Speaker: in to talk to you about an
• 0:53
  Speaker: exciting weekend that just took
• 0:55
  Speaker: place in the culinary world with
• 0:57
  Speaker: the James Beard Foundation
• 0:59
  Speaker: Awards.
• 1:01
  Speaker: It's funny on Cookbook Love podcasts.
• 1:03
  Speaker: I don't think I've talked about these awards before, but I'm
• 1:07
  Speaker: talking to you about them today because I want you to be aware
• 1:10
  Speaker: of them and also to share some authors with you who you have
• 1:15
  Speaker: heard here on the show.
• 1:17
  Speaker: So if you follow the food world, maybe even if you don't, this
• 1:22
  Speaker: was an exciting weekend with the James Beard Foundation Awards.
• 1:27
  Speaker: These are often called the Oscars of the food world.
• 1:30
  Speaker: They represent one of the highest honors a cookbook
• 1:33
  Speaker: author, chef, restaurateur, or food writer can receive.
• 1:38
  Speaker: James Beard was an American
• 1:40
  Speaker: chef, teacher, and author,
• 1:42
  Speaker: famously appointed the dean of
• 1:44
  Speaker: American Cookery by The New York
• 1:47
  Speaker: Times.
• 1:48
  Speaker: He lived until nineteen eighty
• 1:50
  Speaker: five, and he was a prominent
• 1:53
  Speaker: foodie and pioneered culinary
• 1:56
  Speaker: arts by becoming the first chef
• 1:58
  Speaker: to demonstrate cooking on
• 2:00
  Speaker: network television.
• 2:01
  Speaker: In nineteen forty six.
• 2:02
  Speaker: So that even predated Julia Child being on television.
• 2:07
  Speaker: Some of his notable achievements was, of course, his NBC show
• 2:12
  Speaker: called I Love to Eat.
• 2:14
  Speaker: His advocacy for fresh, local American ingredients and classic
• 2:19
  Speaker: regional traditions in the US over European cuisine.
• 2:23
  Speaker: He wrote more than twenty classic cookbooks, and he was an
• 2:28
  Speaker: influential educator, mentored generations of professional
• 2:32
  Speaker: chefs and food enthusiasts at his renowned James Beard Cooking
• 2:38
  Speaker: School in New York City, which opened in nineteen fifty five.
• 2:43
  Speaker: Today, his legacy lives through the James Beard Foundation,
• 2:46
  Speaker: which is headquartered in his former Greenwich Village
• 2:48
  Speaker: townhouse in New York City, and the foundation hosts the awards,
• 2:53
  Speaker: the James Beard Awards.
• 2:55
  Speaker: So these took place in the awards receive a lot of
• 2:58
  Speaker: attention from mainstream media, but in the culinary space, it's
• 3:01
  Speaker: one set of awards.
• 3:04
  Speaker: There's also awards for the International Association of
• 3:07
  Speaker: Culinary Professionals, the Art of Eating prize, and the
• 3:11
  Speaker: Gourmand World Cookbook Awards.
• 3:14
  Speaker: So whenever these award season rolls around, people in the food
• 3:20
  Speaker: world get excited.
• 3:21
  Speaker: Kind of like people in film or
• 3:23
  Speaker: screenwriting get excited about
• 3:25
  Speaker: the Oscars.
• 3:26
  Speaker: But I find myself thinking a lot about the question that matters
• 3:29
  Speaker: to all of us who love cookbooks, and thinking a little bit deeper
• 3:34
  Speaker: about the books that won.
• 3:35
  Speaker: What made them award worthy?
• 3:38
  Speaker: Was it the recipes?
• 3:39
  Speaker: Was it the photography?
• 3:40
  Speaker: Was it the writing?
• 3:41
  Speaker: Was it the platform?
• 3:43
  Speaker: Was it the publisher?
• 3:44
  Speaker: And of course, it's all those
• 3:46
  Speaker: things, but it's even more than
• 3:48
  Speaker: that.
• 3:50
  Speaker: The books that rise to the top of these awards, as you're going
• 3:53
  Speaker: to hear today, about three examples that I'm going to give.
• 3:56
  Speaker: You are more than just a collection of recipes.
• 3:59
  Speaker: They are a unique perspective presented by an author.
• 4:05
  Speaker: They often preserve a culture.
• 4:08
  Speaker: They are educational, inspirational, and they help
• 4:13
  Speaker: people who read the book or use the book, see food, and
• 4:18
  Speaker: sometimes see themselves in a whole new way.
• 4:22
  Speaker: So before we celebrate the award winners, I want to take a minute
• 4:27
  Speaker: to talk about how these awards are actually given.
• 4:32
  Speaker: Most people think the judges just flip through the books and
• 4:34
  Speaker: select maybe the one that looks the best or the most famous
• 4:38
  Speaker: author, but it is much more rigorous than that.
• 4:43
  Speaker: They actually create panels of culinary professionals, recipe
• 4:47
  Speaker: developers, editors, journalists, and chefs who spend
• 4:50
  Speaker: months reviewing the submissions for the award.
• 4:55
  Speaker: They evaluate the writing.
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  Speaker: Look at the way the book is organized.
• 5:00
  Speaker: Look at the contribution
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  Speaker: culturally that the book would
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  Speaker: make.
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  Speaker: Look at its originality and the usability of the book.
• 5:09
  Speaker: And then they often take the book into the kitchen, and they
• 5:13
  Speaker: cook from it in their kitchen.
• 5:15
  Speaker: They physically prepare recipes.
• 5:18
  Speaker: They test whether or not instructions are clear, if the
• 5:21
  Speaker: recipes are accurate, and if the recipes deliver on the promise
• 5:26
  Speaker: that is made on the page.
• 5:29
  Speaker: This often happens sometimes,
• 5:30
  Speaker: too, when we propose cookbooks
• 5:32
  Speaker: to publishers if we include
• 5:33
  Speaker: sample chapters.
• 5:35
  Speaker: I have heard cases where editors
• 5:37
  Speaker: will actually take the proposal
• 5:38
  Speaker: into the kitchen and cook from
• 5:40
  Speaker: the proposal.
• 5:42
  Speaker: So every recipe that's in a sample chapter or sample writing
• 5:46
  Speaker: for a proposal need to be ready to be tested.
• 5:50
  Speaker: Fully fleshed out.
• 5:51
  Speaker: Written in your style.
• 5:53
  Speaker: Um. Your own work, your own
• 5:55
  Speaker: words, and a very good
• 5:57
  Speaker: representation of the types of
• 5:59
  Speaker: recipes that are going to be in
• 6:00
  Speaker: your book.
• 6:02
  Speaker: So once the awards are given at the James Beard Foundation, um,
• 6:08
  Speaker: a lot of things can happen to a cookbook as a result of that.
• 6:12
  Speaker: Um, sometimes people see a bump in their sales.
• 6:15
  Speaker: Um, media opportunities are often sought out.
• 6:19
  Speaker: Um, sometimes even books are seen as more desirable.
• 6:23
  Speaker: They maybe are translated into
• 6:25
  Speaker: another language or they're
• 6:27
  Speaker: discovered by a whole new group
• 6:29
  Speaker: of people.
• 6:30
  Speaker: And I also think that this means something else also, and that
• 6:35
  Speaker: these books have contributed to the culinary conversation here
• 6:40
  Speaker: in the US.
• 6:41
  Speaker: They help preserve stories, traditions, and ideas that
• 6:46
  Speaker: deserve to endure.
• 6:48
  Speaker: It's not uncommon that award winning cookbooks are often part
• 6:52
  Speaker: of a serious culinary library.
• 6:55
  Speaker: They become part of a permanent culinary collection.
• 6:59
  Speaker: So if you collect cookbooks,
• 7:01
  Speaker: buying the James Beard Award
• 7:03
  Speaker: winning books is like picking
• 7:06
  Speaker: the best of the best from the
• 7:08
  Speaker: past year.
• 7:09
  Speaker: So personal libraries, libraries and culinary schools, public
• 7:14
  Speaker: libraries, restaurant kitchens, family collections, um, long
• 7:18
  Speaker: after the best seller lists go, um, best sellers are not the
• 7:23
  Speaker: same thing as award winners.
• 7:25
  Speaker: Many of these books remain on the shelf and continue to be
• 7:28
  Speaker: books that teach and inspire for years to come.
• 7:33
  Speaker: So the momentum from the weekend
• 7:36
  Speaker: hasn't really slowed down in my
• 7:38
  Speaker: eyes.
• 7:39
  Speaker: Just yesterday morning, I opened my inbox to find a pitch from a
• 7:42
  Speaker: publicist who wanted me to bring yet another of this year's newly
• 7:48
  Speaker: minted James Beard Award winners onto the podcast.
• 7:52
  Speaker: So I'm excited to bring you that soon.
• 7:55
  Speaker: This community does move fast,
• 7:56
  Speaker: and I can't wait for you to hear
• 7:58
  Speaker: from her.
• 8:01
  Speaker: Um, and it will be an interview that takes place after the award
• 8:04
  Speaker: has been given.
• 8:05
  Speaker: So that'll be fun to talk about.
• 8:07
  Speaker: But let's talk a little bit
• 8:08
  Speaker: about three specific authors
• 8:10
  Speaker: that we have had the privilege
• 8:12
  Speaker: of, um, having as a guest here
• 8:14
  Speaker: on Cookbook Love podcast, I've
• 8:17
  Speaker: had the privilege of spending
• 8:18
  Speaker: time with them during the
• 8:20
  Speaker: interview.
• 8:21
  Speaker: Um, excuse me and the privilege of communicating with them in my
• 8:26
  Speaker: inbox, my email inbox.
• 8:29
  Speaker: And you can tell a lot about a person by the types of emails
• 8:32
  Speaker: they write, and if they actually write them themselves.
• 8:36
  Speaker: And I'm not at all surprised
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  Speaker: that these three authors
• 8:41
  Speaker: personally Wrote back and forth
• 8:45
  Speaker: to me.
• 8:45
  Speaker: Now, the conversation could have been headed off by their PR
• 8:49
  Speaker: agent, which in a couple of cases was, um, Kerry Bachmann,
• 8:54
  Speaker: who I will link to here in the show notes as well, because she
• 9:00
  Speaker: has introduced me to many, um, really great cookbook authors.
• 9:05
  Speaker: And her episode talks all about public relations for a cookbook.
• 9:10
  Speaker: So thank you to Kerry for bringing them my way.
• 9:12
  Speaker: And then also, um, one of the writers was a mastermind student
• 9:20
  Speaker: of mine back in, gosh, I think it was seven or eight years ago.
• 9:24
  Speaker: And she talks about that in her interview.
• 9:26
  Speaker: And, um, she mentions in the interview.
• 9:30
  Speaker: Um, well, I'll talk about that when I get to her.
• 9:32
  Speaker: But anyway, we're going to talk about these three authors and
• 9:35
  Speaker: um, what a privilege it's been to have had the time to talk to
• 9:40
  Speaker: them and to spend time with them here on the show.
• 9:46
  Speaker: Okay, so the first is Sapna Punjabi.
• 9:49
  Speaker: This was episode three forty
• 9:51
  Speaker: seven and her book is called
• 9:53
  Speaker: Daal Chawal.
• 9:55
  Speaker: And in episode three forty
• 9:57
  Speaker: seven, we talked a lot about the
• 9:59
  Speaker: discovery of your authentic
• 10:01
  Speaker: voice.
• 10:03
  Speaker: And we talked about Indian comfort food that she presented
• 10:07
  Speaker: in her book, Dal Chawal.
• 10:10
  Speaker: So, uh, Sapna is a lifelong
• 10:14
  Speaker: vegetarian Ayurvedic
• 10:17
  Speaker: practitioner and registered
• 10:19
  Speaker: dietitian nutritionist.
• 10:21
  Speaker: In this book, Dal Chawal Sapna wrote about Indian comfort food,
• 10:26
  Speaker: homestyle Indian food, which is different than restaurant style
• 10:31
  Speaker: at its finest.
• 10:32
  Speaker: It's economical, it's healthy.
• 10:34
  Speaker: It's delicious.
• 10:35
  Speaker: She wrote eighty five recipes
• 10:37
  Speaker: that form the foundation of
• 10:38
  Speaker: Indian cooking.
• 10:40
  Speaker: And in our interview we talked
• 10:42
  Speaker: all about her journey to writing
• 10:44
  Speaker: Dolce Wall.
• 10:46
  Speaker: And Sapna was the author that was a mastermind student of mine
• 10:51
  Speaker: seven years ago.
• 10:52
  Speaker: And I went back and listened to the interview, and Sapna said
• 10:56
  Speaker: that she can just remember when she joined the mastermind.
• 11:00
  Speaker: She felt so impatient when I said that writing a
• 11:04
  Speaker: traditionally published cookbook is a little bit of a long game.
• 11:07
  Speaker: It may be two to three years
• 11:08
  Speaker: until the book is actually
• 11:09
  Speaker: published.
• 11:10
  Speaker: Um, she said she just felt very impatient.
• 11:13
  Speaker: She wanted the book like right away.
• 11:15
  Speaker: And that's not uncommon.
• 11:16
  Speaker: People, um, when they get this idea and they get the motivation
• 11:21
  Speaker: to start a project, it's just like anything else.
• 11:24
  Speaker: We're so motivated initially that we want the results of what
• 11:28
  Speaker: we're doing to show up fast.
• 11:31
  Speaker: And it happens for a variety of reasons.
• 11:34
  Speaker: Sometimes they are reasons based in reality, and sometimes
• 11:37
  Speaker: there's reasons based in maybe being afraid that someone else
• 11:41
  Speaker: might get to the topic before we do, or that we're going to lose
• 11:45
  Speaker: our motivation or our mojo.
• 11:47
  Speaker: But anyway, she just said she remembered feeling so impatient,
• 11:49
  Speaker: and also she thought three years felt like a really long time.
• 11:54
  Speaker: And she thinks that she had three different concepts that
• 11:56
  Speaker: she had in her mind when she came to the mastermind.
• 12:00
  Speaker: And that's one of the things I
• 12:01
  Speaker: do with people is when we are
• 12:04
  Speaker: home cooks, expert cooks,
• 12:06
  Speaker: culinary professionals,
• 12:07
  Speaker: dietitians, chefs, we know so
• 12:10
  Speaker: much about food and nutrition,
• 12:12
  Speaker: you guys.
• 12:13
  Speaker: And it's often hard to narrow down the concept for our first
• 12:18
  Speaker: book and pick one concept.
• 12:22
  Speaker: And Sapna admitted that she had three.
• 12:25
  Speaker: So, um, she said that this mastermind might have been the
• 12:31
  Speaker: first place that formally heard her ideas for her books, like
• 12:35
  Speaker: said out loud.
• 12:37
  Speaker: And then she went on to write the proposal for Dolce.
• 12:39
  Speaker: Wall.
• 12:40
  Speaker: She retained an agent who.
• 12:43
  Speaker: Sally and Sally went on to shop the proposal.
• 12:46
  Speaker: To the publishers, and she got a contract with Hardie Grant, and
• 12:49
  Speaker: then Hardie Grant ended up publishing the book.
• 12:52
  Speaker: So this book was really rooted
• 12:54
  Speaker: in Sapna's identity, who she
• 12:57
  Speaker: was.
• 12:58
  Speaker: She came to the US as a master's degree student.
• 13:01
  Speaker: She lived in Dallas, Texas, and she missed the homestyle cooking
• 13:05
  Speaker: from India and her meals when she ate at the clinic and when
• 13:09
  Speaker: she ate in the hospital where she ultimately worked.
• 13:11
  Speaker: Always invoked a lot of curiosity from the people who
• 13:14
  Speaker: were in the lunchroom with her.
• 13:15
  Speaker: So she was always kind of
• 13:16
  Speaker: explaining the type of food she
• 13:18
  Speaker: was eating and talking about
• 13:19
  Speaker: wellness.
• 13:20
  Speaker: Then she talks about in the, um,
• 13:22
  Speaker: interview, her routines and her
• 13:24
  Speaker: habits that helped her write her
• 13:25
  Speaker: book.
• 13:26
  Speaker: And she shares a lot of really
• 13:28
  Speaker: great tips for first time
• 13:30
  Speaker: cookbook writers.
• 13:31
  Speaker: So it was a joy to reconnect with Sapna in episode three
• 13:34
  Speaker: forty seven, and it was exciting that her book was nominated for
• 13:39
  Speaker: the James Beard Award.
• 13:41
  Speaker: Okay, the next book was from episode three forty eight, and
• 13:46
  Speaker: the book is called Umma A Korean Mom's Kitchen Wisdom with Sarah
• 13:50
  Speaker: on and Nam soon on.
• 13:53
  Speaker: Sarah is the daughter, Nam soon
• 13:56
  Speaker: is the mother and Sarah appeared
• 13:58
  Speaker: on the show at episode three
• 14:00
  Speaker: forty eight.
• 14:01
  Speaker: During that show, I talked a
• 14:04
  Speaker: little bit about Sarah, who's a
• 14:06
  Speaker: digital storyteller, creator of
• 14:08
  Speaker: Honest Kitchen, where she shares
• 14:10
  Speaker: and documents her mother Namsoon
• 14:13
  Speaker: Ahn's recipes.
• 14:15
  Speaker: In her book, Sarah and Namsoon
• 14:18
  Speaker: took a deep dive into Korean
• 14:21
  Speaker: home cooking.
• 14:22
  Speaker: And by deep, I mean there is a lot to read in this book.
• 14:26
  Speaker: So if you love to read cookbooks
• 14:29
  Speaker: and you're interested in
• 14:30
  Speaker: learning about Korean food, this
• 14:31
  Speaker: is an excellent book to add to
• 14:33
  Speaker: your collection.
• 14:34
  Speaker: And they also added not only the deep dive, but decades of wisdom
• 14:39
  Speaker: and techniques that can help anyone cook like a Korean uma.
• 14:45
  Speaker: Um. Sarah Ann said that her mother's cooking processes and
• 14:51
  Speaker: the processes that she went through just to make something
• 14:53
  Speaker: like, let's just say something like kimchi just really embodied
• 14:58
  Speaker: the love that, um, Namsoon had for her family.
• 15:03
  Speaker: So we talked all about building
• 15:05
  Speaker: her presence online with Honest
• 15:07
  Speaker: Kitchen.
• 15:08
  Speaker: So if you're interested in learning how to do that, she had
• 15:11
  Speaker: some great tips.
• 15:13
  Speaker: We talked about the journey with her mother writing the book, and
• 15:17
  Speaker: that is always a journey.
• 15:19
  Speaker: I remember, um, a couple of
• 15:21
  Speaker: episodes I've had with mother
• 15:23
  Speaker: child cookbook writing teams,
• 15:26
  Speaker: and it's fascinating how that
• 15:30
  Speaker: happens, that the book actually
• 15:32
  Speaker: gets finished because often the
• 15:34
  Speaker: mother and the daughter or the
• 15:35
  Speaker: mother and the son have very
• 15:36
  Speaker: different, um, styles when it
• 15:39
  Speaker: comes to the way they write, the
• 15:40
  Speaker: way they teach, what they want
• 15:41
  Speaker: to talk about, how the book is
• 15:43
  Speaker: actually unfolding, how it's
• 15:45
  Speaker: directed, how it's getting
• 15:46
  Speaker: published.
• 15:47
  Speaker: And, um, it's a journey and it's a dance that the mother and the
• 15:51
  Speaker: child have to do together to write these books.
• 15:54
  Speaker: So she talks about that, and then she talks about helpful
• 15:56
  Speaker: tips for building a pantry, um, three key flavors that is
• 16:00
  Speaker: focused in Korean cooking, which she called sweet, salty and tang
• 16:05
  Speaker: and the recipes that she thinks that people should start with
• 16:09
  Speaker: when they're using the book.
• 16:10
  Speaker: And then the last part of the conversation, and something that
• 16:14
  Speaker: we kind of threaded through the whole thing, which I absolutely
• 16:16
  Speaker: loved, and I think probably because I'm a mother myself, is
• 16:20
  Speaker: I'm a mother's love and wisdom and how far a mother will go for
• 16:26
  Speaker: their own children.
• 16:29
  Speaker: If you're a mother, you understand what that means.
• 16:33
  Speaker: There is just something born and bred into us when we become
• 16:38
  Speaker: mothers, that we will almost go to the lengths of the earth for
• 16:44
  Speaker: our kids, and to feed them is so primal and so instinctive and
• 16:51
  Speaker: sharing food with them.
• 16:54
  Speaker: Um, really, um, I think in a unspoken way allows us to be
• 17:01
  Speaker: the, the women that we are created to be.
• 17:05
  Speaker: And it's not rooted in career.
• 17:08
  Speaker: It's not rooted in recognition.
• 17:10
  Speaker: It's not rooted in anything related to women's liberation.
• 17:14
  Speaker: It is a primal thing.
• 17:15
  Speaker: And I absolutely adored talking to Sarah about that because she
• 17:20
  Speaker: was looking at it from a daughter's perspective, but she
• 17:23
  Speaker: had the maturity and the wisdom to look back and to see that she
• 17:28
  Speaker: just knew that her mother was willing to go to the ends of the
• 17:31
  Speaker: earth also for her and for her father, who worked a blue collar
• 17:35
  Speaker: job as a painter.
• 17:37
  Speaker: She talks about this in the
• 17:38
  Speaker: episode, and he would leave in
• 17:42
  Speaker: the dark.
• 17:42
  Speaker: He'd leave early in the morning and work for twelve hours.
• 17:45
  Speaker: He painted houses.
• 17:46
  Speaker: Maybe he still does paint.
• 17:47
  Speaker: I'm not sure if he's retired, but he's a painter and, uh, his,
• 17:52
  Speaker: uh, wife, Nam, soon packed a lunch for him every day.
• 17:56
  Speaker: And, um, I say, when you're
• 17:59
  Speaker: married to sometimes how far
• 18:01
  Speaker: your love is willing to go for
• 18:02
  Speaker: another person.
• 18:04
  Speaker: Um, it's truly self-sacrificial in a lot of ways.
• 18:07
  Speaker: And, uh, this is just book in
• 18:10
  Speaker: this conversation and the way I
• 18:12
  Speaker: felt about it and the way you
• 18:14
  Speaker: might feel when you read the
• 18:15
  Speaker: book was just dripping with this
• 18:17
  Speaker: whole sentiment of, um, cooking
• 18:20
  Speaker: being a sign of love and
• 18:22
  Speaker: determination and commitment For
• 18:25
  Speaker: a family.
• 18:26
  Speaker: So it's a beautiful book and
• 18:27
  Speaker: congratulations to Sarah on for
• 18:31
  Speaker: her award.
• 18:32
  Speaker: And that's episode three forty eight.
• 18:35
  Speaker: Okay, so the third book and the
• 18:37
  Speaker: third interview that I've had
• 18:38
  Speaker: with the James Beard Award
• 18:40
  Speaker: nominee was episode three ninety
• 18:42
  Speaker: one, baking and the Meaning of
• 18:45
  Speaker: Life, a conversation with Helen
• 18:47
  Speaker: go.
• 18:48
  Speaker: Um, it was great to talk to Helen in our episode.
• 18:52
  Speaker: She's the author of the book
• 18:54
  Speaker: baking in the Meaning of Life
• 18:55
  Speaker: How to Find Joy in one hundred
• 18:57
  Speaker: recipes.
• 18:58
  Speaker: She was widely known prior to writing this book for her work
• 19:01
  Speaker: as a recipe developer with Yotam Ottolenghi, co-authoring the New
• 19:06
  Speaker: York Times best selling books Sweet and Comfort.
• 19:10
  Speaker: So we talked about those books, but we also talked about her as
• 19:14
  Speaker: a debut solo cookbook author.
• 19:17
  Speaker: And for her, the deeper meaning
• 19:20
  Speaker: behind baking, Helen brought a
• 19:23
  Speaker: very unique perspective to the
• 19:25
  Speaker: kitchen because in addition to
• 19:26
  Speaker: her baking work, she maintains a
• 19:29
  Speaker: psychotherapy practice.
• 19:31
  Speaker: So her book blends those two
• 19:33
  Speaker: worlds, sharing not only her
• 19:35
  Speaker: recipe, but her unique
• 19:37
  Speaker: perspective as a psychotherapist
• 19:40
  Speaker: and her reflections on why
• 19:42
  Speaker: baking matters and how it can
• 19:44
  Speaker: bring joy and meaning to every
• 19:46
  Speaker: day life.
• 19:48
  Speaker: I loved this so much because
• 19:53
  Speaker: bringing joy and meaning to
• 19:55
  Speaker: everyday life can come from so
• 19:58
  Speaker: many things that we choose to
• 20:00
  Speaker: do.
• 20:00
  Speaker: And for her, she's talking about baking.
• 20:04
  Speaker: But to take that to a larger
• 20:06
  Speaker: level, cooking can do the same
• 20:07
  Speaker: thing.
• 20:08
  Speaker: Feeding a family can be the same thing.
• 20:11
  Speaker: Enjoying preparing food.
• 20:13
  Speaker: The same thing.
• 20:15
  Speaker: Tons of joy and tons of meaning to everyday life.
• 20:19
  Speaker: We're not talking about restaurant kitchen life here.
• 20:21
  Speaker: We're not talking about the life
• 20:23
  Speaker: of an award winning cookbook
• 20:24
  Speaker: author.
• 20:25
  Speaker: We're talking about everyday life.
• 20:27
  Speaker: So in the book, what Helen does is she draws on her upbringing
• 20:32
  Speaker: from Malaysia and Australia, bringing and weaving in flavours
• 20:36
  Speaker: and foods from those two places.
• 20:40
  Speaker: She talks about her years of
• 20:41
  Speaker: developing recipes with
• 20:43
  Speaker: Ottolenghi.
• 20:44
  Speaker: And I think one thing that happens with recipe development
• 20:48
  Speaker: is you just get good at it.
• 20:49
  Speaker: You're.
• 20:50
  Speaker: It's a practice and you get to, um, you start to develop a mind
• 20:57
  Speaker: where you're always kind of like developing flavour combinations.
• 21:02
  Speaker: You're thinking about the way things go together.
• 21:05
  Speaker: You're maybe mashing up two
• 21:06
  Speaker: recipes and making them your
• 21:08
  Speaker: own.
• 21:09
  Speaker: So she's had a lot of experience doing that.
• 21:11
  Speaker: So she had a lot of fun doing this for her own book.
• 21:14
  Speaker: And she shares in her book both sweet and Savory baking recipes,
• 21:20
  Speaker: so it's not all sweet.
• 21:21
  Speaker: I think sometimes we think of baking.
• 21:22
  Speaker: We're always thinking sweet, but
• 21:23
  Speaker: there are savory things in there
• 21:25
  Speaker: that would be salty or more
• 21:29
  Speaker: vegetal.
• 21:30
  Speaker: And she celebrates creativity, connection, and nourishment.
• 21:36
  Speaker: She also says baking is about
• 21:40
  Speaker: joining connection more than
• 21:41
  Speaker: survival.
• 21:43
  Speaker: I think that's kind of fascinating because when you
• 21:44
  Speaker: think of cooking food, like feeding a family, this is the
• 21:47
  Speaker: way I always felt.
• 21:49
  Speaker: Um, there was joy and connection
• 21:51
  Speaker: from us eating together, but I
• 21:53
  Speaker: was preparing food for our human
• 21:56
  Speaker: survival to provide nutrition,
• 21:58
  Speaker: calories, protein, things that
• 22:00
  Speaker: we needed for the energy for our
• 22:01
  Speaker: everyday life.
• 22:03
  Speaker: But baking takes it above that joy and connection.
• 22:06
  Speaker: And we really looked a deep dive
• 22:08
  Speaker: into the table of contents for
• 22:10
  Speaker: this book.
• 22:11
  Speaker: And, um, Helen does provide some tips and techniques in baking
• 22:15
  Speaker: insights from her years working in a professional.
• 22:19
  Speaker: So those are the three books.
• 22:21
  Speaker: Sapna Punjabi daal Chawal.
• 22:24
  Speaker: Sarah on with Umar and Helen.
• 22:27
  Speaker: Go with baking and the meaning of life.
• 22:30
  Speaker: So I will link to all of those
• 22:32
  Speaker: episodes below in the show
• 22:34
  Speaker: notes.
• 22:34
  Speaker: Because if you're interested in listening to the shows, you can
• 22:38
  Speaker: link back to them.
• 22:39
  Speaker: And also, I highly encourage you
• 22:41
  Speaker: to consider adding one of these
• 22:43
  Speaker: three or all three of these
• 22:45
  Speaker: books to your culinary recipe
• 22:47
  Speaker: collection.
• 22:48
  Speaker: Um, they're not only now
• 22:50
  Speaker: published, like I said, so
• 22:51
  Speaker: different from a bestseller, but
• 22:53
  Speaker: truly something that has been
• 22:55
  Speaker: judged an award winning book or
• 22:57
  Speaker: a nominee by the James Beard
• 22:59
  Speaker: Award.
• 23:00
  Speaker: These books are very strong cookbook concepts.
• 23:04
  Speaker: They're not just recipes, but,
• 23:06
  Speaker: you know, these these authors
• 23:08
  Speaker: have a lot of experience,
• 23:09
  Speaker: expertise.
• 23:10
  Speaker: They also are very curious.
• 23:12
  Speaker: And they had a very strong point of view.
• 23:15
  Speaker: So when you're able to combine
• 23:16
  Speaker: those things with what you know,
• 23:20
  Speaker: what you've lived, what you care
• 23:21
  Speaker: about, and what you want to
• 23:22
  Speaker: share with others, you can come
• 23:24
  Speaker: up with an award winning book
• 23:26
  Speaker: concept.
• 23:27
  Speaker: I think these awards are wonderful.
• 23:29
  Speaker: They bring a lot of recognition
• 23:31
  Speaker: and visibility to the cookbook
• 23:32
  Speaker: space.
• 23:33
  Speaker: Um, but every award winning
• 23:36
  Speaker: cookbook starts the same way
• 23:37
  Speaker: with someone who has an idea and
• 23:39
  Speaker: a message to share and recipes
• 23:42
  Speaker: that they're working on, and an
• 23:44
  Speaker: author who is very willing to do
• 23:45
  Speaker: the work.
• 23:46
  Speaker: And like Sapna said, it takes time.
• 23:49
  Speaker: It's not always a a short game, but a very rewarding process to
• 23:52
  Speaker: be traditionally published by some of the best traditional
• 23:56
  Speaker: publishers in the industry.
• 23:58
  Speaker: Uh, we had, um, Hardie Grant
• 24:00
  Speaker: represented America's Test
• 24:02
  Speaker: Kitchen, did Sara En's Kitchen
• 24:04
  Speaker: and Abrams Books was the
• 24:07
  Speaker: publisher for Helen's book on
• 24:10
  Speaker: baking.
• 24:12
  Speaker: So that is it for today's episode of the Cookbook Love
• 24:16
  Speaker: Podcast, all about the James Beard Cookbook Award winners who
• 24:19
  Speaker: have been on the show.
• 24:21
  Speaker: Stay tuned.
• 24:22
  Speaker: Or James Beard Award nominees or
• 24:24
  Speaker: winners that have been on the
• 24:25
  Speaker: show.
• 24:26
  Speaker: Stay tuned for an upcoming
• 24:28
  Speaker: episode where I will talk to
• 24:29
  Speaker: another James Beard Award
• 24:31
  Speaker: winner.
• 24:32
  Speaker: And I'll also link to the show
• 24:34
  Speaker: with Carey Bachman, the PR agent
• 24:36
  Speaker: who has represented many of
• 24:38
  Speaker: these authors, and she shares
• 24:39
  Speaker: her tips about public relations
• 24:42
  Speaker: for cookbooks.
• 24:43
  Speaker: This is your host, Maggie Green,
• 24:45
  Speaker: and until next time, have a
• 24:47
  Speaker: great day and keep loving your
• 24:49
  Speaker: cookbooks.
• 24:54
  Speaker: Thanks for listening to the Cookbook Love podcast.
• 24:57
  Speaker: You can find out more information at w w w dot
• 24:59
  Speaker: cookbook dot co.