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The Epstein Story Is Bigger Than You Think — 1.5M YouTuber Explains · Unshaken & Unafraid with Joe Pags

0:00
Speaker 1: There are things about Epstein and some of the biggest
0:02
Speaker 1: true crime cases in this country that you were never
0:05
Speaker 1: supposed to see, not because they don't exist, but because
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Speaker 1: they've been buried. This guy who's built one point five
0:10
Speaker 1: million subscriber base digs into this and he says, what's
0:14
Speaker 1: really going on is way darker than people realize.
0:18
Speaker 2: I've been talking about Jeffrey Epstein for years and diving
0:21
Speaker 2: into that story, and I've part of what I've been
0:24
Speaker 2: working on for the last two years are these two
0:27
Speaker 2: different investigative documentary series following these pedophile rinks, historical pedophile rinks.
0:34
Speaker 2: And it's a totally different line of work that I
0:38
Speaker 2: fell into through my wife and i's work. But when
0:42
Speaker 2: I tell you that some of the stuff that we're
0:44
Speaker 2: going to be revealing and talking about is crazy, that
0:48
Speaker 2: is the understatement of the century. It is. It's been
0:51
Speaker 2: quite the journey.
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Speaker 1: It is. The Paranormal Files is the YouTube channel, and
0:56
Speaker 1: in the podcast is Murder in America. People should go
0:59
Speaker 1: and keep both of those out. For me, the Epstein
1:02
Speaker 1: situation as a political commentator and doing news and commentary
1:06
Speaker 1: is my main job. I'm done. I mean, I'm a
1:09
Speaker 1: conservative guy, but I don't care who's on the list.
1:12
Speaker 1: I want everybody. I want it to be released. I
1:14
Speaker 1: wanted to know who was in the ring. Was Pizzagate
1:17
Speaker 1: really a thing? Was that Epstein involved in that? If
1:19
Speaker 1: Trump is on it, I want to know. And I'm
1:21
Speaker 1: a Trump fan, so for me, and I think most
1:24
Speaker 1: people who are watching and listening right now, Colin, they
1:26
Speaker 1: want the answers, and the fact that they're not giving
1:29
Speaker 1: us the answers really pushes people to a page like yours.
1:32
Speaker 1: So when they go to your page, have you got
1:34
Speaker 1: a list of videos that are talking about Epstein already
1:37
Speaker 1: and what you've uncovered and found out?
1:40
Speaker 2: Yeah. On my channel, the Conspiracy Files, I have been
1:43
Speaker 2: doing deep dives into Epstein for years. It was actually
1:46
Speaker 2: the very first video that I did on the channel
1:48
Speaker 2: back in twenty twenty four was dealing with the mysterious
1:51
Speaker 2: death of Epstein and what we knew back then. Now,
1:55
Speaker 2: in the last few years, I've traveled the world interviewing survivors,
1:59
Speaker 2: working with survivors of sexual violence and these rings, and
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Speaker 2: I've learned so much from them, and it is so
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Speaker 2: much bigger and more insidious than people can imagine. And
2:13
Speaker 2: some of the allegations veer into fantasyland territory where it's
2:18
Speaker 2: just so beyond the threshold that people have they just
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Speaker 2: can't bring themselves to even believe that this reality could
2:23
Speaker 2: potentially be true. But that's where I've lived for the
2:27
Speaker 2: last eleven years with my channel and my lifestyle and
2:30
Speaker 2: you know, being in the paranormal. So I've been examining
2:33
Speaker 2: those kind of those wilder allegations and yeah, interviewing people.
2:41
Speaker 2: For example, I was interviewing a woman in Germany and
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Speaker 2: she told me essentially of this cult that she was
2:47
Speaker 2: a part of when she was a child, and she
2:50
Speaker 2: said that her parents brought her into this cult and
2:52
Speaker 2: they were her main abusers, and she was trafficked to
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Speaker 2: these different individuals that were in this group, and she
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Speaker 2: told us, and I'm sitting here listening to this woman
3:03
Speaker 2: tell me the story she told me on camera that
3:06
Speaker 2: it's really graphic and disturbing. But in the middle of
3:10
Speaker 2: one of these cult gatherings or ceremonies, these children were
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Speaker 2: circled up and essentially an adult female was placed in
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Speaker 2: between these kids in the middle of the circle, and
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Speaker 2: a weapon was inserted into the woman and she was
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Speaker 2: then shot and killed. And the children who were there,
3:29
Speaker 2: these are her words, were forced to lick the meat
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Speaker 2: from what happened. Yeah. So the reason I'm saying that
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Speaker 2: is because I have talked to these people, and I
3:40
Speaker 2: know these people, and I'm really good friends with these
3:42
Speaker 2: people that have survived these things. So when I've gone
3:45
Speaker 2: into these investigations dealing with Epstein, my mind has already
3:48
Speaker 2: been open, and it is just shocking how many things
3:52
Speaker 2: don't make it onto Let's just call it the boogeyman.
3:54
Speaker 2: Mainstream media, you know, mainstream media outlets, even photographs of
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Speaker 2: Epstein that you can find your self, and the files
4:01
Speaker 2: that it seems like they refuse to report on for.
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Speaker 2: I mean, you could say unknown reasons, but I mean
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Speaker 2: I think we all know why they they don't want to.
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Speaker 1: I mean, well, I was going to ask you as
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Speaker 1: you were as you were talking about it, and you're
4:11
Speaker 1: actually going to time maybe you're using paranormal psychology or
4:14
Speaker 1: something to get this question out of my brain? Why
4:16
Speaker 1: don't we know more about it? I've been in news
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Speaker 1: and information for thirty six years now, thirty seven years now,
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Speaker 1: and these stories are sometimes popped out in the go away.
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Speaker 1: We never ever focus on it. We never ever get
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Speaker 1: an answer. We to this moment, Colin, don't know what
4:31
Speaker 1: Jeffrey Epstein's job was. Clearly he had billions of dollars.
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Speaker 1: We don't know why he's got billions of dollars, but
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Speaker 1: we assume he's either masade or a CIA, but it
4:40
Speaker 1: might not be any of those things. We know that
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Speaker 1: he's a pedophile, disgusting piece of garbage that owned an island,
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Speaker 1: that would fly the biggest dignitaries on the planet to
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Speaker 1: his island to do allegedly discussing things with children. Why
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Speaker 1: don't we know more about this? Is there is there
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Speaker 1: a scheme in place? And this goes into conspiracy, But
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Speaker 1: is there a scheme in place to hide this information
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Speaker 1: to where he's got leverage or people like him have
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Speaker 1: leverage on all the legacy media, on all the big media,
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Speaker 1: on everybody in government. How's that possible?
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Speaker 2: Well, I think it's I mean, it's a multi it's
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Speaker 2: a complex question that requires a multifaceted answer almost. I
5:18
Speaker 2: mean when it comes to legacy media. Uh, I don't
5:21
Speaker 2: know if you remember that clip of Amy I forget
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Speaker 2: to last name Roorbach.
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Speaker 1: Or she's yes, I do remember that she had the
5:28
Speaker 1: good yeah.
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Speaker 2: About Epstein, and she's saying on camera on the hot mic,
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Speaker 2: essentially that they wanted her to kill the story. So
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Speaker 2: you can see that right there. That is the mentality
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Speaker 2: years ago of these mainstream kind of legacy media outlets.
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Speaker 2: They didn't want this to come out for one reason
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Speaker 2: or another, whether it was too graphic and they didn't
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Speaker 2: feel like their audience would respond to it, as callous
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Speaker 2: as that is, or you know, they were being paid
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Speaker 2: off and protected. That's that's just something we don't know.
5:57
Speaker 2: But what I can say when I could speak to
5:59
Speaker 2: from personal experience, I know that they censor stories based
6:03
Speaker 2: on or about Epstein on social media, like it is
6:07
Speaker 2: absolutely insane. And I've tried to raise the alarm about this.
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Speaker 2: But for example, on TikTok I post, I've got almost
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Speaker 2: four million followers on TikTok and I talk about Epstein
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Speaker 2: every single day, and I've been one of the OG's
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Speaker 2: talking about Epstein for years and I have never let
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Speaker 2: the story up. But I get about four to five
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Speaker 2: videos every single week removed from my TikTok for completely unknown,
6:33
Speaker 2: mysterious reasons. They don't even provide me with a strike.
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Speaker 2: They say community guidelines. This violated the guidelines. They don't
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Speaker 2: let me appeal. It's actually peculiar. I can pull it
6:43
Speaker 2: out right now and show you there are certain videos
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Speaker 2: that they removed of mine that normally when you try
6:48
Speaker 2: to you get a video or move, there's a whole
6:50
Speaker 2: process you follow, you have to go through, you do
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Speaker 2: the appeal, you get it back. You know, you see
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Speaker 2: the result. For certain videos, I'm not even given the
6:58
Speaker 2: opportunity to appeal. And when and I clicked the screen
7:00
Speaker 2: that would usually take you to the appeal screen, it
7:03
Speaker 2: brings me to this really weird. It's got like a
7:06
Speaker 2: ufoon in a spaceship and it says something went wrong. Sorry, apologies. Yeah,
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Speaker 2: it's crazy. And so I can't I can't even try
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Speaker 2: to get the videos back because it doesn't give me
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Speaker 2: the option. And that's happened. I mean, I was talking
7:17
Speaker 2: about Bohemian Grove on Facebook, right because I went outside
7:21
Speaker 2: of the grove and interviewed people a few years ago,
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Speaker 2: and because I posted a video about Bohemian Grove on
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Speaker 2: Facebook in twenty twenty four, my entire Facebook and Instagram
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Speaker 2: was taken offline for about six months. It was insane.
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Speaker 1: Well, it is insane and that censorship is real. I've
7:36
Speaker 1: got one point one million on TikTok, but you'll see
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Speaker 1: there's no virality at all. I mean it used to
7:41
Speaker 1: be like I used to do a video, I get
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Speaker 1: twelve million views. Now I'm getting fifty thousand if I'm lucky,
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Speaker 1: and they're constantly telling me to buy ads. I can
7:48
Speaker 1: get fifty thousand more views if I want. I don't
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Speaker 1: buy any ads at all. Haven't paid for any followers,
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Speaker 1: just like you haven't. We built this organically, and it's
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Speaker 1: like the platforms punish you because you're telling the truth.
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Speaker 1: So let me finish on Epstein this way. Charlie Kirk,
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Speaker 1: before his disgusting, untimely assassination said on I Think Patrick
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Speaker 1: bet David's podcast, it's clear that Epstein was blackmailing everybody.
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Speaker 1: It was a blackmail scheme and he had control and
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Speaker 1: leverage over everybody. Then he just sort of is not
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Speaker 1: on earth anymore. Is that what you're finding as well?
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Speaker 1: There's there's no doubt in my mind because he got
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Speaker 1: a slap on the wrist in two thousand and eight
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Speaker 1: or nine. He's somebody who ended up behind bars and
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Speaker 1: then somehow died allegedly, we don't even know if he's dead,
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Speaker 1: and everybody, but everybody that he had this leverage over
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Speaker 1: still isn't talking. If the guy's dead, if he's gone,
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Speaker 1: why can't we know everything now? So is it your belief,
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Speaker 1: like what Charlie said, that this was all about blackmailing
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Speaker 1: the biggest names on the planet.
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Speaker 2: And when it comes to stories of political blackmail, there's
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Speaker 2: historicity to those claims, not only just I mean, obviously
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Speaker 2: we all know that politicians are compromised and they're blackmailed
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Speaker 2: all the time, whether it's from a drug habit or
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Speaker 2: some sort of cross dressing kink, whatever it is. Now
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Speaker 2: people will get that information and they will hold it
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Speaker 2: against anybody. But when it comes to the kind of
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Speaker 2: Epstein's scheme where you're hooking in these politicians and getting
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Speaker 2: them on camera doing things, we'll just say to skirt
9:13
Speaker 2: the censors with miners. There are stories exactly like that
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Speaker 2: from decades prior. For example, in the Plaza Hotel and
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Speaker 2: the fifties I believe it was fifties, could be early sixties,
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Speaker 2: j Edgar Hoover and Roy Kohane allegedly essentially created the
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Speaker 2: sexual blackmail scheme so they were having these parties in
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Speaker 2: the Blue Suite at the Plaza Hotel. It's an infamous room,
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Speaker 2: and they were doing essentially what boils down to the
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Speaker 2: same thing that Epstein is accused of having done. They
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Speaker 2: were bringing in politicians. They were bringing in extremely young individuals,
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Speaker 2: a lot of reports have said miners, and they were
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Speaker 2: secretly recording these powerful political individuals doing these things with
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Speaker 2: these miners. And this is back in the nineteen fifties
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Speaker 2: and you know, early nineteen sixties. As you go through time,
10:03
Speaker 2: you see this story repeated over and over again. This
10:05
Speaker 2: story pops up in Germany. If you are familiar with
10:08
Speaker 2: the Manual Shadwald story, that's a very similar thing. A
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Speaker 2: kid that was murdered and is supposedly in retaliation for
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Speaker 2: his dad being involved in this sexual blackmail scheme. And
10:18
Speaker 2: then the biggest the bad boy is the Franklin cover
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Speaker 2: up and the Franklin scandal in Omaha, which is a
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Speaker 2: story that I'm intimately familiar. For a number of reasons,
10:30
Speaker 2: I can't talk necessarily too much about the Franklin But
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Speaker 2: are you familiar with that story?
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Speaker 1: It sounds familiar. I don't know much about it, though,
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Speaker 1: can you give us the nuts and bolts without getting
10:40
Speaker 1: too in depth with it. And by the way, those
10:42
Speaker 1: who are watching listening is Colin Brown. Go and check
10:45
Speaker 1: out his YouTube it's the Paranormal Files and his podcast
10:47
Speaker 1: is Awesome Murder in America. Go ahead, film me in
10:50
Speaker 1: on Franklin. Just give me the nuts and bolts.
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Speaker 2: Franklin is essentially the Epstein of the eighties, the Epstein.
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Speaker 2: Before Epstein, you had the exact same allegations being made
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Speaker 2: about children being flown across the country, about parties with
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Speaker 2: powerful individuals in Washington, d C. About powerbrokers victimizing children,
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Speaker 2: will say, drugs, alcohol, parties, all this being recorded, and
11:18
Speaker 2: it all disappeared after it was exposed. So essentially Franklin.
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Speaker 2: The main part of Franklin and the exposing of the
11:28
Speaker 2: story was in the late eighties and early nineties, and
11:31
Speaker 2: right after Franklin disappeared, according to reporting, that's when the
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Speaker 2: Epstein operation, at least the part where he went to
11:40
Speaker 2: try to compromise Bill Clinton in the White House, that's
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Speaker 2: when that picked up in the early nineteen nineties. So
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Speaker 2: if you want to read a book that is that
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Speaker 2: will absolutely change your life and your mentality, especially when
11:50
Speaker 2: it comes to Epstein, I would highly recommend The Franklin
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Speaker 2: Scandal by Nick Bryant. Nick's a really close friend of mine,
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Speaker 2: and it is truly a life changing book because it's
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Speaker 2: the exact same story as Epstein. Just before Epstein, I
12:04
Speaker 2: get it.
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Speaker 1: I'll be honest with you, I don't know anything about
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Speaker 1: the story. I thought it sounded familiar. But what you
12:08
Speaker 1: just said doesn't ring any bells at all. And let
12:11
Speaker 1: me say why that's important. I was a television news
12:13
Speaker 1: anchor for a long time. I've won many awards in journalism.
12:16
Speaker 1: I know how to do the job, and I try
12:18
Speaker 1: to be aware of almost everything, even if I don't
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Speaker 1: use it on my shows. I try to be aware
12:22
Speaker 1: of everything. Why don't I know anything about that?
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Speaker 2: The Franklin story was completely buried, not only because it
12:29
Speaker 2: was buried as it was happening by local media in Nebraska.
12:33
Speaker 2: There were publishers that were alleged to have been a
12:37
Speaker 2: part of this ring by victim witnesses, but in the
12:41
Speaker 2: years afterwards. I mean essentially what ended up happening is
12:44
Speaker 2: the main victim witness, her name's Alicia. She was imprisoned
12:48
Speaker 2: on perjury charges, so they tried to claim that she
12:51
Speaker 2: made the whole thing up, and she never changed her story.
12:55
Speaker 2: The other kids, they were threatened, They had siblings that
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Speaker 2: mysteriously killed themselves in the middle of Judie racial proceedings
13:00
Speaker 2: in the grand jury, I mean in the middle of
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Speaker 2: the grand jury, in the middle of the Franklin grand jury.
13:05
Speaker 2: The main investigator, the lead investigator on this whole thing,
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Speaker 2: his name's Gary Carridori. He is flying his plane with
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Speaker 2: his eight year old son, Andrew, and his plane mysteriously
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Speaker 2: explodes midair and he and his son are are killed.
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Speaker 2: To this date, it's never been explained what happened to
13:22
Speaker 2: the plane. It's been alleged that FBI were the first
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Speaker 2: people on scene Gary's briefcase, which according to many contained
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Speaker 2: compromising photos of powerful people in compromising positions. The briefcase
13:35
Speaker 2: had vanished from the wreck of the plane by the
13:37
Speaker 2: time local investigators got there, even though his son's backpack
13:41
Speaker 2: was still found mostly intact. Pretty bizarre to have the
13:45
Speaker 2: entire briefcase handle, nuts, bolts, everything just disappear. But there
13:49
Speaker 2: have been a lot of people that died attached to
13:51
Speaker 2: the Franklin story, and they have done an absolutely immaculate
13:55
Speaker 2: job of covering it up. And what's also interesting is
13:58
Speaker 2: the same attorney general who was in office at the
14:01
Speaker 2: time that Epstein mysteriously died, Bill Barr. He was also
14:05
Speaker 2: Attorney general at the time that Franklin was covered up.
14:08
Speaker 2: And that's from the very beginning.
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Speaker 1: There's a lot about Bill Barr that I would like
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Speaker 1: to know, because the guy said things that he didn't mean,
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Speaker 1: He meant things that he didn't say, he acted in
14:17
Speaker 1: a way that was opposite of what he said he
14:19
Speaker 1: was going to do. There's something very deep and dark
14:21
Speaker 1: about that guy that I'd like to find out. Go
14:23
Speaker 1: and binge this guy's channel, the Paranormal Files, and go
14:26
Speaker 1: check out the podcast right now, Murder in America. It's
14:28
Speaker 1: Colin Brown. Let's talk about Nancy Guthrie. That for me
14:32
Speaker 1: helped build my page. I gained twenty thousand followers in
14:35
Speaker 1: a month because I was covering Nancy Guthrie from angles
14:39
Speaker 1: that weren't being covered in the legacy media and people
14:42
Speaker 1: just were hungry and thirsty for information on that case.
14:46
Speaker 1: Is this just the perfect storm case that brings people
14:49
Speaker 1: to YouTube, to people like you, people like me in
14:51
Speaker 1: a much lower level to find out what they're not
14:53
Speaker 1: getting from the news. You've got somebody who's a famous person,
14:56
Speaker 1: who's a morning show star. You got her mother is
14:58
Speaker 1: missing and we don't know why she's missing. You got
15:00
Speaker 1: blood on the front door. You've got some weird figure
15:03
Speaker 1: that shows up in a video that they uncovered, you know,
15:05
Speaker 1: days later or weeks later. You've got a really incompetent
15:08
Speaker 1: sheriff in p Ma County, Arizona whose entire deputy staff
15:12
Speaker 1: wants him gone. Not one vote of confidence for Chris
15:15
Speaker 1: Nano's Is that why this is so interesting? And because
15:18
Speaker 1: we have no closure.
15:20
Speaker 2: I would say so. I mean it's a story that
15:24
Speaker 2: I think everybody can empathize with and relate to. I mean,
15:27
Speaker 2: how horrific to have your mother or father taken from
15:30
Speaker 2: their own home and to have no answers. And then
15:34
Speaker 2: on top of that you add so many different layers.
15:36
Speaker 2: I mean, the incompetent police department, the mysterious evidence like
15:39
Speaker 2: you just mentioned, and the fact that this is all
15:42
Speaker 2: related to a very recognizable individual in America. Those are
15:47
Speaker 2: kind of the symptoms or the circumstances that would be
15:50
Speaker 2: needed to create the perfect storm of a true crime case.
15:53
Speaker 2: And I don't know, I think it's shocking that there
15:56
Speaker 2: are still no answers. But I mean, this is the
15:59
Speaker 2: world that I I live in, essentially and working and
16:03
Speaker 2: breathe in and out at every moment of the day.
16:04
Speaker 2: There are so many cases like this throughout US history.
16:08
Speaker 2: I mean, like at the top of the show we
16:10
Speaker 2: were talking about Ted Bundy and the recent DNA discovery.
16:13
Speaker 2: I mean, for me, that's shocking because there's literally I mean,
16:18
Speaker 2: I know, I knew that Ted Bundy more than likely
16:21
Speaker 2: had more victims, right. And it is interesting because when
16:24
Speaker 2: I did a paranormal investigation in Salt Lake City in
16:27
Speaker 2: Utah years ago relating to Ted Bundy, we actually felt
16:32
Speaker 2: like we had received some sort of an answer during
16:34
Speaker 2: that investigation, saying that there were more victims from the area.
16:38
Speaker 2: And now, years later, years after the fact, DNA has
16:43
Speaker 2: linked Bundy to another murder in Utah. Is it in
16:47
Speaker 2: Salt Lake City? I can't remember the exact city.
16:49
Speaker 1: Where, I'm not sure, but I will tell you this.
16:52
Speaker 1: You don't know this about me. I grew up in Florida,
16:54
Speaker 1: So the Ted Bundy case was a very very big case,
16:57
Speaker 1: not only in Florida, was nationally as well. But there
16:59
Speaker 1: wasn't social media, and there wasn't you know, there were
17:02
Speaker 1: two thousand channels on your TV, so we were getting
17:05
Speaker 1: the bulk of it immediately in Florida. And what jumps
17:08
Speaker 1: out at me about that case, and maybe you can
17:10
Speaker 1: opine about this a bit. The only reason why that
17:12
Speaker 1: case was so was so big and so intriguing to
17:16
Speaker 1: people is a good looking guy, be really good lawyer.
17:21
Speaker 1: The judge told him, you're a really good lawyer. I
17:23
Speaker 1: wish that we'd have met in different circumstances. And see,
17:26
Speaker 1: women were literally trying to still get with this guy
17:29
Speaker 1: as he was getting ready for death. Row that angle
17:33
Speaker 1: of it. It's almost like modern day Mangoni. This guy's
17:36
Speaker 1: a good looking guy that everybody wants to All the
17:37
Speaker 1: women are, oh my god, is he killed somebody? But
17:39
Speaker 1: so what healthcare sucks in America? Is that component in
17:44
Speaker 1: true crime stories important when it comes to virality, when
17:48
Speaker 1: it comes to building the page, and when it comes
17:49
Speaker 1: to seeking out information that you're not getting from the
17:52
Speaker 1: legacy media. Because again, good looking guy, very intriguing. Savannah Guthrie,
17:56
Speaker 1: very well known. You got Ted Bundy, a case that
17:59
Speaker 1: was what five years ago that now is coming back
18:02
Speaker 1: to the surface. Is that a component that really does
18:04
Speaker 1: draw attention and a crowd.
18:08
Speaker 2: So many different things I could comment on here that
18:11
Speaker 2: are interesting.
18:11
Speaker 1: Why I have you on? Yeah, go ahead away the uh.
18:17
Speaker 2: The age of the serial killer is over in so
18:20
Speaker 2: many ways, which is why I think these stories are
18:23
Speaker 2: so interesting, especially to younger individuals like myself who didn't
18:27
Speaker 2: really grow up in the era where these serial killers were,
18:32
Speaker 2: you know, terrorizing the public. Now, there is a lot
18:35
Speaker 2: to be said about some of those serial killer stories.
18:38
Speaker 2: Some of those individuals I think are responsible for more
18:42
Speaker 2: victims than have been discovered. But there are stories like
18:46
Speaker 2: the Son of Sam, where I believe that the police
18:49
Speaker 2: got it all wrong and they actually I mean, I
18:51
Speaker 2: don't know. There's a great series on Netflix called The
18:53
Speaker 2: Sons of Sam and a great book by Mary Terry
18:56
Speaker 2: or not Mary Terry. I think it's Mary Terry. I
18:58
Speaker 2: can't remember his name.
18:59
Speaker 1: But are you telling me that Berkowitz wasn't the Son
19:01
Speaker 1: of Sam? What are you? What are you telling me that?
19:04
Speaker 2: Well? I think that he was involved, but I think
19:06
Speaker 2: that there's so much extenuating evidence, and there's so much
19:10
Speaker 2: just materials surrounding the Son of Sam case.
19:13
Speaker 1: I have to go a Binger Channel tonight. Now, I mean,
19:15
Speaker 1: what the heck are you talking about? So there's newing
19:18
Speaker 1: I have to learn about Franklin. You're saying that Burkowitz
19:21
Speaker 1: might not have acted alone, but he was involved somehow.
19:24
Speaker 1: Let's go back to Bundy because we just have we
19:26
Speaker 1: have this late breaking evidence, and you and I can
19:28
Speaker 1: talk for seven hours, truly, I think we can. We're
19:31
Speaker 1: not going to it, but I think we can. When
19:33
Speaker 1: it comes to Bundy, that case has been over for
19:36
Speaker 1: so long. He's dead. He's long dead. And if I recall,
19:39
Speaker 1: it was like seventeen co Eds or something that allegedly
19:43
Speaker 1: he had a part in killing or killed himself. And
19:46
Speaker 1: again here was this suaving debonair guy in the courtroom
19:49
Speaker 1: really as a great lawyer, and now you're telling me
19:52
Speaker 1: there's an allegation that he did something in Utah. I
19:54
Speaker 1: mean that if that resurfaces now, you're probably going to
19:57
Speaker 1: be able to do ten videos on that. And because
20:01
Speaker 1: like you said, you're way younger than I am, I'm
20:03
Speaker 1: probably old enough to be your father. So there are
20:05
Speaker 1: a lot of people from my era, from my generation,
20:07
Speaker 1: who know a lot about this case. But there are
20:09
Speaker 1: people that know nothing about this case. So, if I'm
20:13
Speaker 1: a brand new viewer and I'm twenty eight and I
20:15
Speaker 1: tune into into The Paranormal Files or Murder in America,
20:19
Speaker 1: what do you need me to know about Ted Bundy
20:21
Speaker 1: that's going to grab my attention and make me come
20:23
Speaker 1: back every day.
20:25
Speaker 2: Well, what we like to do with our shows is
20:28
Speaker 2: tell the full story. And I mean that's kind of
20:30
Speaker 2: something that you don't also get in the mainstream media
20:33
Speaker 2: like Sudia. They don't have the time to be able to.
20:36
Speaker 1: They make a lot of assumptions, whereas you can actually
20:38
Speaker 1: spell the entire story out. I love that.
20:40
Speaker 2: Yeah, and it's you know, that's my wife's life's work.
20:43
Speaker 2: She absolutely is an incredible research and we have an
20:46
Speaker 2: incredible team of writers and researchers that help bring the
20:49
Speaker 2: show to life. But you know, when Courtney and I,
20:53
Speaker 2: my wife and I were starting the show, we kind
20:55
Speaker 2: of listen to other programs and the one thing that
20:59
Speaker 2: we always thought and we kept telling each other was
21:02
Speaker 2: we didn't feel like we were given enough information, Like
21:05
Speaker 2: we didn't know the full story. And so with Ted Bundy,
21:08
Speaker 2: I mean, you can watch a documentary about Ted Bundy
21:11
Speaker 2: and learn an hour's worth of details about this guy's
21:14
Speaker 2: life and his crimes. But in reality, I mean, it
21:17
Speaker 2: would take years to go through the full life story
21:19
Speaker 2: if you had every detail. And that's kind of how
21:21
Speaker 2: these crimes, you know, go unnoticed and undetected for so
21:25
Speaker 2: many years. It's it's a thing where I mean, this
21:28
Speaker 2: DNA is absolutely incredible. Just in Houston, I don't know
21:31
Speaker 2: if you saw the news they had the they just
21:35
Speaker 2: made an arrest in the Lover's Lane murders, which is
21:38
Speaker 2: a very very famous unsolved homicide, double homicide here in Houston,
21:42
Speaker 2: and it was through a DNA match. And recently in
21:45
Speaker 2: Austin you also had an arrest made in the Yogurt
21:48
Speaker 2: Shot murders, which is another infamous unsolved case, another DNA match.
21:52
Speaker 2: We cover stories about this all the time on the show.
21:56
Speaker 2: If I were someone who had murdered somebody back in
21:58
Speaker 2: the seventies or sixties, and I had gotten away with
22:01
Speaker 2: it up until this point, I would be shitting my
22:04
Speaker 2: pants because this DNA is becoming so good and it's
22:09
Speaker 2: just it's bringing all these stories back into the light.
22:12
Speaker 2: I mean, Ted Bundy, we're talking about a case that
22:15
Speaker 2: really played out in the seventies eighties, but it's twenty
22:18
Speaker 2: twenty six and we're finding new victims. Something that always
22:21
Speaker 2: shocked me is John Wayne Gacy, paulgo of the Clown.
22:24
Speaker 2: He's one of the most infamous serial killers in American history.
22:27
Speaker 2: There are still victims of John Wayne Gacy's that have
22:30
Speaker 2: never been identified. Same with here in Houston, Dean Coral,
22:34
Speaker 2: the candy Man. I actually live in the heights where
22:36
Speaker 2: Dean Coral was hunting for these young victims. His candy
22:39
Speaker 2: shop was four blocks down the road from me. There
22:42
Speaker 2: are victims of his that have still to this day
22:45
Speaker 2: not been identified. So it's not shocking to me at
22:49
Speaker 2: all that there would be another victim of Ted Bundy's
22:51
Speaker 2: and I personally believe that there are even more. And
22:54
Speaker 2: I think that sadly, because some of these killers were
22:57
Speaker 2: good at what they did back then, we're never going
23:00
Speaker 2: to be able to actually figure out the proper tally
23:03
Speaker 2: of victims and kind of paint the full picture because,
23:07
Speaker 2: let's just face it, they didn't have the technology back then.
23:10
Speaker 2: It must have been so easy to be a murderer
23:13
Speaker 2: back in the day when there were no live streams
23:15
Speaker 2: and no security camera systems and no profiling and you know,
23:19
Speaker 2: all this tech that we have now, it's always shocking
23:21
Speaker 2: to me to think of, you know, what people got
23:24
Speaker 2: away with back then that we still don't know about. Well.
23:28
Speaker 1: Well, with Bundy, I'm surprised at Utah because he did
23:30
Speaker 1: his killing in Florida, So I mean, that's crazy to me.
23:34
Speaker 1: There was a case and I can't think of the
23:35
Speaker 1: guy's name. You'll probably know this off the top of
23:37
Speaker 1: your head, but there was a serial killer case where
23:39
Speaker 1: the guy got away with it and just stopped doing it,
23:41
Speaker 1: and they ended up getting him when he was in
23:43
Speaker 1: his seventies. And it was a named case as well.
23:45
Speaker 1: He was killing young women and it was a DNA
23:49
Speaker 1: match from like nineteen seventy four or something. I think
23:52
Speaker 1: the guy was a former cop. He was a cop,
23:54
Speaker 1: and there were people found dead all over the place
23:56
Speaker 1: where he was near, but they never tied two and
23:59
Speaker 1: two together. And then they caught him when he was
24:00
Speaker 1: in his sixties or seventies, and he admitted to everything,
24:03
Speaker 1: and he started to say, oh, yeah, well, no, that's
24:04
Speaker 1: not that one. There's another victim over there that I
24:06
Speaker 1: buried over here. You know a case I'm talking about.
24:09
Speaker 2: That I believe is Golden State Killer Joseph Danelo.
24:13
Speaker 1: Yes, yes, yes, I mean you're right. People should be,
24:17
Speaker 1: you know, taking that in their pants if they're a
24:20
Speaker 1: killer and got away with it. You us think about it.
24:22
Speaker 1: In nineteen ninety five, when OJ Simpson was on trial,
24:26
Speaker 1: nobody trusted DNA, yet they had him dead to rights.
24:30
Speaker 1: It was a one in eight billion chance and there
24:32
Speaker 1: weren't eight billion people on earth yet that it was him,
24:34
Speaker 1: and the jury still acquitted him. So people now trust DNA.
24:38
Speaker 1: This is a science that I'm guessing evolved even more
24:41
Speaker 1: since OJ Simpson. But do you think that what you
24:44
Speaker 1: said earlier really jumped out at me? You think that
24:46
Speaker 1: there are more victims of these serial killers than we know,
24:49
Speaker 1: because I thought once they get caught, they're like, yeah,
24:51
Speaker 1: there were seven more over here, and then I got
24:53
Speaker 1: these people over here. Do you think they're not admitting
24:54
Speaker 1: to everything.
24:56
Speaker 2: There are tons of stories where years later more victims
25:00
Speaker 2: are discovered. And I mean you had to put yourself
25:03
Speaker 2: in that frame of mind, the mind of a killer,
25:06
Speaker 2: for a moment back in the seven decade.
25:08
Speaker 1: Yeah, but we really honestly in can because we're not.
25:11
Speaker 1: But I get it. So if you did the deed,
25:13
Speaker 1: what would you do I mean, I get that, do
25:16
Speaker 1: you know in your heart of hearts? And maybe your
25:18
Speaker 1: wife and you talked about this on your podcast. Go
25:20
Speaker 1: check it out Murder in America or check out the
25:22
Speaker 1: Paranormal Files. Do you know why we're so interested in
25:26
Speaker 1: serial killers? What is it about cases like that that
25:29
Speaker 1: makes us, as human beings that will never do anything
25:32
Speaker 1: like that, so intrigued by it?
25:35
Speaker 2: You know, I could sit here all day and try
25:38
Speaker 2: to tell you what I believe in, but I don't
25:42
Speaker 2: have the answers. Like my wife was a psych major
25:45
Speaker 2: in college, That's what she graduated with a degree in psychology.
25:49
Speaker 2: And she's tried to understand this for years. And you know,
25:52
Speaker 2: I've had so many conversations with people like we do
25:55
Speaker 2: the show because we'd like to memorialize victims. We like
25:57
Speaker 2: to tell these stories. We like to keep these stories
26:00
Speaker 2: alive and remind people of some of the horrific things
26:03
Speaker 2: that have happened in US history that they don't want
26:06
Speaker 2: to talk about. Or you know, we can't let people
26:08
Speaker 2: forget about some of these things in these events. But
26:11
Speaker 2: I don't know. There are other individuals that are interested
26:14
Speaker 2: in these stories for a multitude of reasons and it's
26:18
Speaker 2: a whole spectrum. You know, there are people who are
26:20
Speaker 2: psychologists and pathologists and people that really want to understand
26:25
Speaker 2: the criminal psyche who are into these stories for those reasons,
26:27
Speaker 2: and then there are also individuals who are inspired by
26:31
Speaker 2: stories like this, you know, to commit further acts of violence.
26:34
Speaker 2: So as horrific as that is, it's hard to even
26:38
Speaker 2: come up with a singular reason why I would think
26:41
Speaker 2: people are interested in these stories because there's so many
26:44
Speaker 2: different reasons. And yeah, we've tried our hardest to make
26:48
Speaker 2: a show that is focused on the victims, and we
26:51
Speaker 2: donate every week to a different charity, and we work
26:53
Speaker 2: with family members and survivers and it's been a really,
26:57
Speaker 2: really rewarding journey. But at the same time time, it's
27:00
Speaker 2: just so shocking to me to see how many murders
27:04
Speaker 2: there are in America, not only every year, but I
27:06
Speaker 2: mean every day. It's just it's an endless cycle of
27:09
Speaker 2: violence that is a real problem in this country that
27:12
Speaker 2: we are grappling with at all times, not even just
27:15
Speaker 2: relating to guns, and you could get into the whole
27:17
Speaker 2: debate of gun control and everything, but just the concept
27:20
Speaker 2: of violence and murder. It is so prevalent in American
27:23
Speaker 2: culture and society. You almost don't know what to even do.
27:27
Speaker 2: It's just it's crazy.
27:30
Speaker 1: The Paranormal Files is the YouTube page. Go there and
27:32
Speaker 1: follow right now. Make sure you subscribe. Also check out
27:34
Speaker 1: Murder in America. It's Colin Brown. I'll leave you with
27:38
Speaker 1: a couple of things. One, I think the reason why
27:41
Speaker 1: we're so intrigued, just from my perspective, is a study
27:44
Speaker 1: that was done twenty or thirty years ago about why
27:45
Speaker 1: we slowed down and we rubberneck when there's an accident
27:49
Speaker 1: on the highway. I think, first of all, we're glad
27:51
Speaker 1: it wasn't us, And second of all, we want to
27:54
Speaker 1: make sure we have empathy. We want to make sure
27:55
Speaker 1: nobody's dead. We hope everybody survived the crash. When we
27:59
Speaker 1: hear about the serial murderers, we think to ourselves, that
28:01
Speaker 1: could easily have been me. How did they end up
28:04
Speaker 1: becoming victims? How did they end up getting away with
28:06
Speaker 1: it so much? So I think that again, I think
28:08
Speaker 1: mostly people are good, and we have human empathy. We
28:11
Speaker 1: want to know the ins and outs. But what I
28:13
Speaker 1: do want to leave you with, and I want you
28:14
Speaker 1: to leave my audience with, is how do you maintain
28:16
Speaker 1: your credibility. And the reason why I ask that is
28:19
Speaker 1: there is so much AI now, there's so much misinformation
28:22
Speaker 1: out there, so much disinformation. People will very fervently look
28:26
Speaker 1: in the camera and say this is the way it
28:28
Speaker 1: is at you and I because we have some knowledge. No,
28:31
Speaker 1: it's not that way, but those who are watching will
28:33
Speaker 1: believe it and will buy it hook line and sinker
28:35
Speaker 1: in what I do in politics In that realm, there
28:38
Speaker 1: are a lot of liars all the time, every day,
28:40
Speaker 1: and you've got to sift through that. And I think
28:42
Speaker 1: the reason why I'm so popular on TikTok and why
28:44
Speaker 1: my show is so good on radio is that people
28:46
Speaker 1: know I'm going to do the research and really give
28:48
Speaker 1: them the skinny. Do you find that that's a barrier
28:51
Speaker 1: as well, that you and your wife have to make
28:53
Speaker 1: sure you dotted every eye, you crossed every t or
28:56
Speaker 1: because if you lose credibility in what you do, you
28:58
Speaker 1: lose your following, you lose your income.
29:01
Speaker 2: Yeah. It's very very interesting to me actually working in
29:06
Speaker 2: not only in the true crime space in general with
29:09
Speaker 2: my wife and I's show, but I have my entire
29:12
Speaker 2: second podcast and channel which is exclusively about what people
29:16
Speaker 2: would label conspiracy theories, but I'm more inclined to call
29:19
Speaker 2: it alternate history. And with every single show that I
29:24
Speaker 2: do for my channel, the Conspiracy Files, I provide the
29:27
Speaker 2: primary source documents, and I link every single book that
29:31
Speaker 2: I glean information from, and I link every program and
29:34
Speaker 2: every web page and you can visit and verify all
29:36
Speaker 2: the information for yourself. And to me, that was incredibly
29:40
Speaker 2: important starting the show, because I wanted to take these
29:42
Speaker 2: stories like the Franklin story, like the Epstein story, that
29:46
Speaker 2: we're living out beyond the realm of comprehension for most individuals,
29:50
Speaker 2: to kind of pull them in to a point where
29:53
Speaker 2: people could start to believe in these things, because it's
29:56
Speaker 2: not like, you know, a conspiracy is really a conspirac
30:00
Speaker 2: Most of the time, there's a there's a kernel of truth,
30:02
Speaker 2: even if there's a lot of disinformation surrounding it, there's
30:05
Speaker 2: always a little bit of truth where this whole thing,
30:08
Speaker 2: you know, starts from it and it launches off from now.
30:11
Speaker 2: I have had a lot of people, uh not only
30:14
Speaker 2: send me disinformation, and I think that there are indeed
30:17
Speaker 2: one thousand percent actual disinformation agents out there on the internet.
30:21
Speaker 2: Person Clearly, there are no doubt. But like with Epstein stuff,
30:25
Speaker 2: I covered any and every file that I could at
30:27
Speaker 2: the very beginning when all these releases came out, and
30:30
Speaker 2: I had tons of millions of people that were getting
30:32
Speaker 2: this information from me, and I was providing every single document,
30:35
Speaker 2: every source that I could possibly find. And it's so
30:39
Speaker 2: funny to me because about a month in I all
30:43
Speaker 2: of a sudden, in the same week, I had like
30:44
Speaker 2: four or five different people randomly take my video and say, Oh,
30:48
Speaker 2: this guy's lying to you. He is saying this document
30:51
Speaker 2: was this, And for example, this one guy's video got
30:54
Speaker 2: like eight hundred thousand views, but he was lying in
30:57
Speaker 2: his video about what I said. He just took a
30:59
Speaker 2: screenshot of me and said that I said this, but
31:01
Speaker 2: I was really saying this.
31:04
Speaker 1: He was a cloud goblin. He was cloud grabbing because
31:06
Speaker 1: of your following and because of you your truth. But
31:09
Speaker 1: see that's the problem. A guy like that will build
31:11
Speaker 1: a following. And I don't know how you feel about
31:13
Speaker 1: Candice Owans. I'll say, from my perspective, a lot of
31:15
Speaker 1: what she said is BS. A lot of what she
31:17
Speaker 1: says is tomorrow, I'm really going to reveal it. And
31:20
Speaker 1: she gets three million views on every live stream that
31:22
Speaker 1: she does. People are making fifteen and sixty thousand dollars
31:25
Speaker 1: a day sometimes by doing that, so there's a great
31:28
Speaker 1: incentive to lie. I love that you're not lying. I
31:30
Speaker 1: love that you are in fact giving the evidence, giving
31:33
Speaker 1: the links, showing the proof, because that's going to make
31:35
Speaker 1: your channel explode even and soar higher than these other
31:39
Speaker 1: channels that aren't telling the truth. I love that you
31:40
Speaker 1: do it that way. Listen, Colin, I could talk to
31:42
Speaker 1: you for like seven hours, but I know that you're busy.
31:44
Speaker 1: I know you just jumped in the chair getting back
31:46
Speaker 1: from doing some work for the channel. So we've got
31:49
Speaker 1: Paranormal files. You also have the conspiracy files. That's it, okay,
31:53
Speaker 1: and then Murder in America is the podcast. Everybody should
31:56
Speaker 1: go and check out everything that you do. I really
31:58
Speaker 1: appreciate you coming on. My daughter is one of your
32:00
Speaker 1: biggest fans. I've become a very quick fan, and I'm
32:02
Speaker 1: going to be binging this weekend most of what you
32:04
Speaker 1: put out there. Let me leave you with this with
32:06
Speaker 1: this one question. What is the number one video that's
32:08
Speaker 1: gotten the top views on your channel that we should
32:11
Speaker 1: maybe go and check out why they did so great?
32:13
Speaker 1: And maybe it'll be an introduction to what it is
32:15
Speaker 1: that you do. Is there one that's gone just nuts?
32:18
Speaker 2: There's yeah, a couple. There's three that I would recommend.
32:22
Speaker 2: The first is my top video, which is an interview
32:25
Speaker 2: I did with a guy about the Superstition Mountains in Arizona.
32:27
Speaker 2: It's absolutely so compelling. Second would be a murder house
32:33
Speaker 2: investigation that we did two years ago where we actually
32:36
Speaker 2: brought in luminol and sprayed the house and we were
32:38
Speaker 2: able to find all the bloodstains from this old murder
32:41
Speaker 2: when we're investigating the house. It is a crazy video.
32:45
Speaker 2: But my personal favorite video that I've ever done is
32:48
Speaker 2: called Pedophile Island, and it is a trip that we
32:52
Speaker 2: took to the Epstein Island that existed before Epstein in Michigan,
32:56
Speaker 2: in Lake Michigan, Oh Wow. And it's that story that's
32:59
Speaker 2: actually the base for the documentary series that now I've
33:02
Speaker 2: spent the last two years investigating, traveling from Germany to
33:05
Speaker 2: India hunting down perpetrators from this story that escape justice.
33:09
Speaker 2: So if there's one documentary that I think people should watch,
33:13
Speaker 2: it is Pedophile Island because it is just the most
33:16
Speaker 2: mind blowing stuff you'll ever you'll see. It still blows
33:18
Speaker 2: my mind and I've I've been working with survivors of
33:21
Speaker 2: this network for the last few years.
33:23
Speaker 1: I love I listen. I love the work that you do.
33:25
Speaker 1: I'm gonna go. I'm gonna go get myself familiar with
33:26
Speaker 1: everything that you've done. I will check those out first.
33:29
Speaker 1: Hopefully everybody watching and listen will do the same. The
33:31
Speaker 1: Paranormal Files, the Conspiracy Files, Murder in America. I heard
33:34
Speaker 1: his name is Colin Brown, and man, I hope he
33:36
Speaker 1: can do this again. Thanks for finding me some time today.
33:38
Speaker 1: I appreciate it.
33:39
Speaker 2: I'll come back on whenever. Man, I mean, the Epstein
33:42
Speaker 2: rabbit hole is unending. It'sat we can talk about this
33:45
Speaker 2: for weeks at this point.
33:47
Speaker 1: One thousand percent. Colin, Thanks civilian brother. I appreciate you.
33:50
Speaker 1: That's going to do it for unshaking and unafraid with
33:51
Speaker 1: Joe Pegs this time. Make sure you subscribe. Another one
33:54
Speaker 1: to drop very soon.