Latest / The SME Stream / Ben Brinkerhoff: When to take a look at your KiwiSaver

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Ben Brinkerhoff: When to take a look at your KiwiSaver · The SME Stream

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: Good girl. But it don't too bacause you know it
• 0:03
  Speaker 1: don't matter anyway, Sam and money won't get your too far,
• 0:08
  Speaker 1: get too far.
• 0:24
  Speaker 2: To take? What is so far?
• 0:28
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• 0:30
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• 1:28
  Speaker 2: but right now it's time for smart money. And my
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  Speaker 2: guest is he's head of advice at Concilium. You can
• 1:34
  Speaker 2: go and check out their their worker anytime Concilium dot
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  Speaker 2: co dot nz or the Kei We Save the Funders
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  Speaker 2: kiwi rap as in't wrapping a present dot co dot nz.
• 1:44
  Speaker 2: And he is Ben Brinkerhoff, gid a Ben. How are
• 1:47
  Speaker 2: you going good? Dem? How are you not too bad?
• 1:49
  Speaker 2: Nice to thank you for coming into the studio. Good
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  Speaker 2: to see you.
• 1:52
  Speaker 1: It's good to be here.
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  Speaker 2: What's been keeping you out of mischief lately in the
• 1:55
  Speaker 2: in the money scene? I mean, but it's a strange
• 1:59
  Speaker 2: way to put a question. It sort of is.
• 2:01
  Speaker 1: I think the best way to stay out of trouble
• 2:02
  Speaker 1: is to read the newspaper as little as possible, Right, Yeah.
• 2:06
  Speaker 2: I might just get you to just pull your microphone
• 2:08
  Speaker 2: just a little closer there, So there we go, There
• 2:10
  Speaker 2: we go. We want to talk about key we saver
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  Speaker 2: a bit because for many people when it comes to
• 2:15
  Speaker 2: the financial investment, it's sort of a default thing where
• 2:19
  Speaker 2: people they're investing in all sorts of things without knowing
• 2:22
  Speaker 2: it and people, I mean, yeah, so if you've got look,
• 2:27
  Speaker 2: we're going to talk about key we saver from a
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  Speaker 2: whole bunch of angles as to how often you should
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  Speaker 2: monitor the performance of your key we save it you
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  Speaker 2: just put it away and forget it does past performance?
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  Speaker 2: For instance, you look at someone and go, man, they
• 2:38
  Speaker 2: have an amazing key we save a fund. Should I
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  Speaker 2: stick my money with them? All those sorts of things
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  Speaker 2: key we saver actually ben how often do you think
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  Speaker 2: people actually look at the performance of their key we
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  Speaker 2: save or is it best? Is it best just to
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  Speaker 2: sort of put it in the bottom drawer and maybe
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  Speaker 2: look at it every six months or so.
• 2:57
  Speaker 1: That's a question with a couple of wars, But let
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  Speaker 1: me just peel back a couple.
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  Speaker 2: Yeah.
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  Speaker 1: There's an awesome paper written in the past called myopic
• 3:06
  Speaker 1: lossid version, and myopic just means short.
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  Speaker 2: I'm gonna write that down myopic myopic, that's short loss
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  Speaker 2: a version, right, okay.
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  Speaker 1: And the premise of this paper was that basically people's
• 3:22
  Speaker 1: point of view is very short sighted. That's what myopic
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  Speaker 1: means short sighted, and the more short sighted your view
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  Speaker 1: of your performance is, the more likely you are to
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  Speaker 1: make bad decisions. And so I wrote a paper once
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  Speaker 1: called It's Okay to Look Away, Yeah, And I wrote
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  Speaker 1: it during the COVID time period where where perform was
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  Speaker 1: pretty challenging. And the other waying premise was don't look
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  Speaker 1: at your account balance. You want to set things up
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  Speaker 1: to be done correctly. You should maybe review it once
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  Speaker 1: a year, and I think you should view with an
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  Speaker 1: advisor and determine if you're on track to achieve your
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  Speaker 1: goals or if you're change if your strategy needs to change.
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  Speaker 1: All that's good stuff, right, But looking at your keys
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  Speaker 1: ever balance regularly is more likely to weed you to
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  Speaker 1: make a mistake.
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  Speaker 2: Well, it's like if you're buying and selling shares and
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  Speaker 2: it was your hobby to do your own make your
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  Speaker 2: own choices, probably following them every day wouldn't necessarily lead
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  Speaker 2: you to the right decisions. Of course, then again, if
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  Speaker 2: they suddenly went up in value a lot, it would
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  Speaker 2: have been useful to follow them. But that's not the
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  Speaker 2: game of chase.
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  Speaker 1: The number one person that looks at car ads car sellers,
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  Speaker 1: people that just bought a car or really, yeah, so
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  Speaker 1: you just buy a car and you're looking at ads,
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  Speaker 1: why just to make sure you've got a good deal.
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  Speaker 1: I think when people make when they change their investments around,
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  Speaker 1: they're going to look at them a lot, decide to
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  Speaker 1: make a good choice and make a bad choice. I
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  Speaker 1: think it leads to a lot of people being unsettled overall.
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  Speaker 1: I don't think looking at your KeyServer balance that often,
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  Speaker 1: no idea.
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  Speaker 2: Are there actually investments where you it does if you
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  Speaker 2: are taking hands on approach, are there investments where it
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  Speaker 2: does pay too keep a regular eye on them? Because
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  Speaker 2: of course, key that's the thing with key we Saver
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  Speaker 2: people aren't key We Saber managers because they're idiots. They
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  Speaker 2: are on the job for you all the time. But
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  Speaker 2: whereas I guess, if you are managing your own personal,
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  Speaker 2: individualized investments, then obviously you're you're going to keep an
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  Speaker 2: eye on that. For instance, if you're you're choosing your
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  Speaker 2: own stocks in the share market, you've got ten companies
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  Speaker 2: that you've invested in, you probably will monitor their performance
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  Speaker 2: more regularly. But that's a completely different game, isn't It's a.
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  Speaker 1: Completely different game. And by the way, don't don't don't
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  Speaker 1: do that. Don't don't that your key we saver balance
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  Speaker 1: on ten stocks.
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  Speaker 2: I No, I wasn't saying that. I was just talking
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  Speaker 2: about different the reasons you might keep an eye on.
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  Speaker 1: Your totally if you're in and yet and they're in
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  Speaker 1: that kind of situation and you are basically the manager
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  Speaker 1: of your own investments, Yeah, then maybe maybe it makes sense,
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  Speaker 1: you know, But I just suggest that that this is
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  Speaker 1: key Saver is one area where you we're diversification and
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  Speaker 1: and maybe taking a different which are.
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  Speaker 2: You've raised a couple of things there which I might
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  Speaker 2: I wouldn't mind digging into, because how many people do
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  Speaker 2: you think actually have a goal with the KEI we
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  Speaker 2: save it? And the reason I asked that is because
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  Speaker 2: we generally have If you are an employee, your employer
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  Speaker 2: may put in I'm not sure what the rules are
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  Speaker 2: because I'm self employed, which is, let's not dig into that,
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  Speaker 2: but say three percent or something or two or three percent.
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  Speaker 2: And I wonder if people just sort of go, well,
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  Speaker 2: this is what key we Saver does, and I've got
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  Speaker 2: this amount, but they don't actually ever stop to think
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  Speaker 2: what the goal is. They just know that there's money
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  Speaker 2: going in that Oh.
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  Speaker 1: You've hit I don't know if you if you thought
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  Speaker 1: about that too much ahead of time, But you've actually
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  Speaker 1: completely hit on the issue is that with kisaver, you
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  Speaker 1: want to have, you want to be intentional. What do
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  Speaker 1: you actually want to achieve? And you think about you
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  Speaker 1: do not have a huge number of choices to make
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  Speaker 1: in KYP saver, but boy that it can be dramatic
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  Speaker 1: the impact of the choices that you make over maybe
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  Speaker 1: a twenty thirty maybe a forty year time arise. If
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  Speaker 1: you start when you're twenty five, you cash out when
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  Speaker 1: you're sixty five, that is a long time for those
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  Speaker 1: choices to compound. And you I'm American, right, so, for
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  Speaker 1: for better or for worse, I tend to be overly
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  Speaker 1: friendly with people. And I'm on I'm on the airplane
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  Speaker 1: and I'm asking I ask people what they're doing in
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  Speaker 1: their kiwisaver, and they.
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  Speaker 2: Are you California? I am California because you can check out,
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  Speaker 2: but you can never leave.
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  Speaker 1: Exactly. Let's not get into the deep spiritual sense that.
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  Speaker 2: That's on California. Yeah, yeah, yeah, Okay, anyway, carry on.
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  Speaker 1: Well, and you talk to people about Kivsaver and you say, well,
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  Speaker 1: based on what you want to spend in your future,
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  Speaker 1: what amount of what you need. Is kivsaver gonna cover
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  Speaker 1: you know? Is it gonna cover forty percent of what
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  Speaker 1: you need? Is it gonna cover sixty percent of what
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  Speaker 1: you need? Is it going to cover everything that you need?
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  Speaker 1: And what's your plan to fund the difference?
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  Speaker 2: I reckon people find that and I'm probably speaking personally
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  Speaker 2: as well, there's a part of I think there's a
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  Speaker 2: huge amount of I'm not sure if the word is
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  Speaker 2: procrastination or avoidance, because people don't want to know what
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  Speaker 2: that means when they set their goal. This is what
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  Speaker 2: I want. It's like, well, this is how far away
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  Speaker 2: from that you are? How often do people avoid it?
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  Speaker 2: Because they just you know, we're living and high we've
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  Speaker 2: been living in under high inflation. The costs of buying
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  Speaker 2: a house is people who are pessimistic about a bunch
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  Speaker 2: of things. I reckon a lot of people put that
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  Speaker 2: stuff in the bottom drawn. That's why they just leave
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  Speaker 2: it to the employer contribution and whatever they have to
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  Speaker 2: stick in and go to sleep. You know that's right,
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  Speaker 2: that's right.
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  Speaker 1: Well, listen, you know, if you don't have a plan,
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  Speaker 1: you'll get somewhere, it just may not be where you intended, right,
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  Speaker 1: So it's.
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  Speaker 2: Like that sounds like a lyric from that song again,
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  Speaker 2: but it's probably not away.
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  Speaker 1: As well as that's an acceptable outcome that you you
• 9:01
  Speaker 1: end up where you ended up, and perhaps that's okay
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  Speaker 1: because you wouldn't have known the difference. But when you
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  Speaker 1: actually know where you want or you have an idea
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  Speaker 1: of what you want. I talk to some people sometimes
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  Speaker 1: and they're just desperate because they think I'm not going
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  Speaker 1: to be successful. I've I've waited too long. It's it's
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  Speaker 1: passed me by. But but you can actually sit down
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  Speaker 1: and still form a strategy, and people can go from
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  Speaker 1: maybe hopeless to go like, do you know this might
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  Speaker 1: actually work out?
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  Speaker 2: And I says something to be said for even if
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  Speaker 2: you know maybe it's not the answer you want, but
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  Speaker 2: the fact of taking control of your finances, it's actually
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  Speaker 2: in its own right. No matter how good or bad
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  Speaker 2: the outcome is, there's something about it that is actually
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  Speaker 2: liberating because you're finally in control and you know what
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  Speaker 2: you're doing absolutely you.
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  Speaker 1: Feel you feel like, well, this is where I'm at
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  Speaker 1: and I'm not in denial anymore, and I actually have
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  Speaker 1: a strategy to make the best out of the choices
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  Speaker 1: I have.
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  Speaker 2: Left. I should like to hear from you on this
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  Speaker 2: ill right one hundred and eight ten. Have you stopped
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  Speaker 2: to think of a particular financial goal or do you
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  Speaker 2: sort of just do different things, like I'll stick a
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  Speaker 2: bit of extra money into ki we Saber because I
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  Speaker 2: think I need to save some more, But you have
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  Speaker 2: no idea what that's going to amount to in the end.
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  Speaker 2: You just sort of think this is what I'm going
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  Speaker 2: to do because I think I should. It's but like
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  Speaker 2: people want to buy get into the residential property market,
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  Speaker 2: they may not have the actual financial goal in mind,
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  Speaker 2: but they'll go, well, apparently this is the place to be.
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  Speaker 2: So I'm going to stick some money in because I should.
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  Speaker 2: I'm actually quite cure. I'll be accused to know how
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  Speaker 2: many people actually have a goal.
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  Speaker 1: I ran the numbers recently, and well, if you took
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  Speaker 1: like a thirty year old, and I know that this
• 10:41
  Speaker 1: sounds like like a big salary, but I want to
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  Speaker 1: think about it from the sink of a professional, because
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  Speaker 1: that was the audience. I was thinking about a thirty
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  Speaker 1: old who was on one hundred thousand dollars a year
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  Speaker 1: and just put in three percent. Poor, you're putting three
• 10:52
  Speaker 1: percent and you know, saved to age sixty five, that
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  Speaker 1: person ended up someway. If you look at the math,
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  Speaker 1: like at three hundred fty thousand dollars balance, but at.
• 11:01
  Speaker 2: That same person's going to be better than that you
• 11:02
  Speaker 2: just said, actually I thought that was going to be.
• 11:04
  Speaker 2: I'm surprised at what it was that much.
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  Speaker 1: Three and fifty thousand dollars balance. It isn't as much
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  Speaker 1: as it should be because you know, that's that's three
• 11:11
  Speaker 1: and fifty thousand and thirty five years from now. What's
• 11:13
  Speaker 1: the purchasing power of that. It's not as great as
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  Speaker 1: it sounds. It's maybe half of what it is now.
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  Speaker 1: If that same person allocated into an aggressive portfolio and
• 11:25
  Speaker 1: put in six percent, they'd end up with three or
• 11:28
  Speaker 1: four times the balance. You know, that's that's a life
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  Speaker 1: altering difference to end up with three hundred thousand, to
• 11:36
  Speaker 1: end up with one point two million. And those two
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  Speaker 1: outcomes are both possible for the thirty year old who's
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  Speaker 1: who's a high earner based on just increasing their personal
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  Speaker 1: contributions and allocating more aggressively. Course, more aggressively you allocate.
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  Speaker 1: There's gonna be ups and downs. We can talk about
• 11:54
  Speaker 1: that later.
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  Speaker 2: If you will I'd love to talk about that. Actually,
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  Speaker 2: I would love to know what you want to of course, Ben,
• 11:59
  Speaker 2: he's got a few about investing. In fact, the last
• 12:02
  Speaker 2: time we on the show, there are a couple of
• 12:03
  Speaker 2: things that you said that really did stick with me.
• 12:05
  Speaker 2: So you did well there. But Brent Ben Brenkerhoff is
• 12:08
  Speaker 2: my guest. He's head of advice at Concilium. You can
• 12:11
  Speaker 2: check out Concilium dot code do in z. They also
• 12:14
  Speaker 2: have their own key we saber fund, which is key
• 12:16
  Speaker 2: we rap as in wrapping a present dot code dot nz.
• 12:19
  Speaker 2: We'd like to take your calls any questions. You've got
• 12:22
  Speaker 2: a back key, we save it and Ben and I
• 12:24
  Speaker 2: have lots to talk about, so we'll be back in
• 12:26
  Speaker 2: just a moment. It's so eighteen minutes past five News
• 12:30
  Speaker 2: Talks b and welcome back. My guest is Ben Bronkerhoff,
• 12:34
  Speaker 2: head of advice at Concilium. Actually I say Concilium, Ben,
• 12:37
  Speaker 2: just quickly, what does Concilium do? What's your bag? Baby?
• 12:41
  Speaker 1: So, Concilium's job is basically to help independent advisors stay independent.
• 12:45
  Speaker 1: So we provide a lot of the services, consulting, a
• 12:48
  Speaker 1: lot of the research and software required for an independent advisor.
• 12:53
  Speaker 1: Not out to sell someone's stuff.
• 12:55
  Speaker 2: So excellent. So we look, we've got a lot of
• 12:58
  Speaker 2: questions about kee we save it. But we went to
• 13:00
  Speaker 2: the break just with the questions around aggressive funds. And
• 13:03
  Speaker 2: I mean, there are generally three types of fund are
• 13:05
  Speaker 2: there is three or four? There's conservative, balanced, and aggressive
• 13:10
  Speaker 2: and maybe there's somewhere but.
• 13:11
  Speaker 1: There's there's some nuancewers there ten But but you can
• 13:14
  Speaker 1: you can stick with those if you want.
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  Speaker 2: Okay, so aggressive, you were talking about over a you know,
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  Speaker 2: say a thirty year old decides they're going to stick
• 13:21
  Speaker 2: a certain percentagen and the difference between being in a
• 13:24
  Speaker 2: more conservative fund to aggressive and the potential money that
• 13:27
  Speaker 2: they could end up having. I guess the first question
• 13:30
  Speaker 2: would be over what time period? So aggressive? Obviously you
• 13:35
  Speaker 2: are more susceptible to the rises and the falls in
• 13:37
  Speaker 2: the market. So is there a time period where the
• 13:41
  Speaker 2: risks of being in an aggressive fund are at at
• 13:44
  Speaker 2: a point where you know what, you're okay, if you're
• 13:46
  Speaker 2: in this for ten years, don't worry, or five years
• 13:49
  Speaker 2: or what's the sort of minimum time to be in
• 13:53
  Speaker 2: an aggressive fund?
• 13:53
  Speaker 1: Yeah? So not personally person people, can we say we
• 13:58
  Speaker 1: mess this up and I'll tell you how they mess
• 13:59
  Speaker 1: it up because they think I'm going to reach sixty
• 14:01
  Speaker 1: five and then oh, I got ten years until sixty five.
• 14:04
  Speaker 1: Therefore my time arison is ten years I'm fifty five. Well, no,
• 14:09
  Speaker 1: when do you want to spend the money? Your time
• 14:11
  Speaker 1: horizon is not based on when you reach the age
• 14:13
  Speaker 1: of the that you can pull the money out. Your
• 14:16
  Speaker 1: time horizon should be the time until you spend down
• 14:20
  Speaker 1: the money. And if you have fifteen years, then you
• 14:24
  Speaker 1: can then aggressive. An aggressive allocation is perfectly fine, but
• 14:27
  Speaker 1: it's actually more nuanced of that. And let me explain this.
• 14:31
  Speaker 1: When you are saving regularly right that means money's going
• 14:35
  Speaker 1: in every couple weeks from your paycheck, then being in
• 14:39
  Speaker 1: an aggressive allocation makes a lot of sense typically because
• 14:42
  Speaker 1: if prices are down and you're a buyer, that's good.
• 14:47
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 14:47
  Speaker 1: So I want to I want to give everyone in
• 14:49
  Speaker 1: the mind if they're in kiwisaver right now, they're regularly contributing,
• 14:52
  Speaker 1: they're a buyer. If there was a recession and prices
• 14:56
  Speaker 1: went down, they're not harmed because they're buying at low prices.
• 14:59
  Speaker 1: Now who they buy buying from, they're buying from people
• 15:01
  Speaker 1: that are selling. Yeah, Well, if if there's recession of
• 15:04
  Speaker 1: prices are down, you're a seller, that's a lot more harmful.
• 15:07
  Speaker 1: So when you're become when you transition from becoming a
• 15:11
  Speaker 1: buyer and you become a seller, you want to have
• 15:14
  Speaker 1: some securities in your portfolio that you can sell that
• 15:17
  Speaker 1: aren't very price sensitive, cash term deposits, fixed interest things
• 15:22
  Speaker 1: like this, so that when prices are down, you're not
• 15:25
  Speaker 1: forced to sell at will prices. But if you're buying them,
• 15:27
  Speaker 1: you're buying every couple of weeks and prices are low
• 15:30
  Speaker 1: because of recession, the stock markets are down, and that
• 15:33
  Speaker 1: doesn't harm you very much because you're buying at low prices.
• 15:36
  Speaker 2: So what I'm hearing there is if I was what
• 15:40
  Speaker 2: even my fund is, Let's let's pretend I'm in a
• 15:42
  Speaker 2: conservative fund and we should aggressive, we should talk. I'm
• 15:46
  Speaker 2: not in a concert fund. Don't worry. I'm in balance.
• 15:49
  Speaker 2: But I'm a bit passive on this because you know,
• 15:51
  Speaker 2: mortgages and all sorts of cost of exp so I
• 15:53
  Speaker 2: haven't been a great contributor. I'm I'm hearing that right now.
• 15:59
  Speaker 2: The you know GDP data and all that sort of
• 16:01
  Speaker 2: data data is we're not rocking and rolling as an
• 16:06
  Speaker 2: economy at the moment. So and tuitally, what I just
• 16:09
  Speaker 2: heard you say is probably now is a good time
• 16:11
  Speaker 2: to switch to an aggressive fund. Yeah, I believe I've
• 16:14
  Speaker 2: got enough time. What is it fifteen years?
• 16:17
  Speaker 1: You say, yeah, I kind of think about it. Fifteen
• 16:20
  Speaker 1: years if you're an aggressive portfolio, that would be ninety
• 16:23
  Speaker 1: percent or more in shares as opposed to cash and
• 16:25
  Speaker 1: bonds and things. Yeah, So if you have that kind
• 16:29
  Speaker 1: of time horizon. Now, I think the idea of when
• 16:32
  Speaker 1: you should be in and we should get out is
• 16:35
  Speaker 1: really tricky because the share market is a prediction. It's
• 16:38
  Speaker 1: a prediction of future prices, so it's really hard to
• 16:40
  Speaker 1: know when to get in and when to get out.
• 16:43
  Speaker 2: And you are reminding me of our earlier conversation as well,
• 16:46
  Speaker 2: because it was about people watching the shear market and
• 16:49
  Speaker 2: thinking when's a good time to buy, and you are like,
• 16:50
  Speaker 2: the market is always going to be ahead of you, buddy.
• 16:52
  Speaker 1: That's that's exactly right. So I don't think that that's
• 16:55
  Speaker 1: a good idea. But I do think that when people
• 16:57
  Speaker 1: are regularly buying, they're partiallylated from the effects of down markets,
• 17:02
  Speaker 1: because if the markets are down, then they can purchase
• 17:06
  Speaker 1: at low prices, and that helps to blunt the effect
• 17:09
  Speaker 1: of those low prices.
• 17:11
  Speaker 2: But if you're constantly buying, you're also buying when the
• 17:13
  Speaker 2: market is inflated as well.
• 17:14
  Speaker 1: That's right, but no one cares in the market's in flavor.
• 17:17
  Speaker 1: They're super happy because they look at their balance and
• 17:18
  Speaker 1: they're they're an aggressive allocation and it's it's done really well.
• 17:21
  Speaker 1: So psychologically they are they're they're happy. Now. The problem
• 17:27
  Speaker 1: with us that with the idea of when the market's high,
• 17:29
  Speaker 1: is the market, over any length of time generally trends
• 17:33
  Speaker 1: one direction, so it's always going to go get higher.
• 17:36
  Speaker 1: So the idea when it's high, if it's at an
• 17:38
  Speaker 1: all time high, does that mean it's going to fall. No,
• 17:40
  Speaker 1: that doesn't mean that at all. It's very hard to
• 17:42
  Speaker 1: know these things because the.
• 17:44
  Speaker 2: Issue that you've maybe touched on is it's one thing
• 17:50
  Speaker 2: to decide when you're going to get into an aggressive fund.
• 17:52
  Speaker 2: And I guess the answer is as early as possible. Yes,
• 17:55
  Speaker 2: that's the answer, as possible.
• 17:58
  Speaker 1: That is the answer, you know, But of course I listen.
• 18:01
  Speaker 1: This isn't advice and not if someone person, if someone
• 18:04
  Speaker 1: is has a has a frame of mind that when
• 18:08
  Speaker 1: markets are volatile, they really lose sleep and it's highly
• 18:11
  Speaker 1: uncomfortable for them. Then they should understand that that they
• 18:15
  Speaker 1: can go more conservative to balance or conservative, but the
• 18:19
  Speaker 1: implication of is that they will likely, over a long
• 18:22
  Speaker 1: period of time, end up with less money. So here's
• 18:24
  Speaker 1: the tension. What is risk? Is risk the fear or
• 18:30
  Speaker 1: the risk of prices going up and down a little
• 18:33
  Speaker 1: bit or even a lot over a short term time period.
• 18:36
  Speaker 1: Or is risk that I might not have as much
• 18:38
  Speaker 1: money as I want when I want to spend it.
• 18:40
  Speaker 2: You know that that is what is risk? Well, actually
• 18:43
  Speaker 2: that is also inadvertently. There's another question that comes out
• 18:47
  Speaker 2: of that is we all understand risk in our own
• 18:56
  Speaker 2: lay person sort of way, like I might hear aggressive
• 19:00
  Speaker 2: fund is more risky. But do I really have any
• 19:03
  Speaker 2: idea what the actual risk is and what that means
• 19:07
  Speaker 2: because we all just have our own subjective because some
• 19:10
  Speaker 2: of us I've got I mean, I've got a maide
• 19:11
  Speaker 2: of mine who's I produce concerts from time to time
• 19:14
  Speaker 2: and I consider that pretty risky mine who does it
• 19:18
  Speaker 2: all the time, and he will have moments where he thinks,
• 19:20
  Speaker 2: oh that's not very risky. That would terrify someone else,
• 19:24
  Speaker 2: so his perception of risk is completely different. So how
• 19:28
  Speaker 2: can we ever, as key we savor investors, which most
• 19:32
  Speaker 2: of it, many of us are, How can we really
• 19:34
  Speaker 2: understand what the risk is? Because it's almost some people
• 19:38
  Speaker 2: might think, okay, you've got conservative. Let's just pretend there's
• 19:41
  Speaker 2: three we've got conservative, balanced and aggressive and aggressive. His
• 19:44
  Speaker 2: picture is more risky, and some people will see that
• 19:47
  Speaker 2: as being that's a bit more risky, but what the
• 19:49
  Speaker 2: hell other people be thinking it's a lot more risky.
• 19:52
  Speaker 2: There's no way. So how do we understand what risk
• 19:55
  Speaker 2: is and key we savor?
• 19:56
  Speaker 1: Well, the number one thing I think you should do
• 19:59
  Speaker 1: is get an advisor, all right, because ultimately, what you're
• 20:05
  Speaker 1: trying to solve, the question you're trying to ask is
• 20:08
  Speaker 1: is the two types of risk I'm trying to trade
• 20:10
  Speaker 1: off is the risk of price movements to go up
• 20:13
  Speaker 1: and down, and that makes me uncomfortable. So when markets
• 20:16
  Speaker 1: go down, how much is my portfolio likely to go down?
• 20:19
  Speaker 1: Or could it go down? But the other risk that
• 20:22
  Speaker 1: no one ever talks about, or pays attention to, or
• 20:24
  Speaker 1: knows intuitively is what's the risk that I won't be
• 20:28
  Speaker 1: able to spend what I want to spend, when I
• 20:30
  Speaker 1: want to spend it, and what's the risk that's actually
• 20:34
  Speaker 1: the more salient risk of the two price movements. You know,
• 20:37
  Speaker 1: does anyone care now what price movements were ten or
• 20:39
  Speaker 1: twenty years ago, Yet your allocation to growth stocks ten
• 20:43
  Speaker 1: or twenty years ago would have a big impact on
• 20:45
  Speaker 1: how much money you have available today to spend if
• 20:48
  Speaker 1: you want to start spending today.
• 20:50
  Speaker 2: Okay, I will drill into one more question. I'm dying
• 20:53
  Speaker 2: to ask that about that, even though you've sort of
• 20:55
  Speaker 2: probably answered my question. If you know how with statistics,
• 20:58
  Speaker 2: there's a bill curve and at the fringes, you know,
• 21:03
  Speaker 2: the majority of action takes place in the middle, sort
• 21:06
  Speaker 2: of thirty forty percent or whatever. When it comes to
• 21:09
  Speaker 2: key we savor portfolios, sure, any of the risks at
• 21:13
  Speaker 2: the extreme of the spectrum where they are either extremely
• 21:16
  Speaker 2: conservative or extremely risky, or are they all sort of
• 21:20
  Speaker 2: more within a narrower band. If you're talking about conservative,
• 21:24
  Speaker 2: balanced growth, and aggressive.
• 21:26
  Speaker 1: You absolutely can take a keV server allocation that can
• 21:31
  Speaker 1: be at the ends of those those you can be
• 21:35
  Speaker 1: virtually all in cash or you can be virtually all
• 21:38
  Speaker 1: in just a few shares, depending on the keV server
• 21:40
  Speaker 1: that you're thinking about. So yeah, there's a wide spectrum.
• 21:44
  Speaker 1: But the question you should be asking yourself is does
• 21:47
  Speaker 1: the allocation I'm in is it likely to achieve what
• 21:52
  Speaker 1: I want?
• 21:53
  Speaker 2: And how do you know?
• 21:54
  Speaker 1: I think for most people they need to get advice.
• 21:57
  Speaker 1: But if you don't want to get advice, you certainly
• 21:59
  Speaker 1: have fail yourself with the tools on sordid dot co,
• 22:02
  Speaker 1: dot nz and and take and take those sorts of
• 22:06
  Speaker 1: tools available to you. But like on our website kivi RAP,
• 22:10
  Speaker 1: we have a list of advisors you can go to.
• 22:11
  Speaker 1: All these people give advice on retirement portfolios and it's
• 22:14
  Speaker 1: good and those are the kind of people you might
• 22:17
  Speaker 1: How does figure out what you want? Most people don't
• 22:19
  Speaker 1: even know what they want tom So it's like the
• 22:21
  Speaker 1: question is very difficult to answer. They say, well, well
• 22:24
  Speaker 1: I have enough? Well I don't even know what I need.
• 22:27
  Speaker 1: I don't I mean, how do I how do I
• 22:28
  Speaker 1: even get to think about the question if I if
• 22:31
  Speaker 1: I have enough or of mine I'm going to be
• 22:33
  Speaker 1: funded through kiwisaver. There's so many questions you need to
• 22:36
  Speaker 1: answer even before that questions relevant how does it.
• 22:39
  Speaker 2: Go with actually I've just gone on to your the
• 22:41
  Speaker 2: Kiwi rap site that you guys have for your kiwisaver,
• 22:45
  Speaker 2: and it says find an advisor. Yeah, and my head's
• 22:48
  Speaker 2: spinning because there's a lot on there. So you know,
• 22:51
  Speaker 2: how do you how do you make a choice there?
• 22:53
  Speaker 2: And and how does it work with the financial advisor?
• 22:55
  Speaker 2: Because I have had people who are personal personal financial
• 23:00
  Speaker 2: advisors who say, to be honest, it's expensive sometimes if
• 23:04
  Speaker 2: you want to get personalized financial advice, how does it work?
• 23:08
  Speaker 1: Well, I have a lot to say about that.
• 23:11
  Speaker 2: Well that's good because we here to talk.
• 23:13
  Speaker 1: So see. You know, advice is not a commodity. It
• 23:18
  Speaker 1: varies widely in quality, and I understand how intimidating that is,
• 23:22
  Speaker 1: you know, so you you don't how do I know
• 23:24
  Speaker 1: if I'm getting really really good advice? And how do
• 23:29
  Speaker 1: I know if maybe I should switch an advisor. I
• 23:31
  Speaker 1: think one of the first things you want to think
• 23:33
  Speaker 1: about in terms of the quality advisor that you're with
• 23:36
  Speaker 1: is whether they're independent. And what I mean by that
• 23:39
  Speaker 1: is do they have the ability to recommend to you
• 23:43
  Speaker 1: whatever they think is in your interests or are they
• 23:46
  Speaker 1: essentially working for a provider. They're working for a company
• 23:49
  Speaker 1: that sells something, and no matter what your problem is,
• 23:53
  Speaker 1: the answer is always going to be by this thing.
• 23:56
  Speaker 1: Most kiwis are not with an advisor that has the
• 23:59
  Speaker 1: free them to give them the best choice possible. Most
• 24:03
  Speaker 1: kibis are with an advisor that maybe working at a
• 24:06
  Speaker 1: financial institution and they'll sell you that institution's thing. So
• 24:11
  Speaker 1: that is now that's not exclusive. There's some people that
• 24:14
  Speaker 1: they are in that space that do it really well.
• 24:16
  Speaker 1: But that is one thing to pay attention to.
• 24:19
  Speaker 2: H Okay, so how do you know that? Do you
• 24:22
  Speaker 2: just say, do you have the questions you should ask
• 24:25
  Speaker 2: a financial advisor.
• 24:26
  Speaker 1: So I was recently, I advisors send me, you know,
• 24:31
  Speaker 1: a blacked out version of someone's statement where all the
• 24:33
  Speaker 1: personal informations blacked out, but I can see what they're
• 24:35
  Speaker 1: invested in. This person has five million dollars invested, and
• 24:39
  Speaker 1: every single thing they're invested in began with three letters
• 24:43
  Speaker 1: because the three letters were the institution they were they
• 24:46
  Speaker 1: had been working with. Yeah, so basically that institution had
• 24:50
  Speaker 1: put them in their own solutions, their own products. If
• 24:52
  Speaker 1: you're in that size situation, I would just suggest to
• 24:55
  Speaker 1: you that oftentimes there's better advice available to you.
• 25:00
  Speaker 2: The thing see I'm instantly just thinking, Okay, how and
• 25:04
  Speaker 2: where do I go? I mean, I would find that
• 25:06
  Speaker 2: bewildering because yea, ideally what we all want is some
• 25:12
  Speaker 2: magic guru mentor and I call them up and say, look,
• 25:15
  Speaker 2: who's a good financial advisor? When they say this person
• 25:18
  Speaker 2: is great because they're not tight and they give you
• 25:20
  Speaker 2: their answer. But you have to do It's not that straightforward.
• 25:23
  Speaker 2: Not many people have a financial work question.
• 25:25
  Speaker 1: You're asking is a great one. How do I find
• 25:28
  Speaker 1: an advisor? How do I find an advisor? And you
• 25:31
  Speaker 1: know what, there isn't a great answer to that situation.
• 25:34
  Speaker 1: I mean, the best I can give you is look
• 25:36
  Speaker 1: at our website right there, because all those people are
• 25:38
  Speaker 1: great advisors, and so that is a great place to
• 25:42
  Speaker 1: choose from. And they do talk about what location that
• 25:45
  Speaker 1: they operate in, so you can always look at your
• 25:49
  Speaker 1: geography as a way.
• 25:50
  Speaker 2: Oh, in terms of people want to have face to
• 25:52
  Speaker 2: face sort of advice, absolutely, yeah, it's I'm going to
• 25:56
  Speaker 2: have a look at people QI wrap Dot, Curtin and
• 25:58
  Speaker 2: Z because any thing where you start making some exploration
• 26:02
  Speaker 2: on this stuff is probably that step in the right direction.
• 26:04
  Speaker 2: But is it important the individuals who are within a
• 26:07
  Speaker 2: company as well, because it's a bit like any organization.
• 26:10
  Speaker 2: There'll be people who are absolutely rocking and rolling at
• 26:12
  Speaker 2: what they do and the people who are maybe not
• 26:15
  Speaker 2: so good. So an organization will is it about particular
• 26:19
  Speaker 2: individuals or is it about the organization.
• 26:22
  Speaker 1: Let me give you some intuition on this. If you
• 26:25
  Speaker 1: go in and talk to an advisor and they spend
• 26:27
  Speaker 1: a lot of time telling you about how they're their
• 26:29
  Speaker 1: their investments that they use are amazing, and they spend
• 26:32
  Speaker 1: a lot of time convincing you that they know how
• 26:34
  Speaker 1: to pick the best investments, be very concerned.
• 26:36
  Speaker 2: Because that sounds like a sale.
• 26:38
  Speaker 1: Very concerned. If you talk to an advisor and they
• 26:40
  Speaker 1: spend a lot of time trying to understand you, what
• 26:44
  Speaker 1: what are your what are your what are the things
• 26:46
  Speaker 1: that that you're passionate? What are the things that you love?
• 26:48
  Speaker 1: How do you want to spend your time? How do
• 26:51
  Speaker 1: you want to allocate your resources? Then they can help
• 26:54
  Speaker 1: you devise a strategy, a financial strategy to achieve those things. So,
• 26:59
  Speaker 1: so just pay attention this one thing. How often does
• 27:02
  Speaker 1: the conversation go back to you and what you want
• 27:06
  Speaker 1: and what matters to you and the financial resources you
• 27:09
  Speaker 1: have to build that life. And how often instead does
• 27:12
  Speaker 1: your your advisor spend talking about how wonderful their investment
• 27:16
  Speaker 1: solutions are. I think that is a good sign. If
• 27:20
  Speaker 1: you're with a good advisor, the advice should be focused
• 27:22
  Speaker 1: on you and your needs.
• 27:23
  Speaker 2: So if they're trying to sell you something first time,
• 27:26
  Speaker 2: first sign of trouble.
• 27:28
  Speaker 1: That is a that is a sign of that is
• 27:29
  Speaker 1: a sign of trouble.
• 27:30
  Speaker 2: Yeah, look, we're gonna be back in just a moment.
• 27:33
  Speaker 2: If you got any questions for being Ben brinker Off
• 27:34
  Speaker 2: a hit of a device, it's going to sell him
• 27:36
  Speaker 2: some great information and conversation. We're going to continue it
• 27:40
  Speaker 2: in just a moment. It is twenty three minutes to
• 27:43
  Speaker 2: six news talks. He'd be ever clone.
• 27:49
  Speaker 1: Let's see what's name name and.
• 27:52
  Speaker 3: Shine the pens.
• 28:04
  Speaker 2: A billion there, and there's the theme for the show
• 28:10
  Speaker 2: when I'm a billionaire. I'm not sure we're going to
• 28:12
  Speaker 2: return into billionaires. It's a lot of money. By the way,
• 28:14
  Speaker 2: when you think I'd like to be a billionaire, it's like,
• 28:16
  Speaker 2: would you really ten million be enough? I wonder how
• 28:18
  Speaker 2: much money would be enough? That will save that for
• 28:20
  Speaker 2: another show. How much money would be enough for you?
• 28:23
  Speaker 2: Tire maker. Note of that, I'm Tim Beverages, a smart money.
• 28:25
  Speaker 2: We've got Ben Brinkoff, head of advice at Concilium in
• 28:28
  Speaker 2: the in the studio with us. I've got a few
• 28:30
  Speaker 2: texts for you, Ben. It if I take out key
• 28:34
  Speaker 2: WE saver in a lump summit retirement, does it get
• 28:37
  Speaker 2: taxed again? If it does, at what rate would it
• 28:40
  Speaker 2: be better to stop putting in and put in savings
• 28:42
  Speaker 2: account at some point to get some interest instead of
• 28:44
  Speaker 2: penalty of tax taken off again? I think they mean
• 28:47
  Speaker 2: does it keep getting taxed on the interest or something
• 28:49
  Speaker 2: once it's I don't know what.
• 28:50
  Speaker 1: When you're withdraw key WE server, it's not taxed. No,
• 28:52
  Speaker 1: it's taxed on the way through.
• 28:54
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 28:54
  Speaker 1: So whatever money you see in your kivserver account at
• 28:57
  Speaker 1: sixty five, you pull that money out those no tax de.
• 29:00
  Speaker 2: Yeah, but if you invest it in a savings account,
• 29:03
  Speaker 2: then you will get taxed on the interest. Correct.
• 29:05
  Speaker 1: Yeah, you're gonna get You're gonna get taxed on the
• 29:07
  Speaker 1: interest in in either account. So it's not that's not
• 29:10
  Speaker 1: gonna yeah effecting.
• 29:12
  Speaker 2: No lump sums to worry about the account, And I
• 29:14
  Speaker 2: think is the moral of the story with the American
• 29:18
  Speaker 2: Fed cutting the interest right, I was on the conservative
• 29:21
  Speaker 2: and my key we saver. I'm now considering going to
• 29:23
  Speaker 2: balance rather because people will now be investing in stocks
• 29:25
  Speaker 2: rather than bonds. Is that a good idea from Sue?
• 29:29
  Speaker 2: I think the way Sue's expressed herself is the way
• 29:31
  Speaker 2: a lot of people just think broadly. It's just like
• 29:33
  Speaker 2: I reckon, this is down self shoved in here and
• 29:36
  Speaker 2: away we go. Not specific financial advice for you, Sue,
• 29:40
  Speaker 2: but Ben's comments.
• 29:42
  Speaker 1: Yes, Sue. So you know, when I think about a
• 29:45
  Speaker 1: situation like this, I don't make any changes at all
• 29:48
  Speaker 1: based on things like what the fad does. And I'll
• 29:50
  Speaker 1: tell you why, what do I know about what the
• 29:54
  Speaker 1: fad just did that markets haven't already praised? Yeah, markets
• 29:57
  Speaker 1: have already praised that information. In in order to actually
• 30:00
  Speaker 1: get an advantage on the markets, you got to know
• 30:02
  Speaker 1: something the market doesn't know. And what the market knows
• 30:04
  Speaker 1: more than anything is what the Fed does. They that
• 30:08
  Speaker 1: is that information is already in prices. So there's not
• 30:10
  Speaker 1: an advantage or disadvantage, but there is an advantage suit
• 30:13
  Speaker 1: of this. If you go to balance, you'll have more
• 30:16
  Speaker 1: growth assets in your portfolio. If you hold that for
• 30:18
  Speaker 1: a long enough time that is very likely, although not guaranteed,
• 30:22
  Speaker 1: to leave you with more money at cash in hand
• 30:24
  Speaker 1: in retirement. That is something you can you can count on.
• 30:30
  Speaker 1: But trying to outwit the market in terms of what
• 30:33
  Speaker 1: they've done with interest rate movements is something that it's
• 30:37
  Speaker 1: very hot. You can't have an informational advantage there.
• 30:39
  Speaker 2: Did the markets know that the feed was going to
• 30:42
  Speaker 2: be dropped or was it by point fifty bases points
• 30:45
  Speaker 2: or whatever? Did they know that or not?
• 30:47
  Speaker 1: What the market will do is that people have differing opinions.
• 30:50
  Speaker 1: That's why there's a buyer and seller right right.
• 30:54
  Speaker 2: It's so blending obvious, but it's good to remember.
• 30:57
  Speaker 1: So what happened is it will it will factor in
• 31:00
  Speaker 1: a rate cut of some variety, and then when the
• 31:03
  Speaker 1: and when the news becomes certain, then they'll have maybe
• 31:06
  Speaker 1: a small correction right in that moment. But generally people
• 31:10
  Speaker 1: have already anticipated these things before they happen.
• 31:12
  Speaker 2: When those announcements are made, are they people sitting at
• 31:15
  Speaker 2: computers ready to ahead a button?
• 31:18
  Speaker 1: Just like I mean, the fact that you say there's
• 31:19
  Speaker 1: a person hitting a button is is like it's it's
• 31:23
  Speaker 1: it's it is an algorithm, my friend. Right, So for
• 31:27
  Speaker 1: the for the most part, people have already factored these
• 31:30
  Speaker 1: things in. It's already priced in. That's a very hard
• 31:33
  Speaker 1: thing to understand. And I understand, I get why that's
• 31:36
  Speaker 1: not intuitive.
• 31:39
  Speaker 2: Actually it's funny. I think the moral of the story
• 31:42
  Speaker 2: that you comes from last time. It's a people uh
• 31:45
  Speaker 2: And when we discussed about making your own investment choices,
• 31:49
  Speaker 2: and the point you made quite well, it's stuck with
• 31:54
  Speaker 2: me was that unless you really really, uh really I
• 31:59
  Speaker 2: fay with stocks and you're passionate about a particular investments,
• 32:03
  Speaker 2: then you don't do your own investing because there's the
• 32:07
  Speaker 2: market is always going to be ahead of you, unless
• 32:09
  Speaker 2: you are just blind lucky like a lotto ticket. I
• 32:11
  Speaker 2: guess that's absolutely right.
• 32:13
  Speaker 1: So what am I? If I buy something, someone's got
• 32:15
  Speaker 1: to sell it. Why does that person want to sell it?
• 32:17
  Speaker 2: Yeah?
• 32:18
  Speaker 1: What do I know that the seller doesn't know? What
• 32:20
  Speaker 1: we both don't know is the news happening in the future, right,
• 32:23
  Speaker 1: And the news will happen. It will be good or
• 32:25
  Speaker 1: it will be bad, and one of us will end
• 32:28
  Speaker 1: up better off in the transaction. But if either of
• 32:30
  Speaker 1: us or both of us knew that information, you know,
• 32:33
  Speaker 1: we would factor that into prices and it would already
• 32:36
  Speaker 1: we wouldn't neither of us would win.
• 32:38
  Speaker 2: It does always fascinate me when things are really in
• 32:41
  Speaker 2: a boom and people are thinking, well, I'm definitely going
• 32:43
  Speaker 2: to sell because it's not going to go any further,
• 32:45
  Speaker 2: and the fact that there are still people to buy.
• 32:46
  Speaker 2: But that's the whole supply and demand and just that.
• 32:49
  Speaker 1: That's what makes the market such a beautiful thing, right,
• 32:52
  Speaker 1: is that is that information needs to be processed so
• 32:54
  Speaker 1: that there's buyers and sellers, so that what you're left
• 32:57
  Speaker 1: with is the buyer takes risk the reward for that,
• 33:00
  Speaker 1: the seller takes cash and they're happy with that. And
• 33:03
  Speaker 1: depending on how much uncertainty there isn't a price as
• 33:07
  Speaker 1: what someone buys when they buy, So the more uncertainty,
• 33:10
  Speaker 1: generally speaking, the more you turn you have to offer
• 33:13
  Speaker 1: me to take that on.
• 33:15
  Speaker 2: Now, another question that's come through from a few texts
• 33:18
  Speaker 2: is when is the time to take your money out
• 33:21
  Speaker 2: of an aggressive fund. So you've decided you've had the window,
• 33:24
  Speaker 2: you've had fifteen years or twenty or thirty or whatever,
• 33:27
  Speaker 2: and you're getting maybe a few years from retirement. There's
• 33:29
  Speaker 2: a part of me that sort of thinks, well, look
• 33:32
  Speaker 2: if I've been it for fifteen years and when I
• 33:34
  Speaker 2: just hang on to it and take it when I
• 33:35
  Speaker 2: need it, And that's my layperson sort of thing. Although
• 33:40
  Speaker 2: the general conversation from most people is like, I'm going
• 33:42
  Speaker 2: to need my money soon, when do I need to
• 33:44
  Speaker 2: shift it to a conservative fund? So what window do
• 33:47
  Speaker 2: you think people should think about it.
• 33:50
  Speaker 1: It's a very individual question because it does depend on
• 33:53
  Speaker 1: when you want to spend and how much you want
• 33:55
  Speaker 1: to spend. So again, these are things you sit down
• 33:59
  Speaker 1: with someone and you work all that out and you
• 34:02
  Speaker 1: figure out what an allocation is appropriate. But when it's
• 34:05
  Speaker 1: in your mind that you could spend some of that money,
• 34:08
  Speaker 1: when you when there's when there's something on the horizon
• 34:10
  Speaker 1: you can think of, Okay, you know, I could see
• 34:12
  Speaker 1: I'm going to start to spend some of this money.
• 34:14
  Speaker 1: You know, maybe it's a couple of years out. Then
• 34:17
  Speaker 1: you should be thinking, maybe I want to start to
• 34:20
  Speaker 1: dial down the amount of shares I have so I
• 34:24
  Speaker 1: have some cash and bonds and something that's a little
• 34:27
  Speaker 1: bit more price stable so that when I want to
• 34:28
  Speaker 1: sell it's there to sell it. But that's very very
• 34:33
  Speaker 1: general generally you want to sit down and with an
• 34:35
  Speaker 1: advisor to determine is the amount I want to spend sustainable?
• 34:39
  Speaker 1: If so, is the allocation I have going to support it?
• 34:42
  Speaker 1: If not, what's the gap? And what do I need
• 34:44
  Speaker 1: to do about it?
• 34:45
  Speaker 2: Who decides when it comes to QP cyber providers, Because
• 34:50
  Speaker 2: you were saying that there is the complete spectrum. You
• 34:52
  Speaker 2: can go incredibly conservative or you can go incredibly aggressive.
• 34:55
  Speaker 1: Absolutely.
• 34:56
  Speaker 2: Who decides the language to describe their funds?
• 35:00
  Speaker 1: I know, right, like it's it is so confusing. I
• 35:03
  Speaker 1: hate the word aggressive. He wants to be aggressive. Most
• 35:05
  Speaker 1: people think Americans are aggressive, wow, you know, and and
• 35:09
  Speaker 1: they do so in a in a fairly derogatory way.
• 35:12
  Speaker 1: Right where the word growth that's or balanced. I want
• 35:16
  Speaker 1: to be balanced. I'm much more balanced, right or balanced?
• 35:20
  Speaker 1: It doesn't sounds good.
• 35:21
  Speaker 2: That sounds a bit of a snooze though it does
• 35:23
  Speaker 2: it Okay, No, I mean it sounds it sounds like
• 35:26
  Speaker 2: you're having a bubb each wright.
• 35:27
  Speaker 1: You know, there's a there's a study once. I love
• 35:29
  Speaker 1: academic studies. And they they gave they gave these two
• 35:32
  Speaker 1: different groups of people two different funds to choose from.
• 35:34
  Speaker 1: They said, you got to make a portfolio from these
• 35:36
  Speaker 1: two funds, right, and one of the in one case
• 35:39
  Speaker 1: the fund was fifty percent shares fifty percent bonds, and
• 35:43
  Speaker 1: the other and they had to balance that was someone
• 35:45
  Speaker 1: that was one hundred percent shares. Well, do you know
• 35:47
  Speaker 1: what they did? They just kind of took fifty percent
• 35:48
  Speaker 1: of each and they got about seventy five percent shares.
• 35:52
  Speaker 1: The other group they gave two funds, one was one
• 35:54
  Speaker 1: hundred percent shares and one was one hundred percent bonds,
• 35:57
  Speaker 1: and that group kind of just took fifty percent of
• 35:59
  Speaker 1: each and end up fifty percent shares. So what happens
• 36:02
  Speaker 1: is people people when they don't know, they just kind
• 36:05
  Speaker 1: of they kind of just take an advert.
• 36:07
  Speaker 2: On the face.
• 36:08
  Speaker 1: So, but is that right for you? I feel like
• 36:10
  Speaker 1: people are just.
• 36:11
  Speaker 2: Feel like, oh, that's the whole point. That's why I
• 36:14
  Speaker 2: was saying. It's even people's understanding of risk, mild risk, whatever.
• 36:18
  Speaker 1: And so what happens is they take these these surveys
• 36:21
  Speaker 1: of five or six questions and it tells you, oh,
• 36:23
  Speaker 1: you should you should be in eighty percent shares, you
• 36:26
  Speaker 1: should be in fifty percent shares, you should be in
• 36:28
  Speaker 1: thirty percent shares, five or six questions. Right, No one
• 36:31
  Speaker 1: ever describes, oh, by the way, in twenty years time,
• 36:34
  Speaker 1: you're gonna have one hundred thousand dollars less because of
• 36:36
  Speaker 1: that choice. Right, No one actually takes you through that logic.
• 36:39
  Speaker 2: No, Right, We're gonna take another break, can come back,
• 36:41
  Speaker 2: we got because time is flying. It's ten to six.
• 36:43
  Speaker 2: But this is news talks. You be back soon, Welcome
• 36:52
  Speaker 2: center play such things, welcome back to the weekend collective.
• 37:03
  Speaker 2: Of course, if you do want to have a good retirement,
• 37:05
  Speaker 2: write a song like Hotel California. And it's probably a
• 37:08
  Speaker 2: license to print money, isn't it Brand Brinkerhoff. So yeah,
• 37:13
  Speaker 2: look are they just we've got about I've got three
• 37:18
  Speaker 2: minutes left. But are there particular warning signs or signs
• 37:22
  Speaker 2: that people should look out for that it might be
• 37:25
  Speaker 2: time to change their advisor or their their plan.
• 37:30
  Speaker 1: Yeah, there are. If you don't know what you need
• 37:33
  Speaker 1: to do to have the retirement that you want, and
• 37:35
  Speaker 1: if your advisor has in contact you in the last year,
• 37:38
  Speaker 1: then change very simple. Okay, if you know if good
• 37:42
  Speaker 1: advice needs to be updated with changes of your circumstances,
• 37:45
  Speaker 1: what you want and what your financial circumstances are. Right,
• 37:48
  Speaker 1: so you need a plan, need a strategy, And if
• 37:52
  Speaker 1: you don't know what your strategy is, you don't know
• 37:54
  Speaker 1: what the gap is between what you want and where
• 37:57
  Speaker 1: you're cruising, then that you need to make a change.
• 38:00
  Speaker 2: What about your key we Saber fund? Are there signs
• 38:03
  Speaker 2: that you should read?
• 38:06
  Speaker 1: So if you don't know why you're in the key
• 38:09
  Speaker 1: we sever you're in, then consider a change, or at
• 38:13
  Speaker 1: least other people. Why am I in? What am I?
• 38:17
  Speaker 1: I guess I'm in at a fault or or I'm
• 38:20
  Speaker 1: I went down to the bank and they signed me
• 38:22
  Speaker 1: up with something I don't really know. Why consider a change?
• 38:24
  Speaker 1: You're not there on purpose? Are there?
• 38:27
  Speaker 2: The sort of dot org dot nz website is one
• 38:30
  Speaker 2: that gets referred to frequently? Does it? Is there any
• 38:34
  Speaker 2: sort of external website? And maybe that's the one that
• 38:37
  Speaker 2: actually assesses the risk profiles sort of from a third
• 38:41
  Speaker 2: party point of view of different funds, Like so because
• 38:44
  Speaker 2: one one one funds aggressive fund maybe completely different in
• 38:48
  Speaker 2: terms of risk profile to another.
• 38:50
  Speaker 1: This is what we do. A Kiwi wrap is you
• 38:53
  Speaker 1: work with an advisor and the advisor actually has five
• 38:55
  Speaker 1: hundred or more different options that they can use. So
• 38:59
  Speaker 1: so the advisors that they're and looks at everything that's
• 39:01
  Speaker 1: available to and then they determine what is the right
• 39:04
  Speaker 1: mix of those things for you. And I think that
• 39:06
  Speaker 1: that is because I think it is an overwhelming thing
• 39:08
  Speaker 1: and likely to be something that people avoid because they
• 39:11
  Speaker 1: feel uncomfortable with it.
• 39:13
  Speaker 2: Hey, believe it or not, that brings the art or
• 39:17
  Speaker 2: close that has flown by, hasn't that? Well, that's that's
• 39:19
  Speaker 2: what I love about radio and having a good conversation. Hey,
• 39:22
  Speaker 2: thanks so much for joining us, Ben. If people want
• 39:24
  Speaker 2: to check out you want to check out Ben's company,
• 39:28
  Speaker 2: he is What's what's your job description again? Financial head
• 39:32
  Speaker 2: of advice at Concilium. There we go. It's a Concilium
• 39:35
  Speaker 2: dot CO dot I and Z. That's c O N
• 39:37
  Speaker 2: S I L I U M. If you're curious about
• 39:39
  Speaker 2: those pages I've referred to in our conversation, that's on
• 39:43
  Speaker 2: the the key we sabor page. It's kiwi rap as
• 39:46
  Speaker 2: and w A R sorry w R A P And
• 39:50
  Speaker 2: you can see the list of the drop down list
• 39:52
  Speaker 2: of advice and a whole lot of interesting information on
• 39:54
  Speaker 2: there which I couldn't begin to describe any further. Given
• 39:56
  Speaker 2: we've only got thirty seconds left, so Ben will catch
• 39:58
  Speaker 2: you again, get on the show again soon. Thanks to
• 40:02
  Speaker 2: my producer, Tyre Roberts for her song choices. That's a
• 40:05
  Speaker 2: sort of that's a mixed thanks because some of them
• 40:08
  Speaker 2: are great and some of them are just dreadful. But
• 40:10
  Speaker 2: you know, as long as someone's happy, we're all happy.
• 40:12
  Speaker 2: I'll look forward to your company. I'm back filling in
• 40:14
  Speaker 2: for afternoons for the next couple of weeks as well,
• 40:17
  Speaker 2: so we'll catch you again same time tomorrow, not same
• 40:19
  Speaker 2: time right tomorrow, twelve o'clock tomorrow, and of course every
• 40:22
  Speaker 2: weekend for the weekend collective at three o'clock. We'll catch
• 40:24
  Speaker 2: again soon. Have a great evening.