Latest / Clear Admit MBA Admissions Podcast / MBA Wire Taps 351—720 GMAT, Executive MBA. 326 GRE, is it enough? Marshall vs Tepper

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MBA Wire Taps 351—720 GMAT, Executive MBA. 326 GRE, is it enough? Marshall vs Tepper · Clear Admit MBA Admissions Podcast

• 0:16
  Speaker A: Welcome to the clear admit MBA admissions podcast. I'm Graham Richmond, and this is your wiretaps for Monday, May 6, 2024. Are you looking for an MBA program where you'll be more than just a number? Vanderbilt Business offers a personalized learning experience to help each student reach their unique career goals. Whether you're looking to switch careers entirely or accelerate the path you're on, the Vanderbilt MBA program will provide you with the individual support you need to propel your career forward. Vanderbilt is currently waiving their dollar 200 application fee for MBA wiretaps. Listeners to learn more about the Vanderbilt MBA program at to claim your application fee waiver, visit business dot vanderbilt.edu clearadmit. I'm joined by Alex Brown from Cornwall, England. Alex, can you believe it's May?
• 1:02
  Speaker B: I know everything's good and it's May. It's springtime and, well, we're recording this on what we call May Day.
• 1:08
  Speaker A: That's right. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So it's. Yeah. It's funny, I used to think of May as being the most sort of sleepy month in the NBA admissions cycle because it's sort of, you know, the people who applied this past season are starting to wrap things up and we have some round three things happening, right. But it's getting quieter. And the next kind of cycle of candidates is still not even sort of thinking about this stuff. But that seems to be less and less true. Like, I mean, I was somebody, a friend of ours in the industry, posted to LinkedIn how we're like four months away from the first round deadlines for some of these top schools for next cycle. So that was kind of a little bit of a awakening for me to realize how close it is.
• 1:46
  Speaker B: Yeah, not just that, but this season's still continuing. We've still got quite a lot of activity, I think, on livewire in terms of waitlists. Round four, round three. Lots of schools now have round fours for application deadlines. We've now got decision deadlines for schools last week. This week we've got Kellogg, Goysetta, Tepe, fuqua, INSEAD, all scheduled to release decisions from round three. There's lots of chatter on Livewire about things like wait lists at Columbia. Well, there's lots of. Lots of chatter about Columbia all over the place right now, but, yeah, yeah. I mean, fingers crossed things get a bit steady, but, yeah. There's still a lot of activity this season, Graeme. It's not just yet all about next season, but you're right. Soon enough, we'll be focusing all our efforts on driving, supporting, folks through the next season.
• 2:49
  Speaker A: And I think I'm biased because I'm working on all these little projects that pertain to the next cycle. Like we have our, well, you know, we have a bunch of webinars coming up at most Wednesdays in the month of May that are aimed at next year's candidates. And then we're doing an event in Chicago. So. Yeah, so maybe that's why I'm kind of thinking about next cycle. But actually, speaking of this cycle, today, Monday, May 6 at noon Eastern, we're going to do our clear admit monthly webinar. That's for anybody who's a registered user of our site. They can come in, join us for the webinar. It's just kind of an ask me anything. Although, though we do, Alex, you always diligently prepare a deck of slides that offer admissions tips and advice, and we'll run through some of that, too. So that'll be the final one for this season.
• 3:31
  Speaker B: Yes, the final one for this season. We're not yet sure what we're going to do next season in this regard. So if anyone has any suggestions, send them in. And obviously we'll ask folks on the webinar later today. I'll say, but even though I'm saying this on Wednesday or whatever, on Monday we'll ask them for feedback, see what approach works best.
• 3:55
  Speaker A: Yeah, that's great. And then the other thing happening this week is on Wednesday. So May 8 at noon Eastern, I'm going to sit down with admissions directors from Berkeley, Duke, Emory, Georgetown and UT Austin to ask them questions about just sort of their application process. Again, this is for people thinking about applying in the coming cycle, and you can sign up for that event, which you have to do in advance at bit Lee caspringwebinars. And then the other thing, Alex, is we're getting closer and closer to our big in person event May 15 in Chicago. And we've got 21 leading MBA programs that have signed on to exhibit at this MBA fair. And we've got some amazing panels with admissions tips and advice about how to get into these top schools and some industry stuff with a head of HR from Bain and company. So that'll be a lot of fun. You can sign up for that at bit Ly Cachicagofair. So I'm really looking forward. It's going to be a whirlwind tour this next few weeks because we have more online webinars in late May where we'll sit down with Dartmouth and Yale and Wharton and Carnegie Mellon and Columbia, I mean, just the list goes on. So stay tuned to our website to be on top of all these events and to sign up and stuff, but lots of exciting stuff.
• 5:07
  Speaker B: Yeah, absolutely brilliant. And best of luck with the Chicago event because that is a first for clear admit. Right. An in person MBA admissions event. And obviously, you know, we've had a lot of success with the virtual events and this one that you're kicking off on on Wednesday, for example, over the last couple of years. So this is a pretty big leap forward for clear emit. So I'm really excited.
• 5:31
  Speaker A: Yeah, should be fun. Over on the website, we did run an admissions tip about reapplying to business school. So not always the news that people want to kind of read about, but if you are in that position where you didn't get in or you for one reason or another weren't happy with offers received, you should read this admissions tip about reapplying to business school. We also have a guide on our website that you can download. It's free to any registered user on our website site. So you can download our reapplying to business school guide as well. But start with the admissions tip. It's some basic advice and then go on from there. So that that came out over the.
• 6:05
  Speaker B: Past week and then we also on that score, Graham. I'm seeing a little bit more activity on decision wide this year from folks that have offers this year, but they're considering whether they should wait and reapply to try to up their games. So it's quite interesting, you know, reapplying. You typically think that's only relevant to folks that obviously didn't get admitted this season, and it is relevant to those folks. But there is a group of candidates that reassesses where they've got in and still ponders whether they could have either improved their profile some way or maybe another year of professional experience might improve their profile or a new test or whatever it might be to target a higher tier program. Yeah.
• 6:52
  Speaker A: And I would say the good news is that there's no stigma with reapplying. So when a candidate is reviewed by the committee, the fact that they've applied before is not viewed as a negative. Sometimes I would argue it's actually viewed as a positive. It shows determination, et cetera. The only thing I will say is, I mean, you know, application volume was up across the board this year at all the top schools. And so I'm kind of wondering, you know, I don't really know what this season will hold. And so you know, if you're holding an offer in hand and you're thinking, well, I'll just walk away from that and reapply, it's hard to predict what we're going to see this coming cycle. So we.
• 7:24
  Speaker B: And that is a particularly risky strategy because when you're actually reapplying to the same schools that you got admitted to, you're going to have to adjust your narrative a little bit.
• 7:35
  Speaker A: Yeah.
• 7:36
  Speaker B: So that, you know, you can explain why you chose not to come last season, but you still want to come this season.
• 7:43
  Speaker A: Yeah. That could be challenging. Yeah. So in any event. Yeah. Check out our reapplying admissions tip as well as the guide, if you can, if you fall into that category. We did catch up with more alums from leading business schools over the last week. We actually caught up with three different alumni. The first one is Patricio, who is a UCLA Anderson grad from the class of 22. And he works at Google as a strategic finance analyst with a focus on their tech infrastructure and machine learning. So very interesting stuff. I guess he's applying his finance skills probably to determine go forward or not on various tech projects and things. So originally, Hale's from Chile and had worked in investment management prior to going to Anderson. And we asked him, what is one thing you would absolutely do again as a part of the job search? And here's what he says. He says, persevere. The job search could become a frustrating journey at times. It's not easy to keep the confidence and energy when things are not working out, but just be patient. So. And obviously Patricia landed on his feet at Google, so there's some words of wisdom from him. Uh, Alex, we also caught up with Tyler. She went to HBS and actually graduated back in 2020. So she's been out a little while and currently works at Amazon as a senior product manager for Amazon Live. Prior to business school, Tyler, who hails from Atlanta, worked for the NBA, so the National Basketball association. And we asked her, were there any surprises regarding your current employer's recruiting process? And she says, at Amazon, you interview with someone not on your team called a bar raiser. That interview is important because it ensures that the incoming cohort of employees meets a company wide standard of excellence. So what do you make of that? Alex? That's kind of an interesting thing they have you meet with someone not on your team, just somebody else, I guess, at Amazon to just have like sort of a check. It's kind of interesting.
• 9:42
  Speaker B: Yeah. I was trying to figure out what is Amazon live?
• 9:44
  Speaker A: Oh, isn't that their tv stuff and everything. I think it's, I actually don't know, but I know that they've been doing deals for football or basketball, and I don't know, maybe I'm missing something, but I thought that was.
• 9:56
  Speaker B: So I guess that's in Amazon Prime. I just think maybe that has been part of Amazon Prime, Amazon Live. I wonder if that's live online shopping. I'm waiting to see how Amazon integrates the more sort of tick tock, tick tock shop type effect. I don't know if that's the case, but, but, yeah, I can't remember your question, but I think that's quite an interesting interview strategy. Yeah. Having, yeah. Having another team interview you to make sure the other team isn't a slacker. Is that what they're saying?
• 10:32
  Speaker A: Kind of. Well, just to maintain sort of company wide quality, which is interesting. The other thing I would say Amazon, you talk about them. I mean, just a sidebar here, but they had their earnings report come out last week and they kind of beat everywhere. And one of the things that was a big beat, I think, was they did really well with their advertising. You know, people advertise on prime. Yeah.
• 10:52
  Speaker B: And.
• 10:53
  Speaker A: Yeah. All that. Yeah. So they. Yeah.
• 10:55
  Speaker B: Just interesting. I thought that was cool. Right. You got to pay for Amazon prime. Right. And then pay 150 or a couple of $100 for that. And now if you don't want ads on your video feed, you got to pay another three, $3 a month or something.
• 11:08
  Speaker A: Yeah. Although I think this also refers to the advertising that they've managed to pull off just in site, you know, so as you're shopping their ads coming up for different products and things, and companies are paying for that. So there's, I think they're doing quite well with that as well.
• 11:21
  Speaker B: Okay. Okay. Very, very good. I think that they were, there was, there was some aspect to Amazon that wasn't all rosy. I think maybe it was. Its e commerce numbers were down a little bit. I forget. Anyway, I think it was that they.
• 11:35
  Speaker A: Forecast, you know, the forecast for earnings wasn't quite as high as the street was predicting, I guess, for the next quarter, but, you know.
• 11:42
  Speaker B: Yeah. Because their stock dropped a little bit. Anyway, this show is not about Amazon and picking stocks.
• 11:47
  Speaker A: Yeah. We're not offering investment advice, whatever disclosure we should be saying there. In any event, the other thing, though, that we asked Tyler, we just asked her, like, why did she go to HBS? And, you know, what factors figured into that decision? And she said that she was really drawn to the way that HBS facilitated learning through the case method. She said that in college, I often found it challenging to stay focused in traditional lectures, but the case method forces you to participate in the learning process and challenges students to come prepared to each class. So just kind of interesting to hear that. It's something we hear over and over again about cases. And most of the business schools that we talk about use cases in the classroom, just maybe not as extensively as HBS does. Right. So just interesting to hear her say that. The last person that we caught up with, Alex, is named Bita, and she went to UCI. So UC Irvine Mirage and graduated in 22, now works at PepsiCo as an associate finance manager. And beta Hales from California had been working in digital marketing prior to business school. And she said that one thing she would absolutely do again, as part of the job search, she says, I would spend as much time networking and talking to people at your companies and functions of interest as possible. I learned so much about what I wanted out of my role by hearing from individuals that actually were working in these roles. MBA programs also offer a wide variety of resources to help prep students on the job search and interview process. So be sure to take advantage of all those resources as well. So good advice from BDO. No?
• 13:18
  Speaker B: Yeah, very good. Very good.
• 13:20
  Speaker A: So in any event, I think those are the main things I wanted to cover in terms of housekeeping this week. Obviously, if people want to reach out to us, Alex, they can always write to info@clearadmit.com use the subject line wiretaps, but otherwise. Do you want to talk about our three candidates for this week?
• 13:35
  Speaker B: Yeah, let's kick on.
• 13:36
  Speaker A: All right, so this is wiretaps candidate number one. So our first candidate this week has seven schools on the target list and is a bit unusual in that this person's looking at executive MBA programs. They want to start in the fall of 25 or, well, in 25, because some of these schools may start in January. They have been working in digital marketing at Nestle, and they want to stay in consumer goods. They're actually going to return to Nestle in the short term after they complete this executive MBA program. And in fact, I say return, but I think the reality is that they'll be staying at Nestle while they complete the program because it's all a part time. Right? So they had a 720 on the GMat. They have a 3.02 GPA, 15 years of work experience. They're located in Seattle, but they're open to relocation. And the target schools they have are kind of based around that. So they have Columbia, Cornell, Georgetown, IMD in Switzerland, Uwashington, Foster, Uva, Darden and Yale. And it turns out that each of these EMBA programs is kind of strategically located near a major hub for Nestle. So Nestle's us headquarters being in DC, which was where Darden and Georgetown have their Embas, obviously there's a presence in New York which explains the kind of Yale and Columbia being on the list. And then I guess this person's currently working out in the Seattle area for Nestle, and they have an office there. And I shouldn't forget, IMD in Switzerland is where Nestle's, like, worldwide headquarters are. So that that's why they have those schools on their list. This person's pretty well rounded. I mean, they do a lot of other things aside from work. I'll maybe let you kind of share some of that. But the thing I wanted to mention is they wrote us a little note. They said, I'm a big fan of the podcast. I've listened to dozens of episodes over the past few years, and it kept me motivated listening to both of you during my arduous GMAT journey. So I guess we can pat ourselves on the back for some of that 720 score, right?
• 15:37
  Speaker B: Yeah. Yeah. And they did pretty well. That's very good.
• 15:39
  Speaker A: Yeah. So happy to. Happy that the podcast was useful in that regard, but, yeah. What do you make of this? Because this is. We don't normally talk too much about executive MBA candidates or, you know, sometimes we'll get an older candidate who we recommend consider Emba. But this, you know, this is someone who's facing, you know, looking at those directly. But what do you make of this candidacy? Because there are a few things that we need to tackle, like the GPA, some other stuff.
• 16:03
  Speaker B: Yeah, I mean, obviously their GPA is probably going to be the sort of the weakest link here. They might need to explain that a little bit in the optional essay, whether it's a majority issue, and they sort of then turn things around a little bit and ended up with a 3.02. It was 15 years ago, so maybe there was a little less grade inflation then. I seems like such a long time ago now. I can't quite remember a 3.02 nowadays, probably a bit more grim. But, you know, I really like their work experience, Graham. It seems like not just what they've done, but they've done it well. They've won awards, they've. They've been, you know, they're clearly extremely competent marketer that's well respected in their industry and in their field and been very successful in their endeavors through two or three different sort of job switches, which over 15 years is very reasonable, I think so. I really like that. I really like their outside of work activities. You explain to me what fingerboarding is.
• 17:08
  Speaker A: Yeah, they are a fingerboarder, obviously.
• 17:11
  Speaker B: Yeah. I have no clue what fingerboarding is. I didn't know that I wanted to put it into Google, so Google thought I was interested in fingerboarding, but anyway. But my point is, they've got some really interesting interests as well as sort of volunteer activities. I think they, they, they've got a nice little sort of focus on historical buildings and sustainability. Their father has a very. Looks like a very robust commercial real estate business that they help with, etc. Etc. So lots of other good stuff out there. So I would think, you know, they've got a pretty decent mix of schools. Obviously, they're a little bit sort of disparate group because it's driven by where NASA is based that they're going to have some options here. I would be surprised if they don't. I mean, I think, you know, executive MBA programs, let's say it's the same executive MBA program as a. In the school that has a very good full time program. They're probably a little bit more forgiving on the actual counting stats. So the 3.02 720 GMAT, even though I think the 720 GMAT certainly, I think that would be above average for executive MBA programs that they're targeting. So, quite frankly, Graham, I think they're going to land somewhere. Right. And there's a couple of reasons why I picked this one. One is, like you said, we don't often talk about executive mbas, and we should recognize that it's not just full time mbas, two year versus one year. But you've got online, you've got hybrid, but you've got executive mbas, which are generally going to be targeted to folks a little bit further along in their career, which may well be the case for this candidate. But I will push a question back to you, Graeme. If they were targeting full time mbas, would they be a viable candidate?
• 19:12
  Speaker A: I mean, I think it'd be dicey, right? Because the GPA is low, the GMAT's good, but it's not above average at top schools. I mean, I guess it would depend which schools we're talking about. So they might need to shift the list. And I also just would argue that with 15 years of experience, it may make sense for them to do something that's relatively fast or can be kind of mixed in with work and it just. Yeah, I mean, obviously they are a bit on the cusp. Like they're not the oldest person applying to an executive MBA. In fact, they're going to be on the younger end of that scale. But I feel like they've had some interesting experiences. It was a bit of a question mark for me in that they've moved around a little. And so I wonder if they may not be quite as senior as some of the people that typically go into an emba in terms of the role they have. Right now they're at Nestle and they're doing digital marketing management for a brand within the Nestle portfolio. But it sounds like they're expanding that role. They're going to be taking on other brands and things again. I feel like they're in the right place when it comes to ESX MBA. I don't know that I would push them towards any sort of traditional full time non executive, but is that, I mean, were you thinking that they should just go to a traditional program?
• 20:25
  Speaker B: I don't know if they had aspirations for a traditional full two year MBA experience, you know, which at the end of the day maybe in the long run helps them with some networking and so on and so forth. And they, I don't know if they plan to join their fathers real estate business and so on and so forth. In the longer run, there might be a small argument to say, you know what, in round one I'm going to apply to a couple of full time as well as these executive MBA programs and just sort of test the water to see where I land. And I do like their professional experience. When I'm looking at it through the lens of a full time admissions officer, I think they've done some really cool things.
• 21:12
  Speaker A: Yes.
• 21:14
  Speaker B: So from that perspective, I think full time. And then. So if that is the case, then do they need to do any additional work to sort of further overcome this? 3.02. Do they need to do MBA math or HBs core? Again, I don't think there's any doubt that they would do well in a curriculum, but just to show ADCoM that they recognize, recognize that's a potential weakness and to, you know, to overcome it or to show that they've got that self awareness that they've taken these classes. Now, if I was then, and I did include a couple of full time programs, I don't think I would target top 16. I would just go all in and say, all right, if I go full time, it's m seven or bust. Otherwise, I do executive MBA, stay with Nestle, and continue on the plan that I have, which is, by the way, a pretty very good plan. Right. So I think if they do. My point is, if they do get distracted by the full time opportunities, I would still stick to just, you know, go, go high or out, you know, aim for the best.
• 22:25
  Speaker A: Yeah, it's an interesting quandary. I mean, you know, this actually brings us kind of full circle in the sense that the one program that could be interesting would be to just do the full time traditional MBA at IMD, which is a program that does veer a little bit older and is in the backyard of Nestle. So they could be really well positioned to potentially stay and work at headquarters afterwards or something if that was of interest to them. But, I mean, for similar reasons, I think the EMBA there at IMD is probably not a bad bet either, because they talk about how they want to go back to Nestle. So if there's any company out there that values the IMD MBA, it's nestle, because I think they were involved. They're very close ties between those two institutions. But I guess for now, this list is a pretty good list. And I do think that when we talk about Emba, a 720, GMAT's great. The GPA is low, but it's older. Wouldn't hurt them to do business fundamentals or MBA math or one of these kind of remedial courses to just show that they have the kind of academic chops to survive a rigorous kind of program that they're juggling with work, etcetera. So that couldn't hurt. But I do like their chances overall. I mean, I think, you know, they have a bunch of schools and a range of schools on their list in terms of admissions difficulty. And so, yeah, if they want to follow your strategy and try a school or two in the first round. But I think that would really just come down to them. Like, I don't. I don't know if this person has thought about, you know, full time, and maybe they just don't want to do that. Maybe they want to keep earning while they're, you know.
• 23:54
  Speaker B: Yeah, I mean, that's absolutely legitimate. I just. If they're only going the executive NBA route simply because they've got 15 years of experience, they've read a few stats to, say programs typically would be more executive. I just want to make sure that they're clear that they're not out of the spectrum to become potentially a strong full time MBA candidate.
• 24:21
  Speaker A: Right? Yeah, that's fair. All right, so I want to thank them for listening to the show and for sharing their profile, obviously, keep us posted with additional comments on that entry if they can, to let us know how things are turning out or if they have other questions. But let's move on and talk about wiretaps. Candidate number two. So our second candidate this week is going to be applying in the coming cycle for full time MBA programs at. They have Berkeley, Carnegie Mellon, Wharton and Lauder. That's that joint degree that Wharton offers in kind of international affairs and language. And then ut Austin, McCombs. And this person's been working at IBM in tech sales, pre business school here, and they want to stay in tech. They actually plan to return to IBM, at least initially. In the longer term, they may want to work on their family's business. They have a GRE score of 326 and a GPA of 3.43. This candidate's got four years of work experience or will have four when they matriculate. They're located in Washington, DC. They also mentioned they're an asian american male, computer science undergrad from a top 20 engineering school. And again, they're going to return to IBM, but in a slightly different role after business school. So those are kind of the basic stats. And, you know, I just wanted to get a take from you, Alex, as to, you know, what do you make of this candidacy? Because on the surface, like, the numbers are okay. I mean, they don't jump off the page, but they sort of are close to the averages at a lot of these schools. But, yeah, what do you make of this candidate? And they didn't really share too much about how they came up with this list and in particular with Wharton. Lauder, I know you had asked them a question about, well, why Lauder, which is that international kind of program, and what language are you picking? Because that's always really important, too.
• 26:09
  Speaker B: Yeah, I mean, and we talked about this before we came on air. We might want to rejig this sort of list of schools because, like you say, they've got Wharton and Hass at the top. Then there's, well, there's a bit of a gap between Wharton and Hass, and there's a larger gap there between Haas and Tepe and Macomb. So there's plenty of programs for them to look at that could help plug some of those gaps, I think, in terms of the right tiers and so forth. My biggest concern with this candidate is how will they stand out? Yeah, they're potentially quite over represented in terms of asian american computer science, potentially a bit nerdy tech sales. So I'm not saying they can't stand out, but these sorts of data points, sort of. There's going to be quite a few people applying to business school that are quite like them. Right. Sure. So how to really stand out and tech sales, hopefully they've gotten into some sort of business development type role or they want to try to differentiate themselves a little bit from a more typical sales role, although I recognize tech sales can be quite complicated and so forth. And you're nurturing relationships with customers over the long term. Well, hopefully you're doing that, etc. They're going to be quite young, 24 on, on matriculation. So. So that, just to bear that in mind, they do do some mentoring. I like that outside of work. And that's kind of where I'm looking for what differentiates this candidate? What are their hobbies and interests? They're not, they're not finger surfing or whatever our previous finger boarding. Yeah.
• 28:06
  Speaker A: Which I forgot to say is like, it's for those who don't know, it's like little tiny skateboards that you run through little tiny skate parks using your fingers and stuff. So it's a totally interesting.
• 28:16
  Speaker B: Not only do they do that, but they have a whole YouTube channel on it.
• 28:19
  Speaker A: Yeah, that's right.
• 28:20
  Speaker B: YouTube calls them a creator. Yes. So that's got to be pretty cool.
• 28:23
  Speaker A: So this, this candidate, though, has some things they're doing right? I mean, they're. You've mentioned right there.
• 28:28
  Speaker B: Yeah, they're mentoring. And mentoring is really, really good, actually, I should say. And they speak in high schools on careers and panels. But what are their hobbies and interests outside of all that kind of stuff? That'd be quite interesting. That might help sort of elevate them a little bit further. And it's just a simple thing. Like Graham, you know, they're coming at it with a 326 GRE, 343 GPA. I recognize it's a computer science degree, so it's a pretty good degree. But those numbers don't stand out either. They're at the median right of the schools that they're targeting. So can they get a few more points on the Gre? If they can, that might be quite helpful. Even if it's only a couple, they've got a little bit of time before they got to apply. They probably should be targeting the first rounds just again, because they need to stand out a little bit more. So, you know, I think, you know, they're probably very viable candidate. I just hope they're able to stand out a little bit and they need to flesh out, fill out some of these additional programs to target. Whether it's a couple more from that top 16 group, which they don't really have. Well, they've got hass, which I would call that a top ten. So we talked before, maybe Duke or Duke, Darden Ross might be one to think about and then maybe even a couple more out of the top 20. They've currently got McCombs and Tepa in that bracket. Tepa's probably a really good fit for them, I would think.
• 30:06
  Speaker A: Yeah. So it is interesting because I think, yeah, as you say, this candidate is going to need to find a way to stand out. And I also do think if they have time retaking the GRE, try to just boost that, that could have an impact not only on their admissions odds, but as we often say, on scholarship dollars. So if they think they can eke out a handful more points, it might be worth even getting a tutor or taking a class or whatever they need to do to make that happen. But I do. Yeah, there's a lot of potential here, but I agree they got to apply in round one because they do risk fading into the overrepresented portion of the pool. But in any event, I will say a little bit of extra points because they're going to go back to IBM. So presumably that's maybe a done deal. That is a bit of a feather in their cap in terms of them having a plan post MBA.
• 30:56
  Speaker B: Yeah. Good. Yeah, their overall goals are good. Right. Because they've got a family business coming to and they can sort of talk about how that's waiting for them in the longer run and, you know, the impact that they can have on that. So that side of the application will be strong, I would think.
• 31:13
  Speaker A: Yeah. And if they can, I mean, they didn't share with us, but it'd be good to know what language, what track, like why Lauder for the Wharton piece? Because that could be a nice way into the Wharton program is if they have this sort of other side and language that they want to develop. So in any event, there's potentially, there's potential here, but there's some work to be done. And as we said earlier, they still have several months before these first round deadlines. So time to kind of get everything tied up in a bow. So we'll see how it goes. I want to thank them, though, for sharing their profile. Alex, let's move on and talk about our third candidate. So this is wiretaps candidate number three, so our final candidate this week comes from a decision wire entry that you selected, and this person applied to Carnegie Mellon, Georgetown, Michigan, Rochester, USC, Vanderbilt and Washington University Olin. And they ended up getting into Carnegie Mellon, Rochester and USC Marshall. And it doesn't look like there were any financial scholarship awards. So it comes down to those three schools. They are looking to start school in the fall, obviously, and they're gonna. They indicate that they. They're not really sure in terms of their post MBA career goal. Right. So they mentioned consulting, they mentioned finance, technology, and so they. They're kind of all over the map there. They had a three, seven GPA, and they're located in Southeast Asia. And they indicate in the note that they left for us that they are torn between Tepper at Carnegie Mellon and us. See? So it's come down to those two programs. They say both are great programs, and I'm currently interested in consulting or finance, but I'm undecided about tech. And then they say they've secured some external scholarship dollars and they want to return to Southeast Asia in the long term. But they're just wondering which program they should choose based on, you know, the alumni network and obviously, job opportunities. But I think they're thinking, what's that alumni network like in Southeast Asia, and what are the job opportunities like in the US? Because they want to stay in the US. Initially, they said. So.
• 33:18
  Speaker B: Yeah.
• 33:18
  Speaker A: So, a lot of moving parts here, but what do you. I mean, where should they go? Carnegie Mellon or USC?
• 33:23
  Speaker B: Yeah, it's not often we get this debate, because clearly, Carnegie Mellon and USC, Marshall and Tepe, they are in the same tier. Right? So we would call that the top 20 tier, along with sort of goysetta and Keenan Flagler and a couple of others. So they're in that tier. Same tier, but they're geographically very different. Like, obviously, people applied to Marshall, they want to be in LA. People applied to Tepe, they want to leave Pittsburgh after the NBA. Right. So, I mean, I joke a little bit, but obviously, Tepe, its career placement does suggest it sends people in lots of different directions, probably a little bit more so, to the northeast corridor, mid atlantic region, but certainly not LA, as to the extent that Marshall is concentrated there and the fact that they're from Southeast Asia or they plan to go back to Southeast Asia. My initial thinking was, well, probably Marshall in that case, because probably a stronger sort of connection there to Southeast Asia from USC going to LA. The real problem for me, though, Graham, is these goals. They basically listed 90% of the jobs that top programs like Marshall and Tepe are able to provide access to. They might want to do finance, they might want to do consulting. They've not ruled out tax, so that's 90% of the job. So I think they really need to think long and hard about. All right, which would be the ideal of these three sort of broad buckets to focus on. And if it ends up being finance, that might lean one school over the other. If it's consulting, it could be a different school. They've got to think about that first job that they can get off of the MBA within the United States, if that's their goal for a couple of years before they then go back to Southeast Asia. Because as one of the folks on the decision wire site, I thought really astutely pointed out, and this is just another community. Well, it's one of our, it is our most prolific community member. The, the brand name of that firm may be really valuable, getting them back to Southeast Asia as when then combined with the brand of the MBA program itself.
• 36:04
  Speaker A: Yeah, agreed.
• 36:05
  Speaker B: So that might lean a bit more towards tepe if they're focused on computer science and tech and, and stuff like that. But, yeah, it's a difficult decision overall. Graham, I could see arguments either way.
• 36:22
  Speaker A: Yeah. I mean, it is a tough call. As you point out, these schools are peers. And I think the thing that's most troubling for me is not where they should go, but as you say, they need to make up their mind about what they want to do in the short term after business school, because consulting and finance are really different and tech is different. And so if they knew which one of those it was, they could really save themselves a lot of trouble by honing in and then doing some due diligence about which of these programs might be better suited. I also think, yeah, geography matters and where they might want to be in the US right immediately after business school. And then again, as you point out, they need to investigate in the market they would be going to in Southeast Asia. How active is the Carnegie Mellon or USC alumni club? And just get a sense for what's the reputation there. So in any event, yeah, a nice dilemma, as we always say, when someone's picking between different schools, and I don't think they can go wrong here. I guess there is a little part of me that because of the emphasis on engineering and science and computer science and tech that people associate with Carnegie Mellon, Tepper, there might be a bit of an advantage in Asia. I don't know. I mean, as our community member pointed out, though. USC has a pretty good reputation because there are a lot of Asians that come to the west coast to study. So, yeah, it's really. I think it's going to just come down to, I mean, they probably need to investigate a little bit about fit as well. Like where do they think they would best fit in? And so it's. Yeah, it's a challenging but nice problem to have and I hope that they can figure this out again. I would start with the goals and go from there.
• 37:47
  Speaker B: Yeah, no, very good. Pittsburgh or LA?
• 37:51
  Speaker A: Yeah, well, I'm actually a big fan of Pittsburgh, so I can't. I'm probably not the best person to ask. I like seasons and all that stuff. So any event. Alex, thanks for picking these out. We ran a little bit long this week because we were chatting on about all these interesting cases and conundrums with these candidates. But thanks again for all your time and for picking these out and we'll do it all again next week.
• 38:10
  Speaker B: Very good. Best of luck, everyone. Stay safe.