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Free to Be You: A Further Exploration of the Gifts · The Father's Business Podcast

• 0:03
  Speaker 1: The Father's Business was founded by Sylvia Gunter to encourage people to a deeper relationship with God.
• 0:08
  Speaker 1: I'm Elizabeth Gunter Powell.
• 0:11
  Speaker 2: And I am Kimberly Roddy.
• 0:12
  Speaker 2: Welcome to the Father's Business Podcast.
• 0:14
  Speaker 2: We are so glad that you've joined us.
• 0:16
  Speaker 2: Well, hi everyone.
• 0:18
  Speaker 2: Welcome to our podcast today.
• 0:20
  Speaker 2: If you have been with us the last few weeks, then you know that we have been going through our Free to Be you study, which is a study on the spiritual gifts.
• 0:28
  Speaker 2: We hope you have enjoyed this study.
• 0:30
  Speaker 2: In this series and as we bring it to an end, we really wanted to discuss what if you're not sure what your gift is, what if you're still having trouble discovering or identifying your gift, and so there are several different elements that we want to talk about that affect this process.
• 0:46
  Speaker 2: Some of those factors involve generic things like parenting and birth order and level of maturity all sorts of things.
• 0:53
  Speaker 2: So, elizabeth, I'd love for you to jump in and talk about that a little bit, and then we'll jump into more of the specific gift pieces where people can mistype or identify themselves.
• 1:04
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm so excited about having this conversation today.
• 1:07
  Speaker 1: This is one of my favorite parts.
• 1:08
  Speaker 1: When we do a Ruroc Journey conference and people are divided down by what you think your group is, there's always those two or three that just come to me like a deer in headlights and oftentimes in tears going.
• 1:22
  Speaker 1: I don't know.
• 1:23
  Speaker 1: I don't know who I am, and so what I want to say to everyone first is it's okay, like our end goal is not to give you another label to put on yourself.
• 1:32
  Speaker 1: It's for you to begin to understand the way God designs you, and so for some of you, as soon as you heard a gift, you're like that's me, that validates me, I feel normal.
• 1:43
  Speaker 1: That's kind of my story.
• 1:44
  Speaker 1: But others of you will have stories more like Kimberly's, where it took a while for her to really settle in into who she is and how God's made her.
• 1:53
  Speaker 1: And wherever you find yourself, it's all right, because there are a lot of factors that play into discovering what our gift is, and sometimes we got to peel back some layers of what other people have put on us, what our life experience has been, and I would say the number one thing that you may need to ask yourself is can you identify what your parents or the main mentor in your life, whoever's had that influence of your life?
• 2:22
  Speaker 1: What was their gift?
• 2:24
  Speaker 1: Because, kimberly, if you think about it, we're going to raise our kids based on our values, right, yeah?
• 2:30
  Speaker 1: And so if I'm a profit gift, I'm going to raise my children to think, make decisions, react like a profit, because I think that is the correct way to see the world, right.
• 2:42
  Speaker 1: And so, as my children are growing up, children also want to please their parents.
• 2:49
  Speaker 1: A lot of times they want to be their parents.
• 2:52
  Speaker 1: You can watch as little children imitate things that their parents do, and so whatever your parents' or mentor's gift has been that was very influential over your life, you're going to have a lot of those characteristics in your life, whether that's your gift or not.
• 3:08
  Speaker 1: So that may be confusing some of what you're processing through about that.
• 3:13
  Speaker 1: Another thing as far as family origins go is your birth order.
• 3:17
  Speaker 1: If you're a firstborn child, typically you are more strong-willed, independent, leader-type person, and so a lot of firstborns will kind of lean toward leader gifts.
• 3:32
  Speaker 1: But that doesn't mean that everyone who's a firstborn is going to be a prophet or a ruler or an exhorter, but there's just in the same way.
• 3:41
  Speaker 1: Sometimes babies of the family or the middle child is the one who's just trying to help everyone get along and be the great peacemaker in the family.
• 3:49
  Speaker 1: And so there are some behaviors we have learned of how to survive in our family system that may make you think that's your gift, but that's not necessarily your gift.
• 4:00
  Speaker 2: That is just your family of origin your gift, that is just your family of origin.
• 4:08
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I think it's important to remember that our birth order and our family systems matter.
• 4:10
  Speaker 2: They play a big part in shaping us.
• 4:13
  Speaker 2: As you're discovering your gift, as you're trying to piece apart, how has God wired me, how do I live in that and especially live in the fullness of that, then it does take some time to kind of understand and be aware enough to look at what role did I play in my family system?
• 4:31
  Speaker 2: I had a professor one time that talked about.
• 4:34
  Speaker 2: You will often see yourself showing up in most relationships, in most work environments, ministry environments, the way that you showed up in your family system.
• 4:44
  Speaker 2: And so if we can identify how was I showing up in my family system, you can then start to maybe piece apart.
• 4:51
  Speaker 2: Is that part of your personality or does that play into your gift?
• 4:55
  Speaker 2: And I think it's just some good questions to ask yourself.
• 4:57
  Speaker 2: I mean, elizabeth, you and I, you're the baby of the family, I'm the oldest in my family but you're the only daughter.
• 5:03
  Speaker 2: So I think again, all of those factors play a part and so it's.
• 5:08
  Speaker 2: You can't just naturally say, like you said, a firstborn child tends to be more leader oriented, but that doesn't necessarily mean that they have a leader, a gift that looks more leader, because all of these gifts can be leaders.
• 5:21
  Speaker 1: Yes.
• 5:22
  Speaker 2: So again, remembering that this is a complex people, I said to my friend this morning humans are the most complex thing out there.
• 5:29
  Speaker 2: God designed us so intricately.
• 5:31
  Speaker 2: And so I think we have to remember all of those things as we're honing in on and trying to discover our gifts.
• 5:36
  Speaker 2: So that's a great point.
• 5:37
  Speaker 1: A few other things for us to think about.
• 5:40
  Speaker 1: As you think about this is your own story about.
• 5:48
  Speaker 1: As you think about this is your own story, not only what you do, which a lot of people are like.
• 5:51
  Speaker 1: Well, this is the role that I've been playing at my job, in my family, in my relationships, and so, therefore, that is who I am and it's separating my as one of our leaders says, you're due from your are.
• 6:02
  Speaker 1: So we need who are.
• 6:04
  Speaker 1: You is separate from who.
• 6:06
  Speaker 1: What you do, and that is very important as we, as you think through these characteristics, that you focus in on that.
• 6:13
  Speaker 1: Also, gender and culture can play a big role in this.
• 6:18
  Speaker 1: Speaking as a profit gift as a female, I think a lot of times women shy away from saying that they're a prophet gift or a ruler gift.
• 6:27
  Speaker 1: If they are in a cultural environment and I don't mean just your nation's culture, it could be your church culture, even your family culture where women are not celebrated as leaders, they will have a tendency to go well, you know, I'm not a ruler, because that sounds too harsh, too strong for a female to be that, but I could be a servant.
• 6:48
  Speaker 1: And they're doing the role of a ruler, but they're calling themselves a servant gift.
• 6:54
  Speaker 1: On the flip side, there's a lot of men, I know who.
• 6:57
  Speaker 1: I can see a strong mercy gift in them, and they run away from that because they're afraid it feels too soft, too tender.
• 7:06
  Speaker 1: And there's this protectiveness that comes up in us and that kind of goes into my next point, which is where we've been wounded in our story.
• 7:13
  Speaker 1: If you have been the victim of abuse, if you have grown up in a toxic environment where the message from a very young age is no one's going to look after me, I've got to take care of myself, I've got to protect myself, that is going to make you feel much more like a different gift.
• 7:34
  Speaker 1: And I remember once, many, many years ago, I was a part of a prayer team that was doing ministry for someone and they were focusing in on another area.
• 7:44
  Speaker 1: But I saw this dynamic going on where it was clear to me this lady was a mercy gift to her core and she had been deeply abused and it was a harsh situation and I saw her continually trying to shut down her mercy gift and not be a mercy, because mercies are going to get stepped on, mercies are going to get hurt, mercies are soft, and so there was the issues that we were trying to deal with in the prayer ministry thing, but then there was this deeper undercurrent that she did not want to embrace what her gift was because it made her feel vulnerable.
• 8:19
  Speaker 1: And so all of us bring all of this of our life story to this whole idea of our gifting, and so we really are going to have to sit with God sometimes and dig into this and go OK, why am I having trouble identifying my gift?
• 8:35
  Speaker 1: What else is going on in this other than just looking at the descriptions of the seven gifts?
• 8:40
  Speaker 2: That's all really true, elizabeth.
• 8:41
  Speaker 2: Really good points.
• 8:42
  Speaker 2: Thank you for bringing those up and I do think, as with many things in understanding scripture and understanding people, our gifts, all those different things, it's really important to just take time to do it and to, like you said, sit with the Lord with that.
• 8:54
  Speaker 2: So it's a good, important word.
• 8:57
  Speaker 2: And so let's talk a little bit more about, maybe, if you're misidentifying a gift.
• 9:03
  Speaker 2: We have several gifts that often and we've mentioned this throughout our series several gifts often can misidentify as another gift because of reasons we've talked about, but also because those gifts are similar.
• 9:14
  Speaker 2: Let's start by talking about the prophet and the teacher how those can misidentify.
• 9:19
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and this is a very common one, because both the prophet and the teacher have a deep passion for truth.
• 9:26
  Speaker 1: And that is not to say the other five gifts don't, but it just goes to a different level with the teacher gift and the prophet gift.
• 9:33
  Speaker 1: They both are very black and white, don't have a lot of room for gray in their lives.
• 9:38
  Speaker 1: It's black and white, right and wrong.
• 9:40
  Speaker 1: But the main key thing you want to kind of hone in on is that processing speed and it's not to say that one is better than the other but a teacher is going to take more time to want to think through, process it, analyze it, whereas a profit gift is going to come to a pretty quick, snap decision.
• 9:59
  Speaker 1: Sometimes that's a good thing and sometimes that's not a good thing, because oftentimes someone will ask me a question.
• 10:05
  Speaker 1: I'll give them an immediate response and then, if I'll take an hour or two to think about it, my answer is now different because I've thought through all of the things that I need to think through.
• 10:16
  Speaker 1: So oftentimes we will have people when we do this at a rock conference and we're like let's let's say, I'm leading the profit group.
• 10:24
  Speaker 1: When we do this at a rock conference and we're like, let's say, I'm leading the profit group.
• 10:27
  Speaker 1: There will be women in there who are resonating with a lot of what we're saying, but at the same time they're like y'all are moving like this.
• 10:32
  Speaker 1: Even this conversation is moving at a faster pace than what I'm comfortable with.
• 10:35
  Speaker 1: And at that point I'm like you know what?
• 10:37
  Speaker 1: Why don't you just for fun, go sit in the teacher group for a little while and see what happens?
• 10:42
  Speaker 1: And there was one lady in particular that she was bound and determined that she was going to be a profit gift.
• 10:47
  Speaker 1: And that's why I think this whole study is so important is because of this experience I had with her.
• 10:52
  Speaker 1: Like, she came to more than one Ruach conference and she was determined that she was a profit gift.
• 10:58
  Speaker 1: And I don't fight people on that, I mean, I have an opinion.
• 11:02
  Speaker 1: And I kept telling her I really think you should go talk to our teacher group and our teacher leader.
• 11:07
  Speaker 1: I think you'd really resonate with them.
• 11:09
  Speaker 1: But it took till, I think, the third conference she attended before she finally God had spoken to her and she started to realize you know what, maybe I am a teacher gift and I'll never forget.
• 11:22
  Speaker 1: She came up to me and she said I finally feel settled inside.
• 11:26
  Speaker 1: I've never felt more like myself than I do now.
• 11:31
  Speaker 1: I finally am settled inside, and so that really is my passion behind this is not again to label people, but to help people understand how God's uniquely created them and stop fighting against the design that he's given them.
• 11:44
  Speaker 1: So yeah, prophet and teacher is a common misidentification of the gifts, because they do have a lot in common.
• 11:51
  Speaker 2: So, Elizabeth, what about the prophet and ruler, because I know those are two often mistyped ones as well.
• 11:57
  Speaker 1: And when we did our interviews with Pam and Richard, I asked them both specifically about this, because so much of what they talk about I'm like yes, absolutely To all of that.
• 12:07
  Speaker 1: We love productivity, we love efficiency.
• 12:09
  Speaker 1: Emotions aren't going to get the job done.
• 12:12
  Speaker 1: I mean, I agree with all of that.
• 12:14
  Speaker 1: But there's two distinctions, I would say, between the profit and the ruler.
• 12:17
  Speaker 1: One they both brought up, which is a ruler is not a visionary as a profit gift, I can't help it.
• 12:24
  Speaker 1: I am constantly coming up with new ideas of creative things we could be doing or new projects we could be starting.
• 12:31
  Speaker 1: Or I am thinking even at the grocery store there's a better way we could have this checkout system working, and my brain is constantly thinking of a new way to try something.
• 12:40
  Speaker 1: A ruler doesn't do that.
• 12:42
  Speaker 1: I had a ruler tell me once give me a vision and I'll make it come to life, but hand me a blank page and I can't fill it.
• 12:49
  Speaker 1: So they don't want to be the one to come up with the vision, but they want to implement it.
• 12:55
  Speaker 1: The other one is about emotions.
• 12:57
  Speaker 1: I think prophets and rulers work really well together because we both agree in the crisis of the moment, emotions are not helpful, Like that is not going to help us get this job done, but rulers kind of put it off to the side and they deal with the emotions later as a profit gift.
• 13:14
  Speaker 1: I push through it, Like I will still be internally struggling with the emotions of whatever is going on at the moment, but I push through that emotion to get the task done and so it's a little that's a nuance, but it is something that I found in my profit friends versus my ruler friends is yes, I feel it, I feel it deeply and that's kind of jumping ahead.
• 13:36
  Speaker 1: That's where I think prophet and mercy can sometimes get confused as well, because both mercies and prophets feel emotions deeply and experience a lot of emotion.
• 13:46
  Speaker 1: But when it's time to get a task done, I can push through that emotion and get it done and deal with the emotions afterwards.
• 13:54
  Speaker 2: Are there any other pieces where the prophet and the mercy are similar?
• 13:58
  Speaker 1: Oh, there's a lot, and they're actually drawn to each other and I don't have a full explanation of why that is, but both prophets and mercies are creative.
• 14:07
  Speaker 1: They're creative in different ways, but they are creative and they enjoy the creativity of others when a mercy may be appreciating the beauty or the atmosphere of a place I appreciate, or a prophet appreciates someone who had a new thought or a new idea or presented something in a different way.
• 14:27
  Speaker 1: So we're both always looking at the world around us, looking for creativity and appreciating it.
• 14:33
  Speaker 1: We also both like to bring alignment to things, but for two very different reasons.
• 14:41
  Speaker 1: Mercies bring alignment and order to situations, to emotions, to even the way how a room is decorated, because they need that settledness of the atmosphere.
• 14:52
  Speaker 1: The whole experience needs to be in alignment and they love creating that and creating that beauty.
• 14:58
  Speaker 1: I want alignment and order because it makes things more efficient, and so that is.
• 15:03
  Speaker 1: The difference between the two is they're doing it more for a beauty and just an enjoyment of the full experience, Whereas I'm doing it because this makes more sense.
• 15:14
  Speaker 1: This is more efficient.
• 15:16
  Speaker 1: I feel more at peace when all of this is in order and I think both mercies and profits while they can enjoy being in a crowd and being around people.
• 15:26
  Speaker 1: What they really prefer is either alone time or one-on-one time, and so they work well together, because neither one of them really want to be the life of the party.
• 15:36
  Speaker 2: They both can be pretty justice oriented too, right?
• 15:39
  Speaker 1: Yes, thank you for reminding me of that one.
• 15:41
  Speaker 1: Yes, they both are going to root for that underdog.
• 15:43
  Speaker 1: I think a key difference may be that, as a profit gift, I'm going to get in there and I'm going to give you my full support and I'm going to be there for you.
• 15:51
  Speaker 1: But if I don't see that underdog starting to make some growth steps towards improving, I'm going to back off and eventually no longer keep walking alongside that person.
• 16:04
  Speaker 1: I think a mercy gift will stick with that person for a lot longer and continue to help them grow longer than a prophet will.
• 16:12
  Speaker 2: Let's talk about our combo Elizabeth the giver and the prophet.
• 16:18
  Speaker 1: Because I think there's a lot, and probably you can speak to this as well.
• 16:21
  Speaker 1: We are both fiercely independent and very resourceful and open to trying something new.
• 16:27
  Speaker 1: So I think that's where I committed the cardinal sin.
• 16:32
  Speaker 1: I broke one of our rules because I was trying to help my best friend out early, early, early on in the days of me learning about the gifts, I sent you the prophet profile and I had highlighted every characteristic of the prophet that I saw on you and those are true of you, but those are also true of the giver gift, and so I didn't fully understand the giver gift at that point and I was just trying to help my friend, and so I broke our rule and tried to tell you what you are and, thank God, you knew enough to say.
• 17:02
  Speaker 1: But the rest of that is not me and you and God continue to work that out.
• 17:06
  Speaker 1: Where do you see other things that either were similar or differences between the prophet and the giver gift?
• 17:12
  Speaker 2: I think one of the big key characteristics is time, and that came up even as you go.
• 17:17
  Speaker 2: That came up in our conversation with Ashley as well, when we interviewed with her.
• 17:26
  Speaker 2: Givers often see plans as flexible or more fluid, whereas profits, when they make a plan, that's the plan and let's stick to the plan, and I want to look ahead and plan for that and remove all the obstacles in the way, and givers are a little more fluid in that way.
• 17:44
  Speaker 2: I think that's one of the key differences.
• 17:46
  Speaker 2: I think it's also the option, the option play, which that's something that givers have.
• 17:52
  Speaker 2: That frustrates a lot of gifts, but I think it frust also.
• 17:52
  Speaker 2: The option, the option play, which that's something that givers have.
• 17:53
  Speaker 2: That frustrates a lot of gifts, but I think it frustrates the profit when the profit doesn't understand where that's coming from or understand that gift in front of them, because it feels again like something shifting or changing.
• 18:04
  Speaker 2: It feels like a plan is shifting or changing when it's really well.
• 18:08
  Speaker 2: I'm just as a giver.
• 18:09
  Speaker 2: I'm often, or always, looking for all the better ways that it could be done.
• 18:16
  Speaker 2: What's another option?
• 18:16
  Speaker 2: What's another option, what's another option.
• 18:18
  Speaker 2: And I think sometimes the prophet is like can you just stick to the plan?
• 18:22
  Speaker 2: Yeah, or just make a decision.
• 18:24
  Speaker 1: Make a decision yeah, yes, yes, because there's something that is settled in me as a prophet gift once a decision has been made Right.
• 18:33
  Speaker 1: And so in some ways, I'm being selfish by asking the giver can we just go ahead and make a plan?
• 18:38
  Speaker 1: Because that makes me feel more settled, but that doesn't make you, as a giver, feel more settled that I've closed off all the other options and said this is what we're going to do.
• 18:46
  Speaker 1: So it is.
• 18:47
  Speaker 1: It's all about compromise, and this is a big one that comes up at our RUAC conferences when we're talking about how do you love another gift, which is a whole other conversation we have at the conference where I've seen a lot of parents who have giver children and it comes down to they're just trying to make plans for Thanksgiving, christmas, whatever, whatever, and their child is wanting to hold the options open, whatever family event might be coming up, and it's really hard to help the other gifts understand.
• 19:21
  Speaker 1: Yeah, you do have the right to know are they going to be at your house for Thanksgiving?
• 19:23
  Speaker 1: Absolutely, but you can't make them give you decisions on everything.
• 19:28
  Speaker 1: I'm just thinking one mom in particular.
• 19:30
  Speaker 1: She wanted every event to know in advance what their child was going to do, and I was like I think you have to pick your battles and pick one or two things that are important, and I think a giver understands that, hey, this is a really important thing to my mom.
• 19:43
  Speaker 1: Therefore, I will commit to this and not play the option plans in my head.
• 19:47
  Speaker 1: Right, but we, as the other six gifts, can't always demand that our giver gifts have plans in advance.
• 19:55
  Speaker 1: Stick to the plan, don't change their mind at the last minute, you know.
• 19:59
  Speaker 1: Don't call an audible, as we say in football, because that's diminishing the giver gift by taking away the beauty that they are always, constantly looking for a better option and a better way to do things.
• 20:17
  Speaker 2: Right?
• 20:17
  Speaker 2: Well, while we're on the giver for just a minute, let's also address the thing that we've said before, which is givers are.
• 20:19
  Speaker 2: It takes a while usually for a giver to be able to identify their gift.
• 20:23
  Speaker 2: I think part of that is because of the options and not wanting to rule out all the options, not wanting to be boxed in.
• 20:31
  Speaker 2: You know there's various reasons for that, but I also think that there's different pieces of each of the gift that a giver, there's different pieces of each of the seven gifts that a giver can resonate with differently.
• 20:43
  Speaker 1: Yes.
• 20:44
  Speaker 2: Because they are flexible and fluid.
• 20:46
  Speaker 2: Now again, you don't often meet givers.
• 20:48
  Speaker 2: If you're honest, most givers don't come across as totally flexible.
• 20:51
  Speaker 2: Let's, if you're honest, most givers don't come across as totally flexible.
• 20:57
  Speaker 2: We'll be honest about that, and you can go back and listen to our giver podcast to hear a little bit more about that.
• 20:59
  Speaker 2: But as far as the internal way of processing things, they feel flexible internally with their decision making, and so I think often they can mistype themselves with the prophet.
• 21:08
  Speaker 2: But I think probably the other one that comes up sometimes is the exhorter.
• 21:12
  Speaker 2: Because of that people orientation, givers often they're very concerned about generational legacy.
• 21:20
  Speaker 2: They're very concerned about connectedness, relational connectedness as well, and so that can sometimes mistype with that exhorter.
• 21:28
  Speaker 2: But I'll be the first to tell you as a giver, the exhorter always has more energy and more connection than a giver will ever have, and so that's something to remember as well.
• 21:40
  Speaker 2: I also think the giver can be mistyped with the teacher at times because there's an analytical process to both of those gifts.
• 21:47
  Speaker 2: They both enjoy gathering data before they make those decisions.
• 21:52
  Speaker 2: But again, givers enjoy that flexibility and that out-of-the-box thinking where teachers have a more methodical approach, more research-based approach.
• 22:02
  Speaker 2: Along with teachers, givers can also sometimes be mistyped with rulers because of that ability to think outside the box a little bit, look at things objectively, want to.
• 22:15
  Speaker 2: There's a certain piece in givers that where they want to press through, to make decisions, they want to lead the way, and so Ashley shared a little bit about that.
• 22:22
  Speaker 2: If you're curious, you can go back and hear her story on that episode.
• 22:25
  Speaker 2: And then, lastly, I think givers can sometimes be mistyped with mercies.
• 22:30
  Speaker 2: Not a lot, but in some small way there is a.
• 22:34
  Speaker 2: That creative side of the mercy can sometimes show up in the giver because it's like we don't want to nail it, we don't want to be nailed down to something.
• 22:43
  Speaker 2: So it can feel like we want to be creative.
• 22:45
  Speaker 2: But it's a very different creativity and alignment oriented piece with the mercy than it is with the giver.
• 22:52
  Speaker 2: Again, listen to those two episodes if you're curious on that about the mercy and the giver, because we address that.
• 22:59
  Speaker 1: Kimberly, a question that comes up a lot at our rock conferences.
• 23:01
  Speaker 1: When people are trying to learn how to love a giver, is they get hung up on the word giver because their experience with their giver person in their life is they come off as kind of stingy, yeah, not very generous.
• 23:15
  Speaker 1: And so can you talk a little bit about that piece of that, the tug between how you invest your time, your resources and all those things plus holding back.
• 23:25
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I actually have been accused of being someone who's not very generous, and that's a pretty hurtful thing to be told, because I don't view myself that way.
• 23:35
  Speaker 2: I view myself as very generous.
• 23:37
  Speaker 2: But here's the key my generosity is very connected to what I value, and so other people have different values and they may think that I should, or they may want me to, give to something that they value, and this sounds very selfish.
• 23:55
  Speaker 2: But values are underneath the surface.
• 23:57
  Speaker 2: For all of us, they're the iceberg.
• 23:59
  Speaker 2: The Titanic hit it because it didn't see it right.
• 24:01
  Speaker 2: Our values are always under the surface, and so whatever I value is where I devote my money, my time, any resource that I have, even silly.
• 24:16
  Speaker 2: Even today, I have some concert tickets to give away and I'm thinking to myself I'll give those away for free to this group of people, but this group of people that are outside of this particular circle, I'll probably charge them a little bit and it's just I don't know if that example makes sense, but it's kind of a way to think about.
• 24:33
  Speaker 2: Like that can come across to people like why would you just not give them away for free to everyone?
• 24:38
  Speaker 2: And I'm like well, I paid for the ticket, so other people would say, no, get money for your tickets.
• 24:42
  Speaker 2: Right, like you paid for the tickets, sell them.
• 24:44
  Speaker 2: There's no right or wrong there, and I'm not trying to isolate people, but there's a, there's a peace in a giver that that desires blessing others and sometimes, sometimes we need to be, we need to open up our eyes and be more generous with that.
• 25:02
  Speaker 2: But what if we're honest about it?
• 25:04
  Speaker 2: It really comes down to, what we value is where that orientation comes from.
• 25:08
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and so, Kimberly, I hear what you're saying about values, and that's why it's so important that we focus on the eternal.
• 25:18
  Speaker 1: That's why it's so important that we focus in on the internal values rather than the external actions, Because, as you're talking about giving in generosity as a profit gift and I know with several other profit gifts we're really quick sometimes to go oh yeah, I'll support that.
• 25:33
  Speaker 1: Because we give a rush, like someone asked a question.
• 25:36
  Speaker 1: We give an immediate answer without really thinking it through, and sometimes I've committed myself to give money to something that I mean fine, I have money, I'll give you some money for it.
• 25:47
  Speaker 1: But it's like if I'd really taken a moment and a beat to think about it, I'm not so sure I would have been as enthusiastic about supporting this as I was in the moment.
• 25:56
  Speaker 1: So, again, a profit gift could be seen as being very generous, and then someone sees that generosity goes oh well, she's a giver.
• 26:03
  Speaker 1: And that's where you got to get down to the underneath.
• 26:07
  Speaker 1: The service to the real values there, which is one of my values, is I'm going to give a quick answer to everything, whether it's good or not.
• 26:14
  Speaker 1: You're going to get an immediate response from me, and so that has less to do with me being generous and more about me making snap decisions and quick judgments.
• 26:24
  Speaker 2: Servants and rulers are like that too, to a certain degree right for different reasons.
• 26:29
  Speaker 2: So let's talk about the comparison between the misidentification between the servant and the ruler, because that's an interesting one, I think.
• 26:37
  Speaker 1: Yeah, they're both more behind the scenes type people.
• 26:40
  Speaker 1: They're both very good at getting a lot of things done quickly, efficiently, and they're both extremely hard workers Like neither one of them will quit until the job is done.
• 26:56
  Speaker 1: So it's kind of the Energizer Bunny there, where they'll just keep going and keep going and keep going, even to the point of physical exhaustion if they need to, and neither one of them are really interested in building their own kingdom.
• 27:06
  Speaker 1: They don't want to be the visionary.
• 27:08
  Speaker 1: They both love coming alongside the visionary and helping the vision come to fruition, and that's where their fulfillment comes.
• 27:16
  Speaker 1: But they never want to be the leader.
• 27:19
  Speaker 1: But there are some very subtle differences between the two.
• 27:23
  Speaker 1: I think sometimes the ruler can come across as a more assertive or dominant gift.
• 27:28
  Speaker 1: More times than not they find themselves defaulting into being the leader on the team.
• 27:35
  Speaker 1: But I've watched servants.
• 27:37
  Speaker 1: They're great team players.
• 27:38
  Speaker 1: They just want to be a part of the team.
• 27:40
  Speaker 1: Not necessarily do they want to lead the team, but in their own way they end up leading the team from that place of team player.
• 27:47
  Speaker 1: So there are some subtle nuances there between the servant and the ruler.
• 27:52
  Speaker 1: And, as we said before, I think a lot of women may be ruler gifts, but it's not culturally appropriate for them to call themselves that term or to be seen as a leader, and so they default into just saying well, I'm just a servant, I just love serving people, because I see in both the servant and the ruler there is a joy in serving others and helping others reach their full potential.
• 28:15
  Speaker 2: That's a good point.
• 28:16
  Speaker 2: What about the servant gift with the teacher gift?
• 28:19
  Speaker 1: Both again tend to be quieter than other gifts.
• 28:22
  Speaker 1: Both are seen as very safe and approachable.
• 28:25
  Speaker 1: Again, teachers and servants not necessarily want to be upfront leaders building their own kingdom, necessarily want to be upfront leaders building their own kingdom.
• 28:37
  Speaker 1: But the teacher's gift passion for truth, research, analytical thought is kind of where I would see the distinction between the two, not to say that the servant doesn't love truth, but servants are going to focus more in on the practical needs.
• 28:50
  Speaker 1: They're going to notice more.
• 28:53
  Speaker 1: Do people seem too cold or too hot in this room?
• 28:55
  Speaker 1: Does everyone have what they want to drink?
• 28:57
  Speaker 1: Is everything in the physical atmosphere appropriate for us, then, to be able to connect with God in a deeper way?
• 29:05
  Speaker 1: And so I think there's a lot of ways that they can both be very safe.
• 29:09
  Speaker 1: Both teachers and servants are very safe people for leaders and a lot of times, as a frontline leader, I find myself emailing or texting my servant and teacher friends and saying, hey, here's where I'm struggling.
• 29:22
  Speaker 1: Hey, here's what I'm feeling.
• 29:23
  Speaker 1: Can you pray for me?
• 29:24
  Speaker 1: And I've watched them come alongside me and run alongside me as we get tasks completed.
• 29:30
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and I would think that even just saying that the servant is supportive is very just.
• 29:37
  Speaker 2: The word servant is very, very supportive, genuinely supportive, and so how does that misidentify or compare with the mercy gift?
• 29:47
  Speaker 1: They are very similar.
• 29:48
  Speaker 1: They're both safe, unapproachable and I think sometimes people will both question their intentions because they are being so focused on the other Kind of like.
• 30:01
  Speaker 1: You know, why are you being so nice to me, like no one does this for no reason.
• 30:05
  Speaker 1: You must have a hidden agenda.
• 30:07
  Speaker 1: There must be something you're after and, really honestly, the servant has absolutely no agenda other than to enable and empower other people, and they both are work process through their thoughts and what they want to say to someone on a little bit slower pace.
• 30:24
  Speaker 1: For both the servant and the mercy, it can be hard sometimes for them to have the words to express what they want to say and I've had to learn that with both my servant and mercy friends to just take a breath and just sit in the silence.
• 30:38
  Speaker 1: And it's okay to sit in the silence and give them the time that they need to let bubble up to the surface whatever it is that they're trying to say.
• 30:45
  Speaker 1: But the mercy, I think you're going to see more of that creative streak in them.
• 30:50
  Speaker 1: You're going to see more of that beauty come in them.
• 30:53
  Speaker 1: There's a deeper appreciation for atmosphere, like when I go out to eat with my mercy friend and even my husband, who's a mercy.
• 31:02
  Speaker 1: He'll make comments about the music that's playing in the background of the restaurant.
• 31:06
  Speaker 1: I haven't even heard the music in the restaurant, but he is tuned in on that.
• 31:10
  Speaker 1: He'll make comments about the people in the other booth, like he picks up everything about the atmosphere and the flow of how things are working.
• 31:18
  Speaker 1: Now, my servant friend, when I go to lunch with them, is going to notice how hard the waitress is working and what can we do at our table to help them do their job better, and so it's very interesting to take your different gifts out to lunch and see what they notice and what they pick up on.
• 31:37
  Speaker 2: Yeah, speaking of the Mercy also, they we talked about this with Laura and Sharon they are very slow processors, which is similar to the teacher.
• 31:48
  Speaker 2: So what?
• 31:49
  Speaker 2: What's the how do?
• 31:50
  Speaker 2: How do you help a Mercy and a teacher understand where, where they might be mistyping themselves?
• 31:56
  Speaker 1: I think the main factor I would see between the teacher and the mercy is a mercy is going to be much more intuitive.
• 32:03
  Speaker 1: They know what they know.
• 32:05
  Speaker 1: They just can't tell you why they know it Versus a teacher is going to be much more analytical, truth-driven.
• 32:11
  Speaker 1: They're going to have the research They've read four articles about this subject before they give you their wisdom on it.
• 32:18
  Speaker 1: So they're going to be much more factual-based in their processing, whereas many times my mercy friends are just like.
• 32:27
  Speaker 1: I feel it in my gut, I have this sense, I feel it in my spirit.
• 32:30
  Speaker 1: However, whatever language they use, I have this sense, I feel it in my spirit.
• 32:32
  Speaker 1: However, whatever language they use, they just know they don't know why they know what they know.
• 32:37
  Speaker 1: But Laura and Sharon both talked about this that they can go out in public and they can sense when something's off between a couple or someone's not having a good day.
• 32:47
  Speaker 1: They can't tell you why they know that, they just know that.
• 32:50
  Speaker 1: And the next thing you know that person's opening up to them and telling them their whole life story, when all they're there to do is buy milk and bread at the grocery store.
• 32:57
  Speaker 1: Right, and so I think it's.
• 33:00
  Speaker 1: It really comes down to the way they process, whether that is more analytical and research based versus a more intuitive approach.
• 33:09
  Speaker 2: So mercies are also very relational.
• 33:11
  Speaker 2: You just talked about that.
• 33:12
  Speaker 2: Yeah, the other gift that's super relational is the exhorter.
• 33:16
  Speaker 2: Yes, speak to that one.
• 33:18
  Speaker 1: Yeah, exhorters are relationships, relationships, relationships.
• 33:22
  Speaker 1: And if you're not friends, you will be in five minutes and you may only be friends for that five minutes and then you may never see that exhorter again.
• 33:29
  Speaker 1: But for that five minutes y'all were really good friends, but for that five minutes y'all were really good friends.
• 33:37
  Speaker 1: Versus a mercy is going to have fewer friendships, but those friendships will be deep and the way that I try to help because this is another one we have a rock conference women coming up to me and going I don't know if I'm an exhorter or a mercy, and there's.
• 33:47
  Speaker 1: I understand that because it is all about relationship, connection for both of them and both of them enjoy, you know, beauty and experiences and atmospheres.
• 33:56
  Speaker 1: So there's a lot that is similar.
• 33:58
  Speaker 1: But if for one, an exhorter and a microphone are best of friends, I can ask the exhorters on our team hey, I did not tell you ahead of time, but can you speak this morning?
• 34:08
  Speaker 1: They're like I got you, I'm on it and they will get up there and do a brilliant job.
• 34:13
  Speaker 1: Okay, mercies are a little bit more behind the scenes.
• 34:16
  Speaker 1: The other key question I ask people when they come to a conference is okay, you're at a wedding.
• 34:21
  Speaker 1: You're at a cafe, you're somewhere where there's a large group of people.
• 34:24
  Speaker 1: Both the exhorter and the mercy are going to enjoy being in that environment.
• 34:29
  Speaker 1: Both mercies and exhorters love crowds of people and being around people.
• 34:34
  Speaker 1: But environment Both mercies and exhorters love crowds of people and being around people, but a mercy is going to be much more of an observer in that situation.
• 34:38
  Speaker 1: They're going to want to sit with their party buddy or their friends at their table and just experience the rest of the room, whereas that exhorter is not going to stay at your table.
• 34:49
  Speaker 1: That exhorter is going to hop up and it's going to go from table to table like a butterfly, going from flower to flower and introducing themselves and talking to everyone in the room and having the best of times, and so part of it is just looking at how do you interact and what do you value.
• 35:04
  Speaker 1: Do you value getting to know everyone in the room or do you value having a deeper conversation with a few people that you can really connect with?
• 35:12
  Speaker 2: Yeah, that's helpful.
• 35:13
  Speaker 2: I'm going to keep pummeling you with questions here, Elizabeth.
• 35:16
  Speaker 2: Sure, come on.
• 35:17
  Speaker 2: What about the exhorter?
• 35:21
  Speaker 1: and the prophet.
• 35:22
  Speaker 1: They also can be very similar because they are both very good communicators, they are both excellent leaders, they are both wonderful motivators.
• 35:32
  Speaker 1: As a prophet gift, I love exhorting people on and that is a problem that people have had when they take other spiritual tests, because every other spiritual gift inventory I've ever taken I come up with the gift of exhortation because that's talking about the do those other tests.
• 35:48
  Speaker 1: This test is really, or these profiles are written to who are you, what are your values, and then your actions flow out of that.
• 35:56
  Speaker 1: Many of the other spiritual gift tests and some of the personality tests that I've taken in the past, I come out very much more exhorter.
• 36:03
  Speaker 1: I love to encourage people to be more of who God created them to be, for them to grow in their relationship with Christ, but I'm going to do that very differently than a prophet.
• 36:12
  Speaker 1: I was in a situation this week with me and Exhorter and some pretty straightforward things need to be said and, oh my gosh, I just marveled at the way that she was able to tell this person and kind of put them in their place, but she did it from her Exhorter gift and they were in no way offended If I had said the same thing, an argument would have started, and it's simply because there is this anointing and gifting on the exhorter gift to connect with people of all kinds and be able to speak truth, but do it in a way that the other person can receive it and not be offended.
• 36:47
  Speaker 1: So where my main difference I see between the prophet and exhorter is how we need to refuel ourselves.
• 36:54
  Speaker 1: I can be with people and I enjoy being with people and interacting with people for a certain amount of time, but, kimberly, you know from living with me, there's a clock running and when that clock runs out, I'm done, the battery is depleted.
• 37:07
  Speaker 1: I need to be alone, I want to go home, I just I want to shut the world out, and I refuel myself by not being with people, whereas if I made an exhorter sit in a situation where they were not around people for long periods of time, that would be draining to them.
• 37:26
  Speaker 1: They are re-energized from interacting with people, and so that is probably the main difference I see between the prophet and exhorter is where does your energy come from and how do you refuel yourself?
• 37:37
  Speaker 2: You know, another gift that doesn't rest or sit well is the ruler.
• 37:40
  Speaker 2: So talk about the exhorter and the ruler.
• 37:43
  Speaker 1: The exhorter and the ruler, again both very strong in leadership skills and they both work really well with a team, but the way they manage a task in a team are going to be different with a team.
• 37:54
  Speaker 1: But the way they manage a task in a team are going to be different.
• 37:57
  Speaker 1: The exhorter is going to be more in tune with the emotions of the members of the team and providing encouragement and making sure we're all having a lot of fun as we get the task done.
• 38:04
  Speaker 1: The rulers can be more focused on the task at hand and how to fit everybody's skill set into the task and, as we heard both Pam and Richard say, emotions are not going to get the job done.
• 38:16
  Speaker 1: So there can be times, if a ruler is not living in their mature place, that they will run over their teammates because they're not concerned about the emotions of the members on the team.
• 38:28
  Speaker 1: They're just trying to get us to the goal of getting the task done.
• 38:31
  Speaker 1: Another key difference is as a leader.
• 38:34
  Speaker 1: My experience has been, and my Exhorter and Ruler friends can tell me if I'm wrong on this, but my experience has been my Exhorter leaders need more affirmation as they are leading and they need that encouragement, just like they love to be a cheerleader for other people.
• 38:50
  Speaker 1: They love people being cheerleaders for them and checking in on their emotions.
• 38:53
  Speaker 1: Natalie talked about that in her interview that you know the way you love an exhorter is ask them how they're doing, because they're constantly asking everyone else how they're doing and how their emotions are.
• 39:03
  Speaker 1: A ruler doesn't need it, not now.
• 39:06
  Speaker 1: All of us humans at a level.
• 39:07
  Speaker 1: We all need affirmation.
• 39:09
  Speaker 1: But a ruler can go a very long time without an attaboy or an attagirl and they will continue to work on the task.
• 39:15
  Speaker 1: They are very appreciative when they get it, but it's not necessary to fuel them to keep going.
• 39:21
  Speaker 2: Elizabeth, I think you've made some excellent points here.
• 39:23
  Speaker 2: As we've had this discussion, we could continue talking for a long time about the seven gifts and how they interact with one another, where they're similar, where they're different.
• 39:31
  Speaker 2: I think we've covered a lot of the misidentifying types.
• 39:41
  Speaker 2: A lot of people come to us and they're not sure and they ask questions, and so we've tried to use this time to talk about those things and to really help our audience understand the answers to these questions and how they can best become who God's designed them to be, so they can live fully out of that alignment with Father, son and Spirit.
• 39:55
  Speaker 2: So, elizabeth, is there anything else you'd like to add to this conversation before we wrap it up?
• 39:59
  Speaker 1: Yeah, here's the bottom line of this.
• 40:01
  Speaker 1: The whole reason why this study is in Rock Journey and that we sell Free to Be you is because your spirit and my spirit, everyone's spirit, has all seven of the gifts, because we have God's spirit in us.
• 40:15
  Speaker 1: So, while I am a prophet gift, I have God's servant, teacher, exhorter, giver, ruler and mercy at my disposal inside of me.
• 40:25
  Speaker 1: And so, as we grow in maturity in Christ, we need to see more of all seven of these gifts bubbling up in us and overflowing in us.
• 40:34
  Speaker 1: To impact those around us and that is something we actually talk about at our Advanced Rock Conference is all the different gifts in our spirit, how they can be wounded, how God comes and heals them, and so there's so much more than just understanding your dominant gift.
• 40:49
  Speaker 1: But understanding your dominant gift is step one, and so we will continue to learn and grow.
• 40:57
  Speaker 1: And my one encouragement I'll put it that way to all of us is be careful what you're saying about the other gifts, because if I get frustrated with my giver, friend or my mercy, husband and I start grumbling and complaining about their gifts, I'm doing two things.
• 41:14
  Speaker 1: One I'm saying the way God designed them is bad, and so I am saying I am speaking ill of what God has created, but I'm also speaking against my own spirit, because my spirit has God's mercy in it, and so, as much as I say oh, it's so frustrating when the mercy does da-da-da-da-da to me I am speaking against my own.
• 41:34
  Speaker 1: I'm wounding my own self, much less the person that I'm trying to be in relationship with, and so my encouragement for all of us is for us to continually be asking God to show us how he is allowing all seven of the gifts to flow in us and through us and out to the world around us.
• 41:52
  Speaker 2: So we hope you have enjoyed this series.
• 41:53
  Speaker 2: We hope that it's been something that you've learned from, something that you can share with others.
• 41:57
  Speaker 2: If you are curious to know more, you can go to our website at thefathersbusinesscom and you can purchase our Ruach Journey Study Kit.
• 42:07
  Speaker 2: Session eight covers the gifts and when you buy that study kit, you have access to all the interviews video interviews that we've done with various leaders to talk about those gifts.
• 42:17
  Speaker 2: It's much more in detail, but you can certainly check out all the podcast episodes that go with this series and check out the free to be you book, as well as the Ruach Journey Study Kit to learn more.
• 42:28
  Speaker 2: So if you have any questions, you can always reach out to us through our website.
• 42:31
  Speaker 2: But we hope that you have enjoyed this and we look forward to seeing you next time.
• 42:34
  Speaker 2: I want to thank you for listening to the Father's Business Podcast.
• 42:42
  Speaker 1: This podcast is made possible through donations by people like you.
• 42:46
  Speaker 1: To donate, go to wwwTheFathersBusinesscom.
• 42:51
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