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The Champion Mentality That Built Venus & Serena | Rick Macci · Harder Than Life

• 0:00
  What's one thing you still want to change about the tennis world before you're done? First off, I'm never going to be done. When you're retired,
• 0:09
  you die. One coaching moment that changed you. Venus and Serena. I do it differently. I build. I've had so many people in the NBA or National Hockey League. Their kids came to me. The genetics were there, but they were a marshmallow. They wouldn't go to the jugular. And I saw that with Venus and Serena. It was baked in double crispy from birth. That was already there. You're a donkey.
• 0:32
  I can make you a world-class donkey. Trust me. Or if you're a turtle, I can make you a better turtle, but you're still a turtle. People got it backwards. You want pressure. It's a compliment. It's a privilege. You want expectation. You got to get uncomfortable to get comfortable.
• 0:50
  If you're not getting better, you're getting worse. All greatness comes from you. Whether you're in the front row or the back row or not even the building, anything's possible. Some coaches teach the game. Rick Macy changes it. A legendary coach whose fingerprints are on five world number ones, eight Grand Slam champions, and over 300 national title holders, from Capriotti to the Williams sisters.
• 1:14
  Rick has trained the greatest, not just in strokes, but in spirit. Let's go all in. So let's go back, Rick, and take us back to the first call from Richard Williams. What made you get on that plane to Compton? First off, you know, it was May 1991, just like yesterday. You know, I get a call from this guy, Richard Williams, and
• 1:44
  I didn't know who he was. And he was the funniest guy I've ever talked to and met. He started cracking one-liners right off the bat. And he goes, I got these two daughters, Venus and Serena. They're 9 and 10. They're going to change the game. You know, and remember, I had Jennifer Capriotti at that time. Well, she already left. She was top 10 in the world at age 14. She won the national 18 and under.
• 2:13
  as a 12 year old. Are you kidding me? So my blueprint, obviously, for greatness was like no other. But that's one of the reasons why he called me. And he said, Rick, you got to come out here and see my daughters. And I promise you one thing, I won't get you a shot. I'm going, who is this guy? He's the funniest guy ever. The only thing I knew about Compton was back then, you know, like riots and all kinds of insanity. And it was May of 91. Summer camp started in June.
• 2:44
  It was a little slow and for whatever reason, for whatever reason, because I never go see someone. They either come to the academy or I see them at a junior tournament. Whatever reason, I said, I'm curious. I want to take a look. So I went out there, flew to LAX, that hotel that night in Compton. Both Orsine and Richard come in, Venus and Serena, one on one leg, Serena on the other.
• 3:12
  hugging and kissing, just like you saw in the movie. Okay, listen to this. This is crazy stuff. He pulls out a piece of paper and he starts grilling me like I'm in a deposition. I go, but then I start thinking, if this guy's gonna let someone in his circle, he wants someone that's been there, done that, father figure, role model. So I kind of got it, but it was brutal. He was asked, he knew more about me than I did.
• 3:42
  Okay, I'm going. But I respected it. But I didn't know if they were any good in tennis. I didn't know. So we talked for about three hours. The next day, they picked me up at the hotel. The same exact bus you saw in the movie. Exactly. Spot on. He goes, we're going to East Compton Hills Country Club. So we get in the bus.
• 4:04
  I sit in the passenger side. Listen to this. Well, I'm looking back. There's Venus and Serena, these two little munchkins back there. McDonald's wrappers, Burger King, smelly towels, ball hoppers. It was like a train wreck. And I'm going, what in God's name am I doing in California? I was at a five-star resort. I was at Greenleaf Golf and Tennis Resort, Haines City, Florida.
• 4:28
  And so here I am up. I didn't go over the rainbow. I went over two rainbows. I get in the passenger side. And I sit. A spring is sticking up. It harpoons me in the buttock. I'm going, whoa, this is crazy. I start to put on the seatbelt. He goes, you don't need a seatbelt. Okay. So I was in the movie too. So then we're driving to East Compton Hills Country Club.
• 4:56
  About 10 minutes into the drive, this story is great. About 10 minutes into drive, I'm looking around, I'm going, this is a strange place for a country club. Listen to this. We pull up to a park, people smoking, drinking, passed out in the grass. Guys are shooting hoops at 7.30 in the morning on a Saturday. There's about...
• 5:18
  20 brothers. They're all firing jumpers and playing. We get out of the bus. We have to go across the basketball court. Listen to these two tennis courts. We get out and they go, hey, Richard. Hey, King Richard. They call this guy King Richard. This was 1991. Listen to this. And then they go, hey, VW, Venus Williams. Hey, meet Serena Jameka Williams. That was Serena's middle name. We go across the basketball court.
• 5:46
  It parts like the Red Sea. This is, I'm just like freaking out, you know. We go onto the court. I had a box of Wilson tennis balls shipped there. He goes, brother, man, we don't use new balls. I want old balls. I want them digging and bending and reaching. We don't use new balls. I'm going, whoa, this guy's, he's on the other side of the tracks than me. So we go onto the tennis court. Me and you wouldn't play on the court.
• 6:16
  tracked up nets have holes in it. We go to net post. There's a shopping cart with seven chains wrapped around it. Okay. I'm sitting there going, we waited 20 minutes. It took him that long to get all these chains off the shopping cart. He goes, Rick got to secure it. It won't be here in the morning. Okay. Then he takes these old balls, puts them in the cart. Now it's showtime. I start feeding balls to Venus and Serena.
• 6:46
  I didn't see anything, nothing. Arms, hair, legs, they had beads in their hair. Beads were flying off. I'm going, this is a joke. I saw some athleticism, but I didn't see anything. But it's a great lesson. Any parent, coach, Rick Macy, or you, never judge a book by the cover. The cover amazing, the book bad. Cover amazing, book bad. So I didn't see anything. And remember, I had Capriati, poetry in motion,
• 7:16
  Racket back in the parking lot, low center of gravity, great fundamentals. I mean, Jennifer was amazing. Okay, now I'm seeing this, something that was out of control. Maybe 100 in the United States, but I see that movie every day of my life. So then the whole landscape changed. I said, let's play competitive points.
• 7:39
  It was going to be me and Serena against Venus because Venus was more mature. Serena was in outer space. She wasn't even there yet. A plane would fly by and she'd wave at it. I'm going, I don't think this girl's going to be number one in the world, you know? So we start playing competitive points. I'm getting near the end here. The whole landscape changed. There was a burning desire inside these two little girls. I never saw my whole life.
• 8:08
  Ever, ever. They'd run so hard for the ball. A couple of times they fell down. I don't see that in girls. That doesn't mean you're going to be number one in the world, but that's going to help you in the game of life. Okay? And then because we were competing,
• 8:28
  They started popping the popcorn, extra butter. The feet got better. The shoulders turned. The technical got a little better, but it was still a mess. I just saw something I never saw before. Now I'm thinking, because if you were big and strong in the early 90s, you weren't nimble. Very different, I said.
• 8:48
  5'10", 145. This is the coach evaluating. Six feet, 160. I'm projecting like when they're 17. I told Richard, this is in the movie. Come here, buddy. Let me tell you something. You got the next female Michael Jordan on your hand. He puts his arm around me. He goes, no brother, man. I got the next two. Okay. So four months later, I go.
• 9:13
  I rolled the dice. We did a contract. $92,000 motorhome, salary, Disney tickets, condo, golf court, my time, hitting partners, taekwondo, boxing, ballet. I was on a mission that not only, okay, this is all on video and print, not only could these girls become number one, okay, they were going to transform the sport. And it was a mystery, but we changed history.
• 9:45
  Before we hit record, you were talking about your new protege, and I don't want to go there yet, but your eyes lit up. Is desire the one attribute that you look for in these killer tennis individuals that you work with? Well, it's one of the most important, okay, what's inside someone is,
• 10:09
  And as I said earlier, what you may see is different than Rick may see. I look on the inside how they compete. That's the number one job of any coach, football, baseball, basketball, to get the player to compete better. And I saw that with Venus and Serena. It was baked in double crispy from birth. That was already there. That means one thing.
• 10:31
  You're going to handle pressure better. You know, when the fans are in the stands, you want, everybody gets nervous and you're going to blink. They were all about the competition. Now you got to have the thoroughbred who win a derby, but now I'm seeing speed, quickness, size, strength, you know, and I'm seeing all these things that the biomechanical part or the technical part or the strategic, I can put that together. Like I did with Capriotti.
• 10:58
  Sharapova, Kennan, Vaskina, Hirsch, Roddick. Okay, that's the easier part. But you got to put it on someone that already brings something to the table. So, yes, you can become a better competitor as you go down the Ellicott road. But if that's what you're all about, and that's what you see in Coco Ga. Coco Ga, family of athletes, they were competing all the time.
• 11:23
  Then if you have other qualities, it makes life a lot easier. That's a beautiful story. I want to set the people that are listening to this. If you're not on YouTube or Spotify watching it, Rick is a 71-year-old white dude. And he's not assuming at all. And for him to be in Compton, California in 1991, we're in the height of the gangster rap
• 11:49
  era. That was when Dr. Dre, who was Compton, California, was just launching. So I believe we're only a couple of years removed from the Rodney King beating. So this is the Rodney King riots, I should say. I commend you. This is what I see in you, Rick. I'm re-listening to Think and Grow Rich. And it talks about you have to have faith
• 12:12
  desire, and then take action. You're the action component of this. They had the faith, they had the desire, they needed to take the massive action. And that's what you do. Do you agree with that? Absolutely. You know, listen, if I don't roll the dice and, you know, fund the whole project, what would they have been great? Probably, but I expedited the learning curve,
• 12:37
  I added some sprinkles and cherries and help them become bulletproof. Like Venus and Serena said at the after party, after the red carpet, the movie, when we all got together, they said, the best compliment I've ever had in my life. She goes, Rick, you and daddy brainwashed us to become number one. So I can't go too deep into the positivity and the atmosphere every day, you know, about thinking big and
• 13:05
  I just do this different than anybody in the world. And that's why I can get people to move mountains and extract. I extract greatness out of someone, whether you're just going to play high school tennis, you're going to go to college, you know, if they buy in and then you're bringing some genetics to the table, I can bring out greatness. So you've said they didn't just change tennis, they transcended it. What did you mean by that? And what's that mean to you now?
• 13:34
  Yeah, well, in the early 90s, if you were big and strong, you weren't super fast or nimble. They brought a different athlete. Forget the African-American community, which they flipped that script and more have gotten involved. That speaks for itself, obviously. But they were Olympic sprinters with a racket in their hand. And their backbone was actually better than their backhand. Okay, I'm just telling you, now you got people in other countries who,
• 14:03
  Maybe instead of their daughter going into volleyball or track and field, whether it be Belarus, Russia, Ukraine, tennis, there's so much money at the top, a different athlete has come in. And now if you watch women's tennis now, many, many people, 5'11", 6'2", but the difference is they can all fly. You know what I mean? Where before it was, it's like that in all sports, that's sports in general.
• 14:33
  Everything's quicker, faster, bigger, and stronger. But Venus and Serena, we flipped the script. And listen, there was people telling me Venus doesn't move that well. I think it was some ballet dancer did a Broadway. I'm going, I don't know what that guy's looking at. Because she could cover the court in two strides. And there was a rage. And you know when you have a rage, you run even faster. So they changed the game.
• 15:03
  into tennis for sure it's the people that you've worked with the talent is is outstanding so you must have an eye to evaluate talent what are your eyes catching that others don't like you just said you talked about venus not being fast what are you seeing that others are missing
• 15:25
  I don't know about other people because they're playing checkers and I'm playing chess. You know, I do this for a living. I evaluate talent, just like the little Ukrainian girl I have we can talk about later. They can't project. People look at something right now and they make a decision, but they don't understand, you know, five more inches, 20 more pounds, one more foot. You know, it's a big difference when you're 10 and 16.
• 15:55
  They don't look like that. I've always projected and I've always analyzed things since I was a kid to figure it out. And it's not just tennis. It's all sports, whether it be quarterback. I mean, I'm very good friends with a lot of people in other sports. And I give them my opinion. I just see it differently. It's all the intangibles, the nuances.
• 16:17
  The subtle things that people do, whether it be a quarterback or a basketball player. I played point guard back in the day in the Hall of Fame in my high school. I just I always look at it differently. I never look at it vanilla on the outside. I don't look at it like that. And I always go deeper.
• 16:35
  And I just knew if Venus and Serena had the opportunity, the best hitting partners, and obviously the best coaching of how to build something that could get there, but more importantly, stay there. Many people can get there maybe, but they disappear. Like Casper, the ghost, they could stay there. So that was it. You know, that, that was it with them. And so I don't know what other people look at.
• 17:06
  They look at the forehand or the backhand of the serve. They look at the wrong movie. I always look at the inside, number one. Then I go to the genetics. Did the mom or dad, were they a boxer, a weightlifter? Did they play track and field, volleyball, NFL, NBA? Listen, I've had so many people in the NBA or National Hockey League where their kids came to me. The genetics were there, but they were a marshmallow.
• 17:37
  They wouldn't go for the jugular. Maybe clutch both ways. Maybe too much money. Maybe entitlement. You know, you want your kid rough and tough, but then you go to the mall and buy him a Gucci bag. That doesn't work, okay? This is an art to this, of how to tug him and squeeze him. That's what I love about Richard Williams. Listen.
• 17:57
  My time with Richard Williams, I should be in the Hall of Fame just putting up with that guy. You know, if you saw the movie, that guy was brutal, brutal. But I was in it for the girls, not about Richard, even though he was my best friend. So and I respect him as a dad, amazing father. And that trumped everything. So that's kind of what I what I look for is like what's on the inside, then the genetic base. Because listen, sports is about movement.
• 18:25
  You know, if you can move, I mean, speed and quickness, and that's in the eye of the beholder. Okay. Even if you're nervous, you can save the day because you can play defense and hang in. You know what I mean? So I always look for the movement, the genetic part. And then on the inside, are you going to go for the jugular?
• 18:43
  Rick, I own several businesses, and this podcasting is just absolutely exploding and having fun, but you're literally giving people the recipe for business as well. If you own a company, which a lot of the Heart of the Life Nation does, he just gave you the recipe when you're hiring people. Find somebody who has the desire
• 19:04
  who has the potential and then wants to take action and help them, lead them to take action. Could you have predicted what happened to Tiger Woods? Did you see something in him that said that he would go softer? He was doing something. I see you as an athlete, as a success whisperer. You mean the way he exploded or the way it blew up at the end? The way it blew up. Well, let me go with the entry first.
• 19:33
  I saw greatness genetically because there was extreme athleticism with the father, African-American, okay? And the mom who was Oriental and there was a calming skill, okay? He got the daily double. He got the intensity and the calmness. Listen, you can be rough and tough, but you got to have the intensity and the calmness to create the ideal performance stage.
• 20:02
  And no one handled pressure better than Tiger. But I think his thing, no, I couldn't see what was going to happen. Everything changed in his personal life. And then the injury set in. Now you're playing catch-up.
• 20:17
  OK, so I think people should look at it for what it is and not look at it like we never caught Nicholas because let's face it. The competition was different and people will agree he's the greatest golfer to ever swung the stick, period. Yeah. What's the first thing you fix when you meet these raw talent? And this is a great time to talk about your new talent, the nine year old that you were gushing about. What I would bet you see the same thing in a lot of people.
• 20:44
  What is that? First off, there's going to have to be eventually an alignment with the parents. You know, if the parents are like crazy, which that's not all bad. You got to be a little bit. You know what I mean? Like who's going to come out this morning at four o'clock when it's 30 degrees and have a lesson with me?
• 21:02
  Okay, not a lot, but there was a nine year old from Dubai. So listen, it is what it is. You gotta get uncomfortable to get comfortable. Okay, if you do things you don't wanna do, your mind gets stronger. Okay, but a lot of people don't understand. It's the exact opposite. And so they're improving because they do physical things, but they're not developing the mental part. So to answer your question,
• 21:28
  To me, the first thing is the movement. Okay, that's the biggest thing because tennis is a movement sport. You look at Nadal, Federer, Djokovic, the one common thread, they all can fly. You look at Alcarez Center, they all can fly. Okay, that is an X factor. It's not the four and back and serve. That becomes the icing, but the cake is movement. Okay, so I look at that first. Listen, if you're a donkey,
• 21:57
  I can make you a world-class donkey. Trust me. Or if you're a turtle, I can make you a better turtle, but you're still a turtle. Okay. It is. I'm not going to make a donkey into thoroughbred. I'm not, and I'm not passing judgment. Everybody can improve a lot. But what you and I are talking about to be one of the best in the world, that's rare error.
• 22:21
  You got to have more stuff in your pocket genetically. That's good. I mean, 100 in the world, that's nothing to sneeze about. Or going to University of Georgia or Florida on a full, that's great. But what we're talking about for me, because listen, ever since Venus and Serena, I never dove in, even though I've asked 10,000 times, I got the next Serena. If you knew about the videos I get, I got the next, I got the next.
• 22:49
  for the last 20 years. And I never dove in. I said, listen, you wanna come here and play, play with other kids, but I can't get involved. And I'm definitely not bankrolling anything. And I'm not gonna get into that game until the little Ukrainian, okay? A good friend of mine, Peter Bodo, senior writer, tennis.com. He said, Rick, you gotta take a look at this girl.
• 23:14
  And I said, Peter, I seen the movie so many times. Send me a video. Send me the video. I didn't see anything. She was seven years old. The racket's as big as her. I saw some athletic ability, but I'm not going, wow. But I didn't do that with Venus and Serena. And I was there in Compton, you know, all the brothers going, I don't see it. So I said, listen, if they want to come here.
• 23:38
  So I can see it live and in color. When I see it live and in color, when I can feel it, taste it, smell it, interact with the parent, when I can go under the hood more, I'll get a better feel. So they showed up on a Saturday, just like yesterday. This was two years ago. I was teaching a 12-year-old boy, had her come on a court. You know me by now.
• 24:00
  I want to get right to the competition. We're not going to date for like four months. I'm going right in there. So I could put her on the floor with a 12-year-old boy. After five minutes, come looking at the mom, like about 5'8", 5'9". I'm already scoping the whole thing out. The speed, it was like on steroids. The quickness and the athleticism. I'm going, interesting. And it was personal. Personal.
• 24:30
  already personal between her and the ball. I'm going, whoa, now you get that in a female athlete. With a guy, you got to have that, or you're not going anywhere at like high level. And right then and there, I said, listen, if you guys want to move to Florida, she can come to the academy. It's expensive. I can't give her private lessons and stuff like that. No contract. But if you want to come here, it's a lot better than New York, Vermont. You can play tournaments every weekend, blah, blah, blah.
• 25:01
  They saw the movie King Richard, obviously, and they knew of me. And it was almost like God sent them to me. And they said, we're moving. Here's where it gets interesting. Now, they said, we're moving. They move here on their own. Okay. Now she's on the court. And I'm watching it all the time, every day for 30 days. Besides doing what I do. I'm going, I see where this is going. I'm going.
• 25:29
  I go to the parents if you're interested. I would do the same thing or similar I did for Venus and Serena. I've never done it in my life. I haven't done it since 1999. I've been asked 10,000 times. Now, this is a seven-year-old. You almost have to be insane because it's not like there could be major endorsements from Nike or someone at 14. This is a long way to go. So I'm thinking...
• 25:58
  I got to dive in, but she needs me. I got to get involved. And I'm already teaching all the time. So we did a contract, 20-year contract. I coach her. I represent her. Listen to this. I coach her, represent her. I take care of a lot of stuff. Blah, blah, blah. The finish line is down the road. But let's back the truck up. And let's see where this starts. Now, two years ago,
• 26:25
  She was a 3.1 UTR. You probably don't know what that means, but that's just like a ranking. That doesn't really mean anything. Two years later, she's an 8.2, the highest ever in the history, that means history, of the UTR. She's only 4'6", 68 pounds. She's already beaten the best 12-year-olds
• 26:51
  OK, in the United States. And she's the size of that microphone you're talking in. OK, it's what she plays the ball. She doesn't leave the baseline. It's personal. When she played the Orange Bowl, everybody could see her live and in color. Every manufacturer, apparel and racket, which I know them all and they know me. And they've seen videos and they've seen everything and they've heard of her. Freak out. No one's ever saying like it.
• 27:19
  The way she's been put together, I changed all her strokes. She doesn't back up. She's like Joe Frazier. She's staying in there punching. She's playing the ball. If she can get to it, three, four more inches, 20 more pounds, it's going to explode even more. But more importantly, the best part of her game is not what you see on the outside, which is crazy. She won't go away.
• 27:43
  Even if she's getting squished like a bug, she won't go away. Every interview her and I do, okay? I could have had her here today if you wanted. Every interview that we do, they ask her, what do you love about tennis? The competition. I love to compete. Okay. Instead of, oh, I like friends. I like to play. All about the competition. When you keep score, she's relentless. Or I wouldn't have got into this. And one final thing. I love the mom and dad.
• 28:13
  We're all in alignment. She's a little kid. She needs to go to the water park. She needs to be with her friends. She has to get straight A's. She's going to Disney World. Since I'm kind of the agent too, there's no rush to do anything. I could do a deal right now. Okay, right now, if I wanna do something, I'm not getting in bed with anybody.
• 28:34
  It's slow. She's going to be a kid. Listen, I raised three daughters by myself from age 13. So I know that drill also. I should be in the Hall of Fame for that besides Richard Williams raising three daughters by myself. So I get it. I get it. And more importantly, she's like my fourth daughter. I love the little girl. I love the family. We're on a mission. There's no rush. And what I love more than anything, even though we started at seven, I'm
• 29:00
  If we'd have started at 12, obviously the financial part's going to come back the other way down the road. Sooner, I can bop and weave, go through the front door, the back door, the side door, the chimney. I can tweak and adjust. I've modified every part of her game technically. Okay? And I'm putting together something when she goes into pro tennis that they've never seen. Because I'm going to be way ahead of the curve. It's going to be quicker and faster, the game.
• 29:30
  And like I said, we're already talking about Coco Ga, Mira and Draven. The people are there, but I'm also worried about who's in the rearview mirror. And so this is how I do things. And like I said, the most important thing, when she's not on the tennis court, she's the nicest little girl you'd ever want to meet. And she can just go bang.
• 29:54
  You know, it's kind of like that football player when he puts on the helmet. He's like a crazed assassin that just wants to terminate you. And then he walks off and he's the nicest human being you want to meet. How you get it, you can't buy it over the internet. You can't buy it at Publix or Walgreens. I don't know where that came from, but that was another gold nugget that I saw inside this child. Every box is checked and I'm building something the game hasn't seen. You are one hell of a leader. Uh,
• 30:25
  First of all, again, I'm going to go back to my listeners. And I want to say, if you're not picking up that this man cares about his athletes, that's the number one thing to be a leader is to care about your people. Having three daughters, he comes from the experience.
• 30:43
  What I'm observing from this, Rick, and I do this in my company as well, I like to find people that had a rough upbringing that maybe didn't have it so...
• 30:56
  you know, rainbows and unicorns, that had a little bit of scarcity, that had a little bit of hardship. That gives them that killer instinct. And it sounds like that's what a majority of these people have done. How do you harness that and keep that burning desire going? Because that sounds like what happened with Tiger, how he just lost, we'll use eye of the tiger. It's like they lost that chip on their shoulder. And it's ironic.
• 31:24
  Because that very chip is what drove me to success. I've done so much therapy that I've put that chip down, but I've kept on because for me, it was all about my purpose. Is that what it is for you? And how are you keeping these athletes with that proverbial chip on their shoulders so they continue to grow? First off, great question. It's a team effort.
• 31:48
  Or I wouldn't have gotten involved with this, with Vlada. Her name's the Panther. That's her nickname because she's always on the attack, the Panther. You'll Google it. You'll see what I'm talking about. Listen, the parents, they're from Ukraine. The mom went back to visit her mom because she was sick. And bombs are going off two miles away. You got to understand, this is hardcore on steroids. And that's way before Rick Macy got involved at age seven.
• 32:17
  So there's an appreciation, like you said, there's some rough and toughness, like I saw in Venus and Serena coming from Compton. You have a different perspective. You know what I mean? You have gratitude, you have appreciation. That's very important. You gotta have that. Even if your parents are a billionaire, you gotta have that. So it's not like, cause Pagula, she's one of the best in the world. So is Navarro and both their parents are billionaires, but they're great competitors, but that's kind of rare.
• 32:46
  When you're hungry and you, people don't know what that means. That's such a big word. Just like coaching. What is coaching? I can tell that's a whole nother podcast. Hunger is hard to describe. It's a different level of hunger. And this girl's hardcore. Like I told the mom, listen, if you want to sleep in today, you can come a little later. You know what her comment was? I can sleep in my next lifetime. Rick, I can answer your question though. Hunger is,
• 33:16
  For people like me that I grew up literally hungry, and there was no food in the house, it's, you've said it from the very first question I asked you, it's desire, a burning desire to succeed and to win. And really it's not even just to win, it's to just grow, the next step, the next step, a burning desire. So people that are listening to this, if you're a worker, if you're a manager, if you're an owner,
• 33:43
  It's having that burning desire to take that next step and just get a little bit better and doing that day in and day out from age seven until 14 and then keep going. And that's what happened with Tiger. He stopped going. You just said something. And I think the viewers would like this. You know, my dad died when I was 10 years old. I was a very good golfer. Okay. I had a four handicap.
• 34:09
  Back then they called me the arrow. Now it's a sparrow. I can't even hit it that straight. So I've changed over time. So at age 12, I picked up a tennis racket. Okay, went down to the local park, taught myself how to play. Listen to this, no lessons, hit against the wall. I love the wall. I love Wally. It always came back. There was no arguing. By 18 years old, I was the number one player in Ohio Valley, no instruction.
• 34:38
  After basketball practice, my mom would drive me back to the school, behind the school, shovel snow, her lights on behind me with my T2000, and I'd be pumping balls for an hour after basketball practice, full day of school, just hit ground strokes because we couldn't afford to go indoor, okay? And I didn't have a lot of people to play with because I got real good real quick because I was athletic. So all those gold nuggets and cornerstones are inside of me
• 35:07
  And that's a big part of the way I teach. And I have as much passion at 71 as I had at 22. And I'm even busier now than ever, but this is what I do. I bring it out of other people and I don't settle. I never settle. I never settle. I never settle. And if you're not getting better, you're getting worse. And I prefer better. I prefer better. Listen.
• 35:35
  With everything I've been fortunate to accomplish and all the people I've coached and all that stuff, there's 300 and some national titles. And everybody's a seven-time coach a year. I could go in. But I'm just trying to get better. And I'm totally focused on whoever in front of me. That hour, that minute, that second, I'm going to do the best I can for that person. Your little Ukrainian girl is different because I represent her too.
• 36:02
  But this is for any business. Okay, it's what you expect of you. And see, I do this very different. I lead by example. I haven't sat down on a tennis court in 35 years. I still pick up the balls. I've done a podcast. People go, wait, why do you pick up the balls? I said, well, in 20 years, they've never jumped up and went into the basket on their own. Or like, why do you answer your own phone? I said, it's ringing. I'm a different cat.
• 36:30
  Okay, I lead by example. Okay, I get in, I've been in that routine. I've become a machine. I get up every day at one o'clock. I run a half mile. I work out. I open up the park, Rick Macy Tennis Center, three o'clock, four o'clock, I'm on there. Listen, at 71, I'm a park ranger. I can put that on my resume. This is seven days. It works for me, but my mind has been trained. When I see garbage, I don't look at it like, why don't these people pick up garbage or whatever?
• 37:00
  I look at it as exercise. I look at it differently. That's why I still sweep the sidewalks. I have humility. And I still have those Midwest qualities inside of me. I treat others better than myself. Besides, I, if you saw the movie, I extract greatness different. I'm not like Bobby Knight. I'm not going to throw a chair at you. Okay, I do it differently. I can be rough and tough and go for the jugular, but then know how to come back around the other way
• 37:30
  And lift, lift. And that's what people should do. Everybody should be trying to get better. And the best motivator for anybody, whether it be a leader or an employee, is in the mirror. All greatness comes from you. People can help you, but they're there to help you. It has to come from you. But people, they like to gossip. They like to mess around. They're okay with mediocrity, but they're going to complain about it.
• 38:00
  everybody's aware what they put, they should be in their mouth, okay? But they're not aware what they put in their brain. They should listen to guys like me and you and YouTube and get off of the negative stuff because that just, this is why people say, how do you have so much energy? I don't know that I have that much energy. It's just that I never make excuses. I look at everything to a different lens, but that I've trained myself to do that for 30 years.
• 38:30
  And I'm exactly the same way. But the main thing I have that gift to be able to present it to other people in a way where they understand it. Well, maybe a guy with a PhD or a sports psychologist, you know, I leave him in the rear view mirror. So good. You're a beautiful human being. This is a masterclass in all things. You said practice makes the master, averages the enemy. Yeah.
• 38:57
  Before I ask you the next question of what separates good from legendary, I got to ask you, I'll be remiss. I heard you push in Ohio. Where were you born? Yeah, a small town, Greenville, Ohio, 10,000 people, 20 miles southwest of Dayton, Ohio. Had the best childhood ever, even though I lost my father at age 10. It's like,
• 39:18
  It was the best. You know what I mean? You don't know, you don't know what's going on and you just love it. And, uh, I just, I loved it in court. Number one, there were six tennis courts and I just, I was there every day. I mean, I would, I'd be serving balls in the rain. I know what hard work is and that's why I try to get that out of others. Totally weird question. It's been 61 years since your dad left the earth. Um,
• 39:46
  Was there ever a conversation? How many conversations have you had with him that you wish you could have had in person? Well, that's an interesting question. You know, I was so young. I didn't even understand what was going on. Other than, you know, he always took me to pump, pass and kick. And he did a lot of athletic things with me with golf and so on.
• 40:06
  I think I was just too young and naive, 10 years old to lose your dad. And that's kind of brutal. It was just me, my mom and my sister. But, you know, I never look back. It is what it is like. You know, I've trained my mind that, you know, I have problems just like you. I anticipate problems. So they're not a problem. And I deal with them differently. So I wouldn't change anything. I've had like
• 40:31
  I have no regrets at all about anything. Is that what makes you a great dad? Am I a great dad? My daughter's, hey, am I a great dad? That just cost me $100. Okay, yeah, I guess so. So listen...
• 40:48
  Yeah, I think so. I bet you're wondering why I asked you that. I'm a very, I believe in that there is a higher power talking to us. And I just worked on some conversations with my therapist yesterday that I wish I could have had with my dad. My father was sick.
• 41:06
  for many many years from eight till he finally passed around when i was 22 and there were conversations i just wish i had as a young man um there was a lot to be desired a lot left on the table my father was super super smart but didn't have that burning desire to get better and he basically just gave up and
• 41:30
  I don't like that to this day. And when I see that in people, I'm like you, I see potential and I see it in everybody. It gets me in trouble. So I just, I, I, I'm a fellow Midwest guy. I grew up in Detroit and I just, I look in a mirror when I see you. And I, I just wanted to ask you that question. I know it seemed odd, but let's go. No, I love it. But, you know, to, to expand upon that, you know, my mom was very much like me.
• 41:59
  She just always said, you'll figure it out. You'll figure it out. You always figure it out. You always figure it out. She never, you know, because you got to understand, I deal with craziness. You could imagine, you know, Stefano Capriotti, Yuri Sharapova, Jim Pierce. I've had the tennis fathers from outer space. So you got to understand. But this, that was my mom. Always supported, just loved.
• 42:25
  You'll figure it out. You'll figure it out. You know, you're special. You're different. You're wired different. Okay? You're wired different. Even when I was a little kid, six years old, I'd write her poems and leave little notes in the refrigerator and under the table. And a big part of the way I teach is rhymes and association and these Macy-isms that are pretty much known around the world. You know, just to expedite that learning curve. And kids remember, people come back.
• 42:52
  And they come back with the one-liners, you know what I mean? And so my mom was like, just so supportive. You'll figure it out. You're different. You're very different. You'll figure it out. And that is a big part of me.
• 43:08
  made me more diverse as a teacher and a role model. I'm a big fan. Again, you keep going down these paths where I feel like I'm looking in the mirror. So I always, I trust me. I trust you, but I trust you because I trust me. Yeah. I trust that I'm going to figure out. And how do you go about teaching? Because I literally just gave this,
• 43:31
  Year first, the start of the year speech to my cybersecurity firm, my AI cybersecurity firm. And I said, guys, we have to have the courage to believe in ourselves and lean and trust on ourselves. How do you instill? I can hear that you have it because I have it. Game recognizes game.
• 43:52
  How do you give that to these individuals, that belief in themselves, that they're going to figure it out and they're going to be OK no matter what? Well, every day at 10 o'clock, I give a speech to all the kids, whether they're five years old, 10 years old, 18 and to the parents. Everybody reports it. They put it in their journal. I make everybody write it down because, listen, all these people hear me.
• 44:19
  but they maybe not will be listening. There's a big difference. And I have the voice obviously, and the platform and the pedigree if they're not gonna listen to me. So they're gonna listen a little bit more, but this is a process and that's the art of coaching. When to say it, how to say it, why to say it, who to say it to, how loud, how soft, how I do with an eight year old is different than a 12 year old or someone on the pro tour. I worked with over like 30 girls on the pro tour
• 44:49
  that come in even with their coaches. There's an art to all of this stuff. But what I do, it's a constant drumbeat. You can't say, oh, they're a bad student. It's not where you start. It's where you finish. And it's brick by brick. Just like any business, people want it yesterday, especially in today's society. That's nonsense. You might get lucky.
• 45:11
  But it's brick by brick. You cannot take the escalator. You got to take the stairs. And I teach them every single day. Little, little, little. And then we're here, you know. And no matter what your ceiling is, whether you just want to play high school tennis, go to college free or pro or you have number one. There's no doubt in Vlada, the little panther, she'd be number one.
• 45:36
  She's going to be number one. We're not going to stop until we get there. So what I'm trying to say is it's this constant 24-7 as me, like you said, being a leader or running the show. It's every single day I'm pepper spraying, whether it be in a text message, verbally. I'm always there, almost like they're boxed in because their parents are going to have some influence on them, obviously. And you can't always trump that.
• 46:04
  That's if the parents have a lot of money, because that could kind of shift. Oh, you know, I'm not going to be as hungry. But I keep them in a box, and they're trapped like a rat. Okay, and I keep pepper. So I'm working on them mentally. The tennis part's easy for me, mentally. And when I get them to run for every ball, not make excuses, okay, I see them like it was freezing today. You know, like three or four kids came up to me and said, it's kind of warm today, isn't it?
• 46:35
  Cause I tell them to flip it. Cause you think it's cold. It just got colder. If you think it's hot, it just got a lot harder. And so it's all mind control. And when I get, they might just be saying that to get a hoodie from me or something. But when I get them to think like that, I know I'm making a difference, not only in their game, but in their life. And especially at this stage of my life, that's the best feeling in the world. Rick, you got to write a book, man. Yeah. I keep thinking about Trevor. Yeah.
• 47:05
  Did you? Macy Magic. There's a book I did a while back about everything. And then I did Billion Dollar Mind. I did it with one of the top neurologists. Yeah. Top neurologists in the world. I actually taught her and her sister. She's like one of the best doctors in the world. Yeah. We did a book together. It was a great thing. She reached out to me. I came at it from
• 47:28
  the way I'm coming at it with you. She came at it from your brain point of view. So we had, and it kind of validated everything I've done my whole career. She's like, whoa. So I loved it. It's a great book. Everybody loves it. So you keep reminding me, you're the tennis version of Trevor Moab, who was the football version. And then I think football coach, he coached all the top football athletes about mindset. And then there's...
• 47:55
  for basketball, he coached Kobe and Michael. You're the tennis version of that. And you're the real deal, my friend. Well, wait, let me chime in with that. What I do is a little different. It's one thing, whether it's Jordan and Kobe and these people,
• 48:15
  The product is almost finished. The house is kind of built. And you can put a different paint on it to make it, like you said, flip the script mentally. I build the box. I get it at Publix. I put it in the oven. I bake it. I put the icing on it. Then there's sprinkles. I'd rather build the box than sit in the box. I do it differently. I build. And that's why you have...
• 48:42
  Venus and Serena, I said when they were little, I'd be number one in the world. Capriati, number one in the world. Sharapova, she'll be number one in the world. She's in a bubble, number one in the world. Sophia Kennan, at eight years old, she'll win a grand slam, won a grand slam. Now, have I been wrong? Yeah. Someone's father passed away, girl broke both her wrists. But I don't say that. I've only said it like,
• 49:08
  eight times and five of them, it's true. And this is at a young age. When you predict legendary or greatness and they're still a kid, people don't like that. And even you said, pressure expectations. I flip it, it's a compliment.
• 49:23
  Listen, if your phone ain't ringing and no one's talking about you, you might as well be dead. You might as well be dead. You're toast. You're toast. People got it backwards. You want pressure. It's a compliment. It's a privilege. You want expectation. When that article came out yesterday on CNN and 15 million people saw it about that, there's going to be people throwing knives and daggers.
• 49:48
  And haymakers, listen, I don't care about that. It's me, the little panther, the mom and dad, and we're going like that. There's a wall up. I've been through this my whole life, okay? Whatever happens, happens. But at the end of the day, she's going to have a great childhood. And no matter where this ends up, even though she'll be number one, all these qualities is going to make her a superstar on and off the court.
• 50:15
  Success leaves clues and not once, except for a couple of little Macy-isms that I hear you talk about you. And I would say that your compassion, your consistency, your kindness, those are all things that make you a great leader. But what is the one thing that will separate someone who's good from someone who's legendary? Wait, say that again. Someone, a player, I mean, who's good?
• 50:44
  What's the difference between being good and legendary? You mean a coach or player? Player. Oh, listen, no matter what anybody says, it's a package. It's not one thing. You know, it's not one thing. It's a package. But the number one thing, every sport, the greatest players of all time in any sport, it's a game of inches from one ear to another. It's the mental part.
• 51:13
  To forget. That's the most important thing in life. We both know people that are still mad about things 20 years ago. I don't know what that guy's problem is. Listen, you got to remember to forget. And this is the toughest thing in the sport that I do. It's brutal. You got 20 seconds to flip it in your mind like it happened 20 years ago. Go back to the fence. Come back out and feel like it's your birthday. You know, like you feel great.
• 51:40
  And you can't have that baggage. So it's the mental part that I work with people more on, because when I get them to get in that routine, as I said earlier, you become a machine.
• 51:53
  I'm enjoying the heck out of this, but we're coming up to the end. I have two more questions and then a quick five rapid fire, and I got to plug and bring this thing home. So what's one thing you still want to change about youth sports or tennis, the tennis world before you you're done? Well, first off, I'm never going to be done. I'll probably hit the dirt. Listen, when you're retired, you die. Listen, it's the craziest thing.
• 52:22
  I know I'm just being honest the way I'm put together. Could I just jump in for a second? I just thought I'm 50 years old. I just was thinking about retiring at 60 and I, I got the chills and I'm like, Oh, no, no, no. I, I, so I'm with you on that. I don't think I'll ever retire ever. Not listen. I listen. The only one that would like that would be my cat. I'd be petting the cat like eight hours a day. I'd probably, I'd be able to train him. He'd probably be doing footwork drills and everything else. I'm just put, I'm wired different. I'm a different animal. Um,
• 52:52
  I say that all the time. And I love that. I, we, I, it's like, I'm looking into a mirror, man. We got to connect. So we're so close. I'm going to, I'm going to come up and visit. By the way, that 10 AM, um, speech that you give every day, is it a motivational speech? Yeah. It's one, it depends on if I have 10 kids there or 50, um,
• 53:15
  I kind of take the temperature of the parents and whatever, but there's some messages I send to the parents and they don't know I'm sending the message to the parents. You know, I can, I can go through the side door. I can slide a little bit, but no, it's like anybody recording them. Cause I've loved it. Yeah. Everything's recorded on YouTube. You know? So yeah, no, it's, it's,
• 53:40
  Sorry, I got excited. I do that. What's the one thing you want to change in the tennis world before you can't do it anymore? I'm going to change the game with this little girl. That's the one thing that's going to happen. But as far as the game, there's nothing I would really change because unfortunately it's getting faster and everybody's getting bigger. The rackets are like AK-47s. The strings are very explosive. It's so much power, but it's like that in every sport.
• 54:10
  You know, so there's nothing that I would really change. I just got to change the way I know it's going to be in six years. So the little Panthers lock, loaded and ready to launch. So there's nothing that I would really change about the game of tennis. And I just want to keep doing what I'm doing, because even today I got better. But more importantly, I got mentally stronger today. Being out there when it's 30 degrees, teaching at four o'clock.
• 54:37
  You know, I looked at it as an opportunity to get better mentally. And with all I've accomplished, I look at things differently, you know, through all life is perspective. And people have the wrong perspective. And so if I'm out there doing what I do, they almost feel guilty. I got to get out there and do the same thing when you lead by example. So I wouldn't change anything about tennis.
• 55:03
  And Rick, you keep saying you look at things differently and you're different. You're not. You're right. You're spot on, my friend. And at least in my book, I say that to myself a lot. I wish I didn't. We're not different. We're just, we just want so much more. That's it. It's not different. I have so many friends, Fortune 500 companies. I mean, I could have run a Fortune 500 company. I could have been a basketball coach. I could have done anything different.
• 55:30
  Okay, because once I go, I don't let go. Okay, I don't let go.
• 55:37
  And that's why I don't settle. I just keep going, you know, and everybody gets comfortable. And even with everything I've been fortunate to accomplish, I just keep going. And it's what you expect of you. It's that game between Rick and Rick, you know, that I play. And I motivate myself every single day because that's what I expect of myself. But I've done this for so long. It just grows. So here I am.
• 56:06
  Self-taught, no lessons, and probably one of the leaders in the clubhouse in the sport that I've been teaching my whole life. Final question, but I do have a comment. I would say in the game, I'd like to see more sportsmanship and especially treating yourself, the umpires, and the fans with respect. I see a lot of whining.
• 56:31
  a lot of complaining that I just would, you didn't see that years past, the smashing of the racket. Come on. Emotional intelligence needs to run rampant in all facets of this life, not just sports, in the world,
• 56:48
  in politics, in business, if we all look in the mirror, become better, this will be a better place. So just, I know that you already preached this, but I want everybody to understand, we all can rise too. Yes, there can only be one number one, but there can be a number two, a number three, a number four, and we can all rise together. What's a dream you haven't touched yet outside of tennis completely? Hmm.
• 57:17
  That's an interesting question. I know this is going to sound crazy, but I've had, I've had the best life. You know, I've been the most fortunate person ever. You know, if you look where it started and where I'm at and my goal right now, my goal right now. Okay. Uh, do this as long as I can, uh, stay healthy, you know, just knock on wood with that. And,
• 57:42
  keep changing lives because that's what I was meant to do. And I'm on a mission. Okay. And what I believe I'm going to achieve is with this little girl, Vlada the Panther, her rancher. I'm on a mission because I have a chance and it's not about me anymore. I'm a vessel. I'm a vessel or a conduit for her to reach her goal. And it's the daily double. I got one of the best athletes I've ever seen.
• 58:08
  that goes for the jugular, okay? And I'm putting together something the world hasn't seen. And that's my goal right now, besides my business and everything that goes on. And because this little girl deserves it because where they came from, escaping Ukraine, and it's the best feeling in the world. Like I said earlier, I'm not just gonna change her career.
• 58:38
  I've changed this whole family's life. And that's the best feeling in the world. And that's where I'm at it to stage the game. What you believe you will achieve. And remember, he just said that. That was Rick Macy. And when you believe it, you will see it. Guys, think of that. Not I'll see it when I believe it. I'll believe it when I see it. I'll believe it. I'll see it when I believe it.
• 59:04
  That's from me. Rapid fire. Five quick, five, six quick ones. Just one word to one sentence. One coaching moment that changed you. Yes, and Serena. I love it. Toughest player you've ever had to motivate. Serena. Best advice you ever got from a parent. Keep your mouth shut.
• 59:31
  I listened to that, especially from that crazy parent. It's mad. And we, that's the hardest thing we do. What do most athletes get wrong about competition? The mental part. One thing you do every day that has nothing to do with tennis. Pet my cat. What's the cat's name?
• 59:55
  Well, I got three of them, Buddy, Munchie, and Lucy. So I got three. I got the trifecta. All three of them. Lucy. I have a Felix the cat, by the way. A lesson you still teach today that you learned from Compton. Whether you're in the front row or the back row or not even the building, anything's possible. Anything's possible. These little girls came from 1991 Compton. If you don't know what that is, go check Eazy-E, any of these gangster rappers back in the day.
• 1:00:23
  I had a blast with you. I cannot wait to meet you in person. Rick offers virtual private lessons, video stroke analysis, and in-person biomechanical training through rickmacy.com. It'll be in the show notes. He also shares free coaching gems weekly via YouTube and is currently accepting a limited number of new private students at his Florida-based academy.
• 1:00:45
  I can't tell you enough of how awesome this was. This was a masterclass. So Rick, you don't just teach forehands and backhands. You teach belief. You turn sweat into skill and kids into champions. From Compton to Wimbledon, from hope to history, Rick has changed the game and the lives of those who dared to dream. If you love this conversation, be sure to follow Rick, dive into his videos, and remember, your limits are only as real.
• 1:01:15
  as you believe them to be. This has been harder than life. Please rate and share this podcast. I'm active on all social platforms and love to hear from my Segal supporters. Each and every episode is sponsored by my company, National Technology Management, the easiest and best IT company to do business with, delivering peace of mind with technology every day, even simplifying cybersecurity. Visit trustntm.com for more info. Until next week, be harder than life.