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E79: Reserve 'Hate' for What Deserves It - Words Matter · The Junto Podcast

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Hello, America. Welcome to the Junto podcast, where we promote the practical
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applications of critical thinking and bold creativity.
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I'm your host, Edgar Mills. Thank you for joining us.
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Welcome back. This is episode 79. a friend of mine suggested this topic. We're,
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going to talk about hate and the various sort of forms and whether or not we
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should be even using that word.
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It's a strong word. It's stronger than people give it credit for, for sure.
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And when I hear children use it flippantly, I got to wonder,
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do their parents use it flippantly?
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And I got to wonder, do they understand what they're saying?
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And do they understand, are they using it in its correct definition?
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And if they are, I got to wonder, are they good people?
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You know what I'm saying? So anyway, let me get to it here. There we go.
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All right. So...
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Yeah, the word gets thrown around a lot. The word gets thrown around a lot.
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So if a 10-year-old girl says, I hate my brother because he's constantly aggravating
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her, she probably doesn't hate her, brother.
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If a man says he hates his job because it's tedious, he probably doesn't hate it.
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If he did, I mean, he would just get another job.
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Or if he really hated it, whether he had another job or not,
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he'd quit, I think. It's not hate.
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It's irritation. It's aggravation. It's discomfort even sometimes.
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But the word carries weight, like I said.
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Now, you guys, pardon me for, I'm having a Coca-Cola right now. I never drink these.
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And I'll probably get hiccups as we're doing this.
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But anyway, I'm having one because I need it. All right.
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It carries weight. It carries weight. It ought to carry weight. It's a succinct word.
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There's no reason to change definitions or anything like that.
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It's much heavier than what people give it credit for, or the way it's most commonly used, I think.
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And if we keep using the heaviest word for the, you know, slight grievances,
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well, that sort of shapes our brain
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to treat any little ordinary everyday friction as like a moral attack.
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And then we start acting as if extreme reaction is valid because we said we
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hated things, so that warrants extreme reaction.
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And it's wrong. It's incorrect. That's the wrong way.
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You guys know I love to skim over the old philosophers, Stoics especially,
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but Aristotle pointed out pretty cleanly, and here's what he had to say about
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it. I paraphrase. I'm not quoting here.
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But anger versus hate, right?
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Anger aims at a specific human, a person who has slighted you,
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done you wrong in some way.
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And in anger you want that first person to feel the sting you want that person,
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to well change their behavior change their actions,
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and anger can can cool over time if that person comes to you and says hey man i'm sorry i,
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i i was i was irresponsible or i was just inconsiderate And I apologize.
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Yeah, well, that's it. Done.
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On the other hand, hate don't necessarily aim at individuals.
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There's individuals who say they hate other individuals, but from the perspective
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of Aristotle, hate aims at a group or a class or a type of person or a system or whatever.
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It wants the object of that hate erased deleted gone from the earth that's strong that is strong,
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time doesn't doesn't cure hate unlike anger anger eases it it's a in the moment
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oftentimes in a moment sort of thing hate is a long-term destruction.
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And individually, yeah, again, anger, if someone apologized to you or whatever,
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yeah, whatever, over a pint, hey, man, no problem.
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Hate, you're not going to sit down with someone you hate and have a pint.
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You want that individual gone, dead, deleted.
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That's strong. That's very strong. It's too strong to throw around the word hate.
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And modern psychology lands in the same place as Aristotle.
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Possibly because of Aristotle, I don't know, but modern psychology says basically
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the same thing. Hate lasts.
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It's a deeper, longer-lasting thing. It's more final, whereas anger is usually
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just temporary. It's a behavior.
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You just want a thing to stop.
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What hate does on an individual level is it identifies the person or the group
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that they are the problem and they are unchangeable.
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If you don't think there's any hope of ever changing an ideology,
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for instance, and it's a bad idea, yeah, you hate it.
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Now, I happen to believe this, though, and I like the way Aristotle is, people are changeable.
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Even people who are deeply invested in certain ideologies, they are changeable.
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If you're mature and open-minded, you can take in new information and assess
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it and think, oh, man, I may have been wrong about this. And you can change.
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Ideologies, on the other hand, usually don't change. Okay.
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But once you've made that distinction to hate, then there is no negotiation. There is no correction.
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That's it. It's not an option.
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And that's why the word matters so much to me. That's why it matters.
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Because if you use the word hate loosely, flippantly, you start to treat people
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you simply dislike or who are just simply aggravating.
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You start to treat them like enemies, and enemies are to be deleted.
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Hate lends itself to extreme. We live in a civilized society, folks, semi.
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Don't go to the extremes. Don't go to the extremes. I believe this to be a thing,
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and I've had this conversation sort of briefly with a friend of mine.
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Can you hate something that you don't fully understand?
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You can, and you can do it blindly, and you can be uneducated,
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and you can say you hate a thing.
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But you can't hate what you can't understand, truly.
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You can dislike it, but can you hate it? Are you willing to delete it and all its practitioners?
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And that's a thing. That's a rule worth keeping. that you can't hate what you
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can't understand. Think on that for a minute.
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Vague accusations or disdain or hearsay from your social medias,
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that's not seriousness. That's cartoon.
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You're not a serious person if that's what you're basing your hate on.
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You hate what your tribe hates. You don't know why. They hate it,
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you hate it. That's not the way. That's not the way.
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If you want to be accurate in your judgment,
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you have to know what the other doctrine that you claim to hate,
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you have to know what it claims,
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what it does, what the outcomes have been in the past, et cetera,
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et cetera, how it spreads, who benefits from it, who benefits.
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That's always a good one for any doctrine, for any system.
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Or any ideology, who benefits, what effects it has in everyday life,
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practical application, what practical application, if this applied,
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what effects does it have?
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That's how you develop whether or not you hate a thing, not because your social media hates it.
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And what that does, though, is so that rule, you can't hate what you can't understand,
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or won't understand, that protects individuals on both sides of the equation. Individuals.
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Because an individual living within a certain system, certain ideology,
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they don't solely define that ideology.
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They're not the sole defined. And I say this all the time about Christianity.
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You can't put the weight of Christianity on one single pastor or one single
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church, or your Christian coworker who doesn't behave in a very Christian-like
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way. So you shit on the whole—you.
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Can't place an ideology on the shoulders of one person.
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Because if you do, that confuses a flawed system from a person,
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individual person who may be worthy of that.
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They may be worthy of hate, but generally speaking, it's the system that you
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hate more than the person.
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And don't hate a person because you reject the system that they,
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if they're okay, they may be misguided.
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But you don't hate a person because you hate the system.
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And making those kind of, well, failing to make those kinds of distinctions,
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well, that just feeds into the mob mentality and the collectivism.
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And for those of you who listen for any length of time, you know,
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I'm fully and wholly against any form of collectivism.
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And sure, people can gather,
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but when you start making decisions based on what the collective versus individual
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decisions, and that's the beauty of Christianity is we have been endowed with free will.
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If I go to a church and that church starts preaching off something I think does
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not jive with what I know to be true from the Bible, I can get up and walk on
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out of that church. Ain't never got to go back.
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Ain't never got to answer to one single person. Yep.
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Now, I can study communism and the theory and the famine and the camps,
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and I can conclude after a preponderance of evidence,
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that communism is murderous and a failed system based on education.
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I can do that. I have done that.
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And I do, in fact, hate communism.
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I do in fact. And I hate all its bastard offspring ideologies.
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Democratic socialism. Bullshit. It's just communism in disguise.
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Socialism. Communism in disguise.
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I don't have to hate every misguided college student who wears a Che Guevara
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shirt. They're misguided.
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They're walking around chanting their pre-scripted, prescribed,
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prepaid for protest signs,
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chanting the approved lines at the whatever approved protest,
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or they may just be wearing it for a fashion statement.
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They may be uneducated and poorly read. They only take in what their leftist
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professor gives them, whatever.
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And I can call them misguided. I can call them ignorant. And I can call them
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useful idiots because that's what they are.
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I can tell them they're wrong. I can debate with them. But I'm going to leave them standing.
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I don't wish to delete all of these young misguided people because they follow
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a murderous, failed ideology.
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So aim your harsh judgment. Aim your hate at the correct target.
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Yeah, aim your hate at the correct target.
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And this same holds true. This same line holds true for other times.
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I use communism. I know and love a few trans people.
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They are not abstractions. And some of them carry some real,
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distress, some real internal issues or real pains and real traumas. Some of them do.
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And that's not to say all trans people have trauma and are, you know, all that.
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But my affection for those people is no different than for a friend that I,
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a straight, whatever friend that I shoot guns with or whatever.
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It's just a typical human affection.
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I don't want to see any person hurt, damaged.
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Yeah, it's just ordinary human loyalty to mankind, sort of.
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Don't require me to bless off on every claim they make.
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No, it doesn't. It doesn't require me to jump on board with the trans,
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queer, intersex, I don't even know what the A stands for, plus mafia.
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I don't have to jump on some ideological bullet train straight to nowhere because
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I have a basic human respect.
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Now, the broader ideology is a different story.
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And a little bit about that. So it kind of dictates that the inner.
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Identity overrides biology, and I disagree with that.
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But it also kind of pushes that any disagreement with it equates to violence.
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It doesn't. I disagree with that.
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They demand sort of that all humans, all institutions, all governments, all everything,
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not only that acknowledge, but reorganize around them to acknowledge and support
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their own whatever self-declaration, whatever that is.
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It demands that we recognize and acknowledge who they say, what they say they
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are, no matter what biology says or no matter how often they may change that.
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Yeah, I disagree with it.
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And in the medical side of that,
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it treats transition, sexual transitioning as sort of the default answer to
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99% of any mental illness.
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They refuse to recognize mental illness. Hey, yeah, you're in the wrong body.
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Let's change it.
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And I reject the medical community that takes part in that. I think it's criminal.
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I hate that system. I do.
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It reduces mental issues to one simple fix that's not simple.
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It's one life-changing, lifelong problem.
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And the levels of sexual dysfunction and literally lifelong regimens of medication
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and hormones and all these things. I reject it. I hate it.
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I think it's wrong and misguided. I think it's destructive to life. So I hate it.
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Yet, I can hold this to be true because I do believe everything I just said,
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but I don't have to hate the trans person standing in front of me trying to
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learn how to shoot guns or ordering a sandwich.
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I can have a conversation.
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I don't have to wish that person deleted from the face of this earth.
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No matter how much I hate the ideology behind it, I do not wish any of those people dead or damaged.
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And furthermore, minus the ideology, if you're a consenting adult and you want
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to change your sex, drive home.
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It's no skin off my nose. Live and let live. I agree with that.
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But the bigger political ideology does not agree with that.
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You can have two separate paths on that. You can hate the ideology without hating
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the individual practicing, well, not necessarily that ideology,
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just who kind of loosely falls into a category.
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That person may be in deep pain.
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That person may be in a constant state of angst or depression or distress.
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Why do I want to exacerbate that by being an asshole?
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They're still a person. And no matter what they look like on the outside,
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and no matter what sexual bits have been added or removed, they're still the
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person they were born to be on the inside.
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You can change the externals all you want. You are who you are.
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That may develop, but, yep, you are who you are. Externals be damned.
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So you have to be able to work on both ends of that scale. I think you have
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to be able to work on both ends of that scale.
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Recognize the difference, that that person does not carry the weight of some,
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bullshit political ideology.
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Now, they may have very dear, close friends who do push that ideology.
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That might be their only perceived form of support structure.
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Even though that support structure may be misguiding them, in my opinion,
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maybe, especially with youth.
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I wrote a lot of stuff about youth here. I don't want to go into it.
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And that's mainly why I hate the whole ideology.
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But you don't have to hate the individual. They may be genuinely good people.
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They are. I know. Yes. Anyway.
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So how have we seen some of this hate play out?
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Not with transgender. I'm on now, right? I'm moving on.
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Well, let's go to Charlie Kirk. Charlie Kirk was murdered, assassinated on Utah
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Valley University campus, having open,
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uncoerced debate with people he knew disagreed with him.
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He was there to present an argument for his belief system.
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And the dude who allegedly murdered him,
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never mind all the conspiracy, never mind all those things, the dude who allegedly
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murdered him wrote something to the effect of some hate cannot be negotiated out.
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Well, that's not an untrue statement. It's hard to negotiate hate.
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But and the fact anyway never mind it's the same sequence of events,
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he hated all the things Charlie Kirk did not hate he hated Christianity maybe
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he hated straight ideology is there a straight ideology I don't know,
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so he reduced the target Charlie Kirk down to to he was not a human being anymore,
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He was the representative for all the things this guy hated.
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Therefore, it must be deleted. You can't delete an ideology,
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so you delete whoever you choose to be the symbol of it, whoever chooses to be the symbol of it.
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Mindless, senseless, built on weak logic.
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Outward demonstration of hate. And his tribe, the leftist tribe,
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cheered it, celebrated it.
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A year later, there's videos of people celebrating it.
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Yeah, there's a problem.
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I mean, just leftist folks.
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In June of 25, a Minnesota Democrat House Speaker, Melissa Hortman,
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and her husband were murdered.
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And two other, another Democratic senator and his wife were wounded.
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And in that investigation, this person, this dude had a list of Democrats and
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abortion rights personalities, a whole list, apparently a kill list.
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And yeah, he, these people pushing this ideology of abortion and leftist whatever,
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those are the people he decided represented, he had access to, I guess, and decided to.
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Well, there's still abortion. There's still leftist ideology,
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and there's just two less humans on this earth that were probably parents,
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brothers and sisters and families, and they did the same exact thing at Thanksgiving
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that you do, and they're deleted from this earth.
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In April of 25, someone set fire to a governor, Josh Shapiro,
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set fire to his house, got caught.
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Why did he set fire to his house? Because he supports Israel.
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All those things were different incidents, but they're all under the same umbrella,
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same umbrella, same logic.
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They viewed their opponent as no longer human.
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They were just a walking symbol of an ideology that they somehow formed a deep
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hate for, probably based off a whole bunch of propaganda, probably based off
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a whole bunch of external input on the social media,
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probably based off a bunch of activist agitators sowing the seeds of dissent,
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on both sides, all sides.
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It's crazy madness.
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All right. All right, lest we forget. How can we? How can we?
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It also attaches to race. We can't forget about it. It's constant. It's always in our face.
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Everybody, politics, they love to use race. Race is awesome.
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We can fire people up. We can keep populations divided along racial lines, if nothing else.
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August 22nd, 2025.
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There was Irina Zarutska, who was a blonde-haired white girl,
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riding on the Charlotte light rail,
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was fairly brutally murdered, stabbed to death by a black dude.
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They didn't know each other. They never shared words.
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But while walking through the aisle after he murdered her, as she bled out and
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fell to the floorboard of the train, he said, I got that white girl.
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Well, had that been, would he have stabbed a white dude sitting there in that moment?
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Maybe. Would he have stabbed a black dude or a black woman sitting right there in that moment?
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Well, he was mentally ill, Edgar. Well, would he have stabbed a black woman
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sitting right there in that moment?
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Highly doubtful. Highly doubtful.
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Well, the country immediately went to race.
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The whole incident was reduced to race.
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And what it did was, I don't want to say it minimized her death.
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She was memorialized, but it was along political lines. It was along political lines.
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There wasn't like just this big human outpour of, oh, a poor innocent person was murdered.
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Yeah. There's always another side, right?
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And several years ago, Dylann Roof walked into it also in Charleston,
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South Carolina, walked into a church and murdered, what, nine people,
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black people, white Dylann Roof walked into it because they were black,
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because it was a black church.
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He reduced those human beings to a group, to a type.
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Same reduction, same thing that happened on the light rail in Charleston.
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Is reduced to a type, a thing, a group.
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You're a symbol of someone I hate. So I have an opportunity to delete you.
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I'm going to. It's ridiculous.
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So though these were individual acts, these were individual acts by individual
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people, I am going to indict collectivism, the mob mentality.
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They make this reduction easy,
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lone isolated individuals don't create their own their own language that dehumanizes other people,
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it's supplied to them by a tribe by a mob by a collective.
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Who get paid money to create this behavior-changing propaganda.
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And all this online piling on after the fact,
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it just reduces individuals to whatever their, this dude, well,
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he's a conservative, or, well, she was a white girl,
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or a teenager, he's just confused, or a parent who rejects transitioning their children are bigots.
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They just get reduced to some thing that's bad, it sounds bad, demonized.
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After the Charlie Kirk murder, the leftists, they acted and spoke as though.
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Debate and opposing opinion justified the murder. Go ask some leftists right
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now Did Charlie Kirk deserve to be murdered?
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And I'll say, yeah He was a zealot He was a Christian zealot Or whatever Or
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a conservative Do all conservatives deserve to die?
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Do all leftists deserve to die?
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After the Zaruzka video on the White Rail,
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A lot of conservatives were Talking like that incident just confirmed every
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negative theory about one single race.
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She just confirmed it, locked it in. Look, all black dudes.
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Is that right? I know it's not right. And then when you come to the gender stuff,
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like one side of that equation calls a cautious parent genocidal.
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It's genocidal not to allow your underage child to transition. What the fuck?
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And then the other side of that equation, they use every frigging dysphoric
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kid as a weapon. See what your system has done.
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Don't have to pull the trigger folks they just all they have to do is present
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a big giant target that's hard to miss,
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and then the next confused and isolated and manipulated person that comes along,
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assumes tacit permission to do all the hyperbolic things that the propaganda
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machine puts out there i'll be a hero if i go murder charlie kurt if a 10 year old girl,
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is carrying on that she hates her brother.
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Does she want her brother deleted off the face of this earth forever?
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Keep the word hate out of your daily lexicon.
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Reserve it for larger doctrines and systems and outward acts of violence or
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things that seek annihilation of other humans.
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That is universally bad. And I think a lot of my listeners are going to agree,
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murder is universally bad.
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The taking of life is universally bad.
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You want to know what the metrics of good and bad are? Well,
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at the end of the day, taking life is universally bad.
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Soldiers in war, Edgar. There's nuance. There's different things going on here.
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We're talking broader. What about genocide? Israel's genocide in Gaza.
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I don't think Israel's genocide in Gaza.
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Reserve the word hate for the things that truly warrant it.
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The scale and the difference between anger and hate should be epic.
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It should be a broad scale.
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Don't confuse the two.
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If you know and love a trans person, but you still oppose puberty blockers for
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minors, you're not practicing hate.
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You're not even practicing anger. You're practicing discernment.
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I'm entitled to an opinion, just like you are. Your friend, your trans friend,
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is not the clinical protocol.
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They're not the school policy that has trans men or whatever reading to kindergarten students.
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And they don't even deserve any anger, let alone hate, unless they try to actually
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stifle and stop the debate.
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So if you confuse that, any understanding, any potential for understanding is gone.
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And it just certainly implies that there's no empathy.
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And if we don't have any of that empathy and understanding, the mob does the
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rest. You get sucked into the mob.
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Okay. So, like most of the episodes, I like to offer some practical application to daily life.
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Practical application to daily life on this topic.
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We do before our heat, our angst, our anger, potentially our hate,
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draws us into something that we can't withdraw from?
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Well, number one, you have to name the feeling correctly.
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You can say a thing disgusts you. You can say that's a lie.
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You can say, no, that endangers children, but the best way to have those opinions
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and to correctly name the feelings is by doing your own research.
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Don't immediately reach for hate. Assess that the object or the person or the
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ideology, one, assess that it deserves the full weight of that word.
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We keep saying that's a heavy word. I want you people to understand and believe that it's a heavy word.
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What's worse than that? Now, hate encompasses a lot of other words at varying
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degrees, but I think hate is the final, that's it.
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So learn, right? Learn, do the research.
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Read the strongest argument for the thing you're against.
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And I mean the strong, don't go looking for weak, don't go looking for weak
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arguments that support your argument, that you can easily poke holes in.
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Look for the strongest argument from their biggest champion and then develop
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your own evidence against it based on research. Look them, right?
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Because let me tell you a thing, uninformed rage doesn't offer you the moral high ground.
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The more enraged you are, it doesn't give you moral superiority.
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It's still just uninformed. It's still, as far as you're concerned, just hearsay.
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All right. Name the feeling from a perspective of education.
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That's number one. Number two,
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separate the person, the individual, from the proposition or the argument.
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Attack the argument, but don't murder your neighbor because you disagree.
35:26
Separate the person from the argument and attack the argument.
35:29
Don't make the person a symbol for all that is evil.
35:33
They might be ignorant. They might be misguided.
35:37
And hey, if it comes down to it, if they are evil, then they are.
35:40
And then put them on the hate list.
35:43
But generally speaking, they're just misguided.
35:47
Number three, refuse to pile on. Ha ha.
35:55
Already piled on, they don't need you there. You're not doing anything.
36:00
You're just a cheerleader at that point.
36:02
Don't taint yourself with the stench of the mob. Don't reduce a human being to a symbol of.
36:12
Race or sexuality or politics. Don't reduce them to that. People are more complex than that.
36:20
Don't cheer violence even when the victim of that violence is somebody you oppose,
36:27
especially when the victim of that violence is someone you oppose.
36:31
Because every coin has an opposite side folks every coin has an opposite and
36:36
equal side if you cheer violence on your enemy right now when violence is done
36:43
to you it'll be cheered loudly,
36:46
refuse the pile on be an individual thinker.
36:50
Was that number three? Number four, take a pause. Take a couple of breaths.
36:57
Assess the situation. Assess the argument. When we have that surge of anger
37:03
in our body, it lasts for a couple minutes if we don't feed it. No, it can burn all day.
37:12
If we don't feed it, We'll have that initial anger and then we'll,
37:14
all right, we'll come down, come down, step away, step outside of the situation.
37:23
Take a, take a nice deep breath or two, do a little, let the blood cool before
37:32
you do a thing that can't be undone.
37:36
And number five, ask yourself the question that keeps free and civilized people
37:43
from consuming themselves.
37:48
Unchangeable or just wrong? Is destruction of this individual the only option?
37:56
Most of the time it's not. There are people out there who you can debate and
38:01
talk with and present new facts to and start to think critically for themselves
38:07
and then make a decision and maybe change their,
38:13
stance. It's possible. It happens.
38:19
That's the work folks that's that's what we need to do use accurate language,
38:24
because everybody says it you hear it all the time words mean things use the correct words.
38:36
Individual recognition. Do not just accept what the mob hands you.
38:42
Assess a person for who they are, individually, and disagree with them on the
38:49
things you disagree with and agree with them on the things you do. Have lunch.
38:54
Recognize the individual, not the mob that they're attached with.
38:59
You can develop enough understanding of a system to hate that system and still
39:04
not hate people who ascribe to it so yeah,
39:13
ben franklin's original junto club and and this junto podcast they're built for what,
39:22
they're built for mutual improvement,
39:25
not mutual destruction mutual improvement not mutual destruction.
39:31
That's my thoughts on the topic of hate. That's my thoughts.
39:38
Well, coincidentally, this topic was suggested by a trans person who I happen to like and respect.
39:46
So, be an individual thinker, yeah, for sure.
39:50
But that's what I have on the topic.
39:53
So, I do want to do a little recap on this past Saturday, we executed another
39:59
armed self-defense course, which is a scenario-based course.
40:04
And this was a really good one, I think. I think this one was among the best that we've done.
40:11
It was very enlightening. We had a lot of role players, volunteer role players. And.
40:18
Volunteer role players added, they enriched the environment to the point to
40:24
where the individual student going through the scenario,
40:29
they had to do a lot of thinking on the move, thinking on the fly,
40:33
assessing human beings for their actions and their facial expressions and their
40:40
words and all those things.
40:44
It was so good. And I just want to thank everybody who came out to volunteer
40:48
and everybody who paid to be trained.
40:51
I hope everyone who was there got a lot out of it.
40:58
I say it about all my courses, but yes, it's one of my favorite courses to do,
41:03
because I get to see all these people.
41:06
Well, I get to see them in action trying to.
41:10
You can see the wheels turning on some of them.
41:14
And you can see eyes darting and you can see like, oh man, this is happening so fast.
41:20
The whole point of the course is to help you develop a process for decision-making,
41:27
under pressure, a time-sensitive, time-compressed decision-making process.
41:32
That's very important. If you're going to carry a gun out in the wild,
41:36
not only do you need to be technically skilled and have the ability to shoot,
41:41
what you mean to shoot faster than the other dude can shoot you that's that's a given,
41:48
you not only need that high level of skill to do that but that skill is irrelevant
41:56
if you don't make the decision the correct decisions,
42:01
up to that point the decision to pull your gun is probably one of the most important
42:07
ones you'll ever make if you're in a situation like that.
42:12
All the things that happen after that, man, it's decision-making on the move.
42:18
And one of the highlights that we talked about was on the range,
42:23
it's all very simple. You have a shot timer.
42:26
Are you ready? Stand by. Beep. The beep is action. That's your decision.
42:33
You don't get that in real life. You don't get it in real life. There is no beep.
42:39
There's a slow roll and slow development and sometimes instant action happens.
42:46
One of the scenarios where you were standing in line at a counter in a store,
42:52
and a dude busts in, gun out, yelling and screaming, everybody on their face,
42:58
this is a robbery. It happened instantly.
43:02
And another one was where the store owner, they were all behind the counter,
43:11
had a dude on the ground pointing a gun at him.
43:15
And the conundrum there was you then walk into the store as this is happening.
43:23
And as you, as the citizen, you don't know who's who.
43:28
There's a guy pointing a gun at another guy who's unarmed.
43:33
Well, the unarmed guy was the bad guy. So that created a conundrum.
43:37
And most of the people reacted just right.
43:41
They assessed the situation and they assessed the guy with the gun's behavior.
43:46
And ultimately, he never was a threat to anyone else in that room.
43:49
He was pointing the gun at the one guy the whole time. And then ultimately,
43:54
as you take that breath and let it play out, eventually, he said,
43:59
hey, call 911. This guy just tried to stab me. Yeah.
44:05
And it was a good decision-making process. I encourage all you folks,
44:10
yeah, come train with OSS. Absolutely, I encourage that. Yes, that's why we're here.
44:17
But go train with someone, and there are good organizations and bad organizations.
44:25
Do the research first by all means.
44:28
But if you don't have an opportunity to come out here with me,
44:29
go get the opportunity somewhere. These scenario-based courses are kind of hard to come by.
44:35
And then when you do come by them, sometimes they're not quite as realistic.
44:40
I pride myself on the fact that our scenarios, our environments,
44:45
and the actions of our role players are very realistic.
44:50
They're not very scripted. Of course, there's a script. There has to be a sort of parameter.
44:57
But they're not so scripted. They're not choreographed in any way.
45:01
We have the basic scenario, and then it organically plays out the way it plays out.
45:10
You either save the day or you were a murderer.
45:16
Well, either way,
45:19
you still get the good training. Either way, you still maybe learn what not to do.
45:28
And I want to say this, and I don't normally make this distinction,
45:30
but for the ladies who came out to this course,
45:34
I think that they got a very eye-opening experience with not only how fast things happen,
45:45
but also once a big burly guy gets his hands on you,
45:51
it's pretty tough after that. I think I think they learned they learned a lot,
45:58
we had a scenario where it was a long hallway like hotel hallway and this wasn't,
46:05
the Ritz Carlton this was the no-tell motel so there was low light like one
46:10
of the hall lights was out,
46:12
yeah and there and they had to walk and their whole job was to get to just go to your bedroom well,
46:20
they had some guy following and then some Some guy came down the hallway toward them.
46:25
And I want to say this about two of the ladies.
46:31
Everybody, there were eight students. And of those eight, one guy made it to
46:37
his bedroom, closed the door, no contact.
46:40
And that was good. That was a win.
46:43
And then other than these two ladies, everyone else got manhandled and pushed
46:47
into the room to where they were murdered. Thank you.
46:54
Go to your room and close the door without two dudes who were armed coming in after you.
46:59
Two of these ladies instinctively, even though they got hands-on in the hallway,
47:07
they instinctively did not allow those men to open that door and push them into the room.
47:14
And so we examined that at the end. Hey, why?
47:19
Well, and one of the ladies said, look, ever since I'm a kid,
47:22
my line i say don't let somebody grab you and take you and don't get pushed into a room by,
47:29
and so she locked up man and i mean locked up tight and she was poking dudes
47:35
without she was not fighting because she was,
47:38
they had control of her for sure but she went rigid and and would not budge
47:45
and would not get pushed into that room,
47:48
it was awesome so there's a lot of decisions there's a lot of ways it could have went down,
47:53
it was a no-win situation it was designed to be no-win and they they won so,
47:59
so anyway great course armed self-defense force on force because we use blue
48:06
guns and and training knives and things like that there's no live fire there.
48:13
And for any of those of you who are in it listening right now,
48:18
yeah, I'd appreciate your feedback on it.
48:20
I know we did an AAR at the end, but after you've had time to let it simmer
48:24
a little bit, yeah, I'd appreciate some feedback on it.
48:28
Okay, and for the rest of you out there, thanks for listening.
48:31
I appreciate you as always.
48:34
OspreyshootingSolutions.com. That's where the main stuff is.
48:40
And DGTOPodcast.com. That's where the podcast, one of the places the podcast resides.
48:47
And then if you're so charitable, please give to gifsengo.com backslash helpahomiefund,
48:57
to help us be charitable to people.
49:00
Help us help people who need diapers and shoes and to get their car worked on
49:07
and things like that and food.
49:10
So anyway, I will be a good steward of your donations.
49:15
And I appreciate all of you who do donate.
49:18
Thank you very much, folks. Thanks for listening. I love you guys.