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Lady Gaga's Baby HATED Practical Magic 2 · Like a Virgin

0:01
Speaker 1: Welcome back to Like a Virgin. I'm Rose Damu.
0:03
Speaker 2: And I'm Fran Torado.
0:05
Speaker 1: And today we are going to talk about some movies
0:09
Speaker 1: we saw recently. And I think a good way to
0:13
Speaker 1: get into that conversation is to talk about this thing
0:17
Speaker 1: that Lily Wachowski said that I clocked and you clocked, Fran.
0:22
Speaker 1: Can you read this quote from an interview she did
0:27
Speaker 1: with Variety for us, please?
0:30
Speaker 2: And honestly, just to give virgins context who maybe didn't
0:34
Speaker 2: listen to our episode about Jane Schoenbrunn's Teenage Sex and Death,
0:41
Speaker 2: It Can't Be Asthma, we were talking about transgender filmmakers
0:46
Speaker 2: and how there literally are none, at least none in
0:50
Speaker 2: working in the mainstream with any sort of budget whatsoever,
0:53
Speaker 2: especially when it pertains to feature films. and how Jane has,
0:59
Speaker 2: it seems, taken up the mantle of being the one.
1:02
Speaker 2: And I remember name-dropping Lily during that conversation and talking
1:06
Speaker 2: about how she constantly has, in my mind, deadline articles about, oh,
1:14
Speaker 2: so-and-so transgender comic is in development with Lily Wachowski. So-and-so
1:19
Speaker 2: queer horror film is in development with Lily Wachowski, and
1:23
Speaker 2: nothing's getting made. And I remember remarking on that and
1:27
Speaker 2: as if an answer to our prayer, maybe, honestly, maybe
1:30
Speaker 2: Lily listens to like a virgin. Maybe Lily's a virgin, Rose.
1:35
Speaker 2: Do you think?
1:36
Speaker 1: If she is, please tell your sister to cut her
1:39
Speaker 1: dreads off. Literally.
1:45
Speaker 2: But on September 11th, Lily Wachowski gives an interview and
1:49
Speaker 2: it says, Lily Wachowski on her new studio, Anarchists Unite,
1:53
Speaker 2: The Black Power Origins of the Matrix and How Harry
1:55
Speaker 2: Potter Fans are Supporting Transgenocide. And she talked about her
2:01
Speaker 2: recent tenure. And she says, I've pitched a lot of wonderful,
2:05
Speaker 2: cool queer stories and trans stories and Hollywood didn't want
2:08
Speaker 2: any of it. There was this TV show based on
2:10
Speaker 2: this comic book, Cosmonauts, that I was going to direct.
2:13
Speaker 2: And it was from me and Emily Andras who made
2:16
Speaker 2: Winona Earp.
2:18
Speaker 1: Winona Earp, not a good show. Winona Earp, sorry.
2:20
Speaker 2: Winona Earp. It's Star Wars with lesbians in space. Amy
2:24
Speaker 2: Poehler was producing it and we pitched it all around town.
2:27
Speaker 2: We had a cool Bible that Emily had written and
2:29
Speaker 2: I put together a jazzy video for it and everybody passed.
2:32
Speaker 2: We had this cool adaptation of Manhunt by Gretchen Felker Martin,
2:35
Speaker 2: which was a bestseller on all these top 10 lists
2:37
Speaker 2: and couldn't get that going. This is around 2022 and
2:40
Speaker 2: now it's four years later and I haven't made a thing.
2:42
Speaker 2: I cannot find a studio that will do any of it.
2:47
Speaker 1: So the woman who... Made the Matrix. Can't get a
2:54
Speaker 1: movie made. That is the world that we're living in.
2:58
Speaker 2: It is actually, obviously, plain and simple transphobia. And not just,
3:04
Speaker 2: I imagine, transphobia for her as a person. In that
3:10
Speaker 2: there are probably many, many studios that would have loved
3:14
Speaker 2: to work with Lily Wachowski pre-transition. and now are too
3:18
Speaker 2: scared to work with a transgender person because they probably
3:21
Speaker 2: have no transgender friends, colleagues, points of reference in their life.
3:26
Speaker 2: Especially in this echelon of the business where it's only
3:30
Speaker 2: really run by cis men and like white women.
3:33
Speaker 1: I know that's a big part of it, but I
3:36
Speaker 1: do think it's less about her as a trans director
3:43
Speaker 1: and more about the fact that she wants to stories
3:47
Speaker 1: that center trans people?
3:48
Speaker 2: Oh, no, I think for.
3:50
Speaker 1: Sure it is both.
3:51
Speaker 2: Like, I do think that there's an inside, there's something
3:56
Speaker 2: inside the scene that we cannot see that is happening
3:59
Speaker 2: to her in these business meetings. And I say that
4:02
Speaker 2: as a fucking transsexual who has been in many an
4:08
Speaker 2: executive boardroom and many a room with powerful suits and
4:13
Speaker 2: that I can talk to and speak to so clearly
4:16
Speaker 2: and use all the jargon. And I see in their
4:19
Speaker 2: eyes that they don't respect me. You know what I mean?
4:21
Speaker 2: Like I I'm obviously projecting, but like, I know that
4:25
Speaker 2: she's experiencing a version of that.
4:27
Speaker 1: Um, and also a version of that, that other, that
4:31
Speaker 1: other filmmakers don't experience who have similar track records to
4:35
Speaker 1: her because, because, you know, CIS filmmakers get, chance after
4:42
Speaker 1: chance after chance.
4:44
Speaker 2: I mean, and also the thing that you just said,
4:46
Speaker 2: they are extremely transgender films that she is pitching.
4:50
Speaker 1: And those just, I think from, you know, also a
4:54
Speaker 1: little bit of insider baseball, you know, like being on the,
4:59
Speaker 1: the creative side of things like, yes, studios are only
5:03
Speaker 1: making things that will appeal to the broadest possible audience and,
5:08
Speaker 1: And I actually think there is some extremely pertinent evidence
5:13
Speaker 1: to this in the films that we are going to
5:16
Speaker 1: be discussing today. So do you want to get into
5:22
Speaker 1: the Practical Magic 2 of it all? And maybe we
5:25
Speaker 1: can weave more of this Lily stuff in as we talk?
5:29
Speaker 2: Yeah, let's do it. I think it's like a jumping
5:32
Speaker 2: off point to set the tone for the virgins that.
5:37
Speaker 2: It is amazing. And I saw this movie with our
5:40
Speaker 2: friend Amy Buchanan, who is also like a budding filmmaker.
5:44
Speaker 2: And it's like, we watched it and like, it was like,
5:47
Speaker 2: oh my God, I cannot believe that shit like this
5:52
Speaker 2: gets up a billion dollars to get made. And like
5:55
Speaker 2: any sort of like screenwriter who you would take a
5:58
Speaker 2: chance on for $ 2 million, like could never, ever, ever.
6:03
Speaker 2: get something.
6:04
Speaker 1: Well, that is, that is the status quo in Hollywood
6:07
Speaker 1: right now is no one is willing to take a chance.
6:10
Speaker 1: That's why everything is IP. Everything is reboots and sequels.
6:14
Speaker 1: There has to be something proven first. I know of
6:18
Speaker 1: people who have been told, I know of people who
6:21
Speaker 1: have been told, you know, they're pitching movie scripts and
6:23
Speaker 1: they're told, well, can you write it as a book
6:26
Speaker 1: first so that we know there's a guaranteed preexisting audience
6:30
Speaker 1: for it? And that like, That's crazy. That's crazy, you know?
6:35
Speaker 2: It's also, sorry, just as a total aside, I guess
6:39
Speaker 2: there is something to be said about the fact that
6:41
Speaker 2: these would be, actually, I was just about to honestly, like,
6:45
Speaker 2: I was just about to kind of be like, well,
6:47
Speaker 2: it is really controversial to have a transgender dystopian, like,
6:52
Speaker 2: murder novel that, like, kills J.K. Rowling at the end. Like, sorry,
6:55
Speaker 2: spoiler alert. But then I was like, no, actually, like,
6:58
Speaker 2: extremely fucked up, shocking things happen in movies all the time.
7:01
Speaker 2: That's what makes good movies. Sorry. Um, anyways, sorry, but,
7:05
Speaker 2: but we saw practical magic too.
7:07
Speaker 1: We saw practical magic too, not together. And let me
7:16
Speaker 1: not piss myself off because I have never been angrier
7:23
Speaker 1: leaving a movie than I was leaving practical magic too. I,
7:27
Speaker 1: I had to, I'm not joking, take a Klonopin because
7:31
Speaker 1: I was so fired up. And I was in Florida
7:34
Speaker 1: seeing this movie with my mother. It was very full
7:36
Speaker 1: circle because we saw the original Practical Magic together when
7:39
Speaker 1: I was like 10. Oh my God. And after the movie,
7:45
Speaker 1: we were going to order in dinner. And she told
7:48
Speaker 1: me she was going to go pick it up because
7:50
Speaker 1: she needed to give me some time to calm down.
7:53
Speaker 1: That's how fired up I was. And- I understand that
7:57
Speaker 1: I'm coming from a place of... Practical Magic is one
8:01
Speaker 1: of my favorite movies.
8:02
Speaker 2: Yes, I would say it's in your top five, top
8:04
Speaker 2: ten echelon, I would say, in the Rose Damu kind
8:07
Speaker 2: of canon.
8:08
Speaker 1: It's extremely important to me. I saw it at exactly
8:11
Speaker 1: the right moment in my life. I have this very
8:14
Speaker 1: specific memory of seeing it at Shadowwood Theaters in Boca Raton, Florida.
8:19
Speaker 1: And when the movie ended... I went outside. I went
8:24
Speaker 1: out into the lobby and just stood there staring at
8:27
Speaker 1: the poster for it because I wasn't ready to let
8:30
Speaker 1: go of it. I didn't want to leave that world.
8:35
Speaker 1: And so this movie is extremely important to me. I
8:39
Speaker 1: still went into Practical Magic 2 with very low expectations,
8:43
Speaker 1: thinking it would be dog shit. But I thought maybe
8:47
Speaker 1: it would be a Devil Wears Prada 2 situation where
8:50
Speaker 1: maybe it surprised me a little. And I am sorry
8:55
Speaker 1: to say that this is one of the worst movies
8:58
Speaker 1: I've ever seen. It made me furious. I believe it
9:03
Speaker 1: is anti-art. I think it's actually actively evil. Yeah.
9:12
Speaker 2: No, I totally agree with you. It felt like... you know,
9:17
Speaker 2: Avengers Doomsday. It felt like, honestly, Hocus Pocus 2, which
9:21
Speaker 2: I thought was a travesty. Like, it reminded me of
9:24
Speaker 2: just these, the soullessness of Disney reboots that we see
9:29
Speaker 2: that are these hollow cash grabs that celebrities are really
9:34
Speaker 2: only doing because they're getting paid one babillion dollars.
9:38
Speaker 1: Well, yes, I brought up that anecdote, I think, last
9:41
Speaker 1: week or like a couple weeks ago about how In
9:46
Speaker 1: an interview, Nicole Kidman said that the reason that this
9:51
Speaker 1: was happening now was because Sandra Bullock finally said yes.
9:54
Speaker 1: And that is very much the vibe of this movie,
9:56
Speaker 1: is they are all there to get a paycheck.
9:58
Speaker 2: Well, there's a really funny episode. Onion article that was like,
10:01
Speaker 2: Sandra Bullock regrets Practical Magic 2 after realizing she could
10:05
Speaker 2: have just had dinner with Nicole Kidman. Which is exactly...
10:09
Speaker 2: The vibe of what this all feels like.
10:12
Speaker 1: No, it was all, this could have been an email.
10:14
Speaker 2: Because their press campaign is beautiful. Stunning. Love watching the
10:20
Speaker 2: two of them talk about this film.
10:22
Speaker 1: Looking like they're about to scissor in every interview. Yes.
10:26
Speaker 2: It's giving like, Cynthia and Ariana levels of like, kind
10:31
Speaker 2: of like, press love. And I think that that is,
10:34
Speaker 2: I love that. I just, as a fucking faggot, I
10:36
Speaker 2: love watching... a press, a press campaign like that.
10:39
Speaker 1: But the ephemera around the movie should not be more
10:42
Speaker 1: engaging than the movie itself.
10:46
Speaker 2: Yeah. Okay.
10:47
Speaker 1: So let's, let's get the, the like facts about this movie,
10:50
Speaker 1: maybe like a brief recap, um, directed by, uh, Suzanne
10:54
Speaker 1: beer written by three people, which tells you a lot, uh,
10:59
Speaker 1: based on the book of magic by Alice Hoffman, which
11:02
Speaker 1: is the fourth book in her practical magic series.
11:05
Speaker 2: I did not know there were many, there were multiple.
11:07
Speaker 1: Yes, my favorite of them is the prequel, The Rules
11:12
Speaker 1: of Magic, which is about the aunts in the 60s
11:15
Speaker 1: and their gay brother. It was, a couple years ago,
11:18
Speaker 1: announced that it was in development as an HBO Max series,
11:23
Speaker 1: and that has not happened. I still think I should
11:26
Speaker 1: be allowed to write it.
11:27
Speaker 2: Yeah, you should.
11:27
Speaker 1: You would eat. And we'll get into some of the
11:31
Speaker 1: differences from the book plot later. Oh, okay. Some of
11:36
Speaker 1: which I appreciated, but most of which are bad. But
11:40
Speaker 1: the basic premise of this movie is that everything that
11:45
Speaker 1: happened in the original film doesn't matter. Because even though
11:50
Speaker 1: at the end of that movie, the curse was broken,
11:52
Speaker 1: it still exists. So Sandra Bullock, Sally Owens' love interest
11:59
Speaker 1: from the first film has died. And because of all
12:02
Speaker 1: that trauma, she has sworn off magic. has made her
12:06
Speaker 1: sister Jillian swear to never tell her daughters about magic
12:10
Speaker 1: and then used a spell to remove their memories of magic.
12:13
Speaker 1: So when one of them falls in love and her
12:18
Speaker 1: boyfriend ends up in a coma, she journeys back to
12:23
Speaker 1: their ancestral England to try to find a way to
12:28
Speaker 1: lift the curse leading Jillian sally and jillian to travel
12:32
Speaker 1: there with her where they meet a sexy lee pace
12:36
Speaker 1: kind of warlock guy and um you know have to
12:41
Speaker 1: have to heal their ancestral trauma once again.
12:45
Speaker 2: I should we start with lee pace.
12:50
Speaker 1: Lee pace who weirdly like i didn't think he was
12:53
Speaker 1: hot in this movie and also he and sandra bullock
12:56
Speaker 1: had like negative chemistry.
12:58
Speaker 2: Well, okay, what happened essentially is that Aunt Franny, who
13:04
Speaker 2: has referred Sandra Bullock to this warlock in London to
13:09
Speaker 2: heal her ancestors, she basically sent her to a kind
13:12
Speaker 2: of gay energy healer.
13:14
Speaker 1: Well, she sent her to get some dick, hoping it
13:16
Speaker 1: would calm her the fuck down.
13:18
Speaker 2: Yeah, she sent her to pound town by way of
13:21
Speaker 2: kind of Kama Sutra energy healing chakra shit, and He
13:28
Speaker 2: is so, so gay, and I think actually very hot,
13:32
Speaker 2: but I agree with you, absolutely negative chemistry.
13:35
Speaker 1: He was hot when he had clothes off, but they
13:37
Speaker 1: dressed him really badly, and the costumes are something we'll
13:40
Speaker 1: get to. Don't worry.
13:42
Speaker 2: Yeah, but like, so here, my theory is that the
13:46
Speaker 2: casting directors were really just trying to find an actor who,
13:50
Speaker 2: who was taller than both Sandra Bullock and Nicole Kidman.
13:54
Speaker 2: And this is who they landed on.
13:55
Speaker 1: That's actually a very good hypothesis.
14:00
Speaker 2: I think Jacob Elordi was not available.
14:02
Speaker 1: Well, I also think they needed someone who wasn't as
14:09
Speaker 1: old as Sandra and Nicole, but looked like he could be.
14:12
Speaker 2: Yes, exactly. Yeah, Jacob would have been too young. They
14:16
Speaker 2: could have gone with Adam Driver, but Adam would never
14:18
Speaker 2: do this movie again. You know, like, it's just, there's
14:21
Speaker 2: only so many men who are 6'7. You know, Alexander Skarsgård,
14:25
Speaker 2: he's already done stuff with Nicole. They're not going to
14:28
Speaker 2: go back at that again.
14:28
Speaker 1: Alexander Skarsgård actually might have been a better pick because
14:33
Speaker 1: they would have, he and Sandra, I think, would have
14:35
Speaker 1: had more convincing chemistry.
14:36
Speaker 2: And he would do a movie like this. And he
14:39
Speaker 2: also would slay playing a warlock.
14:41
Speaker 1: Actually, maybe he wouldn't do a movie like this. I
14:43
Speaker 1: think he's pretty choosy. And maybe he would have read
14:46
Speaker 1: the script and said, No thanks. Maybe he was in
14:49
Speaker 1: consideration and turned it down. We don't know.
14:51
Speaker 2: I know. Well, sometimes I think that Alex is willing
14:56
Speaker 2: to take a role that feels risky or even silly.
14:59
Speaker 1: Yeah, but this is like a cynical cash grab. Yeah,
15:04
Speaker 1: that's true. He only does films. He's not going to
15:09
Speaker 1: go for... He doesn't do Marvel shit. He's not going
15:12
Speaker 1: to go from pillion to practical magic, too.
15:15
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, okay, okay, okay. That's a good point. Right, well,
15:19
Speaker 2: I can't wait to see him in Wicker. However, the-
15:22
Speaker 2: Oh my god.
15:23
Speaker 1: There was- Till the whole room stinks.
15:26
Speaker 2: Here's something that I'm going to say. This, for Lee
15:28
Speaker 2: Pace to branch off into maybe another area of discussion
15:32
Speaker 2: on this film is that, though the, I was about
15:36
Speaker 2: to say romance, but it's really the sex. The sex
15:40
Speaker 2: and the anticipation, the anticipation- The anticipation? The anticipation of-
15:46
Speaker 2: in the original Practical Magic is a critical backbone to
15:51
Speaker 2: that film. The reason it is so delightful is because
15:56
Speaker 2: it is like a movie that seems like it would
15:58
Speaker 2: be for children or seems like it would be for
16:01
Speaker 2: like families, but it's actually kind of for like wine
16:05
Speaker 2: moms and goths because it's violent and There's desperation. There's
16:09
Speaker 2: an emotional realism.
16:11
Speaker 1: Domestic abuse?
16:12
Speaker 2: And there's sex.
16:13
Speaker 1: Murder.
16:14
Speaker 2: They're killing rapists. It's literally... And for the characters in
16:20
Speaker 2: this film to not really have any sex appeal whatsoever.
16:23
Speaker 1: Oh, it's a fully sexless movie.
16:26
Speaker 2: They're all just propped up to deliver really half-assed zingers. Like,
16:32
Speaker 2: it really.
16:32
Speaker 1: There's very little romance in this romance movie.
16:35
Speaker 2: It was rated G. This film was rated G. I mean,
16:38
Speaker 2: I don't know if it was actually, but in my viewing,
16:40
Speaker 2: I was like.
16:40
Speaker 1: This is a G. It was giving. It was giving G.
16:42
Speaker 2: And it should have been PG-13. It really did not have.
16:45
Speaker 1: Should have been NC-17, honey.
16:47
Speaker 2: The original Practical Magic has a kind of, like, whiskey-drinking, leather-wearing,
16:54
Speaker 2: kind of, like, morally ambiguous sort of badness. That Practical
16:59
Speaker 2: Magic 2... completely scrubbed clean, washed of any particularities, washed
17:04
Speaker 2: of any sort of like ambiguity.
17:08
Speaker 1: Washed of any color or warmth. Yeah. I mean, I
17:13
Speaker 1: think this is like, we're kind of going into the
17:16
Speaker 1: like larger structural issues with this movie. And that, that
17:19
Speaker 1: is the thing that I think more than anything, I
17:22
Speaker 1: was so upset about leaving the theater is that the
17:25
Speaker 1: filmmakers fundamentally didn't understand what, why, people still love practical
17:30
Speaker 1: magic and it's not because of the sort of witch
17:37
Speaker 1: lore or like superpowers. It's about the coziness of it.
17:42
Speaker 1: It's about the warmth of it. The original film is so,
17:46
Speaker 1: it's so tactile. It's like a world you can live inside.
17:49
Speaker 1: It is so warm toned and everything feels very tangible and,
17:55
Speaker 1: And this movie is so ugly and flat and gray.
18:01
Speaker 1: And it's been, where is the practical part of practical magic?
18:08
Speaker 1: Why are they fucking Marvel-fied shooting wispy smoke at each other?
18:15
Speaker 2: Girl, fucking WandaVision, it was giving fucking, yeah, Scarlet Witch
18:24
Speaker 2: kind of like, hollow effects. Also, I mean, I would say,
18:29
Speaker 2: while we're getting into the practical effects, I would say
18:32
Speaker 2: a satisfactory amount of hair, but still not enough hair.
18:37
Speaker 1: Are you kidding?
18:37
Speaker 2: No.
18:38
Speaker 1: Nicole Kidman was essentially bald.
18:40
Speaker 2: No, it was down to her waist.
18:44
Speaker 1: It wasn't. Her hair was only shoulder length.
18:46
Speaker 2: No, no, no. She was walking down the pathway to
18:50
Speaker 2: her house, and I noticed that her hair was touching
18:52
Speaker 2: the small.
18:53
Speaker 1: Of her back. I noticed that. We need to be
18:57
Speaker 1: true to the virgins. Well, then the extensions were not
18:59
Speaker 1: well distributed enough.
19:00
Speaker 2: I agree.
19:02
Speaker 1: Also, why did they take that incredible copper color hair
19:06
Speaker 1: she has in the first film and totally wash it
19:09
Speaker 1: out to be essentially strawberry blonde?
19:11
Speaker 2: Yes, it was not right.
19:12
Speaker 1: It was honestly... It's just everything about this movie is
19:16
Speaker 1: washed out.
19:17
Speaker 2: It was redhead phobia. It was. It was literally ginger phobia. Yeah.
19:22
Speaker 2: I felt, actually, I'm so glad you pointed that out
19:26
Speaker 2: because I didn't even notice. It was crazy making that
19:29
Speaker 2: modern filmmakers believe that gingers should be strawberry blonde. That's crazy.
19:35
Speaker 1: And that's not right.
19:36
Speaker 2: That's just not right. It's erasure.
19:39
Speaker 1: And they just, there's so much, like every other scene,
19:44
Speaker 1: someone's chanting Latin and like making smoke come out of
19:49
Speaker 1: their hands when in the original movie, the magic, like
19:52
Speaker 1: the title says, was practical. And that was what was
19:57
Speaker 1: charming about it and also what has endured. We talk
20:01
Speaker 1: so much about the fact of, like we talked about
20:03
Speaker 1: with Legend last week, it's like the reason why it
20:06
Speaker 1: holds up is because all the effects were practical and
20:09
Speaker 1: if they had And CGI dates itself so quickly. Right.
20:13
Speaker 1: That's why this movie is so ugly and no one
20:15
Speaker 1: will ever watch it a second time. I will never
20:17
Speaker 1: watch this movie again. To me, it doesn't exist. It's like,
20:21
Speaker 1: it's like how there's only one version of, there's only
20:23
Speaker 1: one film of Annie. There's only one practical magic movie.
20:27
Speaker 2: Well, I totally agree. And yeah, this movie does not exist.
20:31
Speaker 2: It's not in the canon. It's never, it's never been made.
20:34
Speaker 2: And as far as I'm concerned, But on the magic
20:39
Speaker 2: of it all, I gotta say, something that... I was
20:42
Speaker 2: re-watching the original Practical Magic this morning, actually. And I
20:46
Speaker 2: was like... When I watched Practical Magic 2, I was like,
20:50
Speaker 2: where the fuck was the magic? And as our friend
20:53
Speaker 2: Amy pointed out, why was the majority of the magic
20:55
Speaker 2: conducted by men in this film?
20:57
Speaker 1: That is... Okay, that is one of my biggest problems.
21:00
Speaker 1: And I think something that exemplifies it so well is
21:04
Speaker 1: there's one scene... in which there is a male cover
21:09
Speaker 1: of the iconic 90s female singer-songwriter song, Fade Into You
21:15
Speaker 1: by Mazzy Star.
21:16
Speaker 2: So fucked up.
21:18
Speaker 1: How would you have a man cover that song instead
21:23
Speaker 1: of just using the original? And that to me is like,
21:26
Speaker 1: you all truly missed the point. You have no idea
21:31
Speaker 1: what movie you're making.
21:33
Speaker 2: It's truly disgusting. It's disgusting.
21:37
Speaker 1: It's disgusting. I still listen to the original Practical Magic
21:41
Speaker 1: soundtrack to this day. It's iconic. This one, yes, they
21:46
Speaker 1: used my favorite Florence and the Machine song, Howl, which, okay, great.
21:50
Speaker 1: I'm glad she got that check. But there's so much...
21:57
Speaker 1: Use 90s needle drops to make it feel like the
22:00
Speaker 1: original or... Use the vast amount of music that exists
22:06
Speaker 1: today that was directly inspired by that kind of music. Okay.
22:10
Speaker 1: And not have a man cover Fade Into You.
22:13
Speaker 2: Okay. Honestly, I want to get back to the magic,
22:15
Speaker 2: but while we're on this, I just, I have to,
22:19
Speaker 2: I 1000% agree with you. It's like either give us
22:22
Speaker 2: like 90s Dolly Parton, give us 90s Michelle Branch, Jenny Lewis,
22:29
Speaker 2: Fiona Apple.
22:30
Speaker 1: Oh my God. Where was Fiona Apple?
22:33
Speaker 2: Here's the thing. As you said, Rose, the original Practical
22:36
Speaker 2: Magic soundtrack, iconic, witchy, powerful.
22:38
Speaker 1: I literally have it over on my bookshelf. I have
22:41
Speaker 1: the CD.
22:42
Speaker 2: It is so an integral part to the ethos of
22:45
Speaker 2: the film and the world that is built. And there
22:48
Speaker 2: was none of that. It's like the casting director, sorry,
22:52
Speaker 2: the music supervisor obviously Googled witchiest musicians and found Florence
22:59
Speaker 2: and the Machine and then literally landslide like kill yourself
23:04
Speaker 2: like there's no originality no kill yourself this soundtrack should
23:09
Speaker 2: have had wise blood it should have had ethel kane
23:14
Speaker 2: ethel kane willow's coping mechanism and look this is a
23:17
Speaker 2: wine mom film so you could have thrown in like
23:19
Speaker 2: adele's like 30 like i'm 30 why not could have
23:22
Speaker 2: thrown in maybe like Caroline Palachuk or some boy genius
23:26
Speaker 2: or some Phoebe Bridgers.
23:27
Speaker 1: And it's not like you can't afford it. Take some
23:29
Speaker 1: of the CGI smoke money and put it towards music licensing.
23:33
Speaker 2: There should have been Kate Bush in here. There could
23:35
Speaker 2: have been Ethel Kane in here. It was such a
23:38
Speaker 2: missed opportunity on the musicality.
23:41
Speaker 1: I can admit that the original Practical Magic is more
23:44
Speaker 1: style over substance. That's part of why I like it.
23:48
Speaker 1: This movie... had neither. It had neither style nor substance,
23:52
Speaker 1: and it needed to have one of them. And I
23:54
Speaker 1: would have actually preferred if it had just been style.
23:56
Speaker 2: Put Feist and Haim on the soundtrack, you cowards. I
24:00
Speaker 2: don't know about Haim. Haim, here's the thing. You have
24:04
Speaker 2: to think about the place and time of the original
24:06
Speaker 2: Practical Magic and how that movie had this kiss by
24:13
Speaker 2: Faith Hill. It had the radio bop on it, And
24:18
Speaker 2: I do think that, yes, like Haim is going to
24:20
Speaker 2: be like a mainstream indie girl kind of like pleaser.
24:25
Speaker 2: You know what I mean? It actually would make sense
24:27
Speaker 2: or to put on like even like a rock era
24:30
Speaker 2: Miley or something like that. You know what I mean?
24:32
Speaker 2: Like there's so many different directions you can go with
24:36
Speaker 2: this soundtrack that we're just.
24:37
Speaker 1: I even went to look at the Practical Magic 2
24:40
Speaker 1: soundtrack today. There's only four songs on it and the
24:43
Speaker 1: rest are score.
24:44
Speaker 2: No, it's nasty.
24:46
Speaker 1: Why did... Like they could... If fucking Jane Schoenbrunn can
24:50
Speaker 1: have a whole custom soundtrack made for I Saw the
24:54
Speaker 1: TV Glow, you can do it for Practical Magic 2.
24:57
Speaker 1: You have the money.
24:58
Speaker 2: God, I should become a music supervisor.
25:01
Speaker 1: You would be actually really good at that. Can I
25:04
Speaker 1: tell you some of the differences in the book plot
25:06
Speaker 1: and the film that really pissed me off? Okay, one
25:10
Speaker 1: of them I did actually appreciate.
25:13
Speaker 2: Okay.
25:13
Speaker 1: So at the, the, the plot is pretty much the
25:17
Speaker 1: overarching plot is pretty much the same at the end
25:20
Speaker 1: of the book. I don't forget. I don't remember the
25:23
Speaker 1: exact circumstances, but in to save her daughter, Sally has
25:28
Speaker 1: to give up her powers and she no longer is
25:30
Speaker 1: a witch at the end of the book. And like,
25:33
Speaker 1: it's supposed to be a happy ending for her because
25:35
Speaker 1: you know, Sally like doesn't want to be a witch,
25:37
Speaker 1: but it falls into one of my least favorite tropes,
25:40
Speaker 1: which is when the female witch, Magical girl has to
25:44
Speaker 1: give up her power to save the day.
25:49
Speaker 2: Well, but my caveat to that is that it then
25:56
Speaker 2: used another trope that I think is really lazy, which is,
26:01
Speaker 2: matriarch sacrificing herself for the betterment of the family for
26:05
Speaker 2: apparently no reason. Like, it was giving Magi in Ferngully
26:09
Speaker 2: kind of disappearing into the ether. And you're watching and
26:12
Speaker 2: you're like, wait, why did she do that? How did
26:15
Speaker 2: it help? Was it necessary? And, like, with this, I
26:18
Speaker 2: was like, when.
26:19
Speaker 1: Or like when Diane Wiest died and then like sparkles
26:22
Speaker 1: went up.
26:23
Speaker 2: Yes. I was like, I was like, both of these
26:25
Speaker 2: divas are sacrificing themselves for some sort of greater good.
26:29
Speaker 2: And like, I guess at the end it's like she
26:30
Speaker 2: broke the curse and I'm like, it was that, it
26:33
Speaker 2: was that easy. Like I thought that was a.
26:35
Speaker 1: In the, in the book, Diane Wiest does die. Diane,
26:42
Speaker 1: Aunt Jet does die, but it's not like, it's not
26:45
Speaker 1: like it is in the movie. It's not like she's
26:46
Speaker 1: like sacrificing herself for the family. She doesn't, she knows
26:50
Speaker 1: that she's going to die, but like no one else does.
26:52
Speaker 1: She certainly does not dissolve into magical sparkles. That's fucking dumb. Also,
26:57
Speaker 1: also to my earlier note about this romance movie, having
27:01
Speaker 1: no romance in it, both Jillian and the younger daughter,
27:06
Speaker 1: Antonia have romantic plot lines. Jillian has a man that she,
27:12
Speaker 1: I believe in the book lives with, but like, won't like,
27:16
Speaker 1: move in with technically or get married to because of
27:19
Speaker 1: the curse. So they kind of like work around it
27:21
Speaker 1: by not living together. And her whole journey is about
27:25
Speaker 1: her getting to a place where she wants to finally
27:28
Speaker 1: let love in. In this movie, Jillian has no plot
27:32
Speaker 1: line of her own. She only exists to react to Sally.
27:35
Speaker 1: And then also the youngest daughter, Antonia, she also has
27:40
Speaker 1: a love interest. In fact, in the book, she's pregnant
27:44
Speaker 1: because she like, decided she wanted to have a baby.
27:47
Speaker 1: She's a lesbian in the book who decided to have
27:50
Speaker 1: a baby with her friend and then falls in love
27:53
Speaker 1: instantly with a woman at the hospital as she's watching
27:57
Speaker 1: over Gideon, the comatose boyfriend. And the only hint of
28:02
Speaker 1: that we get is in the final scene, there's a
28:05
Speaker 1: sort of non-binary lesbian who smiles at her twice, which
28:10
Speaker 1: is supposed to be, you know, telling us like, oh,
28:13
Speaker 1: she's going to have a romance. And to me, this
28:16
Speaker 1: is indicative of what we were talking about earlier with
28:19
Speaker 1: queer storylines and how they could not put that in there.
28:22
Speaker 1: They can only nod to it because they know that
28:24
Speaker 1: this movie is primarily going to be seen by wine
28:26
Speaker 1: moms in middle America.
28:29
Speaker 2: Rose, I have to disclose something to you and to
28:32
Speaker 2: the virgins right here and now. I did leave this
28:35
Speaker 2: film 20 minutes early to go see Bo and Yang
28:37
Speaker 2: in O'Mary.
28:38
Speaker 1: And I support that.
28:39
Speaker 2: And when I walked out, I was like, oh, thank
28:41
Speaker 2: God I have to go. And I turned to Amy
28:43
Speaker 2: and I was just like, just tell me how it ends.
28:46
Speaker 2: And I did not hear about that.
28:49
Speaker 1: Well, it was very blink and you'll miss it. My
28:53
Speaker 1: mom did not notice it. I only noticed it because
28:55
Speaker 1: I was looking for it.
28:57
Speaker 2: The kind of like barely lesbian subtext in Practical Magic
29:00
Speaker 2: 2 was giving kind of LeFou in Beauty and the
29:04
Speaker 2: Beast live action like, Looking at another gay guy and oh,
29:09
Speaker 2: oh my God, they're dancing. How beautiful the ending.
29:12
Speaker 1: Of the movie is. But they didn't even dance.
29:15
Speaker 2: Honestly, it's embarrassing that the live action Beauty and the
29:18
Speaker 2: Beast did a better job. Than this fucking film did
29:23
Speaker 2: to the lesbian storyline that I.
29:25
Speaker 1: Did not even know existed. Well, it also is just
29:26
Speaker 1: a better movie than this film was.
29:28
Speaker 2: I think, honestly, talking about the daughters and some of
29:31
Speaker 2: the things, some more of this kind of plot layover
29:35
Speaker 2: stuff is like a rich fodder for maybe perhaps the
29:38
Speaker 2: end of the Practical Magic conversation. that I would like
29:41
Speaker 2: to prompt which is let's pretend.
29:44
Speaker 1: Oh wait one more thing that I just want to
29:46
Speaker 1: say on that note about the daughters someone in our
29:52
Speaker 1: chat said asked a question someone in our patreon chat
29:56
Speaker 1: patreon.com slash like a virgin you should be subscribed asked
29:59
Speaker 1: us why Maisie Williams looked like that. And she was
30:02
Speaker 1: specifically saying that she thought Maisie Williams kind of looked
30:05
Speaker 1: like shit in this movie. And I actually did clock
30:08
Speaker 1: this because I noticed whatever CGI smoothing filter they had
30:14
Speaker 1: on Nicole and Sandra was not on the daughters, specifically
30:19
Speaker 1: not on Maisie. Like, Sandra and Nicole, their faces are
30:23
Speaker 1: totally poreless. Maisie, you can literally see her under eye bags.
30:28
Speaker 2: They... Should have booked Mikey Meeks.
30:31
Speaker 1: Sorry. You know that I'm right.
30:34
Speaker 2: Mikey Meeks.
30:35
Speaker 1: I don't think it was Maisie's fault. I think it
30:37
Speaker 1: was that they underwrote that role and gave all the
30:40
Speaker 1: meaty stuff to Joey King, who was fine. Like, she
30:44
Speaker 1: was good.
30:44
Speaker 2: She was great. I think Joey and Maisie make sense
30:47
Speaker 2: as sisters because they do look a little, they do
30:50
Speaker 2: look pretty similar. But I honestly wanted to take this
30:53
Speaker 2: daughter's conversation and get into this prompt because I think
30:56
Speaker 2: it kind of starts with the daughter's. like let's pretend
30:59
Speaker 2: that a good practical magic to exist. I know we
31:01
Speaker 2: don't want to, but let's pretend that it does.
31:04
Speaker 1: Let's write some fanfic.
31:05
Speaker 2: What is this movie? And I think we can rely
31:09
Speaker 2: on the original text of the book, which I don't know.
31:10
Speaker 2: So I'll lean on you. But I, my first thing
31:14
Speaker 2: with the daughters, I was like, this is set 25
31:17
Speaker 2: years after the events of the first film. These women
31:19
Speaker 2: should be in their thirties and they just did not
31:23
Speaker 2: look like they were in their thirties. They should have
31:25
Speaker 2: cast Evan Rachel Wood again. fucking cowards. She's a brilliant
31:30
Speaker 2: fucking actress who is 39 years old and it is okay.
31:34
Speaker 2: for a 39-year-old to have a relationship with her mother.
31:38
Speaker 1: It is also okay for a woman in her 60s
31:41
Speaker 1: to be in her 60s. Yes. That is why they
31:44
Speaker 1: cast these younger actresses.
31:46
Speaker 2: Yes, they wanted them to seem younger.
31:48
Speaker 1: Yes, which is bullshit.
31:49
Speaker 2: It's bullshit.
31:50
Speaker 1: We all know how long it's been since the original film.
31:53
Speaker 2: And also, Sandra Bullock and Nicole Kidman, yes, they look
31:55
Speaker 2: so much younger, but just let it happen. Just let
31:59
Speaker 2: it work.
32:00
Speaker 1: Make a joke about how they look so good for
32:02
Speaker 1: their age because of magic.
32:03
Speaker 2: Yes. Yes! Yes!
32:07
Speaker 1: Oh my god!
32:08
Speaker 2: And then cast Evan Rachel Wood, cast, sorry, Emilia Clarke. Okay.
32:14
Speaker 1: Wait, we're not bringing back the other original actress?
32:16
Speaker 2: Do you know who she is?
32:18
Speaker 1: No, but like.
32:18
Speaker 2: No, we need to bring back a star.
32:20
Speaker 1: Okay.
32:20
Speaker 2: Bring back a star. Sorry. Evan Rachel Wood is a star.
32:24
Speaker 2: The other actress is not.
32:25
Speaker 1: Emilia Clarke is, I actually think that's a pretty good pick.
32:28
Speaker 2: It would be. Emilia Clarke, I was thinking, I literally
32:30
Speaker 2: Googled actresses in their late 30s. Truly. Like that's how
32:34
Speaker 2: I got there. And then I was like, oh, Emilia
32:36
Speaker 2: makes sense. She does genre. She also does rom-com. She like.
32:41
Speaker 2: She is like someone who doesn't get enough work, I
32:44
Speaker 2: think works perfectly for a blockbuster. And then for a
32:47
Speaker 2: romantic interest, it has to be somebody tall. So I
32:53
Speaker 2: guess we kind of said Alexander Skarsgård because Jacob Elordi,
32:56
Speaker 2: it's too age gap relationship. It's too distracting.
32:59
Speaker 1: Yeah. But you know what? Let's make an age gap relationship.
33:01
Speaker 2: Yes.
33:02
Speaker 1: Why not?
33:02
Speaker 2: Or like Orlando Bloom or something like that.
33:06
Speaker 1: That's interesting.
33:07
Speaker 2: Like somebody who you're... Javier Bardem. Either... I think... Yeah, honestly.
33:16
Speaker 1: He'll do it. He did the fucking live action Little Mermaid.
33:18
Speaker 1: He will take the job.
33:20
Speaker 2: Javier Bardem would be sickening, honestly.
33:22
Speaker 1: Especially because, you know, we're... This guy is supposed to
33:26
Speaker 1: be someone who was into dark magic, so he should
33:28
Speaker 1: have a little bit of darkness to him.
33:31
Speaker 2: Yes. It's that or it's Jacob Elordi. Like, I'm sorry.
33:35
Speaker 1: Jacob Elordi, but in the Frankenstein makeup.
33:38
Speaker 2: Yeah, in the Frankenstein makeup at a certain point because
33:41
Speaker 2: he is a shapeshifter or something like that.
33:43
Speaker 1: Wait, can we talk about the fact that although his
33:45
Speaker 1: part of the movie was the worst, the fucking British twunk?
33:50
Speaker 2: Yeah, who is that?
33:51
Speaker 1: I don't know who he was, but I need to
33:52
Speaker 1: see his fat, uncut pink cock immediately. Immediately.
33:57
Speaker 2: He does have kind of gay porn face, which I love.
34:00
Speaker 2: He has like a kind of like British. Yeah. He
34:04
Speaker 2: has like a kind of like cousin fucking face.
34:07
Speaker 1: You know what I mean? Oh my God. He would
34:08
Speaker 1: kill on FamilyDick.com. Yeah.
34:10
Speaker 2: That's what I mean.
34:11
Speaker 1: He should honestly, Mr. X-Tune should use him as a reference.
34:14
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah.
34:15
Speaker 1: But, like, that part of the movie was so dumb
34:19
Speaker 1: when they were just, like, blasting each other with smoke.
34:22
Speaker 2: So, if our version of this film is, like, daughters
34:27
Speaker 2: in their late 30s who have relationships with their moms,
34:31
Speaker 2: we need sex. We need va-va-voom. And we need lesbianism. So,
34:36
Speaker 2: one of these... Maybe Amelia Clark... Is that right? Maybe
34:38
Speaker 2: it actually needs to be, like, Kristen Stewart or, like,
34:40
Speaker 2: something like that. Aubrey Plaza, I think, maybe.
34:43
Speaker 1: I don't think Kristen Stewart's doing it.
34:45
Speaker 2: No, Aubrey Plaza makes sense for the tone of Practical
34:48
Speaker 2: Magic 2, but I kind of want something smokier like
34:51
Speaker 2: Practical Magic 1. So I do think it has to
34:53
Speaker 2: be a broodier.
34:55
Speaker 1: Maybe Mackenzie Davis, who was played opposite Aubrey Plaza in
35:02
Speaker 1: the gay, the lesbian Christmas movie. Yes!
35:05
Speaker 2: Would love.
35:06
Speaker 1: Honestly.
35:07
Speaker 2: And then we have a lesbian storyline... I don't know
35:10
Speaker 2: what it is. I'm guessing it involves you hauling.
35:13
Speaker 1: No, we just include the lesbian storyline that's in the
35:18
Speaker 1: source material.
35:19
Speaker 2: And what are the stakes of that book? Is there
35:24
Speaker 2: murder at the beginning? Because there really should be. I
35:27
Speaker 2: think that was a big issue with me.
35:28
Speaker 1: No, there's no murder.
35:31
Speaker 2: The first Practical Magic really works because the hijinks revolving
35:35
Speaker 2: around murder are are delightful because it's handled by two
35:40
Speaker 2: beautiful women. And this movie did not have any of
35:44
Speaker 2: that whatsoever and really over-focused on, oh, it's about motherhood,
35:49
Speaker 2: it's about motherhood. It's like, yeah, Practical Magic is about motherhood.
35:52
Speaker 1: Well, it's about sisterhood. It's about sisterhood and female familial connections.
35:59
Speaker 2: And MILFs, okay? Yes. It's about MILFs and they forgot
36:05
Speaker 2: about that. Anyways.
36:06
Speaker 1: Okay. So actually here's my pitch. If, if we decide
36:09
Speaker 1: to ditch, um, the book of magic entirely and do
36:14
Speaker 1: a new plot, let's do it in, you know, in their,
36:18
Speaker 1: you know, sunset years in their sixties, Jillian Sally have
36:25
Speaker 1: decided to, um, open up a new small business because Sally's, um,
36:31
Speaker 1: business that she had in the first movie, the sort
36:35
Speaker 1: of Aveda-esque organic lotions and potions company. Maybe it was
36:42
Speaker 1: bought by Sephora. So they're just looking for something to
36:44
Speaker 1: fill their time. And what they decide to do is
36:48
Speaker 1: go on a road trip helping women kill their abusive husbands.
36:52
Speaker 2: Yeah. They've opened up an underground agency for killing rapists
36:59
Speaker 2: and abusive husbands.
37:00
Speaker 1: Oh my god, here's what they are. They are every
37:03
Speaker 1: Etsy witch. They are secretly doing real spells on people.
37:08
Speaker 2: It actually... Okay, here's actually... Let me like lean... Let
37:11
Speaker 2: me like dig into actually the realism of the first
37:14
Speaker 2: Practical Magic. I think it kind of happens by accident.
37:18
Speaker 2: Nicole Kidman and Sandra Bullock are on this road trip and...
37:22
Speaker 2: They come and maybe they're with their daughters, whatever. Or
37:25
Speaker 2: maybe one of their daughters is getting into an altercation
37:31
Speaker 2: with a fucking guy and they kill him. Maybe kind
37:34
Speaker 2: of accidentally, maybe kind of on purpose as it kind
37:36
Speaker 2: of happened in the first Practical Magic. And they're like, fuck,
37:40
Speaker 2: not again. And then they realize how good they are
37:43
Speaker 2: at this.
37:44
Speaker 1: Totally.
37:45
Speaker 2: And along the way, they probably should kill at least one,
37:50
Speaker 2: if not two more people. And that would be the
37:54
Speaker 2: film that I want to see.
37:56
Speaker 1: Or maybe we get political and it's sort of like
37:58
Speaker 1: Legally Blonde 2 where Elga Woods goes to Washington. They
38:01
Speaker 1: go to the White House to assassinate Trump.
38:04
Speaker 2: Right. Yeah. Now that also would be better than the
38:08
Speaker 2: movie we just watched.
38:09
Speaker 1: Well, I think I don't really have much else to
38:13
Speaker 1: say about this fucking abortion of a film that made
38:18
Speaker 1: me So angry I wanted to grab the wheel from
38:21
Speaker 1: my mother and crash the car so that neither of
38:24
Speaker 1: us had to live in a world in which this
38:26
Speaker 1: movie exists.
38:27
Speaker 2: I do think, and at least I can claim this,
38:32
Speaker 2: that unfortunately Practical Magic 2 is in the running for
38:37
Speaker 2: the esteemed prize of the Like a Virgin Awards Dudukaka
38:43
Speaker 2: of the Year.
38:43
Speaker 1: Yes, huge mega flop Dudukaka. It also has not made
38:46
Speaker 1: as much money as they projected it would, which I'm
38:49
Speaker 1: happy about.
38:50
Speaker 2: Well, they're going to blame it on women, and you
38:53
Speaker 2: know it.
38:53
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's true. And I will say, this does not
38:57
Speaker 1: impede upon my love for the original film. I will
39:00
Speaker 1: still watch it every year at Halloween until I die.
39:03
Speaker 1: I will still read the prequel book every October until
39:06
Speaker 1: I die. This movie.
39:09
Speaker 1: To quote Nancy from The Craft, you don't even exist
39:14
Speaker 1: to me.
39:16
Speaker 2: Exactly. And it doesn't. What movie? Oh, what were we
39:20
Speaker 2: talking about?
39:21
Speaker 1: I don't even remember.
39:22
Speaker 2: I have no idea.
39:22
Speaker 1: I think the wind just blew through here.
39:24
Speaker 2: Anyways, there's a South Korean film.
39:28
Speaker 1: Let's talk about Hope. which is the other movie that
39:33
Speaker 1: we both saw within the past week or so. I
39:36
Speaker 1: saw it yesterday.
39:37
Speaker 2: And much like Practical Magic, it's like, okay, this is
39:42
Speaker 2: a film that we're for sure going to see and
39:44
Speaker 2: for sure going to talk about. And I think we
39:46
Speaker 2: both walked out of that theater feeling kind of like huh.
39:52
Speaker 1: I felt okay well i have to admit something which
39:56
Speaker 1: is kind of telling of my experience of this film
39:59
Speaker 1: i fell asleep which is something that in my 38
40:02
Speaker 1: years on earth has never happened to me in a
40:05
Speaker 1: movie theater.
40:05
Speaker 2: Are you absolutely positive yes that's a never ever.
40:09
Speaker 1: Never never well you know how you know my sleep
40:12
Speaker 1: issues i can't i don't i i can't fall asleep
40:15
Speaker 1: so For me to nod off during a movie that
40:19
Speaker 1: was this loud. Yeah.
40:21
Speaker 2: You were bored.
40:22
Speaker 1: It's kind of telling. And I'm sure you can guess
40:25
Speaker 1: where in the film it happened. Because there are some
40:27
Speaker 1: very obvious lulls.
40:30
Speaker 2: I'm going to guess it was when, was it like
40:35
Speaker 2: when they're finding the alien baby?
40:40
Speaker 1: Yes, it must have been because I did not know
40:43
Speaker 1: there was an alien baby.
40:45
Speaker 2: Oh, I knew it. Okay, okay, okay. So for The Virgins,
40:48
Speaker 2: I think we can kind of give them an overview.
40:51
Speaker 2: I'll start with some context, which is, I mean, you
40:55
Speaker 2: wrote into the notes that this is the highest budget
40:57
Speaker 2: of any Korean film ever made.
40:58
Speaker 1: Allegedly.
40:59
Speaker 2: I did not know that. I had heard that it
41:01
Speaker 2: was among the largest productions in Korean film history. I
41:05
Speaker 2: also know that it is the largest American release for
41:09
Speaker 2: a Korean film since Parasite. So this is a movie
41:12
Speaker 2: that has been highly- I won't say anticipated, but there's
41:17
Speaker 2: tons of budget and support that went into the marketing
41:22
Speaker 2: and promotion of this film. And I think it's also
41:25
Speaker 2: why Alexander Skarsgård and Alicia Vikander have random-ass roles in
41:29
Speaker 2: this film, which we will get to.
41:30
Speaker 1: You mean Michael Fassbender?
41:32
Speaker 2: Michael Fassbender, what did I say?
41:33
Speaker 1: And Alicia Vikander. And randomly Taylor Russell, too.
41:36
Speaker 2: Taylor... Oh, girl. I still can't figure out who she played,
41:39
Speaker 2: but we'll talk about the American actors a little bit later.
41:41
Speaker 2: But how would you describe... Actually, I mean, do you
41:46
Speaker 2: want me to describe the plot?
41:48
Speaker 1: I would love for you to describe the plot.
41:50
Speaker 2: Okay. So my take on the plot is that there's
41:57
Speaker 2: a teeny tiny little town in South Korea and all
42:01
Speaker 2: of a sudden there's like, you know, cows being eaten.
42:06
Speaker 2: There's like buildings being destroyed and they're like, is it
42:09
Speaker 2: a tiger? What is it? And you realize, oh, these
42:13
Speaker 2: buffoons are going to catch some monsters. And the film is,
42:20
Speaker 2: for the overwhelming majority of it, idiots trying to catch
42:24
Speaker 2: monsters for two hours and 47 minutes. But 30 minutes
42:29
Speaker 2: into that progression, a woman enters and she's the only
42:33
Speaker 2: one that is smart. And when she enters the film
42:38
Speaker 2: and kills the fucking monster, spoiler alert, we learn that
42:44
Speaker 2: the alien monster does in fact have family and the
42:48
Speaker 2: monsters aren't dead yet. We got to go catch some
42:51
Speaker 2: more monsters. And I, as someone who loves catch the
42:55
Speaker 2: monsters actually really love a lot of the high octane
42:59
Speaker 2: kind of chase scenes that are in this film.
43:02
Speaker 1: Oh, the two chase scenes are the best parts of
43:06
Speaker 1: the movie, even though I think this, they go on
43:09
Speaker 1: a little too long.
43:11
Speaker 2: I want to know, how long you fell asleep for,
43:13
Speaker 2: because there for sure are more than two chase scenes.
43:17
Speaker 1: There are.
43:17
Speaker 2: I'm like, there might be like four or five.
43:21
Speaker 1: Oh, okay. I must've been asleep for a while.
43:23
Speaker 2: There's so, I felt, so that was like my part
43:26
Speaker 2: of my gripe is that I'm someone who I love explosions.
43:29
Speaker 2: I love a chase. I love like catch the monsters.
43:32
Speaker 2: And even I felt after like chase three or four,
43:36
Speaker 2: I was like, oh, this is a little, I'm actually
43:39
Speaker 2: numbed now to this scene. adrenaline.
43:43
Speaker 1: The movie was so repetitive.
43:45
Speaker 2: Yeah.
43:46
Speaker 1: How, how, how many times are you going to shoot
43:49
Speaker 1: a monster and the bullet does nothing before you just
43:52
Speaker 1: stop using a gun? Yes.
43:54
Speaker 2: That I think that's why the, the, I was like, okay, the,
43:57
Speaker 2: the characters being truly buffoons, I think it's like necessary
44:00
Speaker 2: to this film because it's like the relentlessness, the relentlessness
44:05
Speaker 2: to trying to shoot monsters with guns that won't die
44:07
Speaker 2: from guns is like, I'm like, okay.
44:10
Speaker 1: And you know what? On the buffoonery, there are some
44:12
Speaker 1: things I liked about this movie. And the humor... Lots
44:15
Speaker 1: of things I loved. The humor is one of the best.
44:18
Speaker 1: This is actually a very funny movie. Like the old
44:21
Speaker 1: man's monologue about shitting himself. Love. So good. Incredible.
44:24
Speaker 2: I really think.
44:25
Speaker 1: I do think that there is, with some creative editing,
44:31
Speaker 1: there's a mid to decent to maybe good sci-fi movie
44:36
Speaker 1: in here. It just is like... It's an hour and
44:39
Speaker 1: a half long.
44:41
Speaker 2: An hour and a half too long.
44:43
Speaker 1: No, I would say the good movie is an hour
44:47
Speaker 1: and a half of this almost three hour movie. So yeah,
44:50
Speaker 1: it is an hour and a half too long.
44:52
Speaker 2: My guess is actually that. The length of the film
44:57
Speaker 2: is part of the, they like, well, we're spending this much.
45:00
Speaker 2: We might as well get more movie. So I think
45:02
Speaker 2: that's part of it. I will also say that we're
45:06
Speaker 2: looking at this from a very American lens of film.
45:10
Speaker 2: We are used to like plot, plot, plot, plot, plot, plot, plot,
45:13
Speaker 2: high octane, cut, cut, cut, cut, cut, cut, cut, film over.
45:17
Speaker 2: And like foreign film and maybe Korean film specifically is
45:21
Speaker 2: like slower and more patient. There's more genre blending, abrupt
45:25
Speaker 2: shifts in tone. We, like a virgin, we don't think
45:30
Speaker 2: foreign film has to be American film, right?
45:32
Speaker 1: No, but it still has to be good.
45:34
Speaker 2: Inarguably, this movie is for sure too long. For 10,000%
45:41
Speaker 2: too long.
45:42
Speaker 1: The fact that there is something to be said for
45:46
Speaker 1: building tension and not showing your hand too soon, but
45:52
Speaker 1: You know, one of my major gripes with this film
45:54
Speaker 1: is how doodoo cock of the CGI is. Terrible. The
45:59
Speaker 1: fact that it takes so long for us to finally
46:02
Speaker 1: see the alien. And then when we do finally see it,
46:06
Speaker 1: it looks like that.
46:07
Speaker 2: Okay. So, well, first of all, lots of things that
46:12
Speaker 2: I love about this film. Loved how long it took
46:14
Speaker 2: to see the monster. In fact, I think the reveal
46:17
Speaker 2: could have been held off even longer. Love that.
46:20
Speaker 1: Oh, I disagree. I love not seeing the monster. If
46:22
Speaker 1: you have a monster killing movie, you need to see
46:25
Speaker 1: the monster earlier.
46:26
Speaker 2: We saw the monster, I checked the time, around 45
46:30
Speaker 2: to 50 minutes, I think.
46:32
Speaker 1: Should have been, everything that happened in that first 45
46:36
Speaker 1: minutes should have happened in 15 minutes, narratively.
46:40
Speaker 2: I disagree. I think that the problem, I think that
46:42
Speaker 2: the lag is in the latter two thirds. And that
46:45
Speaker 2: I think the first third and the anticipation of seeing
46:48
Speaker 2: the monster is was the highlight of the film.
46:50
Speaker 1: Oh my God, I so disagree. But that's why we're different.
46:53
Speaker 2: But let's talk about this first monster that we see.
46:58
Speaker 2: And at least in almost the first half of the film,
47:01
Speaker 2: we think is, we believe to be the only monster
47:03
Speaker 2: in the film until it's revealed that there are more monsters.
47:05
Speaker 2: But this first monster is like barbarian, like the film
47:11
Speaker 2: barbarian levels of like Tranny Lish. Like her wig is
47:17
Speaker 2: like kind of like Gollum cunt. Her body is tea.
47:22
Speaker 2: She is mother.
47:23
Speaker 1: And she does get transvesticated. They literally try when they spoilers,
47:28
Speaker 1: obviously spoilers for everything, but when they kill her and
47:32
Speaker 1: there's this doctor examining her corpse, which was another funny scene, um,
47:37
Speaker 1: check to see what the gender was. And the alien
47:40
Speaker 1: has no gendered has no gender. But then later, the
47:44
Speaker 1: other aliens are extremely gendered. The female aliens have boobs.
47:48
Speaker 2: It's a really, really inconsistent. It also like, I mean,
47:53
Speaker 2: the alien lore is like a huge, huge problem in
47:58
Speaker 2: the film that I think we can discuss. But like,
48:01
Speaker 2: if there is something I will also say while we're
48:05
Speaker 2: talking about pace is like, I actually would say it's,
48:10
Speaker 2: there's not a mid to decent film in here. I
48:12
Speaker 2: would actually say there's a really great film in here
48:15
Speaker 2: if they had consolidated the latter half of the chasing
48:20
Speaker 2: and never revealed to us that the aliens can speak.
48:25
Speaker 1: Oh my God. I fucking hated that. And that being
48:29
Speaker 1: the way the movie ends, girl, the fuck was that ending?
48:33
Speaker 2: We will talk about the ending, but I was just like,
48:36
Speaker 2: I really actually was ready to give this film. Like
48:41
Speaker 2: three or four star, like I was ready to give
48:43
Speaker 2: this film four stars, five stars on Letterboxd. I actually,
48:46
Speaker 2: I'm not joking, loved, loved, loved this film until the
48:51
Speaker 2: alien lore unraveled with Disclosure Day levels of like a mess. Wow.
48:57
Speaker 1: And the aliens were kind of giving the Disclosure Day stare.
49:01
Speaker 2: You googled alien and you hired a video game graphic
49:05
Speaker 2: designer to do the aliens. They look so bad.
49:08
Speaker 1: Video games look better than the CGI here.
49:11
Speaker 2: I totally agree.
49:12
Speaker 1: There was too much, like every time there was a
49:15
Speaker 1: close up on an alien's face I wanted to laugh
49:18
Speaker 1: because it looked so bad.
49:20
Speaker 2: Yeah I like look I loved so many different things
49:26
Speaker 2: about this film as we said love the humor I
49:29
Speaker 2: love the action I loved everything that it was doing
49:32
Speaker 2: it really did not for it to be such an
49:36
Speaker 2: expensive film the CGI should have been 10 times better.
49:42
Speaker 2: It was so not right.
49:44
Speaker 1: Or do what we were talking about earlier and show
49:48
Speaker 1: less of the monsters and really spend your money in
49:53
Speaker 1: targeted moments so that the CGI, yes, okay, let's have
49:57
Speaker 1: the monster not show up until 45 minutes into an
50:00
Speaker 1: hour and a half movie and then only see them
50:02
Speaker 1: a couple times so that we spend that money getting
50:07
Speaker 1: really good creature design.
50:09
Speaker 2: Yuck. And no, really. And also just like on this
50:13
Speaker 2: kind of like us, I think I'm kind of craving
50:16
Speaker 2: a bit of like action realism in this me wanting
50:22
Speaker 2: better aliens, scarier aliens. I had this same note that
50:26
Speaker 2: you did about the fact that Soongki literally being tossed
50:31
Speaker 2: around the forest. slammed against tree trunks.
50:34
Speaker 1: Multiple tree trunks.
50:36
Speaker 2: Over and over again.
50:36
Speaker 1: Falling like a hundred feet to the ground and surviving.
50:40
Speaker 2: If that is the logic of the violence in this film,
50:46
Speaker 2: then every character that died in this film should have
50:49
Speaker 2: survived because they would survive bullet wounds. The sturdiness of
50:55
Speaker 2: that particular human was really, really like... like it was
51:00
Speaker 2: not in line with the violence logic of the rest
51:03
Speaker 2: of the film. And that was, I also, I was like,
51:06
Speaker 2: that's really distracting. It was silly. And if it could
51:09
Speaker 2: just be silly, that would be great. Like if it
51:11
Speaker 2: was more silly, more silliness in the physical action, I
51:15
Speaker 2: actually could have gotten behind it.
51:17
Speaker 1: I loved in that final car chase scene when, you know,
51:20
Speaker 1: he's leaning out the window and Hoyon is like, oh
51:22
Speaker 1: my God, I love him. How is he doing this?
51:24
Speaker 1: He's like an action star. Like that's funny. Lean into that.
51:28
Speaker 1: But then we have these, You know, long stretches where,
51:31
Speaker 1: I mean, for me, nothing happened because I was asleep.
51:37
Speaker 1: The thing that I think really hindered this film, and
51:42
Speaker 1: how I also think you could have tightened it, is
51:44
Speaker 1: I think you either need to focus in on one
51:48
Speaker 1: main character, who should have been Hoyeon, because... That moment
51:53
Speaker 1: when she steps out of the cop car, if my
51:55
Speaker 1: theater had been full, I think we would have applauded.
51:57
Speaker 1: Like it was giving that like, oh, finally a woman
52:00
Speaker 1: is here. Yes. Either that or you have to bring
52:04
Speaker 1: the ensemble together much earlier.
52:07
Speaker 2: I totally agree that the different kind of clusters of characters,
52:13
Speaker 2: I did not actually feel like their paths met in
52:17
Speaker 2: a way that felt right. satisfying like it earned itself
52:21
Speaker 2: I think there was a problem with characterization in general
52:24
Speaker 2: which I think is okay if you're just going to
52:25
Speaker 2: be an action movie and these are all archetypes I
52:27
Speaker 2: actually am okay with that but then the plotting of
52:29
Speaker 2: them coming together needs to be satisfying and it just
52:32
Speaker 2: wasn't it.
52:32
Speaker 1: Would have worked well in a novel like it's a
52:35
Speaker 1: very sort of like Stephen King structure where like you're
52:39
Speaker 1: seeing braided narrative you're seeing everyone in the town and
52:43
Speaker 1: the way that they're reacting to things but in an
52:45
Speaker 1: action movie you need action you need you need propulsion,
52:51
Speaker 1: you need movement. And if worse, like I didn't actually
52:56
Speaker 1: know until the end who the main characters were supposed
52:59
Speaker 1: to be.
53:00
Speaker 2: Well, I think it is a true ensemble. And I
53:02
Speaker 2: think that the problem is more like a lack of
53:05
Speaker 2: true relationships between these characters. You know what I mean?
53:09
Speaker 2: There was also like, I can't remember the name of
53:11
Speaker 2: the cop, but the cop kept having like friends of
53:14
Speaker 2: his dying. And I was like, what's the significance of
53:16
Speaker 2: this friend? I don't really understand why this is, Like,
53:19
Speaker 2: we haven't... This hasn't been explained to us at all.
53:21
Speaker 1: Yeah, like, the moment where he accidentally kills the guy
53:24
Speaker 1: in the butcher shop, why didn't we, like... I actually
53:28
Speaker 1: would have really enjoyed seeing the status quo in this
53:31
Speaker 1: town at the beginning.
53:33
Speaker 2: Yes, yes, yes. Because... I agree.
53:35
Speaker 1: Because, like, while they're... It would have heightened the stakes.
53:37
Speaker 1: While they're initially driving around and the town is so empty,
53:41
Speaker 1: I couldn't tell if, like, this is just, like, a
53:43
Speaker 1: really sleepy town with a low population or... Or if
53:48
Speaker 1: everyone's dead because of the aliens.
53:50
Speaker 2: The humans didn't matter.
53:51
Speaker 1: You need to show us what is being destroyed for
53:55
Speaker 1: that destruction to have impact.
53:57
Speaker 2: The humans needed to matter more in this film, which
54:00
Speaker 2: is kind of, it feels crazy to say. And I,
54:03
Speaker 2: you know, I honestly could have used more exposition, which
54:08
Speaker 2: is crazy. They had so much time to explain some
54:13
Speaker 2: of the relationships between these characters and they, It was
54:17
Speaker 2: just kind of pedal on the gas for the overwhelming
54:21
Speaker 2: majority of the film, which I don't have a huge
54:23
Speaker 2: problem with this, but it really lowered the overall stakes.
54:29
Speaker 1: Yeah, the stakes felt non-existent to me. And honestly, I
54:35
Speaker 1: just kept waiting, honestly, for the shots that I remembered
54:38
Speaker 1: from the trailer. I was like, okay, well, when is
54:41
Speaker 1: the big spaceship going to poke through the sky? Because
54:44
Speaker 1: I've seen that. in trailers for the past six months.
54:47
Speaker 1: So I know I'm waiting for it. And this is
54:49
Speaker 1: a movie where every good shot in the movie was
54:52
Speaker 1: in the trailer.
54:54
Speaker 2: Yeah. I mean, well, I don't know if I agree
54:56
Speaker 2: with that. I don't really, I'd have to rewatch the trailer.
54:59
Speaker 2: I thought that the, I loved the action set pieces
55:03
Speaker 2: in this film throughout. I just think they weren't backed
55:06
Speaker 2: by a necessary humanity. And so if the whole movie
55:11
Speaker 2: is like monsters destroying this entire town, but we don't
55:16
Speaker 2: care about any of the people, then the plot is
55:19
Speaker 2: about the protection of property and a town. It's like,
55:22
Speaker 2: I don't have an emotional relationship to this town, really.
55:25
Speaker 2: It's all being projected by this buffoon cop who shot
55:29
Speaker 2: the mother alien in the face. And I think it's
55:33
Speaker 2: kind of doing a really terrible job throughout the film as.
55:35
Speaker 1: A protector of this and because of the repetitive nature
55:42
Speaker 1: of these just like endless car chase scenes or like
55:47
Speaker 1: people shooting guns at aliens and nothing happens to them
55:49
Speaker 1: there's no escalation of violence of action like in Alien
55:56
Speaker 1: or actually like maybe a better comp is in Aliens
56:00
Speaker 1: you know you have like the big boss battle at
56:03
Speaker 1: the end where Ripley gets into the mech suit and
56:06
Speaker 1: goes up against the alien queen and That never happened.
56:10
Speaker 1: They just kept shooting the aliens until finally they got
56:13
Speaker 1: some lucky shots in. And even then, the aliens didn't die.
56:18
Speaker 2: So I want to talk about the ending. Can we
56:23
Speaker 2: talk about the ending? Yes. Okay.
56:25
Speaker 1: What the fuck?
56:27
Speaker 2: The ending was my least favorite part of the film.
56:29
Speaker 2: I love learning that it's kind of something that you
56:31
Speaker 2: also hated. I felt very validated by that. I watched
56:33
Speaker 2: it with Daniel. He also was like, what the fuck
56:35
Speaker 2: was that ending? it truly kind of ruined my experience.
56:38
Speaker 1: It ended so abruptly. I thought it was a mistake.
56:43
Speaker 2: I called our dear friend in geekdom, James Scully, who
56:49
Speaker 2: saw this film and loved it. And I saw that
56:53
Speaker 2: he loved it. And I was like, I need to
56:56
Speaker 2: see this film through someone else's eyes. And our fellow.
57:00
Speaker 1: Look at your life. Look at your life through heaven's eyes.
57:04
Speaker 2: Yeah. And James is like.
57:07
Speaker 1: Look at your life. Look at hope through James Scully's eyes.
57:11
Speaker 2: And if the virgins are not familiar with James Scully,
57:13
Speaker 2: I think you can agree, Rose, that... Google it. James
57:16
Speaker 2: is our sister in being a fucking nerd. Oh, yeah.
57:21
Speaker 1: Big time.
57:22
Speaker 2: She's a true nerd, and I trust her opinion deeply
57:26
Speaker 2: on a lot of different kinds of media, even when we...
57:28
Speaker 2: I disagree with James all the time on things that
57:29
Speaker 2: we watch. And so I want to give James' kind
57:32
Speaker 2: of take on the ending of this film... which I'll
57:35
Speaker 2: describe the ending first, it essentially is all of a
57:38
Speaker 2: sudden the aliens can talk and the aliens have the
57:44
Speaker 2: faces of Alicia Vikander and Michael Fassbender and they're played
57:48
Speaker 2: by these actors. Still have no idea who Taylor Russell played.
57:51
Speaker 2: I think it was another alien that got killed or
57:52
Speaker 2: was running.
57:53
Speaker 1: She was the other alien with boobs.
57:56
Speaker 2: Oh my God. And I do not remember, honestly, any
58:00
Speaker 2: of the dialogue, but I think the gist was kind
58:03
Speaker 2: of like, We have to save this alien baby child
58:07
Speaker 2: that has been captured. Our alien race is doomed. I
58:14
Speaker 2: shall remove my sacred heart. I shall put it in
58:17
Speaker 2: the baby child. It will save our race and our legacy?
58:22
Speaker 1: And then the female alien goes, no. And then she
58:24
Speaker 1: makes some kind of metaphor about faith. And then the
58:28
Speaker 1: movie ends.
58:29
Speaker 2: And then the movie ends. And so James told me
58:31
Speaker 2: something that I did not know, which is that there's
58:33
Speaker 2: a post-credits scene. where Soon-Ki gets up from the road
58:40
Speaker 2: and he's alive still.
58:42
Speaker 1: Insane.
58:43
Speaker 2: Insane. And tells me something that I shit you not,
58:49
Speaker 2: I never, ever, ever would have considered in my entire life,
58:52
Speaker 2: that a sequel has been written and it is a
58:54
Speaker 2: clear cliffhanger for the follow-up film that they think is
58:59
Speaker 2: going to get made.
59:00
Speaker 1: That's not an excuse, though. I agree. Even if you have...
59:06
Speaker 1: sequels greenlit, a film has to.
59:10
Speaker 1: Have to have endings.
59:13
Speaker 2: I think, actually, that there are franchise films with cliffhanger
59:18
Speaker 2: endings that we have enjoyed, for sure. Like, The Hunger
59:21
Speaker 2: Games has something like that.
59:24
Speaker 1: But it's usually not with... Yes, sure. But I think
59:31
Speaker 1: films only have that when it's existing IP where people
59:35
Speaker 1: are counting on you having an investment in the character
59:38
Speaker 1: stories that you want to continue. I don't care about
59:42
Speaker 1: any of these people. I would not see the second
59:45
Speaker 1: movie in this series.
59:47
Speaker 2: I think that I will see it with James Gulley.
59:50
Speaker 2: And honestly, you should come, Rose. Okay, maybe I'll come.
59:54
Speaker 1: If it's under two hours, I'll come.
59:56
Speaker 2: It won't be.
59:58
Speaker 1: Well, then I'll leave after two hours.
59:59
Speaker 2: Yeah.
1:00:00
Speaker 1: I'll leave after 90 minutes.
1:00:02
Speaker 2: My issue with the way the movie ended, the cliffhanger,
1:00:07
Speaker 2: I think is a consequence of the fatigue of the length.
1:00:11
Speaker 2: And if this had been a miniseries, which it wasn't,
1:00:15
Speaker 2: and I knew from the beginning that I'm watching something
1:00:20
Speaker 2: that will be six hours. You know what I mean?
1:00:24
Speaker 1: I actually did have the same thought that I think
1:00:26
Speaker 1: this would have been better as a TV show.
1:00:28
Speaker 2: I think it would have. I actually think it would
1:00:30
Speaker 2: be amazing as a TV show. Especially if we would
1:00:33
Speaker 2: have more breaks between the chases.
1:00:36
Speaker 1: And if we had actually gotten to know the characters
1:00:38
Speaker 1: and know the town and maybe one of the episodes
1:00:41
Speaker 1: is all about the aliens and that's when we find
1:00:43
Speaker 1: out they can talk and maybe the CGI is better
1:00:45
Speaker 1: or like it's still not as good but it's a
1:00:47
Speaker 1: TV show so we're a little more forgiving and we're
1:00:49
Speaker 1: not watching it on a huge screen. And And yeah.
1:00:53
Speaker 2: And, and to that effect as a I, James's James's
1:00:59
Speaker 2: opinion offers a complete and total devil's advocate to that,
1:01:05
Speaker 2: which is, he said, but also if a second film
1:01:10
Speaker 2: was never made, I still would love this movie and
1:01:13
Speaker 2: it would still love the ending. And he said, I,
1:01:16
Speaker 2: I think that as American audiences, we're, conditioned to have
1:01:21
Speaker 2: everything answered for us and to have everything answered quickly.
1:01:24
Speaker 2: And that there is a layer of mystery and untouchableness
1:01:32
Speaker 2: and kind of like no fear of the unknown in
1:01:37
Speaker 2: foreign film and maybe in this film that I think
1:01:41
Speaker 2: most audiences, that James thinks most audiences aren't going to
1:01:44
Speaker 2: give themselves away to. And I'm not going to lie.
1:01:47
Speaker 2: I don't really like the unknown in movies. I want
1:01:49
Speaker 2: to know. And I can't think of very many films
1:01:53
Speaker 2: that end with a kind of, and you'll never know
1:01:55
Speaker 2: what happened that I like enjoyed. But I do think
1:02:00
Speaker 2: that as James is like, it can be a very generous.
1:02:04
Speaker 2: I think that James is like maybe generous read of
1:02:07
Speaker 2: that is something that I'm like, okay, that if, if
1:02:12
Speaker 2: this movie did have a sequel, I actually would feel
1:02:16
Speaker 2: a lot better about the film that I just watched.
1:02:18
Speaker 2: I did not watch Hunger Games and get mad when
1:02:23
Speaker 2: like PETA is possessed at the end and then it
1:02:25
Speaker 2: cuts to black.
1:02:26
Speaker 1: But that's the second movie in a four movie series.
1:02:32
Speaker 1: The first Hunger Games doesn't end like that. It has
1:02:34
Speaker 1: a definitive ending.
1:02:35
Speaker 2: Yes, but my knowledge of the fact that a movie
1:02:39
Speaker 2: will be released plays a part in my enjoyment of
1:02:42
Speaker 2: the ending. You know what I mean?
1:02:43
Speaker 1: I just don't think it should. I think stories are
1:02:47
Speaker 1: so powerful. They are so powerful. And even serialized stories,
1:02:53
Speaker 1: even an episode of television, yes, it can have a
1:02:58
Speaker 1: cliffhanger ending that leads to the next film, but it
1:03:02
Speaker 1: still has an ending. It really does.
1:03:05
Speaker 2: You need to have a satisfying narrative conclusion. Does that
1:03:10
Speaker 2: gorgeously wrap up this two-hander review of Hope and Practical Magic?
1:03:15
Speaker 2: Two movies that have truly nothing to do with each
1:03:18
Speaker 2: other aside from the fact that they are kind of
1:03:21
Speaker 2: mid to bad. I mean, Practical Magic is just bad.
1:03:25
Speaker 1: Practical Magic is a huge mega flop.
1:03:27
Speaker 2: I loved a lot of Hope.
1:03:29
Speaker 1: Hope is like, I think, misguided, misedited.
1:03:33
Speaker 2: People love it.
1:03:34
Speaker 1: It's just, it's just, I think it's just a bloated mess.
1:03:38
Speaker 1: And there were, there were glimmers of a much better
1:03:41
Speaker 1: movie within it that almost made me kind of mad
1:03:45
Speaker 1: that I wasn't watching that movie. Yeah.
1:03:49
Speaker 2: Virgins, if you are not subscribed to our Patreon at
1:03:52
Speaker 2: patreon.com slash like a virgin, you are missing out on
1:03:56
Speaker 2: the upcoming two part deep dive on Dolly Parton and
1:04:00
Speaker 2: Tim Curry. Their oeuvre is, the things that we love
1:04:04
Speaker 2: and know about their career from a kind of like
1:04:06
Speaker 2: a virgin angle. And if you're not familiar with the
1:04:09
Speaker 2: like a virgin angle, that's nerds, transsexuals and perversion. Okay.
1:04:15
Speaker 2: And Dolly and Tim were kind of king and queen
1:04:19
Speaker 2: of that.
1:04:20
Speaker 1: And we'll also maybe be throwing a little Bob Mackie
1:04:23
Speaker 1: in there as well.
1:04:24
Speaker 2: Yes. I honestly could do a whole other episode on
1:04:27
Speaker 2: Bob Mackie. I don't know if the virgins honestly would
1:04:30
Speaker 2: be into that much fashion, but, But maybe we'll talk
1:04:33
Speaker 2: a bit about Bob Mackie or maybe honestly Bob Mackie
1:04:35
Speaker 2: next week.
1:04:36
Speaker 1: I don't know.
1:04:36
Speaker 2: But we will talk about Bob.
1:04:38
Speaker 1: R.I.P. And also welcome back Bob Mackie as Lena Dunham's
1:04:42
Speaker 1: newly born child.
1:04:44
Speaker 2: Right. Yes. Preserving the homosexual dynasty. Rose has suggested that
1:04:52
Speaker 2: Lena Dunham's baby and Gaga's baby become betrothed.
1:04:56
Speaker 1: Yeah, in a sort of Swan Princess situation where every
1:04:59
Speaker 1: summer we bring them together for wacky hijinks and song.
1:05:03
Speaker 2: Yes, it's giving Briar Rose, and Gaga's baby is being
1:05:06
Speaker 2: taken to a forest as we speak by three fairies
1:05:10
Speaker 2: who are going to raise her under a separate name
1:05:13
Speaker 2: as a peasant, and she will re-emerge into the culture
1:05:16
Speaker 2: at the age of 16.
1:05:18
Speaker 1: Having transitioned.
1:05:19
Speaker 2: Having transitioned. To.
1:05:24
Speaker 2: Ma... female who's to say that's part of the fun
1:05:29
Speaker 2: you don't know leave
1:05:30
Speaker 1: Your guess for the gender of lady gaga's baby in
1:05:33
Speaker 1: the comments and we will see you next week me