Latest / INSPIRE STORY / #0112 _STORY INSPIRE: Decisions that transforman with Shanna H. Swan

Transcript

#0112 _STORY INSPIRE: Decisions that transforman with Shanna H. Swan · INSPIRE STORY

0:04
Speaker 1: The Joe Rogan Experience.
0:06
Speaker 2: Train by day, Joe Rogan podcast by night, all day.
0:12
Great to see you again.
0:13
Speaker 1: Great to see you, Joe. Happy to be here.
0:16
Speaker 2: Happy to have you here. So you've got a documentary
0:19
about the– essentially about the same subject that you talked
0:23
about last time you were here, the impact of microplastics
0:26
and all these various endocrine-disrupting chemicals that we're dealing with. Right.
0:32
Speaker 1: Right? Right.
0:34
Speaker 2: Tell me about it.
0:37
Speaker 1: Well, it started as a movie on plastic. And when
0:43
I met Louis and he filmed me in New York
0:46
about five years ago also, it wasn't the small study
0:53
that we have today. But let me backtrack because I
0:59
want to tell you something that I never told you,
1:02
but So important to me. So you remember when I
1:05
was here, you said, are you saying the toxins in
1:10
the environment are threatening the survival of the human race?
1:14
Speaker 2: Right.
1:15
Speaker 1: And I said, that's my story and I'm sticking to it.
1:19
Speaker 2: Yes.
1:19
Speaker 1: Yes. And then you said something which changed my life.
1:25
You said, why don't people know about this? Remember that?
1:31
Speaker 2: Yes.
1:32
Speaker 1: Yes. I went home and I thought a lot about
1:36
that question. And that was what led me to create
1:42
the program that I have now, Action Science Initiative, which
1:47
is doing short, impactful, relatively cheap interventions to alert people
1:54
to the problem and communicating this in a way that
1:59
I'm hoping will reach more people than academia where I
2:04
was speaking before, because before I talked to you, I
2:08
talked to my peers in, you know, academia and the
2:13
ivory tower, you know, at the meetings where they all
2:16
went at the, they read the papers that we all read,
2:19
but the general public didn't get this. So you really were,
2:23
I have to tell you, thank you. And you were
2:25
actually very influential in my life.
2:28
Speaker 2: Well, I'm very happy to help. When I first heard
2:31
about your book and I, started going over the details
2:35
of it in the subject matter, I was shocked. I
2:39
couldn't imagine that something like this could not just have happened,
2:43
but there's no large-scale effort to reverse course or to
2:48
change course or to do something about it or at
2:50
least to make people aware of the impact that plastics
2:53
are having on us. Let me tell you a story
2:55
about a friend of mine. There's a guy named Philip
2:59
Franklin Lee. who is a Michelin star chef that lives
3:03
in Austin. And he has this amazing sushi restaurant, Sushi
3:08
by Scratch, and great chef. Anyway, he was experiencing fatigue,
3:14
like always tired, got his hormones tested, extremely low testosterone,
3:20
but then got his microplastics tested, and they were off
3:23
the charts. Did a series of interventions to try to
3:29
clean his body out from that, stopped drinking anything out
3:33
of plastic, stopped using plastic. Just by whatever he did,
3:39
I'm not sure if he did the plasmapheresis thing that
3:42
I just did recently, his testosterone went up to 1,200.
3:48
With no testosterone replacement, no nothing. Just eliminating microplastics from
3:53
his life over a period of time raises testosterone.
3:57
Speaker 1: So that's And it's what we are seeing in the
4:02
film and so on. I want to just make a
4:05
small point, which is microplastics and plastics and plasticizers are
4:10
not identical, right?
4:12
Speaker 2: Okay. Right?
4:13
Speaker 1: So microplastics are relatively newcomer to the scene because we've
4:19
had plastics since 1950, right? Microplastics have been there but
4:23
not recognized until relatively recently. And actually measuring them in–
4:29
in our bodies is much harder than measuring the plasticizers,
4:34
which are the chemicals that are put in plastic to
4:37
give them the various properties that they have.
4:39
Speaker 2: Phthalates.
4:40
Speaker 1: Phthalates is one, bisphenol A is another, and so on.
4:46
So there are other, you know, and by the way, well,
4:51
we'll come back to that later. So yes, we can
4:54
measure those, but measuring microplastics in particularly if we're going
4:57
to go into your brain or into your testicles, you know,
5:01
into a woman's placenta, obviously that's much more difficult. So
5:07
they're not the same, but the microplastics, what they are
5:11
is the actual pieces of plastic that carry the plasticizers
5:17
along with them. So they kind of piggyback on. So
5:20
they do double damage because they carry the chemical harms,
5:25
and they also— enter the cells, right? So do you remember,
5:31
I'm sure, asbestos you know about, you know, and silicosis,
5:36
and these were other examples of particles that went into
5:39
the body and conveyed both chemical harm and physical harm,
5:44
like inflammation and so on and so forth. So they're
5:49
all bad, but they're not identical. And what we studied
5:53
in the plastic detox, which is the film, And that
5:58
was– we did not study any microplastics. We studied the plasticizers.
6:05
So you probably remember. I think I told you last
6:07
time– well, why should you remember anyway? They're water-soluble. Yeah,
6:11
I do remember. Remember that? So they go into your
6:14
urine and then they're pretty easy to measure. So I'm
6:19
going to give this to you. This is a kit.
6:23
Open it up. I'll tell you what it is.
6:25
Speaker 2: Okay. Learn what's inside. It looks like you pee in that. Okay.
6:35
Speaker 1: That's right.
6:36
Speaker 2: Keep going. And there's more stuff in there?
6:38
Speaker 1: Yep.
6:38
Speaker 2: Okay. Something to send it back. Right. And then this
6:44
looks like biohazard bags.
6:47
Speaker 1: To put your pee in.
6:47
Speaker 2: So my pee doesn't kill anybody. And this is, it's
6:55
got a QR code on it. say hello to a
6:58
healthier you.
6:59
Speaker 1: So those are ways to find out ways to lower
7:01
your exposure.
7:02
Speaker 2: Okay.
7:03
Speaker 1: Yeah.
7:03
Speaker 2: I know a lot of people get these harmful chemicals
7:08
from drinking coffee, hot liquids out of paper cups.
7:13
Speaker 1: Yeah. From the paper cups that are aligned with, for example, bisphenols.
7:17
But the coffee itself is made in most coffee makers
7:22
contain a lot of plastic also. So it comes in
7:25
both the cups and in the The device that's making
7:27
the coffee.
7:28
Speaker 2: That's why we use metal and just make a French press.
7:31
I do that at home too. I got rid of
7:32
my plastic coffee machine.
7:34
Speaker 1: Me too.
7:35
Speaker 2: I was thinking about it. It was like, why am
7:36
I pouring hot water into this plastic thing that can't
7:40
be good?
7:40
Speaker 1: Yeah.
7:41
Speaker 2: It doesn't taste as good.
7:42
Speaker 1: You're learning. You're learning.
7:43
Speaker 2: French press tastes better anyway.
7:45
Speaker 1: So here's my suggestion. If you're willing to do this.
7:49
Speaker 2: I am willing to do this. You are. Good.
7:51
Speaker 1: Cool.
7:51
Speaker 2: So not hard. Okay.
7:53
Speaker 1: Pee in the cup. Send it in.
7:55
Speaker 2: Got it.
7:56
Speaker 1: My colleague, Jenna Wah, and her team will analyze it
8:01
for not everything in the world, but the bisphenols, the phthalates,
8:06
and the parabens. They're going to be adding pesticides soon,
8:11
and that would be great to have that as well. Then,
8:15
if you want to go to phase two, I have
8:20
some things here that you could swap in your kitchen,
8:23
and you could go to that. QR code and find
8:27
out other things that you could reduce. And then if
8:31
you wanted to, we could send you another kit and
8:34
you could see if your levels changed.
8:36
Speaker 2: Okay.
8:37
Speaker 1: You want to do that?
8:37
Speaker 2: I would love to do that. Yay! What is phase two?
8:42
Speaker 1: Phase two would mail you back another kit. You take
8:45
your urine again and that's it.
8:47
Speaker 2: So that's to see if it's changed because of lifestyle changes.
8:51
Speaker 1: That's right.
8:52
Speaker 2: Right.
8:52
Speaker 1: That's right. So you would be doing what the couple's
8:56
in part of what the couples in the intervention did.
8:58
The couples in the intervention also were infertile. And so
9:04
we're not going to touch your fertility question, but they also,
9:07
the men collected sperm, and we can do that if
9:09
you want, but I don't think you, you know, you
9:11
may not want to talk about that on your phone.
9:14
But that's what we did in the intervention. So we,
9:18
in the intervention, we found, I'll just, this is what
9:21
the intervention was. There's a company called Fellow, which has
9:30
grown out of UCSF. And they're very big now. I
9:33
think they have like 200,000 men in their files who
9:36
have had their semen tested. And at the time they
9:42
have their semen tested, they're asked, could we recontact you
9:47
for research? That's one important question. And they're asked, why
9:53
did you want your sperm tested? And if they say
9:57
because we're infertile or subfertile or we worrying about our fertility,
10:01
we ask, or they ask, how long has it been
10:05
that you've been having this problem with fertility? And if
10:09
it's more than 12 months, then they're technically infertile, right?
10:15
So if they said they would agree to be recontacted
10:19
and they were infertile, they were potentially eligible for this intervention.
10:26
You with me?
10:27
Speaker 2: Got it.
10:28
Speaker 1: So actually finding the couples that are in the film
10:33
was a long process. They had to, of course, agree
10:36
to be filmed. They had to have what we call
10:38
a terrible word, idiopathic infertility, no known causes. And they
10:44
couldn't be obese. They couldn't be smokers. They couldn't have
10:48
a diagnosis, a medical diagnosis that explains. We don't want
10:51
it to be unexplained.
10:53
Speaker 2: Okay?
10:53
Speaker 1: So sort of we winnowed down to what was six couples.
10:59
One of them dropped out for personal reasons. So I
11:04
won't go into that. But that's how we got those couples.
11:08
They had to be couples, by the way. And they
11:10
had to be staying together for the next three months
11:12
and not doing IVF.
11:14
Speaker 2: Okay?
11:15
Speaker 1: Okay. So that was the setup. And then the company
11:20
called Million Marker that you're going to send your P to,
11:27
they have an education program. And that's a lot of
11:30
what they do, the testing and the education. And so
11:34
all of those couples, you know, they talked to them
11:37
and said, tell me about what you put on your
11:39
face this morning. Tell me what you washed your clothes with.
11:43
Tell me what you clean your counters with and on
11:45
and on and on like that, right? So they took
11:47
an inventory of what the couples were doing. And then
11:51
they started this educational program, which they're very good at
11:54
and have been doing for a while. Once a week,
11:57
they talk to them. So how's it going? Have you
11:58
changed this? What are you using now? And so on.
12:01
So it was not just a one-time thing. And if
12:05
you were doing this, it would be short. Just like
12:09
use these things maybe. But– Along with that, we sent
12:15
them the fellow kits to collect their semen. Okay. So
12:21
we have beginning, middle, and end. It was three months.
12:25
So beginning, six weeks, 12 weeks. And you know why
12:30
three months?
12:31
Speaker 2: Why?
12:31
Speaker 1: It takes 70 days to make a sperm. So we
12:35
wanted to have a turnover within the course of the intervention. Yeah.
12:39
So we sent them a kit and they collected their
12:42
semen at home, which is nice for guys because you
12:46
don't have to go into the lab and do it there.
12:49
It's much better at home, right?
12:50
Speaker 2: Yeah.
12:51
Speaker 1: And they sent it in and they figured out how
12:53
to get all the parameters right even though it's mailed.
12:56
And yeah, so the couples did that. So we had
13:00
over time levels in their body of the chemicals, semen quality.
13:08
what they were doing, what they changed in their life
13:11
because we had this record of everything they changed. And
13:13
then finally we saw Who Got Pregnant. And I hope
13:18
your listeners will watch The Plastic Detox. It's a movie
13:24
that a lot of people love and found really moving.
13:29
And you should watch it.
13:31
Speaker 2: Can I ask you about the coffee question? When you
13:34
go to a place like, let's just say Starbucks, not
13:36
to single them out, but are they using plastic with
13:40
their coffee machines? Are their coffee machines made with plastic?
13:45
Speaker 1: I don't know about any particular place except my kitchen.
13:49
Speaker 2: I was just with a question.
13:50
Speaker 1: I suspect that they are using plastic.
13:53
Speaker 3: Right.
13:53
Speaker 2: So if people stop at a place like that on
13:56
a regular basis on the way to work in the
13:58
morning to get coffee. And they use– they bring their
14:01
own stainless steel thermos or mug. That would eliminate some
14:07
of it, but perhaps– One source, yeah. Yeah, but perhaps
14:10
they're getting it actually from the coffee machine itself. Yes, yes, yes.
14:15
Speaker 1: Because I see when they slide those.
14:17
Speaker 2: When you see these big industrial machines and they slide
14:20
those filters in, those filters are plastic.
14:22
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah. Well, they're– They probably have bisphenol in them.
14:27
Speaker 2: Right. It's a plastic tray. It seems like. I don't know.
14:30
But then there's a paper filter in the plastic tray.
14:33
Speaker 4: Right.
14:34
Speaker 2: So you're getting it no matter what.
14:35
Speaker 1: And if they use those pods, you know, at home. Bruno,
14:42
one of our guys in the film, wonderful guy, he
14:47
was kind of addicted to his coffee machine, his pods.
14:50
Speaker 2: Right, the pods.
14:51
Speaker 1: And we said, Bruno– want you to stop using those pods. No,
14:54
I don't want to stop using them. But he did.
14:57
He did. And they've had two babies. Yeah. Now, I'm
15:02
not saying that's the reason, but, you know, it's a
15:05
contribution probably.
15:06
Speaker 2: Well, there is certainly an issue. Like I said with
15:08
my friend Philip, that it made a radical difference in
15:11
his sperm count and his testosterone levels. And so this
15:15
is probably the case with so many Americans in this
15:18
country that are dealing with infertility issues. A big part
15:21
of it is probably these plasticizers. Is that how you
15:26
refer to them? Plasticizers, all these various chemicals that are
15:29
endocrine disruptors that are ubiquitous in the modern world.
15:32
Speaker 1: Yes, unfortunately.
15:34
Speaker 2: It's crazy.
15:34
Speaker 1: And by the way, not the women. Let me say something.
15:37
We didn't talk about the women last time.
15:38
Speaker 2: Very much, right? A little bit we did. Yeah, I
15:42
think we did.
15:43
Speaker 1: So the women need testosterone too, you know, for sexual
15:49
arousal and libido and so on. And muscle. And in
15:58
our study, study for future families, I think, or maybe, yeah,
16:05
we got the urine. We saw what they, you know,
16:09
how much phthalates were in their urine. And then we
16:11
asked them some questions about their sexual experience. So how
16:15
satisfied were they with their sexual life? and frequency. And
16:24
the women who had higher levels of phthalates had less
16:27
satisfaction and lower frequency. So it's not just the men.
16:32
Speaker 2: Completely makes sense.
16:34
Speaker 1: Everyone needs testosterone.
16:35
Speaker 2: Yeah. My wife's friend got on testosterone. I guess she's
16:40
about 50. She got on testosterone because her doctor put
16:43
her on some low-level cream or something like that, and
16:46
her Her response was like, it makes me horny like
16:50
a bloke. She's English. I thought that was a very
16:57
funny thing that she said it that way.
16:59
Speaker 1: Did she think that was a good thing?
17:01
Speaker 2: Yeah, she enjoyed it.
17:02
Speaker 1: Yeah.
17:02
Speaker 2: Apparently. Allegedly. I didn't speak to her directly, but I
17:06
think that's what she was saying. Like, whoa, you know,
17:09
just whoa.
17:10
Speaker 1: Yeah.
17:10
Speaker 2: Well, I mean, it's the thing that came out of your,
17:15
the episode that we did that, shocked me the most
17:18
is how little this is discussed in the mainstream. And
17:23
I had not known until you brought it up, until
17:26
you became a guest on the show, until I started
17:28
researching it. I was stunned. I couldn't believe that this
17:32
was something that was so common. And so one of
17:36
the things that comes up all the time is infertility
17:39
with couples that are trying and they're using IVF, and
17:42
it's more common now than ever before. And there's been
17:45
a lot of things that people... A lot of factors
17:48
that people have attributed to that reason, a lot of
17:50
them being older people that are– they put their careers aside.
17:55
In their 30s, they decided now it's time to have kids.
17:58
They're worried that it's too late. But listening to you
18:02
talk about it, it seems like that's only one part
18:05
of the issue and not the big part. The big
18:08
part seems to be that we're being poisoned and we're
18:11
doing it. by virtue of our modern world that we
18:14
live in, where so much of your life relies on plastic.
18:19
And it's very difficult for people that are so set
18:22
in their ways, they have routines, they don't really understand, like,
18:27
what can I do to eliminate this stuff from my life?
18:30
Just having the conversation and understanding that these things are
18:33
having an impact is great. But the steps that people
18:37
need to take in order to eliminate these things from
18:39
their life. I think that's, what's really important to get
18:41
out there now.
18:43
Speaker 1: I thank you. You said it really well. Um, let
18:46
me just give people a, um, a place to go.
18:49
You go to on plastic, your life.com.
18:52
Speaker 2: Okay.
18:54
Speaker 1: And then there's action. And then you can go to
18:57
the various places in your home that you.
18:59
Speaker 2: Can, it's just on plastic, your life, one word on,
19:02
on plastic, on plastic, your life.com.
19:05
Speaker 1: Yeah. Um, let me see if I, Got that. Yeah.
19:09
So on plasticyourlife.com, go to Action Hub and then to
19:12
Protect Yourself. And that'll give you lots of things to
19:17
do to lower these exposures.
19:19
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19:21
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19:24
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19:26
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value at drinkag1. com slash Joe Rogan. Nonstick cookware, that stuff has...
20:29
That's different. Is that different?
20:30
Speaker 1: Yeah.
20:31
Speaker 2: When you have nonstick cookware, does that have any endocrine
20:35
disrupting chemicals as well?
20:36
Speaker 1: Yes, but different ones.
20:37
Speaker 2: Different ones? Which ones are those?
20:38
Speaker 1: So those are what's called the PFAS chemicals. And... It's
20:44
actually not just cookware. It's anything that puts a barrier
20:50
between two medium, if you will. Like a rain jacket
20:55
will put a barrier between the rain and your skin.
20:57
Speaker 2: Right.
20:59
Speaker 1: And also stain resistant, barrier with the stain. And it's– Very,
21:09
very prevalent. I mean it's all– it's in clothing.
21:13
Speaker 2: It's in– I've read it's in a lot of yoga
21:15
tights and things along those lines.
21:17
Speaker 1: Yes. Workout clothes.
21:18
Speaker 2: That's so crazy. You think you're being healthy and you're
21:21
exposing yourself to endocrine-disrupting chemicals.
21:24
Speaker 1: And uniforms. There's a book. I probably shouldn't recommend another
21:29
book but I think it's a good book. I'll just
21:31
say it's called To Die For, DYE, and it's about
21:35
the– flight attendants' uniforms and the harms that they do
21:39
because they're coated. They have a lot of PFAS because they,
21:42
you know, have to keep clean. And they've got, they're
21:45
not clean, right? Because they have this PFAS in them.
21:48
It's in sports uniforms. You can do a lot with sports,
21:51
all the sports uniforms.
21:52
Speaker 2: Nylon. Yeah. Is it anything with nylon?
21:56
Speaker 1: Is that what it is? Probably, but I'm not sure.
21:59
I'm not, you know, I could refer you to somebody,
22:02
but I'm not. the clothing expert, but I know that
22:05
they're in these things. And one of the things that
22:07
is kind of scary is school uniforms. You know, a
22:12
lot of kids have school uniforms and they're loaded with it. Oh. Yeah.
22:17
Speaker 2: Yeah, my kids used to wear a uniform every day.
22:19
Speaker 1: Yeah.
22:19
Speaker 2: When you say to dye for, are dyes in cotton
22:24
clothes also releasing? Really?
22:26
Speaker 1: Yes. Dyes are very risky.
22:31
Speaker 2: We've got to go back to being Amish. Yeah. Here
22:33
it is.
22:34
Speaker 1: Oh, good. Yeah.
22:35
Speaker 2: So, in fact, there's little or no regulation of clothes
22:38
or textiles we wear each day, from uniforms to fast fashion,
22:41
outdoor gear, and even the face masks that have become
22:43
ubiquitous in recent years. Wicker explains how we got here,
22:46
what the stakes are, what all of us can do
22:49
in the fight for a safe and healthy wardrobe for all. Wow.
22:54
Speaker 1: And that's in the film. It's discussed in the film.
22:56
Speaker 2: Okay. A little bit. Not the major, but it's... So,
23:00
blue jeans?
23:00
Speaker 1: Yes. Probably.
23:03
Speaker 2: Probably.
23:04
Speaker 1: I can't, you know, speak about it.
23:06
Speaker 2: There is a river, I believe it's in China, where
23:11
a series of blue gene factories exist where the entire
23:15
river is blue. It's so disgusting. Like not blue like
23:20
beautiful clean water. Blue like dyed.
23:23
Speaker 1: Dyed water.
23:24
Speaker 2: Look at this. Look at that. That's the blue gene
23:28
capital of the world.
23:30
Speaker 1: Wow.
23:30
Speaker 2: That's where they make a lot of blue jeans. And
23:32
look at the stinky, dirty, disgusting blue dye water that
23:37
is just that river leaking out into the ocean, which
23:40
also looks polluted. You want cheap clothes, kids? This is
23:44
what happens. It's so crazy. Like, look at that stuff.
23:48
I mean, how many jeans are they making? And what
23:52
are the, you know.
23:55
Speaker 1: And this is a good point for me to point
23:57
out that these things are affecting everything. Animals, of course.
24:01
Like the animals fish in this.
24:03
Speaker 2: Look at this. African rivers as well. Of course we
24:07
do it in other places. If we did it in America,
24:09
people would be aware. Canada. Canada too.
24:13
Speaker 1: I'm not sure they'd be aware.
24:15
Speaker 2: You don't think so? We're trying.
24:18
Speaker 1: We're trying.
24:19
Speaker 2: We're trying to get them aware. I mean, that's what
24:20
we're doing right now, right?
24:22
Speaker 3: Right.
24:22
Speaker 1: So to go back to that point you raised about,
24:25
you know, Reasons that people give for low testosterone or
24:32
low fertility, low sperm count. And particularly this comes up
24:37
for fertility. More couples are– you know fertility is in
24:41
the toilet, right?
24:42
Speaker 2: Yes.
24:43
Speaker 1: That's a weird thing to say but– yeah, right.
24:47
Speaker 2: For lack of a better– yeah.
24:50
Speaker 1: And I mean used to be five– Children per couple
24:56
on the average in 1960 and now it's– in South Korea,
25:00
it's like 0.88. Wow. That's the worst.
25:06
Speaker 2: Why is South Korea the worst? I don't know.
25:08
Speaker 1: I mean all of East Asia is very, very low.
25:11
Speaker 2: South Korea is– their replacement numbers are so low.
25:14
Speaker 4: That's right.
25:15
Speaker 2: That it's– they're in danger of complete population collapse.
25:18
Speaker 1: Absolutely. And Japan is getting there and all of that
25:22
Southeast Asia. And– So when– there's a lot of articles
25:30
about this, a lot of editorials, a lot of articles,
25:32
and they make me so– Joe, they make me so
25:35
mad because they say correctly that having a child at
25:41
an older age will do this to some extent. Not
25:46
wanting to have children, as many children, will do this
25:49
to some extent. But they never mention toxics.
25:52
Speaker 4: Right.
25:53
Speaker 1: They just– and so I've written editorials saying, hey, guys,
25:58
we're not alone on this planet and we're not the
26:02
only species that's declining in number. And then if you
26:06
look at the curve of the number of species that
26:10
are declining and the rate of decline of human fertility,
26:13
they're parallel. It's all about 1 percent per year. And
26:17
so they're– and we know they're exposed, these other species.
26:20
You showed it.
26:21
Speaker 2: Mm-hmm.
26:22
Speaker 1: Fish in that water are exposed and animals on the periphery.
26:26
So I would love for everybody, when they look at
26:30
these numbers of declining fertility, consider that it's not all choice.
26:38
Animals are not choosing to have their children later or
26:41
to delay childbearing, right?
26:43
Speaker 2: They have big careers. Beavers are trying to make dams.
26:46
They don't have time for children.
26:48
Speaker 1: Right.
26:48
Speaker 2: Exactly. Exactly. Exactly. Yeah.
26:51
Speaker 1: So for me, you know, it's not– those are good–
26:57
those are explanations for sure. Obviously, when you get older,
27:01
your fertility is less. Obviously, if you have a busy
27:05
life and you don't have time to have children, you
27:06
shouldn't have children. But the toxics matter.
27:11
Speaker 2: They matter a lot. Yeah, 100 percent. And the animals
27:15
is the issue exposure to water. That has these chemicals
27:20
in it because of pollution? What is causing it with that?
27:24
Speaker 1: It's in the water. It's in the soil. It's in
27:29
what they eat because it comes in the plants.
27:33
Speaker 2: It gets into the plants?
27:35
Speaker 5: Yeah.
27:36
Speaker 1: Do you know that phthalates– this is a little fun fact.
27:40
Phthalates are put in pesticides. Why would they do that? Well,
27:46
they– Because one of the things that phthalates do is
27:49
they increase absorption. That's why they're in hand cream. Right?
27:54
You see, you put your hand cream on, it goes
27:56
in your skin, right? Phthalates help that. You have the
27:59
pesticide you wanted to go into the plant? Phthalates help that. So,
28:03
you know, these exposures are all over the place, and
28:08
animals are getting them too. A long time ago, I
28:12
don't think we talked about this, but there was a
28:14
wonderful scientist who's not living anymore. His name was Lou Gillette.
28:17
He lived in Florida. And he showed that alligators swimming
28:24
in a lake that had a lot of runoff of pesticides.
28:31
Get this. Their penises were small. He measured them. And
28:35
he was a big guy. He had to do it
28:39
at night. He went at night, wrestled them into the boat.
28:45
And I have pictures of that. Took them to his lab.
28:47
Speaker 2: Measured their penises.
28:48
Speaker 1: Measured their penises.
28:49
Speaker 2: They must have been very confused when they got let go. Like,
28:52
what is this guy kinky with? What is his thing?
28:57
Speaker 1: You know, and they had fewer eggs.
29:01
Speaker 2: Right.
29:03
Speaker 1: So they were a declining species. That's just a very
29:05
dramatic example of, you know, can you put up penis
29:11
size and– Alligator penis size? I'm just wondering.
29:17
Speaker 2: As if you don't already Google that, Jamie.
29:19
Speaker 5: Let me find you a photo. I asked our perplexity
29:24
this thing.
29:25
Speaker 2: So our sponsor perplexity said, yes, this has actually been
29:28
documented in wild alligators. Males in heavily polluted lakes have,
29:32
on average, smaller penises and other reproductive problems linked to
29:36
hormone-disrupting chemicals. We are shrinking alligator penises. ladies and gentlemen.
29:42
Speaker 1: And not only alligator penises.
29:45
Speaker 2: 25% smaller penis sizes compared to males from a cleaner
29:48
reference lake. Males of lower testosterone levels, around 70% lower
29:53
abnormal relationships between hormone levels and penis growth, unlike alligators
29:57
from cleaner lakes. Alligators from polluted lakes also show other
30:01
reproductive issues, abnormal sex hormone patterns, altered gonads, low hatching success,
30:07
various birth defects, all consistent with exposure to endocrine-disrupting contaminants,
30:11
EDCs such as DDT derivatives, dildrin, PCBs, and related compounds. Wow.
30:21
So it's all endocrine disruptors from pollution. Oh, boy.
30:25
Speaker 5: Okay.
30:27
Speaker 2: You would think that this would sound the alarm.
30:30
Speaker 1: And this is not new. He's dead. This is old work. Oh.
30:36
Speaker 2: And no one knows. First of all, there's not a
30:40
lot of people that say, first problem on my list today,
30:43
alligator penis sizes. It's a real issue. You're in front
30:47
of Congress. We've got to talk. Alligator penis sizes are shrinking.
30:50
They'd kick you out of the building.
30:51
Speaker 1: Actually, he, Lou Gillette, went to Congress and he Gave
30:57
talk and he said, every man in this room is
31:02
half the man his grandfather was.
31:06
Speaker 2: As far as testosterone levels, right?
31:08
Speaker 1: And penis size. Well, he didn't measure their penis.
31:11
Speaker 2: But he was making this point. Yeah, I understand.
31:15
Speaker 4: Yeah.
31:15
Speaker 2: Well, I mean it completely makes sense. But what doesn't
31:18
make sense is how little attention that's being paid. You
31:20
would think that in a society– I mean, America is
31:24
also facing a potential population collapse. People don't think about that.
31:29
But our reproduction numbers, we're not reproducing. Yeah, they're down
31:33
quite a bit. And they're not at the level that
31:35
we need in order to keep our population.
31:38
Speaker 1: It's the, you know, the normal shape of the population
31:42
is like this, right? So this is up here, not
31:44
very many people. And down here, lots and lots of people.
31:47
Speaker 2: And this is in terms of age, older, younger at
31:50
the bottom. Right.
31:50
Speaker 1: Right. Lots of people are living longer, but fewer down here.
31:55
And then what that means is the ones down here
31:57
are supposed to support the ones up here.
32:00
Speaker 2: But there's not enough of them.
32:01
Speaker 1: But not enough of them.
32:02
Speaker 2: Right. Yeah.
32:04
Speaker 1: So it's a huge societal problem.
32:07
Speaker 2: Well, it's just so confusing how few people are even
32:10
aware of this. We were talking– I didn't realize it
32:13
had been five years since our last podcast, which is
32:15
pretty crazy. But in that five years– You barely hear
32:19
about it. It's occasional. People bring up certain chemicals they
32:22
think are bad. I'll avoid this. Paul Saladino was the
32:27
one that showed that the paper cups that you get
32:30
from a coffee shop, that if you take that paper away,
32:35
what you have is essentially this plastic membrane. And that's
32:38
what you're drinking your coffee out of. You're not drinking
32:39
your coffee out of paper. And how terrible these things
32:43
are for you. But even that, it's like people just
32:45
dismiss it. The line around Starbucks is always the same.
32:48
There's always people going to get their coffee. They don't
32:51
think anything of it. And they're just consuming these chemicals
32:55
that mess up your health, mess up your vitality, your
32:59
energy levels, everything, brain fog.
33:01
Speaker 1: But whose responsibility is it?
33:04
Speaker 2: Well, to talk about it, I think it's ours. It's
33:07
certainly yours and mine. And we'll spread this word and
33:11
more people discuss it. And I think more people need
33:15
to be aware that this directly impacts you. Like this
33:18
is not like in the future. I don't have to
33:21
think about it. I'll be dead. No, it directly impacts
33:24
your health, your energy levels, your vitality right now as
33:29
a living human being listening to this show.
33:33
Speaker 1: So just to add to that how it affects you,
33:37
not you.
33:38
Speaker 2: Humans.
33:39
Speaker 1: Maybe your levels are lower.
33:40
Speaker 2: I don't know.
33:40
Speaker 1: But we'll find out. But– Both men and women who
33:46
have lower fertility on average– these are studies. There have
33:49
been about four or five studies that have shown this.
33:51
Lower fertility and sperm count on the male side die younger.
33:57
Die younger. OK? This is– should be of concern to everybody.
34:03
Speaker 2: Well, it makes sense.
34:05
Speaker 1: Yeah.
34:05
Speaker 2: You have less vitality. Less energy. Less life force. Yeah.
34:10
Speaker 1: Your sperm, your vitality, your testosterone are also affecting– it's
34:14
a canary in the coal mine, if you will, of
34:17
lots of things that are going south at the same time.
34:21
Speaker 2: Which completely makes sense. And as the case of my
34:23
friend Philip, all this fatigue, all these issues that he
34:26
was experiencing. Yeah.
34:28
Speaker 1: Yeah. It's not just one– never just one thing.
34:30
Speaker 2: Right.
34:30
Speaker 1: Yeah.
34:33
Speaker 2: It is quite disturbing how uncommon these discussions are though.
34:38
That's what's crazy. This should be a huge factor. I
34:42
mean we get concerned with so many– oh, there's people
34:45
concerned with alcohol consumption. It's a big thing like– and
34:50
that has had an impact. Children today or young adults
34:53
I should say today are consuming much less alcohol than
34:57
people in the past. Cigarette smoking. We're aware. Very dangerous.
35:01
Much less cigarette smoking than in the past. The consumption
35:05
of these– Endocrine disrupting chemicals is essentially the same as
35:09
when we talked five years ago.
35:12
Speaker 1: So I want to go back to this question I
35:14
asked is whose responsibility. So I don't think it's– I
35:18
mean it's great for you and I to be concerned
35:20
and for your listeners to be concerned. But in fact,
35:25
it shouldn't be our responsibility because the drug– FDA does drugs, right?
35:32
They have pretty good control of safety of drugs. Yeah.
35:36
Pretty good. Yeah.
35:38
Speaker 2: OK.
35:38
Speaker 1: We can talk about that. But compared to chemicals in
35:43
our daily products, the products we use every day, it's
35:48
fantastic because the regulatory agencies are not doing the job.
35:54
Speaker 2: Right.
35:55
Speaker 1: OK. And so that's why it's all out there. They're
35:58
not doing the job. Here in Europe, it's much better,
36:01
by the way.
36:01
Speaker 2: Is it?
36:02
Speaker 1: Yeah.
36:03
Speaker 2: Well, that's bad. Because they're going to beat us. They'll
36:05
out-reproduce us. We'll go away. They'll take over. No more America.
36:10
Speaker 1: We have to get people angry enough to put pressure
36:16
on– there's a bill, the Toxic Substances Control Act, which
36:25
should be doing a lot of this and I think
36:30
it's coming up for revision and maybe people can pay
36:33
attention to that and read about it and think government
36:37
should be doing this. It's not our job. It's not
36:40
our job to worry about what's in our pants and
36:43
what's in our this and our this and our this.
36:44
You were asking what kind– denim and so on. Should
36:48
we have to read up on that?
36:51
Speaker 2: Are there dyes for jeans and clothes that are not toxic?
36:58
Speaker 1: Yes, but– As I said, this is not my area.
37:01
Speaker 2: I understand.
37:01
Speaker 1: Yeah, you got to get– I can give you a
37:03
name if you want. Get somebody on clothing on this.
37:05
Speaker 2: Yeah, I'd be happy to.
37:07
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah. But just because it was relatively new to
37:13
my consciousness when I was doing the film and before that,
37:17
we didn't collect data on that unfortunately. Maybe we should
37:21
do another study, which reminds me there is just like
37:24
so much work to be done and– For my program,
37:28
there are so many interventions I want to do that
37:30
we did this one, which is great success, and now
37:33
we're doing another one and we have another one. But
37:37
if anybody wants to help with this, it's all privately funded.
37:43
The government is not going to fund this.
37:44
Speaker 2: Right. Unfortunately.
37:46
Speaker 1: Unfortunately.
37:47
Speaker 2: So let me.
37:49
Speaker 1: Know if anybody comes to you and says, how can
37:51
we help and all that.
37:52
Speaker 2: Well, I'm sure somebody will reach out. They usually do.
37:55
The thing that I would imagine would be the response
38:00
to something like this was that there are so many
38:02
industries that are established already that require the use of
38:09
all these compounds, all these chemicals, all these endocrine disrupting chemicals.
38:14
And it's just everywhere. It's everywhere and everything. They use
38:19
plastic in the Production of so many different things. These
38:22
things are leaching into our food. They're leaching into our clothes.
38:25
They're leaching into all these various products that we use
38:28
that contribute to these chemicals entering into our body, disrupting that.
38:32
So you're aware of glyphosate, I'm sure. They were trying
38:37
to eliminate glyphosate from the industrial agriculture. Good luck. Exactly. Well,
38:43
the president passed an executive order blocking it because– Some
38:48
enormous percent, 90-something percent of all of our food in
38:53
terms of wheat, corn, all the agriculture in this country
38:56
relies on glyphosate for production. And so the idea is
39:01
we need poison so that we can make food, which
39:05
is so crazy, especially when you consider the fact that
39:08
all these other countries don't use glyphosate and feed their population.
39:13
So how are they doing it and what do we
39:15
need to do to– to get back on that track.
39:20
I had RFK Jr. in here to discuss it and
39:23
he was very crestfallen when he was explaining that there
39:26
was an executive order passed and that he was working
39:28
very hard to try to eliminate glyphosate. It's something that
39:32
he discussed in previous meetings that he and I had.
39:35
It was one of his primary concerns. Glyphosate is toxic.
39:38
It's terrible. It's just completely awful for your body yet
39:41
the use of it is ubiquitous in agriculture, industrial agriculture.
39:45
He was trying very hard to try to eliminate it
39:48
and then … The government passes this executive order because
39:53
in their estimation– Yeah, exactly. Pressure. Yeah. And this is
39:57
what I worry about with– Yeah, of course. I don't
40:00
want to mention any names, but there's a lot of
40:02
these popular clothing brands that people wear that are fitness.
40:06
I'm healthy. I'm fitness wear. And these fitness wear that
40:10
you're– these clothings that you're wearing are leaching these chemicals
40:14
into your body that are screwing up your health, which
40:16
is so crazy. Crazy, right? But it's so– I don't
40:19
want to say it's perfect, but it sort of encapsulates
40:23
how screwed up our modern life is. Yes, the paradox.
40:28
Speaker 1: So I did a study on glyphosate. I mean I
40:32
examined our populations for glyphosate. And interestingly, they also have
40:38
an effect on– remember anal-genital distance?
40:40
Speaker 2: Yes. The taint size.
40:42
Speaker 1: The taint size.
40:43
Speaker 4: Yes.
40:43
Speaker 1: They influence the taint size.
40:45
Speaker 2: Yeah.
40:45
Speaker 1: Now that's not– We did it in two studies and
40:48
there's been some animal studies. I can't say this is
40:51
an established fact, but I'm just pointing out that it
40:54
has very many unforeseen consequences, none of them good. And
41:00
by the way, I was asked to go to talk
41:03
to RFK tomorrow, but I can't because I have another meeting.
41:09
But I would love to talk to him about this
41:11
because glyphosate is a big concern of mine.
41:16
Speaker 2: Well, I hope you do talk to him.
41:18
Speaker 1: Yeah. He has these roundtables on different scientific topics. So
41:23
this one is on microplastics, which is not perfect for
41:26
me because I haven't measured them. But if he has
41:30
one on glyphosate or pesticides, that would be a good place.
41:33
Speaker 2: Well, his hands are tied right now on the glyphosate
41:36
issue momentarily. They have some non-toxic solutions. One of them
41:43
is they have this new device, which is like the
41:50
same way these machines pull the crops out of the ground.
41:55
These machines go over the crops and zap all the
41:59
non-essential crops with a laser beam. Non-essential crops, excuse me,
42:04
non-essential plants. So weeds, I would say. So as the
42:07
corn is growing or whatever else it is, they're zapping crops.
42:11
all the other stuff that's growing around it that's sucking
42:14
up all the resources, all the weeds.
42:16
Speaker 1: Yeah. That sounds like a good step.
42:19
Speaker 2: That's a great step.
42:20
Speaker 1: Because it minimizes the use of pesticides.
42:22
Speaker 2: Exactly. And I asked, does it have any residual effect
42:24
on the food? He said, no. Well, that's great. But then,
42:27
you know, farmers, one of the big problems is they're
42:30
already barely making money. So if you now require them
42:35
to spend, you know, X amount of dollars on some gigantic,
42:40
Weed zapping laser that has to cover who knows how
42:43
many acres they're running these– I mean I'm sure you're
42:46
aware but monocrop agriculture for people who have never seen
42:51
some of these places that grow corn and wheat. You're
42:54
talking about these massive pieces of land that only grow
42:58
one thing, which in nature doesn't exist. So, of course,
43:02
nature wants to rectify that. Nature's like, why is there
43:04
only weed here? You need weeds. And so, you know,
43:08
birds drop seeds, all these seeds fly in the wind,
43:11
and then all these things grow. So you're going to
43:13
have to get these machines that are capable of traveling
43:17
over all of those crops and zapping out all the weeds.
43:22
How much is that going to cost to people that
43:24
are already struggling? You know, because the American farmers are
43:28
barely getting by, barely, and we need them. And the
43:32
last thing you want to do is burden them with
43:33
another cost. But also the use of– especially when it
43:37
comes to things like wheat because they're using it after
43:41
they harvest the wheat to dry it out quicker so
43:43
that it doesn't grow mold on it. That's why they're
43:45
using glyphosate. So it's not even as a pesticide.
43:49
Speaker 1: I didn't know that.
43:51
Speaker 2: Yeah. They're using it as I guess a desiccator.
43:53
Speaker 1: Wow.
43:54
Speaker 2: Yeah. And that's why so many– to be why so
43:59
many people in this country have a problem with bread,
44:02
you know? It should make sense.
44:05
Speaker 1: And with their tape, no.
44:06
Speaker 2: And their tape, yeah. A lot of tape problems. A
44:08
lot of people are complaining. But it's just– it's so
44:12
weird that we're so intelligent and so informed and now
44:17
we all have supercomputers in our pockets that have access
44:21
to things like perplexity that can answer any questions you
44:23
have about anything. But yet we're being poisoned by the
44:26
very food that we eat, the coffee that we drink,
44:28
the clothing that we wear.
44:29
Speaker 1: The water we drink.
44:31
Speaker 2: The water we drink, everything. Here's a good question. Are
44:35
there any good filters on a consumer level that will
44:39
remove a lot of these chemicals from water that a
44:43
person could buy?
44:44
Speaker 1: I can't name any brands.
44:47
Speaker 2: Right. But are they available?
44:48
Speaker 1: Yes, there are. Is it reverse osmosis?
44:51
Speaker 2: Like what are the ones that work the best?
44:54
Speaker 1: I'll tell you my solution in my house.
44:56
Speaker 2: Okay.
44:56
Speaker 1: That's very personal. We distill our water. So the water
45:05
out of the tap goes into a big container and
45:09
then it's boiled. Steam is formed, crosses over, and the
45:14
steam is condensed into another container, right?
45:16
Speaker 2: Right.
45:17
Speaker 1: And that has nothing in it and removes everything.
45:22
Speaker 2: Right.
45:22
Speaker 1: By the way, all germs also. So that's what we've chosen.
45:26
And in this thing that sits on the counter, my
45:30
husband does this every other day. It's kind of a nuisance,
45:33
but not too bad. And the water is fantastic.
45:37
Speaker 2: Do you have to remineralize it?
45:40
Speaker 1: You should take minerals somewhere. You can do it in
45:42
the water. You can do it in your supplements. It
45:45
does remove the minerals, yes.
45:47
Speaker 2: Right. And– That's what I've heard is the problem with
45:49
drinking distilled water is that it actually leaches minerals and
45:53
nutrients from your own body.
45:55
Speaker 1: That I don't believe.
45:56
Speaker 2: No?
45:56
Speaker 1: I don't believe that. But the water itself has had
45:59
its minerals.
46:00
Speaker 2: Well, let's put it into perplexity. What is the issue
46:03
with drinking distilled water for health purposes? And is it
46:09
recommended that you add electrolytes or minerals or what have you?
46:14
Because that's– so one of the things that fighters do
46:18
when they're cutting weight, I don't think most of them
46:20
do it anymore. But a lot of them were drinking
46:23
distilled water so that the water would go in their
46:25
system and right out of their system. Because cutting weight
46:28
for fighting– I don't know if you know about this.
46:29
But they have to weigh in a certain weight class
46:31
and essentially what they do is radically dehydrate themselves 24
46:35
hours before a fight, which is not a great idea.
46:37
It's a terrible idea. So– So perplexity says it is
46:40
generally safe to drink distilled water. Most people do not
46:42
need to add minerals to it as long as they
46:44
eat a reasonably balanced diet. Distilled water is simply water
46:48
that's been boiled and recondensed. So it's very low in
46:51
contaminants and minerals. Health sources note that it is safe
46:54
to drink but tends to taste flat because minerals like calcium,
46:57
magnesium are removed. What about minerals? You get the vast
47:01
majority of needed minerals, calcium, magnesium, potassium, et cetera, from food,
47:05
not water. So distilled water alone does not usually cause
47:08
deficiencies in healthy people with a good diet. However, some
47:11
organizations and reviews point out that long-term use of very
47:15
low mineral water may slightly reduce mineral intake. And in
47:18
specific groups, children, heavy exercisers, there we go, people with
47:22
certain illnesses could contribute to electrolyte imbalance if diet is poor.
47:28
So when might adding minerals help? Distilled water is humane
47:32
or only drinking water. Your diet is low in fruits, vegetables,
47:34
and other mineral-rich foods. Adding a pinch of mineral salt
47:38
or using a remineralization cartridge. That sounds terrible. Cartridge sounds
47:43
like plastic, right? Or drops can help restore small amounts
47:47
of calcium, magnesium, and electrolytes and improve taste. Athletes who
47:50
sweat heavily, people with kidney or hormonal issues affecting electrolytes,
47:54
and those on very restricted diets should be more cautious
47:58
about relying exclusively on distilled water. and may benefit from
48:01
electrolyte or mineral replacement as advised by a clinician. I mean,
48:06
I recommend people take electrolytes anyway. I always add electrolytes
48:10
to water every day.
48:12
Speaker 1: Here's a funny anecdote. We have a cat.
48:16
Speaker 2: What's the cat's name?
48:17
Speaker 1: His name is Archie.
48:18
Speaker 2: Archie.
48:18
Speaker 1: Archie. And Archie patrols the house and steals our water
48:26
whenever possible. He comes and drinks from our glasses unless
48:29
we cover them up.
48:30
Speaker 2: So I think Archie probably likes your water because it
48:32
doesn't smell like poison to him.
48:34
Speaker 1: He loves our water. And he has the choice of
48:39
his own water, which comes out of the tap. And
48:41
he will 100% prefer our distilled water.
48:45
Speaker 2: Which makes sense. If you think about a cat's sense
48:47
of smell, it's got to be off the charts.
48:49
Speaker 1: Yeah.
48:49
Speaker 2: So he can probably smell like this water's got a
48:52
bunch of junk in it.
48:53
Speaker 1: And when you do the process, which Stephen does every
48:57
other day, and he goes to clean– The container that
49:00
you put the water in, it stinks. It really stinks.
49:04
You would be shocked.
49:05
Speaker 2: Wow. Well, we have a crazy filter at our house.
49:10
We have well water and then we have this crazy filter,
49:13
this giant machine that filters all the water. It tastes delicious.
49:18
But it's not. distilled.
49:22
Speaker 1: I'm not saying that, you know, you shouldn't distill. That's
49:27
an alternative. I mean, sorry, you shouldn't filter. That's an alternative.
49:30
But I'm just saying what we chose to do.
49:33
Speaker 2: And so the distilling, it removes chlorine and all these
49:36
other issues that are in the water as well. Yeah.
49:38
And fluoride, everything. Fluoride is another one that's bananas that
49:43
we add to water under the guise that it helps
49:45
your teeth. Like, shut up, brush your teeth. I don't
49:49
have any cavities. I don't use fluoride. I have fluoride-free toothpaste.
49:53
I don't have fluoride in my water. It's dumb. It's
49:56
not just dumb. It's completely connected to lower IQs. There's
50:01
a direct correlation between higher fluoride content in water and
50:05
lower IQs. But There's a giant business involved in selling
50:10
fluoride to these municipal water supplies.
50:13
Speaker 1: I know.
50:14
Speaker 2: Which is nuts. More poison. We are so screwed up.
50:18
Speaker 1: Chlorination.
50:19
Speaker 2: Yeah.
50:19
Speaker 1: And I've said for years I studied chlorination byproducts and
50:22
they cause miscarriage.
50:26
Speaker 2: So it's got to be terrible for people that swim
50:29
a lot in public pools, right?
50:31
Speaker 1: Yeah.
50:31
Speaker 2: Because then it's being absorbed by your skin.
50:35
Speaker 1: I don't know how much exposure you get in the
50:37
relatively short time you're swimming.
50:38
Speaker 2: Let's find out. I don't know.
50:39
Speaker 5: Yeah.
50:40
Speaker 2: Let's find out. Put that into perplexity. How much of
50:42
an issue is chlorine exposure in swimming pools? Let's find out.
50:51
We don't know. We're learning so much.
50:55
Speaker 1: There's a little science.
50:57
Speaker 3: I feel like that question is going to get– tossed
50:59
around here by perplexity because it could go multiple ways
51:01
with it.
51:02
Speaker 5: Like, is there too much chlorine? Like, what are you,
51:04
you know what I mean?
51:05
Speaker 2: Right. Okay. Let's say, is chlorine exposure in swimming pools
51:11
a health concern?
51:12
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's good.
51:13
Speaker 2: There we go. Let's try that. I bet it is.
51:18
I mean, it only makes sense. I would like to
51:19
study someone like Michael Phelps, someone who spent like thousands
51:24
of hours in a pool, whether or not it's affected
51:27
his body in any way. Whether or not there's like
51:29
measurable chlorine levels in his urine or what have you.
51:33
Chlorine in properly maintained pools is generally considered safe, but
51:37
it can cause irritation of eyes, skin, and airways. Well,
51:40
that can't be good. And heavily frequent exposure, especially indoors,
51:43
can contribute to respiratory problems in some people. What chlorine
51:47
does in pools, it kills germs like bacteria and viruses
51:50
in pools and is key for preventing infections and diarrhea
51:53
illnesses from contaminated water. Public health guidance typically recommends free
51:58
chlorine about one to four parts per million with pH 7.0
52:03
to 7.8 within this range. Disinfection is effective and side
52:08
effects are usually mild. Common short-term effects, irritation of eyes, nose, throat, skin,
52:14
common when levels are high, when chloramines build up, especially
52:17
in indoor pools. Chlorobenes form when chlorine reacts with sweat, urine,
52:22
and other organic matter. It can become airborne and irritate
52:25
the respiratory tract, causing coughing, wheezing, or tight chest in
52:29
some swimmers and staff. Long-term regular heavy exposure in indoors,
52:36
poorly ventilated pools has been linked to increased respiratory symptoms.
52:40
Some studies suggest increased asthma risk. Okay, put this in
52:45
as a follow-up question.
52:46
Speaker 1: Is.
52:50
Speaker 2: Is exposure to chlorine through the skin responsible for any
53:04
health issues? Let's just through the skin. See if there's
53:11
any studies on that. Chlorine getting into the body through
53:15
the intact skin from pool water does not appear to
53:17
cause systemic... whole body health problems in otherwise healthy people,
53:21
its effects are almost entirely local to the skin itself.
53:24
What skin exposure actually does, chlorine is an irritant that
53:28
strips the natural skin oils, disrupts the outer barrier, leading
53:32
to dryness, tightness, itching. So put this in. What exposure
53:37
does chlorine have to healthy skin flora? Because healthy skin flora,
53:44
you know, I... I do jujitsu and one of the
53:47
things that happens with jujitsu is you get a lot
53:49
of skin diseases like you get. Really? People get ringworm,
53:53
staph infections. Well, you're getting scratched up a lot. You're
53:57
rolling around on the mats and if the mats are
54:00
dirty and if it's just– there's exposure to it, you
54:03
can have a problem. And then one of the problems
54:05
that people have is to treat that, they use antibacterial
54:10
skin soap. So what that does is it strips the
54:13
skin of all the healthy flora, which actually protects you.
54:16
The counter to that, I always bring this up. I
54:18
have no affiliation with this product, but it's an excellent product.
54:21
It's called Defense Soap. Defense Soap is my friend Guy Sacco.
54:26
He invented it. He's a wrestling coach. It was a
54:30
solution using healthy things like tea tree oil, eucalyptus in
54:36
this soap that Kills the bad bacteria but does nothing
54:41
to the healthy flora.
54:41
Speaker 1: That's great.
54:42
Speaker 2: Yes. So that's the only soap that I use. Chlorinated
54:47
pool water does disturb normal skin flora temporarily. But in
54:51
healthy people, the microbiome usually recovers within hours to a
54:54
day or so after swimming. So that's a problem if
54:57
you swim every day then. Chlorine is a broad disinfectant.
55:00
So it kills or suppresses both good and bad bacteria
55:03
on the skin surface.
55:04
Speaker 1: That's what you were saying.
55:04
Speaker 3: Yeah.
55:05
Speaker 1: Yeah.
55:05
Speaker 2: Reducing overall microbial diversity right after swimming. Experimental and field
55:12
studies show that even short exposure can cut measured microbiome
55:16
diversity markedly, often cited around 30% to 40%, with composition
55:21
shifting away from the usual dominant groups right after a swim.
55:25
How long disruption lasts. After leaving the pool, many of
55:29
the resident species begin to recolonize from deeper skin layers
55:34
Hair follicles and the environment and community composition tends to
55:38
drift backward towards baseline over the next 24 plus hours.
55:42
With frequent repeated swimming, daily or high volume training, the
55:46
skin may be in a more chronically perturbed state with
55:49
less time for full microbiome recovery in between exposures. I
55:54
know a lot of people have switched their pools over
55:57
to saltwater pools for this very reason. I think there's
56:01
a problem with saltwater pools in very high temperature areas
56:06
though where it's not effective enough to stop mold and
56:11
all the junk. Right, right, right. Yeah.
56:16
Speaker 1: Do you want to see these products I brought?
56:17
Speaker 2: I would love to see these products you brought.
56:19
Speaker 1: Here you go. These are for– cleaning up your kitchen.
56:23
Speaker 2: What's up, Jimmy?
56:24
Speaker 5: A note on what you just said. A saltwater pool
56:26
is still technically a chlorine pool.
56:27
Speaker 2: Oh, still a chlorine pool. It just makes the chlorine
56:30
on site instead of pouring it in.
56:32
Speaker 1: Oh. Yeah.
56:33
Speaker 2: Salt systems work. Pool is ordinary salt, sodium chloride, dissolved
56:37
in the water, usually around 2,700 to 3,400 parts per million,
56:42
which is about one-tenth the salinity of the ocean, and
56:45
close to body fluid levels. The water passes through an
56:48
electrically charged salt cell and which uses electrolysis to convert
56:52
some of that salt into active chlorine, mainly hypochlorous acid
56:59
and sodium hypochlorite that sanitizes the pool. After chlorine does
57:04
its job, it ends up back as chloride and the
57:07
cycle repeats. So you keep generating chlorine as long as
57:09
the system runs and there's enough salt. What's different from
57:13
your standard chlorine pool, you still have free chlorine in
57:16
the water at typical pool levels, about one to four
57:19
parts per million. The difference is the source, salt generator
57:22
versus liquid table chlorine, not the sanitizer itself. Most people
57:26
find salt pools a bit gentler, the water feels softer,
57:30
and continuous low-level generation can mean fewer chloramines, less smell
57:37
and irritation if the system is sized and maintained correctly. Interesting. Okay,
57:42
so it's still chlorine. So it still probably disturbs your microbiome,
57:47
which sucks. This episode is brought to you by Intuit TurboTax.
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near you. Sealed. Should I open it?
58:30
Speaker 1: It should be open.
58:33
Speaker 2: No, it's not. It's sealed. It's tight. What do we
58:37
got in here? A lot of stuff. So.
58:40
Speaker 1: In the movie, you'll see that I came to the
58:43
homes of the participants with a big box, about this big.
58:47
So this is obviously a very small part of that. Yep.
58:51
This is just part of your kitchen.
58:53
Speaker 2: So these are bags that are safe, oven, freezer, microwave.
58:57
It's called zip top.
58:59
Speaker 1: Yeah, they're silicone.
59:00
Speaker 2: They're made of silicone.
59:01
Speaker 1: Oh, okay.
59:01
Speaker 2: Yeah. So silicone's okay.
59:03
Speaker 1: Silicone, that's– there is food-grade silicone.
59:07
Speaker 2: Okay. And that is– Like spatulas.
59:11
Speaker 1: Yeah. And food-grade silicone is free of phthalates and dysphenols.
59:17
So you can use that.
59:18
Speaker 2: Oh, this is a lot thicker.
59:20
Speaker 1: This is like– A lot thicker, yeah.
59:21
Speaker 3: Yeah.
59:23
Speaker 2: And so this is reusable? Is that the idea?
59:25
Speaker 1: Yeah, absolutely. And you just store– put your food in
59:28
the fridge in that instead.
59:29
Speaker 2: Of in a– So you can buy these things?
59:31
Speaker 1: Oh, yeah.
59:32
Speaker 2: This company, Zip Top, do they make them specifically for
59:35
that reason?
59:36
Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm sure.
59:37
Speaker 2: Yeah.
59:38
Speaker 1: There's one of many companies that makes.
59:41
Speaker 2: So this is essentially like a Ziploc bag.
59:43
Speaker 1: Exactly.
59:44
Speaker 2: But it's way thicker.
59:45
Speaker 1: Yeah.
59:47
Speaker 2: Kind of cool. And so they make these larger as
59:49
well so.
59:50
Speaker 1: You can– Okay. There are a lot of good alternatives
59:53
for food storage. Glass, of course, is really good. Mm-hmm.
59:57
Speaker 2: Yeah.
59:59
Speaker 1: And ceramic is really good.
1:00:01
Speaker 2: Well, this seems so much better too because it's not
1:00:03
creating as much plastic waste since it's reusable. Right, right, right. Now,
1:00:06
do you just run this through a dishwasher? Now, what
1:00:08
about dishwashing solvents and detergents and stuff like that?
1:00:13
Speaker 1: There's always problems. Yeah.
1:00:15
Speaker 2: The world's filled with problems, Jamie.
1:00:18
Speaker 1: The pods are probably not great.
1:00:21
Speaker 2: Oh, right. Of course, right? Damn pods.
1:00:25
Speaker 1: Tide pods, tea bags, coffee pods.
1:00:27
Speaker 2: Yeah. Remember when kids were eating Tide pods? It's like
1:00:32
nature's trying to get rid of some of the dummies. Okay.
1:00:37
So this company.
1:00:38
Speaker 1: I think there's two of those in there. Yeah. These
1:00:40
are just little examples, you know.
1:00:41
Speaker 2: Let's give this company a shout out. It's called Zip Top.
1:00:46
And I guess they make them all sizes. This is
1:00:49
like sandwich size.
1:00:50
Speaker 1: Yeah.
1:00:51
Speaker 2: This is, I guess, a snack size. And they make
1:00:53
them larger too.
1:00:54
Speaker 1: Yeah. And they seal well, you know.
1:00:57
Speaker 2: That's another question that I had about sous vide. There's
1:01:02
a lot of people that cook their food in these
1:01:05
sous vide machines. A lot? Really? That's very common. Yeah.
1:01:09
Speaker 1: I thought it was kind of high, you know, kind of.
1:01:13
Speaker 2: In restaurants and stuff?
1:01:14
Speaker 1: Yeah.
1:01:14
Speaker 2: Well, I mean, I know there's consumer versions of it
1:01:17
that I know a lot of my friends use it.
1:01:19
Speaker 1: Yeah.
1:01:19
Speaker 2: Yeah. They use it for wild game. In particular, because
1:01:23
you can slow cook. So one of the things about
1:01:26
wild game, it has a very low fat content. And
1:01:29
a lot of people find that it's more tender if
1:01:32
you slowly cook. So let's say if you like medium
1:01:36
rare is like, what is medium rare? Like 135 degrees,
1:01:39
I think. So what you would do is you would
1:01:42
take this piece of meat and you would seal it
1:01:46
up in a vacuum sealed container. And you dunk it
1:01:50
in this sous vide machine. And it keeps the water
1:01:53
at 135 degrees. You can cook it for several hours
1:01:56
at 135 and then you sear the outside of it.
1:01:58
Speaker 1: Nice. Yeah.
1:01:59
Speaker 2: And so a lot of people like that. And it's
1:02:02
really good for breaking down some of the harder stuff like,
1:02:06
you know, the fascia.
1:02:08
Speaker 1: Gristle.
1:02:09
Speaker 2: Yeah. So is that stuff leaking chemicals into your food?
1:02:13
It has to be, right?
1:02:14
Speaker 3: Why?
1:02:15
Speaker 2: Well, because it's in plastic. You're getting these vacuum sealed
1:02:18
plastic bags that the food goes in. Have you seen
1:02:21
how sous vide works?
1:02:22
Speaker 1: Do you have to put it in plastic?
1:02:23
Speaker 2: Yes. Have you seen how these sous vide things work?
1:02:26
Speaker 1: No, then it's bad. Then it sounds just as bad
1:02:28
as microwaving in plastic.
1:02:30
Speaker 2: Right. So what you do with sous vide is you
1:02:32
season the food and a lot of times you'll add
1:02:36
like olive oil and things like that to the outside
1:02:39
of it.
1:02:39
Speaker 1: You couldn't make it out of silicone?
1:02:41
Speaker 2: I would imagine you could, right? I don't know. Let's
1:02:44
find that out. Has anybody made silicone-based sous vide bags?
1:02:50
And do these sous vide bags leach chemicals?
1:02:54
Speaker 3: I just saw a discussion on Reddit about this, but
1:02:56
they didn't really have an answer. Like they're asking if
1:02:58
the temperatures might not be high enough.
1:03:01
Speaker 1: I don't know.
1:03:02
Speaker 2: Yeah. What are the temperatures that start these chemicals leaching
1:03:09
from the plastics into your water? Because a lot of
1:03:13
times they say don't leave a bottle of water in
1:03:15
your car.
1:03:16
Speaker 1: That's right.
1:03:17
Speaker 2: Because your car can get really hot. So how hot
1:03:19
is your car yet? It doesn't get that hot. It
1:03:22
doesn't get like cooking hot. So it's like what.
1:03:25
Speaker 1: Is– But if the sous vide bags don't have plasticizers
1:03:29
in them, like if they're made of silicone, food-based– what
1:03:34
is it?
1:03:35
Speaker 2: Food grade silicone.
1:03:36
Speaker 5: Yeah, similar.
1:03:38
Speaker 2: So it says we use vacuum sealed bags. We're really
1:03:40
going through them right now, even on our early sous vide.
1:03:42
I tried silicone reusable and I wasn't happy. I don't
1:03:46
really recall why. I think it was hard to get
1:03:48
stuff in without a mess. Okay, that doesn't make any sense.
1:03:51
Just deal with the mess. We made a switch to
1:03:54
vacuum bags. I love it, but oof, we use a
1:03:56
lot of bags. Okay. Put this into perplexity, please. Yeah.
1:04:02
Do sous vide bags leach endocrine-disrupting chemicals into your food
1:04:08
when you cook with them? Let's try that. Sweet. We're
1:04:12
learning things.
1:04:13
Speaker 1: Yeah.
1:04:14
Speaker 5: Does it have to be vacuum sealed?
1:04:16
Speaker 2: Yes.
1:04:16
Speaker 5: Probably, right, because you don't want water leaking in there?
1:04:18
Speaker 2: Yeah. You don't want water leaking in. I have a machine,
1:04:21
and I use this vacuum sealed machine. So if I
1:04:24
get wild game and then I cut it up into
1:04:26
pieces and then I seal it in these vacuum sealed
1:04:30
bags to freeze it. Silicone-based sous vide bags are generally
1:04:35
considered safe for food use and do not significantly leach–
1:04:38
significantly is a weird word– leach harmful chemicals under typical
1:04:42
cooking conditions. High-quality food-grade silicone is inert, BPA-free. This is
1:04:49
silicone though. Food-grade silicone shows minimal chemical migration such as
1:04:55
siloxanes– especially compared to plastics. You can release microplastics like BPA.
1:05:04
This is a silicone, though. What was the question that
1:05:10
you asked? How did you phrase it? Well, you were
1:05:12
asking about sous vide bags. Okay, you write silicone-based sous
1:05:15
vide bags. Not silicone-based, just like plastic sous vide bags.
1:05:21
Speaker 1: Well, you know they're going to leak stuff.
1:05:23
Speaker 2: Let's find out. Regular plastic sous vide bags. Let's see
1:05:28
what it says. Right. But I want to make sure
1:05:36
that it's vacuum-sealed sous vide bags.
1:05:39
Speaker 3: It should know that we're talking about sous vide bags here.
1:05:41
Speaker 2: Regular plastic bags can be reasonably, I don't like that word,
1:05:46
safe for sous vide if you use the right kind,
1:05:48
food grade, BPA, and phthalate-free, and rated for hot food.
1:05:53
But all plastics can leak some chemicals, and the data
1:05:56
specific to sous vide is still limited.
1:05:57
Speaker 3: Yeah.
1:05:58
Speaker 2: What regular bags are safe? Look for bags made with
1:06:02
polyethylene and or polypropylene that are labeled food-grade and microwave-safe.
1:06:08
Is there a plastic that's microwave-safe, though? Is that real? Yeah,
1:06:13
these are considered safe with food up to around 190
1:06:17
to 195 Fahrenheit. Most brands' zipper bags, Ziploc, GLAAD, are polyethylene, BPA,
1:06:25
and dioxin-free and are commonly used for sous vide bags.
1:06:28
at typical temperatures below 176. Purpose-made vacuum sealer or boil-in
1:06:35
sous vide pouches, that's what I used, are specifically certified
1:06:38
as food grade for cooking and are the safest plastic
1:06:40
option if you want disposable. So it seems like it's
1:06:43
reasonably safe to do that. A review by Utah's Department
1:06:47
of Health notes that there's a lack of studies directly
1:06:52
measuring chemical leaching from sous vide bags. but recommends using
1:06:55
FDA-compliant BPA and phthalate-free plastics, which are not known for
1:07:00
estrogenic activity and are considered safe for food contact. Okay.
1:07:10
It says trout. See what it says there?
1:07:11
Speaker 1: Yeah.
1:07:12
Speaker 2: One trout study found detectable BPA in fish cooked. But
1:07:15
the problem is food– like here's the problem. Freshwater lakes–
1:07:23
If you're catching a trout in a freshwater lake, freshwater
1:07:26
lakes have horrible levels of these chemicals in them. And
1:07:30
most people do not recommend eating food from freshwater lakes,
1:07:35
which is so crazy. You think, oh, I'm going to
1:07:38
go catch a fish from a lake. This is going
1:07:41
to be really healthy. It's right from nature. Now we've
1:07:45
ruined lakes.
1:07:47
Speaker 3: Yeah.
1:07:47
Speaker 2: What is the issue? Put this in. What is the
1:07:51
issue with eating fish from freshwater lakes in America? What
1:07:56
are the health issues?
1:07:57
Speaker 1: Health issues, yeah.
1:07:58
Speaker 2: Eating fish from freshwater lakes in America. We've looked this
1:08:02
up before. It's kind of stunning how much chemicals you
1:08:05
get from a single fish that you would catch. So
1:08:07
if you catch a trout from a regular lake, you
1:08:11
go to a lake, it looks clean. I can see
1:08:13
the bottom. Everything's fine. No, it's bad for you. In fact,
1:08:17
I know a guy– who is friends with someone who
1:08:20
does a lot of fishing tournaments. So he goes to
1:08:24
these fishing tournaments, catches a lot of fish. He eats
1:08:25
a lot of fish, obviously. And he got horribly, horribly
1:08:28
sick because of heavy metal poisoning.
1:08:31
Speaker 1: Isn't that terrible?
1:08:33
Speaker 2: Crazy. You think you're eating fresh fish that you've caught yourself.
1:08:38
It's got to be good, right?
1:08:39
Speaker 1: And it's got to be bad for the fish.
1:08:41
Speaker 2: Eating U.S. freshwater fish can expose you to chemical contaminants
1:08:44
like mercury and PFAS, and if eaten undercooked or raw,
1:08:49
to parasites and some bacteria. Most people can still eat
1:08:52
freshwater fish safely if they follow local advisories and avoid
1:08:56
high-risk groups, pregnant people, young children, eating too much. Main
1:09:00
chemical risks, mercury, methylmercury. Nearly all wild fish contain some mercury,
1:09:06
but levels in many U.S. freshwater fish can be high
1:09:09
enough to harm a fetus or a young child's developing
1:09:12
brain and nervous system if eaten often. That's crazy. PFAS,
1:09:16
Forever Chemicals, Many U.S. freshwater fish have measurable PFAS and,
1:09:21
in some studies, show widespread PFAS plus mercury in fish
1:09:25
tissue at levels that pose health risks for frequent consumers.
1:09:29
PFAS exposure has been linked to changes in liver and
1:09:32
kidney function, cholesterol, immune response, pregnancy complications, and increased risk
1:09:37
of certain cancers.
1:09:38
Speaker 1: I don't know why they haven't mentioned autoimmune. Oh, they
1:09:43
do say immune. Immune response, yes.
1:09:45
Speaker 2: Yeah, immune response.
1:09:46
Speaker 1: Yeah, this guy in Denmark studied people on the Faroe Islands,
1:09:51
which they all eat fish. They catch them, you know,
1:09:54
the Faroe Islands, and they catch them there. And so
1:09:56
he looked at the levels of PFAS, and then he
1:10:00
looked at their antibody response to vaccination. Oh. Down.
1:10:06
Speaker 2: Down.
1:10:07
Speaker 1: And so think of what that means in, you know,
1:10:09
like it's time of COVID or whatever.
1:10:11
Speaker 4: Mm-hmm.
1:10:12
Speaker 1: I want to do an intervention where we take kids
1:10:15
who are getting PFAS-free school uniforms. Remember I told you
1:10:21
PFAS was in school uniforms? And then when they come
1:10:25
in at age six for their first grade, they will
1:10:30
have just had their booster. So then we could get
1:10:32
their blood and see if the booster antibody levels were
1:10:39
lower in the kids that had the PFAS uniforms versus
1:10:41
the clean uniform.
1:10:42
Speaker 2: Booster for which vaccines?
1:10:46
Speaker 1: Mumps, pertussis, MMP I think it's called.
1:10:50
Speaker 2: Okay.
1:10:51
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah.
1:10:52
Speaker 2: And so it's lower– it's a lower response if your
1:10:56
body is exposed to these chemicals. So you would imagine
1:10:59
even if you're not– you just lower response period to
1:11:03
all immune function based on this.
1:11:05
Speaker 1: Right, right.
1:11:07
Speaker 2: What is these things?
1:11:08
Speaker 1: Loofah mitts. Oh, the loofah mitts. So you can use
1:11:10
them to scrub your sink or your face.
1:11:12
Speaker 2: Yeah, or use them in the shower.
1:11:14
Speaker 1: Yeah, or in the shower.
1:11:14
Speaker 2: But you should use those for your food too.
1:11:16
Speaker 1: But the sponges that most people use have a lot
1:11:19
of chemicals in them.
1:11:20
Speaker 2: Of course. Makes sense.
1:11:22
Speaker 1: So these are better.
1:11:23
Speaker 2: Yeah, they're plastic sponges. And you get them in hot
1:11:25
water and you're scrubbing things. And some of the stuff
1:11:28
probably gets in your plates and your food and your
1:11:32
cooking ware.
1:11:32
Speaker 1: Yeah, so that's good.
1:11:34
Speaker 2: What else we got here? Beeswrap.
1:11:38
Speaker 1: That's really nice stuff.
1:11:40
Speaker 2: What is this stuff?
1:11:42
Speaker 1: Actually, you can treat– this is some kind of paper
1:11:45
that's been treated with beeswax. So nothing dirty there. And
1:11:49
take it out. You'll see how nice it is.
1:11:51
Speaker 2: Okay.
1:11:56
Speaker 1: I love this stuff. I have a lot of it.
1:11:57
Because it seals up.
1:11:59
Speaker 2: So you feel the wax.
1:12:00
Speaker 1: That's the wax.
1:12:01
Speaker 2: Oh, okay. So you use that to wrap your food with.
1:12:05
Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah. And it seals on itself and you just
1:12:09
rinse it out afterwards. So you don't have to use
1:12:12
saran wrap and, you know, all these.
1:12:14
Speaker 2: It does seal on itself.
1:12:15
Speaker 5: Nice.
1:12:16
Speaker 2: It seems like a form fits around things.
1:12:18
Speaker 1: You can put it on an egg or tomato or
1:12:21
anything you want.
1:12:21
Speaker 2: Well, with my friend Phillip, I guarantee he eats a
1:12:24
lot of sushi. He runs a sushi place. And if
1:12:26
you ever go to a sushi place, all the fish
1:12:28
is wrapped in plastic.
1:12:29
Speaker 1: Yeah.
1:12:29
Speaker 2: They're always wrapped in plastic and then they cut it open.
1:12:33
And so there's exposure to all this stuff.
1:12:35
Speaker 1: All right.
1:12:36
Speaker 2: You should use this stuff.
1:12:37
Speaker 1: Yeah.
1:12:37
Speaker 2: Probably has the same level of sealing as plastic does.
1:12:39
Speaker 1: Might be more expensive, though. Yeah.
1:12:42
Speaker 2: What's your health worth?
1:12:44
Speaker 3: Right.
1:12:44
Speaker 2: But it's also reusable, which plastic isn't.
1:12:46
Speaker 1: Oh, absolutely. Just wash it. Yeah.
1:12:48
Speaker 2: That's the thing. It's probably economical in the long run
1:12:51
because plastic wrap you don't reuse unless you're a psycho.
1:12:55
Speaker 1: And it gets all over the world. Right.
1:12:58
Speaker 2: Everywhere. I'm sure you've seen the Pacific Garbage Patch, which
1:13:04
is crazy, right? These are bags, and these bags are
1:13:10
called Wowie, W-O-W-E, right? And what is this?
1:13:15
Speaker 1: It's another food storage, you know, choice, option.
1:13:19
Speaker 2: It's paper, or no. No, it's cloth.
1:13:22
Speaker 1: Cloth, but clean cloth, yeah.
1:13:25
Speaker 2: And so you use this?
1:13:26
Speaker 1: Like for bread, it's really good. Bread, cookies, you know,
1:13:29
stuff like that.
1:13:30
Speaker 2: Okay.
1:13:30
Speaker 1: Yeah, we use those.
1:13:32
Speaker 2: And so... Is this all– all these different products listed
1:13:36
on your website so people can.
1:13:39
Speaker 1: They're listed on the Million Marker. There's a card there
1:13:43
to scan the QR code and you can go to that.
1:13:48
Speaker 2: But it would be nice if it was like a
1:13:50
one– so if you scan the QR code, is there
1:13:52
a one-stop shop? Like people listening to this right now,
1:13:54
can we send them to a website that can– what
1:13:57
website would that be?
1:13:58
Speaker 1: I don't– I can't– look at the card.
1:14:01
Speaker 2: Yes. This one? Tips for a detox journey. So this
1:14:07
is the QR. So if I scan this right now,
1:14:09
it'll take me there.
1:14:10
Speaker 1: Yeah.
1:14:11
Speaker 2: That's my phone. This world that we live in. We're
1:14:18
not ready. Okay. It says the website is millionmarker.com. Chemical glossary.
1:14:30
So this is the chemical glossary that's on this card.
1:14:33
But it doesn't... Not the products, right? It doesn't say
1:14:36
the products. It says partners.
1:14:39
Speaker 1: So there's products on that other website I told you,
1:14:44
Unplastic Your Life.
1:14:45
Speaker 2: Unplasticyourlife.com. So that's a place where people can go and
1:14:50
see these products.
1:14:50
Speaker 1: Here it is. So there's three steps. Unplasticyourlife.com, Action Hub,
1:14:56
Protect Yourself. And then it can tell you how to
1:14:58
protect yourself against... Various things in different rooms. I have
1:15:02
it by rooms, I think.
1:15:02
Speaker 2: What is this one, Jamie? This is the same website.
1:15:06
Speaker 5: I just already went to the Action Hub.
1:15:07
Speaker 2: Oh, so when you go to unplasticyourlife.com, it takes you
1:15:10
to OSP Society. And then go to the Action Hub.
1:15:14
Speaker 5: Yeah, it redirects to this website.
1:15:15
Speaker 2: Got it. And then go to the Action Hub, protect
1:15:18
your family. And then are the products listed down there? Okay, yeah.
1:15:23
There it is. Okay. Single, okay. Okay. Non-plastic bags, steel cookware.
1:15:32
Got it. Replace the plastic cutting boards with wood. So
1:15:37
I think some people use titanium, which is fine too, right?
1:15:40
And then what's above that? Steel single-use drinking water containers.
1:15:46
Never use plastics to store your food in. Never heat plastics.
1:15:51
Holy crap. Save your skin by selecting personal care products
1:15:54
with natural ingredients such in glass or tin packaging.
1:16:00
Speaker 3: Boy.
1:16:02
Speaker 2: So disturbing.
1:16:03
Speaker 1: Washing your clothes.
1:16:06
Speaker 2: Yeah.
1:16:08
Speaker 1: By the way, we didn't talk about smell.
1:16:10
Speaker 2: Smell.
1:16:11
Speaker 1: But everything that's fragranced has phthalates.
1:16:14
Speaker 2: Of course.
1:16:15
Speaker 1: And, you know, like you think you're doing good if
1:16:18
you hang that little pine tree in your car.
1:16:22
Speaker 2: Not good?
1:16:23
Speaker 1: Not good. And you plug in things in the wall
1:16:28
that are supposed to clean up your air and refresh
1:16:31
your air and so on. Not good.
1:16:33
Speaker 2: There's ones that are in cars now, like certain cars.
1:16:36
I think Mercedes has one where you refill it and
1:16:40
you can– it actually will spray air freshener through the vents.
1:16:45
Does Mercedes do that? I think it's Mercedes, which makes sense. Luxury.
1:16:50
I want to smell luxury. Like lavender as I'm driving.
1:16:53
Speaker 1: Right.
1:16:55
Speaker 2: Oh, look at me in my luxurious car smelling lavender,
1:16:58
dying of chemical exposure.
1:17:00
Speaker 1: We asked women on our study. We said, what do
1:17:05
you use? And then we said, was it fragranced? And
1:17:08
anything where they said it was fragranced, their body burden
1:17:12
of phthalates was higher.
1:17:13
Speaker 2: Of course. What about natural deodorants?
1:17:17
Speaker 1: I don't know. Yeah.
1:17:19
Speaker 2: I have to look it up.
1:17:19
Speaker 1: Yeah.
1:17:20
Speaker 2: I use natural deodorant to try to avoid a lot
1:17:22
of that stuff.
1:17:24
Speaker 3: On the product for it on their website, it says
1:17:26
it's a miscellaneous dangerous good, I think. What?
1:17:28
Speaker 5: I don't know what that is.
1:17:30
Speaker 2: What? It says miscellaneous dangerous goods.
1:17:33
Speaker 5: Maybe it's when they ship it or something.
1:17:35
Speaker 2: What are you looking at? The interior of the vehicle
1:17:36
will be fragranced. It says it right there. This is
1:17:40
under Mercedes, under their smell. Aroma system, Pacific mood. Ooh,
1:17:45
I want a Pacific mood. I'm living on the coast.
1:17:48
I'm fabulous. And it says miscellaneous dangerous goods, other dangerous substances.
1:17:54
That's crazy that it's labeled that way. The interior of
1:17:58
the vehicle can be fragranced to suit your own individual
1:18:01
preference with the air balance package. Flak on Pacific mood,
1:18:07
lemon and orange top notes accompanied by a blend of spices.
1:18:14
But meanwhile, it's probably not good for you. So what
1:18:19
is in there? They're engineered specifically. Does it say what?
1:18:21
They're also subject to rigorous testing, which means each part
1:18:24
comes fully certified. In the end, you can be sure
1:18:26
that your vehicle will perform up to its potential, mile
1:18:29
after mile. Let's see what.
1:18:30
Speaker 5: This word meant. I don't know if you want to
1:18:32
try this.
1:18:32
Speaker 2: Whoa. Can you say that word, doctor?
1:18:35
Speaker 1: Oh, no.
1:18:37
Speaker 2: Gifargutenziken.
1:18:42
Speaker 5: I'm guessing it means dangerous goods, but why not?
1:18:46
Speaker 2: Other dangerous– they're calling it dangerous? That sounds really crazy.
1:18:51
Speaker 1: Miscellaneous dangerous goods.
1:18:52
Speaker 2: Like hazard warnings. This is crazy. But why would they
1:18:57
say that and then you're spraying it and you're breathing
1:19:01
it in?
1:19:01
Speaker 3: It could be very well like one of those California
1:19:03
rules where they say like this building has got Dangerous
1:19:05
chemicals that could cause cancer in people and it like
1:19:08
has to be on everything.
1:19:08
Speaker 2: Right. But it's just weird that that's in the actual
1:19:12
stuff that you breathe in and smell. I've heard another
1:19:15
thing that's really bad for you is incense.
1:19:20
Speaker 1: Probably varies with what's in it. I wouldn't blanket all incense.
1:19:26
I haven't studied that.
1:19:28
Speaker 2: Let's put that into perplexity. Because I know candles are
1:19:32
bad for you. Scented candles in particular.
1:19:35
Speaker 1: Scented, yes. Yes, there's their aroma again.
1:19:37
Speaker 2: Yeah.
1:19:38
Speaker 1: See, one of the things that phthalates do is they
1:19:41
cause something to hold scent, retain scent. So they're put
1:19:46
into perfume and they're put into makeup and they're put into,
1:19:49
you know, the things you put on your wall. So,
1:19:53
you know, you want something to smell for a long time.
1:19:56
You're going to use phthalates.
1:19:57
Speaker 2: It says, burning incense products, smoke, and chemicals that can
1:20:01
irritate your lungs, worsen asthma and allergies, and with heavy
1:20:05
long-term use in poorly ventilated spaces may increase risk for
1:20:09
heart disease and some cancers. You know, you think incense,
1:20:15
you go over to someone's house, they do yoga, they
1:20:17
eat vegan, they burn incense, they must be healthy.
1:20:21
Speaker 1: Right.
1:20:22
Speaker 2: Long-term health risks. Repeated long-term exposure daily for years. Been
1:20:26
associated in studies with increased risk of bronchitis, reduced lung
1:20:30
function in children, and chronic respiratory symptoms in workers heavily
1:20:35
exposed to temple incense. God. Epidemiological studies, mostly in Asian
1:20:40
populations with heavy daily use, have linked long-term incense exposure
1:20:45
to higher rates of cardiovascular problems, hypertension, coronary artery disease, stroke,
1:20:51
chronic limb. What's that word?
1:20:53
Speaker 1: Ischemia.
1:20:54
Speaker 2: Ischemia. What's that mean? What does ischemia mean? It can't
1:20:58
be good. It sounds terrible. What is ischemia? What is ischemia? Huh.
1:21:10
Lack of blood flow to part of a body, usually
1:21:14
because of an artery, is narrowed or blocked. Severe or prolonged,
1:21:18
the affected tissue can be damaged or die.
1:21:21
Speaker 3: Oh, great.
1:21:23
Speaker 2: Oh, wonderful. So you... You think about incense, you think
1:21:29
like healthy, natural people. Oh, they burn incense. It sounds lovely.
1:21:32
It sounds like they're spiritual. Oh, incense. I used to
1:21:36
love incense. I used to use it all the time.
1:21:38
Thought it was cool. Made you like, you know, be
1:21:42
more peaceful. Incense. Bad for you. Everything's bad for you.
1:21:47
You know what's bad for you? These straws if you
1:21:50
trip with them. You know, a lot of people have died.
1:21:52
These are metal straws.
1:21:54
Speaker 1: Really?
1:21:54
Speaker 2: They've died because they're on their phone and they're not
1:21:56
paying attention. They stub their toe and fall and this
1:21:58
thing goes through their eyeball and they die. Oh, shoot.
1:22:01
Speaker 1: Yeah. Okay. I won't recommend that.
1:22:05
Speaker 2: But also, you could die just falling. I mean, if
1:22:08
you're falling and you're holding a steel straw, throw it
1:22:12
to the side. That's my advice.
1:22:13
Speaker 1: So if you want to do this little experiment of
1:22:17
one that we're talking about.
1:22:17
Speaker 2: Okay.
1:22:18
Speaker 1: And of one, unless Jamie wants to do it too.
1:22:20
Speaker 2: Jamie's in. Look at him. He's down.
1:22:25
Speaker 1: Then Jenna or somebody on our team, if you had
1:22:29
an hour, half an hour, I don't know how long
1:22:31
it took, call you and say, ask you, what did
1:22:35
you use? What did you use? What did you use
1:22:36
for this, this, this, this?
1:22:38
Speaker 3: Right.
1:22:38
Speaker 1: And then they'll recommend what to change.
1:22:42
Speaker 2: Right. I recently underwent this plasmapheresis thing. Yeah. And that's
1:22:48
supposed to remove a lot of that stuff from your blood, correct?
1:22:51
So my body... I'll tell you what. The next day,
1:22:54
I was very tired that day, like exhausted that day.
1:22:58
But the next day afterwards, I felt like lighter. I
1:23:01
felt like, whoa, this is crazy. I felt like I
1:23:04
had more energy. It was like kind of late at night.
1:23:06
I was like, I'm not tired at all. This is weird.
1:23:08
Like I felt different, you know.
1:23:11
Speaker 1: So that would be great. Are you going to do
1:23:13
it again?
1:23:15
Speaker 2: No, I just did it. I mean, I would do
1:23:17
it again, but I just did it a few days ago.
1:23:18
Speaker 1: I was just wondering, you know, if you measured chemicals
1:23:22
in your urine before you did that.
1:23:24
Speaker 2: I should have done that.
1:23:25
Speaker 1: And then after that.
1:23:26
Speaker 2: I don't have any pee laying around from before.
1:23:28
Speaker 4: No.
1:23:31
Speaker 2: But I could do it now. And maybe I have
1:23:35
very low levels and we could attribute that to it
1:23:38
because I haven't done the best job. Like I said,
1:23:41
I did get rid of my plastic coffee machine at home.
1:23:44
I did that about three or four weeks ago. One
1:23:47
of the things it's done is it's made my morning
1:23:50
coffee a lot harder to get. It's more of like
1:23:54
a ritual now because I use a steel water boiler
1:23:59
thing that heats it up to 200 degrees. And then
1:24:02
I have a steel French press and I grind the
1:24:06
beans in a steel thing. Right. And then I pour
1:24:10
the beans in the French press and it takes 15
1:24:13
minutes rather than 30 seconds. It tastes way better. But
1:24:17
I'm a big coffee drinker. I love coffee, but I
1:24:19
like it black. Like I love the flavor of coffee.
1:24:22
I really do. And so it just tastes better. It
1:24:26
tastes French press, I think, is the best way to
1:24:28
drink coffee anyway. And so I kind of decided, like,
1:24:31
why am I? I'm avoiding all these microplastics. I don't
1:24:34
drink out of plastic or paper cups. I do all
1:24:36
these different things. Why am I still using a plastic
1:24:38
coffee machine? I look at that thing every morning and
1:24:40
I was like, yeah, but it's going to give me
1:24:41
coffee right now. So I press the button to get
1:24:45
my coffee right now. Then I was like, that's stupid.
1:24:47
So now I just, I only use something like this.
1:24:51
Speaker 1: Yeah.
1:24:52
Speaker 2: So I'd be interested to see if maybe I have
1:24:54
low levels because I certainly feel like my body, it
1:25:00
felt refreshed. Like I had less inflammation. But that's like
1:25:04
a two-hour procedure. It's a pain in the butt. You've
1:25:08
got to sit there for two hours. You look like
1:25:09
a psycho. I should have taken a photo of what
1:25:14
I looked like while I was doing it because I
1:25:16
was laying there and I had like cords in this
1:25:19
arm and cords in that arm. So I had blood
1:25:22
coming out of that arm and going back into that arm.
1:25:24
It was really kind of nutty.
1:25:26
Speaker 1: How expensive?
1:25:28
Speaker 2: I don't know.
1:25:28
Speaker 1: Oh.
1:25:29
Speaker 2: Yeah. I don't know. I'm sure it's not cheap. But
1:25:35
the benefits of it in terms of like the people
1:25:37
that I know that have done it said it's a
1:25:38
game changer in terms of your recovery, market recovery levels,
1:25:42
much better sleep. Like if you're wearing an aura ring
1:25:45
or a whoop strap or something along those lines, you
1:25:47
get much better recovery. And I think that's probably the
1:25:51
case with me. I feel pretty good. I do a
1:25:54
lot of stuff, you know. I do a lot of
1:25:56
things to maximize my health. So it's really kind of
1:25:58
difficult to know like what's doing what.
1:26:00
Speaker 1: What's doing what, yeah.
1:26:01
Speaker 2: I just know all in all.
1:26:03
Speaker 1: You know, we always say, you know, in my field,
1:26:05
you know, do one thing at a time. Right.
1:26:07
Speaker 2: Of course. If you're doing science.
1:26:08
Speaker 1: Yeah.
1:26:09
Speaker 2: Yeah. I'm not doing science. I'm doing chaos.
1:26:12
Speaker 3: Yeah.
1:26:14
Speaker 1: Well, you're doing, you know, your experiment of one.
1:26:16
Speaker 2: Yeah.
1:26:17
Speaker 1: Yeah.
1:26:18
Speaker 2: But it works. All of it together is definitely working.
1:26:21
My body is pretty good.
1:26:23
Speaker 1: So, you know, you were mentioning how– It's going to
1:26:26
be very hard to get these things regulated. And I
1:26:28
just wanted to point out– we probably talked about this
1:26:31
last time. But where do these chemicals come from, these plasticizers?
1:26:38
And you probably know they're made from fossil fuel byproducts, yes?
1:26:44
Speaker 4: Yeah.
1:26:45
Speaker 1: So the forces against– eliminating them are not only the
1:26:53
manufacturers of the plastic, but it's also the fossil fuel industry.
1:26:57
So that makes it extremely difficult.
1:26:59
Speaker 2: Right.
1:26:59
Speaker 1: Yeah.
1:27:01
Speaker 2: And it's probably one of the primary factors in why
1:27:04
this isn't discussed, because it would reduce fossil fuel consumption,
1:27:09
which would affect oil markets, which would affect the economy.
1:27:12
Speaker 1: It's big. It's big.
1:27:14
Speaker 2: Yeah.
1:27:15
Speaker 1: But, I mean, the rate at which plastic production is
1:27:19
increasing is astounding, you know.
1:27:21
Speaker 2: Yes.
1:27:22
Speaker 1: And no end in sight.
1:27:24
Speaker 2: Well, I don't think you're going to get the government
1:27:27
to act about this stuff. I think this has to
1:27:30
be done on an individual level where people are aware
1:27:33
of it and take steps to protect themselves and their
1:27:36
family from these issues. That's my cynical view of how
1:27:40
this is going to be played out. And I'm really hoping,
1:27:44
I know for a fact a lot of people listened
1:27:46
to our last conversation and Made some lifestyle changes. I'm
1:27:49
really hoping that now, with this follow-up visit, more and
1:27:53
more people will be aware of it.
1:27:54
Speaker 1: And watching the movie.
1:27:55
Speaker 2: Yes, and watching the movie. And the movie's called, what's
1:27:57
it called again?
1:27:59
Speaker 1: The Plastic Detox.
1:28:01
Speaker 2: The Plastic Detox. And where is this movie available?
1:28:04
Speaker 1: In your house.
1:28:06
Speaker 5: Right.
1:28:07
Speaker 2: But is it available on Amazon, Netflix? It's Netflix.
1:28:10
Speaker 1: Okay.
1:28:10
Speaker 2: Watch on Netflix. Netflix is great. There's so many great
1:28:13
documentaries on Netflix. The hidden dangers of plastics in our homes.
1:28:18
Six couples embark on a plastic detox within their homes.
1:28:22
It changes their families forever. The plastic detox explains what
1:28:25
microplastics and their chemicals are doing to our health and
1:28:28
how we can take matters into our own hands. From
1:28:30
hormone disruption that's fueling a worldwide fertility crisis to growing
1:28:34
rates of cancer and early heart attack and stroke, this
1:28:37
powerful documentary reveals the shocking science behind plastic's impact on
1:28:42
human life.
1:28:43
Speaker 1: Do you want to see a little trailer?
1:28:44
Speaker 2: Sure. Let's watch a little trailer. Put your headphones on. Well,
1:28:47
you already know what it says.
1:28:48
Speaker 1: I'll listen. Plastic leaches a crap ton of chemicals.
1:28:51
Speaker 3: Even the smallest levels of exposure can have profound effects.
1:28:57
Speaker 1: Fertility Worldwide. It's going down.
1:29:00
Speaker 2: There you are.
1:29:01
Speaker 1: And it is tightly linked to chemicals that are commonly
1:29:05
used in plastic. You have been trying to get pregnant
1:29:08
for over 10 years now. 22 months.
1:29:10
Speaker 5: Two and a half years.
1:29:12
Speaker 1: Say what you always call yourself.
1:29:15
Speaker 5: Ah, I say, you know, Julie, I'm not a human dildo.
1:29:19
Speaker 4: This is a stream of intervention where we recruited six
1:29:23
couples who have unexplained infertility. We look at measures of
1:29:28
semen quality. The cutoff for fertile is about 40. You're
1:29:32
technically subfertile, infertile. So that's kind of scary, right?
1:29:36
Speaker 1: Yes.
1:29:40
Speaker 4: The question is, if we lower people's exposure to chemicals
1:29:45
that are in plastic, can we change their fertility? These
1:29:49
chemicals not only affect your fertility, they also have other
1:29:53
health consequences.
1:29:55
Speaker 3: These chemicals can contribute to early heart attacks and stroke, autism,
1:30:00
as well as obesogens.
1:30:02
Speaker 5: Learning more about plastics, it's opening my eyes to how
1:30:05
much bigger it is.
1:30:08
Speaker 4: Many people think the government takes care of us, but
1:30:10
very few chemicals are actually banned from personal care products,
1:30:15
and over 1,100 are banned in the EU. To have
1:30:21
a child, I believe it is a fundamental human right.
1:30:24
Speaker 2: I think you'd be the best mom ever, and I
1:30:26
really want to see that for you. Plastic doesn't have
1:30:31
to come from a toxic petroleum-based material. We can learn
1:30:34
to do it other ways.
1:30:36
Speaker 1: It can change and you can help with the change.
1:30:41
Speaker 2: That's another good point that he just said right there,
1:30:43
that plastic doesn't have to come from petroleum-based materials. And
1:30:47
most people aren't aware of that, but you can make
1:30:50
plastic out of plant compounds. Yes. And it's biodegradable.
1:30:54
Speaker 1: Yes.
1:30:55
Speaker 2: Which is like they make a hemp plastic.
1:30:57
Speaker 5: Right.
1:30:58
Speaker 2: Potatoes. Yeah. Potatoes. Yeah. And probably a bunch of other
1:31:02
stuff too, right? That you can make plastic out of
1:31:04
that doesn't have these effects.
1:31:06
Speaker 1: Right.
1:31:08
Speaker 2: It would be really nice if we moved in that direction,
1:31:10
wouldn't it?
1:31:10
Speaker 1: Absolutely.
1:31:11
Speaker 5: Yeah.
1:31:11
Speaker 2: Absolutely.
1:31:12
Speaker 1: The plant-based plastics have the cost of raising the plants,
1:31:16
of course. There's that added cost.
1:31:18
Speaker 2: Right. But does that even compare to the cost of
1:31:21
pulling oil out of the ground and refining it? Right.
1:31:24
Then turning it into plastic through some horrific process? That
1:31:29
turns the rivers blue or whatever it does.
1:31:32
Speaker 1: God knows what color it turns us. Right.
1:31:33
Speaker 2: Just kidding. Is there a list of garments that people
1:31:40
shouldn't wear? Are you aware of that, the plastic leeching garments?
1:31:45
Speaker 1: Well, the only specific ones I know are– because people
1:31:49
have told me about them– are the sports uniforms, team uniforms.
1:31:54
Speaker 2: Because they have a coating on them.
1:31:55
Speaker 1: Yeah.
1:31:56
Speaker 2: Is it to make them more durable is the idea?
1:31:58
Speaker 1: Yeah. And probably this book to die for will have
1:32:01
more information. And I have it and I read– I'm
1:32:05
just so busy with this right now and– but I'm
1:32:08
going to read it. And then sports uniforms, kids uniforms,
1:32:16
airline personnel uniforms. I think uniforms. Firefighters. Firefighters are big,
1:32:22
big exposure to these chemicals too.
1:32:25
Speaker 2: Yeah. Because they wear those waterproof– Yeah.
1:32:28
Speaker 1: Anything with it. Yeah, that's right. Anything that's waterproof, stain-proofed,
1:32:32
just like your Teflon pans, you know, barrier. Yeah. Yeah. So, yeah.
1:32:37
But I don't know any particular brands.
1:32:40
Speaker 2: So I'd imagine like nylon track suits and all those
1:32:43
different things.
1:32:44
Speaker 3: Yeah.
1:32:44
Speaker 2: That'd be terrible for you. So the worst offenders.
1:32:47
Speaker 1: I mean, customers could look for, when they buy these things,
1:32:50
they could look for PFAS-free. Just like now people know
1:32:53
to look for. BPA-free or, you know, if they could
1:32:56
look at PFAS-free, then they would be avoiding a lot
1:32:59
of this.
1:33:00
Speaker 2: So go back to the top, please. It says the
1:33:01
worst offenders are synthetic, plastic-heavy garments that are fuzzy, coated,
1:33:06
or very tight to the skin, especially polyester fleece, recycled
1:33:10
polyester fast fashion, and PFAS-coated water stain repellent, outerwear, and activewear.
1:33:17
Polyester fleece jackets, blankets, loungewear, extremely high microfiber shedding. One
1:33:22
study found that polyester fleece shedding... Orders of magnitude more
1:33:26
fibers per wash than other knits, which estimates around 110,000
1:33:30
fibers per garment per wash. This is both bad for
1:33:34
environmental plastic pollution and for indoor dust and air. Recycled
1:33:39
polyester fast fashion like leggings, tees, dresses, and sportswear. New
1:33:45
testing shows recycled polyester garments shed more and finer microfibers
1:33:52
than virgin polyester. Interesting. So you think recycled. Oh, I'm recycling.
1:33:57
I'm a good person. No, you're killing yourself. Increased particle
1:34:01
numbers and potential toxicity. These items are often cheaply made,
1:34:06
shed heavily in washing, and frequently use intense dyes and finishes.
1:34:10
Hot pink. Tight synthetic sportswear and underwear.
1:34:16
Speaker 1: Yikes.
1:34:16
Speaker 2: These are worn for long periods directly against sweaty skin
1:34:20
and mucous membranes, increasing opportunity for contact with microplastics and
1:34:25
additives like antimony, phthalates, and PFAS finishes. Cheap synthetic performance
1:34:31
or wrinkle-free fashion. Stain-resistant, easy-care, anti-odor, and heavy-print coating garments
1:34:39
are more likely to use chemical finishes that can off-gas
1:34:42
or leach on top of the base synthetic fiber issues.
1:34:47
Lower concern choices. Okay, not perfect, but generally less problematic
1:34:51
for leaching and microplastic shedding. Undyed or lightly dyed natural
1:34:56
fibers like cotton, linen, wool, hemp, silk without stain-resistant or
1:35:01
wrinkle-free finishes. Simple weaves, knits rather than fluffy or brushed
1:35:06
surfaces which shed less. PFAS-free rain gear and outdoor clothing.
1:35:12
Brands now often as– what rain gear is– pfas free
1:35:18
that's interesting because i've always thought that like has to
1:35:21
be coded.
1:35:21
Speaker 1: Right a lot of work a lot of work huh.
1:35:26
Speaker 2: Um what has been the response to uh your first
1:35:30
of all you're releasing your first book and then coming
1:35:33
on podcasts and talking about this thing um has it
1:35:36
been surprising to you like what has it been like.
1:35:41
Speaker 1: Um It has been kind of surprising how much interest
1:35:46
there is and how much people are taking this up.
1:35:50
And what's great is there are a lot of nonprofits
1:35:53
that are in the space that are getting out these messages.
1:35:57
So it's not just me. Many, many nonprofits. And then
1:36:03
there's the Plastics Treaty, which is worldwide. It didn't pass,
1:36:10
but hopefully it will come back and maybe next time.
1:36:13
And then there's the work that the EU is doing,
1:36:16
which is miles ahead of us. For example, I think
1:36:21
I might have said this before, but just– so in Europe,
1:36:26
you– if you're going to put a new chemical into commerce,
1:36:31
you have to– it has to pass certain tests to
1:36:33
be safe.
1:36:35
Speaker 2: Right.
1:36:35
Speaker 1: Not here.
1:36:36
Speaker 2: Right.
1:36:37
Speaker 1: So we're– the testing is on you and me and
1:36:41
everyone listening online. And, I mean, we haven't really raised
1:36:46
our hand and volunteered for that.
1:36:49
Speaker 2: Well, I mean, I don't want this to happen, but
1:36:51
I think maybe what has to happen is these companies
1:36:54
have to get in trouble.
1:36:56
Speaker 1: Well, some of them have. There are lawsuits.
1:36:59
Speaker 2: Are there lawsuits against like outerwear, clothing?
1:37:02
Speaker 1: I don't know.
1:37:03
Speaker 2: Yoga pants. Because yoga pants are a problem, right? Yoga pants.
1:37:07
Speaker 1: Yes.
1:37:08
Speaker 2: Yeah, those tight nylon things that a lot of the
1:37:11
gals wear.
1:37:12
Speaker 1: To– I don't know where the lawsuits are. I might
1:37:16
at some point get involved in that. But at this point,
1:37:18
I don't know. But I know there are lawsuits and
1:37:21
that they can be effective way to push back. By
1:37:24
the way, you said we wouldn't get a federal law
1:37:27
and I think that's not for a long time. But
1:37:29
states can do it. California, for example, is doing lots
1:37:33
of good stuff on that.
1:37:34
Speaker 2: What are they doing about it?
1:37:35
Speaker 1: I can't name you the laws but I know they're
1:37:38
very active. Bonta, Ron Bonta, he's a district attorney, attorney
1:37:47
general of the state of California. He's very active. And
1:37:51
so the states that have active pushback, able to get
1:37:55
laws passed, that kind of sets the tone for what's possible.
1:38:02
But I don't see us getting federal pushback very soon.
1:38:06
Speaker 2: No, it seems like industry controls the federal government.
1:38:10
Speaker 1: Yeah.
1:38:10
Speaker 2: More than the health and safety concerns of the people,
1:38:15
which is very disturbing but not too surprising when you
1:38:19
consider a lot of the other things that are allowed
1:38:20
in this country that aren't allowed in other countries. Like
1:38:23
when you show the list of the chemicals that are
1:38:26
illegal in the EU, that are illegal in America, that's disturbing.
1:38:30
Like we're supposed to be number one. We're number one.
1:38:33
We're number one in chemicals.
1:38:35
Speaker 1: Number one in chemicals.
1:38:38
Speaker 2: Yeah. Probably. Probably. The response when you were on this
1:38:41
podcast was pretty shocking for me. So many people reached
1:38:45
out to me. A lot of my friends that watched
1:38:48
the episode were like, I can't believe this. Oh, I
1:38:50
have no idea. It was five years ago. But quite
1:38:52
a few of my friends that, you know, don't reach
1:38:55
out with every episode reached out and said, that is
1:38:58
just nuts. Like, I can't believe this. And especially people
1:39:01
with children and they're concerned about the development of their
1:39:03
children or people who are pregnant who are concerned with
1:39:07
the intake of these chemicals while they're pregnant, which has
1:39:11
a radical effect on the child's development.
1:39:15
Speaker 1: Well, if your friends are listening now, I can tell
1:39:18
them that it hasn't. It hasn't changed much. It hasn't
1:39:22
improved much and we have to do a lot more
1:39:24
both personally and.
1:39:29
Speaker 2: I hate to say it but I think– like I said,
1:39:32
I don't think the government is going to do anything.
1:39:34
I think it's got to be up to individuals to
1:39:37
make choices and I'm really hoping your documentary has another
1:39:41
big impact. One of the beautiful things about Netflix is
1:39:44
that it's– even though things get promoted on Netflix …
1:39:49
Whenever anything– so many people have Netflix. So whenever anything
1:39:52
is good, a lot of people just start sharing it
1:39:55
and start talking about it and posting about it on
1:39:57
social media. And then next thing, the conversation starts happening
1:40:01
and starts raising awareness. And I really do hope you're
1:40:03
going to go on a bunch of other podcasts as
1:40:05
well and talk about this.
1:40:07
Speaker 1: Thank you. And there are showings and Netflix encourages that.
1:40:13
And I'm going actually all over the world talking at
1:40:16
showings now. The schedule is like crazy.
1:40:19
Speaker 2: Do you ever think like how crazy it is that
1:40:21
you're this one person that's sounding the alarm? Because you
1:40:24
kind of are the most public face of this problem.
1:40:29
Speaker 1: That is a little crazy to me, especially given where
1:40:31
I've come from.
1:40:32
Speaker 2: What if you didn't exist? This is the question.
1:40:35
Speaker 1: Oh, there are many, many people pushing back. Many, many people.
1:40:37
Speaker 2: Right, but I don't know if they're doing it as
1:40:39
publicly as you are and certainly not– I mean they
1:40:41
haven't been on this podcast.
1:40:42
Speaker 1: There are many that are. I– you know– I feel
1:40:47
lucky that I've had this– like speaking to you and
1:40:51
your followers and other podcasts. And then having the opportunity
1:40:58
to have designed this intervention and have worked with Louis
1:41:01
and others on the film team to put this forward.
1:41:03
It's a very big thing. And, you know, the film
1:41:06
costs a lot of money. And we've had worldwide support
1:41:10
for putting this out. So there's a lot of support
1:41:12
behind the pushback. And we just have to get everybody in.
1:41:17
on board and just say, no, I'm not going to
1:41:19
use that stuff.
1:41:21
Speaker 2: Yeah. That's really what has to happen. The conversation has
1:41:24
to increase. The volume has to increase. More people have
1:41:28
to share it and talk about it and more people
1:41:30
have to have you on. And, you know, we just
1:41:33
have to sound the alarm. It's kind of crazy that
1:41:37
five years later nothing's changed because, like I said, it
1:41:41
shook up a lot of people that I'm friends with.
1:41:43
But I didn't hear it from any other places.
1:41:46
Speaker 1: Yeah.
1:41:47
Speaker 2: I mean I didn't see you on– did you do
1:41:49
any other podcasts after.
1:41:50
Speaker 1: You did mine? Yeah, I did many. You know Huberman?
1:41:52
Speaker 2: Sure. Very well. I was on his– He's great. Yeah,
1:41:55
he's great.
1:41:55
Speaker 1: And there are– I can't remember the– but yes, a
1:42:00
lot of podcasts. But hopefully now more. I do have
1:42:03
more coming up. My schedule is really kind of crazy.
1:42:06
Speaker 2: One of the things that's great is the documentary is
1:42:08
easily digestible.
1:42:09
Speaker 1: Yes.
1:42:10
Speaker 2: It's on Netflix. Everything is on Netflix. You sit down. OK,
1:42:12
let's watch. And then you go, oh my god.
1:42:15
Speaker 1: And then there's all these– places to go at the
1:42:18
end of it to learn more if people want to
1:42:21
do that. I would love to see it viewed by influencers,
1:42:27
not in the typical social media sense, but people like
1:42:32
religious leaders, leaders who could be won over. If you
1:42:39
have any ideas– I thought about having– The pope? I
1:42:45
mean that sounds really wild. But a lot of people
1:42:49
get their– where do people get their information? From their
1:42:52
religious leaders? From their peers? From their doctors? By the way,
1:42:57
none of this is taught in medical school.
1:43:00
Speaker 2: That's crazy.
1:43:01
Speaker 1: That's crazy right there.
1:43:02
Speaker 2: Well, neither is nutrition.
1:43:03
Speaker 5: Right.
1:43:04
Speaker 3: Yeah.
1:43:06
Speaker 1: So somebody has got to spend a lot of time
1:43:10
getting that curriculum changed, right?
1:43:12
Speaker 5: Mm-hmm.
1:43:13
Speaker 1: Actually, you have to get the test changed because the
1:43:16
teaching is to the test.
1:43:17
Speaker 2: So if we.
1:43:18
Speaker 1: Could get this stuff on the test, there would be
1:43:20
more doctors learning this. But they don't get it. They
1:43:23
don't get it. They learn about lead. That's about all.
1:43:26
Speaker 2: Well, there's not a lot of incentive to teach this stuff.
1:43:29
That's part of the problems that– especially these petrochemical companies
1:43:34
and the use of these things is going to affect–
1:43:41
so many different industries because if you cut that out
1:43:44
and they– I mean how much of an impact is
1:43:47
that going to have on the economy? If everybody just
1:43:50
stopped using all these chemicals, all the Lululemon brands and
1:43:55
I don't want to single them out but all these
1:43:57
different companies, if they all just went under tomorrow, that
1:43:59
would be a giant problem if everybody just stopped using
1:44:02
these things.
1:44:04
Speaker 1: Maybe for a little while. But then they'd be healthier.
1:44:08
Speaker 2: Well, the people would be healthier, but the companies would
1:44:10
go under.
1:44:10
Speaker 1: Oh, the companies will not be healthier.
1:44:12
Speaker 2: No.
1:44:13
Speaker 1: Unless they make the switch.
1:44:14
Speaker 2: But what could they do to make the switch?
1:44:16
Speaker 1: Like if you're a company– Well, you were saying like
1:44:17
plant-based plastics.
1:44:20
Speaker 2: Do they make plant-based plastic clothing? Does anybody do that?
1:44:24
Like plant-based plastic leggings? Let's find that out. Does anybody
1:44:29
make plant-based plastic– Used in clothing.
1:44:33
Speaker 4: Yeah.
1:44:33
Speaker 1: Yeah.
1:44:33
Speaker 2: What is the primary chemicals that come out? Is it PFAS? PFAS.
1:44:38
Speaker 1: Yeah.
1:44:39
Speaker 2: PFAS-free leggings. Because I would imagine especially if you're not
1:44:45
wearing underwear and you're wearing those kind of yoga tights,
1:44:48
that would just get in there, right?
1:44:52
Speaker 3: Well, speaking of that, they're looking for– they want them
1:44:55
to be squat-proof in quotes.
1:44:57
Speaker 5: So they're not see-through.
1:44:58
Speaker 1: Squat-proof?
1:44:59
Speaker 2: Squat-proof?
1:45:00
Speaker 3: Yeah, if there's girls wearing leggings, you know, they're going
1:45:02
to be doing a lot of squats at the gym
1:45:04
probably or something.
1:45:05
Speaker 2: Squat proof.
1:45:06
Speaker 5: So they don't want people to be watching them a lot.
1:45:08
But there are some.
1:45:09
Speaker 2: I don't know what that means. Watching them a lot? Dude. Oh, see-through.
1:45:14
Speaker 5: Yeah, yeah, they're see-through.
1:45:15
Speaker 2: But that's a weird way to say squat. Squat proof
1:45:18
sounds to me like you can't do squats.
1:45:20
Speaker 5: Also probably ripping, I would imagine, too.
1:45:22
Speaker 2: I think it's just a bad phrase. You know, like
1:45:24
when you do a squat or downward facing dog, the
1:45:27
fabric stretches out. You can see some undies through the fabric.
1:45:30
Speaker 3: Someone tested nine different kinds of them. So there's a
1:45:33
few different brands. No, this isn't even related.
1:45:36
Speaker 1: Oh, the bioplastic. Go back. There.
1:45:40
Speaker 2: Yeah, bioplastic. Three primary categories of non-toxic workout clothes. All
1:45:44
natural or almost all natural. For example, 100% organic cotton
1:45:48
or 90% cotton, 10% spandex. Most semi-synthetic fabric. For instance,
1:45:53
10-cell fabric. Plant-based plastic, which is a plastic sourced from
1:45:56
something like castor bean oil instead of fossil fuels.
1:46:00
Speaker 1: Hmm.
1:46:00
Speaker 2: In general, I'm not a huge fan of plant-based bioplastics.
1:46:04
They are advertised as plastic-free alternatives, but they're still plastic.
1:46:09
And some research shows that they're not truly non-toxic. I know.
1:46:13
It's disappointing, it says. Here's the honest-to-God truth. When it
1:46:17
comes to performance, stretchiness, compression, durability, the plant-based plastics do
1:46:22
tend to perform the best.
1:46:24
Speaker 3: Huh.
1:46:26
Speaker 2: Followed by the semi-synthetics. Followed by the, oh, no. I
1:46:29
think they mean perform the best in.
1:46:31
Speaker 5: Terms– Out of the three, I think.
1:46:33
Speaker 2: But in terms of stretchiness– oh, the other three. A
1:46:38
lot of product categories where non-toxic options performs just as
1:46:41
well as a synthetic option like shampoo, to give you
1:46:44
one example. It's not really as straightforward with leggings. At
1:46:47
the end of the day, you're going to have to
1:46:49
decide for yourself what kind of material you prefer. It
1:46:51
will largely depend on things like what type of workouts
1:46:54
you do, how you like your leggings to feel. Where
1:46:58
you work out and more. Okay. My reviews on these
1:47:05
nine almost plastic-free non-toxic leggings. All right. Let's get to it.
1:47:09
It says, what are the ones? So, Mate. It's a
1:47:12
company called Mate. Overall review, they're the best middle ground leggings.
1:47:20
They're not super high performance. I don't know what that means.
1:47:23
But they're made from healthier materials and are very comfortable.
1:47:26
They're great for lower impact workouts, just for general everyday wearing.
1:47:30
Squat test passed but had to size up. So let's
1:47:35
find what the best one is. Do they have the
1:47:37
best one?
1:47:37
Speaker 5: I don't.
1:47:38
Speaker 2: So made is one of them. What are the other ones? Pangaea.
1:47:45
Overall review, find myself reaching for these leggings more often
1:47:49
than any of the others when it comes to hardcore workouts.
1:47:52
Compressive nature of them makes me feel very held in
1:47:56
when I'm jumping around. They have great stretch. Squat test, pass,
1:47:59
material blend, 92% polyamide, bio-based EVO, bio-based content, 8% part
1:48:07
bio-based Creora elastane, 30% bio-based content. Makes them different. Closest
1:48:14
to conventional synthetics in terms of fit, feel, stretch, and compression. Okay.
1:48:19
Speaker 1: Okay.
1:48:20
Speaker 2: Well, so this website is thefittery.com and forward slash plastic-free,
1:48:26
non-toxic workout leggings. Go check it out for yourself. So
1:48:30
there's some options that are out there. Hopefully we'll give
1:48:33
those companies a boost and more people will wear them.
1:48:36
Anything else before we get going? Think we covered it all?
1:48:40
Speaker 1: I think so.
1:48:41
Speaker 2: I think we sounded the alarm.
1:48:43
Speaker 1: I think we tried again anyway.
1:48:45
Speaker 2: Yeah, we did something. Like I said, I think it's
1:48:49
just a volume thing. More and more of these conversations
1:48:53
have to take place so that in the general zeitgeist,
1:48:59
more people are aware of it and it's just increased
1:49:02
awareness and just makes it where more people are making
1:49:06
better choices.
1:49:07
Speaker 1: And your platform is so huge that i'm really encouraged
1:49:11
to have the opportunity to talk about this with you
1:49:14
and happy to come back.
1:49:16
Speaker 2: Well i'd be happy to have you back i loved
1:49:18
you the first time you're great the second time as
1:49:20
well and uh for everybody uh one more time the
1:49:24
plastic detox that's the name of the documentary it's available
1:49:28
right now on netflix go check it out and uh
1:49:33
fix your life kids all right thank you i really
1:49:36
appreciate it it was really fun thank you yeah That's great.
1:49:39
And I'm really so happy that you're out there because,
1:49:41
like I said, if you weren't doing this very important work,
1:49:44
I wouldn't know about it. And I think a lot
1:49:46
of other people wouldn't either. So thank you.
1:49:48
Speaker 1: So pee in the cup.
1:49:49
Speaker 2: I will pee in the cup. I promise you. I
1:49:51
promise you I'll pee in the cup and I'll send it.
1:49:53
Speaker 1: And then if you want to do the next steps.
1:49:55
Speaker 2: Let me know. I will do the next steps as well.
1:49:57
You want to? Okay.
1:49:58
Speaker 1: Sure. So when you're ready to have another test.
1:50:00
Speaker 2: Talk to that microphone so people know what you're saying. Yeah.
1:50:03
Speaker 1: So when you're ready to have another test kit. Or
1:50:08
you can go to Million Marketing and just order one.
1:50:09
Speaker 2: Okay. Yeah. Okay.
1:50:11
Speaker 1: It's $ 100. All right.
1:50:13
Speaker 2: We'll do it.
1:50:13
Speaker 1: But we'll send it for nothing if you want. Just
1:50:15
let me know.
1:50:15
Speaker 2: I'll give you the $ 100.
1:50:16
Speaker 1: Okay.
1:50:16
Speaker 2: Okay. Thank you very much.
1:50:19
Speaker 1: Appreciate it. All right.
1:50:20
Speaker 2: Bye, everybody.
1:50:20
Speaker 1: Bye.