Latest / Random Heathen Ramblings / Random Heathen Ramblings: S5, EP3 - How Has Pop-Culture Influenced Heathenry Today?

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Random Heathen Ramblings: S5, EP3 - How Has Pop-Culture Influenced Heathenry Today? · Random Heathen Ramblings

• 0:01
  Hello everyone and welcome to the Random Heathen Ramblings
• 0:04
  podcast where we discuss all sorts of things Germanic heathen
• 0:07
  re related. My name is Jesse.
• 0:09
  I am your host. Let's get into it.
• 0:35
  All right, folks. Well, here we are, back again
• 0:38
  for another week of random heathen ramblings.
• 0:42
  I'm going to be joined here with a guest.
• 0:44
  Just a moment. His name is Bradley, and he's
• 0:47
  been kind of a social media acquaintance and friend of mine
• 0:52
  now for I don't remember exactly how long.
• 0:54
  We'll probably try and recall that between the two of us as
• 0:58
  soon as we bring him on. But I know he's been supporter
• 1:03
  of the of of you know Midgard musings the you know my YouTube
• 1:07
  channel. But the the podcast as a whole
• 1:10
  now for some time and I've invited him I think as I recall
• 1:15
  to to come on here in the past and things just hadn't aligned
• 1:19
  up as they needed to for it to happen.
• 1:22
  But this past year when I was wrapping up season four and kind
• 1:28
  of put out the, I don't know what you want to call, like a
• 1:31
  call to action or you know, open invitation for folks to think
• 1:36
  about coming on the podcast as a guest, he emailed and expressed
• 1:43
  interest in coming on here. So couple of topics you know he
• 1:48
  had, he had a couple of different things that he was
• 1:51
  interested in, in wanting to talk about.
• 1:52
  But we kind of landed on talking about how you know, pop culture
• 2:00
  and and and stuff has kind of influenced the way Heathenry,
• 2:08
  you know what how Heathenry has been expressed or how how
• 2:13
  Heathenry is being practiced. Some of the influences that pop
• 2:17
  culture has on this, this, this faith, this path, religion,
• 2:22
  whatever you want to call it. So we're going to be talking
• 2:25
  about that today and whatever else may pop up getting cold
• 2:31
  here depending on where you are listening to this.
• 2:34
  I'm sure if you're in North America in in the number of
• 2:39
  locations, I'm sure you know what it is that I'm talking
• 2:41
  about. We finally got some winter
• 2:44
  weather coming through here in Middle Tennessee at the time of
• 2:49
  filming this episode. We are.
• 2:54
  I'm saying we we we got about somewhere between six to seven
• 2:58
  inches of snow on the ground. I think in some areas of the
• 3:01
  Middle Tennessee area it's it, it's a little bit more I've I've
• 3:04
  seen some folks with with measure tape measures or rulers
• 3:08
  measuring about 8 inches in some areas.
• 3:11
  I think around here it's it's somewhere around the six to
• 3:13
  seven mark which is a significant amount of snow for
• 3:18
  you know this this part of Tennessee.
• 3:20
  I know a lot of folks who are not used to this type of
• 3:24
  weather. You know, it gets pretty get
• 3:27
  pretty dicey out there. So if you're out having to
• 3:29
  travel and you know get on the roads and stuff, you know, just
• 3:32
  be mindful and take it slow. If you start losing control,
• 3:38
  don't freak out. It's kind of let up off the gas
• 3:43
  and tap your brakes. Don't don't get you know don't
• 3:47
  get nervous and and and think that slamming on your brakes is
• 3:50
  going to stop you if if you're on ice or if you're on that wet
• 3:53
  snow and and you've lost a bit of control the best thing you
• 3:56
  can do is just tap your brakes to to to to slow down don't
• 4:03
  don't slam on them because then you'll just lock up your tires
• 4:05
  and you'll be skidding out of control into into wherever
• 4:10
  whether the first thing you hit. So be safe out there and stay
• 4:13
  warm or we're definitely feeling the the non typical cold snaps.
• 4:20
  I know we're right now we're in the teens with the real feel
• 4:25
  being in single digits with wind chill factors coming later on
• 4:29
  that are going to put us below 0 and into some negative double
• 4:35
  digits potentially. So by the time this airs, by the
• 4:39
  time you're watching or listening to this, it'll
• 4:40
  probably be above that. But at the time of recording
• 4:44
  this we're going to be seeing some potentially frigid, frigid
• 4:48
  cold temps. So wherever you are, if you're
• 4:50
  experiencing the same thing, be sure to plan accordingly, dress
• 4:53
  accordingly and be safe out there.
• 4:56
  So all that being said, we're going to just put up a word from
• 5:03
  from our sponsors, our good friends over at Fialvetir
• 5:07
  Workshop before we bring Bradley on here.
• 5:10
  And be sure to also check out the link tree link in the
• 5:14
  description or show notes of the podcast if you're watching this
• 5:17
  on Patreon. Thank you so much for your
• 5:19
  support in that way for all of my listeners on the audio
• 5:22
  platforms, your support is also greatly appreciated.
• 5:27
  So check out the link tree that's posted in the the show
• 5:31
  notes or in the description of the video if you're watching
• 5:33
  this on Patreon. All the ways that you can
• 5:34
  support me are listed there as always.
• 5:38
  So let's hear a quick word from our friends and family at
• 5:41
  Vialvitir Workshop and when we come back, we will be welcoming
• 5:47
  Bradley to the show for the first time.
• 5:49
  So let's get things going. The Alvateer Workshop is
• 5:53
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• 5:57
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• 6:24
  All right folks, well, here we are joined with like I mentioned
• 6:27
  in the intro, this is Bradley and he is a heathen out in
• 6:32
  Misery, Missouri, right? Yep.
• 6:36
  Yeah. So the the old, the old show me
• 6:38
  state. I got another another heathen
• 6:40
  from from the Show me state course.
• 6:42
  You probably know Patrick Walsh or I've seen him on the show a
• 6:45
  few times and knows what you know what he does.
• 6:48
  He's out there and in in Missouri too.
• 6:50
  So here we go we got another Missouri yen I believe you guys
• 6:53
  are called. So welcome to the show Bradley.
• 6:55
  Thanks for coming. I actually live like couple
• 6:59
  hours away from Patrick, not too far away.
• 7:02
  Oh really? Yeah, not too far.
• 7:05
  I think he's like 3 1/2 hours from him.
• 7:08
  OK. Yeah.
• 7:08
  That's not bad at all. That's a that's a good, you
• 7:12
  know, afternoon or or yeah. Good old.
• 7:14
  Day trip? Yeah.
• 7:16
  Good little day trip. You guys haven't met up
• 7:19
  personally though, right? No, not yet.
• 7:21
  We almost did during the Heil Hung concert, but he went to the
• 7:27
  Saint Louis one and I went to the Kansas City one.
• 7:30
  So. You were probably closer because
• 7:32
  I think the one where he went, he was only like 20 minutes or
• 7:35
  so away from where. He lives, yeah.
• 7:37
  For you, you were probably you're probably closer to the
• 7:39
  Kansas City. Yeah, I'm like an hour and a
• 7:42
  half from Kansas City. Yeah, that makes sense.
• 7:47
  Nice. You've lived there your whole
• 7:48
  life. Yeah, good portion of it.
• 7:52
  Moved around quite a bit when I was a kid and stuff because my
• 7:54
  dad was a contract truck driver, so we kind of moved around
• 7:59
  whenever he moved companies. But the other than that like big
• 8:03
  huge portion of has been here in Missouri.
• 8:05
  I'd say I've been here probably like 17 years consecutively.
• 8:10
  Yeah, I've been there, been there a number of times for
• 8:15
  work. We used to stay.
• 8:18
  I want to try and remember somewhere outside of.
• 8:21
  I think it was maybe Fallon that that's a place, right?
• 8:25
  Fallon? Yeah, that's a place.
• 8:27
  Yeah, that's a place. I think that's where we used to
• 8:30
  stay, you know overnight. I would, you know, we were
• 8:34
  prisoner extradition, right. So we would house our inmates
• 8:36
  overnight at a jail and I think Fallon was near there or or
• 8:41
  right the the closest major like place that we could house, you
• 8:46
  know, and I say major but it wasn't like a it's not like a
• 8:49
  big big city sort of things for the country as I recall.
• 8:55
  But yeah, man, and and you ever been, or you have been even now
• 8:59
  for roughly how long, you think? I'd say probably about seven or
• 9:03
  eight years is when I've taken it serious.
• 9:06
  Altogether I'd say 10. But the first three years I was
• 9:09
  kind of like put my little toes in the water a little bit,
• 9:13
  saying if I wanted liked it or not or if it was for me.
• 9:16
  And then about four years in, I just pretty much just jumped in
• 9:21
  head first. Yeah.
• 9:23
  Now did you come into, did you come into Heathenry?
• 9:26
  And and if I'm asking questions that you'd refer not to answer,
• 9:29
  then I would totally respect that.
• 9:31
  But for everyone listening, watching, right.
• 9:33
  Like, did you come into, did you did you come into Heathenry from
• 9:38
  another like Pagan path or or was it a more traditional
• 9:43
  Christian kind of? Upbringing.
• 9:44
  I was Southern Baptist for the good first half of my life, and
• 9:50
  same with all my family. They're all Southern Baptists as
• 9:53
  well. And then, well, except for my
• 9:55
  dad. My dad was Wiccan for a little
• 9:58
  while and then for a few years, and then went N after that.
• 10:03
  And then I'd say my dad was practicing for maybe 10 years.
• 10:08
  And then I started like asking questions pretty much.
• 10:12
  And just a lot of stuff that my dad was saying was making sense
• 10:15
  and kind of clicked with me. And then I started doing my own
• 10:20
  practices and have my own personal experiences with the
• 10:22
  gods and especially the ancestors and stuff.
• 10:25
  And I never had a reaction with a spirituality or a path the way
• 10:30
  I have with Norse Pagan paganism.
• 10:34
  So it was really. I don't know.
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  I've grown a lot myself since I've left my old faith, for
• 10:41
  sure. Yeah, I think a lot of people do
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  too. When you when you, whether it's
• 10:48
  Norse, Heathenry or or whatever. I mean if if you were maybe
• 10:52
  brought up or raised in a certain way and then reach a
• 10:54
  point in in their lives where they you know kind of explore
• 11:00
  other options or at least try to let you know learn more about
• 11:04
  other things when it when it calls to you and when it really
• 11:07
  kind of hits the the nail on the head, you start seeing things
• 11:12
  change for yourselves. You know, for ourselves and our
• 11:15
  lives, right when we start feeling like we're doing
• 11:18
  something that is more authentic or genuine to the type of person
• 11:22
  that we are, you can't help but definitely notice those changes.
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  And I think it's great too that you have a a family member who's
• 11:31
  so close. You know, your dad who found a,
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  you know, like you say you know Wiccan into Norse paganism and
• 11:43
  then it took a while before you found it yourself.
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  It wasn't like he found and then was like, hey guys, do what I
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  do. Like he wasn't.
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  At least it doesn't sound like he was trying to influence or
• 11:56
  push you into doing what he was doing.
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  It was find it for yourself. Is that that be accurate or?
• 12:03
  Yeah, absolutely. Yeah.
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  My dad's was a very open minded in that sense where people could
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  as long as your belief doesn't go out of its way to hurt or
• 12:15
  demonize or put down anybody else.
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  My dad was very open with anybody believing whatever they
• 12:22
  wanted as long as it wasn't hurt, nobody else and what's in
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  anybody else's business type of attitude towards it.
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  So, and it definitely helped. Sorry.
• 12:33
  I know you go you. Go ahead.
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  So like throughout my childhood and stuff, even though like my
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  mom and all of her side of the family were very Southern
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  Baptist and obviously if anybody that's either Southern Baptist
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  or knows anything about them and they don't really take
• 12:52
  witchcraft or anything like that lightly at all, like my
• 12:56
  grandmother and grandfather Harry Potter, that's Wizards and
• 13:01
  witchcraft. That's double work.
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  And so like it was that kind of mentality.
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  So when my dad came out as Wiccan at 1st and everything,
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  there was definitely some pushback from my family on it
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  and everything and whatnot. So but with my dad's mindset and
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  stuff, it kind of like influenced my mom's side of the
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  family pretty heavily on like you know, maybe we should take a
• 13:24
  step back and not be so hard on like our viewpoints and stuff
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  and kind of like just light lessen it up a little bit.
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  And so yeah, it was definitely a good dynamic growing up.
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  Like it's it was good. Like, I don't know.
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  I can't really say anything else about it.
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  Like most people around, like because I still live in my
• 13:46
  childhood town. Like I live a couple miles
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  outside of it and like that's you have 1-2 churches and the
• 13:54
  town is divided between those two churches.
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  So like that's you either Catholic or you're Southern
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  Baptist in the town. So growing up in that dynamic,
• 14:05
  there is definitely a heavy Christian base.
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  But with the way my family viewed things and everything, I
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  was able to when I was a Southern Baptist, I was able to
• 14:16
  practice that faith. But also they gave me the
• 14:19
  opportunity to be curious of others and let me read about
• 14:24
  them and stuff like that. So when when I dad came out to
• 14:29
  the rest of them like that, it definitely made it easier for me
• 14:31
  to ask my dad questions and stuff and without anybody
• 14:34
  telling me otherwise. So did you ever see your dad do
• 14:39
  things in his practices? You know, was it like a, you
• 14:43
  know, an altar or or ritual or anything that or was he pretty
• 14:49
  like did he did he keep it more in like private to himself with
• 14:54
  so that way didn't like stir the pot or how was that?
• 14:57
  For a few years, yeah. My dad would have a room in his
• 15:02
  house where he'd keep all of his altar stuff and everything, and
• 15:06
  he'll be in that room. And for the first couple of
• 15:09
  years there was a lock on the room and that was to keep us out
• 15:12
  because he didn't want to make my mom mad or anything like
• 15:14
  that. But after a few years, I'm
• 15:17
  assuming that the grown-ups had a conversation and then the lock
• 15:21
  was brought off and then eventually the door was tooken
• 15:23
  down to where we could just go in as we wanted and just look
• 15:27
  through stuff. And then eventually my dad was
• 15:30
  did a few rituals and then taught me how to meditate and do
• 15:33
  guided meditations and stuff like that.
• 15:36
  So it was definitely my dad helped me a lot during the my
• 15:40
  beginning transitions on, kind of giving me the tools I needed
• 15:43
  to explore myself pretty much instead of relying on a God or
• 15:48
  something to kind of tell me what I should expect out of
• 15:50
  myself, help me find it himself. Yeah.
• 15:55
  Well, I think with the like the topic we're going to be going
• 15:58
  over today, the influence is a thing, right?
• 16:02
  Like, so we're going to be talking about the influences
• 16:05
  that like pop culture in the media or whatnot can have on
• 16:10
  Heathenry specifically. I mean, I'm sure there's other
• 16:13
  examples, but like, you know, you mentioned the the whole
• 16:16
  Harry Potter thing and how that is.
• 16:19
  It's fiction. I mean it's it's, you know, but
• 16:22
  but clearly it has an influence on the way certain people view
• 16:28
  things that don't agree with their beliefs, right?
• 16:33
  And I think it's great that in the midst of things like that
• 16:38
  that have such a a strong influence that will say on
• 16:42
  people's mindset and views that you had the opportunity to be
• 16:48
  stoned something or or or maybe shown you know ways to do things
• 16:52
  with family traditions what have you that we're we're we're
• 16:57
  genuine. You know like it's not like we
• 16:59
  watch we watch this you know movie, you know where we watch
• 17:03
  the you know a couple of episodes of Vikings or something
• 17:06
  or the Last Kingdom or whatever. You know Hollywood take on
• 17:12
  things based our belief on just that.
• 17:17
  You know, like there seems to, from the way you're describing
• 17:19
  it, the the influence that you received was from a very inner
• 17:24
  circle. Yeah, whatever.
• 17:29
  And like those movies and stuff, they're good at the point of
• 17:34
  drawing attention to to us and everything as like a community
• 17:37
  and group. But if like you're watching the
• 17:40
  Vikings or The Last Kingdom, for example, both are very good
• 17:44
  shows, but their shows and they could maybe bring up some like,
• 17:53
  questions or something that someone may have.
• 17:55
  And then if they want to like, say, pursue this spiritual path
• 17:58
  and whatnot, yeah, I'm glad that the Vikings is there to kind of
• 18:02
  like ignite that flame, so to speak.
• 18:05
  But they need to, probably. My advice to especially, I guess
• 18:10
  baby Pagans, is if you're coming off in from those shows, don't
• 18:15
  take those shows as historical documents.
• 18:18
  Take them as like inspiration or something that you could inspire
• 18:22
  from, But also use like the sagas and archaeological finds
• 18:27
  to kind of back up what the show may or may not be putting out.
• 18:31
  Yeah, yeah, definitely. I'm, you know, I'm, I'm, I'm
• 18:36
  very into, like historical information and I wouldn't call
• 18:41
  myself like a historical Recon key.
• 18:44
  Then for anyone listening, watching that doesn't know what
• 18:47
  I mean. You know, there's definitely
• 18:49
  approaches to take in paganism in general.
• 18:53
  And this isn't just in, you know, like the Germanic or the
• 18:55
  Norse favorite, you know, style or or whatever you want to call
• 19:01
  it. There's Reconstructionists in
• 19:03
  all ads, you know what I mean? And but I like to go into the
• 19:09
  historical stuff just to see what we can find, what has been
• 19:13
  discovered, what scholars have been able to come up with,
• 19:16
  whether it's through language studies or anthropology and and
• 19:22
  other stuff like that. Because I think having a
• 19:27
  knowledge and having an understanding of those things
• 19:31
  can help us continue and and build into you know you got to
• 19:37
  have some you got to have a foundation to start with and you
• 19:42
  know the one of the I think I'll just say personally you know I
• 19:47
  think one of the problems that exist with modern pagans today
• 19:51
  is that there isn't enough of that.
• 19:53
  There's not too many people are, you know, going to watch a few
• 20:01
  movies or you know several seasons of a show or something
• 20:05
  and like base their. Spirituality off of that.
• 20:10
  They're not reading the, that is not reading the sagas.
• 20:13
  They're not, you know, doing any sort of research.
• 20:16
  And I'm not saying that you have to be a reconstructionist
• 20:19
  hardcore to experience what this path is about or or any of the
• 20:23
  other you know, whether they're polytheistic or henotheistic
• 20:27
  paths you're you're. I think you're just missing out
• 20:30
  on what can what can happen for for you if you're just totally
• 20:35
  abandoning any of the source material.
• 20:38
  I think at least in in in since we're talking about Heathenry.
• 20:41
  I think also true nowadays is I think that's a big I think
• 20:47
  there's a lot of fault there with with the modern also true
• 20:51
  movement is there's not enough focus on where this all came
• 20:57
  from and and sure while the sagas might be you know stories
• 21:03
  in and of themselves right things that get embellished on
• 21:06
  because of reasons still at least close to you know what we
• 21:12
  have from that time period of of how and the things that that the
• 21:18
  people were doing their world views right.
• 21:20
  All that stuff I think is, is, is.
• 21:23
  Part of it, but I just pulled this book out that's sitting
• 21:26
  next to me. This is a book that I read to my
• 21:28
  kids. I don't know if you can see it
• 21:30
  on the camera, but this is just a little children's book and
• 21:35
  like some of the questions they have because they got their
• 21:38
  mothers brains unfortunately. So they get a lot of questions
• 21:41
  when I read the stories and you know how some of the stories
• 21:45
  will have like let's say you use the I can't, I can't pronounce
• 21:49
  her name, but the cow in the creation story.
• 21:54
  Oh yeah, yeah. Yeah.
• 21:56
  And like, they had a question about that.
• 21:58
  And I just explained to the the way I explained to the kids was
• 22:01
  is that the stories are myths and legends and stuff, and
• 22:06
  they're up for interpretation. Like there's no, like really any
• 22:09
  single way to interpret them. They can deviate from person to
• 22:12
  person or tribe from tribe. But the way I explained to them
• 22:17
  was it's like in the stories and everything there's there, like
• 22:22
  the Norse in general are very good at telling stories.
• 22:26
  I was like, if you go and tell a story of like, say a great
• 22:29
  battle or something like that, there's probably going to be
• 22:32
  some truth to it, but they're going to kind of put a little
• 22:35
  flair on it just a little bit just to get more people's
• 22:38
  attention and to get more people to tell the story.
• 22:41
  I was like, so each story is gonna have maybe a little quirks
• 22:44
  or something in the story that's gonna really catch your
• 22:47
  attention. And that's probably just so that
• 22:50
  way you'll retell the story and you know, just stuff like that.
• 22:55
  But like and with thankfully with like stuff like this in
• 23:00
  modern times and everything like we're able to, they could see
• 23:04
  like images and prints and actual words of the gods and
• 23:08
  stuff. So then if I don't say it right
• 23:11
  or if they don't hear it right, they can go to it and look, look
• 23:14
  it up themselves. And I and I definitely encourage
• 23:18
  that 100%. Yeah.
• 23:21
  What was the name of that book, by the way?
• 23:22
  Because the first people that are the listening platforms.
• 23:25
  It's the child's introduction to Norse mythology and it's it's a
• 23:30
  very well illustrated book and I've read it a couple times
• 23:32
  before I read it to them just to make sure there's not any crazy
• 23:35
  stuff in it, but like almost all of the pictures and stuff are
• 23:40
  like hand painted, like illustrations and everything.
• 23:44
  So like has all kinds of creatures and stuff like here's
• 23:48
  Thor and Loki in it. Yeah.
• 23:53
  Like, and then in the back of the book it also has the room
• 23:58
  table and all kinds of other stuff that you could give the
• 24:01
  kids. So that way they can kind of
• 24:02
  practice on their own and everything.
• 24:06
  And it comes with a poster. They have a poster and they're
• 24:08
  hanging up in the room with the it's like a this shows you
• 24:12
  drusill and then it has like all the gods going down in in like a
• 24:15
  family tree format. So you can kind of guide them
• 24:18
  through because it can get a little confusing sometimes on
• 24:20
  who's actually related to who throughout the myths and stuff,
• 24:23
  so. Yeah, for sure.
• 24:26
  That's another thing that that, you know folks that are new to
• 24:32
  the past and stuff, if they're coming into it from Marvel,
• 24:38
  right, the Marvel Universe, Thor and Loki, right.
• 24:41
  Like that's a big one. Like they are not brothers.
• 24:43
  Like that's that's that's the Marvel mythos, you know like
• 24:47
  that's the Marvel Universe where they're brothers and stuff.
• 24:49
  They are not, they are not brothers.
• 24:51
  They're. They're not even.
• 24:54
  No, not even with the same blood, right?
• 24:57
  They are companions in in several of the of the like
• 25:01
  Thor's you know journeys and stuff and his adventures like
• 25:04
  Loki goes along as a companion and and some of them but they're
• 25:09
  not brothers like like that is represented in in in Marvel.
• 25:13
  So to to take, you know that as as as one of the other examples
• 25:18
  of how pop culture can misrepresent and influence
• 25:23
  incorrectly how people, you know, look at things, view
• 25:26
  things, but like you had said, you know it does plant a seed.
• 25:32
  Yeah, and Marvel definitely does.
• 25:36
  Heavy on the misrepresentation. Pretty bad.
• 25:41
  Yeah, like. Some of their movies like their
• 25:43
  Their movies are good, but coming from a N perspective,
• 25:48
  it's definitely a little cringe sometimes.
• 25:52
  For sure. I mean, you could almost you
• 25:53
  could almost rewrite the characters with different names
• 25:57
  and it's be just as entertaining, you know, instead
• 26:01
  of. For sure.
• 26:03
  Calling Thor, Loki, Odin, you know and and having them
• 26:07
  represented in in the way that they are, I would agree.
• 26:11
  You know it's like you got to definitely take that for what it
• 26:14
  is And and some of the some of the things that I've even
• 26:17
  encountered I don't know if you have as well with people who
• 26:20
  have no interest in pursuing Heathenry as their religion or
• 26:26
  as their path you know spirituality what have you.
• 26:28
  They they see things like the hammer that we wear or they hear
• 26:34
  about, you know, well I believe, you know in the Norse gods and
• 26:38
  they're like oh, you mean like like Marvel, like Thor and Loki
• 26:41
  and Odin. It's like the names.
• 26:43
  Yes. That no.
• 26:45
  Like, yeah, that's not, that's not the religious side of it.
• 26:48
  That's not the spiritual side of it.
• 26:52
  Or they'll also go, oh, so you think you're a Viking like you.
• 26:57
  That's a Viking religion. I'm like also no.
• 27:01
  Right. Do you ever get that from
• 27:03
  people? As it ever happened, all the
• 27:04
  time, I had a guy that I used to work with at this old company I
• 27:09
  worked at. And 'cause I wore, I wear my
• 27:12
  nail nor almost everywhere and even at work.
• 27:15
  And so I'll, I had it out. And then he noticed it and he's
• 27:21
  like, oh, he's like, is that Mjolnor?
• 27:23
  And I'm like, yeah. And he's like right on.
• 27:24
  And we went into like a pretty good conversation.
• 27:27
  I thought, like, oh wow, I'm working with another Norse guy
• 27:30
  now. Then, like, couple weeks went by
• 27:32
  and he had his own mjolnor and everything.
• 27:34
  And I was like, so when did you start practicing A heathen
• 27:37
  rating? He's like, what?
• 27:38
  What's heathen? Right.
• 27:40
  And I was like, what are you wearing?
• 27:42
  I was like with Neil Noir and everything.
• 27:44
  And he's like, oh, he's like, no, he's like, I just got this
• 27:47
  because of, I think it was The Last Kingdom.
• 27:50
  And then he's like, and also really like Thor from Marvel is
• 27:53
  what he went off of. And I'm just like, and I'm
• 27:57
  pretty much just, I was like, OK, I was like, well, I was
• 28:02
  like, you enjoy that necklace. Then buddy And I just walked
• 28:04
  away. Yep, Yep.
• 28:08
  I've seen that in a number of times though.
• 28:10
  It's it's like a fashion statement.
• 28:13
  People just like it, 'cause it looks cool, you know?
• 28:17
  And I don't know, like I try not to get to butt heard about stuff
• 28:21
  like that. When it comes to people that
• 28:23
  admittedly are like, no, I don't know nothing about that, but I
• 28:27
  just like the way it looks. And you know, but definitely a
• 28:31
  part of me, a part of me is like, then you know, I I don't
• 28:35
  know, like I look at it in a way.
• 28:37
  Like I am not a Christian and I wouldn't wear a cross as a
• 28:44
  fashion statement. I wouldn't wear it, 'cause I
• 28:46
  think it looks me that's like that is a symbol that is
• 28:50
  associated with a religion that I don't practice anymore.
• 28:54
  I don't follow that worldview on things.
• 28:57
  So why would I wear a symbol that that associates me with
• 29:01
  that, you know, and in similar fashion I go, well, sure, it
• 29:05
  might look cool, but if you don't believe in what that
• 29:08
  symbol represents and you don't hold any focus on on that in
• 29:12
  your spiritual life, religious life, whatever, then don't wear
• 29:17
  it. Like it's kind of again, I
• 29:21
  don't, I don't go out and just bash people for wearing it if
• 29:25
  they're not Pagan or they're not heathen.
• 29:28
  But it, you know, a little part of me in the back of my mind's
• 29:30
  going, take that off, you know? Like yeah dude that's the exact
• 29:34
  thought that went through my head.
• 29:35
  But yeah whenever I first like started converting and like
• 29:39
  taking it serious I was very like defensive over it.
• 29:43
  I would say like because I had a couple Co workers wearing
• 29:48
  versions of the meal noir and my other work and they were
• 29:51
  straight up were honest with me and I that's.
• 29:54
  I think that's why I was a little bit cooler with it is
• 29:56
  because they knew what I practiced and they did like my
• 29:59
  meal noir so that I wore because I used to have like a collection
• 30:02
  back then. And so they liked them.
• 30:05
  So they went and got their own, which I was OK with that.
• 30:08
  But I asked them, I was like, if you're going to wear it, I'm
• 30:10
  like, can I ask this One basic thing for you guys is just to
• 30:13
  respect it. And I was like it.
• 30:16
  I'm like, wear it because they're a Christian.
• 30:18
  I was like, wear it as if you're actually wearing a cross.
• 30:21
  I was like, don't treat it bad. And I'm like, and if you're
• 30:24
  wearing it in view, I'm like, just present yourself.
• 30:27
  Well, and I was like, and then I was like that that would be OK
• 30:30
  with me because they're pretty much asking if it would be OK
• 30:34
  for them to wear it. So I was like, well, if they're
• 30:36
  asking me if there's conditions, I was like, boy, let me set
• 30:39
  them. So type, yeah, it's a good.
• 30:43
  I used to have but. Yeah no.
• 30:47
  And I wonder too if that if there's a any degree of
• 30:51
  responsibility on on folks in anymore to and I'm just talking
• 30:57
  out loud like I don't you know one way or the other you know
• 30:59
  coming up with an answer at the moment but a sense of
• 31:02
  responsibility that we have as actual practitioners of a
• 31:07
  Germanic or Teutonic path whatever you know label you want
• 31:10
  to put to it is is again is to be that sort of representative
• 31:17
  or or spokesperson maybe is the wrong term but you know what I'm
• 31:20
  trying to say like yeah if you see it's you see it being worn
• 31:23
  and and it's not actually being worn by someone who practices a
• 31:29
  a Germanic pre Christian belief to at least educate so much as
• 31:34
  like hey look you know there's really nothing that we have as
• 31:37
  as dogma that would prohibit you from wearing this if you're not
• 31:41
  he then if you're not taking it. However, I kind of in the
• 31:44
  fashion that you took was to maybe just educate and say hey
• 31:47
  look at least you know carry this with you know and be be
• 31:56
  respectful about it. It's not.
• 31:58
  And who knows if that you know, it may not change their minds in
• 32:02
  terms of well, let me find out what this is and become Pagan or
• 32:07
  Heat. However, it might change the
• 32:09
  perspective of. Them.
• 32:12
  This actually means something, and I shouldn't just wear this
• 32:14
  as a fashion statement. I should, you know maybe not be
• 32:17
  so cavalier about it. And I think one of the other
• 32:22
  things that we've seen to it may not be like a pop culture
• 32:25
  influence. But you know people who really
• 32:28
  take that you know the symbology of it seriously to to to to the
• 32:35
  other extreme where they'd be like you can't wear.
• 32:37
  That's my symbol, right? Like that's our symbol.
• 32:40
  They claim these symbols as as as part of their culture and a
• 32:45
  part of their heritage. And you know while I understand
• 32:48
  like these symbols are like native to a certain area and
• 32:51
  they've they've they they came out of certain parts of the
• 32:54
  world and have become synonymous with certain cultures.
• 32:58
  I don't think, I don't think we can rightfully say that you
• 33:01
  know, wearing a Mulliner, if you're not heathen or if you're
• 33:05
  not European, northern European ancestry like wearing a Mulliner
• 33:09
  is going to you know make someone mad or make the gods mad
• 33:13
  or any such thing like that. Like that's that's not fair to
• 33:16
  say either. I think that's a misrepresent
• 33:19
  too, that that can be seen people that are like, you know,
• 33:24
  because it makes me feel like not inclusive.
• 33:27
  And that's another thing too, is with the pop culture stuff.
• 33:31
  Whenever I first was coming into like practicing full, like, I'd
• 33:35
  say full time air quotes. But when I started taking it
• 33:40
  like seriously, pop culture did influence me quite a bit out the
• 33:45
  gate whenever I was like really deep diving into it and stuff.
• 33:49
  And at the time, like Vikings just come out.
• 33:52
  So I wasn't even really watching that yet.
• 33:54
  But the last Kingdom I had been watching, I've been watching
• 33:58
  that for some time during that time and you know, some of the
• 34:02
  stuff that they were doing and everything.
• 34:04
  And then I got into the Vikings, and then it was leading me down
• 34:07
  through all of this, all these rabbit holes and stuff.
• 34:10
  And then it took me, I think like two years in order for me
• 34:13
  to get the actual, like religious holidays correct.
• 34:18
  Because like there's so many like websites and other
• 34:23
  organizations out there that pretty much copy and paste a
• 34:27
  Wiccan holidays and then just rewrite the names and then put
• 34:31
  them online as facts. And it took me a long time to
• 34:34
  navigate through those and figure out what's true and
• 34:36
  what's not true. And like for you'll, for
• 34:39
  example, that two years ago or no, three years ago is when I
• 34:43
  realized that Yule wasn't actually in December.
• 34:47
  That's how long it took me to realize that.
• 34:50
  And I think it was either you or Olafson that educated me on
• 34:56
  that. It was one of you two, really.
• 34:58
  I know that. I think I was probably, yeah.
• 35:04
  I think I was probably several years into my Pagan journey, you
• 35:09
  know, before I became knowledgeable of the fact that
• 35:13
  yeah, pre Christian Heathen Yule happens at a time that is not
• 35:20
  during the winter solstice. It doesn't happen.
• 35:22
  It's not 12 nights, you know? Talked about it a lot on this
• 35:27
  podcast and other episodes and and have shared a lot of
• 35:31
  information on the YouTube channel, on the Facebook page
• 35:34
  and then other platforms as well about it.
• 35:38
  And yeah, it took me a few years into my studies, into my path to
• 35:44
  discover that as well. Just because again, you Google
• 35:48
  it, you know, or even you old or something, you know, it's it's
• 35:52
  going to tell you and it's going to line up more with when the
• 35:56
  solstice, the winter solstice is that it starts on the winter
• 36:00
  solstice and it's 12 nights. And every night of those 12
• 36:04
  nights is dedicated to certain things.
• 36:05
  And like then that's how I started my practices around
• 36:09
  because that's what I thought was it was real that that was
• 36:13
  authentic. And so similarly like it took,
• 36:16
  it took a while for me to come across the articles and start
• 36:21
  doing my own research and learning and pursuing an
• 36:25
  interest in in trying to be authentic you know or or
• 36:30
  observing. And I don't, I don't fault
• 36:31
  people for, you know, like I've said before, if if if you want
• 36:36
  to observe your holy days, you know, and your celebrations and
• 36:41
  all that at a time, well, you know, let's say it's Yule,
• 36:45
  right. And let's say you want to do,
• 36:46
  you know, 12 nights of Yule and it's going to be in December
• 36:48
  following the solstice. But that's what you want to do
• 36:51
  and that's what's been your practice and your tradition to
• 36:54
  do and it's been working, then I guess rock on with it, right.
• 36:58
  I think it's more like information like, OK, but
• 37:01
  realize right, if we're talking from an authentic historical
• 37:04
  background of things, that that is not the actual time when pre
• 37:09
  Christian German the Germanic peoples observed their Yule
• 37:15
  celebration. See, like with my own home, we
• 37:21
  practice both the Christian Christmas and then we also
• 37:24
  practice. Yule and I talked to you in the
• 37:27
  comments and stuff on your Facebook and everything about
• 37:29
  it. So I'll go ahead and reiterate
• 37:31
  it here like the way we do it and and just to pretty much
• 37:37
  condense it from having Yule in January and then having
• 37:41
  Christmas in December and just having a pretty much a really
• 37:44
  long celebration, we decided to for, especially for the kids,
• 37:49
  just to have them pretty close together.
• 37:51
  We'll have Christmas on the 25th, and normally about 26th or
• 37:54
  27th is when we'll do our Yule and we'll do and we'll do crafts
• 38:00
  and stuff on Yule and everything like that.
• 38:02
  But the reason why we decided to do them so close together is
• 38:05
  because, like I said, most of my family's Baptist and stuff.
• 38:09
  So we'll go and celebrate Christmas at their house and
• 38:13
  everything, and then when we get home we'll pretty much have a
• 38:15
  day of rest from Christmas and then we'll go into our Yule
• 38:19
  celebrations following that. And normally that'll that'll
• 38:22
  last a couple of days and then all age will be done.
• 38:26
  Yeah, which is great. I mean like that's a family
• 38:30
  tradition and I think more, more, more of that is is
• 38:34
  something that gets overlooked. You know what I mean nowadays is
• 38:37
  that sense of preserving family traditions and and and keeping
• 38:43
  those members alive and and doing things I guess like I
• 38:47
  mentioned are are working well for that's that that group of
• 38:51
  people whether it's a family or whether it's a small kindred or
• 38:54
  tribe, whatever that works for them.
• 38:58
  And for whatever reason. You know whether it's just the
• 39:01
  time frame of things right. Everybody's off and you get the
• 39:04
  chance to get everybody together and it just makes justical sense
• 39:08
  to do at that time. Or if it just has become so much
• 39:11
  of A deeply rooted tradition in the family unit that it you
• 39:15
  know, why change it just for the sake of you know?
• 39:21
  We started this early on when my oldest was maybe like two or
• 39:26
  three because we were before that we were just celebrating
• 39:30
  Yule and then like my mom and my grandmother and stuff was having
• 39:36
  concerns because they were kind of were feeling left out and
• 39:39
  everything. And then Mercedes, which is my
• 39:43
  wife, was telling me that why can't we do both?
• 39:47
  And I was like, well, there's nothing that I've read so far
• 39:49
  that says we can't do both my religion.
• 39:51
  So I was like and then we, you know, we're talking about school
• 39:57
  and the area that we live in and stuff and we just felt like our
• 39:59
  kids might feel more included with their friends and
• 40:02
  everything if we also did Christmas as well.
• 40:05
  And but then we didn't tell them the whole like what Christmas is
• 40:10
  around from the Christian perspective, we just pretty much
• 40:12
  said Santa brings gifts. Like, that's pretty much as far
• 40:15
  as into the Christmas lore we went into with them.
• 40:19
  Yeah. But I mean it's worked like.
• 40:24
  Yeah, we do stuff like that too here.
• 40:25
  I mean we've got, you know, a lot of my wife's family, Well,
• 40:30
  all of my wife's family, her immediate family are definitely
• 40:34
  not Pagan. So there's always, you know,
• 40:37
  Christmas dinner and and you know gift giving and and and
• 40:40
  stuff around that time of year. So there's again there's no
• 40:42
  reason to stop that and and and but yeah we we we for a while
• 40:50
  now have kept our Yuletide celebrations are on the the pre
• 40:56
  Christian reckoning of it and that's a fun thing too.
• 40:59
  You know, learning about, you know, when it was is is
• 41:04
  relatively easy to to learn and and find out how it was done is
• 41:08
  another story, you know. And that's that's where I go
• 41:11
  back to, you know, making your own traditions and making your
• 41:14
  own, keeping your own traditions alive because that's what's
• 41:19
  important. It's, you know, we we, we really
• 41:20
  don't have anything that specifically gives an example of
• 41:24
  how it was celebrated. I mean, yes, there was bloat for
• 41:28
  three days that or there was, you know, it was a three day
• 41:31
  long thing. We know that the bloat was done
• 41:35
  on the first night of Yule. We know that there were, you
• 41:40
  know, mentions of, you know, it was hell for three days or until
• 41:44
  the ale was gone or something like that.
• 41:46
  You know what I mean? Yeah.
• 41:46
  Something. Like that.
• 41:47
  There was a lot of drinking, right?
• 41:49
  We know that there were gifts exchanged, there was oaths sworn
• 41:53
  there, you know, certain things like that that have become part
• 41:57
  of our traditions as well, right?
• 41:58
  We exchange gifts. We we give the opportunity for
• 42:01
  oaths to be sworn in the tribe. If there's ever one time of year
• 42:05
  that an oath could be particularly potent, it's at
• 42:09
  Yule, you know, definitely so. But all the other little
• 42:13
  idiosyncrasies, you know, I think are are more important to
• 42:16
  be developed at the, you know, smaller level, right?
• 42:20
  You know, don't. Don't really go too far deep
• 42:22
  into trying to find, well, how did they do it?
• 42:24
  You're probably not going to find anything.
• 42:27
  You know how the families did it or whatever, you know?
• 42:31
  No, definitely not. Especially not after like the
• 42:35
  reckoning that you were referring to.
• 42:37
  That happened when we lost a lot of, if anything, the stuff that
• 42:41
  we did have written down, we lost a lot of it.
• 42:44
  Now we're just kind of like trying to put puzzle pieces
• 42:46
  together and. Yeah, so much of precisely and
• 42:51
  so much of what was written happened after the fact.
• 42:55
  I mean even primary and and primary and secondary sources
• 43:00
  that we have written down or written by Christians.
• 43:07
  I mean that you know sure they may have had knowledge and and
• 43:11
  experience with certain of the pre Christian heathen traditions
• 43:15
  right. The the indigenous Pagan
• 43:17
  practices of the time. Yeah he had knowledge, but it
• 43:20
  was it was all written down by Christians and and probably well
• 43:25
  maybe more than probably but you know, definitely had bias
• 43:29
  Christian bias inserted into. Oh, heavily, yeah.
• 43:33
  And also too right? I know one of the one of the
• 43:38
  people that gets cited for when the months, you know, when when
• 43:44
  the people held certain things on on certain months, the
• 43:47
  venerable bead. I mean he was definitely
• 43:49
  Christian and he was also writing things down, you know
• 43:53
  200 years after Heathenry became kind of like like got wiped out
• 44:00
  right. So he definitely wasn't even
• 44:02
  immediately. It's like us now and and and in
• 44:06
  the Americas or in North America when like the Revolutionary War
• 44:09
  was happening like we it's far enough back where like what do
• 44:16
  you have really to to offer to think I'm sure we have some
• 44:20
  words that were spoken right orally passed down and that's
• 44:23
  that's that's how you mentioned earlier storytelling and and
• 44:27
  stuff. Everything was spoken.
• 44:29
  It was it was an oral tradition. It wasn't.
• 44:31
  We write this down in the book and then pass it down to my kids
• 44:34
  and their kids after them and all this.
• 44:36
  It was all, you know, what did grandpa say?
• 44:38
  What a great grandpa say you know and and so that's how
• 44:42
  things were were passed down and if if it didn't get passed down
• 44:46
  after a certain point then it got it got lost you know which
• 44:51
  is another thing about pop culture and then the influence
• 44:54
  that it has. I mean you mentioned earlier the
• 45:01
  holidays and and and how it's like they're they're copying
• 45:05
  from Wiccan Sabbats you know the the and then just placing like
• 45:10
  Norse name or something over it And that happened like very
• 45:14
  recently by Steven Mcnallan and he and he was Wiccan you know so
• 45:21
  he was the one he's one of the reasons why also true now is is
• 45:27
  stuck in this you know observing holy tides using the Wiccan
• 45:32
  wheel of the year as its model. He's the reason why that that
• 45:36
  happened, you know, or or a big reason why that happened.
• 45:41
  And the fact was, I'm not. I don't know if you want me to
• 45:44
  like name organizations on here because I have some beef with
• 45:47
  some of them. But like several of these big
• 45:51
  organizations know that they're wrong and they don't care that
• 45:56
  they're wrong. Like, like, take TAC for
• 46:01
  example, one of the biggest ones, They've even called
• 46:05
  themselves out a couple times. Like, yeah, we know it's not
• 46:07
  correct, but what can we do about it?
• 46:10
  It's kind of like the attitude that they gave when discussing
• 46:13
  the holidays and stuff like that.
• 46:16
  They just weren't going to correct it.
• 46:18
  And they have like all these members that are going to pick
• 46:21
  that up and then spread it through their own tribes and
• 46:25
  their own communities locally. And it's just a bunch of it's
• 46:28
  like pumping out misinformation faster than anybody that actual
• 46:33
  experience that knows better can fight it.
• 46:38
  Yeah, it's a very small sub subset of the of the Pagan
• 46:43
  population, right. I mean, yes, sure.
• 46:44
  Also True may have a bigger following now than it did you
• 46:48
  know 30 years ago because of organizations like TAC or any of
• 46:54
  the others, right. You know they because they have
• 46:58
  registries, you know they have members and and people join and
• 47:01
  and are are are kept in like a sort of registry.
• 47:04
  So there's there's this documented census in a way that
• 47:07
  keeps track of who's associated with this organization and that.
• 47:12
  But I think in general if if you break it down even further to
• 47:18
  anyone that's genuine about you know for and see they're also do
• 47:22
  old ways type practices that that is an even smaller group
• 47:28
  they're they're they're they're not there aren't any
• 47:30
  organizations are no big time organizations because they don't
• 47:34
  want to be that they're they don't want to be they don't want
• 47:36
  to have this national presence this this overarching almost
• 47:42
  authority over the Pagan population.
• 47:45
  You know, right. One of the one I think one of
• 47:48
  the downfalls of tack is there is so universalist about things
• 47:57
  and I'm not trying to say that that's that that to be non
• 48:00
  inclusive is wrong. Is is is the way to be or or not
• 48:03
  to be. It's it's what I mean by that is
• 48:05
  that it's it's it's if you're not going to take ownership of
• 48:10
  the traditions of a certain time and of a certain place and then
• 48:13
  from a certain area and try to be authentic to that.
• 48:16
  And just like you they say you know, well we were wrong but
• 48:18
  what are we going to do about it?
• 48:19
  Well you can correct it. You can you can redact
• 48:22
  everything that you said that was wrong.
• 48:23
  You can correct yourself. You can fix it.
• 48:28
  You don't just have to keep spouting out stuff that then
• 48:31
  everybody else is gonna pick up and and continue to spread.
• 48:34
  And I wonder if that's a bigger problem than the pop culture
• 48:37
  influences, right, 'cause that's what we know that, we know that.
• 48:41
  That's what I think. It kind of feeds into each
• 48:43
  other, honestly. I think pop culture because when
• 48:46
  I was a part of tact and everything when I first like was
• 48:50
  converting and that's what led me to it's been a holiday
• 48:54
  debacle for the longest time is because I was getting my
• 48:56
  information from tact and being like, oh, OK, so this is when
• 49:00
  the holidays are because I mean they've been practicing longer
• 49:03
  than me. So I'm going to go ahead and
• 49:05
  take their word for it pretty much is what I was.
• 49:07
  My mindset is and or was at the time and then obviously I
• 49:12
  learned and learned from herself and everything And eventually
• 49:16
  whenever I gained all that knowledge, I ended up just
• 49:18
  leaving the organization because like I was, I would make my
• 49:21
  complaints internally and be like hey this is wrong and blah
• 49:24
  blah blah. And then I'd pretty much get
• 49:25
  bullied for like trying to educate them on like hey, you're
• 49:30
  not doing this right type thing and then they pretty much chase
• 49:33
  you out of the organization after that instead of correcting
• 49:37
  it. I've heard, I've heard you're
• 49:39
  not the first person that I've heard say have had experiences
• 49:43
  like that or that. I've heard that that was
• 49:46
  happening. So I mean.
• 49:49
  You know, but back to the I'm sorry, but back to pop culture
• 49:54
  feeding into tact, like with the religious holidays and stuff, I
• 49:58
  think pop culture influenced that.
• 50:00
  And then tact pumps it out and keeps misrepresenting.
• 50:04
  So we get misrepresented warrants in pop culture, and
• 50:08
  then it kind of trickles down into the community, and then we
• 50:12
  get risk stereotyped and misrepresented again.
• 50:15
  And then it just ends up causing the community to just fight one
• 50:18
  another on who's right and who's wrong instead of actually being
• 50:22
  able to come together and be like, oh OK, so this is what
• 50:25
  these sources say about it. Yeah, I've had to take a I've
• 50:30
  had to take a look at myself too, with being being in a
• 50:34
  position of having an influence. You know, we're talking about
• 50:38
  things influencing people's views, right?
• 50:42
  And to the way, like you were saying, you know, you, you, you
• 50:44
  become part of a group or an organization because you think
• 50:48
  I'm going to learn things that I need to learn from people who
• 50:52
  know more than me, right? These, these people have, you
• 50:56
  know, years of experience. They have credentials.
• 50:58
  They have this, they have that, you know, so they have an
• 51:00
  influence as well. I have an influence and and over
• 51:04
  the years I've had to really take that seriously.
• 51:09
  I don't, I don't know and I don't want to speak on behalf of
• 51:12
  anyone else, you know. I just, I think the, I think the
• 51:18
  actions speak for themselves. When we see that a lot, a lot of
• 51:21
  people don't take their ability to influence very seriously.
• 51:29
  It's almost like doing it to kind of be fun and entertaining
• 51:32
  and to have a have a following, right?
• 51:35
  To say that I have this X amount of followers, we have this X
• 51:38
  amount of members, you know, that whatever it's like a, it's
• 51:42
  for the clout, you know, it's for the the fame.
• 51:46
  And it's easy to fall into that trap.
• 51:51
  I'll just say it's easy to fall into that, especially when you
• 51:55
  start, you know, seeing big numbers, you know, and I'm like,
• 51:58
  wow, you know, people really like what I do.
• 52:01
  And I'm just, I'm going to keep doing the thing that they like
• 52:04
  well. Right.
• 52:05
  What if it's wrong? You know What if what you're
• 52:08
  saying is is not true? What if you're saying is not
• 52:10
  accurate? What if you're saying and doing
• 52:12
  is not genuine? What is it?
• 52:15
  What is what is it about that that people are liking, They're
• 52:19
  liking what they see, not what you truly are.
• 52:22
  And what you, you know, the authenticity is, is something.
• 52:26
  That you're not as genuine. Yeah.
• 52:29
  And I you know in genuineness and you know that that that
• 52:34
  faking your way through it or or or putting on a a mask is
• 52:39
  definitely going to get you that following.
• 52:41
  I mean entertainers and performers and stuff they they
• 52:44
  have to they have to go and switch between who they are in
• 52:48
  real life versus who they are in front of a screen.
• 52:51
  Absolutely that's not something that I ever wanted to be.
• 52:56
  It's not what I started mid guard musings for.
• 52:58
  It's not why I wanted to continue on with the podcast.
• 53:00
  It wasn't to, you know, become this Internet celebrity or, you
• 53:05
  know, have this, this great big following.
• 53:07
  Inevitably, when it starts to come though, it is a trap that's
• 53:11
  easy to fall into of. Oh yeah, you just like a honey
• 53:15
  trap. Yeah, yeah, you know, and I
• 53:19
  think the the influence that we have you know, with with people
• 53:23
  is it's it's a huge responsibility and something
• 53:26
  that we have to take seriously if we're going to continue doing
• 53:29
  these types of things. We're going to be a voice
• 53:31
  community in any sort of way sharing of information and we,
• 53:36
  we owe it to people to point them in the right direction.
• 53:41
  Absolutely. If we're out here just putting
• 53:44
  out another, you know, Marvel cosplay play you know,
• 53:53
  performance what what what value is that contributing to people
• 53:57
  that want to be genuine that want to Yeah.
• 53:59
  So where can I go? What can I look at?
• 54:02
  Because there's so much out here that I've found ultimately is is
• 54:06
  wrong. Yeah, that's another thing too,
• 54:08
  is the. Information that's out there is
• 54:10
  all jumbled together and mixed up, and it's hard to navigate
• 54:14
  that whenever you're trying to be authentic because there's 15
• 54:18
  authors all saying different things and you don't know which
• 54:21
  one's credible and which one's not.
• 54:23
  And it kind of gets hard to find those historical actual, like
• 54:29
  documents and stuff whenever people are trying to pretty much
• 54:32
  muddy the water a little bit with them.
• 54:34
  And then it just gets difficult. So like with people like
• 54:38
  thankfully like people like you and Olsen and other people in
• 54:42
  the community and everything that try to educate people on
• 54:44
  this stuff without people like you guys giving out book
• 54:49
  recommendations and stuff like this.
• 54:51
  And where you can kind of take that jumbled up mess and kind of
• 54:55
  organized it just a little bit more for people that are trying
• 54:58
  to figure out their own path, which I is very helpful for the
• 55:02
  community. I appreciate you saying.
• 55:05
  That it it's a labor of love. Come to find out it's, I mean,
• 55:10
  and that's where you know, the genuineness comes from.
• 55:13
  Is, is from love. It's it's from not wanting to do
• 55:16
  this for any other. Not not for the clout.
• 55:19
  Not for the supposed fame. You know it's for for the love
• 55:26
  of it and I, you know I don't want to say you know for
• 55:29
  everyone watching, listen and write that just because it's in
• 55:32
  pop culture is, you know it automatically makes it bogus.
• 55:36
  I've seen some pretty cool things in represented in pop
• 55:40
  culture that have reflected some, you know the the creators
• 55:45
  behind it took some effort to consult with professionals, with
• 55:50
  scholars, with linguists, with you know, you know professionals
• 55:56
  in in the industry as it were to to get a degree of authenticity
• 56:01
  to it. I think one of the examples I
• 56:02
  can think of off the top of my head was I think it was
• 56:08
  Assassin's Creed the the the most recent or one of the most
• 56:12
  recent Assassin's Creed Valhalla.
• 56:16
  Yes. I think, if I'm not mistaken,
• 56:20
  that Jackson Crawford was consulted on the Rune imagery
• 56:26
  and stuff in that game. I haven't played it and I have.
• 56:31
  I've seen some of the game play. Not granted, you know.
• 56:38
  I'm actually playing it right now.
• 56:40
  I was playing it probably like an hour and a half before this
• 56:42
  podcast started. But oh, were you really?
• 56:46
  It's a good game, yeah. But like in on another game like
• 56:50
  that too is God of War. Ragnarok is another one that's
• 56:55
  really good because like Artraeus and that one, you'll
• 56:59
  find like these big boards throughout the open world where
• 57:05
  Artraeus will walk up and he'll like read you the myths and
• 57:08
  stuff and everything. And they're accurate.
• 57:11
  They're literally almost word for word what the myth is
• 57:13
  actually is. And it gives you depictions and
• 57:16
  all kinds of other stuff like, and that's a good aspect of pop
• 57:20
  culture, like. But again, whenever you are
• 57:23
  taking stuff off pop culture for people watching and listening,
• 57:27
  please do your research too, just to make sure it it's
• 57:32
  correct. But like, I understand there's
• 57:35
  definitely a Pelantra of things out there that shine a very good
• 57:39
  light on the community and kind of break a bunch of stereotypes,
• 57:42
  honestly, for sure. And also take into consideration
• 57:47
  that it is what it is. It's, you know, it's a video
• 57:50
  game or it's a movie or it's a show.
• 57:52
  And you know, poetic license gets taken a lot.
• 57:59
  One of the things I loved about the God of War since you
• 58:01
  mentioned it, one of the things I loved about that game is the
• 58:09
  how they represented the the, the, the gods, the Norse gods.
• 58:14
  When Thor shows up and he's this, you know like 10 foot tall
• 58:20
  big belly red hair, real you know kind of crass dude.
• 58:26
  Like yeah, that's the Thor that I think of when I think of the
• 58:30
  Thor of of Norse Smith, right of of of this of the of the lore.
• 58:34
  I don't think of the Chris Hemsworth you know, chiseled,
• 58:37
  cut 6 pack ABS, blonde hair. I don't think of that.
• 58:41
  Doesn't mine. When I think of Thor I think of
• 58:44
  this, you know just and he played like the the the the
• 58:49
  voice actor. I forget his name but like
• 58:55
  everything down to his voice like The Who the voice that they
• 58:57
  got to to to portray it and and his whole aesthetic was like
• 59:04
  Odin was a really interesting take to right.
• 59:08
  I mean he, he was so obsessed with finding knowledge and so
• 59:13
  and and like I'll do anything I need to.
• 59:15
  I've got to have knowledge, you know, like that tracks with what
• 59:20
  we know of him and how he's represented in in the lore.
• 59:26
  I think an interesting. Take on Balder in that game, you
• 59:33
  know, 'cause like we don't really hear much about Balder,
• 59:37
  characteristically speaking in in the lore and in the game he
• 59:41
  has such a prominent A prominent role.
• 59:45
  But but is is portrayed in such a way that I wouldn't have
• 59:49
  thought I would you know, it wouldn't have occurred to me to
• 59:51
  take Balder in that direction with his kind of eccentric
• 59:58
  really like disturbed persona, right?
• 1:00:02
  I mean he he was, he couldn't feel anything, you know, and
• 1:00:06
  they and they took, they took that part of the myth.
• 1:00:09
  Where he's impervious to everything that the gods can do
• 1:00:12
  to him. He he can't be harmed.
• 1:00:13
  He can't be hurt. He can't be killed.
• 1:00:16
  They take that and they put it into a personality that he's
• 1:00:20
  like tormented because of it and and that torment drives him into
• 1:00:23
  this like just crazed rageful warrior type, you know.
• 1:00:31
  So it's like it was really interesting take on on Balder,
• 1:00:34
  you know and I think it's a neat you know again without knowing
• 1:00:39
  much of him from the stories like you've got one version of
• 1:00:42
  Balder in you know, Snorri's myths and then you have another
• 1:00:45
  version of Balder in in in in Danish myth.
• 1:00:51
  You know like he's he's definitely different than than
• 1:00:54
  Snorri's version. But still it's it's like, well,
• 1:00:59
  at least you got something you can think about, you know, and
• 1:01:01
  you can kind of come up with your own idea of it in a way.
• 1:01:07
  But definitely like you were saying, right.
• 1:01:08
  I mean if if you're, if you're taking this from a perspective
• 1:01:11
  of I want to practice this as a as a faith, as a spiritual path,
• 1:01:16
  religion, whatever you know you want to call it, then do your
• 1:01:19
  diligent search. You know, like do your research
• 1:01:22
  and then don't just say like wow, yeah, you know Thor and God
• 1:01:25
  of War, like that's exactly 100% right.
• 1:01:30
  Should be represented. I mean, he's probably.
• 1:01:32
  That's probably the most accurate pop culture
• 1:01:34
  representation of Thor that we have right now.
• 1:01:37
  Yeah, I agree with that. Yeah, like.
• 1:01:42
  Don't. Don't let it be the end all at
• 1:01:43
  all. Yeah, please don't.
• 1:01:47
  But no, it was like when I do believe whenever Ragnarok was
• 1:01:52
  being developed, the developers even said that they're going to
• 1:01:54
  take an account that people actually like follow this
• 1:01:59
  religion and they're going to take information and pull it
• 1:02:03
  straight from the source and make make the characters from
• 1:02:06
  what is depicted in the sagas and stuff.
• 1:02:09
  I do believe one of the developers was quoted in saying
• 1:02:11
  something along those lines. That's admirable.
• 1:02:15
  Yeah, I like to hear that, you know, So that made me pretty
• 1:02:18
  excited whenever it was first. Coming out, I was like, oh, OK,
• 1:02:21
  I'm like, so it's probably going to be pretty decent then war
• 1:02:24
  wise with how they're going to depict certain things.
• 1:02:28
  And then whenever the concept for a thord dropped, I was like,
• 1:02:33
  oh, like, OK, I'm like, so we're not going marvel with this one.
• 1:02:37
  It's like, this is nice. Like, what did what did you
• 1:02:41
  think in my mind? Sorry, go ahead.
• 1:02:46
  No, you. Go you go 1st I have a follow up
• 1:02:48
  question. Oh, I was just saying in my.
• 1:02:50
  Mind, before that concept come out, Eddie Hall, the World's
• 1:02:54
  strongest man. He was by far, probably my in my
• 1:02:58
  image. That's probably the closest
• 1:03:00
  image I had before. Mentally was kind of built like
• 1:03:03
  Eddie Hall. Yeah, power.
• 1:03:06
  Lifter type body, you know. Yeah, yeah.
• 1:03:09
  Not chiseled. In yeah.
• 1:03:12
  To mean to. Be the.
• 1:03:13
  Strongest. The champion of the gods.
• 1:03:15
  I mean, to be the strongest, the physical strongest of the gods,
• 1:03:18
  as he's mentioned in the lore, Thor would have to be.
• 1:03:23
  It couldn't be cut and trim and and you know what I mean, Like
• 1:03:25
  it have to be just this big powerlifter, tight body, a
• 1:03:30
  straight walking mountain. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 1:03:36
  Did you see that? Have you played the game or?
• 1:03:39
  Have you seen the? I've played a little bit of it,
• 1:03:41
  but most of it was. Just through playthroughs,
• 1:03:44
  watching other people play it. Yeah.
• 1:03:46
  Did you see the how they? Did you see how they put gas?
• 1:03:49
  Heimdal. Heimdal No, I don't think I've
• 1:03:53
  seen. One.
• 1:03:54
  OK, They cast him pretty good, yes.
• 1:03:59
  Very interesting, very interesting representation kind
• 1:04:03
  of again like the balder thing that I mentioned, right, like
• 1:04:08
  how we don't like we hear, we hear certain things, but we
• 1:04:10
  don't really hear much about like descriptive characteristics
• 1:04:14
  or whatever. Handball similarly, you know
• 1:04:18
  doesn't get a lot of descriptive things.
• 1:04:20
  I mean he's he's mentioned as being you know whitest or
• 1:04:24
  brightest of the gods. He's you know he can hear the
• 1:04:27
  grass grow and you know his vision is you know he can see
• 1:04:33
  far and wide and and some of those things.
• 1:04:36
  But like, without, without spoiling anything for you, in
• 1:04:38
  case you're going to, you know, continue to play or whatever,
• 1:04:40
  like can think of the fact, like his vision, the foresight,
• 1:04:46
  right? Like he's almost untouchable
• 1:04:49
  because he sees things happening before they happen.
• 1:04:51
  Like any attack that comes his way, he can see it happening and
• 1:04:54
  he dodges and oh, OK, it's like that kind of a thing.
• 1:04:57
  Like, oh, that's an interesting take.
• 1:04:59
  You know, yeah, yeah, yeah. That's true.
• 1:05:03
  Very right. So you get get a chance to.
• 1:05:05
  Watch more of the game play. I mean, I I remember I don't
• 1:05:09
  own, I don't own the the the console or or whatever to play
• 1:05:12
  it. So I'm just like, I probably
• 1:05:14
  won't anytime soon and it's been out long enough.
• 1:05:16
  I'm like, I just, I got time to kill.
• 1:05:18
  Let me find a a gameplay thing on YouTube and it's kind of
• 1:05:22
  where I'm at with it because. Like I said, I live out in the
• 1:05:24
  middle of nowhere, so Internet's far in between.
• 1:05:28
  So pretty much I'll kind of hold off just in case I can get it
• 1:05:33
  downloaded and then play it. But if I can't get it downloaded
• 1:05:36
  within a certain amount of time, it's like, OK, well, time to go
• 1:05:38
  watch other people play it, yeah.
• 1:05:41
  Like I look at there's like an 8 hour long video of the gameplay
• 1:05:47
  from from front to beginning or from beginning to end.
• 1:05:50
  And I'm like, that's not just great.
• 1:05:52
  Yeah, I was. Like, you know, I didn't.
• 1:05:54
  Watch it all in one sitting. Obviously I don't have that kind
• 1:05:57
  of time to waste sit, you know, watching somebody video game.
• 1:06:00
  But I would, I would watch, you know, an hour or two, come back,
• 1:06:02
  watch more. And it was like a movie.
• 1:06:03
  And like, I can't wait to pick it up where I left off, you
• 1:06:07
  know, and just kind of see just everything, like the landscapes,
• 1:06:13
  you know, how they represented the different realms, 'cause,
• 1:06:20
  you know, so much of, like you were talking earlier at the very
• 1:06:22
  beginning about storytelling. This is modern storytelling.
• 1:06:26
  This is how we absorb stories now.
• 1:06:29
  Is, is, is through, whether it's, you know, content in the
• 1:06:33
  forms of videos or podcasts or whether it's playing through
• 1:06:38
  them in a game. You know what not it's it's kind
• 1:06:42
  of the the storytelling aspect of things living on in in modern
• 1:06:48
  time. And I think some of what games
• 1:06:52
  like that can provide is add to that visual aspect, that
• 1:06:56
  creative mind, you know when you're reading something from
• 1:07:00
  the store, right? Realize how you know Thor and
• 1:07:03
  and Loki are going to you know to Yotenheim to win his hammer
• 1:07:07
  back and you can come up maybe with something a bit more vivid
• 1:07:11
  in your mind after playing God of War or something.
• 1:07:13
  You know, whatever. Make sure you know the land of
• 1:07:17
  of the Yotanar being right like you know it.
• 1:07:20
  It helps gives you more of like a visual representation.
• 1:07:24
  Of where you're where the gods and everything's actually at
• 1:07:29
  instead of just trying to create it from scratch, yeah.
• 1:07:34
  So yeah, definitely. But that's all about, you know.
• 1:07:38
  Gods and the myths and and the stories.
• 1:07:40
  Have you seen anything with, you know, anything in pop culture
• 1:07:44
  that you might say is a is a kind of like a like a blatant
• 1:07:48
  misrepresentation of heathen beliefs?
• 1:07:52
  Oh, definitely, right. Like, oh, is is represented
• 1:07:56
  poorly because that's not what it is.
• 1:07:57
  Or it was, you know, represented actually really well or like
• 1:08:00
  anything. Anything like that maybe?
• 1:08:02
  Well? But I'd have to say.
• 1:08:07
  Probably negative. Here recently is probably a
• 1:08:10
  bunch of Peyton Parrish's music that he's been putting out.
• 1:08:14
  I don't like I I can't with that guy sometimes.
• 1:08:20
  Just the over, yeah. We end up we have AI, have a
• 1:08:25
  running meme. With with Patrick Walsh on that,
• 1:08:28
  it's it's wacky, WAVY inflatable arm flailing, too.
• 1:08:32
  Man, Literally. Oh, animated.
• 1:08:34
  With his. And just some of the stuff.
• 1:08:39
  That his songs are about just, I don't know, I feel like it
• 1:08:43
  represents us a little wrong. Especially when he, like, relies
• 1:08:46
  heavily on the Viking stuff and everything.
• 1:08:51
  And then like, people that are coming in or been here a while
• 1:08:55
  that are starting to get into them.
• 1:08:57
  I don't know. I just think it's like it's just
• 1:08:59
  a bad message to send because we're not Vikings.
• 1:09:03
  Vikings are gone. Like I followed this one guy on
• 1:09:09
  Facebook and. Instagram they're they're tattoo
• 1:09:12
  artists in in England, in the north of England, I believe.
• 1:09:18
  But the guy's hilarious. He like, is this this thing all
• 1:09:23
  the time is you're not a fucking Viking?
• 1:09:27
  You even got shirts that say it in like an old north, like a
• 1:09:29
  Norse runic kind of font says you're not a fucking Viking.
• 1:09:33
  That's awesome. At least somebody else.
• 1:09:37
  Is saying it too, like, but yeah, I just, I don't know.
• 1:09:45
  And like with like say like big TV show Vikings, they did a lot
• 1:09:51
  of, I think misrepresentations on what the Norse culture
• 1:09:56
  actually was. Like obviously the TV show was
• 1:10:01
  the Vikings, so they're going to be a lot of blood and
• 1:10:04
  everything. But whenever they did show, like
• 1:10:07
  use Cata Cap for example, they didn't really show a whole lot
• 1:10:12
  of like accurate representations of what the North people were
• 1:10:15
  actually like. They weren't gold hungry, like
• 1:10:19
  savages, like there was artists, there was sculptures, builders,
• 1:10:24
  all kinds of stuff. And I felt like they could have
• 1:10:26
  probably went into the probably put a little bit more money into
• 1:10:31
  like actual clothing and just a little bit more story on the
• 1:10:36
  people of the area at that time instead of armor, blood and war.
• 1:10:42
  Because that's going to be the. What people are going to be if
• 1:10:47
  they're like, oh, let's let me practice this faith, they're
• 1:10:50
  going to look at that and be like, Oh well, if I'm a Viking
• 1:10:52
  man, that means I'm a man and I gotta gotta walk around with my
• 1:10:57
  chest puffed out and all that stuff.
• 1:10:58
  And that's not what Norris Paganism is at all, Right?
• 1:11:04
  There's that. There's that, like I don't know
• 1:11:07
  if you've seen this. Some of the things that I've
• 1:11:11
  some of the challenges I've encountered with trying to you
• 1:11:16
  know be present in the in the in the community.
• 1:11:19
  Right. And welcome people to Germanic
• 1:11:23
  Heathenry is is, you know, a lot of people like, see, they almost
• 1:11:29
  like break the Pagan community into groups like, oh, you got,
• 1:11:31
  you know, you got your eclectic witches, and then you got your
• 1:11:34
  Norse people. And there's always, like, I
• 1:11:39
  always have it. It almost seems like when they
• 1:11:40
  say that, it's like they say it with this, this, like, like
• 1:11:46
  dread in their voice. Like all the Norse people almost
• 1:11:49
  in a way. You know, like, you know, just a
• 1:11:52
  bunch of partiers. A bunch of.
• 1:11:53
  Bunch of crazy people, you know, they they they think they're
• 1:11:56
  Vikings. And yeah, yeah, so like
• 1:11:59
  definitely, that's one thing. I agree that hasn't helped in in
• 1:12:04
  putting a light on. You know definitely there was
• 1:12:08
  war bands and and stuff but like it was such a a niche group.
• 1:12:12
  I mean it was you know they serve the purpose and like in
• 1:12:14
  any culture. I mean you had your, you had
• 1:12:17
  your war bands and in almost every culture in the world I
• 1:12:19
  think so like that that was a part of it sure.
• 1:12:22
  But what about the day-to-day lives That's not interesting to
• 1:12:26
  put film and and to cast into anything, right.
• 1:12:29
  Nobody wants to really right, but like, the way they.
• 1:12:32
  Structured. The cities that made this made
• 1:12:35
  it seem like the only thing that them cities did was raid, right?
• 1:12:40
  That was far from it, right? Yeah.
• 1:12:44
  Raiding was like a holiday thing.
• 1:12:48
  Yeah, you definitely. Got to take it, you know do it
• 1:12:50
  at certain times of the year. I mean you weren't just around
• 1:12:53
  the clock sailing the seas and and visiting and and raiding
• 1:12:58
  like the you couldn't. You had to do it during raiding
• 1:13:02
  season, as it were, you know? Rest of the time you were just
• 1:13:07
  trying. Not to die from cold and you
• 1:13:10
  know, just ease bears. Yeah, Nature you.
• 1:13:15
  Know. Yeah, I would definitely.
• 1:13:19
  Which I think they did A really. Good depiction on that with
• 1:13:23
  Bjorn Ironside whenever he did his well, I guess like finding.
• 1:13:29
  His. Manhood journey.
• 1:13:30
  Whenever he went out and stayed in the Hunter's cabin that
• 1:13:32
  winter, I think it did a good representation just of how the
• 1:13:35
  elements back then would dramatically affect the area
• 1:13:39
  that they lived in at the time. Like it showed Ragnar Lothbrook
• 1:13:43
  not leaving the chieftain's Hut because it was just so brittly
• 1:13:47
  cold outside. He would only sit on the porch
• 1:13:49
  and you know stuff like that. So I I think it did a good there
• 1:13:54
  on showing just on the elements back then, just how our ancient
• 1:13:57
  ancestors might have interpreted and handled those situations,
• 1:14:03
  yeah. Believe it or not, I think one
• 1:14:06
  of the one of the other shows and I I I want to see more of
• 1:14:11
  them because I only think they did like the two seasons.
• 1:14:13
  It's comedic. It's it's very like Monty Python
• 1:14:16
  Esque. But Norseman, have you ever
• 1:14:18
  watched that? Oh yeah, I watched that.
• 1:14:20
  That was a good one. Yeah.
• 1:14:23
  And yeah, it it's, you know, there's there's definitely the
• 1:14:25
  comedy aspect of it I think. But there's there's there's
• 1:14:28
  certain parts of all of that that that shed a bit of more of
• 1:14:35
  a light on the cultural norms or the OR the cultural taboos even.
• 1:14:43
  I mean some of the things that were acceptable versus not
• 1:14:46
  acceptable and just how common the common folk, you know, kind
• 1:14:51
  of lived and and existed. Yeah.
• 1:14:54
  And I like the way that. Sorry, no, I say.
• 1:14:58
  Like, even. Though it was a show, it was, it
• 1:15:00
  was represented in some ways pretty well, I think, and I
• 1:15:05
  think there's. Being delivered in a comedic
• 1:15:07
  aspect also helped with it a little bit, because people tend
• 1:15:13
  to remember something that they've laughed at a little bit
• 1:15:16
  longer than something serious that's been drawn out and or
• 1:15:20
  whatnot. Yeah, I think kind of retains a
• 1:15:22
  little bit better if it. Made them laugh.
• 1:15:25
  Yeah, that, that's that's. Accurate.
• 1:15:27
  You know people attention spans are are shorter if if the
• 1:15:35
  subject matters you know more academically dry and and and
• 1:15:40
  stuff so you you attain more interest when you can throw some
• 1:15:43
  levity and keep it funny. Definitely, yeah, yeah.
• 1:15:50
  Because I know some people. Like the academic stuff and
• 1:15:52
  everything like that. But for the I'd say probably for
• 1:15:55
  the majority, I'd say people probably get a little dull on
• 1:16:01
  that. For a little bit, yeah.
• 1:16:02
  Bored from it, right? Yeah, like, what do you mean I
• 1:16:05
  have to read? This you know?
• 1:16:07
  175 page dissertation about blah blah blah.
• 1:16:12
  Like can't you sum it up for me about 30 seconds or a minute
• 1:16:16
  Like no, not really. I mean you know do you want it
• 1:16:21
  to be accurate, do you want it to be thorough or you know and
• 1:16:25
  and as it goes what we were saying before, right people are
• 1:16:28
  by, by, by and large I think just not interested or willing
• 1:16:32
  to put in the effort and the work to to learn anything.
• 1:16:37
  Sit down and read a book. Yeah, absolutely.
• 1:16:42
  Like just take your time doing it.
• 1:16:45
  But I think the most of the people I would say probably that
• 1:16:48
  are converting now is they're all former Christian.
• 1:16:52
  So they were used to somebody being at the head of told.
• 1:17:00
  Them what? Brooks said.
• 1:17:01
  Because I don't. I know a good amount of
• 1:17:04
  Christians that have never touched the Bible of the day of
• 1:17:06
  their lives, but they could tell you verses because, well,
• 1:17:09
  Preacher Bob told me that. So they didn't really have to
• 1:17:13
  look it up for themselves. They just trusted somebody else
• 1:17:15
  to do it for them and then they ran with it.
• 1:17:20
  And I think that's kind of bleeding unto the converts
• 1:17:23
  nowadays is they're hoping somebody can just tell them so
• 1:17:26
  that way they don't have to do it for themselves.
• 1:17:31
  Which is unfortunate. That's an interesting now.
• 1:17:33
  It's an interesting. Observation.
• 1:17:34
  I haven't thought too much about that.
• 1:17:36
  But you're right. Because Christianity is.
• 1:17:38
  I mean I don't want to say that it's you know every you know
• 1:17:44
  that there's no work involved. I mean there there's definitely
• 1:17:48
  I think, I think you know one of the doctrines of Christianity is
• 1:17:53
  you know your faith without works is is useless.
• 1:17:57
  You have to have work show to show for your faith.
• 1:18:04
  And so much. I think a part of that has to be
• 1:18:06
  like know your doctrine, right. If I I remember a friend of mine
• 1:18:10
  who I've been friends with for many, many, many years.
• 1:18:13
  I worked with them in the prison that I used to work at and then
• 1:18:16
  later on transporting prisoners. We were working at the same
• 1:18:21
  company. We were partners on the road,
• 1:18:23
  you know what I mean? We we've been through a lot
• 1:18:26
  together and and he's he's. Since moved out West with his
• 1:18:31
  wife. And haven't connected in a very
• 1:18:33
  long time but we we're still like on Facebook friends.
• 1:18:38
  But so I forget what the what the topic or the subject matter
• 1:18:44
  was. I think I may have posted AI
• 1:18:47
  forget what I posted about but anyway Rob came in his name's
• 1:18:50
  Rob and he came in with a comment about something from
• 1:18:52
  like the Bible and I was like all right here we go because
• 1:18:58
  yeah I may be heathen now and but I grew up in Christianity.
• 1:19:02
  I've, you know, read the Bible, the King James Version at least
• 1:19:06
  of the Bible like seven times cover to cover Genesis to
• 1:19:10
  Revelation that many times been a part of the Bible studies,
• 1:19:15
  right. Did the whole thing for the
• 1:19:17
  first like 20 years of my life. And so he like spouts off a
• 1:19:20
  verse and then I come back and I give my response to his his
• 1:19:26
  answer. And I, he came back with my from
• 1:19:30
  my response and he's like, oh, I'm going to have to do some
• 1:19:32
  more research on that or something like that.
• 1:19:35
  And I go, all right, Rob, I said.
• 1:19:37
  Then I then I would while while you're researching this or
• 1:19:40
  whatever, it's like I would like to.
• 1:19:41
  And I could tell this then because again, we're friends.
• 1:19:44
  I would say this silly strange. I would tell him.
• 1:19:46
  I said, then you have an you have a responsibility as a
• 1:19:49
  Christian man, as as a, as a somebody who believes in what
• 1:19:53
  they say, right. You have a responsibility to
• 1:19:55
  know more about your doctrine than I do.
• 1:19:57
  I'm the bad guy as a word, right?
• 1:19:58
  I'm the opposite. I'm the heathen, I'm the pain,
• 1:20:00
  and I'm the God, this that thing or the other, right?
• 1:20:02
  And I if I know more about your doctrine, your book, than you
• 1:20:06
  do. That's a problem.
• 1:20:09
  You should know more about what you're talking about than I do.
• 1:20:11
  You should be able to wipe the floors up with guys like, you
• 1:20:14
  know, guys like me, people like me, whatever.
• 1:20:17
  And not a lot of them do anymore like that, you know?
• 1:20:20
  They don't know their Bible, They don't know their doctrine.
• 1:20:22
  And similarly with Heathenry, right?
• 1:20:25
  You don't know your lore, you don't know your your sagas, you
• 1:20:28
  don't know your sources. You're just picking and and and
• 1:20:33
  quotes from you know, this channel, this page, this you
• 1:20:38
  know meme, whatever, thinking that it's you know that you're
• 1:20:43
  going to you know inspire somebody because you you know
• 1:20:45
  you snagged it from from an Instagram post or something like
• 1:20:48
  but what do you know about you have this.
• 1:20:51
  You think it's cool, right? It sounds what do you know about
• 1:20:54
  any of this? What do you how, how are you
• 1:20:58
  representing yourself in this whole thing?
• 1:21:02
  It's nobody wants, nobody wants to do the work, right?
• 1:21:05
  They they, they do, they want it to be fed to them.
• 1:21:07
  They want it to be handed to them.
• 1:21:10
  And I think to a degree, I mean you you got to know where to go.
• 1:21:14
  I mean everybody needs a guide. I need a guide.
• 1:21:17
  You know what I'm saying? I there's times where to go.
• 1:21:22
  I don't know what to do and I but I know where I can go to get
• 1:21:27
  some some guidance. You know what I mean?
• 1:21:29
  I don't want somebody to carry me through it.
• 1:21:32
  I just want them to point, help, you know, show me some options
• 1:21:35
  here, point me in a direction. I'll choose, I'll make the
• 1:21:37
  choice, I'll do the thing. But sometimes we know you need
• 1:21:41
  that, You need that perspective. You need that help along the way
• 1:21:45
  to just. You know, and when, when it gets
• 1:21:50
  a little, I'm not. Sure, where to go.
• 1:21:52
  You need that. So absolutely there's plenty of
• 1:21:55
  it out there. There's also some bad ones.
• 1:21:58
  So I guess one of the things too, with all of it is as long
• 1:22:04
  as you're doing your research, as long as you're taking the
• 1:22:07
  time. Like knowledge is knowledge
• 1:22:08
  wherever it comes from, wisdom is wisdom from wherever it
• 1:22:11
  comes. And you could probably you can
• 1:22:14
  learn valuable stuff from anywhere, even if that valuable
• 1:22:20
  thing is don't do it that way. You know what I mean?
• 1:22:24
  Even if the moral of the story is won't do that.
• 1:22:27
  Hey, at least you've learned something that you otherwise
• 1:22:30
  wouldn't have because you didn't research, you didn't read from
• 1:22:34
  that source, you didn't watch that video, you didn't follow
• 1:22:37
  this person on their social media platforms.
• 1:22:40
  You know, one of the things I think that has happened is, is
• 1:22:43
  people get told, don't listen to this man in person, whatever.
• 1:22:47
  Don't watch their videos, don't follow their platforms because
• 1:22:51
  they are, you know, they're fascist.
• 1:22:56
  They're right wing, they're they're, they're all these
• 1:22:58
  various, like bad, socially enigmatic things, right?
• 1:23:03
  Anything they say, don't listen to them.
• 1:23:07
  Some people will go and be like, well, I want to listen to more
• 1:23:09
  of what they have to say, then formulate my own opinion.
• 1:23:11
  Not because of them being associated with whatever they're
• 1:23:14
  associated with that is abhorrent and and that I don't
• 1:23:18
  want anything a part of. But now I want to see what they
• 1:23:20
  have to say and formulate my own opinion and learn something out
• 1:23:23
  of it. You can learn anything from
• 1:23:27
  anybody. Doesn't mean you have to agree.
• 1:23:29
  It doesn't mean you have to align your your ideals and your
• 1:23:33
  world views with theirs. But you can learn from anybody.
• 1:23:38
  Yep, and like. I encourage my kids all the time
• 1:23:44
  to ask questions, especially about other faiths and stuff
• 1:23:48
  because like especially Christianity and we're in a
• 1:23:51
  heavily Christian town and area and they ask a lot about
• 1:23:55
  Christian stuff and everything like that.
• 1:23:57
  And I told him it's like learning.
• 1:24:00
  Just because you learn a different belief does not mean
• 1:24:02
  you necessarily have to practice it, but it can help you like,
• 1:24:05
  save. Like because one of my friends
• 1:24:07
  and my one of my son's best friends, I'm best friends with
• 1:24:12
  his dad and my oldest is best friends with his oldest son.
• 1:24:15
  But he's a youth or he's a pastor at the Baptist Church
• 1:24:19
  that we used to go to as kids, and he sends his kids over here
• 1:24:23
  so that way his kids can see how other viewpoints are played out
• 1:24:30
  in the world and stuff. And that there's really no
• 1:24:32
  reason to be scared of people that believe different or
• 1:24:35
  anything like that. Like his oldest kid, whenever he
• 1:24:38
  first found out that we were N Pagan, I it looked like I was
• 1:24:42
  the boogeyman. Like his doll dropped, his eyes
• 1:24:46
  got really big and he's like, he's like, can I call my dad?
• 1:24:50
  And he went to, I was like, yeah, so I handed him the phone.
• 1:24:52
  I got my wife's phone, a message and I was like, hey brands is
• 1:24:55
  all freaked out. Just a heads up and whatnot.
• 1:24:58
  I'm like he found out that we were Norris Pagan.
• 1:25:00
  All he said was LOL. He goes, he's like, yeah, he's
• 1:25:02
  calling me now and he's like I'll message you in a second.
• 1:25:05
  So he calls him and he's like, yes, it's fine and blah, blah,
• 1:25:07
  blah. So he came out and I was like,
• 1:25:10
  so I was like, I talked to your dad.
• 1:25:11
  I'm like, Dad wants to know if you want to know anything more
• 1:25:14
  about my religion and stuff. And so I got to share that with
• 1:25:18
  them. And then my kids, vice versa,
• 1:25:21
  get a little bit of like cultural blending from his
• 1:25:24
  family. So that way like when they grow
• 1:25:27
  up, they're not like, oh, you're Pagan, like get get out of here
• 1:25:31
  like type of mentality. Yeah, that can happen from
• 1:25:36
  being. Sheltered from from stuff and so
• 1:25:41
  you know it's. I think it's.
• 1:25:42
  Important to Even if you do believe a certain way, I do
• 1:25:46
  think it's important for you to expose yourself or allow
• 1:25:49
  yourself to be exposed a little bit to what other people might
• 1:25:52
  believe because, one, it could help you in your own beliefs.
• 1:25:55
  And two, it'll kind of like bridges a gap between
• 1:25:58
  communities. And you're not so opposite, so
• 1:26:02
  to speak. You're kind of a little bit more
• 1:26:05
  intertwined because you're able to experience a little bit from
• 1:26:08
  each other. So that way you're not so
• 1:26:10
  alienated in a sense, I guess. Yeah.
• 1:26:13
  Yeah. That's one of the things I had
• 1:26:15
  happen with growing up the way that I did.
• 1:26:19
  And I, you know, I learned a lot of good and valuable things with
• 1:26:24
  with the way that I was raised, not entirely from a religious
• 1:26:29
  perspective, but from just a practical, living perspective.
• 1:26:33
  You know, learning how to hunt, fish, grow food, these, you know
• 1:26:37
  that that sort of thing, cut wood, hay a field, you know,
• 1:26:41
  take care of cattle, all these various, like valuable life
• 1:26:45
  lessons, things like that, you know, But one of the things also
• 1:26:48
  that was it was such it was so sheltered.
• 1:26:51
  It was so anything outside of what we believed was wrong, you
• 1:26:58
  know what I mean? Like we're right.
• 1:26:59
  Everything else is wrong. So there was, you know, and it
• 1:27:04
  wasn't wrong because, well, here's the research, here's the,
• 1:27:09
  you know, no, it was just wrong because it wasn't us or them.
• 1:27:12
  You know what I mean? Like, and I don't.
• 1:27:14
  I don't, I don't agree with that, like you were saying.
• 1:27:19
  I mean, getting the, getting the exposure, at least.
• 1:27:22
  Just getting to know, right? Yeah, Formulate your own
• 1:27:26
  opinion. And then sure.
• 1:27:28
  You know, there's there's a difference between how younger
• 1:27:32
  minds absorb and and digest information than adult minds,
• 1:27:38
  I'm sure. But the fact is, is that the
• 1:27:41
  opportunities are there and they are under adult supervision and
• 1:27:44
  there is this understanding of, hey, this is OK for you to be
• 1:27:48
  exposed to this, that, you know, it's fine.
• 1:27:51
  You can learn from one another. And I think that that's great.
• 1:27:55
  That's a really good influence to have, you know, Yeah, this
• 1:28:03
  has been great. Bradley Was there, Was there
• 1:28:06
  anything else you wanted to? No, it's top of my head.
• 1:28:11
  No, it's been a. Nice conversation for sure, I
• 1:28:15
  agree. I'm glad that we finally got a
• 1:28:18
  chance to to do this. I I was before you came on as
• 1:28:22
  like part of my intro. I'm like, you know, I I don't
• 1:28:25
  know exactly how long you and I have been in contact like
• 1:28:28
  communication with each other. We've been connected through
• 1:28:31
  social media now for probably at least a couple years.
• 1:28:34
  Yeah, I'd say a few years or three.
• 1:28:36
  I'd say about three years, I'd say, yeah.
• 1:28:39
  Yeah, it sounds about right. And I think we've talked in the
• 1:28:42
  past about maybe you haven't you come on the podcast and just
• 1:28:46
  things didn't didn't line up but I'm glad that it that it finally
• 1:28:51
  has here in season five. You know you got a chance to
• 1:28:55
  hear your finally and hear. Your perspective and.
• 1:28:58
  Everybody else has to, so that's great, right?
• 1:29:02
  Yeah, I've been wanting to get on here for quite.
• 1:29:04
  Some time, but I don't know. I just get very nervous speaking
• 1:29:07
  like publicly like this, especially on like platforms and
• 1:29:11
  stuff. So I get pretty nervous.
• 1:29:13
  So I've backed myself out of messaging a lot of times, and
• 1:29:17
  eventually I was. This year I decided that I'm
• 1:29:20
  going to kind of like push myself out of my comfort zone a
• 1:29:23
  little bit and do things I normally wouldn't do and just
• 1:29:26
  kind of experience stuff instead of just living and kind of
• 1:29:30
  working in the shadows of all the pages I follow.
• 1:29:34
  Well, man, I think you did a great.
• 1:29:37
  I think you did great, you know, and I can hopefully anybody else
• 1:29:39
  that's listening and watching this who have had similar
• 1:29:44
  reservations about coming on the show.
• 1:29:46
  You know here you are living breathing, walking truck, an
• 1:29:50
  example of just do it right. This isn't, you know, it ain't
• 1:29:54
  nothing. It ain't nothing to it.
• 1:29:56
  We're just two dudes here chatting, you know, just chit
• 1:29:59
  chatting. Two.
• 1:30:01
  Yeah, 2. People out here just rambling
• 1:30:02
  on. For for an hour or so and you
• 1:30:05
  know this is a this is a a testament to the fact that it's
• 1:30:09
  it's very casual and I love having I love having talks like
• 1:30:13
  this in a in a in a in a more conversational manner.
• 1:30:16
  You know it's great that we have these opportunities with modern
• 1:30:20
  technology to do this. You know, otherwise we'd have to
• 1:30:23
  find somehow to get together in a in a room and and all that
• 1:30:27
  stuff which is also great. But it's not feasible when
• 1:30:30
  you're in misery. And I'm in Tennessee, you know
• 1:30:34
  on the budget that. I've got right on.
• 1:30:35
  This production it's not like I can just travel the country and
• 1:30:38
  meet people in person all the time.
• 1:30:40
  So this is a great chance and you were a great you were a
• 1:30:43
  great guest man thank you conducted yourself well and and
• 1:30:47
  offered a lot of great feedback and and topics of choice.
• 1:30:52
  So I hope everybody that's listening and watching is
• 1:30:56
  enjoying it as well. And anytime you want to come
• 1:30:59
  back, just let me know. If you have something else that
• 1:31:01
  comes up that is itching at your brain that you want to talk
• 1:31:04
  through or whatever, you're you're more than welcome to come
• 1:31:07
  back and would love to have you. Absolutely.
• 1:31:09
  Thank you. I'd love to come back for real
• 1:31:13
  cool. Well.
• 1:31:14
  We'll, we'll definitely keep the open, you know, the invite open,
• 1:31:19
  yeah. So if there's nothing else then
• 1:31:22
  I'll, I'll, I'll, I'll end the stream or not the stream.
• 1:31:25
  But we'll we'll start recording everybody that's listening,
• 1:31:27
  watching you guys check the description and show notes as I
• 1:31:30
  mentioned early on for all the ways that you can, you know,
• 1:31:34
  support what I do here on the podcast.
• 1:31:37
  Thank you to my patrons on Patreon for pledging your
• 1:31:40
  support to keep the video versions of the podcast ongoing.
• 1:31:43
  That is greatly appreciated. All of my listeners on the other
• 1:31:46
  audio platforms, you're awesome as well.
• 1:31:48
  Keeping the keeping the the thing rolling.
• 1:31:52
  Keeping this little wagon rolling here.
• 1:31:54
  It's not quite a not quite a machine.
• 1:31:56
  I don't think it's it's more like a it's more like a wagon.
• 1:31:59
  You know, we got, we got a steady pace.
• 1:32:02
  We're just trucking along. Right.
• 1:32:05
  So thank you, Bradley, for being my guest this week.
• 1:32:09
  Look forward to talking to you again more.
• 1:32:11
  And yeah, that about wraps it up.
• 1:32:13
  So thank you all for tuning into this week's episode of the
• 1:32:17
  Random Heathen Ramblings podcast.
• 1:32:19
  If you do like it, if you're on the video platform, give it a
• 1:32:22
  heart, react, you know, do the thing.
• 1:32:24
  If you're on the audio platforms, upvote it, Download
• 1:32:26
  it, Do whatever thing that it asks you to do to to show your
• 1:32:30
  support. Share it around as as always
• 1:32:33
  too. That helps get the word out.
• 1:32:36
  If you do want to call into the podcast, you could do so by
• 1:32:38
  dialing 615-671-9832. You can leave a voicemail to
• 1:32:43
  share your thoughts. We'd love to feature that here
• 1:32:45
  on the podcast as well. You can remain anonymous if you
• 1:32:48
  so choose, so just let me know if you call in to do that.
• 1:32:53
  Guest request could be emailed into midgardmusingstn@gmail.com
• 1:32:58
  and we'll look at our availability and and book you
• 1:33:02
  for a future episode at a date and time that works for all of
• 1:33:06
  us. Follow me on all my socials link
• 1:33:08
  tree link is down below to follow me everywhere.
• 1:33:11
  Thank you all so very much for being here and thank you again
• 1:33:13
  Bradley for being my guest this week.
• 1:33:15
  Thank you until we talk to. Each other again.
• 1:33:18
  May the gods continue to notice you, and may your ancestors
• 1:33:22
  smile upon you. See you in the next one.
• 1:33:24
  You too.