Latest / The Start, Scale & Succeed Podcast / You’re Asking the Wrong Question with Scott Ritzheimer (stages 1,2,3,4,5,6,7) - Ep. 405

Transcript

You’re Asking the Wrong Question with Scott Ritzheimer (stages 1,2,3,4,5,6,7) - Ep. 405 · The Start, Scale & Succeed Podcast

0:00
Scott Ritzheimer: Hello, hello, and welcome. Welcome once again
0:03
to the Start, Scale, and Succeed podcast, the only podcast that
0:06
grows with you through all seven levels of your journey as a
0:09
founder. I'm your host, Scott Retheimer, and today I want to
0:13
talk about one of the most important lessons that I've
0:15
learned, and that is, in particular, the value of asking
0:20
the right question, you see, we waste an enormous amount of time
0:27
as founders, as leaders, even as entire organizations, trying so
0:32
hard to find the right answers to what is ultimately the wrong
0:37
question, and arguably the most glaring example of that is the
0:43
most common question that I'm asked, particularly by coaches
0:46
that I meet for the first time, and this is, of course, outside
0:51
of how old are you, because I still look like I'm 22 but
0:54
that's that's another thing for another time. By the way, if
0:58
you're not watching this on video, we've got video options,
1:02
not just on YouTube anymore, but also probably in your favorite
1:05
podcast player. You can choose the video option in Spotify. You
1:10
can also choose the video option here in Apple Podcasts, or one
1:13
of the first podcasts to release this option in Apple as well.
1:18
So, check it out if you're in your player, there's a little
1:20
video option in both Spotify and Apple Podcasts. Some of your
1:25
other favorite shows might be that way as well. It's a cool
1:27
experience, and, and one that I think you'll enjoy. So, back to
1:33
this really bad question, this fundamentally flawed question.
1:37
Are you ready? Okay. So, the question is, how do I get to the
1:42
next level, and we ask this in a lot of different ways. We're
1:46
actually going to address several of them over the course
1:49
of this series. This is the first in a what will be a seven
1:52
part series. We'll talk about that in a moment, but how do I
1:55
get to the next level? Now you're probably wondering, like,
1:58
what, like, why is that such a bad question, and, and a big
2:03
part of the reason why is that it usually means, especially
2:06
when it's asked in those words, it usually means that the
2:09
founder doesn't actually know what the next level is, and, and
2:14
more importantly, and almost certainly they don't know if
2:19
that next level is right for them, you see. This matters
2:24
because founders find answers. It's just what we do. We will
2:29
find an answer where everyone has given up, like 17 years ago.
2:34
There's a stubbornness, a determination, a cleverness, a
2:38
resilience, a just recalcitrance in founders that forces us to
2:44
find the answer, and that's why it's so deeply important for you
2:49
to ask the right question, because otherwise you're going
2:53
to find the right answer, or at least an answer, hopefully the
2:57
right one, but it's whether it's right or not, it doesn't matter,
3:01
because it's an answer to the wrong problem. And then, what do
3:06
we do? We then go and build an organization, and I can't tell
3:11
you how many times I see this happen. We build an organization
3:15
that we don't actually want to lead. We end up doing something,
3:19
either as an organization or in our individual job within that
3:23
organization that we don't actually want to do, and truth
3:28
be told, the honest truth of it is you probably won't make any
3:34
more money doing it, and that's such a big driver, especially
3:37
culturally, is like I've got a blank because why, because
3:40
that'll make me more successful. What does that mean? Because
3:42
I'll be making more money, and while it might be true,
3:47
especially within the context of the founders' evolution, that
3:50
that you might be able to generate more revenue in a later
3:55
stage, it's not even close to true that that more revenue,
3:59
more of that revenue will make it to you. In fact, I think you
4:04
can not only enjoy the right level more, but if you optimize
4:09
for the right level for you, most of the time that's also the
4:15
same level in which you'll make the most money yourself, and
4:19
we'll unpack that a little bit as we go throughout the series,
4:22
but, but that is what this series is about. We're gonna do
4:25
a full solo series, just you and me, it would be a lot of fun.
4:29
And the series is going to be called Should You Really.
4:33
We're going to talk about how you can figure out whether or
4:38
not the next level is right for you now. Before that, some of
4:44
you might be new, some of you might have been around for a
4:46
little while, but there are there are two questions that we
4:50
have to answer before we can actually get to that. Is the
4:53
next level right for you? And the first of those questions is
4:57
one that we've addressed a couple of different times. And
5:00
that is what level are you currently in, so we're gonna,
5:03
we're gonna lay just a little bit more context there, at least
5:06
you need to know to get caught up, and that's going to be a
5:09
real helpful precursor to the following episodes in the
5:11
series. The second question is pretty easy once you've answered
5:16
the first one, so once we've answered the question, what
5:18
level are you currently in, then the then the the next level is
5:25
it's kind of one of three options, the next level is
5:29
either the next in progression up the chart, if you will, so
5:33
from level three to level four, for example, that could be the
5:38
next level, the next level could actually just be a better
5:42
version of this level. It could be that you really genuinely
5:45
learned to thrive in this level, and we're going to talk about
5:49
that decision. How do you know if the next level is actually
5:52
stepping forward to the next level, or how do you know if the
5:55
quote unquote next level for you isn't actually the next level at
6:00
all? It's just an optimization of the level that you're
6:03
currently in, learning to embrace it, learning to thrive
6:06
in it. How do you know if that's right for you? And again, we're
6:09
going to address this throughout the series. Now, there is a
6:11
third option, we're not going to talk about it in this series,
6:15
but the third option might be, it's kind of like I think about
6:18
this every time I fly, I'm headed to see a client, or even
6:22
better yet, headed home, and, and sitting on the plane, and
6:26
they go through their whole exit spiel, and what do they say?
6:30
They say the closest exit might be behind you, and that's true
6:34
in, in the founders' evolution as well. Sometimes the right
6:38
level is actually in your rearview mirror, sometimes we
6:42
just breeze right through it, never recognize how good it
6:44
really is until we've lost it. So, there is an option to go
6:47
back again. We're not going to address that in this series, but
6:49
that's a very valid option. And even the idea that it is back
6:55
sounds negative, but it's not. Better way of thinking about it,
6:59
we just talked about this a couple episodes ago, is
7:01
returning home right. Going home is not any worse than going to
7:06
visit my client for the on the outbound journey. It's just two
7:10
parts of the same journey, and so going home isn't a bad thing.
7:13
Going back isn't a bad thing, but neither here nor there. In
7:18
this episode, what I want to do is just, just do a quick run
7:23
through of these different levels, because we do need to
7:24
know what the levels are. That's the easiest way to find out
7:27
which one you're in. We're going to then go through and address
7:31
each level one at a time for the remaining six episodes in the
7:34
series. And yes, there are seven episodes, seven levels, and
7:41
there's only six episodes. How does that work? We're actually
7:42
going to talk about the transition point between each of
7:46
the levels, so in the next episode we're going to talk
7:50
about how to navigate the transition point between levels
7:54
one and two, and then the next episode after that between
7:57
levels two and three. So there are six transition points in the
8:00
journey, there's no transition point out of level seven, except
8:04
the way that we'll all leave this earth, but that's that's
8:07
another thing for another time. So, let's go to this first
8:11
question, What level are you currently in now? For those of
8:16
you who've been with us for a little while, Les and I talked
8:18
about this at length, believe it was back in episodes 303 101
8:23
I'll check that afterwards, and whatever episode it was, I'll
8:26
get it in the show notes for you, so you can go directly to
8:29
there.
8:29
So, if anything about this episode is interesting, or you
8:32
want to know more, we spent a lot more time on it back in, in
8:37
a couple episodes in the past, so we'll link those. You can go
8:39
back to them, and and you're welcome to do so, that's all in
8:43
the show notes. We also, for those of you who are new, or
8:49
those of you who don't know what level you're currently in,
8:52
there's kind of an easy button on this. We have a quiz at
8:55
Founders quiz.com that will tell you exactly what level you're
8:58
in. That link is in the show notes, as well, you can grab
9:01
that. So, in either case, if you leave this episode and you have
9:05
some kind of a question still about what level you're in,
9:07
there's two easy answers there. You can go back and listen to a
9:09
little bit more, that'd be cool, or you can jump into Founders
9:14
quiz.com and just take the assessment, they'll tell you,
9:18
and it's like 10 or 11 questions, it's just really
9:20
easy, all right. So all that out of the way. Here's, here's what
9:26
I think is the easiest way, in 510, minutes, that you can tell
9:30
what founders level you're in. So I'm going to walk through
9:32
these levels one at a time, and and here are the questions we
9:36
want to think about. So, level one, are you in level one? The
9:40
first question we want to ask is, have you started your own
9:42
business or nonprofit and gone full time, like it's your
9:46
primary occupation? If not, then you're in level one. That, like,
9:51
the vast majority of the population relative to the
9:54
founders' evolution is in level one. This is the employee stay.
10:00
Just also the pre-founder stage, but particularly when it comes
10:04
to the founders' evolution level one is for founders different
10:11
than everybody else, and and in the book that's coming out,
10:16
we'll talk about that in a little bit, but there is, we
10:20
spent a lot of time talking about this because there are a
10:23
lot of people who just have bad jobs or don't like their work,
10:26
but for pre-founders and kind of frustrated employees in general,
10:32
there's this sense of being what I call a dissatisfied employee
10:38
and what really like is the genesis of the difference
10:44
between a pre-founder and just someone who's frustrated with
10:47
their job is that the pre-founder isn't really
10:52
thinking like, how do I make more money, although that
10:55
matters, they're not necessarily even thinking how do I get more
10:59
freedom, even though that matters too, that's not quite as
11:04
much of a differentiating factor as it used to be. They aren't
11:09
thinking, how do I get rid of my boss, although that's probably a
11:12
factor as well. What I see in, in those who are set up to be
11:18
successful founders, right, who might be jumping into this
11:21
journey the right way is they're asking the question, isn't there
11:24
a better way? Isn't there a better way, a better product, a
11:31
better service, a better way of treating our employees, a better
11:34
way of managing a team? That one not so much, but you'll find out
11:38
that it's necessary in a little bit, but I we're so level one is
11:46
someone who's thinking about that better way, and they're
11:49
wondering, Should I start my own business? Should I start my own
11:53
nonprofit to pursue that? Should I go full time? That's level
11:57
one, and if that's you, and you're asking that question, and
12:01
you haven't fully answered it yet, or you're just starting to
12:05
ask it. Then the next episode in this series can be fantastic,
12:09
because we're going to talk about whether or not you should
12:11
start your own organization. It's amazing. So that's level
12:14
one. If you haven't gone full time yet, that's kind of the
12:17
transition point. Level two, if you have started your own
12:22
organization already, then you're going to be somewhere
12:25
else on the founders evolution. You're gonna be somewhere
12:27
between two and seven. So, how do we start to flesh that out?
12:30
What's level two look like specifically? Well, in level
12:33
two, it might be just you as a solopreneur, it might be you and
12:39
like up to a handful of employees, I know that's very
12:42
technical amount, but it's different for different folks.
12:47
Contractors fit into that equation as well, but you
12:51
basically have a small, small team, might be just you and a
12:58
couple of helpers, and you're probably riding the
13:01
entrepreneurial roller coaster pretty hardcore as, as a level
13:05
two, what I call startup entrepreneur, and how you know
13:09
you're in this stage again, you've, you've gone full time,
13:11
that's a prerequisite, you don't have more than a handful of
13:14
employees, because that's going to push you into a later level,
13:17
but you're probably sitting there asking yourself, what was
13:20
I thinking, like why in the world before I made the leap, I
13:25
thought the only thing I could ever possibly do, and the only
13:29
way I could ever possibly succeed, was to start my own
13:31
organization. And now that I've done it, I think that's the
13:34
stupidest thing I've ever done in my life, and I don't know
13:36
what I'm going to do now. That's kind of how it feels now. It
13:39
might not be true, it might be true. There's lots of folks who
13:42
shouldn't have started their own organization, hence the next
13:44
episode in this series. But the idea here is we're in it, and
13:50
it's like three times as hard, takes three times as long, costs
13:53
three times as much as we ever could have imagined. And that
13:57
startup entrepreneur phase is pretty tough, but that's level
14:02
two. Level two is largely about you as an entrepreneur, and you
14:08
might have a handful of folks around you that are just kind of
14:11
there to help you, some assistance, maybe a tech or two,
14:16
depends on what you do and what the work looks like, but that's
14:19
level two, relatively small scale. It's not a, it's not an
14:24
amount of time. That's an easy misconception. You might be in
14:28
level two your entire time as a full-time entrepreneur, as a
14:33
full-time founder. For me, in my role, I've actually chosen to
14:38
stay in level two. I'm intentionally resisting, at
14:41
least for now, the pool into level three, so there's no time
14:47
limit on how long you're in level two. You can stay there
14:50
for as long as you want. That's actually true with all of these
14:52
levels. There it commonly takes at least a few years, though, so
14:57
very few people move. Faster than that, it is possible you
15:01
can have venture backing and get a couple early wins, need a
15:05
bigger team, and zoom through level two into level three. That
15:09
does happen from time to time, and that's what we're going to
15:12
talk about now. So, level two startup entrepreneur, what was I
15:16
thinking? Riding the roller coaster, you and maybe a handful
15:20
of helpers level three, so to be in level three, you must have
15:27
been in level two, which means that all of the requisites of
15:31
level two, like namely you've gone full time, need to be true
15:35
for level three as well, and in addition to that, you have to
15:41
have hired more than a handful of employees, so what is this
15:45
handful I've been talking about? It's very technical term, I
15:47
know, but it's somewhere between five and 15, and it varies based
15:53
on a whole bunch of circumstances, but here's what's
15:55
the same across all those circumstances, somewhere along
15:59
the way between bouts of pulling out your hair, usually you find
16:06
yourself asking what is wrong with these people, like what is
16:11
wrong with these people, because in level three you, this is
16:16
where you experience all the joys said facetiously of being a
16:22
reluctant manager. Welcome to the game. Super exciting,
16:25
reluctant manager, but that's what level three is like. I joke
16:30
about this often, but it's just true. Like, I've never met a
16:33
founder who launched their organization, did all the work
16:37
of getting to and through level two with the hope and ambition
16:42
of being able to lead a small team of people like that, that's
16:46
just I'm sure one exists somewhere, probably named Jeff,
16:50
you know, and he probably did a great job. Well done, Jeff, but
16:54
that's just not the way that most of us are cut out, the
16:59
internal wiring requirement that's necessary to get from one
17:02
to two is almost the opposite of what it takes to thrive from two
17:08
to three, and we're left with this question, What is wrong
17:13
with these people? And that actually might be the right
17:18
question for some of your folks. It's almost certainly the right
17:20
question.
17:21
You've probably hired some of the wrong people, but whether
17:25
you hired the wrong people or whether it's just a you problem,
17:29
either case, it's a you problem. You need to, at this stage,
17:32
learn what the right people are, so that you can hire them, and
17:35
you need to learn how to manage those people, because they need
17:39
to be managed in a way that you do not want to be managed, and
17:44
to some extent you might not even be able to imagine wanting
17:47
to be managed, but they're, they're different than you, they
17:50
should be different than you, otherwise they'd be competing
17:52
with you, and that's not what we want, we want a team that's
17:54
working with us, and they need to be managed differently than
17:57
us, so that's level three, you're asking, you've got a
18:00
handful of people, you're full time, and you're thinking,
18:04
what's wrong with these people? They're just driving you crazy,
18:07
they're driving you crazy. That brings us to level four. Now,
18:13
level four again, it's going to build on all the rest. So, we've
18:16
gone full time, we've got more than a handful of people, we've
18:19
actually got more than a handful of a handful of people, and to
18:24
be in level four, you're likely going to be somewhere between 15
18:30
and 45 people. Now that's a pretty big range, given that the
18:34
first range was like one to five, the second range was five
18:37
to 15. We get to a pretty big range here, 15 to 45 people, and
18:41
a lot of things change in an organization during that window,
18:44
and that's not a literal window either. Some folks might not get
18:47
there until 25 some might stay in it until they're 7580 I've
18:52
seen in level four. The these are just kind of guidelines, but
18:57
it's a, it's a rough way of getting a sense for for where
19:01
you might be, but basically, why that 15 to 45 matters is because
19:07
what's going on is that you're trying now to lead through other
19:11
leaders, that that's that's a different game, and you're
19:17
realizing at the same time, because of how challenging that
19:21
is, and because of a lot of stuff that comes with scaling
19:23
and growth, that that the whole growing and scaling thing is not
19:28
anywhere near as great as you thought, and what's so difficult
19:33
about this stage, and it's genuinely where my heart goes
19:36
out the most, is level four folks, I enjoy working with them
19:40
the most, because I feel the pain that they're going through.
19:43
For many folks, three is a really tough stage, but four is
19:46
the worst out of all of them. Sorry, level, and here's, here's
19:51
why, because so much about level four is so good, like, by, by
19:59
most men. Measures that we would use to determine success. You're
20:03
more successful than ever. You probably have higher revenue
20:07
than ever. You have greater brand recognition than ever.
20:11
You're being celebrated externally more than ever. Your
20:15
group of peers all envy you more than ever. Your folks have
20:21
magazine articles written about them at this level. You might
20:24
even be more profitable, at least in terms of dollar amount,
20:27
than you have ever at parts of this stage. However, the
20:33
disillusioned leader levels is level four that we're talking
20:36
about, that profitability tends to decline pretty rapidly
20:39
somewhere in this this level and what's going on there is a
20:50
there's a certain amount of illusion meant that that is
20:54
necessary to approach and survive the earlier levels of
21:01
this process, just honestly, if you're going to go from level
21:06
one to level two, you got about an 80% chance of failing at
21:09
that. That's pretty high, which means that you have to be
21:14
somewhat illusioned to think that you're the guy or the girl
21:18
who's going to be in the 20% right, like 80% don't start that
21:23
journey thinking that they're gonna fail. 100% of us believe
21:27
that we're going to succeed, when in fact 100% of us would
21:31
probably be better off believing that we won't succeed, because
21:34
that's far more likely.
21:35
Eight to two, and so there's a, there's an illusionment that
21:39
happens there, there's an illusionment that happens in
21:43
level three, where we think, well, if I can just get to this
21:45
point, this frustration stuff's gonna go away, if I can reach my
21:53
first $10 million or if I can make my first million dollar
21:56
profit, or if we can open our eighth location, or if I can
22:00
just have a better COO, or or something, there's some
22:04
milestone that we think's gonna fix this thing, because while
22:11
we'll brag about how everything's working inside, we
22:13
kind of feel like it's fundamentally broken, and and
22:17
this is that that level four, and what happens here is we get
22:21
those things and they don't work. We do what we used to do
22:24
and things get worse, and what happens is we start to lose
22:29
those illusions, which sounds like a good thing, but it
22:31
doesn't feel like a good thing. Like when your hopes and dreams
22:35
feel like they're being ripped from your soul, that's not a
22:37
pleasant experience. And what it leads us to is this question,
22:41
like, is this it? Is this as far as it goes? And if you feel that
22:46
way, you're far from alone. In my experience, for founders,
22:50
this is the hardest level, but it doesn't have to stop here,
22:53
because the next level is level five, and this is what I call
22:59
the chief executive level, and here's the difference between
23:02
level four and level five, outside of just how they feel.
23:05
In level five, you finally have at least, and usually more than
23:12
one true executive on your team. And for folks who've never had
23:17
an executive on your team, it's really difficult to articulate
23:19
what that feels like, but every client I've seen go through this
23:23
transition of having a bunch of leaders, a bunch of helpers to a
23:26
bunch of leaders to getting that first like true bona fide like
23:31
executive caliber leader on their team, it is night and day,
23:36
it's night and day, and it allows you to lead an enterprise
23:40
larger than you ever could in level four, you're not limited
23:44
to 4555 75 employees, team members. There's there's not
23:49
really a cap. There's some pretty freaking big
23:52
organizations out there that are led by level five founders, and
23:58
what's really wonderful about this level as a founder is that
24:03
not the weight of every decision is not on your shoulders
24:05
anymore, and in fact you, your job really in a positive way
24:10
shrinks to something like the three to five most important
24:15
decisions that need to be made in a year, your job focus
24:19
refocuses not on how do we solve the fires of this year to how do
24:24
we set ourselves up for success next year and the following
24:27
year, and the the the change, the dramatic change of the
24:35
busyness and frenetic energy of level four gives way to a quiet
24:40
office more often than you'd think, which leads to this
24:45
really strange but deep question of Who am I. That's the big
24:49
question in level five. If I'm not necessary for every part of
24:52
my organization to thrive, if it can continue to succeed without
24:58
me having to drag it there. Like, what does that mean about
25:01
who I am, and that's a big question we have to wrestle with
25:04
in level five. All right, I gotta move these a little
25:06
faster. Level six, eventually the time comes where you don't
25:10
need to step back, that's not the right language really at all
25:14
for this transition. It's time to step out. It's time to step
25:18
out of leading and hand the reins to another, and I'm going
25:22
to be clear on this visionary with a fresh vision for a
25:26
greater future for the organization. If you want to get
25:30
to the richest experience in level six, that's how we're
25:33
going to do it. It's not the only way, but it is by far the
25:35
best way. And at this level, you get to experience owning and not
25:40
running.
25:41
You might also sell the business and take on a different style of
25:47
ownership, like ownership in other assets that are not your
25:50
business, but basically this is the owner level, and in the
25:55
owner level, when we're not operating, we're not leading,
26:01
you thought you had time in level five, you've got time in
26:05
level six, and it leads founders to ask the question, like, well,
26:08
now what do I do, and, and so that's the owner levels, where
26:14
we're investing, we're managing a portfolio, basically, but
26:18
we're not doing all of the work ourselves anymore, or even
26:22
leading the people that do, and then finally there's level
26:25
seven. It's a visionary founder level, where you have all the
26:28
financial and time freedom, so that you don't need to work
26:32
anymore. In fact, in level seven, we don't even need an
26:36
ROI, an ROI anymore. Instead, level seven, we are as close as
26:43
possible to wholly invested in our legacy, because what we're
26:48
really doing in level seven is answering the question, what do
26:51
I want to leave behind, and you're doing that with a level
26:55
of asset and richness that allows you to like make a really
27:02
significant impact, so chew on those for a little bit.
27:06
Hopefully, you've been able to narrow it down to just one, and
27:09
and it is just one. You're only in one level at a time, at least
27:14
one level per enterprise that you lead as a founder, and and a
27:21
couple things, you can't skip a level, so again, what that means
27:25
is we've killed two birds with one stone. If you know what
27:28
level you're in, then that means you know what level's next. And
27:31
so the option really comes down to, do I continue to learn to
27:34
thrive in my current level, or is it time for me to evolve to
27:38
the next one? And that's the question that we're going to
27:42
answer in this series, we've, we've spent another episode on,
27:48
on this topic in particular, so for the sake of time, and to not
27:52
over teach it, one of the big things we're going to come back
27:58
to a lot is just in general, how do you think about which level
28:03
you want, and the answer is not the biggest one, right? Most of
28:09
the time, when we see there's seven levels, well, then
28:11
obviously I want the seventh level, and that's going to be
28:14
true for something less than 1% of the population, both because
28:17
it's really hard to do, but also because it's just not right for
28:20
most folks, and so in episode 363 which is going to be in the
28:25
show notes, there's a whole episode on what I believe is the
28:33
North Star for this decision for you, and that is what is your
28:37
vision for the organization, so you want to build the
28:40
organization to this, the lowest or earliest level that you can,
28:46
while still meeting your vision for the organization, and, and
28:50
so we're going to talk about what that looks like in
28:52
practical terms at each of these transition points. Let me end
28:57
with this sneak peek at what's coming, and how to use this
29:02
series, because one of the challenges of podcasting in
29:06
general, but being true to the model, is that really, if we do
29:12
this right, only one of the remaining episodes in this
29:15
series is going to matter for you. Now, you might gain
29:18
something from all of them, you might have a lot of fun
29:20
listening to them. We'd love to have you there. Send me messages
29:23
about how much you love them. It makes me feel warm inside. I'm
29:26
just kidding. But really, what you want to do is keep an eye
29:32
out for the one episode in the series that's coming up that
29:36
applies to the transition point that you're at. So, if you're in
29:38
level one, you're going to pay attention to the next episode,
29:41
episode two in the series, where we talk about whether or not you
29:45
should really start your own organization, or if you can make
29:49
life a lot easier by doing it through an existing one. If you
29:53
are looking at getting into level three, right, so you're in
29:56
level two, thinking about level three, then episode three is for
29:59
you.
29:59
Where we're going to talk about whether you should hire and
30:03
manage a whole team or if you can shift to higher leverage
30:07
work and keep it simple. Then we're going to go level three,
30:10
and for those that are thinking about level four, we're going to
30:14
look at should you hire other managers or can you actually get
30:18
the impact that you want with a small and mighty team of 10 to
30:22
15 people that you can easily lead on your own with just a few
30:26
skills from a management perspective. The following
30:29
episode, episode five in the series, is going to be on the
30:33
transition from level four to level five, and so if you're in
30:36
level four, you're really going to be asking the question,
30:40
Should you scale, or even more specifically, should you scale
30:44
your staff, because that's where most of the complexity tends to
30:48
come from, or can you lead an organization that really is just
30:52
the right size to serve your market well, and and that's the
30:55
real question between levels four and level five. Levels four
30:59
and five. Level five, we will ask. This can be the sixth
31:03
episode in the series, because we're talking about whether or
31:07
not you should go to level six right now, and that is, should
31:10
you really step down and let someone else carry the vision,
31:14
so you can chase something bigger. Do you know what you're
31:18
going to, or is the one organization that you're already
31:21
leading enough for you to thrive now, or for the next 345 years,
31:25
at least. And then the final episode in the series, we're
31:29
going to talk about the transition from level six to
31:32
level seven, and we're going to say we're going to answer the
31:36
question, Should you really push, push past ownership,
31:39
right? This thing that you've worked so hard to create, this
31:43
wealth that you've created. Should we push beyond that being
31:47
the milestone for you and start working on building a legacy
31:50
that shapes the world you leave behind, or can you just fulfill
31:54
that vision through the companies that you own? Because
31:58
there's no problem with staying in level six if you don't need
32:01
to get to level seven, so stay tuned. We're going to be going
32:05
through these. I, you know, to be honest, don't know what the
32:09
release cycle is going to be. We might stagger them, we might put
32:13
them all in order. I don't entirely know yet, but it'll
32:17
probably be about one a week. And, and for those episodes that
32:20
don't apply to you, obviously, again, you're welcome to listen
32:24
to them, but what would be super helpful would be if you know
32:28
someone who you think might be in that level, share it with
32:32
them, like especially if you go back and listen to them, like,
32:36
man, I wish I had this five years ago, 10 years ago, 30
32:39
years ago. Then give it to someone else who's there now, it
32:43
could change their life forever. Most of you know, podcast
32:46
changed my life, and I hope that this, this can for you and, and
32:50
your friend as well. With that, I know this episode went longer
32:54
than usual, and I promise I'm gonna try and keep the rest of
32:58
these as short as possible. But all that's because you know your
33:02
time and attention mean the world to us. I hope in this
33:05
episode you got a little more clarity than you had before, and
33:09
I can't wait to see you next time. Take care. Hey everyone,
33:13
Scotty Timer here. Thank you so much for listening to the Start
33:17
Scale and Succeed podcast. I hope this episode gave you
33:20
exactly what you need for the level you're in right now, if
33:24
you want to discover what level you're in, take our 10 question
33:28
founders evolution quiz for free@foundersquiz.com That's
33:31
foundersquiz.com It'll pinpoint exactly where you are and give
33:35
you tailored tips to move forward and reach that next
33:38
level in your journey as a founder. If you got something
33:42
out of today's episode, don't forget to subscribe, rate, or
33:46
review. It helps us reach more founders like you. And let's be
33:49
honest, it means a ton to me, my team, and all our incredible
33:53
guests. So, keep starting, scaling, and succeeding, and
33:57
I'll see you in the next episode.