Latest / The Action Catalyst / The Inside Innovator, with Louis Gump (Entrepreneurship, Business, Innovation, Digital Media)

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The Inside Innovator, with Louis Gump (Entrepreneurship, Business, Innovation, Digital Media) · The Action Catalyst

0:00
Stephanie Maas: Hi, it's super nice to meet you.
0:55
Louis Gump: Likewise, Stephanie. It's nice to meet you.
0:57
Stephanie Maas: So where are you calling in from?
1:00
Louis Gump: I am based in Atlanta, and I'm at my home
1:03
office right now, which got started during COVID. And it
1:08
seems to have been a second kind of work home since then, very
1:11
shortly after I started working at home or our son was taking
1:15
trumpet lessons. And I got on a work call. And all of a sudden,
1:20
I was upstairs at the time. And all of a sudden, this really
1:24
loud, middle school level trumpet playing started. And we
1:29
had to change that pretty fast. But that was a wake up call.
1:31
Stephanie Maas: Oh, my gosh, I love it. I love it. Well, I'm
1:34
super excited to talk with you. I will say, while I'm excited, I
1:39
am not going to hold it against you, that you went to Duke. I'm
1:43
a Tar Heel. Just want to caution that listeners that you know you
1:47
had a subpar education. So there's gonna be some limits here.
1:52
Louis Gump: Well, I do understand that. But on the
1:55
other hand, my wife and my dad and my mom and my brother and my
2:00
daughter now have been UNC students. And so we have a lot
2:04
of representation around here.
2:07
Stephanie Maas: Okay. So the first thing I want to jump in
2:10
right away, is a really want you to talk to us about this idea of
2:14
intrapreneurship versus entrepreneurialship. I think
2:17
most people are pretty familiar with the latter. But this
2:21
intrapreneurship might be a little bit new. So talk to us a
2:25
little bit about that.
2:27
Louis Gump: This is a really important distinction. And I
2:29
think it's sometimes under appreciated. You know,
2:32
entrepreneurship is critically important, and the value
2:36
generation and the genesis of new ideas. There's so much there
2:39
with entrepreneurship. And also in large companies, we find that
2:43
there's a lot of value creation and new ideas. And we have
2:47
focused so much in our society on entrepreneurship that
2:50
sometimes the value from within larger organizations kind of
2:53
lives in the shadows, it isn't that it's unknown, we see it all
2:57
the time, we, you know, when we're ordering online, and when
3:01
we're driving a car, you name it. There's all sorts of ways
3:04
that intrapreneurship affects us in our everyday lives. However,
3:08
what I'm finding, and what I've experienced is that
3:11
intrapreneurship is not simply derivative of entrepreneurship,
3:15
rather, they're cousins. And there are some distinct skill
3:18
sets that are required in intrapreneurship. To succeed.
3:22
Some of these are common with entrepreneurs, and some of them
3:25
are a little bit different. One of the distinguishing factors,
3:29
for example, is the size and complexity of the organizations
3:32
and the related skills that are required to navigate through.
3:36
For example, if you're an entrepreneur, and in general, I
3:39
think of that as someone who owns a company or has started a
3:43
company, or both, they tend to have a lot of control over what
3:47
they do and how they do it. If you're an entrepreneur, you're
3:50
are by definition inside a larger organization. And the
3:54
entrepreneur is someone who creates value through innovation
3:57
and growth within a larger organization. And so you have
4:01
other structures, you might have a larger brand, or you certainly
4:04
have a lot more people any one of whom can affect your ability
4:08
to move forward. So there are quite a few differences. But
4:12
both are very important.
4:13
Stephanie Maas: So taking that just a little bit, are there can
4:16
you give me some real life examples of what
4:19
intrapreneurship looks like? Just to help further understand this?
4:23
Louis Gump: One of the examples that comes to mind immediately,
4:26
is what our team experienced at the Weather Channel, starting in
4:30
2001. And what happened was that the Weather Channel TV network,
4:33
of course, was very well known as one of the most trusted
4:37
brands in our country. And then the desktop web was taking off.
4:40
And so weather.com was very popular. And then some of us who
4:44
were working on weather.com, including myself, we also knew
4:47
that wireless had some possibility, but we didn't know
4:50
where it was going to go and we said, hey, we think wireless is
4:54
going to be big someday. This was before we even called it
4:57
mobile. And then we start Did building a first generation of
5:00
apps with technologies like Java and brew and windows and
5:04
Symbian, and that kind of worked, and we had a business
5:07
model, and we started generating some new revenue. And then we
5:10
built some video products. And we were kind of pretty active
5:14
with that for a while, and then mobile web came back around. And
5:17
when the browsing experience came, then we really built the
5:21
user base, the size of that, and then we figured out how to
5:24
monetize it. And so over a period of years, and with the
5:27
assistance of a lot of people, some of whom were dedicated, and
5:31
some of whom are elsewhere in the organization. And in the
5:34
industry, we created something that ultimately was a primary
5:38
value driver of the business, if you get something more current,
5:41
let's say, I don't know, a prototypical example might be
5:44
Amazon, you know, started out selling books, and then they
5:48
started out selling a lot of things. If you look at where
5:51
they generate a lot of their value these days, look at AWS,
5:54
Amazon Web Services. And so companies that do this, well
5:58
just have the ability to serve customers in new ways. And
6:01
obviously give team members opportunities in the process.
6:04
Stephanie Maas: So again, just drilling down a little bit
6:06
further. So who is the intrapreneurial? In those
6:09
scenarios? Is it you, because you are leading these teams? Is
6:13
it the boots on the ground coder, walk me through that one
6:17
level deeper.
6:17
Louis Gump: In general, it's a person who has a leadership
6:20
role, a lot of different people, and a lot of different roles can
6:24
be intrapreneurs. And so that the thing I want to emphasize
6:27
here is that you could be by role the owner of a business
6:30
unit, you could kind of as the way things unfold, you could be
6:33
responsible for an initiative, officially, or you can just be
6:37
doing it because that's who you are. And that's what the
6:40
opportunity is. So there are a lot of different ways to do it.
6:43
And another thing I want to mention here is that as I did my
6:47
research, I started thinking this was primarily in the
6:50
corporate environment. And then I realized, while speaking with
6:53
some folks who are really talented builders, in the
6:56
nonprofit sector, that they identified with this, too, they
6:59
said, Hey, we've been building out new ways to serve, you know,
7:03
the people that we're focused on. And then I heard about this
7:06
in education. And you can go on from there. And so there's a
7:09
pretty broad playing field here. But the key is creating value
7:13
through innovation and growth. And if that's what you're doing,
7:16
you might be officially designated a leader, you might
7:19
create it, but over time, it becomes pretty clear.
7:22
Stephanie Maas: Super cool. So walk us through one of the
7:24
things you said earlier was this skill set between an
7:27
entrepreneurial and intrapreneurial tend to be different?
7:30
Louis Gump: Sure, so what I'd like to do is to start with the
7:33
top five characteristics of Intrapreneurs, some of which are
7:36
shared, and some of which are a little bit different, at least
7:40
in degree. The first one that I found it came up over and over
7:43
again, in fact, maybe in every single interview I did is
7:46
curiosity, an intrapreneur needs to be willing to explore needs
7:49
to be willing to go to places that people haven't gone to
7:53
before. In general, this comes from within, yeah, maybe you can
7:56
train it, but a lot of the times is just how you're wired. The
7:59
second one is action oriented. And this one is critically
8:02
important. Because it's one thing to be curious, but also to
8:06
you know, enjoy tinkering and playing around with things and
8:09
just for the discovery, nothing wrong with that. But if somebody
8:12
is going to be an intrapreneur, they need to be able to make
8:15
things happen, they need to be able to build, they need to be
8:19
able to engage other people. Which brings me to the third
8:22
characteristic. And this one is especially important for
8:25
intrapreneurs, the ability to build bridges. If you're an
8:28
entrepreneur, it helps if you can build bridges, it's a great
8:31
idea. But it's possible to have an idea and some funding and to
8:35
build it in a relatively small space, and then introduce it to
8:38
the world. And if your product or service is good enough, you
8:41
can really go to town with that. But if you're an intrapreneur,
8:45
it doesn't work that way. In general, what you're going to
8:48
see is that you have dozens, maybe even hundreds of people
8:51
that you rely on or could rely on within the organization, and
8:54
any one of them could stop you. Therefore, you're going to have
8:58
to be able to build bridges, not only in quantity, but also with
9:01
different types of people of people who are functionally in
9:04
different places people have, you know, introverts extroverts,
9:08
work closer work farther, you name it. And so someone who can
9:11
do that really well, sometimes inside the company and outside
9:14
the company, when you can do that, that makes a big
9:17
difference for a successful intrapreneur. Next, someone
9:20
who's risk tolerant, but this one is interesting. Also, a lot
9:23
of entrepreneurs are highly risk tolerant. They're like, Hey, I'm
9:27
gonna go do it. I can do this on my own. If it works, and I hope
9:30
it does. That's great. And if not, you know, I can live with
9:33
that. But someone who's an intrapreneur has to be risk
9:36
tolerant. But on the other hand, they often like having the
9:39
resources, the air cover of a larger organization, that is
9:43
something that's really valuable. So you can kind of hit
9:46
just the right spot. And what I find also is that some people at
9:49
different stages of their careers are interested in doing
9:52
one versus the other. So risk tolerance is not static, it can
9:55
change over time. And lastly, someone who's optimistic in
9:58
terms of the top five, someone who can and navigate through the
10:02
ups and downs that are inevitable and say, I think we
10:05
can do this, I have a vision, let's bring people together. But
10:08
it's not blind optimism. It's grounded optimism is someone
10:11
who's realistic, they understand what's possible. So if you have
10:15
those five characteristics, and then you understand that you're
10:18
in a larger organization, as opposed to having a lot more
10:21
control that when you can find some of the most successful intrapreneurs.
10:25
Stephanie Maas: So you're chugging along in your career,
10:27
how do you know? Am I best suited to be an intrapreneur? Am
10:31
I better suited to be an entrepreneur? I mean, how do you
10:34
know?
10:35
Louis Gump: Some of this is self knowledge. But some of it is
10:38
discovery the way you described it over time, I didn't set out
10:41
to be an intrapreneur. And at the same time, I didn't, I
10:44
didn't use wording like that, I just said, Hey, I'd like to go
10:48
help people build businesses. And I love to work with talented
10:51
teams. Turns out, those are two pretty good signs that you might
10:55
be fulfilled as an intrapreneur. Another one is the environment
10:58
you find yourself in, because you have to match someone who is
11:02
naturally wired to be an intrapreneur. With the right
11:05
timing, but you also have to find the right environment,
11:08
there is very little that's more frustrating to an intrapreneur
11:11
than someone who has a great idea. You can see it, you can
11:15
feel it, you can taste it. And then you're in an organization
11:18
which says now sorry, we're busy, we have other priorities,
11:21
no, we're not going to do that. Or you need to do that somewhere
11:25
else, or something along those lines. Opportunities can grow
11:28
out of that, but it doesn't really allow an intrapreneur to
11:32
flourish. So what I find is that when you have the self
11:35
knowledge, and then you find the right organization, that helps a
11:38
lot. And then here's one more that's critically important, a
11:42
great boss, you know, when you have someone who can be your
11:45
advocate, who can be your mentor, call up the department
11:48
over there that might be not quite available. They're nice
11:51
people, but they're just busy, and say, Hey, could you please
11:55
help my team member, as they're exploring this opportunity to go
11:58
into a new market, I would really appreciate it and it
12:02
would be good for the company. When that happens. Intrapreneurs
12:05
essentially get the green light to move ahead and they get the
12:09
support they need. One of the really great things about being
12:12
an intrapreneur is you've have access to resources. And this is
12:15
different from many entrepreneurs, because you can
12:18
go to the marketing department, you can go to strategic
12:21
planning, you can go to the research department, you can go
12:25
to HR, you can go to accounting, you name it, and they can give
12:28
you support. And so the person who is able to essentially bring
12:32
together people in what I think of as a round table to make
12:35
something happen, you're on the path to potential greatness.
12:38
Stephanie Maas: Walk me through the genesis of the book, your
12:41
vision, and just a couple of highlights on the end product.
12:45
Louis Gump: Sure. So I'll start with the goals, I have three
12:48
goals with this book to help people achieve more, build
12:52
stronger relationships, and increase personal fulfillment
12:55
through intrapreneurship. And so everything that I've done with
12:59
this book is related to that simple sentence. And the Genesis
13:02
book was about five years ago, I had been very fortunate to work
13:06
with some amazing companies like the Weather Channel and CNN, we
13:10
had a small company called news on that grew in a year from a
13:14
company without even a name to being one of the top five
13:17
providers of news and information on Roku. And we did
13:20
that with the partnership of a number of local broadcasting
13:24
companies. So as I did that, it became clear to me, Hey, where's
13:28
the resource for people who do this? Because I'm here to tell
13:31
you, Stephanie, our teams have had a lot of success. But we've
13:35
messed up plenty of things too. And some of the things that we
13:39
didn't get right, were easily avoidable. They were
13:42
predictable. I was like, where's the concise guide for that, but
13:46
I didn't find a book on this topic. So it looked like there
13:49
was a gap. And so for about five years, I was thinking about it.
13:53
And I the interest kept growing. In August of 2022. I left a Cox
13:57
media amazing company, in part of cox communications. And a
14:00
couple of months in, I thought, hey, maybe now is the time to
14:04
write that book, when is a better time to write the book?
14:07
And my answer was never. And I wanted it to be a practical
14:11
guide, not theoretical, and also not something that was really
14:15
narrative about my story. The important point is that there
14:18
are certain things that intrapreneurs can do to increase
14:21
their ability to be successful and happy. And so the first
14:25
three chapters are about essentially building the
14:28
foundation and understanding if you're the right person
14:31
personality type to do this, and if so, how you find an
14:34
opportunity in the right environment, and then the second
14:38
half is making it happen.
14:39
Stephanie Maas: That is so exciting. Give us a teaser,
14:42
what are a couple things that oh gosh, in hindsight, that was
14:46
totally avoidable, etc, etc.
14:48
Louis Gump: Sure. So a lot of them are with people. When
14:52
someone is driving change and all intrapreneurs are driving
14:55
change. That's just part of it as part of innovation. It's easy
14:59
to To be in a situation where you have some challenges with
15:05
other people, someone owns a certain department or area or
15:08
someone thinks that something works one way, which is fine for
15:12
what they've been doing in the past, but it might not work as
15:15
well for the future and that sort of thing. And it's easy to
15:18
get impatient, you know, intrapreneurs sometimes are a
15:21
little impatient, they want to get going, they want to make it
15:23
happen. But what can happen there, and I've done this far
15:26
too many times is, in my eagerness to get going, I failed
15:30
to listen well enough to the knowledge of someone else. And
15:35
then maybe, you know, in the spirit of candor, I was a little
15:38
too direct, as opposed to just trying to understand more. And
15:42
so I think active listening skills are critically important,
15:45
I talk about this some in the book, you're not a basketball
15:48
coach, you're in a meeting room, I say that literally in the
15:50
book, because I've tried several times, to draw from some of my
15:55
favorite, you know, basketball coaches, some of whom are really
15:59
amazing leaders. And, you know, if you go in there, and you say,
16:02
hey, I need you to do this, not that, and you step back on the
16:06
listening, that might work on the basketball court, but it
16:09
doesn't work. So in the meeting room, if you forget that, and I
16:12
have from time to time, you'll get a reminder really fast. On
16:15
the other hand, if you do take the time to listen and make sure
16:19
that the respect that is intended is received, then a
16:22
whole lot of really great things happen. Here's another one, I'm
16:26
going to use digital media for this example, because I've
16:29
experienced it but but there are lots of other examples in other
16:31
industries, where you have a technology that works for one
16:35
generation of services, but it doesn't work for the next. And
16:40
companies often try to be really efficient, instead of optimizing
16:45
for the next thing that's coming. And it is possible, for
16:48
example, to take a platform in a big company and say, Hey, we've
16:52
already paid for the platform, we don't want to pay more, we
16:56
don't want to train up new people. So let's just try to use
16:58
that for this new and innovative thing. Sometimes that works.
17:02
Sometimes it's brilliant, but sometimes it doesn't. And so
17:05
it's very important to understand what the goals are.
17:09
And then to assess an existing technology for future purpose,
17:13
not an existing technology for efficiency.
17:16
Stephanie Maas: I want to shift gears ever so slightly if I
17:19
could, and talk a little bit about this idea of
17:24
intrapreneurial roles, training the next generation of leaders.
17:27
So I'd really love to hear you talk a little bit about the
17:30
thoughts around these intrapreneurial is really
17:33
training up that next generation leader.
17:34
Louis Gump: Sure. So some of the findings in the book, for me
17:38
were pretty predictable, like intrapreneurs, create value
17:41
inside organizations. I've known it, I've seen it. But on the
17:45
other hand, one of the ones that I didn't see coming quite as
17:49
clearly until talking with a bunch of folks, is this
17:52
importance of intrapreneurship to the next generation of
17:56
leaders. As I was doing some research for this podcast, I saw
17:59
that Southwestern also focuses on training up the next
18:03
generation of leaders, I was really interested in that. And I
18:07
hope sometime to ask a bunch of questions about how y'all do it
18:11
too. But in this context, I heard story after story about
18:14
how a really talented person who already is wired naturally, to
18:18
be a successful intrapreneur is given an opportunity, they're
18:22
typically given an opportunity for one of two reasons. Either
18:26
the situation they're in brings about a need, they see it, and
18:30
with others, they move forward. And they address that need in
18:33
the process, some really cool things happen. The second one is
18:37
when a senior leader or a more senior leader within the
18:41
organization says you know, this person has a lot of promise, we
18:45
need to give them a good opportunity to expand their
18:48
skill set. Either one can work, there is a woman here in
18:52
Atlanta, and she's mentioned in the book, she was a legal team
18:56
member at Turner Broadcasting. And Turner bought a company and
18:59
they needed some people to help shepherd it through and turn it
19:03
into something that worked inside the company, essentially
19:07
to integrate it. And she was put on the integration team. And she
19:11
learned so much there that she told me I added value from a
19:15
legal perspective and with her legal expertise. But what really
19:19
happened is that she became a general manager through that
19:22
process. And by becoming a general manager, she became much
19:26
better as a legal leader and a much more valuable asset to the
19:30
company and ultimately was one of the most senior leaders of
19:34
that company. And she's now chief legal officer of a company
19:38
that I you know, the valuation has a whole bunch of zeros on
19:41
it. I found examples like that over and over and over again.
19:45
Stephanie Maas: That is so exciting to hear. Part of what
19:48
I'm hearing you communicate is the last five to eight years.
19:51
What I feel like I've witnessed is to your point, folks are
19:55
really embracing that. Hey, my role now is to Look for those
19:59
that are wired a certain way and make sure that they have the
20:03
opportunities, or as a leader step into a mentor type of
20:06
relationship, what have been your observations around that?
20:10
Louis Gump: I think that awareness has increased broadly
20:14
about the importance of training up the next generation of
20:17
leaders, I was fortunate enough kind of from early on, to work
20:21
with people who helped many others, including me to grow.
20:27
And so the environments that I was in, sometimes had people who
20:33
were what I would consider to be very enlightened and supportive
20:36
from the beginning. But in other places, you know, it was all
20:39
about just getting the job done. Like we don't have the time, we
20:42
don't have the budget, we have a job to do, let's go get that
20:45
next sale, let's go ship that next ocean container, let's
20:48
produce that next story, whatever it is. And you know,
20:52
there's a balance, the operational aspect of things I
20:55
think we all would agree is important. But I think you're
20:58
onto something there with this increased awareness, and
21:01
sometimes increased tools, and increased availability of
21:05
coaches and whatnot, I'm seeing much more consistent
21:08
availability of leadership training, and really big
21:12
opportunities for people to grow. From my perspective, if a
21:16
leader is focused on protecting their own their own job, like
21:20
it's understandable that we all have interest, but at the end of
21:23
the day, from my perspective, the primary focus of a leader
21:26
should be on contribution, not on self. If you focus on
21:31
contribution, then a lot of other good things tend to
21:33
happen, especially if you're an environment that's conducive to
21:37
that. And so I'm finding leaders who have said, Hey, I'm
21:41
allocating a certain amount of time to mentoring people. I'm
21:44
finding leaders who are saying, well, yeah, we have a limited
21:48
budget, but I want to let you go to this conference, because it
21:50
would be a really helpful thing for you, and on and on and on.
21:54
Stephanie Maas: And do you see that shift for those who are
21:56
willing to make it or embrace it, contribute to what you what
22:01
else you talked about in the personal fulfillment?
22:03
Louis Gump: 100%, people often have some awareness of their
22:08
talents and their strengths. And I think a great boss, a great
22:14
manager will try to be aware of other people's strengths, and
22:18
then feed those. I also think for each of us as individuals,
22:22
if we have self awareness, and we can help show how we can
22:26
contribute, that kind of invites people to find ways to support
22:30
so I think it's a two way street. It's not just kind of
22:33
leadership somewhere else, it's also us. And if we have that
22:36
knowledge, and if we feed it, goodness knows there are a lot
22:38
of different ways to grow. And oh, by the way, some of them do
22:41
require dollars. Some of them require a trip or a training
22:44
program or an experience, but some of them are pretty simple
22:48
learning and conversation.
22:49
Stephanie Maas: So I have a little bit of a serious
22:51
question. Obviously, you've had a tremendously successful career
22:56
to date. And now this book coming out, which I think it's
23:00
going to be just incredible for folks, do you ever wonder how
23:04
much better or how much more you could achieved if you had gone
23:09
to Carolina? This has been super, super interesting.
23:12
Anything else? We haven't talked about that you want to make?
23:17
Sure we do before I let you go?
23:19
Louis Gump: So there were four takeaways that I had from the
23:23
book for your listeners. If they don't take anything else away,
23:27
and they're interested in the topic, then the first thing that
23:31
I found consistently, is that intrapreneurs push established
23:36
organizations to adapt. There's a great story from an
23:40
entrepreneur and intrapreneur named Quint Studer who says,
23:42
Look, sometimes intrapreneurs are viewed as disruptors, or you
23:47
know, their questions, hey, do they understand what our company
23:49
is about? But actually, the question ought to be, how can we
23:53
harness the value and perspective of these team
23:56
members, because often, they're seeing things that provide a lot
24:00
of value for the future. So in an organization that's really
24:03
healthy, and understands how to adapt, then they're going to
24:06
welcome the contributions of Intrapreneurs. Next, and we
24:09
already talked about it. So I'll mentioned it briefly here.
24:12
Intrapreneurs train the next generation of leaders just over
24:15
and over and over again, I saw that it's not the only place for
24:17
training the next generation, but as disproportionately large
24:21
next intrapreneurs create transformative growth
24:24
opportunities for entrepreneurs. And we haven't really talked
24:27
about this one here today. There's a whole lot to say about
24:31
it. But a short story is that I found in my own experience, and
24:34
through writing this book, it became clear to me great
24:37
intrapreneurs usually don't have all the capabilities they need
24:41
inside their company. And so they look outside and often
24:44
entrepreneurs are solving similar problems. And when that
24:48
happens, intrapreneurs can provide breakthrough
24:50
opportunities for entrepreneurs, and entrepreneurs can provide
24:53
the capabilities and the people power that intrapreneurs would
24:57
take years to develop. So it's symbiotic. And the last thing
25:01
that I would mention is that intrapreneurs drive a large
25:04
portion of the value creation within organization. Again, not
25:06
the only source, but a lot of it, especially the new value
25:10
creation. And, you know, there's a simple statement that I use to
25:14
summarize this intrapreneurs activate innovation.
25:18
Stephanie Maas: It's a powerful statement.
25:20
Louis Gump: Thank you.
25:21
Stephanie Maas: Fascinating. Thank you so much for your time.
25:24
Just really appreciate you carving out some time to be with
25:27
us today.
25:27
Louis Gump: Oh, it's completely my pleasure. Thanks for taking
25:30
the time, Stephanie. I've loved being here.