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The Significance Factor (with Dr. Wayne Pernell) · The Daily Writer

0:04
SPEAKER_00: Hey friends, welcome to episode 124 of the Smart Business Writing Podcast.
0:10
SPEAKER_00: I'm your host, Kent Sanders, and this is the show dedicated to helping you share your message, increase your impact, and grow your business through the power of writing.
0:20
SPEAKER_00: I was talking to a friend the other day and he said, I can't believe it's already the year 2020.
0:25
SPEAKER_00: It seems like it turned the year 2000 just yesterday.
0:30
SPEAKER_00: And indeed, it does seem hard to believe that the whole Y2K hysteria was 20 years ago.
0:36
SPEAKER_00: That's crazy.
0:37
SPEAKER_00: Well, one of the common themes that you'll hear associated with the year 2020 is the concept of vision.
0:43
SPEAKER_00: It's a play on words because, of course, 2020 refers to perfect eyesight as well as the year that just started.
0:50
SPEAKER_00: And I can't think of a better guest to help us think about the power of vision and seeing what our lives can become.
0:56
SPEAKER_00: His name is Dr.
0:57
SPEAKER_00: Wayne Purnell, and he's going to walk us through some ways to increase the power of our lives through what he calls the significance factor.
1:05
SPEAKER_00: And I think you're going to love this really powerful conversation.
1:09
SPEAKER_00: Before we get into the interview, though, I want to mention that today's episode is brought to you by Convert Kit.
1:15
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1:20
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1:25
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1:32
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2:04
SPEAKER_00: To take advantage of the special offer and start your free 30-day trial with ConvertKit, go to KentSanders.net slash ConvertKit.
2:13
SPEAKER_00: Alright, let's get on to today's episode.
2:15
SPEAKER_00: As I mentioned, Dr.
2:16
SPEAKER_00: Wayne Purnell, who's also known as simply Dr.
2:20
SPEAKER_00: P, is a highly sought speaker and number one international best selling author with five books, and also a global high performance executive coach who brings more than 35 years of experience in helping leaders set new strategic targets, gain clarity and confidence, and attained heightened success.
2:40
SPEAKER_00: He's been a guest on countless podcasts and has been on television around the country, and he's also contributed to publications such as Fast Company, Entrepreneur, The New York Times, and others.
2:52
SPEAKER_00: After earning his doctorate in clinical psychology, Dr.
2:56
SPEAKER_00: Purnell began working with leaders across a broad array of organizations, including Schwab, 3Com, Whole Foods Market, and AAA, in addition to running a$6.5 million organization and holding executive level positions in organization development.
3:13
SPEAKER_00: In our conversation on this episode, you'll hear about a life-transforming moment that he experienced around pizza of all things, his approach to writing, why the significance factor is such an important topic, and also his Starts with One movement, which I'm a huge fan of.
3:30
SPEAKER_00: Make sure to check out the show notes at KentSanders.net slash one two four.
3:35
SPEAKER_00: All right, let's get to the conversation with Dr.
3:38
SPEAKER_00: Wayne Purnell.
3:40
SPEAKER_00: Well, Wayne, thanks so much for being on the show today.
3:42
SPEAKER_00: I really appreciate you taking time to do this.
3:44
SPEAKER_00: I've been looking forward to this interview, and I'm really grateful for our mutual friend Trisha Brook for connecting us.
3:50
SPEAKER_00: So thank you once again.
3:52
SPEAKER_01: What a what an amazing time to be connecting.
3:54
SPEAKER_01: This is great kind of Yeah.
3:56
SPEAKER_00: One of the things, and I've mentioned this on the show before, that I love about podcasting is for me as a podcast, a podcaster and a podcast host, is that it gives you an excuse to reach out to people and have conversations about things.
4:09
SPEAKER_00: So I love the format of it and have been really looking forward to this conversation for the last few weeks since we were able to schedule it.
4:16
SPEAKER_01: Me too.
4:18
SPEAKER_01: And as you said, Trisha's amazing too.
4:20
SPEAKER_00: So really on this episode, I'd like to really dive into the connection between leadership significance and writing.
4:27
SPEAKER_00: But first, and the listeners will have already heard, I'm I I will record this later, but they will have already heard a brief bio of you in my intro up front in the podcast.
4:36
SPEAKER_00: But give us a little bit more of your background, maybe some things that I didn't cover in the introduction.
4:41
SPEAKER_00: And I know that there's something life-changing about pizza that you mentioned, and I'm dying to hear what this is all about.
4:47
SPEAKER_01: Awesome.
4:47
SPEAKER_01: All right.
4:48
SPEAKER_01: So my background is clinical psych.
4:52
SPEAKER_01: Shortly after getting my doctorate, I took a left turn into business and I began doing uh I began doing coaching in the business arena.
5:00
SPEAKER_01: Um where I was basically I'm helping business leaders set their strategy, their direction, etc., by focusing on values and by focusing on their vision first.
5:14
SPEAKER_01: And that really helps leadership, whether you're leading at home, whether you're leading in a corporate setting, or even leading yourself, knowing your values.
5:24
SPEAKER_01: Well, this thing about pizza, the funny that you should ask.
5:28
SPEAKER_01: This this was my turnaround for me.
5:31
SPEAKER_01: I was consulting, I was big and powerful in the world, and yet so much was going wrong.
5:40
SPEAKER_01: I was 42 when my life pretty much turned upside down.
5:45
SPEAKER_01: I was on the verge of bankruptcy, I was on the verge of losing my job, even though I was consulting.
5:55
SPEAKER_01: And um and my uh my marriage wasn't going so well at that point either.
6:02
SPEAKER_01: And and I needed to get away.
6:05
SPEAKER_01: My head was in the space of, oh my gosh, now what?
6:09
SPEAKER_01: I flew to my brother's house.
6:10
SPEAKER_01: He lived in Nevada.
6:11
SPEAKER_01: Jeff is um 12 years younger than I am, so growing up, he never really got a chance to help me.
6:19
SPEAKER_01: And so as an adult, now going and reaching out to him, he was ecstatic that I was there.
6:25
SPEAKER_01: Um, you'll have to tell me if I have to stop my cat from doing anything that's unseemly.
6:30
SPEAKER_00: Oh, oh no, because this is just an audio podcast anyway.
6:33
SPEAKER_00: So I love the cat, it's great entertainment value.
6:36
SPEAKER_00: I've got one of my own here in the background, too.
6:38
SPEAKER_01: That's great.
6:39
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
6:40
SPEAKER_01: So um because we could see each other, and and I I didn't know if our if our audience could see us as well.
6:49
SPEAKER_01: So gotcha.
6:50
SPEAKER_01: No, no, they can just hear us.
6:52
SPEAKER_01: All right, so I've got a cat in the background.
6:54
SPEAKER_01: So I flew to my brother's house.
6:56
SPEAKER_01: I'm working on trying to figure out my life, and I'm sitting on the living room rug, uh, pulling at the strands of shag carpeting.
7:07
SPEAKER_01: It was uh that that's gonna date this story, right?
7:10
SPEAKER_01: So I'm sort of rocking back and forth, pulling at the strands of shag carpeting, and um my brother comes in and he's like, Burrata! He's all excited.
7:27
SPEAKER_01: And he's like, Hey, I'm so glad you're here.
7:29
SPEAKER_01: I'm so glad you're here, I'm so glad you're here.
7:31
SPEAKER_01: I'm like, okay, okay, okay, okay.
7:32
SPEAKER_01: I'm trying to be depressed, so uh, so just like settle.
7:36
SPEAKER_01: And he's like, I'm so glad you're here.
7:37
SPEAKER_01: Hey, what should we do?
7:38
SPEAKER_01: Should we get something?
7:39
SPEAKER_01: Should we get a pizza?
7:40
SPEAKER_01: Let's get a pizza.
7:40
SPEAKER_01: I'll tell you what, should we get a pizza?
7:42
SPEAKER_01: It's like, sure, let's get a pizza.
7:44
SPEAKER_01: I'm trying to figure out like my life, and he's trying to cheer me up.
7:49
SPEAKER_01: He's like, Great, and he jumps off to the kitchen and he picks up a phone book, which again dates this story, and he picks up the yellow corded phone from the wall, and he starts to punch in the number for the pizza parlor, and he calls to me from the kitchen, hey, hey, what do you like on your pizza?
8:09
SPEAKER_01: And I'm like, I don't, I don't know, pineapple and olives.
8:13
SPEAKER_01: And I gave him the answer that was the easy answer because that's what the kids liked.
8:18
SPEAKER_01: So it was the go-along to get along answer.
8:21
SPEAKER_01: It was so easy.
8:22
SPEAKER_01: And he goes, Great, pineapple and olives.
8:25
SPEAKER_01: And it was at that point that it all sort of came together for me.
8:29
SPEAKER_01: And I burst into tears.
8:31
SPEAKER_01: He's like, What?
8:33
SPEAKER_01: He hangs up the phone, he comes over to me, he puts his arm around me, and he goes, Dude, it's it's just a pizza.
8:39
SPEAKER_01: And I'm like, I know, but no one's ever asked me that question before.
8:44
SPEAKER_01: He's like, What?
8:46
SPEAKER_01: I go, no one's ever asked me what I like on my pizza.
8:51
SPEAKER_01: I did give you the go-along to get along answer.
8:55
SPEAKER_01: I gave you the answer that was so easy the kids would never argue about it.
9:00
SPEAKER_01: So there was, it was just easy to keep things calm.
9:05
SPEAKER_01: No one's ever asked me what I like on my pizza.
9:07
SPEAKER_01: And I realized in that instant, if I had been giving away the small choices, like what do I like on my pizza?
9:15
SPEAKER_01: What about the big choices in my life?
9:18
SPEAKER_01: What about what else have I been giving away because I wanted to make nice or go along to get along?
9:24
SPEAKER_01: And it was at that point that my life turned around.
9:27
SPEAKER_01: And and the reason to bring this to our audience is that we all at some point have gone along to get along.
9:36
SPEAKER_01: And at some point you have to go, well, what's mine?
9:40
SPEAKER_01: What's mine really?
9:42
SPEAKER_01: It helped me to find my voice and it helped me to launch into writing in a way that I'd never done before.
9:49
SPEAKER_01: And I began to seriously explore writing my first book.
9:54
SPEAKER_01: And that's where choosing your power came from.
9:57
SPEAKER_01: That's how I began writing was what was my journey?
10:01
SPEAKER_01: But more than that, what about the people that had connected with me?
10:05
SPEAKER_01: I had like 300, uh over the course of years, I'd had maybe 300 women that I had worked with and men, but most of my audience at that point was women, and they were they were taken by the idea that we all have gone along to get along at some point.
10:25
SPEAKER_01: Where's my voice?
10:26
SPEAKER_01: How do I show up bigger?
10:28
SPEAKER_01: And so choosing your power is was my first book.
10:34
SPEAKER_00: Wow, that's a powerful story.
10:36
SPEAKER_00: That's really, really powerful.
10:38
SPEAKER_00: And I imagine there are a lot of people listening to this who feel like they're in that same place in their life.
10:43
SPEAKER_00: Maybe their life is not going so well, maybe their their marriage is not going well, they're on the verge of, you know, as you mentioned, on the verge of bankruptcy financially, they're tanking maybe it's something with their kids or their parents or a health situation.
10:57
unknown: Yeah.
10:58
SPEAKER_00: A lot of people probably feel like they're on the verge of giving up or quitting or just becoming disengaged in life.
11:04
SPEAKER_00: So for you in that moment, or maybe not necessarily just in that specific moment, sitting on the floor, you know, of your brother's place, but in that period of your life, it sounds like that writing was a key thing that pulled you out of that situation and that really gave you a lifeline.
11:20
SPEAKER_00: Would that be an accurate way of framing that?
11:22
SPEAKER_01: It's a great way of framing it.
11:24
SPEAKER_01: I, you know, I'd done some journaling, and my journals were really reflecting a downward spiral.
11:31
SPEAKER_01: And so bankruptcy isn't always financial, bankruptcy can be emotional.
11:36
SPEAKER_01: And to recognize that you're at this point of emotionally, I've got nothing left.
11:44
SPEAKER_01: Where am I in the process?
11:47
SPEAKER_01: And so my journals began to make sense to me.
11:50
SPEAKER_01: And when I began writing, and my counseling uh of others changed a little bit at that point.
11:56
SPEAKER_01: I began really helping others find their voice and begin to make their decisions and step into the world without apology and pay attention to the language they use.
12:10
SPEAKER_01: I I I created these 10 watchwords, and you know, the uh I talk about relationship, and relationship, by the way, this this fits with for business leaders, this fits in um in uh whether you're in a uh uh family or in a a group of any kind, relationship is about coming together again.
12:37
SPEAKER_01: Re is again, relation is the way things interact, and ship is the state of.
12:43
SPEAKER_01: And so the idea that we can come together again and really choose how do we want to show up, how do we want to be acknowledged, how do we want to begin anew in the relationship?
12:57
SPEAKER_01: It's gigantic.
12:58
SPEAKER_01: And so um all of this came together after the realization, you know, that I call that pizza place, I call that that my sort of bounce point.
13:08
SPEAKER_01: That's where for me, things, uh, my clarity started to come from.
13:14
SPEAKER_01: I began to reassess my values.
13:17
SPEAKER_01: And I think that's really important, you know, whether you're writing or whether you've got a business that you're running, or even just running your own life, you know, that you really reassess what values do you have?
13:31
SPEAKER_01: And there it's uh that's your journey.
13:34
SPEAKER_01: That's really your journey.
13:36
SPEAKER_00: I love how you frame that as a bounce point.
13:39
SPEAKER_00: And this is I don't know why, but you know, sometimes images just pop into your head for no weird reason.
13:44
SPEAKER_00: I probably watch too many sci-fi movies and that kind of stuff.
13:48
SPEAKER_00: But but it just occurred to me when you meant when you said that phrase, a a bounce point, that whenever you hit the bottom, you can either bounce or you can splat, which is a horrible, horrible, horrible image.
13:59
SPEAKER_00: But that that's just what came to my mind that probably says more about my mental state here at the end of 2019 than anything else.
14:06
SPEAKER_00: But don't you think that's true that you you're you're at the bottom and you can choose to either use it as a bouncing point or you you're just gonna stay there.
14:14
SPEAKER_00: But it sounds like for you that that writing process, that process of of getting your thoughts out on paper and beginning to write for other people was really something that that was a major inflection point for you.
14:26
SPEAKER_01: It really was.
14:26
SPEAKER_01: This is you know, bounce.
14:28
SPEAKER_01: I use that in terms of I'm a big fan of resilience.
14:32
SPEAKER_01: You know, we all have ups and downs.
14:35
SPEAKER_01: And so the trick is can you get up after you've been down?
14:39
SPEAKER_01: And that's resilience.
14:41
SPEAKER_01: So for me, the biggest bounce point for me was there.
14:45
SPEAKER_01: Um writing really was a a chance to recognize that I'm not writing for me, I'm writing for those that have gone through the struggles like me, you know, and and that yes, it's sort of therapeutic to be an author.
15:05
SPEAKER_01: You know, you do put yourself, I do at least, put myself into my work.
15:10
SPEAKER_01: And, you know, I write it, I write my my books as if you're sitting with me.
15:16
SPEAKER_01: And um, because I want to share the journey, not my journey, but the journey, I believe, that pretty much all humans go through.
15:26
SPEAKER_01: We all struggle to be recognized just that bit more.
15:31
SPEAKER_01: We all struggle to know when to apologize and when to stop apologizing.
15:36
SPEAKER_01: We all struggle, right?
15:38
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
15:39
SPEAKER_01: That is so true.
15:40
SPEAKER_01: You know, chapter three of my first book, um, Choosing Your Power, is my first book.
15:45
SPEAKER_01: And chapter three is called Permission Granted.
15:48
SPEAKER_01: It's like you get to show up, you get to breathe the same air as somebody else, you get to uh reach into the same freezer at the grocery store as somebody else, and you don't have to apologize.
16:00
SPEAKER_01: You can say, Oh, excuse me, but you don't have to say, oh, sorry, like sorry I showed up, sorry I'm shopping here.
16:07
SPEAKER_01: It's like, you know, what are you apologizing for?
16:09
SPEAKER_01: Right.
16:10
SPEAKER_01: So I think one of the biggest things for uh for authors, for coaches, for business leaders is to recognize that you can do this unapologetically.
16:19
SPEAKER_01: And if you've made a path, if you've created a path that is uh that turns out to be going in a direction that you don't want to go, awesome.
16:29
SPEAKER_01: Change the path.
16:31
SPEAKER_01: Do so in a way that you're not apologizing for showing up to have created the path in the first place.
16:39
SPEAKER_00: So we hear about a lot of people who want to write books, and I know the statistic has been battered around for years about something like I've heard 80% or 88% or eight out of every 10 people want to write a book, but a much smaller percentage of that actually do.
16:56
SPEAKER_00: In your experience working with so many people and interacting with different different people over the years, why is it that more people don't actually write books?
17:04
SPEAKER_00: I mean, because it is a process.
17:06
SPEAKER_00: There's a lot of time and effort and energy involved in the process.
17:09
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
17:09
SPEAKER_00: What where do people get hung up in that process of finding their voice and expressing it through?
17:14
SPEAKER_00: And I'm not just gonna say writing books.
17:16
SPEAKER_00: I mean it could be blogs, it could be podcasts, it could be speaking or whatever.
17:20
SPEAKER_00: Where do people get hung up in that process of not expressing themselves in that way?
17:25
SPEAKER_01: So there was a mus musician, and it was either Miles Davis or Frank Zappa, and it's two different genres.
17:32
SPEAKER_01: One of them said you have to play a lot of somebody else's music before you find your own.
17:38
SPEAKER_01: That's and and that is the main reason in my working with uh high performance clients, it's the main reason that they haven't started their own blog, haven't started their own books.
17:51
SPEAKER_01: It's like, well, who's who would want to listen to me?
17:56
SPEAKER_01: Right, right.
17:57
SPEAKER_01: I've got I'm not so-and-so, or I'm only, you know, the things that I have, I'm only repeating what somebody else said.
18:05
SPEAKER_01: It's like, well, practice that, reflect that, right?
18:10
SPEAKER_01: So some of the stuff that I do, I reflect psychologists from the 1960s, right?
18:17
SPEAKER_01: Fritz Pearls said, was the first, and he's been like this has been taken and appropriated, and people have attributed it to all kinds of other people.
18:26
SPEAKER_01: Fritz Pearls, the founder of Gestalt Psychology, said, uh, shoulds are sh, and there's no reason to should all over yourself.
18:34
SPEAKER_01: Right.
18:34
SPEAKER_01: I love that phrase.
18:35
SPEAKER_01: He was the first one to say it.
18:38
SPEAKER_01: And a lot of people attribute it to others, you know, leaders.
18:42
SPEAKER_01: Well, the thing is, I always attribute it to him.
18:46
SPEAKER_01: It doesn't mean I can't say it.
18:49
SPEAKER_01: Right?
18:49
SPEAKER_01: And so that's the thing for writers or bloggers or orators is to recognize you've got a voice and you've got your own spin on it.
19:00
SPEAKER_01: You can say whatever you want.
19:01
SPEAKER_01: If you attribute it to someone else, that's awesome.
19:04
SPEAKER_01: If you make a change to it and it becomes yours, that's awesome.
19:08
SPEAKER_01: If you say it and then you explain it in your own way, that's also awesome.
19:13
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
19:14
SPEAKER_01: Let your voice come through.
19:15
SPEAKER_01: And that's where most people get hung up is well, who'd want to listen to me?
19:20
SPEAKER_01: Well, the truth is you're the only one with your voice, your perception, your perspective.
19:27
SPEAKER_01: And so who wants to listen to you?
19:30
SPEAKER_01: Somebody who needs your perspective.
19:33
SPEAKER_01: The truth is, and here's a little encouragement, is that it's selfish not to offer your perspective.
19:41
SPEAKER_01: Yes.
19:42
SPEAKER_01: Somebody needs you, right?
19:43
SPEAKER_01: Somebody needs you.
19:45
SPEAKER_01: So it so don't be selfish and hold your voice back.
19:51
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, we let this fear hold us back and this uh I would maybe almost say insecurity, and we think way too small of ourselves.
20:00
SPEAKER_00: And the truth is that there's there's really nothing that is totally original.
20:04
SPEAKER_00: I mean, everything is built on something else that came before on some level.
20:08
SPEAKER_00: I mean, we're recording this on December 23rd on a Monday.
20:12
SPEAKER_00: You know, the last Star Wars movie just came out a couple days ago, and there's really nothing original in that movie.
20:18
SPEAKER_00: I mean, I loved it, but but still, you don't have to be totally original to still be a value to people and to be either entertaining or inspirational or bring some kind of value to somebody.
20:29
SPEAKER_01: Right.
20:30
SPEAKER_01: And so here this is a great example, right?
20:33
SPEAKER_01: So so the story's been told in different ways.
20:37
SPEAKER_01: George Lucas brought the the story to light, and then it has been taken on and adapted, and for better or worse, Disney now owns Star Wars, right?
20:50
SPEAKER_01: So this is a big deal.
20:52
SPEAKER_01: Well, do you think Disney cares if there are people out there that go that that would say Star Wars is the worst thing ever, Disney should have never bought it.
21:04
SPEAKER_01: Disney doesn't care.
21:06
SPEAKER_01: Right, right, and that's the whole thing.
21:09
SPEAKER_01: One of the things that stops most people not only is the well, who would want to listen to me, but also the biggest fear is not public speaking, the biggest fear is rejection.
21:22
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, so true.
21:23
SPEAKER_01: We fear being rejected from our tribe.
21:27
SPEAKER_01: What if they don't like me?
21:29
SPEAKER_01: The truth is there will be some people that need to hear you.
21:32
SPEAKER_01: There will be some people that flat out don't like you.
21:36
SPEAKER_01: Yep, that's true.
21:37
SPEAKER_01: I screenshotted the first hater I got.
21:40
SPEAKER_01: It was like, this is I'm not gonna say awesome, but it was it was like, wow, I must I must have touched somebody in a way that they bothered to write how terrible my book was.
21:53
SPEAKER_01: It's a badge of honor in some ways.
21:55
SPEAKER_01: In some ways it is.
21:56
SPEAKER_01: And I also got from what they wrote that they hadn't even read it.
21:59
SPEAKER_01: So Okay.
22:00
SPEAKER_01: So it doesn't matter anyway.
22:02
SPEAKER_01: And that's the whole point, is it doesn't matter.
22:05
SPEAKER_01: There are gonna be some people you resonate with.
22:08
SPEAKER_01: There are gonna be some people whose job in the universe it is is to poke and make your life miserable.
22:15
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
22:16
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
22:17
SPEAKER_01: You choose whether to let that bother you or not, right?
22:20
SPEAKER_01: And that's what I'm saying.
22:21
SPEAKER_01: There's you know, Star Wars took this uh very strange turn.
22:28
SPEAKER_01: There are spin-off movies, there's franchised merchandise.
22:33
SPEAKER_01: Awesome.
22:34
SPEAKER_01: It's not for everybody.
22:36
SPEAKER_01: For some people, it's like, oh my gosh, baby Yoda.
22:40
SPEAKER_01: Okay, okay.
22:42
SPEAKER_01: You know, it's like Disney doesn't care because there are gonna be enough people that like it.
22:51
SPEAKER_00: Exactly, exactly.
22:54
SPEAKER_00: It has been kind of funny.
22:55
SPEAKER_00: My my son and I, it's something that we can bond over, you know, Star Wars.
22:59
SPEAKER_00: He's 15, so in the past few weeks we've rewatched all the movies and all that stuff.
23:03
SPEAKER_00: And it is kind of funny that when you start to get on YouTube and you start to see all the channels that are dedicated to Star Wars minutia, yeah, and how people get so emotionally involved in just the tiniest of details, it it's it's a little scary, honestly.
23:20
SPEAKER_00: But yeah, but the reality is that Disney, you know, uh they're still gonna make tons of money, they're still gonna be very profitable with this.
23:27
SPEAKER_00: It was a great investment for them, and you know, they're they're gonna put stuff out, right?
23:33
SPEAKER_01: Somebody's gonna want it, and that goes to each individual audience member, right, that's listening to this.
23:41
SPEAKER_01: You have somebody that wants your message.
23:45
SPEAKER_01: Yes, you may not know who that is yet.
23:49
SPEAKER_01: That's awesome.
23:50
SPEAKER_01: That's really incredible.
23:52
SPEAKER_01: Like, imagine that that there's somebody you're writing for that you may not even have met yet.
23:59
SPEAKER_01: How magical is that, right?
24:01
SPEAKER_01: That's so great.
24:02
SPEAKER_00: And sometimes you don't know until you put it out there.
24:05
SPEAKER_00: So you just have to put it out there and see what happens.
24:08
SPEAKER_01: Exactly.
24:09
SPEAKER_00: I'd like to to uh talk for a moment about your book, The Significance Factor, which I I love by the way.
24:14
SPEAKER_00: I love how it is so conversational.
24:17
SPEAKER_00: I feel like I'm sitting down, you know, around a warm fireplace with you, just getting your coaching and your wisdom and your guidance.
24:25
SPEAKER_00: And plus, I love the fact that it's a short book.
24:28
SPEAKER_00: You know, it's about 100 pages or so, 120 something like that.
24:32
SPEAKER_00: And I love those little short books that you can zip through and you get some great wisdom, and then you're done with it.
24:38
SPEAKER_00: You feel like you've really accomplished something.
24:40
SPEAKER_00: So can you talk a little bit about um your thought process behind how that book came to be and and what you hope to accomplish with it and how it can impact people?
24:49
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, thank you.
24:50
SPEAKER_01: The uh there's so many things wrapped into that question.
24:55
SPEAKER_01: So, yes, I tend to write conversationally.
24:58
SPEAKER_01: My first book was Choosing Your Power.
25:01
SPEAKER_01: When I wrote that, I began writing almost academically because again, my background is psychology.
25:09
SPEAKER_01: And then I realized that nobody's gonna read it if it's academic.
25:13
SPEAKER_01: It's not an academic type of thing.
25:15
SPEAKER_01: And so I became deliberate in choosing an avatar.
25:20
SPEAKER_01: And I think that's really something that if you're writing, you really think about, you hear, choose an avatar.
25:25
SPEAKER_01: Well, I chose this amalgamation, like this mixture of all the people I'd helped over the years, and I created a person.
25:35
SPEAKER_01: And so for choosing your power, my person was Glenda, and I knew everything about her, right?
25:43
SPEAKER_01: And I just I created this and I chose this uh this this woman.
25:49
SPEAKER_01: Um for the significance factor, I wrote this conversationally as well, and there's a statistic that is about the the length of books that if it's under 100 pages, about 80% of the people will get through it.
26:07
SPEAKER_02: Okay.
26:07
SPEAKER_01: That drops to about 40% when it goes to 120 pages.
26:13
SPEAKER_01: And it's really interesting.
26:15
SPEAKER_01: And so I I became deliberate, you know, that that this book does take you through your definition of what uh who you are, how do you lead, how do you think?
26:29
SPEAKER_01: Are you uh are you operational or are you more strategic?
26:35
SPEAKER_01: Are you inspirational or tactical, right?
26:38
SPEAKER_01: So how do you think?
26:39
SPEAKER_01: And then how do you define success?
26:43
SPEAKER_01: And so there are, you know, as easy it is as it is to get through.
26:47
SPEAKER_01: My goal is to have people read it in six-page spurts, you know.
26:51
SPEAKER_01: Okay, that makes sense.
26:53
SPEAKER_01: And then you know, that it's like, oh, you know, and you still feel accomplished because I have exercises, as you saw along the way.
27:01
SPEAKER_01: There are exercises that if you walk yourself through, you come away going, oh, I learned something about myself, and I learned, you know, uh like what my style is and how I need to show up either stronger or differently.
27:15
SPEAKER_01: And I take you from success through a process that leads you to significance.
27:24
SPEAKER_01: Success is really a kind of an inward, well, it's like I've gained all this stuff.
27:33
SPEAKER_01: I've look at what I've got, and significance is more about your ability to look outward and go, look at the impact I've made.
27:42
SPEAKER_01: That's great.
27:43
SPEAKER_01: Right?
27:43
SPEAKER_01: And so my goal is to move the reader from this place.
27:49
SPEAKER_01: It's why it's called the significance factor.
27:52
SPEAKER_01: We have uh I also started a movement as a result of this, too, called Starts With One.
27:58
SPEAKER_01: And I'll I'll talk about that in a minute if if there's time.
28:01
SPEAKER_01: And the idea is we're we live in a time where it's a big look at me time.
28:08
SPEAKER_01: Look at me, I'm an influencer.
28:09
SPEAKER_01: Look at me, look at how many likes I got, look at how many, and instead, I think we need to move that from look at how many likes I got to look at how many lives I've touched.
28:21
SPEAKER_01: So we we move from being an influencer, and I'm now known actually as the outfluencer, because I've talked about how to uh how to reflect outwardly and and impact the lives of others.
28:37
SPEAKER_01: And so you move from look at me to look at the success I've gotten, and the significance factor takes that to the next step and really is look at the impact you've made on others.
28:49
SPEAKER_01: So, as a business leader, how are you lifting others?
28:52
SPEAKER_01: As a as an individual in the world, how have you touched others' lives or helped them to raise up in some way?
29:00
SPEAKER_01: And starts with one is a movement that goes to that place where it's it takes you from look at me to significance to um beyond kindness, even.
29:14
SPEAKER_01: You know, kindness is holding the door for someone, kindness is uh returning a shopping cart, kindness is even paying for the person behind you in the Starbucks line.
29:25
SPEAKER_01: That's awesome.
29:27
SPEAKER_01: What about connecting with somebody?
29:30
SPEAKER_01: What about keeping eye contact, smiling, using their name?
29:34
SPEAKER_01: Rehumanization is really what starts with one is about.
29:38
SPEAKER_01: And so, you know, I uh I think the significance factor was really the groundwork for this new movement that I've just started pretty much in the past few months, and it is taking off amazingly.
29:52
SPEAKER_01: So um, yeah, be a person of significance and be a person who recognizes it starts with one, it starts with me, and I can make these ripples.
30:03
SPEAKER_01: I can make ripples in the lives of people that I've never touched or met.
30:06
SPEAKER_01: You know, it's like that's awesome.
30:09
SPEAKER_00: I really, really love that.
30:10
SPEAKER_00: In fact, I was listening just yesterday to uh a podcast that was talking about how we need to do things in our businesses that don't scale.
30:17
SPEAKER_00: Because so much of particularly those of us who have, you know, we do writing, we have podcasts and things like that.
30:24
SPEAKER_00: So much of that email list is scalable where you do something once and it goes out to a lot of different people, but sometimes we can lose the human connection within that.
30:35
SPEAKER_00: And I see a lot more emphasis recently on doing things that are are connecting with other humans and remembering that we are individual people and we need those connections and that networking and those those actual relationships with people.
30:51
SPEAKER_01: Right.
30:51
SPEAKER_01: So as a reminder, as you're as you're listening to this podcast, you know, when you're done listening, put your tech away and go look somebody in the eye and smile and you know, give somebody a smile so that they can smile during their day.
31:07
SPEAKER_01: I think that we are so much more technologically connected than we've ever been.
31:14
SPEAKER_01: And yet, surveys are showing that we're that 80% or more, 85% of the people interviewed feel even more disconnected than ever.
31:25
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
31:26
SPEAKER_01: And so this rehumanization of it starts with one, right?
31:31
SPEAKER_01: What impact can you make today?
31:33
SPEAKER_01: Can you look at the grocery store clerk or the barista and notice the color of their eyes?
31:38
SPEAKER_01: Can you smile and call them by name?
31:40
SPEAKER_01: I mean, it's small stuff like that that makes such a huge difference.
31:44
SPEAKER_01: And I love that it's being talked about.
31:47
SPEAKER_01: Um, I'm uh my goal is to focus it so that it's deliberate.
31:51
SPEAKER_01: I talk about uplifting others deliberately, actively, positively.
31:56
SPEAKER_01: Be deliberate about it.
31:58
SPEAKER_00: You know what's funny is that those of us who who are in, I'm gonna just categorize anybody like above 35, you know, as the older generations or vintage generations, I guess.
32:09
SPEAKER_00: We tend to look at people who are younger.
32:12
SPEAKER_00: So, like my son is 15 years old, we tend to look at the younger generations and and critique their social skills like, oh, they're wrapped up in their phones all the time, or they're you know, obsessed with their VR headsets or their technology.
32:24
SPEAKER_00: But the truth is that it's it's every age today, and all of us need that reminder.
32:29
SPEAKER_00: So I'm so thankful that you're emphasizing this concept of hey, it starts with one one look in the eye, one hello, one small act of kindness, and taking that emotional energy and investing into to people.
32:43
SPEAKER_00: That is such a critical thing.
32:44
SPEAKER_01: Makes a huge difference.
32:46
SPEAKER_01: We've lost the heart to heart, you know.
32:48
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I think part of part of generational problems is that we each generation looks at the next generation and says, oh, they're they're doing it wrong.
32:58
SPEAKER_01: And the truth is the truth is each generation is doing it absolutely right because that's what's laying the groundwork.
33:06
SPEAKER_01: The problem is that we have become more disconnected, and and the way to do it more right is to put the tech down, uh schedule it.
33:16
SPEAKER_00: Well, Wayne, this has been a ton of fun.
33:18
SPEAKER_00: You have shared a lot of great stuff with us today.
33:20
SPEAKER_00: I understand that you are giving away copies of the significance factor, correct?
33:25
SPEAKER_01: Yes.
33:25
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, as long as your listeners can spell my name right.
33:30
SPEAKER_01: I'll make sure they do.
33:31
SPEAKER_01: Awesome.
33:32
SPEAKER_01: Wayne, W-A-Y-N-E Purnell, P-E-R-N-E-L dot com slash free.
33:40
SPEAKER_01: And you can download a copy of the significance factor.
33:44
SPEAKER_01: You can read it for yourself.
33:46
SPEAKER_01: Tell me what you think.
33:47
SPEAKER_01: You know, you may be among those that go, oh, this is terrible.
33:50
SPEAKER_01: But uh my guess is this became an uh uh number one bestseller on Amazon.
33:56
SPEAKER_01: So my guess is you're gonna like it too.
33:58
SPEAKER_01: So go to WaynePrunell.com slash free and you can get your copy of the significance factor.
34:04
SPEAKER_00: Good deal.
34:05
SPEAKER_00: Well, I will have a link to that in the show notes as well as links to all your social media stuff and all the other goodies you have out there.
34:11
SPEAKER_00: You got a ton of books.
34:13
SPEAKER_00: Just so thrilled about the work that you're doing and the way that you're impacting lives, as well as mine.
34:17
SPEAKER_00: So thanks for doing that.
34:19
SPEAKER_01: Oh, thank you.
34:20
SPEAKER_01: What a pleasure.
34:21
SPEAKER_01: What a joy, truly.
34:22
SPEAKER_00: Well, can you remind us one more time?
34:24
SPEAKER_00: Uh, how can listeners get in touch with you and your work?
34:28
SPEAKER_01: So this is great.
34:28
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
34:29
SPEAKER_01: I mean, go to WaynePurnell.com, look around.
34:33
SPEAKER_01: There's a contact form there.
34:36
SPEAKER_01: If you go to WaynePurnell.com slash free, obviously you can uh download the book.
34:41
SPEAKER_01: Um on my website, WaynePurnell.com, you'll you'll see books, you'll see uh other resources for you.
34:50
SPEAKER_01: I do a weekly blog.
34:51
SPEAKER_01: You can get Wednesdays with Wayne, and uh that's that's usually very topical, usually something that uh uh I have discussed with a high performance client or two.
35:04
SPEAKER_01: It's a theme that comes up.
35:06
SPEAKER_01: So yep, anybody can reach me on all the social facebook.com slash Wayne Purnell, at Wayne Purnell, on uh on Twitter, and on Instagram, it's dr underscore Wayne underscore Purnell.
35:22
SPEAKER_00: Good deal.
35:22
SPEAKER_00: I'll have links to all that stuff in the show notes.
35:25
SPEAKER_00: Wayne, thank you again so much for taking time out to do this.
35:27
SPEAKER_00: This has been a ton of fun.
35:29
SPEAKER_00: It has.
35:29
SPEAKER_00: And I appreciate your you taking the time to do this.
35:32
SPEAKER_01: I appreciate your inviting me and thank you, and thanks for thanks to the audience for listening.
35:39
SPEAKER_00: Absolutely.
35:40
SPEAKER_00: Thanks so much.
35:40
SPEAKER_00: Take care.
35:41
SPEAKER_00: I hope you enjoyed my conversation with Wayne.
35:44
SPEAKER_00: I had a blast talking to him, and I want to give you my three biggest takeaways from our conversation.
35:50
SPEAKER_00: Number one, bankruptcy can be emotional.
35:54
SPEAKER_00: I thought this was a really great insight, and I had never thought about it in quite these terms before.
36:00
SPEAKER_00: We hear about financial bankruptcy all the time, but people can be depleted in a variety of ways.
36:05
SPEAKER_00: They can be bankrupt in lots of different ways, including emotionally.
36:10
SPEAKER_00: Maybe you're at a point where you're feeling hopeless and you're at the end of your rope, sort of like George Bailey in the movie It's a Wonderful Life.
36:17
SPEAKER_00: I've been there before, I think we're all there probably at times, and if you're there, I want to encourage you to get help and do the work to rebuild your life.
36:26
SPEAKER_00: This is why I'm a huge advocate of journaling.
36:29
SPEAKER_00: We have to pay attention to our emotions and our mental and emotional state.
36:33
SPEAKER_00: Now, of course, journaling is not a fix-all for all kinds of problems, but I think it is a really healthy practice that has definitely helped me.
36:41
SPEAKER_00: Main point here though is don't ignore the signs of distress and emotional bankruptcy in your life.
36:47
SPEAKER_00: It's not worth it to chase quote unquote success if your inward life is a mess, or your family's a mess, or you're really unhealthy.
36:56
SPEAKER_00: So if you're feeling emotionally bankrupt, pay attention to that and please take care of yourself and seek help if you need to.
37:04
SPEAKER_00: Takeaway number two, short books are great.
37:08
SPEAKER_00: Wayne's book, The Significance Factor, is a short book and it's around 100 pages.
37:13
SPEAKER_00: And I love this because I'm a huge fan of short books that contain short chapters.
37:19
SPEAKER_00: Now, why is that?
37:20
SPEAKER_00: Well, the reason is really simple.
37:22
SPEAKER_00: It's because I want to write books that people can actually finish.
37:26
SPEAKER_00: The fact of the matter is that when people buy a long book, most of the time they don't finish it.
37:31
SPEAKER_00: I mean, just look at your own bookshelf.
37:33
SPEAKER_00: And I'll look at my bookshelf.
37:34
SPEAKER_00: In fact, as I'm recording this, I'm surrounded here in my home office with books that I haven't actually finished.
37:41
SPEAKER_00: But I can say for sure that I've finished a lot more short books than I've finished long books.
37:47
SPEAKER_00: I think it's a lot better as an author to write a short, simple, straightforward book that gives people a quick hit of success or inspiration.
37:55
SPEAKER_00: It's better to do that than write a huge, complicated book that people will not actually read.
38:00
SPEAKER_00: Now that's not to say there's not a place for long books or complicated books or deep books.
38:04
SPEAKER_00: We need all those.
38:06
SPEAKER_00: But all things being equal, if you want people to read what you've actually written, odds are greater that they're going to actually finish a shorter book.
38:15
SPEAKER_00: So I encourage you to keep your books short, sweet, and readable if at all possible.
38:21
SPEAKER_00: Takeaway number three, remember that you're writing for others.
38:25
SPEAKER_00: Now this seems like such a simple and obvious insight, but I think it does bear repeating here that if we want to build a business with our writing, we have to write for others.
38:35
SPEAKER_00: This means addressing their needs and their pain points.
38:38
SPEAKER_00: It means writing about things that'll help them and solve their problems.
38:43
SPEAKER_00: Now, of course, fiction is awesome, and fiction can actually be one of the best ways to help people because we all learn through stories.
38:51
SPEAKER_00: That's the way that we process information and view the world many times is simply through great stories.
38:56
SPEAKER_00: But overall, whether you're writing fiction or whether you're writing nonfiction, it doesn't matter.
39:01
SPEAKER_00: The point is that we're writing for other people to either entertain them, inspire them, to solve a problem or to talk about a pain point and help them through that in some way.
39:10
SPEAKER_00: Ultimately, our writing is all about serving people.
39:13
SPEAKER_00: And I'm so thankful to have had Wayne on this episode talking about some different ways that he has served other people through writing.
39:20
SPEAKER_00: He's such a great example of using writing to impact other people's lives.
39:24
SPEAKER_00: So I hope that you've enjoyed having him on the show as much as I have.
39:28
SPEAKER_00: Well, hey guys, those are my thoughts, but I'd love to hear what you think about this episode.
39:32
SPEAKER_00: How do you plan to make your life more significant in the year 2020?
39:37
SPEAKER_00: You can let me know by heading over to KentSanders.net slash one two four and you can leave a comment there on the blog post.
39:44
SPEAKER_00: And also that's where you'll find the show notes and the links for this episode.
39:48
SPEAKER_00: I'd also be grateful if you'd consider heading over to Apple Podcast and leaving a rating and a review for the show.
39:54
SPEAKER_00: Those are super helpful.
39:56
SPEAKER_00: I want to give a huge thank you to Dr.
39:58
SPEAKER_00: Wayne Purnell for making time to be a guest on this episode.
40:01
SPEAKER_00: And by the way, make sure to download a free copy of his book, The Significance Factor, at WaynePurnell.com slash free.
40:10
SPEAKER_00: And again, there will be a link for that in the show notes.
40:14
SPEAKER_00: Here's a preview of what's coming up on the next couple of episodes.
40:17
SPEAKER_00: On episode 125, we're going to talk about the number one writing lesson from Disney's Star Wars trilogy, and I can't wait to give you that episode.
40:25
SPEAKER_00: It's going to be a ton of fun.
40:27
SPEAKER_00: And in the following episode, 126, we're going to talk about the benefits of keeping a journal and how that can make you not just a better human, but also a better business writer.
40:37
SPEAKER_00: Well, hey friends, thank you so much for listening.
40:40
SPEAKER_00: Until next time, remember that your writing has the power to change people's lives.
40:45
SPEAKER_00: I'll see you in the next episode.