Musician Marlon Williams + film director Ursula Grace Williams

Just Surrender: Creative Conversations · Nov 5, 2026 · 19m

“I struggle with the idea of authenticity, you know, this idea that you’re putting your true self into art … it’s never as straightforward as that."

In this episode, I speak to heavenly musician MARLON WILLIAMS and film director URSULA GRACE WILLIAMS about their beautiful documentary, Marlon Williams: Two Worlds – Ngā Ao E Rua, which follows the making of an album, Te Whare Tiwekaweka.

Here, Marlon and Ursula discuss authenticity in art and documentary, Marlon’s ambivalence about revealing his private self, Ursula’s verité approach to documentary filmmaking and how she gradually gained…