Latest / At Your Own Pace / Episode 14 - Running Beyond Labels with @theclydesdalerunner

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Episode 14 - Running Beyond Labels with @theclydesdalerunner · At Your Own Pace

• MikeRunsMarathons: Hey everybody, before I sign off from today's episode of At Your Own Pace, I wanted to just quickly shout out a quick deal for all of you. Our friends over at Shox are currently running a 20 % off sale on their brand new OpenDots One headphones. They are the Shox headphones that I recommend for everyone in terms of the way that they fit and the sound quality that they have. I've used them for about five marathons now, and I was actually one of the early testers for the product before it was released. If you've been looking for open ear headphones that still let you hear the world around you on your runs, today's guest is somebody who reminds people that running doesn't have to have a specific body type, a look, or a stereotype to fit in, in order to become and consider yourself a runner. If you follow the Clydesdale runner, you'll see a runner who shows up consistently, work, and does it without trying to fit into what the running culture usually tells us a runner should look like or how a runner should be. His presence quietly challenges assumptions, not through loud messaging, but through his lived examples. These are definitely something that you would want to check out. And because you're part of this community, you can save an additional $5 off of the current sale by using the code Mike Runs Marathons at checkout. So make sure you head over to Shocks, grab those OpenDots headphones. They've actually just released a new color for International Women's Day. And don't forget to use the code Mike Runs Marathons to stack that extra discount. His journey is about building confidence over time, earning belief through consistency and carving out space in a sport that doesn't always make room for everybody. I'm excited to talk about how running has reshaped his identity, what it means to show up when you don't see yourself reflected around you, and also what running at your own pace looks like when the narrative wasn't built for you. So without further ado, let me welcome in Chad. Thank you so much for being here today. Chad Zimmermann: Thanks, I'm happy to be on and love the introduction. That was great. MikeRunsMarathons: Thank you, sir. I appreciate it. How are you doing? Chad Zimmermann: Good, good. Hanging in there. We're finally starting to ⁓ have the teeth of winter come and chew at us a little bit here in central Pennsylvania. We got a little snow this past weekend. ⁓ got a storm coming up this upcoming weekend and some frigid temps. So right now, it's definitely, ⁓ it's ⁓ out MikeRunsMarathons: I mean, I'm in Jersey and I was unaware that there was going to be a storm this weekend. thought we were past the worst of it over this last couple of days. Wonderful. So I'm not looking forward to that at all. But know that from from us talking beforehand that you prefer going out there in that weather unless it's like absolutely abysmal and like dangerous. So I'm forward to ⁓ to discussing kind of how you get out there in those moments when when ⁓ a lot people would rather Chad Zimmermann: Yeah. MikeRunsMarathons: Look out the window, see what the weather is, and then sit back on the couch. when you first started running, did you feel that there was that, that this sport, that there was a space that you naturally belonged in or Did you feel like it was one you had to grow into? Chad Zimmermann: so when I first started running, it was all the way back in 2014. since then there have been kind of some ebbs and flows of, of my participation in the running space. back in 2014, I never, like, I never really focused ⁓ on was me or like the, online running community, I feel like hadn't really blown up at that point. and so I really focused as much on like. wanting to fit in or feeling like I should fit in or things like that. When I first started running, I did it. My wife and I started together as a means to start to get healthier. We were getting ready to settle down a little bit, start a family and do some stuff. And we wanted to get a little healthier. I was significantly overweight and I had been overweight my whole life. So we got to a point where we're like, all right, let's take our health seriously. So we started at a new gym and And then I got invited by ⁓ best friend to go run a 5k in Columbus, Ohio for the ⁓ NHL game in 2015. And I like, all right, I guess I'll start running. ⁓ I had interest in it at that point, but I'm like, yeah, it's NHL All-Star game. There's a 5k. I'll go and run that. Not knowing how long a 5k was because I was so kind of new in space. MikeRunsMarathons: you Chad Zimmermann: And then sure enough, I started running and I, when I started running, I could run a quarter mile before I had to stop. then slowly, but surely over the next three, I think I had about three months before the 5k. Eventually I got to the point where I could run the whole 5k and, and, and, and I basically say training for that. And then doing that race got me absolutely hooked on running. and at that point it was like, all right, what's next? Okay. 10 K a few months later. did a 10K, did another 10K, then all right, half marathon in September. So what comes after a half marathon? Well, a full marathon. So I went from first 5K to first marathon ⁓ about 15 months. Now in that interim, I had also dropped about 120 pounds. So I went from, ⁓ I was 340 when I first started running down to about 220. MikeRunsMarathons: Thanks. Chad Zimmermann: ⁓ so yeah, so it was a pretty drastic and my wife dropped a whole lot of weight and we were living kind of our best life. but even then, like I, I still didn't have like that traditional runners building and even way back then when I was running my first marathon, I really just wasn't focused on it. Cause I was really focused on just doing it for my health. ⁓ then obviously life, life has its way of, ⁓ popping up and throwing in roadblocks. developed, ⁓ MikeRunsMarathons: Mm-hmm. Chad Zimmermann: iliotibial band syndrome, while training for the marathon and actually couldn't run the last six weeks before my first marathon, which was in Paris in 2016. ⁓ Couldn't run. Then I couldn't run for about six months after the fact. ⁓ was so bad. Then I finally start getting back and then my wife gets pregnant with our oldest. MikeRunsMarathons: ⁓ my goodness. Chad Zimmermann: And then all of a sudden I've kind of lost my running partner and my running buddy. So my motivation starts to wane. Then our oldest is born and you have, mean, you'll find out with what you have coming on. Fitness basically took a back seat for a few months. Then slowly but surely I started to get back into it until my oldest was six months old. And then I fell down the stairs, broke my MikeRunsMarathons: I don't know. Mm-hmm. Chad Zimmermann: broke my fibula, tore my ankle apart, had to have a few surgeries to put my ankle back together. ⁓ Wasn't even sure I would ever actually be able to run again the extent of the damage. luckily, a year's worth of rehab, finally felt comfortable, like finally got back into the swing of things, started getting fit again. And then COVID and that kind of throws, a lot of people when COVID hit, that was their motivation to MikeRunsMarathons: ⁓ my God. Chad Zimmermann: get out and start getting fit. Whereas ours, like all of a sudden our toddler is home with us full time and now we're working from home and now like gyms are closed and like, and so that kind of throws you for a loop. Things start to settle down. We're like, you know what? Yeah, we can have ⁓ more kid. We're in a good spot. We're in this new house. Like everything's great. Boom, get pregnant with twins. So. MikeRunsMarathons: Mm-hmm. Hmm Chad Zimmermann: Needless to say, eventually fitness took backseat again because we were getting about maybe 20 minutes of sleep a night and slowly but surely like my weight started to creep back up. I started to get unhealthy again, had really unhealthy habits. Till all of a sudden our twins are about, I think about 14 months old at that point and I went to go pick one of them up and I absolutely just threw out my back and I'm like, know what, enough's enough. I need to get back on track. So it was right then and there. Once my back started feeling better, I started doing some research on, all right, the first go round when I was buying running shoes, I would just go to the store and buy the cheapest ones and say, yeah, whatever, these are on sale. These are fine. Like these will work for me. Now that I was more established and had access to a little bit more money and was, wanting to be a little more cognizant of the fact that I was a bigger runner and I had had this previous leg injury and the ITBS, I was like, I want to be smart about what I'm running in. So started doing research and then all of a sudden I found this giant, people call it shoe tube or it's just the online running community where there was just this plethora of information out there. And I'm like, wow, there's this huge community out there now that didn't seem to exist. This was in 2022. So it was like eight years prior when I first got into running. just, it wasn't there. So then all of a sudden, when you have now, all of a sudden there's this community of people, you start to see what's out there and see all the people and see everything like that. And then all of a sudden, and I don't know why it didn't happen the first go round, but I did start to notice that, Hey, there's MikeRunsMarathons: Mm-hmm. Chad Zimmermann: I'm not seeing a lot of people like me out there in the online running space. I know they're there because I've seen, I'd seen them at races. I'm a back of the pack runner. I'd seen them in the back of the pack with me. So I know they're out there, ⁓ but we just weren't the forefront. MikeRunsMarathons: A lot of your story I identify with because I started running to to get healthier. I was I was very overweight and I was told by a doctor that I would have a heart attack or a stroke if I didn't take care of myself. And so that was a wake up call for me. Now, so I want to go back to when you first began, you know, that you ran that first 5k for the All-Star up until running this first marathon. Was there a moment or was it kind of, was it at the beginning when you first started running or was it at a certain point during your running journey when you began that you felt like you started to believe that you were a runner? Like, because when I started running, I didn't think of myself as a runner. I was just somebody trying to get fit. Chad Zimmermann: Yeah, it took it took doing the race because like the 5k like and and that's the thing and and at one point I had You get that kind of MikeRunsMarathons: The Marathon or the 5K? Okay. Chad Zimmermann: you find that balance, because I was still working out at the gym. was lifting some weights. I was doing like various classes and stuff. And I did see myself more as someone like, hey, I'm getting into fitness. Running is just a part of it, but I'm not a runner. I'm buying cheap shoes. I'm not dedicating myself to running. Once I crossed the finish line and the atmosphere of doing a race and everything, I'm like, okay, yeah, no, this is for me. Even at that point, I was still, I mean, MikeRunsMarathons: Mm-hmm. Chad Zimmermann: I think by the time I ran the first 5k, I was still probably almost over 300 pounds. ⁓ But I was like getting fit, getting strong, getting healthier by the day. And I was like, this is something. I mean, at that point I wasn't like, hey, this is gonna be a big part of my identity like running is now. But I'm like, I can see calling myself a runner. ⁓ MikeRunsMarathons: Mm-hmm. Chad Zimmermann: I've never hesitated. know there are a lot of people out there who hesitate to do it because they walk or they don't do marathons or I mean, they, I don't see why anyone who doesn't strap up shoes, get out there. If you run for any portion of the duration of time when you are out there getting in your fitness or your exercise, you're a runner. ⁓ ⁓ don't see the distinction. There is a lot of gatekeeping out there, with all the positives there are in the running community. A lot of times there is a lot of gatekeeping. And a lot of people are saying, slower back of the pack runners, you're not going to benefit from carbon plated shoes, so don't wear them. science shows that may benefit just like our 4 % may not make us quality OTQ. ⁓ MikeRunsMarathons: Yeah. Chad Zimmermann: But that 4 % might help us set a new ⁓ PR that'll make us happy. I don't see why just because we're not gonna be elite athletes that we shouldn't do those things. So yeah, when it comes to the distinction of being a runner, I say you lace up the shoes and go, claim it. MikeRunsMarathons: Exactly. Exactly. Amen to that. I was actually looking at something online right before this and it was a response that Herm gave to a post where someone was moaning about they posted screenshot of some I think it was a finisher shirt from the Berlin Marathon this year and they were like hot take but if you don't finish the marathon you don't deserve to wear this and someone and ⁓ people were like well off why does it bother you like Chad Zimmermann: Yeah. MikeRunsMarathons: like live your own life. and Herm was like, you know what, I respect anybody who wants to spend their money on anything they want. ⁓ I won't stop them. So, yeah, the gatekeeping is insane. it you're right that there are a lot of positives in the running community. There's a lot of supportive people, you know, whether it's influencers everyday runners or podcasts, what have you. But there's always there. Those bad apples that come out that you're like, really? come on, we could do so much better than this. And it impacts your own confidence as a runner. And, you know, as you pointed out, it can impact those people that want to consider themselves runners because they run walk or they don't run marathons. They run for fun. They run for health. They don't run for a race. with your own confidence that you've gained ⁓ the ⁓ couple of several years with running, what were some of the early wins that helped build up that confidence for you? Chad Zimmermann: early, early on, like I, I'm a very goal oriented person. and on the goal was ⁓ achieving new distance really. Cause obviously being new, ⁓ I necessarily, I wasn't necessarily worried about pacing. it was like, can I achieve this feat of going ⁓ longer? and, it's funny because I had that first year. where, for the first year and a half or so where I was like all in and I just went just like further and further each time. and that was great. I accumulated the medals. ⁓ ⁓ but after, ⁓ after really, I didn't have a long consistent stretch ⁓ of cause I kept getting interrupted with all those various things we talked about before. Um, but I have now consistently been running, I think again, since August of 2022 is when I picked back up and started. And so this is the longest stretch I have had of, um, consistent fitness and running and it all being kind of part of my life and knock on wood I've stayed relatively healthy and other, other than the occasional niggle you get here and there along the way. So I think. What builds confidence for me along the way is consistency. Getting out there when I don't want to get out there. Doing those runs where... There are very few days when I don't want to get out there. There are some times where I'm a little fatigued or I've gone too hard or it's the second day of a back-to-back, which I don't do often. a lower volume, lower mileage runner, but yeah, ⁓ feel like the consistency is the thing that has helped me the most. ⁓ it's funny because what has come with the consistency are a lot of the things that a lot of would build confidence with other people, like a new PR or things like that. Those have come kind of hand in hand with the consistency because by being consistent ⁓ ⁓ MikeRunsMarathons: Mm-hmm. Chad Zimmermann: doing the workouts when I need to do the workouts, doing the easy runs, doing my strength training, which I'm kind of like 50-50 right now, strength training, and I spend a lot of time in the gym as well. But so when I can be consistent, that is what builds my confidence, both in running and day-to-day life. Because if I know I can show this consistency to something that is hard, like running, consistency and stuff, other stuff that's hard like day-to-day life, parenting, work, things like that. If I can be consistent here, I can easily be consistent over here as well. And so it kind of helps in a lot of different aspects. MikeRunsMarathons: Mm-hmm. Oh yeah. Right. I love how running permeates into every other part of our lives. when initially we all think we just like you and I would get into it because we want to get healthier and fitter and take care of our bodies. We don't realize what else it helps us with in our lives. I know you talked about the consistency being something that has really benefited you and something that's really been able to, to you've been able to build from the ground up, but has there been anything else that you used to doubt yourself about? As a runner that you like, I don't want to say no longer question, but you might not question it as much anymore. Chad Zimmermann: Yeah, when would say when I was first getting back into running in 2022 and I started to do that look around of the online community ⁓ and to try and say, okay, I'm going to get back into running. Maybe I'll, I'll sign up for some races to help keep me motivated and things like that. I started to see a little bit of that online gatekeeping, which obviously had me doubting. myself because at that point I was back too close to my starting weight from the first go round. And so I was unhealthy again, unfit. was trying to buy this time I was actually trying to buy like running clothes as opposed to whatever I could get at TJ Maxx or Marshall's and stuff like that. And I'm buying the stuff in the biggest sizes and it's coming and it's like, ⁓ this extra large fits like a medium and ⁓ like clothes or so like MikeRunsMarathons: Mm-hmm. Chad Zimmermann: a lot of that brand stuff where like you buy stuff and you're like, all right, this will fit. And then it's basically like, look like Winnie the Pooh wearing a crop top. Like, well, and it doesn't help them six, three, two, but so, um, yeah. So things like that. And I mean, it seems innocuous to order, but like if you order from four different brands and order their biggest size shirts and MikeRunsMarathons: Yeah. Chad Zimmermann: none of them come anywhere close to fitting you and they're running specific brands. You're like, all right, yeah, that's a little disconcerting. then for me, when I was trying to do my research into what shoes to buy, a review guy, I ⁓ reviews, I ingest a lot of information, I watch video reviews, read online reviews before I buy. MikeRunsMarathons: Yeah. Yeah, me too. Chad Zimmermann: anything, if I'm going to be spending 150, 200 bucks on something, I always read reviews. So I was reading reviews, watching shoe tube videos. And I saw that there was really no one out there that looks like me that did wrote those reviews or did those reviews. So I'm like, all right, well, it seems hard for me to pick a shoe based on how someone who's five, five, 135 pounds says the shoe works for them. when I'm 6'3", 300 plus, so I realized that I had to take everything that was reading online with a grain of salt, which was kind of discouraging ⁓ actually kind of what led me to where I am now ⁓ the online ⁓ community. So it had its ⁓ and cons, that sort of feeling of not being represented. MikeRunsMarathons: Yeah, no, mean, then with the representation that you bring though, I mean, you work with Believe in the Run, you do their, you know, a lot of their reviews for a lot of their trail shoes and things like that. I know. And I think if I correct me if I'm wrong, your profile specifically says, guy reviewer for Believe in the Run. Chad Zimmermann: Yeah. Yeah. So, so trail trails is new. is a new thing for me. That is a 20 trails is a 20, 26 endeavor. and we, and we can kind of get into how I got there eventually, but yeah. So trails is new, but yeah, I've been, I've been with believe in the run since ⁓ November, think a 2022. so been with them for a while and I'm the lead big guy reviewer for. ⁓ had been all road shoes up until just recently. Now I'm going to be doing both trail and road. ⁓ MikeRunsMarathons: I'm a huge fan. believe in the run. I want to hear about, cause I'm pretty sure you probably get at least people who reach out to you, ⁓ you know, with messages about ⁓ whether it's the reviews you give or the support that you provide to those that might not feel like they belong within the running community for a number of reasons. talked about the gatekeeping. ⁓ what kind of messages do you get from people that when, when they resonate with, ⁓ your running journey? Chad Zimmermann: Mm-hmm. Yep. I get, I get a couple, at least two to three messages a week and they from, hey, I watched this YouTube video that you were in. have a couple of questions about that. I saw your posts on Reddit because I do, I try and stay active in the Reddit forums as well answering, because a lot of people go there first to ask questions ⁓ and, and Ask Running Geeks even has like a sub Reddit tab of Bigger Runner. MikeRunsMarathons: Yeah. Chad Zimmermann: So I'll always go to those and answer questions. So I people message me on Reddit. I have people message me on Instagram. I always go through for every video I do on Believe in the Run, I go through every one of the comments and I either like or respond if it has a question ⁓ just do that. Just because feel like I'm providing a service that was not there for me when I was either first getting into running or even the second time. when I was getting into running, it wasn't there. So I feel like I have a little bit of a responsibility to kind of do that. it's part of, part of what I am trying to cultivate is a big open welcome space where people have someone they can go to for these questions. So I get, I probably get anywhere. Sometimes it's three messages and, and they will all usually be very complimentary cause either they've seen a video, MikeRunsMarathons: Yeah. Chad Zimmermann: that I did or they'll read my reviews and they'll have certain questions shoes. And if someone comes to me, they're like blank slate, like I know you do reviews. ⁓ need a shoe recommendation. I basically sit and I chat with them for 10, 15 minutes and I get all their and what sort of shoe they're looking for. Do they have any pronation issues? Do they have any width issues? What sort of feel are they looking for in a shoe? MikeRunsMarathons: Mm-hmm. Chad Zimmermann: And then I boil that down and I usually come up with a couple options for them. only thing I ask in return is that if they go with one of my recommendations, after they've run in it for a little while, they come back and tell me how the recommendation went. That's the only caveat I have about giving out ⁓ recommendations is because it's a little Monday morning quarterbacking for me to kind of see how my recommendations are ⁓ people. So at the end of the day, the messages I get ⁓ all positive and it's it's really affirming. The phrase use is it's selfishly altruistic because obviously I feel I am providing this service that wasn't there before solely because it wasn't there for me and it makes me feel good to do it. So it's like a little bit, a little bit selfish, a little bit for me that I'm doing it. at the grand scheme of things, I'm doing it for others ⁓ have that resource. MikeRunsMarathons: No, I love when people do some sort of service because they see that they did not receive it themselves and they put themselves in the shoes of the other person to be like, okay, if I were that other person, what would I want them to have? And especially now with what you do with Believe in the Runs for the last several years, it does come with a certain gravitas behind it now of they can trust you and... And they know that you have the knowledge to be able to provide that to them. But how has being this visible how you show up either it's whether it's with your training, with your races. I know we talked about you being a line at shout out the running shoe geeks. ⁓ that sub reddit so much. I've wasted so much money because of the deals I find on there. ⁓ But like how, how has that changed how you show up in those different facets? Chad Zimmermann: Yeah. Yep. Yeah. Yep. well, doing the shoe reviews generally an extra layer of motivation to get out there and run the miles. cause getting anywhere between two to shoes a month, depending on where we are in the release cycle. like right now, right now I have three shoes in ⁓ that I have that I need to get miles into review. ⁓ two, ⁓ well, actually I one, ⁓ one dedicated trail MikeRunsMarathons: Mm-hmm. Chad Zimmermann: road to trail, gravel option, and then one road option. So now all of a sudden in my head, I'm processing, I'm like, all right, how am going to structure my run training so I can get in some gravel miles, some road miles, treadmill miles, because we got the weather coming up, but then also trail miles. So it's really motivating in the sense that now that I'm, especially now that I'm doing trail, when it was all road, it was a lot easier because I'm just like, all right, I'll run. MikeRunsMarathons: Mm-hmm. Yeah. Yeah. Chad Zimmermann: my four mile run in this shoe on Monday, I'll run my six mile run on Wednesday in this shoe. And then know over a couple of weeks, I'll have accumulated enough miles to write the reviews. I have to be a little smarter and plan a little bit more. But it definitely provides that extra motivation to get out and run the miles. Cause I know I have a responsibility, only to the community. ⁓ that is relying on the information, but also to believe in the run because they are facilitating getting these shoes and I'm doing this for them. It's a quasi volunteer position. I don't receive a paycheck, but I receive more than enough compensation in the form of free pairs of shoes to run in. And ⁓ obviously it a lot of other perks as well, the exposure being one of them. ⁓ MikeRunsMarathons: Yes. Chad Zimmermann: But yes, and then I also owe responsibility to the brand because they want honest feedback. They want feedback that actually comes from having run in the shoe and done all the miles. Because it would be pretty circumspect and pretty to ⁓ in a shoe for three, four or five miles and then say, hey, here's everything. I ⁓ mind doing like a, hey, here are some first thoughts on the shoe. MikeRunsMarathons: Mm-hmm. Chad Zimmermann: But to write an actual good faith review of a shoe or do a video on it, I need to get at least three to four runs, 20, 25 miles in a shoe. Sometimes it's a little less, sometimes it's maybe 15 miles. If a shoe, more often than not if a shoe does not work that well for me, it'll be around the 15 mile mark, as I know very quickly and that a shoe is not working for me or causing issues. I've only had a few that have ever. ⁓ cause me some issues with, ⁓ some post-tib stuff, ⁓ or, or Achilles, but yeah, for the most part, yeah, there's just a lot of people kind of depending on you. so in, in addition to the self motivation of wanting to stay healthy and, and get out there and train and prep for whatever races you have coming up, ⁓ I have a responsibility to, the online community, believe in the run and the brands. MikeRunsMarathons: Mm-hmm. ⁓ you a fantastic job with the amount of people that are believe in you. I keep these words that are choose, ⁓ They ⁓ you. trust you. ⁓ They trust in what you're able to give them in both not just the understanding of what you know about the shoe, but also they know that even if they come to you with questions, you're not going to try to sell them anything. Chad Zimmermann: Yeah. It sets itself up. Yeah. Yeah. MikeRunsMarathons: going to try to give them the best thing that would benefit them. Chad Zimmermann: Yeah, I've, yeah. And I've, in all the years I've been doing this now, I've not had one person come back getting a recommendation from me or reading one of our reviews and coming back and saying that, hey, this shoe didn't work for me or I didn't like the shoe. I've ⁓ more people come back and say, okay, I love this shoe. ⁓ now I want to get a tempo day shoe, what should I do? Or, hey, this is great. I have now signed up for a half marathon and I want a specific shoe to run the half marathon and what should I do? and a lot of times that's, a lot of times that's the first question I ⁓ asked is they're like, Hey, I've been training and I've been running ⁓ ⁓ shoe for all my training miles, but I'd like to get something special to run a half marathon in or to ⁓ tempo day or to do this or to do that. So. Yeah, I've not had one person come back with any sort of ⁓ negative reaction to a recommendation. So that's another feather I like to put on my cap. MikeRunsMarathons: That is, that's awesome. So folks, you heard it here. If you need shoe advice, go to Chad. ⁓ Chad Zimmermann: Yeah. And, and I'd like to think I've, I've also had people who, who probably would not classify themselves as a bigger run. Cause here's the one thing I will never place a label on anyone as to whether they're a bigger runner. That is a self-applied label. will never, someone could come to me and say, Hey, I'm six, 150 pounds. And I consider myself a bigger runner. Okay. Awesome. ⁓ that's, if that's how you identify great. MikeRunsMarathons: Mm-hmm. Chad Zimmermann: I will never put a label on anyone that is self-applied. So, but I have had people who might not necessarily ⁓ be close to where I am in terms of size come to and I'm more than happy to help anyone out with recommendations. I've had friends and family who aren't bigger runners as big as I am and my recommendations have. ⁓ help them out as well. MikeRunsMarathons: it's great that you're ⁓ voice that can be able to share that sort of knowledge and information to other people who need it because there's, as pointed out, I like you said, traditionally styled runners because some of the reviews I've seen from a variety of different people, I'll go and buy the shoe because I it's great and then I'll use it and I will. run three runs in it and then it'll just be sitting on my rack because I'll just never use it again. now I, ⁓ I want to back to the training area, right? the portion of, you know, whether it's for your first five K or when you're training for the Paris marathon or any other race that you might have coming up, running ⁓ obviously is about mental toughness, And about. patience, training for the long game. has running taught you about patience, ⁓ especially when progress is not fast and it's definitely flashy at times? Chad Zimmermann: Yeah, I like patients consistency almost go hand in hand. ⁓ A lot of people want to see those dramatic immediate results. want go out ⁓ and have a four mile run be easy and then have the four mile run be even easier. But I mean, progress is not linear. whether it's progress, if you're on a weight loss journey, progress is not linear there. If you are on a journey to set new PRs in your races, progress is not linear. You go and you can have an absolutely killer day and run a fast half marathon and then have another one scheduled later that year and have a bad day. So one, progress linear ⁓ and MikeRunsMarathons: Mm-hmm. Chad Zimmermann: I think the main way to see progress is to be consistent. ⁓ And ⁓ itself ⁓ it almost props you ⁓ to be consistent because if you make something a non-negotiable in your day and make it not to the point where it's stress. ⁓ MikeRunsMarathons: Mm-hmm. Chad Zimmermann: I am a little type A and my wife will confirm that there are times where like if my schedule gets thrown out of whack and it's going to lead to me either missing a run or having to change my training plan, sometimes I'm a little too rigid. And it can stress me out to say, well, no, I got to do this. I got to do that. So there has to be a balance there, but obviously staying as consistent as you can, that will help. MikeRunsMarathons: Mm-hmm. Yeah. Chad Zimmermann: that will help you progress, that will help. I mean, that helps me mentally I know that I can a better father, ⁓ a husband, better employee, a better if I'm in the state mind. So for me, with the aspect of running and fitness being so positive, not just for my physical health, but my mental health, know that I am putting myself in the best position to succeed on all of those fronts if I do the work and get that job done. So for me, ⁓ that's where see the most progress ⁓ is being MikeRunsMarathons: Absolutely. And I'm glad you brought up the progress is not linear because I feel like a lot of people lose sight of that. I can't tell you the amount of times that I've had one good run and then I'll go the next day and try to run the same exact thing. And it will feel like it's 200 % times worse for some reason. And it's easy for us to compare ourselves to others in a variety of different areas with our running. When that comparison comes up, how are you able to stay grounded? You know, whether it's online or if it's in races, what have you. Chad Zimmermann: Yeah, well, and maintain the adage is so true that comparison is the thief of joy. the comparison trap is real. I I fall into it all the time. I ran Chicago this ⁓ past October, Chicago my first MikeRunsMarathons: Mm-hmm. Chad Zimmermann: I had the best training block I had had for any race. I did not miss a run. I got all my strength training in. I was fit. I was healthy. Kouros was telling me I could run a 428. My goal was around 430. I had hit all the paces. was around that. On my 20 mile long run, I was around the pace. MikeRunsMarathons: Mm. Chad Zimmermann: for a 430 on a long run. So like that's how fit I was. And I had had a great training block over the summer and early fall. And I was like rip roaring ready to go. One of your prior guests, Hillary and I, ⁓ had even talked about, cause I knew her goal was to go sub 430 ⁓ in that race. She had been at that barrier for so long and had, I think she had like five attempts where she ⁓ just missed it. ⁓ I'm like, hey, maybe we'll run together because I'm shooting around that time. We never ended up connecting on race day. And I'm glad I didn't cause she went out and ran a 415. It would have blown me out of the water. but I mean, you can't control the conditions. It was, it was warm that day in Chicago. I had made the unfortunate decision to wear, I'd worn a long sleeve heat gear, like shirt ⁓ design, for the heat to, cause I figured I could protect my arms, keep me cool. Cause it was going to be really sunny. MikeRunsMarathons: it was. Mm-hmm. Chad Zimmermann: All it did was like trap the heat in. I started overheating real early. Um, the paces felt so much harder because by the time I was running, it was almost 70 degrees already. Um, I think, I think, I think it started and it was around the low sixties and then within an hour it was almost in the seventies. And then you get into the back half of that course and you are just, you're in the neighborhoods without skyscrapers. You were just exposed to the sun. And so I had, I had a rough day out there. I had to stop at mile 14. had, um, MikeRunsMarathons: Yeah. Mm-hmm. Yeah. Mm-hmm. Chad Zimmermann: I had a doctor cut the sleeves off my long sleeve shirt at like mile. Cause I was, I was, I was at the point where I was like, I'm going to get to halfway and I might just drop cause I'm not feeling good at all. But I saw an, I saw an A-10 I'm like, they're going to have scissors there, like the scissors to cut bandages. I'm like, and so I walked in and I told the doctor, I'm like, I'm like, you got to cut me. He's like, what? I'm like, I need you to cut my sleeves off. He's like, ⁓ okay. So like he took the scissors and he cut the cut me down to like a sleeveless. MikeRunsMarathons: Wow. Hmm Chad Zimmermann: And I felt better from then on. but I'd still, I had burned up so much of my energy stores by being overheated and the pace is being harder. and I was still, I was still on pace for a PR. and I could have, cause 4 30 would have been like a 28 minute PR. So I was still on pace, but I had just, I had, I had lost it at that point and, and couldn't really get it back. So I got home from. MikeRunsMarathons: Yeah. Chad Zimmermann: I got home from Chicago and I was just like, was looking around at all the people that even in the, even in those conditions that had successful days. I Connor Mantz frigging set the new U S men's marathon record and I'm sitting there and I'm looking around and I know, and obviously I was over the moon for Hillary who had, who had struggled for so long to get over that four 30 mark and she blew it out of the water. And I, and I was obviously kind of. MikeRunsMarathons: Yeah. Chad Zimmermann: sitting there like, well, I missed my goal by like 40 minutes. Like not, not just miss my goal. Cause my A goal was obviously around four 30. And then I had like a B goal of four 45. And then I had a C goal of, a PR, which would have been sub four 58, which I felt was easily in the bag. and then, and then just finishing obviously is always the D goal. but I obviously started to compare and I'm like, what? MikeRunsMarathons: Yes. Chad Zimmermann: what went wrong and I started going through and I realized I had made the poor wardrobe choice, I, and it's funny cause I had run when I did my 20 mile or the temperature wasn't significantly off from what I was running in Chicago. And I ran in that shirt. Cause obviously nothing new on race day. ⁓ but it was just, there was something about that day that just didn't work out. And I, I actually, took me ⁓ solid week or so to process and sort of grieve. MikeRunsMarathons: Yep. Hmm. Chad Zimmermann: what I felt like I had lost, was, because I felt like I let a lot of people down. I had made it known what my goals were and I had built up this thing in my head that was going to be a great achievement and I fell woefully short. So I didn't like, I literally took my medal when I got home and I just put it on the counter and it just sat there. I didn't. MikeRunsMarathons: Yeah. Chad Zimmermann: didn't hang it up on my metal hanger, didn't do anything with it, just didn't really revel in the fact that I had just, and I had a lot of people like coming to me and saying, like, finished a marathon, like you achieved something great. And I just couldn't, I couldn't see the forest or the trees. Like it was just, I was so hyper-focused on like the goal, the goals that I had missed. So it ⁓ me about a week to process. And then finally, slowly but surely I started to MikeRunsMarathons: Thank Yeah. Yeah. my God, I feel you. And it took me, ⁓ had made it a goal since I first started running marathons to break four hours. I was like, I don't care if it's 359, I just want to do it. And it took me eight marathons to get to it. I crossing the finish line when I realized that that had happened. I just broke down into tears. I just started sobbing. Chad Zimmermann: Yeah. MikeRunsMarathons: because of just what it represented. yeah, huge shout out to ⁓ Hillary on that because she obliterated her goal, which I'm so proud of. And I look forward to what she's going to do in 2026 because she already has plans. ⁓ Chad Zimmermann: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. like me. She always seems to thrive when she's got something on her calendar and to keep her ⁓ motivated. yeah, so for me, motivation comes from not only the community around me, but also I usually always have something in the works to kind of keep me out there. MikeRunsMarathons: Mm-hmm. Yeah. ⁓ yeah, I'm the same exact way. They always talk about the post-marathon blues and for me it's always like, well, I don't have them for that long because I have four marathons. Chad Zimmermann: I never get them because I always have something else to start. I'll take, and in fact, think there's only, I think in the last three, a little over three years, maybe almost three and a half years, I've taken three total weeks off running. One was after my second marathon, which was in February of 2024. I took a week off after. Then I had gotten MikeRunsMarathons: Mm-hmm. Chad Zimmermann: We as a family had gotten COVID sometime in early 2025. So I took a week off. Now luckily I didn't have anything scheduled. It didn't impact really anything. But so I took week off then. And then I took a week off after Chicago to kind of like clear my head. ⁓ I felt I felt okay. ⁓ But just kind of clear my head and clear the air, do my grieving process and move on. So yeah, those are the only, those are the... MikeRunsMarathons: Absolutely. Chad Zimmermann: only three weeks where I have not run in basically since 2022, since August 2022. And that's the thing is control the controllables. Can't control the weather. Unfortunately, I did not control the controllables because I mean, my nutrition was on point. I was carving up. was doing this, doing that. But yeah, once the wardrobe, ⁓ blame the wardrobe decision, but unfortunately, the wardrobe decision was mine. So. MikeRunsMarathons: Mm-hmm. Well, so I did Berlin too last year and that was probably like just because of the weather was probably the worst marathon I've ever run. Chad Zimmermann: ⁓ that, heard about that one. MikeRunsMarathons: I ⁓ remember calling my wife at mile 17 being I hate this. ⁓ I would quit, I don't wanna do this. then I also remember at the same time, I paid to come to Europe, I paid to run this race, I can't not finish because then I'll have wasted my money. ⁓ And my wife is also the kind of person who, ⁓ she's not afraid to tell me to shut fuck up and keep going. Chad Zimmermann: Yeah. Yep. Yep. I am. Yeah. MikeRunsMarathons: So luckily I had that person, but no, ⁓ weather this year has just been obscenely all across the board and it makes me furious. Chad Zimmermann: When I, and I did the typical, it's funny, I I did, I've done the same thing after each one of the marathons, but for like a shorter duration. So after Paris, the first time I'm like, all right, no more, I've done one, no more marathons. Like that's fine. After I ran Wilmington, North Carolina in February of 2024, I had a very, it was a very short period of, all right, now I've done, this is the marathon of my comeback. So like I came back to running, I ran another marathon. Okay, cool. I'll stick to the half distance. And that lasted maybe a couple of weeks. And then all of sudden I got the idea of, maybe I'll run a major for charity. And then sure enough, after Chicago, and I think Chicago was a little bit more, because I was somewhat disappointed in the performance, I said, no more marathon. And that, I think that lasted just a few days. That one was short. MikeRunsMarathons: Mm-hmm. Chad Zimmermann: Because immediately thereafter, I'm like, all right, what am I doing in 2026? MikeRunsMarathons: Mm-hmm. so I want to jump now to, cause we talked about, you know, a lot of these accomplishments that we've had as, as runners, as marathoners, To the person who is considering jumping into the sport, whether it's for for fun or they want to start getting into races or things like that, there's a lot of intimidation that they can feel. Whether it's about their body, about their pace, about their background, would you want them to know before decide to lace up for the first time? Chad Zimmermann: I mean. I would like to think that slowly but surely the environment is going to get more and more welcoming, especially the more and more people we get in who, and that's not to say the community isn't very welcoming. I think a lot of people have that preemptive intimidation, of not being accepted. And that's just a natural human emotion because as humans we're, we have a herd her desire, a pack mentality, we want to be part of a pack. And obviously you want to be accepted. So I think a lot of people go in and ⁓ more they need But that's not to say it's not legitimate concern, because ⁓ obviously, as also talked about, there is ⁓ a fair of gatekeeping. jump in both feet. We will... people like me, people like Herms, people like Hillary, we are going to be there to support you. gonna be there, we're gonna be a resource as best we can. There are just as many people out there who ⁓ look you, who ⁓ run paces. I mean, ⁓ the pack is the place to be. That's where you're gonna find the ⁓ support. where you're gonna find. people who are out there grinding, that's where you're gonna find the people who are in this for the love of it. Because you know what? You're not gonna go out and do something for four, four, five, six hours if you don't love it. So ⁓ the end of the day, ⁓ are out there because we love it. ⁓ out there doing what I do for the community because I love everyone in it. I felt, I personally have felt, ⁓ incredibly welcomed, not just by everyone I believe in the run, but everyone else kind of in the online running community, whether it's, whether it's ⁓ Aubrey who now goes by bigger than running. ⁓ and I, he's a UK guy. He and I chat all the time. ⁓ Kufusi, ⁓ Emily Heller runs like Heller, like the Drew Whitcomb from Where Testers in a room ⁓ Where Testers. Everyone's just been so welcoming and ⁓ understand the that I MikeRunsMarathons: Mm-hmm. Chad Zimmermann: play in the community is just as important to the roles that they play in the online community. And they never, I've never doubted my belonging since getting in. I've never doubted my belonging in the space. on, obviously there was a little bit of imposter syndrome and things like that. mean, and ⁓ something I've suffered from my whole life, but no, at the end of the day, if you're someone who's looking to get in, mean, just MikeRunsMarathons: ⁓ yeah. Chad Zimmermann: Jump in with both feet. We will be here to support you. There are just as many people out there that will be that supportive force as there are the people who will be doubters or or ⁓ people who might try and cut you down or tell you you don't deserve to run in race day shoes or, you're a back of the packer. don't, ⁓ one's about what you're doing. We will be here. will support you. Find us, we'll be in the back of the pack with you. And that's the thing is ⁓ have nothing but support since getting into the community. that's what I to be able to instill in others, a confidence to jump in, a confidence to do these things. I want them to see me going out and doing Chicago or going out and doing bigger races like I have planned in 2026 and say, I'm not sure if I can do it, but I'm going to go for it. Because there's only one way to find out whether you, I mean, I think, what is the phrase? Whether you believe you can or you can't, you're right. So. MikeRunsMarathons: I've actually never heard of that. I love that. I've never heard of that quote before. That's awesome. Now, I want to ask you this because you call yourself the big guy reviewer, believe in the runs and and a lot of people come to you for for advice. What's one misconception about larger runners that you wish people would let go? Chad Zimmermann: I mean, I think a ⁓ misconception about bigger runners ⁓ a belonging sort of Not that we don't earn it, like that us running a to five hour marathon isn't as hard as, ⁓ someone going out and running their sub three hour marathons, because you know what? At the end of the day, we're, we're spending twice as long as you on our feet. We're taking twice, twice as many ⁓ as you are our body. We, we have more force going down on our joints. MikeRunsMarathons: Hmm. Chad Zimmermann: than you do. mean, there's a plethora of ways in which we are putting in just as much effort. Sure, we may not be racking up 80, 90, 100 mile weeks, but our 25 to 30 mile weeks may take just as much time as yours. It may take just as much effort for us to get out the door and do those things. So in terms of the effort ⁓ I mean, I MikeRunsMarathons: Mm-hmm. Chad Zimmermann: anyone, regardless of body type that goes out and puts them through the grind that is a marathon training block and gets to the start line, them up and at least ⁓ the attempt, has ⁓ major props from me at any point, regardless of who you are. ⁓ always have more of a soft spot in my heart for people who look like me who go out and do it because I know just how hard it is. MikeRunsMarathons: Yeah. Yes, yes, agree with you 100%. No, we talked about someone who might be intimidated by, you know, getting in the running based off of a variety of different, different things. Is there a moment in your journey that you would want someone who is a hesitant new runner to hear about that would ⁓ make want to get in or make them feel more comfortable about joining in on the sport? Chad Zimmermann: Once you cross that first finish line, you're going to be hooked. mean, get, find the right race, find something that's going to motivate you. If, if it's going to be running for a cause that's important to you to get you out the door and get you training, whether it's a marathon, a half marathon, if you are a Disney enthusiast, do a Disney race. My wife is a big proponent of doing Disney races now. She's done a few and she's going to be doing one in April. Find ⁓ that motivates whether it's intrinsic to the race or whether it's for your health ⁓ or, once you cross that first finish line, it's ⁓ gonna be over. ⁓ The feelings you're gonna have, whether your first finish line is a 5K, your first finish line is a 10K, whatever it is. If you once, once you do that, you will, you will feel a new sense of pride that no one, no one can take from you and it won't go away. And if you're like me and crossing that first finish line was like, okay, what's next? What's next? And it doesn't have to be, it could be, Hey, you know what? Like I cross that first 5k finish line, 5k is enough for me. I'm just going to keep doing 5k. Not everyone needs to run. MikeRunsMarathons: Mm-hmm. Chad Zimmermann: Marathons not everyone needs to run half marathons or even 10 K's 10 milers. I've done I've basically run the gamut of distances from half marathon to sorry from 5k all the way to marathon and in 2026 will be beyond but You don't have to I mean ⁓ you you can go on be like, alright, I've done a first 5k What's next 10k? Okay, 10 K is a perfect distance for me. I can do it comfortably 10 K's where I'm gonna cap out fine great MikeRunsMarathons: Yes. Mm-hmm. Yeah. Chad Zimmermann: But crossing that finish line will be a moment that you need to soak in, you need to drink it in and just live on that. MikeRunsMarathons: Definitely. mean, living on that, that feeling of I remember I crossed my first finish line. I did a five K actually for NAMI in 2019. It was my first race I ever done in my life. I'd never run before, you know, in front of a large crowd of people. And it was it was ⁓ unlike any feeling that I'd had in life before. And you're right. You don't have to run marathons. You don't have to run half marathons. You don't have to run 10 K's. You don't have to run five k's. If you want to go out and run a mile, go out and run a mile. Like there's so much pressure, I think, on people because of what they see online. Like everybody's running marathons now. Everybody's doing these long distances. You don't have to do those. Just go out there and have fun. Chad Zimmermann: Yeah, no, that's it. Yep. Completely. And, and you know what? Like if you, if you want to do it and put yourself out there, go for it. More power to you. You don't have to know when I'm not, if someone comes to me and says, Hey, I'm, I don't consider myself a runner. only run five days. All right. Well, first of all, you just said you run five days. You're a runner. Like let's hard stop. No. Second of all, props to you going out and running five case. Like that's not MikeRunsMarathons: Mm-hmm. Yeah. Chad Zimmermann: I mean, you are, you are lapping everyone who's on the couch, not running five case. So think about it like that. And, and, and like I said, for me, for me, I enjoy it. Like I enjoy logging the mileage. enjoy the training. I act. I'm one of those sickos who actually enjoys the training. race race day is kind of the, the cherry on top of the Sunday, but I'm, ⁓ I enjoy the train. I enjoy the miles. it gives me that time to help. MikeRunsMarathons: Amen to that. Mm-hmm. Chad Zimmermann: clear my head and process things and be good for my mental and physical health. So the training is great. The race is kind of the cherry on top. MikeRunsMarathons: I mean, talking about this, crossing the finish line and having this enthusiasm and excitement running is something that, you know, every runner, regardless of this, and you run needs to in some way, or form during the running journeys. for you, what keeps you excited about continuing long run journey. Chad Zimmermann: ⁓ well, actually 2026 is going to be a new year for me because I, after, after and being a little bit let down, I actually, it was funny. ⁓ I got home, ⁓ started process and I said, you know what? I had this amazing build earlier in the year. I had attempted to set a new half marathon PR. but it was on a rail trail and it rained the night before and the day of the race. the. MikeRunsMarathons: Mm. Chad Zimmermann: the gravel rail trail is just like slop. ⁓ So I miss setting a new PR. I think my PR at the time was like 209 something. And so I got to the halfway point and I was like on PR pace, but just ⁓ was an out and back. So I had already known what I had run through. And I'm like, ⁓ just can't sustain this pace ⁓ the mud and all the, like the mud, the water was like ankle deep in some areas on the rail trail. like, I'm not gonna do it. MikeRunsMarathons: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Chad Zimmermann: took the back half and I'm just like, I'm just going to enjoy this nice, beautiful run. were in Jim Thorpe, Pennsylvania, beautiful mountainous rail trail, great views. So was like, I'll just enjoy the view and jogged it in. But so that was my spring attempt. And I'm like, you know what? I had the best training block I've ever had for a race. I'm going to capitalize on the fitness I built and the marathon build. The Harrisburg half marathon was four weeks after Chicago. So I'm like, I can take a full week off. MikeRunsMarathons: Mm-hmm. Chad Zimmermann: I decided to start shifting into doing some trail running around me. I'm going to be doing some trail reviews for the dirt division of Believe in the Run. And I decided, I'm like, you know what, what better way to experience trails than by running some trail races. So I registered for my first 50K in May of 2026 in Northwest Philly. So, so yeah, and, I'm going into that with zero expectation. It's, it's almost like me going back to 2014 and 2015 when I first started running where I have no expectations on myself other than to just go out and experience the run and finish. that's my goal. And I'm running, ⁓ think as a training race for that, I'm running the Philadelphia trail half marathon, which is in a different park in Philly. And yeah, so for me, 2026 is all about experiences as opposed to performance related goals. I have Knock on Wood. ⁓ trying to potentially get into the New York City ⁓ Marathon in ⁓ We'll see. I do have a friend who's running that and it's going to be her first marathon. She did the nine plus one. MikeRunsMarathons: Mm-hmm. Chad Zimmermann: So she's going to run that and I have told her I will do my best to get into that so we could run it together. So yeah, and that will be us just going out. It's her first. It'll be me just going out and enjoying it and running it with her. So yeah, it's all about experiences in 2026. So yeah. MikeRunsMarathons: I love that. ⁓ I mean, the name of the game, right? You chase times as much as you want, but as soon it becomes so much of pressure on top of what you're trying to do, it takes away from fun. So going out there and just enjoying ⁓ it is the best you could possibly. Chad Zimmermann: Mm-hmm. And like I said, I'm a sicko enjoys the training. I am going to, I'm going to still dedicate myself to the training as if I am training for a race, but each race day is going to just be treated like just another run. ⁓ so J J R JAR is the theme of, of 2026. It's just another run. and yeah, and, who knows? I mean, I have somewhat fallen in love with the trails. MikeRunsMarathons: Absolutely. I love that. I love that. Chad Zimmermann: my long runs, I've been doing most of my long runs on trails. done up like 10 to 12 miles on trails the last few weekends and yeah, sort of falling in love with it. So who knows? I mean, maybe after ⁓ 50K, we looking at different ultra distances, but we'll see. Yeah, ⁓ we'll see. I once ⁓ I started getting into the trails and the dirt stuff, John. MikeRunsMarathons: 150 miles and 100 Ks. My goodness. Chad Zimmermann: ⁓ Calabrese, one of ⁓ the dirt division guy, he runs a, he runs a hundred milers every other weekend or something like that. His ultra sign up, you look at his ultra sign up, his ultra sign up has like 75 different entries over the last couple years. ⁓ he's just, he eats up miles on the week. So his first, his first comment to me is like, all right, so ⁓ what's your first hundred, hundred mile are going to be? I'm like, let's. MikeRunsMarathons: Cheers. Ahem. Chad Zimmermann: That would be years down the road, maybe when the kids are a little older and yeah, yeah. MikeRunsMarathons: Let me do the 50 K first. Uh, So this next section is I call the hot seat. These are questions that I ask everybody that I interview. They're just some quick, rapid fire Don't think too hard. I'll them ⁓ based off whatever comes top of mind. And I'm actually... very interested in the answers we have for some of these. But I actually don't know what this first answer would be, trail or road. Chad Zimmermann: Man, if you had asked me this weeks ago, ⁓ would have been emphatically road. I ⁓ only run trail one before that. It was for a Believe in the Run event ⁓ for grit party. And it was sort of like a backyard ultra sort of thing. had like a four mile loop and you just ran it as many times you could. I think I ran 14 miles on trails having never run them before. the next day my posterior chain was on fire. It hurts so bad. You know what? I'm still going to say road just because ⁓ still so new in the trails. But ⁓ if if, if we were to be doing this interview next year, it might be different. We'll, we'll see. There's just, there is something liberating about being out two, two hours on the trails. ⁓ MikeRunsMarathons: back. Chad Zimmermann: goes by so fast, like mentally compared to two hours on the road. And I've done both. I've done two hours out in the trails and I've done two hours on the road very recently. And it's just a completely different animal. MikeRunsMarathons: Yeah. Yeah, no, same here. I mean, I don't trail run anymore because I have a tendency of falling a lot when I trail run. But when I did, I would specifically go out into trails in Delaware and Pennsylvania and just like be out there for two, three, sometimes four hours at a time. when it would be done, I'd be like, oh, I didn't know how much time passed. This was a lot of fun. Chad Zimmermann: Yep. Yeah, I'll look, I'll, I'll load, maps onto my Garmin or roots under my Garmin and the trails. And, and sure. A 10 mile run on the trails might take me 30 or 40 minutes longer. Cause obviously you get the inclines and you get the different terrain that you're trying to navigate. and you're in, I'm actually eating snacks as opposed to just taking gels on the road. I'm eating my chewy granola bars, but No, it's just such a different experience and I'm really starting to take to it. So we'll see. MikeRunsMarathons: I'm going to I'm going to check in with you come the summertime and see how you how how you feel. Chad Zimmermann: Yeah. Yeah, that'll be different. like I said, is the 50K. And then we'll see. Yeah. MikeRunsMarathons: I'll check in with you in June and see how you feel. I can't wait to hear this one. What is your favorite running shoe brand right now? Chad Zimmermann: That's tough. mean... Top to bottom. It's hard to fault ASICs. ⁓ really just is not putting out bad shoes right now. All way down from like Nova Blast Super Blast 2 is still to this day. I ran Chicago in the Super Blast 2. I ran Wilmington in the original Super Blast. It's still to this day my favorite shoe, my long run go-to shoe. MikeRunsMarathons: Mm-hmm. Yes. Chad Zimmermann: ⁓ I haven't run in the Mega Blast or Sonic Blast yet. I am trying to get my hands on a pair of those. Everyone raves about them. But even the Meta Speed series, like in terms of from a bigger runner perspective, like I did really well with the Meta Speed Sky. I ran the Cherry Blossom ⁓ 10 Mylar and the Meta Speeds overall. ⁓ It's tough because I'm really liking what... I do really like a lot of what New Balance does, especially their race day shoes, which are a little less aggressive and therefore a little more accommodating to bigger or slower runners. But yeah, from a top to bottom perspective, and are in somewhat of a golden age of running right now where ⁓ are so few misses these days. ⁓ There are so few, like, MikeRunsMarathons: Mm-hmm. So much. Yeah. Chad Zimmermann: Some people, if you're brand diagnostic, you can put together an absolutely killer lineup top to bottom of, can mix and match, there are some shoes that won't mesh necessarily well ⁓ you in ⁓ one but another similar model will in another brand. And so you can create an absolutely killer lineup these days. MikeRunsMarathons: Now, I think you hinted at this earlier, but early alarm or late run. Chad Zimmermann: I'm an early run person. I did one run actually just this past Saturday. ⁓ And of it ends up being one of the best runs I've had in a long time. was the second half of a double ⁓ after I to cut an earlier run short. But yeah, I'm just so much more, ⁓ I don't like when I have like, A, the stress of the day on my weighing shoulders. A lot of people use running to like, alleviate stress, I do it preemptively to like start my day with a clean slate of, hey, we're gonna start from a good mental standpoint. For me, I don't like having the stress of the day on me. I don't like having food in my stomach. So yeah, I'm an early morning guy. MikeRunsMarathons: I'm more power to people who run in the morning. I just can't get up. I'm either a middle day runner or I tend to now be a very late night runner. Chad Zimmermann: In the winters, I do transition to sometimes more, I do work from home, so I'll go out over my lunch a lot of times and run when it's a little bit warmer, the sun's out and stuff like that. come spring and summer and fall, I'm always early. MikeRunsMarathons: Mm-hmm. is your favorite post marathon meal? Chad Zimmermann: I like a good burger. It just is the perfect blend of you get the carbs from the fries and you get the protein from the burger ⁓ the carbs from the bun. Yeah, it's just, it's so well balanced. You get the fat from the burger and the cheese and all the top bacon that you get on there. It's what I had after Chicago actually was a, had a nice burger. ⁓ MikeRunsMarathons: and the protein. Chad Zimmermann: I did, I ordered from the hotel restaurant. I went down and picked it up and brought it up to my room and just sat on the bed and crushed a huge burger. MikeRunsMarathons: Nice. ⁓ that sounds perfect. I love that. podcasts or silence on your easy runs. Chad Zimmermann: Easy Runs is podcasts. If I listen to music, I get too ⁓ and all of a sudden my pace slowly creeps up. But so Easy Runs is podcasts. MikeRunsMarathons: Mm-hmm. Chad Zimmermann: And it's actually beneficial when I know a lot of the people on the podcast I listen to know them personally, where all of a sudden it's like, ⁓ I like, it's like listening to friends. So it makes it easy. MikeRunsMarathons: What is the one piece of running gear that you can't live without and you can't say your shoes? Chad Zimmermann: ⁓ I, I love some, some people don't, I love my running watch. ⁓ I love, I'm a data guy. I love it. Now, when I am running, I try to avoid focusing on it because I am trying to avoid. Like I'll check in on my heart rate. I'll check in on pace just to make sure, especially in work, but like for nailing workouts and things like that, when I, when I am incorporating speed work. MikeRunsMarathons: Mm-hmm. Yeah. Chad Zimmermann: and tempo tempos into my training. The fact that I can set the intervals ⁓ easily and ⁓ my workouts. ⁓ Also, now that I'm running trails, the mapping features are super helpful. ⁓ just upgraded actually from the Coros Pace 3 to the Nomad, which has a much larger screen and the mapping is great and the battery life is incredible. So yeah, so Coros is, I net MikeRunsMarathons: Yeah. ⁓ yeah. Mm-hmm. Chad Zimmermann: I sleep in it and I wear it. The only time I'm not wearing is when I'm in the shower, so. MikeRunsMarathons: I'm the same exactly. I cannot tell you when I would be trail running how the, wouldn't be able to trail run if I didn't have the mapping feature. I would be, they would find me dead some. Chad Zimmermann: ⁓ I, I'm, I'm, yeah, I'm, I am very directionally gifted. Like I can find my way places very easily, but out on the trails, like I just, a, cause I partially kind of, I'm living kind of, I'm in the zone a little bit and all of a sudden, but like, luckily with having the mapping feature and I can design routes it'll, and it warns you about turns and yeah. Yep. Yep. I did, I actually did. MikeRunsMarathons: Yep. And when you go too far and you're like, I'm crying, I got back. Chad Zimmermann: My most recent trail run, was the first trail run after I got the Nomad. hadn't changed a lot of my, I had forgot to go in and change a lot of my navigation settings that I had had on the pace three. So it didn't warn me that I was off route until I was like almost half a mile off. So I had to backtrack by, so I added an extra mile to my 11 mile run by having to backtrack a whole other half mile. ⁓ MikeRunsMarathons: hand. So now guess I want to know what this is now because you're starting to get in the trail races, but do you have a dream race? Chad Zimmermann: It's sort of hanging up behind you. I'd love to run Boston. ⁓ from New England. I was born and raised in New Hampshire. So the lore of the Boston Marathon, even when I wasn't a runner and into fitness, it still obviously has the cache all around New England and all over the running community. I would love to run it, even if I just run it once. I just want be able to say I did it. MikeRunsMarathons: Mm. Yeah. Chad Zimmermann: And it's sort of a cop out answer because that's everyone's kind of like, ⁓ I want to run Boston because it's so hard and so elite to do. for me, it's not a hometown race because I'm not from Boston. But I mean, when you say New Hampshire, everyone's like, ⁓ so basically Boston. Yeah, pretty much. Yeah. So for ⁓ I ⁓ like to run Boston. ⁓ MikeRunsMarathons: Now, you pick anyone to run Boston with, who would it be? Chad Zimmermann: man, that's ⁓ MikeRunsMarathons: Friend, family, celebrity, whoever, living or dead. Chad Zimmermann: Well, and one of my answers a different podcast interview was who would you want to bring to ⁓ pasta dinner as your plus one? Who's a runner? This was on the runs. Yeah. And so my interview there, so my answer for who I'd want to be ⁓ on run is going to be the same for this. I'd love to run it with Kira DeMato because I feel like she would help. She's so funny. MikeRunsMarathons: ⁓ was this on the runs? I love them. Mm-hmm. Chad Zimmermann: ⁓ Just like naturally she's just a naturally funny person. I feel like ⁓ I could turn to her for some There's some laughs during during for me. What's gonna be a four plus hour marathon now for her she would She would be ⁓ going at quite a slow pace for her. But yeah, if I if I could have someone there who could keep me In the zone mentally and in humor and being funny, I think will help you MikeRunsMarathons: just finished her her audiobook and yeah, I agree. hysterical Chad Zimmermann: Yeah, I did that on the way out and back to Chicago. I had the audio book and I listened to that. MikeRunsMarathons: Yeah, my wife and I went to, went to go visit her family over the holidays. And I ⁓ the book right before we left and we listened to it, like the whole way there. ⁓ then we finished about halfway back on the way home. And she was like in my wife is, like I said, not a runner. And she was like, in gross. She was like, and what happened? What's gonna happen? What happens next? ⁓ you get Chad Zimmermann: Yeah. Well, and she, yeah, and Kira and I, a few, a few years ago, she actually followed me on Instagram. So she and I chat from time to time on, on Instagram about stuff. And I told her, cause obviously now we both, we both now been interviewed for on the run. So we're both, both part of the pod fam and we were talking about stuff. And I actually, when I was in Chicago, I was doing a ShakeOut run with New Balance and Fleet Feet with Meb. MikeRunsMarathons: Yeah. Chad Zimmermann: we were running along the waterfront and I see these two people come flying up on us, not from behind, but like towards us. And I look really quickly and it was Kira and Clayton Young running together on the waterfront. So I gave them a loud shout out. I'm like, ⁓ Kira and Clayton. And then ⁓ I pulled up our Strava maps and sent a screenshot to Kira. like, if you heard someone yell your name right here and I circled it for her, yeah, that was me. MikeRunsMarathons: him. No way. That is ⁓ Chad Zimmermann: And then I actually saw Clayton either later that night or the following night, because I went to the Laura Green comedy show and Clayton was one of her guests there. So I actually saw him later and I talked to him about giving him the shout out on the run too. MikeRunsMarathons: Oh, that's funny. That's funny. It actually gave me my medal at New York last year. It was it was the most surreal experience of my life. I crossed the finish line and I turned to my left and he crosses the finish line to with I for with his charity. And I literally I literally just stood there and went, are you fucking kidding me right now? Like I went up to him. I was like. Chad Zimmermann: ⁓ yeah. Yeah. MikeRunsMarathons: I don't want to bother you. I just want to leave them such a fan. love your book. and he was like, well, let's go get medals. And he gave me I put my medal over my I like recorded I was like, you guys are not gonna believe this. And I was just like, this is one of the greatest days of my life. Like I was not. ⁓ was awesome. Chad Zimmermann: Yeah, yeah, I got to do, he was at the run, I got to do a meet and greet, I got a signed copy of his book, got to chat with him for like, he was also at the Believe in the Run Shakeout, so I got to see him there as well too, so yeah, so he was great. read, when I got back from Chicago, that was the first book that I read when I got back. Yep. MikeRunsMarathons: Mm. ⁓ yeah, such a good book. I love it so much. Now this question that I have is one that I call the motivation library. If you could pick one quote, a mantra or line to get you through the tough miles, what would that be? Chad Zimmermann: Uh, and I've, I've said this to myself on runs where I, I, I feel like quitting or, or early on on a run where I'm not feeling it. And, and I just say to myself, you have never once regretted a run. I, and, that gets me through, I, I have powered through some rainy runs, snowy runs, runs where I'm got side stitches, runs where I'm just not feeling great. MikeRunsMarathons: Mm. Chad Zimmermann: runs where it's just hard that day. I've gotten through runs with just saying you have never. And, and I, there have been very few instances where I've actually cut a run short and it's usually because something is actually like hurting, not like, ⁓ because I'm not motivated or, it's just a, my day. but repeating that myself that I've never once. MikeRunsMarathons: Mm-hmm. Chad Zimmermann: regretted a run and and and I that can get me through MikeRunsMarathons: Now, I agree with you on that so much. that one hits deep. I like that one a lot. Now, I wanna jump to May where you have your ⁓ first 50K, right? You see the finish line. Your body feels beaten up beyond belief, Because you've never done this distance before. What song is blasting through your headphones as you cross that finish line? Chad Zimmermann: I'm going to end up circling back to, ⁓ to my on the runs interview. when, when, they put together the playlist ⁓ for, for podcasts guests. and it's going to be Andrew WK party hard. ⁓ because that, that song has just the absolute perfect rhythm and cadence. MikeRunsMarathons: Okay. Chad Zimmermann: where if I want to be running like up tempo and I know I'm going to want to be running up tempo and sprinting to that finish line. That is a perfect finish line song because it has just consistent ⁓ entire song, there's like no break. It's about two and a half minutes long of just pure energy. And at end of the day, I know when I'm crossing that finish line, I'm going to go that night and I'm going to party hard. So... So that's gonna be my motivating song to get me across the finish line. MikeRunsMarathons: I love that. I love that. No, it's always good to have those songs that, you know, don't just stay with you and you cross finish line, but then they just like they go further and they carry you on past the finish line. no. Chad Zimmermann: Yeah. And when that comes on and that's partly why I only listen to music when I'm doing workouts or races, just because music plays such a big role in. I funny, like, and it, and I don't, well, there, there is a psychological, there are studies on the psychological impact of perform music and performance in strength training and running. but like I will go out and if I run, let's say I'm running a nine minute pace. If I'm running a nine minute pace listening to a podcast. MikeRunsMarathons: Mm-hmm. Chad Zimmermann: my heart rate will be higher than when I'm listening, running nine minutes listening to music. There's just something about the music that makes it easier psychologically, which obviously then has an impact on your heart rate. It's the craziest thing. MikeRunsMarathons: Yeah, I'm going to have to read this up. I had no idea about that. Chad Zimmermann: Yeah, that's how it impacts me. So that's all anecdotal. But yeah, there are a lot of studies out there about the performance benefits of music. MikeRunsMarathons: awesome. Well, no, I love running the music. don't know. Herm was telling me about how they, you can't have headphones in the JFK 50. ⁓ Chad Zimmermann: ⁓ JFK. I don't think it's funny. I was actually talking to Herms about doing JFK sometime in the future. And the one limiting thing for me would be being out there for 10 to 12 hours with no music. MikeRunsMarathons: Yup. Yeah, that's what I said. Same thing to him. I said, I don't know if I could do that. And being a little my thoughts for that many hours. I don't know. Chad Zimmermann: If I ever move beyond the 50K distance, I will need to do something that allows headphones. yeah. MikeRunsMarathons: Yes, agreed, agreed. I mean, I need it for my marathon. Chad Zimmermann: Yeah, I didn't have my music on for maybe the first half of Chicago. And then I ended up turning it on when I was in the pain cave and like thinking about quitting. ⁓ And it help get me through. So even though there are some areas where I use shocks and I couldn't even really hear my headphones through the crowds, but. MikeRunsMarathons: Mm-hmm. Same, same, yeah. ⁓ so Chad, those are actually all the questions that I had for you today. I really want to thank you so much for sharing not just your story, but about what connects us as runners and how to feel and build a community with in running so that you can feel like you belong in the sport. and what stands out the most to me is not just what you've accomplished. It's the way that you've shown people that running belongs to everyone, regardless of the finished time, their body type, their their background, it is, whatever their story is, everyone has some ⁓ of ⁓ and becoming a part of this community. that long you maintain that strong consistency of showing up and continuing to put one foot in front of the other, you'll make that progress that you want to make. that visibility matters more people realize. If you're listening, you already follow him. His username is the Clydesdale runner, all one word. So make sure you go ahead and check him out and make sure to also check him out and believe in the run. It is a fantastic website in case you haven't heard about it that offers insanely detailed reviews of running shoes for everyone. His journey is a reminder that you don't need permission to start and you don't need to look like anyone else to be able to belong in this sport. So. Thank you so much, Chad. I appreciate it. Chad Zimmermann: Yeah, thanks Mike. MikeRunsMarathons: Again, I want to thank Chad for joining us today. It was a pleasure to speak with him about his running journey, what got him started into running. know, our stories are very similar in terms of getting started with our fitness and trying to become healthier going from his first 5K all the way up to his first marathon in 15 months is just an incredible story. and the way that he shows up for runners that specific questions that might not be answered by some people within this running community is something that I think is so powerful and so inspiring. Like I said again, if you are looking for a great pair of shoes and you don't know where to start when it comes to looking for the right reviewer or the right website to find the right review on, Believe in the Run is a fantastic website that I use myself ⁓ having chat on here is an honor. to be able to speak with him about not just his background as a runner, but also how he utilizes his knowledge to be able to provide support to runners everywhere in the world. So again, thank you so much, Chad. I want to thank all of you again for tuning in at your own pace, whether walking, racing, or just dreaming about getting started with your running journey, I want you to remember that you belong here. at every pace. So until next time, keep running your story one mile at a time and I'll see you in the next one. Bye.