Latest / The Reverse Aging Club with Meredith Oke / 168: The Quantum Biology Revolution: A View from the Front Lines of Emergency Medicine

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168: The Quantum Biology Revolution: A View from the Front Lines of Emergency Medicine · The Reverse Aging Club with Meredith Oke

5:34
All right, Dr. Lance Becker, welcome to the QBC
5:37
podcast. This is going to be a fun time,
5:41
I hope. I think we'll have some fun today. You're working on some
5:45
cool stuff, so I'm looking forward to getting into it. But
5:48
first, tell us a little bit who you are, what your background is.
5:52
So I have kind of an unusual background. I'm an emergency medicine
5:55
doctor, and I'm the chair of emergency medicine for the
5:58
Northwell Health System. It's a big health care system with 30
6:02
hospitals, but I'm also a scientist, and I run a basic
6:05
science laboratory. And that is what is kind of like,
6:09
led me down the rabbit hole to quantum
6:12
biology that I'll talk a little bit about and sort of
6:16
my background, because I see people when they're really desperately
6:20
ill, sometimes they don't have a pulse. Okay. And
6:24
my background is in trying to bring people back to life. And
6:28
so I've worked in this area. It's called cardiac arrest or resuscitation.
6:32
And it involves things like CPR and defibrillators
6:35
and drugs and all the kinds of things that happen to
6:39
people when they're really, desperately, desperately ill. And so I've
6:43
tried to approach it both sort of at a high level and at a
6:46
cellular level. Like, why is it, for example, that we just
6:50
can't bring somebody who's been dead for a while just back
6:54
to life? Like, what is the limitation to that? And that was
6:57
really the question that I started with going back
7:01
to when I was at the University of Chicago and I started
7:05
a basic science lab. And we started to think about cells, and we started to
7:08
think about what could we do to, like, maybe we could learn something from cells.
7:12
And that work led me to some really
7:16
interesting, interesting biology. And it led me to
7:20
this little organelle that makes energy
7:23
inside our body called the mitochondria.
7:27
And mitochondria are sort of having a
7:30
resurgence of interest right now because it's
7:34
increasingly recognized that not only do
7:37
they make energy, which is, like,
7:41
vital, so if you don't have your mitochondria making energy, you will be
7:45
dead in seconds. All right? But they also do all these other
7:48
things, and they actually tell ourselves kind
7:52
of the state they're in. So, like, should I
7:56
live or should I die? Should I stay or should I go?
8:02
And all of our cells have that kind of a switch inside
8:05
them. Should I stay or should I go? And
8:09
that switch is monitoring our cells all the time.
8:13
And what we discovered over Maybe the last 20
8:17
years is that one of the reasons that you can't bring a person back to
8:20
life if they've been dead for a while is because that switch has gone off.
8:24
So I began to look at how do you fix that? And so it has
8:27
all kinds of things to do with mitochondrial health
8:31
and mitochondrial behavior and then
8:34
mitochondrial action. And so what
8:38
sort of happened just in the last few years
8:42
is that we actually figured out that these mitochondria don't even stay inside
8:46
a cell all the time. They don't know
8:49
boundaries. They're sort of like me that wanders
8:53
all over the place, sometimes my career, as I've been accused of
8:57
doing, you can imagine. And they don't stay in the box.
9:01
Okay, so it turns out our mitochondria have the ability to
9:04
get out of the box and go into another cell. Now, no one
9:08
yet is even really teaching that in fundamental
9:12
biology, certainly not when I went to medical
9:16
school or graduate school, because that is so new
9:19
and it is very controversial. And whether it is like for good
9:23
or for ill is there's all kinds of controversy. And
9:27
recently I was the host of a large,
9:31
the world's first mitochondrial transplantation
9:35
conference. Because it turns out it looks like it's going to be possible
9:39
that if you desperately needed a mitochondria for energy,
9:43
maybe I could slip one into you if I was really smart
9:47
and give you a brand new working mitochondria. And it
9:51
turns out that mitochondrial disabilities
9:55
are fundamental to all kinds of things to
9:59
bringing a patient back to life who's almost dead, to
10:02
pediatric mitochondrial disease, to aging,
10:06
to dementia, to heart disease,
10:10
to toxins that we're exposed to, just all kinds of
10:14
things because you can imagine energy is just fundamental to
10:17
our existence. And so that
10:21
whole, like exploring all of that space sort of
10:25
led me to sort of a kind of an interesting point where
10:29
so many colleagues said, lance, you've really got to get into
10:32
energy now, just energy itself. And that
10:37
sort of was my down the rabbit hole into quantum
10:41
biology and quantum behavior. And so
10:45
maybe just like a little bit of my. How I think about quantum.
10:49
The quantum world. Like, yeah, what do we know about the quantum
10:52
world? Like, I. But I'm not a quantum biologist. So that's
10:56
the first thing to disclaimer here, you know. So what I
11:00
think about is when you get down to those little tiny structures,
11:04
teeny, you're going down. You're like below the size of
11:08
a mitochondria, which is already like a mitochondria is about the
11:11
limit of what you can see in the microscope, in a light microscope. And
11:15
so now you get even smaller. And what happens is the world
11:19
itself, us, we get very weird,
11:23
okay? And by weirdness, I mean quantum
11:26
weirdness, where the things inside us
11:30
begin to not just behave like a molecule, like a ping
11:34
pong ball bouncing around, but they begin to
11:38
act like a wave. And so once things start
11:41
to have this duality where it's like, ooh,
11:45
maybe it's a thing, a particle. Oh, maybe it's a
11:49
wave. Okay, now you've entered the quantum
11:53
world. And so quantum biology
11:56
is this growing field that's just kind of exploding
12:01
where we're realizing these little things that we looked at for a long,
12:04
long time and we thought they were just like due to a molecule. They
12:08
also have the ability to be a wave. And
12:12
that is weird. Okay? And that is quantum
12:16
weirdness. And that's the world of quantum biology. Because we're
12:19
starting to see that all kinds of reactions going inside of our
12:23
body are somehow being influenced by
12:27
both being maybe a particle, but maybe
12:30
also being a wave at the same
12:34
time. And that is really, really an
12:37
eye opening kind of thing. And so that's kind of
12:41
how I think of the quantum world. And, you know, it's probably
12:45
very likely going to be bound up, bound up
12:49
with, you know, disease, with
12:53
my ability to make a diagnosis on
12:56
someone, maybe my ability to treat them,
13:00
like maybe I don't always have to give the molecule,
13:05
maybe I could give the wave. Right,
13:08
right. So if I can give the wave
13:12
and do the same thing as giving the molecule,
13:17
boy, that will be a revolution. And I believe that's
13:21
the revolution that's coming. Yes, I hope so.
13:24
Yes. Well, I mean, it is, it's happening. And so when you talk about
13:28
the giving a molecule or giving a wave, would that be the
13:31
difference in giving someone a pill versus giving
13:35
them light therapy? Exactly.
13:39
So that might be the difference between having to give them a pill that
13:43
has all the issues that a pill is going to have versus
13:47
giving them a photon of light or a
13:50
wave of an electron or a
13:53
sound. Okay. That we know that sound
13:58
is vibrations and they travel as
14:01
waves. And when they get down to that tiny structure, they actually
14:05
I. They're called phonons. So
14:09
now you've got the phonon world where there's
14:13
these tiny waves that are vibrating
14:17
things inside our body. And maybe those. And
14:20
the thing we know about waves, which is so much fun, is they
14:24
have the ability to sort of collaborate together
14:28
or they can interfere with each other and
14:32
you can kind of put two waves together and
14:35
you get a new thing A new wave. And
14:39
it's going to be just so important to begin to
14:43
learn some of that. And we may be able to,
14:46
for example, diagnose a person who has
14:50
a disease, because, okay, right now what we do is we take
14:54
their blood and see if their blood has
14:57
maybe some kind of a chemical in it that
15:01
tips us off about a disease. But all of the
15:04
reactions along the way to that chemical give
15:08
off little waves. And so there's little
15:11
wavelets that are being generated. Yes, Our
15:15
body generates light. Our body
15:19
generates waves. Some of them are
15:23
big waves, and some of them are small waves. And
15:26
when those waves are in a certain range, we call it light,
15:30
we call it the photons that we can perceive.
15:34
But there are longer ones and there are shorter ones. And it's
15:37
very likely, since we evolved as little
15:41
critters on this planet that was being
15:44
bombarded by the sun with the energy from the
15:48
sun, that's all coming as waves. Okay. That's like pure
15:51
waveology coming at you. Okay. And very
15:55
likely the way we evolved is we probably
16:00
were smart enough to take advantage of that. And it's probably
16:03
built right into our hard wiring
16:07
of our system. And if you will, that
16:11
right now it's kind of invisible to us. Like, we don't see it. But
16:15
that does not mean that it's not there, that those waves aren't
16:19
going through us all the time. And in so many ways,
16:23
we're kind of as much a collection of waves
16:27
and wavology as we're a collection of chemicals
16:31
or molecules that we would recognize more and
16:35
more. You know, at the limits of physics, those two things, they
16:39
just become kind of interchangeable. And so we have
16:43
so much to learn and potentially benefit as
16:46
we open up this area of science.
16:50
Well, I have to say I'm utterly delighted to
16:54
hear you describing this. And also, as from someone
16:57
who works in a hospital who somehow also was open
17:01
to going down this rabbit hole. That's a new one.
17:05
So just to pull it out a little more. So if we're.
17:09
If we're waves, what are the implications of that? You talked
17:13
about potentially being able to diagnose in a different way than we do now.
17:17
What could that. What would that potentially look like? It's one of
17:21
the most exciting things that, like, literally this stuff just keeps me up at
17:24
night. Okay. Honest. Like, I wouldn't wish
17:28
my brain on anyone. Why is the universe
17:32
so exciting? Exactly. It's like. Like here I3 in
17:36
the morning, and I'm, like, picking up waves. I see them, you know,
17:40
so so every chemical reaction
17:44
is driven in one way or another by something that in
17:47
classical thermodynamics, we call a delta G, a
17:51
difference in energy. So there's like, one molecule. It's got
17:55
its energy up here. Another molecule has its energy maybe
17:58
down here. For if this molecule changes into this molecule,
18:03
okay, like, glucose would change into
18:07
from six carbons to two, three carbon things,
18:11
okay, there's a change in energy. Well, what the
18:15
physics people have told me, and they said, look, you just
18:18
can't violate this Lance, whether you like it or not, is that when
18:22
you do that change, because there's a
18:26
difference in the total energy of the system.
18:29
There's a wave that's given off, or there's
18:33
a wave that has to go into that and be
18:36
absorbed. Energy has to be absorbed. So
18:40
energy is either given off or it's absorbed.
18:44
And that energy is not just like energy.
18:49
It's got a name, it's got a note, like
18:53
the notes on a piano. Maybe it's a C or maybe
18:56
it's a D, or maybe it's an A or an A sharp, right?
19:01
But it has a wavelength. And we know it comes in a
19:04
little packet, a quanta. So it's got a
19:08
wavelength and a quanta. And it means that our chemical
19:11
reactions that are going on by the billions
19:15
in our body every second, that each one of those is.
19:19
They're giving off little bits of energy
19:23
in the form of waves. And it's not like. It's not like
19:27
an option. Do you know what I mean? It's not like, well, maybe I'll give
19:30
it. No, I'll keep the waves inside. No, it's like
19:34
if you do the reaction, you got to give that off. Like, that's the way
19:37
physics works, okay? And so that means
19:41
now those waves are at a really, really low level.
19:46
And right now, they're invisible to us because they're so low,
19:49
and there's not a lot of them. But it's very likely that
19:53
each reaction has its own fingerprint of what
19:57
waves those are. Because, remember, it's not just
20:01
energy. It's like. It's a specific
20:04
fingerprint to that energy made up of
20:08
this wavelength. And so an example
20:12
is infrared light. Sort of red light is about
20:15
660 in terms of its wavelength, all right?
20:20
Blue light, oh, in the four hundreds. And
20:23
there's green light, violet
20:27
light, ultraviolet light. Each reaction
20:31
has to give off its own fingerprint
20:35
of a wavelength, if you will, a color,
20:38
a chord, a note. And if we can
20:42
identify what those are, we could go back and
20:45
say, oh, that reaction took place. So
20:49
I know that if a glucose turns into another
20:53
molecule that has lower energy, it loses this much
20:57
energy, it has to give off an energetic
21:01
packet. Well, what if we could measure that packet?
21:05
And so that's what physicists attempt to do all the time.
21:09
They're measuring photons, they're measuring energy.
21:12
And so as we learn to do that in biology, we
21:16
could even know very specifically, it's
21:20
possible that there's one little fingerprint that would just let
21:23
me know that you have converted a
21:27
molecule of glucose to 2,
21:30
3 carbon fragments. Okay, well that would tell
21:34
me all kinds of things that I can tell from you.
21:38
And I didn't have to draw any blood, I
21:41
didn't have to poke you, I didn't have to
21:45
chop anything out, it's just there. But somehow I
21:49
do have to sense it. So we're going to need
21:52
sensors that to be honest, we don't have yet.
21:56
And so that is part of where I think the world is
22:00
going to go. And if we develop those sensors, it means that rather than you
22:04
getting your blood sampled, like maybe we could just sample all of the
22:07
photons coming out of you and be able to make
22:11
a pretty good guess in terms of what are the chemical reactions that are taking
22:15
place in your body. And that would be very powerful.
22:19
And I think we're going to go to that future. Wow. Yeah. I
22:22
mean that would completely change the game and non invasive and getting
22:27
much more detailed live. Because even with
22:30
blood, by the time you look at it, it's, you know,
22:34
it's not necessarily the same time has passed.
22:38
We have to take it somewhere. Right. Or your brain function,
22:42
right as your brain is
22:46
undergoing electrical conduction of
22:50
signals and thoughts and all of those things are going,
22:54
those are energetics, there must be waves that
22:58
are kind of associated with that. And you know that there is
23:01
already a whole field of wavology on the brain
23:05
called neurology. And there's a thing called an EEG
23:10
electric encephalogram where you put electrodes on the
23:13
scalp and you can see the waves that are taking place
23:17
within the substance of the brain. And we think that
23:21
those waves reflect sort of
23:24
large scale electrical conduction,
23:28
sort of networks of cell working in unison.
23:32
However, it's likely that there's even smaller information
23:37
available at the level of the individual
23:40
reactions that are going on. So great opportunities
23:44
for getting insight. And I'll say another thing is
23:48
for the people who are sort of just like maybe
23:51
thinking about this, oh my goodness, there would be something
23:55
amazing about measuring the energy as opposed
23:58
to measuring the level of something. So right now what
24:02
we do is we mostly our measurements, as you said before, they're
24:06
like static. They're like call them dead. They're a one
24:09
time picture. Okay, here's how much glucose
24:13
you have. But if we get down this rabbit hole
24:17
a little ways, as opposed to knowing here's how much glucose you
24:21
have, know that you'll actually know how fast is
24:24
glucose turning over. So remember that most of our
24:28
chemicals are like little hamsters on a wheel. They're running
24:32
around like this in one way or another, meaning they don't just
24:36
go like this and they don't go like this. They mostly have sort of an
24:39
equilibrium point. And we think that there are things like
24:42
diabetes or being septic
24:46
or having different kinds of conditions
24:51
where the levels may change, but probably even before
24:54
that, there are significant changes
24:58
in the rate of those chemicals
25:02
being turned over. Okay. And the nice
25:06
thing about if you measure the photon that comes off, that
25:09
tells you that a chemical, not just that the chemical was here, it tells you
25:13
the reaction and how many times that reaction has taken place.
25:17
We would learn all kinds of things about physiology if we had that kind
25:21
of insight. Right. And it would be
25:24
real time and not a snapshot of something that happened.
25:29
And as the dumb dedicated doctor that I am, like, what
25:32
I want to do is I want to give you a drug and say, is
25:35
it helping you or not? Well, this might be the
25:39
fastest way to actually identify that
25:42
because very, very quickly you'll see a
25:46
change in that turnover rate. Okay. Like the
25:50
throughput. Okay. Did the drug that I gave
25:54
you to treat your condition, did it help you?
25:57
Well, if I was like measuring the
26:01
waves that were coming out, I have a feeling that the answer is
26:05
there, but that is speculation. I understand.
26:10
And you know, like, as a responsible scientist, what I really
26:13
want to do is I want to prove it. Yeah. I want to measure it.
26:17
And that's the horizon that we're looking at
26:21
right now. Because now I think we know just enough to be
26:24
dangerous. Okay. And I've spent a lot of
26:28
my life just knowing just enough to be dangerous.
26:32
And it's really important to now do the research,
26:36
to do the studies, to do the hard work
26:39
that it takes to quantify it, to prove it, to measure
26:43
it. And we don't have great devices. We're going to need some
26:47
new gizmos, we're going to need new equipment, we're going to need new
26:51
machinery, we're going to need new. Yeah, that was my Next question
26:54
is, like, does technology need to be able to catch up with the science,
26:58
with the wave waveology in order to make these things
27:02
reality? You know, the quick answer is, yes, it does. But I think,
27:06
like, my guess is we're going to find out that we have the
27:09
technology, that we've just been kind of lazy, which is
27:13
we've not applied it to this because maybe we didn't think it. Now,
27:17
remember this. And I could get some of. That's true.
27:21
We could build cern. We could probably find a way to measure.
27:24
That's what I'm saying is like, we. Got the James Webb
27:28
telescope that can pick up one
27:31
photon from like a billion light years
27:35
away. Now, my understanding is that the major
27:38
component to that telescope
27:42
is a single photon detector
27:46
that is a little wafer that can detect
27:50
one little infrared photon that hits
27:53
it. Now, there's a lot of fancy stuff that puts it all together
27:57
because you got to measure for a long, long, long time because there's not that
28:01
many photons coming from one star. That's a billion light.
28:05
But, like, we can do that. Imagine if we just turn that
28:08
telescope around and sort of look inside my brain, you know,
28:12
assuming that there's something. Yeah, right. Like, let's
28:16
be around. Okay. Of course,
28:21
like, that detects one
28:24
photon at a time. So I don't think
28:28
it's. That we don't have the technology. I think we just
28:32
haven't had the imagination and the resources and
28:35
the drive and the cohesiveness
28:39
to say this is really, really, really important. Let's get our act together,
28:44
okay? Let's have a bunch of physicists who
28:47
made the James Webb get with a bunch of
28:51
biologists who were trying to measure
28:55
mitochondria. Let's lock them in
28:59
a room together until we got
29:02
it. Until then, figure it out. And that's really what we
29:06
should do. I totally agree, because. And it, you know, now
29:10
that you put it that way, it's so true. We have all of this, like,
29:13
unbelievable equipment, but because there was no
29:17
paradigm in physics that included biology,
29:21
we didn't. Nobody thought to use it that way.
29:25
And now the quantum biologic paradigm is
29:29
emerging, which is providing a framework, would you say, to
29:32
give people some common. Ground, come together and remember,
29:37
look, scientists are my friends. So I can say this. They are very
29:40
rigid. They are very conservative, okay? They
29:44
are not necessary. They get very comfortable with what
29:47
they do. And sometimes they're like, well, I'm just going to keep doing
29:51
what I do because this other new thing with light out
29:55
here, like I don't even have the right language for it.
29:58
Okay? And I don't, like, as a clinician,
30:02
like, how am I going to talk to my patients about photons or something
30:06
like this and say, oh, maybe it'd be good for you to try some red
30:09
light out. Maybe it'd be good for you to get some more sunlight. Maybe it'd
30:13
be good for you to do some of the things that are looking
30:16
like they have all kinds of interesting health effects for
30:20
some people. And I will argue we don't even have a
30:24
language. And that's always like one of the first things that
30:27
groups have to do when they come together is they have to like, get a
30:30
common language so they know what the hell they're talking about.
30:34
That's true. And I've heard from people who are, you know, I
30:38
know a lot of citizen researchers or people who work in
30:42
the wellness space and are just constantly reading papers and
30:45
they're like, oh, well, I thought there wasn't research on, you know, structured
30:49
water, but it turns out half the world calls it something else.
30:53
So I found all this new research I didn't know was there because they call
30:56
it, they use different terminology, but they're kind of talking about
31:00
the same thing. That's absolutely correct. And, you know,
31:04
it takes a little bit of bravery, you know, because,
31:08
like, I'm a academic, do you know what I mean? Like, like I grew up
31:11
at the University of Chicago and then I was the University of
31:15
Pennsylvania and got tenure and stuff. And like, they don't
31:18
really say, hey, bet your whole career on this,
31:22
you know, crazy idea. Like what they tell you
31:26
instead when you're young is they say, look, pick a really
31:29
kind of safe thing to do because you know
31:33
what you need to get papers out. You need to get funding for
31:37
this. There's no funding for photons
31:41
in biology, okay? Like, nobody is going
31:45
to give you a nickel probably if you apply to the
31:48
NIH for funding on this. So. And that's true of
31:52
every brand new field. That's like, that's true of mitochondrial
31:56
transplantation, despite the fact that it's already being used in some
31:59
people with some amazing results. It's been ridiculously
32:03
hard to get funding. So you've got to have like that first generation
32:07
of scientists and of people who will work together.
32:11
And like, I'm going to like jump to our quantum biology forum
32:15
for just a moment here to say that the reason that
32:18
we're bringing everyone together is it takes a community to get
32:22
the ball rolling. Like, we gotta get some stuff together
32:26
so that it's not for me to talk a young person into making
32:29
this the focus of their career. I have to be able
32:33
to look them in the eye and say, you're not
32:36
endangering your whole ability to have a career
32:40
in this if you study this area, right? I gotta be serious
32:44
about that. I like, I gotta be honest about that. And if they look
32:48
at me and say, well, Jesus, Lance, I'm worried. I'm young and
32:51
I don't have papers like you have, I'm gonna be brand new, I'm
32:55
gonna need a job, I'll need to get to a university, I'll need to
32:59
get some stuff going. Takes a pretty
33:03
courageous person to overcome that
33:06
energy hump, to get on the other side of that
33:10
hill. So what we can do as a community of
33:13
scientists coming together for the Quantum biology forum
33:17
is we can bring that energy down, right? We can make
33:20
it easier so that a young person can say,
33:24
you know, this is like some of the craziest, most exciting stuff I've ever
33:29
heard of. I'm gonna go into this field because there's going to
33:32
be a discovery around every corner. Okay?
33:37
It's gonna be just like being at the very
33:40
beginning of discovering there were genes. Okay?
33:44
Like, can you. Yes. Imagine like in the 50s, they
33:48
discovered there were genes and they discovered there was DNA
33:52
and all of a sudden, oh my goodness.
33:56
Okay, so that's where we are. There's going to be
33:59
discoveries in every closet. There's going to
34:03
be a discovery as you walk through this new space. And
34:07
that's a super exciting time. So there's never been,
34:11
in my opinion, a more exciting time to go into
34:15
science like this. This
34:18
puts the last hundred years to shame. And let me
34:22
tell you, the last hundred years have seen
34:25
scientific breakthrough after scientific breakthrough,
34:29
Amazing leaps and bounds and increases in
34:32
longevity and people living to be 90 and
34:36
100 and like, it's not even noteworthy anymore
34:40
when 200 years ago, people lived to be 40.
34:43
Okay, so like, we have made some
34:47
leaps and bounds here, but this may be
34:51
even more than all of those. It's truly
34:54
astonishing. It is a wild and amazing time to be alive. And
34:58
I don't know, I sometimes I meet people and they're like, oh, this is
35:02
happening and that's happening. And I'm like, is it? All I know is
35:06
there is so much cool stuff going on and so many people focused on
35:10
such like, unbelievably mind blowing,
35:14
paradigm changing ideas. And you
35:17
know, you mentioned sunlight and red light therapy. You know, we have
35:21
a Nonprofit for practitioners. And all we do is, like,
35:25
translate the research into practical steps.
35:29
Low risk. We don't want to be dangerous. Not rolling out
35:33
anything, but, you know, spending more time outside and
35:36
considering the. You know, helping
35:40
practitioners and to consider the
35:44
idea that the environment that their clients
35:47
and patients are. Is in, like, a wave
35:51
communication with their bodies. And so
35:54
if that's true, and let's just. So there we're like, okay, well, let's just
35:58
pretend it is. Like, what then? How would we proceed? I mean,
36:02
I think this is a wonderful space for us to
36:05
explore. And there's even. Because I'm sort of part of
36:09
this kind of motley crew of quantum
36:12
biology interested people. And we
36:15
communicate. There's just some amazing stuff. Like, there's a
36:19
new phrase being termed
36:23
infrared malnutrition. Now, who would have
36:26
thought, like. Like, if I had ever said that, like,
36:30
I learned about that months ago. Months ago. So
36:34
this is pretty out there, you know. But who would have thought
36:38
that maybe in our built environment where we live
36:41
under, like, one set of lighting a lot and
36:45
we kind of like a cave almost, and we're not outside.
36:49
Who would have thought that maybe we're a little
36:52
malnourished from the
36:55
wavelengths that we're not getting. And so maybe we
36:58
either need to get out more or supplement that. So there's all kinds of
37:02
wonderful information coming out on the near infrared
37:05
and what it can do for healing and what it can do for
37:09
energy generation, what it can do for mitochondrial function. It's
37:13
been shown to have some kind of an effect. And remember,
37:17
because we're talking about the old wave, that's some kind of quantum
37:20
biology, okay? There is information out
37:24
there that certain wavelengths of green light
37:28
can go into your brain. And it can, like,
37:31
reproduce almost the sensation of
37:35
an anesthetic of a. It reduces your pain
37:38
perception. Like, really, green light
37:42
might be something that people could use to.
37:46
To attenuate pain. Now, that's
37:50
crazy. And there's even evidence that
37:53
ultraviolet light. So that's a little bit
37:56
smaller wavelength, which means it's higher energy. It has the
37:59
ability to beat up your cells, smack a
38:03
cell membrane and bust. Like, ultraviolet can,
38:07
like, bang your molecules apart because it has enough energy
38:11
to cause some damage even. But there's even evidence
38:15
that people who get some limited exposure
38:19
to that and keep it within reasonable amounts. Like what you would
38:22
get out walking around, for example, without a sunscreen,
38:26
okay. That their blood pressure is
38:30
lower when they're exposed to that kind of an
38:33
energy. And there are higher
38:37
rates of blood pressure in individuals who never see the sun
38:41
compared to people who see the sun. And think of what blood
38:44
pressure does to our cardiovascular health and our brain health
38:48
and all of our metabolic health. So, you know, we're just
38:51
beginning to see, you know, be like
38:55
photons to see some of that. But here's what we don't know yet,
38:59
even with this very interesting information. Like, we don't know, like,
39:02
well, what's the dosage? Like, how much do you need?
39:06
And so remember I talked about that. We don't even have a
39:09
language. Honestly, I don't even know if I'm smart enough
39:13
to know if somebody said, lance, you need some more infrared. And I
39:17
said, well, how much do I need? Like, what would the dosage of
39:21
that infrared be? Is it like, because it's not
39:24
time, it's not like you need 15 minutes, there's an actual number
39:28
of photons per second per square centimeter
39:32
of skin that has to go into your body at a certain
39:35
wavelength. Okay? And, and so
39:39
we have a ton to figure out. And just think
39:43
of all this fun research that we can be doing
39:47
on some of these things. And you know, I think like, one of the
39:51
biggest questions for the general public is like, well, does
39:54
this seem like a valuable thing to maybe learn about? And
39:58
I kind of think this is a really important thing for us to learn about.
40:02
And so hopefully we will use the next few
40:06
years to bring a community together. And we're
40:09
trying to build this community through the quantum biology
40:13
forum, not just with one phenotype. By that I mean
40:17
one kind of a person, right? It's not just a scientist, like,
40:20
hey, we need some patients to be part of this community.
40:24
And if you go to our website, you're going to see a very important patient
40:28
talking about his own disease, his experience,
40:32
and that has gotten many, many, many views because he is a very
40:35
well known actor who has ALS and he's embarking
40:39
with some quantum medicine. So he'll be there,
40:43
got patients, you got people that give out money, got to have scientists there,
40:47
got to have clinicians there, you got to have policymakers there, got to have some
40:51
politicians there, you got to have the people that can make
40:54
the whole thing move faster, working
40:58
together, because we have such an opportunity to pick up the
41:02
pace, okay? So what I want to do is I want to pick
41:06
up the pace, okay, of discovery,
41:09
of the ability to do things. We got to pick up the
41:13
pace, okay? And I have no doubt, like,
41:17
like in an infinite amount of time, we'll figure it all out. You know what
41:20
I mean, but the difference between figuring out something
41:24
in a hundred years compared to figuring out in the next
41:27
five years is very possible to change
41:31
that kind of a slope. If we work cohesively
41:35
together, if we collaborate, and if we build the kind
41:39
of community that will support that. Oh, Lance, I'm going to cry.
41:44
Don't do that. No, it's just
41:48
so. This is weird, but this is just so thrilling
41:51
to me that you're doing this and that this ecosystem is coming
41:55
together, that you're recognizing all that you need to weave
41:59
in all of the different areas. It's not going to just come
42:02
from an academic silo, which is, you know, I
42:06
held back from doing interviews with the hardcore scientists. I'm like, oh, who am
42:10
I? And then I realized, you know, we need people to build that bridge
42:13
out into all of those different areas if this paradigm shift
42:17
is truly going to get traction. Right. I have for
42:21
my whole career even going. And, you know, I started with CPR
42:25
and better CPR and defibrillators. That's why they're in airports.
42:29
That was a study that my colleagues, I did
42:32
so many years ago. And I get the rewards because people actually write
42:36
me letters. Thank you. You saved my uncle's life because
42:40
of this defibrillator you put in that is a heart restarter. But
42:44
the, to do that, it took a community. It wasn't like one
42:47
person. It just, it doesn't work. It's not a university.
42:51
And think about just those kinds of things. So who? So, like,
42:55
the really good question is like, who do we need in the room to make
42:58
it happen? Who do we. Yeah, I want to get the
43:02
people in the room and make it happen. Okay. And so if we
43:05
get the right people in the room, we can make it happen. But
43:09
it means, yeah, there's going to have to be some, you know, bald headed
43:13
scientists like me. They're, they're skeptical and
43:16
hardcore and, you know, but guess what? We're going to need
43:20
some companies. I haven't seen hardly anything
43:24
get out to the bedside to get into a patient unless there was some
43:27
company that had the wherewithal to make it into a thing.
43:31
Okay. Because if I make the device, it'll look like
43:35
Frankenstein. Okay. Whereas if a good
43:38
company makes it, it'll be something that people can use. They take it right
43:42
to the bedside and shine this new beam on this person and
43:46
fix their dementia or their stroke
43:50
or their ALS or their
43:53
cardiovascular disease. Like that is what we're talking
43:57
about doing. Okay. But it's going to, we got to get
44:01
a lot of people in the room for that. Okay. So there's got to be
44:05
the devices. Well, if you've got the scientists and now you've got the
44:09
devices, well, who else do you need? Guess what? You need a bunch of physicists
44:12
on this one. Okay. Yeah. And just like I'm
44:16
a biological scientist, like, the physicists will hardly even talk
44:20
to me about this now. What's happened in the last few
44:24
years is it's beginning to really open up. The physicists
44:27
in the year 2022. So that's like four years
44:31
ago, they all met and they decided there was a new
44:34
area of physics, unbeknownst to the rest of us. And
44:38
it was called biological physics. And that is
44:42
now as legitimate an area to study as nuclear
44:46
physics or particle physics. Physics. And
44:49
fantastic. It is a new thing that a
44:53
physicist can go into. So the physics people
44:57
have recognized that biological physics is
45:01
quantum biology. Okay. Okay. That's what it is.
45:05
All right. Okay. So tell me just a
45:09
little more about the forum you have. Did you
45:13
just sort of call up people and ask them to come speak? I know you're
45:16
also accepting applications. People to present.
45:21
Nick Lane is presenting, and Martin Picard and
45:25
Eric Dane, the actor is coming. So
45:28
was that you just like pulling it together and.
45:32
No, no, no. So first, I have to give a lot of credit
45:36
to my organization, Northwell Health,
45:40
looking at every possible way we can help
45:44
people's health. And there's no question that to have something so
45:48
big and so bold of a future that
45:52
major healthcare organizations are going to have to move into this
45:56
and at least be aware of it. And so we. We're
46:00
hosting this because we think it's going to help humanity. But
46:04
assisting us is United Therapeutics. That's a
46:07
drug company. It's not a typical drug company. Was started
46:11
by an amazing pioneer
46:15
whose TED talks are inspirational. Her name is
46:19
Martine Rothblatt. She has her own
46:22
amazing story, but she was really the
46:26
person who stepped up and said, we need to have a meeting on
46:30
this. And this first meeting will actually be at the United
46:33
Therapeutics headquarters where they've got the world's largest building
46:37
that is net carbon neutral. Martine
46:41
Rothblatt, that's. Dr. Rothblatt is an engineer
46:45
herself. Okay. And is an energy
46:48
wonk. Okay. Like me. And
46:52
she kind of got her start in satellite. So
46:56
sending a message from here to here
46:59
makes sense to a satellite
47:03
engineer. So when we talked about the
47:07
fact that I believe that our mitochondria deep
47:10
inside us send a message from here
47:14
out to here, where it's received.
47:18
She had the open mindedness and
47:21
foresight to say this is too important for us to
47:25
not talk about. It's too important for us to not
47:29
meet about. And so Northwell and United
47:33
Therapeutics are doing this together. We're joined by the Guy
47:36
foundation out of Europe. And the Guy
47:40
foundation has been on this story for at least
47:44
I'd say seven years. They are ahead of
47:48
me, they're ahead of most of us. They're thinking about this and
47:51
they're a full participant in this. Oh, Fantastic. Their
47:55
founder, Dr. Jeffrey Guy will
47:59
be one of our keynote speakers at the conference
48:02
as well. And so there's a community. It's like
48:06
starting. It's coming, coming. I can feel
48:10
it, you know, it sure is. Okay. It's like
48:14
sort of think of that we think of our senses. You know,
48:18
it's like I think I feel the vibrations from it coming.
48:21
You know what I mean? I think I see the, at least the
48:25
smoke starting. Maybe not flames yet, but it's coming,
48:29
it's coming. And so, you know, this is going to be the
48:32
inaugural meeting of this group. It'll be a small, intimate
48:36
group, but we invite anybody that wants to. I was going to say is it
48:40
open? I saw on the website there's a short application. Is
48:44
that just open to anyone who'd like to attend or is it for
48:47
medical professionals? Or how is this. It is open to anybody. But
48:51
here's the thing is we don't have seats for everybody. I'm just being straight up
48:55
about that. Okay. Like we have limited number of seats kind of
48:58
intentionally for this first meeting because we kind of feel like
49:02
we all need to start the community. We need to get
49:06
the process going. We will do future
49:09
forums that will be, have the ability to take
49:13
hundreds, thousands of people. All right. But you
49:17
got to start kind of the right way
49:20
and focused, Titan focused. Got to be focused.
49:24
And we have to build a community that doesn't exist yet.
49:28
We have to get people to talk with one another who don't
49:31
normally talk. So we're bringing in physicists and, and
49:35
biological scientists and mitochondrial scientists and
49:39
engineers and patients and
49:42
policymakers and funders and. Just blowing up all
49:46
the silos. Lance, that's, that's all
49:50
these brilliant minds are spilling out into the quantum biology
49:53
forum. Yep. So, you know, it's going to take a little while to get
49:57
everything to build that momentum. And so the first
50:01
meeting will be a landmark because it'll be the first time that the group has
50:05
come together and it'll be fabulous. Fun. I can't
50:08
wait to hear some of the speakers you mentioned. Some of them.
50:12
Doug Wallace, who essentially discovered mitochondrial
50:17
is going to be there. And Nick Lane who's thinking about how did life
50:20
start on the planet? And Nerosha mirror again, who's thinking about
50:24
the brain that gives off photons. And Martin Picard who's
50:28
thinking about autism and mental kinds
50:32
of disorders and psychology and what that has to do
50:35
with energetics of the body. And that's just to name
50:39
a few. And yes, we've got the, I'll say a number of people who are
50:43
into light and the effect of photons in terms
50:47
of what they can do to physiology. And so we're
50:51
like it just like. I can't wait. And this is the kind of
50:54
group that if we do it right, I believe
50:58
this kind of group can create a new
51:02
momentum for the world and that momentum
51:06
can start to accelerate our ability to
51:09
build new knowledge, to figure out stuff,
51:13
to make discoveries and to do it faster
51:17
and to do it better and to do it faster.
51:21
And that's really what the world needs. Yeah, well,
51:25
it's super exciting. And I will also tell you there is like a
51:28
grassroots movement of non scientist
51:32
citizens who are going to be really excited about this as well.
51:35
There's. Well, I know you guys are building up the high level
51:39
infrastructure and there's actually quite a lot of us on the ground
51:42
who are sort of waiting and some maybe had
51:46
given up hope that this shift would happen, you know, at the
51:49
institutional level. So we are all here. CHEERING
51:53
CHEERING CHEERING here's the thing is. This is the wrong time to give up hope.
51:57
Don't, don't even go that way. Don't go to the darkness,
52:00
my friends. Go to the light. Go to the light. Well,
52:04
light, it's. Yes, because this is just
52:08
truly exciting. And just to wrap up, I'd love to hear.
52:12
So you had a traditional medical training. Thank you
52:15
for the defibrillators, by the way. Last summer on the beach
52:19
had my training on the AED and the lifeguard
52:23
hut. So we're all ready to go. That's a major.
52:27
Everyone should know how to do that and know how to do cpr. And then
52:31
now we'll talk about quantum biology. Yeah. Okay.
52:35
So coming from traditional medical school, you
52:39
are, you know, you have the gift of curiosity and an open
52:43
mind and following where the evidence is leading. What are some of
52:47
the things that you now understand to be true
52:51
that were most surprising, even speculative things compared to
52:54
what you were taught traditionally? So you already Talked about the
52:58
mitochondria moving around the mitochondria communicating
53:02
with the environment. Like, was any of that
53:06
on your radar before? No, I mean, just this
53:09
was all like, there's a lot we don't know about the world.
53:14
So I think the most important thing is, like, remain humble, you
53:17
know, like, you might think you know a lot, but there's more.
53:21
There's more out there. I promise you there's more. And
53:25
so we can get a hold of some of that. And, you know, I think
53:29
one of the most amazing things that I learned about mitochondria is that you could
53:33
intentionally transplant them. Like, I now could give
53:36
you mitochondria to fix potentially an issue
53:40
that's a whole field. And that field is just taking off as
53:44
we speak. Now the next step
53:47
is to understand kind of what
53:51
those mitochondria are doing in terms of their quantum
53:54
biology. So we're actually going to be talking about mitochondria as the, as your
53:58
little quantum organelle. Now, I don't even know if that's true,
54:02
okay? But it is true that your mitochondria
54:06
cycle the most energy of any spot in your
54:10
body. Okay? So they are cycling energy
54:13
like crazy, which is to say they are producing a high energy molecule
54:17
and it gets used up and another high energy and another high energy.
54:21
All of that's. So that's why they are sort of the
54:24
prototypic quantum organelle. And so
54:28
we'll be talking about them because they're a great model. So this is a great
54:32
time for us to learn how does a quantum organelle
54:35
organize itself? How does it protect itself from
54:39
too much energy? And how does it put itself together
54:42
so that the waves, the
54:45
electrons, the particles, the little
54:49
charged protons that have little waves as well,
54:53
like, how do they stay in the right place? How do they know when to
54:56
go here? How do they know how to go here? All of that
55:00
makes them like an ideal. You know, as a scientist, I want a
55:03
model that I can study. Okay? So they're pretty
55:07
remarkable in that way. And they are going to be this huge
55:11
therapeutic breakthrough, I think, probably in the next decade.
55:15
And then as we learn more about what is the actual
55:18
opportunity for the. Just the energetic side of that
55:22
equation. So let's appreciate all the wonderful
55:25
molecules that we learned in biochemistry. Okay?
55:29
The Krebs cycle, you know, is everybody. It's the Krebs
55:32
cycle at the middle, at the heart of biochemistry, those are all molecules.
55:36
Boing, boing, boing, boing, boing, boing. But remember, each one of those Molecules
55:40
has some sort of a wave, some sort of an energy
55:43
associated with it. And we have not figured that out.
55:47
So what is going to be, if you will, the Krebs cycle?
55:51
Like, right? Everybody learned that awful thing that you had to learn in
55:54
biochemistry when you memorized all of those molecules.
55:58
There's going to be an energetic Krebs cycle
56:02
too, right, with waves. And maybe
56:06
they work together, okay?
56:09
Maybe some of them cancel each other out
56:13
and diminish it. Maybe they
56:16
activate other parts of the
56:20
cell, maybe the mitochondria as it's sitting there
56:24
spitting out photons, which it does all the time, as
56:28
that mitochondria is sending those signals out. Who are you going to
56:32
call? Okay, maybe this one goes to the
56:35
nucleus and I'm going to call for a new building
56:39
block, a new protein to be made. Maybe this
56:42
one is going out to the cell membrane to say,
56:46
hey, let that molecule out. Let this other
56:50
molecule in. Open up a channel for me
56:53
over here. It's very likely that those
56:57
things are happening inside us all the
57:01
time. And as we unravel that, I mean,
57:04
that's going to be big. It's going to change everything. I
57:08
think so. Dr. Becker, thank you so much for being here today.
57:12
This was delightful. And thank you for the work that you're
57:16
doing, for transferring all the skills that you learned
57:19
rolling out defibrillators in the airport to creating a
57:23
quantum biology infrastructure. Well done. And well,
57:27
listen, I want to. No, I want to thank you and say something that is
57:30
maybe the most important, which is that none of this works.
57:34
If we don't have people in the community that kind of understand
57:38
what we're doing and why it's important and where we're going, and
57:41
sometimes the bald headed scientists and whatnot, and
57:46
even the non bald headed scientists, sometimes
57:49
we don't do a good job explaining what we're really after,
57:53
what the meaning is, what the impact is going to be like. We are guilty
57:58
in as a field of not doing a great
58:01
job of communicating and sometimes we can't even
58:05
communicate with the guy in the next lab from us,
58:08
okay? So we are not strong on
58:12
communication, despite what anybody might say, okay? And
58:16
that's where, Meredith, you come in and that's where members of your
58:19
community can come in. Because first they
58:23
can continue to follow. This story is like, you know, watch this
58:27
space, okay? It's going to be exciting. Watch this space.
58:30
But they can tell the story. They can talk to
58:34
people who have influence to say, hey, look, like
58:38
maybe half of what Dr. Becker is saying is not true. But let's figure out
58:41
which half is right and which half is wrong. Let's do the research and
58:45
figure it out. We can do that. We can do that not just in our
58:48
lifetime, we can do that in several years if we all work
58:52
together at it. And if we don't do it, think
58:56
of how much we give away. Think of what our loss
59:00
is. So you provide such an important
59:03
voice so that everybody can understand how important
59:07
this is and will hopefully be open
59:11
minded to the notion that this is worth
59:15
investigating. This is like why research
59:19
has value to our country and to our
59:22
world. And that at a time when
59:27
some of those values are under attack, when
59:30
good science and truth is under attack,
59:34
it's really important that we have voices that
59:38
tell everyone how valuable
59:42
research is to the world and how valuable it could be
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to the future of the world, to our children,
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to our grandchildren and beyond.
59:53
Indeed. Thank you. So thank you for
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what you do, Meredith. It's every bit as important as what the rest
1:00:01
of us are doing. Well, I don't know, but I very, very
1:00:04
much appreciate you saying that. Thank you so much, Lance.