Latest / Exploring Fashion Futures With Dr.HB / She Visually Merchandises The Stores For A global Luxury Watch Company
Transcript
- speaker-1: Thank you so much for being here. welcome to my podcast Exploring Fashion Futures with Dr. HB. There are so many job opportunities and business opportunities and career options in the global fashion and textile industry, but most people don't know about anything. So I, you know, based on my nine years of industry experience as a sourcing manager and almost twenty years in academic as a professor and the department chair of the Of the Department of Textile and Apparel Management at the University of Missouri, I decided to host a podcast to talk about all these hidden jobs and things that you do so the next generation of future fashion professionals can start imagine and think about their future career. What can I do now? And can this fashion be something that I can even pursue? So today I'm here in New York City, I'm meeting one of our alumni, Zoe. And we're gonna hear all about what she does and and how she got here. So welcome Zoe. Tell speaker-0: Thank you. speaker-1: us tell me about who you are. speaker-0: I am Zoe Bednar. I'm a Mizzou Tam grad. I've been living here in the city for it'll be nine years this September, which is wild. Time really flies. I'm from Missouri, born and raised in Jefferson City, So I was there my whole life and then graduated from Mizzou and said, It's time to go. So made it speaker-1: Here to right. Tell me what your current role is, what type of company you're working for, as if I'm ten years old. speaker-0: So currently I'm working for a watch company. Uh-huh. And I guess you could say I'm like kind of like a coach. So I go in and when we're setting up the store, I help create the plan where the product is gonna go, where the accessories on the bookshelves are gonna go. Creating the game plan before, making sure everything's organized, making sure everything gets there in time, for store openings, and then once we're there at the store, I help coach the team and advise where things go, where to place things, the strategy behind it. Yeah, I guess that's speaker-1: So the official title is a visual merchandiser. speaker-0: Yes, exactly. speaker-1: So what that means is you present your all kinds of watches visually attractive and inviting to the customers. Yes. So the watch company is like big global. speaker-0: Yes, it is a global watch company. speaker-1: Company Luxury Watch Global Company. Do you know how many stores and what is the annual total company? speaker-0: I don't. I don't Yes. speaker-1: So big, right? speaker-0: It's very large. speaker-1: So it's a big global watch company and you have your own your branded store all over the world. Yes. Right? Exactly. And then your job is so you're mostly managing North American stores? speaker-0: Yes, North America and the Caribbean. I've had the opportunity to travel to last year I was able to travel to Bermuda, which was speaker-1: Wow. speaker-0: amazing. That was amazing. Yeah, yeah. So it's been great. I've mostly been on the East Coast when I've traveled, but I'm not just only doing in-store visual merchandising, I'm also doing project management. speaker-1: What's that mean? speaker-0: Project management is kind of the behind the scenes logistics part of it. Also selecting where signage is going within the store, what campaigns are placed in the store, that sort of thing. speaker-1: let's say imagine I walk into a big name watch store in globally, like in the Fifth Avenue in New York City. Yes. And then everything I see visually, like here's a yellow, that's gold, there's signage, this is a price tag, there's a message. Like that all visual presentation is done by you. Wow. speaker-0: Yes. So I'm a part of setting that up, the selection of the product, what product is displayed and just, you know, con what message is conveyed when the client walks into the environment and ensuring that it's not, you know, overwhelming, messy. I mean, I'm sure we can all relate to walking into a store somewhere. I mean, this is kind of a throwback, but like forever twenty one. Yeah. When it was a thing, you walk in and it's just chaos everywhere because there's product everywhere and I think visual merchandising isn't something that people always think about, but that's kind of why I like it. It's more of a behind the scenes that is super impactful, but not everyone realizes it. But I like playing a part in that aspect of it. speaker-1: Was visual merchandising always like a thing for you? Like w were you always interested in that? How did you get there? speaker-0: Right. Well, I mean, as far as fashion goes, I didn't grow up thinking, I'm gonna move to New York City and work in fashion. I was actually a dancer growing up. You were. Yes. So dance was a huge part of my life growing up and so when I think back about, you know, fashion and what people were wearing, I think about the costumes of recitals or competitions or Performances. Yes. And costumes were something that I always looked forward to. I always was asking the teacher ahead of time, What are we wearing? What's our costume gonna be this year? And then I remember always looking forward to before recital, my dance video would like cut out this is when like catalog shopping was speaker-1: Before speaker-0: right. Right. And they would cut out each, you know, like classes costume for recital and put it on the board and everyone would go and get to see on the board and that's something that I always look forward to. I think my mom, I'm an only child and growing up I was always me and my mom all the time and she would always ask me like, what do you think of this? Do you like this? Like she would ask my opinion, even at a young age. And I would give her my opinion, whether it was you know, speaker-1: Yeah. speaker-0: something she wanted to hear or not, I think sometimes. But it's always been a part of my life and and interested in it, but not until I went to Mizzou and heard about the TAM department. Yes did I think, okay, this is something I've always cared about and been interested in and why not? speaker-1: Right. speaker-0: See let's see what it's about. I'd heard great things about the department. Uhhuh. My mom's good friend is friends with Kerri. speaker-1: Yeah. speaker-0: And so I remember towards the end of my freshman year, I had she like I had a quick call with her and she kind of like No freshman of Yes. speaker-1: Freshman of high school. speaker-0: So it wasn't even something that I thought about in high school, like getting into VM or fashion. I I I was thinking more marketing, more of a business general, not as specific. Yeah. And so I had the conversation with Kerri and was fully convinced and on board and really excited. I think for the first time at Mizzou, like I was excited about learning. You know, excited about what I was gonna be learning about. I remember a class of hers that I think, you know speaker-1: Okay. Intro to product development or something like that. speaker-0: Where you had to go on Vogue Runway and pull like a few looks and analyze them, discuss them, the color, the movement, the text speaker-1: They try it. speaker-0: and I loved that class. And also I thought it was really cool that she would, you know, let people speak about their selections in class and so hearing other people's opinions and being exposed to what other people are interested in. I think that was just really was such an eye opening, exciting class to be a part of just in the beginning, getting started. Right. So, you know, I think I mean, and then I feel like my journey while I was in at Mizzou, yeah. I was thinking I was gonna go into buying. That was really speaker-1: That's all I know, like design or buying. Design or buying. Exactly. speaker-0: Exactly, exactly. And so, you know, that seemed like something that was stable. I could find a job maybe not only in New York City. I didn't even think I was gonna move to New York City until speaker-1: Yeah. speaker-0: my the summer before my senior year of college. So Before my senior year, we went on a trip to Chip. speaker-1: trip that I took to New York. So you were part of the trip. I was. I normally I annually I take about fifteen to twenty students, come to New York, yeah meet with industry tour basically. speaker-0: Exactly. speaker-1: You had the taste of New York of the first time. speaker-0: The taste of New York and seeing that there's exactly there's so many other jobs outside of buying. Even though, you know, that's kind of was my focus. I was like, okay, well, even if, you know, that doesn't work out, there's still so many different routes that I take. So and meeting the alumni, like having that in the back of my head, I feel like that's a big thing of yours. And what I really appreciate is connecting alumni with students and sharing stories and that is huge in figuring out, you know, how your path can go and and where it can go and you know, just hearing experience. speaker-1: So it sounds like so you are in general you're more interested in merchandising and retailing side instead of design and product development side. Yes. But then but you always seem like you have some sort of a visual presentation. Like even dance itself is a visual presentation of movement. And then the clothing, then then the lighting that the speaker-0: All plays into the story that you're telling. speaker-1: visual presentation of product, right? Exactly. So now that became fashion study and then you love the fashion industry. But to me the luxury watch is part of fashion. speaker-0: Yeah, I think, you know, it's different in fashion as far as, you know, there's not as as much depth or breadth and the skews that you have. Yeah. But it's still very much visual and perception and experience that the client has. It plays a huge role and, you know, it's all about the client. speaker-1: I mean for expensive what like a what's your average price point for the thing? I mean for an expensive speaker-0: Right. speaker-1: watch walking into your store is the experience of speaker-0: Exactly. You have to feel the luxury. You're entering the environment and you know you want the the client to feel and experience that surrounding them. And that further, you know, enhances their experience, maybe enhances their interest in the brand, things like that. So just playing a role. I mean, I feel like a lot of the clients that are interested in watches, I mean The knowledge is Yes, exactly. speaker-1: They already know the product. speaker-0: Most of the clients already know the product but you know, they don't know what necessarily an experience is gonna be like when they're going to to purchase the product. Sure. Yeah. speaker-1: Sure. What was your first job after college? speaker-0: My first job after college was actually I was a merchandise assistant. So I moved here and I moved without a job but I feel like, you know, from the trip that we took and just hearing other people's experience, it's possible to move here without a job entry and get an entry level job in New York, right? So I connected with a Mizzou alumni who was working at a recruiting agency. Yeah. And I interviewed for a merchandise assistant role at Lord & Taylor. speaker-1: What does that mean? speaker-0: So a merchandise assistant is basically you're an assistant to the buying team in some sort of capacity. There's it's broken up into different categories. You have men's, women's, and I was actually in not luxury but hire and jewel you know. I wasn't really working in fashion and that role, but it was, you know, my first time actually you know, it wasn't my first time working at on the buying side. because I had a job in college as the assistant buyer at the bookstore. Exactly. speaker-1: Bookstore. University bookstore. speaker-0: Yeah. Forget about that. But that was huge in my college experience. I think I really felt like I had found my place in that job and speaker-1: Buy buying all the clothing and jewelries and speaker-0: All the accessories. Do they still have like the fun, not the Mizzou branded okay? I was I haven't been back to speaker-1: It's speaker-0: yes, the Zoutique, of course. Of course, the Zoutique. So that was a crazy experience. And I think after my time as a buyer there, before, while I was there, you could student charge Zoutique items. that was that was fun to just to see, you know, my peers excited about what's in the store. Exactly. So that further fueled my interest into buying. Yeah. I got here and what I was more so doing once I started here in New York was Excel work, was entering in SKUs, all of the back end information about every product. Price changes, sale, allocation, that sort of thing, that's what I was handling. So it was a little less hands on with product. Right. And I think by doing that job I learned I think I wanna be more involved with product and more of the creative aspect of things. Uhhuh. And so speaker-1: How long did you do that job? Merchandising. Three months. speaker-0: Three months. speaker-1: So you were missing I mean as much as you loved it, you were missing working with the product. speaker-0: I was like I'm in New York City. I'm surrounded by fashion and creativity more than I ever have before. Like, I need to take advantage of this. I need to like Right, speaker-1: Like Shure see. speaker-0: right. You know, if there's something else out there. Right. So I heard I speaker-1: Extremely high end luxury. speaker-0: Exactly. I heard that they were hiring for an office assistant position at the flagship boutique off of Fifth Avenue. Right. So what that entailed, not really anything to do with fashion buying, but it was an opportunity. Exactly. speaker-1: be in the Fifth Avenue. speaker-0: A foot in the door working for a luxury fashion company. I mean I'll give it a shot, why not? So I interviewed and you know I speaker-1: You got it? speaker-0: yes, I was very fortunate to to get the role. Right. So I started and I was answering phones. Okay. speaker-1: That's your first job. speaker-0: Exactly. Answering phones. I was ordering, you know, snacks, I was managing calendars, helping track the numbers for the sales associates, like sending their numbers out weekly, that sort of thing. But that was really my full immersion uh-huh in luxury fashion. Right. And through that experience, so while once I started after so I expressed my interest in visual merchandising to my manager because I knew that floor sets happened. The visual merchandising manager for the boutique actually was on the opposite side of my desk. Just you know, on the other side. So I was around and, you know, I'd see them coming out, etcetera. Yeah. See all of like the posters that they would get, the planning that went into it. and I was like, I really, you know, wanna be a part of this. I wanna see what this is like. Yes. So expressed my interest and was able to participate in some floor moves. So that would be me coming in. I would get to come in probably around like five PM. We'd have a meeting. The manager would go over the plan for the evening, VM people from the corporate side would come as well as boutique support. So both sales associates, retail operations, everyone was a part of the floor move. And I think that was another thing. Floor move. Or install, yes, the floor set. Something you know, there's so many Different terms, yeah. But it's when you go in and you flip the store at night. So then when everyone comes in the morning it's all new product. I see. speaker-1: Like putting this here, putting that here, the lights good. speaker-0: Deciding the color stories for each wall, you know, it's it was an incredible experience. So I stayed for a few of those. And about a year after I was there, they were reopening the flagship. We were operating out of a temporary location and exactly, speaker-1: They're renovating, right? speaker-0: exactly. So once they reopened the flagship, they realized this is, you know, huge square footage. We need someone in the boutique full time right to an entire store. Yes, the entire store. Five floors. Yes. So, you know, tons of product, mannequins. We had, I believe when the flagship opened, there were over fifty mannequins in store and it was all live product available for purchase. Only women. Only women's okay. But, you know, they would need someone to be able to change mannequins on a whim if a client wanted to try something on. So not only was it mannequins, it was d store displays, it was shoes, it was scarves, costume jewelry, handbags, everything. Right. So all encompassing, I was hands on, like I had never been before. I would, you know, prep hundreds of handbags and in prep in preparation for floor moves that we would do once it reopened, but I'm kind of like getting off track, zigzagging. I applied for they because the boutique is so large, they created the new position. I you know, I applied was fortunate enough to get it without any experience, but the relationships that I had built, I think, with the team previously definitely contributed to that as well as, you know, speaking up and and sharing my interest. speaker-1: Your work ethics and all of that, right? So you've been doing that for how many years speaker-0: I was there for six and a half years. That's a lot. One of those years I was an office assistant. But yeah, so five and a half years. Yeah. speaker-1: that's good. Yes. And then after that you are now in this new company. Yeah. speaker-0: So now I'm with a new company, more on the corporate side. So I go to an office three days a week. I get to work from home two days a week. So that's amazing as well. But before that I was working retail, no set schedule, working weekend. speaker-1: Sure. So before you were responsible for visually merchandising your high-end luxury women's wear five floor. speaker-0: Five floor. speaker-1: Now you're responsible for visual merchandising for this global luxury watch company of the entire North America and Caribbean Caribbean. Yes. That's a big step up. I mean if you combine all the stores Annual sales. How many stores are we talking about? speaker-0: You know, I don't know the exact number. I would say maybe under three hundred, a little under three hundred locations. speaker-1: So you are planning and dictating how these products will be displayed, what the store is gonna look like from here and telling all three hundred stores you need to do it this way. Yes. speaker-0: We host town trainings, communicating, yes, training. Once we work with the jewelers, if I go to a store, I do occasionally visit the Manhattan area. Yeah. Visit with those jewelers and discuss, you know, the product, what we're displaying, you know, making sure all of the tools are in good shape. Ordering speaker-1: It's right. speaker-0: those on the back end, working with our commercial logistics team to make sure everything's in stock. speaker-1: Right. And then each store manager responsible for setting the merchandise the way the head corporate wants it. Yes. And so that the consistent brand messages is happening across the three hundred stores. Right. So wow. Yeah. Do you sleep at night? speaker-0: Honestly, I sleep a lot more with this role than I did previously. But yeah, it's it's been a great experience so far. It's been a complete kind of 180 from what I was doing. speaker-1: from store level but yes now you're telling store what to do. So speaker-0: Exactly, exactly. speaker-1: so I understand that the dance background, which is very visually creative background and then dance wear background, helps VM for visual merchandising side of it. What do you think like what I mean, yes, work ethics, speak speaking up, those that, but what kind of technical skills do you think is important for anybody who might be interested in visual merchandising? speaker-0: Hmm, that's a great question. technical skills, maybe, you know, I think you have to have an eye. Yeah. You have to have discernment and and knowing what you like, what you don't like. Because and and I think with discernment also comes being open minded to other people's opinions. Right. speaker-1: Yeah. speaker-0: Because it's a very objective, you know, role that you're playing. You know, someone could think this looks good, someone could think it looks good, but it could be better. Right. Or it would look good this way instead of that way. So I think it's about being open minded, being creative, technical skills. Yeah. Are those more I I you know, I feel like maybe that's more s of a soft skill. Technical skills, I think, you know, you have to be open to working on your feet. It's not necessarily you have to be good at Excel or you have to I think Adobe workshop as far as, you know, Photoshop or InDesign, those are definitely great skills to have if you're interested in getting into visual merchandising because more often than not I see a lot of that those requirements when, you know, looking at various job descriptions because a a lot of it is created like the guidelines are created through Photoshop or InDesign or things like that. So being able to, you know, have those skills would be something that's important. And that's a class that I also took at Mizzou. Yeah. speaker-1: Alright, I have a question for you. Yeah. How is styling different from visual merchandising? So a lot of students are like, I wanna be a stylist, especially celebrity stylist. speaker-0: Right? speaker-1: So I can see there is some commonality in terms of visual creativity. speaker-0: Right. speaker-1: But like how how is it different? speaker-0: Say visual merchandising when you're visual merchandising for a brand, you are communicating that brand image. There are guidelines, you know, there is a specific image that you are portraying within this retail environment. I think the difference with styling is that you have to have the knowledge of how to dress someone. what they like, what they don't like. It's more it's not as clear cut. I think, you know, it's definitely as you're running around as much, you're doing pulls, you're doing returns, you're meeting with clients, etc. which is similar to visual merchandising if you're visual merchandising in the retail environment, right? You're running around, you're changing mannequins, you're pulling product, you're prepping product, etc. But I think it comes You know, styling is more your own knowledge and using your own knowledge and your own point of view and helping, you know, shape that for someone if they're wanting your assistance. And what do I wear for this event? I have X, Y, and Z. What's appropriate for this? What do you you know? It's a lot of your own personal knowledge comes into play when you would work as a a celebrity stylist. Yeah. Or any sort of stylist. I think that's you know, you kind of get experience if you're working in retail just in the fitting room. I worked at the mall in college and just offering your opinion. People ask your opinion, do you think this looks okay? Does this fit? Does it come in any other colors, etc.? That's like working in the fitting room, I would compare it like that's very entry level to getting into the stylist track. speaker-1: So, you know, a lot of people that I know meet with in fashion industry, they say you have to have both art and science speaker-0: Right and left brain. speaker-1: right and left brain and arts and science of the fashion industry. So the creative and analytics goes, right? Exactly. So so visual merchandising I can say like, you know speaker-0: There's strategy. That's what I'm saying. Strategy. It's strategic. It's planning. You have to be very organized. It's not you just walk in the store and you figure out this. Okay, we have like this many. That'll work. You're gonna be there all night. Yeah. You know, just speaking from my own experience, we started preparing for our one night floor move a month in advance. Communicating with the operations team when our shipments coming in. What are we getting? What are we receiving? Will there be assistance as far as prepping? We have, I mean, like I said, you would have to prep over a hundred handbags coming in. You'd have to know, okay, the guidelines are stating they want this color and this area and this color story in another area, but we're only getting X amount of this color story. So are we going to do we have enough product from other collections to substitute here? You know, where what product are we going to have available? Because the guidelines could say, you know, you have to do XYZ, but what speaker-1: What if you speaker-0: if you don't get the product in time or what if it sells out before it hits the floor? Because that's another thing is, you know, reserves. And and having access to the product. So you're not it's not always going to be exactly what's in the guidelines. You have to know how to make it work, how to convey the same message of this new collection that you're launching with previous collection merchandising and being strategic. Yeah. And also very organized. I mean, keeping everything organized, we would load, you know, bags onto these big bakers racks and have I mean Eight rolling racks of different clothes organized by skew, by color, by floor. I mean, it's a lot of back end work, but it's fun. Like that part organize the organization part of that is fun to me too. Right. So it's it's a little bit of everything. You have to be strategic, you have to be organized, but you also have to have, you know, a creative eye, a creative vision. Right. so it's a little bit of both. speaker-1: That's what I've been saying to a lot of parents actually. And I said if your daughter or son, like if your children have both creative but also like strategic and analytical mindset, this will the fashion will be perfect industry for them because 'cause the reality is many people who think, my kids are so creative then then they think about like a c pure creative art industry. speaker-0: Right, right. speaker-1: Then if my kids are so good at math and then they think they have to go to engineering or science. The reality is this fashion here where you can use both of your brain, right? So like total you can be still strategic while being creative. Or vice versa. Yes. It sounds like a visual merchandising is right there. speaker-0: Exactly. I think that really is, you know, the my favorite part is that I get to use both my creative and strategic side. Yeah. You know, left and right brain. I think it's important going into i I mean, even in in buying, you have to have a creative eye, you have to know the trends, you have to know what people are looking for, but you also have to be mindful business wise. What allocation? What's the budget? You know, what's the open to buy? What's exactly exactly. speaker-1: The margin I have so with all this journey, when did you feel like dang I made it here? speaker-0: you know, I don't know if I've ever had like that sort of moment. I've had amazing experiences. I think once I realized I was, you know, leading these floor sets and not just trying to keep up. Wow. And, you know, asking what to do next, but planning and seeing the vision and noticing things. Wow. That's when I think I really would say probably Two and a half years. I mean, maybe a year. I you know. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's all relative, but it's just the more you learn about not only the product and the planning, but working with people. I think working with a variety of different people and how to work with people is also huge. speaker-1: So you don't regret that you're in fashion at all? speaker-0: No. No. No. I definitely, you know, there was a time when I it was towards the end of my time at my previous position and I was ready for growth. Uh-huh. But I wasn't sure, you know, what exactly that looked like. Right. And and and how, you know, to go bigger uhhuh from from what I was doing and I considered going to law school. Yes. I even you know, I was like Maybe maybe this is this is the end and I'm not able to see beyond this because I meant for something else, but it just so happened, you know, a recruiter reached out to me about my current role. And that's how I ended up where where I am currently. speaker-1: And you're not considering law school anymore? speaker-0: No, I don't think so. Not right now. Yeah, not speaker-1: today. I mean that's it sounds like an amazing job and responsibility you have. Yes. And I'm sure it has so much more growth plan because it's just such a global speaker-0: Exactly. speaker-1: so with that I'm gonna go like what if, now that you're here, yeah, what if you were to send a text message to your college self? Yes. What would you say to Zoe? I would speaker-0: Just say keep going. You've got this. You know? Trust speaker-1: You had no idea. speaker-0: yourself. Trust yourself. I mean, I really I was not the person that had a five year plan, nor have I ever been the person to have a five year plan. You know, I trusted myself and had a great community around me of you know, my parents were great. I also have to mention, you know, not only dance of course played a huge part of my creative eye and expression, but I grew up in retail. My mom owns a small business. speaker-1: I see. speaker-0: So I grew up going to her store with her since first grade. I would go there after school every day, sometimes on the weekends. I was sleeping under the tables, under her display tables when I was really young and speaker-1: I hope so. my god, I hope my heart is where I'm right. speaker-0: But it's I mean seeing her she does it all herself. You know, she's there, she you know, being an entrepreneur and owning your own business, you don't have a day off. You don't you don't have a day off and just seeing her work ethic and her love for what she does, I think also really inspired me to you know chase my my dreams and and do what I love. speaker-1: So keep doing what you're doing. Okay, speaker-0: Yeah, I got speaker-1: that's the text message. Okay. Yes. So what will be the one class for everyone should take? speaker-0: I would say the class that I spoke about that was made a huge impact on me. speaker-1: Yeah. Intro to Apparel design. speaker-0: Maybe, maybe honestly it's been so long, I cannot remember the names, but you know. speaker-1: This is a first dip in the just looking at what's speaker-0: And fashion industry, what's outside of, you know, what you see around you, what you see at the mall, like a a global perspective. speaker-1: Is so even at the mall you're not a consumer anymore. You're seeing it as a future career. Why the products are presented this way here, why is that there? And what kind of what's the pricing strategy? So just being aware of it, but opening an eye to it. Yes. speaker-0: Exactly. speaker-1: What is the one thing that you like to see from somebody's resume? speaker-0: Their story. If you can convey your story through your bullet points, you know, yes you I think being able to communicate a big project that you were a part of in some way or the difference that you made or the change that you made. Not just the action items, but kind of the story of your career through your bullet points, I think is you know, gives a little background into who you are, what your journey's been like. Uhhuh. your work ethic, that sort of thing. I think I think that's helpful just from my perspective when I'm looking at a resume. I want to know, you know, what you've participated in, the breadth of different projects that you've been a part of, that sort of thing. I was. Okay. speaker-1: Were you part of sorority? What? Even sorority projects. I speaker-0: Honestly, I wasn't really heavily involved in my sorority. I was a part of a sorority, but I wasn't like a co chair or I wasn't into any of that really during my time. As I mean, as a student, like I said, I feel like I really didn't find my niche and like my place until my senior year. That and being an assistant buyer. So I went on this trip and then I started that role when I was a senior. Yeah. So it really, you know, everything worked out and kind of fell into place. But Also, you know, that was from my curiosity and and being open to new experiences and not being afraid to to speak up. speaker-1: Yeah. What is the one thing that you don't like to see from somebody's resume? speaker-0: I think I think let's make sure grammatically we're we're spelling things correctly. There's not any like random periods or like weird spacing, that sort of thing. It's visual. Visual That's your first impression of someone. So yeah, make sure you're rereading all of your bullet points multiple times, getting opinions from your professors, your peers, like see what they're doing, what you know, I think Using the people around you and and getting feedback, obviously know yourself and and be confident in yourself, but it's helpful to hear other people's opinions and perspective. Right for sure. speaker-1: Right. What would be the one thing they everyone say yes to? speaker-0: Yes, to being open and talking to people. I think I met so many people during college that I wouldn't have met through group projects. I feel like Tam is very much a group project avenue culture. And I met so many great people through group projects and you know, just hearing their story, what they're interested in, learning new things, new you know, you never know. what you're gonna hear from someone, what you're gonna learn from someone, what someone else has experienced. I think it's being open to, you know, grabbing coffee, with your even your classmate for a group project, even if it's, you know, only two of you and there's four of you in the group, like find your way. I mean, I think, you know, that's the big part of college is meeting people and learning about people's experiences and perspectives. And that's huge when you're Going into the real world because you're around new people all the time. speaker-1: That's right, right? What is one thing they should everyone say no to? speaker-0: Comparing your timeline. Everyone has a different timeline that they're on. You know, I think that, you know, with fashion and buying, it can seem like, okay, you were this for two years, this for two years, you know, it's but you're not in college anymore. It's not a set in stone progression. Right. So your path could be very different than someone else's. So don't compare speaker-1: No more comparison. speaker-0: your timeline and where you're going with someone else. speaker-1: Yeah. Sounds good. So it sounds like it when you said a coffee, but coffee or networking? speaker-0: Yeah. I I would say coffee. It's much more I'm I'm much more of like a casual person. Let's be real one on one. I think networking I can kind of be overwhelming, like networking events, there's so many people around. I say coffee. Sure. Yeah. speaker-1: Okay, so one final question. Out of all everything you've said, what have not what have I not asked you? So what do you what else do you want to say to people who might be whether they're fashion majors or not? Because if think about it, we need chemistry and textile, we need accounting, we need engineering, you know, product development. So many opportunities for anyone you know, in and outside of fashion majors. What would you like to say to them who might be interested in? speaker-0: Say stay curious. Stay curious and be open to, you know, new opportunity. And also like pay attention to what sparks your own interest and and follow that. You know, if there's a specific brand that you're really into and you could go down a rabbit hole with that or If you, you know, haven't had experience, like for example, I never had experience in visual merchandising throughout college. I didn't have a VM internship. Right, right. all of my experience was more retail. But I didn't let that die. I s I stayed curious and expressed that and now and and here we are. So I would say stay curious, stay open minded. That's the best part of college is it's and it's okay to mess up. Yeah. It's not a linear, you know, you can up it not and and not everything has to be perfect. You know, I think it's that's all a part of the learning process and how you grow and yourself and your career. speaker-1: So what's your next to Zoe? So not law school for now. speaker-0: Not law school. No, not for now. But we'll see. I I really have enjoyed my time where I am with this company and you know, just looking forward to the future and we'll see where it takes me. Like I said, I'm not a five year plan person, but I'm excited about growth where I am right now. speaker-1: Right. Yeah. So maybe I should just went one more question. Okay. What would you say to people? Yes. Whether they're parents or people or students, so they're like, What do you do with fashion degree? You can speaker-0: do anything. It's not just buying. It's not just styling. It's you can go into sustainability. I think sustainability is a huge topic right now within fashion. I think obviously like you said, accounting. You can still work in fashion and work for the accounting. You could work in fashion law if I wanted that's that was kind of what I had in the back. I could still work in fashion and go to law school, but you can work for, you know, copyright and That sort of thing. There's so many different avenues, product sourcing, overseas, textiles, the chemistry of textiles. There's so many different avenues. It's not just styling and buying. Right. But that's the whole thing. Stay curious. Right. Be open to hearing other people's experiences. But yeah, there's they're wrong. There's definitely speaker-1: Wake up and smell coffee. speaker-0: Exactly. Look around you. The whole the whole cerulean blue speech that Merel Meryl Streep does in Devil Wears Prada, I feel like that really is so just right on the nose about fashion that people, you know, you don't really think about it but it you're surrounded by it. Right. And you have no idea, you know, the people that are making the decisions. I mean, learning and working with that in college and seeing, you know, the trend predictions for your Twenty twenty nine. Like people are already thinking about these things and predicting and and you know, dictating what is going to be produced, what's going to be the trend. Right. speaker-1: It's a psychology, it's selling, it's creating, yes, it's developing, it's innovating, it's technology. Right. It's just so much. Yeah. But still just think of it fashion as a runway or you know, only the design and buying. And I just there's just that's why I open up this a podcast studio anyway. speaker-0: Exactly. speaker-1: But thank you so much. It was it's been my pleasure. And I look forward to watching you grow even more. speaker-0: And I'll see you soon, hopefully next networking event.