Latest / Crime Stories with Nancy Grace / BOY, 12, DEAD AFTER 24 HOURS AT CAMP, FOUND WITHOUT PANTS: RULED HOMICIDE

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BOY, 12, DEAD AFTER 24 HOURS AT CAMP, FOUND WITHOUT PANTS: RULED HOMICIDE · Crime Stories with Nancy Grace

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. A little boy just twelve
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  Speaker 1: years old. What is that fifth grade is dead after
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  Speaker 1: just twenty four hours at summer camp, found dead without
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  Speaker 1: his pants in the last hours. Ruled a homicide. Good evening,
• 0:25
  Speaker 1: I'm Nancy Grace. This is Crime Stories. Thank you for
• 0:28
  Speaker 1: being with us.
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  Speaker 2: A twelve year old boy dies just twenty four hours
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  Speaker 2: after arriving at a wilderness therapy camp. His death now
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  Speaker 2: ruled a homicide.
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  Speaker 1: Good Lord in heaven, you send your child away to
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  Speaker 1: a wellness camp for his own good on beautiful trails
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  Speaker 1: and forested areas in Carolina, and in less than twenty
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  Speaker 1: four hours at camp.
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  Speaker 3: He's dead.
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  Speaker 1: Last hours, this little boy's death has been ruled a homicide.
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  Speaker 1: With me an all star panel to make sense of
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  Speaker 1: what we know right now, including an investigative reporter, a
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  Speaker 1: renowned medical examiner, therapist, and importantly the co founder CEO
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  Speaker 1: of unsilenced, a victim of the troubled teen industry, and
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  Speaker 1: a beautiful young woman who attended the camp at just
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  Speaker 1: age twelve like this little boy, as I like to
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  Speaker 1: do with juries when I can. Let's go back to
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  Speaker 1: when this happened and hear the nine to one one
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  Speaker 1: call based as.
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  Speaker 4: A side unders finding Cambro Trus, Carolina.
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  Speaker 5: So a girl now alas Thursday ones that are out
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  Speaker 5: of cities. Goty's responding, I've brought podcast the college pos
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  Speaker 5: for us. I'm not sure I'm thinking contact with them again.
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  Speaker 3: Okay.
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  Speaker 1: When we looked up their codes eight and eleven, we
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  Speaker 1: learned that means carbon monoxide inhalation or choking. So that
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  Speaker 1: tells NIL one immediately that there's some type of respiratory
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  Speaker 1: sell your let's listen to more.
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  Speaker 6: Yeah, I didn't go the SURGU twelve one two.
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  Speaker 5: Okay, maybe four CPR is being given at this time.
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  Speaker 6: I had to add somebody up the flag.
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  Speaker 5: Y'all had just behind the five hundred buildings. I can
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  Speaker 5: lose a contact with the subject core service.
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  Speaker 6: I'm here. I don't see work.
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  Speaker 1: I mean, my stars, you've got a little boy dying
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  Speaker 1: or dead on your watch.
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  Speaker 3: It's just been ruled homicide.
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  Speaker 1: This camp is full of counselors and kids, and they
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  Speaker 1: don't have anybody out there to direct the ambulance to
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  Speaker 1: the right location in a giant wilderness camp. I mean
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  Speaker 1: before I go to Nick Auxner, investigative producer and chief
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  Speaker 1: investigative reporter WBTV to doctor Eric Eeson, renowned forensic pathologist
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  Speaker 1: doctor Ethan. For lack of a better term, that's BS.
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  Speaker 1: I mean, look, my dad had one cardiac event. As
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  Speaker 1: doctors like to say, after the next one of us,
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  Speaker 1: my mom will be performing, be performing CPR, another one
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  Speaker 1: of us will be out in the driveway waving trying
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  Speaker 1: to flag down the ambulance. I mean, every second counts.
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  Speaker 1: And guess what, they saved his life more than once.
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  Speaker 1: So here you got the ambulances driving around the camp
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  Speaker 1: just for starters, trying to find the little boy.
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  Speaker 3: I mean, have you ever heard anything like it? A
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  Speaker 3: camp full of.
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  Speaker 1: Counselors, they're supposed to be trained in CPR and doing
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  Speaker 1: the right thing.
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  Speaker 7: I've never heard anything like that happened for myself.
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  Speaker 8: It wasn't a remote area, so maybe that had something
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  Speaker 8: to do with it, But yeah, sounds like it was
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  Speaker 8: a pretty disorganized.
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  Speaker 1: Okay, and that's just exactly what you don't need. Hey,
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  Speaker 1: you know, remote area parents paying thousands of dollars to
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  Speaker 1: send their children.
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  Speaker 3: This isn't even a teen. He's twelve years.
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  Speaker 1: Old from New York, thousands of miles away in the
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  Speaker 1: middle of the wilderness and nobody can even get the
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  Speaker 1: ambulance to the boy to try to save his life.
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  Speaker 3: Okay, that's just a tip of the iceberg. Listen.
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  Speaker 6: They said they had to.
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  Speaker 5: Go to the hall to call, said when they woke
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  Speaker 5: up everything we're doing the bed and rest.
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  Speaker 6: Hey, I think I god want when you get to
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  Speaker 6: my truck, come all the way out for here and
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  Speaker 6: get to my truck. Come by that cabin and let's
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  Speaker 6: see you. This is I got you that I'm showing you.
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  Speaker 6: All things come almost so.
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  Speaker 1: The counselors get told there's something wrong, and now they
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  Speaker 1: say they had to go to the office to make
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  Speaker 1: the call.
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  Speaker 3: So how many more minutes did they lose?
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  Speaker 1: But listen, their incompetence is really just a tip of
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  Speaker 1: the iceberg.
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  Speaker 3: For those of you just joining us.
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  Speaker 1: Parents send a twelve year old boy to a wilderness camp,
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  Speaker 1: a wellness camp, as they call it, it's anything but well.
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  Speaker 1: And let me tell you something, this little boy is
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  Speaker 1: not the first time that someone has ended up dead
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  Speaker 1: at Carolina Trails. And then we find out the counselors
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  Speaker 1: of staff won't cooperate with the investigation.
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  Speaker 9: Listen, the Transylvania County Sheriff's Office said when they arrived
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  Speaker 9: at Trails, Carolina for an unresponsive participant, medicks found evidence
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  Speaker 9: that CPR had been performed, but the child appeared deceased
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  Speaker 9: for some time. But now, in an odd twist of trust,
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  Speaker 9: the Wilderness Therapy Camp in North Carolina is refusing to
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  Speaker 9: allow investigators to talk to staff or juveniles present when
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  Speaker 9: the twelve year old died. According to a search warrant,
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  Speaker 9: the boy suffered a panic attack the night he arrived
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  Speaker 9: at the camp, and the next morning he was found cold, stiff,
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  Speaker 9: and frothing at the mouth, not being able to talk
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  Speaker 9: to staff or campers. It is unclear what caused the
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  Speaker 9: boy to present with frothing from the mouth. According to
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  Speaker 9: an affidavit from the detective that got the search warrant,
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  Speaker 9: froth about the mouth could end kate he ingested some
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  Speaker 9: sort of poison.
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  Speaker 1: First of all, I gave up cursing where the twins
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  Speaker 1: were born. But every way, every term I can think
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  Speaker 1: of to describe this would break.
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  Speaker 3: That vow for those of you just joining us.
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  Speaker 1: A shock coroner's report reveals that a twelve year old
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  Speaker 1: little boy is dead at Trails Carolina Wellness Camp due
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  Speaker 1: to homicide. First of all, I want to go to
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  Speaker 1: Nick Oxnar, joining US executive producer, chief investigative reporter at WBTV,
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  Speaker 1: and he has been investigating Trails Carolina since May twenty
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  Speaker 1: twenty one. Okay, Nick Oxnar, thank you for being with us.
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  Speaker 1: It raises a huge red flag when witnesses and employees
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  Speaker 1: will not cooperate with LA law enforcement.
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  Speaker 4: That's a I think it was a concern for the sheriff,
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  Speaker 4: and he highlighted that lack of cooperation in the public
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  Speaker 4: and statements that he's made that his deputies couldn't get
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  Speaker 4: information about what happened on the scene, and they've continued investigating.
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  Speaker 1: You have been investigating. This camp is so called therapeutic camp.
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  Speaker 1: Therapeutic forty nine hundred dollars the last time I looked
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  Speaker 1: to enroll up to seven hundred plus dollars a day
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  Speaker 1: for a twelve year old to do what walk around
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  Speaker 1: the trails and have three hots and a cot.
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  Speaker 3: I mean nearly eight hundred.
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  Speaker 1: Dollars a day, five grand enrollment fee. Why did you,
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  Speaker 1: Nick Oxen, begin investigating Trails Carolina.
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  Speaker 4: Yeah, we got a phone call from a concerned parent
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  Speaker 4: whose child almost went there and Essentially, that phone call
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  Speaker 4: said I've looked into this place and done my own
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  Speaker 4: homework and maybe you ought to look into it as well.
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  Speaker 4: And actually, Nancy, what we found is that the children
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  Speaker 4: attending Trails Carolina most of the time don't even.
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  Speaker 10: Get a cot.
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  Speaker 4: They're actually sleeping in a sleeping bag or a sleeping matt,
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  Speaker 4: either in a cabin or out in the wilderness.
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  Speaker 10: And that's just emblematic.
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  Speaker 4: I say that, because emblematic of the kind of experience
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  Speaker 4: they're getting at this ord, at this facility.
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  Speaker 3: How did the whole thing start? Listen.
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  Speaker 11: The parents of a twelve year old boy think Trails
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  Speaker 11: Carolina might be just the place to help their son.
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  Speaker 11: Trails Carolina claims to be a leader in wilderness therapy,
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  Speaker 11: offering an adventure wilderness program for children who have behavioral
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  Speaker 11: and or emotional difficulties. The parents say their boy is
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  Speaker 11: transported by two men from New York to Trails Carolina
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  Speaker 11: Camp at Lake Talksaway, North Carolina. Their son arrives at
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  Speaker 11: the camp in an agitated state. The twelve year old
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  Speaker 11: is loud and disruptive, but he is assigned to a
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  Speaker 11: cabin with other children, as well as four adults in
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  Speaker 11: less than twenty four hours. The twelve year old is dead.
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  Speaker 11: Sheriff Chuck owenb says an autopsy is being conducted because
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  Speaker 11: the death appears suspicious since the boy died at the
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  Speaker 11: camp less than twenty four hours after he arrived.
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  Speaker 3: Crime Stories with Nancy Grace.
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  Speaker 1: A boy dead just twelve years old, twenty four hours
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  Speaker 1: after getting to camp having panic attacks upset. I wonder
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  Speaker 1: why found dead without his pants on joining me In
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  Speaker 1: addition to Nick Oxner from WTV, Leanne Roberts is joining us.
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  Speaker 1: A beautiful young woman who attended Trails Carolina age twelve,
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  Speaker 1: just like this little boy. Leanne, thank you for being
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  Speaker 1: with us. Tell me about your experience at Trails Carolina.
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  Speaker 12: Yeah, so, from the very first minute that you're there,
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  Speaker 12: it's pretty traumatizing. The thing that they have you do is,
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  Speaker 12: you know, conduct a strip search, and everything you have
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  Speaker 12: is taken from you. And that kind of set the
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  Speaker 12: tone for the rest of my stay there. I experienced,
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  Speaker 12: you know, and witnessed things that no twelve year old
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  Speaker 12: ever should, no child ever, should, no person ever really should,
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  Speaker 12: all in the name of therapy, which we actually weren't
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  Speaker 12: even really receiving. We saw a therapist once to maybe
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  Speaker 12: two times a week. So I mean, yeah, just just horrible.
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  Speaker 12: There were you know, we weren't getting enough food at
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  Speaker 12: twelve years old. I enrolled at ninety pounds and I
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  Speaker 12: left at eighty, so that's ten pounds over a three
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  Speaker 12: month span. I spent Thanksgiving, Christmas, and New Year's there.
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  Speaker 12: We weren't given enough adequate gear for the weather, the temperature,
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  Speaker 12: so we got to like negative twenty degrees and we
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  Speaker 12: had two three layers max. Of really thin clothing.
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  Speaker 3: Just some some horrific, horrific stuff.
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  Speaker 1: You know, I'm trying to take in everything that you
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  Speaker 1: were saying, but you gave me so much information I've
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  Speaker 1: got to dissect it.
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  Speaker 3: You said that you, as a twelve.
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  Speaker 1: Year old little girl, saw things that no child nor
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  Speaker 1: anyone should ever see, such as what you know.
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  Speaker 12: On many occasions, I saw my friends' faces being pushed
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  Speaker 12: in the ground when being put on a restrictive hold.
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  Speaker 12: I you know, experienced and watched my friends be so
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  Speaker 12: emotionally manipulated. We had a problem with when I was there,
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  Speaker 12: with understaffing, and they wouldn't have enough staff sometimes to
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  Speaker 12: facilitate facilitate bathroom breaks, and so that meant that instead
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  Speaker 12: of letting us use the restroom, they would rather us
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  Speaker 12: like pr pants. And so in a solution to that,
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  Speaker 12: because we weren't doing laundry, we weren't getting showers, everyone
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  Speaker 12: smell of urine, and they threatened, and for some girls
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  Speaker 12: distributed adult diapers instead of letting us use the restroom.
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  Speaker 12: And that's truthfully only like the tip of the iceberg,
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  Speaker 12: which is deeply saddening. But those are, you know, just
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  Speaker 12: a few things that come to mind.
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  Speaker 1: Leanne went to this camp at just twelve years old.
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  Speaker 1: Praise the Lord, she's alive. The damage and the trauma
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  Speaker 1: and the emotional problems it's caused her, that's a whole
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  Speaker 1: nother can of worms. But she's alive, so she lives
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  Speaker 1: to fight another day. She lives to deal with what
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  Speaker 1: happened at Trails, Carolina.
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  Speaker 3: This little boy.
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  Speaker 1: Didn't live twelve years old, Pale, frail, upset, having panic.
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  Speaker 3: Attacks, and he dies within twenty four hours of going
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  Speaker 3: to this camp. This is camp season. Parents, wake up,
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  Speaker 3: be alert, Lee and Roberts.
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  Speaker 1: You stated that when you got there you had to
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  Speaker 1: be strip searched, that you were not given bathroom breaks,
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  Speaker 1: that the campers were told to wear adult diapers so
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  Speaker 1: they could urinate and defecate in their pants.
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  Speaker 12: Why, I mean, they would have all these kind of
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  Speaker 12: like safety reasons. They didn't really have an excuse for
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  Speaker 12: the diapers other than it was our fault for drinking
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  Speaker 12: so much water and not managing it, which is ridiculous,
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  Speaker 12: because if you got to go, you gotta go. But
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  Speaker 12: the strip searching, you know, they say it's to make
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  Speaker 12: sure you don't have anything dangerous on you, but they
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  Speaker 12: take away everything you come in with. And I genuinely
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  Speaker 12: do believe that it's, you know, a way to strip
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  Speaker 12: you of your individuality and maybe any comfort you have
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  Speaker 12: going in. You're dressed all the same as the other children.
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  Speaker 12: You don't have anything that, you know, like I said,
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  Speaker 12: as comforting or makes you feel safe or you know,
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  Speaker 12: you're just kind of stripped down to the bone.
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  Speaker 1: You mentioned the strip search you're describing that, guys, I
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  Speaker 1: doubt all.
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  Speaker 3: Of you parents experience this. If and when you got
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  Speaker 3: to go to camp.
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  Speaker 1: We got to go to camp at four AH Camp,
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  Speaker 1: and I remember my parents trying to get together the
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  Speaker 1: money to go to four H Camp. It was thirty
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  Speaker 1: seven dollars for each child to go to four ahe
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  Speaker 1: camp and we got to go. But it was a
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  Speaker 1: wonderful fun experience the only time each year that I
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  Speaker 1: would be away from home overnight.
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  Speaker 3: What you were hearing happened, This happened. There's no doubt
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  Speaker 3: about it.
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  Speaker 1: A little boy is dead tonight after just twenty four
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  Speaker 1: hours at this camp. It's not just at Trails, Carolina
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  Speaker 1: that this is happening. As a matter of fact, take
• 16:24
  Speaker 1: a listen to a victim that managed to survive the
• 16:29
  Speaker 1: Provo Canyon school.
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  Speaker 13: The first thing that they said to me was you're
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  Speaker 13: going to need to be strip searched, and so they
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  Speaker 13: took me to this room filled with cyber or six
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  Speaker 13: stass in there. Yeah.
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  Speaker 3: I had to remove all my clothes.
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  Speaker 13: They had to thoroughly.
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  Speaker 2: Examine my body.
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  Speaker 13: They asked me to sorry to do very strange things
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  Speaker 13: while I was naked. They asked me to bend over,
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  Speaker 13: touch my toes. I had to spread everything apart. I
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  Speaker 13: was told to squat into cough and they had me
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  Speaker 13: do that repeatedly for a few minutes while all the
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  Speaker 13: staff members last and made jokes.
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  Speaker 2: Parents send a twelve year old boy for treatment at
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  Speaker 2: a wilderness therapy camp. He never comes home dying just
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  Speaker 2: twenty four hours later.
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  Speaker 1: Found dead twenty four hours after going to Trails Carolina Camp,
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  Speaker 1: a therapeutic wellness camp for children and teens. Did his
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  Speaker 1: parents have any idea what really went on at that
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  Speaker 1: camp before they sent him. I've heard many, many true
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  Speaker 1: life traumatic stories about how children are basically kidnapped. The
• 17:55
  Speaker 1: parents know what's happening, but the child doesn't know it's
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  Speaker 1: about to go to a camp, and they are just
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  Speaker 1: taken away and they end up at a camp, a
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  Speaker 1: wellness camp or a boot camp for children and teens.
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  Speaker 1: Joining me, Meg Applegate, co founder, CEO Unsilenced, victim of
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  Speaker 1: trouble Teen Industry, author of Becoming Unsilenced, Surviving and Finding
• 18:24
  Speaker 1: the trouble teen Industry, and you can find her at
• 18:27
  Speaker 1: Unsilenced dot org.
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  Speaker 3: Meg, thank you for being with us.
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  Speaker 1: A death as if a strip search and malnourishment, beatings, hazings,
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  Speaker 1: adult diapers as if that's not enough, now, Meg, A
• 18:48
  Speaker 1: death of a twelve year old boy at camp right,
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  Speaker 1: and it's.
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  Speaker 14: Very, very sad, and unfortunately we're not all that surprised.
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  Speaker 1: We understand that this little boy was not delivered to
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  Speaker 1: the camp by his parents. That two strangers took kem.
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  Speaker 3: How does that work?
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  Speaker 15: Yeah, so we call that an escort service, or a
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  Speaker 15: lot of people call that booning. It's basically when you're
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  Speaker 15: woken up, usually in the middle of the night, you're
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  Speaker 15: told that you're coming with them.
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  Speaker 14: A lot of times you're.
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  Speaker 15: Asked to you undressed in front of them as to
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  Speaker 15: go to the bathroom in front of them, and then
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  Speaker 15: you're escorted from your home to wherever you're going to
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  Speaker 15: be gone.
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  Speaker 3: Now, what did you say?
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  Speaker 1: The phrase to describe it is maybe people call it boning,
• 19:29
  Speaker 1: gooning g as in gregarious in gooning.
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  Speaker 3: Correct, that's correct. Gooning.
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  Speaker 1: Okay, that evokes nothing but a semblance of fear of
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  Speaker 1: terror to get gooned.
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  Speaker 3: I mean, what do you mean gooned?
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  Speaker 14: I mean, it's pretty much how it feels myself.
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  Speaker 15: I was gooned as well, and it's so incredibly traumatic
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  Speaker 15: that it sticks with you for the rest of your life.
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  Speaker 14: It's truly like you're being kidnapped.
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  Speaker 3: What happened to you? Exactly?
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  Speaker 14: So I was woking up around two am by these
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  Speaker 14: two strangers.
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  Speaker 15: They said, you're coming with us, and we can do
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  Speaker 15: this the easy way or the hard way, and they
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  Speaker 15: indicated that the hard way was going to be in handcuffs.
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  Speaker 14: So I listened, and they basically made me undress in
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  Speaker 14: front of them.
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  Speaker 15: Go to the bathroom, threw me into the back of
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  Speaker 15: an suv, and we were off to Lax and off
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  Speaker 15: to my first program.
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  Speaker 1: To Nick Oxtar joining US chief investigative reporter WBTV, he
• 20:29
  Speaker 1: has been investigating Trails, Carolina says twenty twenty one, and
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  Speaker 1: there's no reason for that, this guy, Nick, Nick Oxtar
• 20:37
  Speaker 1: doesn't just get up your tail pipe for no reason.
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  Speaker 3: Nick, again, thank you for being with us.
• 20:43
  Speaker 1: How do the children, the teens get to trails, Carolina?
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  Speaker 1: Because I noticed immediately this little boy and we are
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  Speaker 1: withholding his name, the little boy that ends up dead
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  Speaker 1: without his pants on in the middle of the night.
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  Speaker 1: He did not get escorted there by his parents. They
• 21:00
  Speaker 1: didn't take him to camp and drop him off like
• 21:02
  Speaker 1: in What is It? The Parent Trap? Remember that Lindsay
• 21:06
  Speaker 1: Lohan is taken.
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  Speaker 3: By the butler. I think it is, and by the
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  Speaker 3: dad and it's wonderful. It's not like that. What is gooning?
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  Speaker 3: Are you familiar with that?
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  Speaker 7: Nick?
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  Speaker 6: Yeah?
• 21:18
  Speaker 4: Just about every former participant in Trails Carolina that I've
• 21:21
  Speaker 4: spoken with, and I've talked to more than a half
• 21:23
  Speaker 4: dozen of them. Just about everybody was gooned or transported
• 21:29
  Speaker 4: to the camp. And I'll tell you the very few
• 21:33
  Speaker 4: that I've talked to who weren't had a slightly less
• 21:36
  Speaker 4: traumatic start to their camping experience. But it's exactly as
• 21:39
  Speaker 4: I've heard it. Luckily I never had to experience this,
• 21:42
  Speaker 4: but as I understand, it's exactly like what we just
• 21:44
  Speaker 4: heard of may describe. These strangers come to your house.
• 21:47
  Speaker 4: You're woken up in the middle of the night and
• 21:49
  Speaker 4: taken whisked away unexpectedly by these strangers, you know, far away.
• 21:54
  Speaker 4: Think about this boy came from New York City.
• 21:57
  Speaker 10: To the wilderness of North Carolina.
• 21:59
  Speaker 4: I've been out to the site of the Trails Carolina
• 22:01
  Speaker 4: camp and let me tell you it's nothing like New
• 22:04
  Speaker 4: York City.
• 22:04
  Speaker 3: Oh yeah, oh yeah.
• 22:06
  Speaker 1: Karen Stark joining me, renowned psychologist, TV radio trauma expert
• 22:11
  Speaker 1: consultant and you can find her at Karenstark dot com.
• 22:14
  Speaker 3: And that's Karen with a C in case you're looking
• 22:17
  Speaker 3: for her.
• 22:18
  Speaker 1: Karen Stark, you need to write the book on panic attacks,
• 22:23
  Speaker 1: because you've done.
• 22:25
  Speaker 3: So many case studies on that.
• 22:27
  Speaker 1: But this little boy gets gooned, as Meg Applegate is
• 22:31
  Speaker 1: describing it, and Karen, I spoke to you about this
• 22:35
  Speaker 1: when it occurred. Friends of our children got gooned and
• 22:45
  Speaker 1: we're taken to a camp across the country and the
• 22:53
  Speaker 1: girl got to take one pair of underwear and one toothbrush.
• 22:59
  Speaker 3: She had no idea that was going to happen.
• 23:03
  Speaker 12: And just.
• 23:05
  Speaker 1: I mean, Karen, that right there, this little twelve year
• 23:10
  Speaker 1: old boy was having panic attacks. I guess he was
• 23:14
  Speaker 1: at twelve years old. It's just a baby, for Pete's sake.
• 23:20
  Speaker 1: What is a panic attack? And I'm getting to something probative,
• 23:24
  Speaker 1: Karen Stark. I ask you all of these psychological questions
• 23:28
  Speaker 1: because I want to prove something. I want to prove
• 23:31
  Speaker 1: something that I can take in front of a jury.
• 23:35
  Speaker 1: This boy, by all accounts, was having panic attacks. Okay,
• 23:39
  Speaker 1: he should have been watched even more closely that night,
• 23:44
  Speaker 1: but instead he ends up dead.
• 23:47
  Speaker 3: So what is a panic attack and what would the
• 23:52
  Speaker 3: symptoms be? Karen Stark.
• 23:54
  Speaker 16: When you have a panic attack, Nancy, you are feeling
• 23:58
  Speaker 16: like you're having a heart attack. And many of my
• 24:01
  Speaker 16: patients describe that because your heart is racing. Your breathing
• 24:06
  Speaker 16: isn't regular. It's very, very frightening, and people don't understand
• 24:10
  Speaker 16: that it's something that will pass, that your body is
• 24:13
  Speaker 16: reacting to trauma. And when you think about and you've
• 24:17
  Speaker 16: made some good points, this little boy, he's being taken off.
• 24:22
  Speaker 16: All of these children they're taken away. They are not
• 24:25
  Speaker 16: able to know ahead of time, and the parents believe
• 24:27
  Speaker 16: this is a good thing. They're told that, so they
• 24:30
  Speaker 16: don't even know what is happening to them. They're humiliated,
• 24:35
  Speaker 16: they're frightened. And you take a child like this, who
• 24:39
  Speaker 16: already has anxiety and panic attacks, and put him in
• 24:43
  Speaker 16: a situation that is overwhelming where he has absolutely no
• 24:48
  Speaker 16: idea what's happening. And it's not the way that you're
• 24:52
  Speaker 16: supposed to be helping somebody. You're supposed to be helping
• 24:55
  Speaker 16: a child. That's why they're going there. This is a
• 24:58
  Speaker 16: cant that's supposed to be providing good services, and instead
• 25:02
  Speaker 16: they scare them.
• 25:04
  Speaker 3: And that is the worst tactic you could use. Karen Stark.
• 25:07
  Speaker 3: On many occasions, these counselors did nothing, Nancy.
• 25:11
  Speaker 16: They can't do anything. They don't have the right training.
• 25:14
  Speaker 16: They really don't understand what they're doing. And that's one
• 25:17
  Speaker 16: of the problems. These camps are unregulated. They can hire anyone,
• 25:21
  Speaker 16: and they are not equipped to deal with real mental
• 25:24
  Speaker 16: health issues or anything that is out of the ordinary.
• 25:29
  Speaker 16: All they're taughtest punishment, nothing that has to do with
• 25:33
  Speaker 16: good therapeutic health.
• 25:35
  Speaker 2: Survivors fighting trauma from therapy camps speak out after a
• 25:40
  Speaker 2: twelve year old boy dies.
• 25:43
  Speaker 1: How can a twelve year old boy who had been
• 25:45
  Speaker 1: suffering panic attacks after being taken to Trails Carolina therapeutic camp,
• 25:50
  Speaker 1: How can you end up dead in the last hours
• 25:53
  Speaker 1: we learn the medical examiner has ruled it a homicide
• 25:58
  Speaker 1: by a sphyxy.
• 26:01
  Speaker 3: It sounds like the camp.
• 26:02
  Speaker 1: Canselers just stood by while the little boy was having
• 26:04
  Speaker 1: a panic attack. So what do we know about Trails Carolina?
• 26:11
  Speaker 1: And let me remind you this is not just happening
• 26:16
  Speaker 1: at Trails Carolina as a matter of fact, listen to this.
• 26:21
  Speaker 17: Constantly reported that he was left in a room for
• 26:24
  Speaker 17: days with basically they just would leave them, feed them,
• 26:28
  Speaker 17: let them out, made him pee in a jug, tackled
• 26:31
  Speaker 17: by staff constantly, which was always denied. I asked them
• 26:36
  Speaker 17: to view cameras every time it happened it was somewhere
• 26:38
  Speaker 17: where there was in the cameras. He got into a
• 26:40
  Speaker 17: little bit of trouble when he got a nothing major,
• 26:42
  Speaker 17: but a week later he took his life. I think
• 26:45
  Speaker 17: he thought he was going to end up back there.
• 26:47
  Speaker 1: That dad is talking about Proso Canyon, where children and
• 26:51
  Speaker 1: teens were gooned, forced to go there, and when things
• 26:56
  Speaker 1: went sideways, they were not allowed to contact their parents.
• 27:00
  Speaker 1: When they did call home, they were monitored as to
• 27:04
  Speaker 1: what they were saying. For us to being a form
• 27:07
  Speaker 1: of solitary confinement, only given sporadic meals and forced to
• 27:13
  Speaker 1: urinate in a jug. So the boy comes back home
• 27:17
  Speaker 1: after a stint at Provo and gets into minor trouble.
• 27:23
  Speaker 1: He was not threatened with being sent back to Provo,
• 27:26
  Speaker 1: but he was afraid he was going back and committed suicide.
• 27:31
  Speaker 1: That was the father of Trevor Hooker speaking out. And
• 27:37
  Speaker 1: it's not just these two camps. It's happening industrywide across
• 27:43
  Speaker 1: our country. Meg Applegate and joining us CEO of Unsilenced,
• 27:47
  Speaker 1: who endured similar conditions herself and is now fighting to
• 27:52
  Speaker 1: change it. I don't think parents understand what's happening. I
• 27:56
  Speaker 1: mean parents send their children to camp, just like I
• 27:59
  Speaker 1: was sent to four eight with no idea what's gonna happen,
• 28:04
  Speaker 1: what the child gets there?
• 28:05
  Speaker 14: Meg, It's true, It's true.
• 28:07
  Speaker 15: And I don't think parents understand or the general public
• 28:10
  Speaker 15: in general, that we're talking about one hundred and twenty
• 28:12
  Speaker 15: to two hundred thousand kids a year are ending up
• 28:14
  Speaker 15: in these kind of programs.
• 28:15
  Speaker 1: What more do we know about what happened to the
• 28:18
  Speaker 1: night this twelve year old child dies After the.
• 28:23
  Speaker 11: Twelve year old has a panic attack around midnight. A
• 28:25
  Speaker 11: councilor told investigators that the boy was checked on throughout
• 28:28
  Speaker 11: the night, starting at twelve am, with additional checks on
• 28:31
  Speaker 11: his well being at three am and six am. At
• 28:34
  Speaker 11: seven forty five am, the boy is found dead. According
• 28:38
  Speaker 11: to the search warrant, when investigators arrived on scene, CJH.
• 28:41
  Speaker 3: Was stiff and cold to the touch.
• 28:44
  Speaker 11: He was lying on his back, his arms were on
• 28:46
  Speaker 11: his chest, and his knees bent upward towards the sky.
• 28:49
  Speaker 11: Also in the search warrant, investigators noted spots of bleeding
• 28:52
  Speaker 11: under the skin, possible patikia in the boy's lips and eyes.
• 28:56
  Speaker 11: Thepr mask was covering the boy's face and he was
• 28:58
  Speaker 11: not wearing pants or underwear. His pants and underwear were
• 29:02
  Speaker 11: lying next to his shoulder.
• 29:03
  Speaker 1: To doctor eric Asen, a Board certify Forensic Pathologists and consultant,
• 29:09
  Speaker 1: doctor Ason.
• 29:10
  Speaker 3: Thank you for being with us.
• 29:11
  Speaker 1: You've just heard the description given as to how the
• 29:14
  Speaker 1: twelve year old boy was found dead.
• 29:17
  Speaker 3: What do you make of it?
• 29:18
  Speaker 1: Particularly the partikia the burst blood vessels.
• 29:22
  Speaker 8: Well, patikii are typically found in individuals who can die
• 29:28
  Speaker 8: from asphyxia.
• 29:29
  Speaker 7: That's usually asphyxia.
• 29:30
  Speaker 8: From like a hanging or a strangulation, when there's some
• 29:34
  Speaker 8: type of pressure on the neck and it causes a
• 29:37
  Speaker 8: pressure build up of a blood and the blood bustles
• 29:39
  Speaker 8: in the eye and then they will rupture and cause
• 29:42
  Speaker 8: these small dots known as patikii. So you typically see
• 29:44
  Speaker 8: them in asphyxia, but there's other causes of petikii. So
• 29:48
  Speaker 8: you don't just want to say, hey, if you see PETIKIAI,
• 29:50
  Speaker 8: this is definitely an asphyxial death. They can happen from CPR,
• 29:54
  Speaker 8: they can actually happen from a heart attack.
• 29:57
  Speaker 7: You can actually sneeze really hard and cause patikia in
• 30:00
  Speaker 7: your face.
• 30:01
  Speaker 3: Hold on just a moment.
• 30:02
  Speaker 1: I'm hearing a subtle but important distinction doctor eric Ason.
• 30:07
  Speaker 1: When they particularizes the very tiny blood vessels in your eyes,
• 30:12
  Speaker 1: I guess your lips and elsewhere, possibly your your nasal passages.
• 30:18
  Speaker 3: When they burst.
• 30:21
  Speaker 1: If you simply run out of air, will they burst
• 30:26
  Speaker 1: or does there need to be some sort of pressure
• 30:30
  Speaker 1: such as a pillow over the face, some sort of
• 30:35
  Speaker 1: mechanical pressure. When I say mechanical, I mean hands ligatory
• 30:39
  Speaker 1: pillow put.
• 30:41
  Speaker 7: Right, and there needs to be pressure.
• 30:42
  Speaker 3: Would they burst simply from running out of air?
• 30:45
  Speaker 7: No, that's not the typical explanation for I form.
• 30:49
  Speaker 8: They're gonna They's gonna be some some type of physical
• 30:51
  Speaker 8: trauma to a blood vessel to cause that to happen,
• 30:54
  Speaker 8: and that.
• 30:56
  Speaker 3: Is the crux here or Esen, go with me on this.
• 31:02
  Speaker 1: I'm trying to explain this in regular people talk, but
• 31:05
  Speaker 1: I think you'll understand what I'm trying to say. This boy,
• 31:09
  Speaker 1: if his patikia were burst in his lips, did not
• 31:13
  Speaker 1: die of just running out of air in his sleeping bag.
• 31:17
  Speaker 1: First of all, the sleeping bag a bivy. Everybody that
• 31:22
  Speaker 1: camps knows not to do what they did. The boy
• 31:26
  Speaker 1: was sleeping a sleeping bag in a bivy which comes
• 31:31
  Speaker 1: up around you kind of like a canoe and there
• 31:33
  Speaker 1: was a covering over it. Very often used. My son's
• 31:37
  Speaker 1: got one and he will camp out just out in
• 31:40
  Speaker 1: the middle of nowhere. It looks like a sleeping mag
• 31:42
  Speaker 1: with a top over it to keep mosquitoes out. He
• 31:46
  Speaker 1: had this child had the outer weather proof covering over him,
• 31:53
  Speaker 1: which you're not supposed to do because it can seal.
• 31:56
  Speaker 3: Out the air.
• 31:58
  Speaker 1: Unlike the mesh one, it's breatheable. But uh huh No,
• 32:03
  Speaker 1: if there were burst partikia and his lips, then.
• 32:09
  Speaker 3: There had to be some type of mechanical force on him.
• 32:12
  Speaker 3: Am I making any sense?
• 32:13
  Speaker 7: It makes sense to me?
• 32:14
  Speaker 3: Yes, what do you think?
• 32:15
  Speaker 7: Yeah? I agree.
• 32:16
  Speaker 8: I think there had to be some type of pressure
• 32:18
  Speaker 8: on the neck or on the blood belts of the
• 32:20
  Speaker 8: face to cause the petikii if they were definitely found
• 32:26
  Speaker 8: an autopsy, and I don't recall if they were.
• 32:28
  Speaker 1: Well, I mean, we just heard the reporter state that
• 32:31
  Speaker 1: there was damage to the patikia at the.
• 32:34
  Speaker 3: Time Crime Stories with Nancy Grace.
• 32:48
  Speaker 1: Nick Oxner joining me from WBTV way in because the
• 32:54
  Speaker 1: medical examiner there at Wake Forest Baptist Medical has ruled
• 33:00
  Speaker 1: this a homicide. And I also noticed that in the
• 33:04
  Speaker 1: autopsy there was bruising on the thighs, and there was bruising,
• 33:10
  Speaker 1: I believe on page four as I was analyzing it,
• 33:15
  Speaker 1: another bruise on the hip, the hip and the thigh.
• 33:21
  Speaker 1: That's disturbing. Why does this frail, pale little boy have bruising.
• 33:27
  Speaker 1: He had no health complaints prior to this. He didn't hyperventilate,
• 33:33
  Speaker 1: he had never had respiratory problems, Nick, nothing like that.
• 33:37
  Speaker 1: So his hyoid was intact, which rules out, well, not
• 33:42
  Speaker 1: necessarily a strangulation. But I'm concerned that I'm hearing there
• 33:48
  Speaker 1: was particular damage.
• 33:49
  Speaker 3: What do you make of it?
• 33:50
  Speaker 4: Yeah, What I think is interesting is that the autopsy
• 33:53
  Speaker 4: notes the bruising, like you said, but then also says
• 33:57
  Speaker 4: there is no signs of real trauma. It also says
• 34:01
  Speaker 4: that investigators did a sexual assault examination kit post mortem, obviously, and.
• 34:08
  Speaker 10: That was negative.
• 34:09
  Speaker 1: Nick, my dear sweet boy, my naive investigatiory border. You
• 34:14
  Speaker 1: think just because there's no tearing, bruising or blood and
• 34:19
  Speaker 1: his anus, that there's not a sex assault. Just talking
• 34:24
  Speaker 1: about what's in the papers, Nancy, True, You're right, You're
• 34:27
  Speaker 1: right again, And as you know, I.
• 34:29
  Speaker 10: Think it's instructive and as you're doing as well. I
• 34:32
  Speaker 10: sit down, I.
• 34:32
  Speaker 4: Read the autopsy report, and I read what's in there
• 34:35
  Speaker 4: and what's not in there, and I look at what
• 34:37
  Speaker 4: is written versus what else we know or other questions
• 34:41
  Speaker 4: we have. But I think it's helpful to follow along
• 34:43
  Speaker 4: what's in this autopsy, just like you're doing right now,
• 34:46
  Speaker 4: and continue to raise questions.
• 34:48
  Speaker 18: The twelve year old is not the first youth that
• 34:50
  Speaker 18: the camp has dealt with. Alec was able to walk
• 34:53
  Speaker 18: away from the camp in November of twenty fourteen, only
• 34:56
  Speaker 18: to be found in a stream dead. Investigators believe he
• 34:59
  Speaker 18: fell while climbing a tree, breaking his hip as he
• 35:02
  Speaker 18: landed in the stream below. Unable to move, the teen
• 35:05
  Speaker 18: died from hypothermia.
• 35:06
  Speaker 9: Before the death of the twelve year old, Trails Carolina
• 35:09
  Speaker 9: has been dealing with other issues in court. Most recently,
• 35:13
  Speaker 9: a federal lawsuit was filed on February nine by a
• 35:16
  Speaker 9: former camper who says when she was twelve, she told
• 35:19
  Speaker 9: staffers that another child was sexually assaulting fellow campers. According
• 35:24
  Speaker 9: to the lawsuit, counselors at Trails Carolina did nothing to
• 35:28
  Speaker 9: stop the alleged assaults. The former camper is now twenty
• 35:32
  Speaker 9: years old, and tells the Charlotte Observer the most upsetting
• 35:36
  Speaker 9: part for her is the trauma she experienced was preventable.
• 35:40
  Speaker 9: Her suit follows a similar suit filed last year in
• 35:43
  Speaker 9: federal court claiming a former camper alleges that camp counselors
• 35:47
  Speaker 9: didn't do enough to prevent an older camper from sexually
• 35:51
  Speaker 9: assaulting her in twenty nineteen, even though she asked for
• 35:56
  Speaker 9: help multiple times.
• 35:58
  Speaker 2: An investigation underway after a shocking autopsy rules a twelve
• 36:02
  Speaker 2: year old boys cause of death a homicide at a
• 36:06
  Speaker 2: wilderness therapy camp.
• 36:08
  Speaker 13: This is what I know.
• 36:10
  Speaker 1: The sheriffs who went to the scene and see the
• 36:14
  Speaker 1: body stated there was bleeding under the skin of the
• 36:20
  Speaker 1: boy's lips and eyes, possible PARTICKI. And it's totally not
• 36:26
  Speaker 1: even really mentioned in the autopsy report. Why that doesn't
• 36:31
  Speaker 1: sound like he just ran out of air in his buvy.
• 36:36
  Speaker 1: Also that night, Nick Oxter, we hear that the counselors
• 36:40
  Speaker 1: kept coming to his buvy because he was thrashing about
• 36:46
  Speaker 1: but they didn't do anything.
• 36:47
  Speaker 6: Yeah.
• 36:47
  Speaker 4: In fact, one of the counselors in that room told
• 36:50
  Speaker 4: state investigators with the Department of Health and Human Services that.
• 36:54
  Speaker 10: He felt like he failed the boy or could have
• 36:57
  Speaker 10: done more to prevent his death.
• 37:00
  Speaker 4: It is pretty clear now from what we know from
• 37:02
  Speaker 4: investigators that those counselors at one point, we're all asleep
• 37:07
  Speaker 4: inside that cabin, and that the boy was found, if
• 37:11
  Speaker 4: you read the autopsy, was down one hundred and eighty
• 37:13
  Speaker 4: degrees turned from from inside the bivy sack where he
• 37:17
  Speaker 4: was zipped inside. That's all that we've been able to
• 37:20
  Speaker 4: glean from these public reports so far.
• 37:23
  Speaker 1: In other words, he was upside down. For instance, if
• 37:26
  Speaker 1: you were on a bed, your feet would be on
• 37:28
  Speaker 1: the pillow and your head would be at the baseboard.
• 37:30
  Speaker 3: That's not right.
• 37:32
  Speaker 1: And we know the boy was thrashing around more than
• 37:35
  Speaker 1: once in the night and they did nothing. I mean,
• 37:38
  Speaker 1: I'm not convinced he died from just running out of air.
• 37:42
  Speaker 1: With the PARTICULARI The sheriff noted that said, back to
• 37:45
  Speaker 1: Lianne Roberts, who attended Trails Carolina age twelve.
• 37:49
  Speaker 3: What was it like being there? Leanne?
• 37:53
  Speaker 12: And it was like very traumatic to say the least.
• 37:57
  Speaker 12: It's you know, I carry still to this day a
• 38:00
  Speaker 12: lot of the memories and the trauma that I'm working through.
• 38:06
  Speaker 12: It was a very emotionally hostile environment. You're being monitored
• 38:11
  Speaker 12: twenty four to seven, and so it doesn't really feel
• 38:15
  Speaker 12: like there's room to breathe, room to do something wrong,
• 38:18
  Speaker 12: room to have feelings. Emotional outbursts or even crying. Were
• 38:23
  Speaker 12: really kind of punished, heavily punished, and I mean the
• 38:29
  Speaker 12: punishments were cruel. When you don't have anything left to
• 38:34
  Speaker 12: take away, they have to get kind of creative. And
• 38:37
  Speaker 12: so every day you could earn, you know, time to
• 38:40
  Speaker 12: talk if you did something within the timeframe that they
• 38:44
  Speaker 12: allotted you, or you could earn what was called a
• 38:47
  Speaker 12: negative consequence. And so everything you did, every breath you
• 38:50
  Speaker 12: took had some sort of you know, negative or positive consequence.
• 38:54
  Speaker 12: There wasn't any time to just like breathe freely. And
• 38:58
  Speaker 12: the negative consequence, as we're, pretty disturbing to say the least.
• 39:02
  Speaker 12: There was one that sticks out to me in particular always,
• 39:06
  Speaker 12: which is what staff would call pea party. And pea
• 39:11
  Speaker 12: party is as disgusting and disturbing as it may sound.
• 39:16
  Speaker 12: It meant that if somebody had to use the restroom
• 39:19
  Speaker 12: in the middle of the night, you know, you have
• 39:23
  Speaker 12: to wake up a staff to say that. You know,
• 39:25
  Speaker 12: you have to go to the restroom because you have
• 39:26
  Speaker 12: to be monitored, you have to be listened to and watched.
• 39:29
  Speaker 12: And if you woke up a staff in the middle
• 39:31
  Speaker 12: of the night, doesn't matter the hour to use the restroom.
• 39:34
  Speaker 12: They woke everybody up and everyone had to stand around
• 39:38
  Speaker 12: until said person was finished using the restroom, kind of
• 39:42
  Speaker 12: as like a you know, it was more so a
• 39:44
  Speaker 12: reward to the staff that they wouldn't have to wake
• 39:46
  Speaker 12: up in the middle of the night to facilitate a
• 39:49
  Speaker 12: bathroom break, because it was like such a shame filled
• 39:52
  Speaker 12: negative consequence and that was, you know, kind of the
• 39:55
  Speaker 12: theme of my whole say, there was a lot of shame.
• 39:58
  Speaker 3: Guys.
• 39:58
  Speaker 1: You're hearing Lean Raw speak out and Meg Applegate as well,
• 40:02
  Speaker 1: Nick Oxner, who has been investigating this particular camp for
• 40:06
  Speaker 1: now three years. This is so pervasive in the camping industry.
• 40:11
  Speaker 1: One victim a name you'll know, Paris Hilton.
• 40:16
  Speaker 3: Listen.
• 40:16
  Speaker 19: A seventeen year old Paris Hilton is sent by her
• 40:19
  Speaker 19: family to the Provo Canyon School in Utah. In a
• 40:23
  Speaker 19: documentary This Is Paris, she describes the place as a
• 40:26
  Speaker 19: prison camp with solitary confinement and physical abuse. She details
• 40:31
  Speaker 19: being forced to submit to a pelvic exam, then being
• 40:34
  Speaker 19: forced to wear a pair of faded sweats labeled with
• 40:37
  Speaker 19: the number one twenty seven. That number became her identity
• 40:41
  Speaker 19: and her name. Hilton says the staff would choke and
• 40:44
  Speaker 19: beat campers. Speaking before lawmakers, Hilton described how children were restrained, hit,
• 40:51
  Speaker 19: thrown into walls, strangled, and sexually abused regularly.
• 40:55
  Speaker 1: At Provo, A twelve year old boy dead at summer
• 40:59
  Speaker 1: camp after just twenty four hours?
• 41:02
  Speaker 3: What happened?
• 41:03
  Speaker 1: Joining me Leanne Roberts, who attended the same camp age twelve,
• 41:07
  Speaker 1: and Meg Applegate, author of Becoming Unsilenced, Surviving and Fighting
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  Speaker 1: the troubled teen industry. Meg Applegate, You've been listening to
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  Speaker 1: the facts presented in this case along with Karen Stark's psychologist,
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  Speaker 1: and I'm sure that you have an opinion on what
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  Speaker 1: has happened to this twelve year old boy?
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  Speaker 3: And what do you make of Leanne Roberts description.
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  Speaker 15: I've likely talked to over one hundred survivors from Trails, Carolina,
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  Speaker 15: and you take Lianne's experience and you copy and paste
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  Speaker 15: it to all the others, and it doesn't matter what
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  Speaker 15: year they went. They're really experiencing all the same things.
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  Speaker 3: What sort of things are you describing, Meg.
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  Speaker 15: Everything that you've heard as far as being denied bathroom breaks,
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  Speaker 15: enough food, honestly adequate water and clean for that, I've
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  Speaker 15: talked to many survivors who have gotten parasites and giardia
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  Speaker 15: and all of these things from not or being not
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  Speaker 15: allowed to have clean water sources or having broken filters.
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  Speaker 15: It's absolutely horrendous, Leanne.
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  Speaker 1: Were you ever given a chance to tell your parents
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  Speaker 1: what was happening to come get you out of there?
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  Speaker 12: Yeah, my first or second day, I wrote a letter
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  Speaker 12: to my dad and I have those letters now in verbatim.
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  Speaker 12: I say, this is traumatizing. I'm not safe here, these
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  Speaker 12: kids are not well. And when that letter was sent out,
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  Speaker 12: I think it is pretty protocol for my therapists at
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  Speaker 12: the time, or just their program in general. They prep
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  Speaker 12: parents for that. So they literally had told my dad's
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  Speaker 12: word for word what I was going to say and
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  Speaker 12: that I was a liar before they had sent that letter,
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  Speaker 12: and so it was a weird. It reinstalled his trust
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  Speaker 12: in the program because he thought, if they're able to
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  Speaker 12: predict these patterns and behaviors and literally what my daughter
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  Speaker 12: is going to do, then they must know what they're
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  Speaker 12: talking about, when really he was being lied to and
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  Speaker 12: deceived and becoming a victim of this industry as well.
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  Speaker 3: The warning is out parents, this is camping season.
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  Speaker 1: You have the chance to protect your children from camps,
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  Speaker 1: just like Trails Carolina.
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  Speaker 3: Nick Auxtar, what's going to happen to Trails Carolina.
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  Speaker 4: Well, their license has been revoked by the North Carolina
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  Speaker 4: Department of Health and Human Services.
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  Speaker 10: So effectively it shut down.
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  Speaker 4: They have an opportunity to appeal that so that could
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  Speaker 4: be reversed, but it's basically been shut down most of
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  Speaker 4: this year since this boy died, and it looks like
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  Speaker 4: it will continue to remain closed.
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  Speaker 1: It's amazing, Meg Applegate, that it took another death at
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  Speaker 1: another camp before the camp was reprimanded, after all of
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  Speaker 1: the complaints that have been lodged, all the children that
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  Speaker 1: have suffered there, this boy had to die.
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  Speaker 14: I know, and honestly, that's a lot of time.
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  Speaker 15: What it takes, unfortunately, is a child dying in one
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  Speaker 15: of these facilities for people to finally pay attention. And
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  Speaker 15: in this case, so we have Alec Lansing who died
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  Speaker 15: many years before that at Trails Carolina and still it
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  Speaker 15: took this amount of time.
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  Speaker 1: Thank you to our guests for being with us and
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  Speaker 1: speaking out, but especially to you for joining us here
• 44:26
  Speaker 1: on crime Stories.
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  Speaker 3: Nancy Grace signing off, Goodbye friend,