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What If Your Choices Don't Need a Full Explanation? · Conversations Beyond Borders

• 0:05
  SPEAKER_01: Welcome back.
• 0:06
  SPEAKER_01: I'm Susan.
• 0:07
  SPEAKER_02: And I'm Laura.
• 0:09
  SPEAKER_01: This is our fourth episode in our second season of Conversations Beyond Borders.
• 0:15
  SPEAKER_01: Last week, you know, we talked about hearing our voice.
• 0:18
  SPEAKER_01: And this week, we're going to continue a bit with that, but we're going to go beyond that.
• 0:22
  SPEAKER_01: And what I mean is it's about trusting it.
• 0:26
  SPEAKER_01: It's because once I think we start listening to ourselves, another quiet shift often follows.
• 0:34
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know if you've noticed, but how much time I've spent explaining myself, explaining why I'm tired, why I'm saying no, why I've changed my mind, why I'm leaving early, why you're choosing differently than you used to.
• 0:51
  SPEAKER_01: Not because anyone else is keeping score, but I don't know about you, but sometimes I believe that I actually need a narrator.
• 1:01
  SPEAKER_01: So this episode is not about boundaries.
• 1:04
  SPEAKER_01: It's really about something even quieter.
• 1:07
  SPEAKER_01: It's the freedom of letting a choice simply be a choice.
• 1:11
  SPEAKER_01: Without apologies, without the justification, and without turning it into a production.
• 1:17
  SPEAKER_01: Wouldn't that be nice?
• 1:19
  SPEAKER_01: Wouldn't it?
• 1:22
  SPEAKER_02: So today we are going to be looking into a concept that might be unfamiliar to some of our listeners.
• 1:30
  SPEAKER_02: The concept is essentially I'm no longer turning this into a production.
• 1:35
  SPEAKER_02: Or more specifically, what if my choices don't need a full explanation?
• 1:41
  SPEAKER_02: Let's take this idea and look at it a couple different ways.
• 1:45
  SPEAKER_02: First, let's look at a habit we may not have realized we have.
• 1:49
  SPEAKER_02: Many of us don't realize how often we explain ourselves because it's become part of our personality until one day we overhear ourselves doing it.
• 1:59
  SPEAKER_02: Susan, do you believe that's true for you?
• 2:02
  SPEAKER_01: Well, I would say that's true for me.
• 2:04
  SPEAKER_01: I think I've been guilty of feeling like I have to explain what I can't do, something, you know, I can't do something for someone long before someone may even have asked for the explanation.
• 2:18
  SPEAKER_01: I think it's programmed in me.
• 2:19
  SPEAKER_01: It's probably because, well, maybe I've never wanted to disappoint a friend, or perhaps the guilt is, you know, has me showing up for everyone but myself.
• 2:30
  SPEAKER_01: Sometimes we explain simply because we expect disagreement.
• 2:34
  SPEAKER_01: Lord, can you think of any other habits that we might have?
• 2:39
  SPEAKER_02: Well, sometimes I think we don't just answer, but we feel like we have to build a case.
• 2:47
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 2:48
  SPEAKER_02: Right?
• 2:49
  SPEAKER_02: So it's like bring down the the god, the what do they say?
• 2:52
  SPEAKER_02: The gavel?
• 2:55
  SPEAKER_02: The gavel.
• 2:55
  SPEAKER_02: The gavel, the gavel.
• 2:57
  SPEAKER_02: Well, it's like it's like there's certain people that when you want to do something or you don't want to do something, you have in your life these people that you feel like you have to present your evidence like you're going to court, like you said.
• 3:11
  SPEAKER_02: You've got to bring down that gavel.
• 3:13
  SPEAKER_02: And you should really be okay with just saying, I'm done, I've had a busy week.
• 3:19
  SPEAKER_02: And or if you've committed to something already.
• 3:23
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 3:24
  SPEAKER_01: No.
• 3:24
  SPEAKER_01: Or if you have a child that needs you.
• 3:27
  SPEAKER_01: Oh boy, that one hits home for me.
• 3:30
  SPEAKER_01: Even if I already have something planned, or honestly, even if I just wanted the evening to myself, I still find myself reaching.
• 3:38
  SPEAKER_01: You know, what can I do?
• 3:40
  SPEAKER_01: What can I do for everyone else?
• 3:42
  SPEAKER_01: I don't think that women are trying to be dishonest.
• 3:46
  SPEAKER_01: I think we're just trying to be understandable.
• 3:48
  SPEAKER_01: We want people to know we're still kind and dependable and still caring.
• 3:54
  SPEAKER_01: So instead of simply answering, like you say, we just start building evidence that our decision is justified.
• 4:02
  SPEAKER_01: You know, those little words like I just um, I only or I'm probably overthinking, those little phrases shrink perfectly reasonable decisions.
• 4:15
  SPEAKER_01: I know, Laura, we've talked about these habits getting ready for this episode.
• 4:20
  SPEAKER_01: I think you are doing a better job at being definitive with your responses.
• 4:24
  SPEAKER_01: I have some learning to do.
• 4:25
  SPEAKER_01: Why do you think some of us struggle with thinking we have to provide the lengthy explanation?
• 4:32
  SPEAKER_02: I think one, we've been trained up to feel like we have to explain everything that we want to do.
• 4:41
  SPEAKER_02: We have not, we were not raised with the idea that it's just okay to say no.
• 4:49
  SPEAKER_01: Um, you know, or not to have all the answers.
• 4:52
  SPEAKER_02: Exactly, exactly, especially as women.
• 4:54
  SPEAKER_01: Do you think that people would say that there's a lot of us that might feel safer?
• 5:03
  SPEAKER_01: It might be easier.
• 5:06
  SPEAKER_02: For sure.
• 5:06
  SPEAKER_02: There's, you know, definitely safer.
• 5:09
  SPEAKER_02: Not everybody's comfortable with conflict.
• 5:12
  SPEAKER_02: That's the other thing I think that we're raised to believe, or at least I was raised to believe, that that conflict is bad.
• 5:18
  SPEAKER_02: And I can't even pinpoint where that comes from.
• 5:21
  SPEAKER_02: It wasn't like it was obvious or it was a discussion, or maybe it was just because whenever I saw conflict, it was always in a negative, whether it was in a movie, TV show, between parents or parents' friends, or whatever, or even between my own friends as I was growing up.
• 5:35
  SPEAKER_02: Um, but it really was was once I started getting into the working world, and I was with a group of people and we were working through a process, and there was conflict about it.
• 5:51
  SPEAKER_02: And it was like, wait a minute.
• 5:55
  SPEAKER_02: I think it should be this way, you think it should be this way.
• 5:58
  SPEAKER_02: We're sitting here, we're showing each other why we think it should be this way or the other.
• 6:02
  SPEAKER_02: And instead of it being a negative, it ended up being this amazing positive experience where right here with each other, right?
• 6:11
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, exactly, exactly.
• 6:12
  SPEAKER_02: So we were listening to each other and we were learning, and then we each learned a different way to do the thing.
• 6:17
  SPEAKER_00: Right, right.
• 6:18
  SPEAKER_02: So it doesn't have to be about one person being right and the other one being wrong, it's just being open to listening to another opinion and another viewpoint.
• 6:26
  SPEAKER_01: I think that that comes down to sometimes there is context to what in order to be considerate, um, in order to be able to hear, you know, you're right, the other person who might be presenting something, and in and in that light, all of a sudden you realize, wait a minute, you're right.
• 6:44
  SPEAKER_01: I might not necessarily be wrong, but I now have new information that I might be able to make a better informed decision.
• 6:52
  SPEAKER_01: Why does it have to be conflict?
• 6:54
  SPEAKER_01: Exactly.
• 6:54
  SPEAKER_01: Um, I think I just have to be careful because I have to am I sharing because I generally want to, or because I feel my decision won't be accepted without enough evidence that's something to think about for sure.
• 7:08
  SPEAKER_01: Let's move on to the next layer of this discussion and why we feel that our choices must come with a full explanation.
• 7:17
  SPEAKER_02: Think about this.
• 7:19
  SPEAKER_02: What if we learned how to give ourselves permission to be okay with not overexplaining and instead just believing we're allowed to just do and be?
• 7:33
  SPEAKER_02: So thinking about that concept, Susan, are you okay with saying things like I'm staying home tonight?
• 7:45
  SPEAKER_02: And then just stopping.
• 7:46
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 7:47
  SPEAKER_02: No explanation, no excuse, no apology, just I'm staying home.
• 7:55
  SPEAKER_01: Nothing like putting me on the spot, Laura.
• 7:58
  SPEAKER_01: I'd say early in my marriage in my family life, I definitely felt like I was the peacekeeper.
• 8:05
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know that I realized it then, but I thought, you know, a good woman explained herself.
• 8:10
  SPEAKER_01: A good wife explained herself, a good mother explained herself.
• 8:14
  SPEAKER_01: So I think every decision came with a little speech, hoping everyone would understand and get what they needed.
• 8:20
  SPEAKER_01: And that that basically, I think that has warped my warped my feeling about yes, listening to my own needs and that somehow someone else's needs are more important.
• 8:39
  SPEAKER_01: But you know, after 40 years of marriage, I think how much energy I did spend trying to prevent disappointment before it even happened.
• 8:47
  SPEAKER_01: And I think I was explaining decisions nobody had questioned me yet.
• 8:52
  SPEAKER_01: And these days I'm learning that you know, my family doesn't need a detailed explanation every time I choose something that's right for me.
• 9:00
  SPEAKER_01: How does that land on you, Laura?
• 9:03
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, well, I will say, being on newly married, sort of, I was given an opportunity to correct some bad habits I had in my first marriage.
• 9:16
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 9:16
  SPEAKER_02: And in my first marriage, anything that I wanted to do or disagreed with was like going to trial.
• 9:23
  SPEAKER_02: And there was a lot of explanation and bargaining and stuff like that needed to be done.
• 9:30
  SPEAKER_02: And so when I got back into the dating world, I made a pact with myself that I was not gonna let that happen again.
• 9:38
  SPEAKER_02: And so I had to get brave because it did feel very uncomfortable at first.
• 9:44
  SPEAKER_02: Um, very uncomfortable, very uncomfortable.
• 9:48
  SPEAKER_02: Um, but uh, you know, my my husband, Greg, I mean, he's he's great.
• 9:54
  SPEAKER_02: He's great.
• 9:55
  SPEAKER_02: I he there's even times, you know, every once in a while I'll still go into this long and he'll just look at me and shake his head and he'll say, You don't need to explain yourself.
• 10:04
  SPEAKER_02: And I just look at him and go, thank you.
• 10:07
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, it's hard.
• 10:09
  SPEAKER_01: It's hard having permission to make our own decisions when, yeah, even when, you know, years ago I can remember trying to get out of things that we didn't want to do as a couple, but for some reason, I always had to provide the excuses how to get out of it.
• 10:26
  SPEAKER_01: Like, I don't think we're going to make it, or we're keeping Christmas small this year.
• 10:31
  SPEAKER_01: There you go.
• 10:32
  SPEAKER_01: I don't really feel like traveling.
• 10:35
  SPEAKER_01: None of those sentences are rude, but I have to admit there is this responsibility for making everyone okay with them.
• 10:43
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 10:44
  SPEAKER_01: Why?
• 10:46
  SPEAKER_01: Why is this?
• 10:49
  SPEAKER_02: I think part of it is again, you know, women are just raised so differently.
• 10:55
  SPEAKER_02: Um, at least I feel for our generation.
• 10:59
  SPEAKER_02: We're praised for being consistent and loyal and dependable.
• 11:05
  SPEAKER_02: And heaven forbid that we put ourselves first and hope that the other person understands and will give us some grace and say, oh no, it's okay.
• 11:16
  SPEAKER_02: You know, I it's okay.
• 11:17
  SPEAKER_02: I get tired too.
• 11:19
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, right.
• 11:20
  SPEAKER_02: I understand if you need a break, it's okay.
• 11:24
  SPEAKER_02: That's what we hope for, right?
• 11:26
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 11:27
  SPEAKER_02: But but I just think it's the programming and and not, and we don't want we don't want somebody to feel bad, you know.
• 11:31
  SPEAKER_02: We we want we want them to be able to depend on us and feel that they can depend on us.
• 11:36
  SPEAKER_02: And you know, any any deviation from constantly being available gives that feeling that, or at least, you know, for me, I could see where that would give the feeling of they're not gonna think I'm dependable anymore.
• 11:48
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, no, I agree.
• 11:50
  SPEAKER_02: Susan, do you do you think a simpler life can mean a fuller one?
• 11:57
  SPEAKER_01: Wow, we've had debate about this question, haven't we?
• 12:00
  SPEAKER_02: Yes, we have.
• 12:02
  SPEAKER_01: First, we must define simpler, yes, and then we must define fuller.
• 12:08
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 12:10
  SPEAKER_01: They don't necessarily mean smaller and bigger.
• 12:15
  SPEAKER_01: Um, I don't know.
• 12:16
  SPEAKER_01: I think a simpler life can be fuller.
• 12:21
  SPEAKER_01: And I think I think a simple life, at least to me, is not living sort of by these standards.
• 12:34
  SPEAKER_01: I think a simpler life is that I get to decide sometimes in conjunction with my husband and sometimes with my children, but I really get to decide on a on a daily basis how I want to spend my time and I what what I want my day to look like.
• 12:53
  SPEAKER_01: And that would that would have been a real privilege back, you know, in the day when um our kids were young.
• 13:00
  SPEAKER_01: We didn't have those privileges.
• 13:02
  SPEAKER_01: Um it was time to be super mom.
• 13:04
  SPEAKER_01: And for me, a fuller life would be having those decisions freely made to decide if I want to travel or if I want to spend time with the grandkids.
• 13:17
  SPEAKER_01: It's it's not having to explain to someone the whys and the hows.
• 13:27
  SPEAKER_01: And I yeah, I think when I'm 65 in October, just tried to apply for Medicare um last week.
• 13:37
  SPEAKER_01: Um I think when you get, at least for me, when you get in your 60s, there is a pause about how much time you have left.
• 13:50
  SPEAKER_01: And I don't want to spend the rest of my life, you know, being the PTO president that I did when I was when I was young.
• 14:00
  SPEAKER_01: I want to savor the time.
• 14:02
  SPEAKER_01: I wanna, as I was telling you, I want to slow down the time.
• 14:07
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know if you feel the same way, Laura.
• 14:10
  SPEAKER_01: How can you explain a full life that you would want?
• 14:18
  SPEAKER_01: And I know you really struggle with moving on to the next thing and the next thing and the next thing.
• 14:26
  SPEAKER_02: No, I do.
• 14:27
  SPEAKER_02: I do.
• 14:28
  SPEAKER_02: And for me, I guess I just really need to take a pause and just sit and think about what truly a simpler life could look like.
• 14:39
  SPEAKER_02: Because to me, quite honestly, I think it's simple and I think a boring.
• 14:42
  SPEAKER_02: I think of not doing anything, I think of not going anywhere, I think of, you know, after dinner, you clean up the kitchen, you turn on the TV, and then you do nothing the rest of the day.
• 14:55
  SPEAKER_02: I want to see things, you know, and I'm getting close to 60.
• 14:59
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, I'm not 60 yet, but but I also do see that my children are getting older and my granddaughter's getting older, and there's memories I want to make and there's things I want to do.
• 15:10
  SPEAKER_02: And so for me, the fullness, I haven't figured out how simple and full can work together.
• 15:20
  SPEAKER_02: I want to do the things, I want to plan the weekend trips, but there's times that you know I really need to stay home on the weekend and just scrub my shower and do my laundry.
• 15:36
  SPEAKER_01: No, I agree, I agree.
• 15:38
  SPEAKER_01: You know, I'm I'm not looking for, you know, uh boredom either.
• 15:42
  SPEAKER_01: I'm looking for choices, and I think you're right.
• 15:45
  SPEAKER_01: I think peace often feels a little suspicious because we have spent decades managing schedules and expectations and family dynamics and everyone else's emotional weather.
• 15:59
  SPEAKER_01: But I, you know, peace could could feel a little uncomfortable, and I think if that's what I hear in you, yeah.
• 16:04
  SPEAKER_01: Um, you know, you're asking, shouldn't I be doing more, helping more, like hosting more, explaining more?
• 16:11
  SPEAKER_01: But the stillness that we have spoken in in the last couple of episodes is a part of that fullness.
• 16:19
  SPEAKER_01: I don't think peace and stillness to be boredom, right?
• 16:25
  SPEAKER_02: I I don't disagree.
• 16:27
  SPEAKER_02: It's just I'm trying to figure out how to reconcile that in my brain because I could definitely use more peace and stillness.
• 16:35
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, God knows.
• 16:36
  SPEAKER_02: Sure.
• 16:37
  SPEAKER_01: Sure, yeah.
• 16:38
  SPEAKER_01: Well, I think for the last several chapters, that's what I think that is owed to us after after being so selfless and being so driven in the many roles that we provided for in our family.
• 16:53
  SPEAKER_01: And I just, yeah.
• 16:55
  SPEAKER_01: Do you think do you think then that is there a fear underneath all of this?
• 17:07
  SPEAKER_01: Is there just being able to say no?
• 17:13
  SPEAKER_01: Just being able to tell someone as you were speaking of that I'm, you know, maybe I'm not the person to depend on today.
• 17:26
  SPEAKER_01: Maybe there's some fear and in will they be disappointed or will they think I've changed?
• 17:33
  SPEAKER_01: Will they think I'm selfish?
• 17:36
  SPEAKER_02: Well, I would say for me, not anymore.
• 17:44
  SPEAKER_02: I would say, I would say when I was in my first marriage, absolutely, absolutely.
• 17:51
  SPEAKER_02: I had societal expectations, familial expectations, all sorts of expectations put on me.
• 17:59
  SPEAKER_02: Um, and now no, I've become very but I will say, I will say it was You're clear about what you want.
• 18:06
  SPEAKER_02: Yes, it's like you and and and I'm and I'm okay with saying my my my compromise has become, you know what, I would love to, but that doesn't work for me.
• 18:19
  SPEAKER_02: I could be available at this time or this day, right, but but that doesn't work for me.
• 18:24
  SPEAKER_02: I'm sorry.
• 18:25
  SPEAKER_02: And that's it, you know, right?
• 18:26
  SPEAKER_02: Um, but but I will say it was very uncomfortable at first, even within a new dynamic, no matter where I was.
• 18:35
  SPEAKER_02: Because, you know, even if it's a new, a new social group, a new familial group, um, a new state with different, you know, societal expectations, and you know, because the area is so much different.
• 18:46
  SPEAKER_02: But yeah, I it was still uncomfortable because it was so much of my life, um, you know, giving, you know, reasons and and and feeling like I had to explain myself.
• 18:59
  SPEAKER_01: Well, and again, as we were getting ready for this, um you said something that really connected with me, and that is taking the opportunity to be brave, to take to sit in that uncomfortable position and realize that it's not that it gets easier, but it becomes a different mindset and it becomes a different way of looking at things.
• 19:31
  SPEAKER_01: And I think, you know, I really value that conversation with you because I've I've intentionally um in these last couple of weeks, you know, tried to put this in in practice.
• 19:46
  SPEAKER_01: And and I just, yeah, I think I'm just finally believing that that, yeah, I should give myself permission and that it's okay to give myself permission and not to carry the guilt.
• 20:02
  SPEAKER_01: It's one thing to say it, the other not to feel the guilt.
• 20:05
  SPEAKER_01: But yeah, yeah, I think sometimes we're not patient with ourselves.
• 20:10
  SPEAKER_01: We've lived one way for decades, we've explained our choices, we've softened our opinions, we've tried to keep everyone comfortable.
• 20:18
  SPEAKER_01: You know, those habits don't disappear overnight, but I think you're absolutely right about one small step, one tiny speck of courage that says that yeah, it's it's your time and it's okay to take it that way.
• 20:36
  SPEAKER_02: No, for sure.
• 20:37
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, it it like I said, it it it feels it feels awkward.
• 20:40
  SPEAKER_02: And it and it and anytime you do something new, it's gonna feel clunky.
• 20:43
  SPEAKER_02: It's not gonna be, you know, eloquent and smooth, it's gonna be clunky and feel weird and it's gonna feel icky um at first.
• 20:52
  SPEAKER_02: But when you get that courage and you put yourself out there and you start creating this space where you have your time is your time, and it's okay without explanation, and you see how other people react to that.
• 21:11
  SPEAKER_02: Now, whatever narrative you had going on up in your head about whether they're gonna not trust you or think less of you, now you have new evidence.
• 21:21
  SPEAKER_02: And in I believe that anytime you go into any area of your life where you're changing something about how you react to something, you it's so important just to get the courage to start taking those steps because you really need that evidence is feedback to be able to solidify these these new, maybe healthier habits.
• 21:45
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 21:46
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 21:47
  SPEAKER_01: Well, let's move into the final section that we wanted to talk about.
• 21:51
  SPEAKER_01: And this I think is is mostly for our listeners to think about, right, Laura?
• 21:57
  SPEAKER_02: Right, right.
• 21:58
  SPEAKER_02: This is where we want you to.
• 22:00
  SPEAKER_02: Be curious.
• 22:01
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 22:02
  SPEAKER_02: So sit in this just a little bit and listen to these and notice how different these sentences might feel to you.
• 22:11
  SPEAKER_02: So next time somebody wants you to do something and you don't want to, think about this works better for me.
• 22:20
  SPEAKER_02: Or I'm not available.
• 22:23
  SPEAKER_02: Or I've decided not to.
• 22:27
  SPEAKER_02: Or I know, right?
• 22:29
  SPEAKER_02: I've decided not to.
• 22:31
  SPEAKER_02: That would be a tough one for me.
• 22:33
  SPEAKER_02: Only because if I've decided not to, that means I already decided to, and now I'm going back.
• 22:38
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 22:38
  SPEAKER_01: So that part, that one I would have to do.
• 22:40
  SPEAKER_01: You're still worrying about what people think.
• 22:42
  SPEAKER_02: I know.
• 22:42
  SPEAKER_02: I know.
• 22:43
  SPEAKER_02: That one, I'm good to just tell people no out of the gate.
• 22:46
  SPEAKER_02: But if I say yes, then that one would be hard.
• 22:49
  SPEAKER_02: Or think about I'm choosing something quieter.
• 22:52
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 22:52
  SPEAKER_02: Or I've changed my mind.
• 22:54
  SPEAKER_02: Who can argue with that?
• 22:56
  SPEAKER_02: Right?
• 22:56
  SPEAKER_02: Well, exactly.
• 22:58
  SPEAKER_02: Uh well, there's people out there.
• 23:00
  SPEAKER_02: We all know them.
• 23:01
  SPEAKER_02: There's people out there.
• 23:02
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 23:03
  SPEAKER_02: You know, just really consider no speeches.
• 23:06
  SPEAKER_02: You don't need to surprise you know, support uh provide any supporting documents.
• 23:10
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 23:11
  SPEAKER_02: Just, you know, these statements calm and honestly.
• 23:15
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 23:16
  SPEAKER_01: Well, I think the other key is to realize that not everyone is going to understand.
• 23:21
  SPEAKER_01: Um, but one of the biggest freedoms of midlife that I'm starting to understand is that their understanding isn't actually required, that people are allowed to wish you made a different choice, but that doesn't automatically make my choice wrong.
• 23:39
  SPEAKER_02: No, exactly, exactly.
• 23:41
  SPEAKER_02: Um, you know, going back to, you know, we've been taught that that consistency is a virtue.
• 23:47
  SPEAKER_02: And one of the things I wanted to bring up was something I learned in reading Maya Angelo's series of autobiographies.
• 23:56
  SPEAKER_02: Um, she said something about, I think it was her grandmother had told her, you know, it's okay to look down the path that you're going and look down the path that you've come up.
• 24:08
  SPEAKER_02: And if you don't like the direction you're headed, it is absolutely okay to cut yourself a new path.
• 24:17
  SPEAKER_02: And I read that book in my mid-30s, I think we'd actually just moved to Colorado.
• 24:25
  SPEAKER_02: Um, I read that book in my mid-30s, and I that that has really stuck with me.
• 24:31
  SPEAKER_02: It it really gives us permission um to uh to be able to to change when we need to.
• 24:39
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, change your mind.
• 24:40
  SPEAKER_01: I have different friendships, different routines, you know, different priorities.
• 24:46
  SPEAKER_01: You're right.
• 24:47
  SPEAKER_01: Changing isn't inconsistency, it's the evidence that life keeps shaping us.
• 24:54
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 24:55
  SPEAKER_01: Right?
• 24:56
  SPEAKER_01: And just imagine, you know, that less emotional labor for one, that you know, those explanations that require all the energy and the justifications that ask us to carry someone else's possible reaction.
• 25:11
  SPEAKER_01: Imagine how much lighter life feels when you stop rehearsing those conversations before they happen.
• 25:19
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, for sure, for sure.
• 25:20
  SPEAKER_02: The the quiet confidence that there's something incredibly peaceful about saying this is what I'm choosing, and just allowing that to be.
• 25:29
  SPEAKER_02: Not because you don't care, but because you've learned that your choices don't become more legitimate, you know, after a lengthy explanation.
• 25:38
  SPEAKER_01: Right, right, right.
• 25:40
  SPEAKER_01: I shall put that on my mirror.
• 25:44
  SPEAKER_01: So our final thought we want you to think about is maybe one of the quiet signs of growing older isn't about becoming louder, maybe it's becoming calmer, not rushing to fill every silence, not trying to convince everyone, not needing applause for ordinary decisions, just quietly, quietly trusting yourself.
• 26:10
  SPEAKER_02: So the next time you catch yourself building a long explanation up in your head for how you're going to tell the person no, pause for a second and ask yourself Am I sharing because I want to, or because I think I have to earn the right to make this choice?
• 26:30
  SPEAKER_02: You actually might discover that your decision was already enough.
• 26:35
  SPEAKER_01: Amen, sister.
• 26:37
  SPEAKER_01: So maybe the switch isn't that we stop caring what people think.
• 26:42
  SPEAKER_01: Maybe it's that we stop making every honest choice pass through a committee first.
• 26:48
  SPEAKER_01: And maybe that's the one of the most peaceful freedoms midlife has to offer.
• 26:53
  SPEAKER_01: There you go.
• 26:55
  SPEAKER_01: So that's our conversation today.
• 26:58
  SPEAKER_02: And we're so glad that you're a part of it.
• 27:00
  SPEAKER_02: Don't forget to subscribe to our podcast on your favorite listening platform.
• 27:05
  SPEAKER_02: And remember, you can find us on all the social medias.
• 27:09
  SPEAKER_02: And you can uh please come to Facebook and join our private Facebook group at Conversations Beyond Borders With You.
• 27:17
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 27:18
  SPEAKER_02: So on next time, take good care of yourself and each other.
• 27:31
  SPEAKER_02: See you next week.