Latest / Wake Up with Miya / Episode 212. Bradshaw Ranch: Bigfoot, UFOs, Portals & Missing Time

Transcript

Episode 212. Bradshaw Ranch: Bigfoot, UFOs, Portals & Missing Time · Wake Up with Miya

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: Something that really caught my attention is the idea that
• 0:03
  Speaker 1: whatever is at that Bradshaw Ranch may actually be aware
• 0:08
  Speaker 1: of the investigators. It seems like it knows you're there,
• 0:12
  Speaker 1: just like the portal. It knew and it kind of
• 0:14
  Speaker 1: opened up when you started and closed up when you left.
• 0:19
  Speaker 1: It kind of felt that way, like there was an
• 0:21
  Speaker 1: intelligence behind those experiences. It's like the synchronicities.
• 0:26
  Speaker 2: Yeah, Colonel John Edwards Under did the first big investigation
• 0:30
  Speaker 2: of Locker Ranch and the big old ranch. I did
• 0:36
  Speaker 2: an interview with him, and he thinks, he says for sure,
• 0:40
  Speaker 2: whatever the presence is, it's precognitive. It knows it's going
• 0:45
  Speaker 2: to happen before it happens, in a certain sense. And therefore,
• 0:48
  Speaker 2: it shapes the experience. And Skidlocker Ranch just moves with
• 0:52
  Speaker 2: all their equipment on. Nothing ever works out there. Never
• 0:55
  Speaker 2: had a problem with anything ever not working. They poked
• 0:58
  Speaker 2: a bear, I had night contact. It's a whole different approach.
• 1:08
  Speaker 1: What if there are places where the lines between our
• 1:12
  Speaker 1: world and something else becomes a little thinner? A place
• 1:17
  Speaker 1: where UFOs, Bigfoot, strange entities, missing times, and even possible
• 1:22
  Speaker 1: portals have been reported in this same location. Today, we're
• 1:27
  Speaker 1: taking a closer look at Bradshaw Ranch near Sedona, Arizona,
• 1:31
  Speaker 1: a place often compared to Skinwalker Ranch, known for decades
• 1:36
  Speaker 1: of high strangeness. My guests today are Ron Meyer and
• 1:41
  Speaker 1: Mark Reeder, co-authors of The High Strangeness of Bradshaw Ranch.
• 1:47
  Speaker 1: Ron was part of the team that investigated the property.
• 1:52
  Speaker 1: What they experienced and documented raised an even bigger question.
• 1:56
  Speaker 1: Are all these strange phenomenon really separate or could they
• 2:01
  Speaker 1: be somehow connected? Aloha guys and welcome to another show.
• 2:06
  Speaker 1: Before we get started, make sure you follow, subscribe and
• 2:10
  Speaker 1: hit that notification bell so you never miss any new episodes.
• 2:14
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• 2:17
  Speaker 1: leave a positive review on Apple Podcasts. It really does
• 2:21
  Speaker 1: help more people find this show. And for those of
• 2:24
  Speaker 1: you who want to go even deeper, you can join
• 2:27
  Speaker 1: me on the plus side through Patreon or YouTube memberships
• 2:31
  Speaker 1: for extended and exclusive conversations. You'll find the link in
• 2:36
  Speaker 1: the show notes below. Now, let's get into the high
• 2:40
  Speaker 1: strangeness of Bradshaw Ranch. Enjoy the show. Aloha and welcome
• 2:45
  Speaker 1: to the show. Ron and Mark, I'm really looking forward
• 2:48
  Speaker 1: to this conversation. Bradshaw Ranch is fascinating because we're not
• 2:54
  Speaker 1: just talking about one unexplained phenomenon. You've got UFOs and
• 3:00
  Speaker 1: Bigfoot and possible portals and strange entities and time anomalies
• 3:06
  Speaker 1: and so much more. So before we get into all
• 3:09
  Speaker 1: of that, I'd love for everyone to get to know
• 3:12
  Speaker 1: both of you a little bit better. Ron, let's start
• 3:14
  Speaker 1: with you. You had a long career in film before
• 3:19
  Speaker 1: the paranormal research. So what happened that took you from
• 3:24
  Speaker 1: filmmaking into investigating Bigfoot, UFO, and the unexplained?
• 3:29
  Speaker 2: Well, Ron, it was a company that I did a
• 3:33
  Speaker 2: lot of work for, particularly on.
• 3:36
  Speaker 2: Serial killers, you know, and back in the days of
• 3:40
  Speaker 2: DVDs and then into streaming, they hired me to do
• 3:45
  Speaker 2: a documentary series on Bigfoot because it was hot. That's
• 3:52
  Speaker 2: how I got into it. My daughters, I was debating,
• 3:56
  Speaker 2: do I want to do this or do I want
• 3:57
  Speaker 2: to do it? She was working for me at the time.
• 4:00
  Speaker 2: She's much more into this sort of stuff. And she says, yeah,
• 4:05
  Speaker 2: I'll help you. You got to do this. It eventually
• 4:08
  Speaker 2: evolved into her meeting somebody and they got married. So
• 4:13
  Speaker 2: that's what happens when you start doing Bigfoot stuff. That
• 4:19
  Speaker 2: was 10 years ago. Wow. Before that, I had pretty
• 4:23
  Speaker 2: much followed a typical contemplative Eastern spiritual path. In a
• 4:30
  Speaker 2: certain sense, I did practice any one thing, but I
• 4:33
  Speaker 2: investigated them all because I could because I'm a filmmaker.
• 4:37
  Speaker 2: But getting into these contact experiences was a change. And
• 4:45
  Speaker 2: eventually it led to the stuff that I'm doing now,
• 4:48
  Speaker 2: which arose in a way that there's something similar to
• 4:53
  Speaker 2: these contact experiences in the way they affect people's lives,
• 4:57
  Speaker 2: just as a mystical experience. On the other side, it
• 5:00
  Speaker 2: affects people. We have a sense of oneness with God
• 5:03
  Speaker 2: or the divine self. My goal is eventually, how is
• 5:09
  Speaker 2: that possible and how do they relate together? And is
• 5:11
  Speaker 2: there one way we can assume of under a kind of,
• 5:15
  Speaker 2: at least a hypothesis we can explore and test? Awesome.
• 5:20
  Speaker 1: That's great. Mark, what about you? What's your background and
• 5:23
  Speaker 1: what drew you into these subjects? And how did you
• 5:26
  Speaker 1: and Ron eventually begin working together?
• 5:29
  Speaker 3: Well, Ron and I had been working together for a
• 5:31
  Speaker 3: number of years before he started the Bigfoot project. I
• 5:34
  Speaker 3: worked for his company, Center Communications, as a researcher, writer,
• 5:39
  Speaker 3: and occasional producer of educational videos for him. And we
• 5:45
  Speaker 3: also started writing novels together. We found out that we
• 5:49
  Speaker 3: had compatible abilities as writers, and Ron was and continues
• 5:57
  Speaker 3: to be a fountain incredibly interesting plots. And I love
• 6:02
  Speaker 3: writing characters and describing scenes, so we meshed very.
• 6:08
  Speaker 4: Well that way.
• 6:09
  Speaker 3: So about six years ago, after he had done his
• 6:13
  Speaker 3: first film, he also did a film called The Alien
• 6:19
  Speaker 3: Bigfoot Connection Revealed.
• 6:22
  Speaker 4: There was a lot in that movie that It couldn't
• 6:29
  Speaker 4: be presented because it would have made.
• 6:30
  Speaker 3: The documentary very, very long.
• 6:33
  Speaker 4: So he wanted to write a companion book to it.
• 6:37
  Speaker 3: Since we had written a lot of novels together and
• 6:39
  Speaker 3: I had worked for his company, he asked me to
• 6:42
  Speaker 3: help him. Now, I was at the time a skeptic.
• 6:45
  Speaker 3: If you had told me that somebody was a Bigfoot believer,
• 6:48
  Speaker 3: I would have said, well, you know, hand me some
• 6:52
  Speaker 3: of the stuff they're smoking because I think that must
• 6:54
  Speaker 3: be pretty good shit. But Ron was serious about it.
• 6:59
  Speaker 3: And he explained to me, and I immediately saw what
• 7:03
  Speaker 3: he was talking about, explained to me, these people have
• 7:07
  Speaker 3: these experiences and they have profound effects on them. I
• 7:11
  Speaker 3: want to write about that in the book. I want
• 7:12
  Speaker 3: to write about these different paranormal hotspots that we visited.
• 7:17
  Speaker 3: And I'd like your input, not only as a skeptic,
• 7:21
  Speaker 3: but as a person seeing this stuff for the first time.
• 7:25
  Speaker 4: What we're working on. And as he and I.
• 7:32
  Speaker 3: Approached the book and we outlined how he wanted things
• 7:35
  Speaker 3: to be written and where he wanted my input as
• 7:39
  Speaker 3: a historian, I was trained as a historian at the
• 7:41
  Speaker 3: University of Cincinnati. And I began to understand that the
• 7:51
  Speaker 3: paranormal is not what science.
• 7:57
  Speaker 4: Portrays it as.
• 7:59
  Speaker 3: If you go on Wikipedia, for example, Wikipedia just downplays
• 8:03
  Speaker 3: the paranormal a lot. And I was a big Wikipedia fan.
• 8:10
  Speaker 3: But as we went into this subject and Ron showed
• 8:17
  Speaker 3: me the interviews with people and what he was working on,
• 8:21
  Speaker 3: I began to realize that These paranormal experiences are a
• 8:25
  Speaker 3: huge impact, not only on individuals, but on our community
• 8:31
  Speaker 3: as the individual stories spread. And they're easily, now because
• 8:36
  Speaker 3: of the internet, these people know that they're not alone
• 8:39
  Speaker 3: in their experiences. There are others that have similar, if
• 8:43
  Speaker 3: not the exact same experience, such as running into a
• 8:47
  Speaker 3: Bigfoot or having seen a UAP or UFO, depending upon
• 8:52
  Speaker 3: which term you want to use. And so my skepticism
• 8:57
  Speaker 3: began to be tempered by the idea that I'm not
• 9:02
  Speaker 3: always right. And I think that's a real blind spot
• 9:05
  Speaker 3: in skeptics. They always think they're right and that their
• 9:09
  Speaker 3: skeptical view is the only one that's acceptable. So I
• 9:13
  Speaker 3: began at that point in my life, I was about
• 9:15
  Speaker 3: 70 years of age, and I began at that point
• 9:18
  Speaker 3: in my life to shed a persona that I'd had
• 9:21
  Speaker 3: for a very long time in search of one, for
• 9:26
  Speaker 3: one that was more searching for what was out there
• 9:30
  Speaker 3: instead of thinking I already knew the truth.
• 9:32
  Speaker 1: Wow, that's great. Wow, that's great that you're so open-minded
• 9:36
  Speaker 1: though and changed. But you did. So that's amazing. That's
• 9:42
  Speaker 1: really amazing.
• 9:43
  Speaker 4: Yes.
• 9:44
  Speaker 1: Now, before we get into what happened at Bradshaw Ranch,
• 9:49
  Speaker 1: For someone who's never heard of Bradshaw Ranch, what is
• 9:53
  Speaker 1: this place and why has it developed such a reputation
• 9:57
  Speaker 1: for high strangeness?
• 10:00
  Speaker 2: Well, do you know Skinwalker Ranch? Yes. Probably everybody knows
• 10:04
  Speaker 2: about Skinwalker Ranch. Three weeks before we did our first investigation,
• 10:12
  Speaker 2: Brandon Fugel, you know who he is? The owner of
• 10:15
  Speaker 2: Skinwalker Ranch?
• 10:16
  Speaker 1: Oh, okay, yes.
• 10:18
  Speaker 2: He's a Mormon and lives in Utah. He tried to
• 10:23
  Speaker 2: buy Bradshaw Ranch because it was going to be the next,
• 10:28
  Speaker 2: it was going to be, I guess he thought it was,
• 10:31
  Speaker 2: the next Skinwalker Ranch. And so he either was interested
• 10:36
  Speaker 2: in it because of the technology that might be there
• 10:39
  Speaker 2: or because he thought it was a good business opportunity,
• 10:42
  Speaker 2: one or the other. But anyhow, turns out that we
• 10:45
  Speaker 2: own it. You, me, and Mark belongs to the U.S. government.
• 10:50
  Speaker 2: And by the Energy Department, supposedly studying the effects of
• 10:57
  Speaker 2: climate change on native vegetation. Now, that's absurd. But they
• 11:03
  Speaker 2: bought it, turned it to Sanche. And what they were
• 11:07
  Speaker 2: buying was a fairly large old ranch. This is in
• 11:13
  Speaker 2: the southwest. And so, you know, you don't grow corn, beans,
• 11:17
  Speaker 2: and the usual agricultural stuff. It was a cattle ranch,
• 11:23
  Speaker 2: and it turned into a movie scene. And like Skinwalker Ranch,
• 11:28
  Speaker 2: there was an original building that's been preserved that was
• 11:33
  Speaker 2: from the original homesteaders. So that was back in the
• 11:35
  Speaker 2: day when you could do the homestead act, get a
• 11:39
  Speaker 2: piece of land. And they built an adobe house because
• 11:42
  Speaker 2: in the Southwest, adobe houses make more sense than wood-framed
• 11:47
  Speaker 2: buildings because, you know, it's in the desert. And the
• 11:54
  Speaker 2: property became quite successful as a movie set for Westerns
• 12:01
  Speaker 2: back in the 60s and 70s when they were shooting,
• 12:06
  Speaker 2: when John Wayne was making Cold War movies and Elvis Presley.
• 12:09
  Speaker 2: So it's got a long history there. It was then
• 12:11
  Speaker 2: turned into sort of a dude ranch. by the Bradshaws, father, son.
• 12:21
  Speaker 2: And in the 90s, Linda Bradshaw, which was the wife
• 12:25
  Speaker 2: of the last Bradshaw man, developed a good friendship with
• 12:31
  Speaker 2: Tom Donville, who was a long-time paranormal investigator. And they
• 12:36
  Speaker 2: started having all these experiences, Bigfoot, lots of weird traps, portals, UAPs.
• 12:48
  Speaker 2: I think a lot of them were about to get
• 12:50
  Speaker 2: back scattered, but some stuff they were pretty darn good.
• 12:53
  Speaker 2: They wrote books on it, and it got famous that
• 12:57
  Speaker 2: way by the fact that they wrote books on it.
• 13:00
  Speaker 2: Then the government came in. This was in the 90s.
• 13:03
  Speaker 2: At the turn of the century, the government bought it. Now,
• 13:08
  Speaker 2: the way you get into it, it's fenced off. is
• 13:12
  Speaker 2: that there's this place that's been created where you lift
• 13:14
  Speaker 2: up the fence, crawl underneath, and go on in. Although
• 13:18
  Speaker 2: one time when we were there, the gate was wide open,
• 13:21
  Speaker 2: so we could just drive in. It was wonderful. It
• 13:23
  Speaker 2: was the last day we did any research and filming
• 13:26
  Speaker 2: out there. Up until earlier this March or April, we
• 13:33
  Speaker 2: were out there adjacent to Sedona, which is a very
• 13:39
  Speaker 2: sacred place. because of the vortexes and spectacular scenery. And
• 13:45
  Speaker 2: so when you enter there, the first thing you encounter
• 13:48
  Speaker 2: is the Dolby House. Off to the right is a
• 13:50
  Speaker 2: wood mill. They had to pump their own water. And
• 13:53
  Speaker 2: then on the left is the original house that served
• 13:57
  Speaker 2: many purposes, including stages for West Kingdom fights and all
• 14:00
  Speaker 2: that sort of stuff. And then as you go back,
• 14:03
  Speaker 2: you see it's pretty much all devoted to the cattle
• 14:06
  Speaker 2: and horses they had to to be part of the
• 14:10
  Speaker 2: dude ranch for cowboys riding horses. So that's kind of
• 14:14
  Speaker 2: the layout. Wow.
• 14:18
  Speaker 1: And how far is this from Sedona?
• 14:24
  Speaker 2: As the Raven flies, I would say six miles.
• 14:29
  Speaker 1: Really? That close?
• 14:30
  Speaker 4: Wow.
• 14:32
  Speaker 2: Driving there, it's a little different, you know, because it's very,
• 14:36
  Speaker 2: the topography is very modest. And so we'd drive on
• 14:40
  Speaker 2: a main highway and then get off on a gravel
• 14:43
  Speaker 2: road and drive for a half hour to get to
• 14:47
  Speaker 2: the gate.
• 14:48
  Speaker 1: Wow. And how did you guys bump into it, though?
• 14:51
  Speaker 1: You just heard about it through all the books and things?
• 14:56
  Speaker 2: No, it's a long story of synchronicity.
• 14:59
  Speaker 1: Oh, I see. Now, your original plan.
• 15:04
  Speaker 3: Go ahead. One thing to remember about that area in
• 15:09
  Speaker 3: the desert southwest is it is a particularly strong power spot.
• 15:17
  Speaker 3: Sedona is known for its vortexes. The area around it
• 15:23
  Speaker 3: was considered a spiritual, mystical place by the original inhabitants.
• 15:28
  Speaker 3: The literally told future generations about their experiences by putting
• 15:38
  Speaker 3: petroglyphs on the rock walls, pictures of UFOs, pictures of
• 15:45
  Speaker 3: spirals that also mimic Egyptian spirals that mean portals, pictures
• 15:51
  Speaker 3: of a Bigfoot. These are all images that the original
• 15:55
  Speaker 3: inhabitants saw, experienced while they were there. And this power
• 15:59
  Speaker 3: spot is similar to other power spots around the world,
• 16:02
  Speaker 3: such as Ayers Rock in Australia, Mount Shasta in California.
• 16:12
  Speaker 4: And.
• 16:14
  Speaker 3: Mauna Loa in Hawaii is also considered, I believe, to
• 16:18
  Speaker 3: be a very spiritual, mystical spot. So these places are
• 16:24
  Speaker 3: all around the world, and people are drawn to them.
• 16:29
  Speaker 3: And the synchronicities that Ron could tell you about were
• 16:33
  Speaker 3: literally events drawing him to Bradshaw Ranch as if the
• 16:38
  Speaker 3: ranch wanted someone to say, tell others about this story.
• 16:45
  Speaker 2: Wow. I wish you did. I was invited to tell
• 16:50
  Speaker 2: the story. So, I've talked about this so many times,
• 16:53
  Speaker 2: but I'll keep it short, okay? So, um, We were
• 16:59
  Speaker 2: doing a follow-up to the Bigfoot Alien Connection reveal. And
• 17:03
  Speaker 2: I wanted to do an investigation of some sort, which
• 17:05
  Speaker 2: is the way we ended the movie. And I was
• 17:09
  Speaker 2: going to do it in Ohio with the Bigfoot area.
• 17:12
  Speaker 2: But the people who are going to be our hosts,
• 17:13
  Speaker 2: you can't come out. It's deer hunting season. And you'll
• 17:18
  Speaker 2: probably get shot if you're running around in the woods here.
• 17:20
  Speaker 2: So I needed to find another place in a big hurry.
• 17:25
  Speaker 2: And the morning after that, learning that information, the first
• 17:30
  Speaker 2: thing on my news feed was an article on the
• 17:35
  Speaker 2: mysteries of Sedona. So I thought, well, I'll take that seriously.
• 17:40
  Speaker 2: And through, let me see, one, two, three, four, five connections,
• 17:47
  Speaker 2: starting with some psychic in Sedona who put me in
• 17:54
  Speaker 2: touch with somebody who had visited Bradshaw Ranch and kind
• 18:01
  Speaker 2: of knew the area of Colorado where I was from.
• 18:05
  Speaker 2: And within one day, through a sequence of people, I
• 18:11
  Speaker 2: was calling a person. Remember I mentioned Tom Donkel, who
• 18:16
  Speaker 2: had written a number of these books with Linda Bradshaw?
• 18:20
  Speaker 2: He's got a mentor called Uru Paul or or his
• 18:24
  Speaker 2: last name is really Hess, and he's mentoring him, and
• 18:28
  Speaker 2: he had been going out to the ranch for quite
• 18:31
  Speaker 2: a while, and I think he would be a good
• 18:34
  Speaker 2: guide for us to do our filming and introduce us
• 18:37
  Speaker 2: to the ranch. And here's the interesting thing. When I
• 18:41
  Speaker 2: was talking to him on my cell phone, all of
• 18:44
  Speaker 2: a sudden they seemed to take control of our cell
• 18:47
  Speaker 2: phones and started showing me a picture of myself, you know, video,
• 18:53
  Speaker 2: And Hasak had the same experience, except it was himself.
• 18:57
  Speaker 2: So we thought, well, that's a damn good sign. Something
• 19:01
  Speaker 2: knows we're coming. There's some presence that knows that it
• 19:04
  Speaker 2: wants us to get out there and tell the story.
• 19:07
  Speaker 2: So that's how we got out there. And so within,
• 19:10
  Speaker 2: I would say, three weeks, we were out there doing
• 19:13
  Speaker 2: our first investigation. Wow.
• 19:17
  Speaker 1: Now, your original plan was only to spend only a
• 19:20
  Speaker 1: day or a night or so there?
• 19:22
  Speaker 2: You're supposed to be, you know, like the ending to
• 19:26
  Speaker 2: another movie, which would be about probably 10 minutes. Be
• 19:32
  Speaker 2: about the right amount of time for that. But so
• 19:36
  Speaker 2: many things happened that first trip that we knew we
• 19:40
  Speaker 2: had to come back and make a whole full movie.
• 19:42
  Speaker 2: We're being told all these things in this kind of
• 19:45
  Speaker 2: mystical way. Wow.
• 19:48
  Speaker 1: So one of the strangest... experiences in the book happens
• 19:53
  Speaker 1: before you even reach the ranch that night. You described
• 19:56
  Speaker 1: getting lost for what seemed nearly an hour, yet somehow
• 20:01
  Speaker 1: arriving at the ranch on time.
• 20:02
  Speaker 2: Yeah, typical times. The time slip. So... It was a
• 20:09
  Speaker 2: half hour, by the way. So I told you earlier
• 20:12
  Speaker 2: that we knew that it took, once we left the
• 20:15
  Speaker 2: main highway, it took 30 minutes to get to the ranch.
• 20:18
  Speaker 2: And we had done that before. We knew that was true.
• 20:21
  Speaker 2: So I called Tom Doggo and said, we're going to
• 20:24
  Speaker 2: go out there. What time should we be there? He said,
• 20:25
  Speaker 2: be there at 7. So he was the man, so
• 20:28
  Speaker 2: why not? So we met Rudul in the parking lot.
• 20:33
  Speaker 2: And he was in another car. He came and joined
• 20:35
  Speaker 2: us in our big SUV. to go to Bradshaw, and
• 20:40
  Speaker 2: it was 6.30, so we knew we'd get there at 7.
• 20:44
  Speaker 2: But as we began driving, and the way you get
• 20:46
  Speaker 2: there is you just stay straight. Don't go left, don't
• 20:49
  Speaker 2: go right, and you'll end up in the right place.
• 20:52
  Speaker 2: But all of a sudden, it was dark by now,
• 20:55
  Speaker 2: and we were seeing things we shouldn't see, things that
• 20:59
  Speaker 2: we had seen many times, had gone there so many
• 21:04
  Speaker 2: times at night, They were building structures. Everything was kind
• 21:08
  Speaker 2: of distorted and really weird. And everybody was having that experience.
• 21:13
  Speaker 2: It's similar to one where I had an auto body
• 21:15
  Speaker 2: experience where I got out of my flying in bed
• 21:18
  Speaker 2: and got on, moved around, did some shit. And we
• 21:24
  Speaker 2: all knew it wasn't good. Eventually we can clean. We
• 21:28
  Speaker 2: almost drove off a ledge. And then remarkably, we were
• 21:35
  Speaker 2: on the road. And we arrived at 7 o'clock precisely.
• 21:38
  Speaker 2: But we had a very sophisticated GPS system. And you
• 21:42
  Speaker 2: could see on that that we were squiggling around on that.
• 21:45
  Speaker 1: Wow.
• 21:49
  Speaker 2: So I got an extra half hour of life.
• 21:54
  Speaker 4: But a scary extra half hour of life.
• 21:56
  Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly. Yeah. Did you experience any of that.
• 22:01
  Speaker 2: There, Mark?
• 22:03
  Speaker 3: I was not on any of the Bradshaw expeditions. When
• 22:07
  Speaker 3: Ron recruited me to help him write the three books
• 22:10
  Speaker 3: now that we've done on paranormal experiences, I had decided
• 22:14
  Speaker 3: that as a historian, I would step back to keep
• 22:18
  Speaker 3: a certain objectivity to what he was doing. And that
• 22:22
  Speaker 3: served me very well in terms of being able to
• 22:25
  Speaker 3: ask Ron questions about what was going on and also
• 22:29
  Speaker 3: to look at what happened with fresh eyes instead of
• 22:36
  Speaker 3: having been immersed in it. So, no, I did not
• 22:41
  Speaker 3: attend any of the research things that.
• 22:44
  Speaker 4: Ron was doing.
• 22:45
  Speaker 1: But as a historian, did you find a lot of historical,
• 22:49
  Speaker 1: I guess, evidence from Native Americans that lived there before?
• 22:55
  Speaker 1: I know you mentioned there were some petroglyphs on the
• 22:58
  Speaker 1: walls and things.
• 23:00
  Speaker 4: Well, the Sinaloa Indians.
• 23:02
  Speaker 3: basically from about 600 A.D. to 1400 A.D., occupied that area.
• 23:09
  Speaker 3: And unfortunately, the historical evidence is pretty much limited to
• 23:16
  Speaker 3: those petroglyphs, though we talked later with a Santee shaman.
• 23:22
  Speaker 2: Well, Mark, there's a lot of structures where they lived,
• 23:24
  Speaker 2: but just like Yanisazi.
• 23:26
  Speaker 3: Well, yeah, there are structures, but I'm talking about in
• 23:29
  Speaker 3: terms of the.
• 23:33
  Speaker 3: Mystical, spiritual aspects of the area. But we later talked
• 23:39
  Speaker 3: to a Santi shaman, a man named Jim White, and
• 23:44
  Speaker 3: we showed him these petroglyphs, and he was quite illuminating
• 23:49
  Speaker 3: in talking to us about how these images really project
• 23:56
  Speaker 3: a connection to a world beyond our own And so
• 24:05
  Speaker 3: that helped us in understanding how to write the book
• 24:09
  Speaker 3: that followed the documentary.
• 24:12
  Speaker 2: Wow.
• 24:14
  Speaker 1: There's an area I believe you eventually named the space
• 24:18
  Speaker 1: of high strangeness where people reported becoming dizzy or nauseated
• 24:23
  Speaker 1: or feeling intense energy. and your equipment later registered unusual
• 24:28
  Speaker 1: magnetic activity. What do you believe actually happened in that
• 24:32
  Speaker 1: particular spot?
• 24:36
  Speaker 2: Well, everybody calls it the portal. It's been there a
• 24:42
  Speaker 2: long time. Who knew? Melinda Leslie, who's spent a lot
• 24:47
  Speaker 2: of time there, Tom Donald. Everybody who's been out there
• 24:51
  Speaker 2: knows where it is. It seems to be somewhat of
• 24:54
  Speaker 2: a permanent feature. It's not always there. When it is there,
• 24:59
  Speaker 2: it's in the same spot. Does that make sense to you?
• 25:04
  Speaker 2: What I'm saying?
• 25:05
  Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah. Was there historical things? I guess I know
• 25:12
  Speaker 1: you said the petroglyphs had the swirls, the circles, and
• 25:17
  Speaker 1: they also probably experienced some kind of portal as well
• 25:20
  Speaker 1: over there.
• 25:22
  Speaker 4: Absolutely.
• 25:25
  Speaker 1: Do you think that's something with your historical background that
• 25:28
  Speaker 1: they created or something that was always there?
• 25:35
  Speaker 3: That's been an interesting debate, or not debate, but a
• 25:38
  Speaker 3: discussion that Ron and I have been having recently that
• 25:42
  Speaker 3: leads into something that Jacques Vallée, ufologist and brilliant thinker, uh,
• 25:55
  Speaker 3: talks about in terms of the, uh, what he calls
• 25:59
  Speaker 3: the control system hypothesis, an idea that there has been
• 26:03
  Speaker 3: a presence, uh, uh, subtly, uh, influencing, guiding humanity for
• 26:08
  Speaker 3: the last 50,000 years or so. Um, and the discussion
• 26:13
  Speaker 3: that Ron and I have been having goes around whether
• 26:17
  Speaker 3: that presence is an external presence or an internal presence. My, uh, my,
• 26:24
  Speaker 3: personal feeling is that it is not external, it's that
• 26:27
  Speaker 3: it is internal, that this presence is something that is
• 26:30
  Speaker 3: within all of us and can manifest itself at any time.
• 26:35
  Speaker 4: So if we go back to Bradshaw Ranch and.
• 26:38
  Speaker 3: The Sanahua Indians, you see the buildings that they lived in,
• 26:43
  Speaker 3: very similar to the Anasazi buildings.
• 26:46
  Speaker 4: The places had.
• 26:53
  Speaker 3: Like a well-like type structure that was a way of,
• 26:58
  Speaker 3: was itself.
• 26:58
  Speaker 4: Like a physical portal to enter another realm.
• 27:04
  Speaker 3: So, yeah, I honestly believe from the structures there and
• 27:12
  Speaker 3: what they then later recorded in the petroglyphs that they
• 27:16
  Speaker 3: definitely had a way of connecting to, I don't want
• 27:25
  Speaker 3: to say another reality, that's such a loaded term, another
• 27:29
  Speaker 3: way of experiencing.
• 27:33
  Speaker 4: What was going on around them through different eyes.
• 27:37
  Speaker 1: Yeah, makes sense. You also captured a translucent triangular shape
• 27:44
  Speaker 1: over that area on a trail camera. followed by what
• 27:49
  Speaker 1: appear to be, I guess, hundreds of objects or orbs
• 27:52
  Speaker 1: all around it. Can you talk about that? Yeah, that
• 27:58
  Speaker 1: was pretty cool.
• 28:00
  Speaker 2: So we didn't, you know, because, you know, I was
• 28:04
  Speaker 2: using a trail cam, which projects infrared, so you only
• 28:08
  Speaker 2: get images at night. But because, you know, we can,
• 28:12
  Speaker 2: we have a skinwalker ranch where we have a command
• 28:15
  Speaker 2: center and all that can add a lot, We got
• 28:18
  Speaker 2: to bring what we captured on film back and then
• 28:20
  Speaker 2: look at, download it, put it on the computer and
• 28:23
  Speaker 2: look at it. So we didn't know we captured any
• 28:25
  Speaker 2: of that until we got back into the Boulder area
• 28:28
  Speaker 2: and what we captured. And that pyramid structure and the
• 28:37
  Speaker 2: potential or whatever they were, was right in the beginning.
• 28:43
  Speaker 2: And then for the next three nights, Nothing else that
• 28:49
  Speaker 2: was shown. I mean, the pyramid was always there, but
• 28:52
  Speaker 2: nothing ever came like the orbs. And then basically the
• 28:56
  Speaker 2: last image before we left was them going back, the orbs.
• 29:02
  Speaker 2: So they all showed up twice. Wow. Once in the end. Like, hi,
• 29:06
  Speaker 2: how are you? I'm right here. And we'll have some
• 29:10
  Speaker 2: fun with you. And now that you're leaving, we're leaving too.
• 29:14
  Speaker 2: I don't know.
• 29:16
  Speaker 4: I like the word only. They only appeared twice.
• 29:19
  Speaker 2: Yes.
• 29:20
  Speaker 4: They only appeared twice.
• 29:22
  Speaker 3: Actually, something like that affects people. Whether you see it
• 29:27
  Speaker 3: or not, things like that do affect people. The effect
• 29:33
  Speaker 3: is much more profound when we viscerally feel it or
• 29:37
  Speaker 3: see it in person than on film.
• 29:38
  Speaker 1: Yes.
• 29:40
  Speaker 3: Watching that triangle and the orbs coming out of it,
• 29:46
  Speaker 3: I'm like, wow, how does that happen? As I mentioned
• 29:50
  Speaker 3: at the top of the show, I started this whole
• 29:54
  Speaker 3: thing with Ron as a skeptic. And I'm looking at
• 29:57
  Speaker 3: this saying, How do you explain that? How does science
• 30:00
  Speaker 3: explain that? Even the idea of, we talk about this
• 30:04
  Speaker 3: in the alien connection revisited, we talk about Einstein-Rosen bridges,
• 30:12
  Speaker 3: which propose that there are magnetic portals which information can
• 30:18
  Speaker 3: come out of.
• 30:19
  Speaker 4: So even if we.
• 30:20
  Speaker 3: Try to use that sort of modern science technique to
• 30:25
  Speaker 3: look at this, it doesn't quite capture What is happening
• 30:29
  Speaker 3: with this portal appearing, orbs by the hundreds coming out
• 30:34
  Speaker 3: of it, and then orbs by the hundreds returning back
• 30:36
  Speaker 3: into it? So my feeling is that while the scientific
• 30:43
  Speaker 3: method is a great method of looking at things, it
• 30:45
  Speaker 3: needs to look at this and not just have scientists
• 30:48
  Speaker 3: put these paranormal experiences into a box and say, well,
• 30:51
  Speaker 3: we can't explain them, so they're not important.
• 30:54
  Speaker 4: No, this is really important.
• 30:56
  Speaker 3: This is something that is happening, being experienced by people
• 30:58
  Speaker 3: all around the world. And in the 21st century with
• 31:02
  Speaker 3: 8 billion people on the planet, there are more of
• 31:04
  Speaker 3: these experiences than ever.
• 31:06
  Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly. And I think if I remember correctly on
• 31:10
  Speaker 1: a documentary, there was a lot of tall grasses and
• 31:14
  Speaker 1: they weren't moving. So it wasn't like a wind was
• 31:17
  Speaker 1: blowing a bunch of dust or a bunch of bugs
• 31:19
  Speaker 1: or anything like that. It was just the orbs that
• 31:22
  Speaker 1: you could see coming out.
• 31:23
  Speaker 2: And they didn't notice what you just saw cause we
• 31:27
  Speaker 2: didn't buy a key. We're not sure other people would
• 31:30
  Speaker 2: have a keen enough eye because they was, they all
• 31:32
  Speaker 2: big guess the wind kicked in at the end. But no,
• 31:36
  Speaker 2: not true.
• 31:37
  Speaker 1: Exactly. Yeah. That was fascinating catch there. That was really cool. Um,
• 31:43
  Speaker 1: Bigfoot is another major part of this story. Um, I think, um,
• 31:48
  Speaker 1: was it Allen that described seeing a Bigfoot like figure?
• 31:53
  Speaker 1: Outside of the Adobe's homestead?
• 31:56
  Speaker 2: Yes, he did.
• 31:57
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 31:58
  Speaker 2: Yeah. Stupidly, we filmed him because he was in this
• 32:05
  Speaker 2: Alder State looking at it, you know. We could see
• 32:08
  Speaker 2: that something was going on with him because he was
• 32:10
  Speaker 2: just staring, you know, like in a way that usually
• 32:14
  Speaker 2: is with that. This is my son-in-law who married my daughter.
• 32:18
  Speaker 2: So we filmed him, not what he was looking at.
• 32:22
  Speaker 2: How's that for a bigfoot? He had been a bigfooter
• 32:31
  Speaker 2: part of the BFO for 15 years. He led bigfoot
• 32:36
  Speaker 2: hikes and all that stuff already. He always had the
• 32:41
  Speaker 2: kind of experience where you're almost catching, you know, they
• 32:44
  Speaker 2: throw something and you smell something, you hear a word now.
• 32:48
  Speaker 2: All these things associated with the behavior of a bigfoot
• 32:51
  Speaker 2: which you never really get a good picture of them
• 32:54
  Speaker 2: with a trail cam or otherwise. They're really elusive in
• 32:57
  Speaker 2: that way. And so there he was seeing the darn thing.
• 33:03
  Speaker 2: Called Big Gal. The people who like Udo and Melinda Leslie,
• 33:13
  Speaker 2: Tom Donnell. They all call her Big Gal because of
• 33:16
  Speaker 2: the feeling, I guess, with boobs. And so it's a
• 33:20
  Speaker 2: well-known Bigfoot that hangs out there. A lot of tracks.
• 33:23
  Speaker 2: It could really be big. A lot of weird tracks.
• 33:26
  Speaker 2: Big birds. I don't know. Dinosaurs, they say. And, of course,
• 33:32
  Speaker 2: you get fresh ones because the saddle was very loose. Yeah,
• 33:37
  Speaker 2: it's full of tracks. It's amazing. Plus some heavy, you know,
• 33:41
  Speaker 2: kind of might be military vehicles that have been there
• 33:47
  Speaker 2: for sure. So at the track heaven, if you were
• 33:51
  Speaker 2: to go out there and just Take pictures of tracks
• 33:53
  Speaker 2: in the dirt. It's a great place to go. Wow.
• 33:58
  Speaker 1: So did he physically, was it physically there or was
• 34:03
  Speaker 1: it something that was spiritual that he saw?
• 34:07
  Speaker 2: It was physical for him. Wow.
• 34:10
  Speaker 1: That's crazy.
• 34:11
  Speaker 2: Udo had taken a picture of it. He had seen it.
• 34:14
  Speaker 2: And he showed it to Alan Nettleton that didn't exactly
• 34:18
  Speaker 2: what I saw.
• 34:18
  Speaker 1: Wow.
• 34:22
  Speaker 2: If you watch the movie, the picture is in the movie.
• 34:25
  Speaker 1: I can't remember now. It's been a while. Wow. That's great.
• 34:32
  Speaker 1: I met a guy who was walking his dog one day.
• 34:36
  Speaker 1: I can't remember. I don't remember. I think it was
• 34:39
  Speaker 1: Utah somewhere. But he was walking somewhere, his dog, and
• 34:44
  Speaker 1: he didn't notice the Bigfoot. His dog did. And the
• 34:47
  Speaker 1: dog was barking.
• 34:48
  Speaker 2: Barking.
• 34:49
  Speaker 1: And he was taking the dog for a walk. Dog
• 34:51
  Speaker 1: was barking, barking at something. He's like, quiet. What are
• 34:54
  Speaker 1: you barking about? And then he looked and he said
• 34:57
  Speaker 1: there was a brown Bigfoot squatting on the ground. And
• 35:03
  Speaker 1: the Bigfoot just got up and walked away. He didn't
• 35:07
  Speaker 1: even see it until it moved. He said it was
• 35:09
  Speaker 1: blended right in. So that's crazy. I mean, some people
• 35:13
  Speaker 1: can see it maybe. And I don't know. The dog
• 35:16
  Speaker 1: knew it was there. But he didn't.
• 35:21
  Speaker 2: But just enough so that it's elusive.
• 35:23
  Speaker 1: Exactly.
• 35:24
  Speaker 2: Here's the mystery.
• 35:26
  Speaker 1: Exactly. He was shocked. That was the last thing he
• 35:29
  Speaker 1: was thinking. Oh, let me get my phone. He was like,
• 35:31
  Speaker 1: what just happened? And it disappeared. And this guy's a pilot.
• 35:36
  Speaker 1: This guy's a pilot. And he even saw some strange
• 35:40
  Speaker 1: things in the sky that pilots can't talk about.
• 35:43
  Speaker 4: Of course.
• 35:44
  Speaker 2: You know, after I did that. The Bigfoot Alien Connection reveal.
• 35:50
  Speaker 2: The person who hired me to do that, I said,
• 35:52
  Speaker 2: I don't know if I want to do this. He said,
• 35:55
  Speaker 2: I'll advance you the money, and you're going to end
• 35:58
  Speaker 2: up making probably half a million dollars on this. And
• 36:01
  Speaker 2: I said, bullshit. But it kind of turned out that way.
• 36:06
  Speaker 2: But as a result, to so many people I'd seen,
• 36:08
  Speaker 2: it was on so many streaming platforms, it kind of
• 36:12
  Speaker 2: made me and my crew kind of a celebrity. So
• 36:16
  Speaker 2: I got invited to speak at all these conferences. And, um,
• 36:20
  Speaker 2: as you can imagine, part of what I was trying
• 36:25
  Speaker 2: to do in the movie was to tell people like this, ma'am,
• 36:29
  Speaker 2: it's okay to have that. It's important. It's a real experience,
• 36:32
  Speaker 2: but it's a strange one and it creates a mystery
• 36:35
  Speaker 2: and they all do. So it's cool. Don't worry about it.
• 36:37
  Speaker 2: You're kind of special if you see one. And, um,
• 36:43
  Speaker 2: And so after that, I'd go to these conferences, and
• 36:45
  Speaker 2: of course, people would line up to tell me their stories,
• 36:49
  Speaker 2: and it was like, oh, I'm more glad I got
• 36:50
  Speaker 2: to hear another one. You know, personally validate their experiences. Sure.
• 36:56
  Speaker 2: Many of them never told anybody before. So that was a...
• 37:04
  Speaker 2: Besides the success, you know, the number of... I think
• 37:08
  Speaker 2: it was over 10 million views over multiple streaming platforms.
• 37:12
  Speaker 2: Don't you wish your podcast had that?
• 37:14
  Speaker 1: Yeah, one of my videos got over 5 million so far. So,
• 37:18
  Speaker 1: but yeah, I'm hoping 10 million eventually.
• 37:20
  Speaker 2: Good. Oh, right. I mean, 100 million. That's what I'm
• 37:25
  Speaker 2: about to say.
• 37:26
  Speaker 1: 100 million. That's amazing.
• 37:28
  Speaker 2: Yeah. That's viral.
• 37:31
  Speaker 1: Yes.
• 37:32
  Speaker 2: In a certain sense. I mean, for you, it sure
• 37:35
  Speaker 2: is great. Oh, I guess. It won't be a fine deal.
• 37:41
  Speaker 3: One of the interesting things that happens when Ron and I,
• 37:44
  Speaker 3: we go out for coffee around here all the time
• 37:47
  Speaker 3: when either we're discussing a new nonfiction book on the
• 37:51
  Speaker 3: paranormal or we do write novels together. So we'll be
• 37:55
  Speaker 3: discussing something. And one time we're at this particular coffee
• 38:00
  Speaker 3: house and we're discussing.
• 38:04
  Speaker 4: The paranormal.
• 38:05
  Speaker 3: And this young couple next to us gets up, comes
• 38:08
  Speaker 3: over and tells us their story. And part of that
• 38:12
  Speaker 3: is because we were not mocking what was going on.
• 38:16
  Speaker 3: We were talking about how intense these experiences are for
• 38:19
  Speaker 3: people and how individuals are changed by them. And they
• 38:24
  Speaker 3: talked about their experience and it took about five minutes.
• 38:27
  Speaker 3: And then they felt, as Ron mentioned, it was sort
• 38:31
  Speaker 3: of cathartic to be able to express this to someone
• 38:36
  Speaker 3: who wouldn't taunt them about it, but it would instead listen,
• 38:41
  Speaker 3: which is, Ron's very good at that. He's very good
• 38:43
  Speaker 3: at interviewing. He's very good at listening. And they went
• 38:46
  Speaker 3: back and sat down. And it occurred to me that,
• 38:50
  Speaker 3: as I mentioned earlier, these experiences are important for the
• 38:55
  Speaker 3: individual because they happen directly to that individual.
• 38:59
  Speaker 4: They're very visceral. They're life-changing. They have.
• 39:05
  Speaker 3: Things that happen down the road as a result of them.
• 39:09
  Speaker 3: A lot of times individuals will keep these stories deep
• 39:13
  Speaker 3: inside themselves. I can't even tell my wife that I
• 39:16
  Speaker 3: had this experience because, you know, they're going to put
• 39:19
  Speaker 3: me in a straitjacket and send me off to the
• 39:21
  Speaker 3: loony farm. But now, as I said, with the advent
• 39:26
  Speaker 3: of the Internet and the people coming together, we're finding
• 39:30
  Speaker 3: that more and more people are having these experiences. More
• 39:32
  Speaker 3: and more people are being changed by them. And usually
• 39:36
  Speaker 3: the change, I think, is for the good. I mentioned
• 39:39
  Speaker 3: this on another podcast. The American Plains Indians have a
• 39:47
  Speaker 3: sun dance, a sun festival today. at the solstice, the
• 39:50
  Speaker 3: June solstice. And young men will commit themselves to the
• 39:55
  Speaker 3: tribe by going through this very trying experience of the Sundance.
• 40:00
  Speaker 3: It's not, you know, you dance for a couple of
• 40:02
  Speaker 3: hours and then you go have a beer. No, this
• 40:05
  Speaker 3: thing lasts for days. And they have these profound visions,
• 40:08
  Speaker 3: profound experiences that change their lives forever. these experiences that
• 40:14
  Speaker 3: other people have, whether it's a Bigfoot sighting or some
• 40:18
  Speaker 3: other paranormal experience, it changes people's feelings, how they view themselves,
• 40:26
  Speaker 3: how they view what's going on around them. My personal
• 40:30
  Speaker 3: feeling is that this is all building to a crescendo
• 40:32
  Speaker 3: of some.
• 40:33
  Speaker 4: Kind where we will be.
• 40:37
  Speaker 3: At a tipping point and the What's happening now on
• 40:42
  Speaker 3: our planet, climate change-wise, with governments and everything else, will
• 40:47
  Speaker 3: change into what I would think is going to be
• 40:50
  Speaker 3: a golden age. But then I am also a romantic.
• 40:53
  Speaker 3: So we'll see how it works out.
• 40:57
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 40:59
  Speaker 1: Well, something that really caught my attention is the idea
• 41:01
  Speaker 1: that whatever— oh, go ahead.
• 41:04
  Speaker 2: Can I follow up on that?
• 41:05
  Speaker 1: Yes.
• 41:06
  Speaker 3: Okay.
• 41:08
  Speaker 2: I did just finish a movie on near-death experiences. It's
• 41:12
  Speaker 2: amazing how many people had some sort of near-death experience
• 41:17
  Speaker 2: when they were kids and could not tell people about it.
• 41:21
  Speaker 2: But because when we were kids, we were more open
• 41:24
  Speaker 2: to this kind of phenomena, many children have, let's just
• 41:29
  Speaker 2: call it a paranormal experience. And when they try and
• 41:33
  Speaker 2: tell their parents or teachers or whatever, they're not accepted.
• 41:40
  Speaker 2: And in fact, often, you know, somebody I know had
• 41:44
  Speaker 2: an experience like that and he got exercised. So that's
• 41:49
  Speaker 2: the big damaging part of it is the reaction to
• 41:54
  Speaker 2: it when you're a kid because it's very ribbing. And
• 41:57
  Speaker 2: so that's another reason I really want to get this
• 42:00
  Speaker 2: out that because the last person we interviewed, like if
• 42:05
  Speaker 2: you want to get into heaven, You have to become
• 42:07
  Speaker 2: like a child, as Jesus said. And so you have
• 42:10
  Speaker 2: to open up in the way you were open when
• 42:13
  Speaker 2: you were a kid. So a lot more stuff happens.
• 42:15
  Speaker 2: They get these experiences, and they can't tell anybody. And
• 42:20
  Speaker 2: if they do, and they get ridiculed, they feel like crap,
• 42:23
  Speaker 2: and they carry that with them their whole life until
• 42:26
  Speaker 2: they end up in a shrink, taking Xanax. So it's
• 42:30
  Speaker 2: a big deal. Just tossing it in that this is
• 42:39
  Speaker 2: part of the unveiling we're doing here right now by
• 42:42
  Speaker 2: talking about these things.
• 42:44
  Speaker 1: Yeah, absolutely.
• 42:45
  Speaker 2: I tell you, except that they did have an experience.
• 42:49
  Speaker 2: It may not make any sense to you, but they're
• 42:52
  Speaker 2: still real, just like that person who saw the Bigfoot
• 42:54
  Speaker 2: and the dog. It has that quality that's synonymous, not
• 42:59
  Speaker 2: quite right, in terms of our normal way of our consensus,
• 43:04
  Speaker 2: you know, we're taught in society. But that doesn't mean
• 43:07
  Speaker 2: it's not happening.
• 43:09
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I agree. Something that really caught my attention is
• 43:14
  Speaker 1: the idea that whatever is at that Bradshaw Ranch may
• 43:20
  Speaker 1: actually be aware of the investigators. It seems like it
• 43:26
  Speaker 1: knows you're there, just like the portal. It knew and
• 43:29
  Speaker 1: it kind of opened up when you started and closed
• 43:32
  Speaker 1: up when you left. It kind of. felt that way,
• 43:37
  Speaker 1: like there was an intelligence behind those experiences. It's like
• 43:42
  Speaker 1: the synchronicities.
• 43:44
  Speaker 2: Yeah, Colonel John Alexander, who did the first big investigation
• 43:48
  Speaker 2: of the Walker Ranch, when Bigelow owned the ranch, I
• 43:55
  Speaker 2: did an interview with him, and he says, for sure,
• 44:00
  Speaker 2: whatever the presence is, it's precognitive. It knows what's going
• 44:05
  Speaker 2: to happen before it happens in a certain sense. And therefore,
• 44:10
  Speaker 2: it shapes the experience. And skinlocker rats just use all
• 44:14
  Speaker 2: their equipment all the time. Nothing ever works out there.
• 44:19
  Speaker 2: Never had a problem where the whole thing ever not working.
• 44:23
  Speaker 2: They poke the bear, I invite contact. It's a whole
• 44:26
  Speaker 2: different approach. In fact, one of these investigations, the disembodied
• 44:31
  Speaker 2: boys said....
• 44:34
  Speaker 1: I think I remember that.
• 44:36
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 44:37
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 44:39
  Speaker 2: So, you know, I'd like to tell the story where
• 44:44
  Speaker 2: you saw the stick figures, right? Yes. That show up
• 44:48
  Speaker 2: on the SLS devices.
• 44:49
  Speaker 1: Mm-hmm.
• 44:51
  Speaker 2: There's two things you got to know about the LS.
• 44:53
  Speaker 2: You know, it was designed by Microsoft to create, put
• 44:58
  Speaker 2: on a pattern of infrared, because we have temperature, you know,
• 45:02
  Speaker 2: you're probably pretty high water and it would convert the
• 45:08
  Speaker 2: basic structure of a human eye into the stick figures
• 45:12
  Speaker 2: that look like humans, the rate of bones or something.
• 45:16
  Speaker 2: But there's two false positives that occur with that. When
• 45:20
  Speaker 2: you see those things, one is the thing, like if
• 45:24
  Speaker 2: you're doing a tree and it thinks it's a person,
• 45:27
  Speaker 2: it'll always be there. You turn the camera away, look,
• 45:30
  Speaker 2: it'll be there again. It never leaves. And so if
• 45:34
  Speaker 2: you've got a real one, it can't stay very long
• 45:37
  Speaker 2: for some reason, in my experience. It'll show up, go away,
• 45:42
  Speaker 2: come back. Show up, go away. And sometimes you look
• 45:45
  Speaker 2: like they're dancing. You're really not moving. What's going on
• 45:50
  Speaker 2: is that the temperature between themselves and the camera, you know,
• 45:55
  Speaker 2: the temperature of the air, is constantly fluctuating. So the
• 46:00
  Speaker 2: image is going to fluctuate too because the air is
• 46:02
  Speaker 2: always moving. Little temperature changes all over the place. So
• 46:05
  Speaker 2: that could happen if I was positive or with a
• 46:09
  Speaker 2: real one. But like when we were in the house,
• 46:11
  Speaker 2: the temperature was very stable. And our stick figures were,
• 46:15
  Speaker 2: you know, perfect. They weren't dancing. And the creatures would
• 46:21
  Speaker 2: show up and they'd go away, show up and go away.
• 46:24
  Speaker 2: Like the one that was sitting in the chair that
• 46:27
  Speaker 2: I put the laser at, it hit a I think
• 46:31
  Speaker 2: it was at least the third time he came back
• 46:33
  Speaker 2: into the chair. We'd sit there for a while, look around,
• 46:35
  Speaker 2: and then pop up, and then we'd come back, pop up,
• 46:38
  Speaker 2: and come back. But the thing that impressed me the most,
• 46:44
  Speaker 2: we were recording. We had a large magnetometer, which was
• 46:48
  Speaker 2: monitoring the magnetic fluctuations. And it was going crazy when
• 46:54
  Speaker 2: these things were around. And they were messing with the
• 46:58
  Speaker 2: guy who owned the equipment at one point. Not letting
• 47:01
  Speaker 2: him create the baseline. It was kind of fun. He
• 47:03
  Speaker 2: didn't see him, but we were watching him on the camera.
• 47:06
  Speaker 2: It was just messing with him. That would have been
• 47:08
  Speaker 2: kind of fun, I guess. I think the person has
• 47:11
  Speaker 2: a sense of humor. And so I like my green
• 47:17
  Speaker 2: light laser. I like poking it in the wrong. And
• 47:19
  Speaker 2: so I poked it at this figure sitting in the
• 47:23
  Speaker 2: chair at its feet. And as clear as can be,
• 47:27
  Speaker 2: It looked down at it with its head, and, you know,
• 47:29
  Speaker 2: you could see it look down. Do you remember seeing that?
• 47:32
  Speaker 1: No, I don't remember that at this point.
• 47:35
  Speaker 2: Tuesday, it kicks the laser, touching its feet perfectly. So
• 47:40
  Speaker 2: it shows situational awareness.
• 47:43
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it shows intelligence.
• 47:46
  Speaker 4: Yes.
• 47:48
  Speaker 1: Wow.
• 47:49
  Speaker 2: That was the last thing that we captured on the
• 47:52
  Speaker 2: whole investigation. It's like it said, I'll give you something
• 47:55
  Speaker 2: that's really good to end your murder with. Thank you.
• 48:06
  Speaker 1: The government, I guess you mentioned they acquired the Bradshaw Ranch.
• 48:11
  Speaker 1: Is there any stories about underground tunnels there? Have you
• 48:14
  Speaker 1: confirmed anything while you were there?
• 48:16
  Speaker 2: The whole area is riddled with stuff like that.
• 48:20
  Speaker 4: Yes.
• 48:22
  Speaker 2: I see. So we do this thing called the C6 Protocol.
• 48:27
  Speaker 2: Last April, We were invited to do our protocol, and
• 48:32
  Speaker 2: it was called the Ascension Convention. A bunch of really
• 48:35
  Speaker 2: rich white people get together and spend a lot of
• 48:38
  Speaker 2: money to have experiences. And there's this guy called Chris Bledsoe.
• 48:43
  Speaker 2: He puts his hand up like this, and orgs show up. Well,
• 48:47
  Speaker 2: he was supposed to do the crowning event, which was
• 48:50
  Speaker 2: the eye-watching event, sky-watching event. But he bugged out, and
• 48:54
  Speaker 2: so my publicist got us to replace him. And so
• 49:00
  Speaker 2: I had done this with groups now that were that
• 49:04
  Speaker 2: many people. So I thought, well, this would be cool.
• 49:07
  Speaker 2: You were there, Mark, when we had this conversation. What
• 49:09
  Speaker 2: are we going to do if we have, you know, 50,
• 49:12
  Speaker 2: 60 people? Are we going to get them to behave?
• 49:16
  Speaker 2: Hashtag people will behave very well. They can organize. Something
• 49:19
  Speaker 2: I discovered. But it turned out it was going to
• 49:22
  Speaker 2: be in a football stadium and everybody wanted to come
• 49:25
  Speaker 2: because we gave a talk before. So over 200 people.
• 49:29
  Speaker 2: I was like, holy shit, how long have I been here?
• 49:33
  Speaker 2: But the coolest thing that happened that we were recording,
• 49:36
  Speaker 2: I mean, people were sitting vortexes, and one person, some
• 49:41
  Speaker 2: people saw Jesus, and motherships, and captured some of these
• 49:47
  Speaker 2: things with their cameras, like a perfect triangle and everything.
• 49:51
  Speaker 2: But at one point, I said, okay, now open your
• 49:53
  Speaker 2: eyes and look to the sky. And four, they call
• 49:58
  Speaker 2: them fast-movers, on our thermal showed up. Remember, this is
• 50:04
  Speaker 2: really close to Bradshaw, right? As the crow flies. It
• 50:07
  Speaker 2: was the brave flies You know, they were moving at
• 50:10
  Speaker 2: the same speed as the Tic Tacs. You know what
• 50:12
  Speaker 2: the Tic Tacs are?
• 50:14
  Speaker 4: Yes.
• 50:15
  Speaker 2: And those are thermals as well. And they would.
• 50:21
  Speaker 2: So in 17 seconds, we had four of them race
• 50:24
  Speaker 2: across the thermal at these incredible, impossible speeds. Perfect images.
• 50:33
  Speaker 2: So that was the thing.
• 50:36
  Speaker 1: It's incredible. Yeah. That is incredible.
• 50:41
  Speaker 2: And, you know, the next evening, I actually took a group,
• 50:44
  Speaker 2: a special little group out to Bradshaw and we crawled
• 50:48
  Speaker 2: underneath them. And, you know, these are people that had,
• 50:53
  Speaker 2: you know, a lifelong dream to go out to Bradshaw
• 50:55
  Speaker 2: Ranch and got them out there a little. I had
• 50:59
  Speaker 2: them all walk through the portal, you know, where everybody
• 51:03
  Speaker 2: got sick. People just were kind of wobbly. But there
• 51:07
  Speaker 2: was a very famous paranormal writer. He's the one that
• 51:10
  Speaker 2: instigated the whole thing. Richard Estep. Because he wanted to,
• 51:14
  Speaker 2: you know, because he's a writer. He threw in just
• 51:17
  Speaker 2: for that. And nothing really happened. And just a little
• 51:23
  Speaker 2: bit of, you know, I feel wobbly. I feel a
• 51:26
  Speaker 2: little shaky and so on. But nothing like when Riga's there.
• 51:30
  Speaker 2: Except just before he left. Because he stayed with Alan,
• 51:34
  Speaker 2: you know, to continue further than The group that was there.
• 51:37
  Speaker 2: And he got really zapped in the portal.
• 51:42
  Speaker 1: Oh, wow. That's interesting. With the tunnels in Bigfoot, did
• 51:51
  Speaker 1: the Native Americans ever talk about tunnels under the grounds
• 51:56
  Speaker 1: or Bigfoot, anything like that?
• 52:02
  Speaker 2: They do. Living Native Americans. I mean, I've interviewed many
• 52:06
  Speaker 2: Native Americans. I've had experiences where they put for sure.
• 52:11
  Speaker 2: About tunnels, I never asked them about tunnels.
• 52:15
  Speaker 3: And my research that I did didn't reveal anything that
• 52:20
  Speaker 3: would connect Native Americans with.
• 52:25
  Speaker 4: Tunnels.
• 52:26
  Speaker 3: Now, it is true that among the Anasazi and other
• 52:31
  Speaker 3: groups in that area, they had, like mentioned earlier, they
• 52:36
  Speaker 3: had these wells that would sink down into the earth as.
• 52:39
  Speaker 4: A way of communicating with the spirits or another world.
• 52:46
  Speaker 3: But as far as tunnels are concerned, I'm sorry, I
• 52:48
  Speaker 3: haven't any information on that.
• 52:50
  Speaker 1: Interesting. Yeah. Did Native Americans ever talk about, historically anyway,
• 52:56
  Speaker 1: about Bigfoot or something like a Bigfoot?
• 52:58
  Speaker 2: Oh, yeah. Really? Historical accounts have their own names all
• 53:08
  Speaker 2: over the world.
• 53:09
  Speaker 4: Yeah, there's.
• 53:13
  Speaker 3: Among the Lakota and among the Santee and the northern,
• 53:23
  Speaker 3: we refer to it as the Sioux Indian tribes, there
• 53:26
  Speaker 3: are a couple of words that they use.
• 53:27
  Speaker 4: One is Sitanka, another one is.
• 53:31
  Speaker 3: Chiataka, these are like elder brother or big brothers, and
• 53:35
  Speaker 3: they also refer to Bigfoot-type entities.
• 53:40
  Speaker 4: That are helpers.
• 53:43
  Speaker 3: Now, sometimes people see Bigfoot as an intruder or, you know,
• 53:47
  Speaker 3: our shop that we talked to, Jim Hoyt, gave us
• 53:55
  Speaker 3: a few wonderful stories about Bigfoot as a healer.
• 53:59
  Speaker 1: Oh.
• 54:01
  Speaker 4: Wonderful to listen to him tell these stories.
• 54:06
  Speaker 3: Wow.
• 54:07
  Speaker 2: The Bigfoot joins in when he's doing his big healing ceremonies.
• 54:13
  Speaker 1: Wow, that's interesting. Now, did anyone in the team experience
• 54:18
  Speaker 1: what is sometimes called the hitchhiker effect when they left
• 54:23
  Speaker 1: Bradshaw Ranch? Did anything strange seem to follow you home
• 54:27
  Speaker 1: or anyone home after the investigation was over? No.
• 54:31
  Speaker 4: No.
• 54:33
  Speaker 2: Oh.
• 54:38
  Speaker 1: That's good. That's great. You also have something called the
• 54:43
  Speaker 1: Contact and Flow Retreat coming up?
• 54:47
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I do.
• 54:49
  Speaker 1: You want to talk?
• 54:49
  Speaker 2: What we're wanting to do is based on the CD6
• 54:52
  Speaker 2: protocol where we call forth and interact with the presence
• 54:57
  Speaker 2: that can masquerade and pretty much any four little ones.
• 55:02
  Speaker 2: Probably the two big memes that are in conversation is
• 55:08
  Speaker 2: Bigfoot and UAPs. And the way these tiktads that we
• 55:14
  Speaker 2: recorded and the Navy pilots recorded under this hypothesis, that's
• 55:22
  Speaker 2: the presence masquerading as these things. It's not aliens from
• 55:27
  Speaker 2: someplace or some strange craft from inter-dimensionality, it's this presence
• 55:34
  Speaker 2: that's been here forever for us in a way, masquerading
• 55:38
  Speaker 2: that way, it can do that. So in terms of
• 55:41
  Speaker 2: the Bradshaw Ridge portal, and maybe even the creatures, it
• 55:45
  Speaker 2: was manifesting as those things for us.
• 55:49
  Speaker 1: And what's the difference between the CE6 contact and CE5?
• 55:56
  Speaker 2: The CE5 is not asking for contact. In interaction, we are,
• 56:01
  Speaker 2: and it does interact with us. And we've done several
• 56:05
  Speaker 2: of these now, and it never repeats itself. It always
• 56:09
  Speaker 2: shows up in some different way.
• 56:13
  Speaker 3: From my perspective, what's very interesting about the CE6 protocol
• 56:17
  Speaker 3: is that it can be done by an individual or
• 56:19
  Speaker 3: it can be done by a group. Now, I participated
• 56:22
  Speaker 3: in a group effect, and When Ron was leading that
• 56:27
  Speaker 3: group and Ron was bringing the group together through a
• 56:30
  Speaker 3: meditation to begin with so that we're all in alignment.
• 56:35
  Speaker 4: And then as the leader of the group, as he
• 56:39
  Speaker 4: is asking.
• 56:42
  Speaker 3: For the presence to make itself manifest. And he's asking
• 56:46
  Speaker 3: the group to share that ask. And the power.
• 56:51
  Speaker 2: You mentioned the chair, which is critical to the.
• 56:54
  Speaker 4: And the cat, which is A-E-I-O-U.
• 56:58
  Speaker 3: Now, these vowels are prototype language. Every language on the
• 57:05
  Speaker 3: planet is developed from these vowels. And there's a certain
• 57:11
  Speaker 3: interesting history behind that. If you go back 50,000 years
• 57:17
  Speaker 3: ago and the beginning of language, we can talk about
• 57:20
  Speaker 3: that a little bit later. But I want to get
• 57:21
  Speaker 3: back to this CE6 protocol.
• 57:24
  Speaker 4: People are doing this chant.
• 57:25
  Speaker 3: We're all in alignment. And in the process of that alignment,
• 57:32
  Speaker 3: really interesting events occur. I don't want to put a
• 57:38
  Speaker 3: name on them like magical.
• 57:40
  Speaker 4: Events or paranormal events.
• 57:41
  Speaker 3: These are events that actually everybody sees and that can
• 57:46
  Speaker 3: be captured, that everybody feels and experiences within.
• 57:50
  Speaker 4: And while the group is.
• 57:57
  Speaker 3: Focusing on one ask that Ron is doing, individuals within
• 58:02
  Speaker 3: the group can also.
• 58:03
  Speaker 4: Have an experience that affects them as well.
• 58:10
  Speaker 3: So this CE6 protocol, you asked about the CE5 protocol,
• 58:16
  Speaker 3: is different.
• 58:18
  Speaker 4: In that it.
• 58:21
  Speaker 3: It requires the, or not requires, it asks of the
• 58:25
  Speaker 3: participant to be present and ask something of the presence.
• 58:30
  Speaker 3: Not just be a passive observer, but to actually be.
• 58:35
  Speaker 4: Connected with what's going on.
• 58:37
  Speaker 3: And that, in my opinion, is what makes it not
• 58:39
  Speaker 3: only different than the CE5 protocol, but more powerful. Powerful
• 58:43
  Speaker 3: for the individual participating and for the group.
• 58:46
  Speaker 2: Wow.
• 58:47
  Speaker 1: And do you.
• 58:48
  Speaker 2: Can I add to that in a way?
• 58:50
  Speaker 1: Yes.
• 58:51
  Speaker 2: So when we were at the football stadium, people were
• 58:55
  Speaker 2: having their own individual experiences, seeing different things in the sky.
• 58:59
  Speaker 2: We captured the fast movers. But one of the phenomena
• 59:04
  Speaker 2: associated with Bigfoot is it puts out this smell, which
• 59:08
  Speaker 2: is both sweet and... and terrible. It's a combination that's
• 59:14
  Speaker 2: kind of unique. And many people have reported just like the,
• 59:18
  Speaker 2: you know, hearing the wood dog but never seeing the thing.
• 59:22
  Speaker 2: And so at one point during the protocol, that smell,
• 59:26
  Speaker 2: the exact same one we had I had smelled before
• 59:31
  Speaker 2: on the first protocol I ever did, permeated the whole
• 59:35
  Speaker 2: football stadium. Everybody had the same experience of the smell.
• 59:40
  Speaker 2: So it shows like these people can be having their
• 59:43
  Speaker 2: own visual picture of God and Jesus in the sky,
• 59:47
  Speaker 2: but they're also smelling this sweet, awful odor. It was
• 59:52
  Speaker 2: really cool. It's just showing how capable it is and
• 59:57
  Speaker 2: how it can, like, how is that possible? I mean,
• 1:00:01
  Speaker 2: you could say it was a bad campfire, but you know,
• 1:00:03
  Speaker 2: we're in the middle of town, we're in a football stadium,
• 1:00:06
  Speaker 2: nobody's having a campfire. Like, what a smell over this
• 1:00:10
  Speaker 2: whole area with all these people in it. Anyhow, that's
• 1:00:14
  Speaker 2: what it tells us. Wow.
• 1:00:16
  Speaker 1: That's incredible. So did you experience something there? The smell?
• 1:00:23
  Speaker 1: Besides the smell, did you see anything?
• 1:00:25
  Speaker 2: No, I'm busy producing a movie.
• 1:00:29
  Speaker 1: Okay. Okay.
• 1:00:31
  Speaker 2: You know, that's my problem. You know, I'm making a movie.
• 1:00:39
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 1:00:40
  Speaker 2: It makes me kind of insensitive to the feeling sense
• 1:00:43
  Speaker 2: that a lot of people have. Yeah. I've got to
• 1:00:46
  Speaker 2: make a movie. I've got to get the shot. It's
• 1:00:48
  Speaker 2: totally dark, and I didn't expect that. Because it's a
• 1:00:53
  Speaker 2: dark sky city. And when they turned off the film,
• 1:00:57
  Speaker 2: I was thinking, oh, my God, it's totally dark. Can't
• 1:01:00
  Speaker 2: see a damn thing. I had an improvise. I had
• 1:01:05
  Speaker 2: to figure out how I could get responses where people
• 1:01:08
  Speaker 2: run out and get people to talk in a microphone.
• 1:01:11
  Speaker 2: We had cameras like the thermal running all the time
• 1:01:15
  Speaker 2: focused on the crowd. So when it got that dark,
• 1:01:20
  Speaker 2: you know, some cameras won't pick up anything. Yeah.
• 1:01:24
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 1:01:24
  Speaker 2: First because it's rural. But the only thing that happened
• 1:01:29
  Speaker 2: at the end is that there was too many people
• 1:01:32
  Speaker 2: who all of a sudden said, we're going to take
• 1:01:34
  Speaker 2: this over. We're going to do the chant. We're going
• 1:01:37
  Speaker 2: to hold hands and form a giant circle. And they did.
• 1:01:41
  Speaker 2: What the hell was that? That was so cool. You know,
• 1:01:44
  Speaker 2: the thermal, you could see these people moving, holding hands. Wow.
• 1:01:48
  Speaker 2: You know, each other. Chanting.
• 1:01:53
  Speaker 1: That's pretty cool.
• 1:01:54
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 1:01:55
  Speaker 1: So do you have another one of these CE6 coming?
• 1:02:00
  Speaker 2: We just wrapped up two of them. Oh, okay. We
• 1:02:04
  Speaker 2: haven't analyzed all the results yet. We should probably have
• 1:02:10
  Speaker 2: a couple more.
• 1:02:11
  Speaker 4: Nice.
• 1:02:12
  Speaker 1: And that's going to become a documentary that we can watch?
• 1:02:17
  Speaker 2: I don't know yet. There's a lot of data. We
• 1:02:22
  Speaker 2: have to figure out how the hell is that data.
• 1:02:25
  Speaker 2: Why is it at one place it shows up as
• 1:02:26
  Speaker 2: the Raven punctuating words? and another is a smell. Oh,
• 1:02:31
  Speaker 2: I'm going to win.
• 1:02:34
  Speaker 1: Aye, aye.
• 1:02:35
  Speaker 2: One of the last ones we did, there's this thing
• 1:02:37
  Speaker 2: called a sacred tree in Colorado, and the Ute Indians
• 1:02:41
  Speaker 2: is another tribe, and it lives along the mountains, and
• 1:02:45
  Speaker 2: you put your hand on it, you'll get a communication
• 1:02:47
  Speaker 2: of some sort. I've had four of them. Plus, I
• 1:02:50
  Speaker 2: saw a Bigfoot behind me on some of the lawn.
• 1:02:54
  Speaker 2: And he was waffling in and out of existence, sort
• 1:02:56
  Speaker 2: of we're touching the tree. And, um, I asked the
• 1:03:02
  Speaker 2: president to make the tree cold, a cold spot. And
• 1:03:08
  Speaker 2: he did. Right down the middle of the tree was
• 1:03:10
  Speaker 2: this long, cold spot.
• 1:03:15
  Speaker 1: That's amazing. Yeah.
• 1:03:19
  Speaker 2: And we're keeping it up late. And we're doing the
• 1:03:21
  Speaker 2: protoculture and stuff, you know, in the different places that
• 1:03:25
  Speaker 2: are resilient. And when the people begin to wobble on
• 1:03:28
  Speaker 2: the bottom of the tree, The cold spot gradually started
• 1:03:33
  Speaker 2: going down as people were walking. When they were about
• 1:03:36
  Speaker 2: five steps away, it completed. So they knew they were
• 1:03:40
  Speaker 2: moving at the time, just to show them what it
• 1:03:42
  Speaker 2: can do. Wow.
• 1:03:44
  Speaker 1: Now, when your son-in-law saw the Bigfoot, did you smell it,
• 1:03:49
  Speaker 1: or could he smell it?
• 1:03:51
  Speaker 2: I saw it. He felt it.
• 1:03:54
  Speaker 1: Oh.
• 1:03:55
  Speaker 2: So finally, you know, I looked at it and said,
• 1:03:57
  Speaker 2: it was a shadow form. It was an orange shadow form.
• 1:04:01
  Speaker 2: And I said to him, there's a creature behind you. Because,
• 1:04:04
  Speaker 2: you know, I had to figure, what in the heck
• 1:04:06
  Speaker 2: is that? And he said, I know. I've been feeling
• 1:04:09
  Speaker 2: it for quite a while. I felt it come up
• 1:04:13
  Speaker 2: behind me.
• 1:04:15
  Speaker 1: Wow. That's scary.
• 1:04:17
  Speaker 2: So Mark went to that tree in the Amazonas.
• 1:04:20
  Speaker 1: Did you? What was your experience?
• 1:04:22
  Speaker 3: Well, I've had actually two kind of unique experiences now
• 1:04:27
  Speaker 3: involving trees. Ron and I were out in Sequoia National
• 1:04:32
  Speaker 3: Park near Yosemite.
• 1:04:34
  Speaker 4: And we, I think it was, yeah.
• 1:04:37
  Speaker 3: And we went to this particularly large tree. And just
• 1:04:41
  Speaker 3: on what I thought was a lark, let me give
• 1:04:45
  Speaker 3: a little more background. We were doing a series on
• 1:04:48
  Speaker 3: America's national parks and national monuments. And so we were
• 1:04:52
  Speaker 3: filming at Yosemite and came down to the.
• 1:04:56
  Speaker 4: Park below it.
• 1:04:57
  Speaker 3: And what I thought was a lark, Ron said, Mark,
• 1:05:00
  Speaker 3: let's go and put our hands around this tree. Now,
• 1:05:03
  Speaker 3: we couldn't reach, the tree was large enough that even
• 1:05:06
  Speaker 3: with our arms completely outstretched, we could not reach each
• 1:05:09
  Speaker 3: other's fingers. And I thought this was just a lark.
• 1:05:12
  Speaker 3: And so we go to do this. And Ron says, Mark,
• 1:05:17
  Speaker 3: at this point, we were not doing the CD6 protocol.
• 1:05:19
  Speaker 3: It had not really been developed yet. But Ron, with
• 1:05:24
  Speaker 3: his own spiritual practices, said, I said, Mark, let's breathe
• 1:05:28
  Speaker 3: really deeply and let our minds go as blank as possible.
• 1:05:32
  Speaker 3: And at that moment, it wasn't that the tree disappeared.
• 1:05:38
  Speaker 4: I knew the tree was still there. But I felt the.
• 1:05:43
  Speaker 3: Energy of the tree go all the way down into
• 1:05:47
  Speaker 3: the earth beneath my feet.
• 1:05:48
  Speaker 4: Now, I'm still a skeptic at this point.
• 1:05:51
  Speaker 3: I hadn't gotten rid of my skepticism until Ron and
• 1:05:53
  Speaker 3: I started on the Bigfoot Project books. But I had
• 1:05:58
  Speaker 3: to admit, even as a skeptic, I had never felt
• 1:06:01
  Speaker 3: anything quite so profound in my life that I could
• 1:06:05
  Speaker 3: feel this energy like a heart beating and blood pumping
• 1:06:10
  Speaker 3: from deep down into the earth.
• 1:06:12
  Speaker 4: Up through the tree.
• 1:06:14
  Speaker 3: Now, this is kind of important because when Ron asked
• 1:06:17
  Speaker 3: me to go to this sacred tree.
• 1:06:21
  Speaker 4: And put my hands on it, I thought, oh, I
• 1:06:26
  Speaker 4: kind of went back.
• 1:06:27
  Speaker 3: To that experience that I had earlier, a few years earlier.
• 1:06:30
  Speaker 3: And so as soon as I put my hands on
• 1:06:32
  Speaker 3: the tree, I realized, I don't feel anything.
• 1:06:35
  Speaker 4: What is this thing about a sacred tree?
• 1:06:38
  Speaker 3: But I closed my eyes, went into some breathing, and
• 1:06:41
  Speaker 3: then I actually stepped back so that my hands were
• 1:06:43
  Speaker 3: not quite touching it. And at that moment, the same
• 1:06:47
  Speaker 3: feeling I had had years before pulsed through the tree,
• 1:06:51
  Speaker 3: but also pulsed through me. And I'm like, okay, I understand.
• 1:06:58
  Speaker 3: And the understanding was something that I had known as
• 1:07:03
  Speaker 3: a child but had dismissed. And that was that the
• 1:07:08
  Speaker 3: earth is a living being. It is not just a
• 1:07:12
  Speaker 3: dusty orb with mountain ranges and water.
• 1:07:16
  Speaker 4: And seas and oceans on it. It is a living,
• 1:07:20
  Speaker 4: breathing being.
• 1:07:21
  Speaker 3: And later on, I went outside and I was walking
• 1:07:25
  Speaker 3: and I was looking at the mountains here.
• 1:07:29
  Speaker 4: I live in Boulder, Colorado, and the.
• 1:07:30
  Speaker 3: Foothills are literally I can walk out of my house
• 1:07:33
  Speaker 3: and see the foothills within 30 feet. And you could
• 1:07:37
  Speaker 3: literally see the aura around the foothills pulsing like a breath.
• 1:07:43
  Speaker 4: And I went, OK. Ron, you've taken me this far.
• 1:07:47
  Speaker 4: Where are we going next? This was back in Memorial
• 1:07:50
  Speaker 4: Day this year.
• 1:07:51
  Speaker 3: So now I am really eager to find out where
• 1:07:54
  Speaker 3: Ron is doing his next E6 protocol because I want to.
• 1:08:00
  Speaker 4: Continue to search.
• 1:08:02
  Speaker 3: It's sort of like the bales get dropped from the
• 1:08:04
  Speaker 3: eyes or the eyes are open, what ore you want
• 1:08:06
  Speaker 3: to use or simile you.
• 1:08:07
  Speaker 4: Want to use. Once that happens... It isn't about, well,
• 1:08:12
  Speaker 4: I want to experience more. I want to, you know,
• 1:08:15
  Speaker 4: I really want to feel that power.
• 1:08:16
  Speaker 3: No, it's more like I want to search more. I
• 1:08:19
  Speaker 3: want to feel what's going on so that my own
• 1:08:25
  Speaker 3: worldview can expand, my own.
• 1:08:28
  Speaker 4: Self can expand and understand even more if it's possible.
• 1:08:33
  Speaker 1: That's amazing. Yes, I hope we all can experience something
• 1:08:36
  Speaker 1: like that someday. That's amazing.
• 1:08:39
  Speaker 2: We'll take you to the tree.
• 1:08:41
  Speaker 1: Yeah. Is it a specific?
• 1:08:43
  Speaker 4: It was my favorite coffee house.
• 1:08:44
  Speaker 1: Nice.
• 1:08:47
  Speaker 2: We did a movie on it, on the tree basically.
• 1:08:50
  Speaker 2: It's become this spiritual attraction. And I always love the resorts.
• 1:08:56
  Speaker 2: You know, I kind of hate it because they get trafficked.
• 1:08:58
  Speaker 4: What?
• 1:08:59
  Speaker 1: What?
• 1:09:00
  Speaker 2: To experience the tree.
• 1:09:04
  Speaker 1: Wow. So it's only that one tree so far that
• 1:09:06
  Speaker 1: you experienced this with?
• 1:09:08
  Speaker 2: Yeah, so this is a culturally modified tree. It was
• 1:09:10
  Speaker 2: set up by the Udinas in probably 1890s, 70s, something
• 1:09:15
  Speaker 2: like that. Kind of like bonsai.
• 1:09:17
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 1:09:20
  Speaker 2: And forever, people would come and get little pieces of bark.
• 1:09:23
  Speaker 2: You can see where they took that. It's been, you know,
• 1:09:27
  Speaker 2: so it's been, how many people have put their hands
• 1:09:30
  Speaker 2: on it is probably enormous, you know, over the last
• 1:09:35
  Speaker 2: almost 200 years. Wow. So it's very powerful. I've had
• 1:09:39
  Speaker 2: three other experiences there. Some nice, some really nice. So
• 1:09:47
  Speaker 2: it was the end of the call for me. Wow.
• 1:09:52
  Speaker 1: Well, where can people listening find your books, your documentaries?
• 1:09:57
  Speaker 1: Where can they find you, your website?
• 1:10:01
  Speaker 2: We have a Facebook page called the Bigfoot Trilogy. What
• 1:10:08
  Speaker 2: is it called again, Mark?
• 1:10:10
  Speaker 4: I'm sorry, Ron. I don't have that with me. I
• 1:10:13
  Speaker 4: can't help you.
• 1:10:14
  Speaker 2: Bigfoot Chronicles Trilogy.
• 1:10:16
  Speaker 4: Oh, that's right.
• 1:10:17
  Speaker 2: It started with the first thing we ever wrote together.
• 1:10:22
  Speaker 2: And this is the main area. And I just kept
• 1:10:25
  Speaker 2: the title. And so you can see I announced a
• 1:10:28
  Speaker 2: lot of the stuff, new books, movies there. Other than that,
• 1:10:34
  Speaker 2: you know, most of these things I found on YouTube
• 1:10:38
  Speaker 2: and other streaming platforms. The books are all on Amazon.
• 1:10:43
  Speaker 2: Barnes & Noble. Did I send you my biography with
• 1:10:47
  Speaker 2: all those different links?
• 1:10:50
  Speaker 1: I believe so, yes. I think so. Or I got Mark's. Yeah. Yes,
• 1:10:57
  Speaker 1: I got somebody's, yes.
• 1:10:59
  Speaker 4: She got mine, Ron.
• 1:11:00
  Speaker 1: Yours, okay.
• 1:11:02
  Speaker 4: You'll need to send her yours. Okay.
• 1:11:04
  Speaker 2: It's got all the links to, not all of them,
• 1:11:06
  Speaker 2: but many of the links.
• 1:11:07
  Speaker 1: Okay.
• 1:11:08
  Speaker 2: Yes, please. And this domain, not everything we've ever done,
• 1:11:12
  Speaker 2: which would be taking into some strange areas.
• 1:11:18
  Speaker 1: Do you have anything coming up?
• 1:11:21
  Speaker 2: Well, the last that came out, it's called You Are
• 1:11:23
  Speaker 2: a World of Truthful Near-Death Experiences. You can get that
• 1:11:27
  Speaker 2: on YouTube.
• 1:11:28
  Speaker 4: Okay.
• 1:11:30
  Speaker 1: Well, Ron and Mark.
• 1:11:31
  Speaker 3: We do have a novel coming out in the fall
• 1:11:35
  Speaker 3: from Hanger One Publishing, which deals with AI and a
• 1:11:41
  Speaker 3: look at how AI might shape our future. But it
• 1:11:44
  Speaker 3: is a novel. It's not a documentary or something. But
• 1:11:48
  Speaker 3: that's our latest project that we're just finishing. But the
• 1:11:53
  Speaker 3: CE6 protocol is something that Ron does fairly regularly. So
• 1:11:57
  Speaker 3: what we can do is send you an email the
• 1:12:00
  Speaker 3: next time we're having one and hopefully your way out
• 1:12:03
  Speaker 3: to Colorado.
• 1:12:04
  Speaker 1: That would be wonderful. Thank you, Ron and Mark.
• 1:12:08
  Speaker 2: Yes.
• 1:12:10
  Speaker 1: That would even be better.
• 1:12:12
  Speaker 2: Yes.
• 1:12:12
  Speaker 3: John has not been to Oahu except for the airport.
• 1:12:15
  Speaker 1: Exactly.
• 1:12:16
  Speaker 3: He's not willing to go back, so we'll come to Oahu.
• 1:12:20
  Speaker 1: That would be awesome.
• 1:12:21
  Speaker 2: One of the calls we've done has been a relationship
• 1:12:25
  Speaker 2: with a larger conference where the people can come and
• 1:12:29
  Speaker 2: join that either for free or pay. We figure the
• 1:12:32
  Speaker 2: one in Sedona, the people who put on that conference
• 1:12:36
  Speaker 2: probably made $ 30, 000 that way. Wow. Because they paid good
• 1:12:41
  Speaker 2: money to come and hear me babble.
• 1:12:44
  Speaker 1: Well, Ron and Mark, thank you so much for joining
• 1:12:51
  Speaker 1: me today and for taking the time to share your
• 1:12:53
  Speaker 1: work and experiences at the Bradshaw Ranch. This has been
• 1:12:57
  Speaker 1: a fascinating conversation. And I really appreciate both of you
• 1:13:01
  Speaker 1: coming on and giving us a deeper look into the investigation.
• 1:13:05
  Speaker 1: the strange phenomenon you documented and some of the bigger
• 1:13:09
  Speaker 1: questions surrounding what may actually be happening there. So thank
• 1:13:13
  Speaker 1: you again for your time and sharing all of this
• 1:13:16
  Speaker 1: with me today. Appreciate it.
• 1:13:18
  Speaker 2: It's been a great pleasure.
• 1:13:20
  Speaker 4: Yes.
• 1:13:20
  Speaker 1: Thank you.