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Founder-First Philosophy Disrupts Asia: Why Adil Nurgozhin's Big Sky Capital Approach Works · The Inspired Stories Podcast

0:04
Welcome to another edition of the Inspired Stories podcast,
0:08
where leaders share their experiences so we can learn from
0:11
their successes and be inspired by how they've overcome
0:14
adversity. My name is Anthony Kotaspodi and
0:17
today's guest is Adil Nergosian, founding partner at Big Sky
0:21
Capital BC. His firm is dedicated to guiding
0:24
early stage startups towards success through a founder first
0:28
mentality with a $20 million fund one, they aim to support
0:34
entrepreneurs in emerging markets, particularly those
0:37
building powerful software and tech solutions.
0:40
The Big Sky Capital has been recognized for its innovative
0:43
approach, earning multiple accolades and helping founders
0:46
shape the future of industries like fintech and SAS.
0:50
The Deal himself brings a wealth of expertise from his previous
0:54
roles in venture capital and board membership, where he honed
0:58
skills in deal structuring, risk management, and fundraising.
1:02
His background includes an MBA from the University of Montana
1:06
and executive education from NC ADD, focusing on leading digital
1:11
transformation and innovation. Now before we get into all that
1:15
good stuff, today's episode is brought to you by my company,
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To find out if your company qualifies, contact us today at
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Add Back benefits.com. All right, back to our guest
1:46
today, the managing partner at Big Sky Capital.
1:49
Adeal, I appreciate you making the time to Share your story
1:51
today. Hey, good to see you, Anthony.
1:55
So Adeal, you've had a lot of experience investing and sitting
1:59
on the boards of different companies.
2:01
We're talking about Kazakhstan, Singapore, USA.
2:06
I'm curious what first sparked your interest in the world of
2:10
start-ups? Well, it kind of started all all
2:18
the way down, you know, all the way back to the university and
2:21
high school when we did all kind of interesting stuff in terms of
2:26
entrepreneurship experience was selling the newspapers on the
2:29
streets. And it's hard to imagine and it
2:32
sounds really, really something maybe you will see in retro
2:36
movies, but that was it. There was a there was a
2:41
newspaper named Caravan that was distributed just like that on
2:47
the streets where the cars were driving.
2:50
And one of my uncle just bought me like a bunch of bunch of
2:54
those newspapers, like 100 pieces and said, sell all this,
2:58
whatever my money make, it's all yours.
3:01
And then doing, you know, trying to buy wholesale watermelon
3:07
assembly, selling those by cutting all kind of stuff like
3:11
that. Very emerging markets, very
3:12
streets, very poor country at the time where I'm from in
3:16
Kazakhstan. And that was the early 90s when,
3:20
when, when everyone was doing something just to survive and to
3:24
put, you know, some bread on the table.
3:27
And that's how we grew up and we had to move all the time.
3:32
It becomes a habit and it becomes part of you and you just
3:34
continue, you know, So it's a. Poor environment.
3:38
You guys work hard just to put bread on the table.
3:40
Why was it you were moving around all the time?
3:42
Was there a safety issue? But it actually was, I mean, any
3:49
movie that you could see about Latin America, I guess it's
3:52
easier to imagine or, or any kind of Asian poor countries.
3:56
It was a very similar story in Kazakhstan at the time when the
4:00
Soviet Union collapsed, the country was in very deep crisis.
4:04
He had inflation of 1000% per year.
4:07
And sometimes we couldn't make it to the store with the money
4:10
that my mom gave me to buy a piece of bread.
4:14
And I have to ask the, the, you know, the, the shopkeeper to cut
4:19
it into health because my money was worth health.
4:22
We've gone through that. That's my dad was working three
4:26
jobs. He comes back at whatever he
4:28
comes back and then he takes our old Mazda on the streets and
4:31
drives all the way until 4:00 or 5:00 in the morning just to
4:36
bring something to the table. It was that kind of situation
4:40
that led, led to a formation if you wish.
4:46
But we have to just move, continue moving.
4:50
A lot of street fights, very different, different kind of
4:53
background. We grew up, but then all of a
4:55
sudden we discovered oil in Kazakhstan and in, you know, in
4:58
whatever three years situation changed everything start all of
5:02
a sudden developing 11% GDP growth and the whole thing
5:05
Skyrax and, and within one generation we saw poverty, we
5:11
saw crazy money. We saw as you know, skyscrapers
5:17
and all kind of developments and it's, it's all in one life.
5:23
So it was a lot of change and then there's no stability and I
5:27
guess you kind of get used to it, if that's possible.
5:31
When you used to do stuff, how old were?
5:34
You when the oil was discovered and things started to change
5:36
very rapidly. So the oil discovered was long
5:41
time ago, Soviet geologists did it, but never, no one, you know,
5:47
managed to put it into a capacity of a proper oilfield
5:51
development. Only few companies in the world
5:53
at the time possessed those technologies like Chevron, like
5:56
Conoco, like those big guys. So in in 1994 or 95, I don't
6:03
remember, their first contract was signed with the American
6:07
company Chevron at the time. And then within another three to
6:14
five years old, the rest of them came like you name it.
6:17
And I Italians, Koloko, Philip Shell, whatever, everyone
6:22
British federal and impacts Japanese, everyone and everyone
6:26
started to use. It's a very it it was at the
6:31
time very deep kind of oil, filthy when you have to drill
6:35
very deep and has its own complexities because oil is
6:39
heavy. It's not like Arab sweet or any
6:42
Brent or anything like that. It's very, it has a lot of
6:44
sulfur. How do you call sulfuric?
6:47
Was it sulfur serum, whatever, all kind of other chemicals that
6:52
makes it very difficult. Yeah, it's harder to, to get it
6:56
out from there. You, you need to do the
6:57
separation work, blah, blah, blah.
6:59
Anyway, so those companies start showing up, opening the offices
7:03
and drilling it and etcetera, finally proving it and putting
7:06
putting it properly to the balance by the drug standard to
7:10
whatever the standards they have in oil and gas.
7:12
And then finally the country start kind of pulling itself out
7:16
of the deep sheet that it was. I got myself into a into a
7:24
scholarship was Kazakh Turkish school that kind of kept me out
7:28
of the streets because they put us into the boarding school and
7:33
they taught us English and Turkish and other languages and
7:37
took care of us. Essentially was a charity
7:39
project at the time by by some Turkish foundation.
7:42
That you qualified? How did you get in?
7:47
I was in a regular public school and then they did all kind of
7:51
tests on us, which now I remember was way ahead of the
7:57
time. So if you know what is Gallup
7:59
test, they did something like that on to us.
8:03
Not only mathematics, English and all the science stuff that
8:07
you usually do on whatever 6th grade, 9th, 7th grade, but they
8:11
also do a proper psychological test and then identify, probably
8:15
identify the the other skills of leadership characteristics or
8:19
whatever something. And that was a big chunk of the,
8:24
you know, decision making process, an assessment.
8:29
And then that's how they identify those peaks.
8:32
I think because all of our, all of our alumni guys are all
8:37
successful. Not a single person failed in
8:41
their life. Not a.
8:41
Single so they identified some early threats and you said, hey,
8:44
these people, including Adele yourself, you know, you're,
8:48
you're well positioned for success, you're bright.
8:50
You, you know, you have these capabilities, get into this
8:52
boarding school that helps to set you up for future success
8:56
'cause they're teaching you the foundations of what you need to
8:58
know. They're teaching you foreign
8:59
languages. And so when you leave that
9:02
school, how did you eventually find yourself in sort of the
9:05
world of start-ups? Yeah, so, so I entered it in one
9:12
of, well, National University in Kazakhstan and then, but I only
9:18
studied the first year. I found it very boring.
9:22
My major was law, and then inside that was an international
9:27
law minor. I kind of got bored easily out
9:30
of that stuff. Then we were having a lot of
9:34
friends who did the used car business.
9:38
We did a lot of import, export operations from China.
9:42
Cheap, cheap cell phones, all kind of fake shit that that was
9:45
selling fast and cheap. I'd say it could take a signal.
9:49
All right. So, so we drove 300 kilometers
9:55
towards the border that we have with China and just smuggled it
9:59
in, took it from the smugglers and then went back to the city
10:03
and distributed and sold it. And then because my English was
10:07
allowing me to communicate with all the traders, that that was
10:10
very helpful. The other thing we did was we
10:13
opened the company trying to be closed with the foreigners who
10:19
entered the country. And then the in the, in the
10:22
airport, they had this special hall like whatever hallway VIP
10:26
or the VIP where they pass through all these fancy people
10:31
coming from world and gas and some other fancy companies.
10:35
They need a translator and they need the Butler to handle the,
10:39
you know, the, the luggages and make sure they they're in time,
10:42
blah, blah, blah. The chauffeur is in time.
10:45
So we organized that company that essentially provided such
10:50
services. You know, what you do is you
10:52
remember what this particular dude likes to drink, for
10:55
instance, A McCallum and he likes to read the Washington
10:59
Post. And then he has his own very
11:02
table and he comes 5 minutes before the departure, not not
11:05
earlier than that. He has one assistant that comes
11:08
like 20 minutes before handle the luggage, blah, blah, blah,
11:11
family lover, whomever. You have to know all the names
11:18
and you have to just make sure everyone's happy, put everything
11:20
in place. And when he shows up, says he
11:23
talks to you like maybe a second, but then he kind of gets
11:27
used to you as a as a part of interior, you know, and when you
11:31
when, when you're not there, he kind of misses you.
11:35
It's like, you know, the bottom on the on the particular place
11:38
of the toilet that even if you're half asleep, you still go
11:41
like push it and if you don't find it then something's wrong.
11:46
Something like that. So.
11:48
You're saying you were the you were the button or the handle on
11:50
the toilet? Yeah, yeah, whatever.
11:53
Yeah, toilet door or or a hanger that that is there, you know,
11:57
put your hat and you just throw it, you know it's there.
12:01
What if I'm not? There, I like that.
12:02
Better I I don't refer you. As a part of a toilet I think
12:05
maybe the yeah the hat hook. Yeah.
12:07
I, I, I, I don't, I don't like, I don't, I don't really.
12:10
I don't care. So so yeah.
12:14
And then if they're in a good mood, they'd call some fancy
12:18
deal that just gives you, you know, like 100 bucks tip, which
12:22
is like my monthly normal budget to leave, you know, that
12:28
includes rent and my food and whatever everything including my
12:32
fund. So all of a sudden I start
12:34
having money. I fired 3/3 of my fellow
12:39
students and four of us were serving all these people.
12:44
Most of the flights were at night.
12:46
So we work like shifts, you know, 24 hours.
12:50
You work in the airport, you never get out.
12:52
And then you pick a rest one day and then you go with another
12:55
shift. And we usually do double S
12:59
because at the peak when the Lufansa or KLM or American
13:04
Airlines or United, somebody lands large, it's impossible to
13:08
serve all of them and they need attention, those people.
13:12
So, so that kind of business we did, it brought a lot of money.
13:16
Actually it was pretty good. I bought myself an old used
13:19
Hyundai at the time pretty happy we we went clubbing, dating and
13:26
burning money the first time you had money in your.
13:28
Pocket, Yeah, and I mean just from the couple of stories that
13:31
you've. It was fun, yeah.
13:32
Clearly there's an entrepreneurial.
13:34
Yeah, I mean, you're smuggling stuff across the border, you
13:37
know. Yeah, cell phones and.
13:38
Yeah, yeah, all kind of shit. Yeah, this.
13:41
Yeah, all kind of stuff, I'm sure.
13:42
I eventually graduated. I eventually graduated the
13:45
university. In between I got a couple other
13:48
scholarships. State Department was at the time
13:51
and Source Foundation was distributing on the competition
13:56
base and the one year exchange program student whatever is
14:00
sponsored by by the taxpayers of the United States of America
14:03
pretty much. And then I got into dragged into
14:08
one of those programs. I somehow won it and they send
14:11
me all over to Montana and I was 18.
14:15
Oh no, I was 19. Yeah, I was 19, a sophomore year
14:21
student flying all over, all over and from from Kazakhstan.
14:27
First time in Manzana, I saw the plane for the first time that it
14:31
was a very long fucking flight. It took me, I don't know how
14:34
long, it took me two days to reach it's.
14:36
A long flight from Asia to the US.
14:38
Yeah, yeah. Then I made it to Montana that
14:42
way and it's hence that's where I met Jean, my partner now at
14:48
Big Sky Capital. And hence the Big Sky is the
14:51
name. It's a Big Sky country.
14:54
That that's how the the whole thing started developing, that
14:58
that place was one of the one of the one of the places.
15:02
John American or the national student as well.
15:07
He was an international. He was the first Kazakh who
15:09
arrived there even earlier, even weirder ways because he came in
15:14
when he was 16, right after the high school from a deep sheet
15:17
place called Taras, which is which is nobody knows that it
15:22
exists. Actually, it doesn't matter.
15:24
It's a dot on the on the spot 1. He was a capital of criminal
15:29
activities at the time. The gangs were fighting
15:31
everything and somebody's dead. So there was a, some kind of
15:37
church, one of those American churches, I don't even remember
15:43
what was the name of that church.
15:44
Anyway, so they, they took him in and he flew to Montana.
15:51
Parents were happy because he was off the streets and he
15:54
wouldn't get shot or stabbed. So whatever they sent him off,
16:00
gave him $200 in fucking go. He went to a high school, the
16:04
church sponsored that and somehow get into Montana
16:07
University. And then and then the story goes
16:10
from there and I arrived third year of his being him being
16:14
there or fourth year. By the time he's already applied
16:18
for citizenship or whatever, something else.
16:22
He he was no longer the member of that church.
16:24
He was a member of the athletic team of the university for I
16:28
don't even know for what for running.
16:30
I guess he cannot run really just he got in somehow.
16:36
It doesn't matter. It's just so that there was a
16:40
place to leave and, you know, he was, he was cleaning the toilet.
16:45
He was a janitor for the dorm. And they used to have a a room
16:51
down at the basement for those people who you can live for
16:54
free. There's a small window there,
16:56
but then you clean the toilets so you don't have to pay for the
17:00
dorm. Yeah, he survived that.
17:04
He was just one of those crazy survivors.
17:06
I was lucky year out of us too actually, because I'm still
17:12
winning some kind of scholarships and like I know
17:15
something whatever. So I arrived there we we met and
17:21
did all kinds of stuff there together that we become friends
17:24
and we kept in touch since then. Depends.
17:26
It doesn't matter what the distance was and.
17:28
So how did the idea you know come about for you and John to
17:32
start Big Sky Capital? What was the inspiration there?
17:38
So in between him and I, we did 7 or 8 ventures together out of
17:46
that in in last whatever since 2001.
17:50
So how many years passed? 24 years passed.
17:52
Yeah, 2024 years passed since then.
17:57
So we did whatever more loading, the moving with roofing,
18:02
whatever did the used car, exporting to Kazakhstan because
18:07
all those fancy big hammers at the time were becoming popular.
18:11
So what we did is we cut them half and then we brought them to
18:15
Kazakhstan. He sent them off and I met them
18:19
there at the customs. I took them and cleared them and
18:22
then we extended it and put the limousine parcel.
18:27
Yeah, yeah. And we?
18:29
A Hummer. Yeah, Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah,
18:32
yeah. We rented those for the weddings
18:35
and blah, blah, blah, stuff like that.
18:36
And then Toyota Camry is the most popular car in Kazakhstan.
18:41
You could it, it's better than the gold it was at the time.
18:47
Most reliable car, you can sell it anytime.
18:49
Most liquid never loses value, actually gains value all the
18:53
time. So we didn't have an official
18:57
dealership of Toyota at the time in the in the country.
19:00
So what was happening is I was just going there, buying,
19:04
collecting money like from all the neighbors, from whomever I
19:08
could get money, getting his money, my money combined
19:11
essentially crowdfunding and you know, getting like 1 used Camry
19:15
after another or used, used Highlander, whatever, whatever
19:20
used Toyotas. We could get a hands on in, in a
19:23
better shape and send it either from New Jersey ports or, or
19:26
Miami ports to Kazakhstan. And then I, I used to sell them
19:33
there and then send the money and then do the, the whole thing
19:36
again, stuff like that. Doing that.
19:39
Eventually we kind of separated our way.
19:42
So I went back to Kazakhstan, went to China for one year.
19:45
He was doing whatever he was doing.
19:47
He was always close to IT. His background is in IT.
19:52
And I was always on the investment side, deal side,
19:54
whatever. And then one day he called me in
19:57
2009. He says, well, so what's up?
20:00
What are you doing? I haven't seen you for some
20:01
time. And that was happening in
20:04
between. I was a, he married once and I
20:07
was his best man at that first wedding.
20:11
Then they got divorced. Whatever.
20:15
And then he calls me again and says blah blah blah.
20:18
So I have this crazy idea. Let's do a clown of LinkedIn in
20:23
2009 for for Asia. It was like, the fuck is
20:28
LinkedIn? It's just he sends me the link.
20:31
He says, take a look at this. So we're going to just fucking
20:34
copy it and then just do it in our language.
20:38
It's like OK. Specifically for SO.
20:39
What do you want me to? Do all of Asia was your thinking
20:42
or? We just we just started from
20:44
Kazakhstan because physically I'm there.
20:46
I mean in Central Asia and then Monkin, we named it Monkin.
20:51
Monkin in Kazakh and in all Turkic language mean means the
20:54
same opportunity. But it happens that in India,
20:57
Monkin is also means the same in Hindi.
21:01
You know, Hindi is a mix of Turkic languages and local
21:04
Hinduistic languages. The north of India was Turkic,
21:08
ruled by the Turkic empire at the time.
21:10
The our ancestors ruled the northern India.
21:13
That's how we become Muslim and become what they is now for 300
21:17
years. Anyway.
21:18
So he changed the language. It's the same.
21:19
It's our word essentially that works the same way there.
21:22
And that's the part of the story.
21:24
So he says this is a startup bro.
21:27
It's like the fuck is startup, you know?
21:30
Explained I got. All these hustles that you guys.
21:33
Had Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
21:35
He said, he said he he said it doesn't matter.
21:37
It's just an online business. We need to fundraise.
21:40
It's like, OK, what do you want me to do?
21:43
Yeah, help me to fundraise. OK, No problem.
21:47
Are you in? Yeah.
21:47
I mean, what do you want me to do?
21:48
One more time. OK.
21:49
We register the company in Delaware and and start
21:52
fundraising. We managed to raise almost
21:57
$500,000, only 17%. Yeah, I'll explain.
22:02
I'll tell you now, sorry you guys for 17% of the company.
22:06
'S ever heard of you? You've never done this.
22:08
We're nobody. Yeah, we're nobody.
22:10
Yeah. Well, in between, yeah, in
22:13
between all that stuff. So he was doing his IT business,
22:17
IT growing his IT career. He he become a product manager
22:20
in IT got all the fancy letters after his last name, you know
22:25
the all the 16 months old certifications blah, blah, blah.
22:30
Building a splendid career in Citrix Ultimate Software, maybe
22:34
an hour all the time in ITI was shifting towards investments
22:39
after China went back to Montana, did my MBA that time
22:42
without him. And then I came back and start
22:46
getting into myself into an investment part of it since so,
22:53
so since whatever 2005 and 2009 we didn't meet and all that
22:57
stuff happening. I, I was a junior associate and
23:01
then a senior associate in the private equity firm.
23:04
I already understood the the the modelling, blah, blah, blah,
23:08
everything else like that. I started applied for CFA
23:13
because everyone else was doing it.
23:14
I don't know why or whatever. I just did the first stage
23:18
because I understood it was useful.
23:20
Then I just gave up. Doesn't make sense to me to have
23:23
that whatever it was boring. It's for it's for different type
23:28
of personality. It was for analytical type of
23:31
people. I'm not, I'm not necessarily
23:34
that kind of person. I can analyze but I don't want
23:36
to seek all the time. You need to be up moving.
23:40
So anyway, so he he. Making things happen, yeah.
23:43
Yeah, yeah, yeah, I got to be. I got to be doing something like
23:47
that. Fun, fun stuff.
23:50
So, so anyway, so he, he came to me with this idea and then 2010
23:55
I said, bro, I cannot pull it out without you.
23:57
You got to come here. It's your idea.
23:58
You're the main founder. What do you want me to sell?
24:01
Like I don't even fucking understand how it works.
24:05
And then he, he introduced me everything.
24:08
The, the IT part, I didn't understand the business part, of
24:11
course I understand and the, the modeling and everything else.
24:14
So I drafted the business plan kind of stuff like first
24:18
financial model, blah, blah, blah, packaged it into a a
24:21
somewhat, you know, you know, somewhat reasonable data room
24:27
type of stuff. And then he came over, he moved
24:29
his family and that time he married.
24:30
The second time I'm at home, the younger one says goodnight.
24:39
Yeah, yeah, goodnight. Yeah.
24:43
So, so, so we came in and he he I said just move back bro move
24:49
Kazakhstan. You're a citizen already.
24:51
It doesn't hurt you nothing. You have the right passport.
24:53
Just come and let's try fundraising.
24:56
If you fundraise, it happened to have some cash, then you stay.
25:00
If not, then you go back. You do whatever.
25:03
It's OK. He comes for summer and I just,
25:08
you know, lift it up all in whomever I could get my hands on
25:11
and start talking to everyone and pitching.
25:14
Every time we pitch, we just change the presentation change.
25:17
It change got got through like 300 people.
25:22
Every fucking contact I could get my hands on.
25:25
We ended up having one Hungarian guy.
25:30
I don't know how good dude I get that guy.
25:32
But anyway, his name was Sardor and the son Shandor, and he used
25:36
to work in Kazakhstan. He did.
25:38
He was selling medical equipment.
25:39
I don't know why I know him. Anyway, I just pitched him.
25:42
He said I like the idea, let me put on some cash.
25:46
And since that European dude put first whatever 30,000 he put in,
25:51
it become easier because we packaged it really well.
25:54
Because it's a Delaware company in America.
25:56
You have one American dude with me.
25:58
Whatever I do doesn't matter because I'm a second Co founder
26:02
with the smaller shares. And then and then we we give a
26:06
little bit of shares to one of John's bosses in he was at the
26:11
time in Miami and AB and AMRA Bank for free, whatever, so that
26:15
we could show his kind of like fancy face on every
26:19
presentation. Yeah, because who we are, I
26:22
mean, like, whatever. And it was an experimental
26:26
thought. We we thought it would be nice
26:28
to have this kind of person on behind us for the sake of it.
26:33
And I didn't know that that was the right thing to do.
26:36
It was just an experiment and it worked out well.
26:40
So I sell that guy's like old fancy white face.
26:43
And then these guys, American Passport and this Hungarian dude
26:48
putting some cash, all of a sudden Catholic people said, OK,
26:51
seems like he was selling something fans.
26:53
And that's how we kind of chips in and got a lot of people
26:57
involved and collected. Not at once, not at once.
27:03
It took us, took us like a year maybe of humiliation to get
27:09
somebody. There's like residency that's
27:12
just woven into your DNA because, I mean, you know, the
27:16
stories that you're telling here, you pitched 300 people,
27:20
you know, growing up in the tough streets, you know, you
27:24
know, being concerned for your safety, just, you know, having
27:27
to cut down like a piece of bread in half because that's,
27:31
you know, because of the inflation.
27:32
That's all you were, you know, able to afford in that moment.
27:36
So there's from these hard life experiences and you know, from
27:40
your parents, I'm guessing too, like there's a, there's a
27:43
definitely a threat of resiliency here where you know,
27:46
you, you're just tough, like you just bounce back and you, you
27:49
kind of scrape through the hard stuff.
27:51
We just this, this is this was our reality and you just I don't
27:56
think we necessarily realized it or anyhow reflected on this and
28:02
I don't think we actually thought about it now neither
28:06
just part of the part of life. You just continue whatever.
28:09
It doesn't matter. We're savages.
28:12
This is our background. Both of us are coming from this
28:14
part of the world. And then we, we don't mind.
28:17
We don't mind, you know, admitting it.
28:19
We we are comfortable saying it. And you mean that you're we
28:22
don't give a? Shit.
28:25
Oh, because we are. I mean, we're.
28:29
What is that word to you? We are, we've gone through all
28:38
kind of stuff. It doesn't necessarily and we
28:41
survived and the the stats statistics of our generation
28:46
surviving in the generation that was like 3-5 years older than
28:51
us, surviving on the street. It's like whatever, after that
28:58
you don't, you don't care anymore.
29:00
It just continues. We're not polite.
29:04
We're not. We don't care about all the
29:07
touchy feeling things, all the new newly concepts.
29:11
They don't stick to us because it doesn't matter.
29:14
End of the day, you show everything by doing.
29:19
And we don't mind talking to anybody like we don't give a
29:22
shit. I can talk to Bush.
29:24
I can talk to Trump. I can't.
29:25
I I don't care. You're not.
29:27
Intimidating. There is no authority.
29:30
They're just. People Nah, nothing.
29:32
It doesn't matter. It, it just doesn't matter.
29:37
It doesn't click. There's nothing to land on there
29:41
'cause I don't have even. It's coming from a level of
29:46
arrogancy, I guess. And then because we don't know
29:52
who this person is and what he's done and what was at the time
29:56
Harvard and what does whatever he because we don't know, it was
30:00
easier for us to just keep moving, if you know what I mean.
30:05
A. Little bit and I also think
30:06
there's probably an element and tell me if I'm right here that I
30:10
mean you, you, you stared, you know, death in the face.
30:13
I mean the, the upbringing that you're describing here, it's
30:17
it's pretty rough. And so after that it's like,
30:21
what is there to be afraid of? I, I survived the hard stuff
30:24
having conversations with these, you know, wealthy people, these
30:28
well educated people that that doesn't bother me.
30:32
I've, I've looked at a gun, I've looked at a knife.
30:33
I've am I right here? Am I, am I sort of wrapping my
30:36
head around sort of your life experience?
30:38
Yeah. Pretty pretty much, I guess
30:40
pretty much I, we don't necessarily talk about it much,
30:44
but that was what it was. OK, so.
30:48
So, yeah, so. So that was part of it, I guess.
30:53
So I, I want to make sure that we carve out enough time here to
30:55
talk about what you're doing with Big Sky cap.
30:57
So, so tell me what's what was the idea behind starting this?
31:00
What is it that you guys are doing?
31:05
So, so after we kind of met with this didn't go well, Munkin
31:12
there, we raised the last cash from the 1 Indian millionaire
31:16
family. We tried to launch it in India.
31:19
John was flying to Delhi for quite some time.
31:21
I was flying there. We were way ahead of the time
31:24
because India that time had only call centres at all.
31:27
They had not much. It didn't even fucking
31:31
understand what we were doing. So we fucked it up.
31:33
We lose our money, we went our own waste again.
31:37
He went back to Miami broke, spend all his money like couple
31:41
years in Kazakhstan. Whatever he saved I, I have to
31:45
restart my own career again, which I did.
31:50
And then after after a while I joined the venture capital fund
31:56
because my background was that this actually helped to get the
31:59
job with the venture capital fund.
32:00
Afterwards the night to BF New York headquartered venture fund
32:05
with some Russian Jews and some some other some European Jews,
32:10
like bunch of Jews. I don't know why I was there,
32:12
but they got me hired. I was representing them and then
32:16
helped them to raise first fund. Second fund.
32:18
I got into AVC full full fledge already by 2000, like 11 after
32:25
we fucked up the moonkin start up and I was building a career,
32:30
I become a partner with them. I got already 2 funds under
32:32
management La La la. I got invited into national
32:35
welfare fund. I'm squeezing everything in a
32:37
very short period of time. Anyway, I used to work as AC
32:42
level executive at National welfare welfare fund doing again
32:46
investments and digitalization, whatever.
32:49
Then I quit my career there in 2021.
32:52
I called him again. I said, yeah, what's up?
32:57
He says he's married by the time, already have three kids.
33:01
I think I had four. Yeah, I was.
33:05
Yeah, I had four that time already called him up.
33:07
I said, I'm looking at your pictures here on Instagram.
33:10
You're fucking bored, bored, bored in that Miami of yours.
33:15
Like all they do, your your all you do is drinking some
33:21
smoothies lying down on the beach.
33:23
I cannot imagine anything more boring than that.
33:27
It says, yeah, I'm bored, what's up?
33:30
Because I decided to do my own fun.
33:33
It's like, OK, I'm in. That was that was a
33:36
conversation. And.
33:38
He's like he's. Like, and then we, you know,
33:43
interesting part, the things that I thought he already did or
33:50
vice versa. So it's like I start discussing
33:55
something he says, OK, I, I do this.
33:59
I do do. It's not like it's not like I
34:01
have to explain shit. Tiny was right as well.
34:05
He was already doing all right, saved enough, you know, invested
34:10
enough, real estate was good, whatever.
34:12
Everything was fine in his comfort zone.
34:15
But he was bored. And I know him really well.
34:19
It's not good when he's bored, something bad happens to him.
34:26
So I called him up. I said, OK, bro, let's do it.
34:29
And then he says I'm in. And he says, OK, I'm let me fly
34:32
into Miami and let's catch up. I, I flew in, He lives in Fort
34:38
Lauderdale estate like a week or so.
34:43
We were drafted the, the first teaser presentation and
34:46
etcetera, went through all our options in terms of structuring,
34:51
blah, blah, blah, everything else.
34:53
And the name, the name Big Sky Capital came in from a Big Sky
34:58
country where we from, from Montana, because he spent five
35:03
years of his most important time of his life there.
35:06
And for me, it was very important because I also meet my
35:08
wife during my NBA years there and brought, brought her from
35:12
there. We spent, I spent four years
35:14
there. All in all, he spent like five
35:17
years. That's, that's our country and
35:21
it's important. And we like the people there and
35:24
every single of them, every single of them was kind enough
35:28
to support us. And many of them, and we
35:30
remember all of them by name, all of them supported us in many
35:34
different ways to people from from nowhere, you know, and
35:40
then, you know, many, many things.
35:43
Somebody got us a scholarship, somebody gave us a place to
35:46
stay, somebody got us a job. Somebody just took care of us.
35:51
You know, there is just so many people that took care of us in
35:55
that particular place. And very kind people, very, very
36:01
honest people, very, very hard, hard working people that some of
36:07
them were very, very religious as well.
36:08
But those are the people who build America.
36:10
People don't understand who build America.
36:12
Those people build America. And if you think about it, yeah.
36:18
So it's important that that is that is where we're from, not
36:23
only Kazakhstan, but also also from there.
36:26
And that's that's our story. Yeah.
36:28
That's that's that's that's why it's a Big Sky country.
36:30
And he was he wasn't even discussed.
36:33
I said the name will be the sky capital.
36:35
He says, yeah, OK, I got it. And and we start fundraising
36:41
again. 2021 the the fucking the worst time to fund the like it
36:49
was a stupid idea actually yeah yeah just come out from the
36:53
COVID and the market shrunk and went into the into the VC winter
36:59
2223 and we were fundraising fundraising all 22 again going
37:05
through another 300 humiliating meeting.
37:09
How did you get your? First one, your first investor
37:11
for Big Sky. It's all our relations and our
37:16
all our human capital. If you wish our our reputation
37:23
by the time close people already former bosses, bosses, bosses,
37:29
you know, high net worth individuals, family, family
37:33
offices structured in a way a lot of them are people who know
37:41
them know us for whatever years already.
37:44
It's like for friends and family.
37:45
Same, same stuff as start-ups. Like this is a big message for
37:48
us. The start-ups think those VCs
37:51
are fancy sometimes route some sometimes whatever investors and
37:55
blah, blah, blah. There's this flur of, you know,
38:00
of a fancy investors, some, you know, some kind of image there,
38:07
but we're doing the same stuff. We're essentially working in a,
38:13
in a, in a sandwich environment if you wish, because we have
38:16
fundraising on one side and we have to deploy on the other side
38:20
and our investors are actually more difficult to deal with.
38:25
More difficult than. The it's not, no.
38:31
Our investors are more difficult to deal with than the typical
38:34
VCs because VCs at least know what the fuck you're doing and
38:37
what is startup and stuff. And now investors have no idea.
38:42
And there's a lot of education to do, a lot of patience to do,
38:45
a lot of babysitting to do, a lot of listening to do, and a
38:49
lot of egos to deal with and, and all kinds of stories we have
38:54
to go through, especially in the beginning.
38:57
The institutional is another thing.
38:58
You have to be very patient, very diligent, very there's a
39:02
lot of chasing to do. There's usually like 2 years of
39:05
chasing before you close anything from there maybe
39:07
sometimes three years. So, so for start-ups, they need
39:12
to understand this. This is the message is it's not
39:16
that easy. It's we are also entrepreneurs
39:19
same way as they are, but we have a pressure from up and we
39:24
have a pressure from down and we are right in the middle of it.
39:27
We don't mind. We enjoy it a lot.
39:29
That's another thing we like paying.
39:31
Probably because you grew up with.
39:33
I don't know. But it's just part of you now.
39:36
Yeah, probably. Probably.
39:37
Yeah, probably. Yeah.
39:39
So what's the investment? Piece of the deal.
39:41
Like what? What are you guys aiming to do?
39:43
What kinds of companies do you look to invest in?
39:48
Yeah, so, so, so we decided not to, you know, not to go too
39:54
fancy and just do what we understand the most.
39:59
The, the, the prior to Big Sky Capital, the funds what I used
40:04
to work with all B to B always was and is.
40:09
So since 2011 to 2021, ten years, I was investing in B to B
40:14
always another B to B SAS vertical SAS Enterprise
40:16
solutions. I understand it really well.
40:20
And Jean, it happens that he was selling B to B on the IT site to
40:27
large, large, you know, customers like Facebook, like
40:32
whatever and he was managing the teams within the B to B
40:35
environment and etcetera, etcetera.
40:36
It was very easy for us to decide what what we want to do.
40:43
So, yeah, so we just decided and it was kind of consistent as
40:47
well with both of our experiences.
40:51
He understands enterprise software really well because
40:55
he's been doing it, he's been managing teams there, he's been
40:57
developing it and deploying it and etcetera, etcetera.
41:00
On that side. My site was investing into this
41:03
thing and actually making exits out of them.
41:08
Vertical size goes the same way. It's just the number of clients
41:12
is larger and the tickets is smaller and you happen to sell
41:15
it over over subscription. All of these have been under
41:20
pressure and disruption was AI and multi agent and everything
41:25
else. But fundamentally B to B cycle
41:29
sales cycle doesn't change. Why do you say?
41:31
They've been under pressure because of AI.
41:33
Is it because it's so easy for, well, because editors to
41:36
replicate what you're doing? It's just the most of the
41:43
solutions that are present in the market have a certain legacy
41:47
to, to deal with in terms, both in terms of technology, which is
41:52
obsolete by now, in terms of the forces, both in Salesforce and
41:59
you know, and then IT people and everything that cannot be
42:03
rethought and retrained fast. That's why it's just easier to
42:07
get rid of them all together. And then that's, that's another
42:10
thing. And that's, you know, AI is
42:11
coding for you. It's designing the architecture
42:15
for you in taking care of all the workflow, all the processes
42:21
for you. And that is a big, big, big
42:26
chunk of the work that you used to do.
42:28
Coding, actually programming quality checking, making sure
42:34
the perimeter is safe or blah, blah.
42:36
All that work is already being disrupted now and, and the pace
42:41
is too high and etcetera, etcetera.
42:42
So, So what we have done is we, we kind of saw it coming.
42:48
We decided to keep ourselves away in Big Sky from all the the
42:53
hype and the, the buzz and all that big game that big guys were
42:57
doing in terms of infrastructure play, you know all these big
43:00
models, language models and etcetera.
43:02
Because you cannot compete there with the with the ticket tickets
43:05
that you have. We decided to wade through and
43:09
go after niches again, B to B, and go deep in verticals, in
43:15
unique data sets in the industry, expertise in
43:19
peculiarities and minute differences that actually make
43:24
the difference, that actually make it by a cell kind of can.
43:28
You give me an example. Well, I can give you an example.
43:34
So, so, so we've invested in the company a guy his name is Artom,
43:43
he's Ukrainian also a savage that somehow arrived illegally
43:47
here by not here in the United States state coated all did all
43:52
kind of shit and then landed on this farm all right in, in in
43:57
Northern California dairy farm with a bunch of 25,000 cows do
44:02
milking whatever and just was helping them with some, you
44:07
know, backlog issues and then, you know, doing some work with
44:14
servers and stuff like that. Nothing, nothing really special.
44:17
But then he started looking at it.
44:19
He figured, though, there's business processes involved.
44:21
OK, and then then the cows tend to get ill.
44:24
They they're in a different mood and whatever if you don't clean
44:29
them. Well, something like everything,
44:31
everything, everything. Well, every small thing affects
44:34
the the the amount, the gallons of milk that you can, you know,
44:39
get from the cow end of the day and that exactly your bottom
44:43
line afterwards. So, so he, and he's a typical IT
44:51
nerd, right? Like, wait, he looks like one
44:54
actually very thing, like, you know, with the glasses and
44:57
stuff. And he got yourself cameras, got
45:01
got an open code platform, start coding and figured out the
45:05
computer vision part of it. Start collecting data.
45:07
Just put like first five cameras everywhere and then put another
45:12
10 collecting data. The task was to to to get as
45:18
much data as possible, put it through your model and analyze
45:22
all the inefficiencies and all the discrepancies and all the
45:25
problems that are in the business process.
45:27
End of the day that might affect the the the business.
45:32
So like how often you clean the cow and what makes the cow sort
45:36
of upset? Everything the people.
45:38
Who are acting with the? Turns out everything through
45:40
every. Place in an efficient manner
45:42
like these kinds of. Things OK, turns out all that
45:45
stuff effects and then this particular in this particular
45:49
farm, because of the relations that he already built, they
45:52
allowed him to do it within one kind of box.
45:55
I don't know how you call this thing where certain amount of
45:58
cows can feed it. And he proved it by the pilot
46:01
that if you eliminate many places human being, which is
46:05
actually the problem and the cause of all the illness and the
46:10
and the cause of violence and cause of all kind of issues,
46:13
actually cow will be happier and it will give you more milk.
46:17
And he proved it by the numbers that this thing can actually
46:21
increase your bottom line to 10 to 12%.
46:25
That's a lot. Yes.
46:26
And then, yeah. And then and then he raised
46:29
money on that. He figured, OK, I'm, I'm going
46:32
on to something. The most important part is I
46:37
looked at his cap table when we found the guy and we have this
46:41
advantage, right? We know every goddamn founder
46:44
from Central Asia, from our part of the world, from Ukraine, from
46:49
Russia, from Belarusia, from wherever that that's our domain.
46:54
We know all of them. We know how to talk to them, we
46:56
know their psychology, we know what to do with the buses and
46:58
whatever. And then usually they're really
47:02
good technically, strong technical background, they know
47:06
the product really well. Good engineers, really bad
47:10
communication skills like this suck actually just I don't know
47:17
that's that's the package you always get the same.
47:20
Shit, that's, that's where you guys come in, right?
47:23
This is part of your skill. Set yes, that's what we do we
47:26
communicate yeah, yeah. So so we we got the guy in I
47:32
look at his cap table. Turns out all this, you know,
47:36
Scrooge, greedy farmers and owners chipped in everyone 20
47:45
you know 30K and funded the guy. That's the best funding you can
47:51
ever get. That's best better than VC,
47:54
that's better than any kind of funding.
47:56
This is the real industry funding that will comes with an
47:59
expertise, with a network, with all kinds of stuff.
48:02
So when I saw that I said OK we're in, doesn't matter.
48:05
Can you give me like 2 telephone numbers I can talk to?
48:09
So he gave me this old dude from Wyoming was a large farm there.
48:13
And he gave me this original guy from California whom I talked
48:17
to. And these guys are third
48:19
generation farmers that do only one thing for all this time,
48:22
right? They said, listen, the, the, you
48:27
know, Long story short, he saves me money and my bottom line is
48:33
growing. I don't know how he does it.
48:35
I don't understand fuck how he does it doesn't matter.
48:37
He, he, he know, he knows this he, he knows.
48:41
And it's not only him. They're like a team of people.
48:44
By the time whatever, 6-7 people.
48:48
So I said, this is it, this. I don't need anything else.
48:51
I don't need to confirm anything.
48:53
I just what else you need here is the first check and we
48:55
organize a small round of funding whatever first meal,
48:59
second meal, whatever. Now that is something that AI
49:04
will never be able to do fast because there is a lot of a lot
49:09
of industry specific details, knowledge, nuances that comes
49:16
only with meticulous collection of the data, analyzing and
49:21
putting it through all the models and gives you like at
49:24
least 2-3 years of head start. That's fascinating.
49:27
And it doesn't matter how fancy, how fancy Facebook you are, you
49:31
can be 10 * 10 times whatever. Open AI, it doesn't matter.
49:38
Doesn't matter because you don't know the little.
49:40
Bit of a Moat here because of the the depth of knowledge that
49:44
you now have with the industry and all the data that has been
49:48
collected to sort of inform the models on.
49:52
Here are the inefficiencies, and here's how to fix them.
49:57
Yeah, yeah. It's very, very important.
49:58
And that's the play we do. That's how we differentiate.
50:02
We go very deep into the verticals and we dig it, dig it,
50:07
dig it until we understand it that we like the industries that
50:10
are kind of not being disrupted yet because everything you know
50:15
what happens, you know, all the IT comes into into the place
50:19
where it is already is usually because it's a pathway that is
50:24
easier to do. And then they he comes and he
50:26
says blah, blah, blah. I have better features on faster
50:29
and cheaper whatever, but you actually should avoid that.
50:33
You should go different places where where there is a value,
50:38
where there is a value, where there is a value.
50:41
So we do that. We do that and we look for those
50:45
like, you know, bunch of like whatever toilet, public toilet
50:49
managers, if you have like 20,000 of them all across the
50:52
country, you're all client. We have to figure out how to
50:56
make it efficient, works better, blah, blah, blah.
50:58
And if we can optimize on if you, if we have people like you
51:02
all over the world who are willing to pay for this shit,
51:04
yes, whatever. See what I mean?
51:07
Much. So tell me about the founders
51:10
first mentality, why this is so important to you.
51:16
Because, well, first of all, we were in the scheme many, many,
51:22
many, many types. And second of all, it's the
51:29
matter of well, well, you know, founders are very lonely people,
51:37
like really lonely people. And, and, and they're lonely
51:44
because because nobody sometimes believes them or trust their
51:52
work and, and it's really hard to communicate and etcetera.
51:57
They have a lot of lot of issues like that.
52:00
And there should be a person who's going to be able to, well,
52:04
first of all, listen, understand the second of all, support not
52:09
by words, not by tapping on the shoulder, but actually with
52:13
action, with cash, with, with something that is real tangible.
52:17
And, and, and because he is actually betting more, he is
52:24
more courageous. He is stronger, is many, many
52:29
ways better than us, because if you look at it, we are, we are
52:34
cowards that we, we are not doing what he does or we are
52:38
less intelligent or we are lacking something.
52:42
If you think about it that way, you will understand that this
52:45
guy some way better than you, definitely better.
52:50
And if he's better, you might as well learn something AB you
52:53
might as well help and support and they help him to flourish.
52:58
And that's something we kind of enjoy that that's the
53:05
understanding because we, we, we were lucky because we always
53:08
have each other to bounce off because we lost money together
53:12
before we fought for money, whatever it was all kind of shit
53:16
we went through. And we were lucky because we we
53:21
can still communicate it and it's not because of anything.
53:25
It just happened like that, you know, stars aligned, if you
53:29
wish, whatever something. And it's very rare.
53:32
And whereas whereas usually the CEO and the main guy who needs
53:41
to make a decision, he and the end of the days kind of left
53:46
alone in the room to decide. And that's the burden.
53:53
And then we respect that, we respect that, we admire that and
53:56
I think we are there to try helping.
53:59
Is this an uncommon mentality in Asia your part of the world?
54:07
It is overall failure is a problem, as you know, I mean,
54:11
I'm in Asia now fully right. I, I spend a year helping in, in
54:15
China. My wife is Japanese and I know
54:19
this Asian mentality by now really well, but it's not only
54:24
here. It's in, in Southeast Asian
54:26
Asian and Central Asian Asian are somewhat similar, except for
54:29
Kazakh. Kazakh a little bit weird
54:31
because we missed too much, but but it's there is this.
54:37
People don't like faylor. They don't accept faylor.
54:39
They, they, they kind of blame you for that and they kind of
54:46
don't forgive that, if you know what I mean.
54:49
They don't like mistakes and it's it's like that in the city,
54:54
in the school like that, it's in the families like that and
54:58
everywhere in the society. So did you face some of that
55:01
when your LinkedIn clone was unsuccessful with your
55:05
investments? Well, I, I, well, I lost half of
55:08
my people, half of my friends and half of my mentors,
55:12
whatever, whatever that was. And that's it.
55:18
They, they got. People don't like to lose.
55:21
I mean, nobody likes to lose. It's just, it's just the how can
55:26
I say cannot accept it maybe. Are you more accepting of it?
55:32
Is that part of what forms this bond with the the founders that
55:36
you invest in because you've been through it just like they
55:39
have? I think so.
55:45
I can relate to that. I had definitely understand it's
55:47
not pleasant when when when everyone says you're wrong and
55:53
sometimes rudely tells you right into your face, hopefully in a
55:58
polite, kind manner, which is most of the time not the case.
56:03
They actually tell you you're fool and you know you're not and
56:08
there's a conflict there and they're really not pleasant at
56:12
all. See like.
56:15
Say more about the differences in kind of leadership style
56:18
between the West and Asia that you know, you you've had
56:22
experience in kind of both sides of the pond.
56:25
What? What differences do you see
56:27
there? See, W is too big of a term.
56:33
I think it's the only concerns two countries, yeah, US and in
56:37
to the certain extent, Australia.
56:40
US and Australia. The West W that is in Europe,
56:43
those Westerners are different type of people, yeah.
56:50
And and how would you categorize the difference between like what
56:53
the US and the Australians are like with leadership styles
56:55
versus what you've experienced in Asia?
57:01
Well, if you just dig in into history, you will understand it
57:05
easier because those are the second sons, essentially the
57:10
pirates, the most adventurous out of them, the most, the
57:13
boldest, the the most courageous.
57:17
Those people were already under pressure.
57:21
Those people were unneeded. Those people were already
57:26
deprived from something and therefore they put themselves
57:31
into the ships and boats and crossed the oceans and made it
57:34
to far, far away places to restart the life again.
57:39
And that mentality is not, it's not in Europe.
57:44
You don't find it in Europe. It doesn't exist.
57:48
It's only, it's only in few places like Australia and the
57:53
US. So, so, yeah.
58:00
And and that, that that is, that is not true for Spanish people
58:05
for instance, or French people, or I travelled extensively all
58:09
across Europe. I know those people never move
58:12
their ass from one place. They're going to sit there for
58:14
seven generations in the same castle if they can, or near the
58:18
castle or whatever, they'll be totally fine and happy with
58:21
that. And those who left the the, the
58:26
the mainland and made it, made it imagine in whatever 16th
58:31
century on the boat to US, those are something very interesting.
58:37
Those are the strongest. And this is a completely
58:41
different mentality. It's only as I say, it's very
58:43
few places in the world has it. So, so that's the difference.
58:50
The whole the rest of the world doesn't work like that.
58:53
Asia as well, like majority of Asian people stay in Asia, most
58:58
of it 99.99999 and whatever percent all of them are there.
59:04
So you're saying the people who sort of have the the gumption,
59:08
the courage, maybe the restlessness to move from their
59:12
safe home base, there's something in them, there's
59:14
something in that DNA that gets passed along that allows them to
59:18
be sort of bigger risk takers, bigger movers, bigger shakers.
59:25
Yes, I in the that's the culture that was in that's how America
59:30
become America. That's that's what is driving
59:35
the whole thing and will continue driving.
59:38
It's not American Dream per SE. It's a it's a those people from
59:45
that they couldn't fit in the boxes where they are, you know,
59:49
from the beginners. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
59:53
And that, that's the that's the essence.
59:55
And then that that essence went into the value system and the
59:58
value system turned into a country.
1:00:01
And then then they declared themselves a nation.
1:00:04
It's not a typical nation per SE, as you know.
1:00:06
It's just a bunch of people from a bunch of different places in
1:00:09
the world. The ultimate melting pot.
1:00:11
That's it. Adeel, I've just got one more
1:00:13
question for you. But before I ask it, I want to
1:00:15
let people know the best way to get in touch with you or to
1:00:17
follow your story. What would that be?
1:00:22
I'm on Facebook and LinkedIn. I don't have a Instagram, TikTok
1:00:27
or or Twitter. Nothing.
1:00:30
Just a little too much for me and.
1:00:32
We'll direct people to your website as well, which is Big
1:00:34
Sky capital.ceo.co. So last question for you, Adele,
1:00:41
as you kind of look, I don't know where we are now and where
1:00:45
we're heading in the next, call it, two years.
1:00:48
What are the trends that you're most excited to keep an eye on
1:00:52
and to be a part of? We want to continue investing
1:01:01
into our emerging market founders.
1:01:08
We can see how the development accelerates so fast that the
1:01:13
borders don't matter anything anymore.
1:01:15
It doesn't matter. We can see that our founders are
1:01:19
competitive from this part of the world creating really cool
1:01:23
stuff, never being, never use the plane and that that is that
1:01:29
is so cool. Like they just sit there, they
1:01:32
know already, they know all the models, they have a good
1:01:36
mathematical skills and etcetera and they start doing it from
1:01:39
here and they are competitive already day one.
1:01:43
And that's what's driving me a lot.
1:01:45
I can see that happening a lot more and more and that is
1:01:50
something we've been kind of working on as a part of the
1:01:53
ecosystems in this emerging markets and drives that drive us
1:01:57
a lot because you actually make an impact.
1:02:00
Five years ago in Central Asia, there was no such thing as
1:02:04
venture funds. I created the first 3 when I was
1:02:09
at the National Welfare Fund and we created the Astana hub, the
1:02:14
the IT hub, there was nothing. And now they, they export like
1:02:20
up close to a billion dollars worth of IT services and we
1:02:26
close annually, we close like $250 million worth of deals.
1:02:31
It's all, it's all small tickets and very early stage blah, blah,
1:02:36
blah. But it didn't exist.
1:02:38
It didn't exist at all. Like, if you think about it
1:02:43
like, wow, that was fast. And then and then now you hear
1:02:49
three of our founders came into the valley and one raced around
1:02:54
within whatever two weeks was general catalyst for his new
1:02:58
model. And then the two guys that I
1:03:00
know grew up on my eyes. The 22 years old dude just
1:03:05
closed the third round was a valuation of 120 million, was
1:03:09
his AI model from my hometown. And All in all, it's only, it's
1:03:16
only what 13 months passed from the day he started the launch he
1:03:20
started. He's like, wow, that is really
1:03:25
cool. That means our talent is
1:03:27
competitive. That means our guys are smart
1:03:30
and and bold and encourages and talented and competent.
1:03:36
And they moved already in in the Silicon Valley.
1:03:39
I can tell you it's that's your model that's that's very
1:03:44
inspired. Advantage built in, and that
1:03:46
you're getting access to talent that the rest of the world has
1:03:49
just been ignoring. Yes.
1:03:53
And we'll continue doing so. That's our arbitrage.
1:03:55
That's where we we came, where we came from, where we coming
1:03:58
from and we'll continue doing so.
1:04:00
And then in Southeast Asia, for instance, I have 700 million
1:04:03
people population. Nobody knows nobody, nobody
1:04:06
hears about. And it happens that they're
1:04:09
developing like 6-7 percent annually.
1:04:11
And it happens that 35% of this population is young and, and you
1:04:19
know, most of them already know English and the whole thing is
1:04:23
moving so fast. You have no idea how fast.
1:04:26
And there aren't many places in the world that that, that both
1:04:30
understandable, comprehendible for our minds and our values and
1:04:35
etcetera, but also growing at the same time and will continue
1:04:39
growing for another 30 years and has laws and regulations
1:04:44
etcetera, etcetera. Many, many factors are coming in
1:04:46
together now and they're in two places in the world is Central
1:04:49
Asia and Southeast Asia, Central Asia 85,000,000 and Southeast
1:04:53
Asia is 700 million. Africa we don't know nothing
1:04:57
about, like no white person or no Kazakh person or no European
1:05:02
understands nothing about Africa, whatever they say.
1:05:06
No Chinese person understands Africa.
1:05:10
You have to be, you have to be African to understand Africa.
1:05:16
And Africa is actually very different.
1:05:17
For instance, you know, Eastern Africa or West Africa and
1:05:21
whatever South Africa, that is another point of growth in in
1:05:25
the world which everyone is ignoring, which nobody knows
1:05:29
about actually and which will continue growing and will you
1:05:33
will hear a lot of surprises coming from there.
1:05:34
It's just we are not there and we cannot be there.
1:05:37
Another untapped. Market to be explored in the
1:05:39
future. A Dylan Nergosian.
1:05:42
Yeah, yeah. So that's.
1:05:43
Yeah, I want to be the first one to thank you for sharing both
1:05:46
your time and your story with us today.
1:05:48
I really appreciate it. Yeah, I appreciate it.
1:05:52
It's fun fun talking to you. That's a wrap on another episode
1:05:55
of the Inspired Stories podcast. Thanks for learning with us
1:05:58
today.