Latest / Financial Planner Search / Building a Life, Not a Portfolio with John Browning | Financial Planner Search
Transcript
- Gregory Wilnau: All right, John. Thank you so much for joining us on the podcast today. How are you doing today, sir? John Browning: Doing great and thanks for having me. I appreciate the appreciate the time and the opportunity. Gregory Wilnau: Absolutely. I've been looking forward to it. Okay. To get started, why don't you take a moment and tell us about your practice and what you specialize in. John Browning: Sure. so we are Guardian Rock Wealth. And it's the whole thing started out of being spending about 28 years on on and in Big Wall Street. And the idea behind Guardian Rock Wealth is we wanted to create a firm that didn't accept any outside money, marketing dollars, anything like that, and was not influenced unduly by any Wall Street firms. We are completely independent, fiduciary, registered investment advisors. We try and cover the whole gamut and create what I call a wealth management system as opposed to just a collection of investments that we call a portfolio, that it encompasses your entire life. We focus on income and keeping cash flow flowing. One of our key words is Cash flow is about it better in any weather, including when the market's going higher or when the especially when the market's going lower. And that's really our our big focus, but at the same time, we want we use that to create the growth and the maybe possibly more steady growth than most people may be used to. Gregory Wilnau: Okay, I love it. what tell us a little bit more about what inspired you to do this. John Browning: So I I'm gonna keep this as short as I can, but I'm gonna go clear back to something that many of us remember. Some of us are now reading in the history books, and that is 9-11. So I was on the trading desk at a little firm called Morgan Stanley. I happened to be in Chicago at the time, but I was talking to two separate people, one in the second tower and one at the Bank of New York just down the street. And all we knew for for longer than you would think was that there had been a big loud boom and the folks down the street said there must be a ticker tape parade because of all the papers that were raining down. Nob nobody knew what had really happened. And being an executive at Morgan Stanley after that day, it was kind of a blur for an entire year because I got to be tasked with putting things back together because I happen to be in Chicago. And I'll I I about July of that year, I found myself in the same hotel that I always went to, the Millennium Hilton. It's right across from where the towers were. And late at night after one of those typical Wall Street days, uptown, downtown, midtown. If you're familiar with New York City, you know what I'm talking about. Started at 5 a.m. and you know, I'm back in my hotel room in the in the suit of Wall Street, suit, tie, and it's July, so I've sweated through the whole thing from all the walking around and everything else. Just you know, miserable. And I looked down on what was still a mess, and I started to really wonder about my life choices. I had six kids and I had missed a lot of first pitches, baseball games, wrestling meets, that type of thing. And I started really that started the idea. Really poor financial plan. If you have six children who are younger, to quit your lucrative Wall Street career. So I didn't do anything right away, but the idea was there to start something that wasn't connected with Big Wall Street, but took everything that I knew and everything that I had learned and my experience and applied it to what I call real people. You know, not the hundred millionaires and billionaires, but but people like me and and Gregory Wilnau: Yeah. John Browning: help them find the hidden fees, the tricks and tactics and strategies that Wall Street uses that normally most people don't know about and don't know that it's actually really is available to them. So fast forward until 2019 and I finally founded Guardian Rock Wealth and took the big leap of faith. Most of my kids were were out on their own and doing fairly good fairly well and I had one more left. And even then I was a little bit nervous, but that's what started Guardian Rock Wealth. That's why we do it. Gregory Wilnau: Love it. So you wanted to take everything that you would the things that you had learned, kind of go independent, hopefully ha you know, have more time, create for more freedom for yourself, more time with family, but also better serve the the people that you wanted to work with. John Browning: Right. There there's one one thing that you'll you'll notice on Wall Street, and this is not everyone. I want to make that clear. There's some great people, great, happy people that work on Wall Street. so I'm not saying this is everybody, but you tend to be surrounded, even your clients often are what I call miserable rich people. And Gregory Wilnau: I'm not laughing 'cause it's funny, but it's a little funny. You know. John Browning: Yeah, and but but you know it's true, right? We we hear about it all the time and and you know we saw it every day. My goal is to create happy rich people, and that's really the theme of Guardian Rock wealth. I wrote a book called Build a Life Not a Portfolio, and that's what it's about. It's about you don't if you money's just the tool that we use to create the life that we want. Money's not the goal. If it is the goal, we're all you're in big trouble. But for many people, it is the goal. And so we try and talk to our clients about first before we even talk about the money, what's your best life? Define it. And why? Why do you think that? Gregory Wilnau: Yeah. We'll go more into your process later in the in the episode, but I want to talk more about who you work with. Maybe you could take a moment to kind of describe the type of person who who comes to you. maybe what's a typical situation that they need you to help lead them? John Browning: So typically we work with someone who has, you know, been, you know, we'll call it the definition, right? Successful. what does successful mean? Well, that's different for everyone. but someone who has sort of outgrown the I need a collection of three or four mutual funds and Pat me on the head when the market goes down, say everything will be okay. You've outgrown that. You need you need more than that, more sophisticated strategies, you need tax strategies because your tax bill's getting out of hand. You start realizing that if you are planning your taxes year to year, you're losing the game because you're not planning for lifetime taxes. Things like that. You've got a substantial amount of assets. you You realize there are a lot of other strategies and tactics you could be using, but they're not coordinated. Maybe there's an account here, here, and here, or maybe there's just a few portfolios of 401k, but you really need them to all be working together into what we call a wealth management system rather than just a collection of investments that we hope grows someday. If that makes some sense. Gregory Wilnau: Yeah, so a coordinated wealth management system instead of things that are just kind of all over the place. That does make a lot of sense. I like that a lot. how about a typical situation that you help lead an a new client through? anything specific? Anything any patterns you've noticed? John Browning: Yeah, I think the the most the people who enjoy working with us and who I enjoy working with are generally speaking really good at doing whatever it is that they do in their zone of genius and they recognize maybe they've actually had the experience of one of their clients or maybe somewhere else, so somebody who tried to go outside that zone of genius and And we all have, right? We've all tried to do something on our own and realize that's not what I do, but I do something else really well. So they know they're good at that. And they're and they're really willing to willing and ready to admit that, hey, I don't know everything about creating wealth management systems, and I want to make sure I put myself in the best position. And the I love it when they ask questions. I that's actually my favorite client is one that does ask questions. But also understands that you know this is not what they're good at. And that tends to be my best client. If you if you're just thinking of some of my favorite clients, a lot of times they're business owners, a lot of blue-collar folks, dentists are a couple of them too. But these are folks that generally speaking, again, I'm stereotyping here. I don't really mean to do that because it's there's never an always or a never. Gregory Wilnau: Mm-hmm. John Browning: But generally speaking, like builders and plumbers, electricians, and people running their own business recognize that they're really good at being a plumber or builder or whatever. And yet they're starting to also realize they may not want to do that for the rest of their life. And what happens when one day they can't? Yeah. Gregory Wilnau: Yeah. Yeah. Well well, I come from a blue collar background. Before we started our business, I was a I was in construction. and I know a lot of those guys. And it's hard on your body, man. It really is. It's definitely not something that you want to do your entire life. So I really get that. it also makes sense too that you're if you're y you love working with people, your best clients are the ones who ask a lot of questions, which tells me that they're kind of hands on, right? John Browning: Mm. Yeah. Mm-hmm. Yep. Gregory Wilnau: But they know what they know they don't know what they don't know, right? John Browning: Right, but they want to understand it. Yeah, it's important that people understand what what I'm doing on their behalf 'cause I don't want any surprises someday. I didn't know you I didn't understand that. I don't want that to happen. Gregory Wilnau: Exactly. Yeah. Right. So it's kinda like an they're hands on, but they want your help, but they want to understand. They want the basic knowledge. And that even empowers them to help ask even better questions. So okay, what are some of the questions your clients typically ask when they meet with you for the first time? Maybe they haven't become a client yet. What are some of the top two to three questions that you find that you get? John Browning: The the number one question that I get is because they've probably heard me talking or they've read something that I've put out there or listened to one of my podcasts, and they say, How do you really create income? I thought there was only one or two ways to create income, you know, buying bonds as part of your portfolio. And so I get to explain to them there are a lot of ways to create income, and they all serve a purpose. They're just different tools in the toolbox. And That's the number one question because especially as people get closer to retirement, they're saying, Great, the stock market moves up and down, but I need a monthly income to pay my mortgage or my regular bills that I have to pay. How am I going to do that? So that's question number one. question number two is my tax bill is just seems out of control. I I guess I have to pay taxes, but Gregory Wilnau: Mm-hmm. John Browning: Sometimes I hear about tax strategy. And then we get to have a lot of fun. And I get to show them how, yes, I can help you run a portfolio that makes sense, but I can actually help you keep money in your pocket instead of in Uncle Sam's pocket by doing a not all that complicated sometimes. Some things that can be done and frankly should be done because the rules are there to help the taxpayer, actually, believe it or not. But even a lot of CPAs are just not aware. so that's probably the second biggest question that I get. Gregory Wilnau: So, questions about creating income. There are a few ways. that you get a lot of questions about all the different ways, what's the the purpose, like how can we apply these? And, you know, they pay a lot in taxes, but it feels like it's huge. Is there a way that I can keep more legally instead of keeping it to unp giving it to Uncle Sam? Those are some great some great some great questions and and probably on the minds of your clients when they're talking to you for the first time. Okay. So let's talk a little bit more about your your approach and and your philosophy. first of all, I wanna know more, like how do your clients typically find you? Where are they where where are they coming from? John Browning: So we do, I mean, we do do some marketing and some reach out and all of that, but typically, I mean, it's it's very referral based. So my my new clients often come from my current clients. so that's that's the number one spot that they come from. But also we do a lot of posting on LinkedIn, Facebook, and all that about just education. My my goal isn't really to sell. you on anything, but if I can educate you, then I'm having fun. Because I love to teach. and that's that's what my book is about too. It's about it's it's all about teaching. And I do a twice a month podcast and then I even do a daily market update. So I get clients that will call me and say, hey, I I've been listening to your podcast for two years or I've been listening to your morning update every morning for the past you know three years. Gregory Wilnau: Yeah. That's awesome. John Browning: How do I talk to you? You know, and they'll contact me through the website or or wherever. But yeah, they come from all over. I get I have clients in Hawaii, Maine, and everywhere in between. so they're all over the United States. Gregory Wilnau: Nice. Nice. That's awesome. How many clients do you have now? John Browning: I have actually just changed so I've got ninety clients now. Gregory Wilnau: Congratulations, that's awesome. Very cool. All right, let's talk a little bit more about your practice and and kind of your vision for it and and and where you're going. where do you see it in the next one to three years? What's what's your vision? Are there any goals that you're working on? John Browning: Yeah. So Yeah, I mean just from a business standpoint and and very transparently, I'd I'd like to do more because the more people I can help, the happier I am. I mean people think that's cliche, but I could have stayed on Wall Street and made it made more money. You know, that's that's not it. But if I can if I can make a happy r happy rich person instead of a miserable rich person, or take someone that's like, I don't know if I can survive in retirement because the yield and and the income I'm able to produce with everything that I know, I I'm not gonna be able to do it and take them to a position where I'm really comfortable moving into retirement. Or take a young person and they're like, how do I get ahead in today's world? Everything has changed since my Generation X parents say that, you know, they they just did this and it worked. And it's changed. If I can take them to a position of confidence Gregory Wilnau: Yeah. John Browning: and see that confidence on their face and listen to it in their voice, that's what really excites me. I don't know if I'm answering your question or not, but that's that's my that's my goal. And and that again, that makes me happy. I have a good time. I get out of bed in the morning and I enjoy enjoy what I do. Gregory Wilnau: Mm. No, you you absolutely are. That's what it's all about, man. is there anything standing in your way? Any any any any current challenges per feel are kinda John Browning: Yeah. You know, I think it's more there's a there's a dramatic mistrust of the profession and unfortunately it is probably well deserved. And frankly, I I watched it when I was on Wall Street. There's a lot of money flowing through a lot of fingers, and sometimes it's not the best thing for clients, and that's really unfortunate. It's why I'm independent and why I'm like fiercely independent. It's very difficult, by the way, to be independent in today's world. But I think that's the biggest block to helping more people is people are distressful, and unfortunately, rightfully so. that's the biggest thing, yeah. And just getting the word out to the right people so that they sort of pay attention and they realize hey this is a real thing that I should be paying attention to it's the rest of your life, folks. It's the tool that you're gonna use for the rest of your life once the paycheck stops. So it's important to pay attention to, but people see it as all that ha that's tomorrow. Or they want like a immediate hit the button and everything's fixed and it just doesn't work that way. Gregory Wilnau: Absolutely. Yeah. Could if you f ever find that button, would you mind sending it over to me? I could really use it. John Browning: I will. I that button or the easy button, either one, I will take it. Yep. Yeah. Gregory Wilnau: So you know, as as bus as a business owner, we rarely do this alone. So as your practice has grown, are are there any programs or trainings that have shaped or positively impacted how you serve your clients? Is there anyone you'd like to give a shout out to? John Browning: man. Well, you know, as much as I, you know, I knock on Big Wall Street, that's where I learned all all these almost all these straty strategies and all these tactics. there's so many people that have helped me along the way that have taken time to mentor me and shown me what not to do. Let me fail, frankly. And that's how you learn the most. And I got to fail with, you know, Wall Street money as opposed to, you know, my own or someone else's and that was all you know I'm very grateful to what the institution I got to sit across from people that you would know like their household names I got to learn from them so that that that's huge. I I probably shouldn't mention their names but though that's that's the main people and people also that have been influential on me people like John Maxwell and just Gregory Wilnau: It's awesome. Sure. John Browning: Just great people that Jim Rinkey, which I know he's he's not necessarily a famous guy, but man, has he had a great impact on my life. He wrote a book too called Transformed Pain. And just just so many people, and most of all, without a doubt, and very clearly the most important is my wife, and she works with Guardian Rock Wealth as well. She deals with all the paperwork. Gregory Wilnau: Very important. John Browning: Or most of the paperwork and does all the insurance work and things like that because that's not stuff that I enjoy. And she just takes it over. And she's put up with the whole thing from zero to where we are today. So Gregory Wilnau: That's that's awesome. probably her taking a lot of the things that need to be done, and you're doing more of the things that you you love to do, which it sounds like, you know, teaching and turning more miserable rich people into happy rich people, right? John Browning: Mm-hmm. That's right. Exactly. Yeah. Gregory Wilnau: Alright, so I wanna learn a little bit more about what it looks like to work with you. So maybe you could walk us through your actual process. So if somebody were to become a client today, what happens the first couple of weeks? What does onboarding look like? What does it look like to work with you over the course of a calendar year? John Browning: Yeah, I mean to to really start from the very beginning, we have an initial conversation. And during that conversation, we kind of decide. I decide because I you know, when I first started at zero, you know, if if you had a pulse and you could flog a mirror, you were a you were a great client. now that we're a little bit larger, it may not be a good fit. And we want to be honest about that and direct somebody and maybe even refer them to somebody else who would be a good fit because I know a lot of other wealth managers, a lot of people who aren't wealth management or wealth managers, but they're financial advisors. And if you're in that stage when that's just that's what you need, it's just a financial advisor or somebody to allocate your assets. We're gonna say, hey, go call these three people. One of them will be a great fit. And the other side of it is, hey, if you don't like me, I'm not for everyone. You know, I can you know, I'm probably not gonna put a suit on for ya. I I gave up my suit and tie when I left Wall Street. I used to wear a suit and tie for a while when I first started, and I was like, I'm not gonna do that anymore. They're uncomfortable. so I mean if you Gregory Wilnau: Yeah. It's funny, I I had never worn a suit and tie in my entire life because I have a blue collar background. so when I started this business I actually like wearing a suit and tie sometimes, you know. It's I assume if you have to do it every day, you know, you'd probably, you know, wouldn't want to do it. 'Cause you're right, it it's not as comfortable as, you know, a t a t shirt and jeans, you know. John Browning: Yeah. There you go. Yeah, it's whatever you have to do, you don't want to do, right? Yeah. I'll put I'll put one on, you know, if it really makes you happy and I get along with you really, really well. But that's pretty far in few between. And most people don't care. I found most people really don't care. They just want to make sure they're getting great service and a great value. so we talk that through. And if if both sides decide, hey, this is something I want to continue, we have another meeting. And again, you haven't paid me anything at this point. Gregory Wilnau: Absolutely. John Browning: And we go through your statements, what you have now, and then we determine hey, is this something that you really need me for? Or do you just need maybe a little bit of an edge in one direction or the other? We're still deciding whether or not we want to work together because I want to be very careful about who we have as clients here at Guardian Rockwealth. no jerks. And and and a few other criteria. But Then once that happens, you know, we get the statements, we sign a bunch of paperwork because the regulators say we have to. And there are certain things that make a lot of sense that the regulators make us do. And we get the account set up once all that paperwork is done. And then we start to develop what I referred to before, which is that wealth management system. And we start with the portfolios, but every part of that portfolio ties into other parts of the portfolio. And what I mean by that is again the system. So you think of a system like it's got gears that work together. Some beer some gears are bigger, some are larger. And which funds are taxable versus tax free, tax deferred versus tax-free forever? Which are your you know solid assets? You know they're going to be there, there they have some sort of guarantee maybe on them or something like that. What about your insurance? Are you overinsured? Are you underinsured? How do we fix that? And how might that tie into your tax? And by the way, have you thought about your estate planning? Do you have your powers of attorney? And we start building the whole life system. And especially with you know high-net worth individuals who have a family that had one of their goals. And we talked about the first conversation, really also centers around what's your goal? What's your best life? And not what your mother, your brother, your sister tells you, but when I ask you the question why for the sixth or seventh time, either you're gonna hate me or you're gonna be laughing with me because you're realizing you're getting to the true why. Based on that, if one of your whys is, I want to leave a legacy, we can talk about setting up things like a family bank. And how do you educate your kids in the right way so that you don't lose lose all that family money in the third generation, which is what Gregory Wilnau: Right. Yeah. John Browning: over ninety percent of the time is what happens. And the main reason is that the kids didn't weren't brought in and taught and allowed to participate in the family dynasty, so to speak, in the family trust. And they never were educated and they never were part of it. Like, no, you're not allowed to make decisions on this or participate because you didn't make the money. That's a that's a great way to make sure your Gregory Wilnau: Mm The vision, so to speak. John Browning: Family wealth disappears by the third generation. Gregory Wilnau: Wow. That's crazy. I never thought of it that way. But that makes a lot of sense. So d part of your process if if if it makes sense of the situation is such that you start having bringing the the kids and the parents together to start having those conversations. Wow. John Browning: Mm-hmm. Family meetings. I mean that takes a while. That's that's usually down the road a little bit. But yeah, no, it's really, really important to a lot of people to leave a legacy and they generally speaking, most people just don't think about great, I'm gonna leave my kids a you know, a million dollars or ten million dollars. Great, where's it gonna go? Gregory Wilnau: Sure, it's a process, yeah, obviously. That's very interesting. John Browning: How about your grandchildren? What are they gonna do with it? How what are they gonna even know? Are they gonna even know how to handle that money? And that's that's why it disappears. Gregory Wilnau: Yeah. one of the things that I kind of work through is a lot of times I think the when I talk to people like this, and this is just personal observations, right? Everybody's different, but a lot of times when you f you a first generation wealth builder, you really have to go through a lot of transformation hardships and experiences to kind of become that that person, right? And there's a lot of growth that has to happen on the journey to build generational wealth. And oftentimes if your children weren't a part of that, they haven't gone through the changes. They haven't learned the lessons that you've learned that you've learned. They haven't gone through that that transformation. Quite frankly, right, the the pain, you know? They haven't had enough they don't develop the character in the same way. So it's part of like what you do is you you when you bring these the the two sides together, do you start like sharing those lessons? Like how do you help us understand a little bit more about kind of what that maybe that first conversation kind of looks like between parents and the kids and how how do you kind of facilitate that? what questions do you typically try to get across? Like how do you just start seeding the conversation, you know? John Browning: Yeah, well it really starts with either usually with the matriarch or the patriarch, and and it varies. a lot of times the the ladies are really the ones that are whatever interested or kind of the leader in the terms of the financial situation. So you know, I never assume on that, and I always try and make sure we got both husband and wife involved, even if one of them hates the whole concept of managing the money and the wealth. I say I really need to like see you on the Zoom call or see you in person because I I'll see one of them sort of roll their eyes at something and I can pick up on that kind of stuff. And because I gotta yeah, I don't wanna be the cause of anybody breaking up their marriage, right? I wanna keep hey, it sounds like either you don't understand this or you think it's a bad idea. Why is that? And I kinda sort of Gregory Wilnau: Aww. Yeah. John Browning: Sometimes they hate me, but then usually they end up laughing with the whole process because they know it's happening and the spouse knows it's happening. But the first step is to get the leaders on board. Because if they're not on board, it will not work. But the second part to get to the heart of your question, what questions do you start to start to ask with the family and how do you bring them together? Is the first thing to do is have the leader, the matriarch, the patriarch, whatever. Gregory Wilnau: Solarly. John Browning: Begin to develop and write down the family trust plan, right? Usually it's some sort of trust that we're that we're building out. And and how you want it to work. Do you want to allow the kids an opportunity to say, I don't want anything to do with this? Because sometimes the kids are like that. I don't want anything to do with this. And all the kids are different. And do you want to allow for that? And if that happens, are they allowed to come back at any point in the future? Or do they take X number of dollars or percentage or whatever and they go their own way and do their own thing? That's a really important part of the document and setting out those sort of sort of rules and regulations of the family trust, the wealth of the family. And then I usually coach the first few meetings of and they have a business meeting. It's a board meeting. And teaching the kids as young as five, six, seven years old. Gregory Wilnau: I love it. John Browning: A lot of times they're part of it and you ask questions on their level, like you ask them what charities they want to support. And you know, it might be, you know what, I really like the zoo, so you put a few bucks toward as a donation to the zoo, whatever it is. And then later on as they get older, they've learned not only are are their dis are their decisions and their opinions valued, but they're actually acted upon. Obviously, when they're younger. Gregory Wilnau: Yeah. John Browning: It might be 10 or 20 bucks, goes to the zoo or whatever. When they get older, it might be I really, you know, I have the skills, I've gotten the education, I want to start a business. They can take a loan, not a gift, a loan, or maybe the family trust takes an equity position in that particular business. And that person is responsible then for reporting back to the board, the family board, as to how that business is doing. Gregory Wilnau: Nice. Nice. Mm. John Browning: Each quarter or each year, however it's set up. Yeah. Gregory Wilnau: I love the structure, how you structured it kinda like a business and you start having conversation ab conversations about it, but it starts with getting the vision on paper. Which is where everything starts, right? Yeah. John Browning: Right. That's that's exactly right. It's gotta be written down. Yeah, and it's gotta be followed once it's written down. Gregory Wilnau: I love it. And you kinda act as the mediator. All right. So we are right at about time, John. but so let's go ahead and land this plane. for anybody who's listening, who wants to get in touch with you or is interested in possibly exploring what it's like to work with you, what should they do next? Where should they go? John Browning: All right. The very best way to get in touch with me is to go out to the website guardianrockwealth.com. And up in the upper right hand corner, there's a contact us section. Click on that, fill out that form. It's really a simple form. I don't ask for a lot of information, just how to contact you back. If you have a specific question, definitely put it in there. That's the best way. This the And also, by the way, just go off to the website and explore if you're not really sure you want to talk to me because maybe I'm not your style. There's a whole lot of educational stuff there. Explore the resources section, all that. The other way to get in touch with me, especially if you don't really want me calling you or responding back to you, and I get that. If you just want to learn a little bit more, is grab your cell phone, pick up the cell phone, open up the texting app, dial 321. 421 5213. Type in the word life L I F E send that. You'll get a link back. I promise you I will not spam you with a bunch of text messages because I hate that too. And you'll get all my links. And you'll be able to listen to the podcast or whatever you want to listen to. And it's just a lot of free education that I put out there. If you just want to maybe test it out a little bit first before you talk. Gregory Wilnau: Dip the toe in. All right, John. Well, thank you so much for coming on the pod. We appreciate ya. John Browning: Right. All right. Thanks so much.