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Larry Davis Robbery Crew · NYPD Through The Looking Glass

0:00
SPEAKER_01: go down a staircase and it there's this guy crawling and he's leaving a trail of blood he shot up but he was also armed he had you know he had two guns on him so he he was one of the perps robbing the apartment of the perps right and then so get him roll him over he shot up right he was I don't know if he survived or not survived but you know handcuffed him up took two guns off of him and then upstairs there's you know there's three people dead there's two more people shot you know someone else shot in a staircase so you know the the victims were shooting back at the at the perps and then there was a series of robberies this was a notorious led by a guy named Larry Davis today's guest is retired ESU lieutenant Nicholas Bavara he's the author of the new book The Big One Reflections of an NYPD lieutenant Nick Bavara welcome to the show thank you Vic nice to see you Nick please tell our listeners a little something about yourself I'm born and raised in Queens i I lived there up until three years ago then I'm 660 I'll be 64 soon so I lived in Queens my whole life now I'm living on Long Island went on the job in the NYPD in 1984 January it's like I got to think about that right I started out in NSU 13 which is the 817375 went went to the 3-4 from there gone to street crime as a matter of fact I went to three street crime three times it was a top sergeant lieutenant there I got I got lucky I was one of only three people that did three ranks there and one one snuck out of another rank he got promoted one last time before he left and he ended up doing four he was the only only person that did four but the place I loved and I did uh a couple stints in the two six one as a sergeant one as a lieutenant another place I loved did a little stint in narcotics back in the 3-4 uh and then ended up in back in street crime as a lieutenant until I ended up in emergency service and that's how I finished out my last five years which was tell you the truth the dream come true it was a it was a great job I I just I just loved it matter of fact I loved it so much that I I I passed on a captain's test I was like I I had no interest in getting promoted or leaving I said I'll take the next one right the next one never came for me but but I'll take the next one because I I I didn't I didn't even want a chance leaving so that that's it and then I've had a whole nother after I left in 2004 to put myself through law school private practice for about three years found myself uh doing compliance work for banks and that's how I've been making a living for the last uh 20 plus years why did you want to become a member of the New York City Police Department?
2:33
SPEAKER_01: It's something about it always having the law right and I had I had an uncle that was my uncle Sal was a cop in Mount Vernon right so probably for you too right you were closer to Mount Vernon being in the Bronx but for me anything past the Bronx is upstate.
2:48
SPEAKER_01: I've come to learn that I've come to learn that anything past the Bronx was was upstate but uncle Sal was a cop in in Mount Vernon right and it was always the allure of that and come come to parties they always have a jacket on Uncle Sal can't take his jacket off because he has a gun but I was young and I was a little kid and maybe five or so we went to his house one time you know one weekend and he had to leave we had dinner and my cousins were there and everything was there and he had to leave and came back a little while later and he suited up got got dressed had a radio call with him and he took me for a ride in this thing and it was like from that moment it was like man I was I was I was I was hooked you know and then in the back of my mind I was always like oh can I be a cop can I be a cop and then I didn't think it was ever going to happen because I'm kind of on the short side right and they always had a height requirement I was like I don't think I'm gonna make it you think I'm gonna make it you think I'm gonna make it anyway they dropped that and I I took a test I was 16 and a half years old.
3:45
SPEAKER_01: So the first test I took maybe was 1010 or something like that I took that test did well like you know I got like an 98 99 I did well 16 and a half no and my father said just take it practice and then couldn't wait for the next one because then then I was of age and I took it again did well you know like probably I think I wrote a hundred on on the test which was great but then they did that banding right all of a sudden you know you weren't the top applicants they put everybody in a band so I ended up being like number 5000 something on the list but within a year I was I was on a job I was living a dream.
4:19
SPEAKER_00: For for for a kid from Queens and you lived in a nice part of Queens to go to NSU 13 which covers the 75 precinct was that culture shock for you no and I'll tell you why I was I was on the Queens Nassau border lived in a in an area called Glenox.
4:33
SPEAKER_01: Yeah I went to Van Buren and traveled through life you know Queens Village or St.
4:38
SPEAKER_01: Albans all those places so you know the the neighborhoods were diversified if you want to use today's word right so and then as a senior in high school I got a job in the neighborhood in Queensville for a medical supply company and driving vans and trucks delivering oxygen hospital beds things of that nature so you know my route was the southern part of Queens and Brooklyn all the way from from East New York all the way to Bansonhurst and Bay Ridge and work with you know the same guy all the time and that was our route so we deliver oxygen and oblivious to everything rolling oxygen tanks taking hospital beds having a little wrench in in my pocket for for the oxygen and stuff I was in the pink houses I was in the 40 houses I was in everything.
5:21
SPEAKER_01: It's just just this little kid me and this other guy roll rolling up no one ever messed with us no one ever bothered us I mean I was in and out of Roundsville East in York and then next thing you know I'm a cop there.
5:30
SPEAKER_01: I've been in these buildings a million times on Lavonia Avenue been on Rockaway Boulevard it was like uh it was like second nature like delivering medical supplies that it didn't even dawn on me that being a cop there was any different than than that.
5:43
SPEAKER_01: That's slight different people thought you know we were doing good with delivering oxygen and all the mess with us but then you're a cop you know and it's like it's like it's like a whole different animal right people hate you just because they hate you and then you you you realize that quick it's like all right this is a little different.
5:59
SPEAKER_01: But culture shock no not not really I had been to all those streets over and over and over again.
6:05
SPEAKER_01: You you had a funny story in your NSU with a guy that had six months more than you sound NSU right it was two two squads two platoons right half the crew was doing date tours while the other half was doing uh 4-12s and then every other week we burst right and I was paling around with this guy Billy Billy G and oftentimes we get a joining post things that nature but I don't know we just became friends you're a guy from Brooklyn right short Italian guy from Brooklyn short Italian guy from Queens I don't know we we we connected we became friends and the one day we're doing 4 to 12 we we we turn out you know roll call get our assignments and we're coming down the stairs and the day tour is going up this you know sign out and go home and as as we're going down the stairs Billy reaches out to this guy this guy's coming up the stairs and a big guy right roll bruiser kind of guy you know muscle muscle kind of guy grabs up by the yum goes buddy what happened right and the guy goes what what he goes what happened who died turns out the guy was a rookie was a rookie like us right but on a shield he was wearing a morning band right a black black piece of elastic band that you're wearing the cap dyes everybody in the city wears it for you know seven days ten days whatever whatever it is and then uh you know believe it's genuine and he goes who what happened you know who who's what what are you talking about like the guy the guy's got like a shitty attitude right and he goes as he's walking up the stairs he turns back and he goes the job is dead the job is dead get used to it pal looking up the stairs like the job is dead we're on the job six days we just continue out the door out out out the station house onto Ralph Avenue room the eight one and couldn't help but laughing like the job is dead like like we were literally there six nah it was more than six days but it was just so funny it was like how how can you know you look back at that how could someone be such a hairbag at such an early age do you got any funny stories from your NSU days the NSU is is like everything right you're just trying to you're trying to get used to everything.
8:08
SPEAKER_01: You're on Sutter Avenue with an oxygen tank not no one no one pays any mind to you you're walking down the street and everybody's got their eye on you right but so you're just trying to get used to being in your own skin right you know being a top all of a sudden it's new you're 21 years old well you know do you have any answers for anything you're trying to do your car stops you know you're not in a car you're trying you're trying to do them on foot post and one of the things I realized and this happened after the fact that while you're getting used to being in your skin in uniform and everything like that one of the things you don't really do much is talk on the radio right what do you do special post one radio check five by five you don't really have an opportunity to talk on radio and I didn't realize that until this one particular night it's a four to twelve turnout I got eight one special post one or two so it's right up the block from the precinct it's on Broadway it's under the L.
9:02
SPEAKER_01: The L is elevated the subway tracks right and I'm standing on our post and you know you got your radio you're listening trying to listen is anything going on there's nothing going on right it's it's just dead you know there's a lot of stores are closed down and shut every day they haven't been opening years and you just walk in your two three blocks and also radio cars are pulling up pulling up right I'm on the corner they're pulling up all over the place Quincy and and Broadway they're pulling up all over the place one guy rings out the window listener radio rookie train must have been going overhead I didn't hear anything right I didn't hear anything.
9:36
SPEAKER_01: So there was a house it was a couple houses three houses they were like brownstone type houses one was empty it was a derelict building there was another one where a guy lived in and he saw someone going in the window so he called the police and everybody comes rolling off.
9:52
SPEAKER_01: Now it's in there it's an abandoned building it's hoarded up and everything like that.
9:56
SPEAKER_01: They're trying to rattle the guy out or shake the guy out and no one really wants to climb up to the second floor to take a look in there.
10:03
SPEAKER_01: It's you know it's got the red X on it meaning you know it's unsafe like the fire department won't need to go in there.
10:08
SPEAKER_01: So like I think you know they tell the guy if if you know if you hear anything he give us a call back right and I'm just you know taking it all in listening to it all his police work you know like I'm just trying to get the jargon get get this get that right you know what's going on and and someone turns to me again and says listen to your radio and I'm like it's probably the same guy right okay okay so everybody leaves 20 minutes later half hour later whatever it is you know I'm standing down pissed at myself right how did I miss this right how did I miss this there's big police work and I miss this right so I see this guy climbing out the second floor window onto a tree and I'm like I got him I got him I got him right I got the flashlight I got my nightstick I put my nights under my arm I got the flashlight don't move don't move right take my revolver out I'm like I don't need a revolver he's up in the truck all right I'm not moving I'm not moving so I get on in the air right so I never really talked on the radio I realized that I never really talked on the radio I said special post to you got the guy I can I got the guy that's all I said was I got the guy you got the guy what I go the guy from before from before I got the guy on Quincy I got the guy units uh can someone respond right everybody comes running back again and cops get out of the car and everybody's shaking their head and the guy's up in a tree to make him come down and the sergeant that was there's an eight one sergeant I remember his name it was the Diane guy right gold chain right cigar comes out of the car goes over there making heads of tails of whatever's going on right guys down a tossing him and he turns there's two or three rookies were all standing there he goes all right who's the guy that's got the guy like uh that would be me right like all right you got this I'm like oh what do I got you got the guy so you take the guy and that was like wake up kid wake up like you know learn the job better you know but who's the guy that's got the guy was was the sergeant's saying I was like oh my god I was so embarrassed but that's it it's that's that's the fun of being a rookie I guess well some of those guys could be brutal and they only had a year or two on you and they could be just so nasty and condescending and make you feel so small when you call for help or there's a call on your post and you didn't hear it because you really don't understand.
12:29
SPEAKER_00: There's no real training or there wasn't how to listen to that radio.
12:32
SPEAKER_00: There wasn't and you go out there and it's like I remember like I was trying to learn another language I'm like how how am I going to do this?
12:40
SPEAKER_01: Exactly you're being kind you you you're being kind to me but it it's it's true.
12:45
SPEAKER_01: Oh I did that you know but uh so after NSU you wind up in the 3-4 which was the wild west when you got up there in 84 85 can can you explain to our listeners what the 3-4 precinct was like in its heyday when you got there yeah so so you go to Brooklyn North and there's always a saying right once you're in Brooklyn North you never get out and in Brooklyn North the 817375 is all part of Brooklyn North so get our orders right tenants reading off the orders Bavaro 34 like 34 never heard of it.
13:17
SPEAKER_01: So afterwards we're milling up out Sarge where where's the 3-4 was this guy named George Weavy right he goes I don't know I don't know it's up up uptown somewhere wear your best bring two guns right I'm like I have no idea where I'm going right 3-4 and then uh a little research you know we didn't have the internet back then right we didn't know anything you bring out the map it's like all right it's Washington Heights inward right really don't know anything about it right nothing doesn't exist so we get up there it's a hundred year old station house and you know we start he start learning about the command and the command was was extremely interesting like it had been in the 7375 the eight one there was a lot of you know empty brownstones there was a lot of dilapidated uh blocks you know buildings ripped down the abandoned housing and all that before it wasn't like that at all it was kind of vibrant you know from river to river right from the Hudson to the East River 155th Street all the way north to 218th Street on one side 225th on the other side so it was a big big piece of real estate but it it it wasn't it wasn't a ghetto right it it just wasn't it wasn't broken down or anything like that but it was very unique.
14:29
SPEAKER_01: There was there was down at the lower end by Edgecombe there was a black neighborhood then on this side of Bennett and Fort Washington it was a Jewish neighborhood then you got up north and it became Irish and then and then you know that then you know even farther north up by Dykman Street, Inwood it was it was very Irish so you had a lot of everything but it wasn't a ghetto but what was happening was the crack wars were starting right you had a large Dominican population moving into the non not disparaging it's just you know it's just it is what it is it you know and you you had a lot of immigrants coming into the city and they were settling in that area and you know the the neighborhood was changing and along with that you know there was you know kids young people you know drug dealers and they were finding their ways and you know carving out their turf and you know pushing people out of the neighborhoods and people people were leaving and more people were coming in and then you know and then almost mayhem but the neighborhood itself is so interesting.
15:28
SPEAKER_01: I'm a history buff so you know you got from different parts you can see Yankee Stadium Ragoridgecoming these beautiful beautiful buildings right you go into them and the views were unbelievable it was marble everywhere you know you're going into a pong and something like that you know the only thing we're missing was the grand piano right the 12 foot ceilings absolutely gorgeous there's a historic cemetery right there under 55th street there was a couple museums the numismatic museum the museum of the American Indian right so you know I I'd say you have to work and and and go to those you know John Audubon drew little pictures of birds was buried there and that was very historic and then you know the the the Beatles that visited Sherman's ribs on on on you know on on Audubon Avenue and and then and then you go a little further there's the Jamel Mansion and there's still to this day there's Sylvan Terrace there's early 1800 clapboard houses that one block of them but the they've been restored people live in them you know back then they were expensive they're 10 times more expensive now one goes for sale people hold on to them and then a little north of that was for Washington where you know the the third battle of of the revolution was fought right at the battle of Washington Heights it was a battle battle of Lowham Battle of Fallon Heights Battle of Washington Heights the the cloisters you know it was just so historic.
16:52
SPEAKER_01: So I'm I'm a junior history buff so for me it was like it was the greatest exploring that it was was just unbelievable.
16:59
SPEAKER_01: I loved it for that I loved the the way the neighborhood was all the different parts and components to it and then you know so met minute minute a couple people when we were going through our orientation our locker room was on the third floor this hundred year old station house so it was like ah this is this is what it was great.
17:17
SPEAKER_01: The station house had still had the old switchboard wasn't working but still had the switchboard with the with the with the things it was behind the TS the telephone switchboard operator right still that old fashioned desk just like oh this was the the coolest environment during the orientation they were talking about who was going to what squads and what platoons and they were trying to push people onto the late tours and I really had no interest in going to the late tours but I made a couple friends you know during the orientation and it seemed like the quickest way to ride right to get into a radio car and begin to ride by going to late tours and I actually my list number was really good compared to other people so I I didn't have to but I volunteered for the late tours turned out to be the best thing I did right it turned out to be the go to late tours right we do our orientation a couple days later it's like all right we're gonna be in a radio party it's gonna be good who's gonna hook up with who's this who's that we don't know anything right with war arms right but we get to the late tours my first my first night is uh fixed post at Yeshiva University one of those embassy boxes.
18:19
SPEAKER_01: So you know you're hearing all these stories during the orientation oh we got 20 shootings a year oh there's you know so many homicides you know it did leave the city in homicides you know it was always uh the 4-4 the 3-4 and the 7-5 and look at the 4-4 being in the bronze with you know three biggest commands in the city always vying for who had the most homicides right not that we had anything to do with those numbers right there it was just happening right we didn't help in any way shape or form it just happened but uh so you're hearing all these stories and you know all the shootings the cops have been involved in and how many homicides there were and you know you go ah this is where the action is this is going to be good right we're gonna learn and then first night yeah on a foot post you know in the in an embassy box the whole tour it's like you know it's like oh my god this is brutal and then that that was a fixed post I mean you'd have it from time to time but but my first night that that was it so you know anticlimatic right the second night I'm in a radio car finally and I'm with a guy that's got six months more than me this guy Ricky and uh you know I'm like all right this is great I'm Larry Corter he's driving and he's showing me the neighborhood we're on St.
19:22
SPEAKER_01: Nicholas Avenue we passed this I guess it's a I guess it's a restaurant but things were different right like with what we would think of a restaurant right it was you know the counter with food and in the back it was music so it was like a restaurant nightclub type of thing even though it wasn't really a nightclub right so music was filling out in the street was all people out front so we passed by and that was probably a little culture shock right because now I got the Caribbean like that that I never experienced right East New York I've experienced before but you know the Caribbean I was never in the Caribbean or anything like that.
19:55
SPEAKER_01: And it wasn't bad it was interesting that people were out and we passed this and he Ricky makes a right turn because I'm gonna swing around right and go back around now it's a long street all the way down to Amsterdam and then over one block and then back up all one way streets.
20:11
SPEAKER_01: By the time we came back and we never heard a thing the crowd is like running like mad right there's smell of gun smoke everywhere right everywhere right and there's a guy right in front of the place that you know that is there's a doornail right you know I'm not a doctor don't play on TV but dead when you see dead right he he's he's gone we had just been there just a couple minutes before just the time it took to go around the block long block by the time it came to to go around the block and so there that was like baptism through fire.
20:44
SPEAKER_01: We didn't fire we weren't engaged we weren't involved in any way shape or form but you know the you know first job of the night was was a homicide that that was I guess typical for for the neighborhood during that period of time.
20:58
SPEAKER_00: So well you guys average for a while 110 120 homicides a year and I'm sure you've had your fair share do any stand out to you?
21:06
SPEAKER_01: Homic you know it's what's what's weird is you know you you you could think back and you you're talking 35 40 years right and and weirdly I could still see that guy's face right I could I could probably if I was good an artist I could probably paint a picture of of how he was laying right you know there was those homicides there was the you know the drug dealer wars and the and the fights between them and you'd see a guy pitching coke or pitching crap at some point and then you know he ends up dead.
21:37
SPEAKER_01: Well you knew that was gonna happen right you know just out there all the time that wasn't surprising and everything like that.
21:44
SPEAKER_01: I think I think probably the one that stands out the most was was an innocent woman.
21:51
SPEAKER_01: Just just you know an innocent woman who who was uh coming home from work late right uh late and uh one of these big buildings up on Sherman Sherman Avenue, so way up north in the precinct.
22:02
SPEAKER_01: And you know, it was one of these buildings that has like a north-south staircase, right?
22:07
SPEAKER_01: Like you you walk in the building, the north side of the building had, you know, part of the 201N, right?
22:13
SPEAKER_01: South side had 21S, right?
22:15
SPEAKER_01: So it was this big building, you know, staircases and the big fire doors and the staircases and stuff like that.
22:21
SPEAKER_01: Some some some bastard freaking just just strangled this woman to death and sexually abused her and raped her, whether it was before or after she was gone.
22:31
SPEAKER_01: And you know, just the way she was on the staircase and just the way she she led her.
22:35
SPEAKER_01: And we, you know, we got the job, and everybody was responding to the job.
22:39
SPEAKER_01: It wasn't our job, it was someone else's job, but you know, to do is uh, you know, people responding.
22:44
SPEAKER_01: And another car got there first, and they they were at the top of the stairs looking down.
22:48
SPEAKER_01: I remember coming up the stairs and just seeing this sight of this this pool and I'm like this.
22:52
SPEAKER_01: I was like, freaking this is probably, you know, I'd seen in humanity, right?
22:57
SPEAKER_01: I'd seen, you know, shootings and victims and drug dealers and stuff like that.
23:01
SPEAKER_01: But I think this was the first, first, you know, innocent victim.
23:04
SPEAKER_01: You could argue that it oh, drug dealers, innocent victim, right?
23:07
SPEAKER_01: But they they're in the game, right?
23:09
SPEAKER_01: They they they they know what they signed up for.
23:11
SPEAKER_01: They live by the sword, they died by the sword.
23:13
SPEAKER_01: This this was an innocent lady, right?
23:16
SPEAKER_01: And then got R ID and everything like that, and the looking in squads coming in most, just it was just it was just horrible.
23:23
SPEAKER_01: But she was on her floor where she lived, right?
23:27
SPEAKER_01: So while her husband and child slept inside, this poor woman was was destroyed, right?
23:33
SPEAKER_01: And then, you know, waiting for the squad to come and so they could knock on the door, and you know, we we went we we resumed patrol.
23:43
SPEAKER_01: We you know, we did call New York City 98, we went 98, you know, and it was it was it there was no reason for us to be there anymore.
23:50
SPEAKER_01: But I think that's the one that that that probably sticks out in my head the most, you know.
23:55
SPEAKER_01: It's it's it's this innocent, you know, just coming home from work, you know, work working a shift.
24:00
SPEAKER_01: I I think she was in the eight or you know, uh in the hospital or something like that, you know.
24:09
SPEAKER_00: There was so much drugs, street level drugs in the heights.
24:12
SPEAKER_00: There were also wholesalers that were selling kilos, and it was nothing for a street cop to walk into the station house with a couple of kilos on a car stop, was stopping a guy walking into a building carrying a duffel bag over it.
24:26
SPEAKER_00: It was a wash of drugs.
24:27
SPEAKER_00: What was the most like a drug collet?
24:29
SPEAKER_00: What was the most you came in with weight?
24:31
SPEAKER_00: I had partnered with a with a guy named Mitch.
24:34
SPEAKER_01: We stayed partners for a long time, right?
24:36
SPEAKER_01: And we're still best friends to this day.
24:38
SPEAKER_01: So it's 40 years later, you know, we you know, his wife, my wife, we're we're we're the best of friends, right?
24:44
SPEAKER_01: So, you know, we we made a collet down low.
24:47
SPEAKER_01: We were probably we were poaching in that example.
24:51
SPEAKER_01: We were poaching, or maybe we're coming from a job because that was a command, you know, it turned out three cars and a sergeant, right?
24:58
SPEAKER_01: So, so seven cops and one sergeant, right?
25:00
SPEAKER_01: And you turn out whole holding 30 jobs, right?
25:03
SPEAKER_01: And then, you know, you try to go to Meal, no meal, you know, we're holding, you know, we're holding three priorities.
25:09
SPEAKER_01: So we we probably weren't poaching looking, but we we came across.
25:13
SPEAKER_01: And we we had we got this, we got this young girl and crossing the street, and for whatever ha whatever reason, I think when she saw us, she panicked and she threw a bag.
25:24
SPEAKER_01: And then, you know, it gets out towards her, I go get the bag, and it's it's like a handbag, but she threw it.
25:30
SPEAKER_01: She flung it.
25:31
SPEAKER_01: And there's defense attorneys, right, that'll call, oh, it's dropsies, the cops are making this up.
25:36
SPEAKER_00: No, that's people path, yeah.
25:38
SPEAKER_01: Yes, right?
25:39
SPEAKER_01: It's bullshit.
25:40
SPEAKER_01: You know, I never lied in my life.
25:41
SPEAKER_01: I never had to lie in my life, right?
25:43
SPEAKER_01: The conviction wasn't worth lying.
25:45
SPEAKER_01: You know, that's perjurious.
25:47
SPEAKER_01: I, you know, I I never did that.
25:48
SPEAKER_01: But this did she panicked, she flung it, right?
25:51
SPEAKER_01: Now it's now it's garbage, right?
25:53
SPEAKER_01: So it's 400 vials of crack, right?
25:56
SPEAKER_01: 400 vials of crack.
25:57
SPEAKER_01: That was a lie, right?
25:59
SPEAKER_01: So we bring it, we bring it to the station house, they call, you know, they call it borrow, they call operations, 400 vials of crack, right?
26:06
SPEAKER_01: I don't know how many was a felony yet.
26:08
SPEAKER_01: Remember at some point they had to change the law, they made seven vials of felony, but I don't think it that had happened yet, right?
26:15
SPEAKER_01: Because it was concentrated in cocaine, right?
26:17
SPEAKER_01: So the whole the the level of charge went by the weight of of the of the product, right?
26:23
SPEAKER_01: But but I don't think that had happened yet.
26:25
SPEAKER_01: So now we got 400 files.
26:27
SPEAKER_01: Everybody got duty captain comms, people taking pictures.
26:29
SPEAKER_01: No one had seen that much, right?
26:31
SPEAKER_01: A week later, a guy gets two keys.
26:33
SPEAKER_01: Another week later, they got 2,000 freaking and it just blew up from there.
26:38
SPEAKER_01: So so from 400 to multiple keys to duffel bags.
26:42
SPEAKER_01: You mentioned the duffel bags, right?
26:44
SPEAKER_01: And that's that's all right.
26:45
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, that case went all the way to the supreme court, right?
26:48
SPEAKER_01: Because the search, it was uh was it John Benson?
26:52
SPEAKER_01: It was John Benson now.
26:53
SPEAKER_01: I think about it, right?
26:54
SPEAKER_01: They they saw guys loading duffel bag into a trunk and it was the middle of the night.
26:59
SPEAKER_01: Right?
26:59
SPEAKER_01: I remember that case.
27:01
SPEAKER_01: I think it was I think it went to the Supreme Court, and definitely went to the highest court in New York, but but that that that was a case where there was multiple duffel bags.
27:10
SPEAKER_01: And as soon as the cops, they were just pulling on because people moving out in the middle of the night.
27:16
SPEAKER_01: Some some some neighborhoods, people do move out in the middle of the night trying to beat the landlords, trying to not pay the rent, right?
27:22
SPEAKER_01: Or whatever reason, they go money, right?
27:24
SPEAKER_01: But the duffel bags, and you know, who flees, who doesn't, who they grab, and then all of a sudden you've got you know multiple duffel bags.
27:31
SPEAKER_01: It was weed, it was marijuana.
27:32
SPEAKER_01: Now it's you know, now it's not the night see that same person unloading into one of these dispensaries, right?
27:37
SPEAKER_01: It's not a crime anymore, right?
27:40
SPEAKER_01: But but yeah, but then it it just blew up and it took off and it I guess it's I don't know if it ever stopped, but uh but you go from 400 miles, like, oh, what you guys did to nothing anymore, right?
27:53
SPEAKER_00: Nothing.
27:53
SPEAKER_00: Well the and here's another thing that the 3-4 kind of it started in the 3-4, in my opinion, because I worked in the 5-0 years later next door.
28:01
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
28:01
SPEAKER_00: So in addition to the gangs bumping each other off for turf, I this is my crack spot, this is my coke spot.
28:08
SPEAKER_00: The Dominicans started these gangs that would go around and rip off the drug dealers.
28:15
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
28:15
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
28:16
SPEAKER_00: And they were not kind.
28:17
SPEAKER_00: They they would torture, kidnap.
28:20
SPEAKER_00: It was and you were getting homicides with people tied up and bound and tortured to death with a plastic bag over their head.
28:27
SPEAKER_00: I they used to dump a lot of them up in the 5-0 sometimes, or they'd wash up in Spite and Dival or along the Hudson River.
28:35
SPEAKER_00: And you they were always from the 3-4.
28:37
SPEAKER_00: They'd find their wallet or something.
28:39
SPEAKER_00: It was always you guys.
28:41
SPEAKER_00: Did you come across a lot come across that with the gangs ripping people off?
28:44
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
28:44
SPEAKER_01: And one time I was I was up at the Columbia Boathouse, right?
28:47
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, those of you that are not familiar with the area, it's at the very tip of Manhattan.
28:51
SPEAKER_01: There's a there's a body of water that that goes around, goes from the East River, goes around to the Hudson, and the 5-0 where where Vic was, there's a body of water between there.
29:01
SPEAKER_01: And I would see 5-0 cops with oars pushing the current back towards us, right?
29:05
SPEAKER_01: Oh, yeah.
29:06
SPEAKER_01: Oh, I'm making a joke, I'm making a joke.
29:08
SPEAKER_01: No, but they would.
29:10
SPEAKER_01: But no, those those multiple homicides, we we had a rash of them.
29:14
SPEAKER_01: Like, you know, you you get to an apartment, or you know, being a million, you know, you know when it's a real job, right?
29:20
SPEAKER_01: When there's there's multiple parts, 20, 30 calls, you know, and for the people there that are calling, it sounded like, you know, a law, right?
29:28
SPEAKER_01: It wasn't just pop pop, it was, you know, it was extended and then probably handled, you know, or being at at least a half a dozen where there was multiple homicides, three, four, five victims shot, three dead uh in apartments, and exactly that robberies, exactly that.
29:44
SPEAKER_01: I could list a couple, like, you know, cops with this one job.
29:48
SPEAKER_01: It was always like more in the lower end, like 155th to 181st, like in that area from Broadway to Edge Palm Avenue.
29:56
SPEAKER_01: Most of that that violence happened down there, but you know, the cops were going in the building.
30:01
SPEAKER_01: Me and my partner went went down the stairs, and there's this guy crawling in, you know how some of these buildings are.
30:07
SPEAKER_01: They have staircases that go down, and usually the super lives down there, and that's where the the garbage is stored and stuff like that.
30:14
SPEAKER_01: So, you know, I go down a staircase, and it there's this guy crawling, and he's leaving a trail of blood.
30:19
SPEAKER_01: He shot up, but he was also armed.
30:21
SPEAKER_01: He had, you know, he had two guns on him.
30:24
SPEAKER_01: So he he was one of the perps robbing the apartment, other perps, right?
30:29
SPEAKER_01: And then to get him, roll him over.
30:31
SPEAKER_01: He shot up, right?
30:32
SPEAKER_01: He was, I don't know if he survived or not survived, but you know, handcuffed him up, took two guns off of him, and then upstairs, there's you know, there's three people dead, there's two more people shot.
30:42
SPEAKER_01: You know, someone else shot on a staircase.
30:44
SPEAKER_01: So, you know, the victims were shooting back at the at the perps.
30:47
SPEAKER_01: And then there was a series of robberies.
30:49
SPEAKER_01: This was a notorious led by a guy named Larry Davis.
30:53
SPEAKER_01: He was identified, like, you know, he got picked up.
30:55
SPEAKER_01: There was one one shooting where where three guys are dead, but one of the victims, you know, they they duct tape everybody up, lay everybody on the floor, and and Davis was basically executing people.
31:07
SPEAKER_01: You know, like he he just couldn't let it go with that.
31:10
SPEAKER_01: He he was executed.
31:11
SPEAKER_01: So this one victim bailed out of a window.
31:14
SPEAKER_01: It's like a third floor window.
31:15
SPEAKER_01: He just crashed out the window, landed on the street, and happened to be two cops.
31:19
SPEAKER_01: And to this day, I'm still friendly with one of them.
31:21
SPEAKER_01: We we we see each other all the time, Chris and his partner, Vinny.
31:24
SPEAKER_01: And they heard the crashing and they would just be passing, they were just passing by, and you know, they heard the crash, they heard the glass, and then all of a sudden there's this guy on the street.
31:33
SPEAKER_01: And as they're getting out of the car, the stick-up crew is is coming out, and it was right in between Audubon and Edgecombe.
31:41
SPEAKER_01: They're not my story, it's their story, right?
31:43
SPEAKER_01: But right in between Audubon and Edgecombe, which is a patch of woods, and then a drop-down, and then you got the polo grounds of projects where the New York Giants used to play.
31:52
SPEAKER_01: It used to be a ball field there, the polo grounds.
31:55
SPEAKER_01: But they come out, they bail into cars, they hit a getaway driver, and they take off.
31:59
SPEAKER_01: So, so they call for ammo, they call for backup, and they go after the car and they chase them down to 155th Street, which there's a little bridge there.
32:07
SPEAKER_01: Yankee Stadium, right in the background.
32:09
SPEAKER_01: On the other side in the Browns, it's 161st Street, so it's the 161 bridge, right?
32:14
SPEAKER_01: It it was named after the street, right?
32:17
SPEAKER_01: They go over, you know, they're in pursuit, they're chasing, right?
32:20
SPEAKER_01: The car comes to a you know, crashing halt, and there's uh a street.
32:24
SPEAKER_01: You you you're probably familiar with it, Yankee Stadium.
32:26
SPEAKER_01: It's a staircase that goes up through this park, and then there's a street at the top of the staircase.
32:31
SPEAKER_00: Ogden Avenue.
32:32
SPEAKER_01: Ogden, that's that's exactly right.
32:34
SPEAKER_01: I was trying to remember the name, it was Ogden.
32:36
SPEAKER_01: So the perps all go up there, and one guy turns and he's firing at them with two-fisted, right?
32:42
SPEAKER_01: And in his choice of weapons were like 45s, right?
32:46
SPEAKER_01: Like 1911 45s.
32:47
SPEAKER_01: So two-fisted, he's firing at them.
32:50
SPEAKER_01: And I don't know if they return fire or not, but they they they get away.
32:54
SPEAKER_01: But they were eyewitnesses to this guy.
32:57
SPEAKER_01: The guy that lived who threw himself out the window was so we all had pictures of of him in in our cars and everything, and we were looking for him.
33:05
SPEAKER_01: So the the heat was on and he knew it.
33:06
SPEAKER_01: And he lived, I think he lived on Hodgin.
33:08
SPEAKER_01: Uh one block over Woody Crest.
33:10
SPEAKER_01: Woody Crest, there you go.
33:12
SPEAKER_01: There, there you go.
33:13
SPEAKER_01: He he was on his way home, right?
33:15
SPEAKER_01: And then uh so they they got intel on him in emergency service, and the the detective bureau went went looking for him.
33:22
SPEAKER_01: He was supposed to be in his mother's house or his sister's house or something like that.
33:25
SPEAKER_01: They cornered him, but he came out shooting.
33:27
SPEAKER_01: Five cops were shot, right?
33:29
SPEAKER_01: He he managed to shoot five, five cops, right?
33:32
SPEAKER_01: None thankfully none died, but but he hit five five of them, right?
33:36
SPEAKER_01: There's a whole story about that shooting too, but but you know, then he got away and then he got caught within days later.
33:43
SPEAKER_01: I think then he finally got caught at his mother's house or something.
33:46
SPEAKER_01: Um, I think it might have been in the projects, but it was a whole barricaded situation.
33:50
SPEAKER_01: It was Webster Avenue.
33:53
SPEAKER_01: So those are the bad stories of the Washington Heights, you know.
33:56
SPEAKER_01: I try to spin it by hey, Washington fought a battle here, you know.
33:59
SPEAKER_01: It's the Sylvan Terrace, it's this beautiful clapboard houses from the 1800s.
34:03
SPEAKER_01: But yeah, you know, it was it was an interesting place to be and learn to be a cop.
34:09
SPEAKER_01: No matter how many years passed by, no matter how many commands I was in, I still consider myself a 3-4 cop, right?
34:15
SPEAKER_01: Does that sound strange?
34:16
SPEAKER_01: I I don't know.
34:18
SPEAKER_00: Well, after you got seasoned in the 3-4, which you probably saw more than most in a few short years up there, you went to the NYPD's elite street crime unit.
34:27
SPEAKER_00: Can you tell us about the unit?
34:28
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
34:30
SPEAKER_01: So got lucky with that.
34:32
SPEAKER_01: And I I don't know how, right?
34:33
SPEAKER_01: It it started, it started with first time I ever heard of that.
34:37
SPEAKER_01: I was a partner was out out either sick or on vacation or whatever he was.
34:41
SPEAKER_01: I was working with this other guy, and we had an aided at at Columbia, the university uh medical center, right?
34:46
SPEAKER_01: It's it's a big hospital, 168th Street and Broadway, right across the street from the Audubon house.
34:52
SPEAKER_01: But uh it's just a a fight in the street, Central Plaza, and attack this guy.
34:59
SPEAKER_01: And I we were coming out from an aided, right?
35:02
SPEAKER_01: And I saw him just take off, and he just attacks this guy, he was a homeless guy who was camped out there, and run over there, and he's he's really wailing on him, he's hurting bad.
35:11
SPEAKER_01: At some point, bites down on his forehead, right?
35:14
SPEAKER_01: And I mean, blood is splurting everywhere, and I'm trying to get this guy off, and I'm you know, trying to fight him, trying to get him off.
35:20
SPEAKER_01: Partners calling for help, and the guy latches onto my leg, he bites me in the leg.
35:25
SPEAKER_01: I go down, we're fighting.
35:27
SPEAKER_01: But earlier in the night, before the tour started, I had uh my father's friend's son was a dentist in in Englewood, right?
35:34
SPEAKER_01: And I was having a problem with my wisdom teeth.
35:36
SPEAKER_01: So he had taken the week before he taken two out, not an issue.
35:39
SPEAKER_01: This time I go see him before work.
35:41
SPEAKER_01: He takes two more out, but one was in pack doors, I was stitches, I was so now I'm fighting with this guy, and I tore stitches, I'm bleeding all over the place.
35:50
SPEAKER_01: Not from him, right?
35:51
SPEAKER_01: I'm just bleeding all down in front of my face.
35:54
SPEAKER_01: Not from him, you know.
35:55
SPEAKER_01: He bit me.
35:55
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, he got me good.
35:56
SPEAKER_01: He bit me really good in the cab.
35:58
SPEAKER_01: But struggle with him, gem cough, I'm pissed, right?
36:00
SPEAKER_01: He bit me in the leg, right?
36:02
SPEAKER_01: But and this, these two guys are running towards us.
36:04
SPEAKER_01: Guy, hey, take it easy, take it easy, all right.
36:06
SPEAKER_01: It's over, it's over, it's over.
36:07
SPEAKER_01: Good.
36:08
SPEAKER_01: That's what you want.
36:08
SPEAKER_01: You want you want other cops to to stop things, right?
36:12
SPEAKER_01: Before anything gets out of hand.
36:14
SPEAKER_01: So I turn around, and these guys are wearing the old anti-crime uniform, army jackets, right?
36:18
SPEAKER_01: The beards, right?
36:19
SPEAKER_01: It's the early 80s, right?
36:21
SPEAKER_01: So the beards and shields around the neck, and I'm like, so I turn around, like, I'm like, I'm like, oh yeah.
36:27
SPEAKER_01: So I got blood dripping down my face.
36:30
SPEAKER_01: He goes, holy shit.
36:32
SPEAKER_01: And he he goes to like, and I'm like, no, no, no.
36:34
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I guess no, no, no, nothing to do with this, nothing to do with this, right?
36:39
SPEAKER_01: So he goes, Oh, all right, all right, all right.
36:40
SPEAKER_01: So I I'm also I know I had toothpoles, I'm just bleeding, right?
36:46
SPEAKER_01: So I go, where are you guys from?
36:48
SPEAKER_01: Like, I knew all our anti-crime guys.
36:49
SPEAKER_01: I said, Street crime, street crime.
36:52
SPEAKER_01: Never heard of it before.
36:53
SPEAKER_01: So the next night, night, whatever, Mitch is back to work and tell him the story, and he goes, Street crime, what's that?
37:00
SPEAKER_01: I go, I don't know, man.
37:01
SPEAKER_01: These guys are beards, they look like Serpical, right?
37:03
SPEAKER_01: They look like, you know, they look like it's an old movie, right?
37:06
SPEAKER_01: It's a it's a historic, you know, story about a cop that, you know, who's undercover, and but it they look like him, right?
37:13
SPEAKER_01: So I was like, what do they do?
37:14
SPEAKER_01: I don't know.
37:15
SPEAKER_01: I don't know.
37:15
SPEAKER_01: So we started asking around, and you get mixed reviews.
37:18
SPEAKER_01: Ah, they steal everybody's collars, oh, they do this, oh, they do that.
37:21
SPEAKER_01: But they go all around the city, right?
37:23
SPEAKER_01: In plain clothes, doing anti-crime work.
37:26
SPEAKER_01: Sounded interesting.
37:27
SPEAKER_01: So we'd asked and seen, we'd talk to one guy.
37:30
SPEAKER_01: So one one day we had a court, and we had to take a car from Manhattan, criminal court.
37:36
SPEAKER_01: We had to sign out a car, and we would go and take pictures of a crime scene, or I forgot what the what what the case was, but we'll search for witnesses, take pictures, and on the way back, we went to street crime.
37:47
SPEAKER_01: So it was an old parkhouse on Randall's Island, which sits in between Queens, the Bronx, and Manhattan, right?
37:54
SPEAKER_01: Under the Triborough Bridge, which is now the Robert F.
37:56
SPEAKER_01: Kennedy Bridge, right?
37:58
SPEAKER_01: So we walk into there, and uh it's it's funny.
38:01
SPEAKER_01: You look back at it, you go, they were mocking us.
38:03
SPEAKER_01: But at the time, it was so nice, right?
38:05
SPEAKER_01: You had no idea.
38:07
SPEAKER_01: It may be a little naive, right?
38:08
SPEAKER_01: So we walk in the door and some guy behind the wheel, the phone with the desk, he goes, Can I help you, young fellows?
38:14
SPEAKER_01: We were in uniform.
38:15
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, we're we're interested in uh we're interested in learning about the the unit, maybe get applications or find out how we can how we can come to work here.
38:24
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, sure.
38:25
SPEAKER_01: Hey, Sarge, Sarge, right?
38:27
SPEAKER_01: You know, it's always shoulder, these two guys want to come into the unit, right?
38:30
SPEAKER_01: So that's when I met the great Sergeant Josandi, right?
38:33
SPEAKER_01: Sarge and Jasandi, right?
38:35
SPEAKER_01: Great man, great, great man, right?
38:37
SPEAKER_01: Resounding voice, big guy.
38:39
SPEAKER_01: Oh, so you guys want to be part of the unit, huh?
38:41
SPEAKER_01: All right, this is what you do.
38:43
SPEAKER_01: He goes into a drawer and he pulls out these two applications that are probably were still being used when I was still there as a lieutenant years later, right?
38:51
SPEAKER_01: Still the same applications, right?
38:52
SPEAKER_01: No change in them.
38:54
SPEAKER_01: All right, just fill those out, drop them off to us, and all right, hey, what are we gonna do?
38:59
SPEAKER_01: We're looking at them, all right.
39:00
SPEAKER_01: How many arrests, how many medals, didn't you do this, that, the other thing, right?
39:05
SPEAKER_01: We had no hooks.
39:06
SPEAKER_01: I mean, we we neither were we were the first on our you know, families on the job, right?
39:11
SPEAKER_01: We didn't know anybody, we didn't have anything.
39:13
SPEAKER_01: They were just humoring us, and then as we're leaving, they're all like, all right, goodbye, good luck, goodbye.
39:18
SPEAKER_01: We're like, but we we did it.
39:19
SPEAKER_01: We diligently did the applications, and long behold, a few months later we got called for interviews and we got picked up.
39:25
SPEAKER_01: Uh maybe the guy liked us, you know.
39:31
SPEAKER_01: And now we were, we ended up in street crying together, as a matter of fact.
39:34
SPEAKER_01: We were a month apart, we got there first, but but we ended up there together.
39:38
SPEAKER_01: So explain what it's like working in there.
39:40
SPEAKER_01: So it's citywide anti-crime, which which means you're you're in plane clothes, plane cars, right?
39:47
SPEAKER_01: And you you're out in the streets, you're assigned to different different commands depending on the day.
39:53
SPEAKER_01: And more times than not, you go to repetitive commands.
39:56
SPEAKER_01: You're in a 7-5 in Brooklyn or the 7-3 in Brooklyn, the 4-6 or the 4-4 in the Bronx, right?
40:02
SPEAKER_01: The 3-2 in Manhattan or Midtown, Midtown North, Midtown South, right?
40:07
SPEAKER_01: Though those those were basically your four areas.
40:10
SPEAKER_01: And then we were augmenting the precincts, right?
40:14
SPEAKER_01: Plain clothes, right?
40:15
SPEAKER_01: We not the strip cars, we had taxi cabs, we had livery cabs, we had undercover cars.
40:21
SPEAKER_01: We weren't undercover, right?
40:22
SPEAKER_01: That's a whole different job description.
40:25
SPEAKER_01: But we were in plain clothes, and the whole idea was street crimes, right?
40:29
SPEAKER_01: Street robberies, guns off the street, violence in the street, thing things of that nature.
40:34
SPEAKER_01: So we're precinct anti-crime, you know, the you pass something ten times and it becomes normal, even if it's abnormal, right?
40:42
SPEAKER_01: Whereas us, if we're new in the command and we don't see if something looks abnormal, maybe, maybe we're looking into it more.
40:48
SPEAKER_01: Or being discreet and watching, or being discreet and following, or or or looking for signs and signals that there's criminality afoot, and then and then making comments.
40:58
SPEAKER_01: But street crime is what street crime is.
41:00
SPEAKER_01: It's basically street crimes and run the gamut.
41:03
SPEAKER_01: You know what I mean?
41:04
SPEAKER_01: Burglaries next in, definitely a lot of robberies, you know, guns, taking guns off the street.
41:10
SPEAKER_01: And I said, I said something before about uh either people loved us or hated us, right?
41:15
SPEAKER_01: But we go to a lot of commands and it'd be like, ah, here's street crime again, stealing our colours, street crime again, stealing our colours, right?
41:21
SPEAKER_01: So Midtown we were in a lot, probably probably once a week.
41:24
SPEAKER_01: Every squad was in Midtown, right?
41:26
SPEAKER_01: And at at the time, Midtown being like Times Square area, right?
41:30
SPEAKER_01: You know, and and at the time there was these wilding events, right?
41:34
SPEAKER_01: Where kids from everywhere, they didn't have to be organized, didn't matter, right?
41:38
SPEAKER_01: Come from the Bronx, come from Brooklyn, come from Queens, whatever.
41:41
SPEAKER_01: And then enough kids get together and all of a sudden it's mayhem.
41:45
SPEAKER_01: People are being assaulted, people's handbags are being robbed, people chain snatches, whatever.
41:50
SPEAKER_01: But it'd be a crew of kids running up Broadway, you know, just knocking people over, stealing whatever they could.
41:56
SPEAKER_01: Kind of a crime of opportunity.
41:58
SPEAKER_01: Very unorganized, you know, just a collection of people.
42:01
SPEAKER_01: It got together.
42:02
SPEAKER_01: And once it starts, that's it.
42:04
SPEAKER_01: It's going crazy.
42:05
SPEAKER_01: And I don't know, dude.
42:07
SPEAKER_01: I know there'll be some people that'll be insulted by this, but but this is the truth, right?
42:12
SPEAKER_01: We're we're on um we're on uh the Broadway in 7th split, right?
42:16
SPEAKER_01: There's a split by 42nd Street.
42:18
SPEAKER_01: So so we're on 7th, right?
42:20
SPEAKER_01: And there's these kids picking themselves up off the floor.
42:24
SPEAKER_01: They had been victims of one of these these attacks, right?
42:27
SPEAKER_01: And they're all clipped up and you know, tore clothes are torn because they were ripping their pockets open to get it cash, ripping their wallets out, right?
42:36
SPEAKER_01: And we just happen to roll up on the victims, right?
42:39
SPEAKER_01: And when did it happen?
42:41
SPEAKER_01: Just happen, just happened, they just ran down that street, right?
42:44
SPEAKER_01: So grab one, throw him in the car, right?
42:47
SPEAKER_01: He's the one that's clipped up the most, right?
42:49
SPEAKER_01: He's the one that's injured the most.
42:51
SPEAKER_01: His pants are torn, like literally the pockets are ripped down and out, right?
42:56
SPEAKER_01: Throw him in the car, and there's three of us in the cars, me and my partner, and then a third person who was with us because her partner had had left the command, right?
43:04
SPEAKER_01: So we turn, we turn the street, it's a long street down to Eighth Arrogan, right?
43:09
SPEAKER_01: And there's a bunch of kids, right?
43:11
SPEAKER_01: Which ones, which ones, as we're coming up.
43:13
SPEAKER_01: We're in a nondescript car, so they're just they're just running.
43:16
SPEAKER_01: He goes, that one, that one, definitely that one, and that one, and and that one.
43:19
SPEAKER_01: He points out like three, four, five different people.
43:22
SPEAKER_01: So, you know, Jeff jumps out and he's like, I got the guy in blue.
43:25
SPEAKER_01: I said, I got the guy in green, right?
43:26
SPEAKER_01: And Marine jumps out, she says, I'll grab that guy.
43:29
SPEAKER_01: So we all went for a specific person, right?
43:32
SPEAKER_01: So no one goes easy, right?
43:34
SPEAKER_01: You're you're you're chasing them.
43:35
SPEAKER_01: They just beat up like three or four kids, right?
43:37
SPEAKER_01: And now they're running.
43:39
SPEAKER_01: That's why I'm on the floor.
43:40
SPEAKER_01: You're running behind them and you're just tackling them, right?
43:43
SPEAKER_01: You you're just tackling.
43:44
SPEAKER_01: Boom, it's inside.
43:45
SPEAKER_01: Excuse me, can I talk to you?
43:46
SPEAKER_01: No, no, you're just tackling, right?
43:48
SPEAKER_01: And then and then a little bit of struggling and stuff like that.
43:51
SPEAKER_01: And the the best thing to do is get copped as quick as possible.
43:54
SPEAKER_01: So I got one, Marie's got another one, and then and then Jeff actually's got two.
44:00
SPEAKER_01: Two.
44:00
SPEAKER_01: But while he's locking one up, some guy jumps on him trying to free his friend.
44:05
SPEAKER_01: And he's pretty strong.
44:07
SPEAKER_01: He's got one guy and clocks the other guy, freaking gets him down.
44:10
SPEAKER_01: Now he's got two.
44:12
SPEAKER_01: You know, got another pair of cuffs in the car.
44:13
SPEAKER_01: So, you know, I got my guy, or I held the the third guy, and either Marie ran to the car, got no set of cars, hey.
44:20
SPEAKER_01: So now you catch a breath, right?
44:22
SPEAKER_01: All right, we got we got four.
44:24
SPEAKER_01: We got four, right?
44:25
SPEAKER_01: And he's, you know, who he said is who we chased after.
44:29
SPEAKER_01: That guy in the green.
44:30
SPEAKER_01: All right, I got him, right?
44:31
SPEAKER_01: So we got them, right?
44:34
SPEAKER_01: And now, you know, we got him on a car, we're tossing everything.
44:37
SPEAKER_01: And the victim, he goes, I don't know if I'm on any part of this.
44:40
SPEAKER_01: I go, you don't want to know if you want any part of what?
44:43
SPEAKER_01: He goes, Yeah, you guys are too rough.
44:45
SPEAKER_01: I go, I'm looking at him.
44:48
SPEAKER_01: His his pants are shredded, right?
44:50
SPEAKER_01: His pocket, he's clipped up all over the face, right?
44:53
SPEAKER_01: He's he's freaking, you know, he's bleeding, right?
44:56
SPEAKER_01: His lip is freaking swollen, he's he's bleeding.
44:58
SPEAKER_01: I'm like, no one did anything excessive.
45:01
SPEAKER_01: We made arrests.
45:02
SPEAKER_01: So we bring everything to the station house.
45:04
SPEAKER_01: We get we get to the south.
45:05
SPEAKER_01: I don't know.
45:06
SPEAKER_01: You've probably been in the south, right?
45:07
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and so we walk in, we got four guys, of course.
45:11
SPEAKER_01: Of course, no one did anything, right?
45:12
SPEAKER_01: No, no one did anything, but we got four cats, right?
45:15
SPEAKER_01: So we we go, we we we go up to the desk, and you know, exactly.
45:20
SPEAKER_01: We got this kid that he's like upset because we thinks we were too rough, right?
45:24
SPEAKER_01: You know, uh just fight with two guys.
45:26
SPEAKER_01: I don't know how much rougher you can be, you know.
45:28
SPEAKER_01: I mean, no one's injured, you know, no, no, no one's going to the hospital.
45:33
SPEAKER_01: No, no, no one's hurt badly, right?
45:35
SPEAKER_01: No one's going easy.
45:36
SPEAKER_01: We get to the desk, and there's a there's a cop on the desk.
45:39
SPEAKER_01: And he does, here we go, street crime, stealing our collars.
45:46
SPEAKER_01: Like, I just laugh, I just laugh.
45:50
SPEAKER_01: I'm pissed.
45:51
SPEAKER_01: And then he goes to the back to get us like booking sheets or whatever they are.
45:55
SPEAKER_01: And then when he comes back, he's throwing them on a table.
45:58
SPEAKER_01: I go, you know what your problem is?
46:00
SPEAKER_01: And they had now, if you're from the South, please don't get annoyed at me, right?
46:03
SPEAKER_01: But they had a sign hanging from the ceiling, right?
46:07
SPEAKER_01: Right?
46:07
SPEAKER_01: Midtown South, busiest in the world, right?
46:10
SPEAKER_01: So this is a this is a long time ago, this is the 80s, and it's true.
46:13
SPEAKER_01: Radio runs and 1010s and things like that.
46:15
SPEAKER_01: They had over 100,061 crime reports every year.
46:19
SPEAKER_01: Bigtown, I said, you know what your problem is?
46:22
SPEAKER_01: You read that sign every day and you believe it.
46:24
SPEAKER_01: Instead of being here behind the desk, why don't you go out there and look for some of these guys doing robberies, right?
46:29
SPEAKER_01: I'll forget, of course, you know, I get showed like you know, you made your point, you made your point, right?
46:34
SPEAKER_01: Now, if you're from the South, please don't get don't get annoyed at me.
46:37
SPEAKER_01: I have respect for everybody, right?
46:38
SPEAKER_01: But it was just this one guy at this one particular time.
46:41
SPEAKER_01: We weren't stealing anything from you, you know.
46:43
SPEAKER_01: We happen to have it as a pickup.
46:45
SPEAKER_01: But that that that was sometimes our reputation, even though I I would argue it's not true.
46:51
SPEAKER_01: I like street crime.
46:52
SPEAKER_01: You what were you in street crime from?
46:53
SPEAKER_01: What years?
46:54
SPEAKER_01: So as a cop, I was there from 87 to 89.
46:57
SPEAKER_01: I got promoted out of there to sergeant, and then I ended up back there in let's see, 94 to 96.
47:07
SPEAKER_01: 94 to 96 as a sergeant.
47:10
SPEAKER_01: And then I went to narcotics for for two years as a sergeant.
47:13
SPEAKER_01: And in 98, I got promoted to lieutenant out of narcotics.
47:17
SPEAKER_01: I ended up back in the 2-6, and then uh the ICO from Street Crime, who I know and love dearly, is retiring.
47:24
SPEAKER_01: He came and recruited me for the job.
47:26
SPEAKER_01: So I was on the desk in the 2-6.
47:28
SPEAKER_01: Remember, they put lieutenants back on the desk, right?
47:31
SPEAKER_01: White shirts back on the desk, he was a desk officer, right?
47:34
SPEAKER_01: So stuck on a desk.
47:35
SPEAKER_01: And uh he was he was recruiting me, he was retiring, and he came in.
47:39
SPEAKER_01: And so you know, see, I got promoted in 98, in February 98, so in November 98, I got picked up as the the ICO for street crime.
47:48
SPEAKER_01: So I was back there until until the end, until we got disbanded.
47:52
SPEAKER_01: And then uh nine months later, I ended up in emergency.
47:55
SPEAKER_00: So the reason I ask is my first taste, I I have a very similar story about you walking into street crime.
48:02
SPEAKER_00: So you guys, I was in Bronx Task Force in the summer of 1989, and they must have had a shitload of shootings up there.
48:10
SPEAKER_00: So they had everybody up there, and then they had us in task force doing they changed our chores instead of working until two in the morning, I think four or five in the morning.
48:18
SPEAKER_00: And street crime was all over the place.
48:20
SPEAKER_00: And I loved you guys because I had a couple of car chases for stolen cars, and the next thing you guys were like popping up like whack-a-moles all over the place.
48:28
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and they they were coming in every night in the 4-7 with guns.
48:32
SPEAKER_01: There's a way to do intelligent policing, right?
48:34
SPEAKER_01: With without violating, you know, the Fourth Amendment, without violating rights or anything like that, you know.
48:40
SPEAKER_01: But it sometimes it's just laying low and being quiet and watching.
48:43
SPEAKER_01: Sometimes it's turning over rock, you know.
48:45
SPEAKER_01: But there it was a I I'll I'll defend it to the day I'm dead, you know.
48:50
SPEAKER_01: There was a lot of phenomenal cops with raid instincts that that ri really, really were into uh policing and police work, you know.
49:01
SPEAKER_01: Once or twice uh someone slipped through the cracks and maybe, maybe they maybe maybe they forgot about the Fourth Amendment.
49:06
SPEAKER_01: Like, but that that wasn't the norm.
49:08
SPEAKER_01: The norm was really intelligent police work.
49:11
SPEAKER_01: So I I always thought we augmented.
49:13
SPEAKER_01: We we got we got sophisticated later on.
49:16
SPEAKER_01: In the beginning, it was just like, all right, you're going here, and there was no rhyme or reason, right?
49:19
SPEAKER_01: And then um just I'm gonna go off on on a second, just just backtrack.
49:24
SPEAKER_01: You're this and anyone on the job knows this, right?
49:27
SPEAKER_01: On the city job anyway, right?
49:29
SPEAKER_01: The color of the day, right?
49:31
SPEAKER_01: So so operations would send out a teletype message every morning on what the color of the day was.
49:37
SPEAKER_01: So plain clothes cops, not undercover cops, plain clothes cops would have headbands with that particular color.
49:43
SPEAKER_01: So every day you turned out at roll call, they said the color of the day is red, the color of the day is green, and you had headbands, sweatbands, really to protect your own life, right?
49:53
SPEAKER_01: You know, this this way cops could identify you easy, and you know, we thought, ah, no one knew what the color of the day was.
49:58
SPEAKER_01: Meanwhile, there was a radio station in New York that was broadcasting it every day.
50:02
SPEAKER_01: All right, for those of you out there, the color of the day is green, right?
50:05
SPEAKER_01: But but it was a way to identify, right?
50:07
SPEAKER_01: You get the color of the day.
50:08
SPEAKER_01: So I, you know, all right, I just knew about the color of the day.
50:11
SPEAKER_01: I get the street crime, and uh there was a uh a PAA there, and then she later on, she stayed in the unit the whole time.
50:19
SPEAKER_01: She's gone now, too, right?
50:20
SPEAKER_01: But the paddock, and uh one day one day I was there during the day and everything like that.
50:24
SPEAKER_01: She takes out, she I gotta do the color of the day.
50:26
SPEAKER_01: She takes out a piece of paper.
50:27
SPEAKER_01: It's a blank, it's just a blank the month, right?
50:30
SPEAKER_01: And she I go, how does that get set?
50:32
SPEAKER_01: She goes, I do it.
50:34
SPEAKER_01: Right?
50:35
SPEAKER_01: She goes, yeah.
50:36
SPEAKER_01: She goes, watch.
50:37
SPEAKER_01: She goes, yellow, red, and she's just writing Y, R, P for pink, right, green, right?
50:44
SPEAKER_01: Just randomly on on this calendar, right?
50:47
SPEAKER_01: On on this blank calendar, just writing it randomly and then and then call calling it into operations, just random.
50:56
SPEAKER_01: And then operations would would take that, and she put the calendar in the mail for for the following month, and the operations would put it on full time.
51:03
SPEAKER_01: But Patty set the color on a day for 30 plus years, right?
51:08
SPEAKER_01: I would have never known that.
51:09
SPEAKER_01: No one does it.
51:10
SPEAKER_01: I don't know who does it now or how it does it, or even if they still use it.
51:13
SPEAKER_01: But I thought that was the funniest thing.
51:15
SPEAKER_01: It's like you peek behind the curtain and there's Patty.
51:18
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, there's back when people could smoke it.
51:21
SPEAKER_01: Smoking a cigarette, let's see, Monday.
51:23
SPEAKER_01: Yellow, red, green.
51:25
SPEAKER_00: Just so random.
51:26
SPEAKER_00: But that was it.
51:28
SPEAKER_00: So Nick, you got into writing after you retired from the job.
51:31
SPEAKER_00: Tell us about your your new book, The Big One, Reflections of an NYPD Lieutenant.
51:35
SPEAKER_01: So in my mind, right, you know, I'm in emergency service and live through the 11th, right?
51:40
SPEAKER_01: Live through, work through all of that.
51:43
SPEAKER_01: And in reality, the 11th never really ended.
51:45
SPEAKER_01: I know we just we just you know had the 25th anniversary, but for some, for a lot of people, it just hasn't ended, right?
51:52
SPEAKER_01: So I always felt like I had a story to tell.
51:55
SPEAKER_01: And a friend of mine had had had written a book, and we we worked together years and years ago, not on the police department, right?
52:03
SPEAKER_01: But then I was at I was at a bank and he was doing security at the bank.
52:07
SPEAKER_01: He was working for a different company and we we talked almost every day.
52:10
SPEAKER_01: And he had just finished a book and he got published, right?
52:13
SPEAKER_01: And you know, but we we would we would just check, yeah, I'd go down for a cup of coffee and we'd hang out and talk.
52:19
SPEAKER_01: He goes, You got good stories, man.
52:20
SPEAKER_01: You should put this down.
52:21
SPEAKER_01: So I tried, I took a stab at it a couple of times, right?
52:24
SPEAKER_01: But always nagging at me about the 11th, right?
52:27
SPEAKER_01: Always nagging at me because, you know, quite frankly, we all say, Oh, we're all right, I'm all right, I'm all right.
52:32
SPEAKER_01: But you know what, you know, you can wake up in the middle of the night and still think about s some of the some of the things.
52:38
SPEAKER_01: And I I was had a sense that, you know, I had unfinished business.
52:42
SPEAKER_01: My friend Joe, Joe Battalamente, asked if I he could interview me for last year, it's the 22nd or 23rd or 24th anniversary.
52:52
SPEAKER_01: Can can I interview you?
52:53
SPEAKER_01: I had never done anything like that.
52:54
SPEAKER_01: Okay, never spoke about it.
52:56
SPEAKER_01: I told him a story here, a story there, just from sometimes comic relief, and a lot of things I just kept bottled up, right?
53:03
SPEAKER_01: So told the story and he wrote.
53:05
SPEAKER_01: And then my my my younger daughter, you know, of course my family, my younger daughter says that I was three when it happened.
53:12
SPEAKER_01: She goes, I I know you did more than this.
53:15
SPEAKER_01: I I one day you've gotta you've gotta tell us what the story is, right?
53:20
SPEAKER_01: All right, I yeah, I'll do that.
53:22
SPEAKER_01: I'll I'll try it.
53:22
SPEAKER_01: I took a couple stabs at writing, and it looked more like uh like a 12th grade essay than than it did any any real kind of work.
53:31
SPEAKER_01: So after Joe's article came out, you know, I read it.
53:34
SPEAKER_01: I said, that's pretty good.
53:35
SPEAKER_01: So I called him, right?
53:36
SPEAKER_01: And we were friends a long time.
53:37
SPEAKER_01: I said, hey, you want to work on something with me?
53:39
SPEAKER_01: And I told him, I said, I got all this rambling thoughts in my head.
53:42
SPEAKER_01: I can't get them on paper.
53:43
SPEAKER_01: I need help.
53:44
SPEAKER_01: All right, how do you want to do this?
53:46
SPEAKER_01: I don't know.
53:46
SPEAKER_01: We'll talk, right?
53:48
SPEAKER_01: So what we did was we set aside nine o'clock every Saturday morning for a better part of a year, and I I I would sit here.
53:54
SPEAKER_01: I would sit here and just on the phone telling a story.
53:57
SPEAKER_01: Morons that we are, right?
53:59
SPEAKER_01: We've got all this technology, we've got computers, we got this.
54:01
SPEAKER_01: We could have got out of, we could have got no, we sat, I sat with a cup of coffee and the phone in my hand and just started relaying stories.
54:09
SPEAKER_01: We didn't know where we were going, we didn't know what we were doing, right?
54:12
SPEAKER_01: And he goes, Well, I never knew this about you.
54:15
SPEAKER_01: I uh like I never you never told this story.
54:17
SPEAKER_01: I says, I never told you a lot of stories, right?
54:19
SPEAKER_01: Like I never told you a lot.
54:21
SPEAKER_01: I had drawn an outline and said, I need to get this out.
54:23
SPEAKER_01: Whether it helps me sleep, whether it, whether it clears my head, whether it's therapy, whatever it is, I I need to get this out.
54:30
SPEAKER_01: We both had no idea we were going with this.
54:32
SPEAKER_01: But as we were going on, like he transposed what I said into into words, and then he'd email me and we'd look and we we played with it a little bit and we put it aside and next Saturday tell him another story.
54:44
SPEAKER_01: Before you know it, you know, we had a lot.
54:46
SPEAKER_01: And we literally, I swear to God, you know, sat in that that that big comfy chair, right?
54:51
SPEAKER_01: And and just just talking and bullshit.
54:54
SPEAKER_01: And you know, sometimes we cry and sometimes we laugh, sometimes, you know, stupid stories, sometimes, you know, bad stories, you know.
55:00
SPEAKER_01: But we went through it all.
55:02
SPEAKER_01: And then, you know, at some point you realized, yeah, we get we kind of kind of got a body of work here, you know.
55:06
SPEAKER_01: Like, what do you think?
55:08
SPEAKER_01: Like, I don't know, I think we can do something with this.
55:10
SPEAKER_01: So as we refined it, we we started thinking, let's let's see what we can do.
55:15
SPEAKER_01: So we we came up with this body of work, right?
55:18
SPEAKER_01: The big one, and I appreciate you mentioning that.
55:21
SPEAKER_01: And and you know, what I think emerged from it is really a an honest personal portrayal of uh what I saw, what my experiences were during the entire event, right?
55:34
SPEAKER_01: From day one, 9-11, till today, till today, right?
55:38
SPEAKER_01: Because it really hasn't stopped.
55:39
SPEAKER_01: Whether there's a family out there that never received word of the whom that their loved one was found, right?
55:46
SPEAKER_01: It's is still yearning for that that phone call, right?
55:49
SPEAKER_01: Or, you know, illness, right, which is non-stop, is as you know.
55:56
SPEAKER_01: I'm sure I'm sure you've had a lot you know, a lot of people that you've talked to that are the same way, you know.
56:00
SPEAKER_01: Friend from a friend of mine is in slow now.
56:03
SPEAKER_01: He's in there for 30 to 30 days.
56:05
SPEAKER_01: So many people we've lost through the years, you know.
56:08
SPEAKER_01: So it continues to this day, you know, it's the 25th anniversary, but it didn't stop.
56:12
SPEAKER_01: And honestly, it didn't stop for me either.
56:14
SPEAKER_01: So I will warn is it's raw, it's emotional.
56:18
SPEAKER_01: There's some things that'll make you smile, there's some things that'll make you laugh, some things that'll make you cry.
56:23
SPEAKER_01: So I just if someone is kind enough to pick it up and and read it, I I just be forewarned, you know.
56:30
SPEAKER_01: And I don't better, but you know, I think what we managed to put out is powerful.
56:35
SPEAKER_01: I hope your listeners, you know, pick it up, look at it.
56:38
SPEAKER_01: I hope they find it the same way.
56:40
SPEAKER_01: It's not about me, it's about my experiences, but it really is a tribute to those that I work with, the those that we lost, those that continue to suffer.
56:49
SPEAKER_01: And God forbid I I made it, you know, about me.
56:52
SPEAKER_01: It's not.
56:53
SPEAKER_01: It's it's really about them.
56:55
SPEAKER_01: So that's what we came out with.
56:57
SPEAKER_01: And I would argue it's centered on the 11th, but I don't think it's an 11th story.
57:02
SPEAKER_01: It's I think it's more than that.
57:03
SPEAKER_01: There's a lot of resilience and resolve in there, and I think it's evident by some of the actions that uh people that I know and work with did that day and onward, you know.
57:14
SPEAKER_01: So I don't know, Victor.
57:15
SPEAKER_01: That's uh you're kind to mention it.
57:17
SPEAKER_01: I really appreciate it.
57:18
SPEAKER_01: And I I just hope it's received well by by people out there.
57:22
SPEAKER_00: Well, Nick, what's what's one more time?
57:24
SPEAKER_00: What's the name of the book and where can our listeners pick up a coffee?
57:27
SPEAKER_01: So it's we titled it The Big One, uh Reflections of an NYPD Lieutenant.
57:33
SPEAKER_01: It's more of a memoir than anything else.
57:36
SPEAKER_01: In print, it's on Amazon.
57:37
SPEAKER_01: It's on Arns and Noble electronic form, it's uh on Apple electronic form.
57:42
SPEAKER_01: In in print, just on Amazon.
57:44
SPEAKER_01: I hope they enjoy it.
57:45
SPEAKER_01: You know, Erline said recently, he said, Why do you care?
57:47
SPEAKER_01: It's out because I care.
57:49
SPEAKER_01: I care.
57:49
SPEAKER_01: You know, I think it's I think this story is generational.
57:53
SPEAKER_01: It's really no different than what happened on December 7th, you know, in in Pearl Holland.
57:58
SPEAKER_01: You know, like it's important.
58:00
SPEAKER_01: Not not so much my story, but the 11th is is our history.
58:04
SPEAKER_01: It's important for people to understand, know, and remember.
58:07
SPEAKER_00: Well, Nick, I appreciate you coming on the show and thank you for spending your time with us today.
58:12
SPEAKER_01: Thanks for having me.
58:12
SPEAKER_01: It's been it's been this is heavy, but it's it's been fun.
58:16
SPEAKER_01: Thanks for letting me unload a little bit.
58:18
SPEAKER_01: I really appreciate it.
58:19
SPEAKER_00: Anytime.
58:20
SPEAKER_00: And as always, I'd like to thank everyone for tuning in, especially my listeners in Tampa, Florida, Elmont, New York, Woodmere, Woodmere, New York, Yorktown Heights, Northridge, California, and Hilverson, North Holland.
58:31
SPEAKER_00: If you worked in law enforcement and had an interesting criminal background, please drop me a note on Twitter or Instagram at VicProy50.
58:37
SPEAKER_00: If you're watching on YouTube, please hit the like and subscribe buttons.
58:40
SPEAKER_00: If you enjoy the content, check out my Amazon author page.
58:42
SPEAKER_00: Just type in my name Vic Ferrari like the car, where you can preview all my NYPD books for free.
58:47
SPEAKER_00: Thanks again, everyone, and I'll see you next week.