Latest / BREAK/FIX the Motorsports & Vehicle Enthusiast Variety Show / What Should I Buy? - EVs, Hybrids, and Heated Seats: A No-Holds-Barred Debate!

Transcript

What Should I Buy? - EVs, Hybrids, and Heated Seats: A No-Holds-Barred Debate! · BREAK/FIX the Motorsports & Vehicle Enthusiast Variety Show

• 0:00
  Our panel of break fix petrolheads are back for another rousing
• 0:03
  what should I buy debate.
• 0:05
  Using unique shopping criteria, they are challenged to find our first
• 0:08
  time collector the best vehicle that will make their friends go.
• 0:12
  Where'd you get that?
• 0:13
  Or what the hell is wrong with you?
• 0:15
  At the next Cars and Coffee.
• 0:19
  Oh, the dreaded car buying experience.
• 0:21
  No matter who you are, it's probably a safe bet this isn't your
• 0:25
  ideal way to spend your weekend.
• 0:26
  In and out of dealerships, the hassle, haggling, the decision making.
• 0:30
  When confronted with car buying in today's modern world, there are
• 0:33
  just so many more choices besides make model and what color do I want.
• 0:37
  Now it's which power source do I want?
• 0:39
  To what level does it drive itself?
• 0:41
  Which creature comforts and gizmos are available for subscription?
• 0:44
  Am I Apple or Android?
• 0:45
  Even before so many choices, men and women have traditionally approached this
• 0:49
  experience differently for a multitude of reasons, some spanning use cases,
• 0:53
  from the mom van to car enthusiasts.
• 0:55
  Today, we will be diving deeper into what should I buy from a lady's point
• 0:59
  of view, focusing on the new car buyer versus car collector demographic, and
• 1:04
  even more specifically, EV buyers.
• 1:06
  Our group of extraordinary Petrolhead panelists range from veteran car
• 1:10
  reviewers to prospective buyers, as well as ladies already living with EVs.
• 1:15
  We're here to explore what to look for in today's EV car market.
• 1:19
  Joining us tonight, we have some returning Brake Fix guests.
• 1:23
  Please welcome Sarah Lacey from A Girl's Guide to Cars, Carolyn
• 1:27
  Ford from the Tech Transforms podcast, Grand Touring Motorsports.
• 1:31
  Sports Club members, Emily Fox and Chrissy Crutchfield, as well as special
• 1:35
  guest Kat Thelorean from DNG Motors.
• 1:38
  Welcome to the show, ladies.
• 1:40
  Hello.
• 1:40
  Thanks for having me.
• 1:41
  Hello.
• 1:41
  Thank you.
• 1:42
  Hi.
• 1:43
  We're here to talk cars.
• 1:45
  Where are we in our car journeys?
• 1:48
  So I'll start.
• 1:49
  I am not an EV car owner.
• 1:50
  That's what our main focus of discussing is tonight.
• 1:53
  I am, in fact, not even a new car owner.
• 1:56
  All my cars are aged.
• 2:00
  If you will, for historic tags, right?
• 2:03
  Yeah, I got one on historics already.
• 2:06
  Another I could put on historics this year and my daily driver,
• 2:10
  I can't put on historics, but it would be ready in two years.
• 2:12
  So I'm right there with you.
• 2:14
  I don't have an EV or any real new cars.
• 2:17
  I think my newest car is 2017.
• 2:21
  I've owned a hybrid before, but all of my cars are internal combustion.
• 2:25
  I own many cars.
• 2:27
  I actually own a new car.
• 2:28
  I own a 2022 XC40 Recharge, smaller size SUV, and I freaking love this thing.
• 2:35
  This is my daily driver.
• 2:36
  And I also have a 1967 MGBGT, which has the interior pulled
• 2:41
  apart, so I'm currently in the middle of year two of redoing it.
• 2:45
  But, Buying the SUV EV was perfect for me.
• 2:48
  I've got two girls.
• 2:49
  I need to carry all their soccer stuff around and all their girl
• 2:52
  scout stuff everywhere, all over Maryland every weekend.
• 2:55
  And it works perfectly for that.
• 2:56
  Going to the grocery store, whatever it is that I need.
• 2:59
  It does take a while to fill up, but for a daily task car, and
• 3:03
  you're only going maybe an hour, an hour and a half out of your.
• 3:06
  Regular charting area.
• 3:07
  It's not too bad.
• 3:08
  So Emily's winning our oldest car prize.
• 3:11
  I was winning until Emily spoke.
• 3:13
  So Chrissy, we have the Volkswagen ID for first edition and we just got a new Toyota
• 3:20
  Tundra, but obviously that's off topic and we have two others, mostly older cars.
• 3:25
  I'm excited to share and make suggestions even because there's a
• 3:29
  few that I'm actually interested in.
• 3:31
  I am not a new car owner either.
• 3:34
  My car is a 2016, but I did buy my son for his first car, a hybrid.
• 3:39
  He's still driving it right now.
• 3:41
  It's a 2005.
• 3:42
  I'll have to ask him how many miles.
• 3:44
  I feel like it had almost 150, 000 miles on it when I bought it.
• 3:48
  And I live in Utah.
• 3:49
  We just got dumped on with snow like 15 inches.
• 3:53
  Like, he gets to where he needs to go in this little Prius, which always shocks me.
• 3:58
  That was my hybrid.
• 3:59
  It was a Prius.
• 4:00
  I loved it.
• 4:00
  It was my fun little clown car.
• 4:02
  Yeah, he loves his and I drive a CR V because I do a lot of outdoor things and
• 4:08
  like, I'm going up the mountain to ski.
• 4:09
  So I need room for my skis and everything.
• 4:11
  And I'm always worried that I won't be able to get to where I need to go,
• 4:14
  but he doesn't seem to have a problem.
• 4:16
  He snowboards, he's taken it up into the mountains.
• 4:19
  So I'm very interested.
• 4:21
  In a pure EV and I'm lazy and impatient, and I don't want to have to wait at
• 4:29
  a charging station for 45 minutes.
• 4:31
  So I can't wait to have you guys help me get over these big hesitations
• 4:35
  for an EV because I want one.
• 4:38
  Sarah, round us off.
• 4:39
  Okay.
• 4:40
  I have a 2021 Tesla model Y and I have a 1982 Porsche 911 SC.
• 4:49
  Oh, as we dive into this outdoors.
• 4:53
  You want to take it into the mountains, you want to load your ski or snowboard
• 4:57
  gear in it, you're lazy, you're impatient, you don't want to wait
• 5:01
  three hours at the charger station.
• 5:04
  Well, and I go to the desert, so my runs like to the desert from my house, it's
• 5:08
  a three, three and a half hour ride.
• 5:11
  I'm going to have to stop and charge halfway there, right?
• 5:14
  And how long is that going to take, Emily?
• 5:16
  Uh, a while, depending on what kind of car you buy.
• 5:20
  And depends on what year it is.
• 5:21
  Because if they actually do anything about the EV charging grid across
• 5:25
  the continental United States, it might get a little bit better.
• 5:28
  But right now, it'll take you a really long time if you can find a
• 5:31
  charger on your way there and back.
• 5:34
  Exactly.
• 5:35
  So ladies and gentlemen listening, we are quickly devolving into what
• 5:39
  should I not buy and that's an EV car.
• 5:42
  That has something to say here though.
• 5:45
  Talk me into it.
• 5:46
  You're shaking your head.
• 5:47
  No, I'm shaking my head because if you brought me on here to convince you to
• 5:50
  get an EV, he called the wrong guest.
• 5:54
  No, I think I wanted you to convince me because I want to be a good
• 5:58
  global citizen and do my part.
• 6:01
  My question is, is with all of these requirements and concerns and your
• 6:05
  experience thus far with a car that was purchased with 150, 000 miles on it,
• 6:12
  why are you going EV and not hybrid?
• 6:14
  That's what I want to ask you guys, like right now.
• 6:17
  I just heard a story on NPR that totally crapped all over the hybrids
• 6:22
  and said, we got to do better and go into the full EV, but I agree with you.
• 6:26
  Like the hybrid seems like a really good way to go.
• 6:30
  It's not for everyone.
• 6:31
  There's a lot of things that go into EVs being greener.
• 6:34
  And there's a lot of things that are going into what's happening with EVs right now.
• 6:38
  While you may want to get an EV eventually, that'll meet all the
• 6:42
  needs that you have, you're not necessarily a bad global citizen
• 6:46
  for going hybrid because an EV right now doesn't meet your needs.
• 6:50
  Also, in order for the electricity that's charging your EV to be greener,
• 6:56
  it has to come from a greener source.
• 6:59
  than the gasoline or in some way.
• 7:01
  That was another big question of mine.
• 7:03
  How do you know that what you're charging with isn't doing just as much damage?
• 7:08
  If you want to be a good steward of the environment, work to offset the carbon
• 7:13
  you use until you can get something that can be a fully neutral vehicle.
• 7:17
  Don't try and change your entire life just because you want something that everybody
• 7:22
  else will look at you and go, Ooh, look, she's doing great for the environment.
• 7:26
  It's a great way of putting it.
• 7:27
  Well, and I think that that speaks to the idea that there's a discrepancy
• 7:31
  between what is available and what people can manage in their daily lives.
• 7:37
  And there is something to wanting to speak via your wallet.
• 7:41
  You know, I'm going to purchase an EV because I know that maybe everything
• 7:46
  I want in an EV isn't there yet, but I want to push that forward by purchasing
• 7:51
  an EV or a plugin hybrid at this.
• 7:54
  Stage of the game, there's a lot of gray area to consider for this.
• 7:59
  And I do think that your feelings are valid that yes, you do want to be a
• 8:03
  global citizen and recognizing that it's not maybe a hundred percent the
• 8:08
  right choice for you right now, but it doesn't mean that you can't also
• 8:12
  find something that bridges that gap.
• 8:14
  Day to day, we're just seeing so many more models.
• 8:17
  We're seeing so many improvements in infrastructure, but there's
• 8:21
  still a lot of work to be done.
• 8:24
  Charging stations are tough.
• 8:26
  Understanding and being a consumer in this environment is tough.
• 8:29
  We all have to become electrical engineers all of a sudden.
• 8:33
  It's a very early time in the life of EVs.
• 8:36
  So you have to be patient with yourself.
• 8:39
  And unfortunately, you have to do a lot of homework.
• 8:41
  I don't want you to, uh, lazy shame yourself.
• 8:44
  It's just a lot of information to take on right now.
• 8:48
  Yeah.
• 8:48
  I have a question about the environmental impact of EVs.
• 8:53
  So I buy an EV.
• 8:54
  Let's say I buy, I think it was a Chevy Bolt, which is about 20, 000.
• 8:59
  And in eight years, With an internal combustion engine, I would have
• 9:02
  turned around and sold that car or a hybrid with 150, 000 miles on it, and
• 9:07
  it would have continued to live on.
• 9:09
  But in eight years, it's going to cost somebody who spent 20, 000 on a
• 9:12
  car 15, 000 to replace the battery.
• 9:15
  So you're creating a bunch of throwaway cars.
• 9:18
  while harvesting all of the lithium from our planet and these toxic chemicals
• 9:23
  that create death napalm when they catch on fire to save the planet.
• 9:27
  You're who I needed to talk to.
• 9:29
  I feel better about myself.
• 9:32
  I'm telling you that I am not the person to convince you to buy an EV.
• 9:36
  Also, our electric infrastructure can't support our air conditioning.
• 9:41
  Do you guys know what happens when you bring three electric
• 9:43
  Cadillacs into a dealership at once?
• 9:45
  You can't plug them all in or the whole dealership goes dark.
• 9:48
  It's not just the charging stations.
• 9:50
  We don't currently make enough electricity to support every single
• 9:54
  person plugging car into their house.
• 9:56
  So we can't push EVs for every single person when there are other options
• 10:01
  that we had available to us to put our research towards and They're
• 10:04
  not available for us to buy now.
• 10:06
  And I have feelings about the fact that they're going to be delaying them.
• 10:11
  Because I feel like too, that is yet another piece that's moving along.
• 10:16
  You know, it feels like a snail's pace for a lot of us, but when I was at the
• 10:20
  Chicago auto show and there was a woman there from Con Ed speaking, and she
• 10:24
  was talking about how, what we have to remember is that every single person
• 10:28
  isn't going to plug in every single night.
• 10:30
  And crash the grid, granted, she's in the Midwest.
• 10:34
  She's not speaking from the standpoint of someone in California, where you have to
• 10:39
  manage things like brownouts and whatever.
• 10:42
  And one of our writers on our website, she just bought this
• 10:45
  really cool solar generator.
• 10:47
  In the event of a brownout, she's still going to have the option to charge
• 10:52
  her car from the solar generator.
• 10:55
  So it's yet another piece.
• 10:56
  That we're seeing a lot of development taking place.
• 11:00
  I think it's important that we recognize too, that that kind of information
• 11:04
  and those things change on a month to month basis, things are changing.
• 11:08
  They're figuring things out.
• 11:10
  We still don't really know for sure how recycling these batteries is going
• 11:14
  to work, and we don't know for sure what that cost ultimately will be.
• 11:18
  We're facing a massive, massive phase of early adoption.
• 11:23
  We just really haven't seen that on this scale.
• 11:26
  So it's hard to know we're not creating throwaway batteries.
• 11:29
  We're creating throwaway entire cars.
• 11:31
  That's my problem with it.
• 11:32
  It'd be one thing if we were just causing an issue with recycling the
• 11:36
  batteries, but it's causing the cars to be something we just toss away.
• 11:39
  I don't know how much people on this call.
• 11:42
  No.
• 11:42
  There is an existence, a hydrogen peroxide engine that was developed and
• 11:47
  quashed because of EV policymakers.
• 11:50
  So again, I have very, very strong feelings about what's
• 11:53
  happened in the EV world.
• 11:55
  You mentioned people probably aren't going to plug in every night.
• 11:58
  I don't know if that's true or not.
• 12:00
  I plug in every night.
• 12:02
  I would, I do.
• 12:03
  I don't have to.
• 12:04
  But I do, you know, they're pushing the trend toward, you know, everyone's
• 12:09
  no longer building internal combustion engines by the year last year, you
• 12:14
  know, and it's Evie or die, you're going to have multi Evie cars in your home.
• 12:18
  Someone's going to be plugging in every night.
• 12:20
  You're right.
• 12:21
  The grids can't handle it.
• 12:22
  We've seen this in the last couple of years, the huge outages in Texas
• 12:26
  where everyone was freezing to death because the grids couldn't support it.
• 12:29
  And they're their own special case of owning their own
• 12:32
  infrastructure and electricity.
• 12:33
  So we won't go there, but nonetheless, there's always brownouts and blackouts
• 12:38
  in California and this, that, and the other, that is a big problem.
• 12:40
  And Kat, to your point, what's always seems to be missed
• 12:43
  as a life cycle analysis.
• 12:45
  which is literally from the very beginning of the smallest component
• 12:50
  that goes into the car to what happens when it is put in the crusher at the
• 12:54
  landfill and put back into the earth.
• 12:56
  I still haven't gotten a good read on what that is versus
• 13:00
  your traditional ice engine car.
• 13:03
  I mean, a lot of the components are the same.
• 13:04
  You've got the frames and the body panels and all that, but you just
• 13:07
  have so many more electronics that are specialized that we know aren't Great to
• 13:13
  just throw out into the oceans, right?
• 13:16
  I'm not necessarily convinced either that 100 percent way that the future should go.
• 13:21
  I think there's room for them, and I think they have great use cases, and there
• 13:25
  are great times they should be applied.
• 13:27
  But just like your finances, you don't put all your eggs in one basket.
• 13:32
  You need to diversify.
• 13:33
  So there's still room for our hybrids, even more than regular ice engines.
• 13:37
  And there's also homes for EVs as well as hydrogen engines.
• 13:40
  Hopefully if they can, you know, solve the impending Hindenburg issues and
• 13:43
  whatever other, you know, technology Dutch are trying to put solar panels
• 13:48
  on the tops of cars and you can run them for an hour a day or whatever.
• 13:52
  There's all this going on.
• 13:53
  It's a complicated answer.
• 13:55
  It is, but you bring up a really interesting point that I don't think
• 13:58
  a lot of people actually think about when they're talking about what kind of
• 14:01
  car should I buy is the ability of you to maintain or work on your own car.
• 14:06
  We've had gas powered motors.
• 14:09
  For such a long period of time, decades upon decades, culturally,
• 14:13
  in that era of growing up, there was a reasonable expectation that
• 14:16
  you as the owner of your car were responsible for the maintenance of it.
• 14:20
  And it wasn't until you got mass market production of all of these kinds of
• 14:24
  vehicles in like the 1980s and the 1990s that you started to see this,
• 14:28
  as Kat put it, this throwaway kind of mentality associated with cars, you go
• 14:33
  to a specialty shop to do a repair on it.
• 14:35
  You're not necessarily doing it.
• 14:37
  Yourself, you're not being taught those skills.
• 14:39
  The next natural iteration of that, as you modernize engines to be more
• 14:43
  efficient, to do more, to do amazing things of whatever anybody wants
• 14:47
  it to be in saving the environment, you're taking away the ability to be
• 14:51
  self maintaining on your own vehicle.
• 14:54
  You're abstracting that.
• 14:55
  And you see that today in a lot of technology concepts, going from writing
• 14:58
  on something with a paper, pen and pad to actually scribbling on your
• 15:01
  iPad with it, and how many layers of extraction and tactile difference.
• 15:05
  You're losing over the course of that.
• 15:07
  And when that happens, there is no life cycle assessment because we've
• 15:11
  not been around long enough to say that there's somebody that can actually
• 15:14
  work on EVs and recycle those batteries and reuse those parts and rebuild
• 15:18
  those parking sensors by themselves.
• 15:20
  And then when it's an uphill battle, because there's.
• 15:21
  For years now, actually, I think there's been groups that are trying
• 15:24
  to advocate the anti right to work.
• 15:27
  You're not allowed to work on your car.
• 15:29
  You have to go bring it to a service station or auto dealer, whoever it is.
• 15:32
  I hate that.
• 15:33
  I hate that so much.
• 15:35
  That's terrible.
• 15:36
  I hope that never passes.
• 15:37
  That's actually something that we're working very, very hard
• 15:40
  on in the design of our car.
• 15:42
  I love working on my car for Many reasons, my car is one of
• 15:46
  the best engineered cars ever.
• 15:48
  That C7 is just beautiful.
• 15:50
  And the weight distribution, it's an incredible car.
• 15:52
  I can't get in there.
• 15:53
  It's too tight.
• 15:54
  My husband and I have been talking about this loss of a design.
• 15:58
  50 percent of kids today, they don't want cars.
• 16:00
  And we believe part of it is because you have that loss of
• 16:03
  tactile relationship with it.
• 16:06
  You can no longer work on your cars.
• 16:08
  And so one of the questions I said to my technology engineers was, can we
• 16:12
  Minecraft the car or Linux the car?
• 16:14
  Make it open source, take it to somewhere where we can open source, right?
• 16:19
  Start to actually work on our cars.
• 16:21
  Because not only do you have this battery obsolescence, you've planned
• 16:24
  obsolescence in the technology.
• 16:25
  You're not going to have these cars supported their computers on wheels.
• 16:29
  And so what happens when windows goes end of life and it's no longer
• 16:33
  supported, you can't get updates and the what's going to happen to these cars.
• 16:37
  There is a throwaway.
• 16:39
  Whereas you can still buy a 64 GTO today.
• 16:42
  There is an absolute death point on these cars where they will not be
• 16:47
  able to be revived, no matter what you do now with hybrids, you have an
• 16:50
  interesting situation where if this hybrid dies, you can actually rebuild it.
• 16:57
  With a mid engine internal combustion engine.
• 16:59
  So there is an opportunity for at least some of these cars to be repurposed.
• 17:05
  And I do believe that if you start to think about that in these EV cars, okay.
• 17:10
  When it dies, it's going to die.
• 17:12
  How do we create something that can be turned into something else?
• 17:16
  Is the throwaway thing true with all EVs or just the lower end?
• 17:20
  Like Sarah's Tesla, is it going to die in eight years?
• 17:23
  You're going to have to pay tens of thousands of dollars for a new battery.
• 17:27
  The question becomes, do you, at the end of that, however many, 120,
• 17:32
  000 miles, do you want to spend 000 to get a new battery pack?
• 17:37
  Or do you want to let the car go and get something different or a new one?
• 17:43
  Whatever you decide you want to do at that point.
• 17:46
  But one of the things I wanted to touch on about that was that
• 17:49
  there's a debate going on right now too about technology and cars.
• 17:54
  And this goes a little bit beyond the EV discussion, but in Germany, BMW is
• 18:01
  creating subscription based features.
• 18:05
  Yes.
• 18:05
  Mercedes too.
• 18:07
  Yes.
• 18:11
  What do you mean subscription based features like radio?
• 18:15
  You want to go faster?
• 18:16
  You pay.
• 18:17
  You pay a monthly fee for your heated seats.
• 18:20
  What?
• 18:21
  No.
• 18:22
  Uh huh.
• 18:24
  That's just one example.
• 18:26
  I'm curious what the real return on investment of that is,
• 18:29
  because the infrastructure to support that Has to be massive.
• 18:33
  Are you really making that much money?
• 18:34
  I guess.
• 18:35
  I don't know.
• 18:36
  People have gotten so hooked in the last, I don't know how many years you
• 18:40
  want to call it, with this pay to play.
• 18:42
  And the younger generation is like addicted to that, because all your video
• 18:46
  gaming systems, it's no longer I go to the store and I just Spend 50 bucks, I
• 18:51
  have a game, and I have the entire game.
• 18:53
  No, it's, I spend 50 bucks, and I have a quarter of the game, and then like,
• 18:57
  every two months, I have to pay 25.
• 19:00
  I can level up.
• 19:01
  To get like, the next 10 minutes of playtime.
• 19:03
  And then, on top of that, like, 1.
• 19:05
  99 here, and 1.
• 19:06
  99 there.
• 19:07
  And the same thing on your cell phones.
• 19:09
  Like, Candy Crush and all this stuff.
• 19:10
  And it's like, they keep tempting you and teasing you with these little bits
• 19:13
  of features that you want for, you know, little amounts of money and As you do it
• 19:18
  little by little, it desensitizes you, and then they're shifting that now into cars.
• 19:22
  It's like, yeah, you want heated seats?
• 19:24
  It's an extra 9.
• 19:24
  99 a month.
• 19:25
  You want to turn your radio on and actually hear a channel broadcast?
• 19:29
  Another 10 a month, and so on.
• 19:31
  It's ridiculous.
• 19:32
  Yeah.
• 19:32
  Kind of doing this one to ourselves because we're allowing it to happen.
• 19:35
  Even with streaming TV.
• 19:36
  It's like, we all complained about cable TV.
• 19:39
  We don't, I don't have what I want to watch.
• 19:41
  I wish I could a la carte it.
• 19:42
  And now we can a la carte it cause there's 15 streaming
• 19:45
  services and we're unhappy again.
• 19:48
  I want to go back to what, something you said though, about the gamification.
• 19:52
  I'm labeling it now that you didn't say gamification, but you put something in my
• 19:56
  head about the kids working on their cars.
• 19:59
  Like I totally had an Iron Man vision.
• 20:01
  of them able to like, really, are you going there?
• 20:04
  Yeah, it's something that I would like other people to adopt that's part of our
• 20:08
  whole model is yes, I want kids to be able to interact with their cars again.
• 20:13
  And I'm not necessarily going to be able to get them to be able to
• 20:17
  interact with it the way I could.
• 20:19
  So instead of trying to give them the experience I had, how
• 20:22
  can I take it to their level.
• 20:24
  And if you look at how profoundly successful anything open source is
• 20:28
  that allows them to get creative.
• 20:30
  That's the whole thing.
• 20:31
  Everybody wants to get back to using their hands.
• 20:34
  I not only want to create something that they can interact with, that they could
• 20:37
  3d print parts for, and that they can program their own little updates for.
• 20:42
  Whatever.
• 20:42
  I want to create something that will last forever.
• 20:45
  I want them to have a lifetime warranty on their car and I'll just build it
• 20:48
  into the price of the car and put away a savings that goes with it until they.
• 20:51
  Sell it and then it goes away, whatever.
• 20:53
  But we have this cost of maintenance, this cost of ownership that is stifling.
• 20:58
  Now, when my dad built cars, the thing that drove him crazy was the
• 21:02
  two biggest expenses you have in your life or your house and your car.
• 21:05
  Why are we paying for the second one forever?
• 21:07
  Literally forever.
• 21:09
  Soon as you finish paying for the first car, either you're paying as much as
• 21:12
  a new car payment to maintain it, or you have to go buy a new car because
• 21:17
  it just died for whatever reason.
• 21:19
  Why aren't we investing a little bit more in making something people
• 21:21
  can actually own and afford to own?
• 21:23
  My dad was a car guy too and he always said that it was
• 21:26
  designed that way on purpose.
• 21:28
  It doesn't have to be that way.
• 21:30
  That's exactly why my father quit General Motors.
• 21:34
  He wrote a whole book about it, got him in a lot of trouble.
• 21:37
  There's no money in keeping cars.
• 21:39
  Yeah.
• 21:40
  He said, why are you doing this?
• 21:41
  I don't agree.
• 21:42
  And testified before Congress about it.
• 21:45
  It's a big thing that has been in existence forever.
• 21:48
  And it's time that we do something to stop the bleeding.
• 21:52
  And it terrifies me that we're not thinking about the fact that we might
• 21:55
  be creating fast fashion with cars.
• 21:58
  by not thinking about the life cycle of these EVs.
• 22:01
  I'm not anti EV.
• 22:02
  I'm anti rushing EV all overnight without actually thinking about
• 22:08
  the implications of our future.
• 22:10
  That's all.
• 22:10
  Yeah.
• 22:11
  I can't wait to see the pendulum swing back to, Oh, we're doing
• 22:14
  research on ice engines again.
• 22:17
  This isn't panning out how we thought like the return of vinyl, what people
• 22:21
  don't understand about internal combustion engines is it's internal combustion.
• 22:25
  That's not internal oil burning engine.
• 22:28
  You can do a lot of different things.
• 22:30
  What if you use some of the new carbon capture technology?
• 22:33
  There's carbon capture technology that now prints carbon fiber.
• 22:36
  Stick it on your tailpipe and spit out carbon fiber and print a new car.
• 22:40
  I mean, like, there's so many different things.
• 22:42
  Kat, you're blowing my mind because now, I'm sorry, I'm
• 22:45
  thinking about Back to the Future.
• 22:46
  Your dad's car and the professor put garbage in it.
• 22:51
  Yeah.
• 22:52
  Go.
• 22:53
  Okay.
• 22:53
  So did you know that there's an acid that if you put an aluminum
• 22:57
  can in it, it turns to hydrogen gas.
• 22:59
  And I literally said to my husband, there you go, Mr.
• 23:01
  Fusion, build it, make it happen.
• 23:04
  But that's what we should be looking at is alternatives, not just.
• 23:08
  The one we should be looking at what are different fuels that we could use
• 23:12
  that could maybe balance things out.
• 23:15
  Also, my father, when he was building his car, he was investing research into
• 23:19
  a sterling engine, which is fascinating.
• 23:22
  Are we looking into flywheels and kinetic engines, gyroscopic technology, different
• 23:27
  batteries, all sorts of different, right?
• 23:29
  Which that brings up a question for me.
• 23:31
  Here's going to show my full idiocy with the hybrids.
• 23:35
  Why can't the kinetic energy of just moving recharge the engine?
• 23:40
  Why do we even have to have a hybrid?
• 23:42
  That's a fascinating, wonderful, amazing question.
• 23:45
  It has a lot to do with the energy required to actually push the car
• 23:50
  forward in different situations.
• 23:51
  A great way to answer that question would be to drive with your son in his Prius.
• 23:56
  Because they have a screen that I was obsessed with.
• 23:59
  If I could watch all the time, you can coast and watch it recharge your battery.
• 24:04
  Yeah.
• 24:05
  We haven't quite gotten to the point yet where we can generate enough power, but
• 24:11
  we've done a lot of research into that.
• 24:13
  And that's one of the things that my father and I were developing an engine
• 24:17
  that was based on the Stirling engine concept that would go from New York
• 24:20
  to California and a teaspoon of gas.
• 24:22
  It was hybrid, but it would only use a teaspoon of gas if you
• 24:24
  never shut the car actually off.
• 24:26
  It's possible up until this point, it was a lot more difficult because in
• 24:31
  order to do a lot of that, the computer efficiency, the programming, the timing
• 24:36
  has to be so specific and powerful that we hadn't quite gotten there yet.
• 24:41
  But technology has gotten to a point of where we're probably going to
• 24:44
  see some of those engines coming in the near future, if we don't.
• 24:47
  Spend all of our research dollars on Eevee.
• 24:49
  See, I thought you were just going to say, because Carolyn's
• 24:52
  science, that's why you can't do it.
• 24:54
  No, you can, you can do it.
• 24:57
  I would be remiss if I didn't speak for Eric since he's being
• 25:02
  very good about not interjecting.
• 25:04
  He's dying.
• 25:05
  Alternators on all the wheels.
• 25:08
  Yes, yes.
• 25:10
  That's actually part of what is in the design of the engine we were working on.
• 25:14
  Because that's important is the four independent alternators in
• 25:18
  the wheels generate the power.
• 25:20
  Alright, so let's circle back a moment.
• 25:23
  So Carolyn, how familiar are you with all the different brands of EVs
• 25:29
  out there on the market right now?
• 25:30
  You know Tesla, you know the hybrid that's the Prius, but full electric vehicles.
• 25:34
  Do you have knowledge around what your options are when you're
• 25:37
  trying to make this decision?
• 25:39
  Not really.
• 25:40
  I mean, I googled, I test drove a Tesla.
• 25:42
  It was really pretty.
• 25:43
  I liked the lights.
• 25:45
  I did not like when I would take my foot off the gas.
• 25:48
  It was like stepping on the brake.
• 25:49
  Didn't like that.
• 25:50
  Oh, that's the best.
• 25:51
  Okay.
• 25:52
  Well, I guess you get used to it, Emily.
• 25:54
  It really, I was like, wait, what's happening?
• 25:55
  It was fun to drive and I drove a Genesis, but I forget who, what's
• 26:01
  the, what kind of car is that?
• 26:02
  That's the brand.
• 26:03
  Hyundai.
• 26:04
  It's the luxury arm of Hyundai.
• 26:06
  Correct.
• 26:06
  There you go.
• 26:07
  Okay.
• 26:07
  Also fun and very pretty.
• 26:09
  I liked the little ball thing in the middle.
• 26:11
  That's about all I know.
• 26:12
  There's a lot.
• 26:13
  The year 2023 available and I didn't fact check this number, but at
• 26:19
  least have a list of 43 different.
• 26:21
  I'm not surprised.
• 26:22
  EVs that are available and it spans.
• 26:25
  And probably you don't want a GMC Hummer, but nonetheless, there's
• 26:29
  Hummer, there's Ford, there's Rivian.
• 26:31
  Those are going to be pickup trucks.
• 26:32
  You've got various different Audi models.
• 26:35
  You've got the outrageously priced Porsches.
• 26:38
  You've got Jaguar has an entry, Volvo, Emily has one, Cadillacs, BMWs, you
• 26:43
  know the Genesis already, Tesla, of course, the Nissans, because Nissan
• 26:47
  Leaf has been around for a while, right?
• 26:49
  They've got a few other.
• 26:50
  Models as well.
• 26:51
  You've got Kia has entered the fray for a while now.
• 26:54
  And VW got the ID four, the new ID seven, all that stuff.
• 26:58
  Toyota obviously is in the mix.
• 27:01
  I'm really impressed with the Prius.
• 27:02
  Like I said, my son's Prius is almost 20 years old.
• 27:06
  And he's driving it in Utah, cold and Utah snow.
• 27:09
  And it's still going the same battery.
• 27:11
  When they first came out with it, my dad told me to go buy one.
• 27:14
  That's why I ended up buying one.
• 27:16
  He said, they are selling this car for less than what it costs them to
• 27:20
  make, to get this technology out there.
• 27:22
  And he was really impressed with how the, I loved that car.
• 27:25
  I loved driving it every day.
• 27:27
  It was so much fun.
• 27:29
  Very well made.
• 27:30
  So what's the hybrid I should buy?
• 27:32
  You should do what works for you.
• 27:34
  So you like to go to the cold.
• 27:35
  That's another thing about EV, your battery drains.
• 27:38
  Think about when you take out your phone or think about ghosts
• 27:41
  or is like, Oh, it gets colder.
• 27:43
  And my battery drained in my thing.
• 27:44
  So you have to consider your life right now.
• 27:47
  And when it comes to what you buy, feel good about what you buy.
• 27:51
  So you're asking what hybrid.
• 27:53
  You should buy that should be based around what is it that you like to do
• 27:57
  and what's going to fit your needs.
• 28:00
  And also you can consider how the hybrid functions when it comes back to
• 28:05
  the charging back of the battery and different things, because there are
• 28:08
  different ways you can drive the car to get a lot more gas mileage, different
• 28:11
  ways you can feel better about it.
• 28:13
  The question I would have for you is you described that you want to be going.
• 28:17
  Skiing and making these long drives, what's more important to you having
• 28:23
  a lot more space so that if you have more stuff to take with you, you
• 28:28
  don't have to worry or the ability to zip around and not have to worry.
• 28:33
  Do you want something a little more fun to drive or something
• 28:35
  that can fit all your stuff?
• 28:37
  No matter what, that's where you start.
• 28:38
  Yeah, I would consider the Toyota hybrid just because I've been
• 28:42
  so impressed with the Prius.
• 28:44
  That's the one that I would lean towards.
• 28:46
  But it would need to be bigger because I got an 85 pound dog that takes up half the
• 28:50
  car and then I got the rest of my gear.
• 28:52
  Have you seen the bigger Priuses?
• 28:54
  Yeah, they have new, bigger Priuses.
• 28:56
  They have like little mini SUVs and the new one is so beautiful.
• 29:00
  Like it got all kinds of press coverage for being just really cool looking.
• 29:04
  How much?
• 29:05
  It looks like they start at 27, 000 and the XLE, the
• 29:08
  bigger one is about around 40.
• 29:10
  That's all.
• 29:11
  What's your price range, Carolyn?
• 29:13
  Where do you live in your mind?
• 29:15
  Where would you want to be?
• 29:16
  Because that's going to exclude a lot of your choices.
• 29:18
  Yes, it is.
• 29:19
  Straight at EVs.
• 29:20
  Honestly, Kat, what you just said about the Prius is shocking.
• 29:23
  I paid for my CRV and I got like the top of the line brand
• 29:27
  new, like no miles on it.
• 29:29
  And I paid 48 for it.
• 29:31
  Now that was in 2017, so to get a Prius hybrid, I'm surprised
• 29:37
  that it's about the same price.
• 29:38
  What do I want to pay?
• 29:39
  Like, I don't know, 5, 000 or something.
• 29:41
  5, 000, nothing.
• 29:43
  Is there a radio shack around still?
• 29:46
  Get you a little remote control car for bad reasons.
• 29:50
  Duracell Energizer.
• 29:51
  Again, I paid 8, 000 for it, but used.
• 29:54
  But yeah, no, I expect to pay about 50, 000 to get, like, all the comforts.
• 29:58
  And I don't want to pay a subscription for my heated seats.
• 30:02
  That's not here yet.
• 30:03
  Right?
• 30:03
  So the heated seats, super important to me.
• 30:06
  Like, these are the things I look for.
• 30:08
  Is the heated seat kind of thing.
• 30:09
  You have narrowed my field of 43 significantly by saying you want to
• 30:14
  be, we'll call it between 40 and 60.
• 30:17
  There's a chunk of cars that sit there.
• 30:19
  And then I think the next question has to be based on your
• 30:23
  passions and hobbies and use case.
• 30:26
  How far do you want to go on a charge?
• 30:29
  Because that's going to narrow your window even further.
• 30:31
  There's a place in the desert that I go to fairly often.
• 30:34
  It's about three and a half hours from here.
• 30:36
  So it's not fair because I do stop for gas halfway.
• 30:39
  I don't want to stop and charge.
• 30:41
  If I could stop and charge as fast as I could fill up with gas, no problem.
• 30:44
  But I'm not going to stop and charge for 45 minutes.
• 30:48
  So let's say you need to at least hit a 300 mile mark.
• 30:51
  Yeah.
• 30:51
  In the 40 to 60, 000 range.
• 30:54
  We've narrowed it down.
• 30:55
  That's a small group.
• 30:57
  The seven cars.
• 31:00
  And it will fit my dog.
• 31:02
  There's seven that will fit the criteria.
• 31:04
  I've got the Mach E, the Ford F 150.
• 31:07
  That'll fit your dog in the back.
• 31:09
  The Cadillac Lyrik, the BMW i4, which I don't think would fit your dog.
• 31:14
  I'm not sure which size that one is.
• 31:15
  That's the little one or not.
• 31:16
  The Ioniq 5, which is small, probably won't fit your dog, but it's a nice car.
• 31:20
  The Ariya, which is the Nissan, and then the larger Kia EV6, which apparently we
• 31:26
  just learned costs less than the Ioniq 5.
• 31:29
  Well, but I'm also very concerned about what you've brought up, Kat.
• 31:33
  If these cars are really only gonna last eight, ten years,
• 31:37
  that makes me sick to my stomach.
• 31:38
  That feels worse than burning fossil fuel right now, to me.
• 31:43
  We haven't gotten there yet, but there is no plan for what's
• 31:47
  gonna happen to these cars.
• 31:48
  If we're not talking about it, we should be, because yeah, that's it, if we're
• 31:53
  creating a bunch of throwaway cars.
• 31:55
  What's going to happen to them?
• 31:56
  Are we recycling them?
• 31:57
  Are we reusing the parts?
• 31:58
  By the way, the 40, 000 included a 5, 000 markup.
• 32:02
  So the highest MSRP is only 35, 000, which is kind of mind blowing.
• 32:07
  I want to go buy a breeze now.
• 32:09
  I do too.
• 32:10
  There's so many pieces to this.
• 32:12
  It's bonkers.
• 32:13
  But basically you have the federal tax credit.
• 32:16
  It used to apply to any EV.
• 32:19
  That you bought.
• 32:20
  And then as of this summer, it became any EV that was made in America.
• 32:26
  And so a lot of these credits are being shifted away from the
• 32:33
  Hyundai's and the Kia's and all this.
• 32:34
  And I think that it has provided incentive for those manufacturers to
• 32:38
  start wanting to build back in America.
• 32:41
  I think that's.
• 32:42
  The lofty goal there, but it's also important to be mindful that you
• 32:46
  cannot take that credit for granted.
• 32:48
  You have to determine whether or not the car that you are
• 32:51
  looking at is eligible for that.
• 32:54
  And then you might have some state incentives and whatnot.
• 32:57
  Again, it's not as black and white as we're used to everything being just a
• 33:02
  regular internal combustion car purchase.
• 33:05
  There are more factory options.
• 33:07
  BMW is building in this country, Volkswagen, Toyota.
• 33:10
  They actually are going to be building EVs in a Kentucky plant, I heard.
• 33:15
  Breaking news.
• 33:16
  Mercedes have plans.
• 33:17
  I think there's even plans for more manufacturers to do that because it is.
• 33:21
  More beneficial to be near your market.
• 33:25
  Michigan actually just started a whole initiative to try to get more
• 33:29
  manufacturing in state from some of these automotive manufacturers.
• 33:33
  They're not the only ones either.
• 33:34
  This is a whole big push that's happening across the industry.
• 33:37
  That's actually the entire business model we have is to rebuild Detroit.
• 33:42
  It's all built around bringing manufacturing back and providing jobs and
• 33:46
  taking the hit so that the manufacturers who want to keep making their own money.
• 33:51
  And I'll just do my not for profit thing over here.
• 33:54
  See, but there again, I will go back to the whole maintenance thing.
• 33:56
  Like if I blow a tire, if I crack a windshield.
• 34:00
  My Tesla, my husband was driving it and got in an accident.
• 34:04
  So I am also the current owner of a 2022 Nissan Rogue Sport as my rental car.
• 34:12
  Okay.
• 34:13
  So Sarah, you just brought up some stuff like when you get in an accident or
• 34:17
  blow a tire, what the hell do you do?
• 34:19
  Or even crack a windshield.
• 34:21
  Aren't they like super expensive and even hard to replace?
• 34:25
  So, this is actually the second time that my car's gotten hit.
• 34:29
  Neither time has been our fault, so the other people's insurance paid for it.
• 34:35
  The second time is definitely going to be more because the impact ruined some
• 34:40
  parking sensors and some other sensors.
• 34:42
  And it was just more extensive.
• 34:44
  Before that, did not have a whole lot of repairs on my old car.
• 34:48
  So, when I did have repairs, it was Very inexpensive.
• 34:51
  So I would have sticker shock if I were to be paying for this repair myself.
• 34:56
  The problem that I'm experiencing currently, and I'd be curious to know,
• 35:00
  I haven't done a whole lot of homework about it, is taking an extraordinarily
• 35:04
  long time, even to just get into the shop.
• 35:07
  The administrative piece of it, it's been frustrating once it's.
• 35:11
  In the shop, like the first time it took them about a month and a half.
• 35:14
  And it was just basically a bumper and a new lift gate repair that
• 35:19
  took a significant period of time.
• 35:21
  I think that was six and a half weeks.
• 35:23
  Isn't that usually just because Tesla is the only company that's manufacturing
• 35:28
  those bumpers and those parking sensors.
• 35:30
  They don't have sources that can manufacture it for them after market.
• 35:34
  They're so tightly held on that.
• 35:36
  It's not surprising.
• 35:37
  It's taking that long.
• 35:38
  I think there are more of them out on the road now.
• 35:41
  So there's just more volume of cars to be repaired.
• 35:44
  Yep.
• 35:45
  So I think that they're having a tough time keeping up now.
• 35:48
  The caveat to that is that we did want to go to the Tesla shop and not
• 35:54
  to one of their approved vendors.
• 35:56
  So I was being very picky about that just because I'm so nervous.
• 35:59
  Because there's sensor damage here.
• 36:01
  I was feeling like, Ooh, I'm just really not sure.
• 36:04
  I want to navigate that and worry about whether or not that's going to
• 36:07
  be a repair that's not up to snuff.
• 36:11
  So when you say sticker shock, like how big of a sticker shock?
• 36:14
  My current estimate, just what the insurance estimate
• 36:17
  the damage to be before.
• 36:19
  Even getting in the shop and having them get in there and look at it.
• 36:22
  It's already at 4, 800 and estimates tend to be low ball as well, right?
• 36:27
  And it is not a car you can work on yourself.
• 36:30
  I mean, maybe there's somebody out there who could, I am not
• 36:33
  someone who would feel confident.
• 36:35
  Doing that.
• 36:36
  And of course, then there's more MT issues.
• 36:38
  There's too many cameras and sensors probably requires special Tesla
• 36:43
  proprietary computers to hook up and disable this, that, and the
• 36:46
  other to unlatch the bumper screws or something ridiculous like that.
• 36:50
  I had a former coworker that had a similar experience in the before times.
• 36:54
  So there was no chip shortage or things like that, supply chain issues.
• 36:58
  And he had just bought a model three or whatever.
• 37:01
  I think he had it two days essentially, or a week at most.
• 37:04
  And he got rear ended by like a city Metro bus.
• 37:07
  It was at very low speed apparently, but still the rear end bumper damage.
• 37:12
  It was months that he was back on a rental car.
• 37:14
  And it was just like, wow, if it was a Toyota, you'd have been in and out
• 37:17
  and you know, eight days on your way.
• 37:20
  I heard from someone they had something wrong with one of their Tesla doors
• 37:24
  and it took them months and months and months of trying to source one and get
• 37:27
  it painted and they ended up buying a busted up Tesla out of a junkyard or
• 37:32
  off of a towing company and ended up reinstalling the door that way and they
• 37:36
  got it paint matched, but that was the only way that they were ever going to
• 37:38
  get a door for it because doors are going towards New manufactured cars.
• 37:43
  You have to buy one that's totaled to get them.
• 37:45
  You guys are totally talking me out of an EV.
• 37:48
  No, no, no.
• 37:51
  There's so many options.
• 37:53
  A certain brand.
• 37:54
  Yeah, Tesla's not the only one.
• 37:56
  Tesla's not the only one.
• 37:58
  Am I six weeks out like Sarah?
• 38:00
  No.
• 38:01
  These days, you're paying an arm and a leg if you crack a windshield, no matter
• 38:05
  what it is, because these windshields with the fancy sensors are like ridiculous.
• 38:10
  Speaking of windshields, back to Caroline's question, is that not covered
• 38:15
  under your comprehensive deductible?
• 38:17
  So like 250 or even zero deductible?
• 38:21
  Yeah, that's a good point.
• 38:22
  Yeah, so it's like, that seems sort of moot.
• 38:25
  Well, other than getting it in.
• 38:29
  And so I want to say it was within a month, we had to replace the windshield
• 38:33
  on the ID for because a truck kicked up a rock and took it out while
• 38:39
  safely claims they can repair it and do the programming they couldn't.
• 38:44
  Right.
• 38:45
  So what had happened was we had to take it to Volkswagen.
• 38:49
  They had to reprogram it.
• 38:51
  We had to pay 700 for them to reprogram it, and then we sent
• 38:55
  the receipt for that back to Safe Flight, and they reimbursed us.
• 38:59
  How long did that whole process take, though, too?
• 39:02
  Again, lazy.
• 39:03
  It was about a month.
• 39:04
  Yeah, I think everything's just going to take longer with EVs
• 39:06
  because the tech is so much deeper.
• 39:09
  And there's just not an abundance of it.
• 39:12
  And then there's not an abundance of workers or shops to go to that are
• 39:16
  certified or understand the technology and can do all those replacements.
• 39:20
  So at this juncture with it's still being so new and sort of in its
• 39:24
  infancy, it's just going to be a lot harder than my Toyota Corolla,
• 39:28
  blah, blah, blah, Honda Civic.
• 39:30
  And I, you know, a week later, I've got it fixed with parts from advanced auto.
• 39:34
  A lot of the new cars, it's all like the.
• 39:37
  Distance control, whatever other crap that's in the windshield, they're all
• 39:41
  taking just as long to get that stuff.
• 39:44
  And they're probably going through that same process.
• 39:46
  So that's not exclusive to EVs.
• 39:49
  Well, my CRB just has plain glass.
• 39:51
  Yes.
• 39:51
  I like that.
• 39:52
  Mine do too.
• 39:54
  They don't sense the weather.
• 39:55
  Yeah.
• 39:56
  Your tires are going to be regular tires.
• 39:58
  Yeah.
• 39:58
  You might want to get like a low rolling resistance tire,
• 40:02
  but you can do regular tires.
• 40:03
  And especially since you're in Utah, you can put on all weather.
• 40:07
  A winter tire.
• 40:08
  Now you're not going to be as efficient with a winter tire and
• 40:11
  all of this, but you can do that.
• 40:13
  So some of the basic things you're okay on and that is the benefit of going
• 40:17
  with an EV from a known manufacturer and an established manufacturer.
• 40:22
  So those parts are going to be much easier to come by and much easier to replace.
• 40:27
  Versus something new like a Rivian or a Tesla or Alpha or Fisker or Lucid.
• 40:33
  So Chrissy, cause you've had regular Volkswagen's we'll call
• 40:36
  them gasoline powered, and now you have the electric Volkswagen.
• 40:40
  Do you feel like you're in a Volkswagen when you're in the ID4 or
• 40:44
  was it something totally different?
• 40:45
  Meaning to say Volkswagen's a Volkswagen.
• 40:47
  So you can have that comfort and know what you're getting.
• 40:49
  It's a Volkswagen.
• 40:50
  Absolutely.
• 40:51
  It's comfortable.
• 40:52
  We like it.
• 40:53
  I still have problems with.
• 40:55
  Getting used to the things that the car wants to do for me.
• 40:58
  I still like to have control.
• 41:00
  The worst part.
• 41:01
  Yeah.
• 41:02
  Wait, what do you mean?
• 41:03
  What does it want to do for you?
• 41:05
  Well, to conserve energy, you're supposed to use like adaptive cruise control.
• 41:11
  And so it's spaces.
• 41:13
  The vehicles for you based on whatever the camera's telling you.
• 41:16
  My CRV does that too, and I don't like it.
• 41:19
  And I hate it because even though Mike has it sort of like as close
• 41:24
  as it can be, because we might be a little bit of the tailgaters,
• 41:27
  but People can still cut you off.
• 41:28
  Well, and that too.
• 41:30
  And so it's like, I don't want to drop five miles per hour
• 41:34
  because I'm just getting ever so slightly too close to a car.
• 41:38
  So I hate that.
• 41:38
  I love my adaptive cruise control.
• 41:41
  It took a lot of getting used to and it was terrifying for
• 41:44
  a while, but it's much nicer.
• 41:46
  I will say though, just generally the adaptive cruise control technology,
• 41:50
  even in EVs or whatever kind of car it is, has a long way to go before
• 41:55
  like some of that gets smoothed out so that the experience as a driver is
• 42:00
  a little bit more friendly and less.
• 42:01
  terrifying and an association with whatever your kind of like principles
• 42:05
  are, but your point, Carolyn, about somebody cutting you off,
• 42:08
  that is the most irritating thing.
• 42:10
  And my dad has made comments about how much he loves cutting off EVs that have
• 42:14
  adaptive cruise control on because the driver gets all frustrated and flustered.
• 42:18
  It is what it is.
• 42:19
  But you can certainly disable those things.
• 42:21
  I don't drive with really any of that enabled because I don't like cruise
• 42:26
  control on an internal combustion engine.
• 42:28
  I mean, it makes me crazy.
• 42:29
  I don't like to not feel like I know exactly what the
• 42:33
  car is doing at all times.
• 42:34
  There's a lot that you can work on that with, but that would be
• 42:37
  something that you would want to pay attention to when you do a test drive.
• 42:41
  What can I turn off?
• 42:43
  What can I adjust so that I feel comfortable and confident?
• 42:47
  I love cruise control.
• 42:48
  I cruise control through traffic.
• 42:50
  I do too.
• 42:51
  It's amazing.
• 42:51
  Again, lazy.
• 42:52
  My ankle gets tired, but also I will get a ticket if I don't cruise control.
• 43:00
  Emily, same question, because you've got the Volvo EV right now and I believe you
• 43:04
  have past history with regular Volvos.
• 43:07
  So we have a lot of Volvos.
• 43:08
  Are you getting the same Volvos of all those same experience?
• 43:11
  You're comfortable, you're, you're recognizing that you have, or is
• 43:14
  it something totally disparate?
• 43:16
  So let's be clear.
• 43:16
  A Volvo is not always a Volvo.
• 43:18
  We have a Volvo 480 turbo and that looks nothing like any of the other
• 43:23
  Volvos that exist in the market.
• 43:25
  It is a nice interior.
• 43:27
  It's well made.
• 43:28
  It meets kind of like my style expectations on the interior.
• 43:31
  I don't look like somebody super glued an iPad to the dash and it doesn't
• 43:34
  look like I'm sitting in the middle of a cockpit with just glass everywhere
• 43:39
  that you see with the Mercedes EQS, it's a little insane, but it's nice.
• 43:43
  It's comfortable.
• 43:44
  I definitely get the safety features that one would expect from Volvo and
• 43:48
  they're very noticeable and I enjoy them.
• 43:51
  I wanted to say and emphasize that a plug in hybrid might really be a nice
• 43:57
  middle ground for Carolyn to consider.
• 44:00
  It's kind of the best of all worlds.
• 44:03
  You're going to have an engine, so you're going to have the safety
• 44:07
  of not having range anxiety.
• 44:10
  That a lot of people perceive as a hurdle towards EV ownership, you're
• 44:14
  going to have the regenerative braking.
• 44:17
  Even when you drive and your battery depletes, you can charge it up again.
• 44:21
  You can plug it in at night.
• 44:23
  It's going to be a small amount of charge, but you can plug it in just to a regular
• 44:27
  outlet and get a few miles each night and, you know, enough to maybe get a couple
• 44:34
  of errands done and get out on the road.
• 44:36
  So I would.
• 44:37
  Really advise you to consider that if you kind of feel like the full EV may
• 44:42
  not be right for you But you still want to consider something Different
• 44:47
  and kind of new frontier ish sort of a stepping stone to EV if you're not
• 44:51
  fully ready to commit yet Go that middle ground where you're slowly kind
• 44:56
  of getting into that EV range without fully committing yet Right and like Kat
• 45:01
  said if you have these long trips that you're taking all the time and you don't
• 45:04
  want to be Sitting at a charging station for however long during those trips.
• 45:11
  It's really potentially a good option.
• 45:13
  All right, so we've narrowed your field down considerably.
• 45:17
  I'm sorry, but Kat's already convinced me I'm going for this.
• 45:20
  All right, so.
• 45:21
  We're done.
• 45:22
  We're done.
• 45:23
  Switching gears.
• 45:24
  So now on to What Should I Buy?
• 45:25
  Hybrid Edition.
• 45:27
  How can carolyn's go about starting this journey, this
• 45:30
  process, any recommendations?
• 45:32
  I mean, obviously if you're looking for new, new, you're going to a new car
• 45:35
  dealership, but these days, is that still have the same relevancy as it once did?
• 45:40
  Are there other means?
• 45:42
  When we bought the Tundra back in July, they're not taking
• 45:46
  custom orders for Toyotas.
• 45:47
  And that may have changed since then, but it's basically go to the dealer.
• 45:52
  You tell them what you want.
• 45:54
  And they'll try to get as close as they can with it.
• 45:57
  Like they took what colors we wanted, what features we absolutely needed.
• 46:00
  And it's like, Hey, we've got this coming in on the truck.
• 46:03
  And then next couple of weeks, does this work for you?
• 46:05
  That's how Toyota did it.
• 46:07
  Very similar with mine.
• 46:08
  I ended up placing two orders for the same car through two different dealers
• 46:13
  to try to get the car I wanted because Volvo shut off the ability to build your
• 46:18
  own custom car with whatever package options you wanted in extra features.
• 46:22
  So I was.
• 46:23
  Talking to two different dealers to see which one was going to
• 46:25
  get here first off of the boat.
• 46:27
  And one of them, I had an order in with Volvo USA.
• 46:30
  And that was the one that happened to come in like just a few weeks early.
• 46:34
  It was incredibly frustrating.
• 46:35
  It took 68 weeks after I placed the order, but some people,
• 46:38
  they were waiting six months.
• 46:39
  At least so just like shopping for anything else, go to the store
• 46:43
  to look at it, then go home, get online and buy it off Amazon.
• 46:48
  Yeah, that's about right.
• 46:49
  That's not uncommon for any car right now.
• 46:52
  It's just been that way.
• 46:54
  But I would say that because you are looking at making a change from
• 46:59
  your current Car to potentially a hybrid, some type of EV.
• 47:05
  I do think auto shows are still good for that because you're going to find
• 47:10
  that the cargo space and the seating space is going to feel a little
• 47:14
  different because you know, how you use your space is not always a thing
• 47:19
  where you can say, Oh, this car has.
• 47:21
  Such and such cubic feet of cargo, you know, maybe you're carrying a dog kennel,
• 47:26
  maybe you're carrying skis, all of those different pieces, they to me that maybe
• 47:31
  an auto show would be a good fit for you and you could walk around and you may
• 47:35
  not be able to order that car just yet, but at least you can have a sense of how
• 47:40
  that's going to work differently for you.
• 47:42
  I agree.
• 47:42
  That's a great way.
• 47:43
  When I'm looking for a new type of car and it doesn't matter the manufacturer,
• 47:48
  the auto shows the first place I go.
• 47:49
  You said you drive a CRV.
• 47:51
  Yes.
• 47:52
  So the hybrid CRVs it's 40 grand.
• 47:54
  There you go.
• 47:55
  You can just go with the same car you drive.
• 47:57
  Ta da sold.
• 47:59
  I finished my last payment on the CRV maybe six months ago.
• 48:04
  It's been so nice.
• 48:05
  Cause I don't have maintenance fees yet.
• 48:07
  And no car payment has been just like so nice.
• 48:11
  So the idea of getting a car payment again kind of makes me sick to my stomach.
• 48:15
  And that was my father's point.
• 48:17
  Why is this a thing that we are married to?
• 48:20
  Why is this normalized?
• 48:22
  Why is your second biggest payment something you just accept making for Ever.
• 48:29
  Forever.
• 48:30
  Until the end of death.
• 48:31
  Yeah.
• 48:31
  I'm enjoying no car payment right now.
• 48:34
  So screw the planet?
• 48:35
  No, I'm sorry.
• 48:37
  Basically, yes.
• 48:38
  Hashtag team dead dinosaurs all the way.
• 48:43
  No.
• 48:45
  I'm actually looking at how to convert my diesel to like used cooking oil.
• 48:50
  Save the planet and you know, save my car.
• 48:53
  The other problem in all of this that always gets glazed over too
• 48:57
  is The big bad oil, you know, oh, we hate them, blah, blah, blah.
• 49:01
  Well, the problem is gasoline and diesel, especially nowadays are byproducts of
• 49:07
  all the other stuff that everyone's not willing to give up in life.
• 49:11
  Plastics, makeup, all sorts of adhesives.
• 49:15
  The asphalt on the road that we drive our cars on, that is all a result of
• 49:21
  crude oil transformation in a refinery.
• 49:23
  And I don't believe there's a world where you could possibly never have gasoline and
• 49:28
  diesel because you could keep destroying those down into smaller components that
• 49:33
  then could be chemical feedstocks to make all our plastics and stuff like that.
• 49:36
  But there's a cost associated with doing that.
• 49:38
  It doesn't make sense at a certain point.
• 49:40
  So then suddenly my pen here is going to cost me.
• 49:43
  30 because my raw material goods is so expensive, right?
• 49:47
  So that goes back to this balance of don't put all your eggs in one basket.
• 49:51
  We can significantly decrease volumes of things, but I don't see where you're
• 49:56
  ever going to get rid of it entirely.
• 49:58
  Has anybody considered evaluating whether or not their older classic
• 50:03
  car is worth an EV upgrade?
• 50:06
  Eric's very happy with that.
• 50:07
  What do you mean an EV upgrade?
• 50:09
  You can do that?
• 50:10
  Yeah.
• 50:11
  Have been some people that have taken older like Jaguars and things like that.
• 50:15
  And they'll go buy a Tesla battery pack, motor, whatever.
• 50:19
  And they'll stick it in there.
• 50:21
  Or there are people that are crazy enough to do that.
• 50:23
  I just saw an article about, I forget what it was he was converting, but I
• 50:27
  just sort of, I was like, Oh, cool.
• 50:30
  It's a neat way of getting it back to that tactile and still being able
• 50:34
  to work hands on on your car, because if you're the one that's actually
• 50:37
  doing the work and putting it in, you'll know those systems very well.
• 50:40
  Ideally, they're ones that you designed or ones that you worked with a company to
• 50:44
  make sure that you had all the parts for.
• 50:46
  That market is so young.
• 50:48
  I know that there's a shop EV West in California that will take some.
• 50:52
  Classic older cars and they'll convert them to EVs for you.
• 50:55
  I think they've been popularized with Volkswagen bugs from a really long
• 50:59
  time ago doing torches for a while.
• 51:00
  Yeah It's a neat alternative if you can get over how you're getting that
• 51:05
  electricity to the car to charge it in the first place But for some
• 51:08
  of those smaller cars, you can get great performance out of them.
• 51:11
  There's also a new three wheeled EV coming out Made by Malcolm Bricklin,
• 51:16
  that's a whole lot of fun to drive.
• 51:18
  You know, you should check that one out too.
• 51:19
  All right.
• 51:20
  So now that we've solved Carolyn's next purchase debacle, have we,
• 51:25
  have we, I don't know, I don't know.
• 51:27
  I'm probing, I'm probing the Honda CRV hybrid that does exist.
• 51:32
  So that there's already 2023 models for that.
• 51:34
  So that might pique your interest, but I guess would that
• 51:36
  satisfy what you're looking for?
• 51:38
  It'd be.
• 51:39
  more of the same of what you already have.
• 51:40
  It'd be very comfortable.
• 51:41
  Or are you looking to further branch out?
• 51:44
  Actually, that feels really good to me, other than the car payment.
• 51:47
  Maybe I'm just really justifying my part in screwing the planet.
• 51:52
  Think about all of the carbon that went into manufacturing the new car.
• 51:56
  And you're keeping your old car on the road.
• 51:58
  So you can't say I'm being a bad steward of the environment
• 52:03
  because I'm not doing this thing.
• 52:04
  There's also other things you can do to get better gas mileage out
• 52:07
  of the car that you're driving.
• 52:08
  And again, other ways to offset the carbon that you create, just drive
• 52:12
  responsibly and respectably do the best you can with what you have.
• 52:16
  Understand that it's not all black and white, there's return on investment in
• 52:21
  intangible things in corporate world.
• 52:24
  So if you think about people equate things to dollars and cents, this
• 52:29
  iPad costs a certain amount of money.
• 52:31
  And if I break this iPad, or if something happens to it, I can put A dollar amount
• 52:36
  on it, but people don't think about if my system goes down, I also have
• 52:40
  people hours for every person that I pay 15 an hour, whatever that adds up.
• 52:46
  Just like, I wonder what it costs for BMW to charge people for those heated seats.
• 52:50
  They have to pay people to support them and to charge
• 52:53
  people and the infrastructure.
• 52:54
  People don't think about those dollars and cents.
• 52:56
  So it's not all black and white.
• 52:57
  I have felt really guilty about driving the car that I'm driving.
• 53:02
  It's kind of a gas guzzler.
• 53:03
  I checked it today.
• 53:05
  It averages 25 miles to the gallon.
• 53:07
  I don't feel as guilty.
• 53:09
  All of your points.
• 53:10
  I'm hearing you guys.
• 53:12
  It's not black and white.
• 53:13
  I want to let you off the hook a little bit about that too.
• 53:16
  Cause to Kat's point, there's a lot that goes into this.
• 53:19
  And as you move forward through this process.
• 53:23
  Maybe the right thing to do is to keep your car that you have right
• 53:26
  now and either just proceed as normal or figure out if your driving habits
• 53:32
  can create more fuel efficiency.
• 53:35
  You can also determine a threshold for you as you learn.
• 53:39
  For example, I went to the launch of a Toyota BZ concept, and they were
• 53:44
  talking all about Zero emissions and their new goal of being
• 53:49
  carbon neutral to the cat's point.
• 53:51
  We want every piece of this car to be something that will either
• 53:54
  be reused or will be offset in some way, shape, or form.
• 53:59
  They obviously don't have a timeline for that yet.
• 54:02
  Kind of the lofty goal, but you can also decide as a consumer to
• 54:07
  do your homework and figure out how important that is to you.
• 54:10
  And when you're ready to pull the trigger on a new purchase, you can make
• 54:14
  that decision a part of your purchase.
• 54:16
  You know, when I bought my car, it was only in 2021, but it felt
• 54:22
  like there were no other options.
• 54:23
  And the luxury of this right now is that you do, including the option not to buy.
• 54:29
  You can move forward in this process, thinking about what is the
• 54:33
  thing that makes me feel the worst?
• 54:36
  Is it.
• 54:37
  The perception that I'm a horrible person.
• 54:39
  Yeah, that's the one gas in my car, or is it really that I've never taken care
• 54:45
  of the car and there's a big black cloud coming out of the back or whatever.
• 54:49
  I think you need to understand that it's okay to maintain status quo.
• 54:53
  And even if you decide that you want an internal combustion engine
• 54:57
  that is more efficient for your new car, that's a good thing too.
• 55:01
  Yeah.
• 55:01
  You guys have made me feel really good about myself.
• 55:03
  I'm not going to lie.
• 55:05
  You know, what's amazing is, is there's so much in our lives that we do,
• 55:09
  decisions we make and choices, the way we treat ourselves that are based on
• 55:14
  these ideas we have in our head about what other people think about us.
• 55:18
  I had this really profound experience with this lately, where I was struggling
• 55:23
  with something at work, and then I heard my curriculum director describing her
• 55:27
  struggles with the same exact thing.
• 55:29
  And then I said, you know, it's really nice that you shared that with me
• 55:32
  because I felt a little less alone.
• 55:34
  And she said, You know, I said to myself, If this badass hacker who did
• 55:38
  this for 20 years is getting stuck on the same thing, maybe I'm not so bad.
• 55:41
  I said, Wow!
• 55:42
  I said, If my badass curriculum director who can learn all these things is
• 55:45
  getting stuck, maybe I'm not so bad.
• 55:47
  So here both of us were beating up on ourselves, thinking the other one
• 55:50
  was the coolest thing on the planet.
• 55:52
  It was all in our head.
• 55:53
  You're making decisions based on what you think is outside of your space.
• 55:56
  Examine your whole life.
• 55:58
  I guarantee you that there are things in your life that you're doing that
• 56:00
  are causing far more damage to the environment than driving your car,
• 56:04
  that you can actually take action on now to feel better about what
• 56:07
  you're doing and then take this.
• 56:09
  in stride.
• 56:10
  Make a decision based on what's good for you.
• 56:12
  Understand the implications of changing car that you have.
• 56:16
  Maybe buy a used CRV hybrid that has a lower car payment and is something
• 56:20
  that somebody already had the carbon that went into developing it and now
• 56:24
  you're just swapping one for the other.
• 56:26
  There's a lot of different things and you have to first forgive
• 56:29
  yourself for what's in your own head.
• 56:31
  That nobody else is thinking about you.
• 56:33
  Absolutely.
• 56:34
  Cause I have done some research, but to listen to each one of you who actually
• 56:39
  are pretty passionate about this, have experience in this, you're experts in this
• 56:43
  area and to hear the different angles and to hear all the considerations that each
• 56:48
  of you have taken has been very helpful.
• 56:51
  You know, you can rat hole on the research and looking at the
• 56:55
  different cars and then I'm like, I don't know, is the CRV hybrid good?
• 56:58
  I don't know.
• 56:59
  But it's been really helpful with listening to all of
• 57:03
  you and your experience.
• 57:05
  Since we seemingly solved her car debacle, going back to EVs in general,
• 57:10
  and we'll take your criteria off specifically and use the criteria
• 57:14
  of kind of a general everyday car, what would we recommend to somebody?
• 57:19
  Looking for a pure EV that kind of meets your going to work every day, whatever we
• 57:24
  want to call a normal mileage commute is.
• 57:26
  I go to the grocery store and a couple extra things during the week.
• 57:29
  I've got 2.
• 57:30
  1 kids and a dog, maybe, maybe not.
• 57:32
  What would be that all around?
• 57:34
  Is it the Volvo?
• 57:34
  Is it the ID4?
• 57:35
  Is it something else?
• 57:36
  Is it the Tesla?
• 57:37
  I think it all depends on your price range and what you need to do with it.
• 57:42
  How big does it need to be?
• 57:44
  Really give me a lucid air.
• 57:46
  Right.
• 57:46
  I know.
• 57:47
  Oh my God.
• 57:49
  Have you seen the alphas too?
• 57:52
  Those are gorgeous.
• 57:53
  The Fisker Ocean.
• 57:55
  That looks like a fat beluga whale.
• 57:56
  It's so adorable.
• 57:59
  Okay.
• 57:59
  So I think what I would say the other significant question is.
• 58:05
  And it's so counterintuitive, but how are you going to charge?
• 58:09
  I think the answer is different.
• 58:10
  If you are going to be able to charge at home, it's not wildly different,
• 58:15
  but you are going to have a different experience of EV ownership if you
• 58:19
  are charging out in the world.
• 58:21
  And it's a serious part of the EV conversation right now, because so many
• 58:26
  people don't own their homes and they may not live somewhere where they can
• 58:30
  just plug in when they get home at night.
• 58:33
  For me, that would be.
• 58:34
  A number one thing you have to ask yourself.
• 58:37
  I would add on and say, do you enjoy driving?
• 58:40
  I think driving is one of those things that everybody can fall in love with, with
• 58:44
  the right car and with the right time and the right set of things off of their mind.
• 58:50
  I love my XC40 recharge and I would buy another one because I enjoy the
• 58:54
  experience, but as of late, I'm looking at whether or not a Polestar is.
• 58:58
  In my future at some point or an alpha or a lucid or something that's
• 59:04
  newer cutting edge to kind of push the envelope of what EVs could be in
• 59:09
  America 20 or 30 years from now, because I want to see the market do well.
• 59:13
  And I want to see us to be more economically responsible
• 59:16
  with how we're developing and building these cars for consumers.
• 59:19
  When you say Alfa EV, what are you talking about?
• 59:21
  The Alfa Motors Ace and the Wolf that they have.
• 59:25
  Those are some pretty awesome things.
• 59:26
  They also have the Saga.
• 59:27
  I want to see that.
• 59:28
  Oh yeah.
• 59:29
  They're classic retro designs.
• 59:31
  They're beautiful.
• 59:32
  Not talking about Alfa Romeo, unfortunately.
• 59:35
  No, probably not.
• 59:37
  Oh, look at that.
• 59:38
  Aren't they cool?
• 59:39
  Yeah.
• 59:39
  They're the ones that have the pickup truck that looks like the one from
• 59:43
  Back to the Future that Marty drove.
• 59:44
  Yes, yes, yes, yes, yes.
• 59:46
  I'm not a pickup truck person, but that one's.
• 59:47
  Pretty cool.
• 59:49
  That is really neat.
• 59:51
  I like it.
• 59:51
  If I don't bring this one up, Eric will be very sad because his
• 59:55
  current answer is Machi Machi Machi.
• 59:58
  What do people think about Ford's Machi value for money?
• 1:00:01
  It's fully loaded.
• 1:00:02
  I think it's more closer to the 50, 000 range.
• 1:00:04
  So you're somewhere between 000 for this.
• 1:00:06
  You get a little bit over 300 miles of range.
• 1:00:08
  It's a Ford that could deter you.
• 1:00:10
  That could make you happy.
• 1:00:11
  I don't know.
• 1:00:12
  I will never date somebody who drives the Mustang period.
• 1:00:15
  End of conversation.
• 1:00:17
  Oh, that's just it.
• 1:00:20
  My girlfriend, she would never speak to me again.
• 1:00:23
  So, I mean, it's an F body thing.
• 1:00:26
  However, I met the guy in charge of the new Mustang launch and on my board is a
• 1:00:33
  key chain because he was a fabulous man.
• 1:00:36
  So there is that, but that's my response to the Mach E.
• 1:00:39
  Ladies and gentlemen, the only Ford cat will own that key chain.
• 1:00:46
  That's actually not true.
• 1:00:47
  Cause I drive a Ford F 250.
• 1:00:49
  I love my Ford truck.
• 1:00:51
  I love Ford trucks.
• 1:00:52
  So I just can't drive specifically a Mustang or date
• 1:00:56
  anybody who drives a Mustang.
• 1:00:57
  It goes back to my first car was a Z28 in the nineties.
• 1:01:00
  And that was the, the heat of the Mustang Camaro shootout.
• 1:01:04
  It's like ingrained.
• 1:01:05
  in my teenagerdom that I can't, I must hate all mistakes.
• 1:01:11
  I think the Mach E isn't a bad purchase.
• 1:01:12
  It's not like my taste.
• 1:01:13
  Ford is Ford.
• 1:01:14
  If you like Fords, go with Mach E.
• 1:01:16
  If you're trying to look for an EV, they have a good range.
• 1:01:19
  They've got some good pep seen that they handle well, but I
• 1:01:22
  have not personally driven one.
• 1:01:23
  I'm looking at one right now.
• 1:01:25
  It says it's 80, 000.
• 1:01:26
  Like there's a range.
• 1:01:27
  Of course you find the 80, 000 one.
• 1:01:31
  I personally really want the F 150.
• 1:01:34
  The lightning?
• 1:01:34
  I just passed one on the road the other day.
• 1:01:37
  I got married in a lightning version.
• 1:01:39
  So the Harley Davidson F 150, it was a lightning edition F 150.
• 1:01:43
  So that has a little bit of something to do with it.
• 1:01:46
  But that's the one EV that sparked my interest.
• 1:01:49
  True interest.
• 1:01:50
  So no Cybertruck.
• 1:01:51
  No, no.
• 1:01:52
  Making cars out of stainless steel is stupid.
• 1:01:57
  I just think the Cybertruck is stupid.
• 1:01:59
  Little known fact, it was because he couldn't afford a paint factory for
• 1:02:02
  three billion dollars and he knew somebody who could actually forge the
• 1:02:06
  stainless steel and then his genius was making it seem intentional.
• 1:02:11
  Oh, and who knows if that figment of Musk's imagination will ever actually.
• 1:02:16
  I can tell you from trying to actually make one car out of
• 1:02:21
  stainless steel, there's no way.
• 1:02:23
  When my dad made it out of stainless steel, stainless was actually cheaper
• 1:02:26
  than aluminum because aluminum was only provided to the aerospace industry.
• 1:02:29
  So he would have made it out of brushed aluminum.
• 1:02:31
  If he could have, it just was way too expensive.
• 1:02:34
  Making something out of stainless today, especially when it's so much harder to
• 1:02:37
  come by when all appliances are made by it, I can't even get a sheet of it.
• 1:02:41
  So how he's going to build many cars.
• 1:02:44
  I don't know.
• 1:02:45
  That's a great question.
• 1:02:46
  Nobody knows.
• 1:02:47
  Already four years behind.
• 1:02:49
  Allegedly it's this year, but probably not.
• 1:02:52
  They still haven't figured out the laser beams for the windshield wipers yet.
• 1:02:55
  So they can't, you know, go to production yet.
• 1:02:57
  To start closing out, and I'm going to point at Sarah, so are there any
• 1:03:02
  new features that are really cool that people should be looking for in their
• 1:03:06
  new car, EV or otherwise, really?
• 1:03:09
  And, you know, what are some tips and tricks or do's and don'ts
• 1:03:12
  about going on this journey?
• 1:03:14
  People are looking for new cars every day from anything from
• 1:03:18
  two years ago, you know, beyond.
• 1:03:20
  That's what I'm thinking of when you're thinking of new features.
• 1:03:23
  I came back to this world of actually buying a car after
• 1:03:28
  owning my car for 10 years.
• 1:03:30
  And I had stepped away from riding for a while.
• 1:03:32
  So I was just really surprised at how tech heavy everything was.
• 1:03:37
  You know, new features that you should look for in a new car that might help
• 1:03:41
  ease that transition to me are something like Apple CarPlay or Android Auto.
• 1:03:48
  Pat had kind of mentioned this a little bit earlier, but every
• 1:03:51
  manufacturer has their own kind of in house multimedia system.
• 1:03:56
  Some of those are easier to use than others.
• 1:03:59
  So I find that using something like Apple CarPlay and ease that transition.
• 1:04:05
  If not be something that I use completely, depending on the car that I'm driving.
• 1:04:10
  I would really like, have they solved the problem of using my nav on my phone,
• 1:04:15
  putting it on my display in my car?
• 1:04:17
  That's what Apple CarPlay will do for you.
• 1:04:20
  The only caveat is that if you are driving somewhere where you're going to lose
• 1:04:25
  coverage, like where your phone would drop off or where you don't have service.
• 1:04:29
  You're not going to be able to see that navigation happening.
• 1:04:32
  So the benefit of it when it's in the car system is that it's usually a
• 1:04:37
  downloaded map that's in the system.
• 1:04:39
  So you can go through the desert and still get the directions directly from the car.
• 1:04:44
  More advancements in that particular feature set because Mercedes just.
• 1:04:48
  Revealed that they're joining a partnership with Google and
• 1:04:51
  specifically to use their navigation technology in their new vehicles.
• 1:04:56
  Yeah, that's right all that.
• 1:04:57
  Right.
• 1:04:57
  It's the interface that I don't like in my car.
• 1:05:00
  It's just enough different than what I use on Google Maps.
• 1:05:03
  Right.
• 1:05:04
  I have never used the navigation system in my CRV because I can't figure
• 1:05:09
  out how to use the damn interface.
• 1:05:12
  See, that's really funny because that's one of the things that I
• 1:05:15
  asked when trying to design our cars.
• 1:05:17
  I said, why does anybody put all this tech in the car anymore?
• 1:05:20
  Nobody uses it.
• 1:05:21
  Why don't they just create something that will magnify your phone screen?
• 1:05:25
  Absolutely.
• 1:05:26
  Hello?
• 1:05:28
  Because I don't know anybody who uses the navigation in their
• 1:05:30
  car, especially since it goes.
• 1:05:33
  Like, you have to update it after a while, so what's the point?
• 1:05:37
  Why do we spend all this money on navigation nobody uses?
• 1:05:41
  I will say a lot of cars now will have a wireless charging pad for
• 1:05:45
  your phone, and I've seen a lot of innovative ways of doing that.
• 1:05:49
  In the new Corvette, there's like a vertical charging pad
• 1:05:53
  back here, which is so nice.
• 1:05:55
  So sometimes it's vertical.
• 1:05:56
  So if there's a space saving issue, you can use it that way.
• 1:05:59
  But oftentimes it's a flat pad, but it creates a space for your phone.
• 1:06:04
  And then you can connect via Bluetooth and have everything talking to
• 1:06:08
  your phone, which is really fun.
• 1:06:10
  So is there anything unique to EV car buying when you walk into the
• 1:06:14
  dealership and you just feel like you're going to get swindled every time
• 1:06:17
  you go into those places sometimes, is it the same, same, doesn't matter.
• 1:06:20
  That's an internal combustion engine.
• 1:06:22
  It doesn't matter that it's.
• 1:06:23
  running off pixie dust?
• 1:06:24
  Or are there certain things they try to trap you with?
• 1:06:27
  Things that can be confusing that a first time EV buyer should be more mindful
• 1:06:32
  of than maybe what they're used to?
• 1:06:33
  Depends if you talk to the dealer.
• 1:06:35
  If you just go online, like you just go and try out the car at like an
• 1:06:38
  auto show and then go buy it online.
• 1:06:40
  I would say it's the same last minute add ons that they get you for anything else
• 1:06:45
  that you walk into the dealership with.
• 1:06:46
  I don't think that there's anything I recall from my buying experience.
• 1:06:49
  That was unique to the EV.
• 1:06:51
  They wanted to give me the fancy extra paint protection.
• 1:06:54
  Did they try to sell you the oil change kit or something?
• 1:06:58
  Yeah, like all those stupid add on features.
• 1:07:00
  Yeah, you know, the guy who's doing the financing, it's like,
• 1:07:03
  well, if you get this for an extra 700, and it's like, yeah, it's an
• 1:07:07
  EV, I don't got to change that.
• 1:07:09
  That's all ice crap.
• 1:07:11
  What about home charging stuff, though?
• 1:07:13
  I would think that would be different because they'll try and sell you
• 1:07:15
  a home charging station, right?
• 1:07:17
  So I didn't get that with mine.
• 1:07:19
  I got a package of like credits with Chargepoint or whatever the other one
• 1:07:24
  is, like one of the popular ones, like a free year of charging, anything like
• 1:07:27
  that, like a 50 gift certificate off of Chargepoint, whatever it was, I had
• 1:07:32
  taken the time to figure out what kind of charger I wanted to install in my house.
• 1:07:36
  I watch YouTube videos based off of temperatures and how those cables wrap
• 1:07:39
  mine sits outside that I was going to be able to plug it in and like zero
• 1:07:43
  degree weather outside when it's snowing and not fight a cable that's stiff.
• 1:07:48
  And being aware of those types of programs, like most manufacturers right
• 1:07:53
  now are partnering with Electrify America.
• 1:07:56
  That's the one.
• 1:07:57
  There might also be some with EVgo, but it's like.
• 1:07:59
  Get three free years of charging.
• 1:08:01
  So you want to be sure that if you do purchase that car, that you are
• 1:08:05
  getting those kinds of services.
• 1:08:07
  Are you able to finance your home charging station when
• 1:08:10
  you buy your car with the car?
• 1:08:12
  I don't think so.
• 1:08:13
  Or at least it wasn't that way with Volkswagen.
• 1:08:16
  Separate, but then we got a tax credit for the state for the purchase of the
• 1:08:22
  charger and install 40 percent back from the state just for the install cost.
• 1:08:27
  That is such a terrible barrier entry point to EV ownership.
• 1:08:31
  That is so discriminatory.
• 1:08:34
  And like, how much is a charger?
• 1:08:36
  Tens of thousands of dollars.
• 1:08:38
  Are you serious and you can't finance it with your car, you are automatically
• 1:08:44
  shutting out an entire segment of our population that cannot afford
• 1:08:47
  to do the upfront cost of that.
• 1:08:50
  I am so do not.
• 1:08:52
  That's true.
• 1:08:52
  You can get a home charging kit.
• 1:08:55
  It totally depends on the manufacturer.
• 1:08:57
  So the prices are different per manufacturer.
• 1:08:59
  So they're usually around 2, 000 give or take.
• 1:09:03
  But then you also have to consider whether or not you have the electrical foundation.
• 1:09:08
  Like you have to make sure that you have the ability to power that charger.
• 1:09:12
  So you need the right kind of amp.
• 1:09:14
  You have to have your house redone by an electrician, which is a cost that
• 1:09:19
  I already assumed you had to absorb, which is a significant because I had to
• 1:09:23
  do it when I wanted to install a kiln.
• 1:09:25
  It's also one of the cost barriers.
• 1:09:27
  If you want to look at how much it might cost.
• 1:09:29
  There's a lot of information on installing the tankless water heaters.
• 1:09:32
  They also require the same type of power to your house.
• 1:09:35
  So you can estimate how much it'll cost.
• 1:09:37
  And it's significant because they have to actually run the
• 1:09:40
  power from the power line.
• 1:09:42
  You'll pay more money from the power company.
• 1:09:44
  Yeah.
• 1:09:45
  So it's not the charger itself.
• 1:09:46
  It's getting the infrastructure to be able to use the charger.
• 1:09:49
  Yeah.
• 1:09:50
  Usually the only exception to that is if you already have like a two 40
• 1:09:54
  volt outlet in your garage, you can.
• 1:09:57
  Retrofit that to make it work with your charger.
• 1:10:00
  So now that we're tacking on an extra 10, to your EV purchase, you have now
• 1:10:05
  moved your choice option to still hit a 50, 000 target to the Chevy Bolt.
• 1:10:13
  Actually the Chevy Bolt has a really high satisfaction rating,
• 1:10:17
  probably because it's a 20, 000 EV.
• 1:10:20
  Your standards are down here.
• 1:10:24
  You could also get a Nissan LEAF, a MINI or a Mazda MX 30, but you're
• 1:10:28
  getting 150 mile range at best.
• 1:10:32
  And the thing about the LEAF is depending on where you live, as
• 1:10:35
  the infrastructure, especially with Electrify America builds out.
• 1:10:38
  They're not doing the EV charger that's compatible with the leaf anymore.
• 1:10:43
  They're eliminating the chatty.
• 1:10:45
  Good call.
• 1:10:46
  So we're talking about like an Apple Android charger situation here with
• 1:10:49
  these EV infrastructure pretty much.
• 1:10:51
  Yeah.
• 1:10:52
  Wow.
• 1:10:53
  Most are CCS then there's the Tesla network and then there's
• 1:10:57
  Chatimo, which was Mitsu and Nissan.
• 1:11:01
  There's usually one at each of the Electrify America
• 1:11:04
  stations I've ever been to.
• 1:11:05
  And some jerk parks in front of it in their whatever and they block it and then
• 1:11:11
  the poor Nissan Leaf pulls up and it's just like, well, I'm going to wait because
• 1:11:15
  I have no choice any closing thoughts for our intrepid EV purchasers out there.
• 1:11:21
  You know, I started considering some of the things that all
• 1:11:24
  of you guys were throwing out.
• 1:11:25
  It's an important consideration that I even consider keeping my car right now,
• 1:11:29
  because like, I looked at the CRV hybrid.
• 1:11:32
  I Googled it while we were talking the gas mileage.
• 1:11:35
  I don't know if the gas mileage on the hybrid justifies getting a new car.
• 1:11:41
  It's not that much better.
• 1:11:43
  It's better.
• 1:11:44
  It's not that much better than the one that I'm already driving.
• 1:11:47
  So do I, my viewpoint on that is you will never justify a new car purchase.
• 1:11:53
  If there's nothing already wrong with your current car, your current car
• 1:11:56
  died, then you have full justification.
• 1:11:59
  Everything makes sense.
• 1:11:59
  You need a new car.
• 1:12:01
  But if your car is still going to go another 10, 15 years and your car's
• 1:12:06
  paid for and all you're doing is regular maintenance and you go turn
• 1:12:09
  around and you go 60, for a car.
• 1:12:12
  I don't care what the fuel economy is on that thing.
• 1:12:14
  It's going to take you years.
• 1:12:16
  To break back even.
• 1:12:18
  It's such an important point to consider and I hadn't thought about that.
• 1:12:22
  So I'm just keeping my CRV.
• 1:12:24
  Take the money that you save on the car payment and invest it
• 1:12:27
  in supporting climate science.
• 1:12:29
  Yeah, I like that.
• 1:12:31
  Just do something that makes you feel better.
• 1:12:33
  Also, I would do the math.
• 1:12:35
  Because I think if you looked at the numbers and saw exactly how much
• 1:12:38
  extra damage you as one human would be doing by not buying a new car.
• 1:12:45
  Now again, I'm all for saving the environment, like I'm all for EVs, I'm all
• 1:12:48
  for it, but it has to make sense for you.
• 1:12:51
  We can't make decisions based on what we think other people think
• 1:12:53
  of us or what's going on in our own heads that isn't reality.
• 1:12:57
  So just examine what the reality of the situation is and if you're
• 1:13:00
  making up things that aren't real.
• 1:13:02
  Yeah, you'll be a lot happier if you keep your current car and
• 1:13:07
  then just go plant some algae.
• 1:13:10
  And it'll suck up all the CO2.
• 1:13:13
  Definitely.
• 1:13:15
  Just put a pond in your backyard.
• 1:13:16
  That algae will come all on its own.
• 1:13:18
  No worries.
• 1:13:20
  Don't do it.
• 1:13:21
  Okay.
• 1:13:25
  Resounding hybrid is the answer.
• 1:13:27
  Hashtag dead dinosaurs.
• 1:13:29
  It's entirely Based off of like how you would buy a normal car,
• 1:13:33
  you need to consider all of the things that your lifestyle needs,
• 1:13:37
  the things that you can afford and what you're willing to put up with.
• 1:13:41
  Maybe an EV is part of that category.
• 1:13:43
  Maybe you just don't want to deal with that headache.
• 1:13:45
  So filter it out of your next internet search.
• 1:13:48
  I agree.
• 1:13:48
  I think they're great for the everyday day to day and you have
• 1:13:51
  access to your charging station for the situation we presented.
• 1:13:56
  Going on long trips and not wanting to stop.
• 1:13:59
  Definitely not an EV.
• 1:14:00
  But there are situations where they work.
• 1:14:02
  Unique to everybody.
• 1:14:03
  Depends on who you are and what you need.
• 1:14:04
  So last question.
• 1:14:05
  Money's no option.
• 1:14:06
  You sleep on piles of cash.
• 1:14:08
  What EV would you buy?
• 1:14:10
  When they may come out.
• 1:14:11
  One of which you stood up next to that technology show.
• 1:14:15
  Yes, yes, the buzz.
• 1:14:18
  So cool.
• 1:14:19
  No, the other one.
• 1:14:20
  Oh, which other one?
• 1:14:21
  Wasn't there the ID7?
• 1:14:22
  Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 1:14:23
  I went inside the reveal booth.
• 1:14:25
  Yep.
• 1:14:25
  That's what I want.
• 1:14:27
  Nice.
• 1:14:28
  E Ray, Corvette, E Ray.
• 1:14:30
  Lucid Air, I think was Emily's answer, but, or do you want to change it?
• 1:14:33
  Lucid Air or the brand new Polestar.
• 1:14:35
  One of those two.
• 1:14:36
  Polestar 1 would be really fun.
• 1:14:38
  Yeah.
• 1:14:38
  The new Polestar is amazing.
• 1:14:40
  I'm Googling all of these.
• 1:14:41
  I don't even know.
• 1:14:42
  Are you happy with your model?
• 1:14:45
  Why Sarah, would you upgrade?
• 1:14:47
  I would say I am happy with the EV experience.
• 1:14:52
  My problem that I've had with my Tesla is it's.
• 1:14:56
  All screen based and I realized that more and more as I got out and started
• 1:15:01
  testing other cars again, a lot more, I need more than just a screen.
• 1:15:05
  So I'm stuck in this space where the Tesla charging network is great and super
• 1:15:11
  reliable and fast, but the car itself.
• 1:15:16
  It's such a frustrating situation.
• 1:15:18
  I don't know that I would buy that car again just based on my in car experience.
• 1:15:24
  Especially since there's so many choices now.
• 1:15:26
  Good news!
• 1:15:27
  Apparently the U.
• 1:15:28
  S.
• 1:15:28
  government made a deal with Tesla to open up 7, 500 chargers on their networks.
• 1:15:33
  I know it's exciting.
• 1:15:35
  And now we just have to wait to see how that plays out.
• 1:15:42
  So good point, Emily, for sure.
• 1:15:44
  I'm excited about that.
• 1:15:46
  And I think obviously it opens a ton of options up for, for me going forward.
• 1:15:51
  But if money was no object, what would you buy?
• 1:15:54
  I feel like I.
• 1:15:56
  I had a really great experience with the Mercedes Benz EQS.
• 1:16:01
  Like if I just didn't have a care in the world and I could drive whatever.
• 1:16:07
  It was beautiful.
• 1:16:08
  It was customizable.
• 1:16:10
  It was.
• 1:16:11
  The frontier of Eevee everythingness, but I'm also super curious
• 1:16:18
  about the F one 50 lightning.
• 1:16:20
  I'm in Colorado, so I feel like I would love to have a truck experience
• 1:16:26
  and see what that's all about.
• 1:16:28
  I also drove.
• 1:16:30
  The B-M-W-I-X-M 60, so that's a performance version of
• 1:16:35
  their ix, kind of an SUV.
• 1:16:38
  It was really interesting in that I always thought like a performance
• 1:16:42
  version of an EV is ridiculous 'cause like really is, is it diminishing
• 1:16:47
  returns, the power and the speed.
• 1:16:50
  Could you really tell?
• 1:16:52
  And that was a yes . But it's also an EVs, it's still not the same as driving a super
• 1:16:59
  powerful internal combustion engine cars.
• 1:17:03
  Since money is no object, I'm going to go a different route and I don't
• 1:17:05
  want any of the cars listed on my, uh, lists that I curated and
• 1:17:09
  I'm going to build my own cars.
• 1:17:11
  And I am going to create a retro Fiat Panda EV.
• 1:17:15
  Because Fiat Panda is always my answer.
• 1:17:18
  If you do that, you have to sell schematics and make parts
• 1:17:22
  for everyone else to do it.
• 1:17:23
  I'm just putting that out there into the universe.
• 1:17:27
  Love it.
• 1:17:28
  I love it.
• 1:17:29
  We hope you enjoyed our What Should I Buy Ladies and EVs edition, and if
• 1:17:33
  you're excited for more, well then, keep up with all the latest car trends
• 1:17:36
  and vehicle reviews, and not just EVs, by visiting agirlsguidetocars.
• 1:17:41
  com, where you can catch all of Sarah's latest car news.
• 1:17:44
  Fire up your favorite podcatcher and tech out with Carolyn while
• 1:17:47
  listening to tech transforms.
• 1:17:49
  Learn more from folks like Emily and Chrissy by joining the
• 1:17:52
  Grand Touring Motorsports Club.
• 1:17:53
  And finally, hop over to dngmotors.
• 1:17:56
  com to check on all of Kat's progress in starting up her very own car company
• 1:18:00
  and peruse the online tribute museum to her father at deloreanlegacy.
• 1:18:05
  org.
• 1:18:05
  Ladies, I gotta say, this has been a stellar episode.
• 1:18:10
  It's been awesome to watch you guys debate EVs.
• 1:18:13
  And you know what?
• 1:18:14
  I have to say, I think it did a better job than the guys normally do, where we
• 1:18:18
  get up on our soapboxes and pontificate about spending other people's money in
• 1:18:21
  cars that are absolutely unobtainable.
• 1:18:23
  But you know what?
• 1:18:24
  I learned a lot from this, and I hope our listeners did too.
• 1:18:27
  And if I can just add one little extra thing, I think if money was no
• 1:18:30
  object and I had to buy an alternative fuel vehicle, there's two on my list.
• 1:18:34
  One of which keeps playing the hokey pokey on me, which is the Hyundai concept.
• 1:18:38
  And then I think I might just wait for this new supercar that's
• 1:18:42
  coming out and we'll see when it becomes available as an EV.
• 1:18:44
  So I'll just leave it there.
• 1:18:45
  But thank you all for joining us yet again.
• 1:18:48
  You know, the difference between the male and all female is that
• 1:18:52
  I believe we were all sober.
• 1:18:58
  He makes a huge difference.
• 1:19:01
  This was really fun.
• 1:19:02
  Thanks you guys.
• 1:19:03
  And thanks.
• 1:19:03
  Thanks for all the advice.
• 1:19:04
  It was very helpful.
• 1:19:05
  No.
• 1:19:05
  Thank you all for coming.
• 1:19:07
  It's been a pleasure.
• 1:19:08
  Thank you.
• 1:19:17
  If you like what you've heard and want to learn more about GTM,
• 1:19:20
  be sure to check us out on www.
• 1:19:23
  gtmotorsports.
• 1:19:23
  org.
• 1:19:24
  You can also find us on Instagram Also, if you want to get involved or have
• 1:19:30
  suggestions for future shows, you can call or text us at 202 630 1770 or send
• 1:19:37
  us an email at crewchief at gtmotorsports.
• 1:19:39
  org.
• 1:19:40
  We'd love to hear from you.
• 1:19:42
  Hey everybody, Crew Chief Eric here.
• 1:19:44
  We really hope you enjoyed this episode of Break Fix, and we wanted
• 1:19:47
  to remind you that GTM remains a no annual fees organization, and our goal
• 1:19:53
  is to continue to bring you quality episodes like this one at no charge.
• 1:19:58
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