Latest / The Home of Fertility with Liz Walton & Helen Zee / The Power of Reproductive Autonomy: Conversations with Dr. Sam Sturrock

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The Power of Reproductive Autonomy: Conversations with Dr. Sam Sturrock · The Home of Fertility with Liz Walton & Helen Zee

• 0:04
  Liz Walton: Welcome to the home of fertility, a space for real conversations and expert insights about fertility, healing and creating family.
• 0:14
  Liz Walton: I'm Liz Walton.
• 0:17
  Helen Zee: And I'm Helen Z.
• 0:18
  Helen Zee: We are two mums who've walked this path and are passionate about supporting you on your journey emotionally, physically and spiritually.
• 0:28
  Liz Walton: We talk about it all fertility treatments, holistic support, relationships, mindset and the emotional highs and lows.
• 0:38
  Helen Zee: Because sometimes the missing piece lies in someone else's story, in the quiet wisdom of the body or in a breakthrough that's finally made for you we are so glad you are here.
• 0:52
  Liz Walton: Let's dive in.
• 0:58
  Helen Zee: Welcome to a very special episode that we've got in the home of fertility, and today we are speaking with the amazing and very approachable Dr Sam Sturrock, who is a fertility specialist at Monash IVF, who is also based in Brighton and Cremorne.
• 1:19
  Helen Zee: He supports people with a fertility care and egg freezing and reproductive planning.
• 1:25
  Helen Zee: He works closely with patients fertility care and egg freezing and reproductive planning.
• 1:26
  Helen Zee: He works closely with patients to help them feel informed and supported and how important is that?
• 1:32
  Helen Zee: With a strong belief in open, honest conversations.
• 1:36
  Helen Zee: Dr Starek focuses on helping people understand their bodies and feeling more in control of their next steps.
• 1:45
  Helen Zee: He continues a family legacy in fertility care and brings a calm, approachable presence to the Monash IVF team.
• 1:53
  Helen Zee: Welcome, welcome, welcome, dr Sam.
• 1:58
  Dr Sam Sturrock: Helen, thank you so much for having me today.
• 2:00
  Dr Sam Sturrock: That was a very, very lovely introduction.
• 2:04
  Dr Sam Sturrock: I appreciate it.
• 2:06
  Helen Zee: Great, and I know that our audience is too.
• 2:09
  Helen Zee: So please, if you are listening, get nice and comfortable.
• 2:14
  Helen Zee: There's a lot of golden nuggets that Dr Sam and I will be sharing and exploring, and we feel the conversation today will be one where it takes a listener through the journey of what their options are and also whole-centered health.
• 2:32
  Helen Zee: Speaking with Sam earlier and also knowing of his work, it's really important that I know that a lot of people that come through our spaces come in and say you know, we want to feel like we've got autonomy and we want to also feel like there is a whole person approach, and I know that you do that, sam, dr Sam, with your clients and with your patients, and so we're going to take the listener on an experience today.
• 3:06
  Dr Sam Sturrock: Sounds fantastic.
• 3:07
  Dr Sam Sturrock: I think, particularly in fertility medicine, a lot of the time there are specific characteristics and factors that we are interested in that can help us move towards certain treatment pathways.
• 3:20
  Dr Sam Sturrock: But if we're not tailoring our care and our focus to the individuals or the family sitting in front of us, then we're doing them a disservice.
• 3:29
  Dr Sam Sturrock: So I think that all sounds very important.
• 3:34
  Helen Zee: And Dr Sam, when a person or a couple come in to see you, is it reassurance that they're wanting in that first few consultations?
• 3:47
  Dr Sam Sturrock: Certainly so.
• 3:49
  Dr Sam Sturrock: There are many different contexts that we could see an individual or a couple at any stage in their early reproductive years or in their early attempts at reproduction, or even as pre-conception counselling.
• 4:05
  Dr Sam Sturrock: And certainly we try, and you know a big part of what we try to do when we're seeing these patients for the first time is get an understanding first of all of that patient's expectations and their wishes, and a lot of that is providing a lot of reassurance understanding that for the most part, most families, most couples and most individuals have the ability to conceive, but also understanding what that couple wants.
• 4:31
  Dr Sam Sturrock: Some patients and couples prefer to go with the flow a little bit and prefer a more hands-off approach, which is entirely reasonable in a lot of circumstances, whereas others prefer to have as much information from the outset to allow them to feel that additional sense of control and being an active participant in these journeys.
• 4:55
  Dr Sam Sturrock: So a lot of it's about understanding who it is that we're trying to treat.
• 4:57
  Dr Sam Sturrock: That is just as important as any possible pathology in helping them achieve a family.
• 5:05
  Helen Zee: Yeah, beautiful, beautiful, I love that as any possible pathology in helping them achieve a family.
• 5:11
  Helen Zee: Yeah, beautiful, beautiful, I love that.
• 5:12
  Helen Zee: And it is so important in what you're saying because and also, the more that people you get to understand what the person wants, you evolve, and then their care evolves as well.
• 5:20
  Helen Zee: It's not just a one and done.
• 5:22
  Helen Zee: The journey changes, doesn't it, as you're saying, wonderful.
• 5:35
  Helen Zee: I know that we have spoken about fertility and fertility care and understanding our bodies, especially when we're younger, you know, in our 20s and 30s, I find like I've got adult children.
• 5:53
  Helen Zee: They're 30 and 28.
• 5:55
  Helen Zee: So, you know, growing with their friends, et cetera.
• 5:58
  Helen Zee: And I know that the big focus is living life more from contraception, yeah, and we all do that.
• 6:06
  Helen Zee: We want to know that we want to have children when we want to have children and the rest of the time when we don't, we're wanting our bodies to act in a contraceptive mode, irrespective of methods.
• 6:19
  Helen Zee: But what is it about our fertility that we need to foster and let our people know where it's not just an on-off switch, but how can we be fertile in our bodies and make those choices about when we are ready to want to have a family and when we're not wanting to have a family to want to have a family and when we're not wanting to have a family.
• 6:52
  Dr Sam Sturrock: Yeah, I mean, that's so interesting and important, particularly in the modern world that we find ourselves in now.
• 6:55
  Dr Sam Sturrock: The harsh realities of it all is that we are peaking, particularly from the female perspective.
• 6:59
  Dr Sam Sturrock: Peaking in regards to fertility in our late teenage years and early 20s, and so certainly for the overwhelming majority of people, while if we looked at their fertility within a vacuum, that is when we're at our peak.
• 7:15
  Dr Sam Sturrock: But obviously there are significant social and personal factors that make that usually an unappealing time to be pursuing a family.
• 7:27
  Dr Sam Sturrock: So I think that you know you use your kids as an example at 28 to 31 years of age really a very common time that we start to encounter people considering their reproductive wishes and starting to consider factors that might make it more challenging for them.
• 7:51
  Dr Sam Sturrock: I think, like I said, you know if people are coming to see us in their 20s.
• 7:59
  Dr Sam Sturrock: So let's take the late 20s, for example.
• 8:02
  Dr Sam Sturrock: Overwhelmingly that's a reassuring thing they're seeking to address issues and gain information at an age that allows them, if any issues are identified, for those to be assessed and addressed in a timely manner before more significant declines in take egg quality, for example, begin to occur after in our mid-30s, and so it allows for thorough assessment and also to address things in the most non-invasive ways, because we have that time up our sleeve and I think that usually fertility consultations in our mid to late 20s allow us time to help the patient gain an understanding about reproduction broadly.
• 8:49
  Dr Sam Sturrock: So many people just don't quite understand the normal reproductive cycle and timing of ovulation and our fertile window and when we can optimize possibilities.
• 9:03
  Dr Sam Sturrock: A lot of that is because you know exactly what you said earlier in regards to considering things like contraception.
• 9:09
  Dr Sam Sturrock: Understandably, as teenagers and young adults we can be fearful of pregnancy and we're thought to understand pregnancy is something that can occur randomly and easily, and so certainly when it comes time for these things to be a want, you know we have to reframe that consideration and there's a lot of education that goes into that as well and not only trying to understand the reproductive cycle more broadly, but also allowing for the patients and their couples to understand their own bodies.
• 9:38
  Dr Sam Sturrock: Are there particular considerations for that individual patient that might affect their abilities to have a family and that might present itself as an irregular cycle, which might make us consider ovulatory issues that can be associated with conditions like PCOS, for example, or do they suffer from painful periods or painful intercourse, which might make us more suspicious of conditions like endometriosis, or is there a history of pelvic infections or sexually transmitted infections in their past that might make us more concerned about tubal factors that might contribute to subfertility?
• 10:23
  Dr Sam Sturrock: So I think that by presenting early, it allows us this time for knowledge gaining, education and understanding that we sometimes don't have the liberty or the luxury of if people present to us later.
• 10:39
  Helen Zee: Wow, you shared so much goodness in there.
• 10:44
  Helen Zee: Like it is, I'm going there, thank you, thank you.
• 10:48
  Helen Zee: I would like to break it down a little bit and have a little bit more of a conversation.
• 10:51
  Helen Zee: So what I've heard and what I really want to hone in for the person listening as well, is in that reassurance of going to see your medical professionals to get the testing done.
• 11:09
  Helen Zee: So then you know, just like we go to have other diagnostics, that we get done with other ailments or areas of our life, we don't really consider fertility as being something that we can check in early enough.
• 11:25
  Helen Zee: We think that we have to wait until there is something wrong, and that is not the case.
• 11:32
  Helen Zee: You're a fertility specialist, you're a fertility expert.
• 11:36
  Helen Zee: So, of course, coming to see you and just exploring those factors upfront, like you said, people will not realise that if they've had reoccurring sexual transmitted diseases, how that can translate to their overall health and the fertility health when they are choosing to want to start a family.
• 11:59
  Helen Zee: And I know, even with the education, how many times do people come to you?
• 12:08
  Helen Zee: You give them the information and they lean in and say I wish I knew this earlier.
• 12:13
  Helen Zee: It's one of the biggest things that we get right.
• 12:18
  Dr Sam Sturrock: Frequently, why don't?
• 12:19
  Helen Zee: we teach that at school.
• 12:20
  Helen Zee: Why don't we know this?
• 12:21
  Helen Zee: Yes, we've got more information with dr, google and all this other stuff.
• 12:27
  Helen Zee: And you spoke on the fertility window.
• 12:30
  Helen Zee: You spoke about the reproductive cycle.
• 12:33
  Dr Sam Sturrock: You spoke about um irregular, irregular cycles, um, let's flesh that out of course, course, well, yeah, no, I agree entirely, and certainly there is always that the opposing viewpoint, obviously being that we don't want to overtreat and over-medicalise people with review.
• 12:57
  Dr Sam Sturrock: Sorry, I'm sorry, yeah.
• 13:01
  Helen Zee: I did not hear that.
• 13:03
  Dr Sam Sturrock: Sorry, that was my phone, apologies.
• 13:04
  Dr Sam Sturrock: So yes, that all makes sense entirely.
• 13:08
  Dr Sam Sturrock: I guess the pushback to that is that we don't want to be, you know, over-reviewing, over-servicing and over-treating people who may have been able to achieve a pregnancy spontaneously anyway.
• 13:19
  Dr Sam Sturrock: I would reassure people that by coming to see a fertility specialist, there are no means lining themselves up for treatment.
• 13:28
  Dr Sam Sturrock: That is unnecessary, and it's all about just trying to understand what their individual challenges may be, if there are any.
• 13:35
  Dr Sam Sturrock: The teaching, you know, is traditionally under the age of 35 years you seek assistance after 12 months.
• 13:41
  Dr Sam Sturrock: Over the age of 35 years you seek assistance after six months.
• 13:44
  Dr Sam Sturrock: But that's certainly 35 years, you seek assistance after six months.
• 13:45
  Dr Sam Sturrock: But that's certainly not a blanket rule that I think behooves all individuals to follow.
• 13:51
  Dr Sam Sturrock: You know, we'll take polycystic ovarian syndrome, for example, if you're 28 years of age and you're having two periods a year, because your PCOS means that ovulation is more challenging and significantly more irregular, trying for 12 months is not going to serve any particular purpose, because without ovulation we won't be able to conceive, and so being seen sooner allows us to address factors in, like I said, in low morbidity ways.
• 14:24
  Dr Sam Sturrock: That might just be management of lifestyle factors like diet and exercise.
• 14:28
  Dr Sam Sturrock: And then, even if medical treatments are needed and explored, these are usually much lower intervention than things like IVF.
• 14:36
  Dr Sam Sturrock: So I think yeah, I think that people should not be scared to seek review and assistance.
• 14:41
  Dr Sam Sturrock: It does not necessarily set you down a pathway of intervention.
• 14:45
  Dr Sam Sturrock: Seek review and assistance.
• 14:46
  Dr Sam Sturrock: It does not necessarily set you down a pathway of intervention.
• 14:50
  Helen Zee: It can just arm you with the information that's required, but it also may unearth something that means you are no longer wasting your time.
• 14:55
  Helen Zee: I love that For the person listening.
• 14:56
  Helen Zee: Really, let that land.
• 14:59
  Helen Zee: It is not about over-medicalising.
• 15:02
  Helen Zee: It is about armouring you with the best knowledge that you have for your body to make choices and the steps forward from there.
• 15:12
  Helen Zee: Beautiful, you mentioned PCOS or PCOS and other conditions as well, and they are.
• 15:21
  Helen Zee: You know symptoms and medical conditions and they do.
• 15:25
  Helen Zee: Also, they can hand in hand through lifestyle choices.
• 15:33
  Helen Zee: You know, like you said, diet and exercise, et cetera, be able to help through.
• 15:39
  Helen Zee: So then we've got a synergistic approach with fertilised treatment as well.
• 15:46
  Helen Zee: So let's talk about that.
• 15:48
  Helen Zee: Let's talk about how we can optimise our health through general wellbeing, bmi and also fertility-specific practices.
• 16:03
  Dr Sam Sturrock: Well, I mean, if we're continuing down the line of PCOS, I think, first of all, yeah.
• 16:08
  Dr Sam Sturrock: First of all, I think it is important for us to acknowledge that amongst this particular population of patients, while certainly keeping weight within a healthy range and optimizing things like diet and exercise absolutely has benefits broadly to the health conditions associated with PCOS which are metabolic, such as diabetes, bone and heart health, but also, clearly, for fertility implications too.
• 16:42
  Dr Sam Sturrock: I think we also have to really acknowledge that this particular cohort of patients, managing things like weight can prove to be significantly challenging, and I think that sometimes you know, we say that we need to do these things, but I think we also have to acknowledge how difficult it can be as well, and in addition with these patients as well, addressing holistically the mental health components associated with that we know to be associated with PCOS2 and the challenges associated additionally associated like physical health and fertility concerns.
• 17:18
  Dr Sam Sturrock: So I think that's all.
• 17:19
  Dr Sam Sturrock: In order to address these things, usually it involves a team of people to help and we can, as doctors, would certainly try and give advice in regards to diet and exercise, but there are specific professionals with much more minute expertise in these areas.
• 17:44
  Dr Sam Sturrock: Much more minute expertise in these areas.
• 17:49
  Dr Sam Sturrock: Dieticians can certainly help to personalise an approach to nutrition for these patients.
• 17:53
  Dr Sam Sturrock: Obviously, exercise people with a background like yourself can really help to personalise treatment for patients like this and also, as doctors, we can come in and give advice with that um, but also can help to monitor, um, those consequences of PCOS from a medical perspective that need to be monitored and also, um, uh, help to uh understand hormonally what what's happening and, um and uh, and particularly, I guess, from the context of ovulation, they're all things that we can manage and I think that we're trying to achieve.
• 18:32
  Dr Sam Sturrock: Like there is a very specific and delicate balance of hormones that goes on in order for a woman to achieve ovulation.
• 18:40
  Dr Sam Sturrock: And you know it's very exciting when you see patients with PCOS who, through simple measures, you see the cycle, the cycle come back because there is essentially no other reason that the human body provokes that regular monthly cycle other than ovulation.
• 18:56
  Dr Sam Sturrock: So I say to these patients I don't, we don't need necessarily need to be doing a day 21 progesterone.
• 19:00
  Dr Sam Sturrock: I don't think you need to be weighing on a stick to measure the LH surge necessarily.
• 19:04
  Dr Sam Sturrock: I know from your 26 to 30 day cycle that you're having that hard work that you've been doing has kind of restarted that regular ovulatory cycle.
• 19:16
  Dr Sam Sturrock: I think I've talked a bit around in circles there, but that's kind of how I approach that from that perspective, not at all?
• 19:22
  Helen Zee: Not at all.
• 19:22
  Helen Zee: It so important it's.
• 19:24
  Helen Zee: It's very juicy information for for people to have, because I know even in the work that I do so as a lifestyle uh practitioner.
• 19:36
  Helen Zee: So, working as you, as you mentioned as well, through fitness, through, through natural food choices, the sleep-wake cycle, when that's out of whack, that also affects your hormones when you're not sleeping well enough, stress certainly does as well.
• 19:55
  Helen Zee: When you've got excessive estrogen in the body and you actually see that as the symptoms that are, whatever we're seeing outside of the body, we can actually trace back into what is happening internally.
• 20:08
  Helen Zee: That's part of the diagnostics.
• 20:10
  Helen Zee: And when a person does come and present themselves and having the symptoms of, say, polycystic ovaries, I know that and say part of that is also carrying excessive weight.
• 20:25
  Helen Zee: I remember when I worked on my pilot program for lifestyle factors and fertility that if a person and back then you know a woman was wanting to go through IVF, if they were reaching the high level of obesity and morbidly obese, we wouldn't be doing IVF treatment because the comorbidity factors and the stress on that body means that the person is more affected and that pregnancy can also be a lot more affected, right?
• 21:01
  Helen Zee: So you've got to go to preconception healthcare and that is what I'm hearing from you as well is that window and that leading window that you're able to work with a patient, to be able to have that preconception care plan medicalized and non-medicalized, to get the body ready to start planning for that fertility cycle.
• 21:32
  Helen Zee: Because if someone's got a PCOS or endometriosis or a whole heap of other medical conditions, it just doesn't happen with that one-month cycle.
• 21:41
  Helen Zee: And this is, I think, what we need to start.
• 21:44
  Helen Zee: You know, we tell people that you need to be on these meds or you need to be on this lifestyle for two months, three months for it to be able to kick in before we can go to that next level.
• 21:58
  Dr Sam Sturrock: For sure.
• 21:59
  Dr Sam Sturrock: I mean, look from a pure fertility perspective, all of the interventions that we have that we think may be useful in optimising egg quality or these general health considerations, just due to the physiology of conception.
• 22:19
  Dr Sam Sturrock: Time is necessary.
• 22:21
  Dr Sam Sturrock: Time is necessary and uh, the later that we come to find these issues or address these problems, um, the less uh options we have, um, and the kind of more aggressive we need to be.
• 22:33
  Dr Sam Sturrock: So I think it's about um, yeah, it's about gently um, uh, managing things and um, and which which allows for, quite commonly, the most patient-centered approach to maximizing their fertility.
• 22:52
  Helen Zee: I love that and before, when you were talking and I said there's a few things that I want to explore, you also mentioned about the approach that circles this person to be able to have that care that they need.
• 23:06
  Helen Zee: And that really is where we say the village starts coming out to support this individual and this couple who are wanting to go through their family journey.
• 23:15
  Helen Zee: And I know that you work quite closely in investigating and also establishing a team of trusted specialists to be able to help a person go on their journey.
• 23:30
  Dr Sam Sturrock: Yeah, certainly so, look, yeah, and we work closely with many other doctors, allied health specialists and wellness practitioners in efforts to improve the conditions as much as we can for these patients, and I think exactly what that looks like is very variable from person to person and also depends on what we're trying to achieve.
• 23:58
  Dr Sam Sturrock: From a PCOS perspective, it might be a fertility specialist, an endocrinologist, dieticians, physiotherapists.
• 24:07
  Dr Sam Sturrock: From an endometriosis perspective, obviously, gynecologists and those of us who perform laparoscopic surgeries for treatment of endometriosis, as well as physiotherapists to help with pelvic pain.
• 24:20
  Dr Sam Sturrock: And then, obviously, if we're moving down the pathways of fertility treatment, obviously we have to work very closely with our nurses and our scientists, who can help to provide the best outcomes for all our patients too.
• 24:32
  Dr Sam Sturrock: So certainly there is no one-size-fits-all approach, but it always involves a very wide array of very specialised and very knowledgeable individuals that help our patients.
• 24:47
  Helen Zee: You have helped you have helped In the 50 years that IVF has been available as a medical treatment.
• 24:56
  Helen Zee: There are millions and millions of families that have been created worldwide and, humbly, how much has come out of Melbourne and the specialist teams here, who are world-class and people around the world.
• 25:16
  Helen Zee: It is.
• 25:17
  Helen Zee: It is.
• 25:18
  Helen Zee: I've been in the space for over 20 years.
• 25:22
  Helen Zee: I just get so excited.
• 25:24
  Helen Zee: It's like, really, there has been a human-type glue that's been created, so we don't implant it the three-day embryo and we plant a five-day blastocyst embryo you know, we plan a five-day blastocyst, and that means that pregnancy is more likely to take hold and there is a particular glue that can go in to embed, and so what we're doing is exactly what the human body would be doing without us being under the microscope.
• 25:55
  Helen Zee: You know, of course, it's so damn exciting, of course, and just the new technology that keeps growing is actually helping more and more people, you know, create the families, and you know you spoke earlier about preservation options and prevention options, and this is basically, I feel, a big message of what you're sharing is that when a person can come in in their 20s, in their 30s, not just waiting until potentially we've been trying and we can't, but if you have an established relationship with your fertility practitioner, you get to know, like and trust each other.
• 26:37
  Helen Zee: You're going on that journey together, and so we'll know, and you'll know when intervention is needed and also when preservation is needed, based on, as you said, the lifestyle factors that we're leading in our modern age and having this medical treatment where people can choose to preserve their fertility for later on in life for any number of reasons.
• 27:03
  Helen Zee: Let's talk about that, sam.
• 27:06
  Dr Sam Sturrock: Yeah, that's amazing.
• 27:08
  Dr Sam Sturrock: So I guess egg freezing and the move from it being a quasi-experimental type of treatment to, over the last decade to 15 years, becoming an understood and like a well-understood and effective means of preserving a woman's reproductive autonomy, is essentially a game changer, and I think it's incredibly important.
• 27:38
  Dr Sam Sturrock: I think we remember it that way Quite commonly.
• 27:41
  Dr Sam Sturrock: I think there's this old school thinking about you know, people come to see you about fertility preservation and ask about do I freeze embryos or do I freeze eggs?
• 27:51
  Dr Sam Sturrock: And while per embryo we probably have a better understanding of its fertility potential we probably have a better understanding of its fertility potential it doesn't actually go about achieving the desired outcome.
• 28:02
  Dr Sam Sturrock: You know, when an embryo is created, it's tied to another's gametes and really doesn't do a lot to preserve that person, that woman sitting in front of you her specific reproductive autonomy, which is the ultimate goal of egg freezing.
• 28:17
  Dr Sam Sturrock: I think that this conversation is that's probably one of the more important topics to consider and certainly if a patient is coming to see us in their mid-20s, it might not necessarily be that we need to be barreling down the pathways of egg freezing in your mid-20s.
• 28:32
  Dr Sam Sturrock: That's not necessarily the case, but certainly.
• 28:35
  Dr Sam Sturrock: What do we know about eggs Well, we know that there is a significant age-related decline in both the number of eggs that are there as well as their quality.
• 28:46
  Dr Sam Sturrock: So we know that as you get older or when we're younger, we are more likely to be able to achieve, retrieve more eggs using less treatment.
• 28:57
  Dr Sam Sturrock: But we are also likely to need less eggs because they're of a higher quality, the flip side of that being that as we get older, we are to to ensure any kind of uh, of assurance or uh, or an appropriate level of um, of, of um you know, an appropriate level to allow that patient to be comfortable with what they have frozen we are likely to need more eggs but are less likely to be able to retrieve those in a fewer number of cycles.
• 29:28
  Dr Sam Sturrock: So you know, as we said earlier, these are the reproductive piggies in your 20s.
• 29:35
  Dr Sam Sturrock: But for most people there are significant social factors that make that not an opportune time to have a family.
• 29:42
  Dr Sam Sturrock: So it's important to understand that as we approach our late 20s, and particularly in our early 30s, if having a baby is not possible at that time due to relationship factors ie you're single or you're in a relationship where that's not a priority at that particular time, but having children is at some point, particularly if multiple children are something that you desire.
• 30:06
  Dr Sam Sturrock: That is a very, very important time to consider your options.
• 30:10
  Dr Sam Sturrock: In regards to egg freezing, as we're talking about it today, certainly, egg freezing in your later 30s is possible, but the amount of reassurance that we could give to an individual based upon those stored eggs is less.
• 30:29
  Dr Sam Sturrock: So it's a give and a take, and so I think it's all about this education, as we talked about earlier.
• 30:34
  Dr Sam Sturrock: It's about not falling for the trap of thinking I'll just think about this when, when I'm 40, and if it's too hard, I'll just have IVF.
• 30:43
  Dr Sam Sturrock: That's, you're being sold a bit of a fallacy there.
• 30:47
  Dr Sam Sturrock: It's not about trying to push people towards having a baby sooner than they're ready for, or making compromises in regards to their social situations or, you know, whether that be relationship or work, but it's about helping people to achieve that flexibility and maintain that autonomy until they are ready.
• 31:10
  Helen Zee: Oh, yes, yes to all of that.
• 31:13
  Helen Zee: All power to you.
• 31:17
  Helen Zee: know, in what you're saying, you were giving so much power through choice to the person listening to you right now for sure where we think that our body fails us or the power is given to our doctor and to this process, and exactly what you've said, the absolute power of what you've shared like this is like a little transmission piece.
• 31:47
  Helen Zee: My body started tingling in the truth bomb and what you said now is you were giving the power and autonomy to that listener.
• 31:57
  Helen Zee: Yeah, you were there to help execute, to help support what they're wanting to do for themselves, Absolutely Until it's too late and feeling like it's crumbled.
• 32:10
  Helen Zee: My body has failed me, I don't have this, this and this, and now I just have to bleed myself dry because of blah, blah, blah.
• 32:18
  Helen Zee: I mean.
• 32:19
  Helen Zee: You know, even financially, looking at this and starting earlier, what means that financially, it may not cost you as much.
• 32:29
  Dr Sam Sturrock: Absolutely.
• 32:30
  Helen Zee: Yeah, or at all.
• 32:31
  Helen Zee: I know I've worked with clients who have preserved their eggs and then they get in a relationship and they get pregnant relatively easily 100% the relationship dissolves.
• 32:44
  Helen Zee: They're a little bit older, they want to grow their family.
• 32:47
  Helen Zee: They've got their eggs in reserve.
• 32:52
  Helen Zee: Absolutely, yeah, yeah, absolutely, yeah, yeah, totally tickles all over my body.
• 32:59
  Helen Zee: People converse with me, you know.
• 33:02
  Helen Zee: I'm having with my kids as well, just like, and even my kiddos telling their friends speak to my mum, you know.
• 33:10
  Dr Sam Sturrock: Yes.
• 33:11
  Helen Zee: Speaking to my mum means, well, you've got to speak to this person and this person because they're the ones that have got um, they're the ones that have got the good um, the good oil, to share with you.
• 33:22
  Dr Sam Sturrock: Yeah yeah, no, it's um.
• 33:26
  Dr Sam Sturrock: I think that that's really, you know, a really important, important thing.
• 33:30
  Dr Sam Sturrock: And um, and it's not to say that those who haven't frozen their eggs for many that wasn't an option you know that any attempts or efforts are futile and that treatment is not available.
• 33:42
  Dr Sam Sturrock: That's absolutely not the case.
• 33:44
  Dr Sam Sturrock: But if we're talking about choice options, optimisation, then I think that you know it's a disservice to not be armed with this information.
• 33:57
  Helen Zee: Yeah, disservice not to be armed with this information.
• 34:01
  Helen Zee: Let's pop that in a quote.
• 34:03
  Helen Zee: Timestamp, that one.
• 34:08
  Dr Sam Sturrock: Yeah.
• 34:12
  Helen Zee: Dr Sam, it was an absolute delight to speak with you today and I know that the listeners who are going to be listening to this will want to reach out and get more questions and have your availability, so we'll have that in the show notes.
• 34:32
  Helen Zee: I know you'll be okay with that.
• 34:33
  Helen Zee: I'm going to contact you and sit and have such an amazing conversation very personable, likeable wealth of knowledge in helping a person through their journey.
• 34:47
  Helen Zee: So thank you.
• 34:49
  Helen Zee: Before we wrap it up, is there anything else that we haven't touched on that you would like to share with?
• 34:56
  Dr Sam Sturrock: us?
• 34:56
  Dr Sam Sturrock: No, I don't think so.
• 34:57
  Dr Sam Sturrock: I think you know.
• 34:58
  Dr Sam Sturrock: Just thank you so much for having me, and I'm relatively young in my career.
• 35:03
  Dr Sam Sturrock: But you know, as a generalist who cares for people with fertility concerns but also helps manage people in pregnancy, I've kind of it's taken me by surprise the overwhelming satisfaction that I get, particularly in looking after patients who've come to see me with fertility concerns in an obstetric manner and helping them to birth their babies too, and so obviously there's a selfish element there in that it fills my cup.
• 35:36
  Dr Sam Sturrock: In that it fills my cup, and so you know, being able to speak to you about things like this, hoping to see many patients who we can help from all of these perspectives, is very exciting to me.
• 35:48
  Helen Zee: So thank you so much.
• 35:49
  Helen Zee: Absolutely, and I know you mentioned about being relatively young in your career, but I'll also preface with say that humans, our dharma, which is our purpose in life, you know that knocks on our door very early and it's less about the years and more about the absolute passion, the absolute you know you're made for, this were made and you you chose, because all those little pebbles were like well, I'm going to take my career in this direction yeah yeah I can say that I started my fertility journey before I was three, when I was sitting next to my mom and being pregnant and I could remember her.
• 36:35
  Helen Zee: I'm like I why can't you see what I'm seeing?
• 36:37
  Helen Zee: Like I joke around and say I started at three years old because I could just see and sense things.
• 36:43
  Helen Zee: And you know, and here we are, you know.
• 36:47
  Dr Sam Sturrock: Exactly, I mean as the son of an obstetrician, gynecologist and fertility specialist.
• 36:51
  Dr Sam Sturrock: I you know yes, probably not at three years of age, but certainly my bedroom was above the garage door, so hearing that go up and down at all hours of the day and night I think I certainly went into this career with my eyes fully wide open to not only the joys of it but the demands of it, and certainly the joys of it.
• 37:13
  Helen Zee: I think yeah, but genetically you've had your Dean switched off, my friend.
• 37:17
  Dr Sam Sturrock: You're calling me a nepo baby, Helen, I think.
• 37:21
  Helen Zee: I'm not.
• 37:21
  Helen Zee: I studied genetics, so I did my genetics thing and I'm like epigenetics and junk DNA.
• 37:28
  Helen Zee: What do you mean?
• 37:29
  Helen Zee: Junk DNA?
• 37:30
  Helen Zee: Nothing is junk in the human body.
• 37:32
  Helen Zee: No, that was in 1988.
• 37:34
  Helen Zee: So the world just caught up with what I instinctively knew was not junk.
• 37:42
  Helen Zee: My friend, right?
• 37:43
  Helen Zee: Uh, look, dr sam, I'm super excited to see you at the upcoming melbourne fertility expo.
• 37:52
  Helen Zee: Actually, as you were talking, I'm like so for people listening, come and and you're going to be there and you know people can come up, say hello and also just yeah, meet your goodness.
• 38:09
  Dr Sam Sturrock: I can't wait.
• 38:11
  Helen Zee: Yeah, same here.
• 38:13
  Helen Zee: Thank you so much for listening and thank you so much for being here.
• 38:17
  Helen Zee: It's an absolute delight to share so much with you today.
• 38:18
  Helen Zee: Thanks so much for being here.
• 38:18
  Helen Zee: It's an absolute delight to share so much with you today.
• 38:21
  Helen Zee: Thanks, thank you, ellen.
• 38:23
  Dr Sam Sturrock: Yay.
• 38:29
  Helen Zee: Thanks for joining us at the Home of Fertility.
• 38:32
  Helen Zee: We hope today's episode brought you clarity, comfort and connection.
• 38:39
  Liz Walton: If this podcast resonated, please share it, leave a review or subscribe.
• 38:44
  Liz Walton: This helps us support more people that are on this path.
• 38:49
  Helen Zee: And if you'd like to connect or share your story, find us on Instagram and Facebook.
• 38:54
  Helen Zee: At Australian Fertility Summit.
• 38:57
  Liz Walton: Remember, the missing piece might be waiting in a story, your body's wisdom or something new just made for you.
• 39:06
  Liz Walton: Take care, and we'll see you next time.