Latest / BREAK/FIX the Motorsports & Vehicle Enthusiast Variety Show / Built to Win: Inside Garretson Enterprises and the Rise of the Apple 935

Transcript

Built to Win: Inside Garretson Enterprises and the Rise of the Apple 935 · BREAK/FIX the Motorsports & Vehicle Enthusiast Variety Show

0:00
BreakFix podcast is all about capturing the living history of people from
0:04
all over the autosphere, from wrench turners and racers to artists, authors,
0:09
designers, and everything in between.
0:11
Our goal is to inspire a new generation of petrolheads that wonder.
0:16
How did they get that job?
0:18
Or become that person?
0:19
The road to success is paved by all of us.
0:22
Because everyone has a story.
0:27
Being the owner and driver of a sports car team during the heyday of sports car
0:32
racing in the late 1970s and early 80s can be challenging, but also very rewarding.
0:38
Competing part time in both the World Sports Car Championship and IMSA
0:42
GT Championship, during 1978, Arges accomplished a win at the Sebring
0:47
12 Hours, along with veteran racer Brian Redmond and Bobby Rayhall.
0:52
Arges won the 24 Hours of Daytona, but despite not winning another race
0:56
that season, he won the first ever awarded World Endurance Championship
1:01
for driver's title in 1981.
1:03
He sold his team and retired from racing shortly thereafter.
1:07
But that's just the beginning.
1:09
So tonight, I'd like to welcome back Mike Carr from the Randy Lanier episode
1:13
as my co host, who is a huge fan of the golden era of sports car racing.
1:18
And with that, we are both pleased to welcome Bob Gerritsen
1:22
to Break Fix to tell his story.
1:24
So welcome, Bob.
1:25
Thank you very much for that introduction.
1:27
Very nice to be here with you, Bob.
1:28
Thank you.
1:29
So Bob, like all good Brake Fix stories, there's always an origin.
1:34
So tell us about the who, what, where, and when of Bob Gerritsen.
1:37
How did you get into cars and eventually into racing?
1:40
Did it start as a kid?
1:42
Did you come from a racing family?
1:43
Well, I, uh, grew up in Southern California, and my older brother, who is
1:49
quite a bit older than I am, but he was into going up to Muroc, Dry Lake, and
1:53
trying to, you know, run the speed stuff.
1:55
So I thought, well, when I got to drive, I should do the same thing.
1:59
So I fiddled around, but didn't enthuse me very much.
2:02
And so then a high school friend of mine saw a sports car race being run at Hanson
2:08
Dam in the, in San Fernando Valley.
2:11
Southern California.
2:12
So we went to that, look at my friend.
2:14
And I said, look at those guys get to drive for 20 minutes and we
2:18
only get to drive for 20 seconds.
2:20
I think there's a better deal.
2:22
So got interested in road racing, then went off to university and
2:26
do much of anything until I got out of the Navy after graduation,
2:30
I worked my way through college.
2:32
Overhauling Ford V8.
2:34
My dad worked at Warner Brothers Studio and he would find people
2:38
that needed an engine overhaul.
2:40
So I would come home on the weekend, pick up a car, take it home, pull the
2:44
engine out, tear it all down, send the block and heads and stuff out to the
2:49
vendors to grind the valves and bore the cylinder and all that kind of stuff.
2:54
I come home the next weekend.
2:55
I'm trying to get it all back together and on the third weekend i would come
2:59
put the engine back in and deliver the car when i graduated from uc berkeley
3:04
i want to work for hewlett packard when i was working at hp silicon valley
3:09
started to go at a party one night a guy.
3:13
Telling me about he was starting a new chip manufacturing company.
3:16
And so I jokingly said to him, well, if you need a mechanical
3:19
engineer, let me know.
3:20
Well, he called me up the next day and hired me.
3:23
So I got in on the ground floor of Silicon Valley was lucky enough to invent
3:28
something that every chip maker needed patented and all that kind of stuff.
3:32
Now I had money to play with and go racing.
3:36
So that's what one of my close friends is.
3:38
Another name you most likely know.
3:41
Chuck Forge, he had the Johnny Von Neumann car and we got to be
3:45
friends and he let me drive it a few times and then I got hooked.
3:49
But by then I had acquired four children and things like that and my
3:54
wife said, I don't think it's a great idea for you to be out road racing.
3:58
So I said, well, you know, okay.
4:00
She said, I don't mind if you're the only one on the track, you know,
4:04
not competitive wheel to wheel.
4:07
So I took off and started doing hill climbs and autocrosses
4:11
and things like that.
4:12
And you're in your twenties at that point, I presume.
4:14
Well, thirties almost, but along about them, one of the guys I used to compete
4:19
against with at Porsche parades and stuff like that was a guy by the name of Dick
4:23
Barber, which I'm sure you all know.
4:26
You know, we used to talk and I would go to Laguna Seca, for example, and I'd see
4:30
him and he, I'd say, Dick, you ought to have Garrison Enterprise prepare your car.
4:34
He says, no, no, no, I have a great mechanic and all this stuff.
4:37
I said, all right, fine.
4:38
At Laguna Seca, he DNF'd, so that's why I suggest he ought
4:42
to have us take care of his car.
4:44
So next time I saw him was at Sears Point.
4:47
Same thing happened.
4:48
Well, he got pretty ticked off at his people and told him to take the car down
4:53
to Mountain View, where our shop was.
4:55
So we started preparing that.
4:57
Well, the first race it went out to run was the finale at Atlanta.
5:03
Of course, wouldn't you know, in practice, something happened.
5:06
And God, here I am saying how wonderful we are and all that stuff.
5:09
Well, it turns out that the Porsche truck was there and I could get the parts needed
5:13
and fix it and he finished the first race in these nine thirty four and a half.
5:18
So next year he bought a new nine thirty five said to him, I said, Dick, you
5:23
ought to let me drive the spare car.
5:25
And he agreed that I said, if you can drive it as long as you'll drive with
5:30
renter riders that pay to sit in the seat.
5:33
The first race was the 78 Sebring race.
5:37
Brian Redman was just recovering from his big Formula 5000 accident.
5:43
Joe Hoppin was running Porsche Racing in America, and he convinced Barber
5:49
that, you know, I guess paid him some money, of course, to put Redman
5:52
in the seat with me, which is fine.
5:55
The owner of the Sebring track was the third driver.
5:59
And so we went off and, uh, as the night went on, everybody
6:03
broke and stuff like that.
6:04
And, uh, here we go win the race.
6:07
So that was kind of an exciting start.
6:09
And I didn't race many races after that.
6:12
I did Le Mans, which I crashed on the Mulsanne straight at
6:16
four o'clock in the morning.
6:18
Uh, didn't really get serious as far as I was concerned about racing until the
6:23
next year when we ran the whole season.
6:26
Did, you know, Bond didn't win any races in my whole career in IMSA.
6:30
I only won two races.
6:32
So one of them was Daytona and the other was Sebring.
6:35
So we went on and ran and prepared the SACS car for Barbara up through 1980.
6:41
81, Barbara quit racing.
6:43
So I was left with what to do.
6:46
And there was another team of Roy Woods and Cook.
6:50
Brian Redman came to me and he said, look, a new car coming over, new Lola.
6:54
Which he is supposed to drive.
6:56
He said, uh, I want you guys to prepare the car.
7:00
The car wasn't ready for Daytona and the car wasn't ready for Sebring.
7:04
And finally it showed up at Laguna Seca.
7:07
We brought the car down from Mountain View and ran it.
7:10
Bobby Rahal drove the 935 at that race.
7:14
Of course, the Lola T70 won the race, and Brian went on
7:18
to win the IMSA championship.
7:21
But at Le Mans in that year, I drove with Annie Charlotte Vernet and Ralph
7:26
Kent Cook, and we got in a big fight over some stuff, and I was on my own.
7:32
But my car that we drove at Le Mans.
7:35
So I just went and carried on on my own going to the races I could afford.
7:40
I was, you know, not in the big financial position like those guys cook and stuff.
7:45
And so I finally had to give up in about August.
7:49
I just couldn't afford it anymore.
7:51
I get this telephone call from Juergen Barth at Porsche.
7:56
Juergen says, Bob, are you coming to Brands Hatch?
7:59
I said, why do I want to go to Brands Hatch?
8:02
He says, well, you're leading in the world championship.
8:04
You've got to come to Brands Hatch.
8:06
Word got out that some of the guys that I'd driven with, one of them's
8:10
sponsor was Flying Tiger Airlines, and he convinced Flying Tigers to
8:15
fly the car to England and back.
8:17
All the crew guys, I said, I can't, can only take a couple of you.
8:21
And they all came on their own and stuff like that and we made it over there and
8:25
we finished second in the race but group C what had been formed so they ran group
8:31
C cars and group five cars, uh, four are driven by a couple of formula one guys.
8:37
Won the race, but we finished second and won the world championship,
8:42
winning the world championship and then having and going through a divorce.
8:46
I moved to England and that was, that was it.
8:48
I want to talk to you about your approach to choices in
8:52
terms of what races you enter.
8:55
They had sort of a manufacturer's prize going on, and privateers were racing
9:01
a set of races, and then the makers were racing a different set of races,
9:05
focusing on winning that maker's trophy.
9:08
And it seems like it added up to you not only winning the season, but assuring
9:13
your place in the FIA Hall of Fame on a limited season of select entries,
9:19
maybe half the entries were in us and half the entries were in Europe.
9:23
Which did you focus on?
9:24
I only did six races out of the 10, five in the United States and one in Europe.
9:30
One of the brands hatched the finale, but you know, the old
9:33
adage, you got to finish to win.
9:35
We finished every race.
9:36
That was the goal.
9:38
Another thing that struck me as unusual is Lancia as the maker won that year.
9:44
Over Porsche and other manufacturers.
9:46
I'm confounded as to how that happened.
9:48
The car that beat us at Brands Hatch was a Ford.
9:51
It was a Group C car, not a Group 5.
9:54
This is the thing that kind of upsets me a little bit, is that the race was for the
9:58
world championship in endurance racing.
10:01
Yet they allowed cars that weren't in that championship to compete and a group
10:08
C car is going to beat a nine 35 every single time, especially if you've got
10:12
two formula one drivers sitting in it and have tested it and all that kind of stuff.
10:16
And I just felt that we kind of got cheated a little bit in the quote
10:20
glory that the team and the effort and Porsche and everybody else put forth.
10:25
Yeah, we'd won the world championship, but the world
10:28
championship really didn't become.
10:29
A big deal until all the cars were running group C cars and
10:33
Jackie X was my successor.
10:36
And then, you know, it goes on and on and on from there.
10:38
You just laid down an immense amount of information where I want to go back
10:43
to is how you had a wife who told you that she didn't want to see you doing
10:49
wheel to wheel, but you had a race shop.
10:51
that was better than the shops that were working on competitors cars.
10:55
Behind all this is Gerritsen Enterprises, so let's talk about
10:58
what that is, its history, what it's all about, and how that was fueling,
11:03
basically, your racing career.
11:05
I had a 356 Porsche.
11:07
And a Ford station wagon,
11:11
right?
11:12
Well, when I was telling you about this Hanson damn race and wanting to get a
11:17
sports car rather than a dragster, the car I wanted to get was an Austin Healy.
11:21
So you'll mark two.
11:23
I had one all lined up to buy the guide.
11:25
I was going to buy it from died and his wife sold the car trying to get
11:30
rid of stuff before she contacted me.
11:32
Anyway, when I was in the Navy, I went back to a homecoming.
11:36
Event at the fraternity house and met the guy that I'd gone to school with there.
11:41
We got talking about cars and I told him, well, I'm trying to buy an Austin Healey.
11:45
He said, ah, you don't want to buy an Austin Healey.
11:47
He said, come with me.
11:49
We go outside and there's a little 356 coupe sitting there.
11:54
An early model, uh, not even an A.
11:56
He said.
11:57
Come with me.
11:57
We'll go for a ride.
11:59
Well, that was it.
12:00
I went after that ride.
12:01
I had to have a 356.
12:03
I saved everything up and in January 1958, I bought a 57 356 and that's where
12:11
I started having fun driving a lot.
12:13
I used to autocross and hill climb all the time.
12:16
This comes right at the heels of the whole James Dean situation with him.
12:21
Bringing the 356 into the popular view of, you know, Southern California.
12:26
And then he switches to the 550 and then his untimely death.
12:29
We covered this in a previous episode with Lee Raskin, but you're
12:32
right in the middle of all this.
12:34
Was that also a factor in you getting your 356 or why it suddenly
12:39
just was there as a popular car?
12:41
After, and I couldn't, and I didn't get the Austin Healy.
12:44
I started looking into when I got the HP.
12:48
I said, there's seven Porsches sitting out in the parking lot.
12:51
You know, they're going to need service at night at home.
12:55
I had four kids and the wife and trying to buy a house and all this stuff.
12:58
So I have always was short of money.
13:00
So I approached a few of these guys and you need service on your car and oil
13:06
change, you know, all this kind of stuff.
13:07
So I started doing that at night in my garage.
13:10
One of the guys that worked there knew nothing about cars,
13:14
but it was very interesting guy by the name of Bruce Anderson.
13:17
You may hear that rallying around the Porsche world.
13:20
So he started hanging around and finally one day he said, can you
13:24
come with me to my parents house and have a talk with my father?
13:29
Oh my god, what did I do now?
13:30
He was getting elderly and wanted to get his sons into some kind of business
13:36
where they could be independent.
13:38
So he said, look, if you'll open up a shop and do this on a full time basis.
13:44
With these two kids and not me working full time because I'm staying
13:48
at HP, I'll finance the start.
13:50
So that's where Garretson Enterprises started.
13:53
We grew out of a one stall to two stalls to four stalls on a industrial complex.
13:59
Then when my mother passed away, my brother and I built a purpose
14:03
building with seven lifts, a dino room, and all this stuff and started
14:08
working on preparing race cars.
14:10
And that's where it all got going.
14:12
This whole thing with Barber started and after he agreed to bring the car
14:16
down and stuff like that, we decided that, look it, we can't work on race
14:20
cars in the shop designed to run for street cars doing everyday service.
14:26
So we put a hole in the fence in the back and there was an industrial site
14:30
behind us and we rented a couple of places there and that's where Garrison
14:34
Racing was and we kept the name Garrison Enterprises on the cars and stuff like
14:39
that to advertise the street shop.
14:41
Head of technology at Google, you know, at some point he found
14:45
himself with some money to do some racing, which good for him.
14:48
The funniest thing was, I don't know if you were aware, but Steve
14:52
Jobs had a 356, didn't run, but he had a 356 and Wozniak had a 928.
15:00
He used to bring to us for service.
15:02
The, uh, head of, um, public relations or whatever it is, also had a Porsche
15:08
911 or some kind that brought it to Garrison Enterprises for service.
15:12
And so, one day, a guy was coming to pick his car up and Steve
15:16
Jobs drove him to the shop.
15:18
And so I went up to him and I said, you know, you guys
15:21
ought to sponsor a race car.
15:22
Steve says, no, no, no, no way.
15:25
We, you know, what's that going to do for me?
15:27
Well, when was the, I came back to pick up his car.
15:31
See, I didn't work there.
15:32
I never worked at Garrett's enterprise because I was too busy in the, in
15:35
the chip semiconductor business.
15:37
But I used to come every day at lunchtime, every day at the end of
15:41
the day, spend a couple hours there getting everything working right.
15:45
And met these guys.
15:46
And so after was asked about it and he was a little more.
15:50
Enthusiastic well, uh, advertising guy said, Hey, I think it's a great idea.
15:56
We're opening a new campus in Cupertino.
15:59
I think it'd be just a absolute barn burner.
16:02
If we had a nine 35 sitting out there on the apron, you know,
16:07
with all the Apple colors.
16:08
So I don't know if you ever saw the Apple car, but in 1980, it
16:12
was sort of the neatest looking.
16:14
935 running so that was a great event and that's the car everybody that ever.
16:20
It says, Oh, do you drove the apple car?
16:22
And I said, yeah, I drove the apple car.
16:24
Do you know how many tributes to that car have been built over the years?
16:28
Oh, no, I don't.
16:30
But there's a whole bunch of them in Europe.
16:32
Anyway, the guy that owns my 935 now, you'll know the name, Adam Carollo.
16:38
We've heard of him.
16:40
He's a comedian, but he's a nice guy, great guy.
16:43
Matter of fact, at the last Monterey Historic System in August, I asked him, I
16:49
said, this year's races was sponsored by Le Mans, the 24 Hours of Le Mans, because
16:54
they were trying to get people to come to the 100th anniversary of the race.
16:58
They were going to have demonstration laps.
17:00
They were trying to get all the drivers and all the cars
17:03
that ever raced at Le Mans.
17:04
Come over there.
17:05
So anyway, I approached Adam.
17:07
I said, Adam, would it be possible in these demonstration laps, you're supposed
17:12
to be following a pace car around and stuff like that, no racing or anything.
17:16
I said, would it be possible to drive the nine 35?
17:20
I mean, I, first of all, I had to get permission from my wife because
17:22
she doesn't think I should do it, but anyway, she finally agreed.
17:25
And so he let me drive the car, which.
17:29
I mean, I can't believe I drove that thing competitively.
17:32
I mean, well, of course, I'm 89 years old now, so just unbelievable.
17:36
Just fantastic car.
17:38
It's been said that the Porsche 935 is one of the most challenging
17:41
cars to drive and to master.
17:43
Tell us about that experience.
17:44
experience, what you can remember of driving it.
17:47
What's the appeal of that car over others?
17:49
Is it one of the best 911s ever?
17:51
If you think about it in comparison, do you still hold the 935 in the
17:55
same regard today knowing what you know about all the modern Porsches?
17:59
How did it compare to the 956?
18:01
Well, it was 956, of course, a whole different car.
18:04
It was a ground effects car, 935, you know, had aerodynamics, but
18:09
didn't have any ground effects.
18:10
I never drove a 962, so I can't really comment on that, but the beauty of the
18:18
935 was how much of a beast it was.
18:21
There was no finesse in that car.
18:24
You did it with brute force and...
18:27
Ignorance and just, I mean, I was absolutely amazed when I drove this
18:31
car this year and how fast it was.
18:34
I mean, the acceleration was unbelievable in the day, you know, didn't have that
18:39
kind of an impression on you, but coming back almost 50 years later, uh, 40 years
18:44
later anyway, it's just unbelievable.
18:46
And the other thing that was interesting about the car, it had a locked rear end.
18:51
Oh, you have to, you know, meet your down shifts and everything or else
18:56
got squirrelly and stuff like that.
18:58
And what I noticed was driving the car this time, when I
19:01
accelerated, it pulled to the right.
19:04
And when I decelerated, it pulled to the left.
19:07
Come to find out that Adam Carolla and his mechanics that own the car
19:11
know nothing about tire stagger.
19:13
So with two different size rear tires, Uh, you're going to get,
19:17
you know, different actions on the acceleration and decelerate.
19:20
So anyway, that's one thing they're getting straightened out.
19:22
Cause he kept complaining.
19:23
He kept telling me what do I do to stop spinning out?
19:27
I spin out.
19:28
Well, I think this is what happens.
19:29
He lets off on the gas and all of a sudden the car jerks one way
19:33
and he doesn't prepare for it.
19:35
He's not a better active driver and anything, but historic
19:38
races and stuff like that.
19:40
And most of the people that drive the 935s now, there's a special
19:44
limited slip differential made just for the car and they put that in
19:49
so they don't have this problem.
19:50
Can we talk about 1981?
19:52
Sure.
19:53
So you're with Redmond.
19:54
It sounds like he may have been the motivating force to
19:58
get you on track with him.
20:00
Is that right?
20:00
No.
20:01
The way Redmond came along with, I told you about Sebring in 78.
20:05
Yeah.
20:06
Somebody came to Joe Hoffman and said, Can you get Brian Redman a ride in the car?
20:12
He wants to start coming back.
20:14
This was after his big accident in Canada.
20:17
And so Arbor said, well, yeah, how much are you going to
20:21
subsidize me for doing this?
20:22
And it was just at the last minute, basically that he joined the team.
20:27
So it was myself and Redman and.
20:30
The guy that owned Sebring at the time was Charles Mendez was it?
20:34
You find yourself in your mid to late 40s.
20:36
When I won the championship in 81 I was 48 years old.
20:40
And I think Redmond at the time was probably about 45.
20:44
Yeah.
20:44
And then you've got Rahal on the team and he's a 28 year old kid.
20:49
Who has found some success in F1 and F3, and his career is just taking off.
20:55
How did you hook up with him?
20:56
Well, here again at Sebring.
20:58
Wasn't 78, but it was one year at Sebring.
21:00
He had just lost his ride with Wolf in Formula One when Wolf went broke.
21:05
And so he didn't have any ride.
21:08
And so he came down to.
21:09
Sebring looking around, talking to teens and, you know, asking to get
21:14
a ride with him and stuff like that.
21:16
He's dock walking.
21:17
He's looking for a job.
21:19
That's great.
21:20
And Barbara said, yeah, you can drive.
21:22
And so that's how we got together.
21:25
And then Bobby and I became.
21:27
Yeah, even though there's quite a difference in the race, we
21:29
became very close friends.
21:31
My wife and I and Bobby's parents were great friends.
21:35
We used to go back and stay with him and do things all the time.
21:38
And Bobby's dad decided he wanted to run the Mille Miglia, you know,
21:41
the repro of the Mille Miglia.
21:44
So he asked me to get him a car, so I got a 550 Spyder for him.
21:48
We ran that three years in a row, you know, things like that.
21:52
That's a Bobby and I are just great friends in France.
21:55
They run a thing called a tour auto, which is a tour around France and the
22:00
doing race circuits along the way.
22:03
So Bobby and I, Ray Hall and I did that three times and one year, the last year we
22:08
did it, we did it in a three liter RS 911.
22:11
So one of the circuits that we're going to drive is the old Nurburgring.
22:16
And I don't know how long it had been since Bobby had driven the
22:19
course, but he still knew the turns.
22:21
He says, okay, we're, we're going to come around the corner here.
22:25
It was a left hander.
22:27
And he says, you're going to see all kinds of cars over in the grass, up
22:31
against the guardrail on the outside.
22:34
Sure enough, we come up there and come flying around the corner.
22:36
And there are all these cars sitting there.
22:38
And you know, he still remembered after 10 years before the last time he raced,
22:43
he still remembered all this stuff.
22:45
You know, just so simple for him.
22:47
You always knew that he was in control, such a nice personality.
22:53
Doesn't have any errors about how great he is and stuff like that.
22:56
He just, it's just Bobby nowhere near the driver.
22:59
He is, but he's unbelievable.
23:01
Were you driving against the Randys and the Bob Wallocks and the other drug
23:07
dealers in the early 80s who would buy a 935 at Le Mans with a bag full of cash?
23:14
No, you mean like, uh, Preston?
23:15
Yes, we spent some time talking about Preston Henn.
23:18
Yeah.
23:18
Well, Preston Henn was actually a nice guy, but, uh, just...
23:21
Well, John Paul Sr.
23:23
was the guy that was, uh...
23:24
Real bad actor.
23:25
And I felt sorry for his son because he had to live under
23:29
that cloud, but it all right.
23:31
Randy Lanier told us that John Paul Jr.
23:33
was the faster of the two.
23:35
Oh, definitely.
23:36
John Paul Sr.
23:37
was not that fast.
23:38
He drove one of Barber's cars at Aledega.
23:41
Well, I didn't drive at that race, but Arbor was faster
23:45
than John Paul er in our car.
23:47
I don't know if in his own cars and stuff like that what he had, but, and
23:51
then I was thinking of the Whittingtons.
23:52
Oh, the Whittingtons.
23:53
Yeah.
23:54
They now Whittingtons were good drivers.
23:56
They were competitive all the time.
23:58
I guess if you can fly AP 51 Mustang, you can drive a
24:01
sports car, especially at 9 35.
24:04
I mean, they're probably on the same scale, right?
24:06
Yes, that's right.
24:07
I think AB 51 might be better behaved.
24:12
Yeah, I don't think you can spin out as fast in a P 51 as you can in a 935.
24:17
You can't pull over, but the ground's pretty far away.
24:21
That's right.
24:21
Yep.
24:22
It's gotta be a big jump going from autocross and hill climb right into
24:26
sports car racing, into Camel GT and IMSA.
24:29
And back then it was a little bit more open.
24:32
Everybody was building a better mousetrap, trying to build the best car, trying
24:35
to one up each other and whatnot.
24:37
What was it like?
24:38
Out on track, not just in the 935, but some of your competitors,
24:42
were there clear advantages and disadvantages between the cars?
24:45
What was the competition like back then?
24:47
We're, you know, we're talking about some of the drivers right now, but even in
24:51
your short time, did you have some rivals?
24:53
Did you make friends?
24:55
Like what was it like in those days?
24:57
That era, everybody was friendly.
25:00
I mean, you, you didn't fear talking to anybody that they were going to
25:03
get any secrets or anything like that.
25:05
I think the biggest difference that I found in the racing in that
25:10
was the preparation of the cars.
25:12
There were guys that was spending tons of money that cars were terrible.
25:17
Put a Bob Wallach in a car and it doesn't perform like somebody
25:21
else's car that he sits in.
25:23
That's what we always prided ourselves on is that, well, we tried to make it as
25:27
good as we, as it could possibly be made.
25:30
And we did lots of little things.
25:33
driving it easier.
25:35
And we were the first ones to put on big intercoolers.
25:39
I mean, we built special exhaust systems because Porsche one was made
25:44
out of 303 stainless and they would crack and break and stuff like that.
25:49
We made ours out of 400 series stainless because it doesn't transfer as much heat.
25:54
Therefore you get more turbo action and, you know, little things like that.
25:58
Equal length pipes was the Porsche one was.
26:01
Three into one into, you know, we felt that you had to not only outdrive
26:06
them, but you had to outsmart them.
26:08
Well, and the poor victim of that, he's dead now, so he can't come after
26:12
me, but poor Bob Aiken, he spent.
26:15
Tons of money trying to get things done.
26:18
There was always some screwball thing going on with his car.
26:22
This is the 935, not when he got into the 956 or whatever it was.
26:26
Anyway, that's just one man's opinion anyhow.
26:29
As you were coming up through your driving, and then you got onto the
26:33
big stage on the IMSA and the Camel GT series, Did you have any coaches?
26:38
Did you have mentors?
26:40
Did you have other drivers that you were just chasing them around
26:43
and learning from them on the fly?
26:45
Like, how did you develop yourself as a driver going from autocross
26:48
and hill climb to pro racing?
26:50
Well, I think in all kinds of racing, the objective is the same thing.
26:55
You're trying to win.
26:57
You either teach yourself or you find out somehow what to do.
27:01
And I think that in my case, it was never driven a 935 until Sebring in 78.
27:07
He got in the car and away we went.
27:09
I don't know, it just sort of came natural, I guess.
27:12
Were there any drivers that you looked up to?
27:14
I mean, on that roster of names, when you look at those years specifically
27:18
you race, you've got people like Chip Ganassi, you've got AJ Foyt, you've got
27:21
David Hobbs, Hurley Haywood, Peter Gregg.
27:24
I mean, you were rubbing elbows with all sorts of famous drivers from that era.
27:28
Were there guys that you were looking up to?
27:30
Or that, again, you were chasing around the track trying to
27:32
learn from them on the fly?
27:34
One of the guys that I thought was absolutely fantastic is Hurley Haywood.
27:39
Yeah, I mean, you certainly looked up to guys like Wallach.
27:42
And I got to drive twice in the 935.
27:45
I got to drive with Rick Mears and Johnny Rutherford.
27:48
They were teammates at Watkins Glen two times.
27:52
Did you run with any other indie winners?
27:55
Yeah, right.
27:56
I mean, you got Rahal, Mears.
27:58
Yeah.
27:59
No, those are the only ones.
28:01
I didn't drive with him, but Rolf Stamlin drove a couple of times
28:04
with Barbara in the other car.
28:07
He was a guy that thought he was the greatest, you know.
28:09
We were at Sebring one year, and my first wife was with me.
28:14
Stamlin fancied himself as quite a tennis player.
28:17
My wife was quite a tennis player too, so they went and played and she beat him.
28:22
And you talk about a miserable guy for the next, seemed like the whole time from
28:27
then on, but just a very interesting guy.
28:29
I couldn't feel like we were on the same wavelength most of the time.
28:34
Wallach was a nice guy.
28:36
He's quiet.
28:38
You had to almost pull the words out of him.
28:40
You know, it was a shame of what happened to him.
28:42
What about Mike's number one guy, not Randy, but Al Holbert.
28:47
Yeah, Al was, he was great because here again, another guy that
28:52
thought about things to do and didn't just get in a car and drive.
28:56
I mean, he was involved in the car itself.
28:59
I'm from Doylestown and that's where Al's from and his father, Bob, they kind
29:04
of had a big role in Porsche factory racing in America going all the way back.
29:09
It was really fun to go to different tracks.
29:12
This is how I know of you.
29:14
Because you were racing against him at places that my family would
29:17
visit with the Holbrook family.
29:18
The loss of Al was just huge, but ignoring that for the moment.
29:23
Watching him race against you, watching you beat him, watching
29:26
Randy Lanier beat him when he's driving a factory sponsored 962.
29:32
I'd like to try driving one.
29:34
It's what engendered my love for this sport.
29:37
Well, one of the things about Porsche is that the Porsche world, you've got friends
29:42
no matter where you go in the world.
29:44
I don't know if any other car make has the camaraderie that the Porsche world has.
29:51
You think about Germans being cold and hard and rigid and all this kind of stuff,
29:55
yet the factory is open once you've like, I was fortunate to work with them, but
30:01
it's a totally different atmosphere.
30:04
I had a Ferrari for a while.
30:06
I used to run the Virginia city hill climb with it and nobody, unless you're
30:11
somebody or you got the latest, greatest thing, nobody really wants to talk to you.
30:16
Porsches are not that way.
30:18
It's a different life.
30:20
You try to explain that.
30:22
Like my second wife, when we got married, she said, what the hell?
30:25
You know, next thing you know, she's immersed in this thing.
30:28
And it's just unbelievable.
30:31
Anyway.
30:32
This brings up a great question, Bob.
30:34
So since you left racing, have you really left racing?
30:38
Where does the story of Gerritsen Enterprises go?
30:41
Is it still in continuation today?
30:43
You mentioned the meal Amelia.
30:45
Are you still up until this point?
30:47
Are you have you been active in the racing community, even though
30:50
not being on the big stage at him?
30:53
So, no, no, I haven't.
30:55
I don't know if you're aware, but I did crash at Lamont 1st time.
30:59
I race there 4 o'clock in the morning 2 more laps to go on my.
31:04
I'm going down the Mulsanne straight and come to the kink,
31:07
which they don't have anymore.
31:09
All of a sudden the rear end starts to come out and you forget how fast
31:13
you're going and way overcorrected and it went the other way.
31:17
And of course I crashed into the barrier and the car flipped over.
31:20
I counted seven times that we went over, but ended up on all four wheels.
31:25
And even though he wasn't a teammate.
31:27
Brian Redmond stopped and asked if I was all right.
31:32
And uh, yep.
31:32
I don't know if I've ever driven at Le Mans, but it's quite an experience.
31:37
And the thing that will always be in the back of my mind
31:40
is when it rains over there.
31:42
You go flying down the Mulsanne Strait, we're doing 200 miles an hour.
31:46
Other cars are maybe doing 120, 140.
31:50
You come across this cloud, and it looks like a heavy fog.
31:54
You pray that the guy in the slow lane that you're going to
31:58
pass is going to stay there.
32:01
I mean, you go into the cloud and you can't see a thing until
32:04
you come out the other side.
32:06
And it's quite an experience.
32:08
I've managed to walk away.
32:09
The hardest thing on the whole situation was getting out of the damn
32:13
car because the doors wouldn't open.
32:15
I didn't think that there was no windshield in the car.
32:18
I could have climbed out that way.
32:20
Only the corner workers managed to bend the window frame.
32:24
Down because, you know, we had to have nets on the windows because we
32:27
were running into class so I could climb out through the window and
32:31
didn't get hurt at all after 81.
32:35
I did.
32:36
I think you did into some part of 83.
32:39
I drove Daytona in 82 and then 83.
32:44
We converted the car 935 to basically a 934.
32:50
They raced as a GTO car rather than a Group 5 car.
32:55
I drove it a couple times, but just didn't have any enthusiasm for them.
33:00
Are you satisfied having left the arena when you did?
33:05
You had had such success, and then you moved on.
33:08
Oh yeah, no, I mean, I quit on top and that was very satisfying and I, you know,
33:13
I'm not sorry at all that I ever stopped.
33:16
I tried to help various people along the way, just like I said,
33:20
Brian Redman insisted that I prepare his Lola first of all.
33:26
An English guy came over and became the crew chief finally.
33:29
But what broke that situation up was we took Lola T70 and put a
33:35
935 engine and gearbox in the car.
33:38
Problem was we were running out of time.
33:41
The car was supposed to debut at Le Mans.
33:43
Well, we got to Le Mans and had never been on the track before, went out
33:48
there and we couldn't get any boost.
33:50
It wasn't getting to the engine.
33:52
The problem was is that the.
33:54
Framework that supported the intercooler was not sturdy enough.
33:58
So as the pressure built up, it opened gaps in the gaskets.
34:02
And so we started losing boots.
34:04
So it never did run at Le Mans.
34:06
And that was the straw that broke the camel's back as far
34:09
as me and Cookwood's racing.
34:11
And so I had to go out on my own from there on.
34:14
So that's what happened.
34:16
The rest of the history of Gerritsen Enterprises.
34:18
Is it still around?
34:20
Does, did it continue on or did you close that chapter too?
34:23
No, what, what happened to Garrison Enterprises was I had sold my
34:28
semiconductor business as a company that bought it, wanted me to stay
34:33
with them and run the business.
34:36
Keep it going the way it was or expand whatever happened well i was still racing
34:42
it was 81 or 82 i guess i still playing around stuff like that and these guys
34:48
came to me and said look at we don't like you running around the world doing all
34:51
this stuff you're supposed to be running this business i said well business is
34:55
running i've run it the way i've run it all along what's the big problem.
35:00
And he said, well, if you don't stop, you're gone.
35:02
I said, fine.
35:03
Well, I'm gone because I had a lifestyle and that's the way I wanted to live.
35:08
What happened was, was I just said, okay, I'm gone.
35:11
Take my money and run.
35:13
And I went over and basically took the English office over and competed
35:18
with the other companies because the EU had started then so we could supply
35:22
from England, all the stuff that we used to have to have offices in.
35:26
Germany and France.
35:27
So Garrison Enterprises was functioning.
35:30
I'd come back three or four times a year or more and find out what's
35:35
happening and all those kinds of, well, I came back one trip and the
35:39
assistant bookkeeper came to me and said, you better look at these things.
35:42
We don't have any cash.
35:44
Something's wrong with the money situation.
35:45
We have to do an investigation, find out that the head bookkeeper
35:49
was embezzling money because she thought she was a professional bridge
35:53
player and was gambling on bridge.
35:56
And then the two brothers that were business partners said, you know, you're
36:00
not here to guys and stuff like that.
36:02
Can we sell the business?
36:04
They had a friend that had a Porsche customer who was a big banker
36:09
and he wanted to buy the whole.
36:12
To me having to come up and get us out of debt and all that kind of stuff.
36:16
I said, you guys sell it.
36:17
And I left my brother and I kept the building and they paid the rent on it.
36:21
When I left, I left my association with Garrison Enterprises.
36:26
They made it run for a year and then went.
36:29
So my brother and I sold the building to the Dotson dealership across the way
36:33
and Garrison Enterprises was no more.
36:36
Knowing what you know now, looking back over your career, your wins,
36:40
you know, all the people that you've met for young, aspiring racers.
36:44
That are coming up through the system now.
36:46
Do you have any advice?
36:48
Anything you can pass on to them?
36:49
Words of wisdom?
36:50
Anything you'd like to share?
36:52
Well, I think that the young kids today, the drivers are extremely
36:56
talented, but I don't think they have a complete understanding of
37:01
the mechanics of what's going on.
37:03
And why they do things and why things happen when they do certain
37:07
things and stuff like that.
37:08
And I think that's part of the stuff.
37:11
I don't think I have any talent compared to half the guys that I raced against, but
37:16
I think that I was able to, some cases, I'll think of them and stuff like that.
37:20
Looking back over the course of your life and career and your racing experience
37:25
and your success in business and, you know, the people that you've met and
37:29
the interesting life that you've had.
37:31
Where does racing rank?
37:32
I've made great friends with a lot of people, and some people
37:36
just unable to make friends with.
37:38
They, you know, they thought, who's this punk kid that
37:41
thinks he's a race car driver?
37:43
I, I mean, I admit it, and I'm not the talent that half the guys I race
37:48
against are, but the thing is that we manage to do what racing's all about.
37:52
We manage to win and do things.
37:54
So it seems like there's more ego in things than there used to be.
37:58
I don't think that's true.
38:00
I think there's a, it's just expressed differently.
38:02
It seems like you got in and then you got out and you drove an epic car.
38:07
Absolutely.
38:08
You did some amazing things with it.
38:10
I don't know how you walked away.
38:12
It answers some questions, it leaves more questions.
38:15
But you guys must have some more questions.
38:18
Sure, Mike does.
38:19
I don't want to keep you up all night though, you know.
38:23
I could talk to you for hours.
38:24
It's a real pleasure to talk to you.
38:26
So thank you, sir.
38:27
I have to second Mike's sentiments there.
38:29
I mean, I can't thank you enough for coming on here and sharing your journey
38:34
into the sports car world, coming up the way you did, and then just
38:37
gracefully exiting, as you said, at a high point in your career, having that
38:41
win at Sebringham, the win at Daytona.
38:44
And it's just like.
38:45
Wow.
38:45
That's all I can, all I can keep thinking is, wow, but then you've done
38:49
so many other cool things since then and worked on cool cars and made so
38:52
many different lifelong friends between the Rahalls and the Redmans and all
38:56
the other folks that you mentioned.
38:57
I mean, it's just, again, thank you.
39:00
Bob, anything else before we let you go?
39:02
Or Mike, any other questions you want to ask?
39:04
I'm good.
39:05
Thank you.
39:05
Well, if you think of anything you want to ask, don't hesitate.
39:09
Thank you so much, Bob.
39:10
Well, you're very welcome.
39:11
I enjoyed it myself.
39:12
Thanks, Bob.
39:13
Take care.
39:14
This episode has been brought to you in part by the Exotic Car Marketplace.
39:18
Founded by BrakeFix guest William Ross, he provides private client
39:23
services to discreet Ferrari and Porsche buyers as well as sellers.
39:27
With experience and access to the most desired vehicles in the marketplace,
39:30
William can source the perfect Porsche or Ferrari you've been looking for.
39:34
To learn more, be sure to check out www.
39:39
exoticcarmarketplace.
39:39
com.
39:40
Additionally, this episode was supported by the International Motor Racing
39:43
Research Center in Watkins Glen, who provided the factual data as well as
39:47
racing results and photographs from their archives, which can be seen in the
39:50
follow on article alongside this episode.
39:53
You can learn more about the IMRRC by visiting www.
39:57
racingarchives.
39:57
org.
40:03
If you like what you've heard and want to learn more about GTM,
40:06
be sure to check us out on www.
40:10
gtmotorsports.
40:10
org.
40:11
You can also find us on Instagram Also, if you want to get involved or have
40:16
suggestions for future shows, you can call or text us at 202 630 1770 or send
40:23
us an email at crewchief at gtmotorsports.
40:26
org.
40:26
We'd love to hear from you.
40:28
Hey everybody, Crew Chief Eric here.
40:30
We really hope you enjoyed this episode of BreakFix, and we wanted to remind you that
40:35
GTM remains a no annual fees organization.
40:39
And our goal is to continue to bring you quality episodes
40:42
like this one at no charge.
40:44
As a loyal listener, please consider subscribing to our Patreon for
40:48
bonus and behind the scenes content, extra goodies, and GTM swag.
40:53
For as little as 2 and 50 cents a month, you can keep our developers,
40:56
writers, editors, casters, and other volunteers fed on their strict diet of
41:01
fig Newtons, gummy bears, and monster.
41:04
Consider signing up for Patreon today at www.
41:07
patreon.
41:08
com forward slash GT motorsports, and remember without fans,
41:13
supporters, and members like you.
41:16
None of this would be possible.