Latest / Carne Cruda Podcast / Derroteros: La Ciudad, con Inés García y Paula Ducay, PUNZADAS (CARNE CRUDA EXTRA)

Transcript

Derroteros: La Ciudad, con Inés García y Paula Ducay, PUNZADAS (CARNE CRUDA EXTRA) · Carne Cruda Podcast

0:06
Goodbye goes equally course. Cut it out well, road direction medium taken to
0:13
get to the end, proposed set of data that indicate the way to get
0:17
to a place, but that we go direction that is given. In writing.
0:21
For María Díaz motto is going to be in the end of a book
0:25
that contains a defeat then a line marked on the tidal map to guide the
0:29
pilots. Defeater let yourself be taken two ways to think walking with Indes García
0:43
and Pablo Ducai, punched inés Paula. How about, how are you?
0:48
Hello, I mean, here we are How about you, me, wonderfully
0:51
good traveling a lot. You' re already doing a Rockstar Cerati tour.
0:55
You' re not like exhausted. Tante faces, yes for himself they always
1:00
give to see me, since I am an age, then I notice IT
1:02
becomes less because you are younger and because of the makeup it is very beautiful.
1:07
How about your novel well, very happy. Now comes the third edition
1:11
this month. I' m already at Tope, there Tope loves me so
1:15
happy. Thank you very much. Listen, what are we going to do
1:17
today, because today we bring something that is precisely related to travel, although
1:21
there are many ways to travel and we are going to talk more about the
1:23
bad ruins, but today we wanted to reflect on the current problems that cities
1:29
have, not usually big cities. Well, that' s fine, because
1:30
we always walk around the city when we make these courses. So it'
1:34
s total is the best subject this is. Besides, it makes us very
1:38
excited, because we brought a book that we were lucky enough to present with
1:41
Jorge Dian Y López, when I presented it here in Madrid a year ago,
1:45
almost years ago, when the fast time passes how big Jorge dion is
1:47
And it is all that Spain writes of the amazing Pools and now the discomfort
1:52
of the cities. That' s published in the ARPA publishing house. And
1:55
that if in Spain of the Pools it focused a little more on analyzing all
1:59
the steps and models these of urban concentration that are on the outskirts of the
2:02
cities, in this case it focuses on the center and, in fact,
2:06
thinks about why the cities are emptying, that is, why people move to
2:09
the periphery or to the outskirts of the cities to live. However, anyone
2:15
who is listening may think well the empty, empty centers do not seem to
2:20
be, especially I know when Christmas lights turn on and all this that there
2:23
is a whole debate about that no one can move concretely, for example,
2:25
here in Madrid, of course, but they are full of those who come
2:29
from outside clear. That is the key that Jorge Dioni poses from the beginning,
2:31
which may seem to us that the center is always full, but this
2:35
is because the city is characterized by the permanent movement. But it is not
2:38
a space to live, that is, the city is not inhabited, but
2:43
everything is movement. He says it' s an economic space that needs constant
2:46
movement. As I was saying, if it' s full, it'
2:50
s because there are people passing by outsiders. It' s actually a physical
2:52
movement of people that looks a lot like the movement that constantly needs money.
2:55
In the economy, capitalism is absolutely closely related. In fact, all these
3:00
problems that he develops very well in the book and that I' m going
3:04
to go through them quickly are the exorbitant prices of housing, which we all
3:07
already know, we suffer. This is increasingly terrifying the priority being given to
3:10
tourist housing, which is often connected to those terrible evictions that promoters buy and
3:15
empty and leave many people on the street. And, moreover, that these
3:22
tourist homes increase the prices precisely total, not only of the housing, but
3:27
everything else. Absolutely, the city is a commodity in itself. It is
3:30
characterized and crossed by these concepts that we know so well also this Community of
3:35
Madrid is that it is like the paradigm of all this, freedom, capital
3:38
and property. There is also progressive privatization, says Jorge Dioni. The economic
3:43
model makes the city a product and in the process societies weaken, because cities
3:46
could say that they are characterized by public spaces, by dialogue, by encountering
3:52
other people who are not like you. And yet, in this privatization,
3:55
what is characterized by social isolation and not much property, a city is created
4:01
where inequalities are entrenched and policies are not made for the people who live there,
4:06
but for the outside world, which, as you said, are not
4:10
only the people who come, but also the economic flow. Investors do not
4:14
want to attract from abroad. Today, in this walk of courses, we
4:18
do not want to delve into these problems that, besides we know and hear
4:23
you sometimes that you are always very attentive in raw meat to analyze them and
4:27
to tell them, but how to attract other ways of living, of experiencing
4:30
and of evoking the city that all of them have these problems behind, but
4:33
that also serve us in a way as more proactive to discover other forms of
4:36
urban. I love if we' re going to become more abstract and more
4:40
philosophical, why grass are we here clear? Sure, and we' ve
4:43
come to the exact philosopher. We don' t have poets. People don
4:45
' t panic. Ah Well, let' s think about the city and
4:47
evoke the city, evoke the city from the hands of a poet who,
4:49
besides, could be your cousin because his name is Juan Gallego. Well,
4:53
he couldn' t be my brother, because the brother' s name is
4:55
Juan Gallego. As Is brothers, for a touch of your brother, who
4:59
is Juan Gallego. He' s a stupid, wonderful poet. He has
5:02
released in the Bugs box an essay that is called the city without images and
5:08
that starts from a very interesting premise, a personal premise. It is a
5:11
good essay, quite poetic, quite autobiographical also and part of a diagnosis that
5:15
they make him, which is that the author has a problem in memory that
5:18
makes it difficult to fix images in the brain, that is, he confuses
5:23
all the time, the faces, for example, of his relatives, and
5:26
is unable to assign the right name to his friends, which is a good
5:29
thing, very curious, and this forgetting the faces and images makes Galician Benot
5:33
and that the people who suffer from prosopagnosia, which is the name that this
5:36
disease, have a very curious and very strange relationship with the space that had
5:42
a guy who had this same go genes. Yeah, yeah, I had
5:46
this same particularity. And besides, this looks almost like an Oliversax case.
5:50
No. The thing is that this book is about part of this prosopagnosia,
5:54
of this diagnosis. And John wonders what happens to his relationship with space,
5:58
because he says he gives it as it does not have any sense of orientation
6:00
and says the streets through which I walk do not lead anywhere. I don
6:05
' t know what' s behind every corner, and the ratio of squares,
6:10
avenues and walks seems to me like a maze that is renewed every day,
6:13
that is, every day you have to rediscover the city or the place
6:16
where you live, because you don' t fix those images on a map
6:20
that you can inhabit and tour. And then we wondered what our personal relationship
6:24
with the places is like, because we all have an emotional map of the
6:27
places, not a geography of affection that we call it very particular in the
6:31
links that we have with other people are inscribed wherever we are, for example,
6:35
the portal where you gave the first kiss with nuggets or with pepito the
6:40
park where you broke up with your partner. Parks always serve very well for
6:41
breakups. Then something we' ve checked several times. Yeah, that'
6:45
s right. You don' t walk and you cut the relationship to cut
6:48
and they quote you, or they' re left to cut short and they
6:54
quote you in a park, that is if they quote you in a park.
6:55
Go there and they' ll tell you the phrase first. We need
6:58
to talk. Yeah, those two, those two things together, you say,
7:01
look, I' m not going anymore because it' s already a
7:02
little clearer. Yeah, I don' t want to go after killing Send
7:05
me an audio to the slaughterhouse, which, besides, in Madrid is next
7:08
to the park. Indeed, Madrid Rio can be the park for you.
7:12
I came next door. I' m not talking. If anyone needs anything
7:14
that' s accurate. Yeah, we can go with a glass of water.
7:17
I know, because all these examples of things that happen in the cities
7:20
the bar that you got kicked out of for fighting with I don' t
7:24
know who when you were drunk, because all that stores memories, but it
7:29
' s not like that for Galician Benot and opposite clear, this is very
7:31
strong and it' s very interesting the book so it says often I have
7:36
seen myself in sad moments looking at Google Maps images of the park where I
7:41
was walking with some love or walking virtually around my grandmother' s home portal.
7:42
I cry many times in front of the screen when the place arises before
7:46
me as a loan from the memory of others who can never belong to me.
7:49
When I try to narrate those places, the memory is simply dark and
7:54
fragile, which is good, very strong and in the part as more emotional
7:57
of the book where it says that of course that well, since he does
8:00
not have this relationship that other people have with the places and we wondered what
8:05
this lack of images fixed in memory implies, in his relationship with the city.
8:07
The book speaks of several cities where he lives, speaks of London,
8:11
Seville, Madrid, and gives concrete examples, anecdotes and reflections that we then
8:13
tell some and he says that his sick eyes are not able to form hierarchies
8:18
of images and that he sees the city as the space of the uncompromising,
8:22
which cannot reduce it to what we said about a mental map of coordinates and
8:26
fixed elements. And now we want to ask ourselves beyond this disease that diagnoses
8:31
you if this is not a fairly common way to live the city. Those
8:35
of us who suffer from this ailment do, and to think about it we
8:39
bring a little piece of a Go Benot rooster interview that says prosopagnosia is quite
8:46
common in many ways. Many have come to tell me that they have that
8:48
feeling that the city is getting out of hand, that it overwhelms them,
8:52
that it changes very quickly, the bars, the shops, all the gentrification
8:56
that shapes the cities, all this kind of changes that we cannot and that
8:58
modify our own life and experience. Prosopagnoia is a very contemporary way of understanding
9:05
and living the city. Not that it' s good or bad, but
9:09
it' s there. Don' t mean beyond this disease. As Paula
9:11
said, there are a lot of people who recognize themselves in this jo thing.
9:13
You don' t seem to be able to grasp everything around you because
9:18
it' s constantly changing. And this has to do with the movement that
9:20
initially introduced Jabert through Jorge Dioni, because for him the movement is the key
9:24
to the urban economy. It matters more, as we said, the people
9:28
who pass by than the ones who live there. It is difficult for concrete
9:31
people to anchor affections and memories. This is why Paula said that we each
9:35
have our own geography of affection in a city that changes constantly. Then there
9:41
is another thing that seems to me the most interesting, which is gentrification and
9:43
how it creates a feeling of homogeneity that you could be in any city almost
9:48
and dion and talks about this with one thing that makes me very funny,
9:50
which is the specialty cookisese cafes. Everything is full and they are the same
9:56
in all cities where you are, in Madrid, in Paris, in London,
10:00
in Vienna, it is difficult to know. And in the labor field,
10:01
the movement, although today we are not going to get into this so
10:03
much, but we did it in another course with pluga eudals and or such
10:07
interesting ideas. There is also movement, there is a worker who has to
10:11
be flexible, available, who adapts, and all this movement in the workplace,
10:16
obviously, is linked to a deep precariousness chaining contracts to that there is
10:20
no stability in time and also the consumer is modified by those empty spaces,
10:28
those spaces that are actually filled with space in which you could be in any
10:33
city in the world and you could be any avatar in the world. In
10:35
reality, you are not, no one else who enters and is empty of
10:39
personality entering a place without personality, yes as if the identity is diluted,
10:43
of course the identity of the city, the identity of the cafeteria is diluted,
10:46
the identity of the worker and also of the client is diluted. Yes
10:52
they totally let you not enter a place so clear if you are eating the
10:54
same capcake that they eat in any city of the world, with the same
11:00
coffee that has the same name and the same additives, Yes totally the logic
11:03
of consumption is crossed also by all this and by the idea of movement in
11:07
buying, throwing, buying or coffee, coffee and other coffee, says Jorge
11:11
Dioni. If you do not consume, the city is not for you and
11:15
in fact this we can see more in the urbanistic form in our cities and
11:18
as the terraces have become the center. Instead of saying that this is talked
11:22
about a lot lately banks or tables where you can go with you whatever you
11:26
want to take from your saw. In effect and getting there you have to
11:30
be, you have to go out to consume, because if there are no
11:33
other spaces where you can find yourself, says Jorge, hypermobility becomes difficult.
11:37
All kinds of cultural integration, both for the guest and for the host that
11:41
this is also a thing that I think is very well explained in his book,
11:45
which is that we are all guests and hosts in the sense. There
11:48
are people very angry with tourists, which is normal because suddenly, your building
11:52
is full of airbund bes or whatever, and this, obviously, is not
11:54
comfortable and on many occasions there is no respect for the people who live there
11:58
all the time. But of course, then we all move somewhere else and
12:01
we' re the other person. Then he defends a little that we do
12:05
not have to confront the particular people who come to our city, for example,
12:09
but with the system that drives all this and that moves this type of
12:13
tourism, because he says it is very easy for power. Let' s
12:16
say we face each other individually between people, when it' s not about
12:18
that. And this cultural integration also has to do with the feeling that Juan
12:22
Diego Benot said, that it is the city escapes from his hands, what
12:26
we do with this city and we can not, like grasping clear and the
12:31
thread of all this that told inés about the tourists, we wanted to tell
12:35
you a anecdote that Benot tells in his book and is that he lives in
12:39
an apartment from which you see the whole street, He can see the different
12:41
portals, see how people come out and enter their houses and one of the
12:46
exercises that the doctor recommends to him to try to see how his memory works
12:50
in relation to the images, is that he tries to make a list of
12:52
the neighbors to see if he remembers them and, above all, to see
12:56
if he can classify them by groups and see then who is part of the
13:01
same family, who lives in which portal. Well if you live in the
13:01
same number and all this, then he does the exercise of sitting with his
13:05
boyfriend in front of the window once a month with the list in his hand
13:09
to see how that memory is working, which seems to me a pretty nice
13:11
act of love. Two there and well, because they try to remember between
13:16
the two and curiously good, not curiously, the easiest to recognize are the
13:20
tourists, because he tells that the place where he lives, good it is
13:22
seen that there is an ervian I saw or something like that and many tourists
13:24
arrive. If these tourists say he does not exercise any kind of inhabit space,
13:30
they, well, are tourists who pass through space much more superficially and
13:33
tell an anecdote, which is that tourists often pass through a corner where a
13:37
lot of garbage accumulates. What Juan says, I never see who leaves the
13:41
trash, but suddenly the garbage piles up. Not like I lean into the
13:45
window and there' s another bag and it says that garbage, which is
13:50
one thing that a priori, because we don' t love it. The
13:52
trash. It is an irrefutable proof that in that alley and in that neighborhood
13:56
lives people families, because they have a life, they make their life in
13:58
space, they consume, they eat, they throw away, they throw away
14:03
things and say any other neighborhood the garbage would bother, But one of the
14:05
hobbies of the neighbors who live in this alley is to see how tourists have
14:09
to dodge the garbage like sometimes drunk from sangria. It says the book slips
14:15
and I quote even though the garbage I have not put it, even if
14:18
it has nothing to do with me or with the decent neatness of my home,
14:22
I look at it with affection and think this is my shit that big,
14:24
that made me very funny. I really like this act of resistance this
14:28
part of the Neighborhood. No, he doesn' t call me trash as
14:31
a form of political resistance. In this sense, yes, yes, absolutely.
14:33
Already, it is a phrase that, in fact, has become the
14:35
motto of the resistant neighborhoods against the tourist plague. This is where people live.
14:41
Of course, people live here, of course we are not passing by,
14:45
of course we live here if it is our space, it is inhabited
14:48
by us and the space also inhabits us, because precisely, Juan, who
14:52
is a poet, calls this garbage a crack of the present, which is
14:56
a thing like very poetic and very beautiful to apply the garbage. And he
14:58
says that' s why the neighborhood is full of bars restaurants that have just
15:03
opened, but that have a kind of ancient aesthetic that is designed to make
15:05
the tourist feel that he is visiting a kind of former historical place. But
15:09
that really is a false past that is built not for the premises that,
15:11
as you say, live there all year round, but as a kind of
15:16
decoration for the enjoyment of the foreign person that is going to spend, because
15:18
a week, for example, there and then the city is posed as a
15:22
stage, because supposedly clean and neat, and the garbage is a sign that
15:26
there live people of truth that inevitably, because in Sucia and between quotations it
15:31
bothers the tourist that what is expected is to see, since a place like
15:33
clean and clean and good, since as a kind of city has been created
15:37
where, for that, the people that live there would not leave any kind
15:41
of footprint, because the tourist obviously does not want to see the ugly,
15:43
neither the dirty nor the poor. Yes, in fact, he comments that
15:48
many times trucks pass like everything in the morning, like everything else, like
15:50
hidden, not like we' re going to leave it here, that it
15:54
doesn' t look and we' re going to get rid of it.
15:54
Of course he says in the town hall before someone will be nervous to pick
15:58
up the garbage so that tourism does not good, as they have done with
16:03
people living in the street, beggars, for them too are garbage. Then
16:06
they have been removed from the center l or as it was done at the
16:08
time with the advertised people with the men sign, who did not do it
16:15
because it was unworthy of work, but because the tourists did not see it.
16:18
Of course I buy gold in gold is not aesthetic, it' s
16:22
not this key. It does break with that false scenario. And about this
16:25
we wanted to talk about the city now a little bit like a stage prepared,
16:30
because Galician Benot says that of course he has to face this unstoppable city
16:33
every day and tries to find permanence as a place, as we said,
16:37
to grab us, as those images get erased or appear. And then he
16:41
says that when he tries to seek this permanence, he does not find refuge,
16:47
for example, in the great ruins of the past or in the cathedrals.
16:48
That this was a phrase that we liked a lot and we spent a
16:52
lot of time thinking about it and that' s why we wanted to dig
16:56
deeper into this, because basically it means not an unstoppable city and you could
16:57
say good. The only thing that remains are, then, the great historical
17:02
buildings that have a past and that are not going to move From there,
17:03
in Madrid, I know that the twenty things to see in Madrid, the
17:07
Palace of the Plaza Mayor, the source of Cibeles and all this type of
17:11
but there does not happen the one that lives in the city. The monuments
17:15
of your city are not clear you go to the monuments of the cities that
17:18
you visit as a tourist totally, and it is that these monuments are prepared,
17:22
as Paula said, with this kind of scenario, not clear, there
17:26
not around these monuments it is difficult for people to live and this is the
17:29
thing no, I would think more about the time, yes, of your
17:32
whole neighborhood, of your whole life, the lord who sells the alpargatas for
17:36
seventy years or the family business that has been more than a century in your
17:37
street. Of course it' s the fabric of the neighborhoods. Of course
17:41
absolutely, because just to Juan you go to the same thing. He says
17:42
that he cannot find this permanence in the past and in these buildings, because
17:48
of their obvious renovation and restored character, this aspect as a performatic, as
17:53
a preparation, and he is more anxious about these buildings than the shops,
17:57
which barely last a few months. It says the continuous change and such and
18:02
this calls it a lie of the cathedrals, not finding the habitable space in
18:06
this one calls historical paralysis and we wanted to stop a little to reflect on
18:11
this, to ask ourselves why we should feel, as Javier said, more
18:15
anchored to the cathedral than to the space where something personal has happened to us
18:18
or to the space, since it can be a fruit shop or a butcher
18:22
shop that we inhabit almost every day, how we choose, what is important
18:26
and what is characteristic of a city. We do not really build an artificial
18:29
past that is often not only distant, but also renewed in this sense,
18:33
as of falsehood, of make- up and also that always seems as static,
18:37
impolute, sacral, as almost sacralized and that serves, as we said,
18:42
as decorated. And this is very important. Not what monuments, what
18:45
symbols and what historical stages are used to build the official history of a place
18:49
or a country. We have all studied the use, for example, during
18:52
Francoism, of this whole past, of the reconquest and the Catholic kings,
18:56
which is very evident and there are still great debates or days about whether to
19:00
remove some statues and in many cities, that is, that it is quite
19:03
relevant. All this. Yes, we also wanted to think about the subject
19:07
of the ruins that Inés mentioned, and ask ourselves if it is the past
19:11
as far away and as static as they want us to create these supposed decorations
19:15
of great monuments. And this comes under the thread of a subject we gave
19:18
in the career called European Cultural Transmission, where we had some classes with Valerio
19:23
Roco, who is saving the director of the circle of fine arts that always
19:26
serves us a lot. We sent a little kiss from here to Valerio and
19:30
then we will tell you some things that he says and that comes very close
19:33
to the thread of the book of Benot because Bennot tells in an interview that
19:37
had a teacher is also that good teachers are always very important to stay effectively
19:42
here are like the exact cities and he had a teacher in Baccalaureate who said
19:47
that in merida, every time it was dug, it appeared more merited.
19:49
And eb did not take as that idea of having the city as a space
19:53
to dig the image, that every time you remove an image of something,
19:56
it will always seem another behind and the city itself originates the city itself and
20:02
the future of the city is also more city. Well, all of this,
20:04
all of this, let' s think about it. You wanted to
20:07
ask if you' ve been to Rome. Yeah, that' s it,
20:10
no, ines, no, but it' s that valerians with some
20:14
very interesting things about Rome that maybe well, I don' t know how
20:17
much you noticed the ruins of Rome, but a lot. I was,
20:18
in fact, a whole month because my parents lived in Rome for four years
20:23
and in fact, I was hardly born in Rome by a hair and then
20:30
they have many friends there. Then I went a summer to spend it and
20:34
it' s a city that made me very much in love from the start.
20:37
It was the first city outside the city where I was born, which
20:40
is Madrid, where I felt very much at home. I am obviously embarrassed
20:44
by what is a glorious and beautiful city, but I do not know there
20:48
was something in Rome that I said uy. I feel at home here You
20:51
could live there. Yeah, then it happened to me with New Orleans and
20:53
I think it' s gonna be my place in the world. But that
20:56
' s what we talked about another day. Well, I' m talking
20:56
about cities. Yeah, look, New Orleans would be cool for me city,
21:00
because Valerio explained to us that Rome is many cities within a city,
21:04
although the tourists that we are good here, obviously there are many forms of
21:08
tourism, but I am fast tourism that I hate of European cities. This
21:12
fortnight and you see, I don' t know how much clear it'
21:17
s taking you running from one place to another. Yeah, I saw you
21:19
see the five things to see in a day in Milan with the Selfi sticks,
21:22
which now are not so fashionable but bad rum plus they were like phosphorites
21:29
all good, yeah, it' s a garnish that there' s no
21:32
place to take it. Well, if there' s somewhere to pick it
21:33
up, but it doesn' t matter, yeah, totally, because that
21:37
' s what happens to us. Sometimes it depends on the form of tourism
21:37
that we do, that we can only see a rome, which is this
21:41
rome that is presented to us through consumption and all these things that we have
21:45
been talking about. But beyond Rome it is built. Besides, this looks
21:49
great in many cities. I believe this commercial identity that is elaborated for the
21:53
visitor, not that it is in the Jorge Ion in his book, says
21:57
that if you do not have traditions or dishes types or something to show you
22:02
make them up and if not copies, you do not bring them clearly that
22:04
this is being done a lot in Madrid, with the terrible amount of flamenco
22:11
tables and this type of three hundred euros one night with a Spanish dinner and
22:15
a flamenco show or the faults is that only suddenly they will bring us also
22:18
like the San Fermín or something like to appropriate all the traditions, because,
22:22
as Madrid is Spain, inside Spain, because this has to be seen,
22:26
then this commercial identity is elaborated, whether it is the city, and this
22:30
does, as I said before, that they are like very homogenous, that
22:33
we do not know very well where we are now. In fact, ne
22:36
has a very funny phrase that says There are some foreign visitors who know they
22:40
are in Spain because they speak Spanish, but they do not know very well
22:41
or in which city, where they are. And it happens a lot with
22:45
also the visits to Castile, which are mon have a lot of buildings heritage
22:48
of the humanity and all these visits to Segovia, toÁvila and such and
22:52
it says that if it gets too much like with the tents of swords and
22:56
shields, that it is like ah you are in Castile, then it has
23:00
to be like tents of helmets only to a shipowner. It is a little
23:02
replicating Toledo everywhere in just success and in fact cites in this regard the film
23:06
welcome, Mr Marshall, that the inhabitants of a town of Madrid dress up
23:10
in flamingos to welcome the Americans. Well, and that was a parody,
23:12
something that Francoism did, which is to appropriate Spanish folklore, especially Andalusian folklore,
23:18
but others of everything that was supposed to be racial and castizo Spanish and
23:22
to be an absurd mejunje that represented Spain and, in fact, we are
23:26
still trying to remove ourselves. That dandruff. It was the first advance in
23:30
this construction of a tourist Spain. In fact, then came the motto of
23:34
different spanis and all the campaigns that attracted Spanish tourism did, in fact,
23:40
a book by Jorge Lón. There is a historical review of all this that
23:42
we recommend a lot. So, contrary to all this, we find it
23:45
much more interesting to think of the city of Rome, as Valerio Roco proposed,
23:49
from the category of stratum. What we see when we walk around the
23:53
city is really the accumulation of many different Romes that are superimposing each other.
23:59
He shows us photos where this looked great, because they looked like they were
24:03
in what they were called archaeological sites, the strata, literally, the different
24:07
homes or ways of life that had been superimposed. But he also showed me
24:11
a picture, as I don' t know if it was from a town
24:14
hall or something, where the air conditioners were seen on the outside and in
24:18
a very good way to see how the passage of time the different ones.
24:19
Of course, buildings have to be conditioned. Now the cathedrals have warm air,
24:23
because it is very cold inside, because all this is accumulated many times
24:29
in the façade itself. So you can see even literally, and we also
24:32
want to add that the Romans or the city are also superimposed, that it
24:37
is of all those individual and anonymous people who have inhabited it beyond history,
24:41
with capitals against through the reigns, the popes and all is that it is
24:44
really that, that so anteo and it ends, the phrase is falling out
24:47
of my sight, because it was in sheer boredom. The rectal, of
24:52
course. So do I. In addition, there are people that I took
24:53
a history course in Madrid as told from popular history, from dress, from
24:57
food, from the traditions of language, and I said I don' t
25:00
want any more kings. You know this is what I wanted to see.
25:04
If good here, more kings do not want, clearly, here in the
25:07
Republic much seems good. I just think that' s why I liked Rome
25:11
so much, because I lived it with Romans. Sure. Of course,
25:12
they didn' t take me on tourism. Of course they took me around
25:15
to see what their city is like. Of course staying with me, I
25:19
went with a family son, who was about my age, and I went
25:22
with colleagues about the things he did in the summer. Sure, he'
25:27
d take a map of the city. Let' s go rumula, just,
25:32
because what we see is that this apparent stratification of many Romas or ruins
25:36
that are being superimposed in the city is the rest of a struggle of a
25:40
Roma against the previous ones. And this is what Valerio didn' t tell
25:41
us in class, which is a bit of a dialectic view of history.
25:45
This is something philosophers give a lot of paper at the university. It'
25:48
s mostly worth me who' s Hegelian. Of course, then, all
25:49
the time with this, but he told us a little bit that each historical
25:53
epoch struggles with the previous one and so that this meaning is gaining. And
25:56
he said either in the class notes that we rescued to do this is the
26:00
medieval rome is incomprehensible without the previous rome. And the same is true of
26:03
the fascist rome in one succession of another, and strata remain in one of
26:07
the other. And sometimes, as has been said, a past is collected
26:10
to give meaning to a present before, in a way that is good,
26:12
questionable, very deep, very deep that we are going to make the fascist
26:15
branch. Just that and we also wanted to bring you an idea that Félix
26:21
Duque told us, which was good, another great philosopher, who was another
26:23
of our professors in this subject, coordinated by certain masterfully by Eduardo Zazo,
26:27
who is our friend. We' re going to quote him here that was
26:30
our three teachers. And the truth is, these are ideas that have already
26:32
been a few years since we graduated and are still in our head to see.
26:34
And it' s a little bit of a way of thinking culture like
26:37
a river, like a stream. And he said that the stream of this
26:41
stream, this cultural water, let' s say, is made of frozen
26:45
pieces of time that are getting rid of cultures, because they mix with each
26:48
other. The pieces of the ice cubes he was talking about get rid of
26:51
and sometimes assimilate one culture to another. Or, well, they mix.
26:56
Then two things can happen, that one culture is soaked with another and that
26:59
the stream is transformed that we assimilate certain cultural traits that will not be alien
27:03
before. Well, and this would mean that culture is something that' s
27:06
always changing, that it' s not static, that it' s not
27:08
good, that it' s not tancho. And if, on the contrary,
27:11
the water of the stream was always the same and the ice cubes remained
27:15
frozen and did not melt, we would have a culture that would be morfa,
27:21
that would be stagnant, that would smell bad because the stagnant water does
27:23
not smell good. And then, like we have to think about culture and
27:26
these cubes, which are also said by the tiny deaths and simulations of time
27:32
spent in a very poetic class, we have to see that and try to
27:36
dilute them in our present as ways to collect our past and accept it and
27:40
see how it can serve us to build a present instead of being like constantly
27:42
fighting with it or inventing pasts that do not exist, as we counted with
27:47
the decoration of those cathedrals of Lie that Bennut mentioned and has this very beautiful
27:51
idea that a human group will survive if it keeps the past, mixing it
27:56
with the expectations of the present. And this vision, going back to the
27:59
theme of the cities, this vision of the city, as containing many cities
28:03
in its interior and in its past and in its future, implies as when
28:07
we visit cities, we should go beyond the ruins or these eacnalized monuments of
28:11
things that yes or yes, you have to visit and do another kind of
28:15
tourism that sometimes seems to go to Paris to take a photo with the Efel
28:18
Tower only so that the others see that we have been in Paris And really,
28:21
because we do not enjoy, because I do not know of the fruit
28:23
shop of the corner of Paris. Maybe there' s something much more interesting
28:26
about it. Yes, in fact, Juan Gallego Benot said one of these
28:27
interviews that he thinks a lot, for example, with the lubre, with
28:30
the photo of the Mona Lisa, which is dementia that happens here with the
28:33
Prado Museum and the meninas, which seems. What interests people is to prove
28:36
that they' ve been there like a check on their list. If I
28:38
' ve been, I' ve been there, I' ve been in
28:41
Paris, I' ve done the ten things that had to be done and
28:44
one was this and now, with the nets much clearer clamste you could give
28:47
the sheet to your ten friends and with the already positive ones and the others.
28:48
It' s true. That was now done to thousands of people that
28:52
no one ever wanted to see. The pictures of the trips those evenings in
28:56
families, sitting around the TV saying it' s worth a picture of and
29:00
others just like that. It literally says. I try to propose a way
29:03
of walking and visiting that does not always involve going to the obligatory site,
29:07
going to the mon momento and taking a picture there, so try to understand
29:11
the city as this space of excavation of the image of this idea that we
29:15
have repeated. There is always something behind and the city itself has its own
29:18
city as its origin and as a future more city. Not that, as
29:21
Paula said through the stream, an exchange between the past, the present,
29:23
the future and, in addition, other ways of living the city are possible
29:29
through all this that we talked about. Okay. For that, situationist drifts
29:33
and man- courses are highly recommended and, by supposed courses, what is
29:37
actually an inheritance and we call it that for this reason, because that wandering
29:41
is to let oneself be carried away, never go to the same place,
29:47
or let the city take you clear that more they say that it is good
29:49
as neurologically speaking that not always go the same way. This is health for
29:55
the brains of the listeners like that, not always go the same way,
29:57
because you already walk it, like without thinking about the direction you are taking.
30:02
I think the doctors recommend, without being me here Ph D, yes,
30:06
they take different paths, they go to the same place. And it
30:07
' s one thing that' s highly recommended. Also and I think very
30:10
enjoyable is that I let you carry around the city a little bit randomly,
30:15
that is, that signs are appearing to you and you make decisions regarding those
30:19
signs, for example, that the name of a street will take you an
30:22
address to look for, because if it' s called the street tree,
30:26
then look for trees in the city and then that tree that will take you
30:29
to a park and that park, say, I' m going to look
30:30
for a river, etcetera. Not and always with the Google Maps in hand,
30:33
looking, please, only where to go. Well, in line with
30:36
all these things, we wanted to close this walk with a recommendation that many
30:41
people will know. But let' s explain a little bit why we do
30:42
it. What is the book The Invisible Cities, such or Calvino, which
30:45
is an author that we like very much, which is a book that is
30:48
easier to say what is not what it is, because it is quite unclassifiable,
30:52
cannot be defined as a novel. It' s not a storybook either.
30:56
In fact, the fragments about cities were born as always as a beautiful
31:00
book of reading and Calvin reflects on why urban life has become so unpleasant.
31:06
He questions what it is and what the city should be for the human being
31:08
and raises an idea of cities that can be understood through the idea of Russian
31:11
dolls and says an unhappy city. It may contain perhaps for an instant a
31:18
happy city. Future cities are already contained in the current ones like insects in
31:22
the chrysalids that reminds us. This idea of the roma of the strata and
31:25
what Benot identified as this present, which is always behind the cities when he
31:29
does that excavation of the image. Yes, in fact, in this book
31:33
what he is doing is to address the problems of capitalist cities late, which
31:37
he reflected a lot about and has a lot of interview on this topic,
31:41
which is because of real estate speculation, the destruction of ecosystems and many other
31:45
things, and he intends to move from the inviable city to the invisible city
31:49
in an extremely interesting exercise of imagination, of thinking about the utopian city that,
31:56
in fact, Jorge Rioni also concludes his book claiming this need to do
32:00
a political image exercise to think about how we want to relate, how we
32:05
want to inhabit these cities. Or Juan Gallego Benot with these new forms of
32:07
urban that he proposes so brilliantly in his book. Calvin says that cities exist
32:13
because we evoke them and think about them, so they exist because we walk
32:16
them and place our stories in them. They also exist because we have intimate
32:22
experiences and different relationships with them. They exist because they change, they transform,
32:27
they evolve. A city contains many inside. They exist because they contain
32:30
very different lives and very diverse experiences. So if we stop doing all this,
32:35
inhabiting, traveling, living together, evoking, they will cease to exist
32:38
and become a set that changes in an absolutely dizzying way to satisfy the desires
32:45
of those who transit it. So it would become a city absolutely at the
32:49
service of the movement and so far today' s walk. Well, I
32:53
' ve walked around about how many ideas they' ve left behind and stayed
33:00
in the street. The street is walking ideas, all ideas,