Latest / The Gill Athletics Track and Field Connections Podcast / BONUS: Wisconsin State Meet featuring Mark Hoffman from South Milwaukee HS

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BONUS: Wisconsin State Meet featuring Mark Hoffman from South Milwaukee HS · The Gill Athletics Track and Field Connections Podcast

• 0:00
  It's bonus time here on the Gill Connections podcast.
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  In an effort to increase communication, empathy and
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  understanding around the country, we're going to be
• 0:08
  running a new episode every day interviewing a coach, a high
• 0:12
  school coach from every state, and yes, even you, Washington,
• 0:16
  DC with explaining how the state qualifying system works in their
• 0:21
  state. We'll be talking with a local
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  state expert on how many classes, private versus public
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  schools, what events and what is the process?
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  Is it areas, districts, regionals, state meet?
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  Is it a descending order list? Are there fun things that you do
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  a little differently? Like maybe you, I don't know,
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  maybe you do double points for relays looking at you Texas.
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  And then we're also going to get to the bottom of is it the state
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  meet or do you qualify for states?
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  So check us out every day here at April and May of 2024 as we
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  run through each state with a local state expert.
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  So let's get started right now. All right.
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  You know, in track and field, we use the word penultimate a lot.
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  It's the next to the last step. And guess what?
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  Here we are today in Wisconsin and it's our penultimate state.
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  We started back in April with Alabama.
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  We're going all the way till, well tomorrow with Wyoming.
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  And so we're excited to learn about Wisconsin today.
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  So help me welcome from South Milwaukee High School, Mr. Mark
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  Hoffman. Mark, how are you today, Sir?
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  Good. Thanks for having me.
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  Hey, thanks for being here. You know what we're As you come
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  to the end of a project, you start, you know you have a lot
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  of things behind you and experience.
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  Now you know this project would not happen without 51, including
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  you, Washington, DC servant leaders stepping up to represent
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  their state. So we're just so grateful.
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  I'm so grateful for you volunteering.
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  You were very quick to volunteer.
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  I'm so grateful for you for doing that.
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  And just want to say publicly, thank you so much for being here
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  and helping us learn about Wisconsin today.
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  My pleasure. Why don't we start, Mark?
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  Why don't we take a step back here and get to know you just a
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  little bit better? Maybe give us a 32nd 30,000 foot
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  level of you. Give yourself some St. cred.
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  Why should we be listening to you for Wisconsin?
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  Well, this is my 34th year of coaching track and field high
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  school level. I'm past president to the
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  Wisconsin Track Coaches Association and I'm currently.
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  The Clinic Co chair by no means. There's a ton of people that do
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  a lot of work for us that could come on here and speak.
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  So I'm honored to represent them today.
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  Awesome. Well, we're honored you're here,
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  man. Thank you so much.
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  Let's hop into it, Mark. We're learning that not many,
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  but some states have a whole separate Athletic Association
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  for private schools, a separate one for public schools.
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  Private schools go on their own route to a state meet.
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  Public schools go on their own route to a state meet more
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  common. Public and private schools are
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  together, battling out for the same state titles.
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  What are we doing in Wisconsin? Public and private schools.
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  Yeah, it's combined. All the high schools are
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  combined into one division WE. Combined in about 2001 and I'm
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  kind of guessing there, it was about that time.
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  Yeah, perfect. OK, that's that's most common.
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  It's good. Let's we'll continue moving on
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  from there. So let's talk about classes or
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  divisions. You tell us what they're called.
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  How do we split up track and field in the state?
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  In Wisconsin, we have 3 divisions split by enrollment.
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  The top 128 schools are in Division One then.
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  There's the next 136 are in division two and then all the
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  rest are in Division Three. So we've got three, we're
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  calling them division so we've got Division One, Division two,
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  Division Three. So we're there.
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  There are three boys teams that are going to earn a state team
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  title and three girls teams that are going to win earn a state
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  team title at the end of the track season.
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  Correct. In addition to that, we have a
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  state wheelchair team champion. So if you we have a state
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  champion. One division combined for all
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  the Wheelers. Oh, cool.
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  Well, we've got that question later.
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  Let's make sure we talk about that.
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  That's really interesting. OK, so let's talk about how the
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  kids get to the state meet all around the country.
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  We have the first round. It calls area districts,
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  regional sectionals. There's all these different
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  names. What's the first round in
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  Wisconsin called? Ours is called Regionals and
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  there's 48 of them. There's 16 in each of the three
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  divisions. OK, Got.
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  Yeah. OK.
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  So we got regionals, for clarity's sake.
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  What's the next round? Do we have another round or do
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  we go to state after that? No, we've got another round
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  which is sectional. So regionals be held on a
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  Monday, typically the week prior to Memorial Day.
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  If it's the Memorial Day weekend, we'll go on Tuesday and
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  then three days later will be the sectional meet.
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  So either Thursday or Friday depending if it's the week of
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  Memorial Day or not. So Regionals, Sectionals and
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  then state. Correct.
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  OK, so let's talk about Regionals.
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  Perfect. So Regionals, how do I enter
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  kids in the regionals? And what I mean by that is, do I
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  get 2 per event and that's it? Is there a qualifying standard
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  and I can enter as many kids as possible that meet that
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  standard? How do I start this journey to
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  state? They're essentially entering
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  your your team. You've got 28 individual entries
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  plus your relays. You cannot enter any more than
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  three per event as long as it doesn't exceed that 28.
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  And then an athlete can be an up to four events total, so you can
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  list 6 for your relays. But even if you're an alternate,
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  that counts as one year events. Oh, that's interesting.
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  OK, now something you said there that we haven't heard.
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  Up to this point, you only have 28 total entries.
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  Correct. So you have a a travel squad, if
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  you will. Interesting.
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  How did that come? About you're bringing your team
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  to Regionals? Yeah.
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  Do you have that in the regular season as well, or is this the
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  first time we have a we'll call it a travel squad?
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  No, that's it's pretty common for conference meets.
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  A lot of conferences have decided to go with that format
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  so that it mimics what they're going to see the next week at
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  Regionals. OK, love that.
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  OK, so 28 entries, 3 per event, up to four events per kit, and
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  if they're listed as the alternate on the relay, that
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  counts as one they're for even if they don't run it correct?
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  And with those three per event, no other wildcards qualifying
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  time. So if I have 4:00, I always use
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  the miles as my example. 4 stud Millers that 4th Miller is going
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  to have to figure out the 800 or two mile or relay or something
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  else. Correct.
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  And we've had that before. We've had a school that may have
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  had four discus throwers over 170 or 4 pole vaulters over 14
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  feet. You know those are state
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  qualifying performances. But you're the 4th best on your
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  team, so you don't get to go. We used to have a qualifying
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  standard from regionals to sectionals, and we replace that
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  by adding more automatic qualifiers.
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  We we we take more individuals from regionals to sectionals.
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  Now I I always use the mile as example because that that this
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  mythical 4th person I at least get to you know put in other
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  events the 800 the two mile the you know maybe a relay or
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  something. My pole vaulters I feel bad
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  about because if I'm the 4th pole vaulter, see you next year.
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  I mean, I don't know what you know.
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  There's no good answer there unfortunately.
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  So all right, so I've got my three per event, my 28 total
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  entries in the regionals. What do I need to do in
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  regionals to get to sectionals? So from it, that'll depend on
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  what division. So Division One, Nope, I take
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  that back. This is true for all the
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  regionals. Top four, top four, top four go
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  to the sectional again, no time and you mentioned to kind of
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  gauges into there maybe there used to be qualifying times as
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  well, the sectionals, but now it is top four.
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  If you're 5th place, sorry. See you next year.
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  Right. And that's, it used to be top 3
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  + a qualifying standard, so now it's top four.
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  And philosophically it was because it filled lanes and
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  Division One, you have two regionals feeding into a
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  sectional, you get 4 from each regional.
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  So there you filled your eight lanes.
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  So when we get to sectionals. So I've got top 4 going to
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  sectionals. There are only eight people per
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  event already in the sectionals. In Division One, correct.
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  Yeah. OK.
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  So I get out of regionals in top four, I go into sectionals,
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  that's the second round and we're learning not many states
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  have more than one round. Pretty typical is a regional
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  straight to state. We do have a few that have
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  multiple stages here, so we do here in Wisconsin.
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  We're going to go to sectionals. I made it to sectionals.
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  Awesome. But the big dog is the next
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  week. How do I get there to that next
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  meet? What do I got to do in
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  sectionals to qualify for state? So in Division One if you're one
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  of the top three finishers you go to state and then in
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  divisions 2 and three if you're one of the top 4 fish finishers
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  you go to state. And no again qualifiers at large
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  is it is headset top three for Division One top 4D2D3?
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  No, we do have an extra qualifying procedure.
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  So if you finish out of the top three, say in Division One, your
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  4th, 5th or whatever, but you are ranked top eight in the
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  state of all the performances on that day, on the sectional day,
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  then you are brought along as an extra qualifier.
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  So that philosophy is that if you have a reasonable
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  expectation of scoring, you should be at the state meet.
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  So walk us through that. So let's use the Division One.
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  So top three are going on automatically to state I get
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  4th. If that time or distance or mark
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  is top eight out of all sectionals, then I'll also go.
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  That is correct. So the one year we had the 200
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  meters, we had the top five times in the state in our
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  sectional and so the top three went plus four and five because
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  they were within the top eight in the state.
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  So, so it's maybe my math is not right here.
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  So at best you can be as top four as as fourth in the state
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  because there's three people in front of you and there's 45678.
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  So there's five more spots. So you're taking five.
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  Yeah, theoretically you could. Yeah.
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  Not possibly. Yeah.
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  Or or 0. Yes, correct.
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  Yeah. Yeah.
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  OK. That's OK.
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  That that's good. So yeah, it could be all five,
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  which would be all eight of your finalists.
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  It could be 0. That's right, 'cause it's got to
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  be top 8 out of out of everybody.
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  So not top eight out of non qualifiers, It's top eight out
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  of everybody. So if everybody runs really fast
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  or jumps really far on sectional weekend and you're 9th, see you
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  next year. I hate, I hate that term.
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  Just see you next year. Yeah, it's terrible for our
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  seniors. And the seniors are like,
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  whatever, man. I don't have next year.
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  OK, All right. Well, that's cool.
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  So that at least allows some. I like the explanation there.
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  The thought process there is, you know, if you're top eight in
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  the state, that means you have there.
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  There should be a potential for you to score at the state meet.
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  There's no guarantees in our sport, which makes it awesome,
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  but there's a reasonable expectation, So you should get
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  that try the next week at the state meet, Correct?
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  Yeah. Cool.
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  All right, let's talk about our state meet.
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  So we've got six state meets going on.
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  Three boys championships and three girls state championships.
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  Are we doing these all in the same venue on the same weekend?
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  Do they spread out amongst the state?
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  Tell us about the venue. Does it all?
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  Is it always at one place? Does it rotate?
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  Talk to us about this state meet.
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  It's all at 1 venue and we're at the UW lacrosse great stadium
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  and it's able to house and have all three divisions at once.
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  It's a two day state meet. And so on Friday, it'll be a
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  split session. This year we had divisions 2 and
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  three went in the morning and Division One was a late
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  afternoon evening session. Next year it's going to flip
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  back and forth, so that's where we'll have our preliminaries or
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  any event. Field events will only go one
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  day, so we split half the field events one day, half the next.
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  We split the distance races. We have two of them one day, two
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  of them the next and so. Everything else is going to be a
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  prelim up through the 400 meters.
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  Higher than that they just run once.
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  Then on Saturday it's combined and it will go with division
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  girls 321 and boys 321 for finals on the track.
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  So like the 100 meter dash it'll go girls 100 meter dash D3 DTD
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  one and then boys 100 meter dash D3 DTD one.
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  Correct. And then, of course, the
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  wheelchair events are going to be on the second day, with the
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  exception of the shot put. That's on the first day.
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  So they don't have to crossover between field and track that
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  way. At the end of the day, you're
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  having these six 4x4 championships all together, when
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  I say all together, meaning in a row concurrently.
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  And then six team titles are are either already won or they're
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  going to be won during the four by four as well.
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  So it's kind of like championship time format.
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  We're going to have four by fours win team titles and then
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  that's going to typically predict who's going to win the
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  state team titles as well. Right, right.
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  That's exactly. That's fun.
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  All right. Let's talk about this wheelchair
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  because you know, my next question is, you know, we've
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  learned that a lot of states, it's actually quite awesome to
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  hear and see have added adaptive unified wheelchair events.
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  I, I, I think I know this, you, you correct me, Mark.
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  Wisconsin has a long tradition of this.
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  I feel like I've heard of Wisconsin being extremely
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  inclusive here. Talk to us about these the state
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  wheelchair events that you have going on.
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  Yeah, I don't remember the exact year, but it was probably around
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  mid 2000s O five O 6 something like that where we started
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  including wheelchair in our events and we have 4 on the
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  track, 104 hundred 800 and 1600 and then the shot put is the
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  field event. Yeah it's great.
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  It's been growing. As you know, in the early years
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  it might have been two or three wheelchair athletes that had
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  been doing it through clubs. And now we actually end up
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  having to have two heats in the 100, I believe the last time we
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  did it. So it's it's growing.
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  You know, more kids are seeing the opportunity to get involved
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  and they're taking advantage of it.
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  That's awesome. How do you implement those, if
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  at all, in the team title aspect?
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  Do they count the points at all, or do they have their own state
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  team title? Or do they just have their
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  individual state medals that they win for the four events?
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  They have their own individual medals, team titles, so forth.
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  It's not within the team scoring.
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  You know, the dream is someday it gets big enough that
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  everybody has an athlete like that or there are enough from
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  out there where maybe it could be.
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  But right now to get the recognition, I think being
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  separate is probably the best route right now.
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  And did you say they do give a team title for that though?
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  Correct. Yeah, that's cool.
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  That's it. That's unique as well.
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  So one of the major reasons we started this series that we're
• 15:02
  coming to a close, it's a little bit sad we're coming to a close
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  in this amazing series here was to create conversation around
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  the country that someone from Wisconsin, here's what George is
• 15:11
  doing. It's like, well, wait a minute,
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  you guys have figured this out. We need to talk to you then we
• 15:15
  need to figure this out and how we do that.
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  So I love that you do that. I love that you have a team
• 15:19
  title for that. And we've learned I'm not going
• 15:21
  to spoiler alert because you need to go listen to all 51 of
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  these bonus episodes. Here is we do have a state that
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  does include our wheelchair adaptive unified athletes into
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  their state team title. For the overall, it's really,
• 15:33
  it's really interesting. So well, you know, spoiler
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  alert, these are not done in order.
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  So I just still have a couple of states to go.
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  But for sure at this point only one other state has done that.
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  I thought that was really, really, really interesting.
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  All right, Mark, let's keep working down the way.
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  You know, with three divisions here, that means using the let's
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  use the shot put as my example for this one.
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  That means we've got three boys state champion shop putters and
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  three girls state champion shop putters.
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  Some states, whether it's officially through the Athletic
• 16:01
  Association or unofficially through maybe the Wisconsin
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  Track Coaches Association, which is a really strong state track
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  coaches association by the way, I got to make a quick plug for
• 16:09
  these guys. They do an amazing, amazing job.
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  Some states will host a meet of champions.
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  We invite the top two or three per division in each event, get
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  them together, battle it out and we find air quotes here.
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  The true state champion. Anything like that up in
• 16:23
  Wisconsin? We had a meet the spotlight meet
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  where we used to compete against Iowa, Illinois, one year
• 16:30
  Nebraska, trying to think who else came in and joined us.
• 16:35
  It was generally the three states.
• 16:37
  On occasion we'd have 1/4. That lasted about 10 years.
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  What we found is we weren't always getting the top seniors,
• 16:46
  graduations, graduation parties, summer job, whatever.
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  And we were having this the week after the state meet.
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  So we flipped it around and we are actually hosting A Freshman
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  Invitational and it's not team based.
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  It's Any freshman in the entire state of Wisconsin can compete
• 17:05
  in this meet. And they didn't necessarily have
• 17:07
  to be on their track and field team.
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  So if you had a baseball player that wanted to try something and
• 17:11
  track, they're welcome as long as they are a Wisconsin
• 17:15
  freshman. And that's the week after a
• 17:17
  state meet. Jeff Steinbach at Arrowhead
• 17:21
  started this and that's where the meets been the last couple
• 17:24
  years. We had, I think it was 450
• 17:28
  entries last year and we get Kenny Harrison, who was from
• 17:33
  Wisconsin. Olympic gold medalist.
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  He comes, he hands out the medals to all the kids.
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  He even goes over to the triple jump pit Rakes and gives advice
• 17:41
  and it's it. It's just a really cool
• 17:43
  experience for the kids and it's way bigger than we ever thought
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  it was going to be in. Our philosophy is we want to
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  take care of the grassroots and I think that's going to help
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  grow the sport. So that's what we've chosen to
• 17:54
  do instead of a meet to Champions.
• 17:55
  That's super interesting. What do you call it again,
• 17:58
  Freshman showcase? It's it's freshman State.
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  Meet State. Invitational.
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  Yeah, state invite, right? Yeah, Invitational.
• 18:06
  That's really interesting. You know when we think about
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  track and field, it's the most participated sport in high
• 18:11
  school and college when we had boys and girls together and men
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  and women together on the college level.
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  So I I'm always interested in how do we continue growing that.
• 18:19
  What an awesome way Wisconsin coaches help.
• 18:21
  I don't want to say build that self esteem, but give that that
• 18:25
  importance of track to our freshmen at the state.
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  That's really, that's really interesting because most likely
• 18:30
  a a freshman's not going to make it to the state meet.
• 18:32
  Certainly there's plenty that do, but I would think the
• 18:35
  majority don't. So here's a special way to kind
• 18:37
  of honor them and let them get another competition in and see
• 18:40
  what the next step is for the the the full state meet come the
• 18:43
  come their sophomore year and junior and senior year.
• 18:46
  Yeah, and that's what's kind of neat is because it's freshman
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  and it's regardless of ability, you will have freshman that
• 18:52
  qualified for the state meet, maybe even want to state
• 18:55
  championship. And they're competing for the
• 18:58
  kids that are completely developmental that eventually
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  maybe of seniors will get to that point, but they all get to
• 19:04
  be in the same competition and it's it's kind of a camaraderie
• 19:08
  building thing. These kids recognize each other
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  and see each other in future years at the state beat and it's
• 19:14
  it's just been a great experience.
• 19:16
  Yeah, I really do like that and very cool Garrett example there
• 19:19
  about, you know, baseball players playing as regular
• 19:21
  baseball season. Maybe he's got wheels or he's
• 19:23
  got the ability to throw and doesn't get the chance because
• 19:25
  of baseball. Heck, we might, I don't want to
• 19:28
  say steal. We might get people from
• 19:30
  baseball to the full track season because of something like
• 19:33
  that. That's really cool.
• 19:34
  I love that you guys are doing that.
• 19:35
  Very awesome. OK, let's talk about some events
• 19:38
  here, Mark. Let's kind of go group by group
• 19:40
  here. We can assume you're doing the
• 19:42
  one, the two, the four, and the 8.
• 19:45
  Yep. All right.
• 19:46
  The next two events are we doing the 1632, the fifteen 3000, the
• 19:49
  mile, Two mile. What are we doing these next
• 19:51
  two? 1632 Cool.
• 19:53
  That's the most common. Next, we've got the 110 high
• 19:55
  hurdles for the boys and 100 high hurdles for the girls.
• 19:58
  Correct. Are we doing the 300 hurdles?
• 20:01
  300 hurdles correct. Gotcha.
• 20:03
  Let's move to the relays here. We know you're doing the four by
• 20:05
  one and four by four because if you weren't doing those two
• 20:07
  events, you're not doing track and you wouldn't be on this
• 20:09
  podcast. What other relays might we be
• 20:12
  doing? 4 by 204 by 800.
• 20:16
  Got it. Any Sprint, Medley, Shuttle
• 20:19
  hurdles, Anything else like that at the state meet?
• 20:21
  No, not that. That's one thing.
• 20:24
  I know other states do. And where you had that meet of
• 20:27
  champions, we added that hurdle shuttle and so it was, it was
• 20:29
  interesting for our kids. But no, we're traditional.
• 20:32
  Got it. Very good.
• 20:34
  Let's move to the field events here.
• 20:35
  So we've got long jump and triple jump for boys and girls.
• 20:38
  Correct. OK.
• 20:39
  We, we've learned. We've got to actually ask that
• 20:41
  because it's not everybody. We got to get that to
• 20:44
  everywhere. Shopping discus.
• 20:45
  Boys and girls correct. Pole vault and high jump.
• 20:48
  Boys and girls correct. Anything else?
• 20:51
  Javelin Hammer steeple 5000 multi events, Anything else at
• 20:54
  the state meet? No, nothing of of that level.
• 20:57
  We don't throw a javelin or hammer in Wisconsin.
• 21:01
  It's come up and our kids will get to do it in the club but I
• 21:04
  think with the venue we have in the time we have that would be
• 21:07
  hard to fit it into the state meet.
• 21:10
  Much like this meet of champions, some states will do
• 21:12
  an unofficial, it's for sure unofficial state meet multis
• 21:16
  hammer, etcetera, anything like that that's that you know that's
• 21:19
  unofficially going on where we get together and kind of do
• 21:22
  these events not specifically in Wisconsin, at least not out of
• 21:27
  season. Yeah, perfect.
• 21:28
  OK, great. All right, Mark, before we get
• 21:30
  to a couple of fun questions, anything that we missed,
• 21:32
  anything I didn't ask. Anything that makes Wisconsin
• 21:35
  unique. You double your relay points.
• 21:37
  You only score 6 at state. You run the four by four at
• 21:40
  midnight because that's a Wisconsin tradition.
• 21:42
  You give out here, I'm going to, I'm going to go real Wisconsin
• 21:46
  here. You give out a wheel of cheese
• 21:47
  to every winter because it's Wisconsin.
• 21:49
  I don't know. Anything else we need to know
• 21:51
  here we we run our four by before at midnight but it's
• 21:54
  because of weather delaying the state meet actually.
• 21:58
  That's very true last year, Last year there was a delay in the
• 22:02
  Division One state meet and we or two delays and I believe the
• 22:07
  final four by four was run at 1:45 Saturday morning, Yeah.
• 22:14
  And so we had a little bit of delay on Saturday to accommodate
• 22:17
  some recovery time. But it was yeah, that's the kind
• 22:20
  of thing that happens when we try and cram all that into a two
• 22:23
  day period. Speaking of cheese, people
• 22:27
  should know that not everybody wears those stupid hats.
• 22:30
  I hate them. I eat a lot of cheese, but I
• 22:33
  know I hate those hats. That may be the fact of the meet
• 22:38
  or the podcast right there. Not everybody.
• 22:42
  I love it. All right, Mark of us hate them.
• 22:43
  Let's have a little bit of fun here.
• 22:45
  Help us settle a debate, an argument, if you will, at least
• 22:48
  in your culture. Your bus ride to the meet.
• 22:50
  When you're talking about the state meet held there at UW
• 22:53
  lacrosse, are you? Did you qualify for state?
• 22:56
  Did you qualify for states? Did you qualify for the state
• 22:59
  meet? How are we saying this?
• 23:01
  Help us settle this debate. Qualify for State.
• 23:04
  I heard no S correct. That sounds too plural, like
• 23:07
  there's multiple states involved in the meet, so.
• 23:11
  Got it. Love it.
• 23:12
  It's been a very passionate topic, so I love we've got
• 23:16
  another check mark for State Noes.
• 23:18
  Love it. All right, Mark, You've been
• 23:20
  awesome, man. Thank you so much for helping us
• 23:22
  learn more about Wisconsin. You win, You get the magic wand.
• 23:26
  If you could change one thing and please only one thing, my
• 23:29
  friend, that would make the experience the meet the season
• 23:33
  for track and field better. There at Wisconsin, I'm afraid
• 23:36
  my magic wand is broken to allow for better weather in March.
• 23:39
  That would probably be almost every Wisconsin's number one.
• 23:43
  But if you could change one thing that would make it better
• 23:46
  in your opinion, what might that be?
• 23:48
  OK, because it would have been the weather.
• 23:52
  Actually, I'm on a committee right now and what we're looking
• 23:55
  at is redefining the qualifying procedure for state.
• 24:00
  And if I could change one thing, one thing that's come up is what
• 24:03
  I talked about earlier, that school that had multiple discus
• 24:08
  throwers or multiple pole vaulters and these kids are not
• 24:11
  making it to the next level. Is there a way where we can
• 24:14
  change either number of athletes that are allowed in an event or
• 24:19
  the big one we're looking at is eliminating regionals and having
• 24:23
  one sectional meet and one meet to qualify for state.
• 24:27
  I think some of those kids they got left behind at regionals
• 24:31
  that would that would address that problem.
• 24:34
  So that's that's what I would do it and we're finding a lot of, a
• 24:38
  lot of problems along the way with the details.
• 24:40
  But that's that's one thing, one thing, and that I would change,
• 24:43
  and it's why I want to listen to the rest of these 50 states to
• 24:45
  find out what they're doing. As well, say if you're
• 24:47
  listening, you started back at Alabama and we're going all the
• 24:50
  way to tomorrow with Wyoming. You'll know that that is the
• 24:54
  number one concern amongst coaches around the country.
• 24:57
  How do we get the best kids that they don't trip up, maybe
• 25:00
  literally you know, foul and they're the best long jumper in
• 25:04
  the state and they hit 3 fouls. Should that person really not be
• 25:07
  at the state meet the next week or figuratively, they get sick,
• 25:10
  they fault star, things like that.
• 25:11
  That is easily the number one concern.
• 25:14
  That magic wand has been worn out, but it's obviously a very
• 25:17
  valid concern. So I I appreciate that very
• 25:19
  much. Mark, Mark, thank you so much,
• 25:21
  man. You know, it's been a blast as
• 25:22
  we continue to go Alabama all the way through Wyoming.
• 25:25
  We have one more tomorrow here with Wyoming.
• 25:27
  And we're just so grateful that you were here with us today and
• 25:29
  help us learn about this great state of Wisconsin.
• 25:31
  Thank you so much, my friend. My pleasure.
• 25:33
  Thank you.