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you're not making it up · soulful biz guidance

0:01
SPEAKER_01: Hello, hello and welcome to Whispers of Inner Power.
0:04
SPEAKER_01: We're here for another interview for highly sensitive women in business.
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SPEAKER_01: I'm meeting today with Kathleen, a HSB practitioner.
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SPEAKER_01: Thank you so much for joining us today, Kathleen.
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SPEAKER_01: How are you doing?
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I'm doing well thank you so much for having me I was so excited
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to chat with you I
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love everything you've been doing with empowering women and
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sensitive women in
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business because that's who I am too so yeah I really
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appreciate being here with
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you Oh my pleasure and I'm excited too because we've been going
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back and forth into
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notes and commenting on each other's notes on Substack I feel
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like you're my friend
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SPEAKER_01: already
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SPEAKER_00: Yeah, that's what Substack feels like.
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SPEAKER_00: Like, we just become friends with people.
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SPEAKER_00: And I just saw Calibrate Chaos and Gabby saying, hey, Kathleen.
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It's just like we get to know people and we get to read their
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thoughts and it's amazing.
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SPEAKER_01: Yeah,
1:00
SPEAKER_01: in a way,
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SPEAKER_01: I feel that no other platform allows us to do,
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SPEAKER_01: you know,
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SPEAKER_01: I have been off social media for two years now.
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SPEAKER_01: I just, it's not, my nervous system does not agree with that.
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SPEAKER_01: And I feel it's complete difference here.
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SPEAKER_01: And I mean, even if notes can feel like sort of a social media feed,
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I never feel that I have to stay there longer than I want to
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and we can just you
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know interact with each other a bit and it's done and if for a
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few days you don't
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want to go I feel like it's fine but maybe other people will
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say no it's not fine
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you have to post five times a day of course of course I think
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it's fine it is fine
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and I'm sure we'll talk more about that today about actually
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listening to what you
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SPEAKER_00: really need versus what everyone else is telling you you should do
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yes yes absolutely so tell us a bit more about you what you do
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and how you came to
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do that yeah I mean it's a good first question so yeah I mean
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you introduced me as
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an HSP practitioner so I can kind of share the journey on like
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what does that
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SPEAKER_00: actually mean what is HSP how did I get there and so I guess like
2:16
SPEAKER_00: Going way back.
2:17
SPEAKER_00: Let's just start way back.
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SPEAKER_00: Why not?
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SPEAKER_00: I always knew I was a little bit different.
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SPEAKER_00: You know,
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I felt like I was trying so hard to fit in and I was able to
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fit in because I was
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SPEAKER_00: always trying so hard.
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SPEAKER_00: I was achieving.
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SPEAKER_00: I was doing all the right things.
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SPEAKER_00: I got good grades.
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SPEAKER_00: I went to a good school.
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SPEAKER_00: I got a good job and I stayed in that very stable corporate career for
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Over 10 years I got married started a family and so I was able
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to do all of that
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with a sense of this is hard this is exhausting but I kept
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going because that's all
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I knew that's what I was told to do that's what I was told was
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successful and what
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life is like and I really just didn't want to be different I
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just wanted to be
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SPEAKER_00: accepted and then
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SPEAKER_00: When I became a mom a few years ago,
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SPEAKER_00: so I have a three and a half year old daughter,
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SPEAKER_00: I tried to keep up with that same principle of,
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SPEAKER_00: okay,
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SPEAKER_00: I have to do everything right.
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SPEAKER_00: I wanted, you know, to be an A plus mom.
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SPEAKER_00: I wanted to be seen as a good mom and I wanted to be a good mom.
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SPEAKER_00: And so I kept, I guess, outsourcing my knowledge.
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SPEAKER_00: So I would obviously Google everything.
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um constantly like what's going on what's wrong is this normal
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is this not normal
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and I really just wanted somebody to hand me a blueprint like
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what exactly do I
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need to do to take care of this baby and there really isn't a
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blueprint because
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every baby is different like every human is different and
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especially with my
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SPEAKER_00: daughter
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I learned it was actually my therapist who directed me to the
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book Highly Sensitive
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Child by Elaine Aron because my daughter just responded
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differently than I expected
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SPEAKER_00: you know she had some
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SPEAKER_00: pretty intense feeding troubles.
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SPEAKER_00: She had super big emotions.
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SPEAKER_00: She just seemed more sensitive to things than other babies did.
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SPEAKER_00: And so I was struggling even more to understand what was going on.
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SPEAKER_00: And so reading that book,
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SPEAKER_00: The Highly Sensitive Child,
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SPEAKER_00: started opening up my perspective to say,
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SPEAKER_00: okay,
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SPEAKER_00: there's a different world out there.
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SPEAKER_00: There are people who aren't maybe
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SPEAKER_00: who everybody says we need to be,
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SPEAKER_00: they feel the world differently,
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SPEAKER_00: they feel the world more deeply,
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which can come across as a bad thing when it's not supported
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and embraced,
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but can actually be a truly beautiful thing when you are in the
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right environment
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SPEAKER_00: and you are listening to your sensitivities.
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And so at the time,
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you know,
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I accepted that my daughter was highly sensitive.
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SPEAKER_00: I embraced it.
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I wanted her to feel loved for exactly who she is,
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but I didn't accept it for myself at first.
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I actually thought,
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I was like,
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she triggers me because we are so different.
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SPEAKER_00: I'm not sensitive.
5:36
SPEAKER_00: I'm not sensitive.
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SPEAKER_00: You know, don't be too sensitive.
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SPEAKER_00: I'm not sensitive.
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SPEAKER_00: Which now I look back, I'm like, okay.
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SPEAKER_01: Because you are.
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SPEAKER_00: Exactly.
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SPEAKER_00: And so,
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SPEAKER_00: you know,
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SPEAKER_00: during my maternity leave in Canada,
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SPEAKER_00: very lucky to have,
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SPEAKER_00: I took 14 months for maternity leave.
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SPEAKER_00: And during that time, I was experiencing some signs of burnout.
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SPEAKER_00: You know, I was feeling disconnected.
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SPEAKER_00: I was exhausted all the time, no matter how much rest I was getting.
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SPEAKER_00: And I just like put aside, pushed aside saying, this is normal.
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SPEAKER_00: Every mom is exhausted.
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SPEAKER_00: And I'm just going to go back to my corporate career.
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SPEAKER_00: And somehow everything's going to be OK.
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SPEAKER_00: I'm going to be working, paid work full time and be a mom.
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SPEAKER_00: And I also had a long commute.
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SPEAKER_00: and I just thought, hey, everything's gonna be okay.
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About eight months after returning to work,
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that's when I just collapsed from burnout.
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SPEAKER_00: I remember just not being able to even think.
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SPEAKER_00: I would think about going to work and just even attending meetings
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SPEAKER_00: and I started crying.
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SPEAKER_00: I just couldn't handle it.
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SPEAKER_00: I was like, why can't I just go to work?
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SPEAKER_00: This is something I've been doing for years.
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SPEAKER_00: Why can't I just do it?
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SPEAKER_00: And it reached the point where my body said, no, you have to stop.
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SPEAKER_00: You have to give yourself rest.
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SPEAKER_00: You have to slow down.
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SPEAKER_00: And so I ended up taking
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a medical leave from work and like all things I tried to
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optimize that leave I
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tried to do all the right things I wanted to feel better fast I
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was like okay I'm
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gonna you know do all the things all the wellness things I'm
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gonna work out I'm
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gonna eat really well I'm gonna rest I'm gonna do I just like
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was gonna do all the
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SPEAKER_00: things and I ended up feeling worse I
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SPEAKER_00: Got sick, like really sick, which was pretty common for me.
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I was sick every couple weeks,
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which was a sign that my body was burning out.
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SPEAKER_00: And I got even more sick once I went on leave.
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SPEAKER_00: And it's because when you finally stop,
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SPEAKER_00: and we were talking a little bit about this,
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SPEAKER_00: you and I,
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when you finally stop and you give your system a chance to
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finally feel everything
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SPEAKER_00: that's been carrying,
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it's going to let you know what it feels like it's like okay
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you're giving me the
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chance let's let it all out there you go I deliver and it
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wasn't until a friend who
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had also gone through burnout but a couple years prior just
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kind of suggested like
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well what if you actually just slowed down and really did
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nothing like did actually
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SPEAKER_00: as little as possible like don't
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SPEAKER_00: Push your body to work out if it doesn't feel like it.
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SPEAKER_00: Don't push yourself to do anything if you don't feel like it.
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SPEAKER_00: And that was kind of like the turning point for me.
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SPEAKER_00: I mean,
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I was also in therapy and I was finally peeling back the layers
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of understanding
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how much I was living based on other people's expectations and
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how much I was
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SPEAKER_00: overriding my sensitivities.
9:02
SPEAKER_00: Like thinking about being in,
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SPEAKER_00: I was in an office from nine to five,
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SPEAKER_00: back to back meetings,
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SPEAKER_00: fluorescent lighting,
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SPEAKER_00: cold space.
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Like it was just,
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it's horrible for a sensitive nervous system and system.
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SPEAKER_00: It really is horrible.
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SPEAKER_00: And I just finally accepted and started to be able to hear what I needed.
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Like when I actually slowed down,
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tried to take as many distractions away as possible.
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SPEAKER_00: And it was very uncomfortable, don't get me wrong.
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SPEAKER_00: I wanted the distractions.
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SPEAKER_00: I wanted to be doing something.
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SPEAKER_00: We have those parts in us that say, okay, you should be doing more.
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But when I kind of stripped all that away and I was able to
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finally hear myself,
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SPEAKER_00: that's when I realized how much of my life,
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SPEAKER_00: yeah,
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SPEAKER_00: I just hadn't been living true to me.
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SPEAKER_00: And that I wanted to do something meaningful with my life as well.
10:01
It's interesting so HSPs are highly sensitive people there's
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this belief that many
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HSPs are almost meant to go through a challenge or almost a
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crisis because then
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you're meant to support other highly sensitive people who are
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going through that
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SPEAKER_00: same experience I feel so called out I figured you would
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I think there's a lot of people here like on Substack who might
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feel a similar way
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as well like you see so many people talking about what they
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want to do that it's
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based on their experience now they want to help other people go
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through the same
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thing so now I want to help other women other sensitive women
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who are feeling
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exhausted feeling burnt out even if they won't admit to
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themselves that they're
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SPEAKER_00: feeling burnt out because we tend to minimize their experiences yeah
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but if you're getting a sense that something is off I want to
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help other women come
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through that and reconnect with what they really need instead
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of suppressing their
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needs and so last year you know I kind of I was just looking at
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ways I could
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actually do that I love being a manager people leader in my
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corporate career I love
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SPEAKER_00: empowering women and then I've
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Determined like hey I want to become really knowledgeable and
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highly sensitive
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SPEAKER_00: people I want to support them and that's when I became certified to be a
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practitioner for highly sensitive people and that's what I've
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been doing now Wow
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SPEAKER_01: there I have so many points that I want to react to thank you so much for
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SPEAKER_01: For sharing,
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SPEAKER_01: no,
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SPEAKER_01: it's a rich,
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SPEAKER_01: rich story and rich journey and very interesting to see,
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SPEAKER_01: you know,
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how you've come to where you are today and everything that you
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had to go through.
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SPEAKER_01: And I recognize myself in a lot of what you were saying.
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SPEAKER_01: I was not in corporate.
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SPEAKER_01: I was always...
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my first career was as a teacher you know it's already kind of
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a way to be more
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with people and less in this corporate environment I was in
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corporate for like a
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year and a half it was horrible I was in depression after that
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but I really like
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how you underlined as well you know what it means to be highly
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sensitive I think
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SPEAKER_01: it's also something that is often
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SPEAKER_01: Misunderstood.
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SPEAKER_01: Oh, it means that you have a lot of emotions, but we all have emotions.
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SPEAKER_01: We're all human.
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SPEAKER_01: We're all sensitive beings.
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SPEAKER_01: You cannot say some people are sensitive, some people are not.
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SPEAKER_01: We're all sensitive.
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SPEAKER_01: But when you're highly sensitive, you have this this deeper way of
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I'm just not I don't feel safe something's gonna happen I
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remember this light in in
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the hallway of my home when I was a kid you know like when that
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light was on I felt
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SPEAKER_01: something's gonna happen and it's not something good
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and so I was already in hypervigilance and hypervigilance is
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part of it sounds for
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me one thing is touch for instance if someone touches me my son
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my son is highly
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sensitive my son triggers me a lot because we have like
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opposite things I feel like
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oh my god like how are you triggering me so much because he he
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looks for touch but
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SPEAKER_01: he touches me constantly and I'm just like
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Leave me alone you know and I resonate so much with what you
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said because I felt
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that part of me feeling better but I want to say just having a
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better life really a
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day-to-day life has come through first acknowledging my high
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sensitivity and being
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SPEAKER_01: able to embrace it and to communicate about it and to tell
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SPEAKER_01: My family,
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SPEAKER_01: because we live together all the time,
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SPEAKER_01: we homeschool,
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SPEAKER_01: my husband and I both work from home,
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SPEAKER_01: to be able to say,
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SPEAKER_01: right now,
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SPEAKER_01: I am in sensory overload.
14:11
SPEAKER_01: Right now,
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I need to be in my room with music in my ears and not see
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anyone or any movement
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SPEAKER_01: around me for at least 30 minutes because I need to regulate myself.
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But you can't say that if you haven't accepted that this is how
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you're wired.
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Absolutely I mean yeah there's so much truth in what resonates
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and what you shared
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there as well like sensitivity is a scale everyone is in some
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way a little bit
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sensitive but you know about 20% of the population is highly
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sensitive and what you
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said there also is beautiful of accepting and even embracing it
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it becomes a
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SPEAKER_00: strength whereas it's so unfortunate that
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So many of us were raised to believe that sensitivity is a
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weakness like you know
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oh you're you're too sensitive you're too dramatic you're too
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this you're too that
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but truly like when you can communicate what you need and other
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people also are
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accepting and understanding of it it's beautiful like you're
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honoring your energy
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SPEAKER_00: and then it creates room and space
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for you to feel all the amazing strengths of being highly
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sensitive like noticing
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things that other people don't notice even in nature like
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noticing you know the
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leaves falling down from the trees or the way the sunlight is
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shining through the
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leaves and the empathy is really big for highly sensitive
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people as well like you
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can empathize with other people and so when you accept and
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embrace your sensitivity
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SPEAKER_00: it
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Shifts from this thing that makes you different in a bad way to
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something that
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SPEAKER_00: maybe makes you different in a very cool way.
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SPEAKER_00: And I love to hear that you've accepted that as well.
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SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
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SPEAKER_01: Thank you so much for sharing this.
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You talked a little bit about burnout as something that we
16:13
discussed before going live.
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SPEAKER_01: And we were mentioning how often there's some misunderstanding or
16:23
Wrong Beliefs Around What It Means To Be Burned Out The Signs
16:27
Of Burning Out You
16:29
Know A Lot Of People For Instance Believe And I Did That I
16:32
Believe That Myself
16:33
Before It Happened To Me That Burnout Comes From Working Too
16:37
Much Or Not Really
16:39
Being Aligned With Your Work And I Think I Did Believe That Not
16:42
So Much Through
16:44
SPEAKER_01: What I Read But More Through
16:47
The first burnout I went through,
16:49
that was actually me not being aligned with my job at all.
16:52
SPEAKER_01: And I hold this anxiety because I felt,
16:54
SPEAKER_01: you know,
16:55
SPEAKER_01: it was a quarter-life crisis,
16:56
SPEAKER_01: I guess,
16:56
SPEAKER_01: when I was 20.
16:58
SPEAKER_01: Like in this job,
16:59
SPEAKER_01: and you're like,
17:00
SPEAKER_01: oh my God,
17:00
SPEAKER_01: and I hate it with a passion,
17:03
SPEAKER_01: but I thought I would like it.
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SPEAKER_01: And what's wrong with me?
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Because everyone else seems to be able to put up with a job
17:11
that they mightily love.
17:13
SPEAKER_01: It's okay.
17:15
SPEAKER_01: It's not horrible.
17:16
SPEAKER_01: I'm not doing something complete.
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SPEAKER_01: I was a secretary for lawyers.
17:20
SPEAKER_01: It's not like it's completely...
17:23
SPEAKER_01: But to me, it was.
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SPEAKER_01: It really, really was.
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SPEAKER_01: I feel like I was selling my soul.
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SPEAKER_01: I wasn't agreeing with their values or whatever.
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So I thought,
17:33
okay,
17:33
burnout is when you're doing something you don't like.
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SPEAKER_01: So the second burnout was...
17:40
SPEAKER_01: 20 years later, almost.
17:41
SPEAKER_01: I'm maybe not counting well, but I'm not good at math.
17:47
SPEAKER_01: It was in 2022.
17:50
SPEAKER_01: And my son was a year and a half.
17:53
SPEAKER_01: And I did something similar to you when my son is my second child.
17:58
SPEAKER_01: And we're homeschooling.
17:59
SPEAKER_01: So it's already like kind of a busy family, let's say.
18:04
when I was pregnant with him in 2020 he was born in February
18:08
2021 I thought you
18:10
know I'm gonna take three weeks off my business and then I'll
18:14
be back everything
18:16
will be fine that's why it's another point of what you shared
18:18
like it's gonna be
18:19
okay like I'm I work from home what could be wrong right and I
18:24
think it's quite
18:25
SPEAKER_01: incredible that I still managed to
18:28
SPEAKER_01: to keep my business running for a year before I burned out.
18:33
SPEAKER_01: But the burnout there was kind of,
18:35
SPEAKER_01: yes,
18:36
SPEAKER_01: too much work,
18:38
SPEAKER_01: but mostly too much pressure because it was the pressure,
18:40
SPEAKER_01: like you were saying before,
18:41
SPEAKER_01: the pressure of being a good parent,
18:43
SPEAKER_01: of homeschooling in a good way,
18:44
of being present for my daughter as well that is nine years
18:48
older than my son.
18:49
um the pressure of making money in my business and providing
18:52
for my family the
18:53
pressure of being a good coach the pressure of having enough
18:56
knowledge to help my
18:57
clients the pressure of uh doing good marketing and making sure
19:01
that not only do I
19:02
have clients now but I have clients also in nine months to me
19:06
it was the pressure
19:06
and I think that it kind of caught me by surprise because
19:09
that's not really the
19:12
main story of what it's shared around what causes burnout yeah
19:17
yeah absolutely um
19:19
the way I like to say it is that burnout doesn't just happen
19:23
because you're doing
19:23
too much it happens because you're disconnected from your needs
19:29
and so alignment is
19:30
definitely part of that like in your first burnout it's like
19:33
okay your values
19:35
didn't align with the job you had that makes sense but even in
19:39
the second time that
19:40
SPEAKER_00: you burnt out
19:41
that pressure is a disconnect from what you need you need less
19:46
pressure you need
19:47
fewer of those expectations telling you how to be and so when
19:53
you're listening to
19:54
the expectations and the pressure over what you really need
19:58
that causes burnout and
20:00
that's really the core of it of you can be doing a bunch of
20:05
stuff and love your job
20:06
SPEAKER_00: and feel like everything is aligned
20:09
SPEAKER_00: But if something is off,
20:11
SPEAKER_00: if you're still wired to work on or push through,
20:15
SPEAKER_00: for example,
20:16
SPEAKER_00: when you're tired and say,
20:17
SPEAKER_00: okay,
20:17
SPEAKER_00: there's this deadline,
20:18
SPEAKER_00: this timeline,
20:18
SPEAKER_00: I have to meet it,
20:20
SPEAKER_00: even though everything in your body is telling you that you need a break,
20:23
SPEAKER_00: that can still lead to burnout.
20:26
And so you're right,
20:27
it's not just alignment,
20:29
it's being disconnected from what you really need.
20:33
SPEAKER_00: And the other piece you said there about,
20:34
SPEAKER_00: you know,
20:35
SPEAKER_00: taking a few weeks away,
20:36
SPEAKER_00: that definitely is one of the biggest misunderstandings,
20:40
SPEAKER_00: I think,
20:40
SPEAKER_00: about burnout.
20:43
SPEAKER_00: Because in reality,
20:43
SPEAKER_00: it takes meaningfully changing your patterns and again,
20:49
SPEAKER_00: connecting to what you truly need,
20:51
SPEAKER_00: not just going back and operate the way you were operating,
20:56
A change needs to be made and that change is listening to your
21:01
needs and what works
21:02
SPEAKER_00: for you,
21:03
SPEAKER_00: how you can operate effectively in that environment.
21:08
I mean it'd be great if we could take a few weeks off and feel
21:13
completely better
21:14
but and some people tell themselves that they do and maybe they
21:17
do temporarily but
21:21
they're going to start feeling those symptoms of burnout again
21:24
you know the
21:24
exhaustion the disconnection and because they are operating in
21:28
a way where they're
21:29
not listening to what they actually need yeah yeah and so yeah
21:33
I was sharing with
21:34
you that in the second burnout I mean my first decision then
21:38
was to take five years
21:39
off I took two years off and came back because at some point I
21:44
did miss being my
21:46
SPEAKER_01: own person and not
21:47
I did rest I slept so much every time my son had a nap I was
21:50
napping with him but
21:51
SPEAKER_01: it's such a deep rewiring of
22:10
of everything of my brain but more than that it's it's finding
22:14
safety in not being
22:17
productive it's um disconnecting my worth from what I do and
22:25
finding value in you
22:27
know I'm just I'm just still that word I'm just raising my kids
22:32
which is already a
22:33
SPEAKER_01: full-time job really yeah
22:37
um so what would you say about you know let's say someone has
22:43
is going through
22:44
burnout or has gone through burnout recently and they're
22:47
thinking okay so how do I
22:49
now um get better what what what do I need to get better if
22:54
it's not just rest yeah
22:57
um yeah it's a great question I think I mean the most important
23:01
thing there is that
23:02
SPEAKER_00: rest is still crucial it's still important
23:06
because that rest is going to give you ideally the space to
23:11
start listening to what
23:12
you really need and I think it's a bit about shifting your
23:16
mindset from like I need
23:18
to get better and I need to get better fast to taking small
23:25
steps maybe it's every
23:26
SPEAKER_00: day or every week just towards being able to rest and listen to yourself
23:33
will make the most meaningful,
23:35
sustainable change in how you feel in your life.
23:40
SPEAKER_00: There is no quick fix.
23:42
There's nothing that's going to make you feel better,
23:45
faster,
23:46
and sustain you in the long run.
23:48
It's really about taking the time,
23:52
it can even be five minutes,
23:54
ten minutes a day,
23:55
to be still
23:58
Or you know even walk without any distractions and give the
24:03
space for you to
24:04
actually hear yourself and what you need and yes that might
24:09
feel uncomfortable at
24:11
first actually it most likely will feel uncomfortable and then
24:14
you know the hard
24:15
SPEAKER_00: feelings might come
24:17
Like crying,
24:18
you know,
24:19
like I was crying every day when I was on my leave for sure.
24:27
SPEAKER_00: They are likely going to come and that's actually a good thing.
24:31
It's accepting that it's going to be hard,
24:34
it's going to be uncomfortable and that's okay.
24:37
SPEAKER_00: You're going to get through it.
24:39
Just keep finding the small moments where you can listen to
24:43
what you really need.
24:45
SPEAKER_00: And you'll start noticing,
24:48
what am I telling myself versus what are all those expectations
24:51
telling me?
24:53
um so yeah that's the biggest thing I would say yeah I love
24:57
that and it's it's
24:59
making me think about what I'm myself going uh not going
25:03
through but experimenting
25:04
with um right now so about so I'm having a lot of physical
25:09
symptoms it's been a few
25:10
people in my world they know uh like maybe two three months
25:14
that you know it's like
25:15
SPEAKER_01: just maybe it's perimenopause maybe whatever it's a bit of a lot of um
25:20
SPEAKER_01: A lot of different symptoms that are difficult to pinpoint to one thing,
25:24
SPEAKER_01: but okay,
25:25
SPEAKER_01: there's also grief.
25:26
SPEAKER_01: I've lost my dad like two years ago.
25:29
I went back to work right after I do recognize their coping
25:34
mechanism of having to
25:35
take my life into my own hands absolutely but recently I
25:41
decided to reduce my
25:43
working days to four days a week I see it's really new it's
25:46
like three weeks ago
25:48
first week you know oh wow it's amazing I have a three-day
25:51
weekend symptoms are
25:54
Subsiding it's a wonderful second week third week why am I so
26:01
sad and anxious and
26:06
it seems like it's something similar I just recognize it faster
26:09
this time to being
26:11
like it's not really burnout it's just I don't I don't feel
26:15
burned out I feel that
26:16
I haven't had the proper space to I haven't given myself the
26:21
proper space to listen
26:22
SPEAKER_01: to
26:23
to everything my body has been carrying in terms of emotions
26:27
and having that day
26:29
that I'm fighting hard with another part of myself not to fill
26:34
with another kind of
26:34
great project that I probably will find you know because the
26:38
brain is really good
26:39
SPEAKER_01: at finding things to fill all the spaces
26:42
um to use that day to actually yeah just be present um with uh
26:49
with myself talking
26:50
about parts you you have you use that language you said there's
26:53
a part of us yes do
26:54
you work with IFS yes um so part of my training um I don't like
27:03
I don't actually do
27:04
SPEAKER_00: IFS with clients but I'm informed on IFS so um
27:11
Integrated family systems for anybody who doesn't know and
27:15
highly sensitive people
27:18
they are more likely to have more parts and so when we say
27:22
parts it can it does
27:24
make sense that I go into this yeah no but I have studied IFS
27:29
as well and I tell
27:30
her yes yes makes sense so adding anything that I may miss here
27:34
but so so yeah so
27:38
SPEAKER_00: When we were born, we're basically born as our whole true self.
27:43
And over time,
27:44
as we grow older,
27:46
we build parts of ourselves that protect us.
27:50
SPEAKER_00: It doesn't mean they're bad.
27:51
SPEAKER_00: They're actually very good in a lot of ways.
27:54
So for example,
27:56
maybe you grow up being highly sensitive and it's not really
27:59
accepted.
28:00
SPEAKER_00: People are telling you, don't be weird.
28:02
SPEAKER_00: That was a big one for me.
28:04
SPEAKER_00: Don't be weird.
28:06
SPEAKER_00: Don't be too sensitive.
28:07
SPEAKER_00: Don't be a baby.
28:08
and so you build a part of yourself which is pretty cool to
28:13
protect you to say okay
28:14
I won't be weird I won't be too sensitive I'm going to act the
28:18
way that I need to
28:19
act to stay loved to stay accepted to stay safe and so it's
28:24
actually a pretty cool
28:25
thing that our systems do for us the problem comes when you
28:29
know we're 30 years old
28:31
and we no longer rely on that situation or those people for our
28:35
love safety
28:37
SPEAKER_00: or acceptance, but it's still there telling us what to do.
28:42
SPEAKER_00: Those voices,
28:43
those parts of us that we've built were built on interactions
28:47
with others,
28:47
SPEAKER_00: expectations with others,
28:50
but we don't always need those when we're older and we're in a
28:55
different situation
28:56
SPEAKER_00: completely.
28:57
SPEAKER_00: And so it's about identifying what
29:01
SPEAKER_00: I see is so helpful is starting to notice, okay, is this a part of me?
29:07
SPEAKER_00: Does this sound like maybe it was an expectation from someone else?
29:10
SPEAKER_00: Or is this like part of my true self, like my whole being?
29:16
SPEAKER_00: So yeah,
29:18
SPEAKER_00: the parts,
29:18
SPEAKER_00: I find it so interesting because like I,
29:22
SPEAKER_00: highly sensitive people,
29:22
SPEAKER_00: we have so many parts,
29:24
SPEAKER_00: so many parts that we built.
29:27
It's very interesting work I love journaling with the parts and
29:32
I have full
29:32
conversations like it feels like I have multiple personalities
29:36
but it's like okay
29:38
so I'm talking to an ambitious side of me versus the part that
29:43
doesn't want to be
29:44
seen and the people pleases etc etc it's really really
29:47
interesting work to do
29:49
because every time I think we have these conversations and I
29:52
mean we can't go into
29:54
SPEAKER_01: too many details in such a short interview but
29:58
every time we do have conversations with the different parts of
30:01
us it kind of puts
30:04
us again in the awareness that this is the true self versus the
30:10
people pleaser for
30:11
instance so I can identify as me talking to that part of myself
30:15
that is surely
30:17
SPEAKER_01: there to protect me but also is maybe overdoing it a bit yeah
30:21
SPEAKER_01: And it's really connecting to what we were saying earlier.
30:24
SPEAKER_01: You were saying how burnout is caused by not listening to our needs.
30:31
SPEAKER_01: And it's probably,
30:33
SPEAKER_01: again,
30:33
a part of us telling us not to listen to our needs because we
30:37
need to perform a
30:37
SPEAKER_01: certain way to be safe.
30:39
SPEAKER_01: We're always looking for that safety.
30:41
Whatever that means,
30:42
it's emotional safety,
30:44
physical safety,
30:45
mostly emotional safety,
30:46
I think.
30:47
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, absolutely.
30:51
SPEAKER_01: It's so, so interesting to have this conversation.
30:54
SPEAKER_01: I think we could keep going for hours.
30:58
So to conclude,
31:00
because we're reaching the 30 minutes,
31:03
tell us,
31:03
Kathleen,
31:03
how can people...
31:05
Start their journey of reconnecting to themselves or embracing
31:09
their sensitivity,
31:10
SPEAKER_01: overcoming burnout with you,
31:12
SPEAKER_01: what kind of support do you offer?
31:15
Yeah,
31:17
well,
31:17
if anybody's interested to learn more,
31:19
I have a website,
31:20
resetwithkathleen.ca.
31:23
SPEAKER_00: But really,
31:25
my goal is to be like the professional version of my friend who
31:32
helped guide me
31:33
SPEAKER_00: through burnout.
31:36
SPEAKER_00: Because so often, we're tired of having people tell us what to do.
31:41
We are living based on expectations constantly and to be able
31:45
to sit with somebody
31:47
SPEAKER_00: who understands your experience,
31:50
SPEAKER_00: can empathize with it,
31:52
understand it without judgment and just create a safe space for
31:59
you to start
32:00
SPEAKER_00: listening to yourself is incredibly impactful.
32:05
SPEAKER_00: That's the support I had during my burnout journey.
32:09
SPEAKER_00: And I do the same now for other people and other women.
32:14
SPEAKER_00: I love that.
32:15
SPEAKER_01: So you're like a burnout doula.
32:21
SPEAKER_00: Do you know what?
32:22
SPEAKER_00: I never thought of it like that, but I love that explanation of it.
32:27
SPEAKER_01: Let's go through the journey together.
32:31
SPEAKER_01: Out of the cave and back to your rebirth.
32:34
I'll briefly hold your hand through it all I'll be there
32:37
encouraging you I'm not
32:39
going to tell you exactly what to do because we're tired of
32:42
that we don't need
32:43
anybody else telling us exactly what to do we need to start
32:45
hearing what we need
32:46
and so that's my goal that's the space I want to create lovely
32:52
yes and so on
32:53
SPEAKER_01: Substack you have a publication that
32:58
Less Noise More You which is all about lessing other people as
33:05
a brand and like
33:06
very on brand really good good title okay lovely so we'll add
33:13
all the links I mean
33:15
the the live here will be published as a replay on Substack
33:19
we'll add the links to
33:20
to you is there something else you'd like to share maybe a word
33:24
of encouragement
33:25
SPEAKER_01: for anyone listening to us
33:28
Yeah,
33:30
I mean,
33:30
no matter what you're feeling right now,
33:34
it matters and you're not making it up.
33:38
SPEAKER_00: I think that's a big one too.
33:41
SPEAKER_00: So just know that you're not alone in it and yeah, you're not alone.
33:45
I think that's a big one not alone I love that I love that
33:48
because there's so much
33:50
shame I think and guilt around you know not feeling like we
33:53
should be feeling and
33:55
and like I was you know mentioning for me it was like what's
33:58
wrong with me everyone
33:59
SPEAKER_01: seems to be able to
34:01
SPEAKER_01: I love what you share like you're not making it up and
34:19
SPEAKER_01: It's important.
34:20
SPEAKER_01: Thank you so much for your time, your energy, your gentle soft energy.
34:24
SPEAKER_01: It's a pleasure to speak with you.
34:29
SPEAKER_01: And yes, we'll connect soon.
34:32
SPEAKER_01: For those of you listening to the podcast,
34:35
SPEAKER_01: if you enjoyed it or you have questions for Kathleen,
34:38
SPEAKER_01: you can leave a comment,
34:39
SPEAKER_01: send me a DM or send her a DM because I also...
34:44
add her profile to the description of the podcast and until
34:49
next time have a
34:50
SPEAKER_01: wonderful rest of your day thanks Jessica