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From K-Pop Dreams to Tech Leadership: Building Resilience with Shun Fujisawa · Speak In Flow

• 0:03
  Melinda Lee: Welcome, dear listeners, to the speak and flow podcast, where we dive into strategies to help you and your team unleash the power of their voice and flow. Today I have a wonderful CEO and co-founder Shawn Fujisawa. Hi, Shawn.
• 0:22
  Shun Fujisawa: Hi! Thank you so much for having me.
• 0:24
  Melinda Lee: I am so excited. Your story and journey is so inspiring and unique. So I'm glad you're here. So, Sean, he's the CEO and founder of Lumen Luminetta.
• 0:38
  Shun Fujisawa: Of Lumena.
• 0:39
  Melinda Lee: Lumenna.
• 0:40
  Shun Fujisawa: Yeah.
• 0:41
  Melinda Lee: Lumena, and and it's just a fascinating app and so we're gonna go into the journey of how Shawn has got to the place the success where he's at. So before we dive into where you've come from, and what happens? Tell us what Lumen is about, or what the the outcome, or what the goal of the app does.
• 1:01
  Shun Fujisawa: For sure, Lumena is essentially a cosmetic review platform that really allows people to learn about the world of cosmetics, skin care, makeup, anything related to beauty from people that are similar to you. So, to give an example, if I'm the Asian man with a little bit of a darker skin with, you know, eczema issues. Then I'll learn about skin care what makeup products I should use from people that.
• 1:24
  Shun Fujisawa: It's Asian, you know. It has very similar problems as me and all of that as well. So the core underlying principle is, you learn from people similar to you, and we wanted to kind of replace the functionality that Tiktok has. Right now, where you know, people look for reviews, people look for kind of how to videos on Tiktok and transition them onto Lumena. So it's is a reliable platform where you can just learn about cosmetics. Really, in a really easy way.
• 1:49
  Melinda Lee: Yeah, I mean, that's so innovative and fascinating, because in our community, we we want to learn about the product before we buy it. And so.
• 1:58
  Shun Fujisawa: Yeah, for sure.
• 1:59
  Melinda Lee: Learn it from then the actual consumers.
• 2:02
  Melinda Lee: and have one place, one app, like Lumena, to go to, to, not only get the reviews, but also learn the how to videos, just like a tick. Tock does.
• 2:12
  Shun Fujisawa: Definitely. Yeah, I think, like, personally speaking, as well. If the app exists, it'll be really useful for me, too. So I'm just trying to make my life easier as well as a lot of people's life.
• 2:21
  Melinda Lee: Right right right here. It's like I need it. I have it, and when I need it I have it.
• 2:26
  Shun Fujisawa: Yeah, exactly. Yeah.
• 2:27
  Melinda Lee: Yeah. And so tell me, I mean, that's so. I mean, I love the idea. And so I I know it didn't get born overnight. So can you tell us about where like, how this all started? Even, I mean, you can go even back to childhood, or like, yeah, what that beginning stages is about.
• 2:44
  Shun Fujisawa: Yeah, for sure. In terms of the beginning stages. I actually had a little bit of background in the K pop industry. During high school. I think this was back in like 20,
• 2:53
  Shun Fujisawa: 2021, or 2022 or something when I was in high school. Essentially, I had the opportunity to audition to a K-pop agency called Sm Entertainment and Hive Entertainment.
• 3:03
  Shun Fujisawa: Which is the one that Bts is in, as well as a lot of famous a lot of other famous K-pop agents groups are in and actually at the.
• 3:12
  Melinda Lee: Or were you.
• 3:13
  Shun Fujisawa: Oh, it's like K. Pop autos, or essentially they sing, dance, and do everything so.
• 3:16
  Melinda Lee: Oh, so you did everything.
• 3:18
  Shun Fujisawa: Yeah. So I had the opportunity to actually get in and go to Korea. So I was stuck in sm entertainment, and Uc. Berkeley, but also gone into for college, and you know I was talking about with my parents. But I ended up. I did end up going to Uc. Berkeley, and not Korea, and all that. But I think that kind of experience in the kpop industry and kind of auditioning for that, talking to a lot of staff members from there.
• 3:40
  Shun Fujisawa: It really just sparked a lot of big interest in the field of beauty, cosmetics and makeup and skin care and all that, and I think that kind of passion of mine persisted
• 3:50
  Shun Fujisawa: until now as well. And when I came to Berkeley, and you know, kind of saw how entrepreneurial everyone was, how willing and everyone was to actually make something new, I think, that really sparked an interest in the world of entrepreneurship. And so I contacted a close friend on fire from back in high school. I knew he was a really good engineer. He had a lot of experience, you know, making prosthetic hands and all that. And so I
• 4:12
  Shun Fujisawa: I reached out to him. And I was like, Hey, like trying to work on this business. What do you think about it? And after some discussion with him here and there, we came up to this idea of a cosmetic social media platform.
• 4:22
  Shun Fujisawa: and you know, at the beginning. The idea was just to like, let people, post videos and all that. But I think over time talking to a lot of people, and especially. I also had the opportunity to be in Denver this summer. So talking to people from there as well, it really just talking to a lot of people really helped me understand the issue, the core underlying issue, which is the fact that these reviews are one flawed. Oftentimes they're fake, sponsored by companies and 2.
• 4:47
  Shun Fujisawa: It's really difficult to follow reviews when they're not very similar to you. And so
• 4:52
  Shun Fujisawa: I just really wanted to fix that issue. And I think the app
• 4:55
  Shun Fujisawa: kind of morphed into what it is today over time, and talking to a bunch of people.
• 5:00
  Melinda Lee: Wow! So so go back to that time when you
• 5:04
  Melinda Lee: started off as the entrepreneur like, what were you thinking about? Were you afraid? What were your concerns at that time.
• 5:12
  Shun Fujisawa: I think, at the very beginning, at least for the 1st few months, really, just like aspiration.
• 5:16
  Shun Fujisawa: You know, my co-founder. We had no idea how to make an app like we had. Especially my co-founder. He had to learn, you know, this programming language go swift to make the app and all that. And so I think, just at the beginning, it was really just trying to figure out how to even do this, how to make an app. I'm just acquiring as much information and knowledge as much as possible. To make sure we can make this and execute this and all that. It did take a little bit of while our time, just because we are students at the same time.
• 5:41
  Shun Fujisawa: And so it took us 2 years to actually make. And, you know, make everything better and actually produce a product that's minimally viable for the industry. And so it was a little bit of hassle. But I think at the beginning it was a lot of aspiration.
• 5:55
  Shun Fujisawa: And not that much fear. But now now it's a lot of fear.
• 5:59
  Shun Fujisawa: Yeah.
• 6:00
  Melinda Lee: And so what is it that you're fearful of.
• 6:03
  Shun Fujisawa: Yeah, for sure. I I think it's like 2 things right? Like, we spent 2 years working on this product. And I think, actually, I read a very famous why, company article about this, where, you know, founders really become scared to actually launch a product? And I think that was actually really true here, in a sense that we were really scared to launch a product as well. We're worried that, like people might not like it. What if it's a flop, you know, and all that? There's a lot of worries
• 6:26
  Shun Fujisawa: up until this point. And I think now we've gotten over that. We're now we're ready to launch and we're gonna launch it. We already have the app on the app store. So in that regard,
• 6:35
  Shun Fujisawa: that's fine. But I think the biggest story, personally speaking, outside of this company, was spending so much of my time not getting a job
• 6:44
  Shun Fujisawa: in the Us. And to give you a little bit more background. I'm international student from Japan, you know, not having a single family member in this continent. My parents wanted me to find a job here. You know, get a good job, get a high paying salary and all that. And so, you know, working at a really big, famous company right?
• 7:00
  Shun Fujisawa: And so when people around me are working at consulting companies like Mckinsey, Bain, or Bcg. Or, you know, investment banking firms like Goldman Sachs or Jp. Morgan, all that? Or, you know, tech companies like Google, I think to myself, like, Am I even doing the right thing like, am I spending the time am I wasting my time?
• 7:16
  Shun Fujisawa: And so in that regard, I think just trying to figure out whether what I'm doing is the right thing or not, and just the fear that I might upset my parents is something that's really big for me.
• 7:26
  Melinda Lee: Yeah, yeah, yeah. So I can see that I can relate to that.
• 7:31
  Melinda Lee: And so what have you come up with so far.
• 7:34
  Shun Fujisawa: Push all right. Solutions to go against. Huh?
• 7:37
  Melinda Lee: Yeah.
• 7:38
  Melinda Lee: or just.
• 7:39
  Shun Fujisawa: Is.
• 7:39
  Melinda Lee: I mean, where? So the fear? There's a fear there. And it makes sense. It's reality. And because you have, like you said your friends are in jobs. And you have the steady paycheck, and so have you like made a commitment to just say, Hey, this is the entrepreneurial journey that I'm gonna take.
• 7:58
  Melinda Lee: This is where I'm gonna go or what like. What? Yeah, what did you decide.
• 8:03
  Shun Fujisawa: Yeah, for sure. I I think in terms of what I decided. Well, it's a little bit hard, because I'm I just turned 20 recently. So I'm still really young, Greg, and so I haven't really made a concrete decision as of yet. I feel like, but I think we did set a hard goal where, if we don't get 10,000 downloads by the end of this year and a million downloads by the end of 2020 2025. We're gonna stop working on this. So
• 8:27
  Shun Fujisawa: one thing we did was set a specific one. If it doesn't work out, we're gonna drop the project.
• 8:32
  Shun Fujisawa: But in terms of what I'm trying to do right now. You know, there's 24 h in a day, and I sleep for 5 HA day. So you know, I have it like around. I have a little. I'm like around 19 HA day to work on other stuff. And so I actually have this Google Calendar, where I keep track of every single thing that I do, every single minute from, you know, eating lunch, waking up, taking a bath and taking a break, and all that. So everything is planned
• 8:56
  Shun Fujisawa: where I can balance not only my extra curricular activities on campus and my startup, but also things like applying to internships and making sure, especially like I can get a job over the summer, just to make sure I don't get my parents too upset. So I think in that regard time management was a solution that I came up with so far.
• 9:16
  Melinda Lee: Yeah, I mean, you got funding. Did you say that you got you got.
• 9:19
  Shun Fujisawa: Yeah.
• 9:21
  Melinda Lee: Awesome.
• 9:22
  Melinda Lee: And and so you would you? So you said time management is key for you. I mean, it sounds like you're passionate about what you do or.
• 9:31
  Shun Fujisawa: Bad music.
• 9:32
  Melinda Lee: Do something that like from your K-pop days. You're like, this is something amazing. This is something back. What you saw was useful in Japan to here. And you're you're being innovative to launch it over here. And you're also seeing how it could be important for each individual making accessible for each individual.
• 9:53
  Melinda Lee: So I think those those are some key ingredients to doing something that that we're scared of right.
• 10:00
  Shun Fujisawa: I think it's also a big part is just like sucking up and just going forward with it.
• 10:04
  Melinda Lee: Just do it. Just go for it, cause we never know what's gonna happen. So have you seen some?
• 10:11
  Melinda Lee: I guess a confirmation that you're on the right track.
• 10:16
  Shun Fujisawa: I'll
• 10:16
  Shun Fujisawa: this is a little bit of a weird story where, essentially like our app just became approved on the app store pretty recently. And so it's on there. But we started noticing that we have to start. Obviously, we have to market it right? And so it's actually currently a team of 6, including me, where it's 4 engineers, me and a person that's helping me with marketing. And so the person is actually his name is Kevin. So Kevin and I. We've been working heavily on marketing, where actually, like, 2 days ago, we were on Berkeley's campus, wearing a frog costume.
• 10:46
  Shun Fujisawa: inflatable frog costume, just so we can film a bunch of tick tocks, you know, talk to people and all that. So I think in that regard when we were actually on campus. There's a lot of new students like freshmen's incoming freshmen and transfers as well. So a bunch of new people interested in new things, and they actually came up to us like every 2 min. We're taking a photo with someone. And so
• 11:06
  Shun Fujisawa: yeah, they're really interested. Why are we doing this? You know? I mean, there's like 2 dudes wearing a really big frog costume working around, you know, walking around Berkeley's campus. And so, you know, we did attract a lot of attention. So they came up to us, and whenever we told them idea
• 11:18
  Shun Fujisawa: A lot of dudes as well as girls as well, they were really interested in what we were doing and the concept that we had, and they also recognized that this was an issue on their experience as well. So I think in that regard that was like the biggest confirmation that I had. So far, we're actually talking to the people that would use the app. And they said. It's a good idea.
• 11:35
  Melinda Lee: Oh, that's awesome! That's awesome.
• 11:38
  Shun Fujisawa: Yeah.
• 11:38
  Melinda Lee: I mean, have fun with it. Right? You might as well.
• 11:41
  Melinda Lee: And so, having fun with the marketing, I think it just because when you are inspired, and feeling good and and enjoying yourself and and the marketing, it definitely comes across.
• 11:55
  Shun Fujisawa: It was really hot. I think it was. I was doing Celsius right. I think it was like 32°C, or something. I think I was like
• 12:02
  Shun Fujisawa: around 90 something Fahrenheit, or whatever, and the sun was glaring at us. We're wearing like a you know, full like big costume around us. Oh, we were just like sweating out of our mind, drenched in sweat.
• 12:15
  Melinda Lee: Have good products.
• 12:16
  Shun Fujisawa: Yeah. Oh, thankfully, if it was for nothing, I think we'll be very devastated right now.
• 12:22
  Melinda Lee: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, you might. But then you you didn't get to meet a lot of people.
• 12:27
  Shun Fujisawa: Yeah, yeah, there was a lot of people literally like taking photos like, every 2 min people were coming.
• 12:31
  Melinda Lee: Wow!
• 12:32
  Shun Fujisawa: Yeah.
• 12:33
  Melinda Lee: Wow. I mean, I think it's a fabulous idea. I'm definitely gonna download it. We'll put the link in the in the notes section so people can download the app
• 12:42
  Melinda Lee: and check it out. And so that would be so awesome like, what? And so what are the what do you think? Going forward. What are your next steps going forward.
• 12:53
  Shun Fujisawa: For sure, I think.
• 12:56
  Shun Fujisawa: I think just like getting a make the app better. Getting as many users as much as possible. Is our primary goal right now.
• 13:02
  Shun Fujisawa: I think I mentioned this a little bit earlier, where our goal is to reach 10,000 downloads by the end of this year a million by the end of next year. So it's a pretty pretty big goal. I'm not gonna lie, you know, talking to 10,000 people is pretty hard. So I think
• 13:17
  Shun Fujisawa: I think downloads getting users and making sure that the app is something people need.
• 13:22
  Shun Fujisawa: Is, I think, the biggest goal, moving forward and making sure that my co-finite grit doesn't dissipate over the years.
• 13:30
  Melinda Lee: Yeah, yeah. How? How would you? How are you gonna protect that or ensure that.
• 13:35
  Shun Fujisawa: I think, personally speaking, I think in terms of my own grit, I just go for it. I don't think too much about it
• 13:43
  Shun Fujisawa: you just gotta do the job that you assigned yourself to do so. I think that's not too big of an issue. But I do sometimes worry about the people that are on my team and how I can make sure that they're motivated to keep on working. So I think that's something that I'm just like learning over the years. As time goes by, I think, watching, you know, reading Y combinator article looking a bunch of.
• 14:03
  Shun Fujisawa: you know, leadership principle books and all that. I think it's helpful to an extent, but it's also like experiencing. And then seeing what works, seeing what doesn't work. You know what really motivates people learning, understanding. That is really important. I think.
• 14:16
  Melinda Lee: Yeah, yeah,
• 14:18
  Melinda Lee: I mean, like, earlier, we talked before we got on the call, and you'd mentioned the whole.
• 14:23
  Melinda Lee: What? How leaders are probably gonna be working more. Yeah, can you tell us more about that? We're working harder than the people.
• 14:31
  Shun Fujisawa: Yeah.
• 14:31
  Melinda Lee: And a quote.
• 14:33
  Shun Fujisawa: Oh, yeah, I think it was like on a scale of one to 10. If a leader is working at a 10, all the employees would work around like an 8 or a 9, or maybe even a 7. And so if you want them to work at a 10, you have to be working at like a 15 or something of this sort. It's just kind of like I don't. I don't have a direct quote that I'm referencing to. I think it's something that I learned over time. I just like to make sure
• 14:54
  Shun Fujisawa: like one way I motivate other people is by working hard myself. If the leader is not working hard. If you're an employee or person on the team, you're not going to want to work hard as well, because you think to yourself like, what like, why am I going to work for this guy? He's not working hard. And so I think that's like a really big learning. That I had in the past 2 years.
• 15:13
  Melinda Lee: Right right. And I I mean I can. I see it I I even though I don't. We don't know the exact quote, but I think I see it. I know that I experience that I see with leaders, and it is a constant struggle to to motivate our employees, because leaders have much more responsibility. We have more writing. We have more risk involved. We're gonna work harder at this.
• 15:34
  Melinda Lee: And so how do we help the employees or motivate them to to feel the same way, to have that sense of same urgency. But at the same also. If you're an employee or a staff member. I I think if you know that if you continue to drive, continue to work hard, you're gonna stand out like, if you are pushing yourself, do it for yourself.
• 15:55
  Melinda Lee: And not to get recognition, or I mean do it so so you can learn. And you know you'll stand out. You'll definitely stand leader.
• 16:04
  Shun Fujisawa: For sure. I think it's kind of like thinking of a reward system kind of figuring out what really motivates people to work hard is something that I'm also trying to learn every single day as well.
• 16:16
  Melinda Lee: Have you found anything in particular to help you.
• 16:20
  Shun Fujisawa: I mean, I think, in terms of like. Logically speaking, there's 2 things that could occur and oftentimes I think the Government sees this as well where the other provide them equity or money, and that kind of motivates people to work hard to an extent. But I think what's really important moving forward is
• 16:34
  Shun Fujisawa: people that are motivated by money is gonna leave the company if they can't get the money. And so I think, just
• 16:40
  Shun Fujisawa: from the ground up finding a team that really understands what you're trying to do. And is a group of people that
• 16:47
  Shun Fujisawa: is driven by the same mission, I think, is a really big factor, and I think
• 16:51
  Shun Fujisawa: I think the Airbnb CEO actually did this at the very beginning of Airbnb, where, during any interview, he asked the applicant. Would you work at Airbnb, if you only have like a year or 2 left in your life, or something? So I think that's kind of like a really good representation, where you just really want to get a team of people that
• 17:11
  Shun Fujisawa: really is motivated by the mission, and it's driven by the mission.
• 17:15
  Melinda Lee: Right right? And then how do you? How do we communicate that effectively? Right.
• 17:21
  Shun Fujisawa: Oh, well, I want to know as well.
• 17:26
  Shun Fujisawa: Little bit hard, I think.
• 17:29
  Shun Fujisawa: I think it's just like talking to the person over time. I feel like, even personally speaking, as well. Sometimes, you know, there are industries. I don't really care about that much, and whenever I'm talking to another founder that is really motivated by the industry, and I can tell that the person is motivated. Maybe I think that might be something that really pushes people to work really hard as well. Kind of understand a little bit more about the mission.
• 17:52
  Melinda Lee: Yes, yes.
• 17:54
  Melinda Lee: Yup, exactly right. I mean, cause we are the leader that has the drive and the vision, and the and the passion for it, and when we communicate to have the same passion, because sometimes, maybe if you're an engineer, you might just stick to all the facts, and it doesn't. But it's not as engaging. And so some passion like show that you care show that it's important. And then also asking people asking your team members what do they think? And I can bring them along with you.
• 18:22
  Melinda Lee: and then they they may not make all the decisions, but then, at least, maybe some parts of the vision or the execution. They can have parts of the decision making process, and then they'll they'll therefore be more included and be more excited about the vision and implementing the vision.
• 18:39
  Shun Fujisawa: Yeah, for sure, definitely. I mean, I think, even from my personal experience as well, like, I only started this company 2 years ago to register for only a year, and we're just launching the product and everything. So in that regard, I think there's so much more that I need to learn
• 18:56
  Shun Fujisawa: So I think there's always room for growth for anyone, especially for a young person like me. I think there's significantly more things I need to learn moving forward.
• 19:03
  Melinda Lee: We're all learning. I'm learning learning from you. So we learn from each other. I'm just so inspired by you, just jumping on to this podcast and sharing what you know and sharing about your business. And so and congratulations for taking that launch. I mean that's huge
• 19:22
  Melinda Lee: in terms of leadership in terms of inspiring or bringing the innovation here to United States.
• 19:28
  Melinda Lee: And so what is the one I like to ask, like all like you asked. All my guests is, what would you like to share? What is that? One key leadership goal, then takeaway
• 19:38
  Melinda Lee: for the audience?
• 19:44
  Shun Fujisawa: like 1 1 thing right?
• 19:46
  Melinda Lee: Yeah, it. It makes it hard, because there's 1 thing.
• 19:51
  Shun Fujisawa: I think again it goes back to the idea of this. The leader has to be the hardest working person.
• 19:59
  Shun Fujisawa: I don't think any leader should never. No leader should ever expect to
• 20:04
  Shun Fujisawa: have their employees, or, you know, team members to work
• 20:08
  Shun Fujisawa: harder than them.
• 20:10
  Shun Fujisawa: And so if you want them to work hard. You have to be working twice as hard as you want them to be working. So I think that's like the biggest leadership principle that I learned so far.
• 20:20
  Melinda Lee: That's awesome, and you have the experience and the results to show your success. And through that hard work, so congratulations.
• 20:30
  Shun Fujisawa: Thank you so much. Hopefully, I can achieve more in the future. Down the line. Get get the done.
• 20:35
  Melinda Lee: Well.
• 20:35
  Shun Fujisawa: Everything.
• 20:36
  Melinda Lee: I know that you're gonna be working hard, doing, no matter what you're doing. And so you're going to be successful.
• 20:41
  Shun Fujisawa: Thank you.
• 20:42
  Melinda Lee: It is you are.
• 20:43
  Shun Fujisawa: Trailing.
• 20:43
  Melinda Lee: You're already successful. So thank you so much, Shawn. It was really wonderful. I I trust, that you. I got a lot of it, and so I trust that also the audience has also taken some takeaways. And so download Shawn's Lumena, the app we're gonna keep the. We're gonna put the link in the show notes and so download it. Check it out you're gonna learn a lot about your skin and the best products and how to use it.
• 21:10
  Melinda Lee: In the palm of your hands.
• 21:12
  Shun Fujisawa: Yeah, in the palm of your hands, inside your palm.
• 21:14
  Melinda Lee: Coffee inside the palm of your hands. Thank you so much, Sean, and thank you listeners, for being.
• 21:20
  Shun Fujisawa: Someone.
• 21:21
  Melinda Lee: Until next time. I'm your sister and Flo may prosperity flow to you and through you to others, and I'll see you next time.
• 21:30
  Melinda Lee: Bye.
• 21:33
  Shun Fujisawa: Thank you.